Microsoft GPS

Sun Jan 11 13:18:07 UTC 2009

On 1/10/09, ted leslie <tleslie-RBVUpeUoHUc at public.gmane.org> wrote:
> ah ok that makes it a bit harder (i.e. not borrowing from other sources),
> means i probably have to get the "Tracks", then at home place the googlemap
> (and maybe also mapquest)
> names to the traces, get a print out, then verify the names
> on another trip,
> and change anything (hopefully) very little, to the actual street names on
> the signs.
> (so as not to fall into any traps).

Some of the OSM mappers take a camera and/or audio recorder and/or
note pad along with them to keep notes about what they have seen,
street names. For myself, I have been known to take a commercial map
with me on a mapping run, and then scribble notes about what is/isn't
right with the map as I travel (I take some pride in the number of
commercial map errors caught :-) ). Bottom line though, if I don't see
it, then it doesn't get entered...

> i am not seeing any satellite photos (as layers) on OSM, even when i toggle
> all the layers on the (+) pullout,
> and i look in north US too, am I missing something? or is the satellite
> stuff still being hooked up in north America?

If you go into the Potlatch editing screen you will see Yahoo aerial
photos (if they are available for the place in question, and Yahoo's
coverage is limited), otherwise the Landsat sat. photos will be
displayed. Toronto is covered by Yahoo photos, while Perth is only
visible via Landsat. The Yahoo photos are good enough to make out
individual streets, while Landsat aren't.

> i see people marking walking trails, washrooms, schools, etc,
> do you know how, if possible, one would mark
> "snowmobile routes" not on a licensed trail, and "snow mobile routes of a
> licensed trail" (if permit holder),
> kinda means having two other "pathing" colours (meta tagging) and having to
> explain it somewhere,
> or does OSM not really have the custom power yet?

You can enter anything, with any tag you want, but unless you use one
of the "approved" tags it will not show up on the rendered map.

The range of approved tags is slowly expanding  and you can see a list
of additions being proposed here:

wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Category:Proposed_features_"Proposed"

> i could just imagine that if people start logging stuff like snowmobile
> trails, biking trails, etc,
> that would rarely come up no the commercial products, that eventually ..
> well.. screw the commercial products! :)

Bicycle routes are already part of the standard, and some of the bike
routes inside Toronto are documented in OSM (though, not by me...).

> seems like this OSM is a good candidate to be like Linux is to the OS world,
> ... to be (in time), at the end of the day,
> the best place to go for your mapping and GPS details!

Yes.

