From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 1 09:00:34 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Tue, 01 Aug 2006 05:00:34 -0400 Subject: Linux on the GPL3 @ Groklaw Message-ID: <44CF1832.2000409@telly.org> Here's the piece he wrote: http://www.groklaw.net/comment.php?mode=display&sid=20060727140038810&title=DRM+%26quot%3BMisunderstood%26quot%3B&type=article&order=&hideanonymous=0&pid=465722#c465745 And the full thread: http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20060727140038810#comments -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 1 13:38:56 2006 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins Witteman) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 09:38:56 -0400 Subject: Sending email on a schedule? In-Reply-To: <1154380692.21349.273.camel-H4GMr3yegGDiLwdn3CfQm+4hLzXZc3VTLAPz8V8PbKw@public.gmane.org> References: <20060731201841.GA2496@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060731205814.GA29928@wp.magstar.net> <1154380692.21349.273.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> Message-ID: <20060801133856.GA5471@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> On Mon, Jul 31, 2006 at 05:18:12PM -0400, John Van Ostrand wrote: > On Mon, 2006-07-31 at 16:58 -0400, William Park wrote: > > Yes, it's called 'at' and 'crontab'. It would be helpful if we know > what ways that at/crontab were deficient. > > There is more than that. You will need to know how to send email via > command line. Thank you William and John. Yes, I can do all that. What's missing from at and cron? A unified, simple, easy-to-use interface, that's what. Remind and wyrd (or calendar) are close, but they don't send email by default, and that's what I need. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From stephenc-wtWqQT8woy8 at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 1 13:58:33 2006 From: stephenc-wtWqQT8woy8 at public.gmane.org (Stephen W. Clarke) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 09:58:33 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Linux Gigabit NIC In-Reply-To: <20060726173257.GJ13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <22862.72.38.22.170.1153925305.squirrel@72.38.22.170> <20060726173257.GJ13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <17174.72.38.22.170.1154440713.squirrel@72.38.22.170> Len (and everyone else on this list), Thanks for your tips, but I think I must be missing something important. Can you tell me where I went wrong? Distro: WhiteBox EL4 Kernel: 2.6.9-34.0.1.EL gcc: 3.4.5 I installed the card. When I run: lspci | grep -i ethernet I get: 00:0a.0 Ethernet controller: D-Link System Inc: Unknown device 4b01 (rev 11) 00:12.0 Ethernet controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT6102 [Rhine-II] (rev 78) I added: alias eth1 sk98lin at the end of /etc/modprobe.conf but when I run: ifconfig eth1 192.168.xxx.xxx netmask 255.255.255.0 up I get: SIOCSIFADDR: No such device eth1: unknown interface: No such device SIOCSIFNETMASK: No such device SIOCGIFADDR: No such device SIOCSIFBROADCAST: No such device eth1: unknown interface: No such device On boot I get: eth1 does not appear to be present delaying initialization. What am I missing? Thanks, Stephen > On Wed, Jul 26, 2006 at 10:48:25AM -0400, Stephen W. Clarke wrote: >> Can any of you recommend a Gigabit NIC that will work easily with >> multiple >> versions of linux? I'd like to limit the time spent mucking about with >> drivers. I'm currently using a mix of WhiteBox EL4, CentOS EL4, Fedora >> Core 4, Fedora Core 5 and Ubuntu 6.06. >> >> I've been looking at the D-Link - DGE-530T but mostly because of the >> price >> point. > > That one should work well. It uses the marvel yukon / sysconnect chip, > which is supported by the sk98lin/skge driver in linux. > > I have mainly used the same chip onboard, but never had a problem in the > last 2 years of using it. > > -- > Len Sorensen > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- Stephen W. Clarke Marketing and Communications Officer Nray Services Inc. 56A Head Street Dundas, ON L9H 3H7 CANADA Tel: (905) 627-1302 x14 Fax: (905) 627-5022 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 1 15:11:47 2006 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 11:11:47 -0400 Subject: Sending email on a schedule? In-Reply-To: <20060801133856.GA5471-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20060731201841.GA2496@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060731205814.GA29928@wp.magstar.net> <1154380692.21349.273.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> <20060801133856.GA5471@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <20060801151147.GA3627@wp.magstar.net> On Tue, Aug 01, 2006 at 09:38:56AM -0400, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: > On Mon, Jul 31, 2006 at 05:18:12PM -0400, John Van Ostrand wrote: > > On Mon, 2006-07-31 at 16:58 -0400, William Park wrote: > > > > Yes, it's called 'at' and 'crontab'. It would be helpful if we know > > what ways that at/crontab were deficient. > > > > There is more than that. You will need to know how to send email via > > command line. > > Thank you William and John. Yes, I can do all that. What's missing > from at and cron? A unified, simple, easy-to-use interface, that's > what. Remind and wyrd (or calendar) are close, but they don't send > email by default, and that's what I need. If you mean GUI interface to all those time/date fields, then a quick GTK dialog box may be an answer. If you mean a third-party software designed to read your mind, well... :-) -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 1 20:15:50 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Tue, 01 Aug 2006 16:15:50 -0400 Subject: Linux on the GPL3 @ Groklaw In-Reply-To: <44CF1832.2000409-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg@public.gmane.org> References: <44CF1832.2000409@telly.org> Message-ID: Evan Leibovitch wrote: > Here's the piece he wrote: > > http://www.groklaw.net/comment.php?mode=display&sid=20060727140038810&title=DRM+%26quot%3BMisunderstood%26quot%3B&type=article&order=&hideanonymous=0&pid=465722#c465745 > > > And the full thread: > > http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20060727140038810#comments I get the feeling that there might be some context missing here? I think that that bottom link should be as follows: http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20060727140038810 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 1 17:06:36 2006 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins Witteman) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 13:06:36 -0400 Subject: Sending email on a schedule? In-Reply-To: <20060801151147.GA3627-SBOj+Tp9hCvc29vQ/UIUOA@public.gmane.org> References: <20060731201841.GA2496@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060731205814.GA29928@wp.magstar.net> <1154380692.21349.273.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> <20060801133856.GA5471@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060801151147.GA3627@wp.magstar.net> Message-ID: <20060801170636.GA7304@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> On Tue, Aug 01, 2006 at 11:11:47AM -0400, William Park wrote: >> Thank you William and John. Yes, I can do all that. What's missing >> from at and cron? A unified, simple, easy-to-use interface, that's >> what. Remind and wyrd (or calendar) are close, but they don't send >> email by default, and that's what I need. > >If you mean GUI interface to all those time/date fields, then a quick >GTK dialog box may be an answer. If you mean a third-party software >designed to read your mind, well... :-) Actually, a curses or CLI interface is what I was hoping for. However, if you know of software designed to read my mind, that *would* be easier. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 1 17:29:53 2006 From: john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org (John Van Ostrand) Date: Tue, 01 Aug 2006 13:29:53 -0400 Subject: Sending email on a schedule? In-Reply-To: <20060801170636.GA7304-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20060731201841.GA2496@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060731205814.GA29928@wp.magstar.net> <1154380692.21349.273.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> <20060801133856.GA5471@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060801151147.GA3627@wp.magstar.net> <20060801170636.GA7304@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <1154453393.21349.355.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> On Tue, 2006-08-01 at 13:06 -0400, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: > Actually, a curses or CLI interface is what I was hoping for. However, > if you know of software designed to read my mind, that *would* be > easier. Ahh, that's DWIMNWIS: Do what I mean, not what I say. -- John Van Ostrand Net Direct Inc. Chief Technology Officer 564 Weber St. N. Unit 12 Waterloo, ON N2L 5C6 map john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org Ph: 519-883-1172 ext.5102 Linux Solutions / IBM Hardware Fx: 519-883-8533 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 1 18:34:08 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 14:34:08 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Obnoxious self promotion Message-ID: <20060801183408.44418.qmail@web88201.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Just a little self promotion. The August issue of Tux Magazine is out, and there is an article by me about KDETV (pages 21 - 24). Funny things can happen when working to a deadline. During the writing of the article I had a bit of trouble with the TV tuner card I was using, so I could only get a handful of channels. Now, to illustrate the screen capture function I needed an image taken from the TV. Ideally I would have loved to grab screen shots from "Space" or the "Discovery" channel (my favourites :-) ), but that wasn't an option for me and I was running out of time. Any event, I caught Jan Wong, a journalist with the Globe and Mail Newspaper being interviewed on Vision TV. Not ideal in my books, but good enough. So, I figure the editor will put that in as a little thumbnail image to show the screen capture feature works... Last page of the article and a BIG image of Jan Wong... You never know... Well, next up on my plate articles on "Doom 3 & Quake 3" (almost done), "Procmail" and "Freespire". Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 1 22:54:05 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Tue, 01 Aug 2006 18:54:05 -0400 Subject: Obnoxious self promotion In-Reply-To: <20060801183408.44418.qmail-57gzaD/7YRGB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060801183408.44418.qmail@web88201.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Colin McGregor wrote: > Just a little self promotion. > > The August issue of Tux Magazine is out, and there is > an article by me about KDETV (pages 21 - 24). > > Funny things can happen when working to a deadline. > During the writing of the article I had a bit of > trouble with the TV tuner card I was using, so I could > only get a handful of channels. Now, to illustrate the > screen capture function I needed an image taken from > the TV. Ideally I would have loved to grab screen > shots from "Space" or the "Discovery" channel (my > favourites :-) ), but that wasn't an option for me and > I was running out of time. Any event, I caught Jan > Wong, a journalist with the Globe and Mail Newspaper > being interviewed on Vision TV. Not ideal in my books, > but good enough. So, I figure the editor will put that > in as a little thumbnail image to show the screen > capture feature works... Last page of the article and > a BIG image of Jan Wong... You never know... > > Well, next up on my plate articles on "Doom 3 & Quake > 3" (almost done), "Procmail" and "Freespire". Shouldn't that now be Quake 4? The linux port is great. Wine and Halflife 2 would be good as well. What about tremulous? It's based on the q3 engine but is heavily modified. Totally free too :) Jamon -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 1 19:05:22 2006 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 15:05:22 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Sending email on a schedule? In-Reply-To: <1154453393.21349.355.camel-H4GMr3yegGDiLwdn3CfQm+4hLzXZc3VTLAPz8V8PbKw@public.gmane.org> References: <20060731201841.GA2496@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060731205814.GA29928@wp.magstar.net> <1154380692.21349.273.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> <20060801133856.GA5471@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060801151147.GA3627@wp.magstar.net> <20060801170636.GA7304@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <1154453393.21349.355.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> Message-ID: On Tue, 1 Aug 2006, John Van Ostrand wrote: > On Tue, 2006-08-01 at 13:06 -0400, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: > >> Actually, a curses or CLI interface is what I was hoping for. However, >> if you know of software designed to read my mind, that *would* be >> easier. > > > Ahh, that's DWIMNWIS: Do what I mean, not what I say. Richard Stallman has a story about that. He tells the story that he worked on a (non-unix) system once with an rm command that attempted to use the DWIMNWIS principal - with predictable consequences. Since then I understand he's been rather hostile to the idea of DWIMNWIS. Cheers, Rob -- Robert Brockway B.Sc. Phone: +1-905-821-2327 Senior Technical Consultant Urgent Support: +1-416-669-3073 OpenTrend Solutions Ltd Email: support-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Web: www.opentrend.net We are open 24x365 for technical support. Call us in a crisis. If you are emailing regarding an open ticket please consider mentioning the ticket ID as this will assist us in responding as quickly as possible. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 1 19:22:06 2006 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 15:22:06 -0400 Subject: Sending email on a schedule? In-Reply-To: <20060801170636.GA7304-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20060731201841.GA2496@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060731205814.GA29928@wp.magstar.net> <1154380692.21349.273.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> <20060801133856.GA5471@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060801151147.GA3627@wp.magstar.net> <20060801170636.GA7304@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <20060801192206.GA15834@wp.magstar.net> On Tue, Aug 01, 2006 at 01:06:36PM -0400, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: > On Tue, Aug 01, 2006 at 11:11:47AM -0400, William Park wrote: > >> Thank you William and John. Yes, I can do all that. What's missing > >> from at and cron? A unified, simple, easy-to-use interface, that's > >> what. Remind and wyrd (or calendar) are close, but they don't send > >> email by default, and that's what I need. > > > >If you mean GUI interface to all those time/date fields, then a quick > >GTK dialog box may be an answer. If you mean a third-party software > >designed to read your mind, well... :-) > > Actually, a curses or CLI interface is what I was hoping for. However, > if you know of software designed to read my mind, that *would* be > easier. Play around with select minute in 0 15 30 45; do [ "$minute" ] && break done echo "minute={$minute}" -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 1 19:26:29 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 15:26:29 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Obnoxious self promotion In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20060801192629.85273.qmail@web88203.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- Jamon Camisso wrote: > Colin McGregor wrote: > > Just a little self promotion. > > > > The August issue of Tux Magazine is out, and there > is > > an article by me about KDETV (pages 21 - 24). [snip] > > Well, next up on my plate articles on "Doom 3 & > Quake > > 3" (almost done), "Procmail" and "Freespire". > > Shouldn't that now be Quake 4? The linux port is > great. Wine and > Halflife 2 would be good as well. What about > tremulous? It's based on > the q3 engine but is heavily modified. Totally free > too :) During the exchange of e-mails between myself and editor Kevin Shockey, I was looking at what was already on my shelf to write about. Yes, I likely should have suggested Quake 4, but I noted Quake 3 because I already had a copy of that on hand. As is, Doom 3 gets about 3/4 of the text in my current draft. Nice thing about Quake 3 is that you can run that on a Pentium II quite nicely, assuming you have a half decent video card (Quake 3 and Doom 3 are both somewhat fussy in that area). As for the other games, I may suggest those for future articles, as doing some justice to Quake 3 and Doom 3 in 2,000 words is a tight fit... Colin McGregor > Jamon -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tlug-neil-8agRmHhQ+n2CxnSzwYWP7Q at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 1 20:38:46 2006 From: tlug-neil-8agRmHhQ+n2CxnSzwYWP7Q at public.gmane.org (Neil Watson) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 16:38:46 -0400 Subject: ethernet bonding in Redhat AS 4 64bit Message-ID: <20060801203846.GC13297@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> I've been attempting to bond two NICs together in an active-passive mode. I cannot do this reliably. When I do get it working and run "service network restart" without error, connectivity is permanently dropped. I think is has something to do with how the bonding module is loaded. I've duplicated this behaviour on two separate servers. modprobe.conf lines: alias bond0 bonding options bond0 miimon=100 mode=1 ifcfg-bond0: DEVICE=bond0 USERCTL=no ONBOOT=yes BROADCAST=176.16.1.255 NETWORK=172.16.1.0 NETMASK=255.255.255.0 GATEWAY=172.16.1.1 IPADDR=172.16.1.203 ifcfg-eth0: DEVICE=eth0 USERCTL=no ONBOOT=yes MASTER=bond0 SLAVE=yes BOOTPROTO=none ETHTOOL_OPTS="duplex full autoneg off" ifcfg-eth1: DEVICE=eth1 USERCTL=no ONBOOT=yes MASTER=bond0 SLAVE=yes BOOTPROTO=none ETHTOOL_OPTS="duplex full autoneg off" -- Neil Watson | Gentoo Linux System Administrator | Uptime 5 days http://watson-wilson.ca | 2.6.16.19 AMD Athlon(tm) MP 2000+ x 2 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 1 21:15:15 2006 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 17:15:15 -0400 Subject: Linux-friendly PCI dialup modem? In-Reply-To: <20060731161659.GS13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20060730225702.GA12330@waltdnes.org> <20060731161659.GS13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20060801211515.GA6950@waltdnes.org> On Mon, Jul 31, 2006 at 12:16:59PM -0400, Lennart Sorensen wrote > An internal modem has a 16550A compatible UART that does 115200. > A serial port card has a 16550A compatible UART that does 115200. > > I fail to see what could possibly make any speed difference between the > internal and external modem. Unless the internal modem is very badly > designed and gets lots of interference from noise in the computer case > itself, then there should be no difference. I find that my 1999 Dell with a USR PCI internal gets 45,300 connect versus 50,666 for an old external X2 flash-upgraded to v90. This is true for linux, and was also true for Windows (The Dell came with 98SE, my last Windows purchase). -- Walter Dnes In linux /sbin/init is Job #1 My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 1 23:07:35 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Tue, 01 Aug 2006 19:07:35 -0400 Subject: Linux-friendly PCI dialup modem? In-Reply-To: <20060801211515.GA6950-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20060730225702.GA12330@waltdnes.org> <20060731161659.GS13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060801211515.GA6950@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <44CFDEB7.2090204@rogers.com> Walter Dnes wrote: > On Mon, Jul 31, 2006 at 12:16:59PM -0400, Lennart Sorensen wrote > >> An internal modem has a 16550A compatible UART that does 115200. >> A serial port card has a 16550A compatible UART that does 115200. >> >> I fail to see what could possibly make any speed difference between the >> internal and external modem. Unless the internal modem is very badly >> designed and gets lots of interference from noise in the computer case >> itself, then there should be no difference. > > I find that my 1999 Dell with a USR PCI internal gets 45,300 connect > versus 50,666 for an old external X2 flash-upgraded to v90. This is > true for linux, and was also true for Windows (The Dell came with 98SE, > my last Windows purchase). > Years ago, when modems were popular, there were often differences between different modem brands and models. For example, the US Robotics Couriers often out performed the USR Sportsters. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jmyshrall-6duGhz7i8susTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 00:47:48 2006 From: jmyshrall-6duGhz7i8susTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (John Myshrall) Date: Tue, 01 Aug 2006 20:47:48 -0400 Subject: Obnoxious self promotion In-Reply-To: References: <20060801183408.44418.qmail@web88201.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <44CFF634.5060706@golden.net> Jamon Camisso wrote: > Colin McGregor wrote: >> Just a little self promotion. >> >> The August issue of Tux Magazine is out, and there is >> an article by me about KDETV (pages 21 - 24). >> Funny things can happen when working to a deadline. >> During the writing of the article I had a bit of >> trouble with the TV tuner card I was using, so I could >> only get a handful of channels. Now, to illustrate the >> screen capture function I needed an image taken from >> the TV. Ideally I would have loved to grab screen >> shots from "Space" or the "Discovery" channel (my >> favourites :-) ), but that wasn't an option for me and >> I was running out of time. Any event, I caught Jan >> Wong, a journalist with the Globe and Mail Newspaper >> being interviewed on Vision TV. Not ideal in my books, >> but good enough. So, I figure the editor will put that >> in as a little thumbnail image to show the screen >> capture feature works... Last page of the article and >> a BIG image of Jan Wong... You never know... >> >> Well, next up on my plate articles on "Doom 3 & Quake >> 3" (almost done), "Procmail" and "Freespire". > > Shouldn't that now be Quake 4? The linux port is great. Wine and > Halflife 2 would be good as well. What about tremulous? It's based on > the q3 engine but is heavily modified. Totally free too :) > > Jamon And it runs quite well on a 900 Mhz Sempron with nVidia 64 MB video card. I would also add Nexuiz to this list. Kudos to the ports on Quake 4 and Doom 3. Doom Resurrection of Evil was a bit different on the install. John -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From zleap-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 02:00:42 2006 From: zleap-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (paul sutton) Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 03:00:42 +0100 Subject: Linux cd burning and meeting up in toronto In-Reply-To: <20060801183408.44418.qmail-57gzaD/7YRGB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060801183408.44418.qmail@web88201.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: I am looking at getting a laptop to use while in canada, As most seem to come with XP installed I will probably download kanotix (debian sid), to use instead of windows, Do I need any extra software in order to burn a kanotix iso file to a cd-r so I can boot and install. Also I am in toronto on Aug 4th to 7th and staying at the global village backpackers (King / spadina intersection) so if anyone wants to meet up we could do, hopefully I will have a laptop by then so we could perhaps have a go at at least burning an iso usintg doze. am used to kde right click and burn but I know windows is not that easy when it comes to handling iso files. The global village has free wireless, which is helpful. thanks for any help. Paul Sutton _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live?? Messenger has arrived. Click here to download it for free! http://imagine-msn.com/messenger/launch80/?locale=en-gb -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 04:50:18 2006 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 00:50:18 -0400 Subject: Linux Gigabit NIC In-Reply-To: <17174.72.38.22.170.1154440713.squirrel-u5iS8elThxsi7FR4L9eesA@public.gmane.org> References: <22862.72.38.22.170.1153925305.squirrel@72.38.22.170> <20060726173257.GJ13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <17174.72.38.22.170.1154440713.squirrel@72.38.22.170> Message-ID: <20060802045018.GA11339@waltdnes.org> On Tue, Aug 01, 2006 at 09:58:33AM -0400, Stephen W. Clarke wrote > I added: > alias eth1 sk98lin at the end of /etc/modprobe.conf > > but when I run: > ifconfig eth1 192.168.xxx.xxx netmask 255.255.255.0 up > > I get: > SIOCSIFADDR: No such device > eth1: unknown interface: No such device > SIOCSIFNETMASK: No such device > SIOCGIFADDR: No such device > SIOCSIFBROADCAST: No such device > eth1: unknown interface: No such device > > On boot I get: > eth1 does not appear to be present delaying initialization. > > What am I missing? I noticed a thread at... http://www.linuxcompatible.org/Driver_for_DLink_DGE-530T_Gigabit_PCI_on_FC4_t33856.html According to it, you should use the "skge" driver. If loaded as a module, change /etc/modprobe.conf to read... alias eth1 skge Make sure skge is built. For nic drivers, I just build them right into the kernel, but that's my personal preference. -- Walter Dnes In linux /sbin/init is Job #1 My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 11:30:19 2006 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 07:30:19 -0400 Subject: ethernet bonding in Redhat AS 4 64bit In-Reply-To: <20060801203846.GC13297-ajb9/b42oWj7qFZT6RBq9oSPOIov7LNK@public.gmane.org> References: <20060801203846.GC13297@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> Message-ID: <44D08CCB.8030201@execulink.com> Neil Watson wrote: > I've been attempting to bond two NICs together in an active-passive > mode. I cannot do this reliably. When I do get it working and run > "service network restart" without error, connectivity is permanently > dropped. I think is has something to do with how the bonding module is > loaded. I've duplicated this behaviour on two separate servers. > > modprobe.conf lines: > alias bond0 bonding > options bond0 miimon=100 mode=1 > > ifcfg-bond0: > DEVICE=bond0 > USERCTL=no > ONBOOT=yes > BROADCAST=176.16.1.255 > NETWORK=172.16.1.0 > NETMASK=255.255.255.0 > GATEWAY=172.16.1.1 > IPADDR=172.16.1.203 > > ifcfg-eth0: > DEVICE=eth0 > USERCTL=no > ONBOOT=yes > MASTER=bond0 > SLAVE=yes > BOOTPROTO=none > ETHTOOL_OPTS="duplex full autoneg off" > > ifcfg-eth1: > DEVICE=eth1 > USERCTL=no > ONBOOT=yes > MASTER=bond0 > SLAVE=yes > BOOTPROTO=none > ETHTOOL_OPTS="duplex full autoneg off" > Maybe don't use "service network restart" if you can bring it all up manually. Something must be amiss in the start-up scripts. And who cares if it don't come up ONBOOT when uptime is measured in years. Are they identical nics using the same driver? Are they using the same interrupt? I don't have any answers, but I am interested in why you're attempting to do this. Are you trying to create something like a full duplex port aggregator tap? Wouldn't you need to bond three nics together for that? Or is this just to passively monitor the fused nic box? The reason I'm curious is because I searched for something like this, and the closest I came to it was an iTap from Net Optics. But with a sticker of 4k each, they're quite out of my reach. Good Luck, greg -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 13:48:43 2006 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 09:48:43 -0400 Subject: Linux cd burning and meeting up in toronto In-Reply-To: References: <20060801183408.44418.qmail@web88201.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On 8/1/06, paul sutton wrote: > I am looking at getting a laptop to use while in canada, As most seem to > come with XP installed I will probably download kanotix (debian sid), to > use instead of windows, Always interesting to see what distros people choose ;-) > > Do I need any extra software in order to burn a kanotix iso file to a cd-r > so I can boot and install. your burning software has to know how to deal with .iso files (disk images) What I have done, in the past, is to use a bootable linux to burn a disk (presumes CD AND CDR drives) cause not all Winders burning apps can cope. (almost all linux apps, though) If you want to take the easy road, c'mon down to linuxcaffe and slap $6 (+tax) on the counter ! > > Also I am in toronto on Aug 4th to 7th and staying at the global village > backpackers (King / spadina intersection) so if anyone wants to meet up we > could do, hopefully I will have a laptop by then so we could perhaps have a > go at at least burning an iso usintg doze. If you're yearning to hang with fellow enthusiasts, we got geek chic AND caffe cachet ! (warning; the coffee's so good, it will spoil you !) > > am used to kde right click and burn but I know windows is not that easy when > it comes to handling iso files. Windose ... yawn ! we have free-as-in-beer disks, too ! snap up an ubuntu 5.10 to do your burning dirtywork ! > > The global village has free wireless, which is helpful. Our wireless is SO free.. like.. ya don't even have to pay for it ! ... wait.. it's even freeer than that ! I would go on and on, but I gotta go bake muffins ! :-D happy travels, djp -- djp-tnsZcVQxgqO2dHQpreyxbg at public.gmane.org www.linuxcaffe.ca 326 Harbord Street, Toronto, M6G 3A5, (416) 534-2116 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mike.kallies-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 14:10:57 2006 From: mike.kallies-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Mike Kallies) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 10:10:57 -0400 Subject: Linux cd burning and meeting up in toronto In-Reply-To: References: <20060801183408.44418.qmail@web88201.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <92ee967a0608020710i7ed9e4f3k95b3ebcd99b0b6@mail.gmail.com> > am used to kde right click and burn but I know windows is not that easy when > it comes to handling iso files. Sometimes it can be tough to find software that works at all on Windows. This'll let you burn ISOs. Free as in beer: http://www.cdburnerxp.se/ http://www.snapfiles.com/get/cdburnerxp.html http://www.cdburnerxp.se/help/license Their site is slow today, you might have to go straight to that second URL. (Hey, this is on-topic. It's how to burn an ISO on Windows so as to install Linux.) -Mike -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 14:24:53 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 10:24:53 -0400 Subject: Linux-friendly PCI dialup modem? In-Reply-To: <20060801211515.GA6950-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20060730225702.GA12330@waltdnes.org> <20060731161659.GS13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060801211515.GA6950@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <20060802142453.GU13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 01, 2006 at 05:15:15PM -0400, Walter Dnes wrote: > I find that my 1999 Dell with a USR PCI internal gets 45,300 connect > versus 50,666 for an old external X2 flash-upgraded to v90. This is > true for linux, and was also true for Windows (The Dell came with 98SE, > my last Windows purchase). Well it is possible that the internal modem does get interference in that machine. I don't think I ever managed over 45333 on an external USR that was upgraded to v90 as well. Which model was the external? I have the courier v.everything, although I hardly ever use it for anything anymore. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 14:36:00 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 10:36:00 -0400 Subject: Linux Gigabit NIC In-Reply-To: <17174.72.38.22.170.1154440713.squirrel-u5iS8elThxsi7FR4L9eesA@public.gmane.org> References: <22862.72.38.22.170.1153925305.squirrel@72.38.22.170> <20060726173257.GJ13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <17174.72.38.22.170.1154440713.squirrel@72.38.22.170> Message-ID: <20060802143600.GV13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 01, 2006 at 09:58:33AM -0400, Stephen W. Clarke wrote: > Len (and everyone else on this list), > > Thanks for your tips, but I think I must be missing something important. > Can you tell me where I went wrong? > > Distro: WhiteBox EL4 > Kernel: 2.6.9-34.0.1.EL > gcc: 3.4.5 > > I installed the card. > > When I run: > lspci | grep -i ethernet > > I get: > 00:0a.0 Ethernet controller: D-Link System Inc: Unknown device 4b01 (rev 11) > 00:12.0 Ethernet controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT6102 [Rhine-II] (rev > 78) The problem is that dlink's PCI device ID wasn't in the driver yet in that old kernel. Also 2.6.17 had a few versions where someone accidentally moved the PCI ids to the sky2 driver, breaking the dlink card supposedly. The driver works fine with the card, it just doesn't know it. You need a newer kernel, or to patch in the device ids to the source of your current kernel, and compile it again. Adding the dlink PCI id to skge or sk98lin sources should deal with it as far as I know. Someone at least thought the sky2 driver should work, and moved the dlink to there. Not sure if that is the right driver for it (although the sky2 is certainly not in 2.6.9). -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 14:45:58 2006 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 10:45:58 -0400 Subject: Dual core Intel... how hot? Message-ID: <20060802144557.GA17952@wp.magstar.net> How hot (temperature wise) does Intel's dual core run, compared to Pentium-4 3.0GHz? -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From stephenc-wtWqQT8woy8 at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 14:48:18 2006 From: stephenc-wtWqQT8woy8 at public.gmane.org (Stephen W. Clarke) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 10:48:18 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Linux Gigabit NIC In-Reply-To: <20060802045018.GA11339-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <22862.72.38.22.170.1153925305.squirrel@72.38.22.170> <20060726173257.GJ13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <17174.72.38.22.170.1154440713.squirrel@72.38.22.170> <20060802045018.GA11339@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <32540.72.38.22.170.1154530098.squirrel@72.38.22.170> This suggestion was the ticket. The thread below let me to this thread. http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=187770 Which in turn made me check the cd that came with the card. (Duh!) The D-Link CD includes a script that rebuilds the kernel with the drivers in it. Unzip. Make a simlink to the kernels directory and run the install.sh file. Vola. Drivers installed and NIC works! Go figure! Stephen > On Tue, Aug 01, 2006 at 09:58:33AM -0400, Stephen W. Clarke wrote > >> I added: >> alias eth1 sk98lin at the end of /etc/modprobe.conf >> >> but when I run: >> ifconfig eth1 192.168.xxx.xxx netmask 255.255.255.0 up >> >> I get: >> SIOCSIFADDR: No such device >> eth1: unknown interface: No such device >> SIOCSIFNETMASK: No such device >> SIOCGIFADDR: No such device >> SIOCSIFBROADCAST: No such device >> eth1: unknown interface: No such device >> >> On boot I get: >> eth1 does not appear to be present delaying initialization. >> >> What am I missing? > > I noticed a thread at... > http://www.linuxcompatible.org/Driver_for_DLink_DGE-530T_Gigabit_PCI_on_FC4_t33856.html > > According to it, you should use the "skge" driver. If loaded as a > module, change /etc/modprobe.conf to read... > alias eth1 skge > > Make sure skge is built. For nic drivers, I just build them right > into the kernel, but that's my personal preference. > > -- > Walter Dnes In linux /sbin/init is Job #1 > My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- Stephen W. Clarke Marketing and Communications Officer Nray Services Inc. 56A Head Street Dundas, ON L9H 3H7 CANADA Tel: (905) 627-1302 x14 Fax: (905) 627-5022 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 14:59:36 2006 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 10:59:36 -0400 Subject: Linux In The Park 2006 Message-ID: Well hello there, my fine, fat and flightless friends ! How's the herring ? I bet you could go for a nice cold glacier, about now ! If I understand correctly, the members of the GTAlug executive (you know who you are) have agreed the Linux In The Park (or LitP) will be held this year on Saturday, August 26 (event times TBA) at Bickford Park, across from linuxcaffe. http://www.linuxcaffe.ca/contact The date is one day after the famous initial usenet post, my Linus Torvals, announcing the first release of linux. We would have LITP on the 25th, but we'll have more fun on a Saturday. The agenda is still up in the air, but we have several major thrusts; 1) outreach Lets use this as an occasion to introduce our hairy own selves to non-geek members of the community. Between now and then, let's identify other communities/ organizations who (whether they know it or not) would greatly benefit from some help in the Open Source department, and invite representatives for some stimulating dialog. 2) exchange We got skillz and we got stuff ! Methinks it's an opportunity for a repeat of last years, highly successful, high-tech yard-sale/ swap-meet. It's also an opportunity for the larger propellers amongst us to help the newbies get their systems working properly. How about a wireless workshop ? or demos of brilliant open source apps ? (if things need infrastructure, we can shuffle groups through the caffe) 3) fun and frivolity ! Let's bring games and be prepared to get silly ! (no lawn darts please !) How about a water slide ? 4) food (yes, I know, this should be #1) Bar-B-Q, salads, beverages, baked good, ethnic treats, BRING IT ON ! We'll be putting together some sort of wiki to ensure that we don't end up with 67 kilos of potato salad and 2 bottles of coke ! maybe on the GTAlug site ? Sy ? just a couple of things that we're working on; a 10ft inflatable tux ! (IMHO, a must-have) an outdoor screening of revolutionOS (after dark, obviously) lots of free stuff ! So mark the date on your calendar and be ready to do some prep work ! see you there, djp -- djp-tnsZcVQxgqO2dHQpreyxbg at public.gmane.org www.linuxcaffe.ca 326 Harbord Street, Toronto, M6G 3A5, (416) 534-2116 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 15:51:22 2006 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 11:51:22 -0400 Subject: Linux In The Park 2006 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20060802155122.GA18132@wp.magstar.net> On Wed, Aug 02, 2006 at 10:59:36AM -0400, David J Patrick wrote: > on > Saturday, August 26 (event times TBA) > at > Bickford Park, across from linuxcaffe. > http://www.linuxcaffe.ca/contact > 4) food > (yes, I know, this should be #1) > Bar-B-Q, salads, beverages, baked good, ethnic treats, BRING IT ON ! > We'll be putting together some sort of wiki to ensure that we don't > end up with 67 kilos of potato salad and 2 bottles of coke ! maybe on > the GTAlug site ? Sy ? That's too complicated. I want 2 sausages and 1 coke. How much? -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 15:53:44 2006 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 11:53:44 -0400 Subject: Linux In The Park 2006 In-Reply-To: <20060802155122.GA18132-SBOj+Tp9hCvc29vQ/UIUOA@public.gmane.org> References: <20060802155122.GA18132@wp.magstar.net> Message-ID: On 8/2/06, William Park wrote: > > That's too complicated. I want 2 sausages and 1 coke. How much? that'll be $7, NEXT ! -- djp-tnsZcVQxgqO2dHQpreyxbg at public.gmane.org www.linuxcaffe.ca 326 Harbord Street, Toronto, M6G 3A5, (416) 534-2116 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 16:14:34 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 12:14:34 -0400 Subject: Linux In The Park 2006 In-Reply-To: References: <20060802155122.GA18132@wp.magstar.net> Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608020914t736b87f9x95d594d994a0e612@mail.gmail.com> On 8/2/06, David J Patrick wrote: > On 8/2/06, William Park wrote: > > > > That's too complicated. I want 2 sausages and 1 coke. How much? > > that'll be $7, > NEXT ! How much to get it super sized? =) -- Scott Elcomb http://w3.avidus.ca/ http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From stephenc-wtWqQT8woy8 at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 16:25:35 2006 From: stephenc-wtWqQT8woy8 at public.gmane.org (Stephen W. Clarke) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 12:25:35 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Secure Linux Distros Message-ID: <32190.72.38.22.170.1154535935.squirrel@72.38.22.170> I was just visiting http://distrowatch.com/ and noticed that EnGarde Secure Linux 3.0.8 was released today. I am always trying to find more secure ways of setting up my servers and was wondering if any of you have any experience with this distro or perhaps have a high security distro you'd recommend. So far my preference has been to use WhiteBox EL4, but I keep thinking that there should be something better. Any Thoughts? Stephen -- Stephen W. Clarke Marketing and Communications Officer Nray Services Inc. 56A Head Street Dundas, ON L9H 3H7 CANADA Tel: (905) 627-1302 x14 Fax: (905) 627-5022 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 16:48:21 2006 From: ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org (Andrew Hammond) Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 12:48:21 -0400 Subject: Linux In The Park 2006 In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f0608020914t736b87f9x95d594d994a0e612-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <20060802155122.GA18132@wp.magstar.net> <99a6c38f0608020914t736b87f9x95d594d994a0e612@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <44D0D755.2010008@ca.afilias.info> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Scott Elcomb wrote: > On 8/2/06, David J Patrick wrote: >> On 8/2/06, William Park wrote: >> > >> > That's too complicated. I want 2 sausages and 1 coke. How much? >> >> that'll be $7, >> NEXT ! > > How much to get it super sized? =) As a member of TLUG, chances are good that you're already super-sized. Perhaps, in the interest of maintaining our existing membership, we should serve crappy tasting tofu-dogs in a low-carb wrap, a tossed garden salad, dressing on the side and a diet soda. How about ribs. I loooooove BBQ ribs. Drew -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2.2 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFE0NdVgfzn5SevSpoRAvdmAJ4kCaBp5aaKOiBTNrZwwHEmrusGbgCfc89g j9hoxzw26i0HUKTi/r+cnQ0= =9eFZ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 17:27:16 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 13:27:16 -0400 Subject: Secure Linux Distros In-Reply-To: <32190.72.38.22.170.1154535935.squirrel-u5iS8elThxsi7FR4L9eesA@public.gmane.org> References: <32190.72.38.22.170.1154535935.squirrel@72.38.22.170> Message-ID: <20060802172716.GW13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 02, 2006 at 12:25:35PM -0400, Stephen W. Clarke wrote: > I was just visiting http://distrowatch.com/ and noticed that EnGarde > Secure Linux 3.0.8 was released today. I am always trying to find more > secure ways of setting up my servers and was wondering if any of you have > any experience with this distro or perhaps have a high security distro > you'd recommend. > > So far my preference has been to use WhiteBox EL4, but I keep thinking > that there should be something better. I recently saw an article that looked at how long it took different distributions to fix security issues. The "secure" distributions were basicaly the slowest, along with the enterprise ones (which of course have much higher testing standards to go through before releasing the fix. Actually RHEL was among the fastest, the others were not). http://searchsecurity.techtarget.com/originalContent/0,289142,sid14_gci1202417,00.html Interesting read, whether it is accurate or not. I am sticking with Debian. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 17:46:25 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 13:46:25 -0400 Subject: Dual core Intel... how hot? In-Reply-To: <20060802144557.GA17952-SBOj+Tp9hCvc29vQ/UIUOA@public.gmane.org> References: <20060802144557.GA17952@wp.magstar.net> Message-ID: <20060802174625.GX13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 02, 2006 at 10:45:58AM -0400, William Park wrote: > How hot (temperature wise) does Intel's dual core run, compared to > Pentium-4 3.0GHz? Well the temp depends on your cooling system. The power use also has something to say though. So here is what I have managed to find: Pentium 4 HT 3.0 (northwood) 81.9W Socket 478 Pentium 4 HT 3.0E (prescott) 89.0W Socket 478 Pentium 4 HT 531 (prescott) 84W LGA 775 Dual core: Smithfield Pentium D: 805,820 95W 830,840 130W Presler Pentium D: 915,920,925,930,945 95W 940,950,960 130W Of course the new dual core chips (Core 2 Duo) run in about half that power, and faster in pretty much everything, making buying anything based on the pentium 4 rather silly, unless you have a board that supports upgrading the cpu and can get one of them at the now very discounted prices. Right now it looks like when I build a new machine for my farther this fall, it will be a Core 2 Duo based system. His previous two machines have been Athlon based, with a PPro200 and 486 before those. Have to go with what is the best after all. The Pentium 2, 3 and especially 4 were never considered an option by me. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From talexb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 17:31:23 2006 From: talexb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Alex Beamish) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 13:31:23 -0400 Subject: Open Source song - "Write Code With You" In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f0607261344s2ba633abrb43ef72a0de2569a-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f0607261344s2ba633abrb43ef72a0de2569a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 7/26/06, Scott Elcomb wrote: > > A friend came up with some song lyrics a couple weeks ago. We'd been > talking about Linux, Open Source, and Atomic OS over some drinks. He > picked up a guitar and went to town. > > Anyway, we produced a quick recording last night on a laptop running > Ubuntu (thx Colin!) It's not a professional job by any means, but > we'd like to see what people think. > > http://atomos.sourceforge.net/#%5B%5BWrite%20Code%20With%20You%5D%5D Well, listening to Scott's recording of Write Code WIth You made me think .. I want to play too! So after some thought and some noodling around, I recorded, mixed and produced a recording of my own, and have uploaded it to a spare domain of mine .. please see http://www.prosco.ca/ for more on my take on Scott's song. Enjoy! -- Alex Beamish Toronto, Ontario -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 18:48:14 2006 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 14:48:14 -0400 Subject: Dual core Intel... how hot? In-Reply-To: <20060802174625.GX13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20060802144557.GA17952@wp.magstar.net> <20060802174625.GX13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20060802184814.GA18495@wp.magstar.net> On Wed, Aug 02, 2006 at 01:46:25PM -0400, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Wed, Aug 02, 2006 at 10:45:58AM -0400, William Park wrote: > > How hot (temperature wise) does Intel's dual core run, compared to > > Pentium-4 3.0GHz? > > Well the temp depends on your cooling system. The power use also has > something to say though. So here is what I have managed to find: > > Pentium 4 HT 3.0 (northwood) 81.9W Socket 478 > Pentium 4 HT 3.0E (prescott) 89.0W Socket 478 > Pentium 4 HT 531 (prescott) 84W LGA 775 > > Dual core: > Smithfield Pentium D: > 805,820 95W > 830,840 130W > Presler Pentium D: > 915,920,925,930,945 95W > 940,950,960 130W Thanks Lennart. Is Core 2 Duo cooler than current AMD 64? -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From wattst-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 18:50:39 2006 From: wattst-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Tom Watts) Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 14:50:39 -0400 Subject: Open Source song - "Write Code With You" In-Reply-To: References: <99a6c38f0607261344s2ba633abrb43ef72a0de2569a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <44D0F3FF.7000709@uoguelph.ca> Alex Beamish wrote: > On 7/26/06, *Scott Elcomb* > > wrote: > > A friend came up with some song lyrics a couple weeks ago. We'd been > talking about Linux, Open Source, and Atomic OS over some drinks. He > picked up a guitar and went to town. > > Anyway, we produced a quick recording last night on a laptop running > Ubuntu (thx Colin!) It's not a professional job by any means, but > we'd like to see what people think. > > http://atomos.sourceforge.net/#%5B%5BWrite%20Code%20With%20You%5D%5D > > > > Well, listening to Scott's recording of Write Code WIth You made me > think .. I want to play too! > > So after some thought and some noodling around, I recorded, mixed and > produced a recording of my own, and have uploaded it to a spare domain > of mine .. please see > > http://www.prosco.ca/ > > for more on my take on Scott's song. Enjoy! > > -- > Alex Beamish > Toronto, Ontario > Is it just me or is this song basically the same as the song that Adam Sandler plays for Drew Barrymore at the end of the movie "The Wedding Singer" (with different lyrics of course)? I haven't seen anyone point this out yet so I was under the impression that I'm crazy or that it's very obvious to everyone else. -Tom -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From talexb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 19:05:58 2006 From: talexb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Alex Beamish) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 15:05:58 -0400 Subject: Open Source song - "Write Code With You" In-Reply-To: <44D0F3FF.7000709-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f0607261344s2ba633abrb43ef72a0de2569a@mail.gmail.com> <44D0F3FF.7000709@uoguelph.ca> Message-ID: Hmm .. http://www.lyricsfreak.com/a/adam+sandler/grow+old+with+you_20003919.html I would have to admit that the lyrics on that page do fit the chord structure of Write Code With You pretty well. I was just doing a cover, so I didn't think about whether or not I'd heard the song before. I wonder if that counts as Fair Use. On 8/2/06, Tom Watts wrote: > > > Alex Beamish wrote: > > On 7/26/06, *Scott Elcomb* > > > wrote: > > > > A friend came up with some song lyrics a couple weeks ago. We'd > been > > talking about Linux, Open Source, and Atomic OS over some > drinks. He > > picked up a guitar and went to town. > > > > Anyway, we produced a quick recording last night on a laptop running > > Ubuntu (thx Colin!) It's not a professional job by any means, but > > we'd like to see what people think. > > > > http://atomos.sourceforge.net/#%5B%5BWrite%20Code%20With%20You%5D%5D > > < > http://atomos.sourceforge.net/#%5B%5BWrite%20Code%20With%20You%5D%5D> > > > > > > Well, listening to Scott's recording of Write Code WIth You made me > > think .. I want to play too! > > > > So after some thought and some noodling around, I recorded, mixed and > > produced a recording of my own, and have uploaded it to a spare domain > > of mine .. please see > > > > http://www.prosco.ca/ > > > > for more on my take on Scott's song. Enjoy! > > > > -- > > Alex Beamish > > Toronto, Ontario > > > > Is it just me or is this song basically the same as the song that Adam > Sandler plays for Drew Barrymore at the end of the movie "The Wedding > Singer" (with different lyrics of course)? I haven't seen anyone point > this out yet so I was under the impression that I'm crazy or that it's > very obvious to everyone else. > > -Tom > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- Alex Beamish Toronto, Ontario -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 19:24:18 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 15:24:18 -0400 Subject: Open Source song - "Write Code With You" In-Reply-To: References: <99a6c38f0607261344s2ba633abrb43ef72a0de2569a@mail.gmail.com> <44D0F3FF.7000709@uoguelph.ca> Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608021224x78f7614fwf705a7a1b16669d4@mail.gmail.com> > On 8/2/06, Alex Beamish wrote: > Hmm .. > > http://www.lyricsfreak.com/a/adam+sandler/grow+old+with+you_20003919.html > > I would have to admit that the lyrics on that page do fit the chord > structure of Write Code With You pretty well. I was just doing a cover, so I > didn't think about whether or not I'd heard the song before. > > I wonder if that counts as Fair Use. I hope so. Growing old with Open Source would be good, but... [...] > > On 8/2/06, Tom Watts wrote: > > Is it just me or is this song basically the same as the song that Adam > > Sandler plays for Drew Barrymore at the end of the movie "The Wedding > > Singer" (with different lyrics of course)? I haven't seen anyone point > > this out yet so I was under the impression that I'm crazy or that it's > > very obvious to everyone else. I've no idea; I've never seen the Wedding Singer. I watch movies periodically (mostly sci-fi, horror, or documentaries) and gave up TV years ago. We were having a couple beers and talking about the stuff that I'm into. He picked it up and ran with some of the ideas. It wasn't mean to be disrepectful in any way. I'll pull up the gmane thread and see what the folks at Digital Copyright Canada think. If there's a conflict, then I suppose we can take the files down and hopefully rework the music. Murphy hates me. I swear it. >:( -- Scott Elcomb http://w3.avidus.ca/ http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 19:33:11 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 15:33:11 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Dual core Intel... how hot? In-Reply-To: <20060802174625.GX13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20060802174625.GX13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20060802193311.32692.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- Lennart Sorensen wrote: > Right now it looks like when I build a new machine > for my farther this > fall, it will be a Core 2 Duo based system. His > previous two machines > have been Athlon based, with a PPro200 and 486 > before those. Have to go > with what is the best after all. The Pentium 2, 3 > and especially 4 were > never considered an option by me. While the numbers do vary somewhat over time plus things vary somewhat between AMD and Intel there is something that seems to stay constant. Namely, of CURRENT generation CPU chips, the cutting edge has about 1.5 - 2 times the performance of the trailing edge. Yet, the cutting edge chip will be 4 - 8 times the price of the trailing edge chip. In other words you pay a MASSIVE premium for a fairly modest performance boost. This explains why ALL of the boxes I have put together (starting with a AMD 386SX-25, back a lot of years ago :-) ) have been current technology, but near the trailing edge of the technology curve. While I am sure there are a FEW situations where going to the cutting edge is cost effective, that doesn't apply to 99% + of desktop users. Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 20:06:18 2006 From: ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org (Andrew Hammond) Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 16:06:18 -0400 Subject: Women in IT (Aug 3). Online freedom of speech (Aug 5th) In-Reply-To: References: <20060727160659.25705.qmail@web88210.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <44C9052D.5020003@telly.org> <44C90BAD.4030104@alteeve.com> <44C914F6.9000304@telly.org> Message-ID: <44D105BA.8080105@ca.afilias.info> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Robert Brockway wrote: > Years ago a female friend had lost her car in an accident. One Saturday > I drove her from dealership to dealership as she selected a new vehicle. > > One salesguy saw us walk in. He looked directly at me (ignoring my > friend) and said "What sort of car are you looking for sir?" To which I > answered "I'm not looking for a car". Even he realised immediately he'd > blown a potential sale out of the water. *sigh*. On the subject of Male Chauvinist Pig Car Salesmen... Before I settled on my Subaru STI, I tried out a number of alternatives, including the MazdaSpeed 6. It's a nice enough car, but I was really put off by the sales guy's comment: "I'm telling you man, it's a real pussy moistener." Not all guys who are looking for a car that's a fast ride are looking for the same features in a woman. I called his manager about that. Drew -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2.2 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFE0QW6gfzn5SevSpoRAgauAKCjFGP5KUykAcKTTPWZrXSNGKN6YQCgm8pv l63A3oHN3MvgGwyGoQW+yFU= =fsLG -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From wattst-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 20:22:12 2006 From: wattst-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Tom Watts) Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 16:22:12 -0400 Subject: Open Source song - "Write Code With You" In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f0608021224x78f7614fwf705a7a1b16669d4-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f0607261344s2ba633abrb43ef72a0de2569a@mail.gmail.com> <44D0F3FF.7000709@uoguelph.ca> <99a6c38f0608021224x78f7614fwf705a7a1b16669d4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <44D10974.80806@uoguelph.ca> Scott Elcomb wrote: >> On 8/2/06, Alex Beamish wrote: >> Hmm .. >> >> http://www.lyricsfreak.com/a/adam+sandler/grow+old+with+you_20003919.html >> >> I would have to admit that the lyrics on that page do fit the chord >> structure of Write Code With You pretty well. I was just doing a >> cover, so I >> didn't think about whether or not I'd heard the song before. >> >> I wonder if that counts as Fair Use. > > I hope so. Growing old with Open Source would be good, but... > > [...] >> > On 8/2/06, Tom Watts wrote: >> > Is it just me or is this song basically the same as the song that Adam >> > Sandler plays for Drew Barrymore at the end of the movie "The Wedding >> > Singer" (with different lyrics of course)? I haven't seen anyone point >> > this out yet so I was under the impression that I'm crazy or that it's >> > very obvious to everyone else. > > I've no idea; I've never seen the Wedding Singer. I watch movies > periodically (mostly sci-fi, horror, or documentaries) and gave up TV > years ago. > > We were having a couple beers and talking about the stuff that I'm > into. He picked it up and ran with some of the ideas. It wasn't mean > to be disrepectful in any way. > > I'll pull up the gmane thread and see what the folks at Digital > Copyright Canada think. If there's a conflict, then I suppose we can > take the files down and hopefully rework the music. > > Murphy hates me. I swear it. >:( > lol, sorry, I didn't mean to wear the hat of captain bringdown, but I think it's fine; I once heard a Christmas song on the Maccast podcast from the podsafe music network which was essentially a song I knew but with different lyrics. If that's possible, I think this would be this is fine. -Tom -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 20:31:23 2006 From: ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org (Andrew Hammond) Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 16:31:23 -0400 Subject: Women in IT (Aug 3). Online freedom of speech (Aug 5th) In-Reply-To: <44CAED89.9010409-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <20060727202833.35079.qmail@web88212.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <44C97CF2.3010106@alteeve.com> <44CA8FE1.5040507@ca.afilias.info> <44CAED89.9010409@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <44D10B9B.70707@ca.afilias.info> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Ahmad wrote: > Andrew Hammond wrote: >> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- >> Hash: SHA1 >> >>> I agree on that. As IT globalises (read: outsources), those >>> that are specialised have a hard time, because they're replaced in >>> waves. >> >> Outsourcing has turned out to be less cost-effective than originally >> imagined. People who whine about having lost their job to India, in my >> experience either were >> >> 1) code grinders or data entry technicians (assuming there's a >> difference) >> 2) working on boring crap anyway >> > > > No this is wrong. I use to think that India would never get decent > software engineering jobs and especially not R & D jobs but they have. > Oracle has lots of development jobs in India. Microsoft has a poured > lots of cash into a company to do R & D and software engineering for new > Microsoft products. Let's hope Indian software developers are worse > than U of Waterloo ones. Heck Microsoft has poured a lot of money into > Indian I.T. period. IBM is right behind them. Linux and Unix work in > India too. Check Monster India to see the jobs they have there. I saw > job postings that seem to fit the experience you have. Nothing like > hearing from the business drones in the media "Jobless recovery.". "I.T. > sector down 17% in Canada this year." Large companies that are IT oriented are one of the few cases for which it turns out to be cost-effective to off-shore. However since all of Big Biz supplies less than 30% of the jobs in IT, that's not a terribly big loss. Furthermore, it appears that while it's possible to off-shore structured development such as maintenance coding and stuff like 1st tier phone/email support, it is not a good idea to off-shore things like RAD efforts, anything that involve much user-interaction, and most sysadmin type stuff. Hence my comment about the interesting stuff still being local. I will however agree that it has made entry level positions harder to find. > I guess I might stay here and practice saying "Would you like to super > size that?" or I can try and get a visa to India(I think it is tough to > get one) and write software for about the same salary as a Fry > Technician here. Currently salaries for non-junior people in India range from 1/4 to 1/2 what you'd pay a Canadian. Which is indeed close to what you'd pay a burger flipper. > Awww yeah Dorothy, I.T. is going bye bye. Got any numbers to substantiate that? The numbers I've seen say that IT is still growing (albeit slower) in North America, despite off-shoring. This has apparently been driven by the small business sector, especially in geographic areas which are not traditionally tech-sectors. I wonder if that includes Kansas? Drew -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2.2 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFE0Quagfzn5SevSpoRAix1AKC6MKGUQEl0f+rc7ksKcosd6stb/QCfd8O+ 95bVFAZlL/7oDdB6Rig+Jcc= =t9lK -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 20:32:24 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 16:32:24 -0400 Subject: Open Source song - "Write Code With You" In-Reply-To: <44D10974.80806-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f0607261344s2ba633abrb43ef72a0de2569a@mail.gmail.com> <44D0F3FF.7000709@uoguelph.ca> <99a6c38f0608021224x78f7614fwf705a7a1b16669d4@mail.gmail.com> <44D10974.80806@uoguelph.ca> Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608021332y6c972bfbs26a6f37217ee39c0@mail.gmail.com> On 8/2/06, Tom Watts wrote: [...] > > I'll pull up the gmane thread and see what the folks at Digital > > Copyright Canada think. If there's a conflict, then I suppose we can > > take the files down and hopefully rework the music. > > > > Murphy hates me. I swear it. >:( > > > > lol, sorry, I didn't mean to wear the hat of captain bringdown, but I > think it's fine; I once heard a Christmas song on the Maccast podcast > from the podsafe music network which was essentially a song I knew but > with different lyrics. If that's possible, I think this would be this > is fine. Heh. Actually, I appreciate the heads up - much better to know than not. A response came in from the DCC list that suggests it is not "Fair Dealing," so I've removed access to the recording on our BBS. That email also suggests seeking Mr Sandler out, and seeing if he might be interested. Not sure how or where to start (other than the web) but if he's interested, it'd make one helluva story. Live and learn I guess. Thanks again. -- Scott Elcomb http://w3.avidus.ca/ http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 20:53:18 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 16:53:18 -0400 Subject: eWEEK Message-ID: <44D110BE.5030602@rogers.com> -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 21:10:29 2006 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 17:10:29 -0400 Subject: Dual core Intel... how hot? In-Reply-To: <20060802193311.32692.qmail-fjYszm/wOJWB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060802174625.GX13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060802193311.32692.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20060802211029.GA31148@wp.magstar.net> On Wed, Aug 02, 2006 at 03:33:11PM -0400, Colin McGregor wrote: > While the numbers do vary somewhat over time plus > things vary somewhat between AMD and Intel there is > something that seems to stay constant. Namely, of > CURRENT generation CPU chips, the cutting edge has > about 1.5 - 2 times the performance of the trailing > edge. Yet, the cutting edge chip will be 4 - 8 times > the price of the trailing edge chip. In other words > you pay a MASSIVE premium for a fairly modest > performance boost. True. But, we can only buy what's available. I hear that non Dual Core will be massively discounted soon, due to overstocking. At the moment, my main concern is heat. I'm already plagued by my harddisk coffee warmer. I don't think I can handle CPU toaster. -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 21:11:50 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 17:11:50 -0400 Subject: Women in IT (Aug 3). Online freedom of speech (Aug 5th) In-Reply-To: <44D105BA.8080105-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw@public.gmane.org> References: <20060727160659.25705.qmail@web88210.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <44C9052D.5020003@telly.org> <44C90BAD.4030104@alteeve.com> <44C914F6.9000304@telly.org> <44D105BA.8080105@ca.afilias.info> Message-ID: <44D11516.8050702@telly.org> Andrew Hammond wrote: >"I'm telling you man, it's a real pussy moistener." > > At this point, I suggest that comparisons between the automotive and IT industries aren't quite so valid anymore. >I called his manager about that. > > ... and he likely got applauded, certainly not punished, after you were gone. That kind of tactic can be very attractive to some when selling a car, (somewhat less useful when selling a computer or OS), especially if the car fails on more-practical criteria. \begin{digression} Some people indeed buy certain things for their potential pussy-moistening (or dick-hardening, depending on context) qualities; get over it. That such qualities are of no interest to you is just fine, but please spare the indignation -- of all possible things to be upset about in the world, this should be at the bottom of anyone's list (if on the list at all). Life's too short to be offended so easily. \end{digression} - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From michael.r.newman-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 21:26:07 2006 From: michael.r.newman-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Michael Newman) Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 17:26:07 -0400 Subject: External 56k USR Sportster modem up for grabs Message-ID: <44D1186F.9050207@gmail.com> Hi list, I have an external 56k US Robotics modem. It is assuredly *not* a Winmodem. Unfortunately it is missing the serial cable, but they are not hard to find. If you could use it, e-mail me and I can bring it to a GTALUG meeting or Linux in the Park. -Mike -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 21:36:22 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 17:36:22 -0400 Subject: Open Source song - "Write Code With You" In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f0608021332y6c972bfbs26a6f37217ee39c0-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f0607261344s2ba633abrb43ef72a0de2569a@mail.gmail.com> <44D0F3FF.7000709@uoguelph.ca> <99a6c38f0608021224x78f7614fwf705a7a1b16669d4@mail.gmail.com> <44D10974.80806@uoguelph.ca> <99a6c38f0608021332y6c972bfbs26a6f37217ee39c0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Scott Elcomb wrote: > On 8/2/06, Tom Watts wrote: > [...] >> > I'll pull up the gmane thread and see what the folks at Digital >> > Copyright Canada think. If there's a conflict, then I suppose we can >> > take the files down and hopefully rework the music. >> > >> > Murphy hates me. I swear it. >:( >> > >> >> lol, sorry, I didn't mean to wear the hat of captain bringdown, but I >> think it's fine; I once heard a Christmas song on the Maccast podcast >> from the podsafe music network which was essentially a song I knew but >> with different lyrics. If that's possible, I think this would be this >> is fine. > > Heh. Actually, I appreciate the heads up - much better to know than not. > > A response came in from the DCC list that suggests it is not "Fair > Dealing," so I've removed access to the recording on our BBS. That > email also suggests seeking Mr Sandler out, and seeing if he might be > interested. > > Not sure how or where to start (other than the web) but if he's > interested, it'd make one helluva story. > > Live and learn I guess. Thanks again. Not that you shouldn't be law abiding, but what does it really matter if you guys came up with a song, around a couple of beers, had a laugh. Screw Adam Sandler, it's your friend's song. There's absolutely no reason to give an inch -- no one is being hurt, no profits infringed (which is by no means harmful to anyone *being*). If everyone just gave up and stopped making music because it sounded like something else we'd all be listening to Muzak and Brittany Spears since they both come from a can. I'd say leave it up and come what may. Just like with code, if you haven't seen the original but wrote function or library that did something similar to a patented piece of code, it isn't really infringing is it? Ask Andrew Tridgell and see what he thinks. While the same may not go for inspired works of art, it damn well should. Apparently you've pulled it so I can't say for sure without hearing the song, but there are only so many chords to go around, and you can't patent or copyright those *yet* I hope. Without having written a song I'm in no position to say of course... The Barenaked Ladies nailed it with their song "It's all been done": "And if I put my fingers here, and if I say "I love you dear," And if I play the same three chords, will you just yawn and say It's all been done before?" Jamon -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 23:17:08 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 19:17:08 -0400 Subject: 4M more Linux laptops sold Message-ID: <44D13274.6020009@telly.org> The One Laptop Per Child initiative appears to be gaining momentum, though I can't say I'm surprised at which countries have each ordered one million systems: Thailand, Nigeria, Brazil and Argentina. http://ct.enews.eweek.com/rd/cts?d=186-4150-31-89-122426-483633-0-0-0-1 It wouldn't surprise me if Mexico, Malaysia and some eastern European countries were close behind. - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 2 23:42:54 2006 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 19:42:54 -0400 Subject: Linux-friendly PCI dialup modem? In-Reply-To: <20060802142453.GU13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20060730225702.GA12330@waltdnes.org> <20060731161659.GS13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060801211515.GA6950@waltdnes.org> <20060802142453.GU13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20060802234254.GA13205@waltdnes.org> On Wed, Aug 02, 2006 at 10:24:53AM -0400, Lennart Sorensen wrote > Well it is possible that the internal modem does get interference in > that machine. I don't think I ever managed over 45333 on an external > USR that was upgraded to v90 as well. Which model was the external? It was a USR X2, near the end of the model run. That was fortunate, because that meant it was flash-upgradeable. -- Walter Dnes In linux /sbin/init is Job #1 My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sacha-ctE++fEYmiYdc6zLPptBHg at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 00:07:37 2006 From: sacha-ctE++fEYmiYdc6zLPptBHg at public.gmane.org (Sacha Chua) Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 20:07:37 -0400 Subject: Women in IT (Aug 3). Online freedom of speech (Aug 5th) In-Reply-To: <20060727202833.35079.qmail-W5RQQfbthkOB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> (Colin McGregor's message of "Thu, 27 Jul 2006 16:28:33 -0400 (EDT)") References: <20060727202833.35079.qmail@web88212.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <87u04uisvq.fsf@sachachua.com> Hello, everyone! Colin McGregor writes: > sample. So beyond the poor social skills idea, to toss > another idea out, does it help to be born outside > Canada to become a woman techie? I'd say this suggests the idea that you have to be a pretty good and pretty lucky techie to travel. There are a *lot* of women in technology who don't get that opportunity. If anything, it's probably harder for foreign-born IT professionals to make it here, and _particularly_ hard for women. You think women in technology have to deal with bias and stereotype? I get compliments on my English all the time. I have so far managed to resist the urge to tell people I got perfect scores on the verbal portions of my GRE and other standardized tests. If people are getting hung up on language, how are they going to trust my technical skills? ;) Then there's the entire problem of networking. It's much harder for people from elsewhere to speak up or to even know where to find interesting people and opportunities. That said, though, the organizing meeting for this Social Tech Brewing event was pretty interesting. Most people there could be considered part of visible minorities. We wanted to run a separate session aimed at helping foreign-born IT professionals integrate into Canadian society, but that didn't work out this month. Still, the need is there. Best regards, Sacha aforementioned Philippine-born UofT grad. student -- Sacha Chua - http://sachachua.com Storyteller, technology evangelist, geekette Interested in social computing in the enterprise -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 00:50:35 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 20:50:35 -0400 Subject: Linux-friendly PCI dialup modem? In-Reply-To: <20060802234254.GA13205-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20060730225702.GA12330@waltdnes.org> <20060731161659.GS13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060801211515.GA6950@waltdnes.org> <20060802142453.GU13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060802234254.GA13205@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <44D1485B.5040208@rogers.com> Walter Dnes wrote: > On Wed, Aug 02, 2006 at 10:24:53AM -0400, Lennart Sorensen wrote > >> Well it is possible that the internal modem does get interference in >> that machine. I don't think I ever managed over 45333 on an external >> USR that was upgraded to v90 as well. Which model was the external? > > It was a USR X2, near the end of the model run. That was fortunate, > because that meant it was flash-upgradeable. > I bought my USR Courier about 15 years ago. It started life at 14.4K and was then upgraded to V.42 56K. It's flashable. I recall downloading and installing the various "almost" V.42 updates. I also received a free upgrade daughter board. I still have that modem connected to my computer, but rarely use it these days. p.s I bought that modem from Canada Remote Systems (anyone remember them?), for a few hundred $. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 01:18:56 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 21:18:56 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Linux-friendly PCI dialup modem? In-Reply-To: <44D1485B.5040208-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44D1485B.5040208@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20060803011856.26954.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- James Knott wrote: > Walter Dnes wrote: [snip] > p.s I bought that modem from Canada Remote Systems > (anyone remember > them?), for a few hundred $. Yes, I remember CRS, my first Internet e-mail account was via them, colin.mcgregor-IGXxzrTDBvzQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org . Later on I worked with CRS founder Jud Newell (after he had left CRS) in the early days of the Toronto Free-Net. In doing a Google search I double cheched on one of those half remembered events (i.e.: was it at convention X or Y that I did A, B, and C). Any event in 1992 at the World Science Fiction Convention in Orlando Florida I attended an @ party. To attend the party you had to have a valid e-mail address with an "@" sign, which at the time made it semi-exclusive (now days who wouldn't have such an e-mail address?). Anyway it was my canrem.com address that got me into that party :-) . As for modems, I paid $499 for a 9,600 bps modem (OUCH!!! but it seemed like a good deal at the time...). Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 01:33:38 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 21:33:38 -0400 Subject: Linux-friendly PCI dialup modem? In-Reply-To: <20060803011856.26954.qmail-DooQHYYYUaiB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060803011856.26954.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <44D15272.3030103@rogers.com> Colin McGregor wrote: > --- James Knott wrote: >> Walter Dnes wrote: > > [snip] > >> p.s I bought that modem from Canada Remote Systems >> (anyone remember >> them?), for a few hundred $. > > Yes, I remember CRS, my first Internet e-mail account > was via them, colin.mcgregor-IGXxzrTDBvzQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org . Later on I > worked with CRS founder Jud Newell (after he had left > CRS) in the early days of the Toronto Free-Net. He also used to work with my aunt, at Consumer's Glass, before he started CRS. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 01:39:43 2006 From: meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org (Meng Cheah) Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 21:39:43 -0400 Subject: Linux-friendly PCI dialup modem? In-Reply-To: <20060803011856.26954.qmail-DooQHYYYUaiB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060803011856.26954.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <44D153DF.3040503@pppoe.ca> Colin McGregor wrote: >As for modems, I paid $499 for a 9,600 bps modem >(OUCH!!! but it seemed like a good deal at the >time...). > > > How much did you pay for your computer? Meng -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jeff-/qp0DKbAOldBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 02:03:45 2006 From: jeff-/qp0DKbAOldBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Jeff) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 22:03:45 -0400 Subject: OT: Unix computers and some give away In-Reply-To: <44D11516.8050702-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg@public.gmane.org> References: <44D11516.8050702@telly.org> Message-ID: <00a301c6b6a1$0daeb0a0$6401a8c0@atlantis> Hello All, I have a small collection of unix machines that I would like to give away. I have no more storage for them. I prefer to have them all taken away at once. For your kindness I will give you a Ultra 10 machine. This is just a list of various items that you will get when you pickup the lot. SGI Indy Indigo 2 x 3 Indigo with 1 pair of special keyboard & mouse With various cables and accessories Sun Ultra 10 SPARCstation 2 SPARCstation 4 x 2 SPARCstation 5 SPARCstation 10 x 2 SPARCstation 20 Two Sun Monitors (one comes for the Ultra 10) With varions cables and accessories, external drives and external cd-rom, keyboard & mouse Apple PowerMac 7500 with 300MHz G3 upgrade, 128RAM, etc DEC Multia (shorted) Some parts might be good? Two Alpha powered DEC machines IRIX 6.5.3, 6.2 and 5.3 cd's Various Solaris and SGI books/guides You must pickup the items by Friday this week. Or if someone wants to store them and then distribute this to fellow TLUG members that would work for me too. Please respond to my email first come first serve. Thanks Jeff -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From dwarmstrong-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 02:21:24 2006 From: dwarmstrong-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Daniel Armstrong) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 22:21:24 -0400 Subject: 4M more Linux laptops sold In-Reply-To: <44D13274.6020009-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg@public.gmane.org> References: <44D13274.6020009@telly.org> Message-ID: <61e9e2b10608021921y259df15fn41a5e30216bd2dda@mail.gmail.com> On 8/2/06, Evan Leibovitch wrote: > The One Laptop Per Child initiative appears to be gaining momentum, > though I can't say I'm surprised at which countries have each ordered > one million systems: Thailand, Nigeria, Brazil and Argentina. > > http://ct.enews.eweek.com/rd/cts?d=186-4150-31-89-122426-483633-0-0-0-1 > > It wouldn't surprise me if Mexico, Malaysia and some eastern European > countries were close behind. Cool machines... some interesting tech involved: http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/14.08/laptop.html I gather from what I have read earlier that the distinctive look is supposed to dissuade theft, i.e. if you are using one of these laptops, and you are not a kid from the developing world... you probably got one on the black market? Which is a shame, because they could probably find paying customers *here*... -- Daniel Wayne Armstrong :: build it yourself biology http://biohackery.com :: -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 02:31:33 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 22:31:33 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Women in IT (Aug 3). Online freedom of speech (Aug 5th) In-Reply-To: <87u04uisvq.fsf-bc55NVWLdWuB+jHODAdFcQ@public.gmane.org> References: <87u04uisvq.fsf@sachachua.com> Message-ID: <20060803023134.53150.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- Sacha ChChuasasacharee.net.phphwrote: > Hello, everyone! > > Colin McMcGregor colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org> writes: > > sample. So beyond the poor social skills idea, to > toss > > another idea out, does it help to be born outside > > Canada to become a woman techie? > > I'd say this suggests the idea that you have to be a > pretty good and > pretty lucky techie to travel. There are a *lot* of > women in > technology who don't get that opportunity. Not quite what I am saying. One of the women I e-mailed about this event was born in (West) Germany, moved to the UK when she was age 12, and then on to Canada a few years later. She moved with her family, but as stands, lives, works, etc., here in Canada. So, she has fairly good social skills (better than mine :-( ), but the moment she opens her mouth people instantly know she isn't from around here (a mostly German accent with traces of her time in the UK). So, having come to Canada for what ever reason at what ever age is that a help in becoming a techie? Is the fact that you sound different, and/or look different and/or have a slightly different outlook an asset in becoming a techie? > If anything, it's probably harder for foreign-born > IT professionals to > make it here, and _particularly_ hard for women. You > think women in > technology have to deal with bias and stereotype? I > get compliments on > my English all the time. I have so far managed to > resist the urge to > tell people I got perfect scores on the verbal > portions of my GRGREnd > other standardized tests. If people are getting hung > up on language, > how are they going to trust my technical skills? ;) I was at a tradeshow event, within ear shot of the above noted woman as she was doing a sales pitch to one guy. He was focused on attempting to figure out her accent, and when he found out joked about how she should date Canadian guys (her answer, she had, and it had never helped). Needless to say the whole sales pitch got lost in the shuffle, sigh... People do get fixated on stuff, be it clothes worn, cars driven, and yes, gender, accents, etc., are all part of that nasty mess. I don't know of any easy solutions there... > Then there's the entire problem of networking. It's > much harder for > people from elsewhere to speak up or to even know > where to find > interesting people and opportunities. Yes, but ... At least to a degree that doesn't happen in some other fields, technology is a leveler. For example, a women web designer that I crossed paths with was deaf. She had been born hearing, had survived a cancer in her skull (the doctors had destroyed the cancer and in the process she had lost her hearing, lesser of two very nasty evils). Ok, so you have a woman who by nature would not I gather have been a techie, but when you need to find a job where you can do effectively everything via e-mail a lot of job avenues are closed to you... > That said, though, the organizing meeting for this > Social Tech Brewing > event was pretty interesting. Most people there > could be considered > part of visible minorities. So, your like my brother Gordon, only much less visible :-) . Semi-serious, Gordon is teaching English in South Korea, where ALL non-Koreans (Chinese, Caucasian, etc.) make up under 0.1% of the population. So, Gordon has had something of a hard time of it, and has found the Internet a life line of sorts in that it does allow him to keep in touch with people... > We wanted to run a separate session aimed at helping > foreign-born IT > professionals integrate into Canadian society, but > that didn't work > out this month. Still, the need is there. > > Best regards, > > Sacha > aforementioned Philippine-born UofT grad. student Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 02:41:05 2006 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 19:41:05 -0700 Subject: Women in IT (Aug 3). Online freedom of speech (Aug 5th) In-Reply-To: References: <20060727202833.35079.qmail@web88212.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <44C97CF2.3010106@alteeve.com> <44CA8FE1.5040507@ca.afilias.info> <44CAED89.9010409@sympatico.ca> <44D10B9B.70707@ca.afilias.info> Message-ID: On 8/2/06, Christopher Browne wrote: whoops - hit "send" too early... > On 8/2/06, Andrew Hammond wrote: > > > Awww yeah Dorothy, I.T. is going bye bye. > > > > Got any numbers to substantiate that? The numbers I've seen say that IT > > is still growing (albeit slower) in North America, despite off-shoring. > > This has apparently been driven by the small business sector, especially > > in geographic areas which are not traditionally tech-sectors. I wonder > > if that includes Kansas? > > The "mature" markets are always ones that are obvious, and, since > their niches are already filled, they aren't terribly open to > newcomers. That's certainly true of the situations in large > businesses. > > Once a large business stabilizes, the opportunities are severely > limited to outsiders as you have only a few kinds of situations: > > - If you're in an area where jobs are relatively stable, the larger > the company, the *less* the proportion of jobs that ... the *less* the proportion of jobs that turn over each year. In effect, if it's a stable place, you get to compete for a vanishingly small number of new positions each year. The other possibility is to be at one of the EDSes or such (E&Y, KPMG, D&T, ...) where the route upwards is an absolutely ferocious rat-race where they have 20% turnover per year because people either leap towards living for partnership, trying to bill 80h/week to their clients, or fail, and become part of that 20% turnover. Big business may be highly visible; that doesn't mean it's all that wonderful a place to be... -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html Oddly enough, this is completely standard behaviour for shells. This is a roundabout way of saying `don't use combined chains of `&&'s and `||'s unless you think G?del's theorem is for sissies'. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ekg_ab-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 02:18:27 2006 From: ekg_ab-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (E K) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 22:18:27 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Secure Linux Distros In-Reply-To: <20060802172716.GW13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20060802172716.GW13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20060803021827.3925.qmail@web61319.mail.yahoo.com> Interesting reading indeed. I had migrated my servers from RH to Ubuntu recently maily for security reason. So far Ubuntu I am happy with it, both on server and desktop front. I liked the fact that the root user is disabled from logging, locally or remotely, though I would like to know what security limitation it may have. EK Lennart Sorensen wrote: On Wed, Aug 02, 2006 at 12:25:35PM -0400, Stephen W. Clarke wrote: > I was just visiting http://distrowatch.com/ and noticed that EnGarde > Secure Linux 3.0.8 was released today. I am always trying to find more > secure ways of setting up my servers and was wondering if any of you have > any experience with this distro or perhaps have a high security distro > you'd recommend. > > So far my preference has been to use WhiteBox EL4, but I keep thinking > that there should be something better. I recently saw an article that looked at how long it took different distributions to fix security issues. The "secure" distributions were basicaly the slowest, along with the enterprise ones (which of course have much higher testing standards to go through before releasing the fix. Actually RHEL was among the fastest, the others were not). http://searchsecurity.techtarget.com/originalContent/0,289142,sid14_gci1202417,00.html Interesting read, whether it is accurate or not. I am sticking with Debian. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml --------------------------------- All new Yahoo! Mail --------------------------------- Get news delivered. Enjoy RSS feeds right on your Mail page. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 02:43:30 2006 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 22:43:30 -0400 Subject: ADSL modem VPI/VCI settings for Cybersurf/3Web in Ontario? Message-ID: <20060803024330.GB13205@waltdnes.org> I've ordered a replacement combo modem/router from an ebay store. It should be here in a week or so. My old unit is so dead that I can't get in to view the VPI/VCI settings. Does anybody know for certain what they are? Any other Cybersurf/3Web ADSL customers on this list? Can you check your settings please? My searching on Google indicates 0/35 for ADSL in Ontario. The script reader at Cybersurf didn't know what I was talking about. His supervisor suggested checking on Google, which I had already done. -- Walter Dnes In linux /sbin/init is Job #1 My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 02:33:19 2006 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 19:33:19 -0700 Subject: Women in IT (Aug 3). Online freedom of speech (Aug 5th) In-Reply-To: <44D10B9B.70707-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw@public.gmane.org> References: <20060727202833.35079.qmail@web88212.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <44C97CF2.3010106@alteeve.com> <44CA8FE1.5040507@ca.afilias.info> <44CAED89.9010409@sympatico.ca> <44D10B9B.70707@ca.afilias.info> Message-ID: On 8/2/06, Andrew Hammond wrote: > > No this is wrong. I use to think that India would never get decent > > software engineering jobs and especially not R & D jobs but they have. > > Oracle has lots of development jobs in India. Microsoft has a poured > > lots of cash into a company to do R & D and software engineering for new > > Microsoft products. Let's hope Indian software developers are worse > > than U of Waterloo ones. Heck Microsoft has poured a lot of money into > > Indian I.T. period. IBM is right behind them. Linux and Unix work in > > India too. Check Monster India to see the jobs they have there. I saw > > job postings that seem to fit the experience you have. Nothing like > > hearing from the business drones in the media "Jobless recovery.". "I.T. > > sector down 17% in Canada this year." > > Large companies that are IT oriented are one of the few cases for which > it turns out to be cost-effective to off-shore. However since all of Big > Biz supplies less than 30% of the jobs in IT, that's not a terribly big > loss. > > Furthermore, it appears that while it's possible to off-shore structured > development such as maintenance coding and stuff like 1st tier > phone/email support, it is not a good idea to off-shore things like RAD > efforts, anything that involve much user-interaction, and most sysadmin > type stuff. Hence my comment about the interesting stuff still being > local. I will however agree that it has made entry level positions > harder to find. Part of that, I think, is business-cycle related, too. We saw, in this locale, some really excessively optimistic growth from four notable perspectives: 0. Y2K work meant that anyone with something resembling credentials got drawn into an effort that companies didn't want to continue to pay for one week after 01-01-00 rolled around. 1. There was an "Internet bubble" where any idiot that could figure out a bit of HTML and VB could become an ASP programmer with aspersions on starting an endeavour to try to outdo Spamazon. 2. Combine some "cellular inflation" where every cell company beefed up imagining they would be The One. 3. These sets of growth caused Internet "infrastructure" companies building and selling hardware, notably, here, Nortel, that carried hardware used for both cellular and Internet networking, to make spectacularly overoptimistic plans. Ottawa's JDS Uniphase was building components for many of the same folks, and got similarly overextended... When the overexuberance fell, this led to quite a lot of fallback. In Ottawa, the government was in a fascinating situation of growth which meant that all the ex-Nortel managers were re-minted as government managers. Not so for the techies; the government didn't have the need. Similarly, Toronto didn't instantly re-absorb the ex-techies. Those that had been "idiots barely able to write HTML" were wise, if they had been playing enough politics to make themselves *appear* indispensable. The true techies, with less political skill, hadn't been similarly entrenched... The result, from 2001 to probably a year or so ago, has been pretty challenging to those that weren't entrenched somehow. There being some simultaneous pressure, in large companies, to move some of their work to India/China/Russia has evidently been mistaken for being the *only* effect in play. If all you choose to see is the "jobs moving to India" effect, then you're choosing a particular bit of blindness... > > I guess I might stay here and practice saying "Would you like to super > > size that?" or I can try and get a visa to India(I think it is tough to > > get one) and write software for about the same salary as a Fry > > Technician here. > > Currently salaries for non-junior people in India range from 1/4 to 1/2 > what you'd pay a Canadian. Which is indeed close to what you'd pay a > burger flipper. > > > Awww yeah Dorothy, I.T. is going bye bye. > > Got any numbers to substantiate that? The numbers I've seen say that IT > is still growing (albeit slower) in North America, despite off-shoring. > This has apparently been driven by the small business sector, especially > in geographic areas which are not traditionally tech-sectors. I wonder > if that includes Kansas? The "mature" markets are always ones that are obvious, and, since their niches are already filled, they aren't terribly open to newcomers. That's certainly true of the situations in large businesses. Once a large business stabilizes, the opportunities are severely limited to outsiders as you have only a few kinds of situations: - If you're in an area where jobs are relatively stable, the larger the company, the *less* the proportion of jobs that -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html Oddly enough, this is completely standard behaviour for shells. This is a roundabout way of saying `don't use combined chains of `&&'s and `||'s unless you think G?del's theorem is for sissies'. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 07:29:27 2006 From: cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org (Chris F.A. Johnson) Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 03:29:27 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Linux-friendly PCI dialup modem? In-Reply-To: <20060803011856.26954.qmail-DooQHYYYUaiB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060803011856.26954.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 2 Aug 2006, Colin McGregor wrote: > > As for modems, I paid $499 for a 9,600 bps modem > (OUCH!!! but it seemed like a good deal at the > time...). I remember when $1 per baud was the norm. -- Chris F.A. Johnson =================================================================== Author: Shell Scripting Recipes: A Problem-Solution Approach (2005, Apress) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From kb2spp-/E1597aS9LQAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 11:41:48 2006 From: kb2spp-/E1597aS9LQAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Juan Rico) Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 04:41:48 -0700 (PDT) Subject: ADSL modem VPI/VCI settings for Cybersurf/3Web in Ontario? In-Reply-To: <20060803024330.GB13205-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20060803024330.GB13205@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <20060803114148.42668.qmail@web50303.mail.yahoo.com> More than a year ago, I used an ADSL BB0060A modem/router and certainly the settings were VPI=0, VCI=35 for connections across the ATM network. It worked like a charm.... Juan Rico --- Walter Dnes wrote: > I've ordered a replacement combo modem/router from an > ebay store. It > should be here in a week or so. My old unit is so dead > that I can't get > in to view the VPI/VCI settings. Does anybody know for > certain what > they are? Any other Cybersurf/3Web ADSL customers on > this list? Can > you check your settings please? > > My searching on Google indicates 0/35 for ADSL in > Ontario. The script > reader at Cybersurf didn't know what I was talking about. > His > supervisor suggested checking on Google, which I had > already done. > > -- > Walter Dnes In linux /sbin/init > is Job #1 > My musings on technology and security at > http://tech_sec.blog.ca > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: > http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 > columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davec-zxk95TxsVYDyHADnj0MGvQC/G2K4zDHf at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 12:09:24 2006 From: davec-zxk95TxsVYDyHADnj0MGvQC/G2K4zDHf at public.gmane.org (Dave Cramer) Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 08:09:24 -0400 Subject: looking for a contract system admin Message-ID: <34D891EF-66BE-49DB-A75B-03B3FE53B2EC@visibleassets.com> I have a need for a part time sysadmin. Responsibilities would include keeping systems up to date, ensuring backups were running, etc. Upgrading a number of systems Please contact me offlist only if you have relevant experience. Dave Dave Cramer VicePresident I/T Visible Assets Inc. 2330 Southfield Rd Mississauga, Ont. L5N 2W8 (519) 939-0336 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 12:13:57 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 08:13:57 -0400 Subject: looking for a contract system admin In-Reply-To: <34D891EF-66BE-49DB-A75B-03B3FE53B2EC-zxk95TxsVYDyHADnj0MGvQC/G2K4zDHf@public.gmane.org> References: <34D891EF-66BE-49DB-A75B-03B3FE53B2EC@visibleassets.com> Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608030513k2c0c9ca2y8920e1ddea0f6508@mail.gmail.com> On 8/3/06, Dave Cramer wrote: > > I have a need for a part time sysadmin. Responsibilities would include > keeping systems up to date, ensuring backups were running, etc. > > Upgrading a number of systems > > Please contact me offlist only if you have relevant experience. Hi Dave, I'm not really in the market for a position, but I do have the experience (in the field, not just school) and know a few other's that do as well. Can you describe the position further - in effect, how many systems and what distro(s) in particular you need to support? If I can, I'll forward your message to qualified folks I know that aren't very active on the TLUG list. Take care, - Scott. -- Scott Elcomb http://w3.avidus.ca/ http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 12:19:59 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 08:19:59 -0400 Subject: Open Source song - "Write Code With You" In-Reply-To: References: <99a6c38f0607261344s2ba633abrb43ef72a0de2569a@mail.gmail.com> <44D0F3FF.7000709@uoguelph.ca> <99a6c38f0608021224x78f7614fwf705a7a1b16669d4@mail.gmail.com> <44D10974.80806@uoguelph.ca> <99a6c38f0608021332y6c972bfbs26a6f37217ee39c0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608030519s1c3d7fc3x8154ef5695de9cc8@mail.gmail.com> On 8/2/06, Jamon Camisso wrote: > Not that you shouldn't be law abiding, but what does it really matter if > you guys came up with a song, around a couple of beers, had a laugh. > Screw Adam Sandler, it's your friend's song. There's absolutely no > reason to give an inch -- no one is being hurt, no profits infringed > (which is by no means harmful to anyone *being*). If everyone just gave > up and stopped making music because it sounded like something else we'd > all be listening to Muzak and Brittany Spears since they both come from > a can. > > I'd say leave it up and come what may. Just like with code, if you > haven't seen the original but wrote function or library that did > something similar to a patented piece of code, it isn't really > infringing is it? Ask Andrew Tridgell and see what he thinks. While the > same may not go for inspired works of art, it damn well should. > > Apparently you've pulled it so I can't say for sure without hearing the > song, but there are only so many chords to go around, and you can't > patent or copyright those *yet* I hope. Without having written a song > I'm in no position to say of course... > > The Barenaked Ladies nailed it with their song "It's all been done": > > "And if I put my fingers here, and if I say > "I love you dear," > And if I play the same three chords, > will you just yawn and say > It's all been done before?" Ok, a couple points here: #1 - I agree with you wholeheartedly. Unfortunately the Canadian Legal System may not. #2 - The Barenaked Ladies have at least one connection to/at/with Digital Copyright Canada and is part of the reason that I've relied on their guidance for as long as I have. I'd say that's a doubleplusgood reason to play things safe and by the book. At least until reality hits the GoC in the head. -- Scott Elcomb http://w3.avidus.ca/ http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 13:30:27 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2006 09:30:27 -0400 Subject: Linux-friendly PCI dialup modem? In-Reply-To: <20060803011856.26954.qmail-DooQHYYYUaiB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060803011856.26954.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <44D1FA73.5080102@telly.org> Colin McGregor wrote: >As for modems, I paid $499 for a 9,600 bps modem (OUCH!!! but it seemed like a good deal at the time...). > > Well, when that's all there was... I had one of the original Telebit Trailblazers (dark grey case, just like the one in the photo at http://www.tonh.net/museum/telebittrailblazer.html ). I was able to get it for the _discounted_ price of $1K because the 386 it was attached to was a known UUCP/Usenet mail/news forwarder. That box served a bunch of sites and was for quite a long time the southern Ontario gateway for the entire biz.* hierarchy. Once a night (at 11pm, once the long distance rates went down) it would call Chicago and exchange all sorts of stuff, which would then get unpacked, forwarded and expired by the hours-long run of Cnews. I think my site and Drew's "lethe" must have between us sometimes served the half of the city that didn't get fed by UofT. But you could do that with Trailiblazers. :-) (By comparison, the USRobotics HSTs that all the BBS and FIDOnet kiddies were playing with at the time were mere toys that couldn't do half the bandwidth.) Sometimes, when one reads about the net-neutrality garbage and the way email is spammed and snooped, it's easy to get nostalgic for the days when you could trust the others on the UUCP network as a simple and straightforward place to get your mail, FAQs, porn and flamewars. "You send 'mail' to people by typing at a computer? What a stupid idea, it'll never catch on..." Evan Leibovitch {uunet!utzoo|ihnp4!attcan}!telly!evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 14:03:12 2006 From: matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (G. Matthew Rice) Date: 03 Aug 2006 10:03:12 -0400 Subject: Open Source song - "Write Code With You" In-Reply-To: References: <99a6c38f0607261344s2ba633abrb43ef72a0de2569a@mail.gmail.com> <44D0F3FF.7000709@uoguelph.ca> <99a6c38f0608021224x78f7614fwf705a7a1b16669d4@mail.gmail.com> <44D10974.80806@uoguelph.ca> <99a6c38f0608021332y6c972bfbs26a6f37217ee39c0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Jamon Camisso writes: > I'd say leave it up and come what may. Just like with code, if you haven't That's a pretty cavalier attitude considering you aren't the one that would be dragged into court. Although, if it was me, I'd leave it up, too. "It's easier to ask forgiveness than permission" ;) Besides, if jibjab can get away with their "This Land" spoof and all the exposure it received: http://www.jibjab.com/JokeBox/JokeBox_JJOrig.aspx?movieid=65 I don't think this one will raise an eyebrow. IANAL... > Apparently you've pulled it so I can't say for sure without hearing the song, > but there are only so many chords to go around, and you can't patent or > copyright those *yet* I hope. Without having written a song I'm in no > position to say of course... I listened to both version but didn't read much of the thread. I thought it was _meant_ to be based on the song from the wedding singer. > The Barenaked Ladies nailed it with their song "It's all been done": > > "And if I put my fingers here, and if I say > "I love you dear," > And if I play the same three chords, > will you just yawn and say > It's all been done before?" Yeah, but that's just a spin on McCartney's "Silly Love Songs" ;) -- g. matthew rice starnix, toronto, ontario, ca phone: 647.722.5301 x242 gpg id: EF9AAD20 http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mike.kallies-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 17:26:52 2006 From: mike.kallies-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Mike Kallies) Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 13:26:52 -0400 Subject: Open Source song - "Write Code With You" In-Reply-To: References: <99a6c38f0607261344s2ba633abrb43ef72a0de2569a@mail.gmail.com> <44D0F3FF.7000709@uoguelph.ca> <99a6c38f0608021224x78f7614fwf705a7a1b16669d4@mail.gmail.com> <44D10974.80806@uoguelph.ca> <99a6c38f0608021332y6c972bfbs26a6f37217ee39c0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <92ee967a0608031026m430e4631i7daec69e4b3ed69d@mail.gmail.com> On 03 Aug 2006 10:03:12 -0400, G. Matthew Rice wrote: > Jamon Camisso writes: > > I'd say leave it up and come what may. Just like with code, if you haven't > > That's a pretty cavalier attitude considering you aren't the one that would be > dragged into court. > > Although, if it was me, I'd leave it up, too. "It's easier to ask forgiveness > than permission" ;) What I heard on the site currently sounds like a derivative of John Cage's work. It wouldn't be the first time there was trouble: Although I expect the incorrect attribution was the real problem, not the chord progressions themselves. The safest course of action at this point would be to put up some randomly generated notes. Be sure to gain sufficient entropy though, else you might be violating somebody's copyright. -Mike -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 17:28:59 2006 From: ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org (Andrew Hammond) Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2006 13:28:59 -0400 Subject: Women in IT (Aug 3). Online freedom of speech (Aug 5th) In-Reply-To: <87u04uisvq.fsf-bc55NVWLdWuB+jHODAdFcQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20060727202833.35079.qmail@web88212.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <87u04uisvq.fsf@sachachua.com> Message-ID: <44D2325B.6070808@ca.afilias.info> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Sacha Chua wrote: > If anything, it's probably harder for foreign-born IT professionals to > make it here, and _particularly_ hard for women. You think women in > technology have to deal with bias and stereotype? I get compliments on > my English all the time. 1) Any non-native speaker who can master the grotesquely complex and ugly language that is English deserves the compliment. I suspect that others feel the same way. 2) I like it when pretty women smile at me. I think there are other guys who like it too. To get smiled at by pretty women, I sometimes try to say nice things to them. I doubt I'm alone in following this tactic. You're a pretty woman and honest compliments about a skill are innocuous... > I have so far managed to resist the urge to > tell people I got perfect scores on the verbal portions of my GRE and > other standardized tests. Wow. Uh... I can swear in Russian pretty good... > If people are getting hung up on language, > how are they going to trust my technical skills? ;) Er... the more I work in this field, the more I am convinced that communication skills are at least as important as technical skills. If it's an interesting problem, then it will certainly require some research and probably some collaboration too. The value of the solution will in large part be a function of how it is communicated, from comments in the code through to presentations at a conference. All of these things are to some degree language related. Drew -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2.2 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFE0jJbgfzn5SevSpoRAsDTAJ92Zmt2BRh4NIsuXXOXpncCJAxx4QCeI3ao fptxgiw9Xlvl4IklASGWSEE= =tlr5 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 18:43:13 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 14:43:13 -0400 Subject: Open Source song - "Write Code With You" In-Reply-To: <92ee967a0608031026m430e4631i7daec69e4b3ed69d-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f0607261344s2ba633abrb43ef72a0de2569a@mail.gmail.com> <44D0F3FF.7000709@uoguelph.ca> <99a6c38f0608021224x78f7614fwf705a7a1b16669d4@mail.gmail.com> <44D10974.80806@uoguelph.ca> <99a6c38f0608021332y6c972bfbs26a6f37217ee39c0@mail.gmail.com> <92ee967a0608031026m430e4631i7daec69e4b3ed69d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608031143m76bf3c43sff08fe3a97252c6a@mail.gmail.com> On 8/3/06, Mike Kallies wrote: > What I heard on the site currently sounds like a derivative of John > Cage's work. It wouldn't be the first time there was trouble: > > > > Although I expect the incorrect attribution was the real problem, not > the chord progressions themselves. > > The safest course of action at this point would be to put up some > randomly generated notes. Be sure to gain sufficient entropy though, > else you might be violating somebody's copyright. LOL - That's almost disturbing. Now I'm doubly glad I ran across the Infinite Game Universe Algorithm article[1] on Gamasutra.com a few years back - well before I even heard of Linux. About 2 years ago, I ran across the book "Infinite Game Universe: Level Design, Terrain, and Sound" [2] at Chapters, which is based on (I believe) the Gamasutra article. The techniques used in both cases are about controlled use of pseudo-random number generators. Will have to get on the silence thing asap! [1] http://www.gamasutra.com/features/19990917/infinite_02.htm (requires registration) [2] http://www.charlesriver.com/Books/BookDetail.aspx?productID=18860 -- Scott Elcomb http://w3.avidus.ca/ http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 18:58:01 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 14:58:01 -0400 Subject: Producing Musical Notes with Linux (Was: Open Source Song - "Write Code With You") Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608031158r70084355ue9f1e997b0ee29a2@mail.gmail.com> Is anyone aware of any command line tools or scripts that produce musical notes under linux? I'm thinking in a similar vein as Festival, just producing pure notes? I started programming on a C-128 when I was like 10 or so; one of my all time favorite Commodore Basic (v7 I think?) intructions was the PLAY command. Really, really simple way to create music, and music keyboards. Of course that was mid 80's... Besides playing with SDL and perl, I've never tried to write sound apps on Linux. -- Scott Elcomb http://w3.avidus.ca/ http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 19:02:09 2006 From: interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (Interlug) Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2006 15:02:09 -0400 Subject: Producing Musical Notes with Linux (Was: Open Source Song - "Write Code With You") In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f0608031158r70084355ue9f1e997b0ee29a2-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f0608031158r70084355ue9f1e997b0ee29a2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1154631730.17225.100.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Thu, 2006-03-08 at 14:58 -0400, Scott Elcomb wrote: > Is anyone aware of any command line tools or scripts that produce > musical notes under linux? shutdown -r now makes a beep, but there is some latency and no pitch or duration control. ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From yanni-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 19:12:43 2006 From: yanni-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Yanni Chiu) Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2006 15:12:43 -0400 Subject: Producing Musical Notes with Linux (Was: Open Source Song - "Write Code With You") In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f0608031158r70084355ue9f1e997b0ee29a2-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f0608031158r70084355ue9f1e997b0ee29a2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Scott Elcomb wrote: > Is anyone aware of any command line tools or scripts that produce > musical notes under linux? I'm thinking in a similar vein as > Festival, just producing pure notes? Does it have to be command line? Wouldn't Squeak be better? See: http://minnow.cc.gatech.edu/squeak/uploads/squeak_music.gif to start; check out the rest of the wiki, maybe starting from: http://minnow.cc.gatech.edu/squeak/3480. Then you can ask more questions of the Squeak community. You can find the mailing list at www.squeak.org. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 19:21:34 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 15:21:34 -0400 Subject: Producing Musical Notes with Linux (Was: Open Source Song - "Write Code With You") In-Reply-To: References: <99a6c38f0608031158r70084355ue9f1e997b0ee29a2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608031221i63cb08dak4edf9dcb3860c87d@mail.gmail.com> On 8/3/06, Yanni Chiu wrote: > Scott Elcomb wrote: > > Is anyone aware of any command line tools or scripts that produce > > musical notes under linux? I'm thinking in a similar vein as > > Festival, just producing pure notes? > > Does it have to be command line? Actually, it's to create, programmatically, pseudo-random sound so that Alex and I don't get ourselves sued due to violating somebody's copyrighted work of silence. =) A command line tool that can be scripted with Bash or Perl, or some c source (and identification of a sound library) would be just about perfect. -- Scott Elcomb http://w3.avidus.ca/ http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 19:57:44 2006 From: mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Merv Curley) Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 15:57:44 -0400 Subject: Open Source song - "Write Code With You" In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f0608021332y6c972bfbs26a6f37217ee39c0-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f0607261344s2ba633abrb43ef72a0de2569a@mail.gmail.com> <44D10974.80806@uoguelph.ca> <99a6c38f0608021332y6c972bfbs26a6f37217ee39c0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200608031557.44868.mervc@eol.ca> On Wednesday 02 August 2006 16:32, Scott Elcomb wrote: > > Heh. Actually, I appreciate the heads up - much better to know than not. > > A response came in from the DCC list that suggests it is not "Fair > Dealing," so I've removed access to the recording on our BBS. That > email also suggests seeking Mr Sandler out, and seeing if he might be > interested. > I would be very surprised to hear that Sandler had anything to do with the writing of the song. Maybe someone with a copy of the movie could look at the end credits and see who gets the credits for music and lyrics. After that it is probably the studio who has copyright. > Not sure how or where to start (other than the web) but if he's > interested, it'd make one helluva story. > > Live and learn I guess. Thanks again. -- Merv Curley Toronto, Ont. Can Kanotix Linux Ver 2005-4 Desktop KDE 3.5.1 KMail 1.2 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 20:02:20 2006 From: mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Merv Curley) Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 16:02:20 -0400 Subject: Linux-friendly PCI dialup modem? In-Reply-To: References: <20060803011856.26954.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <200608031602.20396.mervc@eol.ca> On Thursday 03 August 2006 03:29, Chris F.A. Johnson wrote: > On Wed, 2 Aug 2006, Colin McGregor wrote: > > As for modems, I paid $499 for a 9,600 bps modem > > (OUCH!!! but it seemed like a good deal at the > > time...). > > I remember when $1 per baud was the norm. Surely I'm not the only one who gave Radio Shack $150 or so for a 300 baud modem and then occasionally had large bills from Compuserve for logging on too often. -- Merv Curley Toronto, Ont. Can Kanotix Linux Ver 2005-4 Desktop KDE 3.5.1 KMail 1.2 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 20:06:51 2006 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 20:06:51 +0000 Subject: Producing Musical Notes with Linux (Was: Open Source Song - "Write Code With You") In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f0608031158r70084355ue9f1e997b0ee29a2-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f0608031158r70084355ue9f1e997b0ee29a2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 8/3/06, Scott Elcomb wrote: > Is anyone aware of any command line tools or scripts that produce > musical notes under linux? I'm thinking in a similar vein as > Festival, just producing pure notes? One of the following might be suitable for producing notes... These tools usually include staffs, clefs, and such, too, not merely pure notes... -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html Oddly enough, this is completely standard behaviour for shells. This is a roundabout way of saying `don't use combined chains of `&&'s and `||'s unless you think G?del's theorem is for sissies'. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: midc1.png Type: image/png Size: 721 bytes Desc: not available URL: From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 20:12:59 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 16:12:59 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Open Source song - "Write Code With You" In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f0608030519s1c3d7fc3x8154ef5695de9cc8-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f0608030519s1c3d7fc3x8154ef5695de9cc8@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20060803201259.41025.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- Scott Elcomb wrote: > Ok, a couple points here: > > #1 - I agree with you wholeheartedly. Unfortunately > the Canadian > Legal System may not. > #2 - The Barenaked Ladies have at least one > connection to/at/with > Digital Copyright Canada and is part of the reason > that I've relied on > their guidance for as long as I have. > > I'd say that's a doubleplusgood reason to play > things safe and by the > book. At least until reality hits the GoC in the > head. Ok, so play by the book, just use a very old play book. Take a tune that is old enough to be in the public domain and use that for your new lyrics. This way if someone says "Hey, you ripped that tune off mega-recording star X!" you will be able to reply with something like "No, we both based the tune on a traditional Scottish folk tune that was published in 1805, so the tune is in the public domain, and nobody can legally touch me on that score!" :-) . In other words put yourself in a position where yes, your knowingly "ripping" off another (now long dead) artist, but in a way where nobody can legally touch you. The Toronto Central Reference Library (Yonge near Bloor) has a large printed music collection from the 19th and early 20th centuries that you might want to look at.... Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 3 20:22:31 2006 From: cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org (Chris F.A. Johnson) Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 16:22:31 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Open Source song - "Write Code With You" In-Reply-To: <44D0F3FF.7000709-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f0607261344s2ba633abrb43ef72a0de2569a@mail.gmail.com> <44D0F3FF.7000709@uoguelph.ca> Message-ID: On Wed, 2 Aug 2006, Tom Watts wrote: > > Alex Beamish wrote: >> On 7/26/06, *Scott Elcomb* > >> wrote: >> >> A friend came up with some song lyrics a couple weeks ago. We'd been >> talking about Linux, Open Source, and Atomic OS over some drinks. He >> picked up a guitar and went to town. >> >> Anyway, we produced a quick recording last night on a laptop running >> Ubuntu (thx Colin!) It's not a professional job by any means, but >> we'd like to see what people think. >> >> http://atomos.sourceforge.net/#%5B%5BWrite%20Code%20With%20You%5D%5D >> >> >> >> Well, listening to Scott's recording of Write Code WIth You made me think >> .. I want to play too! >> >> So after some thought and some noodling around, I recorded, mixed and >> produced a recording of my own, and have uploaded it to a spare domain of >> mine .. please see >> >> http://www.prosco.ca/ >> >> for more on my take on Scott's song. Enjoy! > > Is it just me or is this song basically the same as the song that Adam > Sandler plays for Drew Barrymore at the end of the movie "The Wedding Singer" > (with different lyrics of course)? I haven't seen anyone point this out yet > so I was under the impression that I'm crazy or that it's very obvious to > everyone else. I thought it sounded familiar, but like something much older than the Wedding Singer, probably from the 1960s. -- Chris F.A. Johnson =================================================================== Author: Shell Scripting Recipes: A Problem-Solution Approach (2005, Apress) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jeff-/qp0DKbAOldBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 4 02:39:56 2006 From: jeff-/qp0DKbAOldBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Jeff) Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 22:39:56 -0400 Subject: OT: Unix computers and some give away In-Reply-To: <00a301c6b6a1$0daeb0a0$6401a8c0@atlantis> References: <00a301c6b6a1$0daeb0a0$6401a8c0@atlantis> Message-ID: <014b01c6b76f$45e5d1a0$6401a8c0@atlantis> Hello all, Thanks for the reponses. Derek has taken all the machines and offered to give away some of them. Please contact him off list. His email address is: derekm-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thanks Jeff -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org] On Behalf Of Jeff Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2006 10:04 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: [TLUG]: OT: Unix computers and some give away Hello All, I have a small collection of unix machines that I would like to give away. I have no more storage for them. I prefer to have them all taken away at once. For your kindness I will give you a Ultra 10 machine. This is just a list of various items that you will get when you pickup the lot. SGI Indy Indigo 2 x 3 Indigo with 1 pair of special keyboard & mouse With various cables and accessories Sun Ultra 10 SPARCstation 2 SPARCstation 4 x 2 SPARCstation 5 SPARCstation 10 x 2 SPARCstation 20 Two Sun Monitors (one comes for the Ultra 10) With varions cables and accessories, external drives and external cd-rom, keyboard & mouse Apple PowerMac 7500 with 300MHz G3 upgrade, 128RAM, etc DEC Multia (shorted) Some parts might be good? Two Alpha powered DEC machines IRIX 6.5.3, 6.2 and 5.3 cd's Various Solaris and SGI books/guides You must pickup the items by Friday this week. Or if someone wants to store them and then distribute this to fellow TLUG members that would work for me too. Please respond to my email first come first serve. Thanks Jeff -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 4 12:53:51 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2006 08:53:51 -0400 Subject: Dual core Intel... how hot? In-Reply-To: <20060802184814.GA18495-SBOj+Tp9hCvc29vQ/UIUOA@public.gmane.org> References: <20060802144557.GA17952@wp.magstar.net> <20060802174625.GX13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060802184814.GA18495@wp.magstar.net> Message-ID: <20060804125351.GY13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 02, 2006 at 02:48:14PM -0400, William Park wrote: > On Wed, Aug 02, 2006 at 01:46:25PM -0400, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > > On Wed, Aug 02, 2006 at 10:45:58AM -0400, William Park wrote: > > > How hot (temperature wise) does Intel's dual core run, compared to > > > Pentium-4 3.0GHz? > > > > Well the temp depends on your cooling system. The power use also has > > something to say though. So here is what I have managed to find: > > > > Pentium 4 HT 3.0 (northwood) 81.9W Socket 478 > > Pentium 4 HT 3.0E (prescott) 89.0W Socket 478 > > Pentium 4 HT 531 (prescott) 84W LGA 775 > > > > Dual core: > > Smithfield Pentium D: > > 805,820 95W > > 830,840 130W > > Presler Pentium D: > > 915,920,925,930,945 95W > > 940,950,960 130W > > Thanks Lennart. Is Core 2 Duo cooler than current AMD 64? Depends on the model of Athlon 64. Power use on Athlon 64's are: Single core: 89W for 130nm Athlon 64 67W for 90nm Athlon 64 62W for 90nm Athlon 64 (new revision with virtialization support) 89W for FX51/53 104W for FX55/57 Dual core: 89W for some Athlon 64 X2, 110W for others, depending on revision and speed. 