Happy Ada Lovelace Day!

[Lennart Sorensen]

On Wed, Mar 25, 2009 at 10:14:57AM -0400, Marc Lanctot wrote:
> Has it occurred to you that maybe [most] women just aren't as interested  
> in the subject matter as men? Sure, it's intimidating that CS is fully  
> of geeky men (even for some men!).. do you really think you can make the  
> generalization that women avoid it because of people within are socially  
> inept?

Yes it has, and research has been done apparently (my wife would be able
to provide links I am sure) that show that it isn't the subject matter
that is the problem.  So yes I really do think that is a fair
generalization.

If you look throughout history at various types of jobs, it has often
been the case that initially when something is new and cutting edge,
only men do it.  When it starts to become mainstream and more routine
and no longer "cool" for the "cowboys" to be doing it, you get a lot
more women involved.  So there is hope for CS some day.  It just has to
become normal enough that the "jocks" no longer want to do it and move
onto something else.  At some point doctors were pretty much only male.
These days that is far from the case.  At one point teachers were almost
all male (although I guess in some places the studens were all male too
in some cases).

As long as girls are brought up being told "be careful" and "be gentle"
and boys are encouraged to explore and have excitement, we are going
to have issues with genders in certain fields if they require a certain
attitude to survive.  CS is unfortunately to a large extent one of those
environments where people are very competitive and pushy.  That doesn't
suit people who have always been told to be nice and gentle.  Hopefully
that will change.  In fact I hope both the environment and the upbringing
of both genders can be brought in order.

> I've been through CS and had female friends that have been through it as  
> well as some through engineering. What I can say is sometimes it was  
> pretty awkward for them, yes.. and I wouldn't have wanted to be in their  
> position at times. But please don't imply that this environment would  
> stop them from following their career.

At some point a lot of people will decide that the environment is too
hostile to be worth it no matter how much the field interests you.

> I'm with Dave and Peter on this one; even after their requests to end  
> this nonsense people are still following up the thread with juvenile  
> follow-up jokes. There was a lot of this at the last meeting.. so much  
> that it took Colin about two times what it would normally take anybody  
> to give that talk. I was quite amazed.

Oh dear.  I have read comments about meetings in the past, although I
have never made it to one.  Sounds like one of the less good days.

> I'm not without a sense of humor either; I appreciate and contribute my  
> fair share of geek humor when it's appropriate .. but there are 600 or  
> so people on this list, most of whom I'm sure would rather talk about  
> Linux-related subjects than exchange geeky jokes.
>
> So can we please bury this?

It will die out soon.

-- 
Len Sorensen
--
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