> -tl
>
>
> On Sat, 10 Jan 2009 21:12:26 -0500
> "Colin McGregor" <colin.mc151-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org> wrote:
>
>> On 1/10/09, ted leslie <tleslie-RBVUpeUoHUc at public.gmane.org> wrote:
>> > nice example of why this project may be preferable to the googlemaps,
>> > and
>> > such,
>> >
>> > this year my father got my wife and I a GPS for
>> > a present, i said TOMTOM, he was kinda   "why?"
>> > i said, its linux, thats all i need to say,
>> > i didn't know if it was a good one or what,
>> > i just said, its the one i gotta have.
>> > So he got me a 920 (which i think was top of the line one at the
>> > time, except without any hookup to get traffic reports),
>> > then i told him that garmin is turning to linux for there top of the
>> > line
>> > stuff.
>> > He did research for a few months and got a TOMTOM 930 at boxing day.
>> > He smokes the Steve Jobs tobacco pretty heavy,
>> > so this actaully was surprizing, but he researched the hell
>> > out of the stuff an concluded (cause he has basically no budget issue),
>> > that the TOMTOM 930 rules.
>> > Anyways, i moved up to Thornbury, 15 km west of Bluemountain,
>> > and I was out for my first real exploring with my snowmobile today.
>> > I sort of got lost, and figure I gotta keep my 920 with me,
>> > when i go out.
>> > So now i mix this , with your hobby here, the updating of the open
>> > street
>> > project,
>> > and the talk of GPS's and such, and I conclude that here is what woule
>> > be
>> > nice:
>> >
>> > I cant very well have a laptop cracked open on my sled,
>> > and the TOMTOM is linux, and the kernel is available
>> > and appearently one can "hobby" with it.
>> >
>> > So is it not possible, or perhaps a good idea for someone to write,
>> > a peice of software that gets the linux GPS unit (in this case the
>> > TOMTOM
>> > series),
>> > to just work as the plugged in portable? i mean why do i want another
>> > machine tied to it?
>> > surely the unit itself can do everything?
>> > i got a 4GB flash card expansion, and about 3GB free on the built in
>> > flash.
>>
>> Well, off hand I don't know about the Tomtom GPS units, but I have
>> (long story), the long term loan of a Garmin Vista HCx GPS. This
>> Garmin model can record GPS tracks on to a flash memory card, which
>> can then be downloaded on to your PC (USB port on the unit). The unit
>> will run for quite a few hours off of 2 AA size batteries. The track
>> files are readable by the JOSM Open Street Map editing program. So,
>> for things like tracking the banks of the Tay River in Perth, Ontario
>> (where the Microsoft GPS ... would not be a lot of use), the Garmin is
>> great.
>>
>> Flip side of this, the Microsoft GPS is a LOT cheaper than the Garmin,
>> so, if you have a car / truck / etc., and want to try mapping the
>> Microsoft option is great...
>>
>> > i'd love to be on the sled, and just have it data log , (and i think
>> > mine
>> > has accelerometers in it too),
>> > and then use it if i get lost and for "info" and when i get home, i can
>> > x-ref my "trip"
>> > to one of the other map projects to get the street names and then dump
>> > my
>> > data to the
>> > open project(s), that would be ideal, heck maybe there is meta data
>> > ability
>> > to specify good snowmobile routes?
>>
>> Well, on of the central points of OSM is to ONLY ever refer to
>> non-proprietary data sources. So, walking around collecting names off
>> street signs is fine, going to one of commercial maps or other
>> copyright protected sources is UNACCEPTABLE. The OSM people have
>> permission to use data from Landsat sat. photos and some Yahoo aerial
>> photos (Landsat offers the whole world in poor detail, Yahoo offers
>> excellent detail, but only in a limited number of places).
>>
>> Further, since I have been looking at this sort of thing it is an odd
>> funny/scary just how many errors I have seen in commercial maps. Word
>> is that some map companies deliberately add errors in order to catch
>> people copying... Yes, I have on rare occasion caught errors in OSM,
>> but at least those errors I could fix.
>>
>> > i found the link you gave kinda slow, i hope they expand there servers
>> > suffiencently as this grows,
>> > hate for the idea to die just because the service isnt "fast".
>> > also i found when you zoom out, it take a huge amount of time to
>> > calculate
>> > and show you the map -
>> > oh well, its probably a relatively new project, and I am sure they'll
>> > improve.
>>
>> Well, OSM has caught on at different rates in different nations. Have
>> a look at the level of detail available in Germany at some point.
>> Holland and the UK are almost as good as Germany. Data from the US
>> Census Bureau has been added to OSM, which overall is good, but the US
>> Census people are not interest in roads that don't have people, and in
>> some areas the Census people were ... sloppy, some roads that are arcs
>> on the ground got entered as straight lines... In other words in the