89W for Athlon 64 X2 with virtualization support 65W for Athlon 64 X2 EE (energy efficient models) 35W for Athlon 64 X2 3800+ EE SF (small form factor model) 110W for Athlon 64 FX60 125W for Athlon 64 FX62 So I would think any of the X2 EE models are a good match for the Core 2 Duo on power consumption vs. permance, while the 3800 EE SF needs a mobile chip to match it by the looks of it. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 4 12:57:30 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2006 08:57:30 -0400 Subject: Dual core Intel... how hot? In-Reply-To: <20060802193311.32692.qmail-fjYszm/wOJWB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060802174625.GX13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060802193311.32692.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20060804125730.GZ13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 02, 2006 at 03:33:11PM -0400, Colin McGregor wrote: > While the numbers do vary somewhat over time plus > things vary somewhat between AMD and Intel there is > something that seems to stay constant. Namely, of > CURRENT generation CPU chips, the cutting edge has > about 1.5 - 2 times the performance of the trailing > edge. Yet, the cutting edge chip will be 4 - 8 times > the price of the trailing edge chip. In other words > you pay a MASSIVE premium for a fairly modest > performance boost. > > This explains why ALL of the boxes I have put together > (starting with a AMD 386SX-25, back a lot of years ago > :-) ) have been current technology, but near the > trailing edge of the technology curve. > > While I am sure there are a FEW situations where going > to the cutting edge is cost effective, that doesn't > apply to 99% + of desktop users. The thing is, I consider the cost and performance of the whole system when deciding what parts are worth it. If you are going to spend say $3000 on the base components of a system, then a $200 cpu that runs half the speed of a $800 cpu, may still not be a good deal, if you can use the speed, since the slow system will cost you $3200, while the system at twice the speed will cost you $3800. It all depends on how much the other components cost. In a bargain system for $500, upgrading the cpu is often not cost effective. Mixing high end components into a low end system generally isn't. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 4 13:53:10 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2006 09:53:10 -0400 Subject: Linux-friendly PCI dialup modem? In-Reply-To: <20060802234254.GA13205-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20060730225702.GA12330@waltdnes.org> <20060731161659.GS13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060801211515.GA6950@waltdnes.org> <20060802142453.GU13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060802234254.GA13205@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <20060804135310.GA13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 02, 2006 at 07:42:54PM -0400, Walter Dnes wrote: > It was a USR X2, near the end of the model run. That was fortunate, > because that meant it was flash-upgradeable. Was it a sportster, or a courier? Both came in X2 models. I suspect a sportster, since the courier was always flashable (I got mine about 2 weeks before x2 came out, so I managed to flash it soon after getting it which made it a 56k rather than the 33.6 it shipped as, and of course a while later it was flashed to v90). -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 4 14:01:31 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2006 10:01:31 -0400 Subject: Linux-friendly PCI dialup modem? In-Reply-To: <44D1485B.5040208-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <20060730225702.GA12330@waltdnes.org> <20060731161659.GS13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060801211515.GA6950@waltdnes.org> <20060802142453.GU13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060802234254.GA13205@waltdnes.org> <44D1485B.5040208@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20060804140131.GB13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 02, 2006 at 08:50:35PM -0400, James Knott wrote: > I bought my USR Courier about 15 years ago. It started life at 14.4K > and was then upgraded to V.42 56K. It's flashable. I recall > downloading and installing the various "almost" V.42 updates. I also > received a free upgrade daughter board. I still have that modem > connected to my computer, but rarely use it these days. Those modems had some serious overkill. I believe the flash chip is 512KB, and they have quite a lot of ram too, and the DSP is either 20 or 25MHz depending on the model (probably slower back on the 14.4 models before they were upgraded). Modular circuit board to allow upgrading just the components that had to be upgraded for new features. I remember one modem test I read many years ago when 56k modems had just started taking off, and the v.everything had the highest throughput (many other modems didn't have the processing power to actually do full v.42bis compression at full speed doing full duplex, the courier did), and when they simulated various line problems, including bad satelite links, the courier had the highest connect speed, and was the only modem that didn't drop the line on the worst tests (short of actually cutting the line). This only worked that well when it was two couriers connected to each other of course, although even between brands, a courier would often do better with another modem, than the other modem would together with another of the same model. ISPs loved them (except the cost I imagine), but at least they were reliable which helped justify the cost. Now whatever happened to the HST protocol? :) > p.s I bought that modem from Canada Remote Systems (anyone remember > them?), for a few hundred $. I downloaded SLS 1.03 from there back in 93. Took forever at 2400. I remember they used to have piles of couriers before switching to digital lines with USR Total Control Hubs. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 4 14:11:55 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2006 10:11:55 -0400 Subject: ADSL modem VPI/VCI settings for Cybersurf/3Web in Ontario? In-Reply-To: <20060803024330.GB13205-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20060803024330.GB13205@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <20060804141155.GC13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 02, 2006 at 10:43:30PM -0400, Walter Dnes wrote: > I've ordered a replacement combo modem/router from an ebay store. It > should be here in a week or so. My old unit is so dead that I can't get > in to view the VPI/VCI settings. Does anybody know for certain what > they are? Any other Cybersurf/3Web ADSL customers on this list? Can > you check your settings please? > > My searching on Google indicates 0/35 for ADSL in Ontario. The script > reader at Cybersurf didn't know what I was talking about. His > supervisor suggested checking on Google, which I had already done. 0/35 is correct for all ADSL around here, since that is what Bell Canada uses. I think some parts of western canada might be different. The majority of ISPs in north america use the 0/35 setting though. Of course many ADSL modems just auto negotiate the setting (or at least try to, since on most networks there is only traffic on one channel, so you will find it. On a few networks there is other traffic, in which case auto might just fail). -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 4 14:17:39 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2006 10:17:39 -0400 Subject: OT: Unix computers and some give away In-Reply-To: <00a301c6b6a1$0daeb0a0$6401a8c0@atlantis> References: <44D11516.8050702@telly.org> <00a301c6b6a1$0daeb0a0$6401a8c0@atlantis> Message-ID: <20060804141739.GD13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 02, 2006 at 10:03:45PM -0400, Jeff wrote: > Hello All, > > I have a small collection of unix machines that I would like to give away. I > have no more storage for them. I prefer to have them all taken away at once. > > For your kindness I will give you a Ultra 10 machine. > > This is just a list of various items that you will get when you pickup the > lot. > > SGI > Indy > Indigo 2 x 3 > Indigo with 1 pair of special keyboard & mouse > With various cables and accessories > > Sun > Ultra 10 > SPARCstation 2 > SPARCstation 4 x 2 > SPARCstation 5 > SPARCstation 10 x 2 > SPARCstation 20 > Two Sun Monitors (one comes for the Ultra 10) > With varions cables and accessories, external drives and external cd-rom, > keyboard & mouse > > > Apple PowerMac 7500 with 300MHz G3 upgrade, 128RAM, etc > > DEC > Multia (shorted) Some parts might be good? > Two Alpha powered DEC machines > > IRIX 6.5.3, 6.2 and 5.3 cd's > > Various Solaris and SGI books/guides > > You must pickup the items by Friday this week. Or if someone wants to store > them and then distribute this to fellow TLUG members that would work for me > too. Please respond to my email first come first serve. I love old stuff, and would love a few of such machines (I have one SGI, but no sparcs, alphas or ppcs). Unfortunately my wife would kill me if I brought that many old machines into the house, and I don't think I would be able to get that many anyhow. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 4 15:50:43 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2006 11:50:43 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Linux-friendly PCI dialup modem? In-Reply-To: <20060804140131.GB13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20060804140131.GB13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20060804155043.58378.qmail@web88211.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Wed, Aug 02, 2006 at 08:50:35PM -0400, James > Knott wrote: > > p.s I bought that modem from Canada Remote Systems > (anyone remember > > them?), for a few hundred $. > > I downloaded SLS 1.03 from there back in 93. Took > forever at 2400. > > I remember they used to have piles of couriers > before switching to > digital lines with USR Total Control Hubs. If memory serves (and it has been a few years), CRS was a Hayes shop. As for Internet Direct (who I used to work for), they had hundreds of USR Sportster external modems before going to the Total Control Hubs (which caused me a great deal of grief. We knew we had air conditioning problems in the office that housed the Total Control Hubs, what it took us a while to understand was just how heat sensitive those units were... Also explains why I now hate Vivali's "The Four Seasons" (a basically innocuous bit of classical music) which USR used to use as their on-hold music (I heard that way too often and way too long :-( ). Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 4 16:17:24 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2006 12:17:24 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Dual core Intel... how hot? In-Reply-To: <20060804125730.GZ13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20060804125730.GZ13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20060804161724.93408.qmail@web88203.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Wed, Aug 02, 2006 at 03:33:11PM -0400, Colin > McGregor wrote: > > While the numbers do vary somewhat over time plus > > things vary somewhat between AMD and Intel there > is > > something that seems to stay constant. Namely, of > > CURRENT generation CPU chips, the cutting edge has > > about 1.5 - 2 times the performance of the > trailing > > edge. Yet, the cutting edge chip will be 4 - 8 > times > > the price of the trailing edge chip. In other > words > > you pay a MASSIVE premium for a fairly modest > > performance boost. > > > > This explains why ALL of the boxes I have put > together > > (starting with a AMD 386SX-25, back a lot of years > ago > > :-) ) have been current technology, but near the > > trailing edge of the technology curve. > > > > While I am sure there are a FEW situations where > going > > to the cutting edge is cost effective, that > doesn't > > apply to 99% + of desktop users. > > The thing is, I consider the cost and performance of > the whole system > when deciding what parts are worth it. If you are > going to spend say > $3000 on the base components of a system, then a > $200 cpu that runs half > the speed of a $800 cpu, may still not be a good > deal, if you can use > the speed, since the slow system will cost you > $3200, while the system > at twice the speed will cost you $3800. It all > depends on how much the > other components cost. In a bargain system for > $500, upgrading the cpu > is often not cost effective. Mixing high end > components into a low end > system generally isn't. One computer magazine columnist 10+ years ago noted, tongue in cheek, that the PC you want was always about $5,000 U.S. (i.e.: the box with ALL the high end goodies). Now, these days I am sure that number has dropped, even with $500+ video cards, and top of the line CPUs, etc.. Still, the question comes back to where/when can you reasonably justify such costs? If you are talking an engineer doing high end CAD work, where saving say 30 minutes per day at $N per hour, well, the numbers can be crunched and likely a top of the line CPU (or CPUs)can be justified over the course of a year (in which case go as nuts as the numbers justify). On the other hand a shipping clerk who needs to type up Fed-Ex shipping labels, well, forget it, a faster CPU will not make him type any faster, and that will be the speed bottleneck. In other words for ALMOST all business applications the sub-$1,000 no-name PC clones will do just fine. Likewise, for home use what, besides some games, will come even close to taxing trailing edge current generation CPU chips? Again, unless one is doing something BIZARRE I can not see any need/point in using a high end CPU/system for home use... Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 4 16:42:55 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Fri, 04 Aug 2006 12:42:55 -0400 Subject: Dual core Intel... how hot? In-Reply-To: <20060804161724.93408.qmail-7EKNVtTItHqB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060804161724.93408.qmail@web88203.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Colin McGregor wrote: > --- Lennart Sorensen > wrote: >> On Wed, Aug 02, 2006 at 03:33:11PM -0400, Colin >> McGregor wrote: >>> While the numbers do vary somewhat over time plus >>> things vary somewhat between AMD and Intel there >> is >>> something that seems to stay constant. Namely, of >>> CURRENT generation CPU chips, the cutting edge has >>> about 1.5 - 2 times the performance of the >> trailing >>> edge. Yet, the cutting edge chip will be 4 - 8 >> times >>> the price of the trailing edge chip. In other >> words >>> you pay a MASSIVE premium for a fairly modest >>> performance boost. >>> >>> This explains why ALL of the boxes I have put >> together >>> (starting with a AMD 386SX-25, back a lot of years >> ago >>> :-) ) have been current technology, but near the >>> trailing edge of the technology curve. >>> >>> While I am sure there are a FEW situations where >> going >>> to the cutting edge is cost effective, that >> doesn't >>> apply to 99% + of desktop users. >> The thing is, I consider the cost and performance of >> the whole system >> when deciding what parts are worth it. If you are >> going to spend say >> $3000 on the base components of a system, then a >> $200 cpu that runs half >> the speed of a $800 cpu, may still not be a good >> deal, if you can use >> the speed, since the slow system will cost you >> $3200, while the system >> at twice the speed will cost you $3800. It all >> depends on how much the >> other components cost. In a bargain system for >> $500, upgrading the cpu >> is often not cost effective. Mixing high end >> components into a low end >> system generally isn't. > > One computer magazine columnist 10+ years ago noted, > tongue in cheek, that the PC you want was always about > $5,000 U.S. (i.e.: the box with ALL the high end > goodies). Now, these days I am sure that number has > dropped, even with $500+ video cards, and top of the > line CPUs, etc.. > > Still, the question comes back to where/when can you > reasonably justify such costs? If you are talking an > engineer doing high end CAD work, where saving say 30 > minutes per day at $N per hour, well, the numbers can > be crunched and likely a top of the line CPU (or > CPUs)can be justified over the course of a year (in > which case go as nuts as the numbers justify). On the > other hand a shipping clerk who needs to type up > Fed-Ex shipping labels, well, forget it, a faster CPU > will not make him type any faster, and that will be > the speed bottleneck. In other words for ALMOST all > business applications the sub-$1,000 no-name PC clones > will do just fine. > > Likewise, for home use what, besides some games, will > come even close to taxing trailing edge current > generation CPU chips? Again, unless one is doing > something BIZARRE I can not see any need/point in > using a high end CPU/system for home use... Why aren't we all driving smart cars and riding motorcycles instead of Lincoln Navigators, BMW X5s, or Acura MDX's? It's not a matter of what people need in a computer, because when you think about it, that old 266 can run firefox and thunderbird just fine. Also that (hypothetical) $5000 266 machine lasted you 7~8 years or more, which when you think about it, means that the $1000 you'd spend a year (high estimate i know) keeping your old system up to date with new processor, ram, hdd's, dvd's etc. adds up to more in the end. It's a longterm or short term problem, that in the end, comes back to Wall Street and Bay Street -- marketing and sales, profit margins are all that matter. If that means selling people a new computer every 3 years even though they don't need one, then so be it. I do commend those who are still driving their mid 80s or 90s Toyota and still hacking on their old Commodore for holding out against the temptation to condemn that old unit to it's seemingly escaped built in obsolescence. I haven't purchased a "new" system for years, and I've never spent more than $500 in a year on new equipment, even with my shiny amd64 3700+ processor :) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 4 17:10:46 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Fri, 04 Aug 2006 13:10:46 -0400 Subject: Linux-friendly PCI dialup modem? In-Reply-To: <20060804155043.58378.qmail-N/0UzftCW16B9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060804155043.58378.qmail@web88211.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <44D37F96.2030809@rogers.com> Colin McGregor wrote: > --- Lennart Sorensen > wrote: >> On Wed, Aug 02, 2006 at 08:50:35PM -0400, James >> Knott wrote: >>> p.s I bought that modem from Canada Remote Systems >> (anyone remember >>> them?), for a few hundred $. >> I downloaded SLS 1.03 from there back in 93. Took >> forever at 2400. >> >> I remember they used to have piles of couriers >> before switching to >> digital lines with USR Total Control Hubs. > > If memory serves (and it has been a few years), CRS > was a Hayes shop. CRS had a variety of modem brands, so they could work with all the various "standards". However, it was the USR Couriers that they were selling. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 4 17:15:51 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2006 13:15:51 -0400 Subject: Linux-friendly PCI dialup modem? In-Reply-To: <20060804155043.58378.qmail-N/0UzftCW16B9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060804140131.GB13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060804155043.58378.qmail@web88211.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20060804171551.GG13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Aug 04, 2006 at 11:50:43AM -0400, Colin McGregor wrote: > If memory serves (and it has been a few years), CRS > was a Hayes shop. As for Internet Direct (who I used > to work for), they had hundreds of USR Sportster > external modems before going to the Total Control Hubs > (which caused me a great deal of grief. We knew we had > air conditioning problems in the office that housed > the Total Control Hubs, what it took us a while to > understand was just how heat sensitive those units > were... Also explains why I now hate Vivali's "The > Four Seasons" (a basically innocuous bit of classical > music) which USR used to use as their on-hold music (I > heard that way too often and way too long :-( ). Hmm, I may have mixed up the modems of CRS with Netcom Canada. Too many old companies that don't really do what they used to anymore (or even exist in some cases). -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 4 17:18:01 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2006 13:18:01 -0400 Subject: Dual core Intel... how hot? In-Reply-To: <20060804161724.93408.qmail-7EKNVtTItHqB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060804125730.GZ13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060804161724.93408.qmail@web88203.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20060804171801.GH13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Aug 04, 2006 at 12:17:24PM -0400, Colin McGregor wrote: > One computer magazine columnist 10+ years ago noted, > tongue in cheek, that the PC you want was always about > $5,000 U.S. (i.e.: the box with ALL the high end > goodies). Now, these days I am sure that number has > dropped, even with $500+ video cards, and top of the > line CPUs, etc.. > > Still, the question comes back to where/when can you > reasonably justify such costs? If you are talking an > engineer doing high end CAD work, where saving say 30 > minutes per day at $N per hour, well, the numbers can > be crunched and likely a top of the line CPU (or > CPUs)can be justified over the course of a year (in > which case go as nuts as the numbers justify). On the > other hand a shipping clerk who needs to type up > Fed-Ex shipping labels, well, forget it, a faster CPU > will not make him type any faster, and that will be > the speed bottleneck. In other words for ALMOST all > business applications the sub-$1,000 no-name PC clones > will do just fine. The machine for my farther will be a new one to run SolidWorks, so yes it is CAD. He thinks the Dell 3007 would be a nice monitor for CAD work too to replace the failing 21" CRT. > Likewise, for home use what, besides some games, will > come even close to taxing trailing edge current > generation CPU chips? Again, unless one is doing > something BIZARRE I can not see any need/point in > using a high end CPU/system for home use... My own machine is an athlon 700, and an athlon 1700+ in the mythtv box. Plenty for my needs. :) -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 4 17:33:05 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2006 13:33:05 -0400 Subject: [OT] Finally some payback for Online Scammers Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608041033h5a5e398fsd47ca5400212f071@mail.gmail.com> I found this to really fun read. =) Baiters Teach Scammers A Lesson "They pilfer nearly $200 million from Americans annually and drive some of their victims to suicide, but Nigeria's notorious e-mail scam artists may finally have met their match -- and the results can be hilarious. British online vigilante "Shiver Metimbers" is leading tens of thousands of "scambaiters" in a crusade to shut down advance-fee fraudsters, grifters who spam unwitting victims with elaborate, e-mailed sob stories promising a share of nonexistent fortunes in return for upfront payments. So-called 419 scams, named after the section of Nigeria's criminal code that covers the conduct, are the most common type of con; victims are sometimes left penniless. But Metimbers and crew turn the tables on scammers one by one, boomeranging the tricksters' own tactics to entice them into performing outlandish tasks in desperate pursuit of cash -- then trumpeting evidence of the con artists' na?vet? for the online world's amusement." Full Story at: http://www.wired.com/news/technology/internet/0,71387-0.html -- Scott Elcomb http://w3.avidus.ca/ http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 4 17:51:06 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2006 13:51:06 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [OT] Finally some payback for Online Scammers In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f0608041033h5a5e398fsd47ca5400212f071-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f0608041033h5a5e398fsd47ca5400212f071@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20060804175106.74962.qmail@web88205.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- Scott Elcomb wrote: > I found this to really fun read. =) > > Baiters Teach Scammers A Lesson > > "They pilfer nearly $200 million from Americans > annually and drive > some of their victims to suicide, but Nigeria's > notorious e-mail scam > artists may finally have met their match -- and the > results can be > hilarious. > > British online vigilante "Shiver Metimbers" is > leading tens of > thousands of "scambaiters" in a crusade to shut down > advance-fee > fraudsters, grifters who spam unwitting victims with > elaborate, > e-mailed sob stories promising a share of > nonexistent fortunes in > return for upfront payments. > > So-called 419 scams, named after the section of > Nigeria's criminal > code that covers the conduct, are the most common > type of con; victims > are sometimes left penniless. > > But Metimbers and crew turn the tables on scammers > one by one, > boomeranging the tricksters' own tactics to entice > them into > performing outlandish tasks in desperate pursuit of > cash -- then > trumpeting evidence of the con artists' na?vet? for > the online world's > amusement." > > Full Story at: > http://www.wired.com/news/technology/internet/0,71387-0.html I am not sure I would have the nerve to try that sort of thing against a scammer, but I do love reading about such events... Also here is a story about one guy who scammed an auction scammer out of a few $$ : http://easynetworknyc.com/powerbook/ Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 4 18:13:45 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Fri, 04 Aug 2006 14:13:45 -0400 Subject: [OT] Finally some payback for Online Scammers In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f0608041033h5a5e398fsd47ca5400212f071-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f0608041033h5a5e398fsd47ca5400212f071@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <44D38E59.4070909@telly.org> Scott Elcomb wrote: > I found this to really fun read. =) > > Full Story at: > http://www.wired.com/news/technology/internet/0,71387-0.html Better still, go right to the source and read some of the first-hand exploits of Mr. Metimbers at www.419eater.com I've been following it off and on for a while, and I have some favourite scenarios: http://www.419eater.com/html/moses_hand.htm http://forum.419eater.com/john_boko.htm http://www.419eater.com/html/bandofdavid.htm http://www.419eater.com/html/george.htm Have a listen to some of the recorded phone conversations too... - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 4 20:47:43 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Fri, 04 Aug 2006 16:47:43 -0400 Subject: [OT] Finally some payback for Online Scammers In-Reply-To: <44D38E59.4070909-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f0608041033h5a5e398fsd47ca5400212f071@mail.gmail.com> <44D38E59.4070909@telly.org> Message-ID: <44D3B26F.5050204@utoronto.ca> Evan Leibovitch wrote: > Scott Elcomb wrote: > >> I found this to really fun read. =) >> >> Full Story at: >> http://www.wired.com/news/technology/internet/0,71387-0.html > > Better still, go right to the source and read some of the first-hand > exploits of Mr. Metimbers at www.419eater.com > The BBC posted this article on it: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/3887493.stm I think Scotland Yard actually came out at one point a few years ago and told UK citizens to stop scamming the scammers as the "vigilantes" were being a little too effective and violating some law or another. I can't remember the details, but I think As it Happens did an interview with someone from Scotland Yard dealing with just this topic and people like Shiver Metinbers. The RCMP have had a dedicated page for reporting these emails for years: http://www.rcmp.ca/scams/west_african_e.htm -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rickl-ZACYGPecefkm4kRHVhTciCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 4 22:50:52 2006 From: rickl-ZACYGPecefkm4kRHVhTciCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Rick Tomaschuk) Date: Fri, 04 Aug 2006 18:50:52 -0400 Subject: the supermarket will be a supermarket from now on. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1154731852.4813.10.camel@spot1.localhost.com> The Register ... Touching on a broad gamut of competitors and markets, Turner summed up: "We must out run, out think and out execute our competition every day blah, blah, blah... we won't let them steal food from our plates...blah, blah, blah.....we have entitlement....blah, blah, blah...blah, blah, blah...... Create companies which compete in the business world using *nix which neither require nor want their crap software. Build *nix skills. Just go about your business and ignore them. They are irrelevant. RickT -- http://www.TorontoNUI.ca On Fri, 2006-07-28 at 21:55 +0300, Peter wrote: > And it will not be outhustled. The eula will be shorter but more > expensive. Pity, that was the only well-engineered part in their > products imho. Worded exactly like the GPL, but does not allow users to > keep anything, and it allows them to keep the money. > > http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/07/27/microsoft_coo_art_of_selling/ > > Peter > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 5 03:58:16 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Fri, 04 Aug 2006 23:58:16 -0400 Subject: [Fwd: RE: [TORONTO] for those who need help in technology related matters in Toronto] Message-ID: <44D41758.60104@rogers.com> There is a politically related guy who is pushing microsoft stuff at this yahoogroup. Can you give me any URLs related to open source sites so that I can counter him? Most of techsoup.org softwares are Microsoft related types. Kush -------- Original Message -------- Subject: RE: [TORONTO] for those who need help in technology related matters in Toronto Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2006 21:28:59 -0400 From: Advisor Reply-To: MEGACITY-TORONTO-hHKSG33TihgD7/nhltJ10Q at public.gmane.org To: For non profit's in Canada the following website is a great resource. Reduced pricing in software and hardware. http://www.techsoup.org/stock/default.asp?visit=1 www.techsoup.org ------------------------------------------------------------------------ *From:* MEGACITY-TORONTO-hHKSG33TihgD7/nhltJ10Q at public.gmane.org [mailto:MEGACITY-TORONTO-hHKSG33TihgD7/nhltJ10Q at public.gmane.org] *On Behalf Of *Kush *Sent:* Friday, August 04, 2006 8:14 PM *To:* MEGACITY-TORONTO-hHKSG33TihgD7/nhltJ10Q at public.gmane.org *Subject:* [TORONTO] for those who need help in technology related matters in Toronto For small business owners, schools, colleges and even large organizations including government and non profits in Toronto, pls know that most types of software's are becoming free and better and Toronto seems to have a lot of business savvy tech people now. http://www.torontonui.ca/ www.tlug.ca www.ubuntu.ca www.cluecan.ca www.trug.ca www.taug.ca www.openschools.ca http://debian.yorku.ca www.telly.org and sites like www.blender.org etc www.opensource.org www.sourceforge.net Kush __._,_.___ Megacity Toronto MySpace http://groups.myspace.com/megacitytoronto Megacity Toronto flickr Group http://www.flickr.com/groups/megacitytoronto freeTOreuse FREE STUFF TORONTO - TORONTO FREE STUFF http://groups.yahoo.com/group/freeTOreuse ------------------------------------------------------------------------ *Yahoo! Groups Links* * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://ca.groups.yahoo.com/group/MEGACITY-TORONTO/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: MEGACITY-TORONTO-unsubscribe-hHKSG33TihgD7/nhltJ10Q at public.gmane.org * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service . __,_._,___ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ican-rZHaEmXdJNJWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 5 11:11:06 2006 From: ican-rZHaEmXdJNJWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (bob) Date: Sat, 5 Aug 2006 07:11:06 -0400 Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war Message-ID: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> My inlaws purchased a new computer which came with XP preinstalled. The shop also configured the Sympatico dialup Internet and Outlook email. The whole system worked for a week or so. Being the security conscious son-in-law, I took it upon myself suggest a safe computing strategy: OFT (OO, Firefox, Thunderbird). Armed with my copy of The Open CD, I was invited to install OFT (OO, Firefox, Thunderbird) on their box. That is when everything stopped working. The first problem was a "known" or at least an anticipated one. Sympatico was in the process of "upgrading" all their customers to their new "hm" (Hot Mail) oursourced servers. From my previous experience with OFT on my mother's computer, my brother's computer and local forums on the Net I knew that Thunderbird (and possibly Norton) + Sympatico hm simply do not work. (My mother had to switch providers, my brother went back to Outlook). The solution was to switch to the local Cambridge ISP: Sentex ... which was known to work with Thunderbird. Of course when my inlaws call Sentex tech support to get the new dialup setup they give them the standard line "we only support Outlook email". Nonsense I say, Thunderbird will work. After a quick visit, sure enough Thunderbird is indeed sending and receiving email. However, now the dialup is cutting out after a few minutes online with Firefox. Sentex tech support cannot pin the problem to anything in their logs. In frustration my in-laws go back to the computer shop and have everything reinstalled. Now Sentex dials correctly, Outlook email works, no timeouts on IE. However, needless to say my "credibility" on the subject of safe computing is significantly diminished. (Memo to self: don't volunteer to sys admin for family). That is until my in-laws encounter their first major worm, virus and/or spyware infection ... This tale bothers me on a number of fronts. a) that a major national provider can hook up with a convicted monopolist to "ensure" that standard email software doesn't function b) that some obscure "bug" may exist in the combination of OO, Firefox, Thunderbird, The Open CD, Windows XP home, Norton that renders dialup "useless" ... and more importantly that the effort to sort this out will mean that it likely will remain a bug c) that problems like a) and b) are what will ultimately prevent open source software from ever reaching the mainstream home user bob -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mike.kallies-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 5 13:36:04 2006 From: mike.kallies-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Mike Kallies) Date: Sat, 5 Aug 2006 09:36:04 -0400 Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war In-Reply-To: <200608050711.06195.ican-rZHaEmXdJNJWk0Htik3J/w@public.gmane.org> References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> Message-ID: <92ee967a0608050636n71670007u74a2a66a5a794088@mail.gmail.com> On 8/5/06, bob wrote: ... > This tale bothers me on a number of fronts. > > a) that a major national provider can hook up with a convicted monopolist to > "ensure" that standard email software doesn't function > > b) that some obscure "bug" may exist in the combination of OO, Firefox, > Thunderbird, The Open CD, Windows XP home, Norton that renders dialup > "useless" ... and more importantly that the effort to sort this out will mean > that it likely will remain a bug > > c) that problems like a) and b) are what will ultimately prevent open source > software from ever reaching the mainstream home user ... If I understand correctly though, you just described how a partnership with MSN cost Sympatico a customer. I installed Firefox on a machine which I gave to my parents. I hid IE as best I could and gave them a restricted account on the machine. It's just a Win2k system. The worst which has happened so far was my father trying to order tickets through AirCanada and being told by an automated message to upgrade his browser. They wanted something which would support ActiveX. I told him that the computer was set up to be robust and relatively easy to use while requiring minimal fidgeting and customizing. Air Canada doesn't respect that. He was happy with that answer. The machine has OO and uses dial up too. It hasn't been a problem at all. Although I'll have to go look at it to see how many worms, viruses and trojans it has picked up :-) Microsoft seems to recognize that between personal firewalls, antivirus, antispam and system updates, MacOS or Linux are becoming more and more attractive to their userbase. Microsoft has been losing quite a few battles as of late. -Mike -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 5 13:41:05 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 09:41:05 -0400 Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war In-Reply-To: <200608050711.06195.ican-rZHaEmXdJNJWk0Htik3J/w@public.gmane.org> References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> Message-ID: bob wrote: > My inlaws purchased a new computer which came with XP preinstalled. The shop > also configured the Sympatico dialup Internet and Outlook email. The whole > system worked for a week or so. > > Being the security conscious son-in-law, I took it upon myself suggest a safe > computing strategy: OFT (OO, Firefox, Thunderbird). Armed with my copy of > The Open CD, I was invited to install OFT (OO, Firefox, Thunderbird) on > their box. > > That is when everything stopped working. > > The first problem was a "known" or at least an anticipated one. Sympatico was > in the process of "upgrading" all their customers to their new "hm" (Hot > Mail) oursourced servers. From my previous experience with OFT on my > mother's computer, my brother's computer and local forums on the Net I knew > that Thunderbird (and possibly Norton) + Sympatico hm simply do not work. > (My mother had to switch providers, my brother went back to Outlook). Two things: you can use (as I do) sympatico's other smtp servers. try smtp1 and smtp8.sympatico.ca -- I think both of those work in Ontario with your b1 userid (not your user-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org login). Second, Norton will work with Sympatico and any email program if you disable the email monitoring portion. It sounds bad, but as long as you have the rest of norton configured to protect the filesystem, nothing will get through that norton wouldn't normally allow through. > The solution was to switch to the local Cambridge ISP: Sentex ... which was > known to work with Thunderbird. > > Of course when my inlaws call Sentex tech support to get the new dialup setup > they give them the standard line "we only support Outlook email". Nonsense > I say, Thunderbird will work. After a quick visit, sure enough > Thunderbird is indeed sending and receiving email. If they tried calling Sympatico r.e. Thunderbird they'd get the same line. They are still with Sentex? At least if they are you've got them on a local ISP, there's something to be said for that (waiting for my contract to end so I ca switch). > However, now the dialup is cutting out after a few minutes online with > Firefox. Sentex tech support cannot pin the problem to anything in their > logs. > > In frustration my in-laws go back to the computer shop and have everything > reinstalled. > > Now Sentex dials correctly, Outlook email works, no timeouts on IE. > However, needless to say my "credibility" on the subject of safe computing > is significantly diminished. (Memo to self: don't volunteer to sys admin for > family). That is until my in-laws encounter their first major worm, virus > and/or spyware infection ... > > This tale bothers me on a number of fronts. > > a) that a major national provider can hook up with a convicted monopolist to > "ensure" that standard email software doesn't function Rogers has the same sort of deal with Yahoo. Synergy... > b) that some obscure "bug" may exist in the combination of OO, Firefox, > Thunderbird, The Open CD, Windows XP home, Norton that renders dialup > "useless" ... and more importantly that the effort to sort this out will mean > that it likely will remain a bug Not sure of this one, but perhaps a home router might help? I'd imagine that PPPoe and Norton would be the biggest problem, with the router at least they'd have a little more of a hardware firewall and a nice stable (read not looked after by Windows) connection. Are they only on dialup or on DSL with dialup as their alternate system? > c) that problems like a) and b) are what will ultimately prevent open source > software from ever reaching the mainstream home user > > > bob > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pw.armstrong-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 5 14:06:17 2006 From: pw.armstrong-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (PW Armstrong) Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 10:06:17 -0400 Subject: anyone ever run starry night or open-source equivalent on linux? In-Reply-To: <200608050711.06195.ican-rZHaEmXdJNJWk0Htik3J/w@public.gmane.org> References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> Message-ID: <44D4A5D9.4000702@gmail.com> anyone ever run starry night or open-source equivalent on linux? http://www.starrynight.com/ -peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From skrishnan-PeCUgM4zDv73fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 5 14:25:34 2006 From: skrishnan-PeCUgM4zDv73fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Srinivasan Krishnan) Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 10:25:34 -0400 Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war In-Reply-To: <200608050711.06195.ican-rZHaEmXdJNJWk0Htik3J/w@public.gmane.org> References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> Message-ID: <1154787934.1633.27.camel@ambipapa> > This tale bothers me on a number of fronts. > > a) that a major national provider can hook up with a convicted monopolist to > "ensure" that standard email software doesn't function > You don't know the half of it. My workplace had a routed Bell internet line with a /28 subnet, which we used to host our web and mail servers, all running Linux. A few months ago, I noticed a huge speed drop on the line, and called Bell tech support (their enterprise support, not Sympatico). I explained my problem to the support rep, and also told him that the line had worked fine since 2003. The response I got was: we need to test your line. Please take all your computers off of it, and hook up a single Windows PC to it for testing. When I asked why, he responded that he wanted to make sure that none of our servers had a virus that was creating network traffic, thus using up available bandwidth. I explained very politely that we had live web and mail servers connected to the line, and that I could not possibly take them down. I also explained that (a) all our servers ran Linux and were tightly secured, so the possibility of a virus or rootkit (he did not know what that meant) were extremely low, (b) that I had checked each box and sniffed outgoing traffic on each system with netstat and tcpdump (again, the support rep did not know what these were) in any case, just to make sure, and (c) we did not have *any* Windows system connected, so there was almost no chance of malware tying up the bandwidth and slowing things down. Well, the gentleman from Bell would have none of it. He asked me if I knew what I was talking about and said that Linux was as suceptible to virii as Windows, and that it was probably a "Linux virus" that was causing the problem. No amount of arguing or explanation worked, and I finally asked to speak to his supervisor. That worthy was no better, and said that we had to do what tech support had demanded, in order to debug the line. Ultimately I told him we would have to shift critical systems to our backup line, that it would take a day or so to do it, and would they please check their connectivity and the local loop in the meantime. The line was fixed in a few hours after that. I did not have to do anything, so it was something on their end that was causing the problem. The message I got from this incident was that Bell seemed to be going out of their way to be Linux unfriendly. As a result, I have now shifted to an MCI T1. The bandwidth is great for uplink, their support is awesome in terms of quality as well as response time, and their pricing is not all that much higher (significantly lower than Bell's T1 pricing, incidentally). If you're running Linux and use Bell for internet connectivity, caveat emptor! Cheers, Krishnan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr.mcgregor-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 5 14:28:11 2006 From: mr.mcgregor-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (John McGregor) Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 10:28:11 -0400 Subject: Sympatico + Norton + OFT Message-ID: <44D4AAFB.4030206@rogers.com> Its been my experience that the various Norton products do no work well / at all with Win XP and can be the root cause of major problems over and above sending / receiving email.. When a client presents me with a new PC, the first thing I do is to look for Norton Antivirus / Internet Security and then uninstall it. I replace it with the free version of AVG Antivirus: http://free.grisoft.com/doc/avg-anti-virus-free/lng/us/tpl/v5 and the free version of Zone Alarm. Thunderbird will work with Sympatico's new servers if you select the 'use TLS, if available' security option for both incoming and outgoing connections. A far better option, of course, is to switch them to Linux at the earliest possible convenience. HTH John -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr.mcgregor-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 5 15:03:03 2006 From: mr.mcgregor-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (John McGregor) Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 11:03:03 -0400 Subject: Starry Night Message-ID: <44D4B327.3010205@rogers.com> try Celestia: http://www.shatters.net/celestia/download.html HTH John -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 5 18:07:35 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 14:07:35 -0400 Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war In-Reply-To: References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> Message-ID: <44D4DE67.7060009@rogers.com> Jamon Camisso wrote: >> a) that a major national provider can hook up with a convicted >> monopolist to "ensure" that standard email software doesn't function > > Rogers has the same sort of deal with Yahoo. Synergy... Rogers works fine for me. I use fetchmail to download email to my IMAP server and standard SMTP for sending. I can also access their POP server with MOzilla etc. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rickl-ZACYGPecefkm4kRHVhTciCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 5 22:30:41 2006 From: rickl-ZACYGPecefkm4kRHVhTciCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Rick Tomaschuk) Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 18:30:41 -0400 Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war In-Reply-To: <1154787934.1633.27.camel@ambipapa> References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> <1154787934.1633.27.camel@ambipapa> Message-ID: <1154817041.9335.22.camel@spot1.localhost.com> A simple router is all that is required to maintain a connection with Rogers or Bell...not a window$ machine. I had a similar blow up with Rogers last year as I have a Win98 hard drive ready to boot at all times and proved them wrong in a flash and then poked and prodded them about window$ vs Linux. I got the tech to admit that there was no problem at my end but rather they had been upgrading their equipment and this led to my connectivity problem. You should explain to Bell tech that if they are not qualified to assess the problem they should look for employment elsewhere and that as a customer you have the right to run what ever software you please. If they say they don't support Linux tell them they are stupid and don't know what they are talking about then ask for the next supervisor up the chain till you get results. Sometimes just suggesting that you want to talk to a supervisor gets them to move faster. Educate these a_holes. Micro$oft is only relevant to non-tech types. Anyone in the know about basic computer operating systems is aware that business tasks can be done with a PIII running anything except window$. There is no 'war'. What we have is a self image problem in that (Linux/Unix) techs feel worthless unless the daily paper is plastered with ads promoting their favorite operating system. How many ads to you see about basic toothbrushes? or automotive engine pistons? or fuel injectors? or copper wire? or the brand of plastic used to make a toilet seat? or the milk used to make ice cream? or ..... Start a business, however small and use only software you want to support your product/service offering. RickT http://www.TorontoNUI.ca On Sat, 2006-08-05 at 10:25 -0400, Srinivasan Krishnan wrote: > > This tale bothers me on a number of fronts. > > > > a) that a major national provider can hook up with a convicted monopolist to > > "ensure" that standard email software doesn't function > > > > You don't know the half of it. My workplace had a routed Bell internet > line with a /28 subnet, which we used to host our web and mail servers, > all running Linux. A few months ago, I noticed a huge speed drop on the > line, and called Bell tech support (their enterprise support, not > Sympatico). I explained my problem to the support rep, and also told > him that the line had worked fine since 2003. > > The response I got was: we need to test your line. Please take all your > computers off of it, and hook up a single Windows PC to it for testing. > When I asked why, he responded that he wanted to make sure that none of > our servers had a virus that was creating network traffic, thus using up > available bandwidth. I explained very politely that we had live web and > mail servers connected to the line, and that I could not possibly take > them down. I also explained that (a) all our servers ran Linux and were > tightly secured, so the possibility of a virus or rootkit (he did not > know what that meant) were extremely low, (b) that I had checked each > box and sniffed outgoing traffic on each system with netstat and tcpdump > (again, the support rep did not know what these were) in any case, just > to make sure, and (c) we did not have *any* Windows system connected, so > there was almost no chance of malware tying up the bandwidth and slowing > things down. > > Well, the gentleman from Bell would have none of it. He asked me if I > knew what I was talking about and said that Linux was as suceptible to > virii as Windows, and that it was probably a "Linux virus" that was > causing the problem. No amount of arguing or explanation worked, and I > finally asked to speak to his supervisor. That worthy was no better, > and said that we had to do what tech support had demanded, in order to > debug the line. Ultimately I told him we would have to shift critical > systems to our backup line, that it would take a day or so to do it, and > would they please check their connectivity and the local loop in the > meantime. > > The line was fixed in a few hours after that. I did not have to do > anything, so it was something on their end that was causing the problem. > > The message I got from this incident was that Bell seemed to be going > out of their way to be Linux unfriendly. As a result, I have now > shifted to an MCI T1. The bandwidth is great for uplink, their support > is awesome in terms of quality as well as response time, and their > pricing is not all that much higher (significantly lower than Bell's T1 > pricing, incidentally). > > If you're running Linux and use Bell for internet connectivity, caveat > emptor! > > Cheers, > > Krishnan > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- http://www.TorontoNUI.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 5 23:38:49 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 19:38:49 -0400 Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war In-Reply-To: <200608050711.06195.ican-rZHaEmXdJNJWk0Htik3J/w@public.gmane.org> References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> Message-ID: <44D52C09.30608@rogers.com> Though IBM and others seem to back linux, yet when one goes to buy branded laptops, even IBM is selling windows xp preinstalled. Not to mention sony, hp, dell etc and the others. I went with a friend to a computer shop to look at some of the laptops and the sales assistants were not ready to uninstall XP from the IBM machines and take off its cost from the sales price. Why are these companies paying only lip service to backing linux and what can be done? Is the problem unique to Canada or is it prevalent in the US also where I believe there is much more competition and consumer choice? Kush -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 5 23:47:01 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 19:47:01 -0400 Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war In-Reply-To: <44D52C09.30608-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> <44D52C09.30608@rogers.com> Message-ID: <44D52DF5.8040804@rogers.com> Kush wrote: > Though IBM and others seem to back linux, yet when one goes to buy > branded laptops, even IBM is selling windows xp preinstalled. Not to > mention sony, hp, dell etc and the others. http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS7778908329.html BTW, IBM got out of the desktop/notebook computer business about a year ago. > > I went with a friend to a computer shop to look at some of the laptops > and the sales assistants were not ready to uninstall XP from the IBM > machines and take off its cost from the sales price. Would you expect to go into the same computer store and have the clerk remove the DVD drive and reduce the price? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From zleap-Tp5KeRqLOeNeoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 5 23:41:36 2006 From: zleap-Tp5KeRqLOeNeoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (Paul Sutton) Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 19:41:36 -0400 Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war In-Reply-To: <44D52C09.30608-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> <44D52C09.30608@rogers.com> Message-ID: <44D52CB0.3010904@zleap.net> acer are selling laptops pre installed with Linux, Paul Kush wrote: > Though IBM and others seem to back linux, yet when one goes to buy > branded laptops, even IBM is selling windows xp preinstalled. Not to > mention sony, hp, dell etc and the others. > > I went with a friend to a computer shop to look at some of the laptops > and the sales assistants were not ready to uninstall XP from the IBM > machines and take off its cost from the sales price. > > Why are these companies paying only lip service to backing linux and > what can be done? Is the problem unique to Canada or is it prevalent in > the US also where I believe there is much more competition and consumer > choice? > > Kush > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 6 00:06:45 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 20:06:45 -0400 Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war In-Reply-To: <44D52C09.30608-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> <44D52C09.30608@rogers.com> Message-ID: Kush wrote: > Though IBM and others seem to back linux, yet when one goes to buy > branded laptops, even IBM is selling windows xp preinstalled. Not to > mention sony, hp, dell etc and the others. > > I went with a friend to a computer shop to look at some of the laptops > and the sales assistants were not ready to uninstall XP from the IBM > machines and take off its cost from the sales price. Buying from stores at College and Spadina, no XP preloaded. For the same price as the Lenovo unit, you can customize your barebones chassis, purchase manufacturer's extended warranty, and still end up cheaper than purchasing a unit from Lenovo or a large(r) computer shop who won't remove Windows. Have you considered purchasing a unit, disagreeing with the license and taking it back to the store? If you make enough of a fuss there isn't much they can do but give you your money back. Better to buy at a smaller shop though -- support the locals :) > Why are these companies paying only lip service to backing linux and > what can be done? Is the problem unique to Canada or is it prevalent in > the US also where I believe there is much more competition and consumer > choice? Walmart sells Linux on laptops, so there is some penetration there I think, not much I'd imagine. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 6 00:11:58 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 20:11:58 -0400 Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war In-Reply-To: References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> <44D52C09.30608@rogers.com> Message-ID: <44D533CE.8070404@rogers.com> Jamon Camisso wrote: > Walmart sells Linux on laptops, so there is some penetration there I > think, not much I'd imagine. > -- > Walmart does not sell linux laptops/desktops in Canada but in the US, I believe. I had seen their websites a few months back and there was a big difference between what they sell here in Ca and in the uS. Kush -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 6 00:13:48 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 20:13:48 -0400 Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war In-Reply-To: <44D52CB0.3010904-Tp5KeRqLOeNeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org> References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> <44D52C09.30608@rogers.com> <44D52CB0.3010904@zleap.net> Message-ID: <44D5343C.4090008@rogers.com> Paul Sutton wrote: > acer are selling laptops pre installed with Linux, Here's a company that sells notebook computers with Linux or no OS for less than the same computer with Windows. They're local too. http://www.angelcomputer.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 6 00:19:22 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 20:19:22 -0400 Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war In-Reply-To: <44D52DF5.8040804-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> <44D52C09.30608@rogers.com> <44D52DF5.8040804@rogers.com> Message-ID: <44D5358A.4090108@rogers.com> James Knott wrote: > Kush wrote: > >> Though IBM and others seem to back linux, yet when one goes to buy >> branded laptops, even IBM is selling windows xp preinstalled. Not to >> mention sony, hp, dell etc and the others. >> > > http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS7778908329.html > This is some news but will it happen in Toronto is the key question. Here we don't generally see Lenovo computers but more of IBM. > BTW, IBM got out of the desktop/notebook computer business about a year ago. > > >> I went with a friend to a computer shop to look at some of the laptops >> and the sales assistants were not ready to uninstall XP from the IBM >> machines and take off its cost from the sales price. >> > > Would you expect to go into the same computer store and have the clerk > remove the DVD drive and reduce the price? > > > Maybe the clerk would be more customer oriented if there was competition in the market (like the US) and more people knew or asked for what they wanted. At present this place looks to be a sellers market where the sellers have an attitude--take it or leave it. Kush -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 6 00:20:27 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 20:20:27 -0400 Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war In-Reply-To: <44D5343C.4090008-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> <44D52C09.30608@rogers.com> <44D52CB0.3010904@zleap.net> <44D5343C.4090008@rogers.com> Message-ID: <44D535CB.8000602@rogers.com> James Knott wrote: > Paul Sutton wrote: > >> acer are selling laptops pre installed with Linux, >> > > Here's a company that sells notebook computers with Linux or no OS for > less than the same computer with Windows. They're local too. > > http://www.angelcomputer.com > > Thanks Kush -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 6 00:21:29 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 20:21:29 -0400 Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war In-Reply-To: <44D52CB0.3010904-Tp5KeRqLOeNeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org> References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> <44D52C09.30608@rogers.com> <44D52CB0.3010904@zleap.net> Message-ID: <44D53609.3000003@rogers.com> Paul Sutton wrote: > acer are selling laptops pre installed with Linux, > > > Paul Thanks for the info. Kush -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From zleap-Tp5KeRqLOeNeoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 6 00:17:45 2006 From: zleap-Tp5KeRqLOeNeoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (Paul Sutton) Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 20:17:45 -0400 Subject: debian install can anyone help please, In-Reply-To: <44D533CE.8070404-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> <44D52C09.30608@rogers.com> <44D533CE.8070404@rogers.com> Message-ID: <44D53529.1050701@zleap.net> Hi I know this is short notice but does anyone have a copy of debian or kanotix (debian sid based), that they could drop over to the global village backpackers between now and monday evening please. I have a laptop, it's just a basic ibm thinkpad with windows 98, which is great for mail etc, however I want to update my website and perhaps the one for the rugby club and it would really help to have Linux for that. I seem to have a 15 gb hdd, 12 gb free space so thats should be plenty, I am a bit concerned however about deleting the doze partition completly as I would have to back up the drivers in case I need to put windows back on for what ever reason, it's good to have dual boot sometimes anyway. the backpackers hostel is at 460 king street, on the junction of king and spadina, i have some blank cd's here so if you bring one over you can have a blank one to replace the one you used. sorry it's short notice but I have to be back at summer camp on tuesday and the bus leaves from yorkdale at 7:30, so that only leaves sunday and monday to get hold of something, what I intend to do is dual boot, if everything works then I have no real need for windows, but I can't risk not having something work, I think the wireless network card should be ok (SMC), any one had any experince with this. thanks paul -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 6 00:28:34 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 20:28:34 -0400 Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war In-Reply-To: References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> <44D52C09.30608@rogers.com> Message-ID: <44D537B2.6000008@rogers.com> Jamon Camisso wrote: > Better > to buy at a smaller shop though -- support the locals :) > > One would buy from the locals if there was some way to rate them. I saw www.torontopcstores.com but its hardly used as the local better business bureau for the computer/tech market. Maybe there are other competing sites I have no idea of. Nobody has ever done a requirement specifications for what a customer wants in a site which evaluates and monitors a particular industry and is the defacto local BBB. Kush -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 6 00:35:52 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 20:35:52 -0400 Subject: debian install can anyone help please, In-Reply-To: <44D53529.1050701-Tp5KeRqLOeNeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org> References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> <44D52C09.30608@rogers.com> <44D533CE.8070404@rogers.com> <44D53529.1050701@zleap.net> Message-ID: <44D53968.20406@rogers.com> Is your problem that of making a CD because of a lack of a good net connection ? or lack of a cd/dvd writer? I could pass on a debian/kanotix CD if you let me know which Exact version you want. But the delivery will only be tomorrow as tonight will go in downloading the iso from the net if you let me know soon. Kush Paul Sutton wrote: > > Hi > > I know this is short notice but does anyone have a copy of debian or > kanotix (debian sid based), that they could drop over to the global > village backpackers between now and monday evening please. > > I have a laptop, it's just a basic ibm thinkpad with windows 98, > which is great for mail etc, however I want to update my website and > perhaps the one for the rugby club and it would really help to have > Linux for that. > > I seem to have a 15 gb hdd, 12 gb free space so thats should be > plenty, I am a bit concerned however about deleting the doze > partition completly as I would have to back up the drivers in case I > need to put windows back on for what ever reason, it's good to have > dual boot sometimes anyway. > > the backpackers hostel is at 460 king street, on the junction of king > and spadina, i have some blank cd's here so if you bring one over you > can have a blank one to replace the one you used. > > sorry it's short notice but I have to be back at summer camp on > tuesday and the bus leaves from yorkdale at 7:30, so that only leaves > sunday and monday to get hold of something, > > what I intend to do is dual boot, if everything works then I have no > real need for windows, but I can't risk not having something work, I > think the wireless network card should be ok (SMC), any one had any > experince with this. > > > thanks > > paul > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 6 01:08:21 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 21:08:21 -0400 Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war In-Reply-To: <44D537B2.6000008-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> <44D52C09.30608@rogers.com> <44D537B2.6000008@rogers.com> Message-ID: Kush wrote: > Jamon Camisso wrote: >> Better >> to buy at a smaller shop though -- support the locals :) >> >> > One would buy from the locals if there was some way to rate them. I saw > www.torontopcstores.com but its hardly used as the local better business > bureau for the computer/tech market. Maybe there are other competing > sites I have no idea of. > > Nobody has ever done a requirement specifications for what a customer > wants in a site which evaluates and monitors a particular industry and > is the defacto local BBB. There are about 5 stores in the area that I frequent. In no particular order: Filtech (SE corner on spadina at college) Alpha Plus (SW corner on college at spadina) Sonnam (NE corner on spadina at college) Canada Computers (N side of college about 1.5 blocks west of bathurst). There's one other that I only know by sight, either Fortune (which I doubt) or COMing computers. I can't remember. I've also visited PC4Canada just south of Filtech and met with excellent service and prices. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 6 01:12:16 2006 From: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org) Date: Sat, 5 Aug 2006 21:12:16 -0400 (EDT) Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war In-Reply-To: <44D54105.7090502-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> <44D52C09.30608@rogers.com> <44D537B2.6000008@rogers.com> <44D54105.7090502@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <50032.207.188.67.241.1154826736.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> > Canada Computers (N side of college about 1.5 blocks west of bathurst). ^^^^ east or > Canada Computers (N side of college about 1.5 blocks west of bathurst) Spadina ^^^^^^^^ -- Peter Hiscocks Syscomp Electronic Design Limited, Toronto http://www.syscompdesign.com USB Oscilloscope and Waveform Generator 647-839-0325 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 6 01:21:15 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 21:21:15 -0400 Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war In-Reply-To: <50032.207.188.67.241.1154826736.squirrel-2RFepEojUI2DznVbVsZi4adLQS1dU2Lr@public.gmane.org> References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> <44D52C09.30608@rogers.com> <44D537B2.6000008@rogers.com> <44D54105.7090502@utoronto.ca> <50032.207.188.67.241.1154826736.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> Message-ID: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org wrote: >> Canada Computers (N side of college about 1.5 blocks west of bathurst). > ^^^^ east > or > >> Canada Computers (N side of college about 1.5 blocks west of bathurst) > Spadina > ^^^^^^^^ Right, their move from Augusta to the other side of the street got me very confused there. They are at Brunswick and College on the north side, pretty much directly between Bathurst and Spadina. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 6 02:48:20 2006 From: hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (D. Hugh Redelmeier) Date: Sat, 5 Aug 2006 22:48:20 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Dual core Intel... how hot? In-Reply-To: <20060804125351.GY13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20060802144557.GA17952@wp.magstar.net> <20060802174625.GX13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060802184814.GA18495@wp.magstar.net> <20060804125351.GY13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: | From: Lennart Sorensen | On Wed, Aug 02, 2006 at 02:48:14PM -0400, William Park wrote: | > Thanks Lennart. Is Core 2 Duo cooler than current AMD 64? | | Depends on the model of Athlon 64. Thanks for all those figures. I am guessing that they are the "thermal design power" ("TDP") figures for each chip. One problem with TDP is that AMD and Intel specify them differently. In particular, AMD's TDP is the most power that a chip can use when the "inputs" are within spec. Intel's TDP is a nice high-but-not-worst-case number; they demand you throttle when the temperature gets too high. So Intel's numbers appear lower. This article is quite interesting: http://www.silentpcreview.com/article169-page3.html I found this from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermal_Design_Power BTW, speed throttling might not be the most rational approach. Given a fixed amount of computation to perform, full-speed processing followed by sleep-when-done may be more energy-efficient than throttled-speed processing followed by less sleep. If sleep can be entered and exited quickly enough, this may be generalized to interactive computational loads. | 62W for 90nm Athlon 64 (new revision with virtualization support) I didn't realize that this was out already. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From glayng-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 6 03:32:45 2006 From: glayng-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Gary Layng) Date: Sat, 5 Aug 2006 23:32:45 -0400 Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war In-Reply-To: <44D52C09.30608-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> <44D52C09.30608@rogers.com> Message-ID: <200608052332.46051.glayng@sympatico.ca> I find it ironic that we're complaining about not being able to buy computers with Linux preinstalled, the day after Lenovo, the company that bought IBM's PC business, announced that they will preload SuSE Linux on one model of their Thinkpads. Story here: http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS7778908329.html On August 5, 2006 19:38, Kush wrote: > Though IBM and others seem to back linux, yet when one goes to buy > branded laptops, even IBM is selling windows xp preinstalled. Not to > mention sony, hp, dell etc and the others. > > I went with a friend to a computer shop to look at some of the laptops > and the sales assistants were not ready to uninstall XP from the IBM > machines and take off its cost from the sales price. > > Why are these companies paying only lip service to backing linux and > what can be done? Is the problem unique to Canada or is it prevalent in > the US also where I believe there is much more competition and consumer > choice? > > Kush > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- there's no place like 127.0.0.1 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rob-3Aypa9sX/B7wvR0lvYjcXw at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 6 03:50:46 2006 From: rob-3Aypa9sX/B7wvR0lvYjcXw at public.gmane.org (Rob Sutherland) Date: Sat, 5 Aug 2006 23:50:46 -0400 Subject: Open Source MMORPGs Message-ID: <200608052350.46178.rob@luckdancing.com> I'm trying to organize a small LAN party and I'm looking for some pointers to Open Source MMORPGS and other types of networked game/social space MUD/MUSH type things that are easy to set up and get newbies started on. I'm trying to get examples of different types of games, from first person shooters through multi-player strategy games to looser, more socially oriented kinds of things, so any suggestions are welcome. Rob 'What did the zero say to the eight?' http://www.luckdancing.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 6 05:15:02 2006 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2006 01:15:02 -0400 Subject: Linux-friendly PCI dialup modem? In-Reply-To: <20060804135310.GA13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20060730225702.GA12330@waltdnes.org> <20060731161659.GS13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060801211515.GA6950@waltdnes.org> <20060802142453.GU13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060802234254.GA13205@waltdnes.org> <20060804135310.GA13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20060806051502.GB32295@waltdnes.org> On Fri, Aug 04, 2006 at 09:53:10AM -0400, Lennart Sorensen wrote > Was it a sportster, or a courier? Both came in X2 models. "Sportster with X2" -- Walter Dnes In linux /sbin/init is Job #1 My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 6 05:53:37 2006 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2006 01:53:37 -0400 Subject: My ADSL modem/router revived! Message-ID: <20060806055337.GC32295@waltdnes.org> Don't know why, but after a week of vacation, my ADSL modem/router has come back refreshed and full of zip... sort of like me after a week off. The one change I noticed is that it's now at 2784/800 kbps down/up, rather than the previous 3008/800. I remember that IStop restricted me to approx 2200, because they felt the line quality was marginal for 3 megabits. Cybersurf automatically pushed it to 3008/800 when they took over IStop's customers. One of the first things I did was to go to the setup screens and take screen captures of the parameters. I've already ordered a used Netgear 4-port unit from an ebay store. It's too late to back out now. And the experience of a week on dialup has convinced me of the need for a backup ADSL modem... he says as he sits typing and downloading Gentoo updates and listening to a 64Kbit internet radio station. -- Walter Dnes In linux /sbin/init is Job #1 My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 6 08:58:40 2006 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy Ali) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2006 03:58:40 -0500 Subject: Open Source MMORPGs In-Reply-To: <200608052350.46178.rob-3Aypa9sX/B7wvR0lvYjcXw@public.gmane.org> References: <200608052350.46178.rob@luckdancing.com> Message-ID: <1e55af990608060158s15fde120wd604119ddc42fdad@mail.gmail.com> Doom/Quake are good for FPS. I don't know of a decent and finished open source MUD, but there are some free ones like aardwolf.org which have 400+ players on at any moment. Depending on your audience, you could even try things like networked card games or strategy games. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 6 11:31:39 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sun, 06 Aug 2006 07:31:39 -0400 Subject: Open Source MMORPGs In-Reply-To: <200608052350.46178.rob-3Aypa9sX/B7wvR0lvYjcXw@public.gmane.org> References: <200608052350.46178.rob@luckdancing.com> Message-ID: <44D5D31B.5080606@rogers.com> Rob Sutherland wrote: > I'm trying to organize a small LAN party and I'm looking for some pointers to You could have a sing along. "This lan is your lan, this lan is my lan" ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 6 13:31:56 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2006 09:31:56 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Open Source MMORPGs In-Reply-To: <200608052350.46178.rob-3Aypa9sX/B7wvR0lvYjcXw@public.gmane.org> References: <200608052350.46178.rob@luckdancing.com> Message-ID: <20060806133156.27641.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- Rob Sutherland wrote: > I'm trying to organize a small LAN party and I'm > looking for some pointers to > Open Source MMORPGS and other types of networked > game/social space MUD/MUSH > type things that are easy to set up and get newbies > started on. I'm trying to > get examples of different types of games, from first > person shooters through > multi-player strategy games to looser, more socially > oriented kinds of > things, so any suggestions are welcome. I have not tried it yet, but you may want to have a look at the Cube engines: www.cubeengine.com Bottom line, two open source first person shooter games, Cube 1 is reminisent of Doom 1/2 (psudo-3D terain), Cube 2 is reminisent of the Quake 1/2 (true 3D terain). Both games have single player and multi-player modes. Cube 2 is available for Linux, Mac and Windows. Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From zleap-Tp5KeRqLOeNeoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 6 14:17:50 2006 From: zleap-Tp5KeRqLOeNeoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (Paul Sutton) Date: Sun, 06 Aug 2006 10:17:50 -0400 Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war - Linux laptops In-Reply-To: <200608052332.46051.glayng-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> <44D52C09.30608@rogers.com> <200608052332.46051.glayng@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <44D5FA0E.1070400@zleap.net> Perhaps we could have links on the website to companies that sell computers with Linux pre-installed, in return for this perhaps those shops could have flyers for the user group, so new users can then get in touch and get help if they are new to Linux, ok this would work out as either free tech support or helping out the community depending on how you look at things, if this works, word will spread that a) the support is there and b) the expertise is out there, and more importantly the community is helpful, I have a flyer from the computer shop at 298 college street they have an Acer aspire 3623 NWXNi for $569 Paul Gary Layng wrote: > I find it ironic that we're complaining about not being able to buy computers > with Linux preinstalled, the day after Lenovo, the company that bought IBM's > PC business, announced that they will preload SuSE Linux on one model of > their Thinkpads. > > Story here: > http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS7778908329.html > > On August 5, 2006 19:38, Kush wrote: >> Though IBM and others seem to back linux, yet when one goes to buy >> branded laptops, even IBM is selling windows xp preinstalled. Not to >> mention sony, hp, dell etc and the others. >> >> I went with a friend to a computer shop to look at some of the laptops >> and the sales assistants were not ready to uninstall XP from the IBM >> machines and take off its cost from the sales price. >> >> Why are these companies paying only lip service to backing linux and >> what can be done? Is the problem unique to Canada or is it prevalent in >> the US also where I believe there is much more competition and consumer >> choice? >> >> Kush >> >> -- >> The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >> TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >> How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 6 21:39:23 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Sun, 06 Aug 2006 17:39:23 -0400 Subject: OT: 2.5" hdd data recovery Message-ID: I've a friend who's Hitachi Travelstar has packed it in after 4 years of service. Of course he doesn't have a backup. The drive is unrecognized in both my external USB enclosure and in another laptop, leading me to believe that something is wrong with the power connection, and/or the internals themselves. This in mind then: does anyone on this list do 2.5" physical recovery or know of anyone who is reasonably priced who does? By reasonable I'm talking home user prices, not corporate datacenter, globally deployed swat team recovery experts. I'm talking a maximum of $500 or there is no recovery. A near impossible request, I know what the larger services sometimes charge. A grim situation, so TIA for any contacts of offers to help. I know of the large companies like CBL and Ontrack of course, google is useful, but... someone mentioned a downtown company a while ago (last year) that starts with an R, something like R-Tools, or RT soft? I can't remember, but they were reasonable and local. Jamon -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 7 01:59:47 2006 From: meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org (Meng Cheah) Date: Sun, 06 Aug 2006 21:59:47 -0400 Subject: OT: Hackers crack new biometric passports Message-ID: <44D69E93.3040508@pppoe.ca> *Hackers crack new biometric passports* *Bobbie Johnson, technology correspondent Monday August 7, 2006 The Guardian * Hi-tech biometric passports used by Britain and other countries have been hacked by a computer expert, throwing into doubt fundamental parts of the UK's ?415m scheme to load passports with information such as fingerprints, facial scans and iris patterns. Speaking at the Defcon security conference in Las Vegas, Lukas Grunwald, a consultant with a German security company, said he had discovered a method for cloning the information stored in the new passports. Data can be transferred onto blank chips, which could then be implanted in fake passports, a flaw which he said undermined the project. The revelation also casts another shadow over the government's plan for a national ID card, which would contain much of the same information. /More at http://technology.guardian.co.uk/news/story/0,,1838751,00.html There is also a link to a 200 page report on ID cards (in pdf) / -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From dcbour-Uj1Tbf34OBsy5HIR1wJiBuOEVfOsBSGQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 7 02:10:41 2006 From: dcbour-Uj1Tbf34OBsy5HIR1wJiBuOEVfOsBSGQ at public.gmane.org (Dave Bour) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2006 22:10:41 -0400 Subject: OT: 2.5" hdd data recovery Message-ID: <5F47429283BD2A4C8FF1106E3F27F4730A3262@mse2be2.mse2.exchange.ms> Jason, This is one of the things I do regularly. Give me a call tomorrow in the morning to discuss further. I'm based out of Burlington. D Dave Bour Desktop Solution Center 905.381.0077 dcbour at desktopsolutioncenter.ca For those who just want it to work... Giving you complete IT peace of mind. (Sent via Blackberry - hence message may be shorter than my usual verbose responses) PIN 3010A5AF (as of June 12, 2006) -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug at ss.org To: tlug at ss.org Sent: Sun Aug 06 17:39:23 2006 Subject: [TLUG]: OT: 2.5" hdd data recovery I've a friend who's Hitachi Travelstar has packed it in after 4 years of service. Of course he doesn't have a backup. The drive is unrecognized in both my external USB enclosure and in another laptop, leading me to believe that something is wrong with the power connection, and/or the internals themselves. This in mind then: does anyone on this list do 2.5" physical recovery or know of anyone who is reasonably priced who does? By reasonable I'm talking home user prices, not corporate datacenter, globally deployed swat team recovery experts. I'm talking a maximum of $500 or there is no recovery. A near impossible request, I know what the larger services sometimes charge. A grim situation, so TIA for any contacts of offers to help. I know of the large companies like CBL and Ontrack of course, google is useful, but... someone mentioned a downtown company a while ago (last year) that starts with an R, something like R-Tools, or RT soft? I can't remember, but they were reasonable and local. Jamon -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 7 02:10:43 2006 From: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2006 22:10:43 -0400 (EDT) Subject: OT: 2.5" hdd data recovery In-Reply-To: <44D6618B.5010407-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <44D6618B.5010407@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <50194.207.188.67.241.1154916643.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> > I've a friend who's Hitachi Travelstar has packed it in after 4 years of > service. Of course he doesn't have a backup. The drive is unrecognized > in both my external USB enclosure and in another laptop, leading me to > believe that something is wrong with the power connection, and/or the > internals themselves. > If the drive is not being recognized, that might indicate as you say that the power supply or electronic circuit has failed. If that's the case, you could find an identical drive and change the electronics board. (I opened up one failed drive to find a large black hole in one of the IC's. This suggested that the electronics was fried.) This might be a suitable course of action if (a) you're desperate (b) you have very little money (c) you can find the same drive at a reasonable price (d) you have excellent eyesight and (e) you have the necessary desoldering tools and expertise. When I'm put in this situation I insist that my friend ply me with food, drink and interesting stories while I attempt the electronic surgery. Peter -- Peter Hiscocks Syscomp Electronic Design Limited, Toronto http://www.syscompdesign.com USB Oscilloscope and Waveform Generator 647-839-0325 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 7 03:06:47 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Sun, 06 Aug 2006 23:06:47 -0400 Subject: OT: Hackers crack new biometric passports In-Reply-To: <44D69E93.3040508-D1t3LT1mScs@public.gmane.org> References: <44D69E93.3040508@pppoe.ca> Message-ID: <44D6AE47.7090006@rogers.com> The problem with an information in electronic form is that its very easy to duplicate and replicate by atleast 4 orders of magnitude once the security codes are cracked. Kush Meng Cheah wrote: > *Hackers crack new biometric passports* > > *Bobbie Johnson, technology correspondent > Monday August 7, 2006 > The Guardian * > > Hi-tech biometric passports used by Britain and other countries have > been hacked by a computer expert, throwing into doubt fundamental > parts of the UK's ?415m scheme to load passports with information such > as fingerprints, facial scans and iris patterns. > > Speaking at the Defcon security conference in Las Vegas, Lukas > Grunwald, a consultant with a German security company, said he had > discovered a method for cloning the information stored in the new > passports. Data can be transferred onto blank chips, which could then > be implanted in fake passports, a flaw which he said undermined the > project. > > The revelation also casts another shadow over the government's plan > for a national ID card, which would contain much of the same information. > > /More at http://technology.guardian.co.uk/news/story/0,,1838751,00.html > > There is also a link to a 200 page report on ID cards (in pdf) > / > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ralphellis1-VsqqI1RANlEsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 7 06:51:45 2006 From: ralphellis1-VsqqI1RANlEsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Ralph Ellis) Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2006 23:51:45 -0700 Subject: OT: 2.5" hdd data recovery In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200608062351.45521.ralphellis1@netscape.ca> I don't know if it could help but SpinRite is a program with a strong success rate with date recovery but you would have to connect the drive so some sort of IDE controller. See www.grc.com Good luck Ralph Ellis On Sunday 06 August 2006 2:39 pm, Jamon Camisso wrote: > I've a friend who's Hitachi Travelstar has packed it in after 4 years of > service. Of course he doesn't have a backup. The drive is unrecognized > in both my external USB enclosure and in another laptop, leading me to > believe that something is wrong with the power connection, and/or the > internals themselves. > > This in mind then: does anyone on this list do 2.5" physical recovery or > know of anyone who is reasonably priced who does? By reasonable I'm > talking home user prices, not corporate datacenter, globally deployed > swat team recovery experts. I'm talking a maximum of $500 or there is no > recovery. A near impossible request, I know what the larger services > sometimes charge. > > A grim situation, so TIA for any contacts of offers to help. I know of > the large companies like CBL and Ontrack of course, google is useful, > but... someone mentioned a downtown company a while ago (last year) that > starts with an R, something like R-Tools, or RT soft? I can't remember, > but they were reasonable and local. > > Jamon > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 7 04:03:54 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Mon, 07 Aug 2006 00:03:54 -0400 Subject: OT: Hackers crack new biometric passports In-Reply-To: <44D69E93.3040508-D1t3LT1mScs@public.gmane.org> References: <44D69E93.3040508@pppoe.ca> Message-ID: Meng Cheah wrote: > *Hackers crack new biometric passports* > > *Bobbie Johnson, technology correspondent > Monday August 7, 2006 > The Guardian * How to clone the copy-friendly biometric passport By John Lettice Published Friday 4th August 2006 13:08 GMT http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/08/04/cloning_epassports/ "... The ICAO documentation Grunwald consulted is publicly available, and explains the detail of the various levels of security of the ePassport system, the baseline level being something not unadjacent to zero..." For proponents of security though obscurity, that sentence there is pretty much all you'd need to construct a rhetorically charged, loosely factually based, FUD mongering condemnation of the whole notion of open source (I use the term loosely, not specifically in the software sense of the word). What this really means is that, despite the apparent failures of the system presently, the next version or updates to the chips will likely be secured in a more secretive manner. i.e. no more open access to the ICAO's how and what documentation. Just imagine how secretive they'll be allowed to be once DNA imprinting becomes commonplace. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 7 05:00:09 2006 From: meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org (Meng Cheah) Date: Mon, 07 Aug 2006 01:00:09 -0400 Subject: OT: 2.5" hdd data recovery In-Reply-To: <200608062351.45521.ralphellis1-VsqqI1RANlEsA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <200608062351.45521.ralphellis1@netscape.ca> Message-ID: <44D6C8D9.8060600@pppoe.ca> Ralph Ellis wrote: >I don't know if it could help but SpinRite is a program with a strong success >rate with date recovery but you would have to connect the drive so some sort >of IDE controller. See >www.grc.com >Good luck > > Has anyone personal experience of data recovery with SpinRite? I want to know the general consensus with regard to data recovery before spending the money. A couple of my former colleagues have used it for checking drives; they liked it. There was a drive which while being formatted, hung. After a couple of hours, the box was rebooted. I tried SpinRite among other utilities, nothing worked. The drive was "fubar"ed. Thanks in advance. Meng Cheah -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ralphellis1-VsqqI1RANlEsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 7 14:52:54 2006 From: ralphellis1-VsqqI1RANlEsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Ralph Ellis) Date: Mon, 7 Aug 2006 07:52:54 -0700 Subject: OT: 2.5" hdd data recovery In-Reply-To: <44D6C8D9.8060600-D1t3LT1mScs@public.gmane.org> References: <200608062351.45521.ralphellis1@netscape.ca> <44D6C8D9.8060600@pppoe.ca> Message-ID: <200608070752.55115.ralphellis1@netscape.ca> On Sunday 06 August 2006 10:00 pm, Meng Cheah wrote: > Ralph Ellis wrote: > >I don't know if it could help but SpinRite is a program with a strong > > success rate with date recovery but you would have to connect the drive > > so some sort of IDE controller. See > >www.grc.com > >Good luck > > Has anyone personal experience of data recovery with SpinRite? > I want to know the general consensus with regard to data recovery before > spending the money. > > A couple of my former colleagues have used it for checking drives; they > liked it. > There was a drive which while being formatted, hung. > After a couple of hours, the box was rebooted. > I tried SpinRite among other utilities, nothing worked. > The drive was "fubar"ed. > > Thanks in advance. > > Meng Cheah > > > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml In my case SpinRite fixed a persistent disk error that would not go away rather than data recovery. If a sector has been trashed at the lowest hardware level then there is no recovery. If the data is still there at the hardware level and the damage is at the level where the formating is then you have a chance of recovery. Ralph Ellis -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jmyshrall-6duGhz7i8susTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 7 13:01:39 2006 From: jmyshrall-6duGhz7i8susTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (John Myshrall) Date: Mon, 07 Aug 2006 09:01:39 -0400 Subject: OT: 2.5" hdd data recovery In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <44D739B3.4080707@golden.net> Jamon Camisso wrote: > I've a friend who's Hitachi Travelstar has packed it in after 4 years of > service. Of course he doesn't have a backup. The drive is unrecognized > in both my external USB enclosure and in another laptop, leading me to > believe that something is wrong with the power connection, and/or the > internals themselves. > > This in mind then: does anyone on this list do 2.5" physical recovery or > know of anyone who is reasonably priced who does? By reasonable I'm > talking home user prices, not corporate datacenter, globally deployed > swat team recovery experts. I'm talking a maximum of $500 or there is no > recovery. A near impossible request, I know what the larger services > sometimes charge. > > A grim situation, so TIA for any contacts of offers to help. I know of > the large companies like CBL and Ontrack of course, google is useful, > but... someone mentioned a downtown company a while ago (last year) that > starts with an R, something like R-Tools, or RT soft? I can't remember, > but they were reasonable and local. > > Jamon > You may want to check out the drive manufacturers utilities. I seen drives not boot up however as slaves they have been accessible. John -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From wildberger-iRg7kjdsKiH3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 7 14:51:04 2006 From: wildberger-iRg7kjdsKiH3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (John Wildberger) Date: Mon, 7 Aug 2006 10:51:04 -0400 Subject: : Message-ID: <008b01c6ba30$e874e7d0$6501a8c0@Presario> unsubscribe -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 7 15:28:00 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Mon, 07 Aug 2006 11:28:00 -0400 Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war In-Reply-To: <44D5358A.4090108-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> <44D52C09.30608@rogers.com> <44D52DF5.8040804@rogers.com> <44D5358A.4090108@rogers.com> Message-ID: <44D75C00.4060800@telly.org> > This is some news but will it happen in Toronto is the key question. > Here we don't generally see Lenovo computers but more of IBM. That's just a matter of clearing out old stock. Go to IBM's product page at http://www.ibm.com/products/ca/en/ and there's no mention of desktops and laptops. Just a link for "PC products from Lenovo", which takes you to the Lenovo Canada website. Frankly, I don't see the fuss over this subject, and I don't see the logic that goes from "Sympatico won't support Linux" to "open source can't win the war". There are a few points to consider: 1) OEM problems with Linux diversity When an OEM goes to pre-install Windows, there's almost never an issue of "which Windows". They install the one Microsoft gives them to install. When they go to install Linux, they have to answer the complex and often controversial question "which Linux"? The US Walmart Linux systems come with Linspire pre-installed. To listen to some Linux people talk about Linspire, they'd wipe that system off their hard disk as fast as they'd wipe off Windows. The new Thinkpad deal pre-installs Novell, yet TLUG couldn't even find someone to talk about Novell/SuSE for the LinuxWorld distro comparison earlier this year. No matter _what_ an OEM chooses, a significant piece of the already-small market for Linux laptops will find the choice unacceptable. If Lenovo supports Novell and HP supports Red Hat, then going with either constitutes a subtle form of vendor lock-in (if official vendor support matters to you). In the server world, OS options are greater, it's easier to buy systems with no OS so you can just add your favourite. Moreover, servers are more likely sold by VARs and consultants who are capable of handling installation, integration and support issues. Laptops and desktops, OTOH, are part of a numbers game in which high-volume retailers work on thin margins for a small number of items and want as little diversity as possible. For the foreseeable future, Linux laptops and desktops will be the realm of do-it-yourselfers or companies who specialize in doing inexpensive "upgrades" of existing mainstream fare (see "Emperor Linux" for the archetype of this model). 2) Sympatico support I have two brief things to say about that; a) Again, it's a numbers game. Bell serves people who don't ready care (let alone know) about their computers. The first few levels of tech support are dumbed-down and heavily scripted to deal with this reality. Most people using Linux, by their very act of choosing Linux, demonstrate more awareness of their computers than Bell support can generally cope with. This is a good reason to have at least one system in your house that you can dual-boot into Windows, if for no other reason than as a diagnostic tool to help Bell support work within their limitations. Remember, you choose to be the exception to the masses they're used to dealing with. Anyone for whom you install Linux need to be aware of that in advance. b) It's corporate culture; Bell support stinks, and that's not limited to Sympatico. Your experience with doesn't sound anywhere as nightmarish as what I've gone through regarding their regular phone service. That "Emily" voice-response cyber-operator is the most horrid implementation of such a system I've ever encountered; and I've waited a half-hour on hold for the privilege of being connected to "your call cannot be completed as dialled". Rogers, which has its own significant set of warts, couldn't be this bad on its worst day. 3) The future versus the present Your experience with Bell doesn't indicate Linux's ability to become mainstream so much as it reflects on the current reality. To a certain extent there is some chicken-and-egg character to this (what comes first? Support for Linux or demand for it?), so breaking into the mainstream is a slow process that's more evolution than a war with a definitive battle. What we _do_ know is that: - there have been sporadic attempts in North America to market Linux pre-loaded by HP and Dell, and these attempts have generally not succeeded - there are many successful companies marketing Linux laptops outside North America; within the past week alone I posted a pointer to a story about the sale of four million systems in Asia, Africa and South America. In southeast Asia companies _must_ offer Linux on laptops to be competitive. So the issue is not a matter of "is Linux going mainstream" so much as it is "when will we catch up to the rest of the world"? The answer to this is (or should be, IMO) one of impatience rather than despair. - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sciguy-Ja3L+HSX0kI at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 7 16:22:10 2006 From: sciguy-Ja3L+HSX0kI at public.gmane.org (Paul King) Date: Mon, 07 Aug 2006 12:22:10 -0400 Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war In-Reply-To: <44D75C00.4060800-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg@public.gmane.org> References: <44D5358A.4090108@rogers.com> Message-ID: <44D73072.3312.203A7E41@sciguy.vex.net> On 7 Aug 2006 at 11:28, Evan Leibovitch wrote: > That > "Emily" voice-response cyber-operator is the most horrid implementation > of such a system I've ever encountered; and I've waited a half-hour on > hold for the privilege of being connected to "your call cannot be > completed as dialled". Rogers, which has its own significant set of > warts, couldn't be this bad on its worst day. > I have joked with my wife that "Emily", with her 1-second Disneyish flourish at the beginning, has become our "Bell telephone fairy" or, depending on the service, our "Bell Mobility fairy". I can't understand how they could have seriously thought that this was a good idea. It must have cost hundreds of thousands of dollars to put her together. Paul -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 7 21:01:25 2006 From: jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Jason Shein) Date: Mon, 7 Aug 2006 17:01:25 -0400 Subject: OT: 2.5" hdd data recovery In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200608071701.25879.jason@detachednetworks.ca> On Sunday 06 August 2006 17:39, Jamon Camisso wrote: > I've a friend who's Hitachi Travelstar has packed it in after 4 years of > service. Of course he doesn't have a backup. The drive is unrecognized > in both my external USB enclosure and in another laptop, leading me to > believe that something is wrong with the power connection, and/or the > internals themselves. > > This in mind then: does anyone on this list do 2.5" physical recovery or > know of anyone who is reasonably priced who does? By reasonable I'm > talking home user prices, not corporate datacenter, globally deployed > swat team recovery experts. I'm talking a maximum of $500 or there is no > recovery. A near impossible request, I know what the larger services > sometimes charge. > > A grim situation, so TIA for any contacts of offers to help. I know of > the large companies like CBL and Ontrack of course, google is useful, > but... someone mentioned a downtown company a while ago (last year) that > starts with an R, something like R-Tools, or RT soft? I can't remember, > but they were reasonable and local. > > Jamon Well Jamon, I hate to be the one to break it to you, but the IBM / Hitachi "Deathstar" series of drives have an extremely poor data recovery rate. We do data recovery regularly, and have a 97% success rate as long as the bios can see the drive. See: http://www.detachednetworks.ca/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=12&Itemid=28 Unfortunately, the exception of this rule is the Travelstar and Deskstar drives manufactured by Hitachi ( rebranded by IBM ), where the rate falls to 5%. If you have a Travelstar or Deskstar hard drive, regular backups are a must. Or better yet, replace it now before it dies, and use it as a nice paperwight for your desk. -- Jason Shein Director of Networking, Operations and Systems Detached Networks jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org ( 905 ) - 876 - 4158 Voice ( 905 ) - 876 - 5817 Mobile http://www.detachednetworks.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 7 21:14:48 2006 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy Ali) Date: Mon, 7 Aug 2006 16:14:48 -0500 Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war In-Reply-To: <44D73072.3312.203A7E41-TElMtxJ9tQ95lvbp69gI5w@public.gmane.org> References: <44D5358A.4090108@rogers.com> <44D75C00.4060800@telly.org> <44D73072.3312.203A7E41@sciguy.vex.net> Message-ID: <1e55af990608071414k64de68c0j830794d126fa45d2@mail.gmail.com> On 8/7/06, Paul King wrote: > I can't understand how they could have seriously thought that this > was a good idea. It must have cost hundreds of thousands of dollars > to put her together. Because someone said "hey, wouldn't it be cool if..." to someone who had signing power, and away it went. It's the same reason bad "anything" happens.. someone cons the right person and it gets done. Think advertising.. the agency cons the company and the crappy ad gets made. I think Emily is a neat idea.. I like the idea of its open beta test. ;) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 7 23:39:40 2006 From: meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org (Meng Cheah) Date: Mon, 07 Aug 2006 19:39:40 -0400 Subject: OT: AOL Releases Search Logs of 657,427 Users Message-ID: <44D7CF3C.1090603@pppoe.ca> Words fail me. /http://www.techcrunch.com/2006/08/06/aol-proudly-releases-massive-amounts-of-user-search-data// *"The utter stupidity of this is staggering.* AOL has released very private data about its users without their permission. While the AOL username has been changed to a random ID number, the abilitiy to analyze all searches by a single user will often lead people to easily determine who the user is, and what they are up to. The data includes personal names, addresses, social security numbers and everything else someone might type into a search box. The most serious problem is the fact that many people often search on their own name, or those of their friends and family, to see what information is available about them on the net. Combine these ego searches with porn queries and you have a serious embarrassment. Combine them with ?buy ecstasy? and you have evidence of a crime. Combine it with an address, social security number, etc., and you have an identity theft waiting to happen. The possibilities are endless." The apology from AOL: All ? This was a screw up, and we?re angry and upset about it. It was an innocent enough attempt to reach out to the academic community with new research tools, but it was obviously not appropriately vetted, and if it had been, it would have been stopped in an instant. Although there was no personally-identifiable data linked to these accounts, we?re absolutely not defending this. It was a mistake, and we apologize. We?ve launched an internal investigation into what happened, and we are taking steps to ensure that this type of thing never happens again. Here was what was mistakenly released: * Search data for roughly 658,000 anonymized users over a three month period from March to May. * There was no personally identifiable data provided by AOL with those records, but search queries themselves can sometimes include such information. * According to comScore Media Metrix, the AOL search network had 42.7 million unique visitors in May, so the total data set covered roughly 1.5% of May search users. * Roughly 20 million search records over that period, so the data included roughly 1/3 of one percent of the total searches conducted through the AOL network over that period. * The searches included as part of this data only included U.S. searches conducted within the AOL client software. We apologize again for the release. Andrew Weinstein AOL Spokesman -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 7 23:56:53 2006 From: meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org (Meng Cheah) Date: Mon, 07 Aug 2006 19:56:53 -0400 Subject: OT: AOL Releases Search Logs of 657,427 Users In-Reply-To: <44D7CF3C.1090603-D1t3LT1mScs@public.gmane.org> References: <44D7CF3C.1090603@pppoe.ca> Message-ID: <44D7D345.6030902@pppoe.ca> Meng Cheah wrote: > Words fail me. > > /http://www.techcrunch.com/2006/08/06/aol-proudly-releases-massive-amounts-of-user-search-data// > > > *"The utter stupidity of this is staggering.* AOL has released very > private data about its users without their permission. While the AOL > username has been changed to a random ID number, the abilitiy to > analyze all searches by a single user will often lead people to easily > determine who the user is, and what they are up to. The data includes > personal names, addresses, social security numbers and everything else > someone might type into a search box. > > The most serious problem is the fact that many people often search on > their own name, or those of their friends and family, to see what > information is available about them on the net. Combine these ego > searches with porn queries and you have a serious embarrassment. > Combine them with ?buy ecstasy? and you have evidence of a crime. > Combine it with an address, social security number, etc., and you have > an identity theft waiting to happen. The possibilities are endless." > > The apology from AOL: > All ? > > This was a screw up, and we?re angry and upset about it. It was an > innocent enough attempt to reach out to the academic community with > new research tools, but it was obviously not appropriately vetted, > and if it had been, it would have been stopped in an instant. > > Although there was no personally-identifiable data linked to these > accounts, we?re absolutely not defending this. It was a mistake, and > we apologize. We?ve launched an internal investigation into what > happened, and we are taking steps to ensure that this type of thing > never happens again. > > Here was what was mistakenly released: > > * Search data for roughly 658,000 anonymized users over a three > month period from March to May. > > * There was no personally identifiable data provided by AOL with > those records, but search queries themselves can sometimes include > such information. > > * According to comScore Media Metrix, the AOL search network had > 42.7 million unique visitors in May, so the total data set covered > roughly 1.5% of May search users. > > * Roughly 20 million search records over that period, so the data > included roughly 1/3 of one percent of the total searches conducted > through the AOL network over that period. > > * The searches included as part of this data only included U.S. > searches conducted within the AOL client software. > > We apologize again for the release. > > Andrew Weinstein > AOL Spokesman From the README file with the original release: 500k User Session Collection ---------------------------------------------- This collection is distributed for NON-COMMERCIAL RESEARCH USE ONLY. Any application of this collection for commercial purposes is STRICTLY PROHIBITED. Brief description: This collection consists of ~20M web queries collected from ~650k users over three months. The data is sorted by anonymous user ID and sequentially arranged. The goal of this collection is to provide real query log data that is based on real users. It could be used for personalization, query reformulation or other types of search research. The data set includes {AnonID, Query, QueryTime, ItemRank, ClickURL}. AnonID - an anonymous user ID number. Query - the query issued by the user, case shifted with most punctuation removed. QueryTime - the time at which the query was submitted for search. ItemRank - if the user clicked on a search result, the rank of the item on which they clicked is listed. ClickURL - if the user clicked on a search result, the domain portion of the URL in the clicked result is listed. Each line in the data represents one of two types of events: 1. A query that was NOT followed by the user clicking on a result item. 2. A click through on an item in the result list returned from a query. In the first case (query only) there is data in only the first three columns/fields -- namely AnonID, Query, and QueryTime (see above). In the second case (click through), there is data in all five columns. For click through events, the query that preceded the click through is included. Note that if a user clicked on more than one result in the list returned from a single query, there will be TWO lines in the data to represent the two events. Also note that if the user requested the next "page" or results for some query, this appears as a subsequent identical query with a later time stamp. CAVEAT EMPTOR -- SEXUALLY EXPLICIT DATA! Please be aware that these queries are not filtered to remove any content. Pornography is prevalent on the Web and unfiltered search engine logs contain queries by users who are looking for pornographic material. There are queries in this collection that use SEXUALLY EXPLICIT LANGUAGE. This collection of data is intended for use by mature adults who are not easily offended by the use of pornographic search terms. If you are offended by sexually explicit language you should not read through this data. Also be aware that in some states it may be illegal to expose a minor to this data. Please understand that the data represents REAL WORLD USERS, un-edited and randomly sampled, and that AOL is not the author of this data. Basic Collection Statistics Dates: 01 March, 2006 - 31 May, 2006 Normalized queries: 36,389,567 lines of data 21,011,340 instances of new queries (w/ or w/o click-through) 7,887,022 requests for "next page" of results 19,442,629 user click-through events 16,946,938 queries w/o user click-through 10,154,742 unique (normalized) queries 657,426 unique user ID's Please reference the following publication when using this collection: G. Pass, A. Chowdhury, C. Torgeson, "A Picture of Search" The First International Conference on Scalable Information Systems, Hong Kong, June, 2006. Copyright (2006) AOL -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 8 01:31:27 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Mon, 7 Aug 2006 21:31:27 -0400 Subject: OT: AOL Releases Search Logs of 657,427 Users In-Reply-To: <44D7CF3C.1090603-D1t3LT1mScs@public.gmane.org> References: <44D7CF3C.1090603@pppoe.ca> Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608071831k2d0072e5hb3561a474068eed@mail.gmail.com> On 8/7/06, Meng Cheah wrote: > Words fail me. > Well put, but IMO people should discuss it. Large organizations are having a very difficult time keeping pace with the people's needs. Look at Sony BMG and the rootkit fiasco. Or the SCO garbage. Or the RIM scenario. Or, or, or. Even Governments are having difficulty. I feel sorry for the People who were unwittingly involved in AOL's little experiment. History says that it's never wise to infuriate the masses. (With the internet is a new development. ;-) -- Scott Elcomb http://w3.avidus.ca/ http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 8 02:59:41 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Mon, 7 Aug 2006 22:59:41 -0400 Subject: [OT]: Apple releases Kernel sources for Intel Macs and "Mac OS Forge" Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608071959n757cb044qa389e45a8e60d2fd@mail.gmail.com> Apple has released the Darwin Intel Kernel source code, and created a new community site "Mac OS Forge" http://lists.apple.com/archives/Darwin-dev/2006/Aug/msg00067.html M$ is going to get eaten alive over the next few years if they don't open up Windows. -- Scott Elcomb http://w3.avidus.ca/ http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 8 03:26:15 2006 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Mon, 7 Aug 2006 20:26:15 -0700 Subject: [OT]: Apple releases Kernel sources for Intel Macs and "Mac OS Forge" In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f0608071959n757cb044qa389e45a8e60d2fd-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f0608071959n757cb044qa389e45a8e60d2fd@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 8/7/06, Scott Elcomb wrote: > Apple has released the Darwin Intel Kernel source code, and created a > new community site "Mac OS Forge" > > http://lists.apple.com/archives/Darwin-dev/2006/Aug/msg00067.html > > M$ is going to get eaten alive over the next few years if they don't > open up Windows. Of direct, practical interest to fans of kernels other than those from Apple is that they have made code for other things available under Apache-style licenses - An iCal server (which will give the OSAF folks a run for the money...) - launchd, which is kind of a modernized "rc.d" system - bonjour, a system for network self-discovery/self-construction All are at least moderately useful things. -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html Oddly enough, this is completely standard behaviour for shells. This is a roundabout way of saying `don't use combined chains of `&&'s and `||'s unless you think G?del's theorem is for sissies'. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 8 04:13:14 2006 From: tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Tim Writer) Date: 08 Aug 2006 00:13:14 -0400 Subject: Tom's HW Guide: Linux for gaming In-Reply-To: <44BAF994.8080401-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg@public.gmane.org> References: <44BAF994.8080401@telly.org> Message-ID: Evan Leibovitch writes: > http://www.tomshardware.com/2006/07/12/geforce_and_radeon_take_on_linux/ > > I've often trusted Tom's Hardware Guide for good reviews of hardware > components, especially motherboards. It was interesting to see the site > actually tackle something Linux-ish, let alone the use of Linux as a > games system. > > Those reading this list who are involved with ATI (you know who you are) > are invited to use this article to help prod the company to match and > surpass nVidia's level of support. Here's a counterpoint: http://www.phoronix.com/redblog/ ATI is working very hard to improve their Linux support. They release a driver every month so improvements come quickly. -- tim writer starnix inc. 647.722.5301 toronto, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pwa.linux-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 8 12:48:35 2006 From: pwa.linux-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (PW Armstrong) Date: Tue, 08 Aug 2006 08:48:35 -0400 Subject: (unknown) Message-ID: <44D88823.4040104@gmail.com> unsubscribe -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ican-rZHaEmXdJNJWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 8 13:30:07 2006 From: ican-rZHaEmXdJNJWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (bob) Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 09:30:07 -0400 Subject: C warning that I can't seem to track down Message-ID: <200608080930.08148.ican@netrover.com> In newer versions of the GCC compiler the block of C code: int length; ... if(getsockname(s, (struct sockaddr *)&sin, &length)) gives a warning below socketUtils.c:259: warning: pointer targets in passing argument 3 of 'getsockname' differ in signedness I tracked it down to a define called "socklen_t". Damned if I can find where that is defined. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks. bob -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 8 13:52:42 2006 From: hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Howard Gibson) Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 09:52:42 -0400 Subject: why I fear open source can't win the war In-Reply-To: <200608050711.06195.ican-rZHaEmXdJNJWk0Htik3J/w@public.gmane.org> References: <200608050711.06195.ican@netrover.com> Message-ID: <20060808095242.616b109e.hgibson@eol.ca> On Sat, 5 Aug 2006 07:11:06 -0400 bob wrote: > My inlaws purchased a new computer which came with XP preinstalled. The shop > also configured the Sympatico dialup Internet and Outlook email. The whole > system worked for a week or so. > > Being the security conscious son-in-law, I took it upon myself suggest a safe > computing strategy: OFT (OO, Firefox, Thunderbird). Armed with my copy of > The Open CD, I was invited to install OFT (OO, Firefox, Thunderbird) on > their box. > > That is when everything stopped working... Bob, My friends regard me as a computer geek, and they ask me technical questions all the time. I remind them that I have not installed or configured a Windows operating system since 3.1. When I mess with a computer, I assume everything will work out because I have the install CD, and I can reformat the hard drive and start all over again. Short of that, I know where the configuration files are, and I know to back them up before I mess with stuff. A very strong argument against Windows as far as I am concerned, is that I am not familiar with it. I bought my mom a computer and I installed Linux on it so that it would be stable and reliable, and so that when we called me for help, I would know what to do. If someone asks me about Windows security, I tell them they need a firewall and virus scanner, and that they should avoid IE. I prefer to let them install this stuff themselves, or better yet, let the store install it. -- Howard Gibson hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org howardg-PadmjKOQAFn3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org http://home.eol.ca/~hgibson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From talexb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 8 13:51:54 2006 From: talexb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Alex Beamish) Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 09:51:54 -0400 Subject: C warning that I can't seem to track down In-Reply-To: <200608080930.08148.ican-rZHaEmXdJNJWk0Htik3J/w@public.gmane.org> References: <200608080930.08148.ican@netrover.com> Message-ID: On 8/8/06, bob wrote: > > In newer versions of the GCC compiler the block of C code: > > int length; > > ... > > if(getsockname(s, (struct sockaddr *)&sin, &length)) > > gives a warning below > > socketUtils.c:259: warning: pointer targets in passing argument 3 of > 'getsockname' differ in signedness Hi Bob, Google tells me at http://www.penguin-soft.com/penguin/man/2/getsockname.html?manpath=/man/man2/getsockname.2.inc that getsockname has the following prototype: int getsockname(int s , struct sockaddr * name , socklen_t * namelen ); so you need to cast length to a pointer to socklen_t, even if that works out to an int in the end. Change your line to if(getsockname(s, (struct sockaddr *)&sin, (socklen_t *)&length)) and re-compile. Let us know how it all works. I tracked it down to a define called "socklen_t". Damned if I can find > where that is defined. Google is your friend. :) -- Alex Beamish Toronto, Ontario -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rob-3Aypa9sX/B7wvR0lvYjcXw at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 8 13:56:55 2006 From: rob-3Aypa9sX/B7wvR0lvYjcXw at public.gmane.org (Rob Sutherland) Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 09:56:55 -0400 Subject: Open Source MMORPGs In-Reply-To: <20060806133156.27641.qmail-DooQHYYYUaiB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060806133156.27641.