[GTALUG] debian problems

[Gordon Chillcott]

Agreed, Chris.

And I'm not really even a Debian fan, let alone systemd.

Even though I use both.

Gordon


On Tue, 2014-11-18 at 11:40 -0500, Christopher Browne wrote:
> On 18 November 2014 00:48, Digimer <lists at alteeve.ca> wrote:
> >
> > On 17/11/14 11:55 PM, D. Hugh Redelmeier wrote:
> >>
> >>  From the outside, it looks as if the init system decision has
> taken a
> >> horrible toll on debian:
> >>
> <http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=MTg0MjM>
> >> Very sad.
> >
> >
> > I would place more of the blame on the (childish) reaction from Ian
> and others. From what I've seen, the resignations all are based on
> constant abuse and stress.
> >
> > How easily people forget that it's a group of volunteers.
> 
> 
> Right you are...
> 
> 
> You can't expect volunteers to put up with the abuse that paid staff
> are paid
> to take.
> 
> 
> From the comments from the fellow that was working on systemd
> packaging,
> 
> Tollef Fog Heen,  I think there was a further, rather broader,
> poisonous thing 
> going on, namely that a faction of those strongly against systemd
> were 
> behaving spitefully.
> 
> 
> This parallels the way a lot of political debate goes, these days; I
> gather
> 
> that our municipal Fords were seeing a lot of abusive comments, as,
> 
> doubtless, did Olivia Chow, and, based on the "it's like ISIS coming
> to
> 
> Toronto!!!" bit, doubtless John Tory saw some of this.
> 
> 
> The "GamerGate" thing sounds like it had a dose of the same.
> 
> 
> I think I'm seeing it just about any time someone picks up a rock
> 
> nearby anything that has the least bit of controversy around it; you
> discover that there are dreadful people saying corrosively horrible
> 
> things.
> 
> 
> 
> What's awful is that there are groups of people prepared to dump 
> poisonous vitrol, I would think, in an attempt to convince the 
> targets to give up and leave.
> 
> 
> It would be pretty terrible if that led to the Debian project getting
> 
> severely hobbled.  It's awful that people that don't like systemd
> 
> (and I don't count myself too much a fan; it definitely concerns
> me, technically) aren't trying to do things that are helpful to the
> project, but rather pouring acid into the works.
> 
> 
> I'm potentially an "opponent of systemd in Debian"; I don't want
> 
> the vitrol-pourers that were harassing Tollef Fog Heen to
> 
> be imagined to be part of "my side".  I don't want that nonsense
> associated with me.
> 
> -- 
> When confronted by a difficult problem, solve it by reducing it to the
> question, "How would the Lone Ranger handle this?"
> 
> 
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