>> US, the issue is, spot errors, spot incomplete areas, add more
>> detail...
>>
>> A deal was recently reached between the OSM people and the Canadian
>> government so there will be at lot of Canadian data being added in the
>> not to distant future. Mind you if the US example works out here,
>> there will be a lot of detail still to be added / corrected...
>>
>> For example, when I was in Perth, ON, in Sept. I saw a small new
>> housing development being built, but no way to drive down the new road
>> for this development. When I was down in Perth at Christmas, the road
>> was open to traffic, and thanks to me :-) , said road is now in OSM.
>> Not really possible for commercial maps to keep that up to date, but
>> for OSM, no problem...
>>
>> > but, yeah if i can just get my tomtom to data log, i will certainly love
>> > to
>> > dump my data to this openstreetmap
>> > project. Heck for my area, I could put in an insane amount of detail.
>>
>> Any data you can get from direct observation (be they readings off a
>> GPS, or reading a street sign) or other non-proprietary sources would
>> be appreciated.
>>
>> > -tl
>> >
>> > On Sat, 10 Jan 2009 07:54:44 -0500
>> > "Colin McGregor" <colin.mc151-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org> wrote:
>> >
>> >> On 1/9/09, Evan Leibovitch <evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org> wrote:
>> >> > Merv Curley wrote:
>> >> >> Hi all
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I suppose Google would work but...
>> >> >>
>> >> >> My Microsoft Trips 2007/GPS has arrived from Factorydirect.  Now
>> >> >> that I
>> >> >> have
>> >> >> spent $30, what do I need?  [ Do I curse Hugh or bless him for the
>> >> >> $20
>> >> >> coupon?]
>> >> >>
>> >> > The value of having a computer-attached GPS is in the ability it
>> >> > gives
>> >> > you to help participate in the Open Street Map Project:
>> >> > http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Main_Page
>> >> >
>> >> > This is an attempt to duplicate the global mapping used in systems
>> >> > such
>> >> > as Google Maps, but without their proprietary mapping data.
>> >> >
>> >> >> Never having used a GPS, does it only work in the great outdoors?
>> >> >> It
>> >> >> comes
>> >> >> with a little suction cup, I assume this is stuck to a car
>> >> >> windshield?
>> >> >>
>> >> > Correct. Using the Microsoft software, you could use that unit, plus
>> >> > your computer, like a very large portable GPS system.
>> >> > With Linux its value is to help CREATE data rather than just use it.
>> >> > See
>> >> > http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Beginners'_Guide to find out how.
>> >>
>> >> Much of Perth, ON was mapped using a Microsoft GPS, laptop in the
>> >> passenger front seat of a car, GPS sitting on the front dashboard.
>> >> Bottom line with GPS units is that you want as clear a view of as much
>> >> of the sky as possible all the time or you may run into no readings or
>> >> bad readings. You can have issues with GPSs in canyons, be they ones
>> >> created by mother nature in the wild, or the concrete canyons of a
>> >> major city centre...
>> >>
>> >> When you have what amounts to a geographic wiki interestingly odd
>> >> things can happen, like:
>> >>
>> >> www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=40.78377&lon=-119.20424&zoom=16&layers=00B0FTF
>> >>
>> >> The above is a map of part of the Nevada's Black Rock desert and for
>> >> 50 weeks each year it is just ... desert. For just over one week each
>> >> year it is home to the "Burning Man" arts festival (which concludes
>> >> with the torching of a multi-story tall mannequin). So, people want to
>> >> to note where things will be within this temporary festival site, with
>> >> a geographic wiki that isn't an issue... This is the sort of thing
>> >> that would not happen with the likes of say Google Maps.
>> >>
>> >> >> What Linux software is needed for the GPS.  I think Colin has said
>> >> >> but
>> >> >> I
>> >> >> can't find the post.
>> >> >>
>> >> > see
>> >> > http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Making_Tracks_with_Homebrew-ware#Linux
>> >> >
>> >> > The gpsd and associated packages are available as standard Ubuntu
>> >> > packages, and I imagine they're available pre-packaged for other
>> >> > systems
>> >> > as well.
>> >> >
>> >> >> if someone can just post where to go to find this kind of info, I
>> >> >> would
>> >> >> be
>> >> >>
>> >> >> appreciative.  No need to spend time answering my niggling
>> >> >> questions.
>> >> >>
>> >> > HTH.
>> >> >
>> >> > - Evan
>> >> --
>> >> The Toronto Linux Users Group.      Meetings: http://gtalug.org/
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>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > ted leslie <tleslie-RBVUpeUoHUc at public.gmane.org>
>> >
>> --
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>
>
> --
> ted leslie <tleslie-RBVUpeUoHUc at public.gmane.org>
>
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