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <200608080956.55743.rob@luckdancing.com> On Sunday 06 August 2006 09:31, Colin McGregor wrote: > I have not tried it yet, but you may want to have a > look at the Cube engines: > > ? www.cubeengine.com Thanks for the suggestion Colin. I checked it out and it actually looks pretty good if you have a good enough box. It's a little heavy for what I'm looking for though, since my target systems are salvaged and donated boxen. Here are some of the other games I've looked at over the last few days, just to give a little feedback to the community. The jeweled crest - http://sourceforge.net/projects/thejeweledcrest This is a basic web based dungeon type thing. It's a beta and a little rough, but it doesn't look too bad. Blacknova - http://www.blacknova.net/ A web based variation of Tradewars, if anyone remembers that :-) For sentimental reasons I'm running a version at http://www.luckdancing.com/blacknova Liquid War - http://www.ufoot.org/liquidwar/ This is kind of wierd, but it runs OK on a wide range of platforms and has been around for a while. Each player is a body of water, trying to surround and engulf other players. Works for me :-) Planeshift http://www.planeshift.it/main_01.html and Eternal Lands http://www.eternal-lands.com/ These are both free to use hosted 3D virtual worlds, you need a pretty good box and connection to play them, but they're kind of fun and have active communities I also found The Mana World, http://themanaworld.org/, which looks interesting, but the client needs a bunch of dependencies that I don't have time to mess with - anyone tried it? There's a meeting tomorrow night for anyone interested in helping out with this event - 7:00pm Wednesday August 8th, Secular Freethought Center, 216 Beverly St. Rob -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 8 14:39:12 2006 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 10:39:12 -0400 Subject: C warning that I can't seem to track down In-Reply-To: <200608080930.08148.ican-rZHaEmXdJNJWk0Htik3J/w@public.gmane.org> References: <200608080930.08148.ican@netrover.com> Message-ID: <20060808143912.GA4442@wp.magstar.net> On Tue, Aug 08, 2006 at 09:30:07AM -0400, bob wrote: > In newer versions of the GCC compiler the block of C code: > > int length; > > ... > > if(getsockname(s, (struct sockaddr *)&sin, &length)) > > gives a warning below > > socketUtils.c:259: warning: pointer targets in passing argument 3 of > 'getsockname' differ in signedness > > > I tracked it down to a define called "socklen_t". Damned if I can find > where that is defined. > > Any help would be appreciated. Thanks. Probably, 'socket_t' is defined as unsigned, just like 'size_t'. -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jvetterli-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 8 15:15:25 2006 From: jvetterli-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org (John Vetterli) Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 11:15:25 -0400 (EDT) Subject: C warning that I can't seem to track down In-Reply-To: References: <200608080930.08148.ican@netrover.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 8 Aug 2006, Alex Beamish wrote: > On 8/8/06, bob wrote: >> int length; >> ... >> if(getsockname(s, (struct sockaddr *)&sin, &length)) >> socketUtils.c:259: warning: pointer targets in passing argument 3 of >> 'getsockname' differ in signedness > that getsockname has the following prototype: > int getsockname(int s , struct sockaddr * name , socklen_t * namelen ); > so you need to cast length to a pointer to socklen_t, even if that works out > to an int in the end. Change your line to > if(getsockname(s, (struct sockaddr *)&sin, (socklen_t *)&length)) It might be preferable to just declare length as a socklen_t. That way, if you ever move to a platform where socklen_t is a different size than int, you're still covered. HTH JV -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ican-rZHaEmXdJNJWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 8 16:11:37 2006 From: ican-rZHaEmXdJNJWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (bob) Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 12:11:37 -0400 Subject: C warning that I can't seem to track down In-Reply-To: References: <200608080930.08148.ican@netrover.com> Message-ID: <200608081211.38197.ican@netrover.com> Of course. I'll try that once I get back to my system with the newer GCC installed. Thanks. bob PS. Still can't believe how obtuse the Linux headers have become since I last looked in any detail. Maybe Google can tell me where socklen_t is actually defined ... On Tuesday 08 August 2006 09:51 am, Alex Beamish wrote: > On 8/8/06, bob wrote: > > In newer versions of the GCC compiler the block of C code: > > > > int length; > > > > ... > > > > if(getsockname(s, (struct sockaddr *)&sin, &length)) > > > > gives a warning below > > > > socketUtils.c:259: warning: pointer targets in passing argument 3 of > > 'getsockname' differ in signedness > > Hi Bob, > > Google tells me at > > > http://www.penguin-soft.com/penguin/man/2/getsockname.html?manpath=/man/man >2/getsockname.2.inc > > that getsockname has the following prototype: > > int getsockname(int s , struct sockaddr * name , socklen_t * namelen ); > > so you need to cast length to a pointer to socklen_t, even if that works > out to an int in the end. Change your line to > > if(getsockname(s, (struct sockaddr *)&sin, (socklen_t *)&length)) > > and re-compile. Let us know how it all works. > > I tracked it down to a define called "socklen_t". Damned if I can find > > > where that is defined. > > Google is your friend. :) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 8 16:34:45 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 12:34:45 -0400 Subject: Sympatico + Norton + OFT In-Reply-To: <44D4AAFB.4030206-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44D4AAFB.4030206@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20060808163445.GI13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Sat, Aug 05, 2006 at 10:28:11AM -0400, John McGregor wrote: > Its been my experience that the various Norton products do no work well > / at all with Win XP and can be the root cause of major problems over > and above sending / receiving email.. When a client presents me with a > new PC, the first thing I do is to look for Norton Antivirus / Internet > Security and then uninstall it. I replace it with the free version of > AVG Antivirus: > > http://free.grisoft.com/doc/avg-anti-virus-free/lng/us/tpl/v5 > > and the free version of Zone Alarm. > > Thunderbird will work with Sympatico's new servers if you select the > 'use TLS, if available' security option for both incoming and outgoing > connections. > > A far better option, of course, is to switch them to Linux at the > earliest possible convenience. In my experience, both norton and zone alarm are to be avoided. Life is better without them. AVG seems decent enough, although I wish there was an option in the free version to tell it to always quarentine a virus when found, rather than the popup question that disappears after 30 seconds. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 8 16:39:25 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 12:39:25 -0400 Subject: Dual core Intel... how hot? In-Reply-To: References: <20060802144557.GA17952@wp.magstar.net> <20060802174625.GX13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060802184814.GA18495@wp.magstar.net> <20060804125351.GY13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20060808163925.GJ13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Sat, Aug 05, 2006 at 10:48:20PM -0400, D. Hugh Redelmeier wrote: > Thanks for all those figures. I am guessing that they are the > "thermal design power" ("TDP") figures for each chip. > > One problem with TDP is that AMD and Intel specify them differently. > In particular, AMD's TDP is the most power that a chip can use when > the "inputs" are within spec. Intel's TDP is a nice > high-but-not-worst-case number; they demand you throttle when the > temperature gets too high. So Intel's numbers appear lower. That is certainly true. Some people think intel's "typical max" are nice, while others (like me) prefer AMD's true max. After all if you design the cooling system for the typical max, there is a small possibility that it won't be enough for some loads, in which case the system will start to throttle itself to keep cool. > This article is quite interesting: > http://www.silentpcreview.com/article169-page3.html > I found this from > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermal_Design_Power > > BTW, speed throttling might not be the most rational approach. Given > a fixed amount of computation to perform, full-speed processing > followed by sleep-when-done may be more energy-efficient than > throttled-speed processing followed by less sleep. If sleep can be > entered and exited quickly enough, this may be generalized to > interactive computational loads. It is certainly possible, at least if you have to spin up a disk to access some of the data, the quicker you can get it all, the sooner you can spin down the disk again. In the same way I suspect some laptops would save power by having more ram, even though ram uses power too, just because they could reduce disk accesses in some cases. > | 62W for 90nm Athlon 64 (new revision with virtualization support) > > I didn't realize that this was out already. It has been for quite a while actually. Probably the last year or so. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 8 16:46:54 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 12:46:54 -0400 Subject: OT: Hackers crack new biometric passports In-Reply-To: <44D6BBAA.3060106-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <44D69E93.3040508@pppoe.ca> <44D6BBAA.3060106@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <20060808164654.GK13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Mon, Aug 07, 2006 at 12:03:54AM -0400, Jamon Camisso wrote: > How to clone the copy-friendly biometric passport > By John Lettice > Published Friday 4th August 2006 13:08 GMT > http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/08/04/cloning_epassports/ > > "... The ICAO documentation Grunwald consulted is publicly available, > and explains the detail of the various levels of security of the > ePassport system, the baseline level being something not unadjacent to > zero..." > > For proponents of security though obscurity, that sentence there is > pretty much all you'd need to construct a rhetorically charged, loosely > factually based, FUD mongering condemnation of the whole notion of open > source (I use the term loosely, not specifically in the software sense > of the word). > > What this really means is that, despite the apparent failures of the > system presently, the next version or updates to the chips will likely > be secured in a more secretive manner. i.e. no more open access to the > ICAO's how and what documentation. Just imagine how secretive they'll be > allowed to be once DNA imprinting becomes commonplace. When will they learn that you can not do either of: 1) Leave it totally open and readable by anyone with the right equipment. Just because the equipment is hard to get or expensive now, doesn't mean it always will be, or that people can't get it. 2) Making things secret is no better. The spec has to be open, designed by people who know what they are doing, and designed to be secure (which almost never means it should be secret). CSS was secret, look how that went. 802.11's WPE was just plain bad. Secrets have a tendency to become non-secret, so it is better to not make them secret in the first place and just make it secure instead. Of course copying the chip on a passport, doesn't help you much if the chip contains an image or fingerprint that doesn't match the person carrying the passport. It is still a concern though. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 8 16:50:41 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 12:50:41 -0400 Subject: C warning that I can't seem to track down In-Reply-To: <200608080930.08148.ican-rZHaEmXdJNJWk0Htik3J/w@public.gmane.org> References: <200608080930.08148.ican@netrover.com> Message-ID: <20060808165041.GL13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 08, 2006 at 09:30:07AM -0400, bob wrote: > In newer versions of the GCC compiler the block of C code: > > int length; You didn't specify, so perhaps it is a signed int. > ... > > if(getsockname(s, (struct sockaddr *)&sin, &length)) > > gives a warning below > > socketUtils.c:259: warning: pointer targets in passing argument 3 of > 'getsockname' differ in signedness > > > I tracked it down to a define called "socklen_t". Damned if I can find > where that is defined. > > Any help would be appreciated. Thanks. socklen_t is defined as an unsigned 32 bit value. Try making your int unsigned as well. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 8 16:53:38 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 12:53:38 -0400 Subject: [OT]: Apple releases Kernel sources for Intel Macs and "Mac OS Forge" In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f0608071959n757cb044qa389e45a8e60d2fd-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f0608071959n757cb044qa389e45a8e60d2fd@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20060808165338.GM13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Mon, Aug 07, 2006 at 10:59:41PM -0400, Scott Elcomb wrote: > Apple has released the Darwin Intel Kernel source code, and created a > new community site "Mac OS Forge" > > http://lists.apple.com/archives/Darwin-dev/2006/Aug/msg00067.html > > M$ is going to get eaten alive over the next few years if they don't > open up Windows. Shouldn't that be phrased as: "Apple re-releases darwin intel kernel source code". After all it used to be free, and then suddenly it wasn't for a while, and now it is again. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 8 17:00:20 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 13:00:20 -0400 Subject: Open Source MMORPGs In-Reply-To: <200608052350.46178.rob-3Aypa9sX/B7wvR0lvYjcXw@public.gmane.org> References: <200608052350.46178.rob@luckdancing.com> Message-ID: <20060808170020.GN13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Sat, Aug 05, 2006 at 11:50:46PM -0400, Rob Sutherland wrote: > I'm trying to organize a small LAN party and I'm looking for some pointers to > Open Source MMORPGS and other types of networked game/social space MUD/MUSH > type things that are easy to set up and get newbies started on. I'm trying to > get examples of different types of games, from first person shooters through > multi-player strategy games to looser, more socially oriented kinds of > things, so any suggestions are welcome. bzflag! :) -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From aaronvegh-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 8 18:11:21 2006 From: aaronvegh-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Aaron Vegh) Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 14:11:21 -0400 Subject: [OT]: Apple releases Kernel sources for Intel Macs and "Mac OS Forge" In-Reply-To: <20060808165338.GM13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f0608071959n757cb044qa389e45a8e60d2fd@mail.gmail.com> <20060808165338.GM13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <4386c5b20608081111w78f56a91j55d63e2666e76bc4@mail.gmail.com> Not to be too pedantic, but this is the first time the _INTEL_ Darwin kernel is being released; the PowerPC version has always been available under an open source license. Because of the delay in getting this version out (which Apple "regretted"), there was speculation that they would be changing their practice of maintaining the Darwin code into the Intel era. Now thanks to this release, and the larger open source initiative that includes other projects, we know that Apple is still very serious about open source. And that's good news for everyone. Cheers, Aaron. On 8/8/06, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Mon, Aug 07, 2006 at 10:59:41PM -0400, Scott Elcomb wrote: > > Apple has released the Darwin Intel Kernel source code, and created a > > new community site "Mac OS Forge" > > > > http://lists.apple.com/archives/Darwin-dev/2006/Aug/msg00067.html > > > > M$ is going to get eaten alive over the next few years if they don't > > open up Windows. > > Shouldn't that be phrased as: "Apple re-releases darwin intel kernel > source code". After all it used to be free, and then suddenly it wasn't > for a while, and now it is again. > > -- > Len Sorensen > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 8 18:25:49 2006 From: tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Tim Writer) Date: 08 Aug 2006 14:25:49 -0400 Subject: C warning that I can't seem to track down In-Reply-To: <20060808165041.GL13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <200608080930.08148.ican@netrover.com> <20060808165041.GL13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: Lennart Sorensen writes: > On Tue, Aug 08, 2006 at 09:30:07AM -0400, bob wrote: > > In newer versions of the GCC compiler the block of C code: > > > > int length; > > You didn't specify, so perhaps it is a signed int. > > > ... > > > > if(getsockname(s, (struct sockaddr *)&sin, &length)) > > > > gives a warning below > > > > socketUtils.c:259: warning: pointer targets in passing argument 3 of > > 'getsockname' differ in signedness > > > > > > I tracked it down to a define called "socklen_t". Damned if I can find > > where that is defined. > > > > Any help would be appreciated. Thanks. > > socklen_t is defined as an unsigned 32 bit value. Try making your int > unsigned as well. The correct solution is to define length as: socklen_t length; as pointed out by an earlier poster. Otherwise, if sizeof(socklen_t) is not the same as sizeof(int), casting &length to a pointer to socklen_t will be disastrous. Types like socklen_t are your friends. Use them to help you. -- tim writer starnix inc. 647.722.5301 toronto, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 03:51:04 2006 From: meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org (Meng Cheah) Date: Tue, 08 Aug 2006 23:51:04 -0400 Subject: Sympatico + Norton + OFT In-Reply-To: <20060808163445.GI13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <44D4AAFB.4030206@rogers.com> <20060808163445.GI13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <44D95BA8.7000601@pppoe.ca> Lennart Sorensen wrote: >On Sat, Aug 05, 2006 at 10:28:11AM -0400, John McGregor wrote: > > >>Its been my experience that the various Norton products do no work well >>/ at all with Win XP and can be the root cause of major problems over >>and above sending / receiving email.. When a client presents me with a >>new PC, the first thing I do is to look for Norton Antivirus / Internet >>Security and then uninstall it. I replace it with the free version of >>AVG Antivirus: >> >>http://free.grisoft.com/doc/avg-anti-virus-free/lng/us/tpl/v5 >> >>and the free version of Zone Alarm. >> >>Thunderbird will work with Sympatico's new servers if you select the >>'use TLS, if available' security option for both incoming and outgoing >>connections. >> >>A far better option, of course, is to switch them to Linux at the >>earliest possible convenience. >> >> > >In my experience, both norton and zone alarm are to be avoided. Life is >better without them. > > > I've heard of complaints about Norton but Zone Alarm? Perhaps you can share your experiences. Thanks in advance. >AVG seems decent enough, although I wish there was an option in the free >version to tell it to always quarentine a virus when found, rather than >the popup question that disappears after 30 seconds. > >-- >Len Sorensen >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 03:54:19 2006 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 23:54:19 -0400 Subject: Booby trap when setting up another router In-Reply-To: <20060806055337.GC32295-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20060806055337.GC32295@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <20060809035419.GA7756@waltdnes.org> On Sun, Aug 06, 2006 at 01:53:37AM -0400, Walter Dnes wrote > Don't know why, but after a week of vacation, my ADSL modem/router has > come back refreshed and full of zip... sort of like me after a week off. > One of the first things I did was to go to the setup screens and take > screen captures of the parameters. Now it's dead again, but at least I copied the settings for future use... newsflash... the Post Office left a note that the package had arrived. I was able to pick it up at the Pharma-Save in the local shopping Mall and it's now up and running. It should've been a 10 minute operation, but took half an hour. The task looked simple enough... change the default LAN settings of the refurbished Netgear to match the dead GVC. I had several anxious minutes trying to get through to the router on 192.168.0.1 network 192.168.0.0 netmask 255.255.255.0 so I could switch it to 192.168.123.254 network 192.168.123.248 netmask 255.255.255.248. I eventually remembered that I had set up my iptables rules to only allow network 192.168.123.248 netmask 255.255.255.248... dohhh. I shut down iptables and immediately logged on to the router. A few minutes later, it was up and running on the new settings, with iptables enabled again. Now I'm listening to a 64 kbit oldies station on Live365 whilst surfing and emailing... life is good again. -- Walter Dnes In linux /sbin/init is Job #1 My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mwilson-4YeSL8/OYKRWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 12:14:03 2006 From: mwilson-4YeSL8/OYKRWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (Mel Wilson) Date: Wed, 09 Aug 2006 08:14:03 -0400 Subject: C warning that I can't seem to track down In-Reply-To: <200608081211.38197.ican-rZHaEmXdJNJWk0Htik3J/w@public.gmane.org> References: <200608080930.08148.ican@netrover.com> <200608081211.38197.ican@netrover.com> Message-ID: bob wrote: > Of course. I'll try that once I get back to my system with the newer GCC > installed. > > Thanks. > > bob > PS. > Still can't believe how obtuse the Linux headers have become since I last > looked in any detail. Maybe Google can tell me where socklen_t is actually > defined ... :-/ mwilson at darkstar:/usr/include$ grep socklen_t * netdb.h:extern struct hostent *gethostbyaddr (__const void *__addr, __socklen_t __len, netdb.h:extern int gethostbyaddr_r (__const void *__restrict __addr, __socklen_t __len, netdb.h: socklen_t ai_addrlen; /* Length of socket address. */ netdb.h: socklen_t __salen, char *__restrict __host, netdb.h: socklen_t __hostlen, char *__restrict __serv, netdb.h: socklen_t __servlen, unsigned int __flags); unistd.h:# ifndef __socklen_t_defined unistd.h:typedef __socklen_t socklen_t; unistd.h:# define __socklen_t_defined So there it is, in unistd.h Now if we only knew what __socklen_t was, we'd be set. Obtuse? yeah, I sort of agree. Mel. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mwilson-4YeSL8/OYKRWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 13:13:16 2006 From: mwilson-4YeSL8/OYKRWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (Mel Wilson) Date: Wed, 09 Aug 2006 09:13:16 -0400 Subject: C warning that I can't seem to track down In-Reply-To: References: <200608080930.08148.ican@netrover.com> <200608081211.38197.ican@netrover.com> Message-ID: Mel Wilson wrote: > bob wrote: >> Still can't believe how obtuse the Linux headers have become since I >> last looked in any detail. Maybe Google can tell me where socklen_t >> is actually defined ... > > :-/ > unistd.h:# ifndef __socklen_t_defined > unistd.h:typedef __socklen_t socklen_t; > unistd.h:# define __socklen_t_defined > > So there it is, in unistd.h > Now if we only knew what __socklen_t was, we'd be set. Obtuse? > yeah, I sort of agree. Turns out __socklen_t is defined in /usr/include/bits/types.h It's hard to spot because it's defined by a __STD_TYPE statement which is a #defined extension to typedef. It's a __U32_TYPE which is a defined stand-in for unsigned int. Found this with a little Python thing that scrambles through the directory tree finding strings in files. Mel. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 13:16:39 2006 From: cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org (Chris F.A. Johnson) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 09:16:39 -0400 (EDT) Subject: C warning that I can't seem to track down In-Reply-To: References: <200608080930.08148.ican@netrover.com> <200608081211.38197.ican@netrover.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 9 Aug 2006, Mel Wilson wrote: > Mel Wilson wrote: >> bob wrote: >> > Still can't believe how obtuse the Linux headers have become since I >> > last looked in any detail. Maybe Google can tell me where socklen_t >> > is actually defined ... >> >> : -/ >> unistd.h:# ifndef __socklen_t_defined >> unistd.h:typedef __socklen_t socklen_t; >> unistd.h:# define __socklen_t_defined >> >> So there it is, in unistd.h >> Now if we only knew what __socklen_t was, we'd be set. Obtuse? >> yeah, I sort of agree. > > Turns out __socklen_t is defined in /usr/include/bits/types.h > > It's hard to spot because it's defined by a __STD_TYPE statement > which is a #defined extension to typedef. It's a __U32_TYPE > which is a defined stand-in for unsigned int. > > Found this with a little Python thing that scrambles through > the directory tree finding strings in files. Python??? What's wrong with 'grep -r'? -- Chris F.A. Johnson =================================================================== Author: Shell Scripting Recipes: A Problem-Solution Approach (2005, Apress) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 13:22:38 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 09:22:38 -0400 Subject: [OT]: Apple releases Kernel sources for Intel Macs and "Mac OS Forge" In-Reply-To: <4386c5b20608081111w78f56a91j55d63e2666e76bc4-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f0608071959n757cb044qa389e45a8e60d2fd@mail.gmail.com> <20060808165338.GM13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <4386c5b20608081111w78f56a91j55d63e2666e76bc4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20060809132238.GO13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 08, 2006 at 02:11:21PM -0400, Aaron Vegh wrote: > Not to be too pedantic, but this is the first time the _INTEL_ Darwin > kernel is being released; the PowerPC version has always been > available under an open source license. Because of the delay in > getting this version out (which Apple "regretted"), there was > speculation that they would be changing their practice of maintaining > the Darwin code into the Intel era. Now thanks to this release, and > the larger open source initiative that includes other projects, we > know that Apple is still very serious about open source. And that's > good news for everyone. Originally the Darwin kernel code was released for both x86 and PPC. It is less than a year ago that they pulled the source for the darwin kernel as far as I recall. People had already been playing with darwin on x86 for a long time before Apple decided to switch to x86. I remember articles of people complaining about apple pulling the source code, with questions about how commited they really were to open source after all. It happend back in May: http://www.infoworld.com/article/06/05/17/78300_21OPcurve_1.html Maybe they were just trying to figure out what they wanted to do. Darwin 1.3 apparently was rather easy to compile and run on x86 hardware, which was released quite a while ago. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 13:25:58 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 09:25:58 -0400 Subject: Sympatico + Norton + OFT In-Reply-To: <44D95BA8.7000601-D1t3LT1mScs@public.gmane.org> References: <44D4AAFB.4030206@rogers.com> <20060808163445.GI13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44D95BA8.7000601@pppoe.ca> Message-ID: <20060809132558.GP13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 08, 2006 at 11:51:04PM -0400, Meng Cheah wrote: > I've heard of complaints about Norton but Zone Alarm? > Perhaps you can share your experiences. > Thanks in advance. Too many stupid questions being asked of users who generally have no clue whatsoever what the question means. Windows really needs to have firewalls that don't require user interaction to work. We have that on linux, but apparently no one can figure out how to make one for windows. Does anyone make a stateful windows firewall, or are they all just application/port based the way things used to be a decade ago? -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From kru_tch-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 13:41:40 2006 From: kru_tch-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (Stephen Allen) Date: Wed, 09 Aug 2006 09:41:40 -0400 Subject: Sympatico + Norton + OFT In-Reply-To: <20060808163445.GI13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <44D4AAFB.4030206@rogers.com> <20060808163445.GI13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <44D9E614.4030701@yahoo.ca> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > AVG seems decent enough, although I wish there was an option in the free > version to tell it to always quarentine a virus when found, rather than > the popup question that disappears after 30 seconds. You might want to try clam/clamwin best of breed, (IMO) even if it doesn't provide a great eye candy GUI. It's quite reliable and most important OSS. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mwilson-4YeSL8/OYKRWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 14:40:00 2006 From: mwilson-4YeSL8/OYKRWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (Mel Wilson) Date: Wed, 09 Aug 2006 10:40:00 -0400 Subject: C warning that I can't seem to track down In-Reply-To: References: <200608080930.08148.ican@netrover.com> <200608081211.38197.ican@netrover.com> Message-ID: Chris F.A. Johnson wrote: > On Wed, 9 Aug 2006, Mel Wilson wrote: >> Found this with a little Python thing that scrambles through >> the directory tree finding strings in files. > > Python??? > > What's wrong with 'grep -r'? It's what I do best. AND 'grep -r' isn't listed in _Linux in a Nutshell_ (note to self -- what's up with that?) Cheers, Mel. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 15:06:48 2006 From: cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org (Chris F.A. Johnson) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 11:06:48 -0400 (EDT) Subject: C warning that I can't seem to track down In-Reply-To: References: <200608080930.08148.ican@netrover.com> <200608081211.38197.ican@netrover.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 9 Aug 2006, Mel Wilson wrote: > Chris F.A. Johnson wrote: >> On Wed, 9 Aug 2006, Mel Wilson wrote: >> > Found this with a little Python thing that scrambles through >> > the directory tree finding strings in files. >> >> Python??? >> >> What's wrong with 'grep -r'? > > It's what I do best. AND 'grep -r' isn't listed in > _Linux in a Nutshell_ (note to self -- what's up with that?) Even without the -r option, you don't need Python: find /usr/include -type f -print0 | xargs -0 grep PATTERN /dev/null -- Chris F.A. Johnson =================================================================== Author: Shell Scripting Recipes: A Problem-Solution Approach (2005, Apress) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 17:03:24 2006 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 13:03:24 -0400 Subject: LITP06 wikis and commitees Message-ID: Hi All ! looks like this years bunfest http://linuxcaffe.com/node/439 needs a bee in it's bonnet, so, I propose a few pages of real estate is carved out of the gtllug.org wiki; litp -activities -invitations -food -music -permits -promo for starters, k? (Sy ?) and then lets get the ideas flowing ! (sorry for being all stormtrouper-like, but hey, who's really got time for diplomacy ? ;-) I think we really CAN make this a way fun, and totally memorable gathering ! djp -- djp-tnsZcVQxgqO2dHQpreyxbg at public.gmane.org www.linuxcaffe.ca 326 Harbord Street, Toronto, M6G 3A5, (416) 534-2116 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 17:08:53 2006 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 13:08:53 -0400 Subject: LITP06 inter-LUG Message-ID: We haven't cornered the market on linux use nor enthusiasm, and we shouldn't try to ! Let's get the word out to any other linux-related (Toronto) LUG that we can think of ! NewTlug (the OTHER white penguin meat) Perl Mongers ? wirelesstoronto (linux users, they just don't know it yet) TO2600 (yes, I know, they're disruptive and always up to something, but they're into it and they're fun) who else ? djp -- djp-tnsZcVQxgqO2dHQpreyxbg at public.gmane.org www.linuxcaffe.ca 326 Harbord Street, Toronto, M6G 3A5, (416) 534-2116 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 17:19:17 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Wed, 09 Aug 2006 13:19:17 -0400 Subject: LITP06 inter-LUG In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <44DA1915.9080307@telly.org> David J Patrick wrote: > We haven't cornered the market on linux use nor enthusiasm, and we > shouldn't try to ! Let's get the word out to any other linux-related > (Toronto) LUG that we can think of ! There's a list I maintain on the CLUE site of every (known) open source user group in Canada, sorted alphabetically, or by Province:City. The Toronto entries (19 groups) start at http://www.cluecan.ca/group-list?from=60&sort=asc&order=City-sort If there's any incorrect or missing info, just let me know. - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 17:19:31 2006 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 13:19:31 -0400 Subject: LITP06 extra-LUG Message-ID: Even if we managed to gather every available linux enthusiast, what would make it EVEN MORE FUN would be to lure in linux-curious member of the beginning-to-think-that-this-linux-thing-might-actually-work-for-our-organization types. You know; school administrators, and librarians, and small business owners and Windows systems administrators ! ;-) Of course, there's always a chance some of us kooks will scare them off, but it'll give us something to laugh about later ! put your suggestions on the (soon to be created ?) gtalug.org wiki pages. thanks, djp -- djp-tnsZcVQxgqO2dHQpreyxbg at public.gmane.org www.linuxcaffe.ca 326 Harbord Street, Toronto, M6G 3A5, (416) 534-2116 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 17:22:09 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 13:22:09 -0400 Subject: C warning that I can't seem to track down In-Reply-To: <44D9F3C0.2090209-4YeSL8/OYKRWk0Htik3J/w@public.gmane.org> References: <200608080930.08148.ican@netrover.com> <200608081211.38197.ican@netrover.com> <44D9F3C0.2090209@the-wire.com> Message-ID: <20060809172209.GQ13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 09, 2006 at 10:40:00AM -0400, Mel Wilson wrote: > It's what I do best. AND 'grep -r' isn't listed in > _Linux in a Nutshell_ (note to self -- what's up with that?) Maybe it is too old. I have encountered older slackware systems that had a version of grep that was so old it didn't do -r. -r is a "recent" addition (as in some time in the last 10 years). -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 17:22:36 2006 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 13:22:36 -0400 Subject: LITP06 inter-LUG In-Reply-To: <44DA1915.9080307-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg@public.gmane.org> References: <44DA1915.9080307@telly.org> Message-ID: On 8/9/06, Evan Leibovitch wrote: > There's a list I maintain on the CLUE site of every (known) open source > user group in Canada, err... should we book Downsview ? who on that list is reasonably local, active and potentially interested ? -- djp-tnsZcVQxgqO2dHQpreyxbg at public.gmane.org www.linuxcaffe.ca 326 Harbord Street, Toronto, M6G 3A5, (416) 534-2116 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 17:22:46 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 13:22:46 -0400 Subject: C warning that I can't seem to track down In-Reply-To: References: <200608080930.08148.ican@netrover.com> <200608081211.38197.ican@netrover.com> Message-ID: <20060809172246.GR13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 09, 2006 at 11:06:48AM -0400, Chris F.A. Johnson wrote: > Even without the -r option, you don't need Python: > > find /usr/include -type f -print0 | xargs -0 grep PATTERN /dev/null Whatever does the /dev/null do? -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cunnington-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 17:50:27 2006 From: cunnington-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Chris Cunnington) Date: Wed, 09 Aug 2006 13:50:27 -0400 Subject: Smalltalk Club Message-ID: Hi All, The third meeting of the Tomb Robbers' Club is next Tuesday at 6:30 at Paupers Pub. If you're interested in Smalltalk, Squeak, or Seaside, then come out and have a beer! http://www.brokentomb.com Chris Cunnington -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 17:56:14 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 13:56:14 -0400 (EDT) Subject: LITP06 inter-LUG In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20060809175614.29369.qmail@web88212.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- David J Patrick wrote: > We haven't cornered the market on linux use nor > enthusiasm, and we > shouldn't try to ! Let's get the word out to any > other linux-related > (Toronto) LUG that we can think of ! > > NewTlug (the OTHER white penguin meat) > > Perl Mongers ? > > wirelesstoronto (linux users, they just don't know > it yet) > > TO2600 (yes, I know, they're disruptive and always > up to something, > but they're into it and they're fun) > > who else ? Here are a few others: WestTLUG - Granted many of those folks have an aversion to coming into Toronto, but do want to make sure they know they are welcome here. Pegasoft - Ken Burtch's software development group. Unix Unanimous - I will mention the Linux in the Park event at the meeting this evening. Toronto Asterisk Users Group - Not always Linux users (Asterisk does run on Mac and Windows, but Linux is the preferred platform.). Slashdot Meetup - They meet this evening, a conflict with UU so I will not be going to that meeting. Anyone else want to pass the word? Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 18:06:22 2006 From: cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org (Chris F.A. Johnson) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 14:06:22 -0400 (EDT) Subject: C warning that I can't seem to track down In-Reply-To: <20060809172246.GR13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <200608080930.08148.ican@netrover.com> <200608081211.38197.ican@netrover.com> <20060809172246.GR13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: On Wed, 9 Aug 2006, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Wed, Aug 09, 2006 at 11:06:48AM -0400, Chris F.A. Johnson wrote: >> Even without the -r option, you don't need Python: >> >> find /usr/include -type f -print0 | xargs -0 grep PATTERN /dev/null > > Whatever does the /dev/null do? It forces grep to print the file name if there is only one name on the command line. -- Chris F.A. Johnson =================================================================== Author: Shell Scripting Recipes: A Problem-Solution Approach (2005, Apress) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 18:12:02 2006 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 14:12:02 -0400 Subject: C warning that I can't seem to track down In-Reply-To: <20060809172246.GR13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <200608080930.08148.ican@netrover.com> <200608081211.38197.ican@netrover.com> <20060809172246.GR13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20060809181202.GA30531@wp.magstar.net> On Wed, Aug 09, 2006 at 01:22:46PM -0400, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Wed, Aug 09, 2006 at 11:06:48AM -0400, Chris F.A. Johnson wrote: > > Even without the -r option, you don't need Python: > > > > find /usr/include -type f -print0 | xargs -0 grep PATTERN /dev/null > > Whatever does the /dev/null do? It forces 'grep' to terminate if there is nothing coming through the pipe. Otherwise, 'grep' will just sit there reading stdin. -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 18:44:48 2006 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Wed, 09 Aug 2006 14:44:48 -0400 Subject: Tom's HW Guide: Linux for gaming In-Reply-To: References: <44BAF994.8080401@telly.org> Message-ID: <44DA2D20.1080107@georgetown.wehave.net> Tim Writer wrote: > Evan Leibovitch writes: > >> Those reading this list who are involved with ATI (you know who you are) >> are invited to use this article to help prod the company to match and >> surpass nVidia's level of support. > > Here's a counterpoint: > > http://www.phoronix.com/redblog/ > > ATI is working very hard to improve their Linux support. They release a > driver every month so improvements come quickly. One of the presentations at OLS was titled "Open Source Graphics Drivers - They Don't Kill Kittens". I didn't attend but others that did thought it was a good presentation. You can read the paper (from March/06) in http://www.linuxsymposium.org/2006/linuxsymposium_procv1.pdf. The author has prepared an open-source driver for ATI R500 chipsets but has been waiting on ATI's approval to release it (for more than 6 month). I'm not a graphics junkie so I'm a little out of my depth on this but it would be nice if my Dell laptop (ATI R1300 graphics) would just work at 1280x800 as my previous Toshiba laptop had done (i915 chipset I think). If the graphics drivers were fully open source and integrated with kernel and X the hopes for full out of the box support would be much greater. Looking at ATI's page I think there's a 23MB download that might improve my graphics, I think I'll leave it for another day ... According to the paper I mentioned the support from both ATI and nVidia for free drivers is severely lacking (non-existant). Perhaps the AMD/ATI merger will help as well once new products start coming online. -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 18:57:57 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 14:57:57 -0400 Subject: LITP06 inter-LUG In-Reply-To: <20060809175614.29369.qmail-W5RQQfbthkOB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060809175614.29369.qmail@web88212.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20060809185757.GS13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 09, 2006 at 01:56:14PM -0400, Colin McGregor wrote: > Here are a few others: > > WestTLUG - Granted many of those folks have an > aversion to coming into Toronto, but do want to make > sure they know they are welcome here. > > Pegasoft - Ken Burtch's software development group. > > Unix Unanimous - I will mention the Linux in the Park > event at the meeting this evening. > > Toronto Asterisk Users Group - Not always Linux users > (Asterisk does run on Mac and Windows, but Linux is > the preferred platform.). > > Slashdot Meetup - They meet this evening, a conflict > with UU so I will not be going to that meeting. Anyone > else want to pass the word? Dare I ask what a slashdot meetup is? -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 19:02:50 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 15:02:50 -0400 Subject: C warning that I can't seem to track down In-Reply-To: <20060809181202.GA30531-SBOj+Tp9hCvc29vQ/UIUOA@public.gmane.org> References: <200608080930.08148.ican@netrover.com> <200608081211.38197.ican@netrover.com> <20060809172246.GR13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060809181202.GA30531@wp.magstar.net> Message-ID: <20060809190250.GT13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 09, 2006 at 02:12:02PM -0400, William Park wrote: > It forces 'grep' to terminate if there is nothing coming through the > pipe. Otherwise, 'grep' will just sit there reading stdin. xargs -r would have dealt with that. On the other hand the case with one argument and getting grep to list the filename does get solved with /dev/null. It solves the no arguments problem as a side effect really. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 19:43:28 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 15:43:28 -0400 (EDT) Subject: LITP06 inter-LUG In-Reply-To: <20060809185757.GS13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20060809185757.GS13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20060809194328.21849.qmail@web88204.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Wed, Aug 09, 2006 at 01:56:14PM -0400, Colin > McGregor wrote: [snip] > > Slashdot Meetup - They meet this evening, a > conflict > > with UU so I will not be going to that meeting. > Anyone > > else want to pass the word? > > Dare I ask what a slashdot meetup is? In summary a physical meeting of fans of the slashdot.org news website. Details can be found through the meetup.com website. The meeting summary is: The Toronto Slashdot August Meetup Added to Events by Paul Rochford on Wed Jul 12 20:08:45 EDT 2006 When: Wed Aug 09 19:00:00 EDT 2006 Where: Fiddlers Green 27 Wellesley Street East Toronto, ON (416) 967-9442 What: MEETING AGENDA ============= ***DON?T FORGET We?re on the THIRD FLOOR of the pub*** - Introductions - New Faces ? quick introductions - General Discussion - "News You Can Use" ? The Latest in Tech with Howard Carson - Round Table Discussion - Show Off Your Stuff ? Wireless Internet access onsite - Mingle/Network -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 20:11:35 2006 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 16:11:35 -0400 Subject: LITP06 inter-LUG In-Reply-To: <20060809194328.21849.qmail-iE2/U85ktn6B9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060809185757.GS13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060809194328.21849.qmail@web88204.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On 8/9/06, Colin McGregor wrote: > In summary a physical meeting of fans of the > slashdot.org news website. Besides the fact that slashdot is part of the OSDN, why would the Slashdot group like linux more than, say the miniature poodle meet-up group ? heck, let's just send the invite and see who shows ! -- djp-tnsZcVQxgqO2dHQpreyxbg at public.gmane.org www.linuxcaffe.ca 326 Harbord Street, Toronto, M6G 3A5, (416) 534-2116 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 20:26:39 2006 From: mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Merv Curley) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 16:26:39 -0400 Subject: USB Audio Message-ID: <200608091626.39899.mervc@eol.ca> I posted this subject yesterday from another computer but it hasn't shown up yet. So again - I have a little audio device to bring audio from my Amplifier to the computer. When I plug it in, the kernel immediately recognises it but doesn't give me a hint as to a device name or ??? My next question from some multimedia type, is what can I use to take this raw audio and convert it to .wav or other format files. I first thought of sox, but I don't see any hint that it handles USB, I get the impression it only works with soundcards. Help or advice or pointers or ?? Thanks -- Merv Curley Toronto, Ont. Can Kanotix Linux Ver 2005-4 Desktop KDE 3.5.1 KMail 1.2 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 20:42:49 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Wed, 09 Aug 2006 16:42:49 -0400 Subject: USB Audio In-Reply-To: <200608091626.39899.mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200608091626.39899.mervc@eol.ca> Message-ID: <44DA48C9.3000600@rogers.com> Merv Curley wrote: > I posted this subject yesterday from another computer but it hasn't shown up > yet. So again - > > I have a little audio device to bring audio from my Amplifier to the computer. > When I plug it in, the kernel immediately recognises it but doesn't give me a > hint as to a device name or ??? > If you are using ubuntu, maybe you could see it in the "system monitor" tool( under processes) My next question from some multimedia type, is what can I use to take this raw > audio and convert it to .wav or other format files. I first thought of sox, > but I don't see any hint that it handles USB, I get the impression it only > works with soundcards. > > I have used audacity to convert the raw output from a music system which was input into the sound card. Maybe you could try audacity.sourceforge.net > Help or advice or pointers or ?? > > Thanks > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 20:45:03 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Wed, 09 Aug 2006 16:45:03 -0400 Subject: USB Audio In-Reply-To: <44DA48C9.3000600-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200608091626.39899.mervc@eol.ca> <44DA48C9.3000600@rogers.com> Message-ID: <44DA494F.9050000@rogers.com> Oops!! I meant the "devices" tab, not processes tab under the system monitor tool. K Kush wrote: > Merv Curley wrote: >> I posted this subject yesterday from another computer but it hasn't >> shown up yet. So again - >> >> I have a little audio device to bring audio from my Amplifier to the >> computer. When I plug it in, the kernel immediately recognises it but >> doesn't give me a hint as to a device name or ??? > If you are using ubuntu, maybe you could see it in the "system > monitor" tool( under processes) > > My next question from some multimedia type, is what can I use to take > this raw >> audio and convert it to .wav or other format files. I first thought >> of sox, but I don't see any hint that it handles USB, I get the >> impression it only works with soundcards. >> > I have used audacity to convert the raw output from a music system > which was input into the sound card. Maybe you could try > audacity.sourceforge.net >> Help or advice or pointers or ?? >> >> Thanks > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 20:51:04 2006 From: mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Merv Curley) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 16:51:04 -0400 Subject: USB Audio In-Reply-To: <44DA48C9.3000600-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200608091626.39899.mervc@eol.ca> <44DA48C9.3000600@rogers.com> Message-ID: <200608091651.04802.mervc@eol.ca> On Wednesday 09 August 2006 16:42, Kush wrote: > Merv Curley wrote: > > I posted this subject yesterday from another computer but it hasn't shown > > up yet. So again - > > > > I have a little audio device to bring audio from my Amplifier to the > > computer. When I plug it in, the kernel immediately recognises it but > > doesn't give me a hint as to a device name or ??? > > If you are using ubuntu, maybe you could see it in the "system monitor" > tool( under processes) > I can boot into Ubuntu, I wonder if there is a KDE equivalent, h-m-m-m. > My next question from some multimedia type, is what can I use to take > this raw > > > audio and convert it to .wav or other format files. I first thought of > > sox, but I don't see any hint that it handles USB, I get the impression > > it only works with soundcards. > > I have used audacity to convert the raw output from a music system which > was input into the sound card. Maybe you could try audacity.sourceforge.net > Well the audio by default doesn't go to a soundcard. That cuts down on cheap audio circuits getting into the act. The Windows software works well but my FAT partition is really too small to be useful, and I would be happy just to do the same work in Linux. I'll look at Audacity and see what it can do. Of course it would be nice to remove some of the pops and clicks that are now built into my LP's and 'gramofile' hasn't impressed on the tests I have done. > > Help or advice or pointers or ?? > > > > Thanks > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- Merv Curley Toronto, Ont. Can Kanotix Linux Ver 2005-4 Desktop KDE 3.5.1 KMail 1.2 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 20:56:29 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 16:56:29 -0400 (EDT) Subject: LITP06 wikis and commitees In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20060809205629.59251.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- David J Patrick wrote: > Hi All ! > looks like this years bunfest > http://linuxcaffe.com/node/439 > needs a bee in it's bonnet, so, I propose a few > pages of real estate > is carved out of the gtllug.org wiki; > > litp > -activities > -invitations > -food > -music > -permits > -promo > > for starters, k? (Sy ?) and then lets get the ideas > flowing ! > > (sorry for being all stormtrouper-like, but hey, > who's really got time > for diplomacy ? ;-) > > I think we really CAN make this a way fun, and > totally memorable gathering ! > > djp Ok, I've put the event info up on the upcoming.org website, as can be seen here: http://upcoming.org/event/97577 Please pass any corrections/changes on and I will be happy to post them. Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 21:21:26 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 17:21:26 -0400 Subject: USB Audio In-Reply-To: <200608091626.39899.mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200608091626.39899.mervc@eol.ca> Message-ID: <20060809212126.GU13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 09, 2006 at 04:26:39PM -0400, Merv Curley wrote: > I posted this subject yesterday from another computer but it hasn't shown up > yet. So again - > > I have a little audio device to bring audio from my Amplifier to the computer. > When I plug it in, the kernel immediately recognises it but doesn't give me a > hint as to a device name or ??? > > My next question from some multimedia type, is what can I use to take this raw > audio and convert it to .wav or other format files. I first thought of sox, > but I don't see any hint that it handles USB, I get the impression it only > works with soundcards. > > Help or advice or pointers or ?? It most likely shows up as an alsa device assuming it is a usb audio adapter, which it probably is. cat /proc/asound/cards Maybe something in there makes sense. If so, arecord can record from it, to wav if you want at whatever sample rate you want. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 21:27:11 2006 From: mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Merv Curley) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 17:27:11 -0400 Subject: USB Audio In-Reply-To: <200608091626.39899.mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200608091626.39899.mervc@eol.ca> Message-ID: <200608091727.11470.mervc@eol.ca> On Wednesday 09 August 2006 16:26, Merv Curley wrote: > I posted this subject yesterday from another computer but it hasn't shown > up yet. So again - > > I have a little audio device to bring audio from my Amplifier to the > computer. When I plug it in, the kernel immediately recognises it but > doesn't give me a hint as to a device name or ??? > Just tried it on a newer system and dmesg added, usbcore: registered new driver snd-usb-audio Now to find an application that can use this driver, I guess. > My next question from some multimedia type, is what can I use to take this > raw audio and convert it to .wav or other format files. I first thought of > sox, but I don't see any hint that it handles USB, I get the impression it > only works with soundcards. > > Help or advice or pointers or ?? > > Thanks -- Merv Curley Toronto, Ont. Can Kanotix Linux Ver 2005-4 Desktop KDE 3.5.1 KMail 1.2 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 21:41:16 2006 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 17:41:16 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Software Freedom day Message-ID: Are we planning to do anything for the day? http://softwarefreedomday.org/ I'm way too overloaded to even contemplate organising anything but I'd be interested in helping out at a stall or event. Rob -- Robert Brockway B.Sc. Phone: +1-905-821-2327 Senior Technical Consultant Urgent Support: +1-416-669-3073 OpenTrend Solutions Ltd Email: support-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Web: www.opentrend.net If you are emailing regarding an open ticket please consider mentioning the ticket ID as this will assist us in responding as quickly as possible. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 23:10:38 2006 From: mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Merv Curley) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 19:10:38 -0400 Subject: USB Audio In-Reply-To: <20060809212126.GU13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <200608091626.39899.mervc@eol.ca> <20060809212126.GU13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <200608091910.38711.mervc@eol.ca> On Wednesday 09 August 2006 17:21, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Wed, Aug 09, 2006 at 04:26:39PM -0400, Merv Curley wrote: > > I posted this subject yesterday from another computer but it hasn't shown > > up yet. So again - > > > > I have a little audio device to bring audio from my Amplifier to the > > computer. When I plug it in, the kernel immediately recognises it but > > doesn't give me a hint as to a device name or ??? > > > > My next question from some multimedia type, is what can I use to take > > this raw audio and convert it to .wav or other format files. I first > > thought of sox, but I don't see any hint that it handles USB, I get the > > impression it only works with soundcards. > > > > Help or advice or pointers or ?? > > It most likely shows up as an alsa device assuming it is a usb audio > adapter, which it probably is. > > cat /proc/asound/cards > It reports 1 [Audio ]: USB-Audio - USB Audio USB Audio at usb-0000:00:0f.2-1, full speed and I now know the driver is snd-usb-audio > Maybe something in there makes sense. If so, arecord can record from > it, to wav if you want at whatever sample rate you want. > > -- Ain't google great, told me in 2 sec's that arecord was a part of ALSA. I had no idea, and since it isn't in a Debian repository I was thinking it was going to be something hard to find. No to go read something about using it. Thanks again. -- Merv Curley Toronto, Ont. Can Kanotix Linux Ver 2005-4 Desktop KDE 3.5.1 KMail 1.2 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From zleap-Tp5KeRqLOeNeoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 9 23:35:13 2006 From: zleap-Tp5KeRqLOeNeoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (Paul Sutton) Date: Wed, 09 Aug 2006 19:35:13 -0400 Subject: debian install (kanotix) Message-ID: <44DA7131.2090202@zleap.net> Just to let everyone know and give a big thank you to Kush, I now have a working kanotix installation, plus working wireless network card, so I can surf the net from Linux, Will take a day or two to move over compeletly, but I am getting there slowly, thanks again paul -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 10 00:58:59 2006 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy Ali) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 19:58:59 -0500 Subject: LITP06 wikis and commitees In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1e55af990608091758j10b3793as4c49992bb08bde73@mail.gmail.com> On 8/9/06, David J Patrick wrote: > for starters, k? (Sy ?) and then lets get the ideas flowing ! Ok, I tidied up this topic: http://gtalug.org/wiki/litp Making sub-pages is pretty trivial. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 10 01:47:19 2006 From: mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Merv Curley) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 21:47:19 -0400 Subject: USB Audio In-Reply-To: <20060809212126.GU13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <200608091626.39899.mervc@eol.ca> <20060809212126.GU13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <200608092147.19931.mervc@eol.ca> On Wednesday 09 August 2006 17:21, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > > It most likely shows up as an alsa device assuming it is a usb audio > adapter, which it probably is. > > cat /proc/asound/cards > > Maybe something in there makes sense. If so, arecord can record from > it, to wav if you want at whatever sample rate you want. > > -- It looks like there aren't any Linux audio buffs in this city or I just haven't caught their eyes. Arecord does see my device, the soundcard is listed as Card0 and my device as Card1. As far as I can tell ALSA is all about Soundcards. To use arecord one uses alsamixer, but alsa mixer is about the soundcard inputs and outputs. I don't see any way of telling it about Card1 or my sound driver as a source. The site linux-sound.org has a wealth of information but I just haven't found anything that answers my problem. The answer may be somewhere in ALSA, I'll keep looking. Sox and Audacity could also do what I want if I could only tell them about this oddball audio source. Looks like I use Windows to get my L.P's and reel to reel tapes onto the computer. Drat. Thanks Lennart and Kush -- Merv Curley Toronto, Ont. Can Kanotix Linux Ver 2005-4 Desktop KDE 3.5.1 KMail 1.2 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 10 02:08:43 2006 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 19:08:43 -0700 Subject: OT: Alternate Cellular Message-ID: At places like Canada Computers, they're offering fairly sophisticated late-breaking phones at what *appear* to be not overly lordly prices that claim to be "unlocked." In principle, it would seem plausible to move a SIM card from elderly phone into a nice new Razr or such. Is this a reasonable way to go about doing a cell upgrade? That would appear to be a reasonable way to untie from Rogers' phone contracts, assuming that the phone continues to work, and assuming most of the phone's functionality would work... Or is that an unreasonable sort of expectation? -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html Oddly enough, this is completely standard behaviour for shells. This is a roundabout way of saying `don't use combined chains of `&&'s and `||'s unless you think G?del's theorem is for sissies'. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From shiwan-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 10 02:14:27 2006 From: shiwan-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Vlad) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 22:14:27 -0400 Subject: OT: Alternate Cellular In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Rogers' phone contracts will include the SIM card and its use, as that's what the account is tied to. Doesn't matter if you swap the phone or not, for that SIM card to do anything, the account needs to be live and tied to it. This is different from CDMA phones, which have a unique ID embedded into them, that's tied to the account. I'm all for some of the phones available at http://www.dynamism.com/ - I remember when the NEC phone was around US$600 a couple of months ago... Cheers, -- Vlad On 8/9/06, Christopher Browne wrote: > At places like Canada Computers, they're offering fairly sophisticated > late-breaking phones at what *appear* to be not overly lordly prices > that claim to be "unlocked." > > In principle, it would seem plausible to move a SIM card from elderly > phone into a nice new Razr or such. > > Is this a reasonable way to go about doing a cell upgrade? That would > appear to be a reasonable way to untie from Rogers' phone contracts, > assuming that the phone continues to work, and assuming most of the > phone's functionality would work... Or is that an unreasonable sort > of expectation? > -- > http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html > Oddly enough, this is completely standard behaviour for shells. This > is a roundabout way of saying `don't use combined chains of `&&'s and > `||'s unless you think G?del's theorem is for sissies'. > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- end -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lfeder-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 10 02:49:08 2006 From: lfeder-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (lfeder) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 22:49:08 -0400 Subject: Online store ecommerce Message-ID: I was looking to put together an online store. I found oscommerce.com I was wondering if anyone else had setup an online store with ecommerce. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 10 03:02:14 2006 From: jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Jason Shein) Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 23:02:14 -0400 Subject: Online store ecommerce In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200608092302.14232.jason@detachednetworks.ca> On Wednesday 09 August 2006 22:49, lfeder wrote: > I was looking to put together an online store. > I found oscommerce.com > > I was wondering if anyone else had setup an online store with ecommerce. Look into using Joomla with VirtueMart. It works extremely well. http://www.joomla.org http://virtuemart.net/ Try the virtuemart demo shop here http://virtuemart.net/demoshop/ And the demo backend here http://virtuemart.net/demoshop/administrator/ -- Jason Shein Detached Networks jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org ( 905 ) - 876 - 4158 Voice ( 905 ) - 876 - 5817 Mobile http://www.detachednetworks.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 10 03:14:41 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Wed, 09 Aug 2006 23:14:41 -0400 Subject: Online store ecommerce In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <44DAA4A1.5000806@telly.org> lfeder wrote: >I was looking to put together an online store. >I found oscommerce.com > >I was wondering if anyone else had setup an online store with ecommerce. > > I've been a heavy part of the implementation of an online store using the Drupal CMS and its ecommerce module. It took a while to nail down but it works. The nice thing about using Drupal is that you can integrate its e-commerce facility with other CMS components (ie, people can subscribe to premium content or buy access to exclusive file downloads, etc.). If OTOH all you're looking for is a standalone store for hard goods then OScommerce may be all you need. - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 10 06:28:34 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2006 02:28:34 -0400 Subject: OT: Alternate Cellular In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <44DAD212.3070101@telly.org> Vlad wrote: > Rogers' phone contracts will include the SIM card and its use, > as that's what the account is tied to. Doesn't matter if you swap the > phone or not, for that SIM card to do anything, the account needs to > be live and tied to it. Exactly. During one trip to Japan, I rented a cellphone (the Japanese network is neither GSM nor CDMA). The rental phone used my Rogers SIM card without hassle and I was able to accept calls on my Rogers Toronto number using the rental phone and have my airtime and roaming billed to the Rogers account. As Vlad said, Rogers doesn't care about the phone, your contract is associated to the SIM card and whatever it's plugged into. The only link between the contract and the phone is that you probably needed to take out a contract in order to get a cheap(er) price on the phone. If you want a new phone (or your old one breaks and is out of warranty) you can: 1) Get a new Rogers phone in return for extending your contract 2) Pay Rogers more in return for getting a new phone without an extended contract. 3) Pay a little more for an unlocked phone. When your Rogers contract runs out you can just shop for the cheapest GSM service (Rogers or Fido) and keep using your new phone. - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 10 13:18:15 2006 From: ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org (Andrew Hammond) Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2006 09:18:15 -0400 Subject: OT: Alternate Cellular In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <44DB3217.4070107@ca.afilias.info> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Chris isn't an un-educated techno-moron. He knows that by moving the SIM card to a new phone his phone number and contract will follow it. That is obvious from the second paragraph of his original post. He knows that he needs an account with the guys who own the towers on the other end. My understanding of his question is that he wants to know if he can buy a 3rd party phone from an inexpensive source to avoid the whole contract extension / lock-in business that Rogers (and other phone companies) get up to when you try to replace your phone through them: "pay this silly price to upgrade your phone... or... extend your contract and we'll give you a huge rebate". (Where the rebated price is probably on a par with what you pay $DISCOUNT_HARDWARE_STORE for the unlocked phone anyway.) Drew Vlad wrote: > Rogers' phone contracts will include the SIM card and its use, > as that's what the account is tied to. Doesn't matter if you swap the > phone or not, for that SIM card to do anything, the account needs to > be live and tied to it. > > This is different from CDMA phones, which have a unique ID > embedded into them, that's tied to the account. > > I'm all for some of the phones available at > http://www.dynamism.com/ - I remember when the NEC phone was around > US$600 a couple of months ago... > > > Cheers, > > -- Vlad > > On 8/9/06, Christopher Browne wrote: >> At places like Canada Computers, they're offering fairly sophisticated >> late-breaking phones at what *appear* to be not overly lordly prices >> that claim to be "unlocked." >> >> In principle, it would seem plausible to move a SIM card from elderly >> phone into a nice new Razr or such. >> >> Is this a reasonable way to go about doing a cell upgrade? That would >> appear to be a reasonable way to untie from Rogers' phone contracts, >> assuming that the phone continues to work, and assuming most of the >> phone's functionality would work... Or is that an unreasonable sort >> of expectation? >> -- >> http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html >> Oddly enough, this is completely standard behaviour for shells. This >> is a roundabout way of saying `don't use combined chains of `&&'s and >> `||'s unless you think G?del's theorem is for sissies'. >> -- >> The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >> TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >> How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml >> > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2.2 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFE2zIWgfzn5SevSpoRAg7KAJ9x0q8OLXSH3PgQ8poBr99jxhyMtQCgyd5B 7t5kwFhD5+n5QopZLE9CJwg= =bLM1 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tentra-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 10 14:55:03 2006 From: tentra-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Seneca Cunningham) Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2006 10:55:03 -0400 Subject: USB Audio In-Reply-To: <200608092147.19931.mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200608091626.39899.mervc@eol.ca> <20060809212126.GU13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <200608092147.19931.mervc@eol.ca> Message-ID: <7DC9BEDA-88F2-4869-8943-31E2ED71D783@gmail.com> On 09-Aug-2006, at 21:47 :19, Merv Curley wrote: > > Arecord does see my device, the soundcard is listed as Card0 and > my device > as Card1. As far as I can tell ALSA is all about Soundcards. To use > arecord one uses alsamixer, but alsa mixer is about the soundcard > inputs and > outputs. I don't see any way of telling it about Card1 or my sound > driver as > a source. It's easy to tell alsamixer to use card1 instead of card0. Just invoke alsamixer with "alsamixer -c1". You can find the input with "arecord -l", and if, for example, your source is card 1, device1, pass arecord "-D hw:1,0" when you want to record. To play with defaults, take a look at your .asoundrc. -- Seneca Cunningham tentra-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From talexb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 10 15:20:08 2006 From: talexb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Alex Beamish) Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2006 11:20:08 -0400 Subject: OT: Bell Mobility spam (not SMS) from 416-780-8411 & 8483 & 8485 anyone? Message-ID: Hi folks, This is a little off-topic, but it's driving my wife insane. She's been getting a number of spam phone calls from the numbers in the subject line -- they're recordings for some kind of stupid offer. Once a month I could live with, but she got three while we were at a baseball game on Monday (go Jays!). I've filled in a form at bell.ca, but that's only because I don't have 45 minutes to spend on hold at Bell Mobility, and I'm clinging to the hope that this can actually be resolved over E-Mail. Has anyone on this list experienced the same problem with the same frequency? Did you ever hear back from your cell phone provider? Is the only alternative to start blocking numbers? My wife is staying with her Mother in Burlington while they tend for her Father, who is very ill in hospital. She's away from her boys, she's bunking in with her Mother, and some automated system keeps calling her damned cell phone. It's unnecessary stress, and really, really frustrating. Thanks, all. -- Alex Beamish Toronto, Ontario -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From tlug-neil-8agRmHhQ+n2CxnSzwYWP7Q at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 10 15:50:56 2006 From: tlug-neil-8agRmHhQ+n2CxnSzwYWP7Q at public.gmane.org (Neil Watson) Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2006 11:50:56 -0400 Subject: OT: Bell Mobility spam (not SMS) from 416-780-8411 & 8483 & 8485 anyone? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20060810155056.GA14715@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> Did you try a reverse look up on those numbers? Identifying the source might be useful. -- Neil Watson | Gentoo Linux System Administrator | Uptime 14 days http://watson-wilson.ca | 2.6.16.19 AMD Athlon(tm) MP 2000+ x 2 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From talexb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 10 16:00:34 2006 From: talexb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Alex Beamish) Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2006 12:00:34 -0400 Subject: OT: Bell Mobility spam (not SMS) from 416-780-8411 & 8483 & 8485 anyone? In-Reply-To: <20060810155056.GA14715-ajb9/b42oWj7qFZT6RBq9oSPOIov7LNK@public.gmane.org> References: <20060810155056.GA14715@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> Message-ID: On 8/10/06, Neil Watson wrote: > > Did you try a reverse look up on those numbers? Identifying the source > might be useful. Good idea -- all canada411.com tells me is that they're land lines in Toronto, ON. Yeah, thanks Brainiac, I think I had that figured out already. But it does mean I can complain to Bell Canada when Bell Mobility says "Nothing we can do!" And if those numbers are hooked up to systems that dial out, they'll ignore incoming calls. -- Alex Beamish Toronto, Ontario -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 10 16:20:24 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2006 12:20:24 -0400 Subject: USB Audio In-Reply-To: <200608091727.11470.mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200608091626.39899.mervc@eol.ca> <200608091727.11470.mervc@eol.ca> Message-ID: <20060810162024.GV13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 09, 2006 at 05:27:11PM -0400, Merv Curley wrote: > Just tried it on a newer system and dmesg added, > usbcore: registered new driver snd-usb-audio > > Now to find an application that can use this driver, I guess. Any alsa aware application can. Or anything through the alsa oss emulation. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 10 16:22:38 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2006 12:22:38 -0400 Subject: USB Audio In-Reply-To: <200608092147.19931.mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200608091626.39899.mervc@eol.ca> <20060809212126.GU13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <200608092147.19931.mervc@eol.ca> Message-ID: <20060810162238.GX13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 09, 2006 at 09:47:19PM -0400, Merv Curley wrote: > It looks like there aren't any Linux audio buffs in this city or I just > haven't caught their eyes. > > Arecord does see my device, the soundcard is listed as Card0 and my device > as Card1. As far as I can tell ALSA is all about Soundcards. To use > arecord one uses alsamixer, but alsa mixer is about the soundcard inputs and > outputs. I don't see any way of telling it about Card1 or my sound driver as > a source. > > The site linux-sound.org has a wealth of information but I just haven't found > anything that answers my problem. The answer may be somewhere in ALSA, I'll > keep looking. Sox and Audacity could also do what I want if I could only > tell them about this oddball audio source. > > Looks like I use Windows to get my L.P's and reel to reel tapes onto the > computer. Drat. alsamixer -c 1 (that is tell it to use card 1) arecord -l (list available devices) arecord -D Hope that helps. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 10 16:21:07 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2006 12:21:07 -0400 Subject: USB Audio In-Reply-To: <200608091910.38711.mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200608091626.39899.mervc@eol.ca> <20060809212126.GU13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <200608091910.38711.mervc@eol.ca> Message-ID: <20060810162107.GW13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 09, 2006 at 07:10:38PM -0400, Merv Curley wrote: > Ain't google great, told me in 2 sec's that arecord was a part of ALSA. I had > no idea, and since it isn't in a Debian repository I was thinking it was > going to be something hard to find. No to go read something about using it. alsa-utils package in debian should provide it. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mars20years-/E1597aS9LQAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 00:03:15 2006 From: mars20years-/E1597aS9LQAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Buzz Lightyear) Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2006 17:03:15 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Chinese character help needed Message-ID: <20060811000315.50132.qmail@web52914.mail.yahoo.com> Hello All I am running Kanotix Linux in English. My goal is to run it in English and in Chinese so I can 1) read Chinese characters on various web pages and 2) if possible, type in Chinese. How do I go about adding Chinese characters in Kanotix that will allow me to do this? Thanks. Mark __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 04:17:40 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 00:17:40 -0400 Subject: Chinese character help needed In-Reply-To: <20060811000315.50132.qmail-twPDCWrZ0p2A/QwVtaZbd3CJp6faPEW9@public.gmane.org> References: <20060811000315.50132.qmail@web52914.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <44DC04E4.6070106@utoronto.ca> Buzz Lightyear wrote: > Hello All > > I am running Kanotix Linux in English. My goal is to > run it in English and in Chinese so I can 1) read > Chinese characters on various web pages and 2) if > possible, type in Chinese. > > How do I go about adding Chinese characters in Kanotix > that will allow me to do this? For inputting in CJK you want the scim package and any language related packages. You should be able to set your locale using dpkg-reconfigure localeconf. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 00:22:29 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2006 20:22:29 -0400 Subject: OT: Bell Mobility spam (not SMS) from 416-780-8411 & 8483 & 8485 anyone? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <44DBCDC5.5030605@rogers.com> There was a talk of Canada putting in place a "do not solicit registry of phone numbers". I will ask around the megacity-toronto yahoogroup of anybody who knows about handling this matter. Bell canada/bell mobility will then have to ensure that those who do not want to be disturbed by spam callers actually do not get called or disturbed. Kush Alex Beamish wrote: > Hi folks, > > This is a little off-topic, but it's driving my wife insane. She's > been getting a number of spam phone calls from the numbers in the > subject line -- they're recordings for some kind of stupid offer. Once > a month I could live with, but she got three while we were at a > baseball game on Monday (go Jays!). > > I've filled in a form at bell.ca , but that's only > because I don't have 45 minutes to spend on hold at Bell Mobility, and > I'm clinging to the hope that this can actually be resolved over > E-Mail. Has anyone on this list experienced the same problem with the > same frequency? Did you ever hear back from your cell phone provider? > Is the only alternative to start blocking numbers? > > My wife is staying with her Mother in Burlington while they tend for > her Father, who is very ill in hospital. She's away from her boys, > she's bunking in with her Mother, and some automated system keeps > calling her damned cell phone. It's unnecessary stress, and really, > really frustrating. Thanks, all. > > -- > Alex Beamish > Toronto, Ontario -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 01:04:10 2006 From: tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Tim Writer) Date: 10 Aug 2006 21:04:10 -0400 Subject: C warning that I can't seem to track down In-Reply-To: References: <200608080930.08148.ican@netrover.com> <200608081211.38197.ican@netrover.com> Message-ID: Mel Wilson writes: > Mel Wilson wrote: > > bob wrote: > >> Still can't believe how obtuse the Linux headers have become since I last > >> looked in any detail. Maybe Google can tell me where socklen_t is > >> actually defined ... > > > :-/ > > > unistd.h:# ifndef __socklen_t_defined > > unistd.h:typedef __socklen_t socklen_t; > > unistd.h:# define __socklen_t_defined > > So there it is, in unistd.h > > > Now if we only knew what __socklen_t was, we'd be set. Obtuse? > > yeah, I sort of agree. > > Turns out __socklen_t is defined in /usr/include/bits/types.h > > It's hard to spot because it's defined by a __STD_TYPE statement > which is a #defined extension to typedef. It's a __U32_TYPE > which is a defined stand-in for unsigned int. > > Found this with a little Python thing that scrambles through > the directory tree finding strings in files. While this has triggered an interesting discussion about find, grep, and so on, other than mere curiosity, why do you need to know what a socklen_t is. The whole point of these types is so that you don't have to worry about platform dependencies. Just use socklen_t consistently throughout your code and minimize (or, better still, avoid) conversion to and from other integer types. -- tim writer starnix inc. 647.722.5301 toronto, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davec-zxk95TxsVYDyHADnj0MGvQC/G2K4zDHf at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 01:01:50 2006 From: davec-zxk95TxsVYDyHADnj0MGvQC/G2K4zDHf at public.gmane.org (Dave Cramer) Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2006 21:01:50 -0400 Subject: OT: Bell Mobility spam (not SMS) from 416-780-8411 & 8483 & 8485 anyone? In-Reply-To: <44DBCDC5.5030605-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44DBCDC5.5030605@rogers.com> Message-ID: <7010C548-3339-46B2-9733-C5995A9F6F7C@visibleassets.com> Yes, there was such a thing, almost every business who requested to be exempt was granted exemption. This turned into a list of people to call! --dc-- On 10-Aug-06, at 8:22 PM, Kush wrote: > There was a talk of Canada putting in place a "do not solicit > registry of phone numbers". I will ask around the megacity-toronto > yahoogroup of anybody who knows about handling this matter. Bell > canada/bell mobility will then have to ensure that those who do not > want to be disturbed by spam callers actually do not get called or > disturbed. > > Kush > > Alex Beamish wrote: >> Hi folks, >> >> This is a little off-topic, but it's driving my wife insane. She's >> been getting a number of spam phone calls from the numbers in the >> subject line -- they're recordings for some kind of stupid offer. >> Once a month I could live with, but she got three while we were at >> a baseball game on Monday (go Jays!). >> >> I've filled in a form at bell.ca, but that's only because I don't >> have 45 minutes to spend on hold at Bell Mobility, and I'm >> clinging to the hope that this can actually be resolved over E- >> Mail. Has anyone on this list experienced the same problem with >> the same frequency? Did you ever hear back from your cell phone >> provider? Is the only alternative to start blocking numbers? >> >> My wife is staying with her Mother in Burlington while they tend >> for her Father, who is very ill in hospital. She's away from her >> boys, she's bunking in with her Mother, and some automated system >> keeps calling her damned cell phone. It's unnecessary stress, and >> really, really frustrating. Thanks, all. >> >> -- >> Alex Beamish >> Toronto, Ontario > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From talexb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 01:30:18 2006 From: talexb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Alex Beamish) Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2006 21:30:18 -0400 Subject: OT: Bell Mobility spam (not SMS) from 416-780-8411 & 8483 & 8485 anyone? In-Reply-To: <44DBCDC5.5030605-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44DBCDC5.5030605@rogers.com> Message-ID: On 8/10/06, Kush wrote: > > There was a talk of Canada putting in place a "do not solicit registry of > phone numbers". I will ask around the megacity-toronto yahoogroup of anybody > who knows about handling this matter. Bell canada/bell mobility will then > have to ensure that those who do not want to be disturbed by spam callers > actually do not get called or disturbed. > That would be cool. I look forward to hearing the results of your query. Thanks. In the meantime, nothing yet from Bell Mobility. They have until 1115 Monday to respond, according to their service policy. -- Alex Beamish Toronto, Ontario -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 01:55:24 2006 From: mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Merv Curley) Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2006 21:55:24 -0400 Subject: USB Audio In-Reply-To: <7DC9BEDA-88F2-4869-8943-31E2ED71D783-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> References: <200608091626.39899.mervc@eol.ca> <200608092147.19931.mervc@eol.ca> <7DC9BEDA-88F2-4869-8943-31E2ED71D783@gmail.com> Message-ID: <200608102155.24761.mervc@eol.ca> On Thursday 10 August 2006 10:55, Seneca Cunningham wrote: > It's easy to tell alsamixer to use card1 instead of card0. Just > invoke alsamixer with "alsamixer -c1". You can find the input with > "arecord -l", and if, for example, your source is card 1, device1, > pass arecord "-D hw:1,0" when you want to record. To play with > defaults, take a look at your .asoundrc. Thanks to both of you for the help getting me started. I am now in the process of seeing if I can figure out just what this alsamixer does and how it does it. In umpteen years I've messed with once, I think and that was so easy I didn't have to know what I was doing. i assume that somehow I tell arecord where to put the recorded sound and a file name. I'll get to that eventually. When I am thoroughly confused, I'll post another plea. Cheers -- Merv Curley Toronto, Ont. Can Kanotix Linux Ver 2005-4 Desktop KDE 3.5.1 KMail 1.2 -c1 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From dgardiner-k8+l4Qd5hq73fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 12:37:28 2006 From: dgardiner-k8+l4Qd5hq73fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Daniel Gardiner) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 08:37:28 -0400 Subject: OT: Bell Mobility spam (not SMS) from 416-780-8411 & 8483 & 8485 anyone? In-Reply-To: References: <44DBCDC5.5030605@rogers.com> Message-ID: <44DC7A08.4040208@inofas.ca> Actually, there is a Canadian do-not-call list which is entirely voluntary (companies can decide whether or not they follow it) at https://cornerstonewebmedia.com/cma/submit.asp. This is not a legislated list, it is done by the Canadian Marketing Association (or somesuch),. There are regulations on telemarketing and soliciting and a person can request to be removed from a telemarketer's list, after which they are supposed to remain off the list for 3 years. In my experience this tends to work with most companies. The current telemarketing rules are at http://www.crtc.gc.ca/Eng/INFO_SHT/t1022.htm, discussions about a national do-not-call list are still ongoing and as was mentioned previously there are a lot of exceptions to it. Daniel Alex Beamish wrote: > On 8/10/06, *Kush* > wrote: > > There was a talk of Canada putting in place a "do not solicit > registry of phone numbers". I will ask around the megacity-toronto > yahoogroup of anybody who knows about handling this matter. Bell > canada/bell mobility will then have to ensure that those who do > not want to be disturbed by spam callers actually do not get > called or disturbed. > > > That would be cool. I look forward to hearing the results of your > query. Thanks. > > In the meantime, nothing yet from Bell Mobility. They have until 1115 > Monday to respond, according to their service policy. > > -- > Alex Beamish > Toronto, Ontario -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 13:22:50 2006 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 09:22:50 -0400 Subject: Log Suppression Message-ID: <44DC84AA.1030202@execulink.com> Hi, Is there anyway to eliminate oodles of these from appearing in /var/log/messages? Aug 11 08:30:01 localhost crond(pam_unix)[16278]: session opened for user root by (uid=0) Aug 11 08:30:01 localhost crond(pam_unix)[16278]: session closed for user root Aug 11 08:35:01 localhost crond(pam_unix)[16322]: session opened for user root by (uid=0) Aug 11 08:35:01 localhost crond(pam_unix)[16322]: session closed for user root I know the jobs being run from crond and appreciate the alerts but there are simply too many cluttering the log. I wish to add even more jobs to my crontab and this info will soon become ludicrous in the course of a week. Thanks, greg -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 13:04:29 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 09:04:29 -0400 Subject: open source pdf writer Message-ID: <44DC805D.5060401@rogers.com> Does anybody know of any pdf writer which can edit pdf files like adobe distiller does? I have seen many pdf readers --xpdf, kpdf, evince, adobe reader etc and have come across the pdfcreator.sourceforge.net for simple pdf creation using the ghostscript system (ps2pdf) but haven't come across a full blooded pdf editor yet. Kush -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 13:20:58 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 09:20:58 -0400 Subject: open source pdf writer In-Reply-To: <44DC805D.5060401-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44DC805D.5060401@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20060811132058.GZ13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Aug 11, 2006 at 09:04:29AM -0400, Kush wrote: > Does anybody know of any pdf writer which can edit pdf files like adobe > distiller does? > > I have seen many pdf readers --xpdf, kpdf, evince, adobe reader etc and > have come across the pdfcreator.sourceforge.net for simple pdf creation > using the ghostscript system (ps2pdf) but haven't come across a full > blooded pdf editor yet. PDF, like postscript and iso9660, is designed to be readable fairly efficiently, and is designed to be possible to create all at once. They are NOT designed to be edited, short of reading it all and writing it all back from scratch. Adobe's distiller is a very complex program, and I would not expect any competition to it anytime soon. Most people are quite happy as long as they can read, print, and create PDFs. Editing means go back and edit the original source document and regenerate the PDF from that. It was never meant to be editable. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From kru_tch-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 13:34:47 2006 From: kru_tch-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (Stephen Allen) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 09:34:47 -0400 Subject: open source pdf writer In-Reply-To: <20060811132058.GZ13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <44DC805D.5060401@rogers.com> <20060811132058.GZ13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <44DC8777.5020703@yahoo.ca> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Fri, Aug 11, 2006 at 09:04:29AM -0400, Kush wrote: >> Does anybody know of any pdf writer which can edit pdf files like adobe >> distiller does? >> >> I have seen many pdf readers --xpdf, kpdf, evince, adobe reader etc and >> have come across the pdfcreator.sourceforge.net for simple pdf creation >> using the ghostscript system (ps2pdf) but haven't come across a full >> blooded pdf editor yet. > > PDF, like postscript and iso9660, is designed to be readable fairly > efficiently, and is designed to be possible to create all at once. They > are NOT designed to be edited, short of reading it all and writing it > all back from scratch. > > Adobe's distiller is a very complex program, and I would not expect any > competition to it anytime soon. Most people are quite happy as long as > they can read, print, and create PDFs. Editing means go back and edit > the original source document and regenerate the PDF from that. It was > never meant to be editable. Lennart is absolutely correct. Even Adobe's Acrobat, can't edit complex changes or many changes well if at all. PDF is a final document format, and as such one is expected to use the original application for major formatting changes. The exception is the use of forms within Acrobat. At this point in time I'm not aware of any OpenSource PDF form editor, but there are third party commercial applications that can do PDF form generation. PlanetPDF is a good place for all things PDF. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From dgardiner-k8+l4Qd5hq73fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 13:40:06 2006 From: dgardiner-k8+l4Qd5hq73fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Daniel Gardiner) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 09:40:06 -0400 Subject: open source pdf writer In-Reply-To: <44DC805D.5060401-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44DC805D.5060401@rogers.com> Message-ID: <44DC88B6.5090306@inofas.ca> Depending on what you want to do the perl module PDF::Reuse may be enough (and if you use perl). It's not interactive, but you can add text, pages, graphics, endorse the pages, etc. Daniel Kush wrote: > Does anybody know of any pdf writer which can edit pdf files like > adobe distiller does? > > I have seen many pdf readers --xpdf, kpdf, evince, adobe reader etc > and have come across the pdfcreator.sourceforge.net for simple pdf > creation using the ghostscript system (ps2pdf) but haven't come > across a full blooded pdf editor yet. > > Kush > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From talexb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 13:53:47 2006 From: talexb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Alex Beamish) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 09:53:47 -0400 Subject: OT: Bell Mobility spam (not SMS) from 416-780-8411 & 8483 & 8485 anyone? In-Reply-To: <44DC7A08.4040208-k8+l4Qd5hq73fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> References: <44DBCDC5.5030605@rogers.com> <44DC7A08.4040208@inofas.ca> Message-ID: On 8/11/06, Daniel Gardiner wrote: > > Actually, there is a Canadian do-not-call list which is entirely > voluntary (companies can decide whether or not they follow it) at > https://cornerstonewebmedia.com/cma/submit.asp. This is not a > legislated list, it is done by the Canadian Marketing Association (or > somesuch),. There are regulations on telemarketing and soliciting and a > person can request to be removed from a telemarketer's list, after which > they are supposed to remain off the list for 3 years. In my experience > this tends to work with most companies. The current telemarketing rules > are at http://www.crtc.gc.ca/Eng/INFO_SHT/t1022.htm, discussions about a > national do-not-call list are still ongoing and as was mentioned > previously there are a lot of exceptions to it. Daniel, Thanks for this -- I have filled it out with my wife's cell phone number and I will bookmark it for sure. Cheers, Alex -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 17:56:14 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 13:56:14 -0400 Subject: OT: Bell Mobility spam (not SMS) from 416-780-8411 & 8483 & 8485 anyone? In-Reply-To: <44DC7A08.4040208-k8+l4Qd5hq73fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> References: <44DBCDC5.5030605@rogers.com> <44DC7A08.4040208@inofas.ca> Message-ID: <44DCC4BE.9070403@utoronto.ca> Daniel Gardiner wrote: > Actually, there is a Canadian do-not-call list which is entirely > voluntary (companies can decide whether or not they follow it) at > https://cornerstonewebmedia.com/cma/submit.asp. This is not a > legislated list, it is done by the Canadian Marketing Association (or > somesuch),. There are regulations on telemarketing and soliciting and a > person can request to be removed from a telemarketer's list, after which > they are supposed to remain off the list for 3 years. In my experience > this tends to work with most companies. The current telemarketing rules > are at http://www.crtc.gc.ca/Eng/INFO_SHT/t1022.htm, discussions about a > national do-not-call list are still ongoing and as was mentioned > previously there are a lot of exceptions to it. I've been on that do-not-call list for a few years and it does work--after 6 weeks that is. YMMV. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 14:17:08 2006 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 10:17:08 -0400 Subject: Log Suppression In-Reply-To: <44DC84AA.1030202-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ@public.gmane.org> References: <44DC84AA.1030202@execulink.com> Message-ID: <44DC9164.2010001@georgetown.wehave.net> Gregory D Hough wrote: > Is there anyway to eliminate oodles of these from appearing in > /var/log/messages? > > Aug 11 08:30:01 localhost crond(pam_unix)[16278]: session opened for > user root by (uid=0) You need to modify /etc/syslog.conf, probably you are logging all cron messages (cron.*). You could change that so that you're not logging all messages (you probably want at least cron.warn and cron.crit). Look at syslogd man page - and other related manpages. -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 15:42:08 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 11:42:08 -0400 Subject: open source pdf writer In-Reply-To: <44DC805D.5060401-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44DC805D.5060401@rogers.com> Message-ID: <44DCA550.4080709@rogers.com> Thank you guys for the answers to this question, specially appreciate the quickness of the responses. Wasn't expecting so soon! We look to be a fairly big group now --anybody have any idea how big we are. It would help to know on the tlug site how the mailing list is growing. Kush Kush wrote: > Does anybody know of any pdf writer which can edit pdf files like > adobe distiller does? > > I have seen many pdf readers --xpdf, kpdf, evince, adobe reader etc > and have come across the pdfcreator.sourceforge.net for simple pdf > creation using the ghostscript system (ps2pdf) but haven't come > across a full blooded pdf editor yet. > > Kush > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ican-rZHaEmXdJNJWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 15:58:30 2006 From: ican-rZHaEmXdJNJWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (bob) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 11:58:30 -0400 Subject: SIMPL project needs some Python upgrade help Message-ID: <200608111158.30649.ican@netrover.com> I recently upgraded my box to one where the preinstalled Python version is 2.3. I am also the facilitator for the SIMPL open source project (http://sourceforge.net/projects/simpl) and I noticed that the Python-SIMPL extension which was built for Python v1.5 is now broken in my build. Can no longer find "Python.h" amongst other things. The original author for this Python-SIMPL is not available, and my knowledge of this aspect of Python is sparce. Any help getting this build repaired would be appreciated. Thanks. bob -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 16:06:21 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 12:06:21 -0400 Subject: SIMPL project needs some Python upgrade help In-Reply-To: <200608111158.30649.ican-rZHaEmXdJNJWk0Htik3J/w@public.gmane.org> References: <200608111158.30649.ican@netrover.com> Message-ID: <20060811160621.GA13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Aug 11, 2006 at 11:58:30AM -0400, bob wrote: > I recently upgraded my box to one where the preinstalled Python version is > 2.3. > > I am also the facilitator for the SIMPL open source project > (http://sourceforge.net/projects/simpl) and I noticed that the Python-SIMPL > extension which was built for Python v1.5 is now broken in my build. Can > no longer find "Python.h" amongst other things. > > The original author for this Python-SIMPL is not available, and my knowledge > of this aspect of Python is sparce. > > Any help getting this build repaired would be appreciated. Well I know python 1.x and 2.x are somewhat different. I would have thought if there were any problems with it, that the current versions would have fixed that given they seem to have had a release only a few months ago. Now as for Python.h, well on debian at least that exists in the packages: python2.3-dev python2.4-dev python2.5-dev So install the one that matches your python version, and then you should be able to compile python extensions. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rickl-ZACYGPecefkm4kRHVhTciCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 16:08:42 2006 From: rickl-ZACYGPecefkm4kRHVhTciCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Rick Tomaschuk) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 12:08:42 -0400 Subject: OT: Bell Mobility spam (not SMS) from 416-780-8411 & 8483 & 8485 anyone? In-Reply-To: References: <44DBCDC5.5030605@rogers.com> <44DC7A08.4040208@inofas.ca> Message-ID: <1155312522.23058.2.camel@spot1.localhost.com> You can also call Bell directly and ask to be put on the 'do not call' list. When a telemarketer calls/spams tell them you are on the do not call list and ask them why they are calling/spamming you when you are clearly on the list. RickT "Tired of working for some one else? Start your own business." http://www.TorontoNUI.ca On Fri, 2006-08-11 at 09:53 -0400, Alex Beamish wrote: > On 8/11/06, Daniel Gardiner wrote: > Actually, there is a Canadian do-not-call list which is > entirely > voluntary (companies can decide whether or not they follow it) > at > https://cornerstonewebmedia.com/cma/submit.asp. This is not a > legislated list, it is done by the Canadian Marketing > Association (or > somesuch),. There are regulations on telemarketing and > soliciting and a > person can request to be removed from a telemarketer's list, > after which > they are supposed to remain off the list for 3 years. In my > experience > this tends to work with most companies. The current > telemarketing rules > are at http://www.crtc.gc.ca/Eng/INFO_SHT/t1022.htm, > discussions about a > national do-not-call list are still ongoing and as was > mentioned > previously there are a lot of exceptions to it. > > Daniel, > > Thanks for this -- I have filled it out with my wife's cell phone > number and I will bookmark it for sure. > > Cheers, > Alex > > -- http://www.TorontoNUI.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rickl-ZACYGPecefkm4kRHVhTciCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 16:29:27 2006 From: rickl-ZACYGPecefkm4kRHVhTciCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Rick Tomaschuk) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 12:29:27 -0400 Subject: Software Freedom day In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1155313767.26561.5.camel@spot1.localhost.com> Also check out http://video.google.com/videoplay? docid=752164569558662424&q=label%3Aalex+jones particularly "America Destroyed By Design" if you are wondering why you can't get work. Large mega corporations (we know who... Microsoft, Walmart, Cosco (not Costco), ...) are so into globalization that if you want to start a small business at home (Canada/Toronto) you have a tall order on your hands. Starting a small business is possible but a lot tougher than it used to be. Get educated on entrepreneurial skills and allow your Linux skills to pay your bills. Stop relying on your employer to choose Linux! RickT http://www.TorontoNUI.ca On Wed, 2006-08-09 at 17:41 -0400, Robert Brockway wrote: > Are we planning to do anything for the day? > > http://softwarefreedomday.org/ > > I'm way too overloaded to even contemplate organising anything but I'd be > interested in helping out at a stall or event. > > Rob > -- http://www.TorontoNUI.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 17:02:29 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 13:02:29 -0400 Subject: open source pdf writer In-Reply-To: <44DC805D.5060401-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44DC805D.5060401@rogers.com> Message-ID: <44DCB825.2080906@telly.org> Kush wrote: > Does anybody know of any pdf writer which can edit pdf files like > adobe distiller does? > > I have seen many pdf readers --xpdf, kpdf, evince, adobe reader etc > and have come across the pdfcreator.sourceforge.net for simple pdf > creation using the ghostscript system (ps2pdf) but haven't come > across a full blooded pdf editor yet. I'm surprised that nobody yet has mentioned OpenOffice.org. One of the main features that distinguishes OOo from the Microsoft suite is its seamless PDF creation capability. (In fact, MS is having problems incorporating PDF features -- even as a free download -- because Adobe wants a piece of it.) Having said that, the PDF capability is export-only -- while you can create a very elaborate PDF document using OOo, it can't read an existing PDF doc for editing. Searching "PDF" at Freshmeat offers some possibilities, including - "PoDoFo": http://podofo.sourceforge.net/ - pdfsam: http://pdfsam.sourceforge.net/ - Multivalent Document Tools: http://multivalent.sourceforge.net/Tools/ Of course, there are the tools included with the "Xpdf" package that comes with most Linux distributions, it includes tools that can write PDFs as PostScript or PBM bitmaps, or extracts text and images from PDF docs. And lastly, PDFTOHTML, the purpose of which I hope is self-evident: http://pdftohtml.sourceforge.net/ Hope this helps. - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 19:15:59 2006 From: amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org (Alex Maynard) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 15:15:59 -0400 Subject: open source pdf writer In-Reply-To: <44DCB825.2080906-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg@public.gmane.org> References: <44DCB825.2080906@telly.org> Message-ID: Not sure if pdftk was mentioned already: (see http://www.accesspdf.com/article.php/20041129175231241) I think it is command line only but merges, splices, etc. existing pdf files. Alex On Fri, 11 Aug 2006, Evan Leibovitch wrote: > Kush wrote: > > > Does anybody know of any pdf writer which can edit pdf files like > > adobe distiller does? > > > > I have seen many pdf readers --xpdf, kpdf, evince, adobe reader etc > > and have come across the pdfcreator.sourceforge.net for simple pdf > > creation using the ghostscript system (ps2pdf) but haven't come > > across a full blooded pdf editor yet. > > > I'm surprised that nobody yet has mentioned OpenOffice.org. > > One of the main features that distinguishes OOo from the Microsoft suite > is its seamless PDF creation capability. (In fact, MS is having problems > incorporating PDF features -- even as a free download -- because Adobe > wants a piece of it.) > > Having said that, the PDF capability is export-only -- while you can > create a very elaborate PDF document using OOo, it can't read an > existing PDF doc for editing. > > Searching "PDF" at Freshmeat offers some possibilities, including > - "PoDoFo": http://podofo.sourceforge.net/ > - pdfsam: http://pdfsam.sourceforge.net/ > - Multivalent Document Tools: http://multivalent.sourceforge.net/Tools/ > > Of course, there are the tools included with the "Xpdf" package that > comes with most Linux distributions, it includes tools that can write > PDFs as PostScript or PBM bitmaps, or extracts text and images from PDF > docs. > > And lastly, PDFTOHTML, the purpose of which I hope is self-evident: > http://pdftohtml.sourceforge.net/ > > Hope this helps. > > - Evan > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 20:41:14 2006 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy Ali) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 15:41:14 -0500 Subject: Online store ecommerce In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1e55af990608111341o47205856u11d8546e376db527@mail.gmail.com> On 8/9/06, lfeder wrote: > I was looking to put together an online store. > I found oscommerce.com > > I was wondering if anyone else had setup an online store with ecommerce. I have a client who has an old web store which uses oscommerce, and i have nothing but bad things to say about it. Perhaps it has improved in recent days.. but its old stuff certainly did stink. I've been using x-cart for all projects.. it's "ok" but I'll look through some of the suggestions I've seen so far. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 20:49:48 2006 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy Ali) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 15:49:48 -0500 Subject: open source pdf writer In-Reply-To: <44DCA550.4080709-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44DC805D.5060401@rogers.com> <44DCA550.4080709@rogers.com> Message-ID: <1e55af990608111349j3cf020ebl81947cdf9e02e1f0@mail.gmail.com> On 8/11/06, Kush wrote: > We look to be a fairly big group now --anybody have any idea how big we > are. It would help to know on the tlug site how the mailing list is growing. The last count I heard, a year ago, was several hundred subscribers.. There are a LOT of lurkers. =) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From scott-VK/PCEBaDz+N9aS15agKxg at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 20:58:45 2006 From: scott-VK/PCEBaDz+N9aS15agKxg at public.gmane.org (Scott C. Ripley) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 15:58:45 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Online store ecommerce In-Reply-To: <1e55af990608111341o47205856u11d8546e376db527-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <1e55af990608111341o47205856u11d8546e376db527@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: hey Sy, - oscommerce has a half decent interface / fair number of features - you can be up and running quickly (selling actual products/downloads/etc.) - it has an active community with a large number of community contributions (customizations) - things can become a pain when you are mixing/matching mods/patches/etc. Scott On Fri, 11 Aug 2006, Sy Ali wrote: > On 8/9/06, lfeder wrote: >> I was looking to put together an online store. >> I found oscommerce.com >> >> I was wondering if anyone else had setup an online store with ecommerce. > > I have a client who has an old web store which uses oscommerce, and i > have nothing but bad things to say about it. Perhaps it has improved > in recent days.. but its old stuff certainly did stink. > > I've been using x-cart for all projects.. it's "ok" but I'll look > through some of the suggestions I've seen so far. > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- Scott C. Ripley phone: (416)738-6357 www: http://www.scottripley.com email: scott-VK/PCEBaDz+N9aS15agKxg at public.gmane.org Secure Your E-Mail! http://www.mysecuremail.com/javascrypt/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 22:23:43 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 18:23:43 -0400 Subject: open source pdf writer In-Reply-To: <1e55af990608111349j3cf020ebl81947cdf9e02e1f0-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <44DC805D.5060401@rogers.com> <44DCA550.4080709@rogers.com> <1e55af990608111349j3cf020ebl81947cdf9e02e1f0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <44DD036F.4040107@rogers.com> Sy Ali wrote: > There are a LOT of lurkers. =) Its a great learning place. i love it !! The only thing is we need to tomtom the size more since the media and companies like bell/rogers etc like to tomtom costly softwares and that limits the perception of those who have never heard of linux. School teachers, recruiters, office staff etc have never heard of linux and its quite a barrier in promoting linux/open source software as an alternative vocation/career field. Kush -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 11 23:41:49 2006 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 19:41:49 -0400 Subject: Log Suppression In-Reply-To: <44DC9164.2010001-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <44DC84AA.1030202@execulink.com> <44DC9164.2010001@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: <44DD15BD.80204@execulink.com> Fraser Campbell wrote: > Gregory D Hough wrote: > >> Is there anyway to eliminate oodles of these from appearing in >> /var/log/messages? >> >> Aug 11 08:30:01 localhost crond(pam_unix)[16278]: session opened for >> user root by (uid=0) > > > You need to modify /etc/syslog.conf, probably you are logging all cron > messages (cron.*). You could change that so that you're not logging all > messages (you probably want at least cron.warn and cron.crit). > > Look at syslogd man page - and other related manpages. > Thanks for pointing me in the right direction (man syslog.conf). The selector (cron.*) only affects the /var/log/cron action. To prevent all those particular (pam_unix) entries from being logged, I had to add the selector (auth.!info) to the /var/log/messages action in /etc/syslog.conf and then kill SIGHUP `cat /var/run/syslogd.pid`. greg -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 12 00:38:44 2006 From: meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org (Meng Cheah) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 20:38:44 -0400 Subject: OT: Official warning on Windows bugs Message-ID: <44DD2314.8070305@pppoe.ca> "*The US Department of Homeland Security has urged Windows users to install the latest patches from Microsoft as quickly as possible." More at: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/4782811.stm * -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 12 00:47:48 2006 From: meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org (Meng Cheah) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 20:47:48 -0400 Subject: OT: Dell sued over 'false' ads claims Message-ID: <44DD2534.80303@pppoe.ca> *Dell, the world's largest computer maker, is facing legal action in China over allegations of false advertising.* The group has been sued over charges its laptops contained a different, cheaper chip than those advertised. According to state media reports at least 20 lawsuits have been filed against the Texas-based firm. In a statement on its Direct2Dell website, Dell admitted it had made an "unfortunate and unintended marketing mistake" and apologised for the error. Dell said had contacted customers and explained the difference between the two chips and offered full refunds to any customers who were still unsatisfied. *Update delays* Spokeswoman Sharon Zhang said the error took place after the firm began to switch the chips used in certain laptop models, but sales brochures and order forms were not updated in time. The problems centre on Dell's Inspiron 640M laptop, according to marketing materials the model was fitted with Intel's T2300 chip which allows a computer to run multiple software applications at the same time. However, in China, and some other countries Dell instead fitted the laptops with the T2300E chip which did not support this function. The chip also costs $32 less than the T2300. A report in the China Daily newspaper said the first case accusing Dell of false advertising had been filed in Shanghai on 26 July, and a further 19 were filed on 8 August in Xiamen. The court action could hinder Dell's attempts to lure customers away from rival Lenovo, the market leader in China. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/4785641.stm -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From glayng-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 12 01:50:30 2006 From: glayng-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Gary Layng) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 21:50:30 -0400 Subject: Sympatico + Norton + OFT In-Reply-To: <20060809132558.GP13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <44D4AAFB.4030206@rogers.com> <44D95BA8.7000601@pppoe.ca> <20060809132558.GP13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <200608112150.30848.glayng@sympatico.ca> On August 9, 2006 09:25, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > (snip) Windows really needs to have > firewalls that don't require user interaction to work. (snip) > -- I find the best firewall for most Windows users is "unplugged modem". That software is free. ^_^ -- there's no place like 127.0.0.1 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 12 02:39:09 2006 From: hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (D. Hugh Redelmeier) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 22:39:09 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Dual core Intel... how hot? In-Reply-To: <20060808163925.GJ13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20060802144557.GA17952@wp.magstar.net> <20060802174625.GX13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060802184814.GA18495@wp.magstar.net> <20060804125351.GY13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060808163925.GJ13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: | From: Lennart Sorensen | > | 62W for 90nm Athlon 64 (new revision with virtualization support) | > | > I didn't realize that this was out already. | | It has been for quite a while actually. Probably the last year or so. Sorry, what I meant was "I didn't realize that Pacifica was out yet." That certainly hasn't been out for a year or so. I'm looking forward to playing with virtualization on my next machine, but have no plans to get one yet. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 12 03:31:13 2006 From: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 23:31:13 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Accessing serial-usb ports Message-ID: <50519.207.188.65.151.1155353473.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> USB ports are complex to access in software so people have developed hardware and software to access USB ports as serial ports. These serial port devices have names like /dev/ttyUSB0 and conveniently the drivers are built into the kernel since 2.4. We used this extensively in our Tcl software that drives our scope and signal generator. The software simply treats these ports as serial ports, which Tcl can access. (At the other end of the cable there is a hardware integrated circuit that reconverts the USB protocol into asynchronous serial data. So the whole USB protocol can be ignored.) A Linux serial-usb port is created when you plug in a USB device, and disappears when you unplug the device. Unfortunately, the port is created as owned by root and the read and wite permissions are disabled for ordinary users. Consequently, if you operate in user mode you have to become root and change these permissions every time a device is plugged and unplugged, or when you reboot. This gets old fast, so we need a better solution than manual intervention. In my Suse Linux, a long-listing shows that the 'uucp' group has access to the device. I'm therefore proposing that users of this software simply add themselves as members of the uucp group. This seems to work fine, but I wonder if there are other unpleasant side-effects that might result. I would welcome some comments on this approach - does it create security holes, for example? And pointers to alternative approaches would be welcome. Peter -- Peter Hiscocks Syscomp Electronic Design Limited, Toronto http://www.syscompdesign.com USB Oscilloscope and Waveform Generator 647-839-0325 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 12 03:44:58 2006 From: hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (D. Hugh Redelmeier) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 23:44:58 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [GW-C] Re:Tom's HW Guide: Linux for gaming In-Reply-To: <44DA2D20.1080107-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <44BAF994.8080401@telly.org> <44DA2D20.1080107@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: | From: Fraser Campbell | Tim Writer wrote: | > ATI is working very hard to improve their Linux support. They release a | > driver every month so improvements come quickly. I'm glad to hear that. ATI lost me as a customer after a few too many disappointments. I was biased towards the home-town team. Some things that I think I know: - the fastest 3d card with open source drivers, of any brand, is the ATI Radeon 9250. Get them before they die of old age. - In January, I needed a video card that supported Dual Link DVI. At that time, reasonably-priced ATI x1000 family cards (like the x1300) would not work in Linux with an open source driver. Not even as a 2d card. (Well, the VESA driver could do it, but only at resolutions wired into the cards BIOS extension, and those did not include the resolutions I needed.) At the time, 6 months after the product was released, ATI had not disclosed enough about the new fiddly bits for 2d output to enable the open-source Radeon driver to support these cards. - at that time, the ATI web site claimed that the proprietary X drivers supported any card newer than the 9600 (I think that was the number). Pre-sales support repeated this misinformation. I bought nice fanless x1300 card and discovered the mistake. Was the site corrected when I reported this? No. - the open source drivers for nVidia cards are limited to 2d. - I bought a very expensive nVidia card in January because it was the only reasonable choice for a Dual Link DVI card. Even though most of the $450 went into 3d stuff I cannot use. | From: Fraser Campbell | One of the presentations at OLS was titled "Open Source Graphics Drivers - | They Don't Kill Kittens". I didn't attend but others that did thought it was | a good presentation. I went. It was an excellent talk. (Thanks, Fraser, for the ride to OLS and back.) | The author has | prepared an open-source driver for ATI R500 chipsets but has been waiting on | ATI's approval to release it (for more than 6 month). He is asking for approval because an NDA is involved. He does claim that nothing scary is revealed in the code. Maybe somebody inside ATI could champion this (you know who you are). Many of us would be willing to help. | According to the paper I mentioned the support from both ATI and nVidia for | free drivers is severely lacking (non-existent). A decade ago I tried to talk to some ATI engineers that I had met, but there no interest. Intel is the best player, as far as revealing graphics chip details. They have released open-source drivers and are maintaining them. The most recent message from them was written by Keith Packard (one of the key X folks). If he is working for them, that is an even better sign. Apparently most computers use Intel graphics chips. But they are low-end. (Intel is also good about 802.11g drivers. This is why the last notebook I ordered was Intel end-to-end, even though I've been pretty solidly AMD on my desktop for the last couple of generations. My AMD-based notebook has been an unending source of adventures, none of them due to AMD itself.) | Perhaps the AMD/ATI merger will help as well once new products start coming | online. If ATI takes on the Intel attitude towards open source, things would be great. 