TLUG and government grants

[billt-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org]

> 
> There is a big difference between management and leadership. Leadership 
> means offering ideas and giving the community a focal point to which 
> people can contribute. It means showing initiative in not waiting for 
> someone else to move first.

Actually the reason that GTALUG was incorporated was to assure that the club was managed and that people needed to be replaced. When Jan died a very large hole was left in the management of the club not in its leadership.

TLUG has never lacked leadership now or in the past. But leadership is 1% of any operation. It is the part that is easiest to fill. Management is much harder because it means you need people that can make the little decisions and do the grunt work day in and day out.
 
> 
> The problem I see with GTALUG is that it brings something to the 
> community that already existed (ie, an NPO umbrella) but doesn't seem to 
> offer anything else. Structure is easy; I can think of quite a few NPO 
> umbrellas besides GTALUG that could have been used to front open source 
> community programs; they'd probably even do the grant paperwork in 
> return for a small piece of the project budget. What is lacking is 
> leadership, ideas, and the will (or energy) to carry out those ideas.
Actually the structure was something that TLUG lacked. The death of Jan made that very obvious. As for other umbrella groups being available, the people who initiated the incorporation (of which you were one) felt that no such group provided the structure that GTALUG ended up offering.
> 
> The community generally knows GTALUG's structure; what nobody seems to 
> know is its vision, its soul. You don't express a vision by stating an 
> intent to get behind whatever anyone brings to the table.
Everyone knows the vision: To advocate linux and the open source communities within Toronto and the GTA by providing a forum for people to get together and discuss the topics among interested people. To this end we provide an electronic forum (this mailing list), a forum where people can get together formally or informally (The various other meetings) and liason with people in industry and government for the purposes of promoting linux and open source adoption.

This vision has been stated often on this list, at the meetings, to people in industry. 
> 
> >Evan, my post was just an idea for those looking for ways to get some Gov money.
> >
> It did nothing of the sort. It noted someone else that received Gov 
> money and then invited community members (who were prepared to do all 
> the work) to use the GTALUG corporate structure from which to apply for 
> money for a similar project. It actually invites what would be a massive 
> failure, in that the Gov is unlikely to fund multiple projects that are 
> largely identical. A new computer recycling project is now very unlikely 
> to get Trillium money for a while.
> 

William invited interested members to submit ideas to be further discussed before going to the government. That is how many projects are started. Someone throws the idea 'wouldn't it be neat if ...' and people agree, remark, add  their two cents worth etc... the concept is called brainstorming. If such brainstorming methods result in something worth pursuing then one goes to the next level of trying to acquire funding for it.
 
> >Whether the project is under GTALUG or CLUE, is least of my concern.
> >  
> >
> Where did CLUE come into this?
> 
> My point is that there are a bunch of bodies besides GTALUG *or* CLUE 
> who could offer an umbrella structure. What extra does GTALUG have to 
> offer beyond a corporate registration? You didn't even offer to assist 
> with any such project beyond giving them your vote.
It has a thousand members on a mailing list that has at least a marginal interest in linux that can act as a sounding board for ideas. It has a dedicated board and executive that can try to get money or other resources from government or industry for such projects, failing that the board has access to people in government and industry that may be willing to fund this project within their own structure.

An idea need not ever stay with GTALUG to be successful. If the GTALUG board can act as a go-between between people with ideas and drive and those that need such things done, it has accomplished a valuable service to its members.

> 
> >The project needs to be run by someone who can naviagate the Gov grant system, as well as organize incoming/outgoing of computer parts.  All
> >I'm saying is, that's not me.  But, I'll help from my side of thing, as best as I can.
> >  
> >
> Be more specific. What would you -- what would GTALUG -- do to help? 
See above.

> What can it offer to someone with the idea? Project management? 
> Fundraising? Physical space? Publicity? Volunteer recruitment/incentives?
Possibly all of these. If nothing else simply introducing the someone with the idea with one or more of the contacts who may be interested is itself a service worth providing.

> 
> In any case, why try to duplicate a project that you know is already 
> started and funded? A new project that is essentially similar to 
> something already funded is highly unlikely to get new funds of its own.

I do believe that was being used as an example and not being serious entertained.

> 
> If someone wants to help in computer recycling, perhaps the best advice 
> is for that person to contact the group that received the grant. Maybe 
> they need to hire people now that they have the funds. Make that project 
> successful rather than running to create a new one, potentially leaving 
> the community with two half-projects competing with each other for 
> funds, volunteers and used computers.
> 
> >If you and CLUE have idea that you'll like to share with the rest of Linux community, then I'll work with you.
> >  
> >
> CLUE and I already have our hands full with a major the 
> not-yet-announced national open source project. In the meantime, There 
> is plenty of work to be done in other areas -- but first GTALUG needs 
> some vision and it needs to show some leadership if it's to play a 
> valuable role in the community (let alone attract significant membership).

As I stated we have not had any problem with leadership. I'm looking forward with to the announcement for the national open source project.

> 
> Run a flag up the pole and see who salutes. All that is certain is that 
> the status quo -- staring at an empty flagpole -- will get you nowhere.
> 
I believe that was what William was doing when you started attacking him.

Bill
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