OT: Website CMS

[Rajinder Yadav]

On Mon, Aug 24, 2009 at 11:32 PM, CLIFFORD
ILKAY<clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org> wrote:
> On 24/08/09 08:45 PM, Rajinder Yadav wrote:
>> This is excellent feedback, each response has raised more things to
>> consider. I was not looking for comparison on language, but lacking
>> any development/usage experience I wanted to know more about secondary
>> things available to these framework on a macro level. For instance
>> addition modules or tools that would make working with one framework
>> more productive. Of course great documentation is also required, any
>> module without good docs is useless to me.
>>
>> I guess I am looking for a framework that will allow me to stitch
>> functionality together easily. I don't want to write my own CMS,
>
>
> Define "CMS".
>
>
>> however I also don't want a site to look like it's a patch work of say
>> a wiki site, forum, blog, main landing page. If I later decide to
>> change the layout, add or remove functionality I would like to do it
>> in an efficient and painless manner from what's already out there.
>
>
> The question isn't "if" all of the aforementioned products will allow
> you create "seamless" sites. It's "How?".

Very true, this is more like what I meant to say.

>
>
>> I guess I still want flexibility from a programmer's prescriptive and
>> be able to create my own plumbing if needed. I would rather avoid
>> having to fight existing code to make it do something else or take
>> away things I don't want or need. If the framework makes this
>> difficult than I would not consider it.
>
>
> This is why when we spoke, I suggested to you Drupal and Django were
> good fits for what you wanted to do but as you told me about what was
> important to you, I suggested Django was probably the better choice. I
> find it's more developer-friendly than Drupal. Until you have done some
> actual development with both, it is very difficult for you to understand
> what I'm talking about when I talk about "flow". Django has a certain
> flow to it that is hard to describe. I find the whole code, test, debug
> cycle in PHP tedious. I don't want to output stuff to the browser just
> to prototype something. I want to be able to prototype in a shell
> interactively. With Django, typing "python manage.py shell" while in the
> project directory will drop you into the Python shell from where you can
> import anything in PYTHONPATH (imports bring into the current
> namespace), and start prototyping. You get instant feedback. If you have
> an error in your code, you have meaningful stack traces. You can inspect
> objects to get their docstring, their attributes, and their functions. I
> found that ipython accelerated how quickly I learned Django because the
> barriers to prototyping something were so low. I could just whip
> something up quickly and see the results without much fuss. If you go
> through the Django tutorial, you'll notice that they start you off with
> writing code interactively.
>

You know what, this key point really hit me today and ya I get it. I
recall our phone conversation, but it didn't sink in then. This is
totally the way I want to code, debug and try things out. It's much
faster than the Drupal/php way of trying to do the same thing.


>
>> As for my ignorance, I think I've learned from the past that as I
>> learn more, I find out how little I really know =) ... so I am trying
>> to at my older age to use wisdom and the knowledge and experience of
>> others to help me save both time and energy rediscovering things,
>> issues, problems, etc, I don't want to be committed so much in my
>> project that it becomes 'more' painful to go in another direction when
>> I find out something for myself.
>>
>> About Python, being a C++ developer I like using my braces { } to
>> denote code blocks, or any other visual indicator like 'end'
>>
>> I maybe be wrong about this, but read that python (only) uses
>> indentation to denote code blocks? I just don't want to be looking at
>> code that may have several nested blocks trying to line up code
>> blocks. That is what is stopping me from liking Python, that were I
>> stopped looking at Python. If I am wrong about this let me know.
>
>
> I *knew* you were going to say that, which is why I told you I'd bring
> tar and feathers. :)

Ha! when I read your earlier response I burst out laughing and knew
you knew what I might be thinking!!! You're right I need to get over
this silly bias or misconception about unreadable code, just as
William also pointed out =) ... that is why it's good to discuss these
things and bring them out into the open.


> That is a very silly reason to dislike a language.
> As Lennart (I think) posed once, "What do you have against readability?"
> Indentation to denote code blocks enforces a consistency in the code
> that makes it easier to read. That doesn't mean someone can't write
> obfuscated Python code. It just means that you're unlikely to see "holy
> wars" being fought over which is the better curly brace style,
>
> foo {
>  bla}
>
> foo
> {
>  bla
> }
>
> foo {bla}
>
> foo {
>  bla
>  }
>
> foo {
>  bla
> }
>
> Any decent editor, as William pointed out, and the various Python shells
> (I really like ipython), or the IDEs, which I don't use, deal with
> indentation for you. Get past this curly brace fixation of yours and I
> think you'll be amazed at how quickly you can become productive with Python.

This is good to know, more ignorance getting swept aside! Nice one
about the religious brace wars.

> --
> Regards,
>
> Clifford Ilkay
> Dinamis
> 1419-3266 Yonge St.
> Toronto, ON
> Canada  M4N 3P6
>
> <http://dinamis.com>
> +1 416-410-3326

-- 
Kind Regards,
Rajinder Yadav
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