3d looks to be becoming more important due to the Red Hat and SuSE projects (one each) to base the desktop on top of OpenGL. Scary. (ATI made the chipset in my desktop. It took a few months before the kernel folks reverse engineered enough of the quirks. Again, no help from ATI, as far as I could tell (I'm not an insider). There still are a few issues.) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 12 13:29:47 2006 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 09:29:47 -0400 Subject: OT: Official warning on Windows bugs In-Reply-To: <44DD2314.8070305-D1t3LT1mScs@public.gmane.org> References: <44DD2314.8070305@pppoe.ca> Message-ID: <44DDD7CB.20008@georgetown.wehave.net> Meng Cheah wrote: > "*The US Department of Homeland Security has urged Windows users to > install the latest patches from Microsoft as quickly as possible." > > More at: > http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/4782811.stm > * Oh no, wonder if this raises their threat level??? -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rob-3Aypa9sX/B7wvR0lvYjcXw at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 12 13:40:22 2006 From: rob-3Aypa9sX/B7wvR0lvYjcXw at public.gmane.org (Rob Sutherland) Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 09:40:22 -0400 Subject: Online store ecommerce In-Reply-To: References: <1e55af990608111341o47205856u11d8546e376db527@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200608120940.23002.rob@luckdancing.com> On Friday 11 August 2006 16:58, Scott C. Ripley wrote: > hey Sy, > > - oscommerce has a half decent interface / fair number of features > - you can be up and running quickly (selling actual > products/downloads/etc.) - it has an active community with a large number > of community contributions (customizations) - things can become a pain when > you are mixing/matching mods/patches/etc. > I did a comparision between OsCommerce and Zencart last year and basically, if you want something that will work out of the box Zencart is the way to go. However, if you need to do anything like hook your shopping cart up to SugarCRM or do SEO tricks or something, OsCommerce is the way to go because there's so much going on in the community. OTOH, OsCommerce is such a mess under the hood that you'd better know what you're doing. Even if you know how to use version management and diff/patch etc. it's a major pain. The trick with OsCommerce is not to use the vanilla release version, get one of the variations with a theme manager and the most useful contributions already installed. But, for sure, look at Zencart (or something else) first and only if it won't do what you need, look at OsCommerce. Rob -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 12 14:28:25 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 10:28:25 -0400 Subject: Online store ecommerce In-Reply-To: <200608120940.23002.rob-3Aypa9sX/B7wvR0lvYjcXw@public.gmane.org> References: <1e55af990608111341o47205856u11d8546e376db527@mail.gmail.com> <200608120940.23002.rob@luckdancing.com> Message-ID: <44DDE589.5070307@telly.org> Rob Sutherland wrote: >I did a comparision between OsCommerce and Zencart last year and basically, >if you want something that will work out of the box Zencart is the way to go. >However, if you need to do anything like hook your shopping cart up to >SugarCRM or do SEO tricks or something, OsCommerce is the way to go because >there's so much going on in the community. OTOH, OsCommerce is such a mess >under the hood that you'd better know what you're doing. Even if you know how >to use version management and diff/patch etc. it's a major pain. > > A good compromise is the ecommerce module of Drupal. Like OsCommerce, it's part of a widely used CMS system with a huge community, a lot of extensions, and the availability of a powerful CRM. Unlike OsCommerce, its code is clean enough that others in the community are doing contributed modules for it without needing to fork. http://drupal.org/project/ecommerce The downside is that, while it installs cleanly, Drupal's ecommerce can be a bit of a challenge to configure and its default look-and-feel could be much better. However, it is in active development -- some important features, such as product attributes, are relatively new. Drupal's ecommerce is running on the CLUE site and operating quite well. - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rickl-ZACYGPecefkm4kRHVhTciCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 12 15:54:32 2006 From: rickl-ZACYGPecefkm4kRHVhTciCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Rick Tomaschuk) Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 11:54:32 -0400 Subject: OT: Official warning on Windows bugs In-Reply-To: <44DD2314.8070305-D1t3LT1mScs@public.gmane.org> References: <44DD2314.8070305@pppoe.ca> Message-ID: <1155398072.26561.11.camel@spot1.localhost.com> Your C# code may mix with your Perl resulting in a catastrophic computer meltdown resulting in spontaneous combustion of your processor and motherboard which could produce a toxic gas which will be exhausted through the power supply fan into the work environment. ;) RickT http://www.TorontoNUI.ca On Fri, 2006-08-11 at 20:38 -0400, Meng Cheah wrote: > "*The US Department of Homeland Security has urged Windows users to > install the latest patches from Microsoft as quickly as possible." > > More at: > http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/4782811.stm > * > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- http://www.TorontoNUI.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 12 16:08:20 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 12:08:20 -0400 Subject: Software Freedom day In-Reply-To: <1155313767.26561.5.camel-GVHZqC5MSyVSXSDylEipykEOCMrvLtNR@public.gmane.org> References: <1155313767.26561.5.camel@spot1.localhost.com> Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608120908l482cf661iee4aac9ece437b6b@mail.gmail.com> On 8/11/06, Rick Tomaschuk wrote: [...]Stop relying on your employer to choose Linux! If you don't go down the entreprenurial path though, remember to get promoted. That way you can take your skills and knowledge deeper into the almighty Org Chart. -- Scott Elcomb http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ http://search.cpan.org/~selcomb/SAL-3.03/ http://psema4.googlepages.com/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 12 16:37:26 2006 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 12:37:26 -0400 Subject: ipt_recent Time Format Message-ID: <44DE03C6.4060307@execulink.com> Tluggers, Is anyone familiar with NetFilter's timestamps? This is what they typically look like: [root at localhost ~]# cat /proc/net/ipt_recent/ZW | grep '69\.63\.21\.188' src=69.63.21.188 ttl: 32 last_seen: 2484808297 oldest_pkt: 1 last_pkts: 2484808297 And from the log I know the time it was last_seen three days ago: [root at localhost ~]# grep SYNYSTR-RESET /var/log/messages | grep '69\.63\.21\.188' Aug 9 00:24:18 localhost kernel: SYNYSTR-RESET: IN=eth1 OUT= SRC=69.63.21.188 DST=192.168.1.251 LEN=64 TOS=0x00 PREC=0x00 TTL=32 ID=19088 DF PROTO=TCP SPT=2930 DPT=445 WINDOW=53760 RES=0x00 SYN URGP=0 "Aug 9 00:24:18" && 2484808297 are true somehow I'm primarily interested in last_seen. I need a clean-up script which removes an IP's record after a certain period of inactivity and I don't know how to work with that value. Naturally if I can get the current time in the correct format I can work with that value. I suspect it is microseconds since the module was (re)loaded. How do I use date or time or whatever to read in the current value of NOW in this format? Thanks, greg -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 12 02:33:15 2006 From: hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Howard Gibson) Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 22:33:15 -0400 Subject: open source pdf writer In-Reply-To: <44DC805D.5060401-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44DC805D.5060401@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20060811223315.6add2f24.hgibson@eol.ca> On Fri, 11 Aug 2006 09:04:29 -0400 Kush wrote: > Does anybody know of any pdf writer which can edit pdf files like adobe > distiller does? > > I have seen many pdf readers --xpdf, kpdf, evince, adobe reader etc and > have come across the pdfcreator.sourceforge.net for simple pdf creation > using the ghostscript system (ps2pdf) but haven't come across a full > blooded pdf editor yet. > > Kush Kush, Do you want to modify existing PDF files or create new ones? If you want to do new ones and you know LaTeX, use pdflatex. When you use the hyperref package, your PDF file gets a navigatable table of contents. Also, you can use latex2html to create a web page as an alternate to your PDF. -- Howard Gibson hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org howardg-PadmjKOQAFn3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org http://home.eol.ca/~hgibson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 12 20:08:35 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 16:08:35 -0400 Subject: OT: Official warning on Windows bugs In-Reply-To: <1155398072.26561.11.camel-GVHZqC5MSyVSXSDylEipykEOCMrvLtNR@public.gmane.org> References: <44DD2314.8070305@pppoe.ca> <1155398072.26561.11.camel@spot1.localhost.com> Message-ID: <44DE3543.3050906@utoronto.ca> Rick Tomaschuk wrote: > Your C# code may mix with your Perl resulting in a catastrophic computer > meltdown resulting in spontaneous combustion of your processor and > motherboard which could produce a toxic gas which will be exhausted > through the power supply fan into the work environment. ;) The terrorists need an intercontinental grid computing system so as to spawn an artificial intelligence that will take over the world. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 12 18:13:52 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 14:13:52 -0400 Subject: open source pdf writer In-Reply-To: <20060811223315.6add2f24.hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <44DC805D.5060401@rogers.com> <20060811223315.6add2f24.hgibson@eol.ca> Message-ID: <44DE1A60.50509@rogers.com> Howard Gibson wrote: > Kush, > > Do you want to modify existing PDF files or create new ones? > > > Hi Howard, I can create PDF files using xpdf tools (a2ps and ps2pdf) or openoffice in ubuntu and pdfcreator/xpdf/openoffice in windows. But cannot annotate/edit existing pdf files though as other writers have pointed out there are pgmg and commandline tools/libraries to do this work (pdftk, perl modules, sourceforge libraries etc). But thanks for the information. Every new bit helps. Kush -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 12 20:57:50 2006 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 16:57:50 -0400 Subject: Visor and EyeModule Message-ID: <20060812165750.2b56df63.joehill@sympatico.ca> Just got an EyeModule for my trusty old Visor, and I'm trying to figure out how to get JPilot to sync the image files to my comp. Google/linux led me to a useful Python script [1] for extacting the images *once they're sync'd*, but how the heck to get the .pdb files onto my comp? The software is (obviously) Win and Mac only, and eyemodule.com is no longer with us :-( Any tips greatly appreciated! It's kinda outdated, but might be fun to play with :-) [1] http://www.tammura.at/eyemodule/ -- JoeHill / RLU #282046 /////////////////////////// "People should not be afraid of their Government, the Government should be afraid of the People." -- V. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ekg_ab-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 13 02:29:45 2006 From: ekg_ab-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (E K) Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 22:29:45 -0400 (EDT) Subject: OT: Official warning on Windows bugs In-Reply-To: <44DDD7CB.20008-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <44DDD7CB.20008@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: <20060813022945.96106.qmail@web61321.mail.yahoo.com> The fact that DHS is promoting the Windows update will be a big saving for M$. The next logical step for M$ should be to pose Vista as a security fix. EK Fraser Campbell wrote: Meng Cheah wrote: > "*The US Department of Homeland Security has urged Windows users to > install the latest patches from Microsoft as quickly as possible." > > More at: > http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/4782811.stm > * Oh no, wonder if this raises their threat level??? -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml --------------------------------- All new Yahoo! Mail --------------------------------- Get news delivered. Enjoy RSS feeds right on your Mail page. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 13 03:57:53 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 23:57:53 -0400 Subject: any tool better than freemind Message-ID: <44DEA341.6020900@rogers.com> Does anyone here know a better tool than freemind for conceptualising ideas etc? http://freemind.sourceforge.net/wiki/index.php/Main_Page Kush -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phillip-l+pbsqP8NtUm29vl6s1fFg at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 13 14:32:57 2006 From: phillip-l+pbsqP8NtUm29vl6s1fFg at public.gmane.org (phil) Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 10:32:57 -0400 Subject: MP3 Players Message-ID: <5d07cc81f3dfe82a7a90272aed2be088@millsgarthson.ca> I've recently been thinking that I'd like to get a flash-memory MP3 player with built-in microphone -- like Toronto really needs one more person walking around, apparently talking to himself. :-) Research has give me conflicting results, so I'd like to know if people have good or bad results using various models with Linux (KDE) or particular programs. (My current leader on price for features is a SanDisk M250 model, but I'm not wedded to that.) Comments? ........................ Phillip Mills Multi-platform software development (416) 224-0714 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From talexb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 13 14:58:11 2006 From: talexb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Alex Beamish) Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 10:58:11 -0400 Subject: MP3 Players In-Reply-To: <5d07cc81f3dfe82a7a90272aed2be088-l+pbsqP8NtUm29vl6s1fFg@public.gmane.org> References: <5d07cc81f3dfe82a7a90272aed2be088@millsgarthson.ca> Message-ID: On 8/13/06, phil wrote: > > I've recently been thinking that I'd like to get a flash-memory MP3 > player with built-in microphone -- like Toronto really needs one more > person walking around, apparently talking to himself. :-) > > Research has give me conflicting results, so I'd like to know if people > have good or bad results using various models with Linux (KDE) or > particular programs. (My current leader on price for features is a > SanDisk M250 model, but I'm not wedded to that.) > > Comments? I've got a really good little unit from Creative -- 512M storage, USB connector that Linux automounts, FM, built-in microphone. I got it about a year ago from Future Shop for about $75 I think. Records in mono, but the fidelity is quite good, and it uses a AAA cell. It's about half the size of a flip-top cell phone .. works great. -- Alex Beamish Toronto, Ontario -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gilesorr-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 13 15:07:53 2006 From: gilesorr-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Giles Orr) Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 11:07:53 -0400 Subject: any tool better than freemind In-Reply-To: <44DEA341.6020900-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44DEA341.6020900@rogers.com> Message-ID: <1f13df280608130807j5ed8d7e0y1c209d982ba0cb67@mail.gmail.com> On 8/12/06, Kush wrote: > Does anyone here know a better tool than freemind for conceptualising > ideas etc? Freemind has a java dependency that makes cocaine look like a good thing ... The latest version of Freemind required the absolute latest version of java plus several other java-related deps that made it pretty much impossible to install with the previous version of Ubuntu. So I'm still using the older version of Freemind. Freemind is, in my view, the best of a bad lot. It's a very good product, but I object to it because of java. Here are the others I've found in the category of note organizers and/or mind mappers: Riot (text mode, requires Haskell): http://modeemi.fi/~tuomov/riot/ http://www.tuxcards.de/ http://www.jamiehillman.co.uk/mindless/ (stagnant) http://freemind.sourceforge.net/ http://bhepple.freeshell.org/gjots/ http://www.thinkgraph.com/english/index.htm (license) http://www.insilmaril.de/vym/ KDissert (for dissertations, looks good though - but requires 87Mb of deps with my current config): http://freehackers.org/~tnagy/kdissert/ Hope this helps. If anyone tries any of these, please contact me off-list to tell me your experience. Thanks. -- Giles http://www.gilesorr.com/ gilesorr-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rjonasz-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 13 18:50:23 2006 From: rjonasz-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Randy Jonasz) Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 14:50:23 -0400 Subject: MP3 Players In-Reply-To: References: <5d07cc81f3dfe82a7a90272aed2be088@millsgarthson.ca> Message-ID: On 8/13/06, Alex Beamish wrote: > On 8/13/06, phil wrote: > > > I've recently been thinking that I'd like to get a flash-memory MP3 > > player with built-in microphone -- like Toronto really needs one more > > person walking around, apparently talking to himself. :-) > > > > Research has give me conflicting results, so I'd like to know if people > > have good or bad results using various models with Linux (KDE) or > > particular programs. (My current leader on price for features is a > > SanDisk M250 model, but I'm not wedded to that.) > > > > Comments? > > > I've got a really good little unit from Creative -- 512M storage, USB > connector that Linux automounts, FM, built-in microphone. I got it about a > year ago from Future Shop for about $75 I think. Records in mono, but the > fidelity is quite good, and it uses a AAA cell. It's about half the size of > a flip-top cell phone .. works great. I can second that opinion. I bought a 1GB Creative with the above features for $79 last month. Works great. Cheers, Randy > > -- > Alex Beamish > Toronto, Ontario > -- Imagine no possessions I wonder if you can No need for greed or hunger A brotherhood of man Imagine all the people Sharing all the world --John Lennon -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 13 20:24:28 2006 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 16:24:28 -0400 Subject: Accessing serial-usb ports In-Reply-To: <50519.207.188.65.151.1155353473.squirrel-2RFepEojUI2DznVbVsZi4adLQS1dU2Lr@public.gmane.org> References: <50519.207.188.65.151.1155353473.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> Message-ID: <20060813202428.GA11956@waltdnes.org> On Fri, Aug 11, 2006 at 11:31:13PM -0400, phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org wrote > A Linux serial-usb port is created when you plug in a USB device, and > disappears when you unplug the device. Unfortunately, the port is created > as owned by root and the read and wite permissions are disabled for > ordinary users. Consequently, if you operate in user mode you have to > become root and change these permissions every time a device is plugged > and unplugged, or when you reboot. > > This gets old fast, so we need a better solution than manual intervention. The *DEFAULT* udev behaviour is to create /dev entries owned by root and assigned permissions 660. You want to change the default for one or more devices. Check out the udev rule-writing information at... http://www.reactivated.net/writing_udev_rules.html and specifically the section "Controlling permissions and ownership", where you can change any/all of owner, group, and access permissions. -- Walter Dnes In linux /sbin/init is Job #1 My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 13 20:55:59 2006 From: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org) Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 16:55:59 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Accessing serial-usb ports In-Reply-To: <20060813202428.GA11956-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <50519.207.188.65.151.1155353473.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> <20060813202428.GA11956@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <50010.207.188.64.111.1155502559.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> > On Fri, Aug 11, 2006 at 11:31:13PM -0400, phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org wrote > >> A Linux serial-usb port is created as owned by root and you have to >> become root and change these permissions every time a device is plugged >> and unplugged, or when you reboot. We need a better solution. > The *DEFAULT* udev behaviour is to create /dev entries owned by root > and assigned permissions 660. You want to change the default for one or > more devices. Check out the udev rule-writing information at... > http://www.reactivated.net/writing_udev_rules.html and specifically the > section "Controlling permissions and ownership", where you can change > any/all of owner, group, and access permissions. Walter Dnes This is a hopeful pointer, Walter, thank-you. I'll have a look at that approach. -- Peter Hiscocks Syscomp Electronic Design Limited, Toronto http://www.syscompdesign.com USB Oscilloscope and Waveform Generator 647-839-0325 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 13 21:19:27 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 17:19:27 -0400 Subject: Any decent computer book stores in GTA? Message-ID: <44DF975F.3030900@rogers.com> This afternoon, I dropped into the local Chapters and was appalled at how much the technical book section had been decimated, since I last visited a couple of weeks ago. They're really dumbed down what used to be a good selection. Is there any decent technical book store left? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 13 22:09:46 2006 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 18:09:46 -0400 Subject: Any decent computer book stores in GTA? In-Reply-To: <44DF975F.3030900-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44DF975F.3030900@rogers.com> Message-ID: <44DFA32A.5080008@execulink.com> James Knott wrote: > This afternoon, I dropped into the local Chapters and was appalled at > how much the technical book section had been decimated, since I last > visited a couple of weeks ago. They're really dumbed down what used to > be a good selection. Is there any decent technical book store left? > -- It's hit or miss at the bookstores unless you order and pay in advance. Have you tried "The Worlds Biggest Bookstore" on Edward near Yonge? I might also suggest the library. I recently had my daughter locate for me a book entitled "Unix Shell Programming" which was sent to a local branch for pick-up within a week. She has even renewed it twice online! FWIW-I did find a similar technical book at Indigo with a price tag of seventy bucks. I'm getting all that I need from the loaner for free. BTW-Does anyone know when the Canadian price and US price will actually reflect the current exchange rates? What a joke! HTH greg -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 13 21:56:23 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 17:56:23 -0400 Subject: Any decent computer book stores in GTA? In-Reply-To: <44DF975F.3030900-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44DF975F.3030900@rogers.com> Message-ID: <44DFA007.5000100@rogers.com> People like me mostly buy from bookpool.com etc since chapters/indigo is so costly. Even with the postal/courier costs, book buying online is cheaper and now with O'reilly's safari model one can read quite a few of the latest books. If one buys online from chapters, its still cheaper than buying from the store itself. Maybe thats the reason why they had to reduce floorspace for the technical section. Consumers are going the online way. If there was more open competition and maybe specialised bookstores maybe we would have better and cheaper books(the same rates as in the US). The problem in Toronto is that there is no competition and courier companies like UPS/fedex charge a lot via their brokers who sit to do simple customs paperwork but nobody objects. Most of the time the broker charges are more than what the govt gets thru custom duties. Another thing reducing the number of bookstores carrying technical books is the demand from the central library of Toronto ie the TPL. TPL drives a significant portion of the book demand here. I think we should have some sort of library for the TLUG people on the lines of bookcrossing.com or a book bank or we should have a section on the TLUG website which lists where all one can see the latest technical books (e.g. university department libraries or college libraries or govt libraries or company libraries), their timings, membership details, some sort of rating etc etc Kush James Knott wrote: > This afternoon, I dropped into the local Chapters and was appalled at > how much the technical book section had been decimated, since I last > visited a couple of weeks ago. They're really dumbed down what used to > be a good selection. Is there any decent technical book store left? > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 13 21:58:13 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 17:58:13 -0400 Subject: Any decent computer book stores in GTA? In-Reply-To: <44DF975F.3030900-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44DF975F.3030900@rogers.com> Message-ID: <44DFA075.3060908@telly.org> James Knott wrote: >This afternoon, I dropped into the local Chapters and was appalled at >how much the technical book section had been decimated, since I last >visited a couple of weeks ago. They're really dumbed down what used to >be a good selection. Is there any decent technical book store left? > > I wonder if these days the good stuff is all online, leaving only consumer-ish titles (dummies' series, or the books that look like good value because they're 900 pages) on store shelves. I did a little looking on Indigo's website for some stuff recently. I found that many of the better-reviewed books I was looking for are available to ship immediately, but the only store that seemed to have any stock was the one next to (not inside) Square One. In Toronto, World's Biggest should be better, but that doesn't mean it _is_ better. Then again, that's all Chapters/Indigo/Coles. The only major competition seems to be Amazon. Of course, come September the bookstores at York, Ryerson and UofT will have lots of stock too. Also, try http://www.abebooks.com/home/BMV/ - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 13 22:12:39 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 18:12:39 -0400 Subject: Any decent computer book stores in GTA? In-Reply-To: <44DFA007.5000100-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44DF975F.3030900@rogers.com> <44DFA007.5000100@rogers.com> Message-ID: <44DFA3D7.9090107@rogers.com> Kush wrote: > > I think we should have some sort of library for the TLUG people on the > lines of bookcrossing.com or a book bank or we should have a section > on the TLUG website which lists where all one can see the latest > technical books (e.g. university department libraries or college > libraries or govt libraries or company libraries), their timings, > membership details, some sort of rating etc etc > > Quite a few times one has books which one is not using and if there were a member's site which had a list of books and their editions etc, it would be possible to exchange or borrow or sell books among ourselves or via other used book stores. Maybe there is an opportunity here atleast for the people in the GTA by linking a need for a book to a recipient. Kush -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 13 22:21:25 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 18:21:25 -0400 Subject: Any decent computer book stores in GTA? In-Reply-To: <44DFA075.3060908-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg@public.gmane.org> References: <44DF975F.3030900@rogers.com> <44DFA075.3060908@telly.org> Message-ID: <44DFA5E5.4060702@rogers.com> Evan Leibovitch wrote: > James Knott wrote: > >> This afternoon, I dropped into the local Chapters and was appalled at >> how much the technical book section had been decimated, since I last >> visited a couple of weeks ago. They're really dumbed down what used to >> be a good selection. Is there any decent technical book store left? >> >> > I wonder if these days the good stuff is all online, leaving only > consumer-ish titles (dummies' series, or the books that look like good > value because they're 900 pages) on store shelves. I like to browse through the book, before buying. It's hard to do that online. > > I did a little looking on Indigo's website for some stuff recently. I > found that many of the better-reviewed books I was looking for are > available to ship immediately, but the only store that seemed to have > any stock was the one next to (not inside) Square One. In Toronto, > World's Biggest should be better, but that doesn't mean it _is_ better. That's the store I was in today. There is not much left. Years ago, I could buy my Ryerson texts at WBB, often cheaper than in the Ryerson bookstore. Not now though. I noticed Chapters seemed to start going downhill, after Indigo bought it. I read a while ago that Heather Reisman (sp?) wants to turn them into gift stores. I never cared for Indigo, because of their poor technical book selection. Now that they own Chapters and WBB, those stores also have a poor selection. > > Then again, that's all Chapters/Indigo/Coles. The only major competition > seems to be Amazon. > > Of course, come September the bookstores at York, Ryerson and UofT will > have lots of stock too. > > Also, try > http://www.abebooks.com/home/BMV/ > > > - Evan > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 13 22:24:17 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 18:24:17 -0400 Subject: Any decent computer book stores in GTA? In-Reply-To: <44DFA32A.5080008-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ@public.gmane.org> References: <44DF975F.3030900@rogers.com> <44DFA32A.5080008@execulink.com> Message-ID: <44DFA691.2070404@rogers.com> Gregory D Hough wrote: > James Knott wrote: >> This afternoon, I dropped into the local Chapters and was appalled at >> how much the technical book section had been decimated, since I last >> visited a couple of weeks ago. They're really dumbed down what used to >> be a good selection. Is there any decent technical book store left? >> -- > > It's hit or miss at the bookstores unless you order and pay in advance. > Have you tried "The Worlds Biggest Bookstore" on Edward near Yonge? I > might also suggest the library. I recently had my daughter locate for me > a book entitled "Unix Shell Programming" which was sent to a local > branch for pick-up within a week. She has even renewed it twice online! > I often get books from the library. Unfortunately, they tend to be a bit stale. WBB used to be good, but last time I was in there (about a year ago) they had only a poor selection, in place of what used to be an excellent technical book section. You'd think that being downtown and near Ryerson & U of T, they'd have a bit better selection. > FWIW-I did find a similar technical book at Indigo with a price tag of > seventy bucks. I'm getting all that I need from the loaner for free. > > BTW-Does anyone know when the Canadian price and US price will actually > reflect the current exchange rates? What a joke! > > HTH > greg > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 13 22:25:47 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 18:25:47 -0400 Subject: Any decent computer book stores in GTA? In-Reply-To: <44DFA075.3060908-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg@public.gmane.org> References: <44DF975F.3030900@rogers.com> <44DFA075.3060908@telly.org> Message-ID: <44DFA6EB.4050302@rogers.com> Evan Leibovitch wrote: > Also, try > http://www.abebooks.com/home/BMV/ I'll be in that neighbourhood tomorrow. Perhaps I'll drop in. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 13 22:42:56 2006 From: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org) Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 18:42:56 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Accessing serial-usb ports: Solved In-Reply-To: <50010.207.188.64.111.1155502559.squirrel-2RFepEojUI2DznVbVsZi4adLQS1dU2Lr@public.gmane.org> References: <50519.207.188.65.151.1155353473.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> <20060813202428.GA11956@waltdnes.org> <50010.207.188.64.111.1155502559.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> Message-ID: <50057.207.188.64.111.1155508976.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> >> On Fri, Aug 11, 2006 at 11:31:13PM -0400, phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org wrote >> >>> A Linux serial-usb port is created as owned by root and you have to >>> become root and change these permissions every time a device is plugged >>> and unplugged, or when you reboot. We need a better solution. > >> The *DEFAULT* udev behaviour is to create /dev entries owned by root >> and assigned permissions 660. You want to change the default for one or >> more devices. Check out the udev rule-writing information at... >> http://www.reactivated.net/writing_udev_rules.html and specifically the >> section "Controlling permissions and ownership", where you can change >> any/all of owner, group, and access permissions. > > Walter Dnes > It turns out to be quite simple. The fix is to edit the file /etc/udev/permissions.d/50-udev.permissions so that the USB ports ttyUSB* start up with permissions 666 rather than 660. Thank-you, Walter, for pointing me in that direction. -- Peter Hiscocks Syscomp Electronic Design Limited, Toronto http://www.syscompdesign.com USB Oscilloscope and Waveform Generator 647-839-0325 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 13 22:53:51 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 18:53:51 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Any decent computer book stores in GTA? In-Reply-To: <44DFA007.5000100-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44DFA007.5000100@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20060813225351.3094.qmail@web88204.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- Kush wrote: [snip] > I think we should have some sort of library for the > TLUG people on the > lines of bookcrossing.com or a book bank or we > should have a section on > the TLUG website which lists where all one can see > the latest technical > books (e.g. university department libraries or > college libraries or govt > libraries or company libraries), their timings, > membership details, some > sort of rating etc etc David over at Linuxcaffe kind-of sort-off does this. I've kind-off sort-of help with that by dropping off some technical magazines that I had more more use of over at Linuxcaffe. Other people I gather have done similar, and I gather David has received goodies from at least one book publisher. Might want to talk to David about expanding what he is doing now... Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 13 22:59:09 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 18:59:09 -0400 Subject: Any decent computer book stores in GTA? In-Reply-To: <20060813225351.3094.qmail-iE2/U85ktn6B9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060813225351.3094.qmail@web88204.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <44DFAEBD.1050007@rogers.com> Should be meeting him for the LIP event on the 25th. Maybe we can talk about this then. Kush Colin McGregor wrote: > --- Kush wrote: > > [snip] > > >> I think we should have some sort of library for the >> TLUG people on the >> lines of bookcrossing.com or a book bank or we >> should have a section on >> the TLUG website which lists where all one can see >> the latest technical >> books (e.g. university department libraries or >> college libraries or govt >> libraries or company libraries), their timings, >> membership details, some >> sort of rating etc etc >> > > David over at Linuxcaffe kind-of sort-off does this. > I've kind-off sort-of help with that by dropping off > some technical magazines that I had more more use of > over at Linuxcaffe. Other people I gather have done > similar, and I gather David has received goodies from > at least one book publisher. Might want to talk to > David about expanding what he is doing now... > > Colin McGregor > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 14 00:38:20 2006 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 20:38:20 -0400 Subject: ipt_recent Time Format In-Reply-To: <44DE03C6.4060307-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ@public.gmane.org> References: <44DE03C6.4060307@execulink.com> Message-ID: <44DFC5FC.2010604@execulink.com> Gregory D Hough wrote: > > How do I use date or time or whatever to read in the current value of > NOW in this format? > In the spirit of archived circumlocutions... info coreutils date First, a quote: Our units of temporal measurement, from seconds on up to months, are so complicated, asymmetrical and disjunctive so as to make coherent mental reckoning in time all but impossible. Indeed, had some tyrannical god contrived to enslave our minds to time, to make it all but impossible for us to escape subjection to sodden routines and unpleasant surprises, he could hardly have done better than handing down our present system. It is like a set of trapezoidal building blocks, with no vertical or horizontal surfaces, like a language in which the simplest thought demands ornate constructions, useless particles and lengthy circumlocutions. Unlike the more successful patterns of language and science, which enable us to face experience boldly or at least level-headedly, our system of temporal calculation silently and persistently encourages our terror of time. ... It is as though architects had to measure length in feet, width in meters and height in ells; as though basic instruction manuals demanded a knowledge of five different languages. It is no wonder then that we often look into our own immediate past or future, last Tuesday or a week from Sunday, with feelings of helpless confusion. ... -- Robert Grudin, `Time and the Art of Living'. Google hasn't been my friend yet either so my workaround is as follows: #!/bin/bash # Get current timestamp in mystical ipt_recent format # Create a bogus entry echo 11.11.11.11 > /proc/net/ipt_recent/GZ # Read time from bogus entry cat /proc/net/ipt_recent/GZ | grep '11\.11\.11\.11' | cut -b 35-44 > NOW # Display timestamp (or reuse the value) cat NOW # Remove bogus entry echo -11.11.11.11 > /proc/net/ipt_recent/GZ [root at localhost ~]# sh TIMER 2897398043 Thanks anyhow, greg -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 14 00:18:15 2006 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 20:18:15 -0400 Subject: Any decent computer book stores in GTA? In-Reply-To: <20060813225351.3094.qmail-iE2/U85ktn6B9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <44DFA007.5000100@rogers.com> <20060813225351.3094.qmail@web88204.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On 8/13/06, Colin McGregor wrote: > --- Kush wrote: > > [snip] > > > I think we should have some sort of library for the > > TLUG people on the > > lines of bookcrossing.com or a book bank or we > > should have a section on > > the TLUG website which lists where all one can see > > the latest technical > > books (e.g. university department libraries or > > college libraries or govt > > libraries or company libraries), their timings, > > membership details, some > > sort of rating etc etc > > David over at Linuxcaffe kind-of sort-off does this. > I've kind-off sort-of help with that by dropping off > some technical magazines that I had more more use of > over at Linuxcaffe. Other people I gather have done > similar, and I gather David has received goodies from > at least one book publisher. Might want to talk to > David about expanding what he is doing now... It's true, I have a sprawling pile of reference, most of which is out of date and/or in the basement. APress dropped a sweet load of curent titles for review. What I would like to do (or better yet, encourage somebody else to do) is a) catalog the books, using a barcode scanner and amazon lookup. b) make the catalog readable via "shopping cart" on our website (linuxcaffe.ca /books?) c) get my customer/membership database working and d) allow members to borrow the books. e) continue to collect good reference and weed out the cruft. whew ! sounds like a nice winter project ! we have over 60 back issues of Linux Journal and scads of other mags, available fer perusin. thanks to all who dropped off the goods, djp -- djp-tnsZcVQxgqO2dHQpreyxbg at public.gmane.org www.linuxcaffe.ca 326 Harbord Street, Toronto, M6G 3A5, (416) 534-2116 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 14 00:22:41 2006 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 20:22:41 -0400 Subject: Any decent computer book stores in GTA? In-Reply-To: <44DFAEBD.1050007-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <20060813225351.3094.qmail@web88204.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <44DFAEBD.1050007@rogers.com> Message-ID: On 8/13/06, Kush wrote: > > Should be meeting him for the LIP event on the 25th. Maybe we can talk > about this then. > Kush Yooohooo ! it's the 26th ! a Saturday The day AFTER linuxs 15th birthday A date decided by the assembly of the executive board of the gtalug, itself ! so be there or be square ! -- djp-tnsZcVQxgqO2dHQpreyxbg at public.gmane.org www.linuxcaffe.ca 326 Harbord Street, Toronto, M6G 3A5, (416) 534-2116 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 14 01:12:58 2006 From: cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org (Chris F.A. Johnson) Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 21:12:58 -0400 (EDT) Subject: ipt_recent Time Format In-Reply-To: <44DE03C6.4060307-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ@public.gmane.org> References: <44DE03C6.4060307@execulink.com> Message-ID: On Sat, 12 Aug 2006, Gregory D Hough wrote: > Tluggers, > > Is anyone familiar with NetFilter's timestamps? This is what they typically > look like: > > [root at localhost ~]# cat /proc/net/ipt_recent/ZW | grep '69\.63\.21\.188' > src=69.63.21.188 ttl: 32 last_seen: 2484808297 oldest_pkt: 1 last_pkts: > 2484808297 > > And from the log I know the time it was last_seen three days ago: > > [root at localhost ~]# grep SYNYSTR-RESET /var/log/messages | grep > '69\.63\.21\.188' > Aug 9 00:24:18 localhost kernel: SYNYSTR-RESET: IN=eth1 OUT= > SRC=69.63.21.188 DST=192.168.1.251 LEN=64 TOS=0x00 PREC=0x00 TTL=32 ID=19088 > DF PROTO=TCP SPT=2930 DPT=445 WINDOW=53760 RES=0x00 SYN URGP=0 > > "Aug 9 00:24:18" && 2484808297 are true somehow In seconds since the epoch that date is: $ date -d "Aug 9 00:24:18" +%s 1155097458 Get a second date and its equivalent to find the relationship. > I'm primarily interested in last_seen. I need a clean-up script which removes > an IP's record after a certain period of inactivity and I don't know how to > work with that value. Naturally if I can get the current time in the correct > format I can work with that value. I suspect it is microseconds since the > module was (re)loaded. > > How do I use date or time or whatever to read in the current value of NOW in > this format? The date man page lists all the formatting characters, e.g.: now=$( date "+%b %d %H:%M:%S" ) The same format characters can also be used with the dynamically loadable bash built-in command strftime. See . -- Chris F.A. Johnson =================================================================== Author: Shell Scripting Recipes: A Problem-Solution Approach (2005, Apress) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 14 11:32:08 2006 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 07:32:08 -0400 Subject: ipt_recent Time Format In-Reply-To: References: <44DE03C6.4060307@execulink.com> Message-ID: <44E05F38.3030000@execulink.com> Chris F.A. Johnson wrote: > > The same format characters can also be used with the dynamically > loadable bash built-in command strftime. See > . > I think I need a copy of "Shell Scripting Recipes: A Problem Solution Approach" ASAP -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 14 13:56:59 2006 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins Witteman) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 09:56:59 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... Message-ID: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> My wife's computer was in the shop this past week (the motherboard went blooey) and she's been logging into my Linux desktop with an account of her own. Well, it should surprise no one here, but she'd like to switch, and "just have Windows once in a while, for some software". I explained dual booting and virtualization as a couple of choices, and she's decided that she wants to dual boot. I am terribly pleased, but I want it to go well, so I thought I'd ask here for any gotchas on running Linux on the AMD64 architecture. I've heard a few things, like Firefox having to run in 32-bit mode (or is that just Flash? I don't remember) but I don't know how you'd set something like this up. I plan to use Debian, because that's what I use and I know it best, and so I'd love to hear any advice about getting that set up so she experiences minimal disruption - the whole point of running Linux for her is that it's easier, more flexible and more secure, so if it's a big hassle she'll go back to what she knows. Thanks. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 14 14:11:08 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 10:11:08 -0400 Subject: Dual core Intel... how hot? In-Reply-To: References: <20060802144557.GA17952@wp.magstar.net> <20060802174625.GX13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060802184814.GA18495@wp.magstar.net> <20060804125351.GY13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060808163925.GJ13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20060814141107.GB13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Aug 11, 2006 at 10:39:09PM -0400, D. Hugh Redelmeier wrote: > Sorry, what I meant was "I didn't realize that Pacifica was out yet." > > That certainly hasn't been out for a year or so. > > I'm looking forward to playing with virtualization on my next machine, > but have no plans to get one yet. Right pacifica is not that old. They did add some new features about a year ago that allowed things like vmware to run 64bit guests, which originally wasn't possible. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 14 14:12:33 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 10:12:33 -0400 Subject: Accessing serial-usb ports In-Reply-To: <50519.207.188.65.151.1155353473.squirrel-2RFepEojUI2DznVbVsZi4adLQS1dU2Lr@public.gmane.org> References: <50519.207.188.65.151.1155353473.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> Message-ID: <20060814141233.GC13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Aug 11, 2006 at 11:31:13PM -0400, phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org wrote: > > USB ports are complex to access in software so people have developed > hardware and software to access USB ports as serial ports. These serial > port devices have names like /dev/ttyUSB0 and conveniently the drivers are > built into the kernel since 2.4. We used this extensively in our Tcl > software that drives our scope and signal generator. The software simply > treats these ports as serial ports, which Tcl can access. (At the other > end of the cable there is a hardware integrated circuit that reconverts > the USB protocol into asynchronous serial data. So the whole USB protocol > can be ignored.) > > A Linux serial-usb port is created when you plug in a USB device, and > disappears when you unplug the device. Unfortunately, the port is created > as owned by root and the read and wite permissions are disabled for > ordinary users. Consequently, if you operate in user mode you have to > become root and change these permissions every time a device is plugged > and unplugged, or when you reboot. > > This gets old fast, so we need a better solution than manual intervention. > In my Suse Linux, a long-listing shows that the 'uucp' group has access to > the device. I'm therefore proposing that users of this software simply add > themselves as members of the uucp group. This seems to work fine, but I > wonder if there are other unpleasant side-effects that might result. > > I would welcome some comments on this approach - does it create security > holes, for example? And pointers to alternative approaches would be > welcome. The simple solution is to add a rule to udev's scripts that says what permissions and ownership the usb serial port should have when it is created. This is part of udev's job after all. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 14 14:20:50 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 10:20:50 -0400 Subject: [GW-C] Re:Tom's HW Guide: Linux for gaming In-Reply-To: References: <44BAF994.8080401@telly.org> <44DA2D20.1080107@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: <20060814142050.GD13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Aug 11, 2006 at 11:44:58PM -0400, D. Hugh Redelmeier wrote: > I'm glad to hear that. ATI lost me as a customer after a few too many > disappointments. I was biased towards the home-town team. Some > things that I think I know: > > - the fastest 3d card with open source drivers, of any brand, is the > ATI Radeon 9250. Get them before they die of old age. > > - In January, I needed a video card that supported Dual Link DVI. At > that time, reasonably-priced ATI x1000 family cards (like the x1300) > would not work in Linux with an open source driver. Not even as a > 2d card. (Well, the VESA driver could do it, but only at > resolutions wired into the cards BIOS extension, and those did not > include the resolutions I needed.) At the time, 6 months after the > product was released, ATI had not disclosed enough about the new > fiddly bits for 2d output to enable the open-source Radeon driver to > support these cards. > > - at that time, the ATI web site claimed that the proprietary X > drivers supported any card newer than the 9600 (I think that was the > number). Pre-sales support repeated this misinformation. I bought > nice fanless x1300 card and discovered the mistake. Was the site > corrected when I reported this? No. This has unfortunately been very common for ATI over many years. Try getting a driver for a laptop with an ati chipset in it from ati. If your laptop maker doesn't care and doesn't update the drivers, too bad. ati doesn't make drivers for laptops for windows. For linux they do somewhat. I did find the omega drivers that someone else manually puts together using bits and pieces of ati's drivers for windows and makes them work with laptops. This really should not be someone's hobby. Nvidia has no problem providing drivers for laptops. > - the open source drivers for nVidia cards are limited to 2d. They do however usually work with new cards fairly quickly. > He is asking for approval because an NDA is involved. He does claim > that nothing scary is revealed in the code. > > Maybe somebody inside ATI could champion this (you know who you are). > Many of us would be willing to help. Well I did see this: http://www.infoworld.com/article/06/08/02/32OPcurve_1.html One can always hope there is some truth to that. > A decade ago I tried to talk to some ATI engineers that I had met, but > there no interest. > > Intel is the best player, as far as revealing graphics chip details. > They have released open-source drivers and are maintaining them. The > most recent message from them was written by Keith Packard (one of the > key X folks). If he is working for them, that is an even better sign. There appears to be some binary only HAL involved in the new "open source" intel drivers. I haven't quite figured out what that does yet or if it is required for the drivers to work. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 14 14:25:12 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 10:25:12 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: <20060814135659.GA9159-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Mon, Aug 14, 2006 at 09:56:59AM -0400, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: > My wife's computer was in the shop this past week (the motherboard went > blooey) and she's been logging into my Linux desktop with an account of > her own. Well, it should surprise no one here, but she'd like to > switch, and "just have Windows once in a while, for some software". I > explained dual booting and virtualization as a couple of choices, and > she's decided that she wants to dual boot. Most people I know eventually find dual booting a pain because you have to stop everything you are doing and switch. You often end up only using one or the other. With virtualization (like vmware) you are much more likely to use both since you can use each for what you like it best for and you can learn new things slowly. If you have to switch back for a lot of things all the time, you really end up just staying with the one you are most comfortable with (my machine hasn't booted windows in over 2 years, even though it is installed. I just can't be bothered to do it). > I am terribly pleased, but I want it to go well, so I thought I'd ask > here for any gotchas on running Linux on the AMD64 architecture. I've > heard a few things, like Firefox having to run in 32-bit mode (or is > that just Flash? I don't remember) but I don't know how you'd set > something like this up. Just flash, and any other non-free plugins that only come in 32bit. There are people working on getting 32bit plugins to work in 64bit browsers but I am not sure if they are done yet. > I plan to use Debian, because that's what I use and I know it best, and > so I'd love to hear any advice about getting that set up so she > experiences minimal disruption - the whole point of running Linux for > her is that it's easier, more flexible and more secure, so if it's a big > hassle she'll go back to what she knows. Well if you go with Etch, amd64 works rather well. For Sarge it was unofficial, and it does have some things lacking. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 14 14:40:21 2006 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins Witteman) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 10:40:21 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: <20060814142512.GE13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> On Mon, Aug 14, 2006 at 10:25:12AM -0400, Lennart Sorensen wrote: >On Mon, Aug 14, 2006 at 09:56:59AM -0400, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: >> explained dual booting and virtualization as a couple of choices, and >> she's decided that she wants to dual boot. > >Most people I know eventually find dual booting a pain because you have >to stop everything you are doing and switch. You often end up only I know this, and I explained it to my wife, but doesn't think it'll be a big deal. We might know better, but nothing teaches like experience. I can install VMWare later, if she decides that that is what she needs. >> heard a few things, like Firefox having to run in 32-bit mode (or is >> that just Flash? I don't remember) but I don't know how you'd set >> something like this up. > >Just flash, and any other non-free plugins that only come in 32bit. >There are people working on getting 32bit plugins to work in 64bit >browsers but I am not sure if they are done yet. So, is Flash on a 64bit machine possible? If so, how? >> I plan to use Debian, because that's what I use and I know it best, and > >Well if you go with Etch, amd64 works rather well. For Sarge it was >unofficial, and it does have some things lacking. I had planned to use testing, yes. Stable is, um, stable, but it lacks too many programs and updated features. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 14 15:06:20 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 11:06:20 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: <20060814142512.GE13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <44E0916C.9020005@telly.org> Lennart Sorensen wrote: >>I am terribly pleased, but I want it to go well, so I thought I'd ask >>here for any gotchas on running Linux on the AMD64 architecture. I've >>heard a few things, like Firefox having to run in 32-bit mode (or is >>that just Flash? I don't remember) but I don't know how you'd set >>something like this up. >> >> > >Just flash, and any other non-free plugins that only come in 32bit. >There are people working on getting 32bit plugins to work in 64bit >browsers but I am not sure if they are done yet. > > One thing you may miss, along with a Flash player, are some of the Windows Media Player codecs. Almost anything with a .wmv extension won't play under AMD64, and I don't think there's a fix for that coming any time soon. >>I plan to use Debian, because that's what I use and I know it best, and >>so I'd love to hear any advice about getting that set up so she >>experiences minimal disruption - the whole point of running Linux for >>her is that it's easier, more flexible and more secure, so if it's a big >>hassle she'll go back to what she knows. >> >> If that's the case I'd suggest Ubuntu rather than 'pure' Debian. You get the inner guts that you know and love, and she gets a better new-user experience. Xandros will work this way too. - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ray-UsHhwO8CmvuakBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 14 15:23:14 2006 From: ray-UsHhwO8CmvuakBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Raymond J. Payne) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 11:23:14 -0400 Subject: Java opening - Wrong forum, but posting just in case Message-ID: <3C31E454411187439E3314D99DD9502709A1CF@jack.pcrepairs.com> I have someone trying to fill a position for a Java Developer. It's a full time, permanent position. Even though this is a Linux group I figured I'd post anyway in case there is anyone out there looking for something along this line. It's not listed publicly yet which means the odds are better at least. If interested, please reply to me directly. (ray-UsHhwO8CmvuakBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org) Below is a copy of the description I have been given: The Job A successful candidate will become a senior member on one of our core financial development teams. Working directly with a team lead, customers and business analysts, you will be responsible for enhancing out products capabilities to manage hundreds of facilities from a centralized location in the areas of billing and patient accounting. Understanding, designing and implementing new screens, modules, business rules and database designs will be daily requirements. Other responsibilities will include interacting with customers and other knowledge holders, mentoring junior team members, performing code reviews, reviewing requirements, performance tuning, responding to customer issues. Required Qualifications: o Professional Experience with Java / JSP / Javascript - at least 5 years o Strong database skills (design / modeling)- at least 5 years o Object Oriented Design o Excellent verbal and written communications skills o Ability and desire to work directly with customers o Proven track record of successful management of resources and timelines o University degree in computer science or closely related field Desired Qualifications: o Web application design o Large system experience o Experience with either Financial System design and business concepts o Database and application stress testing and tuning o Experience with Struts, Spring, and MVC We offer a competitive salary, performance-based incentives, career development opportunities and a comprehensive benefits package. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tlug-neil-8agRmHhQ+n2CxnSzwYWP7Q at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 14 15:35:18 2006 From: tlug-neil-8agRmHhQ+n2CxnSzwYWP7Q at public.gmane.org (Neil Watson) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 11:35:18 -0400 Subject: Clustering and cronjobs Message-ID: <20060814153518.GC1367@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> I'm setting up a cluster using the Redhat Cluster suite. The cluster offers a DB2 service. So far my tests seem to be working. I'll post a report on how is did this later if anyone is interested. I'm not sure how to handle specific cron jobs that must be run on the active node only. Does anyone have any experience with this? -- Neil Watson | Gentoo Linux System Administrator | Uptime 18 days http://watson-wilson.ca | 2.6.16.19 AMD Athlon(tm) MP 2000+ x 2 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 14 15:40:15 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 11:40:15 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: <20060814144021.GA9312-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <20060814154015.GF13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Mon, Aug 14, 2006 at 10:40:21AM -0400, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: > So, is Flash on a 64bit machine possible? If so, how? I haven't tried it in a long time. I find flash crashes firefox too often on 32bit. I try to just not use flash enabled sites. I know gnu has some flash player project in the works, but I am not sure what the state of it is. If it ever ends up working, then that should solve the 64bit flash problem too. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 14 15:41:50 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 11:41:50 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: <20060814144021.GA9312-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: > On Mon, Aug 14, 2006 at 10:25:12AM -0400, Lennart Sorensen wrote: >> On Mon, Aug 14, 2006 at 09:56:59AM -0400, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: >>> explained dual booting and virtualization as a couple of choices, and >>> she's decided that she wants to dual boot. >> Most people I know eventually find dual booting a pain because you have >> to stop everything you are doing and switch. You often end up only > > I know this, and I explained it to my wife, but doesn't think it'll be a > big deal. We might know better, but nothing teaches like experience. I > can install VMWare later, if she decides that that is what she needs. > >>> heard a few things, like Firefox having to run in 32-bit mode (or is >>> that just Flash? I don't remember) but I don't know how you'd set >>> something like this up. >> Just flash, and any other non-free plugins that only come in 32bit. >> There are people working on getting 32bit plugins to work in 64bit >> browsers but I am not sure if they are done yet. > > So, is Flash on a 64bit machine possible? If so, how? > >>> I plan to use Debian, because that's what I use and I know it best, and >> Well if you go with Etch, amd64 works rather well. For Sarge it was >> unofficial, and it does have some things lacking. > > I had planned to use testing, yes. Stable is, um, stable, but it lacks > too many programs and updated features. Take a look at this page: https://alioth.debian.org/docman/view.php/30192/21/debian-amd64-howto.html#id272672 It should solve most of your 64/32bit compatibility problems using testing. mplayer, flash, w32codecs, vmware it's all there. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bchaffin-//MPyowsN0+FX2APIN6yfw at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 14 17:12:56 2006 From: bchaffin-//MPyowsN0+FX2APIN6yfw at public.gmane.org (Brice Chaffin) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 12:12:56 -0500 Subject: (unknown) Message-ID: <20060814171256.B9EC61158CC@ws1-7.us4.outblaze.com> unsubscribe -- ___________________________________________________ Play 100s of games for FREE! http://games.mail.com/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davec-zxk95TxsVYDyHADnj0MGvQC/G2K4zDHf at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 14 19:52:19 2006 From: davec-zxk95TxsVYDyHADnj0MGvQC/G2K4zDHf at public.gmane.org (Dave Cramer) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 15:52:19 -0400 Subject: simple open source document management system Message-ID: Can anyone recommend a web based very simple, preferrably backed by cvs, or svn, but not necessary document system Dave -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tlug-neil-8agRmHhQ+n2CxnSzwYWP7Q at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 14 20:08:39 2006 From: tlug-neil-8agRmHhQ+n2CxnSzwYWP7Q at public.gmane.org (Neil Watson) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 16:08:39 -0400 Subject: simple open source document management system In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20060814200839.GG1367@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> On Mon, Aug 14, 2006 at 03:52:19PM -0400, Dave Cramer wrote: >Can anyone recommend a web based very simple, preferrably backed by >cvs, or svn, but not necessary document system svn and webdav? You can also you tortoise svn for the Windows users. -- Neil Watson | Gentoo Linux System Administrator | Uptime 18 days http://watson-wilson.ca | 2.6.16.19 AMD Athlon(tm) MP 2000+ x 2 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davec-zxk95TxsVYDyHADnj0MGvQC/G2K4zDHf at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 14 20:12:04 2006 From: davec-zxk95TxsVYDyHADnj0MGvQC/G2K4zDHf at public.gmane.org (Dave Cramer) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 16:12:04 -0400 Subject: simple open source document management system In-Reply-To: <20060814200839.GG1367-ajb9/b42oWj7qFZT6RBq9oSPOIov7LNK@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814200839.GG1367@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> Message-ID: So svn + webdav can do everything that svn can do ? Dave On 14-Aug-06, at 4:08 PM, Neil Watson wrote: > On Mon, Aug 14, 2006 at 03:52:19PM -0400, Dave Cramer wrote: >> Can anyone recommend a web based very simple, preferrably backed >> by cvs, or svn, but not necessary document system > > svn and webdav? You can also you tortoise svn for the Windows users. > > -- > Neil Watson | Gentoo Linux > System Administrator | Uptime 18 days > http://watson-wilson.ca | 2.6.16.19 AMD Athlon(tm) MP 2000+ x 2 > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From david-FkEgs2FKm2NvBvnq28/GKQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 14 21:38:50 2006 From: david-FkEgs2FKm2NvBvnq28/GKQ at public.gmane.org (david thornton) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 22:38:50 +0100 Subject: Clustering and cronjobs In-Reply-To: <20060814153518.GC1367-ajb9/b42oWj7qFZT6RBq9oSPOIov7LNK@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814153518.GC1367@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> Message-ID: <44E0ED6A.6030605@quadratic.net> Neil Watson wrote: > I'm setting up a cluster using the Redhat Cluster suite. The cluster > offers a DB2 service. So far my tests seem to be working. I'll post a > report on how is did this later if anyone is interested. > > I'm not sure how to handle specific cron jobs that must be run on the > active node only. Does anyone have any experience with this? > I would be curious to learn your notes. David -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 01:08:25 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 21:08:25 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: <20060814135659.GA9159-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <44E11E89.5040100@rogers.com> William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: > My wife's computer was in the shop this past week (the motherboard went > blooey) and she's been logging into my Linux desktop with an account of > her own. Well, it should surprise no one here, but she'd like to > switch, and "just have Windows once in a while, for some software". I > explained dual booting and virtualization as a couple of choices, and > she's decided that she wants to dual boot. > > I am terribly pleased, but I want it to go well, so I thought I'd ask > here for any gotchas on running Linux on the AMD64 architecture. I've > heard a few things, like Firefox having to run in 32-bit mode (or is > that just Flash? I don't remember) but I don't know how you'd set > something like this up. > > I plan to use Debian, because that's what I use and I know it best, and > so I'd love to hear any advice about getting that set up so she > experiences minimal disruption - the whole point of running Linux for > her is that it's easier, more flexible and more secure, so if it's a big > hassle she'll go back to what she knows. I run 64 bit SUSE 10.1 on my AMD 64 bit system. Most things are 64 bit, but Mozilla, Firefox etc., are 32 bit, because the plugins are still available only in 32 bit. What's most important though, is that I have a 64 bit version of Solitaire! ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 01:33:52 2006 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 21:33:52 -0400 Subject: [GW-C] Re:Tom's HW Guide: Linux for gaming In-Reply-To: <20060814142050.GD13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <44BAF994.8080401@telly.org> <44DA2D20.1080107@georgetown.wehave.net> <20060814142050.GD13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <44E12480.7070907@execulink.com> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > > Well I did see this: > http://www.infoworld.com/article/06/08/02/32OPcurve_1.html > One can always hope there is some truth to that. > I didn't see any mention of newly released specs for OGD1, the Open Graphics Development board, series 1 http://opengraphics.org/ "The card, called the 'OGD1' for 'Open Graphics Development', is intended for small-quantity production to be used by developers interested in designing the Verilog code for the FPGA chip on the card, and will likely cost about US$1000 per unit. This design, when completed, will form the basis for an ASIC version of the board, expected to run closer to US$200. OGD developers are hoping that GNU/Linux users will be willing to pay the higher price (driven primarily by expected small production runs) in order to have a fully-specified 3D graphics card with fully open specifications and hardware design." greg -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 01:15:07 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 21:15:07 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: <20060814144021.GA9312-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <44E1201B.9030401@rogers.com> William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: > On Mon, Aug 14, 2006 at 10:25:12AM -0400, Lennart Sorensen wrote: >> On Mon, Aug 14, 2006 at 09:56:59AM -0400, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: >>> explained dual booting and virtualization as a couple of choices, and >>> she's decided that she wants to dual boot. >> Most people I know eventually find dual booting a pain because you have >> to stop everything you are doing and switch. You often end up only > > I know this, and I explained it to my wife, but doesn't think it'll be a > big deal. We might know better, but nothing teaches like experience. I > can install VMWare later, if she decides that that is what she needs. > What you may want to do, is create a FAT32 partition and move the "My Documents" folder to it. This will make it easier for her to move documents between the 2 systems. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 01:40:14 2006 From: jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Jason Shein) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 21:40:14 -0400 Subject: simple open source document management system In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200608142140.14657.jason@detachednetworks.ca> On Monday 14 August 2006 15:52, Dave Cramer wrote: > Can anyone recommend a web based very simple, preferrably backed by > cvs, or svn, but not necessary document system > http://mydms.sourceforge.net/ From the project website: "MyDMS is an open-source, web-based document management system written in PHP and supported by an SQL database. Originally coded by Markus Westphal, MyDMS provides document meta-data, version control, security and easy access to your documents. MyDMS is distributed under the terms of the GNU General Public Licence (GPL), Version 2." -- Jason Shein Director of Networking, Operations and Systems Detached Networks jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org ( 905 ) - 876 - 4158 Voice ( 905 ) - 876 - 5817 Mobile http://www.detachednetworks.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 01:49:41 2006 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 18:49:41 -0700 Subject: [GW-C] Re:Tom's HW Guide: Linux for gaming In-Reply-To: <44E12480.7070907-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ@public.gmane.org> References: <44BAF994.8080401@telly.org> <44DA2D20.1080107@georgetown.wehave.net> <20060814142050.GD13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44E12480.7070907@execulink.com> Message-ID: On 8/14/06, Gregory D Hough wrote: > Lennart Sorensen wrote: > > > > Well I did see this: > > http://www.infoworld.com/article/06/08/02/32OPcurve_1.html > > One can always hope there is some truth to that. > > > > I didn't see any mention of newly released specs for OGD1, the Open > Graphics Development board, series 1 > > http://opengraphics.org/ How close are they to actually releasing something??? I am having difficulty distinguishing this from other "hardware vapourware" like the "Freedom CPU" (F-CPU) which went pretty well nowhere. It would be very nice to have an "open source graphics card" or an "OSS CPU," but I really don't see it happening soon. :-( -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html Oddly enough, this is completely standard behaviour for shells. This is a roundabout way of saying `don't use combined chains of `&&'s and `||'s unless you think G?del's theorem is for sissies'. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 04:08:04 2006 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 00:08:04 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: <20060814144021.GA9312-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <20060815040804.GA14384@waltdnes.org> On Mon, Aug 14, 2006 at 10:40:21AM -0400, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote > So, is Flash on a 64bit machine possible? If so, how? Have you considered simply pretending that it's a 32-bit machine, and running in 32-bit mode? Right now, there's no "64-bit-only killer-app". The AMD64 is *NOT* an Itanium with crummy 32-bit emulation. You don't really lose anything by running in 32-bit mode. It solves the hassle of dealing with 32-bit-only stuff like Flash, codecs, Realplayer, etc, etc, because you are really running in 32-bit mode. -- Walter Dnes In linux /sbin/init is Job #1 My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 04:22:24 2006 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 00:22:24 -0400 Subject: Accessing serial-usb ports: Solved In-Reply-To: <50057.207.188.64.111.1155508976.squirrel-2RFepEojUI2DznVbVsZi4adLQS1dU2Lr@public.gmane.org> References: <50519.207.188.65.151.1155353473.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> <20060813202428.GA11956@waltdnes.org> <50010.207.188.64.111.1155502559.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> <50057.207.188.64.111.1155508976.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> Message-ID: <20060815042224.GB14384@waltdnes.org> On Sun, Aug 13, 2006 at 06:42:56PM -0400, phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org wrote > It turns out to be quite simple. > > The fix is to edit the file > /etc/udev/permissions.d/50-udev.permissions > so that the USB ports ttyUSB* start up with permissions 666 rather than 660. > > Thank-you, Walter, for pointing me in that direction. Glad to be able to help. I don't have that file. Are you running PAM? I'm not. I know that /etc/udev/50-udev.rules gets replaced every so often when running upgrades on Gentoo. I don't claim to know what happens with the 50-udev.permissions file. -- Walter Dnes In linux /sbin/init is Job #1 My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From dwarmstrong-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 04:36:57 2006 From: dwarmstrong-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Daniel Armstrong) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 00:36:57 -0400 Subject: Chinese character help needed In-Reply-To: <20060811000315.50132.qmail-twPDCWrZ0p2A/QwVtaZbd3CJp6faPEW9@public.gmane.org> References: <20060811000315.50132.qmail@web52914.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <61e9e2b10608142136m3bfc4517n580f9bec15044927@mail.gmail.com> On 8/10/06, Buzz Lightyear wrote: > I am running Kanotix Linux in English. My goal is to > run it in English and in Chinese so I can 1) read > Chinese characters on various web pages and 2) if > possible, type in Chinese. > > How do I go about adding Chinese characters in Kanotix > that will allow me to do this? I have a friend using Kanotix with a Chinese girlfriend who occasionally needs to use his Linux box, and I setup for him the ability to view and input Chinese on his English-language desktop... I just wrote up a HOWTO outlining what I did: http://biohackery.com/node/21 Hope it helps! -- Daniel Wayne Armstrong :: build it yourself biology http://biohackery.com :: -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From zuzhihui-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 06:52:45 2006 From: zuzhihui-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (=?GB2312?B?WnUgWmhpaHVpICjX5ta+u9Qp?=) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 14:52:45 +0800 Subject: Clustering and cronjobs In-Reply-To: <20060814153518.GC1367-ajb9/b42oWj7qFZT6RBq9oSPOIov7LNK@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814153518.GC1367@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> Message-ID: <64360a0d0608142352g3d9c381ci3035a0bd052e3c10@mail.gmail.com> Assume your shared storage is mounted on /opt/data Use the following script as your cron script. mountpoint -q /opt/data if [ $? -eq 0 ]; then echo "this is the active node" #execute some scripts. else echo "this is not the active node, do nothing" fi Hope it help 2006/8/14, Neil Watson : > I'm setting up a cluster using the Redhat Cluster suite. The cluster > offers a DB2 service. So far my tests seem to be working. I'll post a > report on how is did this later if anyone is interested. > > I'm not sure how to handle specific cron jobs that must be run on the > active node only. Does anyone have any experience with this? > > -- > Neil Watson | Gentoo Linux > System Administrator | Uptime 18 days > http://watson-wilson.ca | 2.6.16.19 AMD Athlon(tm) MP 2000+ x 2 > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 08:11:24 2006 From: hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (D. Hugh Redelmeier) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 04:11:24 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: <20060815040804.GA14384-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060815040804.GA14384@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: | From: Walter Dnes | On Mon, Aug 14, 2006 at 10:40:21AM -0400, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote | | > So, is Flash on a 64bit machine possible? If so, how? | | Have you considered simply pretending that it's a 32-bit machine, and | running in 32-bit mode? Right now, there's no "64-bit-only killer-app". This is the most pragmatic solution. I'm not always pragmatic. I run 64-bit Fedora. It can run 64-bit and 32-bit programs: both sets of shared libraries are installed. Even this isn't as clean as you'd like, at least for firefox. When you install Firefox, you get the 64-bit version. It is tough to replace it with a 32-bit version because several things depend on it (at least in my system -- things like Eclipse). I've installed both, but the startup of Firefox detects if you have one already running and uses it instead of a new one. So you cannot trivially have both running at once. And I always seem to have one running already. Debian does not yet support "multiarch". Hence Debian 64-bit users, if they need to run 32-bit programs, do so in a chroot environment. I would *guess* that this is an effort to set up. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 12:32:27 2006 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 08:32:27 -0400 Subject: litp06, apathy reading Message-ID: In response to the lack of response to my earlier Linux In The Park posts, I send this out to you; Torontos most linuxy lads and lasses; litp06 was initiated by the TLUG membership. As It's happening accross the street, some organazational elements have fallen into my lap. I have had very little response to my posts, but continue to try and make this years bun-fest something special. Is anyone out there actually interested ? Can I get a hand in the co-ordinating efforts ? Maybe even a little whoop-whoop ?? thanks, djp -- djp-tnsZcVQxgqO2dHQpreyxbg at public.gmane.org www.linuxcaffe.ca 326 Harbord Street, Toronto, M6G 3A5, (416) 534-2116 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 07:35:25 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 08:35:25 +0100 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060815040804.GA14384@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <44E1793D.5070006@utoronto.ca> D. Hugh Redelmeier wrote: > | From: Walter Dnes > > | On Mon, Aug 14, 2006 at 10:40:21AM -0400, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote > | > | > So, is Flash on a 64bit machine possible? If so, how? > | > | Have you considered simply pretending that it's a 32-bit machine, and > | running in 32-bit mode? Right now, there's no "64-bit-only killer-app". > Debian does not yet support "multiarch". Hence Debian 64-bit users, > if they need to run 32-bit programs, do so in a chroot environment. I > would *guess* that this is an effort to set up. Not necessarily. I've been using 64bit Ubunutu on my home machine for about 8 months now and don't have a chroot setup. I do have flash and java working with firefox too. Take a look here: http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=202537 It should be trivial to do the same with a Debian testing system. Jamon -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 13:05:46 2006 From: interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (Interlug) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 09:05:46 -0400 Subject: litp06, apathy reading In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1155647146.3511.71.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2006-15-08 at 08:32 -0400, David J Patrick wrote: > In response to the lack of response to my earlier Linux In The Park > posts, I send this out to you; Torontos most linuxy lads and lasses; [ ... ] > Maybe even a little whoop-whoop ?? David, I'll give you a "whoop whoop!!" May I add some cowbell? Linux in the Park 2006 was mentioned at the KWLUG meeting last night, and was greeted with some interest. Reaction was along the lines of "Linux picnic? And beside Linuxcaffe? I've always meant to go there..." You'll probably see a handful of KWLUG folks over the course of the day. Sorry to hear that you are not getting enough support from your local constituents. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lfeder-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 13:10:07 2006 From: lfeder-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (lfeder) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 09:10:07 -0400 Subject: 2X-PXSE Thin Client Message-ID: Does anyone use the PXSE from 2X.com? PXSE looks awesome! -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 13:10:50 2006 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 09:10:50 -0400 Subject: litp06, apathy reading In-Reply-To: <1155647146.3511.71.camel-bi+AKbBUZKY6gyzm1THtWbp2dZbC/Bob@public.gmane.org> References: <1155647146.3511.71.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: On 8/15/06, Interlug wrote: > > I'll give you a "whoop whoop!!" May I add some cowbell? oh YEAH ! > > Linux in the Park 2006 was mentioned at the KWLUG meeting last night, > and was greeted with some interest. Reaction was along the lines of > "Linux picnic? And beside Linuxcaffe? I've always meant to go > there..." You'll probably see a handful of KWLUG folks over the course > of the day. lookin forward to it ! (with your nod) I'll add the GPG signing event, to the activities page. > > Sorry to hear that you are not getting enough support from your local > constituents. well, we both know what a motly bunch of beer swilling louts (and loutettes) they can be ! ;-) djp -- djp-tnsZcVQxgqO2dHQpreyxbg at public.gmane.org www.linuxcaffe.ca 326 Harbord Street, Toronto, M6G 3A5, (416) 534-2116 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 13:12:31 2006 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 09:12:31 -0400 Subject: litp06 wiki Message-ID: http://gtalug.org/wiki/Linux_in_the_Park_2006 ready and waiting for your input ! djp -- djp-tnsZcVQxgqO2dHQpreyxbg at public.gmane.org www.linuxcaffe.ca 326 Harbord Street, Toronto, M6G 3A5, (416) 534-2116 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 13:16:42 2006 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 09:16:42 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060815040804.GA14384@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <44E1C93A.4070305@georgetown.wehave.net> D. Hugh Redelmeier wrote: > Debian does not yet support "multiarch". Hence Debian 64-bit users, > if they need to run 32-bit programs, do so in a chroot environment. I > would *guess* that this is an effort to set up. It isn't too bad. debootstrap to install minimal Linux system in a directory, chroot into it and install firefox/etc and finally bind mount your required partitions within the chroot. As a regular user you can then run 32bit firefox using dchroot: dchroot firefox There's a good howto kicking around out there but my brief search didn't find it. -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 13:18:29 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 09:18:29 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: <20060815040804.GA14384-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060815040804.GA14384@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <20060815131829.GG13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 15, 2006 at 12:08:04AM -0400, Walter Dnes wrote: > Have you considered simply pretending that it's a 32-bit machine, and > running in 32-bit mode? Right now, there's no "64-bit-only killer-app". > The AMD64 is *NOT* an Itanium with crummy 32-bit emulation. You don't > really lose anything by running in 32-bit mode. It solves the hassle of > dealing with 32-bit-only stuff like Flash, codecs, Realplayer, etc, etc, > because you are really running in 32-bit mode. The AMD does run faster in 64bit mode in general. Not a lot, but not nothing. This isn't true of some intel's when running in 64bit mode where some of them get slower instead. For convinience however, running 32bit mode is a lot simpler until someone gets everything working. :) -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 13:19:53 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 09:19:53 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060815040804.GA14384@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <20060815131953.GH13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 15, 2006 at 04:11:24AM -0400, D. Hugh Redelmeier wrote: > This is the most pragmatic solution. I'm not always pragmatic. > > I run 64-bit Fedora. It can run 64-bit and 32-bit programs: both sets > of shared libraries are installed. Even this isn't as clean as you'd > like, at least for firefox. When you install Firefox, you get the > 64-bit version. It is tough to replace it with a 32-bit version > because several things depend on it (at least in my system -- things > like Eclipse). I've installed both, but the startup of Firefox > detects if you have one already running and uses it instead of a new > one. So you cannot trivially have both running at once. And I always > seem to have one running already. > > Debian does not yet support "multiarch". Hence Debian 64-bit users, > if they need to run 32-bit programs, do so in a chroot environment. I > would *guess* that this is an effort to set up. Yeah it takes like 10 or 15 minutes to do following the howto. There are a few tricks for a few programs to deal with, but for most things it works fine. I actually run 32bit debian on an amd64, with a 64bit kernel, and then 64bit debian in a chroot. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rob-3Aypa9sX/B7wvR0lvYjcXw at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 13:24:17 2006 From: rob-3Aypa9sX/B7wvR0lvYjcXw at public.gmane.org (Rob Sutherland) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 09:24:17 -0400 Subject: Arrrr... :-) In-Reply-To: <7DC9BEDA-88F2-4869-8943-31E2ED71D783-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> References: <200608091626.39899.mervc@eol.ca> <200608092147.19931.mervc@eol.ca> <7DC9BEDA-88F2-4869-8943-31E2ED71D783@gmail.com> Message-ID: <200608150924.17982.rob@luckdancing.com> This fascinating tidbit showed up on /. this morn... http://www2.piratpartiet.se/nyheter/press_release_pirate_party_launches_worlds_first_commercial_darknet/ I'm just sitting here imagining our political 'leaders' jumping on this bandwagon - visualizing Steven Harper and Jack Layton swishbuckling around like Johnny Depp is good for a laugh anyway :-) Rob -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 13:55:24 2006 From: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 09:55:24 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Accessing serial-usb ports: Solved In-Reply-To: <20060815042224.GB14384-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <50519.207.188.65.151.1155353473.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> <20060813202428.GA11956@waltdnes.org> <50010.207.188.64.111.1155502559.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> <50057.207.188.64.111.1155508976.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> <20060815042224.GB14384@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <50567.207.188.64.117.1155650124.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> > Walter Dnes wrote: > Glad to be able to help. I don't have that file. Are you running > PAM? I'm not. I know that /etc/udev/50-udev.rules gets replaced every > so often when running upgrades on Gentoo. I don't claim to know what > happens with the 50-udev.permissions file. It's looking as if 50-udev.permissions exists under Suse and RedHat. It doesn't exist under Ubuntu, though there may be another file with an equivalent name. I'm not surprised that it's vulnerable to an upgrade. In fact, RedHat recommend that you not modify this file, but they don't provide enough information for an alternative. And the rules for udev are dauntingly complex. Now the question is this: if you have a file by some name that sets the permissions on certain devices in the same manner as 50-udev.permissions does under Suse, and this file does not mention the ttyUSB ports, can you simply add a suitable entry, such as ttyUSB*:root:uucp:666 We'll try that under Ubuntu and see if it works. P. -- Peter Hiscocks Syscomp Electronic Design Limited, Toronto http://www.syscompdesign.com USB Oscilloscope and Waveform Generator 647-839-0325 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 14:01:43 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 10:01:43 -0400 (EDT) Subject: litp06, apathy reading In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20060815140143.9968.qmail@web88207.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- David J Patrick wrote: > In response to the lack of response to my earlier > Linux In The Park > posts, I send this out to you; Torontos most linuxy > lads and lasses; > > litp06 was initiated by the TLUG membership. As It's > happening accross > the street, some organazational elements have fallen > into my lap. I > have had very little response to my posts, but > continue to try and > make this years bun-fest something special. > > Is anyone out there actually interested ? I am VERY interested, my problem at the moment is a lack of time. I expected that putting together an intro. article on Procmail would be a challenge, it is proving to be a nightmare. Still in a few days I expect to be rid of that horror, and I will be delighted to do what I can to help. > Can I get a hand in the co-ordinating efforts ? Give me a few days and I will be happy to help. For now, a few ideas: - Do a starting with wireless talk at LITP? - Hardware hacking, like building a Pringles can antenna. - A trivia contest with questions like: - Just recently we had the anniversary of the release of the IBM 5150. What was the 5150 better known as? - The IBM 5150 was created in Boca Raton, Florida, what is the literal translation of Boca Raton from Spanish? - If you were a hardware designer, did you see the IBM 5150 as having an 8 or 16 bit CPU. - A scavenger hunt, where people will be asked to find various things around the park (i.e. trash and/or picnic baskets they bring with them). All items would have various point values, like: - Empty Coke or Pepsi can - 5 points - Max 2 cans - Empty flavoured Coke or Pepsi can (i.e.: Cherry coke, Lime Pepsi) - 10 points - Max 2 cans - Necktie - 20 points - Max 1 - Women's disposable razor - 20 points - Max 1 > Maybe even a little whoop-whoop ?? whoop-whoop whoop-whoop whoop-whoop whoop-whoop etc. > thanks, > djp > > -- > djp-tnsZcVQxgqO2dHQpreyxbg at public.gmane.org > www.linuxcaffe.ca > 326 Harbord Street, Toronto, M6G 3A5, (416) 534-2116 > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: > http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text > below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: > http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 14:45:59 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 10:45:59 -0400 (EDT) Subject: litp06 wiki In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20060815144559.42393.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- David J Patrick wrote: > http://gtalug.org/wiki/Linux_in_the_Park_2006 > > ready and waiting for your input ! I've put in my 0.02 cents worth... Quick question, when I posted the note about Linux in the Park to the upcoming.org website I put the event website as being: linuxcaffe.com/node/439 Should I replace that with the above URL? Other comments anyone? Colin. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 15:02:45 2006 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 15:02:45 +0000 Subject: Clustering and cronjobs In-Reply-To: <64360a0d0608142352g3d9c381ci3035a0bd052e3c10-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814153518.GC1367@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> <64360a0d0608142352g3d9c381ci3035a0bd052e3c10@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 8/15/06, Zu Zhihui (???) wrote: > Assume your shared storage is mounted on /opt/data > Use the following script as your cron script. > > > mountpoint -q /opt/data > if [ $? -eq 0 ]; then > echo "this is the active node" > #execute some scripts. > else > echo "this is not the active node, do nothing" > fi There's probably also an IP address associated with the active node. So, if IFCONFIG is set to something suitable like /sbin/ifconfig, and ACTIVEIP is set to the IP address of the IP that the active node claims, then... if [[ `${IFCONFIG} -a | grep "${ACTIVEIP}"` ]] ; then echo "this is the active node" # Do some stuff on the active node else echo "These are not the droids you're looking for; you can go about your business" fi -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html Oddly enough, this is completely standard behaviour for shells. This is a roundabout way of saying `don't use combined chains of `&&'s and `||'s unless you think G?del's theorem is for sissies'. From jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 15:26:04 2006 From: jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 11:26:04 -0400 Subject: C question In-Reply-To: <44BFB61C.1070101-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <44BFB61C.1070101@alteeve.com> Message-ID: execv doesn't behave quite the way you expect. It doesn't want a list of arguments concatenated together (you'd use the system() call if that were the case; and it has its own problems if there are escape characters embedded in any of the arguments). execv() expects its first argument to be the path to the executable in question (this is correct below). It expects its second argument to be a pointer to a NULL-terminated array of pointers...basically a memory address where it can find an array of memory addresses (each of which points at one argument). After the last memory address in the array, there should be one more pointer which is 0 (NULL) to indicate the end of the list. On 7/20/06, Madison Kelly wrote: > #include > > #define REAL_PATH \ > "/home/digimer/projects/mizu-bu/releases/mizu-bu/cgi-bin/exec-priv.pl" > main(int argc, char *argv[]) Should be "int main", as already pointed out. > { > setuid(geteuid()); > setgid(getegid()); > var say; > say="Hello"; You don't need this at all. What you do want: char **myArgs = NULL; /* This will allocate (and zero) enough memory for all of this * program's arguments, plus one null at the end */ myArgs = calloc( argc + 1, sizeof(char*) ); > > int i; > for (i=1; i { > printf("%s%s", argv[i], (i < argc-1) ? " " : ""); This line should be: /* Make myArgs[i] point to its matching argv[i] */ myArgs[i] = &argv[i]; > } > printf("\n"); > printf("%s", say); These two printf statements aren't relevant anymore. :) > /* execv(REAL_PATH, av);*/ Here you'd want to: execv(REAL_PATH, myArgs); > } > > Thanks for any help!! For future reference (in response to other messages in this thread), don't use sprintf or strcat, only snprintf and strncat. Buffer overruns are far too common and avoidable. :) -- taa /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 15:30:44 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 11:30:44 -0400 Subject: Arrrr... :-) In-Reply-To: <200608150924.17982.rob-3Aypa9sX/B7wvR0lvYjcXw@public.gmane.org> References: <200608091626.39899.mervc@eol.ca> <200608092147.19931.mervc@eol.ca> <7DC9BEDA-88F2-4869-8943-31E2ED71D783@gmail.com> <200608150924.17982.rob@luckdancing.com> Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608150830i50b8a2afnb28eb93be8082d92@mail.gmail.com> On 8/15/06, Rob Sutherland wrote: > This fascinating tidbit showed up on /. this morn... > > http://www2.piratpartiet.se/nyheter/press_release_pirate_party_launches_worlds_first_commercial_darknet/ > > I'm just sitting here imagining our political 'leaders' jumping on this > bandwagon - visualizing Steven Harper and Jack Layton swishbuckling around > like Johnny Depp is good for a laugh anyway :-) Aye, now that there be a powerful imagination! I can see Caption Jack, but Harper? Heheh. Seriously though, from my admittidly lacking knowledge of political theory, it looks like foundations are being set for a new class of political parties - parties capable of communicating effectively (with modern tools, internet et. al) with the public, and capable of leveraging the benefits of a public think tank. -- Scott Elcomb http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ http://search.cpan.org/~selcomb/SAL-3.03/ http://psema4.googlepages.com/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 15:32:20 2006 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy Ali) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 11:32:20 -0400 Subject: Arrrr... :-) In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f0608150830i50b8a2afnb28eb93be8082d92-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <200608091626.39899.mervc@eol.ca> <200608092147.19931.mervc@eol.ca> <7DC9BEDA-88F2-4869-8943-31E2ED71D783@gmail.com> <200608150924.17982.rob@luckdancing.com> <99a6c38f0608150830i50b8a2afnb28eb93be8082d92@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1e55af990608150832j2c785676v290567c4cf8cfd4d@mail.gmail.com> On 8/15/06, Scott Elcomb wrote: > Seriously though, from my admittidly lacking knowledge of political > theory, it looks like foundations are being set for a new class of > political parties - parties capable of communicating effectively (with > modern tools, internet et. al) with the public, and capable of > leveraging the benefits of a public think tank. The pirate party, in Canada? http://www.pp-international.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=155 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 15:43:49 2006 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 11:43:49 -0400 Subject: litp06 wiki In-Reply-To: <20060815144559.42393.qmail-DooQHYYYUaiB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060815144559.42393.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On 8/15/06, Colin McGregor wrote: > > I've put in my 0.02 cents worth... Nice ! some fun ideas, there ! > > Quick question, when I posted the note about Linux in > the Park to the upcoming.org website I put the event > website as being: > > linuxcaffe.com/node/439 > > Should I replace that with the above URL? YES ! > > Other comments anyone? well ? ;-) djp -- djp-tnsZcVQxgqO2dHQpreyxbg at public.gmane.org www.linuxcaffe.ca 326 Harbord Street, Toronto, M6G 3A5, (416) 534-2116 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From paul-fQIO8zZcxYtFkWKT+BUv2w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 16:05:33 2006 From: paul-fQIO8zZcxYtFkWKT+BUv2w at public.gmane.org (Paul Nash) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 12:05:33 -0400 Subject: .NET (was Re:C question) In-Reply-To: References: <44BFB61C.1070101@alteeve.com> Message-ID: >execv() expects its first argument to be the path to the executable in >question (this is correct below). Does anyone know of an execv() for .NET? I'm forced to do some Windows Forms work in C# Visual Studio, and the closest that I can find is the Process class, which has a system()-like argument procesor, which is driving me nuts. I can quote wiith the best of them, but Windows' quoting is brain-dead, and this has to exec() something that exec()s ssh to a remote machine where the command line args get de-quoted *again* by another somewhat brain-dead server application that I have little or no control over. Sheeh! Any pointers? paul -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 16:38:45 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 12:38:45 -0400 Subject: litp06, apathy reading In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: David J Patrick wrote: > In response to the lack of response to my earlier Linux In The Park > posts, I send this out to you; Torontos most linuxy lads and lasses; > > litp06 was initiated by the TLUG membership. As It's happening accross > the street, some organazational elements have fallen into my lap. I > have had very little response to my posts, but continue to try and > make this years bun-fest something special. > > Is anyone out there actually interested ? > Can I get a hand in the co-ordinating efforts ? > Maybe even a little whoop-whoop ?? wewt! whoot! woot! w00t! Getting a copy of "Revolution OS" for my permanent collection: http://www.revolution-os.com/index.html I've got a copy of "The Codebreakers", a BBC documentary on FOSS and international development. It is available under a Creative Commons attribution license: http://www.apdip.net/news/fossdoc Would like to have a copy of "The Code" to screen at LITP: http://imdb.com/title/tt0315417/ Anyone have anything else related that they could bring? W00T! Jamon -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 16:54:13 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 12:54:13 -0400 Subject: litp06, apathy reading In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608150954y10276bbdy8f4527ed015af07f@mail.gmail.com> On 8/15/06, Jamon Camisso wrote: > Would like to have a copy of "The Code" to screen at LITP: > http://imdb.com/title/tt0315417/ Not screening quality, but the movie can be found at: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3498228245415745977 -- Scott Elcomb http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ http://search.cpan.org/~selcomb/SAL-3.03/ http://psema4.googlepages.com/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rickl-ZACYGPecefkm4kRHVhTciCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 17:20:56 2006 From: rickl-ZACYGPecefkm4kRHVhTciCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Rick Tomaschuk) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 13:20:56 -0400 Subject: litp06, apathy reading In-Reply-To: <20060815140143.9968.qmail-2K+iNxKRQwOB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060815140143.9968.qmail@web88207.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1155662456.23271.10.camel@spot1.localhost.com> I'm not sure if I be able to be there so I dropped off some NUI magazines and nicknack's at Linuxcaffe this morning. RickT http://www.TorontoNUI.ca On Tue, 2006-08-15 at 10:01 -0400, Colin McGregor wrote: > --- David J Patrick > wrote: > > In response to the lack of response to my earlier > > Linux In The Park > > posts, I send this out to you; Torontos most linuxy > > lads and lasses; > > > > litp06 was initiated by the TLUG membership. As It's > > happening accross > > the street, some organazational elements have fallen > > into my lap. I > > have had very little response to my posts, but > > continue to try and > > make this years bun-fest something special. > > > > Is anyone out there actually interested ? > > I am VERY interested, my problem at the moment is a > lack of time. I expected that putting together an > intro. article on Procmail would be a challenge, it is > proving to be a nightmare. Still in a few days I > expect to be rid of that horror, and I will be > delighted to do what I can to help. > > > Can I get a hand in the co-ordinating efforts ? > > Give me a few days and I will be happy to help. > > For now, a few ideas: > > - Do a starting with wireless talk at LITP? > - Hardware hacking, like building a Pringles can > antenna. > - A trivia contest with questions like: > - Just recently we had the anniversary of the > release of the IBM 5150. What was the 5150 better > known as? > - The IBM 5150 was created in Boca Raton, Florida, > what is the literal translation of Boca Raton from > Spanish? > - If you were a hardware designer, did you see the > IBM 5150 as having an 8 or 16 bit CPU. > - A scavenger hunt, where people will be asked to find > various things around the park (i.e. trash and/or > picnic baskets they bring with them). All items would > have various point values, like: > - Empty Coke or Pepsi can - 5 points - Max 2 cans > - Empty flavoured Coke or Pepsi can (i.e.: Cherry > coke, Lime Pepsi) - 10 points - Max 2 cans > - Necktie - 20 points - Max 1 > - Women's disposable razor - 20 points - Max 1 > > > Maybe even a little whoop-whoop ?? > > whoop-whoop > whoop-whoop > whoop-whoop > whoop-whoop > etc. > > > thanks, > > djp > > > > -- > > djp-tnsZcVQxgqO2dHQpreyxbg at public.gmane.org > > www.linuxcaffe.ca > > 326 Harbord Street, Toronto, M6G 3A5, (416) 534-2116 > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: > > http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text > > below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: > > http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- http://www.TorontoNUI.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jvetterli-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 18:06:42 2006 From: jvetterli-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org (John Vetterli) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 14:06:42 -0400 (EDT) Subject: litp06 wiki In-Reply-To: References: <20060815144559.42393.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 15 Aug 2006, David J Patrick wrote: > On 8/15/06, Colin McGregor wrote: >> Other comments anyone? > well ? Inquiring minds want to know: where did you get a ten foot inflatable penguin? JV -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From alain.maisonneuve_lists-QX23z+6opsUOxlH4FaG5hA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 19:08:18 2006 From: alain.maisonneuve_lists-QX23z+6opsUOxlH4FaG5hA at public.gmane.org (alain.maisonneuve_lists-QX23z+6opsUOxlH4FaG5hA at public.gmane.org) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 15:08:18 -0400 Subject: Remote Desktop Connection Message-ID: <20060815150818.70rr0yr9n47k8osk@webmail.swiftpenguin.com> Hi all, Whats the best way to connect from a linux box to a window XP machines Remote Desktop Connection (RDP)? I don't want to install vnc. What are the good alternatives? Cheers, Alain -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tlug-neil-8agRmHhQ+n2CxnSzwYWP7Q at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 19:10:31 2006 From: tlug-neil-8agRmHhQ+n2CxnSzwYWP7Q at public.gmane.org (Neil Watson) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 15:10:31 -0400 Subject: Remote Desktop Connection In-Reply-To: <20060815150818.70rr0yr9n47k8osk-2RFepEojUI1BfbfP7qimxQ7GUfgVobmE@public.gmane.org> References: <20060815150818.70rr0yr9n47k8osk@webmail.swiftpenguin.com> Message-ID: <20060815191031.GE29434@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> On Tue, Aug 15, 2006 at 03:08:18PM -0400, alain.maisonneuve_lists-QX23z+6opsUOxlH4FaG5hA at public.gmane.org wrote: >Whats the best way to connect from a linux box to a window XP machines Remote >Desktop Connection (RDP)? There is a Linux RDP client. It works very well. -- Neil Watson | Gentoo Linux System Administrator | Uptime 19 days http://watson-wilson.ca | 2.6.16.19 AMD Athlon(tm) MP 2000+ x 2 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 19:18:16 2006 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 19:18:16 +0000 Subject: Remote Desktop Connection In-Reply-To: <20060815150818.70rr0yr9n47k8osk-2RFepEojUI1BfbfP7qimxQ7GUfgVobmE@public.gmane.org> References: <20060815150818.70rr0yr9n47k8osk@webmail.swiftpenguin.com> Message-ID: On 8/15/06, alain.maisonneuve_lists-QX23z+6opsUOxlH4FaG5hA at public.gmane.org wrote: > Hi all, > > Whats the best way to connect from a linux box to a window XP machines Remote > Desktop Connection (RDP)? > > I don't want to install vnc. What are the good alternatives? http://www.rdesktop.org/ It's pretty stable; on those rare occasions when I need access to Windows from my desktop (usually to run deviant versions of web browsers), I can connect to our Windows server with rdesktop... -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/rdp.html Oddly enough, this is completely standard behaviour for shells. This is a roundabout way of saying `don't use combined chains of `&&'s and `||'s unless you think G?del's theorem is for sissies'. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tleslie-RBVUpeUoHUc at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 19:54:21 2006 From: tleslie-RBVUpeUoHUc at public.gmane.org (ted leslie) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 15:54:21 -0400 Subject: Remote Desktop Connection In-Reply-To: <20060815150818.70rr0yr9n47k8osk-2RFepEojUI1BfbfP7qimxQ7GUfgVobmE@public.gmane.org> References: <20060815150818.70rr0yr9n47k8osk@webmail.swiftpenguin.com> Message-ID: <1155671661.8241.150.camel@stan64.site> i have run into some font rendering issues with rdesktop to windows, so rdesktop/vnc isnt acceptable for me. i am currently eval'ing a vnc through NX (nomachine.com) middle ware cache/compressor, it is faster (less bandwidth) then rdp/rdesktop on some stuff, but is really bad on some stuff as well, like nested menus, etc. they (nomachine) claim that vnc (over NX) is even better then rdp (even by factors of 2X or more), but i think that number comes only from their graphic caching abilities, and if you are not revisiting the same graphics over and over again, but rather doing more core GUI (pulldowns, buttons, etc) rdp is preferable. it is working well through a 64Kbit access to a XP pro desktop, making it fairly usable. if rdesktop/rdp doesnt do it for you, try vnc over NX -tl On Tue, 2006-08-15 at 15:08 -0400, alain.maisonneuve_lists-QX23z+6opsUOxlH4FaG5hA at public.gmane.org wrote: > Hi all, > > Whats the best way to connect from a linux box to a window XP machines Remote > Desktop Connection (RDP)? > > I don't want to install vnc. What are the good alternatives? > > Cheers, > Alain > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 19:53:18 2006 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 15:53:18 -0400 Subject: litp06 wiki In-Reply-To: <20060815144559.42393.qmail-DooQHYYYUaiB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060815144559.42393.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On 8/15/06, Colin McGregor wrote: > I've put in my 0.02 cents worth... and I've deposited that $0.02 into the discussion tab of the Activities page. thank yoo ! djp -- djp-tnsZcVQxgqO2dHQpreyxbg at public.gmane.org www.linuxcaffe.ca 326 Harbord Street, Toronto, M6G 3A5, (416) 534-2116 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 19:56:12 2006 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 15:56:12 -0400 Subject: litp06, apathy reading In-Reply-To: <1155662456.23271.10.camel-GVHZqC5MSyVSXSDylEipykEOCMrvLtNR@public.gmane.org> References: <20060815140143.9968.qmail@web88207.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <1155662456.23271.10.camel@spot1.localhost.com> Message-ID: On 8/15/06, Rick Tomaschuk wrote: > I'm not sure if I be able to be there so I dropped off some NUI > magazines and nicknack's at Linuxcaffe this morning. Thanks Rick ! the disk will be in the "free as in beer" bin, the pins on the board, the books in the stack, magazines strewn around and the nifty Novell mumus on the staff ! -- djp-tnsZcVQxgqO2dHQpreyxbg at public.gmane.org www.linuxcaffe.ca 326 Harbord Street, Toronto, M6G 3A5, (416) 534-2116 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From moliver-fC0AHe2n+mcIvw5+aKnW+Pd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 19:57:34 2006 From: moliver-fC0AHe2n+mcIvw5+aKnW+Pd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org (moliver-fC0AHe2n+mcIvw5+aKnW+Pd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 15:57:34 -0400 Subject: OT: =?iso-8859-1?b?R/ZkZWwncw==?= incompleteness theorems In-Reply-To: References: <20060815150818.70rr0yr9n47k8osk@webmail.swiftpenguin.com> Message-ID: <20060815155734.f9lxf3sf3ksgoock@mail.math.yorku.ca> Quoting Christopher Browne : (presumably quoting someone else) > Oddly enough, this is completely standard behaviour for shells. This > is a roundabout way of saying `don't use combined chains of `&&'s and > `||'s unless you think G?del's theorem is for sissies'. Hi Christopher, would you mind giving the context of your .sig? It doesn't seem to make a lot of sense on its own -- for one thing, the G?del theorems don't apply to propositional logic, as the latter is too weak for the theorems to attach. You need quantifiers before you get any nontrivial application of G?del. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 20:37:25 2006 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:37:25 +0000 Subject: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re:_:_OT:_G=F6del's_incompleteness_theorems?= In-Reply-To: <20060815155734.f9lxf3sf3ksgoock-eRF/mgt17vYuqM34mc2EBrDks+cytr/Z@public.gmane.org> References: <20060815150818.70rr0yr9n47k8osk@webmail.swiftpenguin.com> <20060815155734.f9lxf3sf3ksgoock@mail.math.yorku.ca> Message-ID: On 8/15/06, moliver-fC0AHe2n+mcIvw5+aKnW+Pd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org wrote: > Quoting Christopher Browne : > (presumably quoting someone else) > > Oddly enough, this is completely standard behaviour for shells. This > > is a roundabout way of saying `don't use combined chains of `&&'s and > > `||'s unless you think G?del's theorem is for sissies'. > > Hi Christopher, > > would you mind giving the context of your .sig? It doesn't > seem to make a lot of sense on its own -- for one thing, > the G?del theorems don't apply to propositional logic, > as the latter is too weak for the theorems to attach. > You need quantifiers before you get any nontrivial application > of G?del. It's a quote from in the middle of some of the zsh documentation... See section 3.8.1. The point of the quote isn't about an actual application of G?del's theorem; it's that there's a shell behaviour that, much like G?del's theorem, is difficult to understand and to properly apply. (What?!? Treating formal systems as equations involving compositions of powers of prime numbers!?!?!) And the *real* point of the quote is that anything that says "G?del's theorem is for sissies" has got to be an entertaining quote... I should look at changing the quote... Perhaps something like... "This chapter will appeal above all to people who are excited by the fact that print ${array[(r)${(l.${#${(O@)array//?/X}[1]}..?.)}]} prints out the longest element of the array $array. For the overwhelming majority that forms the rest of the population, however, there should be plenty that is useful before we reach that stage. Anyway, it should be immediately apparent why there is no obfuscated zsh code competition." Of course, anyone that would get excited about that probably also fits into the category of "people who think G?del's theorem is for sissies"... -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html Oddly enough, this is completely standard behaviour for shells. This is a roundabout way of saying `don't use combined chains of `&&'s and `||'s unless you think G?del's theorem is for sissies'. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 21:16:23 2006 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 17:16:23 -0400 Subject: Accessing serial-usb ports: Solved In-Reply-To: <50567.207.188.64.117.1155650124.squirrel-2RFepEojUI2DznVbVsZi4adLQS1dU2Lr@public.gmane.org> References: <50519.207.188.65.151.1155353473.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> <20060813202428.GA11956@waltdnes.org> <50010.207.188.64.111.1155502559.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> <50057.207.188.64.111.1155508976.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> <20060815042224.GB14384@waltdnes.org> <50567.207.188.64.117.1155650124.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> Message-ID: <20060815211623.GA15423@waltdnes.org> On Tue, Aug 15, 2006 at 09:55:24AM -0400, phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org wrote > Now the question is this: if you have a file by some name that sets the > permissions on certain devices in the same manner as 50-udev.permissions > does under Suse, and this file does not mention the ttyUSB ports, can you > simply add a suitable entry, such as > ttyUSB*:root:uucp:666 > We'll try that under Ubuntu and see if it works. /etc/udev/rules.d/10-local.rules seems to be the place for local mods to be made. -- Walter Dnes In linux /sbin/init is Job #1 My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 21:22:34 2006 From: caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Chris Aitken) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 17:22:34 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 Message-ID: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> I can't play CDs from fedora core 2. The CD drive sound cable is hooked up to the SoundBlaster Live! card (AlsaMixer reports it as "Sound Blaster Live! eMicro 28028") because I can play CDs when I boot to W98SE (it's a dual-boot set up). All other sound is fine in FC2 - I play .ogg's, and record/playback with Audacity. Occaisionally, I like ot just popoa CD in the drive and play it (as it is now I have to rip songs off the CDs just to play 'em). That slows things down when I have a guitar student and we want to listen to a song right away. There is an onboard soundcard as well. I don't use it though as the SBL! is a better card (which I got to use with Audacity). Of course the CD drive cannot be sending audio to the wrong card (since we know the cable goes to the SBL! card since it works in W98SE). However, I did try hooking the speakers up to the wrong card just to hear - of course nothing comes out that way either... Any ideas for me to chase? Chris -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 21:27:02 2006 From: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 17:27:02 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Accessing serial-usb ports: Partially Solved In-Reply-To: <20060815211623.GA15423-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <50519.207.188.65.151.1155353473.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> <20060813202428.GA11956@waltdnes.org> <50010.207.188.64.111.1155502559.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> <50057.207.188.64.111.1155508976.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> <20060815042224.GB14384@waltdnes.org> <50567.207.188.64.117.1155650124.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> <20060815211623.GA15423@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <50317.207.188.64.117.1155677222.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> > On Tue, Aug 15, 2006 at 09:55:24AM -0400, phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org wrote > >> Now the question is this: if you have a file by some name that sets the >> permissions on certain devices in the same manner as 50-udev.permissions >> does under Suse, and this file does not mention the ttyUSB ports, can >> you >> simply add a suitable entry, such as >> ttyUSB*:root:uucp:666 >> We'll try that under Ubuntu and see if it works. > > /etc/udev/rules.d/10-local.rules seems to be the place for local mods > to be made. > > -- > Walter Dnes In linux /sbin/init is Job #1 > My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca > Sorry, Walter, that can't be it. That file doesn't exist on this Suse 9.1 box. Everyone seems to have done something different in this little corner of the operating system. A file called '50-udev.rules' does exist, but it's far from obvious how to write this particular rule. In one of the udev-howto's, the author warns the reader that they'll need to learn Backus-Naur-Form and that the syntax of the rules must be *exactly* right. Somewhere else, a writer shows a rule saying 'I have no idea why this doesn't work'. I used to know BNF reasonably well, but surely that shouldn't be necessary to change the permission on one particular class of ports. Grrr. P. -- Peter Hiscocks Syscomp Electronic Design Limited, Toronto http://www.syscompdesign.com USB Oscilloscope and Waveform Generator 647-839-0325 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cpchan-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 22:36:35 2006 From: cpchan-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Charles philip Chan) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 18:36:35 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 In-Reply-To: <44E23B1A.6000904-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> (Chris Aitken's message of "Tue, 15 Aug 2006 17:22:34 -0400") References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> Message-ID: <874pwdpqx8.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> On 15 Aug 2006, caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org wrote: > I can't play CDs from fedora core 2. The CD drive sound cable is > hooked up to the SoundBlaster Live! card (AlsaMixer reports it as > "Sound Blaster Live! eMicro 28028") because I can play CDs when I boot > to W98SE (it's a dual-boot set up). Did you unmute and set "CD" to a reasonable volume in ALSAMIXER? Charles -- printk("3c505 is sulking\n"); linux-2.6.6/drivers/net/3c505.c -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 188 bytes Desc: not available URL: From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 15 23:52:20 2006 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 19:52:20 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 In-Reply-To: <44E23B1A.6000904-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> Message-ID: <44E25E34.7090305@execulink.com> Chris Aitken wrote: > I can't play CDs from fedora core 2. The CD drive sound cable is hooked > up to the SoundBlaster Live! card (AlsaMixer reports it as "Sound > Blaster Live! eMicro 28028") because I can play CDs when I boot to W98SE > (it's a dual-boot set up). All other sound is fine in FC2 - I play > .ogg's, and record/playback with Audacity. Occaisionally, I like ot just > popoa CD in the drive and play it (as it is now I have to rip songs off > the CDs just to play 'em). That slows things down when I have a guitar > student and we want to listen to a song right away. > > There is an onboard soundcard as well. I don't use it though as the SBL! > is a better card (which I got to use with Audacity). Of course the CD > drive cannot be sending audio to the wrong card (since we know the cable > goes to the SBL! card since it works in W98SE). However, I did try > hooking the speakers up to the wrong card just to hear - of course > nothing comes out that way either... > > Any ideas for me to chase? > > Chris > -- > I'm not absolutely sure it was FC2, but there was one Fedora release which I had installed and the CDROM would not play CD's. Updating a few packages corrected it. Might have been udev or nscd and/or some others. greg -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 00:23:56 2006 From: caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Chris Aitken) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:23:56 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 In-Reply-To: <874pwdpqx8.fsf-HasXQTlsvt1ah8WM/F5+tg@public.gmane.org> References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> <874pwdpqx8.