ot-no free lunch

Thu Dec 29 10:57:38 UTC 2005

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No-free-lunch_theorem
http://atheism.about.com/b/a/075366.htm
http://www.computerworld.com/governmenttopics/government/legalissues/story/0,10801,95365,00.html
http://trends.newsforge.com/article.pl?
sid=04/03/06/139232&tid=149&tid=29&tid=31

Wow! 
This NFL-No Free Lunch phrase and theory has a wide variety of everyday
uses and applications.

I was using the NFL from animal behavior/training. 

Then there are a lot of IT companies using NFL to describe the Linux
open source model.  

Then there is a No Free Lunch branch of mathematics and theory.
The No Free Lunch theory and how it applies to all computer algorithms
is fascinating.
Equally fascinating is the NFL thoerem applied to biological systems
like evolution.
However, the argument it states NFL is not applicable to evolution,
since evolution is not trying to reach a pre-defined goal. (sort of)

Basically it seems, they are all related. No Free Lunch theory is
applicable to so many everyday things.

There is no free lunch! 
So is this why google and all the search engines dont work as well as
you'd like? :)

/teddy

On Wed, 2005-12-28 at 23:01 -0500, teddy mills wrote:
> 
> I am not sure if Evan is correctly understanding what I am trying to
> say.
> I reviewed his comments, but I differ on his views of my original
> message. 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Wed, 2005-12-28 at 12:00 -0500, Evan Leibovitch wrote:
> > teddy mills wrote:
> > 
> > >That basically means as I understand it, anything that is free, or you
> > >dont have to work for it, has no or very little value to you.
> > >  
> > >
> > Basic Logic 101 states that if your premise is flawed, most conclusions 
> > based on that premise will also be flawed. There are a lot of 
> > assumptions here to be challenged; whether conventional wisdom or 
> > spur-of-the-moment assertions, I agree with very little of what's been 
> > put forward as a foundation for anything to debate.
> > 
> > There is a big difference between a statement being often true and being 
> > a truism. It is a mistake to elevate one's own experiences into 
> > universal constants.
> > 
> > >If you have 10 computers, getting or giving up a computer means very little to you.
> > >
> > If you have 10 computer users in your family, or if each serves a unique 
> > purpose, losing one will certainly mean something.
> > 
> > >The DATA on the computer may mean a LOT to you because YOU HAD TO WORK, perhaps a lot, to get that DATA.
> > >
> > Then again, if a lot of it was downloaded from other sites, it's not 
> > necessarily difficult to recover.
> > 
> > >A video store owner cares nothing about renting movies. He or she is sick of movies. He/she would rather read a good book.
> > >  
> > >
> > Again, true in some cases, but not all. Some people *do* love what they 
> > do and give value to it beyond the pay. As I went through journalism 
> > school, I found that getting one's name in print or one's face on the 
> > air would motivate people to work for far less than their market value. 
> > Media outlets, of course, exploit this vanity.
> > 
> > As for the specific example, my son works part time at Blockbuster 
> > _because_ he loves movies. He can rent 10 movies a week for free and 
> > takes maximum advantage of the perk. His knowledge and ability to talk 
> > about movies makes him more valuable to his employer, but he gets a 
> > genuine thrill about recommending good stuff and keeping people away 
> > from crap.
> > 
> > >Think of anything you have a lot of, or can get for free. Books at the library I dont care about. I can get them anytime! I care about them when they are on hold for me, because I went to the effort of searching, and then waiting, and making the trip to get the book on hold. I had to invest some work, even though the book itself was free.
> > >  
> > >
> > I can't disagree more. I use the library because there are books I want 
> > to read but don't need to own. The fact that I don't directly pay for 
> > the borrowing privilege does not make the books themselves less 
> > valuable. The last book I borrowed was a university textbook that was 
> > only available as a $200 hardcover. The book has value to me, but so 
> > does the library offer value to me by making the borrowing facility 
> > available. The fact that the book was on the shelves and didn't needed 
> > to be on hold does not make the book more or less valuable.
> > 
> > >This is what Linux is having a problem with the human reward/value system.
> > >  
> > >
> > This only peripherally touches on Linux's problem with the human reward 
> > value system. Indeed, I would suggest that this "problem" is one that 
> > many other fields would covet.
> > 
> > >Is there a way to make people "invest" some time and effort so they can get their "book (ie. linux) for free, but now assign a great deal of value to it? *much like getting a free library book thats on hold ?)
> > >  
> > >
> > Bad premise, bad conclusion.
> > 
> > Not only is there a way, but such way is in use. That way is what gave 
> > you Linux and sendmail and so much else of what is in the open source world.
> > 
> > >We can download and install almost 300 different versions of Linux. For the cost of some time, and about $1 in CDs.
> > >
> > The value of such technology is not in simply amassing them, it's from 
> > choosing one of those 300 versions, loading it on your computer, and 
> > using it to accomplish something useful to you. There is no real value 
> > realized until then (unless you have a first edition Yggdrasil CD to put 
> > on eBay).
> > 
> > >You can give someone a deck of cards, but you cannot force them to be the Poker World Champion. They have to want to become the World poker champ.
> > >
> > Somewhere deeply buried here is an attempt to make some point about 
> > scarcity of resources and the foundation for human incentives. Most of 
> > these points have been made before, and debated at length, including the 
> > very real difference between cost and value.
> > 
> > I'm not meaning to belittle Teddy's opinions, but I'm having a very hard 
> > time finding something substantive with which to agree, disagree or debate.
> > 
> > - Evan
> > 
> > --
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> --
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> TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns
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