OT - Cellphone billing

Mon Mar 3 16:26:12 UTC 2008

Hi all,

This was a petty good discussion and it looks like a good number of
people would drop their current phone company if their was a choice.
Lucky for them, there isn't much we can do. Who are the people behind
Virgin Mobile by the way?

Since I have pretty of time today, I feel like writing, I will comment
on some of the discussion that was happening here.

Equipment purchases:
An issue of amortization and equipment replacement was raised and
Christopher explained very well how the two are completely unrelated.
I couldn't have done better. We didn't however mention how the
accounts guys figure out at what time its fiscally proper to replace
an equipment.

They usually look at the current cost of maintaining the equipment at
hand. Issues like skills availability, energy cost, features anything
they can think of. Then, they add up all that cumulative cost until
the equipment end of life - lets say its 5, making sure to bring the
future cost to its present value. Deduct that amount from the revenue
the equipment generates will generate in 5 years - Remember again to
change future revenue to present value. That balance is then compared
with the new gear revenue generation minus initial cost and its
maintenance for fee for 5 years. At the point the later become higher
than the former, thats the time to go shopping.

Of course, thats not the only reason for replacement. Politics in the
management can override all those hard numbers. Seen case where
replacement was primary driven by the fact the equipments were being
sold by a company that the management owned.

Population in Canada:
Some of us feel that Canada's low population justify the cell phone
charges. I not really sure I agree with that statement. A good way of
evaluating if that would be the reason is to compare it with another
country with the same population and population density - well I will
be stretching the later as Canada's land mass is huge.

Kenya population is around 34M and Canada's population is around 33M
(According to wikipedia) The former has 2 mobile phone service
provider and the later 3. In my opinion, their cost - set up and up
keep are similar. Ehh, not entirely true as labour is cheaper in Kenya
compared Canada. The hardware cost should be about the same however.
The population spread is similar - North West Kenya has less the 5
people per km squared. However, for $40, the basic service here would
give you 3 times air time you get here. And the billing is in seconds,
not minutes. How does the former 2 companies manage to do that and
also remain the most profitable companies in that country?

Public/Private  - Completely out of topic
Another issue that was raised by Len Sorensen was people's attitude
toward privatization. I couldn't help but empathize with him. I was
once walking in the street in Nairobi with a friend. Then, we came
across a guy lying by the road. He had a huge wound on the leg that
had clearly not be attend for a long time. The wound was yellowish,
the whole leg swollen, a seen you look at once and don't want to see
it again. Then I commented how bad our government is for not making
hospital access cheap. My friend was totally shocked. She asked "Are
you some kind of communist?" I couldn't understand why she thought my
political leaning is worse than helping a guy clearly in pain. The
point is, majority of people seem to think government getting in
business is bad, plain and simple.

This is unfortunately not correct. Both systems - Capitalist and
socialism had their merits and pains. The thing is, our "socialist"
media has managed to alienate a large number of population from
thinking public is good in any circumstance. Nothing could be further
from the truth than that. Some business are simply monopolistic in
nature and putting them in private hand don't change that. Others may
require a system that emphasis effectiveness over efficiency. Ever
thought what would happen if we privatize Canada post?

Some example of system that runs well in public hands is transport.
Before Ms Thatcher, was British prime minister, rail system in Britain
and most of the west Europe was a public system. Somehow, she thought
that was a terrible error and she had to fixed it. Today, rail service
in Britain fairs badly compared with France, where it is still in
public hands. Its now even impossible for French government to sell
it. How would you explain it to the masses?

Another good example as it relate to Canada politics is energy
industry. I understand that since Toronto city is having money issues,
someone is advicing them to sell an energy company. Europe has gone
the same route. Britain and Germany selling out the energy companies
while the usual suspect - France held on to them. Sometime last year,
their was a bbc article that showed that despite Britain selling out
their energy industry, they were actually paying more than French.
Worse, the French energy was more reliable. Okay, one may say Toronto
is selling out because there is no money, but then would you sell your
house just because your bank balance is low?

One last thing, it funny people expect government to get out of the
business industry while things get really bad, they then call for
government intervention. Damn, that a really bad deal. Imagine you had
a friend and he/she suggested you start a business on condition that,
when things are good he keeps the profit, but if the business fair
badly, he/she has to clear the mess. You would mostly retort "F***
you". Thats however what happen every time governments intervene. A
very sad story for tax payers.

Now, one may be thinking, this guy is clearly a communist. No, I am
not, I also believe there are industries governments should not be
allowed to get into. A good example is entertainment. I love listening
to Nickleback and thanks Canada's tax payers for that, but how the
heck does it make Canada's economy competitive? Educative documentary
is understandable, but entertainment, you are taking it too far.

Sorry for the long email. I think I got a lot of time yesterday.

Regards,
William

On 02/03/2008, D. Hugh Redelmeier <hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org> wrote:
> | From: James Knott <james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org>
>
>
> | So, grandfather those little old ladies and the pulse lines. As the pulse
>  | lines get canceled, they're gone for good.
>
>
> That's exactly what they did.  Perhaps 15 years ago.  Long enough that
>  those little old ladies weren't old at the time :-).
>
>  In other words, DTMF has been a mandatory option for a *long* time.
>
>  Any kind of mandatory option is pretty annoying to customers, not just
>  phone customers.  The "network access charge" on cell phone bills
>  smells like that.
>
>
>  | > I doubt that it had anything to do with poverty activists.  Poor folks
>  | > cannot get pulse-only lines.  Only folks that already have them.
>  | >
>  |
>  | They do make a lot of noise, whenever it comes up. As I said above,
>  | grandfather the pulse lines at the old rate
>
>
> Done, long ago.
>
>
>  | and make touch tone the new basic
>  | service.
>
>
> Not done.  I guess that the CRTC cannot see charging folks different
>  amounts for what is listed as the same service.
>
>
>  | > I would agree with eliminating the tariff, but not just adding it to
>  | > everyones bill.
>  | >
>  | Once it's part of basic service, some adjustment will hopefully occur.
>
>
> Like what?  If 95% of customers pay the $2.80 a month now, do you
>  think that Bell would accept anything other than 100% paying it?
>
>  My motto: I'd rather be subsidized than subsidize.  And that's what it
>  is.  I cost them more than a DTMF customer.  They have put a block on
>  my line to prevent me dialing with DTMF (I can switch to DTMF to get
>  through menu systems after I dial the phone number).
>
> --
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