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> Message-ID: <44E2659C.8010409@vianet.ca> Charles philip Chan wrote: >On 15 Aug 2006, caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org wrote: > > > > >>I can't play CDs from fedora core 2. The CD drive sound cable is >>hooked up to the SoundBlaster Live! card (AlsaMixer reports it as >>"Sound Blaster Live! eMicro 28028") because I can play CDs when I boot >>to W98SE (it's a dual-boot set up). >> >> > >Did you unmute and set "CD" to a reasonable volume in ALSAMIXER? > > There is no "CD" in my Alsamixer v1.0.3 Chris >Charles > > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 00:28:51 2006 From: caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Chris Aitken) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:28:51 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 In-Reply-To: <44E2659C.8010409-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> <874pwdpqx8.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> <44E2659C.8010409@vianet.ca> Message-ID: <44E266C3.3080706@vianet.ca> Chris Aitken wrote: > Charles philip Chan wrote: >> >> Did you unmute and set "CD" to a reasonable volume in ALSAMIXER? >> >> > There is no "CD" in my Alsamixer v1.0.3 However, in the GUI SBL! Alsamixer (command: gnome-volume-control) there are two pairs (stereo) of sliders named "CD" - they are both way up. Chris -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cpchan-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 00:35:32 2006 From: cpchan-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Charles philip Chan) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:35:32 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 In-Reply-To: <44E2659C.8010409-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> (Chris Aitken's message of "Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:23:56 -0400") References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> <874pwdpqx8.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> <44E2659C.8010409@vianet.ca> Message-ID: <87r6zhikkr.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> On 15 Aug 2006, caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org wrote: > There is no "CD" in my Alsamixer v1.0.3 I am using 1.0.11. However there has always been a "CD" in ALSAMIXER. You need to navigate to it using the left arrow key. Charles -- "Nature abhors a Vacuum" -- Brian Behlendorf on OSS (Open Sources, 1999 O'Reilly and Associates) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 188 bytes Desc: not available URL: From cpchan-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 00:37:54 2006 From: cpchan-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Charles philip Chan) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:37:54 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 In-Reply-To: <44E266C3.3080706-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> (Chris Aitken's message of "Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:28:51 -0400") References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> <874pwdpqx8.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> <44E2659C.8010409@vianet.ca> <44E266C3.3080706@vianet.ca> Message-ID: <87mza5ikgt.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> On 15 Aug 2006, caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org wrote: > However, in the GUI SBL! Alsamixer (command: gnome-volume-control) > there are two pairs (stereo) of sliders named "CD" - they are both way > up. How are you trying to play the CD? Also, what are your concerns with using digital extraction to play the CD? Charles -- "Calling EMACS an editor is like calling the Earth a hunk of dirt." -- Chris DiBona on Dirt (Open Sources, 1999 O'Reilly and Associates) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 188 bytes Desc: not available URL: From caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 01:20:14 2006 From: caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Chris Aitken) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:20:14 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 In-Reply-To: <87r6zhikkr.fsf-HasXQTlsvt1ah8WM/F5+tg@public.gmane.org> References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> <874pwdpqx8.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> <44E2659C.8010409@vianet.ca> <87r6zhikkr.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> Message-ID: <44E272CE.9030904@vianet.ca> Charles philip Chan wrote: >On 15 Aug 2006, caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org wrote: > > > >>There is no "CD" in my Alsamixer v1.0.3 >> >> > >I am using 1.0.11. However there has always been a "CD" in >ALSAMIXER. You need to navigate to it using the left arrow key. > > Sorry - yeah, you're right. "CD" is at 90 < > 90 Chris >Charles > > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 01:26:42 2006 From: caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Chris Aitken) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:26:42 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 In-Reply-To: <87mza5ikgt.fsf-HasXQTlsvt1ah8WM/F5+tg@public.gmane.org> References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> <874pwdpqx8.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> <44E2659C.8010409@vianet.ca> <44E266C3.3080706@vianet.ca> <87mza5ikgt.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> Message-ID: <44E27452.4030101@vianet.ca> Charles philip Chan wrote: >On 15 Aug 2006, caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org wrote: > > > >>However, in the GUI SBL! Alsamixer (command: gnome-volume-control) >>there are two pairs (stereo) of sliders named "CD" - they are both way >>up. >> >> > >How are you trying to play the CD? > Just by popping the music CD in the drive, a music player (has no name or menu that I can choose "About..." from) automatically comes up appearing to play the CD but no sound comes out. >Also, what are your concerns with using >digital extraction to play the CD? > > Is that the same as "ripping"? If it is it's fine - I'd just like to play CDs directly on occaision. I have a workaround (playing CDs on my stereo system) but I want a direct solution as there are times (often) that it's more convenient to play from the computer (without ripping first). I remember in Redhat 7.3 I could do this automatically (no configuration) as soon as I installed the OS. Chris >Charles > > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 01:40:22 2006 From: caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Chris Aitken) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:40:22 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 In-Reply-To: <44E27452.4030101-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> <874pwdpqx8.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> <44E2659C.8010409@vianet.ca> <44E266C3.3080706@vianet.ca> <87mza5ikgt.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> <44E27452.4030101@vianet.ca> Message-ID: <44E27786.9060105@vianet.ca> Chris Aitken wrote: > Charles philip Chan wrote: >> How are you trying to play the CD? > > Just by popping the music CD in the drive, a music player (has no name I clicked on the Preferences button and see the application is called, simply, "CD Player". "CD Player" comes up automatically when I pop a music CD in either the CD-ROM drive or the CD burner - the status bar shows that "CD Player" thinks it is playing the CD...but no sound. Chris -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 01:43:28 2006 From: caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Chris Aitken) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:43:28 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 In-Reply-To: <44E266C3.3080706-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> <874pwdpqx8.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> <44E2659C.8010409@vianet.ca> <44E266C3.3080706@vianet.ca> Message-ID: <44E27840.40909@vianet.ca> Chris Aitken wrote: > Chris Aitken wrote: > >> Charles philip Chan wrote: > > > > > >>> >>> Did you unmute and set "CD" to a reasonable volume in ALSAMIXER? >> The Alsamixer that opens with the alsamixer command shows only one control for CD - doesn't seem to be a mute/unmute function in that application. The GUI Alsamixer shows both drives (CD-ROM and CD burner) - on both of these Mute is not checked. Chris -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cpchan-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 01:49:44 2006 From: cpchan-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Charles philip Chan) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:49:44 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 In-Reply-To: <44E27452.4030101-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> (Chris Aitken's message of "Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:26:42 -0400") References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> <874pwdpqx8.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> <44E2659C.8010409@vianet.ca> <44E266C3.3080706@vianet.ca> <87mza5ikgt.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> <44E27452.4030101@vianet.ca> Message-ID: <871wrhbgav.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> On 15 Aug 2006, caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org wrote: > Just by popping the music CD in the drive, a music player (has no name > or menu that I can choose "About..." from) automatically comes up > appearing to play the CD but no sound comes out. OK, I gather that you are using GNOME. What errors do you get if you issue: gnome-cd --unique --play --device where your_device is your CDROM device from an Xterm? > Is that the same as "ripping"? If it is it's fine - I'd just like to > play CDs directly on occaision. Yes and no- Digital extraction rips and plays the CD on the fly. Unforunately I don't think the GNOME CD player is capable of that (last time I checked). The players for Linux that I know for sure that are capable of Digital extraction are KSCD (Part of KDE) and XMMS. Charles -- >Ever heard of .cshrc? That's a city in Bosnia. Right? (Discussion in comp.os.linux.misc on the intuitiveness of commands.) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 188 bytes Desc: not available URL: From cpchan-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 01:55:38 2006 From: cpchan-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Charles philip Chan) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:55:38 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 In-Reply-To: <44E27840.40909-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> (Chris Aitken's message of "Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:43:28 -0400") References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> <874pwdpqx8.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> <44E2659C.8010409@vianet.ca> <44E266C3.3080706@vianet.ca> <44E27840.40909@vianet.ca> Message-ID: <87wt99a1gl.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> On 15 Aug 2006, caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org wrote: > The Alsamixer that opens with the alsamixer command shows only one > control for CD - doesn't seem to be a mute/unmute function in that > application. To mute and unmute channels in ALSAMIXER use the "m" key (please press "F1" to see all the keys you can use). If the channel is muted you will see |MM| underneath the channel. Charles -- panic ("No CPUs found. System halted.\n"); linux-2.4.3/arch/parisc/kernel/setup.c -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 188 bytes Desc: not available URL: From sciguy-Ja3L+HSX0kI at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 02:39:41 2006 From: sciguy-Ja3L+HSX0kI at public.gmane.org (Paul King) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 22:39:41 -0400 Subject: Just when I thought they were doing it right Message-ID: <44E24D2D.18420.7B5B85D@sciguy.vex.net> Hello Where I work, my employer has shifted over from a Lotus Notes-based email system to one that is MS-based. In fact, it is now using M$ SharePoint Server 2003. So far, it is only optimized to run in Explorer. That is under Explorer, you get more goodies than Firefox, but it appears to crash more often. Certain buttons (such as logout) only work intermittently. Generally, the email functions are Outlook-based, and comes complete with a planner and so on. So far, it has all the mixed results I have come to expect from Microsoft. Later Paul -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 02:42:52 2006 From: caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Chris Aitken) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 22:42:52 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 In-Reply-To: <871wrhbgav.fsf-HasXQTlsvt1ah8WM/F5+tg@public.gmane.org> References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> <874pwdpqx8.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> <44E2659C.8010409@vianet.ca> <44E266C3.3080706@vianet.ca> <87mza5ikgt.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> <44E27452.4030101@vianet.ca> <871wrhbgav.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> Message-ID: <44E2862C.8010409@vianet.ca> Charles philip Chan wrote: >OK, I gather that you are using GNOME. What errors do you get if you >issue: > > gnome-cd --unique --play --device > >where your_device is your CDROM device from an Xterm? > > [chris at p733 chris]$ gnome-cd --unique --play --device /dev/cdrom ** Message: Error reading CD header ** (gnome-cd:5326): WARNING **: : (linux_cdrom_play): Drive still not ready ** Message: Error reading CD header ...then CDPlayer opened with the message that the drive was open (though it was not). When Iexited CD player my prompt came back... [chris at p733 chris]$ > > >>Is that the same as "ripping"? If it is it's fine - I'd just like to >>play CDs directly on occaision. >> >> > >Yes and no- Digital extraction rips and plays the CD on the >fly. Unforunately I don't think the GNOME CD player is capable of that >(last time I checked). The players for Linux that I know for sure that are >capable of Digital extraction are KSCD (Part of KDE) and XMMS. > > I see. Chris >Charles > > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 02:46:23 2006 From: caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Chris Aitken) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 22:46:23 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 In-Reply-To: <87wt99a1gl.fsf-HasXQTlsvt1ah8WM/F5+tg@public.gmane.org> References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> <874pwdpqx8.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> <44E2659C.8010409@vianet.ca> <44E266C3.3080706@vianet.ca> <44E27840.40909@vianet.ca> <87wt99a1gl.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> Message-ID: <44E286FF.8080706@vianet.ca> Charles philip Chan wrote: >On 15 Aug 2006, caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org wrote: > > > >>The Alsamixer that opens with the alsamixer command shows only one >>control for CD - doesn't seem to be a mute/unmute function in that >>application. >> >> > >To mute and unmute channels in ALSAMIXER use the "m" key (please press >"F1" to see all the keys you can use). > That only gives me the functions for the terminal (GNOME Terminal Manual). > If the channel is muted you will >see |MM| underneath the channel. > > Actually, above the channel. CD doesn't have the MM so I guess it is not muted. Thanks for the info. Chris >Charles > > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rickl-ZACYGPecefkm4kRHVhTciCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 03:43:36 2006 From: rickl-ZACYGPecefkm4kRHVhTciCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Rick Tomaschuk) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 23:43:36 -0400 Subject: Just when I thought they were doing it right In-Reply-To: <44E24D2D.18420.7B5B85D-TElMtxJ9tQ95lvbp69gI5w@public.gmane.org> References: <44E24D2D.18420.7B5B85D@sciguy.vex.net> Message-ID: <1155699816.6241.3.camel@spot1.localhost.com> All the more reason to look for a new employer. Why stick with a company whose software choices will erode your well being? Let them choke on it. RickT http://www.TorontoNUI.ca On Tue, 2006-08-15 at 22:39 -0400, Paul King wrote: > Hello > > Where I work, my employer has shifted over from a Lotus Notes-based > email system to one that is MS-based. In fact, it is now using M$ > SharePoint Server 2003. So far, it is only optimized to run in > Explorer. That is under Explorer, you get more goodies than > Firefox, but it appears to crash more often. Certain buttons (such > as logout) only work intermittently. > > Generally, the email functions are Outlook-based, and comes > complete with a planner and so on. So far, it has all the mixed > results I have come to expect from Microsoft. > > Later > > Paul > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- http://www.TorontoNUI.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cpchan-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 04:09:55 2006 From: cpchan-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Charles philip Chan) Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 00:09:55 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 In-Reply-To: <44E286FF.8080706-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> (Chris Aitken's message of "Tue, 15 Aug 2006 22:46:23 -0400") References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> <874pwdpqx8.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> <44E2659C.8010409@vianet.ca> <44E266C3.3080706@vianet.ca> <44E27840.40909@vianet.ca> <87wt99a1gl.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> <44E286FF.8080706@vianet.ca> Message-ID: <87lkppjp7w.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> On 15 Aug 2006, caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org wrote: Charles philip Chan wrote: >On 15 Aug 2006, caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org wrote: > > > > That only gives me the functions for the terminal (GNOME Terminal Manual). GNOME terminal must have stolen the shortcut. Charles -- /* * Should be panic but... (Why are BSD people panic obsessed ??) */ linux-2.0.38/net/ipv4/ip_fw.c -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 188 bytes Desc: not available URL: From cpchan-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 04:14:34 2006 From: cpchan-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Charles philip Chan) Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 00:14:34 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 In-Reply-To: <44E2862C.8010409-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> (Chris Aitken's message of "Tue, 15 Aug 2006 22:42:52 -0400") References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> <874pwdpqx8.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> <44E2659C.8010409@vianet.ca> <44E266C3.3080706@vianet.ca> <87mza5ikgt.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> <44E27452.4030101@vianet.ca> <871wrhbgav.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> <44E2862C.8010409@vianet.ca> Message-ID: <87hd0djp05.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> On 15 Aug 2006, caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org wrote: > [chris at p733 chris]$ gnome-cd --unique --play --device /dev/cdrom > ** Message: Error reading CD header > > ** (gnome-cd:5326): WARNING **: : (linux_cdrom_play): Drive still not ready > ** Message: Error reading CD header It seems like a Fedora problem: http://www.fedoraforum.org/forum/showthread.php?t=61413 You should ask on their mailing list. Charles -- panic("floppy: Port bolixed."); linux-2.2.16/include/asm-sparc/floppy.h -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 188 bytes Desc: not available URL: From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 13:11:36 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 09:11:36 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 In-Reply-To: <44E23B1A.6000904-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> Message-ID: <20060816131136.GI13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 15, 2006 at 05:22:34PM -0400, Chris Aitken wrote: > I can't play CDs from fedora core 2. The CD drive sound cable is hooked > up to the SoundBlaster Live! card (AlsaMixer reports it as "Sound > Blaster Live! eMicro 28028") because I can play CDs when I boot to W98SE > (it's a dual-boot set up). All other sound is fine in FC2 - I play > .ogg's, and record/playback with Audacity. Occaisionally, I like ot just > popoa CD in the drive and play it (as it is now I have to rip songs off > the CDs just to play 'em). That slows things down when I have a guitar > student and we want to listen to a song right away. > > There is an onboard soundcard as well. I don't use it though as the SBL! > is a better card (which I got to use with Audacity). Of course the CD > drive cannot be sending audio to the wrong card (since we know the cable > goes to the SBL! card since it works in W98SE). However, I did try > hooking the speakers up to the wrong card just to hear - of course > nothing comes out that way either... > > Any ideas for me to chase? By default win98 uses digital audio extraction to play CDs, so it doesn't even use the audio cable from the cdrom. Linux tends to play CDs the way they were meant to be played using the audio cable. If it doesn't work, then most likely you have the cd input muted in the mixer for your sound card, or potentially your user doesn't even have permission to access the cdrom drive to give it commands to play (on debian a user has to be in the cdrom group to play a cd, just as they have to be in the audio group to play sound and access the mixer). So check your mixer settings and make sure the volume is turned up on the cd input. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 13:13:19 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 09:13:19 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 In-Reply-To: <44E2659C.8010409-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> <874pwdpqx8.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> <44E2659C.8010409@vianet.ca> Message-ID: <20060816131319.GJ13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 15, 2006 at 08:23:56PM -0400, Chris Aitken wrote: > There is no "CD" in my Alsamixer v1.0.3 There is in 1.0.11 if you scroll far enough to the right. Same with 1.0.8 (which is what Debian sarge has. I don't have access to anything more ancient than that). I am quite sure there is in 1.0.3 too. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 13:13:41 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 09:13:41 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 In-Reply-To: <44E266C3.3080706-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> <874pwdpqx8.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> <44E2659C.8010409@vianet.ca> <44E266C3.3080706@vianet.ca> Message-ID: <20060816131341.GK13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 15, 2006 at 08:28:51PM -0400, Chris Aitken wrote: > However, in the GUI SBL! Alsamixer (command: gnome-volume-control) there > are two pairs (stereo) of sliders named "CD" - they are both way up. How about the mute option on that input? -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From erebus-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 17:55:42 2006 From: erebus-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Erebus) Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 17:55:42 +0000 Subject: Audio In Kubuntu In-Reply-To: <20060816131136.GI13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> <20060816131136.GI13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <44E35C1E.7070600@rogers.com> OK. I'm baffled. I've changed my other desktop PC over to Kubuntu (from Windows XP). I told the Sound System choice in System Configurator to "Auto Detect". When I choose "System Notifications" I can hear all the sounds they make. But when I go to play a video in Kaffeine I get absolutely zero audio out of the video. Any thoughts? Frank in Mississauga -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cpchan-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 18:24:30 2006 From: cpchan-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Charles Philip Chan) Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 14:24:30 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 In-Reply-To: <20060816131136.GI13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20060816131136.GI13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <23707dccc289f906243f9c584562c930@MagnumOpus> On 2006-08-16 09:11:36 -0400 Lennart Sorensen wrote: > By default win98 uses digital audio extraction to play CDs, so it > doesn't even use the audio cable from the cdrom. Thanks for the info. I was hasitant in mentioning this since I forgot whether Digital Extraction started in 98 or XP and I don't use Windows. > Linux tends to play > CDs the way they were meant to be played using the audio cable. This is not quite true. There are a few players that are capable of Digital Extraction. For example: KSCD (KDE), later versions of XMMS, and cdplayer.app (GNUStep). > If it doesn't work, then most likely you have the cd input muted in > the > mixer for your sound card, The OP checked the "CD" channels and they are not muted. > or potentially your user doesn't even have > permission to access the cdrom drive to give it commands to play (on > debian a user has to be in the cdrom group to play a cd, just as they > have to be in the audio group to play sound and access the mixer). This is very likely, on my system it is the audio group. I don't know what FC uses. Charles -- I did this 'cause Linux gives me a woody. It doesn't generate revenue. (Dave '-ddt->` Taylor, announcing DOOM for Linux) -------------- next part -------------- RFC3156 defines security multipart formats for MIME with OpenPGP. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 230 bytes Desc: not available URL: From transoxania-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 18:25:55 2006 From: transoxania-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Ahmad) Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 14:25:55 -0400 Subject: Lenovo Releseas "Linux" Laptops Message-ID: <44E36333.5050801@sympatico.ca> Lenovo has released two latops that are "certified" to run with SUSE Linux Enterprise Desktop Version 10. The article claims that Lenovo will offer end user support for these laptops running this flavour of Linux. The article claims even the modem will have Linux drivers available for it. Sadly it uses an ATI chipset. The article claims two features of the laptop are not supported but claim Lenovo may release drivers for them in the future. The two features are Active Protection System and the biometric security. http://www.notebookreview.com/default.asp?newsID=3109 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 18:29:04 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 14:29:04 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 In-Reply-To: <23707dccc289f906243f9c584562c930@MagnumOpus> References: <20060816131136.GI13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <23707dccc289f906243f9c584562c930@MagnumOpus> Message-ID: <20060816182904.GL13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 16, 2006 at 02:24:30PM -0400, Charles Philip Chan wrote: > Thanks for the info. I was hasitant in mentioning this since I forgot > whether Digital Extraction started in 98 or XP and I don't use > Windows. Win95 didn't do it, win98 did. > > Linux tends to play > > CDs the way they were meant to be played using the audio cable. > > This is not quite true. There are a few players that are capable of > Digital Extraction. For example: KSCD (KDE), later versions of XMMS, > and cdplayer.app (GNUStep). Hence the word _tends_. :) > The OP checked the "CD" channels and they are not muted. Makes me wonder if the light on the drive is even indicating it is playing. > This is very likely, on my system it is the audio group. I don't know > what FC uses. One thing I like to do is use cdplay from the command line as the user and as root, to make sure it isn't a permission problem accessing the cdrom. it is part of cdtools which provide the commands cdplay, cdinfo, cdir, cdclose, cdeject, etc. Very handy for scripts and such. It helps to figure out if the problem is with even trying to play the cd, or with the audio setup. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cpchan-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 18:47:33 2006 From: cpchan-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Charles Philip Chan) Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 14:47:33 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 In-Reply-To: <20060816182904.GL13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20060816182904.GL13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: On 2006-08-16 14:29:04 -0400 Lennart Sorensen wrote: > One thing I like to do is use cdplay from the command line as the user > and as root, to make sure it isn't a permission problem accessing the > cdrom. Yes, this is a very good method of checking permission problems. Charles -- printk("%s: confused, missing data\n", drive->name); linux-2.6.6/drivers/ide/ide-cd.c -------------- next part -------------- RFC3156 defines security multipart formats for MIME with OpenPGP. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 230 bytes Desc: not available URL: From john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 19:05:15 2006 From: john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org (John Van Ostrand) Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 15:05:15 -0400 Subject: Lenovo Releseas "Linux" Laptops In-Reply-To: <44E36333.5050801-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <44E36333.5050801@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <1155755115.3626.130.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> On Wed, 2006-08-16 at 14:25 -0400, Ahmad wrote: > Lenovo has released two latops that are "certified" to run with SUSE > Linux Enterprise Desktop Version 10. The article claims that Lenovo > will offer end user support for these laptops running this flavour of > Linux. The article claims even the modem will have Linux drivers > available for it. Sadly it uses an ATI chipset. The article claims two > features of the laptop are not supported but claim Lenovo may release > drivers for them in the future. The two features are Active Protection > System and the biometric security. We've been providing that model and other Thinkpads with Ubuntu 6.06. We have Active Protection and the fingerprint scanner working. -- John Van Ostrand Net Direct Inc. Chief Technology Officer 564 Weber St. N. Unit 12 Waterloo, ON N2L 5C6 map john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org Ph: 519-883-1172 ext.5102 Linux Solutions / IBM Hardware Fx: 519-883-8533 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 19:34:34 2006 From: interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (Interlug) Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 15:34:34 -0400 Subject: Lenovo Releseas "Linux" Laptops In-Reply-To: <1155755115.3626.130.camel-H4GMr3yegGDiLwdn3CfQm+4hLzXZc3VTLAPz8V8PbKw@public.gmane.org> References: <44E36333.5050801@sympatico.ca> <1155755115.3626.130.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> Message-ID: <1155756874.3511.180.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Wed, 2006-16-08 at 15:05 -0400, John Van Ostrand wrote: > We've been providing that model and other Thinkpads with Ubuntu 6.06. > We have Active Protection and the fingerprint scanner working. > I bought a T60 from Net Direct that was preloaded with Ubuntu 6.06 and it is FAAAAN-tastic! How nice to have a working, secure system right off the bat. About the T60: Mine (not sure about other models) has a built-in keyboard light. What a revelation! Perfect for typing notes at a presentation (while the lights are down for the projector). -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 21:56:34 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 17:56:34 -0400 Subject: Lenovo Releseas "Linux" Laptops In-Reply-To: <1155756874.3511.180.camel-bi+AKbBUZKY6gyzm1THtWbp2dZbC/Bob@public.gmane.org> References: <44E36333.5050801@sympatico.ca> <1155755115.3626.130.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> <1155756874.3511.180.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20060816215634.GM13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 16, 2006 at 03:34:34PM -0400, Interlug wrote: > I bought a T60 from Net Direct that was preloaded with Ubuntu 6.06 and > it is FAAAAN-tastic! How nice to have a working, secure system right > off the bat. > > > About the T60: Mine (not sure about other models) has a built-in > keyboard light. What a revelation! Perfect for typing notes at a > presentation (while the lights are down for the projector). That is a fairly common feature on thinkpads over the years. Such a simple yet briliant feature (not sure if the pun is intended or not). -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 22:43:50 2006 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 18:43:50 -0400 Subject: Chinese character help needed In-Reply-To: <20060811000315.50132.qmail-twPDCWrZ0p2A/QwVtaZbd3CJp6faPEW9@public.gmane.org> References: <20060811000315.50132.qmail@web52914.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <44E39FA6.2020807@alteeve.com> Buzz Lightyear wrote: > Hello All > > I am running Kanotix Linux in English. My goal is to > run it in English and in Chinese so I can 1) read > Chinese characters on various web pages and 2) if > possible, type in Chinese. > > How do I go about adding Chinese characters in Kanotix > that will allow me to do this? > > Thanks. > > Mark Maybe not helpful, but, For Japanese input on Debian/Ubuntu I use 'uim' (universal input method, I think). Check it and it's dependancies/recommended packages on your distro's package manager. Also look for the Gnome/KDE panel app as well, to simplify input. As for reading, just search your package manager for Chinese (simplified/traditional) fonts. HTH, Madison -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 22:55:10 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 18:55:10 -0400 Subject: Lenovo Releseas "Linux" Laptops In-Reply-To: <1155756874.3511.180.camel-bi+AKbBUZKY6gyzm1THtWbp2dZbC/Bob@public.gmane.org> References: <44E36333.5050801@sympatico.ca> <1155755115.3626.130.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> <1155756874.3511.180.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <44E3A24E.9060807@rogers.com> Interlug wrote: > About the T60: Mine (not sure about other models) has a built-in > keyboard light. What a revelation! Perfect for typing notes at a > presentation (while the lights are down for the projector). My R31 has it too. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 16 22:57:13 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 18:57:13 -0400 Subject: Lenovo Releseas "Linux" Laptops In-Reply-To: <20060816215634.GM13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <44E36333.5050801@sympatico.ca> <1155755115.3626.130.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> <1155756874.3511.180.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20060816215634.GM13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <44E3A2C9.7080306@rogers.com> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Wed, Aug 16, 2006 at 03:34:34PM -0400, Interlug wrote: >> I bought a T60 from Net Direct that was preloaded with Ubuntu 6.06 and >> it is FAAAAN-tastic! How nice to have a working, secure system right >> off the bat. >> >> >> About the T60: Mine (not sure about other models) has a built-in >> keyboard light. What a revelation! Perfect for typing notes at a >> presentation (while the lights are down for the projector). > > That is a fairly common feature on thinkpads over the years. Such a > simple yet briliant feature (not sure if the pun is intended or not). Well, it certainly was a bright idea. ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ekg_ab-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 17 15:52:37 2006 From: ekg_ab-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (E K) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 11:52:37 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Recomendation for dedicated server In-Reply-To: <1f13df280608130807j5ed8d7e0y1c209d982ba0cb67-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <1f13df280608130807j5ed8d7e0y1c209d982ba0cb67@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20060817155237.86882.qmail@web61316.mail.yahoo.com> Hi all, I was looking for a dedicated server provider. Can you please recomend me one? TIA EK __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From aaronvegh-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 17 16:13:28 2006 From: aaronvegh-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Aaron Vegh) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 12:13:28 -0400 Subject: Recomendation for dedicated server In-Reply-To: <20060817155237.86882.qmail-ddJm7Vz9uCWA/QwVtaZbd3CJp6faPEW9@public.gmane.org> References: <1f13df280608130807j5ed8d7e0y1c209d982ba0cb67@mail.gmail.com> <20060817155237.86882.qmail@web61316.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4386c5b20608170913r7be7ae3rdfdb5f2c816904f8@mail.gmail.com> Hi there, You might want to let us know what your specific needs are. I'm currently dealing with my dedicated server provider now, and I just wanted to chime in with an "anti-recommendation". DO NOT USE CI HOST!!! Their offering is compelling, but the software is ancient and their support has been brutal. Right now my server is up and down like a yo-yo, and they refuse to assist. I have picked up a pacakage now with iWeb.ca, based in Montreal. I've heard lots of good things about them, and my experience thus far has been very positive. Good luck, Aaron. On 8/17/06, E K wrote: > Hi all, > > I was looking for a dedicated server provider. Can you > please recomend me one? > > TIA > EK > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ekg_ab-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 17 16:46:35 2006 From: ekg_ab-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (E K) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 12:46:35 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Recomendation for dedicated server In-Reply-To: <4386c5b20608170913r7be7ae3rdfdb5f2c816904f8-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <4386c5b20608170913r7be7ae3rdfdb5f2c816904f8@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20060817164635.85248.qmail@web61324.mail.yahoo.com> Hi Aaron, Thanks for the tip. I came across a provider called Hostway. They look great (they also provide a choice of Linux distros) but would have liked to get a second thought if any one knows about them. EK --- Aaron Vegh wrote: > Hi there, > You might want to let us know what your specific > needs are. I'm > currently dealing with my dedicated server provider > now, and I just > wanted to chime in with an "anti-recommendation". DO > NOT USE CI > HOST!!! > > Their offering is compelling, but the software is > ancient and their > support has been brutal. Right now my server is up > and down like a > yo-yo, and they refuse to assist. I have picked up a > pacakage now with > iWeb.ca, based in Montreal. I've heard lots of good > things about them, > and my experience thus far has been very positive. > > Good luck, > Aaron. > > > > On 8/17/06, E K wrote: > > Hi all, > > > > I was looking for a dedicated server provider. Can > you > > please recomend me one? > > > > TIA > > EK > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: > http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text > below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: > http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: > http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text > below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: > http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From zhunt-KdxWn004MjY at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 17 17:28:08 2006 From: zhunt-KdxWn004MjY at public.gmane.org (Zoltan H.) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 13:28:08 -0400 Subject: Recomendation for dedicated server In-Reply-To: <4386c5b20608170913r7be7ae3rdfdb5f2c816904f8-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <1f13df280608130807j5ed8d7e0y1c209d982ba0cb67@mail.gmail.com> <20060817155237.86882.qmail@web61316.mail.yahoo.com> <4386c5b20608170913r7be7ae3rdfdb5f2c816904f8@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <44E4A728.4050409@zee4.com> Aaron Vegh wrote: > Hi there, > You might want to let us know what your specific needs are. I'm > currently dealing with my dedicated server provider now, and I just > wanted to chime in with an "anti-recommendation". DO NOT USE CI > HOST!!! > > Their offering is compelling, but the software is ancient and their > support has been brutal. Right now my server is up and down like a > yo-yo, and they refuse to assist. I have picked up a pacakage now with > iWeb.ca, based in Montreal. I've heard lots of good things about them, > and my experience thus far has been very positive. > > Good luck, > Aaron. > Just a small detail about iWeb.ca, they don't seem to support PHP5, at least for shared hosting. I do like that give you a phpinfo() dump when you click on the link for information and you see exactly what you are dealing with. I wish more companies did that. Zoltan www.yyztech.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From david-FkEgs2FKm2NvBvnq28/GKQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 17 17:46:57 2006 From: david-FkEgs2FKm2NvBvnq28/GKQ at public.gmane.org (David Thornton) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 18:46:57 +0100 Subject: Recomendation for dedicated server In-Reply-To: <20060817155237.86882.qmail-ddJm7Vz9uCWA/QwVtaZbd3CJp6faPEW9@public.gmane.org> References: <20060817155237.86882.qmail@web61316.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <44E4AB91.4000704@quadratic.net> E K wrote: > Hi all, > > I was looking for a dedicated server provider. Can you > please recomend me one? > > TIA > EK > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > I'm with Oneandone. I have a root server II. It's got plesk installed. Now normally I would hack things to bits but with this server I'm just playing "user" . I don't want to pooch it (I have friends who have pooched their plesk servers ). I want to take advantage of the saimplicity it lends. And it's great. As for one and one themselves. I only ask for what I think I would get , which is hardware replacement after a failure and a finger to reboot ( which is via a web interface)... and the ydon't let me down too much. :) David -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 17 19:13:25 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 15:13:25 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Exim4, Debian and Rogers... Message-ID: <20060817191325.39302.qmail@web88212.mail.re2.yahoo.com> I am running into some grief attempting to get exim4 to send mail through my Rogers account. I am running Debian Sarge. What I am seeing is a 530 error out of exim4. Anyone got this combo to work? Thanks in advance. Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 17 20:37:04 2006 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 16:37:04 -0400 Subject: Recomendation for dedicated server In-Reply-To: <44E4AB91.4000704-FkEgs2FKm2NvBvnq28/GKQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20060817155237.86882.qmail@web61316.mail.yahoo.com> <44E4AB91.4000704@quadratic.net> Message-ID: <200608171637.04958.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> On Thursday 17 August 2006 13:46, David Thornton wrote: > I'm with Oneandone. > > I have a root server II. > It's got plesk installed. > Now normally I would hack things to bits but with this server I'm just > playing "user" . I don't want to pooch it (I have friends who have > pooched their plesk servers ). I want to take advantage of the > saimplicity it lends. And it's great. I formatted the drive and installed a completely custom version of Debian via their rescue system, works great since I don't need plesk. > As for one and one themselves. I only ask for what I think I would get , > which is hardware replacement after a failure and a finger to reboot ( > which is via a web interface)... and the ydon't let me down too much. I've been with them for a year and it's been rock solid. There is also http://www.cari.net/linux/ - was thinking about trying them (they advertise in LJ). Has anyone tried these guys? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mars20years-/E1597aS9LQAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 17 21:28:13 2006 From: mars20years-/E1597aS9LQAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Buzz Lightyear) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 14:28:13 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Chinese character help needed In-Reply-To: <61e9e2b10608142136m3bfc4517n580f9bec15044927-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <61e9e2b10608142136m3bfc4517n580f9bec15044927@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20060817212813.34299.qmail@web52914.mail.yahoo.com> To Jamon, Daniel and Madison Thanks for your help!!! I appreciate it as it is working fine now. If others on the list want to try out languages other than Chinese (and there are many), do the tutorial, it is helpful. Mark --- Daniel Armstrong wrote: > On 8/10/06, Buzz Lightyear > wrote: > > I am running Kanotix Linux in English. My goal is > to > > run it in English and in Chinese so I can 1) read > > Chinese characters on various web pages and 2) if > > possible, type in Chinese. > > > > How do I go about adding Chinese characters in > Kanotix > > that will allow me to do this? > > I have a friend using Kanotix with a Chinese > girlfriend who > occasionally needs to use his Linux box, and I setup > for him the > ability to view and input Chinese on his > English-language desktop... I > just wrote up a HOWTO outlining what I did: > > http://biohackery.com/node/21 > > Hope it helps! > > -- > Daniel Wayne Armstrong > :: build it yourself biology > http://biohackery.com :: > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: > http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text > below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: > http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From brandon-77Z/iqU1yLlrovVCs/uTlw at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 17 23:27:20 2006 From: brandon-77Z/iqU1yLlrovVCs/uTlw at public.gmane.org (Brandon Sandrowicz) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 19:27:20 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 In-Reply-To: <20060816131136.GI13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> <20060816131136.GI13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20060817232719.GB3034@PyBook.local> On Wed, Aug 16, 2006 at 09:11:36AM -0400, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Tue, Aug 15, 2006 at 05:22:34PM -0400, Chris Aitken wrote: > > I can't play CDs from fedora core 2. The CD drive sound cable is hooked > > up to the SoundBlaster Live! card (AlsaMixer reports it as "Sound > > Blaster Live! eMicro 28028") because I can play CDs when I boot to W98SE > > (it's a dual-boot set up). All other sound is fine in FC2 - I play > > .ogg's, and record/playback with Audacity. Occaisionally, I like ot just > > popoa CD in the drive and play it (as it is now I have to rip songs off > > the CDs just to play 'em). That slows things down when I have a guitar > > student and we want to listen to a song right away. > > > > There is an onboard soundcard as well. I don't use it though as the SBL! > > is a better card (which I got to use with Audacity). Of course the CD > > drive cannot be sending audio to the wrong card (since we know the cable > > goes to the SBL! card since it works in W98SE). However, I did try > > hooking the speakers up to the wrong card just to hear - of course > > nothing comes out that way either... > > > > Any ideas for me to chase? > > By default win98 uses digital audio extraction to play CDs, so it > doesn't even use the audio cable from the cdrom. Linux tends to play > CDs the way they were meant to be played using the audio cable. > > If it doesn't work, then most likely you have the cd input muted in the > mixer for your sound card, or potentially your user doesn't even have > permission to access the cdrom drive to give it commands to play (on > debian a user has to be in the cdrom group to play a cd, just as they > have to be in the audio group to play sound and access the mixer). > > So check your mixer settings and make sure the volume is turned up on > the cd input. > > -- > Len Sorensen > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml I think that maybe the CD audio cable is not hooked up. He says that he knows it is hooked up because "I can play CDs when I boot into W98SE," but if Windows 98 uses digital audio extraction, then he may not even have the audio cable hooked up. Brandon Sandrowicz -- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davegermiquet-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 17 23:49:02 2006 From: davegermiquet-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Dave Germiquet) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 19:49:02 -0400 Subject: Exim4, Debian and Rogers... In-Reply-To: <20060817191325.39302.qmail-W5RQQfbthkOB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060817191325.39302.qmail@web88212.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <32f6a8880608171649k38dd6d3dq4035ff8a9547bfc6@mail.gmail.com> I was using EXIM for a long time using Rogers however it stopped working cuz most mailers will not allow dynamic ip people to send out mail or something. The second thing i heard rogers does not allow MAIL to to go through to your mailbox now as well.. try dyndns.org mail forwarding :S On 8/17/06, Colin McGregor wrote: > > I am running into some grief attempting to get exim4 > to send mail through my Rogers account. I am running > Debian Sarge. What I am seeing is a 530 error out of > exim4. > > Anyone got this combo to work? > > Thanks in advance. > > Colin McGregor > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 00:50:17 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 20:50:17 -0400 Subject: Exim4, Debian and Rogers... In-Reply-To: <32f6a8880608171649k38dd6d3dq4035ff8a9547bfc6-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <20060817191325.39302.qmail@web88212.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <32f6a8880608171649k38dd6d3dq4035ff8a9547bfc6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <44E50EC9.3080504@telly.org> It's been a _long_ time since I switched from Exim to Postfix, but I suspect that the choice of MTA has little to do with the problem at hand. Rogers definitely blocks port 25, the usual one for SMTP. Its network will refuse to complete "normal" email connections; sometimes silently, sometimes with an error. For your incoming mail they expect you to fetch it with POP or IMAP, and for outgoing you need to use some port besides 25 for your SMTP. I specify port 465 for outgoing SMTP connections (I seem to recall a support call in which they recommended that port) and it works fine. Rogers may even be mapping 465 to 25 internally for all I know. I think if you set your outgoing mail on Exim to port 465 you may have some luck. If not, I'm not sure I can help further. You may want to manually diagnose the SMTP connections using telnet. In any case, I don't think Exim or Debian is to blame. This problem also happens with Thunderbird clients on any OS. - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davec-zxk95TxsVYDyHADnj0MGvQC/G2K4zDHf at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 00:56:21 2006 From: davec-zxk95TxsVYDyHADnj0MGvQC/G2K4zDHf at public.gmane.org (Dave Cramer) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 20:56:21 -0400 Subject: Exim4, Debian and Rogers... In-Reply-To: <44E50EC9.3080504-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg@public.gmane.org> References: <20060817191325.39302.qmail@web88212.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <32f6a8880608171649k38dd6d3dq4035ff8a9547bfc6@mail.gmail.com> <44E50EC9.3080504@telly.org> Message-ID: I just port forward port 24 to port 25 and tell people using rogers to switch to port 24. --dc-- On 17-Aug-06, at 8:50 PM, Evan Leibovitch wrote: > It's been a _long_ time since I switched from Exim to Postfix, but > I suspect that the choice of MTA has little to do with the problem > at hand. > > Rogers definitely blocks port 25, the usual one for SMTP. Its > network will refuse to complete "normal" email connections; > sometimes silently, sometimes with an error. For your incoming mail > they expect you to fetch it with POP or IMAP, and for outgoing you > need to use some port besides 25 for your SMTP. I specify port 465 > for outgoing SMTP connections (I seem to recall a support call in > which they recommended that port) and it works fine. Rogers may > even be mapping 465 to 25 internally for all I know. > > I think if you set your outgoing mail on Exim to port 465 you may > have some luck. If not, I'm not sure I can help further. > You may want to manually diagnose the SMTP connections using telnet. > > In any case, I don't think Exim or Debian is to blame. This problem > also happens with Thunderbird clients on any OS. > > - Evan > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ivan.frey-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 00:58:12 2006 From: ivan.frey-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Ivan Avery Frey) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 20:58:12 -0400 Subject: Lenovo Releseas "Linux" Laptops In-Reply-To: <1155756874.3511.180.camel-bi+AKbBUZKY6gyzm1THtWbp2dZbC/Bob@public.gmane.org> References: <44E36333.5050801@sympatico.ca> <1155755115.3626.130.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> <1155756874.3511.180.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <44E510A4.90801@utoronto.ca> Interlug wrote: > About the T60: Mine (not sure about other models) has a built-in > keyboard light. What a revelation! Perfect for typing notes at a > presentation (while the lights are down for the projector). > Apple has had lighted keyboards for awhile now. Ivan. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 01:05:32 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 21:05:32 -0400 Subject: Exim4, Debian and Rogers... In-Reply-To: <44E50EC9.3080504-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg@public.gmane.org> References: <20060817191325.39302.qmail@web88212.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <32f6a8880608171649k38dd6d3dq4035ff8a9547bfc6@mail.gmail.com> <44E50EC9.3080504@telly.org> Message-ID: <44E5125C.7080307@rogers.com> Evan Leibovitch wrote: > It's been a _long_ time since I switched from Exim to Postfix, but I > suspect that the choice of MTA has little to do with the problem at hand. > > Rogers definitely blocks port 25, the usual one for SMTP. Its network > will refuse to complete "normal" email connections; sometimes silently, > sometimes with an error. For your incoming mail they expect you to fetch > it with POP or IMAP, and for outgoing you need to use some port besides > 25 for your SMTP. I specify port 465 for outgoing SMTP connections (I > seem to recall a support call in which they recommended that port) and > it works fine. Rogers may even be mapping 465 to 25 internally for all I > know. > I use port 587 to send email via Rogers, when I'm away from their network. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 01:35:45 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 21:35:45 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Exim4, Debian and Rogers... In-Reply-To: <32f6a8880608171649k38dd6d3dq4035ff8a9547bfc6-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <32f6a8880608171649k38dd6d3dq4035ff8a9547bfc6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20060818013545.82101.qmail@web88206.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- Dave Germiquet wrote: > I was using EXIM for a long time using Rogers > however it stopped working cuz > most mailers will not allow dynamic ip people to > send out mail or something. What I am attempting to do is make my box do SMTP into Rogers mail system (which is being run by Yahoo). In other words I want my outgoing mail system to look as far as Rogers/Yahoo is concerned like your run of the mill Microsloth brand e-mail client... > The second thing i heard rogers does not allow MAIL > to to go through to your > mailbox now as well.. > > try dyndns.org mail forwarding :S > > > On 8/17/06, Colin McGregor > wrote: > > > > I am running into some grief attempting to get > exim4 > > to send mail through my Rogers account. I am > running > > Debian Sarge. What I am seeing is a 530 error out > of > > exim4. > > > > Anyone got this combo to work? > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > Colin McGregor > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: > http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text > below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: > http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 01:42:41 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 21:42:41 -0400 Subject: Exim4, Debian and Rogers... In-Reply-To: <20060818013545.82101.qmail-p6KvMhi7PWKB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060818013545.82101.qmail@web88206.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <44E51B11.3030505@rogers.com> Colin McGregor wrote: > --- Dave Germiquet wrote: >> I was using EXIM for a long time using Rogers >> however it stopped working cuz >> most mailers will not allow dynamic ip people to >> send out mail or something. > > What I am attempting to do is make my box do SMTP into > Rogers mail system (which is being run by Yahoo). In > other words I want my outgoing mail system to look as > far as Rogers/Yahoo is concerned like your run of the > mill Microsloth brand e-mail client... Try sending to port 587. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 02:17:59 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 22:17:59 -0400 Subject: Exim4, Debian and Rogers... In-Reply-To: <20060818013545.82101.qmail-p6KvMhi7PWKB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060818013545.82101.qmail@web88206.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <44E52357.5090402@telly.org> Colin McGregor wrote: >What I am attempting to do is make my box do SMTP into >Rogers mail system (which is being run by Yahoo). In >other words I want my outgoing mail system to look as >far as Rogers/Yahoo is concerned like your run of the >mill Microsloth brand e-mail client.. > > I think that's understood. The default port for doing SMTP (and certainly the exim default) is port 25, but that's blocked by Rogers. They instruct people to set their email preferences to use a different port. The problem is not Yahoo, they just run the servers. Rogers actually blocks traffic trying to use that port, so Yahoo never sees your connection attempt. I reported that port 465 (listed in /etc/services as "SMTP over SSL") works for me (I have SSL set as well). So you may need to run SMTP over SSL in order to make that particular kind of connection work. IE, Thunderbird and KMail support this, but you may need to tweak Exim a little. On the web there are some docs on how to do this; http://ente.limmat.ch/kb/exim/exim_v3_secure_auth.html and http://jeremy.zawodny.com/blog/archives/000453.html describe the procedure for EximV3 under Debian. Others have suggested port 587 (which under /etc/services is "mail message submission", something with which I'm not familiar), or using port forwarding. One of these should work for you. - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 12:47:47 2006 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 08:47:47 -0400 Subject: Exim4, Debian and Rogers... In-Reply-To: <20060817191325.39302.qmail-W5RQQfbthkOB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060817191325.39302.qmail@web88212.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <200608180847.47960.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> On Thursday 17 August 2006 15:13, Colin McGregor wrote: > I am running into some grief attempting to get exim4 > to send mail through my Rogers account. I am running > Debian Sarge. What I am seeing is a 530 error out of > exim4. > > Anyone got this combo to work? Not me. Can you use DSL? There are many DSL providers that don't block network ports. -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tleslie-RBVUpeUoHUc at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 13:24:36 2006 From: tleslie-RBVUpeUoHUc at public.gmane.org (ted leslie) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 09:24:36 -0400 Subject: Probably the biggest thing to ever happen to Linux Message-ID: <1155907476.30331.64.camel@stan64.site> as quoted in the article "We have for the first time a real alternative to the Windows desktop. Linux and open source are there," http://news.zdnet.co.uk/0,39020330,39281014,00.htm i almost don't believe it, i wonder if it only going to be wmv8 and not 9 or something stupid like that, or maybe MS will then standardize on wmv10 ? now games are the only thing left that Linux users can't get (for the most part). at least i will finally get to play wmv's on a 64 bit arch. and not have to dick around with 32bit apps and 32bit dll's -tl -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From softquake-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 13:23:01 2006 From: softquake-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Zbigniew Koziol) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 09:23:01 -0400 Subject: strange hardware problem Message-ID: The machine is running RedHat 9. Pentium III. It reports itself as GenuineIntel in /proc/cpuinfo. It is not heavily used. Top shows mostly 99.8 % of idle CPU as well a lot of free memory. It is used as a test server, visible also from the Internet. It just shuts down itself. In the sense that there is no access to it by ssh, it does not respond to mouse or keybord. This happens more and more often, recentely every 15 minutes. There is no any usefull info in log files (or at least I can not find it). May be someone could perhaps suggest how to approach this problem, how to solve it? How to find out what causes it? We checked the BIOS, apmd is not running. zb. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From tlug-neil-8agRmHhQ+n2CxnSzwYWP7Q at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 13:28:11 2006 From: tlug-neil-8agRmHhQ+n2CxnSzwYWP7Q at public.gmane.org (Neil Watson) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 09:28:11 -0400 Subject: strange hardware problem In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20060818132811.GA15515@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> What is the frequency of these occurrences? Have you tried running some persistent performance counters to see if anything shows up? -- Neil Watson | Gentoo Linux System Administrator | Uptime 22 days http://watson-wilson.ca | 2.6.16.19 AMD Athlon(tm) MP 2000+ x 2 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From softquake-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 14:17:45 2006 From: softquake-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Zbigniew Koziol) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 10:17:45 -0400 Subject: strange hardware problem In-Reply-To: <20060818132811.GA15515-ajb9/b42oWj7qFZT6RBq9oSPOIov7LNK@public.gmane.org> References: <20060818132811.GA15515@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> Message-ID: I am still observing that machine. It happens very often, every 10-20 minutes. Now I can say that it reboots itself (always? sometme?) Sometime it is able to recover, sometime it hangs during self-restarting. What "persistent performance counters" means? zb. On 8/18/06, Neil Watson wrote: > > What is the frequency of these occurrences? Have you tried running some > persistent performance counters to see if anything shows up? > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rob-3Aypa9sX/B7wvR0lvYjcXw at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 14:25:52 2006 From: rob-3Aypa9sX/B7wvR0lvYjcXw at public.gmane.org (Rob Sutherland) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 10:25:52 -0400 Subject: Computer/Gaming/Open Source BBQ Message-ID: <200608181025.52925.rob@luckdancing.com> Thanks to everyone who responded to my earlier posts asking for info on open source networked games. I've been having fun with them and it looks like the event that I was researching them for is going to go ahead. Here's the blurb: "The Secular Freethought Center is starting a computer and gaming group with a Computer and Barbeque afternoon. Do you like computer games? Are you a Linux or Open Source user? Or are you a complete novice interested in asking some questions and eating cheap food? 1:30 - 6 pm Sunday, August 27th Secular Freethought Center 216 Beverly St. Contact info-NjHekf+1etjRUOz8vr8WZISCufW9PC0A at public.gmane.org (416) 971-5676 http://www.secularfreethought.ca" Please feel free to repost. I'm going to be printing up some copies of the Linux Brochure project and burning a few copies of Puppy Linux and the OpenCD to give away. If anyone has any handouts/cd's/whatever that they'd like distributed, please let me know, rob-3Aypa9sX/B7wvR0lvYjcXw at public.gmane.org . Also, I'm (literally) putting this set up together out of a dumpster, so if you have a hub, switch, long ethernet cable or anything else you'd like to get rid of, let me know. Rob -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 14:41:58 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 10:41:58 -0400 Subject: downtown core free wifi Message-ID: <44E5D1B6.2060701@rogers.com> Hi all, Anybody knows how the Toronto Hydro plan to give free 6 month wifi access in the downtown core is progressing? Is it easy to get access or is the service not good enough yet? http://thtelecom.ca/one-zone.html http://thtelecom.ca/THTI_WiFi%20Zone.pdf Kush -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 15:03:43 2006 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 11:03:43 -0400 Subject: strange hardware problem In-Reply-To: References: <20060818132811.GA15515@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> Message-ID: <44E5D6CF.90402@execulink.com> Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > > I am still observing that machine. > > It happens very often, every 10-20 minutes. Now I can say that it > reboots itself (always? sometme?) Sometime it is able to recover, > sometime it hangs during self-restarting. > > What "persistent performance counters" means? > > zb. > > On 8/18/06, *Neil Watson* > wrote: > > What is the frequency of these occurrences? Have you tried running some > persistent performance counters to see if anything shows up? > > Maybe the hard drive is in its death throws? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From softquake-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 14:50:39 2006 From: softquake-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Zbigniew Koziol) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 10:50:39 -0400 Subject: strange hardware problem In-Reply-To: <44E5D6CF.90402-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20060818132811.GA15515@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> <44E5D6CF.90402@execulink.com> Message-ID: May be. How to know that? However, if it was a problem of that kind that data are lost - that would be visible during startup. It however restarts (after unplugging, and thats btw the only way I can restart it) without a problem. zb. On 8/18/06, Gregory D Hough wrote: > > Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > > > > I am still observing that machine. > > > > It happens very often, every 10-20 minutes. Now I can say that it > > reboots itself (always? sometme?) Sometime it is able to recover, > > sometime it hangs during self-restarting. > > > > What "persistent performance counters" means? > > > > zb. > > > > On 8/18/06, *Neil Watson* > > wrote: > > > > What is the frequency of these occurrences? Have you tried running > some > > persistent performance counters to see if anything shows up? > > > > > Maybe the hard drive is in its death throws? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 14:56:39 2006 From: interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (Interlug) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 10:56:39 -0400 Subject: strange hardware problem In-Reply-To: References: <20060818132811.GA15515@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> <44E5D6CF.90402@execulink.com> Message-ID: <1155912999.3789.47.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Fri, 2006-18-08 at 10:50 -0400, Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > May be. How to know that? > > However, if it was a problem of that kind that data are lost - that > would be visible during startup. It however restarts (after > unplugging, and thats btw the only way I can restart it) without a > problem. Sounds like power supply problems or overheating. Does the time between failures become longer when you remove the cover, and / or clean the heatsinks? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From wattst-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 15:13:03 2006 From: wattst-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Tom Watts) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 11:13:03 -0400 Subject: Probably the biggest thing to ever happen to Linux In-Reply-To: <1155907476.30331.64.camel-Wos4hdNTH4j6K7/ahGyk6A@public.gmane.org> References: <1155907476.30331.64.camel@stan64.site> Message-ID: <44E5D8FF.4040703@uoguelph.ca> ted leslie wrote: > as quoted in the article > > "We have for the first time a real alternative to the Windows desktop. > Linux and open source are there," > > http://news.zdnet.co.uk/0,39020330,39281014,00.htm > > i almost don't believe it, > i wonder if it only going to be wmv8 and not 9 or something stupid like > that, > or maybe MS will then standardize on wmv10 ? > > now games are the only thing left that Linux users can't get (for the > most part). > > at least i will finally get to play wmv's on a 64 bit arch. and not have > to dick around with 32bit apps and 32bit dll's > > -tl > > > Wow and this from the company that made my most hated media player, at least under Windows that is. I've never really like HelixPlayer either, but this could completely change my view on them and maybe my default movie player especially if it comes with a browser plugin that is 100% functional and stable. I'm also wondering, though, how long it will take for them to deliver this and if in the meantime MS would develop a new format. -Tom -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 15:31:49 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 11:31:49 -0400 Subject: Probably the biggest thing to ever happen to Linux In-Reply-To: <1155907476.30331.64.camel-Wos4hdNTH4j6K7/ahGyk6A@public.gmane.org> References: <1155907476.30331.64.camel@stan64.site> Message-ID: <44E5DD65.4060709@telly.org> ted leslie wrote: >as quoted in the article > >"We have for the first time a real alternative to the Windows desktop. >Linux and open source are there," > >http://news.zdnet.co.uk/0,39020330,39281014,00.htm > > To me this is good news but hardly the biggest thing, or even a Really Big Thing. Above all, it's hardly _the_ 'killer app' for the Linux desktop that will get people moving over in large numbers. Open source media players have been able, with the right downloaded codecs, to play WMV files for some time. The opening of the formats (which have been in binary-only codecs until now) is certainly nice, but I'm not likely going to stop using Kaffeine just because a new Helix/Real player offers the format. On one hand, the Real/Helix player may be an easy way to play WMV files on 64-bit systems, which can't use the current codecs. OTOH, the opening of the formats will allow existing players such as Xine and mplayer to add their own support the formats without needing Real's widely-disliked player application. IMO, there are bigger advancements for the open source desktop that are either on the way or haven't yet happened: - good 3d acceleration (XGL and family) - Pantone support for GIMP (unfortunately, critical in getting the platform accepted by the graphic arts community) - Wine being easy to install *and* supporting more Win apps without needing proprietary support (ie CrossOver) I'm sure other people have their own lists of what's missing. - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From softquake-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 15:37:47 2006 From: softquake-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Zbigniew Koziol) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 11:37:47 -0400 Subject: strange hardware problem In-Reply-To: <1155912999.3789.47.camel-bi+AKbBUZKY6gyzm1THtWbp2dZbC/Bob@public.gmane.org> References: <20060818132811.GA15515@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> <44E5D6CF.90402@execulink.com> <1155912999.3789.47.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: Opening the cover does not help at all. And I checked also voltage on power supplier - it remains the same all the time, also during computer failure. zb. On 8/18/06, Interlug wrote: > > On Fri, 2006-18-08 at 10:50 -0400, Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > > May be. How to know that? > > > > However, if it was a problem of that kind that data are lost - that > > would be visible during startup. It however restarts (after > > unplugging, and thats btw the only way I can restart it) without a > > problem. > > Sounds like power supply problems or overheating. Does the time between > failures become longer when you remove the cover, and / or clean the > heatsinks? > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 15:42:10 2006 From: john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org (John Van Ostrand) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 11:42:10 -0400 Subject: strange hardware problem In-Reply-To: References: <20060818132811.GA15515@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> <44E5D6CF.90402@execulink.com> <1155912999.3789.47.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1155915730.3626.296.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> On Fri, 2006-08-18 at 11:37 -0400, Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > > Opening the cover does not help at all. And I checked also voltage > on power supplier - it remains the same all the time, also during > computer failure. So to be clear, is this a hung system, where all lights are on (are the keyboard lights flashing), or is the system powering down? -- John Van Ostrand Net Direct Inc. Chief Technology Officer 564 Weber St. N. Unit 12 Waterloo, ON N2L 5C6 map john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org Ph: 519-883-1172 ext.5102 Linux Solutions / IBM Hardware Fx: 519-883-8533 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 15:46:06 2006 From: john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org (John Van Ostrand) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 11:46:06 -0400 Subject: strange hardware problem In-Reply-To: <1155915730.3626.296.camel-H4GMr3yegGDiLwdn3CfQm+4hLzXZc3VTLAPz8V8PbKw@public.gmane.org> References: <20060818132811.GA15515@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> <44E5D6CF.90402@execulink.com> <1155912999.3789.47.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1155915730.3626.296.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> Message-ID: <1155915966.3626.300.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> On Fri, 2006-08-18 at 11:42 -0400, John Van Ostrand wrote: > So to be clear, is this a hung system, where all lights are on (are the > keyboard lights flashing), or is the system powering down? Ooops I should have ready further into the past. Any chance an Athlon kernel was installed by mistake? From all the things that have been checked, I'm thinking that it's a CPU/motherboard problem. If you want to beat this to death, you could try to setup a crash-dump or for cases when it's hung try sys-rq. -- John Van Ostrand Net Direct Inc. Chief Technology Officer 564 Weber St. N. Unit 12 Waterloo, ON N2L 5C6 map john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org Ph: 519-883-1172 ext.5102 Linux Solutions / IBM Hardware Fx: 519-883-8533 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From softquake-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 15:55:09 2006 From: softquake-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Zbigniew Koziol) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 11:55:09 -0400 Subject: strange hardware problem In-Reply-To: <1155915730.3626.296.camel-H4GMr3yegGDiLwdn3CfQm+4hLzXZc3VTLAPz8V8PbKw@public.gmane.org> References: <20060818132811.GA15515@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> <44E5D6CF.90402@execulink.com> <1155912999.3789.47.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1155915730.3626.296.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> Message-ID: On 8/18/06, John Van Ostrand wrote: > > On Fri, 2006-08-18 at 11:37 -0400, Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > > > > Opening the cover does not help at all. And I checked also voltage > > on power supplier - it remains the same all the time, also during > > computer failure. > > So to be clear, is this a hung system, where all lights are on (are the > keyboard lights flashing), or is the system powering down? If the lights on keybord were on - they remain on and can not be changed later after crash. The lights do not change at all. There is no response to mouse or keybord after crash. zb. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dgardiner-k8+l4Qd5hq73fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 15:59:51 2006 From: dgardiner-k8+l4Qd5hq73fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Daniel Gardiner) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 11:59:51 -0400 Subject: strange hardware problem In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <44E5E3F7.1040803@inofas.ca> Is this a new machine/setup or has it been running for some time? It's similar to a problem we had with a memory leak in some new software several years back. After the software had processed a certain amount of information critical memory would be overwritten and the system would either reboot or blue screen; yes, it was Windows so perhaps this isn't useful. Daniel Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > > The machine is running RedHat 9. Pentium III. It reports itself as > GenuineIntel > in /proc/cpuinfo. It is not heavily used. Top shows mostly 99.8 % of > idle CPU > as well a lot of free memory. > > It is used as a test server, visible also from the Internet. > > It just shuts down itself. In the sense that there is no access to it > by ssh, > it does not respond to mouse or keybord. This happens more and more > often, > recentely every 15 minutes. > > There is no any usefull info in log files (or at least I can not find > it). > > May be someone could perhaps suggest how to approach this problem, how > to solve it? > How to find out what causes it? > > We checked the BIOS, apmd is not running. > > zb. > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From softquake-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 16:00:42 2006 From: softquake-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Zbigniew Koziol) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 12:00:42 -0400 Subject: strange hardware problem In-Reply-To: <44E5E3F7.1040803-k8+l4Qd5hq73fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> References: <44E5E3F7.1040803@inofas.ca> Message-ID: Yes, this machine has been running the same system for about a month or two. Problems started some time ago and they become more and more serious. Now, today, I see that sometime I can not already reboot it because it gets mad during startup. So it looks rather that something is going to fail totally, quite soon ;) zb. On 8/18/06, Daniel Gardiner wrote: > > Is this a new machine/setup or has it been running for some time? It's > similar to a problem we had with a memory leak in some new software > several years back. After the software had processed a certain amount > of information critical memory would be overwritten and the system would > either reboot or blue screen; yes, it was Windows so perhaps this isn't > useful. > > > Daniel > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From brandon-77Z/iqU1yLlrovVCs/uTlw at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 16:23:56 2006 From: brandon-77Z/iqU1yLlrovVCs/uTlw at public.gmane.org (Brandon Sandrowicz) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 12:23:56 -0400 Subject: Probably the biggest thing to ever happen to Linux In-Reply-To: <1155907476.30331.64.camel-Wos4hdNTH4j6K7/ahGyk6A@public.gmane.org> References: <1155907476.30331.64.camel@stan64.site> Message-ID: <20060818162356.GD3034@PyBook.local> On Fri, Aug 18, 2006 at 09:24:36AM -0400, ted leslie wrote: > as quoted in the article > > "We have for the first time a real alternative to the Windows desktop. > Linux and open source are there," > > http://news.zdnet.co.uk/0,39020330,39281014,00.htm > > i almost don't believe it, > i wonder if it only going to be wmv8 and not 9 or something stupid like > that, > or maybe MS will then standardize on wmv10 ? > > now games are the only thing left that Linux users can't get (for the > most part). > > at least i will finally get to play wmv's on a 64 bit arch. and not have > to dick around with 32bit apps and 32bit dll's > > -tl > > > FFMpeg has a working wmv3/wmv9/vp 1/whatever decoder in CVS I believe. And Microsoft isnt going to fool around too much with the WMV v9 standard for a couple of reasons: 1) They pushed through and have gotten it admitted as a standard 2) They have it on as part of the Blu-Ray/HD-DVD specs. (Players have to be able to decode WMV v9, MPEG4, MPEG2, etc to be certified) They're not going to make it a moving target for hardware companies to try and embed into their players. For the time being, I know that at least one of the new HD players is just a linux box, but as the marketplace matures, they are going to have embedded decoders on chip (for better performance, less power usage, less heat, smaller/better form factor, etc). Those aren't going to be replaced everytime Microsoft decide to extend the spec. I think that for the time being even as Microsoft pushes WMV v10 out the door, the majority will be stuck on WMV v9. Brandon Sandrowicz -- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 16:45:38 2006 From: john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org (John Van Ostrand) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 12:45:38 -0400 Subject: strange hardware problem In-Reply-To: References: <44E5E3F7.1040803@inofas.ca> Message-ID: <1155919538.3626.309.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> On Fri, 2006-08-18 at 12:00 -0400, Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > Yes, this machine has been running the same system for about a month > or two. Problems started some time ago and they become more and more > serious. Now, today, I see that sometime I can not already reboot it > because it gets mad during startup. So it looks rather that something > is going to fail totally, quite soon ;) Try a memtest. That usually our first course of action regardless of the O/S. Your red hat disk install disk has an option for that. I haven't seen a memory leak cause a reboot, but they do cause hangs. Sysrq can help you diagnose this. Grep your kernel docs for sysrq to see how to use it. The keyboard LEDs should be blinking if the kernel panicked, so it doesn't look like a kernel bug. If you have the means I recommend you replace the hardware. It should be as simple as moving the disk to another system and letting kudzu fix the drivers. If you want PIII I have a few lying around if you want to drive to Waterloo and test it out. -- John Van Ostrand Net Direct Inc. Chief Technology Officer 564 Weber St. N. Unit 12 Waterloo, ON N2L 5C6 map john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org Ph: 519-883-1172 ext.5102 Linux Solutions / IBM Hardware Fx: 519-883-8533 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From systems-qMtYMQfCx00 at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 18:06:46 2006 From: systems-qMtYMQfCx00 at public.gmane.org (Kyril Stoikopoulos) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 14:06:46 -0400 Subject: strange hardware problem References: <44E5E3F7.1040803@inofas.ca> <1155919538.3626.309.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> Message-ID: <004201c6c2f1$11c751e0$cb00a8c0@systems> check the capacitors on the motherboard to see if the tops are popping. Some of the motherboards made durring the pentium 3 era had bad capacitors and as they fail your computer starts acting very strangely. ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Van Ostrand" To: Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 12:45 PM Subject: Re: [TLUG]: strange hardware problem > On Fri, 2006-08-18 at 12:00 -0400, Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > > Yes, this machine has been running the same system for about a month > > or two. Problems started some time ago and they become more and more > > serious. Now, today, I see that sometime I can not already reboot it > > because it gets mad during startup. So it looks rather that something > > is going to fail totally, quite soon ;) > Try a memtest. That usually our first course of action regardless of the > O/S. Your red hat disk install disk has an option for that. > > I haven't seen a memory leak cause a reboot, but they do cause hangs. > Sysrq can help you diagnose this. Grep your kernel docs for sysrq to see > how to use it. > > The keyboard LEDs should be blinking if the kernel panicked, so it > doesn't look like a kernel bug. > > If you have the means I recommend you replace the hardware. It should be > as simple as moving the disk to another system and letting kudzu fix the > drivers. If you want PIII I have a few lying around if you want to drive > to Waterloo and test it out. > > -- > John Van Ostrand > Net Direct Inc. > > Chief Technology Officer > 564 Weber St. N. Unit 12 > Waterloo, ON N2L 5C6 > map > john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org > Ph: 519-883-1172 > ext.5102 > Linux Solutions / IBM > Hardware > Fx: 519-883-8533 > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.11.2/422 - Release Date: 8/17/2006 > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ekg_ab-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 18:52:07 2006 From: ekg_ab-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (E K) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 14:52:07 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Recomendation for dedicated server In-Reply-To: <200608171637.04958.fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <200608171637.04958.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: <20060818185207.86979.qmail@web61322.mail.yahoo.com> Hi Fraser, I thought of going with Carinet and tried to call the Sales and tech support number 1.888.221.5902. All I got was the recorded message "We're sorry your call can not be completed as dialed.....". Well, that is pretty much the end of it. I probably join you and go with 1&1. Thanks for the lead. EK --- Fraser Campbell wrote: > On Thursday 17 August 2006 13:46, David Thornton > wrote: > > > I'm with Oneandone. > > > > I have a root server II. > > It's got plesk installed. > > Now normally I would hack things to bits but with > this server I'm just > > playing "user" . I don't want to pooch it (I have > friends who have > > pooched their plesk servers ). I want to take > advantage of the > > saimplicity it lends. And it's great. > > I formatted the drive and installed a completely > custom version of Debian via > their rescue system, works great since I don't need > plesk. > > > As for one and one themselves. I only ask for what > I think I would get , > > which is hardware replacement after a failure and > a finger to reboot ( > > which is via a web interface)... and the ydon't > let me down too much. > > I've been with them for a year and it's been rock > solid. > > There is also http://www.cari.net/linux/ - was > thinking about trying them > (they advertise in LJ). Has anyone tried these > guys? > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: > http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text > below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: > http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 19:24:41 2006 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 15:24:41 -0400 Subject: Recomendation for dedicated server In-Reply-To: <20060818185207.86979.qmail-I0FLLw3AZCWA/QwVtaZbd3CJp6faPEW9@public.gmane.org> References: <20060818185207.86979.qmail@web61322.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <200608181524.41176.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> On Friday 18 August 2006 14:52, E K wrote: > I thought of going with Carinet and tried to call the > Sales and tech support number 1.888.221.5902. All I > got was the recorded message "We're sorry your call > can not be completed as dialed.....". Well, that is > pretty much the end of it. Looks like the toll-free is US only. I called 1.858.974.5080 and did get through immediately to both sales and tech support (5-10 seconds hold at most). The sales guy was very helpful, I asked him about rescue system/serial console and he was able to tell me that there was none (and was very knowledgeable regarding the underlying technology). If you order larger numbers of servers (server clusters) then remote KVM might be available. I'd be very concerned about having a remote server without rescue/console capability. Also, although the (base) price is right I object to some of the pricing structure - I would want at least software RAID, they charge you $15/month for the extra disk and $20/month for software RAID1, give me a break! I do want to set up a second server soon but don't really want it to be with 1&1 (just for redundancy reasons) so I guess I'll keep looking. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 20:11:03 2006 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 16:11:03 -0400 Subject: strange hardware problem In-Reply-To: References: <20060818132811.GA15515@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> <44E5D6CF.90402@execulink.com> Message-ID: <44E61ED7.3050401@execulink.com> Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > May be. How to know that? > Process of elimination. Boot a live distro and wait. Try another hard drive. Swap in a different power supply. Move the ram around to different slots and use a pencil eraser here and there. It's a drag but we've all had to do it now and again. And that suggestion to look for bulbous capacitors is a good idea too. > However, if it was a problem of that kind that data are lost - that > would be visible during startup. It however restarts (after unplugging, > and thats btw the only way I can restart it) without a problem. > A few summers back my AMD would keep rebooting itself for no obvious reason. Swapping hard drives and power supplies proved to be futile. I eventually noticed some dust bunnies had collect around the cpu fins and a good cleaning was all that was needed. Dieing hard drives (at least in my experience) are the most common source of hardware failures. Weak power supplies are probably a close second. greg > zb. > > On 8/18/06, *Gregory D Hough* > wrote: > > Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > > > > I am still observing that machine. > > > > It happens very often, every 10-20 minutes. Now I can say that it > > reboots itself (always? sometme?) Sometime it is able to recover, > > sometime it hangs during self-restarting. > > > > What "persistent performance counters" means? > > > > zb. > > > > On 8/18/06, *Neil Watson* < tlug-neil-8agRmHhQ+n2CxnSzwYWP7Q at public.gmane.org > > > >> wrote: > > > > What is the frequency of these occurrences? Have you tried > running some > > persistent performance counters to see if anything shows up? > > > > > Maybe the hard drive is in its death throws? > > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ekg_ab-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 21:47:06 2006 From: ekg_ab-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (E K) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 17:47:06 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Recomendation for dedicated server In-Reply-To: <200608181524.41176.fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <200608181524.41176.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: <20060818214706.46341.qmail@web61319.mail.yahoo.com> Hi Fraser, Have you looked at Hostway? http://www.hostway.com/dedicated-servers/truflex-s.html Their offer seem to be better for the same price. The company also looks well established. EK --- Fraser Campbell wrote: > On Friday 18 August 2006 14:52, E K wrote: > > > I thought of going with Carinet and tried to call > the > > Sales and tech support number 1.888.221.5902. All > I > > got was the recorded message "We're sorry your > call > > can not be completed as dialed.....". Well, that > is > > pretty much the end of it. > > Looks like the toll-free is US only. I called > 1.858.974.5080 and did get > through immediately to both sales and tech support > (5-10 seconds hold at > most). > > The sales guy was very helpful, I asked him about > rescue system/serial console > and he was able to tell me that there was none (and > was very knowledgeable > regarding the underlying technology). If you order > larger numbers of servers > (server clusters) then remote KVM might be > available. > > I'd be very concerned about having a remote server > without rescue/console > capability. Also, although the (base) price is > right I object to some of the > pricing structure - I would want at least software > RAID, they charge you > $15/month for the extra disk and $20/month for > software RAID1, give me a > break! > > I do want to set up a second server soon but don't > really want it to be with > 1&1 (just for redundancy reasons) so I guess I'll > keep looking. > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: > http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text > below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: > http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 18 22:44:57 2006 From: caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 18:44:57 -0400 Subject: CDs play in W98 but not FC2 In-Reply-To: <20060816131341.GK13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> <874pwdpqx8.fsf@MagnumOpus.khem> <44E2659C.8010409@vianet.ca> <44E266C3.3080706@vianet.ca> <20060816131341.GK13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20060818224457.10880.qmail@mail.vianet.ca> Lennart Sorensen writes: > On Tue, Aug 15, 2006 at 08:28:51PM -0400, Chris Aitken wrote: >> However, in the GUI SBL! Alsamixer (command: gnome-volume-control) there >> are two pairs (stereo) of sliders named "CD" - they are both way up. > > How about the mute option on that input? Mute is unchecked on all. Chris > > -- > Len Sorensen > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 19 02:19:18 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 22:19:18 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Exim4, Debian and Rogers... In-Reply-To: <20060818013545.82101.qmail-p6KvMhi7PWKB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060818013545.82101.qmail@web88206.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20060819021918.81868.qmail@web88204.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Ok to answer my own question, you can send e-mail using exim4, Debian and Rogers. You don't need to do any wierdness regarding ports. There are two nasty little issues that can bite you hard (at least they bit me hard :-( ). Here is what you need in various files (with e-mail addresses/passwords changed). In /etc/email-addresses you need a line like the following for every local Linux box login that you want to be able to send e-mail: <>: <>@rogers.com More than one <> can point to the same <>, i.e.: I have root and my normal user login pointing at the same <> . In /etc/exim4/exim4.conf.template your need to remove (or comment out) the following bit: plain: driver = plaintext public_name = PLAIN .ifndef AUTH_CLIENT_ALLOW_NOTLS_PASSWORDS client_send = "${if !eq{$tls_cipher}{}{\ ^${extract{1}{::}\ {${lookup{$host}lsearch*{CONFDIR/passwd.client}{$value}fail}}}\ ^${extract{2}{::}\ {${lookup{$host}lsearch*{CONFDIR/passwd.client}{$value}fail}}}\ }fail}" .else client_send = "^${extract{1}{::}{${lookup{$host}lsearch*{CONFDIR/passwd.client}{$value}fail}}}^${extract{2}{::}{${lookup{$host}lsearch*{CONFDIR/passwd.client}{$value}fail}}}" .endif Then put the follow in: plain: driver = plaintext public_name = PLAIN client_send = "^<>@rogers.com^<>" Next you need the following in /etc/exim4/update-exim4.conf.conf: dc_eximconfig_configtype='smarthost' dc_other_hostnames='' dc_local_interfaces='127.0.0.1' dc_readhost='rogers.com' dc_relay_domains='' dc_minimaldns='false' dc_relay_nets='' dc_smarthost='smtp-rog.mail.yahoo2.akadns.net' CFILEMODE='644' dc_use_split_config='false' dc_hide_mailname='true' dc_mailname_in_oh='true' While I suspect it isnt't required I put the following into: /etc/exim4/passwd.client smtp-rog.mail.yahoo2.akadns.net:<>@rogers.com:<> The two things in the above that gave me grief were the dc_smarthost name and the "plain:" bit. There is a bug in exim4 that will choke on CNAMEs, like the smtp.broadband.rogers.com name you find in the Rogers documentation, the 'smtp-rog.mail.yahoo2.akadns.net' is the currently correct replacement (yes, it may be subject to change without notice, sigh). By default exim4 wants to send the RogersID/Password encrypted, but due to problems at the Rogers/Yahoo end of things it will only with plain text (BAD NEWS!). Get any of the above wrong and you will be facing a pile of cryptic error messages and rotten documentation :-( . Now, the reason for putting up with the above is that exim4 when working with fetchmail (which is another pile of unholy @#$%) makes your Linux act/seem like it is mail server on the Internet, allowing the likes of Procmail (which is a toxic waste dump unto itself) to think all is right with the universe. Why do it? Well, it is an interesting challenge, and in my case, I am writing a magazine article on Procmail for a magazine (which will pay some $$ :-) ). Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From david-FkEgs2FKm2NvBvnq28/GKQ at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 19 19:06:59 2006 From: david-FkEgs2FKm2NvBvnq28/GKQ at public.gmane.org (david thornton) Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2006 20:06:59 +0100 Subject: strange hardware problem In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <44E76153.9080407@quadratic.net> Have you examined /var/log/messages? can you put the drive in another chassis? You need to be able to rule out portions of the system. What if you remove the NICs? if it's just on it's own with no network does it behave the same? David Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > > The machine is running RedHat 9. Pentium III. It reports itself as > GenuineIntel > in /proc/cpuinfo. It is not heavily used. Top shows mostly 99.8 % of > idle CPU > as well a lot of free memory. > > It is used as a test server, visible also from the Internet. > > It just shuts down itself. In the sense that there is no access to it > by ssh, > it does not respond to mouse or keybord. This happens more and more > often, > recentely every 15 minutes. > > There is no any usefull info in log files (or at least I can not find > it). > > May be someone could perhaps suggest how to approach this problem, how > to solve it? > How to find out what causes it? > > We checked the BIOS, apmd is not running. > > zb. > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From gilesorr-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 19 19:09:06 2006 From: gilesorr-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Giles Orr) Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2006 15:09:06 -0400 Subject: sell/trade DSL modem, NIC wanted Message-ID: <1f13df280608191209l6c9b5089l675f06aa318d4f27@mail.gmail.com> I don't know if offers to sell/trade stuff is inappropriate to this list (I've seen some trading going on). If it is, I only need to be warned once. I picked up a DSL modem recently at a garage sale to replace a flaky one at home, but didn't notice until later that this one is USB only, no RJ-45. Oops. It's an "Efficient Networks SpeedStream 4060 USB ADSL Modem" (complete with long USB cable and power brick - it's thought to work, but I'm not in a position to check it) and I'd love to trade it for a Linux-compatible 100Mbit half height network card. Most cheap NICs are half height, but I'd really really like to have the rear faceplate to go with it. If no one shows any interest in trading or paying ($3, my cost) for the modem, I'll give it away for free - so let me know if you're interested in a free modem (first come first served, no promises). I'll be at Linux in the Park, and I'd like to take care of this then. If anyone has half-height NICs but doesn't want a USB modem, name a price - I'd be interested in one, two, or three. -- Giles http://www.gilesorr.com/ gilesorr-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 20 00:26:14 2006 From: meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org (Meng Cheah) Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2006 20:26:14 -0400 Subject: OT: Apple admits excessive iPod hours Message-ID: <44E7AC26.4000902@pppoe.ca> *Apple Computer has said a report of labour conditions at its iPod plant in China found workers did more than 60 hours a week a third of the time. *Staff making the world's most popular MP3 player also worked more than six consecutive days 25% of the time. Apple said the hours were "excessive" and said its supplier would now be enforcing a "normal" 60-hour week. The firm said there were "overtime limit exceptions in unusual circumstances" and that it supported a healthy work-life balance. But it did not specify what the triggers for "unusual circumstances" were and what upper limit it set on working hours. But the report has been criticised by a leading international trade union organisation for not being independently verified. Janek Kuczkiewicz, director of human and trade union rights at the International Confederation of Free Trade Unions (ICFTU), said he was not impressed by the report. More at http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/5262110.stm and http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/08/19/mother_jones_goes_to_china/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 20 16:09:53 2006 From: ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ansar Mohammed) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 12:09:53 -0400 Subject: UofT - OT Message-ID: <007001c6c473$12af7690$0405a8c0@northamerica.corp.microsoft.com> Is anyone here enrolled in postgraduate studies at UofT? Can you email me offlist? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 20 14:12:38 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 15:12:38 +0100 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: <20060815131953.GH13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060815040804.GA14384@waltdnes.org> <20060815131953.GH13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <44E86DD6.50306@utoronto.ca> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > Yeah it takes like 10 or 15 minutes to do following the howto. There > are a few tricks for a few programs to deal with, but for most things it > works fine. > > I actually run 32bit debian on an amd64, with a 64bit kernel, and then > 64bit debian in a chroot. So how do you have that working? You install a 32bit version and then simply compile and/or copy your 64bit kernel and associated /lib/kernel folder to your 32bit install? I'm interested as I do find that even using dchroot and various other methods of running 32bit programs on 64bit kernels, there are some quirky little things, like missing gtk libraries etc. for, say Firefox, that I don't want to have to track down and install... Jamon -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr.mcgregor-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 20 19:18:32 2006 From: mr.mcgregor-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (John Mcgregor) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 15:18:32 -0400 Subject: 32 bit vs 64 bit Message-ID: <44E8B588.6080505@rogers.com> Hi Folk, Earlier this week there was a discussion about using the 32 bit version of Linux on 64 bit machines. I have an Acer laptop with a Turion processor on which I would like to do just that. Is it just as simple as downloading and burning a 32 bit distro, or is there some sort of parameter that I have to pass at the initial boot as well? TIA John -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rjh-tkNKonCg4laeFQavDyXPBQ at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 20 19:29:49 2006 From: rjh-tkNKonCg4laeFQavDyXPBQ at public.gmane.org (Robin Humble) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 15:29:49 -0400 Subject: 32 bit vs 64 bit In-Reply-To: <44E8B588.6080505-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44E8B588.6080505@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20060820192949.GA9301@lemming.cita.utoronto.ca> On Sun, Aug 20, 2006 at 03:18:32PM -0400, John Mcgregor wrote: > Earlier this week there was a discussion about using the 32 bit >version of Linux on 64 bit machines. I have an Acer laptop with a Turion >processor on which I would like to do just that. Is it just as simple as >downloading and burning a 32 bit distro, or is there some sort of >parameter that I have to pass at the initial boot as well? just install from a 32bit distro. no idea why you'd want a 32bit distro on a 64bit machine though. it'll be slower. cheers, robin -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rjh-tkNKonCg4laeFQavDyXPBQ at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 20 19:42:57 2006 From: rjh-tkNKonCg4laeFQavDyXPBQ at public.gmane.org (Robin Humble) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 15:42:57 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060815040804.GA14384@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <20060820194257.GB9301@lemming.cita.utoronto.ca> On Tue, Aug 15, 2006 at 04:11:24AM -0400, D. Hugh Redelmeier wrote: >I run 64-bit Fedora. It can run 64-bit and 32-bit programs: both sets >of shared libraries are installed. Even this isn't as clean as you'd >like, at least for firefox. When you install Firefox, you get the >64-bit version. It is tough to replace it with a 32-bit version >because several things depend on it (at least in my system -- things >like Eclipse). I've installed both, but the startup of Firefox we use 64bit distro + 32bit firefox on fc5. (haven't tried eclipse) on x86_64 we do this daily or weekly: yum upgrade yum --enablerepo='core 32bit' --enablerepo='updates 32bit' upgrade where the 32bit yum repo files are in /etc/yum.repos.d/ but are disabled by default. the above auto-updates the full x86_64 distro, and then the 32bit firefox. works well. cheers, robin -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 02:00:01 2006 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 19:00:01 -0700 Subject: 32 bit vs 64 bit In-Reply-To: <20060820192949.GA9301-Xa+LbO3DC1G2Q0qicKDiVp4VBq8PJc8F@public.gmane.org> References: <44E8B588.6080505@rogers.com> <20060820192949.GA9301@lemming.cita.utoronto.ca> Message-ID: On 8/20/06, Robin Humble wrote: > On Sun, Aug 20, 2006 at 03:18:32PM -0400, John Mcgregor wrote: > > Earlier this week there was a discussion about using the 32 bit > >version of Linux on 64 bit machines. I have an Acer laptop with a Turion > >processor on which I would like to do just that. Is it just as simple as > >downloading and burning a 32 bit distro, or is there some sort of > >parameter that I have to pass at the initial boot as well? > > just install from a 32bit distro. > > no idea why you'd want a 32bit distro on a 64bit machine though. > it'll be slower. There's some benefit to both directions... - In the "running in 32 bit mode" direction, there is the merit that things like Flash players and video codecs and OpenOffice.org and such that are primarily or fundamentally 32 bit code will run with as few layers of complications as possible. - Of course, there will be applications that can benefit from being aware of extra registers and of larger "bit grabs". I don't see indication of there being *enormous* performance differences for common "desktop and web browsing and writing some documents" purposes... -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html Oddly enough, this is completely standard behaviour for shells. This is a roundabout way of saying `don't use combined chains of `&&'s and `||'s unless you think G?del's theorem is for sissies'. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr.mcgregor-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 03:54:49 2006 From: mr.mcgregor-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (John McGregor) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 23:54:49 -0400 Subject: 32 bit vs 64 bit Message-ID: <44E92E89.7030100@rogers.com> Chris Browne wrote: > There's some benefit to both directions... > > - In the "running in 32 bit mode" direction, there is the merit that > things like Flash players and video codecs and OpenOffice.org and such > that are primarily or fundamentally 32 bit code will run with as few > layers of complications as possible. > > - Of course, there will be applications that can benefit from being > aware of extra registers and of larger "bit grabs". > > I don't see indication of there being **enormous** performance > differences for common "desktop and web browsing and writing some > documents" purposes... > Thanks Chris, that really helps. The reason that I aked the question in the first place is that the distro I plan to use is MEPIS -- which does't have a 64 bit version, at least on the basis of the mirrors that I checked. I am taking courses through the Chang School at Ryerson. Ryerson seems to be pretty Windows centric in terms of how written work can be submitted, so I need Open Office ( to be able to save as a .doc) to work with a minimum of fuss and bother. As well, the laptop has a Broadcom 43xx wireless nic, so I am likely going to have to use ndiswrapper in order to get it working. I am sure that there are people on this list for whom solving these problems on a 64 bit machine would be a 'no brainer', but I am not in that league yet. :lol: John -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 19 18:17:18 2006 From: hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Howard Gibson) Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2006 14:17:18 -0400 Subject: Acer Aspire 3620 Message-ID: <20060819141718.feb61c24.hgibson@eol.ca> I just bought one. It came with something called Linpus Linux, which provided nothing more than a root command line, but at least I think I avoided the Microsoft tax. My real plan had been to buy a reconditioned laptop, but this new one was irresistable. Fedora Core 5 seems to work very well. The distribution supports the video and the battery. Fedora Core 3 didn't. The computer comes with a 56K win/linmodem. I went to www.linuxant.com, I downloaded the driver for my distribution, processor and Kernel. I installed it and used wvdialconf and minicom and locate and test the modem. I logged out and shut the computer down. So far, so good. When I turned it back on, it started to boot, it reached the part about udev, then everything went screwy. Usually, the final line displayed on the screen was... "Unable to handle kernel paging request at virtual address 61642072" It was always the same virtual address. I was able to boot using the Fedora CD and search the hard drive. I was able to reinstall everything, and it is working fine now. I haven't the nerve to try installing the modem software again. The Linuxant site indicates that there ae problems with Kernal versions, and that I might have to compile one. Is anyone familiar with Linuxant's software for Conexant chips, Fedora, and Celeron processors? -- Howard Gibson hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org howardg-PadmjKOQAFn3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org http://home.eol.ca/~hgibson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From gilesorr-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 12:52:05 2006 From: gilesorr-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Giles Orr) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 08:52:05 -0400 Subject: GTABUG, any members present? Message-ID: <1f13df280608210552u74cbff1aqc86d42d7f8d9ab02@mail.gmail.com> I've developed an interest in the BSD family, and found the GTABUG website (http://www.gtabug.com/). Here's the problem: they say "There's a list of proposed meeting dates below but, to be safe, you should sign up for the mailing list as this page may not always be updated in time for the meetings." I'd like to join the mailing list anyway, but: the link to the listserver is broken, there's no contact info anywhere on the page, and they're using whois obfuscation so I can't even get a name that way. Are there any GTABUG members on this list who can either assist me in getting onto the mailing list? Thanks. -- Giles http://www.gilesorr.com/ gilesorr-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 13:40:29 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 09:40:29 -0400 Subject: GTABUG, any members present? In-Reply-To: <1f13df280608210552u74cbff1aqc86d42d7f8d9ab02-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <1f13df280608210552u74cbff1aqc86d42d7f8d9ab02@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <44E9B7CD.6000206@telly.org> Giles Orr wrote: > I've developed an interest in the BSD family, and found the GTABUG > website (http://www.gtabug.com/). Here's the problem: they say > "There's a list of proposed meeting dates below but, to be safe, you > should sign up for the mailing list as this page may not always be > updated in time for the meetings." I'd like to join the mailing list > anyway, but: the link to the listserver is broken, there's no contact > info anywhere on the page, and they're using whois obfuscation so I > can't even get a name that way. Are there any GTABUG members on this > list who can either assist me in getting onto the mailing list? 1) They have a usual meeting place and time-of-the-month to meet. So you could just show up at the usual place, at the usual time. 2) The GTABUG website has links to a number of individual members' websites/blogs at the bottom. You could always try to contact one of them. - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tleslie-RBVUpeUoHUc at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 14:00:09 2006 From: tleslie-RBVUpeUoHUc at public.gmane.org (ted leslie) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 10:00:09 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: <44E86DD6.50306-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060815040804.GA14384@waltdnes.org> <20060815131953.GH13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44E86DD6.50306@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <1156168809.30331.230.camel@stan64.site> for sled10 x64 it comes out of the box with flash and mp3 i copied a 32bit mplayer, and dll's to the 64bit machine ran the 32bit mplayer, and it got an error on 2 lib's that i brought over from a 32bit suse install, and that was that, no chroot, etc, just a fully working suse sled10, with a 32 bit mplayer (its dll's) and a could of 32bit libs. -tl On Sun, 2006-08-20 at 15:12 +0100, Jamon Camisso wrote: > Lennart Sorensen wrote: > > Yeah it takes like 10 or 15 minutes to do following the howto. There > > are a few tricks for a few programs to deal with, but for most things it > > works fine. > > > > I actually run 32bit debian on an amd64, with a 64bit kernel, and then > > 64bit debian in a chroot. > > So how do you have that working? You install a 32bit version and then > simply compile and/or copy your 64bit kernel and associated /lib/kernel > folder to your 32bit install? I'm interested as I do find that even > using dchroot and various other methods of running 32bit programs on > 64bit kernels, there are some quirky little things, like missing gtk > libraries etc. for, say Firefox, that I don't want to have to track down > and install... > > Jamon > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rjonasz-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 14:16:56 2006 From: rjonasz-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Randy Jonasz) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 10:16:56 -0400 Subject: Open Office and HP 1320 Message-ID: Hey everyone, Has anyone had experience with printing from Open Office to a HP 1320 Laser Printer? The problem I have is that every time I want to print from OO, the error light flashes on the printer. The print job doesn't start until I hit the green button. It then prints fine. It's a pain though, to have keep clearing the error on the printer every time I want to print. Thanks for the help! Cheers, Randy PS. I tried setting the paper size in OO to A4 and letter to no avail :( -- Imagine no possessions I wonder if you can No need for greed or hunger A brotherhood of man Imagine all the people Sharing all the world --John Lennon -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From stephenc-wtWqQT8woy8 at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 14:41:14 2006 From: stephenc-wtWqQT8woy8 at public.gmane.org (Stephen W. Clarke) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 10:41:14 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Open Office and HP 1320 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <34126.72.38.22.170.1156171274.squirrel@72.38.22.170> Randy, I've got 6 workstations running Ubuntu 6.06 and OO 2.0.2 and all of them print to a shared HP1320 without any issues. The shared printer is on a ZOT print server so that may be helping us avoid the issue you mention. Did you set both the paper size and the PageRegion to letter? Also you might want to check and see if the printer trying to print Double Sided? Stephen > Hey everyone, > > Has anyone had experience with printing from Open Office to a HP 1320 > Laser Printer? The problem I have is that every time I want to print > from OO, the error light flashes on the printer. The print job > doesn't start until I hit the green button. It then prints fine. > It's a pain though, to have keep clearing the error on the printer > every time I want to print. > > Thanks for the help! > > Cheers, > > Randy > > PS. I tried setting the paper size in OO to A4 and letter to no avail :( > > -- > Imagine no possessions > I wonder if you can > No need for greed or hunger > A brotherhood of man > Imagine all the people > Sharing all the world > --John Lennon > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- Stephen W. Clarke Marketing and Communications Officer Nray Services Inc. 56A Head Street Dundas, ON L9H 3H7 CANADA Tel: (905) 627-1302 x14 Fax: (905) 627-5022 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rjonasz-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 15:07:34 2006 From: rjonasz-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Randy Jonasz) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 11:07:34 -0400 Subject: Open Office and HP 1320 In-Reply-To: <34126.72.38.22.170.1156171274.squirrel-u5iS8elThxsi7FR4L9eesA@public.gmane.org> References: <34126.72.38.22.170.1156171274.squirrel@72.38.22.170> Message-ID: Hi Stephen, On 8/21/06, Stephen W. Clarke wrote: > Randy, > > I've got 6 workstations running Ubuntu 6.06 and OO 2.0.2 and all of them > print to a shared HP1320 without any issues. The shared printer is on a > ZOT print server so that may be helping us avoid the issue you mention. We have 9 iMacs running OS X connected to 2 HP 1320n. Firefox prints without any issues, but Open Office will only print after pressing green button on printer. > > Did you set both the paper size and the PageRegion to letter? > Also you might want to check and see if the printer trying to print Double > Sided? I've tried US letter and A4 paper sizes in OO. I've also tried setting duplex to simplex, ignore and off without success. Cheers, Randy > > Stephen > > > > Hey everyone, > > > > Has anyone had experience with printing from Open Office to a HP 1320 > > Laser Printer? The problem I have is that every time I want to print > > from OO, the error light flashes on the printer. The print job > > doesn't start until I hit the green button. It then prints fine. > > It's a pain though, to have keep clearing the error on the printer > > every time I want to print. > > > > Thanks for the help! > > > > Cheers, > > > > Randy > > > > PS. I tried setting the paper size in OO to A4 and letter to no avail :( > > > > -- > > Imagine no possessions > > I wonder if you can > > No need for greed or hunger > > A brotherhood of man > > Imagine all the people > > Sharing all the world > > --John Lennon > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > > > -- > Stephen W. Clarke > Marketing and Communications Officer > Nray Services Inc. > 56A Head Street > Dundas, ON L9H 3H7 > CANADA > > Tel: (905) 627-1302 x14 > Fax: (905) 627-5022 > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- Imagine no possessions I wonder if you can No need for greed or hunger A brotherhood of man Imagine all the people Sharing all the world --John Lennon -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From brandon-77Z/iqU1yLlrovVCs/uTlw at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 15:23:16 2006 From: brandon-77Z/iqU1yLlrovVCs/uTlw at public.gmane.org (Brandon Sandrowicz) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 11:23:16 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: <1156168809.30331.230.camel-Wos4hdNTH4j6K7/ahGyk6A@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060815040804.GA14384@waltdnes.org> <20060815131953.GH13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44E86DD6.50306@utoronto.ca> <1156168809.30331.230.camel@stan64.site> Message-ID: <20060821152316.GA592@PyBook.local> It just depends on what you are running. If mplayer doesn't link against any external libraries, then it's portable between 32-bit and 64-bit installs. The real problem with running 64bit/32bit side-by-side is the libraries that apps depend on. Debian doesn't have a standard location like 'lib64' or 'lib32' to separate the 64-bit and 32-bit compiled libraries. 32-bit Firefox can't use 64-bit GTK+ libraries, for example. This is where the chroot comes in. With the chroot, you can have the 32bit libraries installed in the default locations ( which would overwrite the 64bit libraries otherwise) and the 32bit programs look for them there. So you just have your 32-bit chroot pointed to a 32-bit repository and it should install all the 32-bit libraries into the appropriate locations in the chroot. IIRC, other distros just have a 'lib64' for 64-bit libraries or a 'lib32' for the 32-bit libraries and all of their packages are compiled with this in mind for linking. - Brandon Sandrowicz On Mon, Aug 21, 2006 at 10:00:09AM -0400, ted leslie wrote: > for sled10 x64 > it comes out of the box with flash and mp3 > i copied a 32bit mplayer, and dll's to the 64bit machine > ran the 32bit mplayer, and it got an error on 2 lib's that i brought > over from a 32bit suse install, > and that was that, no chroot, etc, just a fully working suse sled10, > with a 32 bit mplayer (its dll's) and a could of 32bit libs. > > -tl > > > > On Sun, 2006-08-20 at 15:12 +0100, Jamon Camisso wrote: > > Lennart Sorensen wrote: > > > Yeah it takes like 10 or 15 minutes to do following the howto. There > > > are a few tricks for a few programs to deal with, but for most things it > > > works fine. > > > > > > I actually run 32bit debian on an amd64, with a 64bit kernel, and then > > > 64bit debian in a chroot. > > > > So how do you have that working? You install a 32bit version and then > > simply compile and/or copy your 64bit kernel and associated /lib/kernel > > folder to your 32bit install? I'm interested as I do find that even > > using dchroot and various other methods of running 32bit programs on > > 64bit kernels, there are some quirky little things, like missing gtk > > libraries etc. for, say Firefox, that I don't want to have to track down > > and install... > > > > Jamon > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.muriithi-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 16:19:52 2006 From: william.muriithi-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Kihara Muriithi) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 19:19:52 +0300 Subject: usb to ttyS0 mapping issues -and wvdial configuration Message-ID: Hi all, I am tryiing to set up an Acer (Aspire 3610 model) laptop for dial up. The laptop don't have one of the most handy interface namely serial port. To connect to a serial port, one has to use a usb to serial cable and I find that very un-ideal. (Why the heck leave out a serial port and then turn around and start selling usb to serial cables?). Beside financial implication, I can't now figure out how to map ppp connection on. The first 4 ttyS* port looks like this to setserial linux:/home/William # setserial -a /dev/ttyS0 /dev/ttyS0, Line 0, UART: unknown, Port: 0x03f8, IRQ: 4 Baud_base: 115200, close_delay: 50, divisor: 0 closing_wait: 3000 Flags: spd_normal skip_test What I don't like is the lack of UART. What is the implication of above? I thought of mapping it to the USB device, but that even look worse to setserial linux:/home/wambugu # setserial -a /dev/usbdev2.1 Cannot get serial info: Inappropriate ioctl for device Okay, one last shot I gave it one more shot linux:/home/William # wvdialconf /home/William/Desktop/wvdial1.txt Scanning your serial ports for a modem. Port Scan<*1>: S0 S1 S2 S3 Sorry, no modem was detected! Is it in use by another program? Did you configure it properly with setserial? >From the above queries, I decided to map modem to /dev/ttyS0. I also gave /dev/ttyS1 a shot with no success Now I hope that is enough information about the laptop. I believe some information about where the serial cable terminate would be important. It connects to a Huawei ETS2577 handset. The handset connect to the ISP through Qualcomm 3G CDMA wireless technology. I am also really hoping that UART will be inside this phone set, but I aren't sure of that.I believe this is sufficient information, but would happly suppiy more information is needed. Now, how can I make this setup work? I have been using wvdial and below is its configuration [Dialer Defaults] Modem = /dev/ttyS0 Baud = 115200 Init1 = ATZ Init2 = ATQ0 V1 E1 S0=0 &C1 &D2 Init3 = Area Code = Phone = 777 Username = some_name Password = some_password Ask Password = 0 Dial Command = ATDT Stupid Mode = 1 Compuserve = 0 Force Address = Idle Seconds = 300 DialMessage1 = DialMessage2 = ISDN = 0 Auto DNS = 1 Now, is there anything that I could have done wrong?.And does wvdial use /etc/ppp/chap-secrets file? What is the sure way of knowing that you are mapping an application to the right /dev? The link between the handset and ISP is fne for sure since I can make phone calls from the handset, so the issue has to be wvdial configuration and the ttyS0 interface. Oh, and my ISP is hostile to Linux, so I don't expect much help from them. Thanks a lot in advance William -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 16:55:38 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 12:55:38 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: <20060821152316.GA592-v/0tkT6wDSGE+EvaaNYduQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060815040804.GA14384@waltdnes.org> <20060815131953.GH13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44E86DD6.50306@utoronto.ca> <1156168809.30331.230.camel@stan64.site> <20060821152316.GA592@PyBook.local> Message-ID: <44E9E58A.80101@telly.org> Brandon Sandrowicz wrote: >It just depends on what you are running. If mplayer doesn't link against any external libraries, then it's portable between 32-bit and 64-bit installs. The real problem with running 64bit/32bit side-by-side is the libraries that apps depend on. > Actually, it's not the libraries that are the problem, but the binary codec files used by them: http://www1.mplayerhq.hu/design7/codecs.html These codecs are not normally installed along with most distributions, though some communities have made their installation easy (notably the PLF network used by Mandriva and EasyUbuntu). Some of these codecs (notably the WMV9 one) are known not to work in a 64-bit environment. Any format natively supported by mplayer (which don't need the codecs) works fine in 64-bit. The other desktop biggie that won't work under 64-bit AFAIK is Flash animation (if someone knows how to make that work, please let me know!) - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 11:58:35 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 12:58:35 +0100 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: <44E9E58A.80101-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060815040804.GA14384@waltdnes.org> <20060815131953.GH13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44E86DD6.50306@utoronto.ca> <1156168809.30331.230.camel@stan64.site> <20060821152316.GA592@PyBook.local> <44E9E58A.80101@telly.org> Message-ID: <44E99FEB.3050404@utoronto.ca> Evan Leibovitch wrote: > The other desktop biggie that won't work under 64-bit AFAIK is Flash > animation (if someone knows how to make that work, please let me know!) As a GNU/Linux user, you might be interested in Gnash -- GNU's flash player that apparently supports everything up to (and including) SWF 7. http://www.gnu.org/software/gnash/ I've not used it myself, but it looks promising. Jamon -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lmlane-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 17:05:03 2006 From: lmlane-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Mark Lane) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 13:05:03 -0400 Subject: 32 bit vs 64 bit In-Reply-To: <44E92E89.7030100-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44E92E89.7030100@rogers.com> Message-ID: On 8/20/06, John McGregor wrote: > Chris Browne wrote: > > > There's some benefit to both directions... > > > > - In the "running in 32 bit mode" direction, there is the merit that > > things like Flash players and video codecs and OpenOffice.org and such > > that are primarily or fundamentally 32 bit code will run with as few > > layers of complications as possible. > > > > - Of course, there will be applications that can benefit from being > > aware of extra registers and of larger "bit grabs". > > > > I don't see indication of there being **enormous** performance > > differences for common "desktop and web browsing and writing some > > documents" purposes... > > > Thanks Chris, that really helps. The reason that I aked the question in > the first place is that the distro I plan to use is MEPIS -- which > does't have a 64 bit version, at least on the basis of the mirrors that > I checked. I am taking courses through the Chang School at Ryerson. > Ryerson seems to be pretty Windows centric in terms of how written work > can be submitted, so I need Open Office ( to be able to save as a .doc) > to work with a minimum of fuss and bother. As well, the laptop has a > Broadcom 43xx wireless nic, so I am likely going to have to use > ndiswrapper in order to get it working. I am sure that there are people > on this list for whom solving these problems on a 64 bit machine would > be a 'no brainer', but I am not in that league yet. :lol: > Running the 32bit version of OpenOffice on a 64bit Distro is not a problem. It requires some 32bit libraries but most distros handle that all for you. -- Mark Lane, CET -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 17:36:42 2006 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 17:36:42 +0000 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: <44E99FEB.3050404-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060815040804.GA14384@waltdnes.org> <20060815131953.GH13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44E86DD6.50306@utoronto.ca> <1156168809.30331.230.camel@stan64.site> <20060821152316.GA592@PyBook.local> <44E9E58A.80101@telly.org> <44E99FEB.3050404@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: On 8/21/06, Jamon Camisso wrote: > Evan Leibovitch wrote: > > The other desktop biggie that won't work under 64-bit AFAIK is Flash > > animation (if someone knows how to make that work, please let me know!) > > > As a GNU/Linux user, you might be interested in Gnash -- GNU's flash > player that apparently supports everything up to (and including) SWF 7. > > http://www.gnu.org/software/gnash/ > > I've not used it myself, but it looks promising. It would provide the about best results for the promise if it was implemented as... main () { exit 1; } The primary benefit to having something that "ate" Flash would be if it made the irritating popup dialog boxes go away... -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 17:53:15 2006 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 13:53:15 -0400 Subject: Patched HP LJ1320 PPD file (was:Open Office and HP 1320) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <44E9F30B.6080206@alteeve.com> Here is a link to my patched copy of the PPD file for this printer. I know it fixed the same problem for me on Debian 3.1 and Ubuntu 5.10 & 6.06. I am not sure if it will work on others (ie: OS X for Randy). Please report success of failure. http://mizu-bu.org/misc/HP_LaserJet_1320_Patched.ppd The patch was created by a script off (iirc) LinuxPrinting, but I can't remember exactly where now. It's the PPD file I use at work currently and it solved my problems. HTH! Madi -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 18:26:54 2006 From: amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org (Alex Maynard) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 14:26:54 -0400 Subject: New ubuntu install freezes on boot on IBM T21 laptop Message-ID: Hi All: Just wondering if anyone has any thoughts on a problem I've been having with IBM T21 laptop? I installed a new kubuntu disk on my laptop. At first it worked well. But about a day later it started going blank halfway through reboot and kept doing this. So essentially I couldn't boot from the hard drive. Later I reinstalled ubuntu and the same thing happened. I used to have the same laptop working using libranet but they went out of business and my CDs from them are too far out of date to update without dependency problems. The only thing I can think of to do now is to try a differerent distribution (any suggestions?), but I thought I would run this by you to see what other suggestions you might have. Alex -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 18:31:46 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 14:31:46 -0400 Subject: New ubuntu install freezes on boot on IBM T21 laptop In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <44E9FC12.9000206@rogers.com> Alex Maynard wrote: > Hi All: > > Just wondering if anyone has any thoughts on a problem I've been having > with IBM T21 laptop? > > I installed a new kubuntu disk on my laptop. At first it worked well. But > about a day later it started going blank halfway through reboot and kept > doing this. So essentially I couldn't boot from the hard drive. > > Later I reinstalled ubuntu and the same thing happened. I used > to have the same laptop working using libranet but they went out of > business and my CDs from them are too far out of date to update without > dependency problems. > > The only thing I can think of to do now is to try a differerent > distribution (any suggestions?), but I thought I would run this by > you to see what other suggestions you might have. SUSE has good ThinkPad support. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 18:47:46 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 14:47:46 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Linux in the Park Message-ID: <20060821184746.28529.qmail@web88208.mail.re2.yahoo.com> So, my article on Procmail is in to the people at SSC, so I can now spend time pitching new article ideas, job hunting and gearing up for Linux in the Park. I have passed along the note you will see below to the freebie mailing lists I am on (with the hope that it will get us a few more bodies and some interesting stuff :-) ). Anyone wanting to have a note re: what they will be bringing to the party and/or looking for e-mail me and I would be happy to add it to the list. What are we doing on food? I would be happy to bring a small charcoal BBQ, but I know the parks department takes a dim view of charcoal in most of the parks (the only park they seem to tolerate charcoal is the Toronto Island (because there are rules against propane tanks on the ferry)). So, how do we suggest people have hot food at the picnic? Thermos? Where are we on permits? What do we have and what do we still need? Music/Entertainment? I have a bunch of MP3's of old science fiction radio shows that have a certain amount of perverse charm. But, quite frankly I could be quite happy without music (especially if it is of a style I hate (read: Country/Western)). Tomorow at NewTLUG I will be promoting Linux in the Park, where else should we be noting the event? Colin McGregor -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- To: FreecycleTO-hHKSG33TihhbjbujkaE4pw at public.gmane.org From: "Colin McGregor" View Contact Details Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 14:21:47 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [FreecycleTO] Computer swapmeet The Greater Toronto Area Linux User Group is planning their yearly picnic for next weekend (August 26th from 2 PM - 6 PM, Bickford Park, 400 Grace St.), more details of which can be seen here: gtalug.org/wiki/Linux_in_the_Park2 With all of this is planned a swap meet to trade bits of surplus hardware (like I plan to bring an 8 port 10 Mbps dumb hub, some copies of Fedora Core 5 Linux on DVD-ROM and maybe a few others bits/pieces, I will be looking for Pentium III CPUs faster than 866 MHz). Details to be seen here: gtalug.org/wiki/Linux_in_the_Park_2006/activities Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rjonasz-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 18:54:26 2006 From: rjonasz-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Randy Jonasz) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 14:54:26 -0400 Subject: Patched HP LJ1320 PPD file (was:Open Office and HP 1320) In-Reply-To: <44E9F30B.6080206-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <44E9F30B.6080206@alteeve.com> Message-ID: Hey Madison, On 8/21/06, Madison Kelly wrote: > Here is a link to my patched copy of the PPD file for this printer. I > know it fixed the same problem for me on Debian 3.1 and Ubuntu 5.10 & > 6.06. I am not sure if it will work on others (ie: OS X for Randy). > Please report success of failure. Thanks very much for the file. It seems to have corrected the problem. On OS X I copied the ppd file to /etc/cups/ppd and made sure to name it to the same as the original ppd file for the hp printer. Cheers, Randy > > http://mizu-bu.org/misc/HP_LaserJet_1320_Patched.ppd > > The patch was created by a script off (iirc) LinuxPrinting, but I can't > remember exactly where now. It's the PPD file I use at work currently > and it solved my problems. > > HTH! > > Madi > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- Imagine no possessions I wonder if you can No need for greed or hunger A brotherhood of man Imagine all the people Sharing all the world --John Lennon -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 19:06:10 2006 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 19:06:10 +0000 Subject: Linux in the Park In-Reply-To: <20060821184746.28529.qmail-JoSsSUNfUciB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060821184746.28529.qmail@web88208.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On 8/21/06, Colin McGregor wrote: > What are we doing on food? I would be happy to bring a > small charcoal BBQ, but I know the parks department > takes a dim view of charcoal in most of the parks (the > only park they seem to tolerate charcoal is the > Toronto Island (because there are rules against > propane tanks on the ferry)). So, how do we suggest > people have hot food at the picnic? Thermos? This seems to me to fall into the category of "things happy picnickers will need to pay LinuxCafe to provide." > Where are we on permits? What do we have and what do > we still need? That looks to me like an ideal conversation for you and David to have pretty pronto... I'd be happy to contribute a thing or two to toss onto a shared BBQ; if that's located on David's soil, then he needs to let us know what's permissible/desired/appropriate. > Music/Entertainment? I have a bunch of MP3's of old > science fiction radio shows that have a certain amount > of perverse charm. But, quite frankly I could be quite > happy without music (especially if it is of a style I > hate (read: Country/Western)). "We've got both kinds of music: Country AND Western!" :-) I think I'd rather be without the music. -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html Oddly enough, this is completely standard behaviour for shells. This is a roundabout way of saying `don't use combined chains of `&&'s and `||'s unless you think G?del's theorem is for sissies'. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 19:14:22 2006 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 15:14:22 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <44E99FEB.3050404@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <200608211514.23028.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> On Monday 21 August 2006 13:36, Christopher Browne wrote: > It would provide the about best results for the promise if it was > implemented as... > > main () { > ? ?exit 1; > } > > The primary benefit to having something that "ate" Flash would be if > it made the irritating popup dialog boxes go away... Neat, your code is even 64bit compatible ;-) -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 19:13:58 2006 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins Witteman) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 15:13:58 -0400 Subject: New ubuntu install freezes on boot on IBM T21 laptop In-Reply-To: <44E9FC12.9000206-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44E9FC12.9000206@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20060821191358.GA12048@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> On Mon, Aug 21, 2006 at 02:31:46PM -0400, James Knott wrote: >Alex Maynard wrote: >>Hi All: >> >>Just wondering if anyone has any thoughts on a problem I've been having >>with IBM T21 laptop? >> >>I installed a new kubuntu disk on my laptop. At first it worked well. But >>about a day later it started going blank halfway through reboot and kept >>doing this. So essentially I couldn't boot from the hard drive. >> >>Later I reinstalled ubuntu and the same thing happened. I used >>to have the same laptop working using libranet but they went out of >>business and my CDs from them are too far out of date to update without >>dependency problems. >> >>The only thing I can think of to do now is to try a differerent >>distribution (any suggestions?), but I thought I would run this by >>you to see what other suggestions you might have. > >SUSE has good ThinkPad support. It is probably not a distro problem, but that some aspect of hardware is misconfigured and balking the boot. Can you report the place in the boot process that the "blanking" happens? If the screen is going blank I would think it'd be a power management setting that's barfing, but it could be a range of things. Debian also has good ThinkPad support, but I don't think that that's the actual issue. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From jasonspiro4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 19:16:15 2006 From: jasonspiro4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Jason Spiro) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 15:16:15 -0400 Subject: Patched HP LJ1320 PPD file (was:Open Office and HP 1320) In-Reply-To: References: <44E9F30B.6080206@alteeve.com> Message-ID: On 8/21/06, Randy Jonasz wrote: > Hey Madison, > > On 8/21/06, Madison Kelly wrote: > > Here is a link to my patched copy of the PPD file for this printer. I > > know it fixed the same problem for me on Debian 3.1 and Ubuntu 5.10 & > > 6.06. I am not sure if it will work on others (ie: OS X for Randy). > > Please report success of failure. > > Thanks very much for the file. It seems to have corrected the > problem. On OS X I copied the ppd file to /etc/cups/ppd and made sure > to name it to the same as the original ppd file for the hp printer. > Perhaps it would be worth it to send the patch back to the original creators of the PPD file? Please CC me, Jason -- When you open Windows, bugs get in. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 19:20:39 2006 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 15:20:39 -0400 Subject: Patched HP LJ1320 PPD file In-Reply-To: References: <44E9F30B.6080206@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <44EA0787.9000600@alteeve.com> Jason Spiro wrote: > On 8/21/06, Randy Jonasz wrote: >> Hey Madison, >> >> On 8/21/06, Madison Kelly wrote: >> > Here is a link to my patched copy of the PPD file for this printer. I >> > know it fixed the same problem for me on Debian 3.1 and Ubuntu 5.10 & >> > 6.06. I am not sure if it will work on others (ie: OS X for Randy). >> > Please report success of failure. >> >> Thanks very much for the file. It seems to have corrected the >> problem. On OS X I copied the ppd file to /etc/cups/ppd and made sure >> to name it to the same as the original ppd file for the hp printer. >> > > Perhaps it would be worth it to send the patch back to the original > creators of the PPD file? > > Please CC me, > Jason I didn't write the patch, so I don't think it's my position to do that. :/ otherwise I would have for sure. Not sure why a fix is out there but not in any releases though... Licensing issues maybe? Madi -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 19:53:42 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 15:53:42 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060815040804.GA14384@waltdnes.org> <20060815131953.GH13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44E86DD6.50306@utoronto.ca> <1156168809.30331.230.camel@stan64.site> <20060821152316.GA592@PyBook.local> <44E9E58A.80101@telly.org> <44E99FEB.3050404@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <44EA0F46.5020709@telly.org> Christopher Browne wrote: > It would provide the about best results for the promise if it was > implemented as... > > main () { > exit 1; > } If you don't like it, don't use it. > The primary benefit to having something that "ate" Flash would be if > it made the irritating popup dialog boxes go away... Apples and oranges. The problem with ads is not what they're written in, but where they come from and what they do. The combination of the "adblock+" and "filterset G" plugins for Firefox works extremely well at reducing them, far better than simply a policy of avoiding Flash. OTOH, many sites now require or depend upon Flash. While it's easy to sneer that one wouldn't want to go these sites, most people don't want to be so limited. - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 19:59:52 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 15:59:52 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: <44E86DD6.50306-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060815040804.GA14384@waltdnes.org> <20060815131953.GH13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44E86DD6.50306@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <20060821195952.GN13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Sun, Aug 20, 2006 at 03:12:38PM +0100, Jamon Camisso wrote: > So how do you have that working? You install a 32bit version and then > simply compile and/or copy your 64bit kernel and associated /lib/kernel > folder to your 32bit install? I'm interested as I do find that even > using dchroot and various other methods of running 32bit programs on > 64bit kernels, there are some quirky little things, like missing gtk > libraries etc. for, say Firefox, that I don't want to have to track down > and install... Sarge includes -amd64 kernels in the i386 release. That's what I use so far. The chroot is setup using debootstrap. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 20:09:11 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 16:09:11 -0400 Subject: Audio In Kubuntu In-Reply-To: <44E35C1E.7070600-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> <20060816131136.GI13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44E35C1E.7070600@rogers.com> Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608211309k78f49810j81638411a4113868@mail.gmail.com> On 8/16/06, Erebus wrote: > OK. I'm baffled. I've changed my other desktop PC over to Kubuntu > (from Windows XP). I told the Sound System choice in System Configurator > to "Auto Detect". When I choose "System Notifications" I can hear all > the sounds they make. But when I go to play a video in Kaffeine I get > absolutely zero audio out of the video. Any thoughts? I've been having trouble with various audio editing applications (RoseGarden, Audacity, Jamin, and several others) under Ubuntu Breezy Badger. I get all my system sound events, and can use a bunch of audio players, but I'm just as puzzled why some apps work and others don't. (I haven't actually tried to sit down and figure the issues out - or collect error messages yet.) Never actually used Kaffeine... Any chance it's a Codec issue? -- Scott Elcomb http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ http://search.cpan.org/~selcomb/SAL-3.03/ http://psema4.googlepages.com/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 20:14:14 2006 From: meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org (Meng Cheah) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 16:14:14 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: <20060821195952.GN13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060815040804.GA14384@waltdnes.org> <20060815131953.GH13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44E86DD6.50306@utoronto.ca> <20060821195952.GN13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <44EA1416.5000006@pppoe.ca> Lennart Sorensen wrote: >On Sun, Aug 20, 2006 at 03:12:38PM +0100, Jamon Camisso wrote: > > >>So how do you have that working? You install a 32bit version and then >>simply compile and/or copy your 64bit kernel and associated /lib/kernel >>folder to your 32bit install? I'm interested as I do find that even >>using dchroot and various other methods of running 32bit programs on >>64bit kernels, there are some quirky little things, like missing gtk >>libraries etc. for, say Firefox, that I don't want to have to track down >>and install... >> >> > >Sarge includes -amd64 kernels in the i386 release. That's what I use so >far. > >The chroot is setup using debootstrap. > >-- >Len Sorensen > > > Thanks for the pointers, they're much appreciated. Will look into debootstrap. Meng Cheah -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 20:41:34 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 16:41:34 -0400 Subject: Audio In Kubuntu In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f0608211309k78f49810j81638411a4113868-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> <20060816131136.GI13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44E35C1E.7070600@rogers.com> <99a6c38f0608211309k78f49810j81638411a4113868@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <44EA1A7E.6050007@telly.org> Scott Elcomb wrote: > Never actually used Kaffeine... Any chance it's a Codec issue? > Kaffeine is just a nice KDE front for the xine engine. If it won't play under xine, it won't play under Kaffeine. I have certainly not spent a lot of time playing with this, however I have noted a few things in using this stuff (YMMV): - Both Kaffeine and Amarok (the KDE audio player) are by default persistent; they'll stay in the system bar even when closed, until explicitly quit. If Amarok is in the system tray it will 'claim' the audio output, so Kaffeine will show video but no sound. Quitting Amarok fixes this problem, though Kaffeine may need to be restarted to get it to 'reclaim' the audio out. - I have encountered some files for which Linux can match the video codec but not the audio, resulting in a silent movie. They're not that frequent, but they do happen; personally I've found this most common in Quicktime format (.mov) files. - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 20:42:08 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 16:42:08 -0400 Subject: Audio In Kubuntu In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f0608211309k78f49810j81638411a4113868-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <44E23B1A.6000904@vianet.ca> <20060816131136.GI13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44E35C1E.7070600@rogers.com> <99a6c38f0608211309k78f49810j81638411a4113868@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <44EA1AA0.4040507@telly.org> Scott Elcomb wrote: > Never actually used Kaffeine... Any chance it's a Codec issue? > Kaffeine is just a nice KDE front for the xine engine. If it won't play under xine, it won't play under Kaffeine. I have certainly not spent a lot of time playing with this, however I have noted a few things in using this stuff (YMMV): - Both Kaffeine and Amarok (the KDE audio player) are by default persistent; they'll stay in the system bar even when closed, until explicitly quit. If Amarok is in the system tray it will 'claim' the audio output, so Kaffeine will show video but no sound. Quitting Amarok fixes this problem, though Kaffeine may need to be restarted to get it to 'reclaim' the audio out. - I have encountered some files for which the media player can match the video codec but not the audio, resulting in a silent movie. They're not that frequent, but they do happen; personally I've found this most common in Quicktime format (.mov) files. - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 20:58:20 2006 From: caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Chris Aitken) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 16:58:20 -0400 Subject: psc but no scan app? Message-ID: <44EA1E6C.9040709@vianet.ca> I want to use the scanner function of my hp psc 1610. Some time ago I managed to install and configure the printing with this device. It was a lot more work than installing other printers. I have been printing to it fine using cups and over the network. This is the first time I want to scan. I went to the red hat menu bar (in FC 2) but don't see any scanning application in there. I was hoping to find one and then see if it recognizes the device I have - but there is no scanning aplication (I'm pretty sure). Is there an easy-to-install scanning application that will work well with the hp psc 1610? Maybe I have an application on this system that just needs to be invoked with a command? Do you think there might be such an application hiding in FC2 ? Chirs -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 21:00:30 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 17:00:30 -0400 Subject: Probably the biggest thing to ever happen to Linux In-Reply-To: <1155907476.30331.64.camel-Wos4hdNTH4j6K7/ahGyk6A@public.gmane.org> References: <1155907476.30331.64.camel@stan64.site> Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608211400l348be13fs7748645d52341afa@mail.gmail.com> On 8/18/06, ted leslie wrote: [...] > i almost don't believe it, > i wonder if it only going to be wmv8 and not 9 or something stupid like > that, > or maybe MS will then standardize on wmv10 ? I had a PocketPC (2003 IIRC) for a while and the only thing I used it for was Media Player. The compression (using .wmv) was wonderful, so having that opened up is a good thing. But I do have to wonder how long it will be before .wmv viruses become a threat to linux boxes. -- Scott Elcomb http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ http://search.cpan.org/~selcomb/SAL-3.03/ http://psema4.googlepages.com/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 21:05:28 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 17:05:28 -0400 Subject: usb to ttyS0 mapping issues -and wvdial configuration In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20060821210528.GO13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Mon, Aug 21, 2006 at 07:19:52PM +0300, Kihara Muriithi wrote: > Hi all, > I am tryiing to set up an Acer (Aspire 3610 model) laptop for dial up. The > laptop don't have one of the most handy interface namely serial port. To > connect to a serial port, one has to use a usb to serial cable and I find > that very un-ideal. (Why the heck leave out a serial port and then turn > around and start selling usb to serial cables?). Beside financial > implication, I can't now figure out how to map ppp connection on. The first > 4 ttyS* port looks like this to setserial > linux:/home/William # setserial -a /dev/ttyS0 > /dev/ttyS0, Line 0, UART: unknown, Port: 0x03f8, IRQ: 4 > Baud_base: 115200, close_delay: 50, divisor: 0 > closing_wait: 3000 > Flags: spd_normal skip_test > > What I don't like is the lack of UART. What is the implication of above? > I thought of mapping it to the USB device, but that even look worse to > setserial > linux:/home/wambugu # setserial -a /dev/usbdev2.1 > Cannot get serial info: Inappropriate ioctl for device > Okay, one last shot I gave it one more shot > linux:/home/William # wvdialconf /home/William/Desktop/wvdial1.txt > Scanning your serial ports for a modem. > > Port Scan<*1>: S0 S1 S2 S3 > > > Sorry, no modem was detected! Is it in use by another program? > Did you configure it properly with setserial? > > From the above queries, I decided to map modem to /dev/ttyS0. I also gave > /dev/ttyS1 a shot with no success > Now I hope that is enough information about the laptop. I believe some > information about where the serial cable terminate would be important. It > connects to a Huawei ETS2577 handset. The handset connect to the ISP through > Qualcomm 3G CDMA wireless technology. I am also really hoping that UART will > be inside this phone set, but I aren't sure of that.I believe this is > sufficient information, but would happly suppiy more information is needed. > Now, how can I make this setup work? I have been using wvdial and below is > its configuration > [Dialer Defaults] > Modem = /dev/ttyS0 > Baud = 115200 > Init1 = ATZ > Init2 = ATQ0 V1 E1 S0=0 &C1 &D2 > Init3 = > Area Code = > Phone = 777 > Username = some_name > Password = some_password > Ask Password = 0 > Dial Command = ATDT > Stupid Mode = 1 > Compuserve = 0 > Force Address = > Idle Seconds = 300 > DialMessage1 = > DialMessage2 = > ISDN = 0 > Auto DNS = 1 > Now, is there anything that I could have done wrong?.And does wvdial use > /etc/ppp/chap-secrets file? What is the sure way of knowing that you are > mapping an application to the right /dev? The link between the handset and > ISP is fne for sure since I can make phone calls from the handset, so the > issue has to be wvdial configuration and the ttyS0 interface. Oh, and my ISP > is hostile to Linux, so I don't expect much help from them. Usually usb serial adapters show up as /dev/ttyusb# or something like that. I have never seen one show up as /dev/ttyS#. Depends on the serial adapter and the driver I suppose. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 21:15:55 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 17:15:55 -0400 Subject: Probably the biggest thing to ever happen to Linux In-Reply-To: <44E5D8FF.4040703-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <1155907476.30331.64.camel@stan64.site> <44E5D8FF.4040703@uoguelph.ca> Message-ID: Tom Watts wrote: > > ted leslie wrote: >> as quoted in the article >> >> "We have for the first time a real alternative to the Windows desktop. >> Linux and open source are there," >> >> http://news.zdnet.co.uk/0,39020330,39281014,00.htm >> >> i almost don't believe it, >> i wonder if it only going to be wmv8 and not 9 or something stupid like >> that, >> or maybe MS will then standardize on wmv10 ? >> >> now games are the only thing left that Linux users can't get (for the >> most part). >> >> at least i will finally get to play wmv's on a 64 bit arch. and not have >> to dick around with 32bit apps and 32bit dll's >> >> -tl >> >> >> > > Wow and this from the company that made my most hated media player, at > least under Windows that is. I've never really like HelixPlayer either, > but this could completely change my view on them and maybe my default > movie player especially if it comes with a browser plugin that is 100% > functional and stable. VLC can be compiled with wmv9 support: http://nanocrew.net/2005/09/01/compiling-vlc/ Also, I've heard that the latest ffmpeg cvs/svn/whatever they use..., as part of Google's SOC, has support for wmv9. Take a look here: http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.comp.video.xine.devel/15683/focus=15683 That said, perhaps it is worth at least downloading (if it is avialable?) helix/realplayer just to show support for their involvement. Don't have to use it though :) Jamon -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 21:57:04 2006 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 17:57:04 -0400 Subject: psc but no scan app? In-Reply-To: <44EA1E6C.9040709-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> References: <44EA1E6C.9040709@vianet.ca> Message-ID: <44EA2C30.1010000@execulink.com> Chris Aitken wrote: > I want to use the scanner function of my hp psc 1610. Some time ago I > managed to install and configure the printing with this device. It was a > lot more work than installing other printers. I have been printing to it > fine using cups and over the network. This is the first time I want to > scan. I went to the red hat menu bar (in FC 2) but don't see any > scanning application in there. I was hoping to find one and then see if > it recognizes the device I have - but there is no scanning aplication > (I'm pretty sure). > > Is there an easy-to-install scanning application that will work well > with the hp psc 1610? Maybe I have an application on this system that > just needs to be invoked with a command? Do you think there might be > such an application hiding in FC2 ? > > Chirs > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > man scanimage might be a good place to start. greg -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 22:07:31 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 18:07:31 -0400 Subject: Probably the biggest thing to ever happen to Linux In-Reply-To: References: <1155907476.30331.64.camel@stan64.site> <44E5D8FF.4040703@uoguelph.ca> Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608211507s109048f3i41a4eabdbf750c7d@mail.gmail.com> On 8/21/06, Jamon Camisso wrote: > That said, perhaps it is worth at least downloading (if it is > avialable?) helix/realplayer just to show support for their involvement. > Don't have to use it though :) FWIW - I do. Showing support for commercial FOSS endevours is a worthwhile goal. $0,02 of course. ;-) -- Scott Elcomb http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ http://search.cpan.org/~selcomb/SAL-3.03/ http://psema4.googlepages.com/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 23:14:16 2006 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins Witteman) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 19:14:16 -0400 Subject: Probably the biggest thing to ever happen to Linux In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f0608211400l348be13fs7748645d52341afa-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <1155907476.30331.64.camel@stan64.site> <99a6c38f0608211400l348be13fs7748645d52341afa@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20060821231416.GA12672@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> On Mon, Aug 21, 2006 at 05:00:30PM -0400, Scott Elcomb wrote: >On 8/18/06, ted leslie wrote: >[...] >>i almost don't believe it, >>i wonder if it only going to be wmv8 and not 9 or something stupid like >>that, >>or maybe MS will then standardize on wmv10 ? > >I had a PocketPC (2003 IIRC) for a while and the only thing I used it >for was Media Player. The compression (using .wmv) was wonderful, so >having that opened up is a good thing. But I do have to wonder how >long it will be before .wmv viruses become a threat to linux boxes. I suspect it'll be a long, long time. The reason wmv virii exist for Windoze is that the OS is full of easily-exploitable hooks so that MS software can update the OS at a fundamental level without bothering the user. Unless your wmv player is broken and you are running as root, there is little chance of an exploit. The big issue is that wmv contains self-executing meta code - any player could, because they see this as a huge vulnerability, run this code in a chroot jail to ensure it is encapsulated safely, if it is executed at all. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 00:22:14 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 20:22:14 -0400 Subject: downtown core free wifi In-Reply-To: <44E5D1B6.2060701-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44E5D1B6.2060701@rogers.com> Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608211722s5710d273jfdd559ed802dee53@mail.gmail.com> On 8/18/06, Kush wrote: > Hi all, > Anybody knows how the Toronto Hydro plan to give free 6 month wifi > access in the downtown core is progressing? Is it easy to get access or > is the service not good enough yet? > > http://thtelecom.ca/one-zone.html > http://thtelecom.ca/THTI_WiFi%20Zone.pdf I've been wondering as well. Also, any ideas on the range? I'm out in the Brampton / Mississauga area... Any chance it'll extend this far? I also spend a lot of time in Hamilton. I read in the Spectator earlier this year that the City of Hamilton was also thinking about setting up city-wide wireless. A quick google search turned up an article on slashgeo, but no comments... http://industry.slashgeo.org/article.pl?sid=06/03/08/1623229 -- Scott Elcomb http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ http://search.cpan.org/~selcomb/SAL-3.03/ http://psema4.googlepages.com/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 00:35:36 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 20:35:36 -0400 (EDT) Subject: downtown core free wifi In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f0608211722s5710d273jfdd559ed802dee53-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f0608211722s5710d273jfdd559ed802dee53@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20060822003536.28753.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- Scott Elcomb wrote: > On 8/18/06, Kush wrote: > > Hi all, > > Anybody knows how the Toronto Hydro plan to give > free 6 month wifi > > access in the downtown core is progressing? Is it > easy to get access or > > is the service not good enough yet? > > > > http://thtelecom.ca/one-zone.html > > http://thtelecom.ca/THTI_WiFi%20Zone.pdf > > I've been wondering as well. Also, any ideas on the > range? I'm out > in the Brampton / Mississauga area... Any chance > it'll extend this > far? This is a Toronto Hydro project and they plan to set up repeaters to cover all of Toronto over the next few years, but only Toronto (starting with the downtown core). Since they are using 802.11g you are talking 300 feet (100 metres) plus or minus. I mean just to prove it COULD be done I was reading about a bunch of guy who set up a 125 MILE (201 Km) 802.11b connection across the desert in Nevada, without amplification, but with 12 foot (3.7 metre) antennas. So, how close are are you to the Toronto boundry is the first question, the second question being how wierd (and/or big) are you willing to get with your antenna? Blunt truth, unless you want to get very wierd you are going to have to talk to the powers that be in Brampton and/or Mississauga. Colin McGregor > I also spend a lot of time in Hamilton. I read in > the Spectator > earlier this year that the City of Hamilton was also > thinking about > setting up city-wide wireless. > > A quick google search turned up an article on > slashgeo, but no comments... > > http://industry.slashgeo.org/article.pl?sid=06/03/08/1623229 > > -- > Scott Elcomb > http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ > http://search.cpan.org/~selcomb/SAL-3.03/ > http://psema4.googlepages.com/ > > "In matters of style, swim with the current; in > matters of principle, > stand like a rock." > > - Thomas Jefferson > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: > http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text > below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: > http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 00:50:56 2006 From: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 20:50:56 -0400 (EDT) Subject: downtown core free wifi In-Reply-To: <20060822003536.28753.qmail-DooQHYYYUaiB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f0608211722s5710d273jfdd559ed802dee53@mail.gmail.com> <20060822003536.28753.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <50871.207.188.67.34.1156207856.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> > >> I've been wondering as well. Also, any ideas on the >> range? I'm out >> in the Brampton / Mississauga area... Any chance >> it'll extend this >> far? > > This is a Toronto Hydro project and they plan to set > up repeaters to cover all of Toronto over the next few > years, but only Toronto (starting with the downtown > core). Since they are using 802.11g you are talking > 300 feet (100 metres) plus or minus. I mean just to > prove it COULD be done I was reading about a bunch of > guy who set up a 125 MILE (201 Km) 802.11b connection > across the desert in Nevada, without amplification, > but with 12 foot (3.7 metre) antennas. So, how close > are are you to the Toronto boundry is the first > question, the second question being how wierd (and/or > big) are you willing to get with your antenna? > > Blunt truth, unless you want to get very wierd you are > going to have to talk to the powers that be in > Brampton and/or Mississauga. > > Colin McGregor > >> I also spend a lot of time in Hamilton. I read in >> the Spectator >> earlier this year that the City of Hamilton was also >> thinking about >> setting up city-wide wireless. There are web sites that describe in great detail how to build a suitable antenna, and the sort of gain that you can get. My favourite: a parabolic dish using a won-ton strainer. Doubtless such a unit could be found on Spadina Avenue near Dundas... One thing to keep in mind is that these antennas (antennae) get their gain by being very directional. So the antenna has to be aimed *very* carefully at the source *and* it has to stay put during things like a Canadian blizzard. Also, a rainstorm in the path can kill reception. So it would be a fun thing to do, but I wouldn't want to count on the reliability. Peter -- Peter Hiscocks Syscomp Electronic Design Limited, Toronto http://www.syscompdesign.com USB Oscilloscope and Waveform Generator 647-839-0325 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 01:16:15 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 21:16:15 -0400 Subject: Linux in the Park In-Reply-To: References: <20060821184746.28529.qmail@web88208.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608211816r4d848b5buf05322a27ed6616d@mail.gmail.com> On 8/21/06, Christopher Browne wrote: > "We've got both kinds of music: Country AND Western!" :-) LOL! That's not fair. When I lived in Alberta and Saskatchewan, I was forced how to learn to dance to both! Why else would I come back to Ontario?? (heheh. j/k.) To be honest, my preference for music would be rap (or very heavy metal)... perhaps that's a bit more incentive to avoid the tunes... =) Regardless of genre, if there's a whole lineup of Free/Libre or Open Source songs I'll be there. And looking for the CD. -- Scott Elcomb http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ http://search.cpan.org/~selcomb/SAL-3.03/ http://psema4.googlepages.com/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 01:39:10 2006 From: caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Chris Aitken) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 21:39:10 -0400 Subject: psc but no scan app? In-Reply-To: <44EA2C30.1010000-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ@public.gmane.org> References: <44EA1E6C.9040709@vianet.ca> <44EA2C30.1010000@execulink.com> Message-ID: <44EA603E.2020307@vianet.ca> Gregory D Hough wrote: > Chris Aitken wrote: > >> >> Is there an easy-to-install scanning application that will work well >> with the hp psc 1610? Maybe I have an application on this system that >> just needs to be invoked with a command? Do you think there might be >> such an application hiding in FC2 ? >> >> Chris >> > man scanimage might be a good place to start. Okay, looks like I'll have to install something called SANE. Although I have the working driver for the printer (hpijs) I might need a SANE driver for the scanning function (?) - if that makes any sense. Chris -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 01:44:51 2006 From: caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Chris Aitken) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 21:44:51 -0400 Subject: psc but no scan app? In-Reply-To: <44EA2C30.1010000-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ@public.gmane.org> References: <44EA1E6C.9040709@vianet.ca> <44EA2C30.1010000@execulink.com> Message-ID: <44EA6193.2020500@vianet.ca> Gregory D Hough wrote: >> > man scanimage might be a good place to start. I did the following. The scsi stuff is intriguing. Are most scanners scsi?: [chris at p733 chris]$ scanimage -L No scanners were identified. If you were expecting something different, check that the scanner is plugged in, turned on and detected by the sane-find-scanner tool (if appropriate). Please read the documentation which came with this software (README, FAQ, manpages). [chris at p733 chris]$ sane-find-scanner # No SCSI scanners found. If you expected something different, make sure that # you have loaded a SCSI driver for your SCSI adapter. found USB scanner (vendor=0x03f0, product=0x4811) at libusb:001:002 # Your USB scanner was (probably) detected. It may or may not be supported by # SANE. Try scanimage -L and read the backend's manpage. # Scanners connected to the parallel port or other proprietary ports can't be # detected by this program. # You may want to run this program as root to find all devices. Once you # found the scanner devices, be sure to adjust access permissions as # necessary. [chris at p733 chris]$ su Password: [root at p733 chris]# sane-find-scanner # No SCSI scanners found. If you expected something different, make sure that # you have loaded a SCSI driver for your SCSI adapter. found USB scanner (vendor=0x03f0 [HP], product=0x4811 [PSC 1600 series]) at libusb:001:002 # Your USB scanner was (probably) detected. It may or may not be supported by # SANE. Try scanimage -L and read the backend's manpage. # Scanners connected to the parallel port or other proprietary ports can't be # detected by this program. [root at p733 chris]# Chris -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 01:45:13 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 21:45:13 -0400 Subject: downtown core free wifi In-Reply-To: <50871.207.188.67.34.1156207856.squirrel-2RFepEojUI2DznVbVsZi4adLQS1dU2Lr@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f0608211722s5710d273jfdd559ed802dee53@mail.gmail.com> <20060822003536.28753.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <50871.207.188.67.34.1156207856.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> Message-ID: <44EA61A9.4000504@rogers.com> phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org wrote: >>> I've been wondering as well. Also, any ideas on the >>> range? I'm out >>> in the Brampton / Mississauga area... Any chance >>> it'll extend this >>> far? >> This is a Toronto Hydro project and they plan to set >> up repeaters to cover all of Toronto over the next few >> years, but only Toronto (starting with the downtown >> core). Since they are using 802.11g you are talking >> 300 feet (100 metres) plus or minus. I mean just to >> prove it COULD be done I was reading about a bunch of >> guy who set up a 125 MILE (201 Km) 802.11b connection >> across the desert in Nevada, without amplification, >> but with 12 foot (3.7 metre) antennas. So, how close >> are are you to the Toronto boundry is the first >> question, the second question being how wierd (and/or >> big) are you willing to get with your antenna? >> >> Blunt truth, unless you want to get very wierd you are >> going to have to talk to the powers that be in >> Brampton and/or Mississauga. >> >> Colin McGregor >> >>> I also spend a lot of time in Hamilton. I read in >>> the Spectator >>> earlier this year that the City of Hamilton was also >>> thinking about >>> setting up city-wide wireless. > > There are web sites that describe in great detail how to build a suitable > antenna, and the sort of gain that you can get. My favourite: a parabolic > dish using a won-ton strainer. Doubtless such a unit could be found on > Spadina Avenue near Dundas... > > One thing to keep in mind is that these antennas (antennae) get their gain > by being very directional. So the antenna has to be aimed *very* carefully > at the source *and* it has to stay put during things like a Canadian > blizzard. Also, a rainstorm in the path can kill reception. > > So it would be a fun thing to do, but I wouldn't want to count on the > reliability. FWIW, I recently attended a course on a digital microwave system (up to 50 Km & 500 Mb/s) and found that aiming was surprisingly easy. First rule of thumb, was to extend your arm, with thumb up, to get a general idea of beam width. ;-) Next, there is a simple bolt on "gun sight", which is used to aim the dish at the target. It is now close enough to measure signal strength to make final adjustments. They even had a device that sends the signal strength info, via blue tooth signal injected into the coax going to the dish, so that the person adjusting the antenna can get a bar graph displayed on a Palm computer. All quite interesting. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 01:47:51 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 21:47:51 -0400 Subject: Linux in the Park In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f0608211816r4d848b5buf05322a27ed6616d-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <20060821184746.28529.qmail@web88208.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <99a6c38f0608211816r4d848b5buf05322a27ed6616d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <44EA6247.9000102@rogers.com> Scott Elcomb wrote: > To be honest, my preference for music would be rap (or very heavy > metal)... perhaps that's a bit more incentive to avoid the tunes... Since when is rap or heavy metal considered music? ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sacha-ctE++fEYmiYdc6zLPptBHg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 21 21:04:26 2006 From: sacha-ctE++fEYmiYdc6zLPptBHg at public.gmane.org (Sacha Chua) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 17:04:26 -0400 Subject: UofT - OT In-Reply-To: <007001c6c473$12af7690$0405a8c0-MlQI6EnZl2wPJunrU1OSJXVPGwe2822SptRUGzx/cGc@public.gmane.org> (Ansar Mohammed's message of "Sun, 20 Aug 2006 12:09:53 -0400") References: <007001c6c473$12af7690$0405a8c0@northamerica.corp.microsoft.com> Message-ID: <878xlhajhh.fsf@sachachua.com> "Ansar Mohammed" writes: > Is anyone here enrolled in postgraduate studies at UofT? > Can you email me offlist? I am! =) -- Sacha Chua - http://sachachua.com Storyteller, technology evangelist, geekette Interested in social computing in the enterprise -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 02:10:00 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 22:10:00 -0400 Subject: psc but no scan app? In-Reply-To: <44EA6193.2020500-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> References: <44EA1E6C.9040709@vianet.ca> <44EA2C30.1010000@execulink.com> <44EA6193.2020500@vianet.ca> Message-ID: <44EA6778.30907@telly.org> Chris Aitken wrote: > [chris at p733 chris]$ sane-find-scanner > [...] > found USB scanner (vendor=0x03f0, product=0x4811) at libusb:001:002 > # Your USB scanner was (probably) detected. It may or may not be > supported by > # SANE. Try scanimage -L and read the backend's manpage. The good news is that sane can see the hardware but isn't sure what driver to use. The other good news is that HP says that scanning is supported on this model according to http://hplip.sourceforge.net/supported_devices/inkjet_aio.html The FAQ at http://hplip.sourceforge.net/faqs.html states that "HPLIP should support all SANE front-end applications. We have tested scanning with xsane, xscanimage, and kooka." So what this means is that you need hplip installed (which you probably need, to support printing from the device anyway). That will provide the "hpaio" driver needed by SANE. Make sure the line "hpaio" appears in /etc/sane/dll.conf and is not commented out. There's a troubleshooting page at http://hplip.sourceforge.net/troubleshooting/scanning.html that may provide some help. - Evan PS: A very slick-looking diagram of the HP/Sane acrhitecture can be found at http://hpoj.sourceforge.net/doc/arch/scanning.png -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 02:19:51 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 22:19:51 -0400 Subject: New ubuntu install freezes on boot on IBM T21 laptop In-Reply-To: <20060821191358.GA12048-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <44E9FC12.9000206@rogers.com> <20060821191358.GA12048@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <44EA69C7.7060703@rogers.com> if the t21 has ram below 512mb, ubuntu/kubuntu/edubuntu will definitely give problems. From what i have read about the t21 at epinions.com, it is a 128mb machine. Kush William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: > On Mon, Aug 21, 2006 at 02:31:46PM -0400, James Knott wrote: > >> Alex Maynard wrote: >> >>> Hi All: >>> >>> Just wondering if anyone has any thoughts on a problem I've been having >>> with IBM T21 laptop? >>> >>> I installed a new kubuntu disk on my laptop. At first it worked well. But >>> about a day later it started going blank halfway through reboot and kept >>> doing this. So essentially I couldn't boot from the hard drive. >>> >>> Later I reinstalled ubuntu and the same thing happened. I used >>> to have the same laptop working using libranet but they went out of >>> business and my CDs from them are too far out of date to update without >>> dependency problems. >>> >>> The only thing I can think of to do now is to try a differerent >>> distribution (any suggestions?), but I thought I would run this by >>> you to see what other suggestions you might have. >>> >> SUSE has good ThinkPad support. >> > > It is probably not a distro problem, but that some aspect of hardware is > misconfigured and balking the boot. Can you report the place in the > boot process that the "blanking" happens? If the screen is going blank > I would think it'd be a power management setting that's barfing, but it > could be a range of things. > > Debian also has good ThinkPad support, but I don't think that that's the > actual issue. > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 02:21:23 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 22:21:23 -0400 Subject: Patched HP LJ1320 PPD file In-Reply-To: References: <44E9F30B.6080206@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <44EA6A23.9020707@rogers.com> Maybe somebody needs to update this information at linuxprinting.org too so that there is one place to look for all linux related printer problems as much as possible. Kush Randy Jonasz wrote: > Hey Madison, > > On 8/21/06, Madison Kelly wrote: >> Here is a link to my patched copy of the PPD file for this printer. I >> know it fixed the same problem for me on Debian 3.1 and Ubuntu 5.10 & >> 6.06. I am not sure if it will work on others (ie: OS X for Randy). >> Please report success of failure. > Thanks very much for the file. It seems to have corrected the > problem. On OS X I copied the ppd file to /etc/cups/ppd and made sure > to name it to the same as the original ppd file for the hp printer. > > Cheers, > > Randy > >> >> http://mizu-bu.org/misc/HP_LaserJet_1320_Patched.ppd >> >> The patch was created by a script off (iirc) LinuxPrinting, but I can't >> remember exactly where now. It's the PPD file I use at work currently >> and it solved my problems. >> >> HTH! >> >> Madi >> -- >> The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >> TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >> How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml >> > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tlug-G8usDCtqe957Ar2qsurDTA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 03:19:06 2006 From: tlug-G8usDCtqe957Ar2qsurDTA at public.gmane.org (Allen Taylor) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 23:19:06 -0400 Subject: New ubuntu install freezes on boot on IBM T21 laptop In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20060822031905.GA24464@thecat.localnet> On Mon, Aug 21, 2006 at 02:26:54PM -0400, Alex Maynard wrote: > > Hi All: > > Just wondering if anyone has any thoughts on a problem I've been having > with IBM T21 laptop? > > I installed a new kubuntu disk on my laptop. At first it worked well. But > about a day later it started going blank halfway through reboot and kept > doing this. So essentially I couldn't boot from the hard drive. > . . . I played a bit with xubuntu on my "new" T21 (with a grand 64MB of memory). I had a similar problem - hanging as soon as X launched. Recovery mode boot would come up to a command prompt with no problem. Since I'm not really up on Debian and its derivatives, I went back to Slackware and installed X using frame buffer mode - works fine. I'm sure I could have gotten xubuntu to work as well with frame buffer mode if I had spent a bit of time on it. Allen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From gilesorr-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 03:36:18 2006 From: gilesorr-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Giles Orr) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 23:36:18 -0400 Subject: GNU / gzip humour Message-ID: <1f13df280608212036s2c738b89v9f758420ac192f01@mail.gmail.com> A friend sent this to me. If you're familiar with gzip you should get a hell of a laugh. Enjoy. http://kovariks.net/pics/gzip9suv.jpg -- Giles http://www.gilesorr.com/ gilesorr-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 04:35:03 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 00:35:03 -0400 Subject: UofT - OT In-Reply-To: <878xlhajhh.fsf-bc55NVWLdWuB+jHODAdFcQ@public.gmane.org> References: <007001c6c473$12af7690$0405a8c0@northamerica.corp.microsoft.com> <878xlhajhh.fsf@sachachua.com> Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608212135w71536f9cq61e57b5bd77eddb9@mail.gmail.com> On 8/21/06, Sacha Chua wrote: > "Ansar Mohammed" writes: > > > Is anyone here enrolled in postgraduate studies at UofT? > > Can you email me offlist? > > I am! =) So much for offlist. Then again, on-list is something I only _really_ appreciated after reading your blog entries. -- Scott Elcomb http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ http://search.cpan.org/~selcomb/SAL-3.03/ http://psema4.googlepages.com/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 04:40:43 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 00:40:43 -0400 Subject: New ubuntu install freezes on boot on IBM T21 laptop In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608212140y52101660x1f8e26516b6285ad@mail.gmail.com> On 8/21/06, Alex Maynard wrote: [...] > Just wondering if anyone has any thoughts on a problem I've been having > with IBM T21 laptop? [...] Not sure how much it might help, but I've been running Ubuntu "Breezy Badger" on an A31p machine for a bit now. Not sure how close it is to a T21, but the A31p definately has a mobo issue; No matter what OS (used to blame it on windoze), I get system-wide hangings. I suspect it's in either Power Management or Video, but have no way to confirm. -- Scott Elcomb http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ http://search.cpan.org/~selcomb/SAL-3.03/ http://psema4.googlepages.com/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 04:55:58 2006 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 00:55:58 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: References: <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060815040804.GA14384@waltdnes.org> <20060815131953.GH13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44E86DD6.50306@utoronto.ca> <1156168809.30331.230.camel@stan64.site> <20060821152316.GA592@PyBook.local> <44E9E58A.80101@telly.org> <44E99FEB.3050404@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <20060822045558.GA27663@waltdnes.org> On Mon, Aug 21, 2006 at 05:36:42PM +0000, Christopher Browne wrote > It would provide the about best results for the promise if it was > implemented as... > > main () { > exit 1; > } > > The primary benefit to having something that "ate" Flash would be if > it made the irritating popup dialog boxes go away... https://addons.mozilla.org/firefox/433/ the "Flashblock" add-on for Firefox. Blocks Flash by default, requiring you to click on a button (*NOT* a popup) to play the Flash. It also has a whitelist, so that you can allow http://video.google.com etc. -- Walter Dnes In linux /sbin/init is Job #1 My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 05:29:58 2006 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 01:29:58 -0400 Subject: usb to ttyS0 mapping issues -and wvdial configuration In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20060822052958.GB27663@waltdnes.org> On Mon, Aug 21, 2006 at 07:19:52PM +0300, Kihara Muriithi wrote > Okay, one last shot I gave it one more shot > linux:/home/William # wvdialconf /home/William/Desktop/wvdial1.txt > Scanning your serial ports for a modem. > > Port Scan<*1>: S0 S1 S2 S3 > > > Sorry, no modem was detected! Is it in use by another program? > Did you configure it properly with setserial? That bit me a couple of times. Long story short... the *DEFAULT* in the kernel is to only support 4 serial ports (COM1: through COM4: in DOS-speak). To support more than 4, which is required for PCI modems, USB modems, etc, you have to build in support in the kernel... Do you understand "make menuconfig" (I hope)? - Device Drivers ---> - Character devices ---> - Serial drivers ---> - (6) Maximum number of 8250/16550 serial ports - (5) Number of 8250/16550 serial ports to register at runtime Works for me with a PCI modem. -- Walter Dnes In linux /sbin/init is Job #1 My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 12:22:35 2006 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 08:22:35 -0400 Subject: Brawling with BitTorrent Message-ID: <44EAF70B.1020503@execulink.com> Hello, Is anyone familiar with BitTorrent? I have a problem with it. I don't use it myself for anything cause I ain't a TV junkie or hyper-music enthusiast and I buy my distros attached to Linux magazines. I am just fed up with a persistant month-long "Afterglow?" I don't know if it is actually afterglow or if it is an MPAA/RIAA Torrent spy, but I want it to Go Away! These UDP's are hitting my IP every twenty minutes and some seconds. So before I start throwing some brutal packets at the offending IP, I'd like to know what is the proper way to make it stop. Thanks, greg -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From dgardiner-k8+l4Qd5hq73fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 12:31:24 2006 From: dgardiner-k8+l4Qd5hq73fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Daniel Gardiner) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 08:31:24 -0400 Subject: psc but no scan app? In-Reply-To: <44EA6193.2020500-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> References: <44EA1E6C.9040709@vianet.ca> <44EA2C30.1010000@execulink.com> <44EA6193.2020500@vianet.ca> Message-ID: <44EAF91C.7030201@inofas.ca> Chris Aitken wrote: > Gregory D Hough wrote: > > > I did the following. The scsi stuff is intriguing. Are most scanners > scsi?: Scanners intended for home use are usually usb, scanners intended for production use (thousands of pages a day) are usually scsi. Daniel -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 08:04:21 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 09:04:21 +0100 Subject: Brawling with BitTorrent In-Reply-To: <44EAF70B.1020503-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ@public.gmane.org> References: <44EAF70B.1020503@execulink.com> Message-ID: <44EABA85.1010205@utoronto.ca> Gregory D Hough wrote: > Hello, > > Is anyone familiar with BitTorrent? I have a problem with it. I don't > use it myself for anything cause I ain't a TV junkie or hyper-music > enthusiast and I buy my distros attached to Linux magazines. I am just > fed up with a persistant month-long "Afterglow?" I don't know if it is > actually afterglow or if it is an MPAA/RIAA Torrent spy, but I want it > to Go Away! > > These UDP's are hitting my IP every twenty minutes and some seconds. So > before I start throwing some brutal packets at the offending IP, I'd > like to know what is the proper way to make it stop. Take a look at moblock: http://developer.berlios.de/projects/moblock/ "MoBlock is a linux console application that blocks connections from/to hosts listed in a file in peerguardian format (guarding.p2p and p2p.p2b) or ipfilter.dat files. It uses iptables libnetfilter_queue userspace library and NFQUEUE kernel module." There is also a version of peerguardian (one of the better blockers for windows) that runs from the commandline in linux: http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=131687 Then you want a comprehensive blocklist: http://www.bluetack.co.uk/config/level1.gz or http://dialspace.dial.pipex.com/town/pipexdsl/s/ashu56/bluetack/level1.gz What does whois tell you about the offending IP? Also, whichever client you use, turn off UDP, it's usually of little to no use, especially on a distro download. Jamon -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 14:45:44 2006 From: meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org (Meng Cheah) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 10:45:44 -0400 Subject: Brawling with BitTorrent In-Reply-To: <44EAF70B.1020503-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ@public.gmane.org> References: <44EAF70B.1020503@execulink.com> Message-ID: <44EB1898.9080906@pppoe.ca> Gregory D Hough wrote: > Hello, > > Is anyone familiar with BitTorrent? I have a problem with it. I don't > use it myself for anything cause I ain't a TV junkie or hyper-music > enthusiast and I buy my distros attached to Linux magazines. I am just > fed up with a persistant month-long "Afterglow?" I don't know if it is > actually afterglow or if it is an MPAA/RIAA Torrent spy, but I want it > to Go Away! Pardon my ignorance but what is "Afterglow"? I did a Google search but did not come up with anything useful (I think). What are the symptoms or do they just show in the log files? Thanks in advance. Meng Cheah > > These UDP's are hitting my IP every twenty minutes and some seconds. > So before I start throwing some brutal packets at the offending IP, > I'd like to know what is the proper way to make it stop. > > Thanks, > greg > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ekg_ab-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 15:10:11 2006 From: ekg_ab-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (E K) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 11:10:11 -0400 (EDT) Subject: New ubuntu install freezes on boot on IBM T21 laptop In-Reply-To: <44EA69C7.7060703-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44EA69C7.7060703@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20060822151012.91743.qmail@web61325.mail.yahoo.com> I had similar problems with the Ubuntu GUI installer. Try to use the alternate cd for text mode installation. Usually, that works fine. Besides, it will alow you to choose among diffrent installation options. EK Kush wrote: if the t21 has ram below 512mb, ubuntu/kubuntu/edubuntu will definitely give problems. From what i have read about the t21 at epinions.com, it is a 128mb machine. Kush William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: > On Mon, Aug 21, 2006 at 02:31:46PM -0400, James Knott wrote: > >> Alex Maynard wrote: >> >>> Hi All: >>> >>> Just wondering if anyone has any thoughts on a problem I've been having >>> with IBM T21 laptop? >>> >>> I installed a new kubuntu disk on my laptop. At first it worked well. But >>> about a day later it started going blank halfway through reboot and kept >>> doing this. So essentially I couldn't boot from the hard drive. >>> >>> Later I reinstalled ubuntu and the same thing happened. I used >>> to have the same laptop working using libranet but they went out of >>> business and my CDs from them are too far out of date to update without >>> dependency problems. >>> >>> The only thing I can think of to do now is to try a differerent >>> distribution (any suggestions?), but I thought I would run this by >>> you to see what other suggestions you might have. >>> >> SUSE has good ThinkPad support. >> > > It is probably not a distro problem, but that some aspect of hardware is > misconfigured and balking the boot. Can you report the place in the > boot process that the "blanking" happens? If the screen is going blank > I would think it'd be a power management setting that's barfing, but it > could be a range of things. > > Debian also has good ThinkPad support, but I don't think that that's the > actual issue. > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml --------------------------------- Share your photos with the people who matter at Yahoo! Canada Photos -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wattst-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 15:12:14 2006 From: wattst-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Tom Watts) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 11:12:14 -0400 Subject: Probably the biggest thing to ever happen to Linux In-Reply-To: References: <1155907476.30331.64.camel@stan64.site> <44E5D8FF.4040703@uoguelph.ca> Message-ID: <44EB1ECE.4090808@uoguelph.ca> Jamon Camisso wrote: > Tom Watts wrote: >> >> Wow and this from the company that made my most hated media player, at >> least under Windows that is. I've never really like HelixPlayer >> either, but this could completely change my view on them and maybe my >> default movie player especially if it comes with a browser plugin that >> is 100% functional and stable. > > VLC can be compiled with wmv9 support: > http://nanocrew.net/2005/09/01/compiling-vlc/ > > Also, I've heard that the latest ffmpeg cvs/svn/whatever they use..., as > part of Google's SOC, has support for wmv9. Take a look here: > http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.comp.video.xine.devel/15683/focus=15683 > > That said, perhaps it is worth at least downloading (if it is > avialable?) helix/realplayer just to show support for their involvement. > Don't have to use it though :) > > Jamon Yes, this is good for you and I, but this answer wouldn't be acceptable to your friend, Joe Desktop User who you're trying to convince to switch to Linux. It's slowly getting easier to convince him. -Tom -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From alain.maisonneuve_lists-QX23z+6opsUOxlH4FaG5hA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 17:24:52 2006 From: alain.maisonneuve_lists-QX23z+6opsUOxlH4FaG5hA at public.gmane.org (alain.maisonneuve_lists-QX23z+6opsUOxlH4FaG5hA at public.gmane.org) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 13:24:52 -0400 Subject: New ubuntu install freezes on boot on IBM T21 laptop In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20060822132452.xf6uwxgcvvgg0cg4@webmail.swiftpenguin.com> I am assuming you are using the latest version of Kubuntu 6.01 Dapper. This is actually a known issue with that particular release. https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-ati/+bug/22985 Modify the xorg.conf file and add the following line to the "monitors" section: Option "MonitorLayout" "LVDS,CRT" that should do the trick :) Quoting Alex Maynard : > > Hi All: > > Just wondering if anyone has any thoughts on a problem I've been having > with IBM T21 laptop? > > I installed a new kubuntu disk on my laptop. At first it worked well. But > about a day later it started going blank halfway through reboot and kept > doing this. So essentially I couldn't boot from the hard drive. > > Later I reinstalled ubuntu and the same thing happened. I used > to have the same laptop working using libranet but they went out of > business and my CDs from them are too far out of date to update without > dependency problems. > > The only thing I can think of to do now is to try a differerent > distribution (any suggestions?), but I thought I would run this by > you to see what other suggestions you might have. > > Alex > > > > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 22:45:35 2006 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 18:45:35 -0400 Subject: Brawling with BitTorrent In-Reply-To: <44EAF70B.1020503-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ@public.gmane.org> References: <44EAF70B.1020503@execulink.com> Message-ID: <20060822224535.GA29845@waltdnes.org> On Tue, Aug 22, 2006 at 08:22:35AM -0400, Gregory D Hough wrote > Is anyone familiar with BitTorrent? I have a problem with it. I don't > use it myself for anything cause I ain't a TV junkie or hyper-music > enthusiast and I buy my distros attached to Linux magazines. I am just > fed up with a persistant month-long "Afterglow?" I don't know if it is > actually afterglow or if it is an MPAA/RIAA Torrent spy, but I want it > to Go Away! > before I start throwing some brutal packets at the offending IP... ..before you start throwing some brutal packets at the offending IP... remember that IP addresses are trivially easy to forge on UDP. You might be hitting an innocent 3rd party with a DOS attack, and they could file criminal charges against you. > like to know what is the proper way to make it stop. Can I assume you have a static IP address? If you have a dynamic IP address, change it. A few UDP packets once every 20 minutes is *NOT* a DOS attack, so I wouldn't bother calling law-enforcement. If you have logs, submit them to the ISP that owns that IP address. -- Walter Dnes In linux /sbin/init is Job #1 My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 22:57:35 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 18:57:35 -0400 Subject: UofT - OT In-Reply-To: <878xlhajhh.fsf-bc55NVWLdWuB+jHODAdFcQ@public.gmane.org> References: <007001c6c473$12af7690$0405a8c0@northamerica.corp.microsoft.com> <878xlhajhh.fsf@sachachua.com> Message-ID: <44EB8BDF.7080901@rogers.com> Sacha Chua wrote: > "Ansar Mohammed" writes: > >> Is anyone here enrolled in postgraduate studies at UofT? >> Can you email me offlist? > > I am! =) > Obviously, postgrads can't read. ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 23:07:27 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 19:07:27 -0400 Subject: Brawling with BitTorrent In-Reply-To: <44EB1898.9080906-D1t3LT1mScs@public.gmane.org> References: <44EAF70B.1020503@execulink.com> <44EB1898.9080906@pppoe.ca> Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608221607m7cca0a26i80b908625fd6169@mail.gmail.com> On 8/22/06, Meng Cheah wrote: > Pardon my ignorance but what is "Afterglow"? This is an english expression, not a techinical fact. Afterglow is like: - the waning of the moon - the second half of the bell curve, or the sine wave - the feeling one gets after s/he's realized the world is alive[1] and not under their direct control In this case, I believe, it refers to the realization that our "Open Source" beliefs are different than those of companies[2] who refuse to grow with the times - aka the MPAA, RIAA and other associated organizations. In a way, Dogma is like a polar opposite to Karma[3]. [1] http://www.calresco.org/ is the only convenient aid I can quote without going off on a diatribe [2] Incumbant business models might be a better term [3] If you don't understand, then you prolly don't want to ask - if you do, shoot -- Scott Elcomb http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ http://search.cpan.org/~selcomb/SAL-3.03/ http://psema4.googlepages.com/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 22 23:22:21 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 19:22:21 -0400 Subject: UofT - OT In-Reply-To: <44EB8BDF.7080901-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <007001c6c473$12af7690$0405a8c0@northamerica.corp.microsoft.com> <878xlhajhh.fsf@sachachua.com> <44EB8BDF.7080901@rogers.com> Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608221622p2751c62dlde6ce19b11ad177@mail.gmail.com> On 8/22/06, James Knott wrote: > Sacha Chua wrote: > > "Ansar Mohammed" writes: > > > >> Is anyone here enrolled in postgraduate studies at UofT? > >> Can you email me offlist? > > > > I am! =) > > > > Obviously, postgrads can't read. ;-) Of course not - if they could, they couldn't be hired. (I don't even know what _kind_ of smiley to put here.) -- Scott Elcomb http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ http://search.cpan.org/~selcomb/SAL-3.03/ http://psema4.googlepages.com/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 00:52:13 2006 From: meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org (Meng Cheah) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 20:52:13 -0400 Subject: Brawling with BitTorrent In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f0608221607m7cca0a26i80b908625fd6169-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <44EAF70B.1020503@execulink.com> <44EB1898.9080906@pppoe.ca> <99a6c38f0608221607m7cca0a26i80b908625fd6169@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <44EBA6BD.3030900@pppoe.ca> Scott Elcomb wrote: > On 8/22/06, Meng Cheah wrote: > >> Pardon my ignorance but what is "Afterglow"? > > > This is an english expression, not a techinical fact. > > Afterglow is like: > > - the waning of the moon > - the second half of the bell curve, or the sine wave > - the feeling one gets after s/he's realized the world is alive[1] and > not under their direct control > > In this case, I believe, it refers to the realization that our "Open > Source" beliefs are different than those of companies[2] who refuse to > grow with the times - aka the MPAA, RIAA and other associated > organizations. > > In a way, Dogma is like a polar opposite to Karma[3]. > > [1] http://www.calresco.org/ is the only convenient aid I can quote > without going off on a diatribe > [2] Incumbant business models might be a better term > [3] If you don't understand, then you prolly don't want to ask - if > you do, shoot Thanks, Scott for the detailed explanation, it's much appreciated. I'll look up [1] and leave [3] alone :-) . My Google search turned up the phenomenon, music album and movie but nothing related to computers. I was beginning to wonder how can you get a month-long after "glow" like that from a good drink, from reading log files :-) . Thanks again. Meng Cheah -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From alain.maisonneuve_lists-QX23z+6opsUOxlH4FaG5hA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 03:43:12 2006 From: alain.maisonneuve_lists-QX23z+6opsUOxlH4FaG5hA at public.gmane.org (alain.maisonneuve_lists-QX23z+6opsUOxlH4FaG5hA at public.gmane.org) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 23:43:12 -0400 Subject: Headless VNC server Message-ID: <20060822234312.qkmnw597ytdcoc80@webmail.swiftpenguin.com> Hi, I am setting up a Myth Box and i would like to setup VNC. I want to be able to VNC over and use KDE. My question is how do i get it (vnc4server) to start up at boot time. I want it to use the .vnc from a specific home directory (/home/alainm). if VNC is not the best approach, i am open to suggestions. BTW, i am using kUbuntu 5.10 Breeze. If have tries FreeNX, but can find a window/mac client. looking for version 1.5. all i can find is 2.0. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 04:48:33 2006 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 00:48:33 -0400 Subject: psc but no scan app? In-Reply-To: <44EAF91C.7030201-k8+l4Qd5hq73fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> References: <44EA1E6C.9040709@vianet.ca> <44EA2C30.1010000@execulink.com> <44EA6193.2020500@vianet.ca> <44EAF91C.7030201@inofas.ca> Message-ID: <44EBDE21.6080808@execulink.com> Daniel Gardiner wrote: > Chris Aitken wrote: > >> Gregory D Hough wrote: >> >> >> I did the following. The scsi stuff is intriguing. Are most scanners >> scsi?: > > > > Scanners intended for home use are usually usb, scanners intended for > production use (thousands of pages a day) are usually scsi. > > > Daniel > > -- > That's funny, I don't recall writing that. greg -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 04:57:45 2006 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 00:57:45 -0400 Subject: Brawling with BitTorrent In-Reply-To: <20060822224535.GA29845-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <44EAF70B.1020503@execulink.com> <20060822224535.GA29845@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <44EBE049.7090308@execulink.com> Walter Dnes wrote: > On Tue, Aug 22, 2006 at 08:22:35AM -0400, Gregory D Hough wrote > > >>Is anyone familiar with BitTorrent? I have a problem with it. I don't >>use it myself for anything cause I ain't a TV junkie or hyper-music >>enthusiast and I buy my distros attached to Linux magazines. I am just >>fed up with a persistant month-long "Afterglow?" I don't know if it is >>actually afterglow or if it is an MPAA/RIAA Torrent spy, but I want it >>to Go Away! > > >>before I start throwing some brutal packets at the offending IP... > > > ..before you start throwing some brutal packets at the offending IP... > remember that IP addresses are trivially easy to forge on UDP. You > might be hitting an innocent 3rd party with a DOS attack, and they > could file criminal charges against you. > I'm truly compelled to respond in that other thread, but to avoid being obtuse I'll stick to the point in the reply that's mostly on the mark. Walter, the word brutal was just an attention getter, sorry. If I filed criminal charges against every party that attempted to DOS my IP, I solemnly swear, I'd have legal pads up the ying-yang and court dates from here to eternity. What would be the point of forging a P2P beacon packet anyway, It doesn't include any redirection? I also expected to see that word criminal show up from using the word brutal; The pair instill fear and usually go hand-in-hand as in "brutal criminal." Incidently, I never said how brutal nor how many. > >>like to know what is the proper way to make it stop. > > > Can I assume you have a static IP address? If you have a dynamic IP > address, change it. > I don't wish to change my dynamic IP address. I like to treat it as though it were static. And besides, running away is cowardly when there is little chance of any harm coming from standing my ground in this instance. I could even turn off logging the 72 or so hits each day in the spirit of blissful ignorance to the ultimate doldrums of nothing ventured nothing gained. > A few UDP packets once every 20 minutes is *NOT* a DOS attack, so I > wouldn't bother calling law-enforcement. If you have logs, submit them > to the ISP that owns that IP address. > This is a rather benign example yes, but it is an effort to form a proper and ethical regime within automated tasks before threading any jigs for bigger FIN'd critters. Submitting logs would be one of my first automated outward expressions, and It would not be a law-enforcement contact initially I'm sure. I will probably have to learn how to integrate jwhois for appropriate to generate messages to. Having said that, here is a typical "auto-reply" when pursuing the correct channels in incident reporting. It was quite lengthy and in multiple languages so it's abbreviated accordingly (note the hyphenated word auto-generated): ================================================================= - To report scans, probes, hacking attempts, or similar activity, please include an excerpt of your auto-generated log files showing ONLY THE INCIDENTS PERTAINING TO INTERNET, cut and pasted directly into the email message, including: - Offending IP Address - Date - Specific Time - Time Zone and GMT offset - Source/Destination Ports - Any other brief pertinent details ***Screenshots will not be accepted in lieu of log excerpts.*** ***Please DO NOT INCLUDE TRACEROUTES, WHOIS LOOKUPS, or PING results, as these do not contribute to the investigation, and can often cause the message to become "garbled" or unreadable.*** ================================================================= This is a pretty good start wouldn't you say? So my next questions are; How many abuses should be sent per HH:MM:SS dd/mm/yy/etc without becoming too much of a pest; And how many upstream providers should be notified in instances where activity is malignant enough to warrant the extra effort in proving a genuine and not a forged *counterfeit* source address; And where is the actual effort when my Linux boxes will doing all the mundane tasks all by themselves? Believe me, I understand the importance of notifying the proper authorities and adhering to due process. And I believe in ISAAC ASIMOV's three laws of robotics as well. When I don't know all the facts I ask and ask and ask til I get the correct answer or at least one which makes the most sense, as yours most certainly does. Thanks again, greg BTW-I use the term "afterglow" in the context of "the activity one experiences on the wire immediately after one is assigned a new IP address where the former holder of that IP address, mere moments ago, was running all kinds of Internet applications, involved in an established botnet or P2P network among other things a bit torrential." You get what you afford when you google. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From dwarmstrong-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 04:47:14 2006 From: dwarmstrong-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Daniel Armstrong) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 00:47:14 -0400 Subject: Headless VNC server In-Reply-To: <20060822234312.qkmnw597ytdcoc80-2RFepEojUI1BfbfP7qimxQ7GUfgVobmE@public.gmane.org> References: <20060822234312.qkmnw597ytdcoc80@webmail.swiftpenguin.com> Message-ID: <61e9e2b10608222147j422d3830gbbef91bdf379aee7@mail.gmail.com> On 8/22/06, alain.maisonneuve_lists-QX23z+6opsUOxlH4FaG5hA at public.gmane.org > If have tries FreeNX, but can find a window/mac client. looking for version 1.5. > all i can find is 2.0. I just started messing with Freenx... If you are looking for a portable FreeNX client option, check out qsclient - http://www.fenner.info/clients/docs/index.html - they provide the means to download a nx client, and install the whole works to a USB pendrive. -- Daniel Wayne Armstrong :: build it yourself biology http://biohackery.com :: -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 11:51:54 2006 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 07:51:54 -0400 Subject: New ubuntu install freezes on boot on IBM T21 laptop In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 8/21/06, Alex Maynard wrote: > > Hi All: > > Just wondering if anyone has any thoughts on a problem I've been having > with IBM T21 laptop? ubuntu (5.04 - 6.06.1) runs great on my T20. djp -- djp-tnsZcVQxgqO2dHQpreyxbg at public.gmane.org www.linuxcaffe.ca 326 Harbord Street, Toronto, M6G 3A5, (416) 534-2116 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 12:01:43 2006 From: john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org (John Van Ostrand) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 08:01:43 -0400 Subject: Headless VNC server In-Reply-To: <20060822234312.qkmnw597ytdcoc80-2RFepEojUI1BfbfP7qimxQ7GUfgVobmE@public.gmane.org> References: <20060822234312.qkmnw597ytdcoc80@webmail.swiftpenguin.com> Message-ID: <1156334503.12073.154.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> On Tue, 2006-08-22 at 23:43 -0400, alain.maisonneuve_lists-QX23z+6opsUOxlH4FaG5hA at public.gmane.org wrote: > Hi, > > I am setting up a Myth Box and i would like to setup VNC. I want to be able to > VNC over and use KDE. > > My question is how do i get it (vnc4server) to start up at boot time. I want it > to use the .vnc from a specific home directory (/home/alainm). > > if VNC is not the best approach, i am open to suggestions. > > BTW, i am using kUbuntu 5.10 Breeze. > > If have tries FreeNX, but can find a window/mac client. looking for version 1.5. > all i can find is 2.0. I'm not versed in Kubuntu, but there will be rc scripts in /etc/rc.d or /etc/init.d. There may be an rc.local in there somewhere. You'll need to add a line to run the vnc server with the args you want. You also want to su to the user to run the command: su -c "vncserver :1 --geometry 1024x768 --depth 16" alainm -- John Van Ostrand Net Direct Inc. Chief Technology Officer 564 Weber St. N. Unit 12 Waterloo, ON N2L 5C6 map john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org Ph: 519-883-1172 ext.5102 Linux Solutions / IBM Hardware Fx: 519-883-8533 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From dgardiner-k8+l4Qd5hq73fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 12:23:12 2006 From: dgardiner-k8+l4Qd5hq73fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Daniel Gardiner) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 08:23:12 -0400 Subject: psc but no scan app? In-Reply-To: <44EBDE21.6080808-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ@public.gmane.org> References: <44EA1E6C.9040709@vianet.ca> <44EA2C30.1010000@execulink.com> <44EA6193.2020500@vianet.ca> <44EAF91C.7030201@inofas.ca> <44EBDE21.6080808@execulink.com> Message-ID: <44EC48B0.1060404@inofas.ca> Gregory D Hough wrote: > Daniel Gardiner wrote: > >> Chris Aitken wrote: >> >>> Gregory D Hough wrote: >>> >>> I did the following. The scsi stuff is intriguing. Are most scanners >>> scsi?: >> >> Scanners intended for home use are usually usb, scanners intended >> for production use (thousands of pages a day) are usually scsi. >> >> Daniel > > That's funny, I don't recall writing that. > > greg Sorry, munged up the quote while snipping. The quote should have been attributed to Chris. Daniel -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From dgardiner-k8+l4Qd5hq73fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 15:26:25 2006 From: dgardiner-k8+l4Qd5hq73fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Daniel Gardiner) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 11:26:25 -0400 Subject: GTABUG, any members present? In-Reply-To: <1f13df280608210552u74cbff1aqc86d42d7f8d9ab02-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <1f13df280608210552u74cbff1aqc86d42d7f8d9ab02@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <44EC73A1.6060604@inofas.ca> Someone asked about this last night so I thought that I would post the information for the mailing list. Send chat mailing list submissions to chat-c+hT0Pt6R4HQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://gtabug.com/mailman/listinfo/chat_gtabug.com or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to chat-request-c+hT0Pt6R4HQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org You can reach the person managing the list at chat-owner-c+hT0Pt6R4HQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Giles Orr wrote: > I've developed an interest in the BSD family, and found the GTABUG > website (http://www.gtabug.com/). Here's the problem: they say > "There's a list of proposed meeting dates below but, to be safe, you > should sign up for the mailing list as this page may not always be > updated in time for the meetings." I'd like to join the mailing list > anyway, but: the link to the listserver is broken, there's no contact > info anywhere on the page, and they're using whois obfuscation so I > can't even get a name that way. Are there any GTABUG members on this > list who can either assist me in getting onto the mailing list? > Thanks. > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 15:01:59 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 11:01:59 -0400 Subject: Headless VNC server In-Reply-To: <20060822234312.qkmnw597ytdcoc80-2RFepEojUI1BfbfP7qimxQ7GUfgVobmE@public.gmane.org> References: <20060822234312.qkmnw597ytdcoc80@webmail.swiftpenguin.com> Message-ID: <20060823150159.GP13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 22, 2006 at 11:43:12PM -0400, alain.maisonneuve_lists-QX23z+6opsUOxlH4FaG5hA at public.gmane.org wrote: > I am setting up a Myth Box and i would like to setup VNC. I want to be able to > VNC over and use KDE. > > My question is how do i get it (vnc4server) to start up at boot time. I want it > to use the .vnc from a specific home directory (/home/alainm). > > if VNC is not the best approach, i am open to suggestions. > > BTW, i am using kUbuntu 5.10 Breeze. > > If have tries FreeNX, but can find a window/mac client. looking for version 1.5. > all i can find is 2.0. You can usually configure xdm/gdm/kdm/wdm to launch specific X servers at startup, and manage logins on them. By default they are usually configured to launch a normal X server on the machine, but you could configure it to launch a vnc server instead. The other option is to launch the vnc server from inittab, so that if it is killed, it starts another one automatically. Might be the simplest way if you don't want a login, but rather would have it just logged in all the time. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From kburtch-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 17:27:46 2006 From: kburtch-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ken Burtch) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 13:27:46 -0400 Subject: Lone Coder: Open Source Guide to the Solar System Message-ID: <1156354067.16247.0.camel@rosette.pegasoft.ca> This month I take a look at Celestia, the open source astronomical program that lets you tour the solar system. http://www.pegasoft.ca/coder/coder_august_2006.html Ken B. -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ken O. Burtch Phone/Fax: 905-562-0848 "Linux Shell Scripting with Bash" Email: ken-8VyUGRzHQ8IsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org "Perl Phrasebook" Blog: http://www.pegasoft.ca ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From alain.maisonneuve_lists-QX23z+6opsUOxlH4FaG5hA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 23:36:15 2006 From: alain.maisonneuve_lists-QX23z+6opsUOxlH4FaG5hA at public.gmane.org (alain.maisonneuve_lists-QX23z+6opsUOxlH4FaG5hA at public.gmane.org) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 19:36:15 -0400 Subject: Headless VNC server In-Reply-To: <1156334503.12073.154.camel-H4GMr3yegGDiLwdn3CfQm+4hLzXZc3VTLAPz8V8PbKw@public.gmane.org> References: <20060822234312.qkmnw597ytdcoc80@webmail.swiftpenguin.com> <1156334503.12073.154.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> Message-ID: <20060823193615.m4jn2g5wgo0gk8kw@webmail.swiftpenguin.com> Thanks for you help.. but.. I tried this and now i am getting Xauth error xauth: /tmp/xauth.XXXXpTwRvB not writable, changes will be ignored xauth: error in locking authority file /tmp/xauth.XXXXpTwRvB New 'X' desktop is ghost:2 Starting applications specified in /etc/X11/Xsession Log file is /home/alainm/.vnc/ghost:2.log and also the KDM doesn't start up properly any thoughts? Quoting John Van Ostrand : > On Tue, 2006-08-22 at 23:43 -0400, > alain.maisonneuve_lists-QX23z+6opsUOxlH4FaG5hA at public.gmane.org wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> I am setting up a Myth Box and i would like to setup VNC. I want to >> be able to >> VNC over and use KDE. >> >> My question is how do i get it (vnc4server) to start up at boot >> time. I want it >> to use the .vnc from a specific home directory (/home/alainm). >> >> if VNC is not the best approach, i am open to suggestions. >> >> BTW, i am using kUbuntu 5.10 Breeze. >> >> If have tries FreeNX, but can find a window/mac client. looking for >> version 1.5. >> all i can find is 2.0. > > > I'm not versed in Kubuntu, but there will be rc scripts in /etc/rc.d > or /etc/init.d. There may be an rc.local in there somewhere. You'll need > to add a line to run the vnc server with the args you want. You also > want to su to the user to run the command: > > su -c "vncserver :1 --geometry 1024x768 --depth 16" alainm > > -- > John Van Ostrand > Net Direct Inc. > > Chief Technology Officer > 564 Weber St. N. Unit 12 > Waterloo, ON N2L 5C6 > map > john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org > Ph: 519-883-1172 > ext.5102 > Linux Solutions / IBM > Hardware > Fx: 519-883-8533 > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 01:41:59 2006 From: john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org (John Van Ostrand) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 21:41:59 -0400 Subject: Headless VNC server In-Reply-To: <20060823193615.m4jn2g5wgo0gk8kw-2RFepEojUI1BfbfP7qimxQ7GUfgVobmE@public.gmane.org> References: <20060822234312.qkmnw597ytdcoc80@webmail.swiftpenguin.com> <1156334503.12073.154.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> <20060823193615.m4jn2g5wgo0gk8kw@webmail.swiftpenguin.com> Message-ID: <1156383719.30847.45.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Wed, 2006-08-23 at 19:36 -0400, alain.maisonneuve_lists-QX23z+6opsUOxlH4FaG5hA at public.gmane.org wrote: > Thanks for you help.. but.. > > I tried this and now i am getting Xauth error > > xauth: /tmp/xauth.XXXXpTwRvB not writable, changes will be ignored > xauth: error in locking authority file /tmp/xauth.XXXXpTwRvB > > New 'X' desktop is ghost:2 > > Starting applications specified in /etc/X11/Xsession > Log file is /home/alainm/.vnc/ghost:2.log > > and also the KDM doesn't start up properly > > any thoughts? My first thought is that the perms on /tmp are wrong. Run 'ls -l /tmp' and check the perms. The should look like: drwxrwxrwt If it isn't run this: chmod 1777 /tmp Then you need to check /home/alainm/.vnc/xstartup. Make sure that this line is there: startkde If there is a twm line, you should comment it out. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From john-Z7w/En0MP3xWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 06:21:00 2006 From: john-Z7w/En0MP3xWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (John Macdonald) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 02:21:00 -0400 Subject: New ubuntu install freezes on boot on IBM T21 laptop In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20060824062100.GC2510@lupus.perlwolf.com> On Wed, Aug 23, 2006 at 07:51:54AM -0400, David J Patrick wrote: > On 8/21/06, Alex Maynard wrote: > > > >Hi All: > > > >Just wondering if anyone has any thoughts on a problem I've been having > >with IBM T21 laptop? > > ubuntu (5.04 - 6.06.1) runs great on my T20. > djp [I didn't see Alex' original post so this comment may be irrelevant.] There was a recent upgrade from Ubuntu that broke the Xorg server. Symptom is that you get "(EE) No devices detected" as the diagnostic when it abandons running X. There was another upgrade soon afterward that fixed things, so if that's what happened to you, log into the console mode and run: sudo apt-get update sudo apt-get dist-upgrade sudo /etc/init.d/gdm restart -- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From moliver-fC0AHe2n+mcIvw5+aKnW+Pd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 06:30:29 2006 From: moliver-fC0AHe2n+mcIvw5+aKnW+Pd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org (moliver-fC0AHe2n+mcIvw5+aKnW+Pd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 02:30:29 -0400 Subject: OT: Recommendations on e-mail providers? Message-ID: <20060824023029.f82rab2qlcgskcs8@mail.math.yorku.ca> For a few months I'm using someone else's ISP, and I'm about to lose one academic e-mail address (visiting position ended), and another's been on borrowed time for a year or so; they may never get around to cancelling it, but then again they might. Any recommendations for a good e-mail provider? Not interested in pure web-based solutions like Hotmail; I want IMAP for sure, and ideally encrypted IMAP (don't like sending my password in cleartext). Fastmail.fm, runbox.com, others? Any experiences with any of these guys? TIA. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 13:30:09 2006 From: john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org (John Van Ostrand) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 09:30:09 -0400 Subject: Headless VNC server In-Reply-To: <1156383719.30847.45.camel-bi+AKbBUZKY6gyzm1THtWbp2dZbC/Bob@public.gmane.org> References: <20060822234312.qkmnw597ytdcoc80@webmail.swiftpenguin.com> <1156334503.12073.154.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> <20060823193615.m4jn2g5wgo0gk8kw@webmail.swiftpenguin.com> <1156383719.30847.45.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1156426209.14994.2.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> On Wed, 2006-08-23 at 21:41 -0400, John Van Ostrand wrote: > My first thought is that the perms on /tmp are wrong. > > Run 'ls -l /tmp' and check the perms. The should look like: Ooops, I mean 'ls -ld /tmp' -- John Van Ostrand Net Direct Inc. Chief Technology Officer 564 Weber St. N. Unit 12 Waterloo, ON N2L 5C6 map john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org Ph: 519-883-1172 ext.5102 Linux Solutions / IBM Hardware Fx: 519-883-8533 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 14:33:04 2006 From: amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org (Alex Maynard) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 10:33:04 -0400 Subject: New ubuntu install freezes on boot on IBM T21 laptop In-Reply-To: <20060821191358.GA12048-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20060821191358.GA12048@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: > It is probably not a distro problem, but that some aspect of hardware is > misconfigured and balking the boot. Can you report the place in the > boot process that the "blanking" happens? If the screen is going blank > I would think it'd be a power management setting that's barfing, but it > could be a range of things. Thanks very much to everyone who wrote back with suggestions. I got really tied up with some other work and am only now able to try to fix this. The messages fly by pretty quickly during the boot, so even booting several times I couldn't catch everything. The last boot messages before the screen went blank were: starting ACPI services starting system log starting kernel log. A few of the more important sounding messages that came up a while before this were: uncompressing linux kernel mounting root file system loading modules configuring network interfaces (there were a lot more but I couldn't catch them all.) Thank again!! Alex > > Debian also has good ThinkPad support, but I don't think that that's the > actual issue. > -- > > yours, > > William > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 16:18:20 2006 From: amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org (Alex Maynard) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 12:18:20 -0400 Subject: New ubuntu install freezes on boot on IBM T21 laptop In-Reply-To: <20060824062100.GC2510-FexrNA+1sEo9RQMjcVF9lNBPR1lH4CV8@public.gmane.org> References: <20060824062100.GC2510@lupus.perlwolf.com> Message-ID: > There was a recent upgrade from Ubuntu that broke the Xorg > server. Symptom is that you get "(EE) No devices detected" as > the diagnostic when it abandons running X. There was another > upgrade soon afterward that fixed things, so if that's what > happened to you, log into the console mode and run: > > sudo apt-get update > sudo apt-get dist-upgrade > sudo /etc/init.d/gdm restart Thank you. I booted in recovery mode (which worked), updated the system using the first two commands (it updated a lot files, & didn't seem to have any trouble), but then the screen went blank after the last command and again when I rebooted in standard mode. Too bad, I was hoping this would fix it. > > -- > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > ----------------------------------------- I have recently moved. Please find my new contact information below: Alex Maynard Associate Professor Department of Economics School of Business and Economics Wilfrid Laurier University 75 University Avenue West Waterloo, ON N2L 3C5 tel: 519-884-0710 ext. 3916 e-mail: amaynard-asLh6aZUA04 at public.gmane.org office: SBE3253 (in the Schlegel Centre) web (department page): http://www.wlu.ca/sbe/amaynard web (personal page): http://www.amaynard.ca -------------------------------------------- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 17:06:29 2006 From: amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org (Alex Maynard) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:06:29 -0400 Subject: New ubuntu install freezes on boot on IBM T21 laptop In-Reply-To: <20060822132452.xf6uwxgcvvgg0cg4-2RFepEojUI1BfbfP7qimxQ7GUfgVobmE@public.gmane.org> References: <20060822132452.xf6uwxgcvvgg0cg4@webmail.swiftpenguin.com> Message-ID: Thank you all again so much. I've resolved the problem using the instructions on the e-mail below. So it appears to have been a problem with Xwindows as many of you suggested. Alex On Tue, 22 Aug 2006 alain.maisonneuve_lists-QX23z+6opsUOxlH4FaG5hA at public.gmane.org wrote: > I am assuming you are using the latest version of Kubuntu 6.01 Dapper. > > This is actually a known issue with that particular release. > > https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-ati/+bug/22985 > > Modify the xorg.conf file and add the following line to the "monitors" > section: > > Option "MonitorLayout" "LVDS,CRT" > > that should do the trick :) > > > Quoting Alex Maynard : > > > > > Hi All: > > > > Just wondering if anyone has any thoughts on a problem I've been having > > with IBM T21 laptop? > > > > I installed a new kubuntu disk on my laptop. At first it worked well. But > > about a day later it started going blank halfway through reboot and kept > > doing this. So essentially I couldn't boot from the hard drive. > > > > Later I reinstalled ubuntu and the same thing happened. I used > > to have the same laptop working using libranet but they went out of > > business and my CDs from them are too far out of date to update without > > dependency problems. > > > > The only thing I can think of to do now is to try a differerent > > distribution (any suggestions?), but I thought I would run this by > > you to see what other suggestions you might have. > > > > Alex > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 17:51:59 2006 From: ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org (Andrew Hammond) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:51:59 -0400 Subject: OT: Recommendations on e-mail providers? In-Reply-To: <20060824023029.f82rab2qlcgskcs8-eRF/mgt17vYuqM34mc2EBrDks+cytr/Z@public.gmane.org> References: <20060824023029.f82rab2qlcgskcs8@mail.math.yorku.ca> Message-ID: <44EDE73F.4050908@ca.afilias.info> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 moliver-fC0AHe2n+mcIvw5+aKnW+Pd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org wrote: > For a few months I'm using someone else's ISP, and I'm about to lose one > academic e-mail address (visiting position ended), and another's been > on borrowed time for a year or so; they may never get around to cancelling > it, but then again they might. > > Any recommendations for a good e-mail provider? Not interested in > pure web-based solutions like Hotmail; I want IMAP for sure, and ideally > encrypted IMAP (don't like sending my password in cleartext). Have you looked at gmail yet? I used to feel the same way about webmail, but gmail changed it for me. I'm actually at the point where I find my work account (which is IMAP based) less convenient and effective to use than my personal account on gmail. Drew -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2.2 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFE7ec/gfzn5SevSpoRAlkhAJ9olHOnUTh4KkEgoaaUjS6tTIq8mgCfdcSA im4d0sPjCA9VW50n1smn00Q= =ezca -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From david-n6TUjxoeaMtM656bX5wj8A at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 17:55:25 2006 From: david-n6TUjxoeaMtM656bX5wj8A at public.gmane.org (David R. Meyer) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 10:55:25 -0700 Subject: New to the group and a question Message-ID: <20060824105525.521b7059f1e09bbdacd7e3b34a5d9af3.6f8f52684e.wbe@email.secureserver.net> Hello All, I wanted to introduce myself and ask a question. My name is David Meyer, and I am a software engineer with a major software manufacturer in the US. I live in Tampa, FL but find myself in your fine city fairly often as of late, and will be coming up on Sunday for the week. I am interested to find out if visitor, especially us war-monger Americans (that was a joke) are welcome at the picnic on Sunday. I happened to find out about it on the Linux Caffe site. As I'm not that familiar with the park where you'll be, I was also hoping for some local intel on parking, etc. You can email me off-list if you want...no need to burn bandwidth. Thanks, and I hope to join you on Sunday. Dave ***** David Meyer http://www.davidmeyer.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From david-n6TUjxoeaMtM656bX5wj8A at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 17:57:55 2006 From: david-n6TUjxoeaMtM656bX5wj8A at public.gmane.org (David R. Meyer) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 10:57:55 -0700 Subject: OT: Recommendations on e-mail providers? Message-ID: <20060824105755.521b7059f1e09bbdacd7e3b34a5d9af3.95e3f341d1.wbe@email.secureserver.net> > > Any recommendations for a good e-mail provider? Not interested in > > pure web-based solutions like Hotmail; I want IMAP for sure, and ideally > > encrypted IMAP (don't like sending my password in cleartext). I use GoDaddy.com. I used to host my own stuff, but after a lightning hit killed my servers I decided to get hosted...much cheaper than replacing them and easier than arguing with the insurance people. GoDaddy does support IMAP, and it's pretty cheap. Also, the service rocks. I've had it for a few years now and have never been unable to get to my website or email. Dave -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 18:09:21 2006 From: mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Merv Curley) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 14:09:21 -0400 Subject: Printing - Kanotix [Debian] Message-ID: <200608241409.21676.mervc@eol.ca> I know this should be posted to the Kanotix forum but this is usually faster and more reliable. I have installed the Easter release on 3 computers and dist-upgraded them. The computers all configured their associated printers with no problems. Starting the Print utility in any application reports the printer as idle and accepting jobs. The problem I have is that a job sent to the printer just sits in the queue and isn't being printed. As far as I can see, all users have access rights. Does this ring a bell with anyone? Seems for the past while, Kanotix users have had a lot of print problems altho they are just using the Debian released KDE. Cupsys is 1.2.2-1. -- Merv Curley Toronto, Ont. Can Kanotix Linux Ver. Easter 2006 Desktop KDE 3.5.4 KMail 1.9.3 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 18:29:09 2006 From: interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (Interlug) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 14:29:09 -0400 Subject: bash: lines of a file in reverse order? Message-ID: <1156444149.3789.464.camel@localhost.localdomain> How do I return the contents of a file in reverse order, by line? I have Line 1 Line 2 Line 3 I want it to come back as Line 3 Line 2 Line 1 I was hoping tail -r would do it, but this appears to be a tail under OSX thing. http://www.ss64.com/osx/tail.html rev doesn't do it. $ rev < lines 1 eniL 2 eniL 3 eniL I want to find the "last matching line" in a large log file. My hope was: tail -50 -r filename | grep -m 1 "matching" would grab it for me if it exists in the last 50 lines of the log. Surely this is being done elsewhere. Got a pointer? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 18:32:27 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 14:32:27 -0400 (EDT) Subject: New to the group and a question In-Reply-To: <20060824105525.521b7059f1e09bbdacd7e3b34a5d9af3.6f8f52684e.wbe-m93nO3Tz//MXDf8mDYMBOoVfYA8g3rJ/@public.gmane.org> References: <20060824105525.521b7059f1e09bbdacd7e3b34a5d9af3.6f8f52684e.wbe@email.secureserver.net> Message-ID: <20060824183227.6553.qmail@web88205.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- "David R. Meyer" wrote: > Hello All, > > I wanted to introduce myself and ask a question. My > name is David > Meyer, and I am a software engineer with a major > software manufacturer > in the US. I live in Tampa, FL but find myself in > your fine city > fairly often as of late, and will be coming up on > Sunday for the week. > > I am interested to find out if visitor, especially > us war-monger > Americans (that was a joke) are welcome at the > picnic on Sunday. I > happened to find out about it on the Linux Caffe > site. Your ancestory isn't an issue, your timing is. 44% of the residents of Toronto were born outside Canada, the only city in the world to have a higher percentage of foreign born residents is Miami, FL (this noted by someone who while born in Canada was born outside Toronto). War is what broght Bruce Becker, one of the really old time local Unix guru's to Canada from the U.S.. Ok, so it was the Vietnam war... Now as for timing, the picnic runs Saturday, August 26th. Sorry about that. > As I'm not that familiar with the park where you'll > be, I was also > hoping for some local intel on parking, etc. You > can email me off-list > if you want...no need to burn bandwidth. While I am sure Linuxcaffe would be delighted to see you, I am not the one to answer questions about parking (normally being one to use the subway). I can tell you that the park and Linuxcaffe are a short walk from the Cristie subway station. While you may be missing out on Linux in the Park, you may want to look in on say the Asterisk user group who have their next monthly meeting next Wednesday: http://www.taug.ca/ Short walk from the North York Centre subway station. Colin McGregor > Thanks, and I hope to join you on Sunday. > > Dave > ***** > David Meyer > http://www.davidmeyer.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 18:36:36 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 14:36:36 -0400 Subject: bash: lines of a file in reverse order? In-Reply-To: <1156444149.3789.464.camel-bi+AKbBUZKY6gyzm1THtWbp2dZbC/Bob@public.gmane.org> References: <1156444149.3789.464.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20060824183636.GQ13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Aug 24, 2006 at 02:29:09PM -0400, Interlug wrote: > How do I return the contents of a file in reverse order, by line? > > I have > > Line 1 > Line 2 > Line 3 > > I want it to come back as > > Line 3 > Line 2 > Line 1 > > I was hoping tail -r would do it, but this appears to be a tail under > OSX thing. > http://www.ss64.com/osx/tail.html > > rev doesn't do it. > > $ rev < lines > 1 eniL > 2 eniL > 3 eniL > > I want to find the "last matching line" in a large log file. My hope > was: > > tail -50 -r filename | grep -m 1 "matching" > would grab it for me if it exists in the last 50 lines of the log. > > Surely this is being done elsewhere. Got a pointer? The reason there doesn't seem to be a tool to do it, is that it can't be done efficiently without using tons of memory, and hence doesn't fit into a pipeline. After all you have to store ALL the lines before you can start to output anything, since the first output is the last input. It simply doesn't fit in the way the standard command line tools do, which almost all work line by line. Of course this doesn't mean there aren't tools to do it, just that it isn't something likeot to be efficient. What you want is 'tac' (that is cat backwards) :) -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From moliver-fC0AHe2n+mcIvw5+aKnW+Pd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 18:37:05 2006 From: moliver-fC0AHe2n+mcIvw5+aKnW+Pd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org (moliver-fC0AHe2n+mcIvw5+aKnW+Pd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 14:37:05 -0400 Subject: New to the group and a question In-Reply-To: <20060824183227.6553.qmail-nQt9QCl3sx2B9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060824183227.6553.qmail@web88205.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20060824143705.5s8u5rh28g8c8sog@mail.math.yorku.ca> Quoting Colin McGregor : > --- "David R. Meyer" wrote: >> I am interested to find out if visitor, especially >> us war-monger >> Americans (that was a joke) are welcome at the >> picnic on Sunday. I >> happened to find out about it on the Linux Caffe >> site. > > Your ancestory isn't an issue, your timing is. 44% of > the residents of Toronto were born outside Canada, the > only city in the world to have a higher percentage of > foreign born residents is Miami, FL (this noted by > someone who while born in Canada was born outside > Toronto). My experience as an American in Canada: If you don't tell them, they usually can't tell. That's in spite of my peculiar Cal-Tex accent with a little Mississippi mixed in there somewhere. Canadians like to think they're very different from Americans, but with the exception of politics, they mostly aren't. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 18:39:16 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 14:39:16 -0400 Subject: New to the group and a question In-Reply-To: <20060824105525.521b7059f1e09bbdacd7e3b34a5d9af3.6f8f52684e.wbe-m93nO3Tz//MXDf8mDYMBOoVfYA8g3rJ/@public.gmane.org> References: <20060824105525.521b7059f1e09bbdacd7e3b34a5d9af3.6f8f52684e.wbe@email.secureserver.net> Message-ID: <20060824183916.GR13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Aug 24, 2006 at 10:55:25AM -0700, David R. Meyer wrote: > I wanted to introduce myself and ask a question. My name is David > Meyer, and I am a software engineer with a major software manufacturer > in the US. I live in Tampa, FL but find myself in your fine city > fairly often as of late, and will be coming up on Sunday for the week. > > I am interested to find out if visitor, especially us war-monger > Americans (that was a joke) are welcome at the picnic on Sunday. I > happened to find out about it on the Linux Caffe site. I thought it was only the country and the administration that was war-monger'ers, not the people living there. The americans I have met seem very nice, although maybe that's because they are part of the pool that ever leaves the country. :) > As I'm not that familiar with the park where you'll be, I was also > hoping for some local intel on parking, etc. You can email me off-list > if you want...no need to burn bandwidth. I don't know that area very well personally. > Thanks, and I hope to join you on Sunday. I probably won't be there, but I suspect lots of people will. -- Len SOrensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 18:44:14 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 14:44:14 -0400 Subject: New to the group and a question In-Reply-To: <20060824143705.5s8u5rh28g8c8sog-eRF/mgt17vYuqM34mc2EBrDks+cytr/Z@public.gmane.org> References: <20060824183227.6553.qmail@web88205.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <20060824143705.5s8u5rh28g8c8sog@mail.math.yorku.ca> Message-ID: <20060824184414.GS13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Aug 24, 2006 at 02:37:05PM -0400, moliver-fC0AHe2n+mcIvw5+aKnW+Pd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org wrote: > My experience as an American in Canada: If you don't tell them, > they usually can't tell. That's in spite of my peculiar > Cal-Tex accent with a little Mississippi mixed in there > somewhere. If you don't tell them where you are from, most likely they just don't care or maybe just don't think about it. There are people from just about everywhere in Canada, and this doesn't seem to be a problem for anyone in general. > Canadians like to think they're very different from Americans, > but with the exception of politics, they mostly aren't. I don't think I have ever met a canadian that thought the place they grew up and the place they currently live were very important features of their personality. From watching tv (which we geta lot of from the US of course), it seems to be considered very important by americans where you are from. So it isn't just politics. Of course in the grand scheme of things, almost all of the people on the continent are historically from somewhere else, many just don't know/remember where from anymore. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From david-n6TUjxoeaMtM656bX5wj8A at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 18:45:27 2006 From: david-n6TUjxoeaMtM656bX5wj8A at public.gmane.org (David R. Meyer) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 11:45:27 -0700 Subject: New to the group and a question Message-ID: <20060824114527.521b7059f1e09bbdacd7e3b34a5d9af3.1f7de596cf.wbe@email.secureserver.net> > I thought it was only the country and the administration that was > war-monger'ers, not the people living there. The americans I have met > seem very nice, although maybe that's because they are part of the pool > that ever leaves the country. :) You hit it right on the head! Most of us are pretty decent people because we get out and see the world, and while we're proud of our country and the "American Way" we know it's NOT the only way, and that seems to serve us well when traveling :) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 19:03:41 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 15:03:41 -0400 Subject: New to the group and a question In-Reply-To: <20060824105525.521b7059f1e09bbdacd7e3b34a5d9af3.6f8f52684e.wbe-m93nO3Tz//MXDf8mDYMBOoVfYA8g3rJ/@public.gmane.org> References: <20060824105525.521b7059f1e09bbdacd7e3b34a5d9af3.6f8f52684e.wbe@email.secureserver.net> Message-ID: <44EDF80D.2090402@rogers.com> David R. Meyer wrote: > Hello All, > > I wanted to introduce myself and ask a question. My name is David > Meyer, and I am a software engineer with a major software manufacturer > in the US. I live in Tampa, FL but find myself in your fine city > fairly often as of late, and will be coming up on Sunday for the week. > > I am interested to find out if visitor, especially us war-monger > Americans (that was a joke) are welcome at the picnic on Sunday. I > happened to find out about it on the Linux Caffe site. > > As I'm not that familiar with the park where you'll be, I was also > hoping for some local intel on parking, etc. You can email me off-list > if you want...no need to burn bandwidth. > > Thanks, and I hope to join you on Sunday. I'm sure you'd be welcome, but the last time I checked, Aug 26 is on a Saturday. I'd have preferred Sunday too. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 19:04:11 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 15:04:11 -0400 Subject: New to the group and a question In-Reply-To: <20060824184414.GS13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20060824183227.6553.qmail@web88205.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <20060824143705.5s8u5rh28g8c8sog@mail.math.yorku.ca> <20060824184414.GS13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608241204i6f757269oa75a4579d9922799@mail.gmail.com> On 8/24/06, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Thu, Aug 24, 2006 at 02:37:05PM -0400, moliver-fC0AHe2n+mcIvw5+aKnW+Pd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org wrote: > > My experience as an American in Canada: If you don't tell them, > > they usually can't tell. That's in spite of my peculiar > > Cal-Tex accent with a little Mississippi mixed in there > > somewhere. > > If you don't tell them where you are from, most likely they just don't > care or maybe just don't think about it. There are people from just > about everywhere in Canada, and this doesn't seem to be a problem for > anyone in general. > > > Canadians like to think they're very different from Americans, > > but with the exception of politics, they mostly aren't. > > I don't think I have ever met a canadian that thought the place they > grew up and the place they currently live were very important features > of their personality. Met is a relative term. ;-) On the 'net, I've run into a few. And being one, I think I'll not touch the politics. Welcome to TLUG David, and well met. -- Scott Elcomb http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ http://search.cpan.org/~selcomb/SAL-3.03/ http://psema4.googlepages.com/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 20:04:27 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 16:04:27 -0400 Subject: Printing - Kanotix [Debian] In-Reply-To: <200608241409.21676.mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200608241409.21676.mervc@eol.ca> Message-ID: Merv Curley wrote: > I know this should be posted to the Kanotix forum but this is usually faster > and more reliable. > > I have installed the Easter release on 3 computers and dist-upgraded them. > The computers all configured their associated printers with no problems. > Starting the Print utility in any application reports the printer as idle and > accepting jobs. The problem I have is that a job sent to the printer just > sits in the queue and isn't being printed. > > As far as I can see, all users have access rights. Does this ring a bell > with anyone? > > Seems for the past while, Kanotix users have had a lot of print problems altho > they are just using the Debian released KDE. Cupsys is 1.2.2-1. It's got to be more than just Kanotix, Ubuntu has problems -- it seems related to an upgrade to cups a while back. Regardless... Try configuring cups though the web interface: http:://localhost:631 Usually you will be able to add, manage, force the queue etc. through that interface versus the kcontrol or gnome print manager. You may have to edit cups configuration files to allow your root user to login through the web interface -- only way to tell is to try. Jamon -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 20:11:16 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 16:11:16 -0400 Subject: Printing - Kanotix [Debian] In-Reply-To: References: <200608241409.21676.mervc@eol.ca> Message-ID: Jamon Camisso wrote: > It's got to be more than just Kanotix, Ubuntu has problems -- it seems > related to an upgrade to cups a while back. Regardless... Try > configuring cups though the web interface: http:://localhost:631 That should be http://localhost:631 of course. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From moliver-fC0AHe2n+mcIvw5+aKnW+Pd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 20:39:41 2006 From: moliver-fC0AHe2n+mcIvw5+aKnW+Pd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org (Mike Oliver) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:39:41 -0700 Subject: New to the group and a question In-Reply-To: <20060824184414.GS13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20060824183227.6553.qmail@web88205.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <20060824143705.5s8u5rh28g8c8sog@mail.math.yorku.ca> <20060824184414.GS13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <44EE0E8D.7000000@mathstat.yorku.ca> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Thu, Aug 24, 2006 at 02:37:05PM -0400, moliver-fC0AHe2n+mcIvw5+aKnW+Pd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org wrote: > >>My experience as an American in Canada: If you don't tell them, >>they usually can't tell. That's in spite of my peculiar >>Cal-Tex accent with a little Mississippi mixed in there >>somewhere. > > If you don't tell them where you are from, most likely they just don't > care or maybe just don't think about it. There are people from just > about everywhere in Canada, and this doesn't seem to be a problem for > anyone in general. I'm talking about cases where it specifically came up. I mentioned that this would be the first time since I was a little boy that I'd lived in a place where there was much snow, and I was asked if I came from B.C. >>Canadians like to think they're very different from Americans, >>but with the exception of politics, they mostly aren't. > > I don't think I have ever met a canadian that thought the place they > grew up and the place they currently live were very important features > of their personality. Actually, to be honest, I found Canadians to be very conscious of being Canadian. One might even say "nationalistic". That was a bit of a surprise; I had expected them to think of nationalism as unsophisticated and bourgeois. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lists-6MMemSSbUSjVkXrxgXmPHQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 20:49:22 2006 From: lists-6MMemSSbUSjVkXrxgXmPHQ at public.gmane.org (Dieter Limeback) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 16:49:22 -0400 Subject: Printing - Kanotix [Debian] In-Reply-To: References: <200608241409.21676.mervc@eol.ca> Message-ID: <44EE10D2.8040106@centripetal.ca> > You may have > to edit cups configuration files to allow your root user to login > through the web interface - I'm not sure about Debian and Kanotix, but I did need to make a small change on my Ubuntu system -- administration via the web interface is disabled by default because it would require the CUPS daemon to be able to read to /etc/shadow. I had to put the cupsys user into the shadow group (as root) with # adduser cupsys shadow More info in /usr/share/doc/cupsys/README.Debian.gz. HTH -- Dieter Limeback Centripetal Media http://www.centripetal.ca/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 20:52:06 2006 From: ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org (Andrew Hammond) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 16:52:06 -0400 Subject: New to the group and a question In-Reply-To: <20060824114527.521b7059f1e09bbdacd7e3b34a5d9af3.1f7de596cf.wbe-m93nO3Tz//MXDf8mDYMBOoVfYA8g3rJ/@public.gmane.org> References: <20060824114527.521b7059f1e09bbdacd7e3b34a5d9af3.1f7de596cf.wbe@email.secureserver.net> Message-ID: <44EE1176.9040203@ca.afilias.info> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 David R. Meyer wrote: > You hit it right on the head! Most of us are pretty decent people > because we get out and see the world, and while we're proud of our > country and the "American Way" we know it's NOT the only way, and that > seems to serve us well when traveling :) There are many things about which Americans should certainly be proud. The fact that America is a war-mongering country is not one of these things. Drew -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2.2 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFE7hF2gfzn5SevSpoRAht9AKCQ1xqtXNdZPz5oPf0awcDFfad7aQCeP5wq ZFgJMY/SclMLdhk0K0+1tzs= =i1Yy -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 21:08:22 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 17:08:22 -0400 Subject: bash: lines of a file in reverse order? In-Reply-To: <1156444149.3789.464.camel-bi+AKbBUZKY6gyzm1THtWbp2dZbC/Bob@public.gmane.org> References: <1156444149.3789.464.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <44EE1546.6070206@rogers.com> Maybe this might work tail -50 filename | tac | grep -m 1 "matching" Kush Interlug wrote: > tail -50 -r filename | grep -m 1 "matching" > would grab it for me if it exists in the last 50 lines of the log. > > Surely this is being done elsewhere. Got a pointer? > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 22:23:46 2006 From: cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org (Chris F.A. Johnson) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 18:23:46 -0400 (EDT) Subject: bash: lines of a file in reverse order? In-Reply-To: <1156444149.3789.464.camel-bi+AKbBUZKY6gyzm1THtWbp2dZbC/Bob@public.gmane.org> References: <1156444149.3789.464.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: On Thu, 24 Aug 2006, Interlug wrote: > How do I return the contents of a file in reverse order, by line? > > I have > > Line 1 > Line 2 > Line 3 > > I want it to come back as > > Line 3 > Line 2 > Line 1 > > I was hoping tail -r would do it, but this appears to be a tail under > OSX thing. > http://www.ss64.com/osx/tail.html > > rev doesn't do it. > > $ rev < lines > 1 eniL > 2 eniL > 3 eniL Use tac: tac filename > I want to find the "last matching line" in a large log file. My hope > was: > > tail -50 -r filename | grep -m 1 "matching" > would grab it for me if it exists in the last 50 lines of the log. grep "PATTERN" filename | tail -n1 -- Chris F.A. Johnson =================================================================== Author: Shell Scripting Recipes: A Problem-Solution Approach (2005, Apress) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 22:43:16 2006 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 18:43:16 -0400 Subject: OT: Recommendations on e-mail providers? In-Reply-To: <20060824023029.f82rab2qlcgskcs8-eRF/mgt17vYuqM34mc2EBrDks+cytr/Z@public.gmane.org> References: <20060824023029.f82rab2qlcgskcs8@mail.math.yorku.ca> Message-ID: If you want POP3/SMTP maybe 295.ca? I've been using it for a couple of years. $2.95/month for pretty reliable dialup access (read: backup internet for all you highspeeders), and it gives you a POP e-mail address and webspace as well. Only downside is the SMTP uses only port 25, so make sure your other internet connections don't block it. Other than that I would second the recommendation of Gmail. It offers POP3/SMTP for free as well. -- If we wonder often, the gift of knowledge will come. -Arapaho -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 25 00:54:10 2006 From: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 20:54:10 -0400 (EDT) Subject: OT: Mac and PC Dealers Message-ID: <50044.207.188.67.34.1156467250.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> As we welcome MacHeads to the world o' Linux, we can expect some crossing of that great cultural divide. To help with this, I offer the following comparison of local dealers for the Mac and generic PC. Perhaps Tlugers can refine and add to this list. Mac Dealers Sales people in suits or other fashionable outfits Tasteful grey carpet Designer track lighting Descriptions in plastic stands Computers that look like wierd table lamps Museum/Art gallery ambience Food: not allowed Cultural influence: California Large prices PC Dealers Sales person in T shirt and sweatpants Linoleum (Old) Fluorescent lighting (may be flickering) Computers in boxes in large pile* Specifications on badly copied, cryptic sheet of paper Computers that all look the same (beige box) Basement ambience Food: Salesman is eating pizza Cultural influence: Hong Kong Low prices * At Canada Computes I was purchasing a PC laptop and had the model number. I asked the sales guy if I could see the unit. The answer: No. No explanation. Just: 'No'. That encapsulates the PC dealership experience. -- Peter Hiscocks Syscomp Electronic Design Limited, Toronto http://www.syscompdesign.com USB Oscilloscope and Waveform Generator 647-839-0325 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 25 03:22:56 2006 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 23:22:56 -0400 Subject: bash: lines of a file in reverse order? In-Reply-To: References: <1156444149.3789.464.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <44EE6D10.3020303@execulink.com> > Use tac: > > tac filename > >> I want to find the "last matching line" in a large log file. My hope >> was: >> >> tail -50 -r filename | grep -m 1 "matching" >> would grab it for me if it exists in the last 50 lines of the log. > > > grep "PATTERN" filename | tail -n1 > A #!/bin/bash grep "INVALID" /var/log/messages | tail -n1 time sh A Aug 24 15:52:22 localhost kernel: INVALID: IN=eth1 OUT= SRC=69.63.65.165 real 0m0.044s user 0m0.001s sys 0m0.015s B #!/bin/bash tail -50 /var/log/messages | tac | grep -m1 "INVALID" time sh B Aug 24 15:52:22 localhost kernel: INVALID: IN=eth1 OUT= SRC=69.63.65.165 real 0m0.048s user 0m0.004s sys 0m0.016s Yep, method A is 4 to 5 thou faster than B most of the time -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 25 03:13:06 2006 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Scott Elcomb) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 23:13:06 -0400 Subject: bash: lines of a file in reverse order? In-Reply-To: <44EE6D10.3020303-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ@public.gmane.org> References: <1156444149.3789.464.camel@localhost.localdomain> <44EE6D10.3020303@execulink.com> Message-ID: <99a6c38f0608242013q2ca9501fq171127fb7a6934f0@mail.gmail.com> On 8/24/06, Gregory D Hough wrote: > > Use tac: > > > > tac filename > > > >> I want to find the "last matching line" in a large log file. My hope > >> was: > >> > >> tail -50 -r filename | grep -m 1 "matching" > >> would grab it for me if it exists in the last 50 lines of the log. > > > > > > grep "PATTERN" filename | tail -n1 > > > A > #!/bin/bash > grep "INVALID" /var/log/messages | tail -n1 > > time sh A > Aug 24 15:52:22 localhost kernel: INVALID: IN=eth1 OUT= SRC=69.63.65.165 > > real 0m0.044s > user 0m0.001s > sys 0m0.015s > > > B > #!/bin/bash > tail -50 /var/log/messages | tac | grep -m1 "INVALID" > > time sh B > Aug 24 15:52:22 localhost kernel: INVALID: IN=eth1 OUT= SRC=69.63.65.165 > > real 0m0.048s > user 0m0.004s > sys 0m0.016s > > Yep, method A is 4 to 5 thou faster than B most of the time That's kinda cool. Might get more accuracy on the last statment if others' results were averaged in. Still, that's a really interesting test, thanks for the results. Is there a way to track memory usage during the same periods? -- Scott Elcomb http://atomos.sourceforge.net/ http://search.cpan.org/~selcomb/SAL-3.03/ http://psema4.googlepages.com/ "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jemcinto-cpI+UMyWUv+w5LPnMra/2Q at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 24 23:25:09 2006 From: jemcinto-cpI+UMyWUv+w5LPnMra/2Q at public.gmane.org (James McIntosh) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 23:25:09 Subject: bash: lines of a file in reverse order? In-Reply-To: <1156444149.3789.464.camel-bi+AKbBUZKY6gyzm1THtWbp2dZbC/Bob@public.gmane.org> References: <1156444149.3789.464.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <3.0.6.16.20060824232509.2e2f0a34@mail.look.ca> At 02:29 PM 2006/08/24 -0400, Interlug wrote: >How do I return the contents of a file in reverse order, by line? > >I have > >Line 1 >Line 2 >Line 3 > >I want it to come back as > >Line 3 >Line 2 >Line 1 > >I was hoping tail -r would do it, but this appears to be a tail under >OSX thing. >http://www.ss64.com/osx/tail.html > >rev doesn't do it. > >$ rev < lines >1 eniL >2 eniL >3 eniL > >I want to find the "last matching line" in a large log file. My hope >was: > >tail -50 -r filename | grep -m 1 "matching" >would grab it for me if it exists in the last 50 lines of the log. > >Surely this is being done elsewhere. Got a pointer? Yes. Do this in two stages. First find ALL matching lines, and pipe the results to the second stage. Second stage is to take the very last of the piped records, by using the programme 'tail'. This uses a larger temporary file than your proposed solution, but it would always work. Jim McIntosh -------------------------------------- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From michael.r.newman-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 25 06:20:33 2006 From: michael.r.newman-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Michael Newman) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 02:20:33 -0400 Subject: OT: Recommendations on e-mail providers? In-Reply-To: <20060824023029.f82rab2qlcgskcs8-eRF/mgt17vYuqM34mc2EBrDks+cytr/Z@public.gmane.org> References: <20060824023029.f82rab2qlcgskcs8@mail.math.yorku.ca> Message-ID: On 8/24/06, moliver-fC0AHe2n+mcIvw5+aKnW+Pd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org wrote: > Any recommendations for a good e-mail provider? Not interested in > pure web-based solutions like Hotmail; I want IMAP for sure, and ideally > encrypted IMAP (don't like sending my password in cleartext). Fastmail.fm, > runbox.com, others? Any experiences with any of these guys? TIA. I have to highly recommend FastMail. I bought a Member-level account a few years ago and it's never failed me. Having the ability to write and upload your own Sieve scripts lets you do some pretty interesting stuff. Also, the community is really amazing - check the Wiki and the forums if you haven't already. Mike P.S. Yep, I'm on Gmail ATM. I prefer it for mailing lists. :) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 25 14:35:07 2006 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 10:35:07 -0400 Subject: bash: lines of a file in reverse order? In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f0608242013q2ca9501fq171127fb7a6934f0-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <1156444149.3789.464.camel@localhost.localdomain> <44EE6D10.3020303@execulink.com> <99a6c38f0608242013q2ca9501fq171127fb7a6934f0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <44EF0A9B.40703@execulink.com> Scott Elcomb wrote: > On 8/24/06, Gregory D Hough wrote: > >> > Use tac: >> > >> > tac filename >> > >> >> I want to find the "last matching line" in a large log file. My hope >> >> was: >> >> >> >> tail -50 -r filename | grep -m 1 "matching" >> >> would grab it for me if it exists in the last 50 lines of the log. >> > >> > >> > grep "PATTERN" filename | tail -n1 >> > >> A >> #!/bin/bash >> grep "INVALID" /var/log/messages | tail -n1 >> >> time sh A >> Aug 24 15:52:22 localhost kernel: INVALID: IN=eth1 OUT= SRC=69.63.65.165 >> >> real 0m0.044s >> user 0m0.001s >> sys 0m0.015s >> >> >> B >> #!/bin/bash >> tail -50 /var/log/messages | tac | grep -m1 "INVALID" >> >> time sh B >> Aug 24 15:52:22 localhost kernel: INVALID: IN=eth1 OUT= SRC=69.63.65.165 >> >> real 0m0.048s >> user 0m0.004s >> sys 0m0.016s >> >> Yep, method A is 4 to 5 thou faster than B most of the time > > > That's kinda cool. Might get more accuracy on the last statment if > others' results were averaged in. > > Still, that's a really interesting test, thanks for the results. Is > there a way to track memory usage during the same periods? > Yes but my time is wasted and the env is a tally whacker. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 25 15:45:30 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 11:45:30 -0400 (EDT) Subject: OT: Mac and PC Dealers In-Reply-To: <50044.207.188.67.34.1156467250.squirrel-2RFepEojUI2DznVbVsZi4adLQS1dU2Lr@public.gmane.org> References: <50044.207.188.67.34.1156467250.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> Message-ID: <20060825154530.33316.qmail@web88208.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org wrote: > As we welcome MacHeads to the world o' Linux, we can > expect some crossing > of that great cultural divide. To help with this, I > offer the following > comparison of local dealers for the Mac and generic > PC. Perhaps Tlugers > can refine and add to this list. > > Mac Dealers > Sales people in suits or other fashionable > outfits > Tasteful grey carpet > Designer track lighting > Descriptions in plastic stands > Computers that look like wierd table lamps > Museum/Art gallery ambience > Food: not allowed > Cultural influence: California > Large prices > > PC Dealers > Sales person in T shirt and sweatpants > Linoleum (Old) > Fluorescent lighting (may be flickering) > Computers in boxes in large pile* > Specifications on badly copied, cryptic sheet of > paper > Computers that all look the same (beige box) > Basement ambience > Food: Salesman is eating pizza > Cultural influence: Hong Kong > Low prices > > * At Canada Computes I was purchasing a PC laptop > and had the model > number. I asked the sales guy if I could see the > unit. The answer: No. No > explanation. Just: 'No'. That encapsulates the PC > dealership experience. Dead on for the Mac stores I've seen and my favourite PC dealers (i.e.: most of the PC dealers near College and Spadina). Still, there is another type of PC dealer, the TigerDirect/FutureShop type place that has the following characteristics: PC Pretender Dealers Sales persons in uniform golf shirts and sweatpants Linoleum (New) Fluorescent lighting (working perfectly) Computers on heavy duty shelves Uninformative specs on neat little cards under PC Computers are beige boxes, or ex-beige boxes after a run in with a hot rod car builder Warehouse ambiance Food: Not allowed. Cultural influence: Walmart High prices on PCs, good prices on some peripherals -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 25 16:15:10 2006 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy Ali) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 12:15:10 -0400 Subject: OT: Recommendations on e-mail providers? In-Reply-To: <20060824023029.f82rab2qlcgskcs8-eRF/mgt17vYuqM34mc2EBrDks+cytr/Z@public.gmane.org> References: <20060824023029.f82rab2qlcgskcs8@mail.math.yorku.ca> Message-ID: <1e55af990608250915p20fdc717n738c60276de80947@mail.gmail.com> Gmail really is quite good.. A while back, Adam Megacz[1] made a gmail-to-imap proxy[2] .. but it looks like it exercised its right to vanish. =/ [1] http://www.megacz.com [2] http://groups.google.com/group/comp.mail.imap/msg/18951660c901464d?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 25 16:48:56 2006 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 12:48:56 -0400 Subject: OT: Mac and PC Dealers In-Reply-To: <50044.207.188.67.34.1156467250.squirrel-2RFepEojUI2DznVbVsZi4adLQS1dU2Lr@public.gmane.org> References: <50044.207.188.67.34.1156467250.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> Message-ID: <20060825164856.GA16583@wp.magstar.net> On Thu, Aug 24, 2006 at 08:54:10PM -0400, phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org wrote: > * At Canada Computes I was purchasing a PC laptop and had the model > number. I asked the sales guy if I could see the unit. The answer: No. > No explanation. Just: 'No'. That encapsulates the PC dealership > experience. Yes, I also find that Canada Computer's people-skill lacking. That's why I don't buy from there, unless it's < $10 which is my cost of gas going to other place. But, consider the people you're dealing with. It's low paying job for people with very little education. That's true for any front-line sales, and most definitely true where margin is low and they have to rely on volume. -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 25 17:47:50 2006 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 17:47:50 +0000 Subject: OT: Mac and PC Dealers In-Reply-To: <20060825164856.GA16583-SBOj+Tp9hCvc29vQ/UIUOA@public.gmane.org> References: <50044.207.188.67.34.1156467250.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> <20060825164856.GA16583@wp.magstar.net> Message-ID: On 8/25/06, William Park wrote: > On Thu, Aug 24, 2006 at 08:54:10PM -0400, phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org wrote: > > * At Canada Computes I was purchasing a PC laptop and had the model > > number. I asked the sales guy if I could see the unit. The answer: No. > > No explanation. Just: 'No'. That encapsulates the PC dealership > > experience. > > Yes, I also find that Canada Computer's people-skill lacking. That's > why I don't buy from there, unless it's < $10 which is my cost of gas > going to other place. If you don't know what you're looking for, it's a bad place to go. If you do, they're often fairly much the cheapest vendor. > But, consider the people you're dealing with. It's low paying job for > people with very little education. That's true for any front-line > sales, and most definitely true where margin is low and they have to > rely on volume. Yeah, people seem not to get that these aren't computer *service* stores. Further, it's something of a mistake to think that they have much if any competence in computing. It is more useful to think of them as a place to buy boxes that (by some useful coincidence) happen to contain computer components. The same is true at Future Shop, Best Buy, and such; they are in the business of selling boxes containing prepackaged bits of technology, whether that be computers, video game consoles, plasma TVs, or washing machines. Information not in the product catalogue tends to be beyond them... If you actually want knowledge and competence, then you have to be prepared to pay Apple style premiums. And it seems to me that Apple has pretty much sewn up the "willing to pay extra for real support" portion of the consumer market. People don't seem interested in paying an extra $500 to have supported Linux systems... -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html Oddly enough, this is completely standard behaviour for shells. This is a roundabout way of saying `don't use combined chains of `&&'s and `||'s unless you think G?del's theorem is for sissies'. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 25 23:21:58 2006 From: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 19:21:58 -0400 (EDT) Subject: OT: Mac and PC Dealers In-Reply-To: References: <50044.207.188.67.34.1156467250.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> <20060825164856.GA16583@wp.magstar.net> Message-ID: <50904.207.188.67.34.1156548118.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> >> Yes, I also find that Canada Computer's people-skill lacking. That's >> why I don't buy from there, unless it's < $10 which is my cost of gas >> going to other place. > > If you don't know what you're looking for, it's a bad place to go. If > you do, they're often fairly much the cheapest vendor. > >> But, consider the people you're dealing with. It's low paying job for >> people with very little education. That's true for any front-line >> sales, and most definitely true where margin is low and they have to >> rely on volume. > > Yeah, people seem not to get that these aren't computer *service* stores. > > Further, it's something of a mistake to think that they have much if > any competence in computing. It is more useful to think of them as a > place to buy boxes that (by some useful coincidence) happen to contain > computer components. > In fairness to Canada Computers, a non-wizard friend of mine found that they were quite patient and helpful in answering his questions. Peter > The same is true at Future Shop, Best Buy, and such; they are in the > business of selling boxes containing prepackaged bits of technology, > whether that be computers, video game consoles, plasma TVs, or washing > machines. Information not in the product catalogue tends to be beyond > them... > > -- Peter Hiscocks Syscomp Electronic Design Limited, Toronto http://www.syscompdesign.com USB Oscilloscope and Waveform Generator 647-839-0325 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 26 00:35:30 2006 From: mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Merv Curley) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 20:35:30 -0400 Subject: Printing - Kanotix [Debian] In-Reply-To: <44EE10D2.8040106-6MMemSSbUSjVkXrxgXmPHQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200608241409.21676.mervc@eol.ca> <44EE10D2.8040106@centripetal.ca> Message-ID: <200608252035.30839.mervc@eol.ca> On Thursday 24 August 2006 16:49, Dieter Limeback wrote: > I'm not sure about Debian and Kanotix, but I did need to make a small > change on my Ubuntu system -- administration via the web interface is > disabled by default because it would require the CUPS daemon to be able > to read to /etc/shadow. I had to put the cupsys user into the shadow > group (as root) with > > # adduser cupsys shadow > I had Kubuntu installed to look at, but hadn't configured a printer. I did that and sure enough, the test page printed ok but nothing is getting printed. It is slightly different, the jobs just disappear, I don't see them in the job list. I tried your suggestion, and it made no difference. Time to post on the Kanotix Forum, after a big flurry of printing posts back in July nothing lately so I'm the only one??? We'll see. Thanks for the suggestion. -- Merv Curley Toronto, Ont. Can Kanotix Linux Ver 2005-4 Desktop KDE 3.5.1 KMail 1.2 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 26 00:40:09 2006 From: mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Merv Curley) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 20:40:09 -0400 Subject: Printing - Kanotix [Debian] In-Reply-To: References: <200608241409.21676.mervc@eol.ca> Message-ID: <200608252040.09792.mervc@eol.ca> On Thursday 24 August 2006 16:04, Jamon Camisso wrote: > > It's got to be more than just Kanotix, Ubuntu has problems -- it seems > related to an upgrade to cups a while back. Regardless... Try > configuring cups though the web interface: http:://localhost:631 > Tried that, didn't help. I added root and me as allowed users, no change. I'll remove - purge cupsys and start over. Maybe I should have done that first. -- Merv Curley Toronto, Ont. Can Kanotix Linux Ver 2005-4 Desktop KDE 3.5.1 KMail 1.2 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 26 00:50:04 2006 From: mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Merv Curley) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 20:50:04 -0400 Subject: OT: Mac and PC Dealers In-Reply-To: <50904.207.188.67.34.1156548118.squirrel-2RFepEojUI2DznVbVsZi4adLQS1dU2Lr@public.gmane.org> References: <50044.207.188.67.34.1156467250.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> <50904.207.188.67.34.1156548118.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> Message-ID: <200608252050.04204.mervc@eol.ca> On Friday 25 August 2006 19:21, phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org wrote: > > In fairness to Canada Computers, a non-wizard friend of mine found that > they were quite patient and helpful in answering his questions. > I have been dealing with the Scarborough Store for quite a few years and it has never changed, But a new system I put together a while back didn't work so back to the store. Sure enough a Chinese XP, CD went in and the bios was updated for me. Over the years the staff come and go regularly but I have exchanged MB's without question on two occasions. The same for their cheapo power supplies after a few months of use.. I have been happy with the money I have saved. -- Merv Curley Toronto, Ont. Can Kanotix Linux Ver 2005-4 Desktop KDE 3.5.1 KMail 1.2 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 26 01:13:18 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 21:13:18 -0400 Subject: no Linux in the park ? Message-ID: <44EFA02E.4000108@rogers.com> Looks like the weather is going to be bad. So would LIP be cancelled? Was looking forward to it and had told quite a few other people to come. Kush -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 26 01:27:57 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 21:27:57 -0400 Subject: OT: Mac and PC Dealers In-Reply-To: <50044.207.188.67.34.1156467250.squirrel-2RFepEojUI2DznVbVsZi4adLQS1dU2Lr@public.gmane.org> References: <50044.207.188.67.34.1156467250.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> Message-ID: <44EFA39D.6090607@telly.org> phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org wrote: >As we welcome MacHeads to the world o' Linux, we can expect some crossing >of that great cultural divide. To help with this, I offer the following >comparison of local dealers for the Mac and generic PC. Perhaps Tlugers >can refine and add to this list. > > After three weeks of training, my son (www.braden.ca) starts a permanent part-time gig at the Yorkdale Apple store next week. >Mac Dealers > Sales people in suits or other fashionable outfits > > FWIW: Nobody in the Mac Store wears a suit. In fact, grunge is practically encouraged; maybe that's what you mean by 'fashionable'. Braden customarily wears cargo pants and jeans as part of the store 'uniform'. Baseball caps are allowed as long as they have either no logo or the Apple logo (a rarity, the Apple baseball hats are only available at the company store in Silicon Valley and not sold online). OTOH, he will have his own business cards... >PC Dealers > > Now, let's be fair. Somebody wanting track lighting and reasonably-groomed PC salespeople doesn't need to look hard. Best Buy, Future Shop, The Sony Store, the Source, department stores, and the growing number of Dell mall kiosks offer all the slick a PC buyer might want. The point you're making is that the PC buyer has the _option_ of the grunge stores whereas the Mac buyer (or, for that matter, the Sun or Playstation buyer) generally does not. Indeed, the PC buyer has alternatives that are neither slick _nor_ grunge, such as Costco or Staples. >* At Canada Computes I was purchasing a PC laptop and had the model number. I asked the sales guy if I could see the unit. The answer: No. No explanation. Just: 'No'. That encapsulates the PC dealership experience. > > Come on. Most people don't get their PCs from Canada Computes; Dells, HPs and Lenovos aren't sold that way. Those people who take the path of the "College&Spadina" stores (which is more mindset than location) are generally enthusiasts who know what they want. Non-enthusiasts who buy whiteboxes generally get them from others who know what they're doing -- an enthusiast friend/relative or VARs (who often turn to wholesale whitebox-builders such as Supercom or ECS). From the perspective here, the big advantage of whitebox builders is that they can easily give you a box without forcing you to buy a Windows license. One interesting retail hybrid is CompuSmart. The location I know (Mavis just south of Britannia in Mississauga) has tasteful grey carpeting and a nice selection of name-brand pre-builts -- but it also has an enthusiasts'/components section along one wall where you can hand-pick the ultimate games box (complete with case cutouts and neon insides) or a cute Shuttle cube; you can just get the parts cash-and-carry or for a few bucks they'll assemble it all for ya. - Evan PS: Personally, I've had extremely good service at the Canada Computer location on Yonge north of Finch. The person was very helpful _and_ "let me look at the unit". -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ivan.frey-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 26 01:34:48 2006 From: ivan.frey-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Ivan Avery Frey) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 21:34:48 -0400 Subject: no Linux in the park ? In-Reply-To: <44EFA02E.4000108-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44EFA02E.4000108@rogers.com> Message-ID: <44EFA538.80302@utoronto.ca> The 3:30pm forecast is predicting a 30% chance of showers late in the day. http://www.weatheroffice.ec.gc.ca/city/pages/on-143_metric_e.html Ivan. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 26 01:42:40 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 21:42:40 -0400 Subject: OT: Mac and PC Dealers In-Reply-To: <200608252050.04204.mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <50044.207.188.67.34.1156467250.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> <50904.207.188.67.34.1156548118.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> <200608252050.04204.mervc@eol.ca> Message-ID: <44EFA710.9050901@telly.org> Merv Curley wrote: >I have been dealing with the Scarborough Store for quite a few years and it has never changed, But a new system I put together a while back didn't work so back to the store. Sure enough a Chinese XP, CD went in and the bios was updated for me. Over the years the staff come and go regularly but I have exchanged MB's without question on two occasions. The same for their cheapo power supplies after a few months of use.. I have been happy with the money I have saved. > > I would go to a store like that for the very opposite reason -- to get not-cheap components. If it's cheap you want, buy Dell. I go into a Canada Computer site wanting a specific case (pre-installed with its top-rated quiet, two-fan power supply), the motherboard for the CPU I want that rated best at Tom's Hardware, and suitable peripherals. For many components such as CPU, RAM and hard disks, there's a shifting "sweet spot" of the best bang-for-buck, and the person in the store is usually helpful at finding out where that sweet spot is at any given moment for each of the parts. (Mind you, it's easy enough to figure that out by looking at their online inventory -- for example http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.php?do=ShowProduct&cmd=pd&pid=007291&cid=CS.664 even tells you how many of the alive Antec cases they have in each location.) And often they will be candid and helpful in their suggestions for small-but-significant bits such as optical drives and CPU fans. - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 26 02:02:08 2006 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 22:02:08 -0400 Subject: no Linux in the park ? In-Reply-To: <44EFA02E.4000108-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44EFA02E.4000108@rogers.com> Message-ID: On 8/25/06, Kush wrote: > > Looks like the weather is going to be bad. So would LIP be cancelled? > I think a full cancell, at this point, is a bad idea. The word has gone out to a lot of folks, many of whom would not get the message in time to alter their plans. If it's all rainy and gross, we can crowd into the caffe and carry on. I'm working on some tarps, in case folks still want to do a swap meet, the GPG fellahs, and CC salon and Wireless Toronto types can still do their thing indoors. It may be a bit soggy for a picnic, but I'll cook up something special (we've already got a big pot of chili on) and I can (and will) screen RevolutionOS (and maybe CodeBreakers) inside. Was looking forward to it and had told quite a few other people to come. > I'm still looking forward to it. There's nothing we can do about the weather, and maybe it /won't/ rain, but that shouldn't stop us from having a good time ! PS, I have a BIG unveiling for you all, something just created, that we can have fun with for the next coupla years ! djp -- djp-tnsZcVQxgqO2dHQpreyxbg at public.gmane.org www.linuxcaffe.ca 326 Harbord Street, Toronto, M6G 3A5, (416) 534-2116 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 26 03:05:02 2006 From: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 23:05:02 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Open Instrumentation Project, Update Message-ID: <50912.207.188.67.34.1156561502.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> Here is an update on the Open Instrumentation Project, which was the subject of a presentation to TLUG a few months ago. That was fun to do, and gave us some useful feedback. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ The Open Instrumentation Project (OIP) supports open-source software and low cost hardware for electronic instrumentation. The objective is to make electronic instrumentation readily accessible to students, hobbiests, engineers and scientists. This then allows independent circuit development and project-based learning in electronics. Three instruments have been completed: - dual channel, 20MSample/sec oscilloscope - 100kHz waveform generator - low-frequency vector-network analyser Screen shots and the software for these instruments are available from sourceforge at: http://sourceforge.net/projects/oip/ The software is licensed under the GPL (Thanks to Bob Findlay for help and encouragement with Sourceforge). Low-cost hardware using this software is available from Syscomp Electronic Design: http://www.syscompdesign.com/ The software uses the Tcl/Tk language without extensions, which makes it simple to install and maintain. The current cross-platform implementation runs under Windows and Linux operating systems. We are currently testing the Mac OS-X version. (Helpful input recently from Seneca Cunningham on that project.) Tcl/Tk is a scripting language that is interpreted text. It is simple for non-experts to add features to the graphical user interface. The hardware uses the USB interface with drivers and hardware that emulate a high-speed serial port, which simplifies programming. No USB programming is required. The Windows and Mac drivers are available from FTDI at http://www.ftdichip.com/ Linux drivers are available in the Linux kernel from version 2.4 onward. Invitation ---------- The current releases of software provide basic features for the instruments, but there are many that could be added. For example, the oscilloscope would benefit from 'waveform math' commands. The waveform generator could be configured as an audio sweep generator. Contributions are welcome and will be shared with the user community. -- Peter Hiscocks Syscomp Electronic Design Limited, Toronto http://www.syscompdesign.com USB Oscilloscope and Waveform Generator 647-839-0325 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 26 14:11:56 2006 From: caitken-Bm8TULXj0r/3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Chris Aitken) Date: Sat, 26 Aug 2006 10:11:56 -0400 Subject: psc but no scan app? In-Reply-To: <44EA6778.30907-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg@public.gmane.org> References: <44EA1E6C.9040709@vianet.ca> <44EA2C30.1010000@execulink.com> <44EA6193.2020500@vianet.ca> <44EA6778.30907@telly.org> Message-ID: <44F056AC.3050906@vianet.ca> Forgive my top-post. I thought it would be appropriate as I don't want you to read all that's been done (with an eye to helping me) as I'm putting a hold on this troubleshoot (getting scanning function of hp psc 1610 to work) for a couple of weeks. I'm creating a music CD and wanted a scan of a photograph for the cover. I'm going to just use clip art for now. For me (though maybe not others) this will be a big troubleshoot. I have to concentrate on getting the instrument tracks and a final mix now - the graphics is secondary. However, don't be surprised to see me pick up this thread in a couple of weeks. I *will* get back to it. Thanks for the help so far. And thanks to everyone for your help over the years. I love linux. I run my business (music lessons) and passion (recording music I compose) on it. I am able to get linux to do what I need (eventually) but I'm not sure I'll ever have enough knowledge to give much back to the list members. Whenever I *can* offer an easy reply (like 'gaim works well for MSN') somebody beats me to the punch. So, I take, have little to give, but am grateful, and happier for your help. Chris Evan Leibovitch wrote: > Chris Aitken wrote: > >> [chris at p733 chris]$ sane-find-scanner >> > [...] > >> found USB scanner (vendor=0x03f0, product=0x4811) at libusb:001:002 >> # Your USB scanner was (probably) detected. It may or may not be >> supported by >> # SANE. Try scanimage -L and read the backend's manpage. > > > The good news is that sane can see the hardware but isn't sure what > driver to use. > > The other good news is that HP says that scanning is supported on this > model according to > http://hplip.sourceforge.net/supported_devices/inkjet_aio.html > > The FAQ at http://hplip.sourceforge.net/faqs.html states that > "HPLIP should support all SANE front-end applications. We have tested > scanning with xsane, xscanimage, and kooka." > > So what this means is that you need hplip installed (which you > probably need, to support printing from the device anyway). That will > provide the "hpaio" driver needed by SANE. > > Make sure the line "hpaio" appears in /etc/sane/dll.conf and is not > commented out. > > There's a troubleshooting page at > http://hplip.sourceforge.net/troubleshooting/scanning.html that may > provide some help. > > - Evan > > PS: A very slick-looking diagram of the HP/Sane acrhitecture can be > found at > http://hpoj.sourceforge.net/doc/arch/scanning.png > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 26 16:26:26 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Sat, 26 Aug 2006 12:26:26 -0400 Subject: Linux may lose its chance of competing with Microsoft after the 64bit revolution gets underway Message-ID: <44F07632.4080900@rogers.com> This is a sobering scenario. Kush Eric Raymond on desktop *Linux* Desktop Linux - USA Analysis -- Eric S. Raymond is one of the founders of open-source, and a good deal of *Linux's* early popularity came from his non-stop beating of the drum for *...* *Linux* Guru: Desktop Window Closing Red Herring - CA,USA Eric Raymond on winning over the iPod generation, why *Linux* advocates don't have much time to beat Microsoft, and the need for open source to conquer hearts *...* -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From zleap-Tp5KeRqLOeNeoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 26 22:44:50 2006 From: zleap-Tp5KeRqLOeNeoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (paul sutton) Date: Sat, 26 Aug 2006 22:44:50 +0000 Subject: New ubuntu install freezes on boot on IBM T21 laptop In-Reply-To: <44EA69C7.7060703-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44E9FC12.9000206@rogers.com> <20060821191358.GA12048@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <44EA69C7.7060703@rogers.com> Message-ID: <44F0CEE2.9000908@zleap.net> Hi I have a t22 and kanotix (debian sid) works great (thanks to Kush again btw for the cd), the t22 has 256 mb ram, I am running kde nicely I can even run open office from kde (i mean load openoffice from kde menus), it also works great with my smc wireless network card, I think debian is a very worthwhile distro, so it may be worth investigating that, as an alternative to ubuntu which I guess is more geared up for the later hardware, in terms of ram, requirements, even though if kde works on my computer than it should work with any distro, and a similar amount of ram, I am guessing though, Paul Kush wrote: > if the t21 has ram below 512mb, ubuntu/kubuntu/edubuntu will > definitely give problems. From what i have read about the t21 at > epinions.com, it is a 128mb machine. > > Kush > > William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: > >> On Mon, Aug 21, 2006 at 02:31:46PM -0400, James Knott wrote: >> >> >>> Alex Maynard wrote: >>> >>> >>>> Hi All: >>>> >>>> Just wondering if anyone has any thoughts on a problem I've been >>>> having >>>> with IBM T21 laptop? >>>> >>>> I installed a new kubuntu disk on my laptop. At first it worked >>>> well. But >>>> about a day later it started going blank halfway through reboot and >>>> kept >>>> doing this. So essentially I couldn't boot from the hard drive. >>>> >>>> Later I reinstalled ubuntu and the same thing happened. I used >>>> to have the same laptop working using libranet but they went out of >>>> business and my CDs from them are too far out of date to update >>>> without >>>> dependency problems. >>>> >>>> The only thing I can think of to do now is to try a differerent >>>> distribution (any suggestions?), but I thought I would run this by >>>> you to see what other suggestions you might have. >>>> >>> >>> SUSE has good ThinkPad support. >>> >> >> >> It is probably not a distro problem, but that some aspect of hardware is >> misconfigured and balking the boot. Can you report the place in the >> boot process that the "blanking" happens? If the screen is going blank >> I would think it'd be a power management setting that's barfing, but it >> could be a range of things. >> >> Debian also has good ThinkPad support, but I don't think that that's the >> actual issue. >> > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From zleap-Tp5KeRqLOeNeoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 26 22:53:32 2006 From: zleap-Tp5KeRqLOeNeoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (paul sutton) Date: Sat, 26 Aug 2006 22:53:32 +0000 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: <20060822045558.GA27663-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060815040804.GA14384@waltdnes.org> <20060815131953.GH13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44E86DD6.50306@utoronto.ca> <1156168809.30331.230.camel@stan64.site> <20060821152316.GA592@PyBook.local> <44E9E58A.80101@telly.org> <44E99FEB.3050404@utoronto.ca> <20060822045558.GA27663@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <44F0D0EC.3050404@zleap.net> that would be really useful, i get a popup up even when running mozilla firefox, oddly the popup window is MSIE, and thats on LInux, agghh, i just close em down but popups are irritating as you say. Paul >>} >> >>The primary benefit to having something that "ate" Flash would be if >>it made the irritating popup dialog boxes go away... >> >> > > https://addons.mozilla.org/firefox/433/ the "Flashblock" add-on for >Firefox. Blocks Flash by default, requiring you to click on a button >(*NOT* a popup) to play the Flash. It also has a whitelist, so that you >can allow http://video.google.com etc. > > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jvetterli-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 27 03:38:17 2006 From: jvetterli-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org (John Vetterli) Date: Sat, 26 Aug 2006 23:38:17 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Linux in the Park aftermath Message-ID: I just want to thank the people who put together today's linux in the park. Unfortunately I had to sneak away early, but it was still good to get out and put some faces to the names. You can see my photos of the inflatable penguin at http://www.flickr.com/photos/jvetterli/tags/tlug/ . BTW, Linuxcaffe makes excellent panini. JV -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 27 03:51:46 2006 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Sat, 26 Aug 2006 23:51:46 -0400 Subject: Linux in the Park aftermath In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 8/26/06, John Vetterli wrote: > > I just want to thank the people who put together today's linux in the > park. I second that ! Thanks Jamon, Colin and tout la gang ! Unfortunately I had to sneak away early, but it was still good to > get out and put some faces to the names. You can see my photos of the > inflatable penguin at http://www.flickr.com/photos/jvetterli/tags/tlug/ . Can I ask everybody who took, and wants to post, photos, to put 'em on Flikr, with a "linuxcaffe" tag ? BTW, Linuxcaffe makes excellent panini. why yes, yes we do ! ;-) -- djp-tnsZcVQxgqO2dHQpreyxbg at public.gmane.org www.linuxcaffe.ca 326 Harbord Street, Toronto, M6G 3A5, (416) 534-2116 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 26 23:34:29 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 00:34:29 +0100 Subject: Linux in the Park aftermath In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <44F0DA85.6000003@utoronto.ca> David J Patrick wrote: > On 8/26/06, *John Vetterli* > wrote: > > I just want to thank the people who put together today's linux in the > park. > > > I second that ! Thanks Jamon, Colin and tout la gang ! > > Unfortunately I had to sneak away early, but it was still good to > get out and put some faces to the names. You can see my photos of the > inflatable penguin at > http://www.flickr.com/photos/jvetterli/tags/tlug/ . > > > Can I ask everybody who took, and wants to post, photos, to put 'em on > Flikr, with a "linuxcaffe" tag ? It's no photo, but what self-respecting LUG could exist without a proper 80x15 banner with which to stick on various forums, wikis, CMS's, personal sites, etc. etc.? Have a look here, tell me what (if anything?) needs doing. Tux himself is a little hard to scale down to anything smaller than 16x16. http://www.jamonation.com/gtalug+button Jamon -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From dwarmstrong-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 27 06:07:46 2006 From: dwarmstrong-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Daniel Armstrong) Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 02:07:46 -0400 Subject: Linux in the Park aftermath In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <61e9e2b10608262307i5a715c81x549acdcfabe1fa6d@mail.gmail.com> On 8/26/06, David J Patrick wrote: > On 8/26/06, John Vetterli wrote: > > > I just want to thank the people who put together today's linux in the > > park. > > > I second that ! Thanks Jamon, Colin and tout la gang ! > Yes... thanks for the organizing efforts... the BBC 'Codebreakers' video was interesting, and the giant Tuxmade it *very* easy to find the GTALUG gathering in the park... :-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:09:58 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:09:58 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: <20060814135659.GA9159-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823100931.01e186b8@misconsult.com> Could you please remove my email address from your mailing list Thank you At 09:56 AM 8/14/2006 -0400, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: >My wife's computer was in the shop this past week (the motherboard went >blooey) and she's been logging into my Linux desktop with an account of >her own. Well, it should surprise no one here, but she'd like to >switch, and "just have Windows once in a while, for some software". I >explained dual booting and virtualization as a couple of choices, and >she's decided that she wants to dual boot. > >I am terribly pleased, but I want it to go well, so I thought I'd ask >here for any gotchas on running Linux on the AMD64 architecture. I've >heard a few things, like Firefox having to run in 32-bit mode (or is >that just Flash? I don't remember) but I don't know how you'd set >something like this up. > >I plan to use Debian, because that's what I use and I know it best, and >so I'd love to hear any advice about getting that set up so she >experiences minimal disruption - the whole point of running Linux for >her is that it's easier, more flexible and more secure, so if it's a big >hassle she'll go back to what she knows. > >Thanks. >-- > >yours, > >William > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:25:38 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:25:38 -0400 Subject: Any decent computer book stores in GTA? In-Reply-To: <44DFA075.3060908-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg@public.gmane.org> References: <44DF975F.3030900@rogers.com> <44DF975F.3030900@rogers.com> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823102537.047a9b68@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 05:58 PM 8/13/2006 -0400, you wrote: >James Knott wrote: > >>This afternoon, I dropped into the local Chapters and was appalled at >>how much the technical book section had been decimated, since I last >>visited a couple of weeks ago. They're really dumbed down what used to >>be a good selection. Is there any decent technical book store left? >> >> >I wonder if these days the good stuff is all online, leaving only >consumer-ish titles (dummies' series, or the books that look like good >value because they're 900 pages) on store shelves. > >I did a little looking on Indigo's website for some stuff recently. I >found that many of the better-reviewed books I was looking for are >available to ship immediately, but the only store that seemed to have >any stock was the one next to (not inside) Square One. In Toronto, >World's Biggest should be better, but that doesn't mean it _is_ better. > >Then again, that's all Chapters/Indigo/Coles. The only major competition >seems to be Amazon. > >Of course, come September the bookstores at York, Ryerson and UofT will >have lots of stock too. > >Also, try >http://www.abebooks.com/home/BMV/ > > >- Evan > >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:33:26 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:33:26 -0400 Subject: ipt_recent Time Format In-Reply-To: References: <44DE03C6.4060307@execulink.com> <44DE03C6.4060307@execulink.com> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823103324.01e3b6f8@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 09:12 PM 8/13/2006 -0400, you wrote: >On Sat, 12 Aug 2006, Gregory D Hough wrote: > >> Tluggers, >> >> Is anyone familiar with NetFilter's timestamps? This is what they typically >> look like: >> >> [root at localhost ~]# cat /proc/net/ipt_recent/ZW | grep '69\.63\.21\.188' >> src=69.63.21.188 ttl: 32 last_seen: 2484808297 oldest_pkt: 1 last_pkts: >> 2484808297 >> >> And from the log I know the time it was last_seen three days ago: >> >> [root at localhost ~]# grep SYNYSTR-RESET /var/log/messages | grep >> '69\.63\.21\.188' >> Aug 9 00:24:18 localhost kernel: SYNYSTR-RESET: IN=eth1 OUT= >> SRC=69.63.21.188 DST=192.168.1.251 LEN=64 TOS=0x00 PREC=0x00 TTL=32 ID=19088 >> DF PROTO=TCP SPT=2930 DPT=445 WINDOW=53760 RES=0x00 SYN URGP=0 >> >> "Aug 9 00:24:18" && 2484808297 are true somehow > > In seconds since the epoch that date is: > >$ date -d "Aug 9 00:24:18" +%s >1155097458 > > Get a second date and its equivalent to find the relationship. > >> I'm primarily interested in last_seen. I need a clean-up script which >removes >> an IP's record after a certain period of inactivity and I don't know how to >> work with that value. Naturally if I can get the current time in the correct >> format I can work with that value. I suspect it is microseconds since the >> module was (re)loaded. >> >> How do I use date or time or whatever to read in the current value of NOW in >> this format? > > The date man page lists all the formatting characters, e.g.: > >now=$( date "+%b %d %H:%M:%S" ) > > The same format characters can also be used with the dynamically > loadable bash built-in command strftime. See > . > >-- > Chris F.A. Johnson > =================================================================== > Author: > Shell Scripting Recipes: A Problem-Solution Approach (2005, Apress) >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:33:48 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:33:48 -0400 Subject: usb to ttyS0 mapping issues -and wvdial configuration In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4.1.20060823103346.047da0d0@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 07:19 PM 8/21/2006 +0300, you wrote: > > Hi all, > I am tryiing to set up an Acer (Aspire 3610 model) laptop for dial up. The > laptop don't have one of the most handy interface namely serial port. To > connect to a serial port, one has to use a usb to serial cable and I find > that very un-ideal. (Why the heck leave out a serial port and then turn > around and start selling usb to serial cables?). Beside financial > implication, I can't now figure out how to map ppp connection on. The first 4 > ttyS* port looks like this to setserial > linux:/home/William # setserial -a /dev/ttyS0 > /dev/ttyS0, Line 0, UART: unknown, Port: 0x03f8, IRQ: 4 > Baud_base: 115200, close_delay: 50, divisor: 0 > closing_wait: 3000 > Flags: spd_normal skip_test > > What I don't like is the lack of UART. What is the implication of above? > I thought of mapping it to the USB device, but that even look worse to > setserial > linux:/home/wambugu # setserial -a /dev/usbdev2.1 > Cannot get serial info: Inappropriate ioctl for device > Okay, one last shot I gave it one more shot > linux:/home/William # wvdialconf /home/William/Desktop/wvdial1.txt > Scanning your serial ports for a modem. > > Port Scan<*1>: S0 S1 S2 S3 > > > Sorry, no modem was detected! Is it in use by another program? > Did you configure it properly with setserial? > > From the above queries, I decided to map modem to /dev/ttyS0. I also gave > /dev/ttyS1 a shot with no success > Now I hope that is enough information about the laptop. I believe some > information about where the serial cable terminate would be important. It > connects to a Huawei ETS2577 handset. The handset connect to the ISP through > Qualcomm 3G CDMA wireless technology. I am also really hoping that UART will > be inside this phone set, but I aren't sure of that.I believe this is > sufficient information, but would happly suppiy more information is needed. > Now, how can I make this setup work? I have been using wvdial and below is > its configuration > [Dialer Defaults] > Modem = /dev/ttyS0 > Baud = 115200 > Init1 = ATZ > Init2 = ATQ0 V1 E1 S0=0 &C1 &D2 > Init3 = > Area Code = > Phone = 777 > Username = some_name > Password = some_password > Ask Password = 0 > Dial Command = ATDT > Stupid Mode = 1 > Compuserve = 0 > Force Address = > Idle Seconds = 300 > DialMessage1 = > DialMessage2 = > ISDN = 0 > Auto DNS = 1 > Now, is there anything that I could have done wrong?.And does wvdial use > /etc/ppp/chap-secrets file? What is the sure way of knowing that you are > mapping an application to the right /dev? The link between the handset and > ISP is fne for sure since I can make phone calls from the handset, so the > issue has to be wvdial configuration and the ttyS0 interface. Oh, and my ISP > is hostile to Linux, so I don't expect much help from them. > > Thanks a lot in advance > William -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:24:48 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:24:48 -0400 Subject: 32 bit vs 64 bit In-Reply-To: <20060820192949.GA9301-Xa+LbO3DC1G2Q0qicKDiVp4VBq8PJc8F@public.gmane.org> References: <44E8B588.6080505@rogers.com> <44E8B588.6080505@rogers.com> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823102446.01403a48@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 03:29 PM 8/20/2006 -0400, you wrote: >On Sun, Aug 20, 2006 at 03:18:32PM -0400, John Mcgregor wrote: >> Earlier this week there was a discussion about using the 32 bit >>version of Linux on 64 bit machines. I have an Acer laptop with a Turion >>processor on which I would like to do just that. Is it just as simple as >>downloading and burning a 32 bit distro, or is there some sort of >>parameter that I have to pass at the initial boot as well? > >just install from a 32bit distro. > >no idea why you'd want a 32bit distro on a 64bit machine though. >it'll be slower. > >cheers, >robin >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:25:04 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:25:04 -0400 Subject: Accessing serial-usb ports In-Reply-To: <50010.207.188.64.111.1155502559.squirrel-2RFepEojUI2DznVbVsZi4WGXanvQGlWp@public.gmane.org n.ca> References: <20060813202428.GA11956@waltdnes.org> <50519.207.188.65.151.1155353473.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> <20060813202428.GA11956@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823102501.047cc5a8@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 04:55 PM 8/13/2006 -0400, you wrote: >> On Fri, Aug 11, 2006 at 11:31:13PM -0400, phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org wrote >> >>> A Linux serial-usb port is created as owned by root and you have to >>> become root and change these permissions every time a device is plugged >>> and unplugged, or when you reboot. We need a better solution. > >> The *DEFAULT* udev behaviour is to create /dev entries owned by root >> and assigned permissions 660. You want to change the default for one or >> more devices. Check out the udev rule-writing information at... >> http://www.reactivated.net/writing_udev_rules.html and specifically the >> section "Controlling permissions and ownership", where you can change >> any/all of owner, group, and access permissions. > > Walter Dnes > >This is a hopeful pointer, Walter, thank-you. I'll have a look at that >approach. > >-- >Peter Hiscocks >Syscomp Electronic Design Limited, Toronto >http://www.syscompdesign.com >USB Oscilloscope and Waveform Generator >647-839-0325 > >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:25:45 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:25:45 -0400 Subject: Any decent computer book stores in GTA? In-Reply-To: <44DFA32A.5080008-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ@public.gmane.org> References: <44DF975F.3030900@rogers.com> <44DF975F.3030900@rogers.com> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823102543.047aeeb0@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 06:09 PM 8/13/2006 -0400, you wrote: >James Knott wrote: >> This afternoon, I dropped into the local Chapters and was appalled at >> how much the technical book section had been decimated, since I last >> visited a couple of weeks ago. They're really dumbed down what used to >> be a good selection. Is there any decent technical book store left? >> -- > >It's hit or miss at the bookstores unless you order and pay in advance. >Have you tried "The Worlds Biggest Bookstore" on Edward near Yonge? I >might also suggest the library. I recently had my daughter locate for me > a book entitled "Unix Shell Programming" which was sent to a local >branch for pick-up within a week. She has even renewed it twice online! > >FWIW-I did find a similar technical book at Indigo with a price tag of >seventy bucks. I'm getting all that I need from the loaner for free. > >BTW-Does anyone know when the Canadian price and US price will actually >reflect the current exchange rates? What a joke! > >HTH >greg >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:24:04 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:24:04 -0400 Subject: [GW-C] Re:Tom's HW Guide: Linux for gaming In-Reply-To: References: <44E12480.7070907@execulink.com> <44BAF994.8080401@telly.org> <44DA2D20.1080107@georgetown.wehave.net> <20060814142050.GD13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44E12480.7070907@execulink.com> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823102327.01e6bc78@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 06:49 PM 8/14/2006 -0700, you wrote: >On 8/14/06, Gregory D Hough wrote: >> Lennart Sorensen wrote: >> > >> > Well I did see this: >> > http://www.infoworld.com/article/06/08/02/32OPcurve_1.html >> > One can always hope there is some truth to that. >> > >> >> I didn't see any mention of newly released specs for OGD1, the Open >> Graphics Development board, series 1 >> >> http://opengraphics.org/ > >How close are they to actually releasing something??? > >I am having difficulty distinguishing this from other "hardware >vapourware" like the "Freedom CPU" (F-CPU) which went pretty well >nowhere. > >It would be very nice to have an "open source graphics card" or an >"OSS CPU," but I really don't see it happening soon. :-( >-- >http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html >Oddly enough, this is completely standard behaviour for shells. This >is a roundabout way of saying `don't use combined chains of `&&'s and >`||'s unless you think G?del's theorem is for sissies'. >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:33:59 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:33:59 -0400 Subject: Java opening - Wrong forum, but posting just in case In-Reply-To: <3C31E454411187439E3314D99DD9502709A1CF-CLNy6lqpgzNGTIAK+MOlGtBPR1lH4CV8@public.gmane.org> References: <3C31E454411187439E3314D99DD9502709A1CF@jack.pcrepairs.com> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823103357.047dad48@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 11:23 AM 8/14/2006 -0400, you wrote: >I have someone trying to fill a position for a Java Developer. It's a >full time, permanent position. Even though this is a Linux group I >figured I'd post anyway in case there is anyone out there looking for >something along this line. It's not listed publicly yet which means the >odds are better at least. If interested, please reply to me directly. >(ray-UsHhwO8CmvuakBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org) > > >Below is a copy of the description I have been given: > > >The Job > >A successful candidate will become a senior member on one of our core >financial development teams. Working directly with a team lead, >customers and business analysts, you will be responsible for enhancing >out products capabilities to manage hundreds of facilities from a >centralized location in the areas of billing and patient accounting. >Understanding, designing and implementing new screens, modules, business >rules and database designs will be daily requirements. Other >responsibilities will include interacting with customers and other >knowledge holders, mentoring junior team members, performing code >reviews, reviewing requirements, performance tuning, responding to >customer issues. > > >Required Qualifications: >o Professional Experience with Java / JSP / Javascript - at least 5 >years >o Strong database skills (design / modeling)- at least 5 years >o Object Oriented Design >o Excellent verbal and written communications skills >o Ability and desire to work directly with customers >o Proven track record of successful management of resources and >timelines >o University degree in computer science or closely related field >Desired Qualifications: >o Web application design >o Large system experience >o Experience with either Financial System design and business concepts >o Database and application stress testing and tuning >o Experience with Struts, Spring, and MVC > > >We offer a competitive salary, performance-based incentives, career >development opportunities and a comprehensive benefits package. > > >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:24:35 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:24:35 -0400 Subject: 32 bit vs 64 bit In-Reply-To: References: <20060820192949.GA9301@lemming.cita.utoronto.ca> <44E8B588.6080505@rogers.com> <20060820192949.GA9301@lemming.cita.utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823102432.047d0fb0@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 07:00 PM 8/20/2006 -0700, you wrote: >On 8/20/06, Robin Humble wrote: >> On Sun, Aug 20, 2006 at 03:18:32PM -0400, John Mcgregor wrote: >> > Earlier this week there was a discussion about using the 32 bit >> >version of Linux on 64 bit machines. I have an Acer laptop with a Turion >> >processor on which I would like to do just that. Is it just as simple as >> >downloading and burning a 32 bit distro, or is there some sort of >> >parameter that I have to pass at the initial boot as well? >> >> just install from a 32bit distro. >> >> no idea why you'd want a 32bit distro on a 64bit machine though. >> it'll be slower. > >There's some benefit to both directions... > >- In the "running in 32 bit mode" direction, there is the merit that >things like Flash players and video codecs and OpenOffice.org and such >that are primarily or fundamentally 32 bit code will run with as few >layers of complications as possible. > >- Of course, there will be applications that can benefit from being >aware of extra registers and of larger "bit grabs". > >I don't see indication of there being *enormous* performance >differences for common "desktop and web browsing and writing some >documents" purposes... >-- >http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html >Oddly enough, this is completely standard behaviour for shells. This >is a roundabout way of saying `don't use combined chains of `&&'s and >`||'s unless you think G?del's theorem is for sissies'. >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:32:51 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:32:51 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: <1156168809.30331.230.camel-Wos4hdNTH4j6K7/ahGyk6A@public.gmane.org> References: <44E86DD6.50306@utoronto.ca> <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060815040804.GA14384@waltdnes.org> <20060815131953.GH13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44E86DD6.50306@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823103249.047b4f20@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 10:00 AM 8/21/2006 -0400, you wrote: >for sled10 x64 >it comes out of the box with flash and mp3 >i copied a 32bit mplayer, and dll's to the 64bit machine >ran the 32bit mplayer, and it got an error on 2 lib's that i brought >over from a 32bit suse install, >and that was that, no chroot, etc, just a fully working suse sled10, >with a 32 bit mplayer (its dll's) and a could of 32bit libs. > >-tl > > > >On Sun, 2006-08-20 at 15:12 +0100, Jamon Camisso wrote: >> Lennart Sorensen wrote: >> > Yeah it takes like 10 or 15 minutes to do following the howto. There >> > are a few tricks for a few programs to deal with, but for most things it >> > works fine. >> > >> > I actually run 32bit debian on an amd64, with a 64bit kernel, and then >> > 64bit debian in a chroot. >> >> So how do you have that working? You install a 32bit version and then >> simply compile and/or copy your 64bit kernel and associated /lib/kernel >> folder to your 32bit install? I'm interested as I do find that even >> using dchroot and various other methods of running 32bit programs on >> 64bit kernels, there are some quirky little things, like missing gtk >> libraries etc. for, say Firefox, that I don't want to have to track down >> and install... >> >> Jamon >> -- >> The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >> TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >> How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml >> > >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:24:26 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:24:26 -0400 Subject: [GW-C] Re:Tom's HW Guide: Linux for gaming In-Reply-To: <20060814142050.GD13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <44BAF994.8080401@telly.org> <44DA2D20.1080107@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823102421.047d1c30@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 10:20 AM 8/14/2006 -0400, you wrote: >On Fri, Aug 11, 2006 at 11:44:58PM -0400, D. Hugh Redelmeier wrote: >> I'm glad to hear that. ATI lost me as a customer after a few too many >> disappointments. I was biased towards the home-town team. Some >> things that I think I know: >> >> - the fastest 3d card with open source drivers, of any brand, is the >> ATI Radeon 9250. Get them before they die of old age. >> >> - In January, I needed a video card that supported Dual Link DVI. At >> that time, reasonably-priced ATI x1000 family cards (like the x1300) >> would not work in Linux with an open source driver. Not even as a >> 2d card. (Well, the VESA driver could do it, but only at >> resolutions wired into the cards BIOS extension, and those did not >> include the resolutions I needed.) At the time, 6 months after the >> product was released, ATI had not disclosed enough about the new >> fiddly bits for 2d output to enable the open-source Radeon driver to >> support these cards. >> >> - at that time, the ATI web site claimed that the proprietary X >> drivers supported any card newer than the 9600 (I think that was the >> number). Pre-sales support repeated this misinformation. I bought >> nice fanless x1300 card and discovered the mistake. Was the site >> corrected when I reported this? No. > >This has unfortunately been very common for ATI over many years. Try >getting a driver for a laptop with an ati chipset in it from ati. If >your laptop maker doesn't care and doesn't update the drivers, too bad. >ati doesn't make drivers for laptops for windows. For linux they do >somewhat. I did find the omega drivers that someone else manually puts >together using bits and pieces of ati's drivers for windows and makes >them work with laptops. This really should not be someone's hobby. >Nvidia has no problem providing drivers for laptops. > >> - the open source drivers for nVidia cards are limited to 2d. > >They do however usually work with new cards fairly quickly. > >> He is asking for approval because an NDA is involved. He does claim >> that nothing scary is revealed in the code. >> >> Maybe somebody inside ATI could champion this (you know who you are). >> Many of us would be willing to help. > >Well I did see this: >http://www.infoworld.com/article/06/08/02/32OPcurve_1.html >One can always hope there is some truth to that. > >> A decade ago I tried to talk to some ATI engineers that I had met, but >> there no interest. >> >> Intel is the best player, as far as revealing graphics chip details. >> They have released open-source drivers and are maintaining them. The >> most recent message from them was written by Keith Packard (one of the >> key X folks). If he is working for them, that is an even better sign. > >There appears to be some binary only HAL involved in the new "open >source" intel drivers. I haven't quite figured out what that does yet >or if it is required for the drivers to work. > >-- >Len Sorensen >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:33:33 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:33:33 -0400 Subject: GTABUG, any members present? In-Reply-To: <1f13df280608210552u74cbff1aqc86d42d7f8d9ab02-JsoAwUIsXouhRSP0FMvGiw@public.gmane.org m> References: <1f13df280608210552u74cbff1aqc86d42d7f8d9ab02@mail.gmail.co m> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823103332.01524a20@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 08:52 AM 8/21/2006 -0400, you wrote: >I've developed an interest in the BSD family, and found the GTABUG >website (http://www.gtabug.com/). Here's the problem: they say >"There's a list of proposed meeting dates below but, to be safe, you >should sign up for the mailing list as this page may not always be >updated in time for the meetings." I'd like to join the mailing list >anyway, but: the link to the listserver is broken, there's no contact >info anywhere on the page, and they're using whois obfuscation so I >can't even get a name that way. Are there any GTABUG members on this >list who can either assist me in getting onto the mailing list? >Thanks. > >-- >Giles >http://www.gilesorr.com/ >gilesorr-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:33:18 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:33:18 -0400 Subject: UofT - OT In-Reply-To: <007001c6c473$12af7690$0405a8c0-MlQI6EnZl2wPJunrU1OSJXVPGwe2822SnZ/81venjTc@public.gmane.org .com> References: <007001c6c473$12af7690$0405a8c0@northamerica.corp.microsoft .com> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823103315.01e1d358@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 12:09 PM 8/20/2006 -0400, you wrote: > > Is anyone here enrolled in postgraduate studies at UofT? > > Can you email me offlist? > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:25:18 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:25:18 -0400 Subject: Acer Aspire 3620 In-Reply-To: <20060819141718.feb61c24.hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20060819141718.feb61c24.hgibson@eol.ca> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823102516.047c5a88@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 02:17 PM 8/19/2006 -0400, you wrote: > I just bought one. It came with something called Linpus Linux, which >provided nothing more than a root command line, but at least I think I >avoided the Microsoft tax. My real plan had been to buy a reconditioned >laptop, but this new one was irresistable. > > Fedora Core 5 seems to work very well. The distribution supports the >video and the battery. Fedora Core 3 didn't. > > The computer comes with a 56K win/linmodem. I went to www.linuxant.com, I >downloaded the driver for my distribution, processor and Kernel. I >installed it and used wvdialconf and minicom and locate and test the modem. >I logged out and shut the computer down. So far, so good. > > When I turned it back on, it started to boot, it reached the part about >udev, then everything went screwy. Usually, the final line displayed on the >screen was... > > "Unable to handle kernel paging request at virtual address 61642072" > > It was always the same virtual address. > > I was able to boot using the Fedora CD and search the hard drive. I was >able to reinstall everything, and it is working fine now. I haven't the >nerve to try installing the modem software again. > > The Linuxant site indicates that there ae problems with Kernal versions, >and that I might have to compile one. Is anyone familiar with Linuxant's >software for Conexant chips, Fedora, and Celeron processors? > >-- >Howard Gibson >hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org >howardg-PadmjKOQAFn3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org >http://home.eol.ca/~hgibson >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:25:34 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:25:34 -0400 Subject: Any decent computer book stores in GTA? In-Reply-To: References: <20060813225351.3094.qmail@web88204.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <44DFA007.5000100@rogers.com> <20060813225351.3094.qmail@web88204.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823102532.047cd100@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 08:18 PM 8/13/2006 -0400, you wrote: >On 8/13/06, Colin McGregor wrote: >> --- Kush wrote: >> >> [snip] >> >> > I think we should have some sort of library for the >> > TLUG people on the >> > lines of bookcrossing.com or a book bank or we >> > should have a section on >> > the TLUG website which lists where all one can see >> > the latest technical >> > books (e.g. university department libraries or >> > college libraries or govt >> > libraries or company libraries), their timings, >> > membership details, some >> > sort of rating etc etc >> >> David over at Linuxcaffe kind-of sort-off does this. >> I've kind-off sort-of help with that by dropping off >> some technical magazines that I had more more use of >> over at Linuxcaffe. Other people I gather have done >> similar, and I gather David has received goodies from >> at least one book publisher. Might want to talk to >> David about expanding what he is doing now... > >It's true, I have a sprawling pile of reference, most of which is out >of date and/or in the basement. APress dropped a sweet load of curent >titles for review. > >What I would like to do (or better yet, encourage somebody else to do) is >a) catalog the books, using a barcode scanner and amazon lookup. >b) make the catalog readable via "shopping cart" on our website >(linuxcaffe.ca /books?) >c) get my customer/membership database working and >d) allow members to borrow the books. >e) continue to collect good reference and weed out the cruft. > >whew ! > >sounds like a nice winter project ! > >we have over 60 back issues of Linux Journal and scads of other mags, >available fer perusin. > >thanks to all who dropped off the goods, >djp > >-- >djp-tnsZcVQxgqO2dHQpreyxbg at public.gmane.org >www.linuxcaffe.ca >326 Harbord Street, Toronto, M6G 3A5, (416) 534-2116 >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:24:17 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:24:17 -0400 Subject: [GW-C] Re:Tom's HW Guide: Linux for gaming In-Reply-To: <44E12480.7070907-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814142050.GD13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44BAF994.8080401@telly.org> <44DA2D20.1080107@georgetown.wehave.net> <20060814142050.GD13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823102409.047c33a0@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 09:33 PM 8/14/2006 -0400, you wrote: >Lennart Sorensen wrote: >> >> Well I did see this: >> http://www.infoworld.com/article/06/08/02/32OPcurve_1.html >> One can always hope there is some truth to that. >> > >I didn't see any mention of newly released specs for OGD1, the Open >Graphics Development board, series 1 > >http://opengraphics.org/ > >"The card, called the 'OGD1' for 'Open Graphics Development', is >intended for small-quantity production to be used by developers >interested in designing the Verilog code for the FPGA chip on the card, >and will likely cost about US$1000 per unit. This design, when >completed, will form the basis for an ASIC version of the board, >expected to run closer to US$200. OGD developers are hoping that >GNU/Linux users will be willing to pay the higher price (driven >primarily by expected small production runs) in order to have a >fully-specified 3D graphics card with fully open specifications and >hardware design." > >greg >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:33:44 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:33:44 -0400 Subject: simple open source document management system In-Reply-To: <200608142140.14657.jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: Message-ID: <4.1.20060823103342.047d9468@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 09:40 PM 8/14/2006 -0400, you wrote: >On Monday 14 August 2006 15:52, Dave Cramer wrote: >> Can anyone recommend a web based very simple, preferrably backed by >> cvs, or svn, but not necessary document system >> > >http://mydms.sourceforge.net/ > >From the project website: > >"MyDMS is an open-source, web-based document management system written in PHP >and supported by an SQL database. Originally coded by Markus Westphal, MyDMS >provides document meta-data, version control, security and easy access to >your documents. MyDMS is distributed under the terms of the GNU General >Public Licence (GPL), Version 2." > > > >-- >Jason Shein >Director of Networking, Operations and Systems >Detached Networks >jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org >( 905 ) - 876 - 4158 Voice >( 905 ) - 876 - 5817 Mobile >http://www.detachednetworks.ca >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:33:56 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:33:56 -0400 Subject: Open Office and HP 1320 In-Reply-To: References: <34126.72.38.22.170.1156171274.squirrel@72.38.22.170> <34126.72.38.22.170.1156171274.squirrel@72.38.22.170> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823103354.01524b18@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 11:07 AM 8/21/2006 -0400, you wrote: >Hi Stephen, > >On 8/21/06, Stephen W. Clarke wrote: >> Randy, >> >> I've got 6 workstations running Ubuntu 6.06 and OO 2.0.2 and all of them >> print to a shared HP1320 without any issues. The shared printer is on a >> ZOT print server so that may be helping us avoid the issue you mention. >We have 9 iMacs running OS X connected to 2 HP 1320n. Firefox prints >without any issues, but Open Office will only print after pressing >green button on printer. > >> >> Did you set both the paper size and the PageRegion to letter? >> Also you might want to check and see if the printer trying to print Double >> Sided? > >I've tried US letter and A4 paper sizes in OO. I've also tried >setting duplex to simplex, ignore and off without success. > >Cheers, > >Randy > >> >> Stephen >> >> >> > Hey everyone, >> > >> > Has anyone had experience with printing from Open Office to a HP 1320 >> > Laser Printer? The problem I have is that every time I want to print >> > from OO, the error light flashes on the printer. The print job >> > doesn't start until I hit the green button. It then prints fine. >> > It's a pain though, to have keep clearing the error on the printer >> > every time I want to print. >> > >> > Thanks for the help! >> > >> > Cheers, >> > >> > Randy >> > >> > PS. I tried setting the paper size in OO to A4 and letter to no avail :( >> > >> > -- >> > Imagine no possessions >> > I wonder if you can >> > No need for greed or hunger >> > A brotherhood of man >> > Imagine all the people >> > Sharing all the world >> > --John Lennon >> > -- >> > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >> > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >> > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml >> > >> >> >> -- >> Stephen W. Clarke >> Marketing and Communications Officer >> Nray Services Inc. >> 56A Head Street >> Dundas, ON L9H 3H7 >> CANADA >> >> Tel: (905) 627-1302 x14 >> Fax: (905) 627-5022 >> -- >> The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >> TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >> How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml >> > > >-- >Imagine no possessions >I wonder if you can >No need for greed or hunger >A brotherhood of man >Imagine all the people >Sharing all the world >--John Lennon >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:33:23 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:33:23 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: <20060821152316.GA592-v/0tkT6wDSGE+EvaaNYduQ@public.gmane.org> References: <1156168809.30331.230.camel@stan64.site> <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060815040804.GA14384@waltdnes.org> <20060815131953.GH13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44E86DD6.50306@utoronto.ca> <1156168809.30331.230.camel@stan64.site> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823103320.014265c0@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 11:23 AM 8/21/2006 -0400, you wrote: >It just depends on what you are running. If mplayer doesn't link against any >external libraries, then it's portable between 32-bit and 64-bit installs. The >real problem with running 64bit/32bit side-by-side is the libraries that apps >depend on. Debian doesn't have a standard location like 'lib64' or 'lib32' to >separate the 64-bit and 32-bit compiled libraries. 32-bit Firefox can't use >64-bit GTK+ libraries, for example. This is where the chroot comes in. With >the chroot, you can have the 32bit libraries installed in the default >locations ( which would overwrite the 64bit libraries otherwise) and the 32bit >programs look for them there. So you just have your 32-bit chroot pointed to a >32-bit repository and it should install all the 32-bit libraries into the >appropriate locations in the chroot. > >IIRC, other distros just have a 'lib64' for 64-bit libraries or a 'lib32' for >the 32-bit libraries and all of their packages are compiled with this in mind >for linking. > >- Brandon Sandrowicz > >On Mon, Aug 21, 2006 at 10:00:09AM -0400, ted leslie wrote: >> for sled10 x64 >> it comes out of the box with flash and mp3 >> i copied a 32bit mplayer, and dll's to the 64bit machine >> ran the 32bit mplayer, and it got an error on 2 lib's that i brought >> over from a 32bit suse install, >> and that was that, no chroot, etc, just a fully working suse sled10, >> with a 32 bit mplayer (its dll's) and a could of 32bit libs. >> >> -tl >> >> >> >> On Sun, 2006-08-20 at 15:12 +0100, Jamon Camisso wrote: >> > Lennart Sorensen wrote: >> > > Yeah it takes like 10 or 15 minutes to do following the howto. There >> > > are a few tricks for a few programs to deal with, but for most things it >> > > works fine. >> > > >> > > I actually run 32bit debian on an amd64, with a 64bit kernel, and then >> > > 64bit debian in a chroot. >> > >> > So how do you have that working? You install a 32bit version and then >> > simply compile and/or copy your 64bit kernel and associated /lib/kernel >> > folder to your 32bit install? I'm interested as I do find that even >> > using dchroot and various other methods of running 32bit programs on >> > 64bit kernels, there are some quirky little things, like missing gtk >> > libraries etc. for, say Firefox, that I don't want to have to track down >> > and install... >> > >> > Jamon >> > -- >> > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >> > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >> > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml >> > >> >> -- >> The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >> TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >> How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:33:37 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:33:37 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: <44E99FEB.3050404-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <44E9E58A.80101@telly.org> <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060814144021.GA9312@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060815040804.GA14384@waltdnes.org> <20060815131953.GH13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44E86DD6.50306@utoronto.ca> <1156168809.30331.230.camel@stan64.site> <20060821152316.GA592@PyBook.local> <44E9E58A.80101@telly.org> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823103335.01e3b7f0@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 12:58 PM 8/21/2006 +0100, you wrote: >Evan Leibovitch wrote: >> The other desktop biggie that won't work under 64-bit AFAIK is Flash >> animation (if someone knows how to make that work, please let me know!) > > >As a GNU/Linux user, you might be interested in Gnash -- GNU's flash >player that apparently supports everything up to (and including) SWF 7. > >http://www.gnu.org/software/gnash/ > >I've not used it myself, but it looks promising. > >Jamon >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:26:00 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:26:00 -0400 Subject: Any decent computer book stores in GTA? In-Reply-To: <44DFA007.5000100-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44DF975F.3030900@rogers.com> <44DF975F.3030900@rogers.com> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823102557.0146db60@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 05:56 PM 8/13/2006 -0400, you wrote: >People like me mostly buy from bookpool.com etc since chapters/indigo is >so costly. Even with the postal/courier costs, book buying online is >cheaper and now with O'reilly's safari model one can read quite a few of >the latest books. > >If one buys online from chapters, its still cheaper than buying from the >store itself. > >Maybe thats the reason why they had to reduce floorspace for the >technical section. Consumers are going the online way. > >If there was more open competition and maybe specialised bookstores >maybe we would have better and cheaper books(the same rates as in the >US). The problem in Toronto is that there is no competition and courier >companies like UPS/fedex charge a lot via their brokers who sit to do >simple customs paperwork but nobody objects. Most of the time the broker >charges are more than what the govt gets thru custom duties. > >Another thing reducing the number of bookstores carrying technical books >is the demand from the central library of Toronto ie the TPL. TPL drives >a significant portion of the book demand here. > >I think we should have some sort of library for the TLUG people on the >lines of bookcrossing.com or a book bank or we should have a section on >the TLUG website which lists where all one can see the latest technical >books (e.g. university department libraries or college libraries or govt >libraries or company libraries), their timings, membership details, some >sort of rating etc etc > >Kush > >James Knott wrote: >> This afternoon, I dropped into the local Chapters and was appalled at >> how much the technical book section had been decimated, since I last >> visited a couple of weeks ago. They're really dumbed down what used to >> be a good selection. Is there any decent technical book store left? >> -- >> The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >> TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >> How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml >> >> > >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:32:43 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:32:43 -0400 Subject: Linux on an AMD64 box... In-Reply-To: <20060814144021.GA9312-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20060814135659.GA9159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20060814142512.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823103240.047d27f0@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 10:40 AM 8/14/2006 -0400, you wrote: >On Mon, Aug 14, 2006 at 10:25:12AM -0400, Lennart Sorensen wrote: >>On Mon, Aug 14, 2006 at 09:56:59AM -0400, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: >>> explained dual booting and virtualization as a couple of choices, and >>> she's decided that she wants to dual boot. >> >>Most people I know eventually find dual booting a pain because you have >>to stop everything you are doing and switch. You often end up only > >I know this, and I explained it to my wife, but doesn't think it'll be a >big deal. We might know better, but nothing teaches like experience. I >can install VMWare later, if she decides that that is what she needs. > >>> heard a few things, like Firefox having to run in 32-bit mode (or is >>> that just Flash? I don't remember) but I don't know how you'd set >>> something like this up. >> >>Just flash, and any other non-free plugins that only come in 32bit. >>There are people working on getting 32bit plugins to work in 64bit >>browsers but I am not sure if they are done yet. > >So, is Flash on a 64bit machine possible? If so, how? > >>> I plan to use Debian, because that's what I use and I know it best, and >> >>Well if you go with Etch, amd64 works rather well. For Sarge it was >>unofficial, and it does have some things lacking. > >I had planned to use testing, yes. Stable is, um, stable, but it lacks >too many programs and updated features. >-- > >yours, > >William > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:33:30 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:33:30 -0400 Subject: simple open source document management system In-Reply-To: References: <20060814200839.GG1367@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> <20060814200839.GG1367@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823103328.01e56870@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 04:12 PM 8/14/2006 -0400, you wrote: >So svn + webdav can do everything that svn can do ? > >Dave >On 14-Aug-06, at 4:08 PM, Neil Watson wrote: > >> On Mon, Aug 14, 2006 at 03:52:19PM -0400, Dave Cramer wrote: >>> Can anyone recommend a web based very simple, preferrably backed >>> by cvs, or svn, but not necessary document system >> >> svn and webdav? You can also you tortoise svn for the Windows users. >> >> -- >> Neil Watson | Gentoo Linux >> System Administrator | Uptime 18 days >> http://watson-wilson.ca | 2.6.16.19 AMD Athlon(tm) MP 2000+ x 2 >> -- >> The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >> TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >> How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml >> > >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:25:53 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:25:53 -0400 Subject: Any decent computer book stores in GTA? In-Reply-To: <44DF975F.3030900-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44DF975F.3030900@rogers.com> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823102549.047c7eb0@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 05:19 PM 8/13/2006 -0400, you wrote: >This afternoon, I dropped into the local Chapters and was appalled at >how much the technical book section had been decimated, since I last >visited a couple of weeks ago. They're really dumbed down what used to >be a good selection. Is there any decent technical book store left? >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:26:08 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:26:08 -0400 Subject: Clustering and cronjobs In-Reply-To: <44E0ED6A.6030605-FkEgs2FKm2NvBvnq28/GKQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814153518.GC1367@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> <20060814153518.GC1367@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823102606.047c7d48@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 10:38 PM 8/14/2006 +0100, you wrote: >Neil Watson wrote: > >> I'm setting up a cluster using the Redhat Cluster suite. The cluster >> offers a DB2 service. So far my tests seem to be working. I'll post a >> report on how is did this later if anyone is interested. >> >> I'm not sure how to handle specific cron jobs that must be run on the >> active node only. Does anyone have any experience with this? >> >I would be curious to learn your notes. > >David >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:25:10 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:25:10 -0400 Subject: Accessing serial-usb ports In-Reply-To: <20060813202428.GA11956-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <50519.207.188.65.151.1155353473.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> <50519.207.188.65.151.1155353473.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823102508.047cd248@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 04:24 PM 8/13/2006 -0400, you wrote: >On Fri, Aug 11, 2006 at 11:31:13PM -0400, phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org wrote > >> A Linux serial-usb port is created when you plug in a USB device, and >> disappears when you unplug the device. Unfortunately, the port is created >> as owned by root and the read and wite permissions are disabled for >> ordinary users. Consequently, if you operate in user mode you have to >> become root and change these permissions every time a device is plugged >> and unplugged, or when you reboot. >> >> This gets old fast, so we need a better solution than manual intervention. > > The *DEFAULT* udev behaviour is to create /dev entries owned by root >and assigned permissions 660. You want to change the default for one or >more devices. Check out the udev rule-writing information at... >http://www.reactivated.net/writing_udev_rules.html and specifically the >section "Controlling permissions and ownership", where you can change >any/all of owner, group, and access permissions. > >-- >Walter Dnes In linux /sbin/init is Job #1 >My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:32:59 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:32:59 -0400 Subject: Open Office and HP 1320 In-Reply-To: <34126.72.38.22.170.1156171274.squirrel-u5iS8elThxsi7FR4L9eesA@public.gmane.org> References: Message-ID: <4.1.20060823103256.01e1d260@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 10:41 AM 8/21/2006 -0400, you wrote: >Randy, > >I've got 6 workstations running Ubuntu 6.06 and OO 2.0.2 and all of them >print to a shared HP1320 without any issues. The shared printer is on a >ZOT print server so that may be helping us avoid the issue you mention. > >Did you set both the paper size and the PageRegion to letter? >Also you might want to check and see if the printer trying to print Double >Sided? > >Stephen > > >> Hey everyone, >> >> Has anyone had experience with printing from Open Office to a HP 1320 >> Laser Printer? The problem I have is that every time I want to print >> from OO, the error light flashes on the printer. The print job >> doesn't start until I hit the green button. It then prints fine. >> It's a pain though, to have keep clearing the error on the printer >> every time I want to print. >> >> Thanks for the help! >> >> Cheers, >> >> Randy >> >> PS. I tried setting the paper size in OO to A4 and letter to no avail :( >> >> -- >> Imagine no possessions >> I wonder if you can >> No need for greed or hunger >> A brotherhood of man >> Imagine all the people >> Sharing all the world >> --John Lennon >> -- >> The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >> TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >> How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml >> > > >-- >Stephen W. Clarke >Marketing and Communications Officer >Nray Services Inc. >56A Head Street >Dundas, ON L9H 3H7 >CANADA > >Tel: (905) 627-1302 x14 >Fax: (905) 627-5022 >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:25:29 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:25:29 -0400 Subject: Any decent computer book stores in GTA? In-Reply-To: <20060813225351.3094.qmail-iE2/U85ktn6B9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <44DFA007.5000100@rogers.com> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823102528.047c7208@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 06:53 PM 8/13/2006 -0400, you wrote: >--- Kush wrote: > >[snip] > >> I think we should have some sort of library for the >> TLUG people on the >> lines of bookcrossing.com or a book bank or we >> should have a section on >> the TLUG website which lists where all one can see >> the latest technical >> books (e.g. university department libraries or >> college libraries or govt >> libraries or company libraries), their timings, >> membership details, some >> sort of rating etc etc > >David over at Linuxcaffe kind-of sort-off does this. >I've kind-off sort-of help with that by dropping off >some technical magazines that I had more more use of >over at Linuxcaffe. Other people I gather have done >similar, and I gather David has received goodies from >at least one book publisher. Might want to talk to >David about expanding what he is doing now... > >Colin McGregor >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:26:11 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:26:11 -0400 Subject: Clustering and cronjobs In-Reply-To: <20060814153518.GC1367-ajb9/b42oWj7qFZT6RBq9oSPOIov7LNK@public.gmane.org> References: <20060814153518.GC1367@ettin.watson-wilson.ca> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823102610.047b4060@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 11:35 AM 8/14/2006 -0400, you wrote: >I'm setting up a cluster using the Redhat Cluster suite. The cluster >offers a DB2 service. So far my tests seem to be working. I'll post a >report on how is did this later if anyone is interested. > >I'm not sure how to handle specific cron jobs that must be run on the >active node only. Does anyone have any experience with this? > >-- >Neil Watson | Gentoo Linux >System Administrator | Uptime 18 days >http://watson-wilson.ca | 2.6.16.19 AMD Athlon(tm) MP 2000+ x 2 >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:24:42 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:24:42 -0400 Subject: 32 bit vs 64 bit In-Reply-To: <44E8B588.6080505-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44E8B588.6080505@rogers.com> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823102440.047cba90@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 03:18 PM 8/20/2006 -0400, you wrote: >Hi Folk, > Earlier this week there was a discussion about using the 32 bit >version of Linux on 64 bit machines. I have an Acer laptop with a Turion >processor on which I would like to do just that. Is it just as simple as >downloading and burning a 32 bit distro, or is there some sort of >parameter that I have to pass at the initial boot as well? > >TIA > >John >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 23 14:33:52 2006 From: russell-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew at public.gmane.org (Russell) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:33:52 -0400 Subject: 32 bit vs 64 bit In-Reply-To: References: <44E92E89.7030100@rogers.com> <44E92E89.7030100@rogers.com> Message-ID: <4.1.20060823103350.047d5840@misconsult.com> Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. At 01:05 PM 8/21/2006 -0400, you wrote: >On 8/20/06, John McGregor wrote: >> Chris Browne wrote: >> >> > There's some benefit to both directions... >> > >> > - In the "running in 32 bit mode" direction, there is the merit that >> > things like Flash players and video codecs and OpenOffice.org and such >> > that are primarily or fundamentally 32 bit code will run with as few >> > layers of complications as possible. >> > >> > - Of course, there will be applications that can benefit from being >> > aware of extra registers and of larger "bit grabs". >> > >> > I don't see indication of there being **enormous** performance >> > differences for common "desktop and web browsing and writing some >> > documents" purposes... >> > >> Thanks Chris, that really helps. The reason that I aked the question in >> the first place is that the distro I plan to use is MEPIS -- which >> does't have a 64 bit version, at least on the basis of the mirrors that >> I checked. I am taking courses through the Chang School at Ryerson. >> Ryerson seems to be pretty Windows centric in terms of how written work >> can be submitted, so I need Open Office ( to be able to save as a .doc) >> to work with a minimum of fuss and bother. As well, the laptop has a >> Broadcom 43xx wireless nic, so I am likely going to have to use >> ndiswrapper in order to get it working. I am sure that there are people >> on this list for whom solving these problems on a 64 bit machine would >> be a 'no brainer', but I am not in that league yet. :lol: >> > >Running the 32bit version of OpenOffice on a 64bit Distro is not a >problem. It requires some 32bit libraries but most distros handle that >all for you. >-- >Mark Lane, CET >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 27 11:26:44 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 07:26:44 -0400 Subject: [GW-C] Re:Tom's HW Guide: Linux for gaming In-Reply-To: <4.1.20060823102421.047d1c30-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew@public.gmane.org> References: <44BAF994.8080401@telly.org> <44DA2D20.1080107@georgetown.wehave.net> <4.1.20060823102421.047d1c30@misconsult.com> Message-ID: <44F18174.9070206@rogers.com> Russell wrote: > *Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. Please read the instructions for unsubscribing, as shown at the bottom of the messages. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 27 11:28:23 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 07:28:23 -0400 Subject: Linux in the Park aftermath In-Reply-To: <61e9e2b10608262307i5a715c81x549acdcfabe1fa6d-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <61e9e2b10608262307i5a715c81x549acdcfabe1fa6d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <44F181D7.20106@rogers.com> Thanks to all( David, Colin, Jamon, Tim, Jeff et al) who organised the event. I really loved being there! Also must thank the people who brought the samosas, strawberries and other refreshments. I learned quite a bit just by being there and wish we had these social meetings more often. Wish we had name tags and had some form of informal introductions to remember. Maybe a video clip of each of us, if we wished. Maybe we could post our photos and a little bit of ourselves somewhere (such as name, area/neighbourhood we are coming from, interests, number of years we have been using linux, how we got into the linux scene, special technical interests if any, personal website etc) Kush Daniel Armstrong wrote: > On 8/26/06, David J Patrick wrote: >> On 8/26/06, John Vetterli wrote: >> >> > I just want to thank the people who put together today's linux in the >> > park. >> >> >> I second that ! Thanks Jamon, Colin and tout la gang ! >> > > Yes... thanks for the organizing efforts... the BBC 'Codebreakers' > video was interesting, and the giant Tuxmade it *very* easy to find > the GTALUG gathering in the park... :-) > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 27 12:14:00 2006 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy Ali) Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 07:14:00 -0500 Subject: [GW-C] Re:Tom's HW Guide: Linux for gaming In-Reply-To: <44F18174.9070206-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44BAF994.8080401@telly.org> <44DA2D20.1080107@georgetown.wehave.net> <4.1.20060823102421.047d1c30@misconsult.com> <44F18174.9070206@rogers.com> Message-ID: <1e55af990608270514w2fb683deyaba0f8ec282ead74@mail.gmail.com> On 8/27/06, James Knott wrote: > Russell wrote: > > *Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. > > Please read the instructions for unsubscribing, as shown at the bottom > of the messages. Those instructions never worked.. =/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 27 12:31:04 2006 From: meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org (Meng Cheah) Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 08:31:04 -0400 Subject: Linux in the Park aftermath In-Reply-To: <61e9e2b10608262307i5a715c81x549acdcfabe1fa6d-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <61e9e2b10608262307i5a715c81x549acdcfabe1fa6d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <44F19088.60100@pppoe.ca> Daniel Armstrong wrote: > On 8/26/06, David J Patrick wrote: > >> On 8/26/06, John Vetterli wrote: >> >> > I just want to thank the people who put together today's linux in the >> > park. >> >> >> I second that ! Thanks Jamon, Colin and tout la gang ! >> > > Yes... thanks for the organizing efforts... the BBC 'Codebreakers' > video was interesting, and the giant Tuxmade it *very* easy to find > the GTALUG gathering in the park... :-) A big thank you to all, especially the organizers. It was great meeting and talking, a change of pace and venue. An opportunity to put faces to names and socialize. I'm just sorry I had to leave at 6, would have loved to stay. Thanks again. Thanks Chris for the advice re hardware and a beginner's database. Cool pix too :-) . Meng Cheah -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 27 13:13:39 2006 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 09:13:39 -0400 Subject: [GW-C] Re:Tom's HW Guide: Linux for gaming In-Reply-To: <1e55af990608270514w2fb683deyaba0f8ec282ead74-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <44BAF994.8080401@telly.org> <44DA2D20.1080107@georgetown.wehave.net> <4.1.20060823102421.047d1c30@misconsult.com> <44F18174.9070206@rogers.com> <1e55af990608270514w2fb683deyaba0f8ec282ead74@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <44F19A83.6070904@rogers.com> Sy Ali wrote: > On 8/27/06, James Knott wrote: >> Russell wrote: >> > *Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. >> >> Please read the instructions for unsubscribing, as shown at the bottom >> of the messages. > > Those instructions never worked.. =/ Oh well. However, no problem. I've already added him to my "Trash" list, so anything from him will be automagically deleted. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davec-zxk95TxsVYDyHADnj0MGvQC/G2K4zDHf at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 27 15:10:34 2006 From: davec-zxk95TxsVYDyHADnj0MGvQC/G2K4zDHf at public.gmane.org (Dave Cramer) Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 11:10:34 -0400 Subject: comparing CPU's Message-ID: <13E6EC4F-F447-4DE8-9E62-DC369192D4FD@visibleassets.com> Now that Intel finally has something to compare to the Opteron, I'm wondering how to compare them. The problem is there are far too many variables. One of the common complaints of the Opteron is that it runs too hot. So power consumption is one important factor. From what I can gather from various sources the latest Intel processor Woodcrest ? consumes considerably more current than any other Intel processor, so I'd guess it will run hot as well. Does anyone have a firm grasp on all of the various factors here ? I did try tomshardware.com, but a direct comparison between an opteron and woodcrest is not available yet. Dave -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ralphellis1-VsqqI1RANlEsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 27 16:17:19 2006 From: ralphellis1-VsqqI1RANlEsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Ralph Ellis) Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 12:17:19 -0400 Subject: comparing CPU's In-Reply-To: <13E6EC4F-F447-4DE8-9E62-DC369192D4FD-zxk95TxsVYDyHADnj0MGvQC/G2K4zDHf@public.gmane.org> References: <13E6EC4F-F447-4DE8-9E62-DC369192D4FD@visibleassets.com> Message-ID: <200608271217.19770.ralphellis1@netscape.ca> On Sunday 27 August 2006 11:10, Dave Cramer wrote: > Now that Intel finally has something to compare to the Opteron, I'm > wondering how to compare them. > > The problem is there are far too many variables. > > One of the common complaints of the Opteron is that it runs too hot. > So power consumption is one important factor. > > From what I can gather from various sources the latest Intel > processor Woodcrest ? consumes considerably more current than any > other Intel processor, so I'd guess it will run hot as well. > > Does anyone have a firm grasp on all of the various factors here ? > > I did try tomshardware.com, but a direct comparison between an > opteron and woodcrest is not available yet. > > Dave > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml One of the difficulties is that real world performance and benchmarks are often very different. The Pentium 4 was the fastest processor for programs that could run entirely in its memory cache but no programs aside from benchmarks do this. Once the cpu talked to the rest of the machine, AMD was far superior. The new Woodcrest chips should be faster than the current AMD ones but no truely independent tests have been done to confirm that. Intel has a long history of "tailored" benchmark tests. AMD should have new processors out in the new year to challenge Intel. In the meantime, real world experiences indicate that unless you are running a huge database server, you are not likely to experience a major performance difference with any one of the top processors. As for heat, the Woodcrest is supposed to run cooler than the Opteron. Performance might be similar to the Sun Niagara chip. Ralph Ellis -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lists-6MMemSSbUSjVkXrxgXmPHQ at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 27 18:31:30 2006 From: lists-6MMemSSbUSjVkXrxgXmPHQ at public.gmane.org (Dieter Limeback) Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 14:31:30 -0400 Subject: [GW-C] Re:Tom's HW Guide: Linux for gaming In-Reply-To: <1e55af990608270514w2fb683deyaba0f8ec282ead74-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <44BAF994.8080401@telly.org> <44DA2D20.1080107@georgetown.wehave.net> <4.1.20060823102421.047d1c30@misconsult.com> <44F18174.9070206@rogers.com> <1e55af990608270514w2fb683deyaba0f8ec282ead74@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <44F1E502.4070809@centripetal.ca> >> Please read the instructions for unsubscribing, as shown at the bottom >> of the messages. > > Those instructions never worked.. =/ Specifically, http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml appears to be a non-existent page. Perhaps the powers that be can change that to http://tlug.ss.org/wiki/Mailing_lists or whatever it needs to be. Granted that's not *that* difficult to find (especially for someone that really REALLY wants to leave the list) but it is a few unnecessary extra clicks away. Cheers -- Dieter Limeback Centripetal Media http://www.centripetal.ca/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 27 23:46:52 2006 From: mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Merv Curley) Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 19:46:52 -0400 Subject: apt-get update Message-ID: <200608271946.52110.mervc@eol.ca> A friend of mine has spent an hour on dialup doing the above. When he started adept he had a list of new packages and upgrades to installed packages. When he started adept the next day it only showed installed packages. I assume that what he got from the update is in a file somewhere on his computer? I've never had this happen, but this guy, a newbie, is forever doing something and causing him and me, problems. Me cuz I'm supposed to have these answers and a lot of the time I am clueless. Help -- Merv Curley Toronto, Ont. Can Kanotix Linux Ver 2005-4 Desktop KDE 3.5.1 KMail 1.2 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 03:48:57 2006 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 23:48:57 -0400 Subject: comparing CPU's In-Reply-To: <13E6EC4F-F447-4DE8-9E62-DC369192D4FD-zxk95TxsVYDyHADnj0MGvQC/G2K4zDHf@public.gmane.org> References: <13E6EC4F-F447-4DE8-9E62-DC369192D4FD@visibleassets.com> Message-ID: On 8/27/06, Dave Cramer wrote: > Now that Intel finally has something to compare to the Opteron, I'm > wondering how to compare them. It's not evident that Intel has done anything to address the memory bandwidth differences, which has been where AMD-64 has been particularly better than EM64-T... Even if the latest Intel CPUs are faster, if they haven't addressed the memory bus issues, they don't likely have parity let alone superiority. After all, the cases where enormous amounts of CPU power can get used tend to be few and far between; it's commonly I/O and memory bandwidth that are the bottlenecks. And the cases where I see CPU used up are cases where it's busy throwing data around in memory, in which case it is memory bandwidth that's the bottleneck... -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html Oddly enough, this is completely standard behaviour for shells. This is a roundabout way of saying `don't use combined chains of `&&'s and `||'s unless you think G?del's theorem is for sissies'. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 03:53:05 2006 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 23:53:05 -0400 Subject: Linux in the Park aftermath In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 8/26/06, John Vetterli wrote: > I just want to thank the people who put together today's linux in the > park. Unfortunately I had to sneak away early, but it was still good to > get out and put some faces to the names. You can see my photos of the > inflatable penguin at http://www.flickr.com/photos/jvetterli/tags/tlug/ . The penguin was most awesome! A most impressive first revealing of a Really Huge Tux! > BTW, Linuxcaffe makes excellent panini. And there's a second reason for kudos to David! -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html Oddly enough, this is completely standard behaviour for shells. This is a roundabout way of saying `don't use combined chains of `&&'s and `||'s unless you think G?del's theorem is for sissies'. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 27 23:13:38 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 00:13:38 +0100 Subject: Wiki spam Message-ID: <44F22722.4040905@utoronto.ca> Anyone seen the talk page for the main page on gtalug.org? I'm not sure the urls that have been added bear posting, but suffice to say that the content on the entire talk page should meet with a swift demise. http://gtalug.org/wiki/Talk:Main_Page -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 04:38:01 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 00:38:01 -0400 Subject: Wiki spam In-Reply-To: <44F22722.4040905-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <44F22722.4040905@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <44F27329.9010002@telly.org> Jamon Camisso wrote: > Anyone seen the talk page for the main page on gtalug.org? I'm not > sure the urls that have been added bear posting, but suffice to say > that the content on the entire talk page should meet with a swift demise. > > http://gtalug.org/wiki/Talk:Main_Page At least that garbage is visible. A site I was managing not long ago had its top index page appended-to with a few hundred links; the author had written the HTML so that they would be invisible to human readers, but visible to Googlebots and others looking for such links. I see this as becoming an increasingly pervasive problem as CMSs, blogs and interactive sites become more common. It's times like this when the Drupal anti-spam module looks really good. - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From gilesorr-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 12:13:22 2006 From: gilesorr-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Giles Orr) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 08:13:22 -0400 Subject: apt-get update In-Reply-To: <200608271946.52110.mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200608271946.52110.mervc@eol.ca> Message-ID: <1f13df280608280513x1fc9f964mc697278084564c07@mail.gmail.com> Hi Merv (and TLUG). On 8/27/06, Merv Curley wrote: > A friend of mine has spent an hour on dialup doing the above. When he started > adept he had a list of new packages and upgrades to installed packages. > > When he started adept the next day it only showed installed packages. I > assume that what he got from the update is in a file somewhere on his > computer? > > I've never had this happen, but this guy, a newbie, is forever doing something > and causing him and me, problems. Me cuz I'm supposed to have these answers > and a lot of the time I am clueless. There are several programs that can be used to work with the packages on a Debian-based system. The most commonly used is "apt-get". I tend to use "aptitude", which shares a lot of common command line switches. These common command line switches have a different behaviour than similar sounding things with "yum" under FC, which can cause confusion. "aptitude update" or "apt-get update" doesn't install any packages: it checks the repositories to get information, primarily lists of new versions of software that are available. That's all. You should always run it before you try to install any software. The command I'm guessing you're looking for is "apt-get upgrade" which looks at your system and upgrades any packages that you have that are older than what's available. "yum update" on an FC system is the same as "apt-get update ; apt-get upgrade" on a Debian system. Be warned that running "upgrade" over dialup is an extremely long process - you can be looking at _days_ if your system decides Open Office is in need of an upgrade. Consider doing single security-critical packages by hand. Hope this helps. -- Giles http://www.gilesorr.com/ gilesorr-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tleslie-RBVUpeUoHUc at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 14:17:13 2006 From: tleslie-RBVUpeUoHUc at public.gmane.org (ted leslie) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 10:17:13 -0400 Subject: comparing CPU's In-Reply-To: References: <13E6EC4F-F447-4DE8-9E62-DC369192D4FD@visibleassets.com> Message-ID: <1156774633.28407.217.camel@stan64.site> Yes this seems very true, about how CPU speed seems to becoming less and less important. Just got a New dual Opteron TYAN MOBO and outfit with dual 2.4Ghz cpu's before i had a dual athlon MP 2800, which is only a 2.0Ghz clock, and the new opties have bigger L1/L2, when i first used the new dual opty it really wasnt all that quickier, in fact i hardly noticed a difference, but when i put 9GB ram in it, and a 10K raptor and a Nvidia 7900 vid card and those additions made way more of a difference then the processor upgrade. I got the 9GB of ram because I am planning to install a vmware install of a linux into a RAM disk (i.e. whole OS in RAM) just to see what it would be like. Looks like the days of getting more (real app) power from cpu's is finally over, and RAM, video card and HD seem to impact much more. With single CPU's become extinct and dual's being the norm, and in a year quadies being the norm, linux and and apps on linux have to start being smart about concurrency other wise we might lose some ground to Bill. At this time, I have to think the disappointment is coming primarily from drive seeks, moores law has been fairly accurate up until a year or (and technically moores law has nothing to do with HD's, but it just that whole "you like to see your whole 'power' double every 18 months'" rule) so ago, but when it comes to real drive seek times, i think they have only about doubled in the last 8 years, and when OpenOffice references about 100-150+ *.so files on a full boot up and use, thats probably upwards of 2 seconds just on drive seeking and reading. I am planning (when i get some hack time) to put a cluster FS on my box, and have one of the clusters in RAM and the other on disk, the secondary will be the disk one, and I will keep all system libs, etc in RAM on that ram/cluster primary, and when i update a package, it will propagate to the secondary, and then be there for the reboot, when it will reset up the cluster and ram disk. This is a better use of ram then doing everything in a RAM vmware machine. Plus you can't use compiz through vmware, and once you have used compiz, its not like you can go back to a old fashion linux desktop environment, even if compiz is 50% eye candy. Nice thing about compiz is you can tell your "windows' using friends" (or Mac users) that your where they will be "on the desktop" on vista (or Jag), in about a year, except I'm (you're) there TODAY! :) :) [this is the best linux gloating ammo thats been provided to us in years!] -tl On Sun, 2006-08-27 at 23:48 -0400, Christopher Browne wrote: > On 8/27/06, Dave Cramer wrote: > > Now that Intel finally has something to compare to the Opteron, I'm > > wondering how to compare them. > > It's not evident that Intel has done anything to address the memory > bandwidth differences, which has been where AMD-64 has been > particularly better than EM64-T... Even if the latest Intel CPUs are > faster, if they haven't addressed the memory bus issues, they don't > likely have parity let alone superiority. > > After all, the cases where enormous amounts of CPU power can get used > tend to be few and far between; it's commonly I/O and memory bandwidth > that are the bottlenecks. And the cases where I see CPU used up are > cases where it's busy throwing data around in memory, in which case it > is memory bandwidth that's the bottleneck... -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 14:25:59 2006 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy Ali) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 10:25:59 -0400 Subject: Wiki spam In-Reply-To: <44F27329.9010002-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg@public.gmane.org> References: <44F22722.4040905@utoronto.ca> <44F27329.9010002@telly.org> Message-ID: <1e55af990608280725r7e0d7220s3bcf31dce85dacb3@mail.gmail.com> On 8/28/06, Evan Leibovitch wrote: > Jamon Camisso wrote: > > > Anyone seen the talk page for the main page on gtalug.org? I'm not > > sure the urls that have been added bear posting, but suffice to say > > that the content on the entire talk page should meet with a swift demise. > > > > http://gtalug.org/wiki/Talk:Main_Page Seneca has taken care of this.. *hugs* > At least that garbage is visible. > > A site I was managing not long ago had its top index page appended-to > with a few hundred links; the author had written the HTML so that they > would be invisible to human readers, but visible to Googlebots and > others looking for such links. > > I see this as becoming an increasingly pervasive problem as CMSs, blogs > and interactive sites become more common. It's times like this when the > Drupal anti-spam module looks really good. It's not a problem anymore: Bad Behavior is a set of PHP scripts which automatically blocks harvesters, spam bots, and other funky stuff BEFORE they can even see the content of the site. http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Bad_Behavior_extension http://www.homelandstupidity.us/software/bad-behavior/installing-and-using-bad-behavior/on-mediawiki/ My notes: http://jrandomhacker.info/Bad_Behavior I've been holding off on installing this for the gtalug wiki because I didn't fully trust it. I've had it installed for a while on my own site, and I'm confident enough to allow open and anonymous editing. Anyone who is serious about their wiki/blog/site should be using Bad Behavio(u)r. I'll take some time soon and get it installed for gtalug.. I hate seeing people waste time, energy and emotion on spam. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 14:49:05 2006 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy Ali) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 10:49:05 -0400 Subject: Putting it all in RAM (was: comparing CPU's) Message-ID: <1e55af990608280749w64f86f41pe87bb86309c2c6e9@mail.gmail.com> On 8/28/06, ted leslie wrote: > I got the 9GB of ram because I am planning to install a vmware install > of a linux into a RAM disk (i.e. whole OS in RAM) just to see what it > would be like. I was thinking of something similar (but for other reasons). There are IDE devices which are volatile memory-based. I wonder how the costs compare.. .. I want to do something similar.. but with a 486. =) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davec-zxk95TxsVYDyHADnj0MGvQC/G2K4zDHf at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 15:06:28 2006 From: davec-zxk95TxsVYDyHADnj0MGvQC/G2K4zDHf at public.gmane.org (Dave Cramer) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 11:06:28 -0400 Subject: Putting it all in RAM (was: comparing CPU's) In-Reply-To: <1e55af990608280749w64f86f41pe87bb86309c2c6e9-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <1e55af990608280749w64f86f41pe87bb86309c2c6e9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Ted's example is more desktop based. Which I agree CPU is not a big deal, I'm really more interested in the bleeding edge of server CPU technology. My concerns are addressed mostly by Chris' reply, but am curious about power consumption, and heat dissipation as well. Opterons are well known for their alternate use as small heaters, but this is somewhat the price to be paid for speed. My suspicion is that as the Intel CPU's catch up in the speed arena, they will also consume proportionally more power. Chris' reply pointed out an oft ignored bit about memory bandwidth. Servers are primarily all about moving bits to and from a disk, so raw CPU isn't as important. Dave On 28-Aug-06, at 10:49 AM, Sy Ali wrote: > On 8/28/06, ted leslie wrote: >> I got the 9GB of ram because I am planning to install a vmware >> install >> of a linux into a RAM disk (i.e. whole OS in RAM) just to see what it >> would be like. > > I was thinking of something similar (but for other reasons). There > are IDE devices which are volatile memory-based. I wonder how the > costs compare.. > > .. I want to do something similar.. but with a 486. =) > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 15:27:07 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 11:27:07 -0400 Subject: Putting it all in RAM (was: comparing CPU's) In-Reply-To: References: <1e55af990608280749w64f86f41pe87bb86309c2c6e9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20060828152707.GU13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Mon, Aug 28, 2006 at 11:06:28AM -0400, Dave Cramer wrote: > Ted's example is more desktop based. Which I agree CPU is not a big > deal, I'm really more interested in the bleeding edge of server CPU > technology. > > My concerns are addressed mostly by Chris' reply, but am curious > about power consumption, and heat dissipation as well. Opterons are > well known for their alternate use as small heaters, but this is > somewhat the price to be paid for speed. Compared to the xeon's the opterons are very cool running. The latest xeon's on the other hand are fairly even with the opterons on power consumption, although it depends which opteron model you look at since they ahve low power versions, as well as a few that are higher power use at the top end of speed. > My suspicion is that as the Intel CPU's catch up in the speed arena, > they will also consume proportionally more power. Chris' reply > pointed out an oft ignored bit about memory bandwidth. Servers are > primarily all about moving bits to and from a disk, so raw CPU isn't > as important. Intel's latest chip runs significantly faster than their previous chip, and uses about half the power. I do not expect power consumption to go up any more. people aren't willing to feed their computer from a dedicated 15A outlet after all, with a seperate outlet for peripherals. Even intel has now figured that out, and ATI and nVidia are also seemingly figuring out that people don't want video cards that need their own power brick and sound like a vacuum cleaner. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 15:30:59 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 11:30:59 -0400 Subject: 32 bit vs 64 bit In-Reply-To: <4.1.20060823102432.047d0fb0-RHHtw29w69GEogu45VfRew@public.gmane.org> References: <20060820192949.GA9301@lemming.cita.utoronto.ca> <44E8B588.6080505@rogers.com> <20060820192949.GA9301@lemming.cita.utoronto.ca> <4.1.20060823102432.047d0fb0@misconsult.com> Message-ID: <20060828153059.GV13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 23, 2006 at 10:24:35AM -0400, Russell wrote: > Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. http://tlug.ss.org/wiki/Mailing_lists it says how you can unsubscribe. Replying to every message is only going to get people to think you are amazingly lazy and/or stupid. The link for how to unsubscribe may be broken, but it wasn't hard to find by just going to the main web site of the url of the broken link. ------- Now can someone please fix the link at the bottom of all messages to point to that instead of a broken link? -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 15:32:16 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 11:32:16 -0400 Subject: [GW-C] Re:Tom's HW Guide: Linux for gaming In-Reply-To: <44F18174.9070206-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44BAF994.8080401@telly.org> <44DA2D20.1080107@georgetown.wehave.net> <4.1.20060823102421.047d1c30@misconsult.com> <44F18174.9070206@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20060828153216.GW13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Sun, Aug 27, 2006 at 07:26:44AM -0400, James Knott wrote: > Russell wrote: > > *Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. > > Please read the instructions for unsubscribing, as shown at the bottom > of the messages. The link is broken and should instead be: http://tlug.ss.org/wiki/Mailing_lists It has been broken for years. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 15:48:25 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 11:48:25 -0400 Subject: [GW-C] Re:Tom's HW Guide: Linux for gaming In-Reply-To: <20060828153216.GW13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <44BAF994.8080401@telly.org> <44DA2D20.1080107@georgetown.wehave.net> <4.1.20060823102421.047d1c30@misconsult.com> <44F18174.9070206@rogers.com> <20060828153216.GW13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Sun, Aug 27, 2006 at 07:26:44AM -0400, James Knott wrote: >> Russell wrote: >>> *Please REMOVE this address from your mailing list. >> Please read the instructions for unsubscribing, as shown at the bottom >> of the messages. > > The link is broken and should instead be: > http://tlug.ss.org/wiki/Mailing_lists > > It has been broken for years. I'm sure I wasn't the only one who sent our spammer a polite and personal message with instructions as to how to unsubscribe. The strange thing is that he replied to multiple messages which must have been a fair amount of work--work that while it should not have to be done, could easily have been done to find the proper instructions. Strange. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 16:01:21 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 12:01:21 -0400 Subject: comparing CPU's In-Reply-To: <13E6EC4F-F447-4DE8-9E62-DC369192D4FD-zxk95TxsVYDyHADnj0MGvQC/G2K4zDHf@public.gmane.org> References: <13E6EC4F-F447-4DE8-9E62-DC369192D4FD@visibleassets.com> Message-ID: <20060828160121.GX13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Sun, Aug 27, 2006 at 11:10:34AM -0400, Dave Cramer wrote: > Now that Intel finally has something to compare to the Opteron, I'm > wondering how to compare them. > > The problem is there are far too many variables. > > One of the common complaints of the Opteron is that it runs too hot. > So power consumption is one important factor. > > From what I can gather from various sources the latest Intel > processor Woodcrest ? consumes considerably more current than any > other Intel processor, so I'd guess it will run hot as well. > > Does anyone have a firm grasp on all of the various factors here ? > > I did try tomshardware.com, but a direct comparison between an > opteron and woodcrest is not available yet. I suspect many are waiting for the new socket F opterons, which are supposed to reduce power consumption as well, before doing comparisons. The new xeon does use less power than the old one, and runs faster. It still has the same bottleneck to deal with in multi cpu systems of course, that the opteron doesn't have. Of course the opteron also comes in HE (high efficiency) versions which reduces power consumption quite a bit. They are often used in blade servers for that reason. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 16:25:28 2006 From: interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (Interlug) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 12:25:28 -0400 Subject: KWLUG: An evening with Dr. Peter H. Salus Message-ID: <1156782328.29303.46.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hello LUG folks, The September KWLUG meeting will be upon us in a fortnight. (Sorry, I've just always wanted to use the word fortnight in an email) Q: What do you get when you cross a comprehensive UNIX encyclopedia with your favourite Uncle? A: A delightful evening of UNIX and Linux history and anecdotes! Date: Monday 11 September 2006 Time: 7:00pm (doors and ad-hoc conversation at 6:00) Topic: UNIX and Linux - Anecdotes you haven't heard Where: KWLUG at 43 Queen Street S, Kitchener ON [1] Who: Open to all with an interest in UNIX, Linux and Open Source Cost: Free, as in 'gratis' If you have not yet met Peter Salus, you owe it to yourself to attend the KWLUG meeting in September. Peter is known as The UNIX Historian and has witnessed most of the history of UNIX and Linux by taking an active role in forming it. To describe Peter as an author is accurate as he has penned such classics as _The Big Book of Ipv6 Addressing RFCs_ and _A Quarter Century of UNIX_. But that doesn't tell the whole story of Peter as he has also been a professor, a dean, a journalist, executive, pundit, raconteur... You can find Dr. Salus' current work in progress, _A History of Free and Open Source: The Daemon, The GNU & The Penguin_ at Groklaw [2] _A History of Free and Open Source: The Daemon, The GNU & The Penguin_ is published under a Creative Commons License [3] You will be entertained, educated and delighted by Dr. Salus at the KWLUG meeting in September. The members of KWLUG welcome you to attend any and all of our meetings, but we know you'll really be kicking yourself if you miss this one. [1] http://maps.google.com/maps?q=43+Queen+Street+S.+kitchener+on&hl=en [2] http://www.groklaw.net/staticpages/index.php?page=20051013231901859 [3] http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-nd/2.0/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tleslie-RBVUpeUoHUc at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 16:35:23 2006 From: tleslie-RBVUpeUoHUc at public.gmane.org (ted leslie) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 12:35:23 -0400 Subject: Putting it all in RAM (was: comparing CPU's) In-Reply-To: <1e55af990608280749w64f86f41pe87bb86309c2c6e9-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <1e55af990608280749w64f86f41pe87bb86309c2c6e9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1156782923.28407.250.camel@stan64.site> >I was thinking of something similar (but for other reasons). There > are IDE devices which are volatile memory-based. I wonder how the > costs compare.. the new i-ram (by gigabyte) has been announced for ages, but apparently not out yet, TYAN has a MOBO with 16 ram slots, and 2GB modules are not to bad if ordered from the US, in canada they want 2-4X the $$$ for 2GB, we are just way behind here in buying large aftermarket 2GB modules, if you get a tyan with 16 slots, you can fit it with 32GB (16 x 2GB) modules at 333Mhz, i have got 2 GB acer ECC's (mail order from US) for about 370$ CND, which isn't to bad. The i-ram(1) was limited by PATA transfer rates i think, i-ram(2) is sata, but it still will not be as good as if the "OS in RAM" is in system ram, as apposed to in a i-ram device. A sata is 1.5GBits i think, where as system ram can be many GBytes, so perhaps still a factor of 10 in transfer between "real" ram and i-ram (on a sata) device. the problem with puttin lotsa ram in a mobo, is that they have power draw issues, and will only allow max. population if modules are NOT stacked and are single rank. Most moduiles are stacked (double the chips, more power draw but cheaper to make), so the MOBO (in case of tyan), will down grade the clock to 333Mhz if you exceed the rank value. The tyan that has 16 slots, can be populated to a max. of 24GB and retain the 400Mhz DDR speed. if you want 32 GB then its down to 333Mhz. I am not going to exceed 9GB until i experiment and see the benefits, then buy more ram as required. Even with the new Vista requirements, it doesnt seem like many people will have to buy 2GB modules still for at least another OS/System generation, so the 16 slot tyan is great if you want to fit it with just 1GB modules and have 16GB of ram (at 333mhz) which still isnt to bad, you can run a few OS (in xen/vmware) and do other things. i think the i-ram is about 300$ cnd, when it comes out, and it has a battery (not sure if its an option). The i-ram is more for the typical win-tel user who wants a easy boost, they are directed to install windows into the i-ram device. -tl On Mon, 2006-08-28 at 10:49 -0400, Sy Ali wrote: > On 8/28/06, ted leslie wrote: > > I got the 9GB of ram because I am planning to install a vmware install > > of a linux into a RAM disk (i.e. whole OS in RAM) just to see what it > > would be like. > > I was thinking of something similar (but for other reasons). There > are IDE devices which are volatile memory-based. I wonder how the > costs compare.. > > .. I want to do something similar.. but with a 486. =) > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 16:47:16 2006 From: mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Merv Curley) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 12:47:16 -0400 Subject: apt-get update In-Reply-To: <1f13df280608280513x1fc9f964mc697278084564c07-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <200608271946.52110.mervc@eol.ca> <1f13df280608280513x1fc9f964mc697278084564c07@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200608281247.16609.mervc@eol.ca> On Monday 28 August 2006 08:13, Giles Orr wrote: > Hi Merv (and TLUG). > Sorry Giles, you missed my question. When one does an 'apt-get update' the data that comes in must go to a file somewhere. In /var/cache/apt/ or ?. Else how could you use that data for a week or two or 6? I want to be able to tell my pal in Japan where to look to see if that file is there. When I do an 'update' and then do it a second time shortly after, my second one takes almost no time since there is nothing to change, I guess. At 2 Kb/s or less, it takes him an hour to do the update and would take equally long to try to install even a small program. When he did the update last time and it apparently disappeared, he did it again the next day. It took an hour again, I would have thought there were very few things to change and would take just minutes. An upgrade is out of the question, he only gets 4 hours a month for many many yen. He would like to able to be able to see how many dependencies there are for an install, something that adept and kpackage etc will tell him. > > There are several programs that can be used to work with the packages > on a Debian-based system. Regards -- Merv Curley Toronto, Ont. Can Kanotix Linux Ver 2005-4 Desktop KDE 3.5.1 KMail 1.2 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 17:05:55 2006 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy Ali) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 12:05:55 -0500 Subject: Putting it all in RAM (was: comparing CPU's) In-Reply-To: <1156782923.28407.250.camel-Wos4hdNTH4j6K7/ahGyk6A@public.gmane.org> References: <1e55af990608280749w64f86f41pe87bb86309c2c6e9@mail.gmail.com> <1156782923.28407.250.camel@stan64.site> Message-ID: <1e55af990608281005y1bc78ddahd23de8e13a0644d1@mail.gmail.com> On 8/28/06, ted leslie wrote: > >I was thinking of something similar (but for other reasons). There > > are IDE devices which are volatile memory-based. I wonder how the > > costs compare.. > > the new i-ram (by gigabyte) has been announced for ages, but apparently > not out yet, No, it's out. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16815168001 $112.99 USD -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 17:08:14 2006 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 13:08:14 -0400 Subject: apt-get update In-Reply-To: <200608281247.16609.mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200608271946.52110.mervc@eol.ca> <1f13df280608280513x1fc9f964mc697278084564c07@mail.gmail.com> <200608281247.16609.mervc@eol.ca> Message-ID: On 8/28/06, Merv Curley wrote: > > > it takes him an hour to do the update and would take equally > long to try to install even a small program. When he did the update last > time and it apparently disappeared, he did it again the next day. It took > an > hour again, I would have thought there were very few things to change and > would take just minutes. have you considered mailing him a debian DVD ? packed with goodness, it is ! (we have it local, if you need a copy.. that'll be $9 please) djp -- djp-tnsZcVQxgqO2dHQpreyxbg at public.gmane.org www.linuxcaffe.ca 326 Harbord Street, Toronto, M6G 3A5, (416) 534-2116 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 18:36:44 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 14:36:44 -0400 Subject: Putting it all in RAM (was: comparing CPU's) In-Reply-To: <1156782923.28407.250.camel-Wos4hdNTH4j6K7/ahGyk6A@public.gmane.org> References: <1e55af990608280749w64f86f41pe87bb86309c2c6e9@mail.gmail.com> <1156782923.28407.250.camel@stan64.site> Message-ID: <20060828183644.GY13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Mon, Aug 28, 2006 at 12:35:23PM -0400, ted leslie wrote: > the problem with puttin lotsa ram in a mobo, is that they have power > draw issues, and will only allow max. population if modules are NOT > stacked and are single rank. > Most moduiles are stacked (double the chips, more power draw but cheaper > to make), > so the MOBO (in case of tyan), will down grade the clock to 333Mhz > if you exceed the rank value. > The tyan that has 16 slots, can be populated to a max. of 24GB and > retain the 400Mhz DDR speed. if you want 32 GB then its down to 333Mhz. > I am not going to exceed 9GB until i experiment and see the benefits, > then buy more ram as required. 9GB seems like an odd amount. How are you distributing that? As far as I know, the opteron systems give best performance when each cpu has the same amount of ram and the same amount of ram on each of the two channels per cpu, so in you case I would think 2GB per channel per cpu would make sense, unless you happen to have some 256MB sticks you are trying to use too giving 2.25GB per channel per cpu. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 18:38:55 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 14:38:55 -0400 Subject: apt-get update In-Reply-To: <200608281247.16609.mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200608271946.52110.mervc@eol.ca> <1f13df280608280513x1fc9f964mc697278084564c07@mail.gmail.com> <200608281247.16609.mervc@eol.ca> Message-ID: <20060828183854.GZ13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Mon, Aug 28, 2006 at 12:47:16PM -0400, Merv Curley wrote: > Sorry Giles, you missed my question. When one does an 'apt-get update' the > data that comes in must go to a file somewhere. In /var/cache/apt/ or ?. > Else how could you use that data for a week or two or 6? I want to be able > to tell my pal in Japan where to look to see if that file is there. /var/lib/apt/lists/ > When I do an 'update' and then do it a second time shortly after, my second > one takes almost no time since there is nothing to change, I guess. At 2 > Kb/s or less, it takes him an hour to do the update and would take equally > long to try to install even a small program. When he did the update last > time and it apparently disappeared, he did it again the next day. It took an > hour again, I would have thought there were very few things to change and > would take just minutes. > > An upgrade is out of the question, he only gets 4 hours a month for many many > yen. He would like to able to be able to see how many dependencies there are > for an install, something that adept and kpackage etc will tell him. Well fortunately etch and future debian's now transfer diff's rather than the complete Packages file, which makes apt-get update run much faster for most people after getting the whole file the first time. Should help a lot in general. Sarge and older transfer the whole Packages file every time it changes (but only when it has changed). -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From geofm-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 18:48:16 2006 From: geofm-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (geofm-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 14:48:16 -0400 Subject: apt-get update Message-ID: <20060828184816.PHGV18394.tomts5-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp1.sympatico.ca> > > From: "Giles Orr" > Date: 2006/08/28 Mon AM 08:13:22 EST > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: apt-get update > > Hi Merv (and TLUG). > > On 8/27/06, Merv Curley wrote: > > A friend of mine has spent an hour on dialup doing the above. When he started > > adept he had a list of new packages and upgrades to installed packages. > > > > When he started adept the next day it only showed installed packages. I > > assume that what he got from the update is in a file somewhere on his > > computer? > > > > I've never had this happen, but this guy, a newbie, is forever doing something > > and causing him and me, problems. Me cuz I'm supposed to have these answers > > and a lot of the time I am clueless. > > There are several programs that can be used to work with the packages > on a Debian-based system. The most commonly used is "apt-get". I > tend to use "aptitude", which shares a lot of common command line > switches. These common command line switches have a different > behaviour than similar sounding things with "yum" under FC, which can > cause confusion. "aptitude update" or "apt-get update" doesn't > install any packages: it checks the repositories to get information, > primarily lists of new versions of software that are available. > That's all. You should always run it before you try to install any > software. The command I'm guessing you're looking for is "apt-get > upgrade" which looks at your system and upgrades any packages that you > have that are older than what's available. "yum update" on an FC > system is the same as "apt-get update ; apt-get upgrade" on a Debian > system. Be warned that running "upgrade" over dialup is an extremely > long process - you can be looking at _days_ if your system decides > Open Office is in need of an upgrade. Consider doing single > security-critical packages by hand. > > Hope this helps. > > -- > Giles > http://www.gilesorr.com/ > gilesorr-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org But, be careful doing an apt-get upgrade. I've trashed 2 Debian based distros doing this. And at least with Kanotix Easter-RC4 the Debian repositories they use are so flaky that even installing a simple applet leads to trashing CUPS and other things. > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 19:00:25 2006 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 15:00:25 -0400 Subject: Planet Linuxcaffe RSS Syndication Message-ID: So I've setup an rss feed on http://linuxcaffe.ca from 5 or 6 of the various people on the mailing-list who I noticed have a website with a functional aggregator. You can view the html version on the linuxcaffe website itself here: http://www.linuxcaffe.ca/planet You can add the feed to your favourite akregator ;) program using this url: http://www.linuxcaffe.ca/planet-linuxcaffe-feed If you would like your feed added, by all means, contact us! Once we reach a suitable number of incoming feeds from users, we'll break things down into specific categories and associated feeds, but for now, enjoy the raw jumble of xml goodness :) Thanks to Colin for the Feb. issue of Linux Journal that had an article on Planet-some-such-thing syndication that gave us the idea. Jamon -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tleslie-RBVUpeUoHUc at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 19:53:01 2006 From: tleslie-RBVUpeUoHUc at public.gmane.org (ted leslie) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 15:53:01 -0400 Subject: Putting it all in RAM (was: comparing CPU's) In-Reply-To: <20060828183644.GY13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <1e55af990608280749w64f86f41pe87bb86309c2c6e9@mail.gmail.com> <1156782923.28407.250.camel@stan64.site> <20060828183644.GY13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <1156794781.28407.275.camel@stan64.site> 2 x 2GB on one cpu 2 x 2 GB on the other, and 2 x 512MB oddly enough my current tyan (not the 16 slot one), has 4 slots for one cpu and 2 slots for the other, for a total of 6, a bit odd, but its not really a high end server board, more good workstation board. -tl On Mon, 2006-08-28 at 14:36 -0400, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Mon, Aug 28, 2006 at 12:35:23PM -0400, ted leslie wrote: > > the problem with puttin lotsa ram in a mobo, is that they have power > > draw issues, and will only allow max. population if modules are NOT > > stacked and are single rank. > > Most moduiles are stacked (double the chips, more power draw but cheaper > > to make), > > so the MOBO (in case of tyan), will down grade the clock to 333Mhz > > if you exceed the rank value. > > The tyan that has 16 slots, can be populated to a max. of 24GB and > > retain the 400Mhz DDR speed. if you want 32 GB then its down to 333Mhz. > > I am not going to exceed 9GB until i experiment and see the benefits, > > then buy more ram as required. > > 9GB seems like an odd amount. How are you distributing that? As far as > I know, the opteron systems give best performance when each cpu has the > same amount of ram and the same amount of ram on each of the two > channels per cpu, so in you case I would think 2GB per channel per cpu > would make sense, unless you happen to have some 256MB sticks you are > trying to use too giving 2.25GB per channel per cpu. > > -- > Len Sorensen > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From wattst-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 20:28:37 2006 From: wattst-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Tom Watts) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 16:28:37 -0400 Subject: Getting my CD burner working Message-ID: <44F351F5.6050705@uoguelph.ca> Hi all, I have a CD burner that has worked under Linux before, from Red Hat 9 up to Fedora Core 2, but has been unable to write to CDs since then. Reading is no problem and I can write CDs under Windows, although it almost always messes up writing iso images (I know this because of Fedora's media check). I'm not really sure where to start, but here is the output of su -c 'cdrecord -scanbus': Cdrecord-Clone 2.01.01a03-dvd (i686-pc-linux-gnu) Copyright (C) 1995-2005 J?rg Schilling [...] Using libscg version 'schily-0.8'. scsibus1: 1,0,0 100) 'CyberDrv' 'CW088D CD-R/RW ' '15HF' Removable CD-ROM 1,1,0 101) 'DVD ROM ' 'CI-BDV316E ' '0052' Removable CD-ROM 1,2,0 102) * [...] Using cdrecord, even as root, always fails. I've recently been thinking about upgrading to a DVD burner in hoping that it'll solve the problem in the process, but want to see if this one is broken or just improperly configured before going down the upgrade path. If more info is needed, please let me know. TIA for any help. -- Tom Watts wattst-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 20:40:47 2006 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 16:40:47 -0400 Subject: Getting my CD burner working In-Reply-To: <44F351F5.6050705-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <44F351F5.6050705@uoguelph.ca> Message-ID: <20060828204047.GA17813@wp.magstar.net> On Mon, Aug 28, 2006 at 04:28:37PM -0400, Tom Watts wrote: > Hi all, > > I have a CD burner that has worked under Linux before, from Red Hat 9 up > to Fedora Core 2, but has been unable to write to CDs since then. > Reading is no problem and I can write CDs under Windows, although it > almost always messes up writing iso images (I know this because of > Fedora's media check). I'm not really sure where to start, but here is > the output of su -c 'cdrecord -scanbus': > > Cdrecord-Clone 2.01.01a03-dvd (i686-pc-linux-gnu) Copyright (C) > 1995-2005 J?rg Schilling > [...] > Using libscg version 'schily-0.8'. > scsibus1: > 1,0,0 100) 'CyberDrv' 'CW088D CD-R/RW ' '15HF' Removable CD-ROM > 1,1,0 101) 'DVD ROM ' 'CI-BDV316E ' '0052' Removable CD-ROM > 1,2,0 102) * > [...] > > Using cdrecord, even as root, always fails. I've recently been thinking > about upgrading to a DVD burner in hoping that it'll solve the problem > in the process, but want to see if this one is broken or just improperly > configured before going down the upgrade path. If more info is needed, > please let me know. TIA for any help. >From top of my head, cdrecord dev=/dev/hdc driveropts=burnfree file.iso -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 20:40:57 2006 From: mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Merv Curley) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 16:40:57 -0400 Subject: apt-get update In-Reply-To: <20060828183854.GZ13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <200608271946.52110.mervc@eol.ca> <200608281247.16609.mervc@eol.ca> <20060828183854.GZ13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <200608281640.57896.mervc@eol.ca> On Monday 28 August 2006 14:38, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Mon, Aug 28, 2006 at 12:47:16PM -0400, Merv Curley wrote: > > Sorry Giles, you missed my question. When one does an 'apt-get update' > > the data that comes in must go to a file somewhere. In /var/cache/apt/ or > > ?. Else how could you use that data for a week or two or 6? I want to > > be able to tell my pal in Japan where to look to see if that file is > > there. > > /var/lib/apt/lists/ > Thanks Lennart, just the thing I was hoping a Debian guru would know. > > Well fortunately etch and future debian's now transfer diff's rather > than the complete Packages file, which makes apt-get update run much > faster for most people after getting the whole file the first time. > Should help a lot in general. Sarge and older transfer the whole > Packages file every time it changes (but only when it has changed). > > -- The Kanotix he is using is Debian etch from about May 1 with KDE 3.5.2 and kernel 2.6.16. I'll watch my own file now that i know where tis. -- Merv Curley Toronto, Ont. Can Kanotix Linux Ver 2005-4 Desktop KDE 3.5.1 KMail 1.2 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 20:54:09 2006 From: meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org (Meng Cheah) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 16:54:09 -0400 Subject: apt-get update In-Reply-To: <20060828183854.GZ13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <200608271946.52110.mervc@eol.ca> <1f13df280608280513x1fc9f964mc697278084564c07@mail.gmail.com> <200608281247.16609.mervc@eol.ca> <20060828183854.GZ13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <44F357F1.1080902@pppoe.ca> Lennart Sorensen wrote: >On Mon, Aug 28, 2006 at 12:47:16PM -0400, Merv Curley wrote: > > >>Sorry Giles, you missed my question. When one does an 'apt-get update' the >>data that comes in must go to a file somewhere. In /var/cache/apt/ or ?. >>Else how could you use that data for a week or two or 6? I want to be able >>to tell my pal in Japan where to look to see if that file is there. >> >> > >/var/lib/apt/lists/ > > > Thank you. I read the post and thought "/var/cache/apt/archives". Ran "apt-get update, upgrade, autoclean and clean" while checking the above directory. Realized that wasn't it and started to read the APT HOWTO. Thanks again :-) >>When I do an 'update' and then do it a second time shortly after, my second >>one takes almost no time since there is nothing to change, I guess. At 2 >>Kb/s or less, it takes him an hour to do the update and would take equally >>long to try to install even a small program. When he did the update last >>time and it apparently disappeared, he did it again the next day. It took an >>hour again, I would have thought there were very few things to change and >>would take just minutes. >> >>An upgrade is out of the question, he only gets 4 hours a month for many many >>yen. He would like to able to be able to see how many dependencies there are >>for an install, something that adept and kpackage etc will tell him. >> >> > >Well fortunately etch and future debian's now transfer diff's rather >than the complete Packages file, which makes apt-get update run much >faster for most people after getting the whole file the first time. >Should help a lot in general. Sarge and older transfer the whole >Packages file every time it changes (but only when it has changed). > >-- >Len Sorensen >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 20:51:43 2006 From: mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Merv Curley) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 16:51:43 -0400 Subject: apt-get update In-Reply-To: References: <200608271946.52110.mervc@eol.ca> <200608281247.16609.mervc@eol.ca> Message-ID: <200608281651.43348.mervc@eol.ca> On Monday 28 August 2006 13:08, David J Patrick wrote: > On 8/28/06, Merv Curley wrote: > > it takes him an hour to do the update and would take equally > > long to try to install even a small program. When he did the update last > > time and it apparently disappeared, he did it again the next day. It > > took an > > hour again, I would have thought there were very few things to change and > > would take just minutes. > > have you considered mailing him a debian DVD ? > packed with goodness, it is ! > (we have it local, if you need a copy.. that'll be $9 please) > djp Well I did mail him the Kanotix distro to get him from KDE 3.4.x to 3.5.2. But he now is several months behind again. However his demands are not high so he doesn't need the latest. I have considered making a CD of my upgrade cache but he wants some 'ham' software that I will have to add first. Soon as i do that, there will be a new release, I just know it. What you're offering is a Debian install CD / DVD? I don't know how easy it would be to upgrade Kanotix from that. I installed a new Debian but missed all the special utils etc that come with a Distro. It is now overwritten by PC-BCD. Not too impressed with FreeBSD so far. Regards -- Merv Curley Toronto, Ont. Can Kanotix Linux Ver 2005-4 Desktop KDE 3.5.1 KMail 1.2 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 20:58:50 2006 From: mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Merv Curley) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 16:58:50 -0400 Subject: apt-get update In-Reply-To: <20060828184816.PHGV18394.tomts5-srv.bellnexxia.net-S6HM6mcWxYWbHxUYzX/Bp7Dks+cytr/Z@public.gmane.org> References: <20060828184816.PHGV18394.tomts5-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp1.sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <200608281658.51000.mervc@eol.ca> On Monday 28 August 2006 14:48, geofm-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org wrote: > > But, be careful doing an apt-get upgrade. I've trashed 2 Debian based > distros doing this. And at least with Kanotix Easter-RC4 the Debian > repositories they use are so flaky that even installing a simple applet > leads to trashing CUPS and other things. > Well I have had the opposite experience, 3 dist-upgrades and no problems. Born under a lucky star for the month of Aug. Might not go so well in Sept. Oh yes, I haven't found the magic of getting printing working either. I am trying on one computer to configure a 10 year old HP printer that has never been a problem with the foomatic-pcl3 driver. But that started before any upgrading. Cheerio -- Merv Curley Toronto, Ont. Can Kanotix Linux Ver 2006- Desktop KDE 3.5.1 KMail 1.2 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 21:37:05 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:37:05 -0400 Subject: Putting it all in RAM (was: comparing CPU's) In-Reply-To: <1156794781.28407.275.camel-Wos4hdNTH4j6K7/ahGyk6A@public.gmane.org> References: <1e55af990608280749w64f86f41pe87bb86309c2c6e9@mail.gmail.com> <1156782923.28407.250.camel@stan64.site> <20060828183644.GY13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <1156794781.28407.275.camel@stan64.site> Message-ID: <20060828213705.GA13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Mon, Aug 28, 2006 at 03:53:01PM -0400, ted leslie wrote: > 2 x 2GB on one cpu > > 2 x 2 GB on the other, and 2 x 512MB > > oddly enough my current tyan (not the 16 slot one), > has 4 slots for one cpu and 2 slots for the other, for a total of 6, > a bit odd, but its not really a high end server board, more good > workstation board. I have seen Asus boards like that too. They still recomended that for optimal perforamnce, each channel have the same amount of ram, so for example you could have 4 * 1GB on one cpu and 2 * 2GB on the other. It means if you started with 4 * 1GB in the system, you could upgrade by moving that all to the cpu with 4 sockets, and putting two new 2GB modules on the second cpu and still have it balanced. Of course you are not required to do this, and the extra 1 cycle latency to get to the memory on the other cpu isn't really that big a deal for most users I imagine. As the NUMA support in linux gets better and better, it may become a non issue, if the kernel simply recognizes that a program using a lot of memory is better to place on the cpu that has the most memory directly connected. I don't think it is that smart yet though. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 22:02:35 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 18:02:35 -0400 Subject: Getting my CD burner working In-Reply-To: <44F351F5.6050705-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <44F351F5.6050705@uoguelph.ca> Message-ID: <20060828220235.GB13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Mon, Aug 28, 2006 at 04:28:37PM -0400, Tom Watts wrote: > I have a CD burner that has worked under Linux before, from Red Hat 9 up > to Fedora Core 2, but has been unable to write to CDs since then. > Reading is no problem and I can write CDs under Windows, although it > almost always messes up writing iso images (I know this because of > Fedora's media check). I'm not really sure where to start, but here is > the output of su -c 'cdrecord -scanbus': If windows creates bad CDs according to the media check, then most likely you are using bad media (or media your drive doesn't like) or the burner is failing. > Cdrecord-Clone 2.01.01a03-dvd (i686-pc-linux-gnu) Copyright (C) > 1995-2005 J?rg Schilling > [...] > Using libscg version 'schily-0.8'. > scsibus1: > 1,0,0 100) 'CyberDrv' 'CW088D CD-R/RW ' '15HF' Removable CD-ROM > 1,1,0 101) 'DVD ROM ' 'CI-BDV316E ' '0052' Removable CD-ROM > 1,2,0 102) * > [...] > > Using cdrecord, even as root, always fails. I've recently been thinking > about upgrading to a DVD burner in hoping that it'll solve the problem > in the process, but want to see if this one is broken or just improperly > configured before going down the upgrade path. If more info is needed, > please let me know. TIA for any help. On a modern system (using a 2.6 kernel and no ide-scsi emulation garbage loaded), you should have to do something like: cdrecord -scanbus -dev ATAPI: To use a drive you should do: cdrecord -dev ATAPI:/dev/hdc ... Works for me. Now hopefully sometime soon libata for pata will get merged into the 2.6 kernel, after which all devices should show up as scsi, and cdrecord should be happy again without stupid ATAPI options. For writing DVDs, you would do: growisofs -Z /dev/hdc=file.iso or growisofs -Z /dev/hdc -J -R -othermkisofsoptions /path/to/files/to/burn or replace -Z with -M to append to a disc made with the above line. Personally I am very happy with my plextor drives, since at least for DVD drives being able to update the firmware to support new brands of disc properly is quite handy, and plextor is the only make I know of that has a linux tool for updating firmware. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 22:31:02 2006 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins Witteman) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 18:31:02 -0400 Subject: apt-get update In-Reply-To: <200608281658.51000.mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20060828184816.PHGV18394.tomts5-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp1.sympatico.ca> <200608281658.51000.mervc@eol.ca> Message-ID: <20060828223101.GA8408@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> On Mon, Aug 28, 2006 at 04:58:50PM -0400, Merv Curley wrote: >On Monday 28 August 2006 14:48, geofm-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org wrote: > >> >> But, be careful doing an apt-get upgrade. I've trashed 2 Debian based >> distros doing this. And at least with Kanotix Easter-RC4 the Debian >> repositories they use are so flaky that even installing a simple applet >> leads to trashing CUPS and other things. >> >Well I have had the opposite experience, 3 dist-upgrades and no problems. >Born under a lucky star for the month of Aug. Might not go so well in Sept. I suspect that this is a Kanotix issue. I don't know anything about Kanotix, but I suspect that it is different from stock Debian in *some* way, which may account for the problems. I have been running Debian on diverse hardware in both testing and stable branches for several years, and run apt-get dist-upgrade ~5 times per week per machine with no problems - including the change from XFree86 to X.org. YMMV, but I went with Debian years ago because, while not fanatical myself, I benefit from the Debian fanaticism for "correctness" and consistency and license compliance. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From wattst-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 28 23:31:09 2006 From: wattst-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Tom Watts) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 19:31:09 -0400 Subject: Getting my CD burner working In-Reply-To: <20060828220235.GB13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <44F351F5.6050705@uoguelph.ca> <20060828220235.GB13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <44F37CBD.2010609@uoguelph.ca> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > If windows creates bad CDs according to the media check, then most > likely you are using bad media (or media your drive doesn't like) or the > burner is failing. > > > On a modern system (using a 2.6 kernel and no ide-scsi emulation garbage > loaded), you should have to do something like: > > cdrecord -scanbus -dev ATAPI: > > To use a drive you should do: > cdrecord -dev ATAPI:/dev/hdc ... > > Works for me. Now hopefully sometime soon libata for pata will get > merged into the 2.6 kernel, after which all devices should show up as > scsi, and cdrecord should be happy again without stupid ATAPI options. > > For writing DVDs, you would do: > growisofs -Z /dev/hdc=file.iso > or > growisofs -Z /dev/hdc -J -R -othermkisofsoptions /path/to/files/to/burn > or replace -Z with -M to append to a disc made with the above line. > > Personally I am very happy with my plextor drives, since at least for > DVD drives being able to update the firmware to support new brands of > disc properly is quite handy, and plextor is the only make I know of > that has a linux tool for updating firmware. > > -- > Len Sorensen Thanks for the suggestion, this is as far as I get with it still apparently running and the lights on the burner haven't flashed once. # cdrecord -dev ATAPI:/dev/hdc file.iso cdrecord: No write mode specified. cdrecord: Asuming -tao mode. cdrecord: Future versions of cdrecord may have different drive dependent defaults. cdrecord: Continuing in 5 seconds... Cdrecord-Clone 2.01.01a03-dvd (i686-pc-linux-gnu) Copyright (C) 1995-2005 J?rg Schilling NOTE: This version contains the OSS DVD extensions for cdrtools and thus may have bugs related to DVD issues that are not present in the original cdrtools. Please send bug reports or support requests to http://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla The original cdrtools author should not be bothered with problems in this version. scsidev: 'ATAPI:/dev/hdc' devname: 'ATAPI:/dev/hdc' scsibus: -2 target: -2 lun: -2 Use of ATA is preferred over ATAPI. Warning: Using ATA Packet interface. Warning: The related Linux kernel interface code seems to be unmaintained. Warning: There is absolutely NO DMA, operations thus are slow. Using libscg version 'schily-0.8'. Device type : Removable CD-ROM Version : 0 Response Format: 1 Vendor_info : 'CyberDrv' Identifikation : 'CW088D CD-R/RW ' Revision : '15HF' Device seems to be: Generic mmc CD-RW. Using generic SCSI-3/mmc CD-R/CD-RW driver (mmc_cdr). Driver flags : MMC-2 SWABAUDIO BURNFREE Supported modes: TAO PACKET SAO SAO/R96P SAO/R96R RAW/R16 RAW/R96P RAW/R96R Does this look like a bad drive? -Tom -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From dwarmstrong-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 29 01:58:09 2006 From: dwarmstrong-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Daniel Armstrong) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:58:09 -0400 Subject: Planet Linuxcaffe RSS Syndication In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <61e9e2b10608281858m510791d7hb56dc7a52dc2cde6@mail.gmail.com> On 8/28/06, Jamon Camisso wrote: > So I've setup an rss feed on http://linuxcaffe.ca from 5 or 6 of the > various people on the mailing-list who I noticed have a website with a > functional aggregator. You can view the html version on the linuxcaffe > website itself here: http://www.linuxcaffe.ca/planet > > You can add the feed to your favourite akregator ;) program using this > url: http://www.linuxcaffe.ca/planet-linuxcaffe-feed > > If you would like your feed added, by all means, contact us! Good stuff... I was going to send you my 'biohackery' feed, but you beat me to it! :-) I would encourage any TLUG subscribers with online projects to submit their feeds... I like to hear what other people are working on, and a 'Planet Linuxcaffe' aggregator makes sense. -- Daniel Wayne Armstrong :: build it yourself biology http://biohackery.com :: -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 29 13:07:28 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 09:07:28 -0400 Subject: Getting my CD burner working In-Reply-To: <44F37CBD.2010609-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <44F351F5.6050705@uoguelph.ca> <20060828220235.GB13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44F37CBD.2010609@uoguelph.ca> Message-ID: <20060829130728.GC13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Mon, Aug 28, 2006 at 07:31:09PM -0400, Tom Watts wrote: > Thanks for the suggestion, this is as far as I get with it still > apparently running and the lights on the burner haven't flashed once. > > # cdrecord -dev ATAPI:/dev/hdc file.iso > cdrecord: No write mode specified. > cdrecord: Asuming -tao mode. > cdrecord: Future versions of cdrecord may have different drive dependent > defaults. > cdrecord: Continuing in 5 seconds... > Cdrecord-Clone 2.01.01a03-dvd (i686-pc-linux-gnu) Copyright (C) > 1995-2005 J?rg Schilling > NOTE: This version contains the OSS DVD extensions for cdrtools and thus may > have bugs related to DVD issues that are not present in the original > cdrtools. Please send bug reports or support requests to > http://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla The original cdrtools author > should > not be bothered with problems in this version. > scsidev: 'ATAPI:/dev/hdc' > devname: 'ATAPI:/dev/hdc' > scsibus: -2 target: -2 lun: -2 > Use of ATA is preferred over ATAPI. > Warning: Using ATA Packet interface. > Warning: The related Linux kernel interface code seems to be unmaintained. > Warning: There is absolutely NO DMA, operations thus are slow. > Using libscg version 'schily-0.8'. > Device type : Removable CD-ROM > Version : 0 > Response Format: 1 > Vendor_info : 'CyberDrv' > Identifikation : 'CW088D CD-R/RW ' > Revision : '15HF' > Device seems to be: Generic mmc CD-RW. > Using generic SCSI-3/mmc CD-R/CD-RW driver (mmc_cdr). > Driver flags : MMC-2 SWABAUDIO BURNFREE > Supported modes: TAO PACKET SAO SAO/R96P SAO/R96R RAW/R16 RAW/R96P RAW/R96R > > Does this look like a bad drive? What does it do after that? I also suggest avoiding the cdrecord with the broken dvd patch like the plague. It is useless, usually broken, and for burning DVD's dvd+rw-tools are much much much better. You can also try using -dev ATA:/dev/hdc instead. On some systems that works better. And of course make sure there is no ide-scsi listed in 'lsmod'. At least it is detecting the drive and lots of details about it. Which kernel version are you on? -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From wattst-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 29 13:49:24 2006 From: wattst-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Tom Watts) Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 09:49:24 -0400 Subject: Getting my CD burner working In-Reply-To: <20060829130728.GC13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <44F351F5.6050705@uoguelph.ca> <20060828220235.GB13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44F37CBD.2010609@uoguelph.ca> <20060829130728.GC13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <44F445E4.2020507@uoguelph.ca> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > > What does it do after that? > > I also suggest avoiding the cdrecord with the broken dvd patch like the > plague. It is useless, usually broken, and for burning DVD's > dvd+rw-tools are much much much better. > > You can also try using -dev ATA:/dev/hdc instead. On some systems that > works better. > > And of course make sure there is no ide-scsi listed in 'lsmod'. > > At least it is detecting the drive and lots of details about it. > > Which kernel version are you on? > > -- > Len Sorensen After that, nothing happens; nothing comes to the terminal, nothing appears to be happening in the drive, and everything else runs unaffected. I'm not seeing any ide-scsi module in the output of lsmod and my kernel version is 2.6.17-1.2174_FC5. Can anyone recommend a package, source or binary, somewhere that is likely to work? Thanks, -Tom -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 29 14:09:42 2006 From: meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org (Meng Cheah) Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 10:09:42 -0400 Subject: Getting my CD burner working In-Reply-To: <44F445E4.2020507-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <44F351F5.6050705@uoguelph.ca> <20060828220235.GB13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44F37CBD.2010609@uoguelph.ca> <20060829130728.GC13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44F445E4.2020507@uoguelph.ca> Message-ID: <44F44AA6.8080502@pppoe.ca> Tom Watts wrote: > > Lennart Sorensen wrote: > >> >> What does it do after that? >> >> I also suggest avoiding the cdrecord with the broken dvd patch like the >> plague. It is useless, usually broken, and for burning DVD's >> dvd+rw-tools are much much much better. >> >> You can also try using -dev ATA:/dev/hdc instead. On some systems that >> works better. >> >> And of course make sure there is no ide-scsi listed in 'lsmod'. >> >> At least it is detecting the drive and lots of details about it. >> >> Which kernel version are you on? >> >> -- >> Len Sorensen > > > > After that, nothing happens; nothing comes to the terminal, nothing > appears to be happening in the drive, and everything else runs > unaffected. > > I'm not seeing any ide-scsi module in the output of lsmod and my > kernel version is 2.6.17-1.2174_FC5. Can anyone recommend a package, > source or binary, somewhere that is likely to work? > > Thanks, > > -Tom > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > You may want to try this but I don't know if it will help. "cdrdao scanbus" For me, it gives: Cdrdao version 1.1.9 - (C) Andreas Mueller SCSI interface library - (C) Joerg Schilling Paranoia DAE library - (C) Monty Check http://cdrdao.sourceforge.net/drives.html#dt for current driver tables. Using libscg version 'schily-0.8' ATAPI:0,0,0 _NEC , DVD_RW ND-3550A , 1.05 Then I use "cdrecord -v dev=ATAPI:0,0,0 file.iso" Does it show anything useful? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 29 15:15:49 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 11:15:49 -0400 Subject: Getting my CD burner working In-Reply-To: <44F445E4.2020507-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <44F351F5.6050705@uoguelph.ca> <20060828220235.GB13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44F37CBD.2010609@uoguelph.ca> <20060829130728.GC13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44F445E4.2020507@uoguelph.ca> Message-ID: <20060829151549.GD13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 29, 2006 at 09:49:24AM -0400, Tom Watts wrote: > After that, nothing happens; nothing comes to the terminal, nothing > appears to be happening in the drive, and everything else runs unaffected. > > I'm not seeing any ide-scsi module in the output of lsmod and my kernel > version is 2.6.17-1.2174_FC5. Can anyone recommend a package, source or > binary, somewhere that is likely to work? I wonder if cdrecord is stuck waiting for vold/hald to stop bothering the drive so it can get an exclusive lock on it. Are you doing this as root or a normal user? -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From wattst-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 29 15:36:43 2006 From: wattst-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Tom Watts) Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 11:36:43 -0400 Subject: Getting my CD burner working In-Reply-To: <20060829151549.GD13640-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <44F351F5.6050705@uoguelph.ca> <20060828220235.GB13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44F37CBD.2010609@uoguelph.ca> <20060829130728.GC13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44F445E4.2020507@uoguelph.ca> <20060829151549.GD13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <44F45F0B.5080609@uoguelph.ca> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > I wonder if cdrecord is stuck waiting for vold/hald to stop bothering > the drive so it can get an exclusive lock on it. > > Are you doing this as root or a normal user? > > -- > Len Sorensen I am running it as root. If it means anything, eject has no problem with the device and it usually needs to wait for it to be not busy; is that the same thing as waiting for an exclusive lock? -Tom -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 29 16:10:47 2006 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 12:10:47 -0400 Subject: Getting my CD burner working In-Reply-To: <44F45F0B.5080609-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <44F351F5.6050705@uoguelph.ca> <20060828220235.GB13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44F37CBD.2010609@uoguelph.ca> <20060829130728.GC13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44F445E4.2020507@uoguelph.ca> <20060829151549.GD13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44F45F0B.5080609@uoguelph.ca> Message-ID: <20060829161047.GE13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 29, 2006 at 11:36:43AM -0400, Tom Watts wrote: > I am running it as root. If it means anything, eject has no problem > with the device and it usually needs to wait for it to be not busy; is > that the same thing as waiting for an exclusive lock? Eject only has a problem if it is locked due to being mounted. That would require something actually mounting it with a valid filesystem already on it. Check if hald or volume manager or vold or something similar is running. If it is, try stopping it using the init.d script for it, and then see if you can write. hald is causing lots of burner grief it seems due to not locking the device correctly and ignoring locks from other processes. -- Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 29 21:05:13 2006 From: mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Merv Curley) Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 17:05:13 -0400 Subject: apt-get update In-Reply-To: <20060828223101.GA8408-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20060828184816.PHGV18394.tomts5-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp1.sympatico.ca> <200608281658.51000.mervc@eol.ca> <20060828223101.GA8408@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <200608291705.13808.mervc@eol.ca> On Monday 28 August 2006 18:31, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: > > I suspect that this is a Kanotix issue. I don't know anything about > Kanotix, but I suspect that it is different from stock Debian in *some* > way, which may account for the problems. I have been running Debian on > diverse hardware in both testing and stable branches for several years, > and run apt-get dist-upgrade ~5 times per week per machine with no > problems - including the change from XFree86 to X.org. YMMV, but I went > with Debian years ago because, while not fanatical myself, I benefit > from the Debian fanaticism for "correctness" and consistency and license > compliance. While 98% is Debian etch, the developer does have scripts and some things like the kernel that he sets up. I haven't posted on the Forum lately but I don't see any posts about printing in the past few weeks. But that is the obvious place for me to put a query. Because we are unstable, thats what I expect :-) Cheerio -- Merv Curley Toronto, Ont. Can Kanotix Linux Ver 2005-4 Desktop KDE 3.5.1 KMail 1.2 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From arpadtoth-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 29 22:35:18 2006 From: arpadtoth-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (Arpad Toth) Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 18:35:18 -0400 (EDT) Subject: asus a7v8x In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20060829223518.5710.qmail@web50611.mail.yahoo.com> hi lads, I am looking for a working asus socket A type mobo, must support DDR, the one a7v8x is just died here....anyone has kinda similar/same? tks, RP __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From crane36-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 29 22:36:33 2006 From: crane36-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Lawrence Lascelles) Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 18:36:33 -0400 Subject: asus a7v8x In-Reply-To: <20060829223518.5710.qmail-ebwtSJx00ySA/QwVtaZbd3CJp6faPEW9@public.gmane.org> References: <20060829223518.5710.qmail@web50611.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 29 23:50:43 2006 From: meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org (Meng Cheah) Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 19:50:43 -0400 Subject: asus a7v8x In-Reply-To: <20060829223518.5710.qmail-ebwtSJx00ySA/QwVtaZbd3CJp6faPEW9@public.gmane.org> References: <20060829223518.5710.qmail@web50611.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <44F4D2D3.3040607@pppoe.ca> Arpad Toth wrote: >hi lads, > >I am looking for a working asus socket A type mobo, >must support DDR, the one a7v8x is just died >here....anyone has kinda similar/same? > >tks, > >RP > > > > You may want to try http://www.mineallmeyn.com/forsale/#mobos The last time I checked (in May), a couple of stores along College had some too. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From zleap-Tp5KeRqLOeNeoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 29 20:44:02 2006 From: zleap-Tp5KeRqLOeNeoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (paul sutton) Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 20:44:02 +0000 Subject: apt-get update In-Reply-To: <20060828223101.GA8408-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20060828184816.PHGV18394.tomts5-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp1.sympatico.ca> <200608281658.51000.mervc@eol.ca> <20060828223101.GA8408@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <44F4A712.2000105@zleap.net> Kanotix is based on debian sid, the website is kept up to date and issues warnings on any issues related to doing apt-get update, the only issue I had recently is doing an update and breaking my xwindow system but that got fixed with I think help from either this group or the kanotix irc room. paul >> >> >> > >I suspect that this is a Kanotix issue. I don't know anything about >Kanotix, but I suspect that it is different from stock Debian in *some* >way, which may account for the problems. I have been running Debian on >diverse hardware in both testing and stable branches for several years, >and run apt-get dist-upgrade ~5 times per week per machine with no >problems - including the change from XFree86 to X.org. YMMV, but I went >with Debian years ago because, while not fanatical myself, I benefit >from the Debian fanaticism for "correctness" and consistency and license >compliance. > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 30 03:23:12 2006 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 23:23:12 -0400 (EDT) Subject: GTALUG meeting July 11, 2006 (fwd) Message-ID: Hi all. Ren Bucholz from the EFF who spoke to GTALUG recently wanted me to pass on a message so I've forwarded Ren's email. Cheers, Rob -- Robert Brockway B.Sc. Phone: +1-905-821-2327 Senior Technical Consultant Urgent Support: +1-416-669-3073 OpenTrend Solutions Ltd Email: support-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Web: www.opentrend.net ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 22:30:22 -0400 From: Ren Bucholz To: Robert Brockway Subject: Re: GTALUG meeting July 11, 2006 Robert, I recently got a message from someone who attended my talk at GTALUG, but I seem to have misplaced it. He was looking for a citation to a story I mentioned about "bits having colour". If you wouldn't mind, could you pass a message to the group that identifies the author as Matthew Skala? The article can be found here: http://ansuz.sooke.bc.ca/lawpoli/colour/2004061001.php Thanks! Best, Ren . : . : . : . : . : . : . : . : . : . : . : . Ren Bucholz Policy Coordinator, Americas Electronic Frontier Foundation p. (416) 628-0777 f. (415) 738-6451 e. ren-juUERV/Fi2c at public.gmane.org On 10-Jul-06, at 10:11 AM, Robert Brockway wrote: > On Mon, 10 Jul 2006, Ren Bucholz wrote: > >> FYI, I can't seem to reach your server. > > Hi Ren. Thanks for the heads-up. I'm not involved with the management of > the GTALUG server[1] so I'll pass the info on to the right people. I might > start monitoring www.gtalug.org with my companies monitoring system :) > > See you on Tuesday night :) > > [1] A club full of sysadmins, imagine :) > > Cheers, > > Rob > > -- > Robert Brockway B.Sc. Phone: +1-905-821-2327 > Senior Technical Consultant Urgent Support: +1-416-669-3073 > OpenTrend Solutions Ltd Email: support-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org > Web: www.opentrend.net > We are open 24x365 for technical support. Call us in a crisis. > > If you are emailing regarding an open ticket please consider > mentioning the ticket ID as this will assist us in responding > as quickly as possible. > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 30 15:05:09 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:05:09 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Looking for UCE Message-ID: <20060830150509.85136.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> I am writing a little piece on the program SpamAssassin, a program that makes it easier to spot unsolicited commercial email (UCE). I have set-up through Rogers a child account (spamtrap151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org) that I will keep working for the duration of creating this article. Problem is how do I get a steady stream of that trash to test the software against? I have started sending "unsubscribe" to the UCE messages that show up in my regular e-mail account, in the hope that some of those @#$% will not only ignore my unsubscribe request but.... Question is, what else can I do to attract UCE to the above noted e-mail address? Thanks. Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From dcbour-Uj1Tbf34OBsy5HIR1wJiBuOEVfOsBSGQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 30 15:08:53 2006 From: dcbour-Uj1Tbf34OBsy5HIR1wJiBuOEVfOsBSGQ at public.gmane.org (Dave Bour) Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:08:53 -0400 Subject: Looking for UCE Message-ID: <5F47429283BD2A4C8FF1106E3F27F4730A3298@mse2be2.mse2.exchange.ms> Visit a few of those sites you shouldn't :) Download a bunch of spyware products that track usage Dave Bour Desktop Solution Center 905.381.0077 dcbour at desktopsolutioncenter.ca For those who just want it to work... Giving you complete IT peace of mind. (Sent via Blackberry - hence message may be shorter than my usual verbose responses) PIN 3010A5AF (as of June 12, 2006) -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug at ss.org To: tlug at ss.org Sent: Wed Aug 30 11:05:09 2006 Subject: [TLUG]: Looking for UCE I am writing a little piece on the program SpamAssassin, a program that makes it easier to spot unsolicited commercial email (UCE). I have set-up through Rogers a child account (spamtrap151 at rogers.com) that I will keep working for the duration of creating this article. Problem is how do I get a steady stream of that trash to test the software against? I have started sending "unsubscribe" to the UCE messages that show up in my regular e-mail account, in the hope that some of those @#$% will not only ignore my unsubscribe request but.... Question is, what else can I do to attract UCE to the above noted e-mail address? Thanks. Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dcbour-Uj1Tbf34OBsy5HIR1wJiBuOEVfOsBSGQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 30 15:09:50 2006 From: dcbour-Uj1Tbf34OBsy5HIR1wJiBuOEVfOsBSGQ at public.gmane.org (Dave Bour) Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:09:50 -0400 Subject: Looking for UCE Message-ID: <5F47429283BD2A4C8FF1106E3F27F4730A3299@mse2be2.mse2.exchange.ms> And post in bunch of forums/newsgroups using the email you want Dave Bour Desktop Solution Center 905.381.0077 dcbour at desktopsolutioncenter.ca For those who just want it to work... Giving you complete IT peace of mind. (Sent via Blackberry - hence message may be shorter than my usual verbose responses) PIN 3010A5AF (as of June 12, 2006) -----Original Message----- From: Dave Bour To: 'tlug at ss.org' Sent: Wed Aug 30 11:08:53 2006 Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Looking for UCE Visit a few of those sites you shouldn't :) Download a bunch of spyware products that track usage Dave Bour Desktop Solution Center 905.381.0077 dcbour at desktopsolutioncenter.ca For those who just want it to work... Giving you complete IT peace of mind. (Sent via Blackberry - hence message may be shorter than my usual verbose responses) PIN 3010A5AF (as of June 12, 2006) -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug at ss.org To: tlug at ss.org Sent: Wed Aug 30 11:05:09 2006 Subject: [TLUG]: Looking for UCE I am writing a little piece on the program SpamAssassin, a program that makes it easier to spot unsolicited commercial email (UCE). I have set-up through Rogers a child account (spamtrap151 at rogers.com) that I will keep working for the duration of creating this article. Problem is how do I get a steady stream of that trash to test the software against? I have started sending "unsubscribe" to the UCE messages that show up in my regular e-mail account, in the hope that some of those @#$% will not only ignore my unsubscribe request but.... Question is, what else can I do to attract UCE to the above noted e-mail address? Thanks. Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 30 15:20:01 2006 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:20:01 -0400 Subject: Looking for UCE In-Reply-To: <20060830150509.85136.qmail-DooQHYYYUaiB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060830150509.85136.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20060830152001.GA7384@wp.magstar.net> On Wed, Aug 30, 2006 at 11:05:09AM -0400, Colin McGregor wrote: > I am writing a little piece on the program > SpamAssassin, a program that makes it easier to spot > unsolicited commercial email (UCE). I have set-up > through Rogers a child account > (spamtrap151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org) that I will keep working for > the duration of creating this article. Problem is how > do I get a steady stream of that trash to test the > software against? I have started sending "unsubscribe" > to the UCE messages that show up in my regular e-mail > account, in the hope that some of those @#$% will not > only ignore my unsubscribe request but.... > > Question is, what else can I do to attract UCE to the > above noted e-mail address? That's easy. Usenet post! -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 30 15:43:39 2006 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:43:39 -0400 Subject: Looking for UCE In-Reply-To: <20060830150509.85136.qmail-DooQHYYYUaiB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060830150509.85136.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On 8/30/06, Colin McGregor wrote: > Question is, what else can I do to attract UCE to the > above noted e-mail address? 0. Fabricate a suitable email address. (Or, preferably, several of them) 1. Head to a "naughty" web site that asks for your email address in order to send you wonderful free things. 2. Head to a "casino" web site that asks for an email address to send you free "chips." 3. Head to a "free stuff" web site that solicits your email address. 4. Put a desired email address on some postings on Usenet. 5. Put a desired email address on a web page as a "mailto:" URL. There may be other places where spammers "harvest" email addresses; I can't think of more, offhand... -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html Oddly enough, this is completely standard behaviour for shells. This is a roundabout way of saying `don't use combined chains of `&&'s and `||'s unless you think G?del's theorem is for sissies'. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From stephenc-wtWqQT8woy8 at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 30 15:23:33 2006 From: stephenc-wtWqQT8woy8 at public.gmane.org (Stephen W. Clarke) Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:23:33 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Looking for UCE In-Reply-To: <20060830150509.85136.qmail-DooQHYYYUaiB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060830150509.85136.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <27067.72.38.22.170.1156951413.squirrel@72.38.22.170> You could also post your desired email address on a high traffic website in both plain text and as a mailto link. This will help you get found by the spider email harvesters. Just a thought. Stephen > I am writing a little piece on the program > SpamAssassin, a program that makes it easier to spot > unsolicited commercial email (UCE). I have set-up > through Rogers a child account > (spamtrap151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org) that I will keep working for > the duration of creating this article. Problem is how > do I get a steady stream of that trash to test the > software against? I have started sending "unsubscribe" > to the UCE messages that show up in my regular e-mail > account, in the hope that some of those @#$% will not > only ignore my unsubscribe request but.... > > Question is, what else can I do to attract UCE to the > above noted e-mail address? > > Thanks. > > Colin McGregor > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- Stephen W. Clarke Marketing and Communications Officer Nray Services Inc. 56A Head Street Dundas, ON L9H 3H7 CANADA Tel: (905) 627-1302 x14 Fax: (905) 627-5022 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 30 16:53:14 2006 From: john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org (John Van Ostrand) Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 12:53:14 -0400 Subject: Looking for UCE In-Reply-To: <20060830150509.85136.qmail-DooQHYYYUaiB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20060830150509.85136.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1156956794.16232.65.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> On Wed, 2006-08-30 at 11:05 -0400, Colin McGregor wrote: > Question is, what else can I do to attract UCE to the > above noted e-mail address? Could you get an address that is more likely to be guessed. Like jsmith-IEbV4ISQ1OQU04JRNCRQjg at public.gmane.org That would attract dictionary attacks. When you get spam make sure you follow the links in the email. You could add that address as a contact on a domain registration. Do you suppose there are any FTP sites that harvest addresses from the anonymous passwords? I've been meaning to setup my own spam trap and just dump the email to sa-learn. I'll be really interested in your results. In fact since I'm interested, if you want a jsmith@, I'd gladly loan you an email address on one of my domains. -- John Van Ostrand Net Direct Inc. Chief Technology Officer 564 Weber St. N. Unit 12 Waterloo, ON N2L 5C6 map john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org Ph: 519-883-1172 ext.5102 Linux Solutions / IBM Hardware Fx: 519-883-8533 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 30 17:10:38 2006 From: meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org (Meng Cheah) Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 13:10:38 -0400 Subject: OT: [HW] Bad blocks on my hard drive] Message-ID: <44F5C68E.1030906@pppoe.ca> Sorry about the OT posting. Yesterday, I posted to the HW list and so far, there been no response. Can someone please help? Thanks. Meng Cheah -------- Original Message -------- Subject: [HW] Bad blocks on my hard drive Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 12:44:14 -0400 From: Meng Cheah Reply-To: GTALUG HW To: hw-kPTIhHHajqAdnm+yROfE0A at public.gmane.org I recently bought a Maxtor 250G hard drive. I've been using it for a few months with no problems. I needed to use the remaining 150G as hda4, I partitioned it and ran "sudo mkfs.ext3 -cjv /dev/hda4". It showed: mke2fs 1.37 (21-Mar-2005) Filesystem label= OS type: Linux Block size=4096 (log=2) Fragment size=4096 (log=2) 18317312 inodes, 36624183 blocks 1831209 blocks (5.00%) reserved for the super user First data block=0 1118 block groups 32768 blocks per group, 32768 fragments per group 16384 inodes per group Superblock backups stored on blocks: 32768, 98304, 163840, 229376, 294912, 819200, 884736, 1605632, 2654208, 4096000, 7962624, 11239424, 20480000, 23887872 Running command: badblocks -b 4096 -s /dev/hda4 36624183 Checking for bad blocks (read-only test): done 183 Writing inode tables: done Creating journal (8192 blocks): done Writing superblocks and filesystem accounting information: done This filesystem will be automatically checked every 39 mounts or 180 days, whichever comes first. Use tune2fs -c or -i to override. Does this mean there are 183 bad blocks out of 36624183? Is this acceptable? Thanks in advance. Meng Cheah _______________________________________________ Hw mailing list Hw-kPTIhHHajqAdnm+yROfE0A at public.gmane.org http://lists.gtalug.org/mailman/listinfo/hw -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 30 17:30:59 2006 From: cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org (Chris F.A. Johnson) Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 13:30:59 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Looking for UCE In-Reply-To: References: <20060830150509.85136.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 30 Aug 2006, Christopher Browne wrote: > On 8/30/06, Colin McGregor wrote: >> Question is, what else can I do to attract UCE to the >> above noted e-mail address? > > 4. Put a desired email address on some postings on Usenet. That's probably the best source (my Usenet address gets approx. 5,000 pieces of spam per month), though it may take a while before it really builds up. Colin, you will probably find that a large proportion of the 12MB of mail in the colin-0l1pH2CMacvR7s880joybQ at public.gmane.org mailbox is spam. -- Chris F.A. Johnson =================================================================== Author: Shell Scripting Recipes: A Problem-Solution Approach (2005, Apress) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lists-tZhE6lH4Esk+k03BA+Hq9g at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 31 00:07:50 2006 From: lists-tZhE6lH4Esk+k03BA+Hq9g at public.gmane.org (Oliver Meyn) Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 20:07:50 -0400 Subject: asus a7v8x In-Reply-To: <20060829223518.5710.qmail-ebwtSJx00ySA/QwVtaZbd3CJp6faPEW9@public.gmane.org> References: <20060829223518.5710.qmail@web50611.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <44F62856.308@mineallmeyn.com> Arpad Toth wrote: > hi lads, > > I am looking for a working asus socket A type mobo, > must support DDR, the one a7v8x is just died > here....anyone has kinda similar/same? > > tks, > > RP > Hi Arpad, I have a like new in box (came out to test a cpu, went back in) A7N8X-E. This chipset was probably the best socket A of them all, supports ddr, has onboard audio and dual nics. You can have it for $80, or less if you insist. I'm in the beaches. Cheers, Oliver -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 31 03:15:32 2006 From: be_a_sport-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Kush) Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 23:15:32 -0400 Subject: Getting my CD burner working In-Reply-To: <44F445E4.2020507-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <44F351F5.6050705@uoguelph.ca> <20060828220235.GB13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44F37CBD.2010609@uoguelph.ca> <20060829130728.GC13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44F445E4.2020507@uoguelph.ca> Message-ID: <44F65454.9010500@rogers.com> Use k3b from the kde stable. It works perfectly. Kush Tom Watts wrote: > > Can anyone recommend a package, source or binary, somewhere that is > likely to work? > > Thanks, > > -Tom -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 31 07:02:00 2006 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 03:02:00 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Linux may lose its chance of competing with Microsoft after the 64bit revolution gets underway In-Reply-To: <44F07632.4080900-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44F07632.4080900@rogers.com> Message-ID: On Sat, 26 Aug 2006, Kush wrote: > This is a sobering scenario. Hi Kush. I didn't find it particularly concerning. Various "last chance to grab the desktop" dates have been predicted in the last few years by lots of different organisations and people. The argument that the change from 32bit to 64bit is a chance to topple the dominant platform isn't a strong one as right now the change is going so seemlessly that few are even noticing it. To me the idea of any "last chance" to get the desktop is a bit silly. 40 years ago the "desktop" as we understand it today didn't even exist. The desktop (circa 2006) will probably be found only in history books in 40 years. Who knows what computer interfaces will be like in even 20 years, let alone 40. To me the key is to keep working towards acceptance of open source software and open standards. IMHO a collapse of OSS would have very grave implications for societal freedoms in the future. We are so dependent on data held within computer systems that to allow control to fall to a select few is very dangerous. You see I am far more concerned with how the law interprets freedoms and knowledge and how that relates to OSS than I am to any specific technologies like the GUI circa 2006. Cheers, Rob -- Robert Brockway B.Sc. Phone: +1-905-821-2327 Senior Technical Consultant Urgent Support: +1-416-669-3073 OpenTrend Solutions Ltd Email: support-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Web: www.opentrend.net -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tleslie-RBVUpeUoHUc at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 31 09:13:29 2006 From: tleslie-RBVUpeUoHUc at public.gmane.org (ted leslie) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 05:13:29 -0400 Subject: Linux may lose its chance of competing with Microsoft after the 64bit revolution gets underway In-Reply-To: References: <44F07632.4080900@rogers.com> Message-ID: <1157015609.5593.227.camel@stan64.site> Desktop is about to become a second class citizen, so who cares! I wake up in the morning, I reach over, hit "pick up mail" on my nokia 9300i, it connects to my wifi, i get my mail, its got a full keyboard, pretty nice monitor and ... its my PHONE!! My girl friends son, he gets up in the morning, reaches over, checks out his pin mesg., images sent to him by his friends, he'd check his pop3 account to, but his phone doesn't have that ability ... yet. 5-6 years from now (as in Japan now), the cell phone will be the dominant computing device by almost ever metric you could judge it by. Now i have a nokia 9300i that was 1000$ and i pay 50$ a month for a pretty sizable amount of data, with first 3 month unlimited. Now it has a key board that i can just touch type on, and a montior that is (i think) 800x320 or something like that. In 6 years, I will have a nokia that has a bit bigger keyboard (so can easily touch type), and a fold out lcd that will give me crystal clear 24bit colour at probably 800x600 or even bigger. be 800Mhz or more, and hopefully running linux. Right now i pull up google maps when i am driving, i read my email on it (cpu is a bit pokey so not quite as good as desktop), and the new opera browser for it allows me to surf the web like i did 7 years ago when i was on 33.6Kb modem. My office uses a voice mail system that takes the voice mail, .wav's it, and send it to my mail box, the nokia, it plays the attachment right out of the box. It also has awesome sound thus making an excellent mp3 player. It can play full length movies, but only at 320x240. In 6 years, for free (included in your plan) you will have a 800MHZ cpu (or greater), 256MB ram (or greater), clam shell foldout, full keyboard, 800x600 monitor, and it will be essential free. And like today 80-90 or more of the kids in school will have them, and they will not be reading there email, doing icq (IM's), reading attachments, trading music, trading picture on a desktop, that will be collecting dust, they will be blue toothing between phones, and EDGE'ing back and forth, and linking it to there PS3/4 XBOX3 , Wii2, etc. The phone will also play dvd quality movies right out of the box. It will be a camera, and the software to slice and dice the pictures i take, will be included on the camera. It will be a video camera, and I will be able to edit the movies i take, right on the phone. Desktop are dead in 6 years, as far as being "where the technology is", or "where the buzz is". Granted, the huge amount of hand-me-downs, and use in poor countries will still mean there will be a lot in use, but that actually works very well for linux, as we see already today. They will still be the preferred device for a programmer, a graphics artist, etc, but 80% of the population will usually be blowing dust off of it each time they use it, save for if they need it for gaming, and to the extent that PC-gaming vs. console gaming plays out, i am not sure. With the typical family in NA having a 720p or 1080p/i big screen tv in 6 years, console gaming, and having the console being a multimedia hub in the house has a lot going for it. If MS doesn't get really big, really quick in the cell phone market, their revenue/profit is in for a world of hurt, at best they will become strictly a gaming desktop top console, and have some small finger in the server market. In 6-7 years, in todays $, a typical PC, keyboard, lcd, cpu, memory, HD is going to be about 300$ (provided you go basic on the monitor) ..... and Bill is going to charge how much for the OS to go on that box? and on the free phone? (included in plan), Bill is going to charge how much for the OS? and the office suite in the phone will likely be OpenOffice unless Bill is going to drastically cut the price for his bugware. Starting getting used to your phone being your primary computing device, if i wasn't a programmer, it would be today for me, for many berry-head executives it already is, and in 6 years when everybody is a berry-head or a nokia-clam-shell-head .... desk top PC ? what dat? -tl On Thu, 2006-08-31 at 03:02 -0400, Robert Brockway wrote: > On Sat, 26 Aug 2006, Kush wrote: > > > This is a sobering scenario. > > Hi Kush. I didn't find it particularly concerning. Various "last chance > to grab the desktop" dates have been predicted in the last few years by > lots of different organisations and people. > > The argument that the change from 32bit to 64bit is a chance to topple the > dominant platform isn't a strong one as right now the change is going so > seemlessly that few are even noticing it. > > To me the idea of any "last chance" to get the desktop is a bit silly. > 40 years ago the "desktop" as we understand it today didn't even exist. > The desktop (circa 2006) will probably be found only in history books in > 40 years. Who knows what computer interfaces will be like in even 20 > years, let alone 40. > > To me the key is to keep working towards acceptance of open source > software and open standards. IMHO a collapse of OSS would have very grave > implications for societal freedoms in the future. We are so dependent on > data held within computer systems that to allow control to fall to a > select few is very dangerous. > > You see I am far more concerned with how the law interprets freedoms and > knowledge and how that relates to OSS than I am to any specific > technologies like the GUI circa 2006. > > Cheers, > > Rob > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 31 09:17:55 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 05:17:55 -0400 Subject: Linux may lose its chance of competing with Microsoft after the 64bit revolution gets underway In-Reply-To: <44F07632.4080900-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44F07632.4080900@rogers.com> Message-ID: <44F6A943.4030107@telly.org> Kush wrote: > > This is a sobering scenario. > It's a dumb scenario. The fact exists that companies such as Red Hat and Novell and IBM and HP have long been able to make the licensing deals ESR advocates. And unlike volunteer FOSS developers, these companies have a shareholder duty to maximize market share, to compete and to differentiate themselves from the rest. And yet they have not implemented ESR's panic remedies, for IMO very good reason. Even lesser players such as Mandriva and Canonical have stayed away. Only Linspire has bothered to try these deals, but the result has hardly catapulted the company into leadership of the FOSS market -- arguably just the opposite. Beating your adversary by becoming your adversary is rarely a victory worth winning. The emergence of open source as a mainstream development model is a substantial societal change, and these kind of things tend to move slowly (in some cases, literally waiting for the opposition to die off). Efforts to effect a small increase in speed, at the expense of fundamental principles, would be futile and potentially result more in damage than progress. FOSS wasn't destroyed by Microsoft's move from NT to XP or 16 to 32 bit, and it won't be destroyed by the company's move from XP to Vista or 32 to 62 bit. While ESR may need to be outrageous in order to attempt to re-establish some relevance for himself, that doesn't mean that the community needs to buy into his scaremongering. - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 31 09:34:46 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 05:34:46 -0400 Subject: Linux may lose its chance of competing with Microsoft after the 64bit revolution gets underway In-Reply-To: <1157015609.5593.227.camel-Wos4hdNTH4j6K7/ahGyk6A@public.gmane.org> References: <44F07632.4080900@rogers.com> <1157015609.5593.227.camel@stan64.site> Message-ID: <44F6AD36.60502@telly.org> ted leslie wrote: > Desktop are dead in 6 years, as far as being "where the technology is", > or "where the buzz is". Granted, the huge amount of hand-me-downs, and > use in poor countries will still mean there will be a lot in use, but > that actually works very well for linux, as we see already today. > Even in developing countries, the move is to open source as a way to pool scarce development resources. The OLPC efforts is gaining nice momentum and it's all Linux based. > If MS doesn't get really big, really quick in the cell phone market, > their revenue/profit is in for a world of hurt, at best they will become > strictly a gaming desktop top console, and have some small finger in the > server market. > Good point. Meanwhile... Palm, Motorola, Nokia and others are all investing heavily in Linux as a platform: http://news.yahoo.com/s/pcworld/20060815/tc_pcworld/126739 http://www.linux.com/article.pl?sid=06/08/22/1855217 http://www.palminfocenter.com/news/8921/access-linux-platform-at-linuxworld-sf/ http://www.gizmodo.com/gadgets/top/road-s101-linux-smartphone-has-it-all-nokia-killer-195289.php http://www.hardwarezone.com/news/view.php?id=5301&cid=9 - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davec-zxk95TxsVYDyHADnj0MGvQC/G2K4zDHf at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 31 13:02:18 2006 From: davec-zxk95TxsVYDyHADnj0MGvQC/G2K4zDHf at public.gmane.org (Dave Cramer) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 09:02:18 -0400 Subject: bell mobility service Message-ID: I have none in Orangeville, is anyone else down ? Dave -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pallen3-iRg7kjdsKiH3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 31 14:44:44 2006 From: pallen3-iRg7kjdsKiH3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Patrick Allen) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 09:44:44 -0500 Subject: bell mobility service In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <44F6F5DC.9020603@cogeco.ca> Dave Cramer wrote: > I have none in Orangeville, is anyone else down ? Working here in Milton Dave. -- Patrick Allen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 31 14:19:15 2006 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 10:19:15 -0400 Subject: bell mobility service In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <44F6EFE3.8040501@telly.org> > I have none in Orangeville, is anyone else down ? Those bloody beavers... -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davec-zxk95TxsVYDyHADnj0MGvQC/G2K4zDHf at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 31 14:38:44 2006 From: davec-zxk95TxsVYDyHADnj0MGvQC/G2K4zDHf at public.gmane.org (Dave Cramer) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 10:38:44 -0400 Subject: bell mobility service In-Reply-To: <44F6EFE3.8040501-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg@public.gmane.org> References: <44F6EFE3.8040501@telly.org> Message-ID: <6334B761-4BEC-4597-B093-1F7B65965DCA@visibleassets.com> Confirmed, They had an issue in the Orangeville area, it's been fixed now Dave On 31-Aug-06, at 10:19 AM, Evan Leibovitch wrote: > >> I have none in Orangeville, is anyone else down ? > > Those bloody beavers... > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From wattst-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 31 15:12:34 2006 From: wattst-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Tom Watts) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 11:12:34 -0400 Subject: Getting my CD burner working In-Reply-To: <44F65454.9010500-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <44F351F5.6050705@uoguelph.ca> <20060828220235.GB13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44F37CBD.2010609@uoguelph.ca> <20060829130728.GC13640@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <44F445E4.2020507@uoguelph.ca> <44F65454.9010500@rogers.com> Message-ID: <44F6FC62.4020709@uoguelph.ca> Kush wrote: > Use k3b from the kde stable. It works perfectly. > Kush > Purely out of curiosity, but how could k3b work if cdrecord doesn't? -Tom -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From matt.price-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 31 17:19:37 2006 From: matt.price-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Matt Price) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 13:19:37 -0400 Subject: relayhost when authentication is required Message-ID: <20060831171937.GB28391@utoronto.ca> hi folks, i run postfix on my home computers and use sendmail for all my maail programs (evolution, mutt, thunderbird, whatever). both machines run ubuntu dapper and postfix 2.2.10. with our old ip i just added a 'relayhost' line in main.cf and my mail was sent out fine. however our new evil isp (rogers/yahoo) requires authentication first. so outgoing mail generates these log messages (sorry for thewrap!): ug 31 12:46:07 localhost postfix/master[15806]: daemon started -- version 2.2.10, configuration /etc/postfix Aug 31 12:46:50 localhost postfix/pickup[15809]: 8522440409E: uid=1000 from= Aug 31 12:46:50 localhost postfix/cleanup[15908]: 8522440409E: message-id=<1157042810.5232.3.camel at localhost> Aug 31 12:46:50 localhost postfix/qmgr[15810]: 8522440409E: from=, size=436, nrcpt=2 (queue active) Aug 31 12:46:51 localhost postfix/smtp[15910]: 8522440409E: to=, relay=smtp-rog.mail.yahoo2.akadns.net[206.190.36.18], delay=1, status=bounced (host smtp-rog.mail.yahoo2.akadns.net[206.190.36.18] said: 530 authentication required - for help go to http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/mail/pop/pop-11.html (in reply to MAIL FROM command)) i assume i need some mechanism for sending out my password to their server, but don't know how to do it. does anyone have this setup or something similar working? thanks, matt ------------------------------------------- Matt Price matt.price-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org History Department, University of Toronto (416) 978-2094 -------------------------------------------- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lmlane-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 31 17:58:20 2006 From: lmlane-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Mark Lane) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 13:58:20 -0400 Subject: Looking for UCE In-Reply-To: <1156956794.16232.65.camel-H4GMr3yegGDiLwdn3CfQm+4hLzXZc3VTLAPz8V8PbKw@public.gmane.org> References: <20060830150509.85136.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <1156956794.16232.65.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> Message-ID: Question is, what else can I do to attract UCE to theabove noted e-mail address? > > > Could you get an address that is more likely to be guessed. Like > jsmith-IEbV4ISQ1OQU04JRNCRQjg at public.gmane.org That would attract dictionary attacks. > > If you can make the address a catchall for a domain that will get lots. You will get all email sent to the domain that doesn't specific an accurate email address. -- Mark Lane, CET -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 31 18:06:55 2006 From: john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org (John Van Ostrand) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 14:06:55 -0400 Subject: Looking for UCE In-Reply-To: References: <20060830150509.85136.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <1156956794.16232.65.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> Message-ID: <1157047615.12137.35.camel@venture.office.netdirect.ca> On Thu, 2006-08-31 at 13:58 -0400, Mark Lane wrote: > > > > Question is, what else can I do to attract UCE to the > above noted e-mail address? > > Could you get an address that is more likely to be guessed. > Like jsmith-IEbV4ISQ1OQU04JRNCRQjg at public.gmane.org That would attract dictionary > attacks. > > > > > If you can make the address a catchall for a domain that will get > lots. You will get all email sent to the domain that doesn't specific > an accurate email address. The problem with a catch all is that it might collect ham because of email address typos. The catch all would work better if the domain is not used for email at all and you excluded valid emails like postmaster. P.S. If you really want spam, you can have all of mine. -- John Van Ostrand Net Direct Inc. Chief Technology Officer 564 Weber St. N. Unit 12 Waterloo, ON N2L 5C6 map john-Da48MpWaEp0CzWx7n4ubxQ at public.gmane.org Ph: 519-883-1172 ext.5102 Linux Solutions / IBM Hardware Fx: 519-883-8533 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 31 18:24:33 2006 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 14:24:33 -0400 (EDT) Subject: relayhost when authentication is required In-Reply-To: <20060831171937.GB28391-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <20060831171937.GB28391@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <20060831182434.75370.qmail@web88204.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- Matt Price wrote: > hi folks, > > i run postfix on my home computers and use sendmail > for all my mail > programs (evolution, mutt, thunderbird, whatever). > both machines run ubuntu > dapper and postfix 2.2.10. > > with our old ip i just added a 'relayhost' line in > main.cf and my mail was > sent out fine. however our new evil isp > (rogers/yahoo) requires > authentication first. so outgoing mail generates > these log messages (sorry > for thewrap!): > > ug 31 12:46:07 localhost postfix/master[15806]: > daemon started -- version > 2.2.10, configuration /etc/postfix > Aug 31 12:46:50 localhost postfix/pickup[15809]: > 8522440409E: uid=1000 > from= > Aug 31 12:46:50 localhost postfix/cleanup[15908]: > 8522440409E: > message-id=<1157042810.5232.3.camel at localhost> > Aug 31 12:46:50 localhost postfix/qmgr[15810]: > 8522440409E: > from=, size=436, nrcpt=2 > (queue active) > Aug 31 12:46:51 localhost postfix/smtp[15910]: > 8522440409E: > to=, > relay=smtp-rog.mail.yahoo2.akadns.net[206.190.36.18], > delay=1, > status=bounced (host > smtp-rog.mail.yahoo2.akadns.net[206.190.36.18] said: > 530 authentication required - for help go to > http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/mail/pop/pop-11.html > (in reply to MAIL FROM > command)) > > > i assume i need some mechanism for sending out my > password to their server, > but don't know how to do it. does anyone have this > setup or something > similar working? > > thanks, > > matt Your problem sounds basicly like the the one I encountered earlier this month, here is the answer I came up with and posted to the list. There was a small error in the answer I posted and what is below has been edited appropriately... Colin. Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 22:19:18 -0400 (EDT) From: "Colin McGregor" View Contact Details View Contact Details Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Exim4, Debian and Rogers... To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Ok to answer my own question, you can send e-mail using exim4, Debian and Rogers. You don't need to do any wierdness regarding ports. There are two nasty little issues that can bite you hard (at least they bit me hard :-( ). Here is what you need in various files (with e-mail addresses/passwords changed). In /etc/email-addresses you need a line like the following for every local Linux box login that you want to be able to send e-mail: <>: <>@rogers.com More than one <> can point to the same <>, i.e.: I have root and my normal user login pointing at the same <> . In /etc/exim4/exim4.conf.template your need to remove (or comment out) the following bit: plain: driver = plaintext public_name = PLAIN .ifndef AUTH_CLIENT_ALLOW_NOTLS_PASSWORDS client_send = "${if !eq{$tls_cipher}{}{\ ^${extract{1}{::}\ {${lookup{$host}lsearch*{CONFDIR/passwd.client}{$value}fail}}}\ ^${extract{2}{::}\ {${lookup{$host}lsearch*{CONFDIR/passwd.client}{$value}fail}}}\ }fail}" .else client_send = "^${extract{1}{::}{${lookup{$host}lsearch*{CONFDIR/passwd.client}{$value}fail}}}^${extract{2}{::}{${lookup{$host}lsearch*{CONFDIR/passwd.client}{$value}fail}}}" .endif Then put the follow in: plain: driver = plaintext public_name = PLAIN client_send = "^<>@rogers.com^<>" Next you need the following in /etc/exim4/update-exim4.conf.conf: dc_eximconfig_configtype='smarthost' dc_other_hostnames='' dc_local_interfaces='127.0.0.1' dc_readhost='rogers.com' dc_relay_domains='' dc_minimaldns='false' dc_relay_nets='' dc_smarthost='smtp-rog.mail.yahoo2.akadns.net' CFILEMODE='644' dc_use_split_config='false' dc_hide_mailname='true' dc_mailname_in_oh='true' While I suspect it isnt't required I put the following into: /etc/exim4/passwd.client smtp-rog.mail.yahoo2.akadns.net:<>@rogers.com:<> The two things in the above that gave me grief were the dc_smarthost name and the "plain:" bit. There is a bug in some versions of exim4 I gather that will choke on CNAMEs, like the smtp.broadband.rogers.com name you find in the Rogers documentation, the 'smtp-rog.mail.yahoo2.akadns.net' is the currently correct replacement (yes, it may be subject to change without notice, sigh). By default exim4 wants to send the RogersID/Password encrypted, but due to problems at the Rogers/Yahoo end of things it will only with plain text (BAD NEWS!). Get any of the above wrong and you will be facing a pile of cryptic error messages and rotten documentation :-( . Now, the reason for putting up with the above is that exim4 when working with fetchmail (which is another pile of unholy @#$%) makes your Linux act/seem like it is mail server on the Internet, allowing the likes of Procmail (which is a toxic waste dump unto itself) to think all is right with the universe. Why do it? Well, it is an interesting challenge, and in my case, I am writing a magazine article on Procmail for a magazine (which will pay some $$ :-) ). Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From wattst-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 31 18:38:27 2006 From: wattst-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Tom Watts) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 14:38:27 -0400 Subject: Considering a DVD burner Message-ID: <44F72CA3.5090402@uoguelph.ca> Does anyone have any experience with this NEC drive under Linux: http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=2271184&sku=N27-1892 I'm considering it, but don't want to buy it if it isn't going to work under Linux. -- Tom Watts wattst-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From amarjan-e+AXbWqSrlAAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 31 18:32:53 2006 From: amarjan-e+AXbWqSrlAAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Andrej Marjan) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 14:32:53 -0400 Subject: relayhost when authentication is required In-Reply-To: <20060831171937.GB28391-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <20060831171937.GB28391@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <44F72B55.5080101@pobox.com> Matt Price wrote: > hi folks, > > i run postfix on my home computers and use sendmail for all my maail > programs (evolution, mutt, thunderbird, whatever). both machines run ubuntu > dapper and postfix 2.2.10. > > with our old ip i just added a 'relayhost' line in main.cf and my mail was > sent out fine. however our new evil isp (rogers/yahoo) requires > authentication first. so outgoing mail generates these log messages (sorry > for thewrap!): > > ug 31 12:46:07 localhost postfix/master[15806]: daemon started -- version > 2.2.10, configuration /etc/postfix > Aug 31 12:46:50 localhost postfix/pickup[15809]: 8522440409E: uid=1000 > from= > Aug 31 12:46:50 localhost postfix/cleanup[15908]: 8522440409E: > message-id=<1157042810.5232.3.camel at localhost> > Aug 31 12:46:50 localhost postfix/qmgr[15810]: 8522440409E: > from=, size=436, nrcpt=2 (queue active) > Aug 31 12:46:51 localhost postfix/smtp[15910]: 8522440409E: > to=, > relay=smtp-rog.mail.yahoo2.akadns.net[206.190.36.18], delay=1, > status=bounced (host smtp-rog.mail.yahoo2.akadns.net[206.190.36.18] said: > 530 authentication required - for help go to > http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/mail/pop/pop-11.html (in reply to MAIL FROM > command)) > > > i assume i need some mechanism for sending out my password to their server, > but don't know how to do it. does anyone have this setup or something > similar working? > > thanks, > > matt > You need to set up SASL authentication in the Postfix SMTP client (you have no idea how long it took me as a non-mail person to discover these buzzwords a few years ago :). See http://www.postfix.org/SASL_README.html#client_sasl for some pretty good instructions. Note that you might have to install additional packages to actually get it working. On Debian/Ubuntu, you need libsasl2, as well as libsasl2-modules, which has the actual authentication modules. I can't give you specific configuration lines that are guaranteed to work with Yahoo, since I just started using pobox.com for relaying when Rogers made this annoying change. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From peter.king-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 31 18:53:23 2006 From: peter.king-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Peter King) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 14:53:23 -0400 Subject: relayhost when authentication is required In-Reply-To: <20060831171937.GB28391-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <20060831171937.GB28391@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <20060831185323.GA12350@grad11.philosophy.utoronto.ca> On Thu, Aug 31, 2006 at 01:19:37PM -0400, Matt Price wrote: > i run postfix on my home computers and use sendmail for all my maail > programs (evolution, mutt, thunderbird, whatever). both machines run ubuntu > dapper and postfix 2.2.10. > > with our old ip i just added a 'relayhost' line in main.cf and my mail was > sent out fine. however our new evil isp (rogers/yahoo) requires > authentication first. so outgoing mail generates these log messages (sorry > for thewrap!): > > ug 31 12:46:07 localhost postfix/master[15806]: daemon started -- version > 2.2.10, configuration /etc/postfix > Aug 31 12:46:50 localhost postfix/pickup[15809]: 8522440409E: uid=1000 > from= > Aug 31 12:46:50 localhost postfix/cleanup[15908]: 8522440409E: > message-id=<1157042810.5232.3.camel at localhost> > Aug 31 12:46:50 localhost postfix/qmgr[15810]: 8522440409E: > from=, size=436, nrcpt=2 (queue active) > Aug 31 12:46:51 localhost postfix/smtp[15910]: 8522440409E: > to=, > relay=smtp-rog.mail.yahoo2.akadns.net[206.190.36.18], delay=1, > status=bounced (host smtp-rog.mail.yahoo2.akadns.net[206.190.36.18] said: > 530 authentication required - for help go to > http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/mail/pop/pop-11.html (in reply to MAIL FROM > command)) > > > i assume i need some mechanism for sending out my password to their server, > but don't know how to do it. does anyone have this setup or something > similar working? You need to set up the smtp_sasl security system, which will authenticate you to rogers/yahoo by using a hashed database of passwords. This is a pretty regularly asked question, and there is lots of documentation on how to do it at the postfix home page. It's straightforward. You *do* need the relay_host line. If it helps, here's my main.cf: ================================================================== myhostname = XXXXXX alias_maps = hash:/etc/aliases alias_database = hash:/etc/aliases myorigin = /etc/mailname mydestination = XXXXX, localhost.localdomain, localhost relayhost = smtp.broadband.rogers.com smtp_sasl_auth_enable = yes smtp_sasl_security_options = smtp_sasl_password_maps = hash:/etc/postfix/sasl_passwd mynetworks = 127.0.0.0/8 mailbox_command = procmail -a "$EXTENSION" mailbox_size_limit = 0 recipient_delimiter = inet_interfaces = all notify_classes = bounce, delay, policy, protocol, resource, software =================================================================== I run postfix on both debian sid and gentoo, and this setup works flawlessly. I assume ubuntu, which is based on sid, will likewise behave itself. Hope it works! -- Peter King peter.king-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Department of Philosophy 215 Huron Street The University of Toronto (416)-978-4951 ofc Toronto, ON M5S 1A2 CANADA http://individual.utoronto.ca/pking/ ========================================================================= GPG keyID 0x7587EC42 (2B14 A355 46BC 2A16 D0BC 36F5 1FE6 D32A 7587 EC42) gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys 7587EC42 -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 31 19:24:58 2006 From: meng-D1t3LT1mScs at public.gmane.org (Meng Cheah) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 15:24:58 -0400 Subject: Considering a DVD burner In-Reply-To: <44F72CA3.5090402-dxuVLtCph9gsA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <44F72CA3.5090402@uoguelph.ca> Message-ID: <44F7378A.3080509@pppoe.ca> Tom Watts wrote: > Does anyone have any experience with this NEC drive under Linux: > > http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=2271184&sku=N27-1892 > > > I'm considering it, but don't want to buy it if it isn't going to work > under Linux. From my computer: cdrdao scanbus Cdrdao version 1.1.9 - (C) Andreas Mueller SCSI interface library - (C) Joerg Schilling Paranoia DAE library - (C) Monty Check http://cdrdao.sourceforge.net/drives.html#dt for current driver tables. Using libscg version 'schily-0.8' ATAPI:0,0,0 _NEC , DVD_RW ND-3550A , 1.05 I've no complaints so far. Works great :-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From paul-fQIO8zZcxYtFkWKT+BUv2w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 31 19:33:41 2006 From: paul-fQIO8zZcxYtFkWKT+BUv2w at public.gmane.org (Paul Nash) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 15:33:41 -0400 Subject: relayhost when authentication is required In-Reply-To: <20060831171937.GB28391-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <20060831171937.GB28391@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: > however our new evil isp (rogers/yahoo) requires >authentication first. Install cyrus-sasl, rebuild postfix with sasl support. in /etc/postfix/main.cf: smtp_sasl_auth_enable = yes smtp_sasl_password_maps = hash:/etc/postfix/sasl_passwd smtp_sasl_security_options = in /etc/postfix/sasl_passwd: smtp.broadband.rogers.com myname-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org:mypasswd -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 31 21:04:34 2006 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 17:04:34 -0400 Subject: Re Robots Wrote This Message-ID: <44F74EE2.8040302@execulink.com> Neat article about robots which includes the words scary, emotion, empathy and experience all in the same paragraph with a link to the "Turing Test; the side the robots can't get to." http://www.wired.com/news/columns/0,71654-0.html?tw=wn_index_17 In the second last line of the article there is seen: "./configure --with-passion=/home/abe/blood" and "make proud_japan" greg -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 31 21:50:39 2006 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 21:50:39 +0000 Subject: Re Robots Wrote This In-Reply-To: <44F74EE2.8040302-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ@public.gmane.org> References: <44F74EE2.8040302@execulink.com> Message-ID: On 8/31/06, Gregory D Hough wrote: > Neat article about robots which includes the words scary, emotion, > empathy and experience all in the same paragraph with a link to the > "Turing Test; the side the robots can't get to." > > http://www.wired.com/news/columns/0,71654-0.html?tw=wn_index_17 > > In the second last line of the article there is seen: > "./configure --with-passion=/home/abe/blood" and "make proud_japan" Neat, but they're complete morons. They think that the code behind Shinzo Abe's head is some sort of "COBOL or FORTRAN" stuff, that is obviously incongruent with him sitting at an Apple laptop. When reality is that it's the shell commands for building and installing some software, complete with - svn checkout - ./configure --with-clever-options - make proud_japan; make check - su - make install - installing a config file - starting a daemon in /etc/init.d Wicked clever backdrop, full of bits of (appropriately) nationalistic options (e.g. - configure has a --with-passion option, it does "make proud_japan"). He's unlikely to be a Unix hacker; I wonder who came up with it. They deserve kudos. -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html Oddly enough, this is completely standard behaviour for shells. This is a roundabout way of saying `don't use combined chains of `&&'s and `||'s unless you think G?del's theorem is for sissies'. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From zleap-Tp5KeRqLOeNeoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 31 21:16:08 2006 From: zleap-Tp5KeRqLOeNeoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (paul sutton) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 21:16:08 +0000 Subject: georgetown Message-ID: <44F75198.50206@zleap.net> hi is anyone in georgetown, I am going to be there from tomorrow and over the holiday weekend, n I may be able to meet up to chat about Linux type stuff if anyone is interested. doing a google search does seem to suggest quite a few users in the area, or certainly listings of companies that use Linux in some way (even if this is mentioned in job descriptions etc). thanks Paul -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From zleap-Tp5KeRqLOeNeoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 31 21:29:37 2006 From: zleap-Tp5KeRqLOeNeoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (paul sutton) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 21:29:37 +0000 Subject: Linux may lose its chance of competing with Microsoft after the 64bit revolution gets underway In-Reply-To: References: <44F07632.4080900@rogers.com> Message-ID: <44F754C1.3020701@zleap.net> I agree with this, why are we obsessed with the desktop, Linux is leading in other fields, e.g on web servers,also whenI watch science programs in general when they are chatting to a scientest (or whoever) in somecases the desktop software being used is not Windows and looks more like nextstep (or perhaps gnustep). Linux is strong on the server market, which means users have something rock solid at least in the back office. We seem to think of Linux on the desktop as perhaps in an office of say accountants, lawyers, and other industries, whereas I think in certain fields GNU is on the desktop, in which case we should be helping them to make things better and perhaps then it will migrate over to less technical industries. paul > > > To me the key is to keep working towards acceptance of open source > software and open standards. IMHO a collapse of OSS would have very > grave implications for societal freedoms in the future. We are so > dependent on data held within computer systems that to allow control > to fall to a select few is very dangerous. > > You see I am far more concerned with how the law interprets freedoms > and knowledge and how that relates to OSS than I am to any specific > technologies like the GUI circa 2006. > > Cheers, > > Rob > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml