From rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 1 00:38:57 2005 From: rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org (Rob Sutherland) Date: Sun, 31 Jul 2005 20:38:57 -0400 Subject: Linux friendly hardware guy? In-Reply-To: <08795C772787354E914917175F5503301B443C-zSf3HPVPggFgk0lh67m1x+TW4wlIGRCZ@public.gmane.org> References: <08795C772787354E914917175F5503301B443C@skarloey.diaslan.net> Message-ID: <42ED6F21.5060103@cheapersafer.com> Jose A. Dias wrote: > You have your work cut out for you. > > I think it's a good thing to check at first the power supply. It's quite > possible that your power supply is now misbehaving and not supplying a > good enough voltage to maintain the memory within spec. As others have > pointed out, try a live CD and see what it can do and what it reports as > "errors." It's quite possible that you might be looking for a > replacement power supply/motherboard very soon. > > Does your bios have some kind of "monitoring" screen? I can boot into my > bios and have it tell me what the +5V, -5V, +12V and -12V lines are at > continuously. If the voltages are more than 5% off spec then you have a > problem. My bios doesn't show the voltages, but I found a freeware Windows app called Speedfan that shows them...I'm seeing Vcore1 1.58V Vcore2 1.58V +3.3V 3.26V +5V 4.92V +12V 11.46V -5V 3.64V +5V 4.87V Vbat 4.08V Looks like a fair bit of variation. I guess I'll have to get a power supply when the stores open up and try replacing that. Rob -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 1 03:37:11 2005 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Sun, 31 Jul 2005 23:37:11 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Linux friendly hardware guy? In-Reply-To: <762-SnapperMsgB9FE4EF2BF12D05D-w2ADs6jKG81PaPreVZ9GnA@public.gmane.org> References: <20050730142359.7532.qmail@memeshadow.net> <20050730214916.GB29026@localhost> <42ECD119.6000509@cheapersafer.com> <762-SnapperMsgB9FE4EF2BF12D05D@198.230.118.101> Message-ID: On Sun, 31 Jul 2005, Jason Shein wrote: > At this point knoppix would be of great assistance due to it's exceptional > hardware detection. Boot the knoppix cd, and as long as it boots properly, > then open a shell and look through the logs and the output of dmesg for > errors. > > if this is a low memory system then make sure you change the default window > manager to something with a lighter memory footprint, such as icewm or > fluxbox. If the original poster is confortable with the shell and doesn't need a GUI, passing "knoppix 2" [1] to the bootloader boots without a GUI (at least it has with all the version of Knoppix I've done this with). [1] Ie, passing run level 2 to the kernel. Rob -- Robert Brockway B.Sc. Phone: +1-416-669-3073 Senior Technical Consultant Email: support-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Web: www.opentrend.net We are open 24x7x365 for technical support. Call us in a crisis. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jad-V3Qe//ktpHnR7s880joybQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 1 12:21:03 2005 From: jad-V3Qe//ktpHnR7s880joybQ at public.gmane.org (Jose A. Dias) Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 08:21:03 -0400 Subject: Linux friendly hardware guy? Message-ID: <08795C772787354E914917175F5503301B443D@skarloey.diaslan.net> Not bad numbers, but two of them are *very bad looking* to me. Here's a little table I put together: Reference -5% Range Actual +5% Range Percentage from spec 1.5 1.425 1.58 1.575 105% 1.5 1.425 1.58 1.575 105% 3.3 3.135 3.26 3.465 99% 5 4.75 4.92 5.25 98% 1) 12 11.4 11.46 12.6 96% 2) -5 -4.75 3.64 -5.25 -73% 5 4.75 4.87 5.25 97% 3) 6 5.7 4.08 6.3 68% Here are some comments on the above: - Number one above (1) is just within spec. By it self that does not mean much, but let's see the rest. - Number two scares me! Are you sure it +3.64? That should be the -5V line. - Number three is very motherboard dependent. I *think* it should be 6V, but I could be wrong. This by itself does not mean anything, specially if the bios settings are sticking. Change something in the bios, power down the machine, and unplug it. Check again in an hour and see if the settings stayed or have reset. Even if the polarity of number two above is corrected, it's still only running at 73% of nominal. No motherboard is going to "work" with these numbers. Try running the utility, and even some other utility, a few more times to be sure... A new power supply *is* a good thing! -- Jose Antonio Dias Jose.Dias-V3Qe//ktpHnR7s880joybQ at public.gmane.org www.diaslan.net -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org] On Behalf Of Rob Sutherland Sent: July 31, 2005 8:39 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Re:Linux friendly hardware guy? Jose A. Dias wrote: > You have your work cut out for you. > > I think it's a good thing to check at first the power supply. It's quite > possible that your power supply is now misbehaving and not supplying a > good enough voltage to maintain the memory within spec. As others have > pointed out, try a live CD and see what it can do and what it reports as > "errors." It's quite possible that you might be looking for a > replacement power supply/motherboard very soon. > > Does your bios have some kind of "monitoring" screen? I can boot into my > bios and have it tell me what the +5V, -5V, +12V and -12V lines are at > continuously. If the voltages are more than 5% off spec then you have a > problem. My bios doesn't show the voltages, but I found a freeware Windows app called Speedfan that shows them...I'm seeing Vcore1 1.58V Vcore2 1.58V +3.3V 3.26V +5V 4.92V +12V 11.46V -5V 3.64V +5V 4.87V Vbat 4.08V Looks like a fair bit of variation. I guess I'll have to get a power supply when the stores open up and try replacing that. Rob -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 1 13:26:30 2005 From: rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org (Rob Sutherland) Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 13:26:30 GMT Subject: Linux friendly hardware guy? In-Reply-To: References: <20050730142359.7532.qmail@memeshadow.net> <20050730214916.GB29026@localhost> <42ECD119.6000509@cheapersafer.com> <762-SnapperMsgB9FE4EF2BF12D05D@198.230.118.101> Message-ID: <20050801132630.29551.qmail@memeshadow.net> Robert Brockway writes: > > If the original poster is confortable with the shell and doesn't need a > GUI, passing "knoppix 2" [1] to the bootloader boots without a GUI (at > least it has with all the version of Knoppix I've done this with). > > [1] Ie, passing run level 2 to the kernel. Yep, tried that...actually, I've tried knoppix, suse, berry, the linux rescue option on the centos install cds and tomsrtbt. Results vary, at times I can boot up, other times it dies at different points. From what I've read over the last couple of days and a few responses on the list, it seems this is pretty consistent with a failing power supply, so I'm just going to get a replacement and stick it in there. Which brings me back to what I was was originally asking about - can anyone recommend a linux friendly hardware guy in the downtown area? Rob -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 1 14:54:22 2005 From: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (Peter Hiscocks) Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 10:54:22 -0400 Subject: Linux friendly hardware guy? In-Reply-To: <20050801132630.29551.qmail-z4MHBalAis9wIbaULDtLvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20050730142359.7532.qmail@memeshadow.net> <20050730214916.GB29026@localhost> <42ECD119.6000509@cheapersafer.com> <762-SnapperMsgB9FE4EF2BF12D05D@198.230.118.101> <20050801132630.29551.qmail@memeshadow.net> Message-ID: <20050801145422.GB22881@ee.ryerson.ca> If you are just buying and replacing a power supply, you can do that without the blessing of a Linux Guru. My advice would be to get the best possible supply you can afford. A crummy one can go into Frankenstein mode and take out every last piece of hardware in the box, as I discovered to my sorrow. Peter On Mon, Aug 01, 2005 at 01:26:30PM +0000, Rob Sutherland wrote: > Robert Brockway writes: > > > > >If the original poster is confortable with the shell and doesn't need a > >GUI, passing "knoppix 2" [1] to the bootloader boots without a GUI (at > >least it has with all the version of Knoppix I've done this with). > > > >[1] Ie, passing run level 2 to the kernel. > > Yep, tried that...actually, I've tried knoppix, suse, berry, the linux > rescue option on the centos install cds and tomsrtbt. Results vary, at > times I can boot up, other times it dies at different points. From what > I've read over the last couple of days and a few responses on the list, it > seems this is pretty consistent with a failing power supply, so I'm just > going to get a replacement and stick it in there. Which brings me back to > what I was was originally asking about - can anyone recommend a linux > friendly hardware guy in the downtown area? > > Rob > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- Peter D. Hiscocks Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering Ryerson University, 350 Victoria Street, Toronto, Ontario, M5B 2K3, Canada Phone: (416) 979-5000 Ext 6109 Fax: (416) 979-5280 Email: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org URL: http://www.ee.ryerson.ca/~phiscock -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 1 17:17:14 2005 From: rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org (Rob Sutherland) Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 17:17:14 GMT Subject: Linux friendly hardware guy? In-Reply-To: <20050801145422.GB22881-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w@public.gmane.org> References: <20050730142359.7532.qmail@memeshadow.net> <20050730214916.GB29026@localhost> <42ECD119.6000509@cheapersafer.com> <762-SnapperMsgB9FE4EF2BF12D05D@198.230.118.101> <20050801132630.29551.qmail@memeshadow.net> <20050801145422.GB22881@ee.ryerson.ca> Message-ID: <20050801171714.1332.qmail@memeshadow.net> Peter Hiscocks writes: > > If you are just buying and replacing a power supply, you can do that without > the blessing of a Linux Guru. My advice would be to get the best possible > supply you can afford. A crummy one can go into Frankenstein mode and take > out every last piece of hardware in the box, as I discovered to my sorrow. > Yes, I'm planning on getting a fairly good one - they don't seem to be that expensive. But, I'm still looking for someone, since just replacing it may not be the end of my problems :-) Rob -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jerome-mhXWc29+iYPyG1zEObXtfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 2 08:57:59 2005 From: jerome-mhXWc29+iYPyG1zEObXtfA at public.gmane.org (JM) Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 16:57:59 +0800 Subject: moving from postgres to mysql Message-ID: <200508021657.59616.jerome@gmanmi.tv> hi all, is there an available application that can migrate postgres data to mysql tia, -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From talexb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 2 12:28:50 2005 From: talexb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Alex Beamish) Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 08:28:50 -0400 Subject: moving from postgres to mysql In-Reply-To: <200508021657.59616.jerome-mhXWc29+iYPyG1zEObXtfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200508021657.59616.jerome@gmanmi.tv> Message-ID: On 8/2/05, JM wrote: > hi all, > > is there an available application that can migrate postgres data to mysql Hi there, I've used both, and the main differences I can think of are that MySQL does a little less .. no sub-selects, no referential integrity. I'm not up to date with the latest version 4 of MySQL, so that may have changed. My baseline is 3.2.2 of MySQL and 7.4.3 of PostgreSQL. If you do a pg_dump from PostgreSQL, and then load the result into MySQL (it's been too long, I don't remember the comamnd) I'm guesing that will work. Then you just have to get used to the differences in how the command prompt works -- show tables instead of \d; and describe table foo instead of \d foo. When you talk about changing a database, I presume this also means you need to change an application, and that may be work involved work. What versions of MySQL and PostgreSQL are you working with? Alex -- ---------- Linux, Firefox and GMail .. what a combination. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 2 12:12:49 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 08:12:49 -0400 Subject: X-Windows M$ Windows question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <42EF6341.80002@rogers.com> Ansar Mohammed wrote: > My sincerest apologies if this is off topic but how can I replicate the > middle button cut/paste functionality on X-Windows on M$ Windows? You're asking how to do something in Windows??? In a Linux list??? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From talexb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 2 14:17:08 2005 From: talexb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Alex Beamish) Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 10:17:08 -0400 Subject: X-Windows M$ Windows question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 8/1/05, Ansar Mohammed wrote: > > My sincerest apologies if this is off topic but how can I replicate the > middle button cut/paste functionality on X-Windows on M$ Windows? 1. Yes, this probably is off-topic for a Linux users mailing list. We discuss Linux here, not how Windows can emulate some of the cool things that Linux can do. :) 2. Have you searched Google? In less than a minute I turned up http://www.shelltoys.com/mouse_software/ which seems to be an answer to your question. And that was choice #2 of 933,000 based on 'windows utility paste with mouse'. Good luck. Alex -- ---------- Linux, Firefox and GMail .. what a combination. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1235-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 2 15:09:06 2005 From: sy1235-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 10:09:06 -0500 Subject: Is there an August meeting? Message-ID: There is currently no information on the next meeting. Where will it be held, and will there be a presentation? http://gtalug.org/index.php/Meetings -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 2 16:15:08 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 12:15:08 -0400 Subject: X-Windows M$ Windows question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <42EF9C0C.5090205@rogers.com> Alex Beamish wrote: > On 8/1/05, Ansar Mohammed wrote: >>My sincerest apologies if this is off topic but how can I replicate the >>middle button cut/paste functionality on X-Windows on M$ Windows? > > 1. Yes, this probably is off-topic for a Linux users mailing list. We > discuss Linux here, not how Windows can emulate some of the cool > things that Linux can do. :) > > 2. Have you searched Google? In less than a minute I turned up > > http://www.shelltoys.com/mouse_software/ > > which seems to be an answer to your question. And that was choice #2 > of 933,000 based on 'windows utility paste with mouse'. Hmmm... So, XP needs a third party utility, to accomplish what Linux/Unix can do out of the box. ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 2 17:06:26 2005 From: cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org (Chris F.A. Johnson) Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 13:06:26 -0400 (EDT) Subject: X-Windows M$ Windows question In-Reply-To: <42EF9C0C.5090205-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <42EF9C0C.5090205@rogers.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Aug 2005, James Knott wrote: > Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 12:15:08 -0400 > From: James Knott > Reply-To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: X-Windows M$ Windows question > > Alex Beamish wrote: >> On 8/1/05, Ansar Mohammed wrote: >>> My sincerest apologies if this is off topic but how can I replicate the >>> middle button cut/paste functionality on X-Windows on M$ Windows? >> >> 1. Yes, this probably is off-topic for a Linux users mailing list. We >> discuss Linux here, not how Windows can emulate some of the cool >> things that Linux can do. :) >> >> 2. Have you searched Google? In less than a minute I turned up >> >> http://www.shelltoys.com/mouse_software/ >> >> which seems to be an answer to your question. And that was choice #2 >> of 933,000 based on 'windows utility paste with mouse'. > > Hmmm... So, XP needs a third party utility, to accomplish what > Linux/Unix can do out of the box. ;-) No, to do what X can do out of the box. -- Chris F.A. Johnson ================================================================== Shell Scripting Recipes: A Problem-Solution Approach, 2005, Apress -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 2 17:08:11 2005 From: cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org (Chris F.A. Johnson) Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 13:08:11 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Is there an August meeting? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Aug 2005, Sy wrote: > Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 10:09:06 -0500 > From: Sy > Reply-To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: [TLUG]: Is there an August meeting? > > There is currently no information on the next meeting. Where will it > be held, and will there be a presentation? A few months ago Robert had me down tentatively for Aug. 9 for a presentation on my book; I have not had any confirmation, nor has anything been posted. -- Chris F.A. Johnson ================================================================== Shell Scripting Recipes: A Problem-Solution Approach, 2005, Apress -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 2 17:44:04 2005 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 13:44:04 -0400 Subject: dealing with a dedicated server's "custom" linux? In-Reply-To: <4386c5b20508011957382fca70-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <4386c5b20508011957382fca70@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 8/1/05, Aaron Vegh wrote: > > I want to manage this thing myself but I don't want to break something > that inadvertently relies on this custom brand of Linux. Does anyone > know about this version of Linux, what makes it custom, and what I can > do to get around it? > > And please, no suggestions that I move to another provider. I > sympathize, but I'm in the midst of a 12 month contract. That won't > help me right now. It seems to me that you're between a rock and a hard place. The provider is providing an incredibly ancient version of Red Hat Linux, and the fact that they then customized it essentially makes it nigh unto unmaintainable. You are quite likely to be best off treating the money spent on the present contract as a "sunk cost" which means that it can and should be IGNORED for decisionmaking purposes. "Economistsargue that, if you are rational , you will not take sunk costs into account when making decisions." in contrast... Many people have strong misgivings about "wasting" resources. This is called "loss aversion ". Many people, for example, would feel obligated to go to the movie despite not really wanting to, because doing otherwise would be wasting the ticket price; they feel they passed the point of no return. This is sometimes called the sunk cost fallacy. Economists would label this behavior "irrational": It is inefficient because it misallocates resources by depending on information that is irrelevant to the business decision being made. The Better Answer for you is likely to purchase services from another provider that can provide you a system that isn't based on an unmaintainable 4-year-old version of a distribution, but which is rather using something at least 3 years newer. That would likely be much cheaper than fighting with an unmaintainable system at the current service provider. If your boss has some sort of "loss aversion" and regards the sunk cost in some irrational manner, then I guess they are prepared to have you spend arbitrary amounts of your time fighting with RHAT 7.2, and maybe you should consider looking for another boss... -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From presidentofthefuture-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 2 18:13:07 2005 From: presidentofthefuture-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Mike Newman) Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 14:13:07 -0400 Subject: KDE Sound In-Reply-To: <20050801150422.629cf73f.hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20050801150422.629cf73f.hgibson@eol.ca> Message-ID: On 8/1/05, Howard Gibson wrote: > I reinstalled Fedora Core 3 and got my sound card working again. Now, it is not working again. I strongly suspect that something in KDE is crashing and locking it up, since everything worked until I tried out KDE. Rebooting does not help. The sound card is a C-Media CM8738. I generally do not see error messages. > > I have eliminated the sound card as the source of the problem. I am assuming that the /dev/dsp is locked or that there is a full buffer, but I cannot find anything. I haven't used KDE in ages.... is KDE starting artds? In my experience sound servers tend to cause more problems than they solve. -- Get Firefox - Take back the Web http://www.getfirefox.com/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 2 18:20:56 2005 From: clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (CLIFFORD ILKAY) Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 14:20:56 -0400 Subject: dealing with a dedicated server's "custom" linux? In-Reply-To: <4386c5b20508011957382fca70-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <4386c5b20508011957382fca70@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200508021420.57423.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> On August 1, 2005 22:57, Aaron Vegh wrote: > Hi there, > I've got a dedicated server package with CI Host (www.cihost.com). > I've been happy with the features of my package, in terms of > bandwidth, machine specs and price. However, over time I've > realized that while they refer to the distro on the machine as "Red > Hat 7.2" it is in fact a customized version of same. [snip] > I want to manage this thing myself but I don't want to break > something that inadvertently relies on this custom brand of Linux. > Does anyone know about this version of Linux, what makes it custom, > and what I can do to get around it? The fact that they are using Red Hat 7.2 should be a tip off that all is not as it seems. Anyone running RH 7.2 today who cares about keeping it updated and running modern versions of kernels and applications, essentially has to create their own distro using RH 7.2 as the base. It can only be called RH 7.2 under the most generous of interpretations. Mass hosting companies that compete on price often use proprietary tools, like those from SW-Soft, that effectively lock them into specific and arguably proprietary Linux distributions. If you are running the run of the mill PHP/MySQL apps, that is probably good enough. However, when you stray outside of that, you are in for adventures. > And please, no suggestions that I move to another provider. I > sympathize, but I'm in the midst of a 12 month contract. That won't > help me right now. No it won't but neither will a lame custom distro that you cannot use they way you would like. Assuming you have enough disk space to play with, you could do an in place installation of another distro. Many hosting companies will offer free a reimaging service so that if you really get the machine bent out of shape, you can always go back to a clean, baseline installation. Some also offer alternate boot methods so that you can leverage that to fix your main distro. I have installed Mandrake 10.1 using the existing (broken) Fedora Core 2 that was provided by the hosting provider before. I shrunk the filesystems, created new ones, and then expanded a tarball of a base Mandrake 10.1 installation to the newly created filesystems. I then modified the boot loader entries to point at the new Mandrake kernel and root and rebooted. It took many tries to get it right only because I did not know that the hosting provider assigned static IPs via DHCP. Once I figured that out, it was a simple matter of installing a DHCP client by booting in FC2, chrooting to the Mandrake installation, and using urpmi to install the DHCP client. This is fraught with dangers. You can easily lock yourself out of the server so be sure you have an alternate boot method. There are some lilo and grub tricks you can use to mitigate the risks of doing this. You might also consider creating a cron job before you boot your freshly installed distro to reboot using the original boot method in say, ten minutes. Having a remote console to the server so that you can see boot time messages before networking comes up is also invaluable, though often not available. -- Regards, Clifford Ilkay Dinamis Corporation 3266 Yonge Street, Suite 1419 Toronto, ON Canada M4N 3P6 +1 416-410-3326 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 2 18:31:31 2005 From: ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ansar Mohammed) Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 14:31:31 -0400 Subject: X-Windows M$ Windows question In-Reply-To: <42EF6341.80002-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <42EF6341.80002@rogers.com> Message-ID: Well, most Windows users have no idea what I was talking about. And I don't think I am googling for the right thing. -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org] On Behalf Of James Knott Sent: August 2, 2005 8:13 AM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: X-Windows M$ Windows question Ansar Mohammed wrote: > My sincerest apologies if this is off topic but how can I replicate the > middle button cut/paste functionality on X-Windows on M$ Windows? You're asking how to do something in Windows??? In a Linux list??? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 2 18:35:43 2005 From: ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ansar Mohammed) Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 14:35:43 -0400 Subject: X-Windows M$ Windows question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Yup, but most tools seem to be payware.. I mean to pay $20 just to have the middle mouse cut and paste functionality is a bit absurd. I was hoping that since most Unix people use Windows too that this would have been a good place to ask. -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org] On Behalf Of Alex Beamish Sent: August 2, 2005 10:17 AM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: X-Windows M$ Windows question On 8/1/05, Ansar Mohammed wrote: > > My sincerest apologies if this is off topic but how can I replicate the > middle button cut/paste functionality on X-Windows on M$ Windows? 1. Yes, this probably is off-topic for a Linux users mailing list. We discuss Linux here, not how Windows can emulate some of the cool things that Linux can do. :) 2. Have you searched Google? In less than a minute I turned up http://www.shelltoys.com/mouse_software/ which seems to be an answer to your question. And that was choice #2 of 933,000 based on 'windows utility paste with mouse'. Good luck. Alex -- ---------- Linux, Firefox and GMail .. what a combination. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 2 18:55:41 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 14:55:41 -0400 Subject: X-Windows M$ Windows question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <42EFC1AD.1020602@rogers.com> Ansar Mohammed wrote: > Yup, but most tools seem to be payware.. I mean to pay $20 just to have the > middle mouse cut and paste functionality is a bit absurd. Well, it *IS* Windows you're talking about. ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 2 19:01:15 2005 From: ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ansar Mohammed) Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 15:01:15 -0400 Subject: KDE Sound In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I have been using Gnome for some time. I just installed kde 3.4 from source. It is simply an incredible environment. The UI is clean and stable. It is really quite fantastic. I am still messing about with it. But initially I would say it is allot better than the most recent version of Gnome. -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org] On Behalf Of Mike Newman Sent: August 2, 2005 2:13 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: KDE Sound On 8/1/05, Howard Gibson wrote: > I reinstalled Fedora Core 3 and got my sound card working again. Now, it is not working again. I strongly suspect that something in KDE is crashing and locking it up, since everything worked until I tried out KDE. Rebooting does not help. The sound card is a C-Media CM8738. I generally do not see error messages. > > I have eliminated the sound card as the source of the problem. I am assuming that the /dev/dsp is locked or that there is a full buffer, but I cannot find anything. I haven't used KDE in ages.... is KDE starting artds? In my experience sound servers tend to cause more problems than they solve. -- Get Firefox - Take back the Web http://www.getfirefox.com/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From aaronvegh-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 2 20:12:45 2005 From: aaronvegh-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Aaron Vegh) Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 16:12:45 -0400 Subject: dealing with a dedicated server's "custom" linux? In-Reply-To: References: <4386c5b20508011957382fca70@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4386c5b20508021312592572fa@mail.gmail.com> > You are quite likely to be best off treating the money spent on the present > contract as a "sunk cost" which means that it can and should be IGNORED for > decisionmaking purposes. > "Economists argue > that, if you are rational, you will not take sunk costs into account when > making decisions." Thank you for a very... unexpected.... answer... That was quite informative. > If your boss has some sort of "loss aversion" and regards the sunk cost in > some irrational manner, then I guess they are prepared to have you spend > arbitrary amounts of your time fighting with RHAT 7.2, and maybe you should > consider looking for another boss... My boss would be really pissed if I found another one. I am the boss, after all. LOL The interesting thing is that the "arbitrary" time would be incredibly fun and I would learn a lot (esp. thanks to Clifford for your personal story), but I lack both time and courage to engage this much further. Mostly courage, let's face it. Thanks! Aaron. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 2 22:33:56 2005 From: blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Byron L. Sonne) Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 18:33:56 -0400 Subject: KDE Sound In-Reply-To: References: <20050801150422.629cf73f.hgibson@eol.ca> Message-ID: <42EFF4D4.1070201@rogers.com> >> I reinstalled Fedora Core 3 and got my sound card working again. Now, it is not working again. In the past I've had problems, but once KDE was started up I fired up a term and did '/etc/init.d/artsd restart' or perhaps it was '/etc/init.d/alsasound restart'... not sure. I don't think you can clear the soundcard off the culprit list yet; if you rebooted and it still doesn't work that isn't a good sign. Then again, perhaps kde borks stuff on load and doesn't unbork on exit. Still, that's odd. Check how you have alsa and oss stuff in your kernel; some stuff shouldn't be built in and should remain as modules. Investigate how any OSS compatibility stuff is installed. If you replace the soundcard with one of a different make & model, do you still suffer these problems? Try that - that should help further eliminate the sound card as the source of the problem. If you have modules for the soundcard loaded, figure out which ones they are then take a look at the module code, and compare the revision and make/model info with that reported by lspci (-x option if I remember). Perhaps you're straddling a line of flakiness when it comes to drivers. I've run into this, and it's amazing how a 1 or 2 byte change and a module recompile can make a huge difference. Check your BIOS for int/dma/etc options too, blah, blah, blah... :) Regards, Byron -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 3 00:18:08 2005 From: interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (interlug-list) Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2005 20:18:08 -0400 Subject: KDE Sound In-Reply-To: <20050801150422.629cf73f.hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20050801150422.629cf73f.hgibson@eol.ca> Message-ID: <1123028288.24140.370.camel@holden.weait.net> On Mon, 2005-08-01 at 15:04, Howard Gibson wrote: > I reinstalled Fedora Core 3 and got my sound card working again. > Now, it is not working again. The Fedoras start with alsa muted at times. From a console try alsamixer. If any of the "VU meters" have an M over them that channel is muted. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 2 19:03:15 2005 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 15:03:15 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Is there an August meeting? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Aug 2005, Chris F.A. Johnson wrote: > On Tue, 2 Aug 2005, Sy wrote: > > > Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 10:09:06 -0500 > > From: Sy > > Reply-To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > > Subject: [TLUG]: Is there an August meeting? > > > > There is currently no information on the next meeting. Where will it > > be held, and will there be a presentation? > > A few months ago Robert had me down tentatively for Aug. 9 for a > presentation on my book; I have not had any confirmation, nor has > anything been posted. Chris and I have ACKed and the wiki will be updated shortly. Rob -- Robert Brockway B.Sc. Phone: +1-416-669-3073 Senior Technical Consultant Email: support-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Web: www.opentrend.net We are open 24x7x365 for technical support. Call us in a crisis. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 1 19:04:22 2005 From: hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Howard Gibson) Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 15:04:22 -0400 Subject: KDE Sound Message-ID: <20050801150422.629cf73f.hgibson@eol.ca> I reinstalled Fedora Core 3 and got my sound card working again. Now, it is not working again. I strongly suspect that something in KDE is crashing and locking it up, since everything worked until I tried out KDE. Rebooting does not help. The sound card is a C-Media CM8738. I generally do not see error messages. I have eliminated the sound card as the source of the problem. I am assuming that the /dev/dsp is locked or that there is a full buffer, but I cannot find anything. -- Howard Gibson hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org howardg-PadmjKOQAFn3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org http://home.eol.ca/~hgibson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jerome-mhXWc29+iYPyG1zEObXtfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 3 05:36:16 2005 From: jerome-mhXWc29+iYPyG1zEObXtfA at public.gmane.org (Jerome Macaranas) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 13:36:16 +0800 Subject: moving from postgres to mysql In-Reply-To: References: <200508021657.59616.jerome@gmanmi.tv> Message-ID: <200508031336.16402.jerome@gmanmi.tv> Hi Alex, i have a phpBB forum and for some reason i need to switch to mysql... i have dumped pgsql data.. im trying it out on how to load that data to mysql v4 tia, On Tuesday 02 August 2005 20:28, Alex Beamish wrote: > On 8/2/05, JM wrote: > > hi all, > > > > is there an available application that can migrate postgres data > > to mysql > > Hi there, > > I've used both, and the main differences I can think of are that MySQL > does a little less .. no sub-selects, no referential integrity. I'm > not up to date with the latest version 4 of MySQL, so that may have > changed. My baseline is 3.2.2 of MySQL and 7.4.3 of PostgreSQL. > > If you do a pg_dump from PostgreSQL, and then load the result into > MySQL (it's been too long, I don't remember the comamnd) I'm guesing > that will work. Then you just have to get used to the differences in > how the command prompt works -- show tables instead of \d; and > describe table foo instead of \d foo. > > When you talk about changing a database, I presume this also means you > need to change an application, and that may be work involved work. > What versions of MySQL and PostgreSQL are you working with? > > Alex -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 3 15:24:58 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 11:24:58 -0400 Subject: place to buy discontinued motherboard? (and, free Celeron/466) Message-ID: <20050803152458.GA2154@node1.opengeometry.net> After 6 years of faithful service, one of my dual-P3 is showing the "symptoms". It's the motherboard. Does anyone know where I can buy a discontinued dual/single-P3 (S370) motherboards? Excess-inventory motherboards would be ideal. To sort of "pay forward" to community, I'm giving away Celeron/466 (S370 on S370-to-Slot1 adapter). It was pulled from a motherboard with leaking capacitors. Let me know if you want it, and I can bring it to next TLUG, WestTLUG, or KWLUG meeting. -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mohan.desouza-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 3 18:12:51 2005 From: mohan.desouza-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Mohan DeSouza) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 14:12:51 -0400 Subject: Posting went thru? Message-ID: <1d085e5505080311125b96090a@mail.gmail.com> Hi Did my posting about the Linux Sysadmin job go thru? Hi All There is a great job opportunity for a Linux Sysadmin/Apache/Tomcat/Windows (Senior System Administrator) downtown paying upwards of 70K depending on experience.. Please contact Sasha Sheybani Placement Director, Quantum Technology Recruiting Inc. 416-366-3660 x 2242 sashas-kkcH8YYIjImROUZz0P5mdQ at public.gmane.org 55 University Ave. Suite 950 Toronto, Ontario M5J 2H7 "Celebrating 35 years of success" Please contact immediately as they are looking for someone to start yesterday ...Also, pls tell Sasha that I referred you (I have met with him.) See the attachment for the job description. BTW, the Linux course I had proposed was cancelled due to poor response. I appreciate anyone who responded and will keep your info on file for any future opportunities... Mohan DeSouza Mohan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mohan.desouza-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 3 14:10:46 2005 From: mohan.desouza-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Mohan DeSouza) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 10:10:46 -0400 Subject: Job Opportunity Message-ID: <1d085e5505080307107fb60269@mail.gmail.com> Hi All There is a great job opportunity for a Linux Sysadmin/Apache/Tomcat/Windows (Senior System Administrator) downtown paying upwards of 70K depending on experience.. Please contact Sasha Sheybani Placement Director, Quantum Technology Recruiting Inc. 416-366-3660 x 2242 sashas-kkcH8YYIjImROUZz0P5mdQ at public.gmane.org 55 University Ave. Suite 950 Toronto, Ontario M5J 2H7 "Celebrating 35 years of success" Please contact immediately as they are looking for someone to start yesterday ...Also, pls tell Sasha that I referred you (I have met with him.) See the attachment for the job description. BTW, the Linux course I had proposed was cancelled due to poor response. I appreciate anyone who responded and will keep your info on file for any future opportunities... Mohan DeSouza -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Senior System Administrator-.doc Type: application/msword Size: 22528 bytes Desc: not available URL: From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 3 18:32:29 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 14:32:29 -0400 Subject: Posting went thru? In-Reply-To: <1d085e5505080311125b96090a-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <1d085e5505080311125b96090a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050803183229.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 03, 2005 at 02:12:51PM -0400, Mohan DeSouza wrote: > Did my posting about the Linux Sysadmin job go thru? Yes, including an evil MS word document. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 3 14:39:10 2005 From: hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (D. Hugh Redelmeier) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 10:39:10 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [good]Video importing and editing on Linux In-Reply-To: <20050720025351.GA954@localhost> References: <20050720025351.GA954@localhost> Message-ID: | From: ted leslie | Date: Tue, 19 Jul 2005 22:53:51 -0400 [Sorry for the slow reply. I don't read the list very often.] | The 100$ Haupauge pci/tv capture 30fps (even/odd scan lines in that) | but it is 4:1:1 Most Hauppauge (note spelling) cards claim to be 4:2:0. What does this mean? I learned from According to that article, 4:2:0 is what DVD uses. 4:2:0 is also used for DV for PAL. 4:1:1 is used by DV for NTSC (NTSC is what we use in North America). -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From peeyush_maurya-/E1597aS9LQAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 3 18:51:25 2005 From: peeyush_maurya-/E1597aS9LQAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Peeyush Maurya) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 11:51:25 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [good]Video importing and editing on Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050803185125.57111.qmail@web54205.mail.yahoo.com> have a look at the following URL for some more video editing software http://linux-faqs.com/Forum/viewtopic.php?t=47 --- "D. Hugh Redelmeier" wrote: > | From: ted leslie > | Date: Tue, 19 Jul 2005 22:53:51 -0400 > [Sorry for the slow reply. I don't read the list very > often.] > > | The 100$ Haupauge pci/tv capture 30fps (even/odd scan > lines in that) > | but it is 4:1:1 > > Most Hauppauge (note spelling) cards claim to be 4:2:0. > What does > this mean? I learned from > > > According to that article, 4:2:0 is what DVD uses. 4:2:0 > is also used > for DV for PAL. 4:1:1 is used by DV for NTSC (NTSC is > what we use in > North America). > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: > http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 > columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From aaronvegh-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 3 13:56:51 2005 From: aaronvegh-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Aaron Vegh) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 09:56:51 -0400 Subject: moving from postgres to mysql In-Reply-To: <200508031336.16402.jerome-mhXWc29+iYPyG1zEObXtfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200508021657.59616.jerome@gmanmi.tv> <200508031336.16402.jerome@gmanmi.tv> Message-ID: <4386c5b20508030656602118b0@mail.gmail.com> I don't know a whole lot about pgsql. If its output is a file that contains the SQL statements that build the data (which is what MySQL does), then you can use this command to get the data into MySQL: In MySQL: create database phpbb; exit; In the shell: shell # mysql -u [username] -p[password] phpbb < output_pgsql_data.sql At least, this is what I do when moving data between MySQL servers. Cheers, Aaron. On 8/3/05, Jerome Macaranas wrote: > Hi Alex, > > i have a phpBB forum and for some reason i need to switch to mysql... i have > dumped pgsql data.. im trying it out on how to load that data to mysql v4 > > tia, > > > On Tuesday 02 August 2005 20:28, Alex Beamish wrote: > > On 8/2/05, JM wrote: > > > hi all, > > > > > > is there an available application that can migrate postgres data > > > to mysql > > > > Hi there, > > > > I've used both, and the main differences I can think of are that MySQL > > does a little less .. no sub-selects, no referential integrity. I'm > > not up to date with the latest version 4 of MySQL, so that may have > > changed. My baseline is 3.2.2 of MySQL and 7.4.3 of PostgreSQL. > > > > If you do a pg_dump from PostgreSQL, and then load the result into > > MySQL (it's been too long, I don't remember the comamnd) I'm guesing > > that will work. Then you just have to get used to the differences in > > how the command prompt works -- show tables instead of \d; and > > describe table foo instead of \d foo. > > > > When you talk about changing a database, I presume this also means you > > need to change an application, and that may be work involved work. > > What versions of MySQL and PostgreSQL are you working with? > > > > Alex > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 3 19:48:06 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 15:48:06 -0400 Subject: moving from postgres to mysql In-Reply-To: <4386c5b20508030656602118b0-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508021657.59616.jerome@gmanmi.tv> <200508031336.16402.jerome@gmanmi.tv> <4386c5b20508030656602118b0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050803194806.GC6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 03, 2005 at 09:56:51AM -0400, Aaron Vegh wrote: > I don't know a whole lot about pgsql. If its output is a file that > contains the SQL statements that build the data (which is what MySQL > does), then you can use this command to get the data into MySQL: > > In MySQL: > create database phpbb; > exit; > > In the shell: > shell # mysql -u [username] -p[password] phpbb < output_pgsql_data.sql > > At least, this is what I do when moving data between MySQL servers. Well I don't know if the output of pgsql would even be compatible with what mysql expects. Certainly the default output of pg_dump would not be. Perhaps pg_dump -i (or whatever does data as seperate insert statements) would be. Of course that doesn't take care of table creation since each db seems to use their own type names for each field type. Of course personally, I would be wanting to switch the other direction instead. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 3 19:55:33 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 15:55:33 -0400 Subject: moving from postgres to mysql References: <200508021657.59616.jerome@gmanmi.tv> <200508031336.16402.jerome@gmanmi.tv> <4386c5b20508030656602118b0@mail.gmail.com> <20050803194806.GC6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <000c01c59865$501b9170$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> From: "Lennart Sorensen" To: Sent: Wednesday, 03 August, 2005 15:48 Subject: Re: [TLUG]: moving from postgres to mysql > > Of course personally, I would be wanting to switch the other direction > instead. > > Lennart Sorensen ... why not move to (the real) Ingres then! Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 3 20:07:52 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 16:07:52 -0400 Subject: moving from postgres to mysql In-Reply-To: <000c01c59865$501b9170$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> References: <200508021657.59616.jerome@gmanmi.tv> <200508031336.16402.jerome@gmanmi.tv> <4386c5b20508030656602118b0@mail.gmail.com> <20050803194806.GC6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <000c01c59865$501b9170$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: <20050803200752.GD6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 03, 2005 at 03:55:33PM -0400, Francois Ouellette wrote: > From: "Lennart Sorensen" To: > Sent: Wednesday, 03 August, 2005 15:48 > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: moving from postgres to mysql > > > > Of course personally, I would be wanting to switch the other direction > > instead. > > > > Lennart Sorensen > > ... why not move to (the real) Ingres then! I like postgresql, and don't know much about Ingres at all. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 3 20:18:32 2005 From: interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (interlug-list) Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 16:18:32 -0400 Subject: Fwd: Free Monitors to a Good Home In-Reply-To: <5.2.1.1.0.20041219152240.009e2010-l9/oolyNyK73oGB3hsPCZA@public.gmane.org> References: <5.2.1.1.0.20041219152240.009e2010@pop3.ilap.com> Message-ID: <1123100312.30652.313.camel@holden.weait.net> On Sun, 2004-12-19 at 15:24, dave morton wrote: > >Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 15:11:35 -0500 > >To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > >From: dave morton Dude, check your CMOS battery. ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 3 20:30:35 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 16:30:35 -0400 Subject: Fwd: Free Monitors to a Good Home In-Reply-To: <5.2.1.1.0.20041219152240.009e2010-l9/oolyNyK73oGB3hsPCZA@public.gmane.org> References: <5.2.1.1.0.20041219152240.009e2010@pop3.ilap.com> Message-ID: <42F1296B.4090508@rogers.com> dave morton wrote: > > Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 15:11:35 -0500 Geezzz!!! It's d?j? vu all over again. ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 3 22:46:26 2005 From: marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Marcus Brubaker) Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 18:46:26 -0400 Subject: Linux friendly hardware guy? In-Reply-To: <20050801184433.6ba7d7aa.joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <08795C772787354E914917175F5503301B443B@skarloey.diaslan.net> <20050731175301.9468.qmail@memeshadow.net> <20050801184433.6ba7d7aa.joehill@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <42F14942.7060203@utoronto.ca> JoeHill wrote: >On Sun, 31 Jul 2005 17:53:01 GMT >Rob Sutherland got hold of an infinite number of monkeys to write: > > > >>I don't have a UPS, alas. This all started after the power went out >> >> > >Aaaaah, the joys of privatization! Lower prices and better service! > >Waitaminnit... > > > To be fair, this is the joys of political wavering. I won't argue that privatization is a great idea for electricity, but Ontario's current power woes have more to do with the fact that (figuratively speaking) the night before things were to be privatized, the Conservative govt had a changing of the guard, got cold feet and changed their minds. The result being a half-assed system that is worse than either the fully government run system was or a fully privatized system would have been. Combine that with a bad financial situation (thanks to the Conservatives) and we have the current set of problems Marcus -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1235-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 00:59:59 2005 From: sy1235-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 19:59:59 -0500 Subject: Posting went thru? In-Reply-To: <20050803183229.GB6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <1d085e5505080311125b96090a@mail.gmail.com> <20050803183229.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: On 8/3/05, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Wed, Aug 03, 2005 at 02:12:51PM -0400, Mohan DeSouza wrote: > > Did my posting about the Linux Sysadmin job go thru? > > Yes, including an evil MS word document. Oh.. I'm sure any good Linux sysadmin can write a perl script to interpret those. ;) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1235-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 01:04:48 2005 From: sy1235-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 20:04:48 -0500 Subject: Free Monitors to a Good Home In-Reply-To: <5.2.1.1.0.20041219150435.009dfd00-l9/oolyNyK73oGB3hsPCZA@public.gmane.org> References: <20050720025351.GA954@localhost> <5.2.1.1.0.20041219150435.009dfd00@pop3.ilap.com> Message-ID: I recall Matt Price had some wierd monitor issues discussed on the list a while back. I'm CCing him in case he's interested. My intuition is telling me that I need a new monitor, but I think I'll invest in a fair quality LCD. I've been working with some basic Dell LCDs at work (can I call it that if I like it?) and I am liking them a lot. I used to be hard to please when it came to LCDs.. but I guess the technology has improved. On 12/19/04, dave morton wrote: > Sorry if it's a repeat, but I didn't see my message appear > > Two 17 inch flat screen (CRT) AOC brand monitors (working fine); > Free. Located at Queen Street and Hwy 410 in Brampton > cell: 647.225.1989 > thanks > dave -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From zkoziol-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 01:10:53 2005 From: zkoziol-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Zbigniew Koziol) Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 21:10:53 -0400 Subject: Posting went thru? In-Reply-To: References: <1d085e5505080311125b96090a@mail.gmail.com> <20050803183229.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <42F16B1D.4080202@istop.com> Sy wrote: > On 8/3/05, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > >>On Wed, Aug 03, 2005 at 02:12:51PM -0400, Mohan DeSouza wrote: >> >>>Did my posting about the Linux Sysadmin job go thru? >> >>Yes, including an evil MS word document. > > > Oh.. I'm sure any good Linux sysadmin can write a perl script to > interpret those. ;) No problem. But... There is a big butt here... I in the past promissed myself: I will not send a resume in MSWord format. Especially (!) to these who request that. I did not keep my promisse this time ;( zb. > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- Zbigniew Koziol, SoftQuake^(tm) Open Source Business Solutions Web Development, Linux, Web Mail Fax Voice Servers, Networking Consultations, Innovative Technologies Tel/Fax: 1-416-530-2780 Toronto, Canada, http://www.softquake.ca, info-lcEyp1+e+UdAFePFGvp55w at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From aaronvegh-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 02:26:32 2005 From: aaronvegh-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Aaron Vegh) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 22:26:32 -0400 Subject: Free Monitors to a Good Home In-Reply-To: References: <20050720025351.GA954@localhost> <5.2.1.1.0.20041219150435.009dfd00@pop3.ilap.com> Message-ID: <4386c5b20508031926502eb1a@mail.gmail.com> I believe Dell has its LCDs made by Samsung. In any event, there are a lot of folks who think Dell makes terrific LCDs. Do a text search for "Dell" in this long page at Macintouch reader reports: http://www.macintouch.com/cinemadisplays07.html There are a lot of happy Mac-using Dell customers... Cheers, Aaron. On 8/3/05, Sy wrote: > I recall Matt Price had some wierd monitor issues discussed on the > list a while back. I'm CCing him in case he's interested. > > My intuition is telling me that I need a new monitor, but I think I'll > invest in a fair quality LCD. I've been working with some basic Dell > LCDs at work (can I call it that if I like it?) and I am liking them a > lot. > > I used to be hard to please when it came to LCDs.. but I guess the > technology has improved. > > > > On 12/19/04, dave morton wrote: > > Sorry if it's a repeat, but I didn't see my message appear > > > > Two 17 inch flat screen (CRT) AOC brand monitors (working fine); > > Free. Located at Queen Street and Hwy 410 in Brampton > > cell: 647.225.1989 > > thanks > > dave > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From aaronvegh-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 03:11:13 2005 From: aaronvegh-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Aaron Vegh) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 23:11:13 -0400 Subject: get account balances from bank Web site? In-Reply-To: References: <4386c5b205071517492027df1c@mail.gmail.com> <200507160849.44061.dbarkwell@pelism.com> Message-ID: <4386c5b20508032011622f2b76@mail.gmail.com> Hi Franco, Thanks very much for this very informative script. I'm not very good with perl (more a PHP guy, so I'm not completely lost!), so this really helped. However, due to my ignorance I have not been able to finish this script, so I was hoping for a little expertise to push me the final few steps. I have five accounts that I would like to get the balances of, and have written a loop that goes through the source code of the site using HTML::TokeParser. The code looks like this: my $stream = HTML::TokeParser->new(\$mech->{content}); while ($stream->get_tag("a")) { if (rindex($stream->get_trimmed_text("/a"), $savingsacct) > 0) { $stream->get_tag("td"); $stream->get_tag("td"); $stream->get_tag("td"); print "Savings Account: " . $stream->get_trimmed_text("/td") . "\n"; } elsif (rindex($stream->get_trimmed_text("/a"), $chequingacct) > 0) { $stream->get_tag("/td"); $stream->get_tag("/td"); $stream->get_tag("td"); print "Chequing Account: " . $stream->get_trimmed_text("/td") . "\n"; } elsif (rindex($stream->get_trimmed_text("/a"), $dreamacct) > 0) { $stream->get_tag("/td"); $stream->get_tag("/td"); $stream->get_tag("td"); print "Dream Account: " . $stream->get_trimmed_text("/td") . "\n"; } elsif (rindex($stream->get_trimmed_text("/a"), $caracct) > 0) { $stream->get_tag("/td"); $stream->get_tag("/td"); $stream->get_tag("td"); print "Car Account: " . $stream->get_trimmed_text("/td") . "\n"; } elsif (rindex($stream->get_trimmed_text("/a"), $locacct) > 0) { $stream->get_tag("/td"); $stream->get_tag("/td"); $stream->get_tag("td"); print "Line of Credit: " . $stream->get_trimmed_text("/td") . "\n"; } } The result is, the script outputs the balance for the first account in this loop ("Savings Account"), but nothing else. Am I doing something wrong? I've been banging my head against the wall on this one. Thanks, Aaron. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tux-4CS0UopE6WdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 03:38:15 2005 From: tux-4CS0UopE6WdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Ilya Palagin) Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 23:38:15 -0400 Subject: Posting went thru? In-Reply-To: <42F16B1D.4080202-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> References: <1d085e5505080311125b96090a@mail.gmail.com> <20050803183229.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <42F16B1D.4080202@istop.com> Message-ID: <42F18DA7.9050503@almatau.com> Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > Sy wrote: > >> On 8/3/05, Lennart Sorensen wrote: >> >>> On Wed, Aug 03, 2005 at 02:12:51PM -0400, Mohan DeSouza wrote: >>> >>>> Did my posting about the Linux Sysadmin job go thru? >>> >>> >>> Yes, including an evil MS word document. >> >> >> >> Oh.. I'm sure any good Linux sysadmin can write a perl script to >> interpret those. ;) > > > No problem. But... There is a big butt here... > > I in the past promissed myself: I will not send a resume in MSWord > format. Especially (!) to these who request that. > > I did not keep my promisse this time ;( Sending rtf to those who want word works just fine. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 03:49:25 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 23:49:25 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Posting went thru? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Wed, 3 Aug 2005, Sy wrote: > > Yes, including an evil MS word document. > > Oh.. I'm sure any good Linux sysadmin can write a perl script to > interpret those. ;) Nah, it just takes a shell script: rm -f *.doc Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 03:55:08 2005 From: hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Howard Gibson) Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 23:55:08 -0400 Subject: Posting went thru? In-Reply-To: <42F16B1D.4080202-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> References: <1d085e5505080311125b96090a@mail.gmail.com> <20050803183229.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <42F16B1D.4080202@istop.com> Message-ID: <20050803235508.27929660.hgibson@eol.ca> On Wed, 03 Aug 2005 21:10:53 -0400 Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > I in the past promissed myself: I will not send a resume in MSWord > format. Especially (!) to these who request that. > > I did not keep my promisse this time ;( > > zb. Zbigniew, No problem. Save the document in RTF format, set the file extensin to DOC, and send it. You should be able to write HTML using VI or EMACS and send that with a DOC extension, although I have not tried it. The recipient will never know, and they will be confident that you are evil enough to work for them. -- Howard Gibson hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org howardg-PadmjKOQAFn3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org http://home.eol.ca/~hgibson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 05:59:26 2005 From: hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (D. Hugh Redelmeier) Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 01:59:26 -0400 (EDT) Subject: buying Dell LCD monitors [was Re: Free Monitors to a Good Home] In-Reply-To: References: <20050720025351.GA954@localhost> <5.2.1.1.0.20041219150435.009dfd00@pop3.ilap.com> Message-ID: | From: Sy | My intuition is telling me that I need a new monitor, but I think I'll | invest in a fair quality LCD. I've been working with some basic Dell | LCDs at work (can I call it that if I like it?) and I am liking them a | lot. Dell LCDs seem fine to me. If you want to buy something from Dell at a low price, you've got to be patient, watchful, and knowledgeable. That's how they get to sell a lot of stuff at a high price and still manage to sell to the price conscious. Quite skillful. A good place to find out about Dell deals is: http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=9&page=1&sort=lastpost&order=&pp=25&daysprune=-1 This might be an interesting thread (only time will tell): http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/showthread.php?t=184687 For example, through information from this site I managed to buy a 24" Dell LCD for $1100 when the list price was $1500 even though there was no sale on. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From saliola-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 14:32:29 2005 From: saliola-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Franco Saliola) Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 10:32:29 -0400 Subject: buying Dell LCD monitors [was Re: Free Monitors to a Good Home] In-Reply-To: References: <20050720025351.GA954@localhost> <5.2.1.1.0.20041219150435.009dfd00@pop3.ilap.com> Message-ID: On 8/4/05, D. Hugh Redelmeier wrote: > A good place to find out about Dell deals is: There are a bunch of places one can find deals. www.techbargains.com www.bensbargains.net www.cheapstingybastard.com Google for "dell coupons". Franco -- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 14:43:43 2005 From: scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Stewart C. Russell) Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 10:43:43 -0400 Subject: Posting went thru? In-Reply-To: References: <1d085e5505080311125b96090a@mail.gmail.com> <20050803183229.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <42F2299F.7070701@sympatico.ca> Sy wrote: > > Oh.. I'm sure any good Linux sysadmin can write a perl script to > interpret those. ;) Perl is overkill: strings evil.doc | fmt -s If you can't get the sense of the document out of that, it probably wasn't worth reading. Stewart -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 15:11:56 2005 From: hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (D. Hugh Redelmeier) Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 11:11:56 -0400 (EDT) Subject: buying Dell LCD monitors [was Re: Free Monitors to a Good Home] In-Reply-To: References: <20050720025351.GA954@localhost> <5.2.1.1.0.20041219150435.009dfd00@pop3.ilap.com> Message-ID: | From: Franco Saliola | There are a bunch of places one can find deals. | | www.techbargains.com | www.bensbargains.net | www.cheapstingybastard.com I think that those are all US sites. Unless you get a US person to order and take delivery, they are not going to work. Dell has much better deals in the US, but they are difficult for us to use. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 15:14:00 2005 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins) Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 11:14:00 -0400 Subject: Posting went thru? In-Reply-To: <42F2299F.7070701-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <1d085e5505080311125b96090a@mail.gmail.com> <20050803183229.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <42F2299F.7070701@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <20050804151400.GA7300@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> On Thu, Aug 04, 2005 at 10:43:43AM -0400, Stewart C. Russell wrote: >Sy wrote: >> >>Oh.. I'm sure any good Linux sysadmin can write a perl script to >>interpret those. ;) > >Perl is overkill: > > strings evil.doc | fmt -s > >If you can't get the sense of the document out of that, it probably >wasn't worth reading. I use antiword, and find it excellent. I use it to read Worm, er, Word documents inline in emails in mutt, which is very handy. Antiword does a very good job of preserving the presentational white space in the document while still letting you read it in the console. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 15:14:56 2005 From: hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (D. Hugh Redelmeier) Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 11:14:56 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Posting went thru? In-Reply-To: <42F2299F.7070701-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <1d085e5505080311125b96090a@mail.gmail.com> <20050803183229.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <42F2299F.7070701@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: | From: Stewart C. Russell | strings evil.doc | fmt -s | | If you can't get the sense of the document out of that, it probably wasn't | worth reading. Unfortunately deleted text could show up without being distinguished. Could lead to much confusion. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 15:41:33 2005 From: tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Tim Writer) Date: 04 Aug 2005 11:41:33 -0400 Subject: Posting went thru? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Henry Spencer writes: > On Wed, 3 Aug 2005, Sy wrote: > > > Yes, including an evil MS word document. > > > > Oh.. I'm sure any good Linux sysadmin can write a perl script to > > interpret those. ;) > > Nah, it just takes a shell script: > > rm -f *.doc I got a good chuckle out of that because I pretty much used to do exactly that. But, if you do want to read it, strings whatever.doc has worked quite well for me in the past. And you get to see stuff (deleted text) they may not have wanted you to see. -- tim writer starnix inc. 647.722.5301 toronto, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From john-Z7w/En0MP3xWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 17:13:25 2005 From: john-Z7w/En0MP3xWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (John Macdonald) Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 13:13:25 -0400 Subject: Posting went thru? In-Reply-To: References: <1d085e5505080311125b96090a@mail.gmail.com> <20050803183229.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <42F2299F.7070701@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <20050804171325.GA2199@lupus.perlwolf.com> On Thu, Aug 04, 2005 at 11:14:56AM -0400, D. Hugh Redelmeier wrote: > | From: Stewart C. Russell > > | strings evil.doc | fmt -s > | > | If you can't get the sense of the document out of that, it probably wasn't > | worth reading. > > Unfortunately deleted text could show up without being distinguished. > Could lead to much confusion. While it can lead to confusion for the reader, it can be an even worse problem for the sender, who thought that the deleted text was really gone and didn't want it to be seen at all. I seem to recall that Microsoft got badly embarassed by an instance of this during their antitrust trial in the U.S. and SCO was probably not intending to tell the world that their lawsuit against Daimler-Chrysler was originally drafted to be against (CitiBank? or BankOfAmerica?) and they changed targets at the last minute. -- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 17:15:39 2005 From: ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org (Andrew Hammond) Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 13:15:39 -0400 Subject: Job Opportunity In-Reply-To: <1d085e5505080307107fb60269-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <1d085e5505080307107fb60269@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <42F24D3B.8050808@ca.afilias.info> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Mohan DeSouza wrote: > Hi All > There is a great job opportunity for a Linux > Sysadmin/Apache/Tomcat/Windows (Senior System Administrator) downtown > paying upwards of 70K depending on experience.. Only $70k, AND you have to work with Windows? How exactly is this a "great job opportunity"? - -- Andrew Hammond 416-673-4138 ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org Database Administrator, Afilias Canada Corp. CB83 2838 4B67 D40F D086 3568 81FC E7E5 27AF 4A9A -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (Darwin) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFC8k07gfzn5SevSpoRAodxAKC3XDWTLKQmeCMiA8Ha4ot+zZ/pXgCfSNk2 IutZyMsAoBjKpIcImvS9aGg= =kGhs -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 17:17:28 2005 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 13:17:28 -0400 Subject: moving from postgres to mysql In-Reply-To: <20050803200752.GD6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <200508021657.59616.jerome@gmanmi.tv> <200508031336.16402.jerome@gmanmi.tv> <4386c5b20508030656602118b0@mail.gmail.com> <20050803194806.GC6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <000c01c59865$501b9170$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050803200752.GD6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: On 8/3/05, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > > On Wed, Aug 03, 2005 at 03:55:33PM -0400, Francois Ouellette wrote: > > From: "Lennart Sorensen" To: > > > Sent: Wednesday, 03 August, 2005 15:48 > > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: moving from postgres to mysql > > > > > > Of course personally, I would be wanting to switch the other direction > > > instead. > > > > > > Lennart Sorensen > > > > ... why not move to (the real) Ingres then! > > I like postgresql, and don't know much about Ingres at all. CA is evidently putting quite a lot of effort into it, according to yesterday's "State of the Databases" talk at OSCON. It's probably a better choice to migrate to than MySQL(tm) if you care about the ability to have the database take robust care of your data. On the other hand, if you have been mandated to use some application Specifically Written For MySQL(tm), there's not much that can be done. There are all too many applications of that sort :-(. -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mohan.desouza-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 17:26:26 2005 From: mohan.desouza-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Mohan DeSouza) Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 13:26:26 -0400 Subject: Job Opportunity In-Reply-To: <42F24D3B.8050808-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw@public.gmane.org> References: <1d085e5505080307107fb60269@mail.gmail.com> <42F24D3B.8050808@ca.afilias.info> Message-ID: <1d085e5505080410264075995c@mail.gmail.com> upwards of 70K, it could be a lot more don't forget to mention my name as the referee hey, you can't have your cake and eat it too.. On 8/4/05, Andrew Hammond wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > Mohan DeSouza wrote: > > Hi All > > There is a great job opportunity for a Linux > > Sysadmin/Apache/Tomcat/Windows (Senior System Administrator) downtown > > paying upwards of 70K depending on experience.. > > Only $70k, AND you have to work with Windows? > How exactly is this a "great job opportunity"? > > - -- > Andrew Hammond 416-673-4138 ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org > Database Administrator, Afilias Canada Corp. > CB83 2838 4B67 D40F D086 3568 81FC E7E5 27AF 4A9A > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (Darwin) > Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org > > iD8DBQFC8k07gfzn5SevSpoRAodxAKC3XDWTLKQmeCMiA8Ha4ot+zZ/pXgCfSNk2 > IutZyMsAoBjKpIcImvS9aGg= > =kGhs > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From teddymills-VFlxZYho3OA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 18:00:02 2005 From: teddymills-VFlxZYho3OA at public.gmane.org (teddymills) Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 14:00:02 -0400 Subject: Mission impossible Message-ID: <42F257A2.5030806@knet.ca> Remember how in Mission Impossible 1, there was a keystroke logger? Well not really...but i need to install a keystroke logger on a Linux Redhat/Fedora Core server. I know I could probably look at the .bash_history, of every user, but I would prefer a single log of all keystrokes from all users local and remote. From the little I know of Linux keystroke loggers, it seems to be some kind of hack. /teddy -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From saliola-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 19:33:24 2005 From: saliola-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Franco Saliola) Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 15:33:24 -0400 Subject: buying Dell LCD monitors [was Re: Free Monitors to a Good Home] In-Reply-To: References: <20050720025351.GA954@localhost> <5.2.1.1.0.20041219150435.009dfd00@pop3.ilap.com> Message-ID: On 8/4/05, D. Hugh Redelmeier wrote: > I think that those are all US sites. Unless you get a US person to > order and take delivery, they are not going to work. Opps. I didn't realize that. I'm living in the US now so I should buy some stuff before I move back. Franco -- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 19:48:11 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 15:48:11 -0400 Subject: buying Dell LCD monitors [was Re: Free Monitors to a Good Home] In-Reply-To: References: <20050720025351.GA954@localhost> <5.2.1.1.0.20041219150435.009dfd00@pop3.ilap.com> Message-ID: <42F270FB.4020400@rogers.com> Franco Saliola wrote: > On 8/4/05, D. Hugh Redelmeier wrote: > >>I think that those are all US sites. Unless you get a US person to >>order and take delivery, they are not going to work. > > Opps. I didn't realize that. I'm living in the US now so I should buy > some stuff before I move back. Well, we'd better start placing our orders now. Who wants a Dell LCD monitor, from the U.S.? ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 20:06:06 2005 From: amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org (Alex Maynard) Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 16:06:06 -0400 Subject: any suggestions for linux compatible laptop projector remote? Message-ID: Hello All, I was wondering if anyone has any suggestions on remotes for laptop projectors that work easily with linux? I'm not sure if "remote" is the correct name, what I mean is the thing that forwards a pdf file to the next page or bullet point standing away from the laptop. Thanks in advance for any suggestions. Alex -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 20:15:41 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 16:15:41 -0400 Subject: any suggestions for linux compatible laptop projector remote? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050804201541.GG6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Aug 04, 2005 at 04:06:06PM -0400, Alex Maynard wrote: > I was wondering if anyone has any suggestions on remotes for laptop > projectors that work easily with linux? I'm not sure if "remote" is > the correct name, what I mean is the thing that forwards a pdf file > to the next page or bullet point standing away from the laptop. > > Thanks in advance for any suggestions. You mean like a wireless trackball mouse, or an infrerad remote control (I imagine some usb attached ir receivers exist with linux support and remotes). Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 20:16:37 2005 From: scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Stewart C. Russell) Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 16:16:37 -0400 Subject: any suggestions for linux compatible laptop projector remote? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <42F277A5.6050704@sympatico.ca> Alex Maynard wrote: > > I was wondering if anyone has any suggestions on remotes for laptop > projectors that work easily with linux? I don't know the range, but the ATI Remote Wonder USB RF remote works for me. Once you've loaded the kernel module, it acts as a mouse and cut-down keyboard (it only supports 0-9, A-F, Enter, cursor keys and a couple more). Without buying an ATI TV tuner, these are a bit hard to get on their own. Only one of the stores on College had one -- it's a place that specialises in CCTV surveillance, north side, a block or two west of Spadina. cheers, Stewart -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 20:32:46 2005 From: interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (interlug-list) Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 16:32:46 -0400 Subject: any suggestions for linux compatible laptop projector remote? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1123187566.30652.441.camel@holden.weait.net> On Thu, 2005-08-04 at 16:06, Alex Maynard wrote: > Hello All, > > I was wondering if anyone has any suggestions on remotes for laptop > projectors that work easily with linux? I'm not sure if "remote" is > the correct name, what I mean is the thing that forwards a pdf file > to the next page or bullet point standing away from the laptop. I've been using a Targus PAWM001. Have a review from someone else ( http://www.techlore.com/article/10807/ ) I find it is too small for use as a mouse, but it's fine for going forward and back on presentation slides. The built in laser pointer is cool too. I wish I were smart enough to keep it charged. I'll be the one leaning over my laptop screaming "charge, damn you, charge" five minutes before I go on. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 20:43:01 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 16:43:01 -0400 (EDT) Subject: any suggestions for linux compatible laptop projector remote? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050804204301.11403.qmail@web88207.mail.re2.yahoo.com> I have been looking into Linux Infared stuff for other reasons, and you should have a look at: http://www.lirc.org These people note where you can buy pre-build Linux compatible IR receivers, as well as offer plans for 4 different types of IR receivers (which their software supports). The receivers are (in order of complexity/cost to build): - A serial port receiver that is NOT fully RS-232 compatible, but close enough it will work with MOST PCs (and VERY simple to build). - A parallel port receiver (that plays tricks with the printer port). - A serial port receiver that is FULLY RS-232 compatible. - A USB receiver (complex and far from simple to build). Now, a few years ago I got two IR detectors (just the detectors, not the parts that go around the detectors to tie into a PC) from Sayle (one of the electronic shops near Victoria Park and Steeles). I would like to get some more similar detectors (as per the lirc.org designs), but Sayle, Active (Components and Surplus), etc. do not now seem to carry what I am after, anyone know of a local source I have missed? Colin McGregor --- Alex Maynard wrote: > > Hello All, > > I was wondering if anyone has any suggestions on > remotes for laptop > projectors that work easily with linux? I'm not > sure if "remote" is > the correct name, what I mean is the thing that > forwards a pdf file > to the next page or bullet point standing away from > the laptop. > > Thanks in advance for any suggestions. > > Alex > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: > http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text > below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: > http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 21:02:57 2005 From: interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (interlug-list) Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 17:02:57 -0400 Subject: any suggestions for linux compatible laptop projector remote? In-Reply-To: <20050804204301.11403.qmail-2K+iNxKRQwOB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20050804204301.11403.qmail@web88207.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1123189377.30652.448.camel@holden.weait.net> On Thu, 2005-08-04 at 16:43, Colin McGregor wrote: > Now, a few years ago I got two IR detectors (just the > detectors, not the parts that go around the detectors > to tie into a PC) from Sayle (one of the electronic > shops near Victoria Park and Steeles). I would like to > get some more similar detectors (as per the lirc.org > designs), but Sayle, Active (Components and Surplus), > etc. do not now seem to carry what I am after, anyone > know of a local source I have missed? Help me out with a part number? Or a link to the appropriate schematic on lirc.org? I have a junk box full of stuff like IR diodes and IR photo transistors, even a few integrated IR Rx modules. That's a kind of local source. Otherwise, Active Surplus, and Supremetronic on Queen St W, Electrosonic and Future Electronics on Gordon Baker Dr. (Disclaimer, I haven't checked these places in that last year or so, they may be gone.) Or Digikey, which isn't local but is overnight. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 22:49:13 2005 From: amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org (Alex Maynard) Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 18:49:13 -0400 Subject: any suggestions for linux compatible laptop projector remote? In-Reply-To: <20050804201541.GG6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050804201541.GG6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Aug 2005, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > You mean like a wireless trackball mouse, or an infrerad remote control Yes, I think what I mean is the infrerad remote control. Something that you hold in your hand and click to the next slide without having to touch the computer. Alex > (I imagine some usb attached ir receivers exist with linux support and > remotes). > > Lennart Sorensen > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From adb-tlug-AbAJl/g/NLXk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 23:29:20 2005 From: adb-tlug-AbAJl/g/NLXk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org (Anthony de Boer) Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 19:29:20 -0400 Subject: Posting went thru? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050804232920.GV4121@leftmind.net> Henry Spencer wrote: > On Wed, 3 Aug 2005, Sy wrote: > > > Yes, including an evil MS word document. > > > > Oh.. I'm sure any good Linux sysadmin can write a perl script to > > interpret those. ;) > > Nah, it just takes a shell script: > > rm -f *.doc and it even has a manpage: rm(1) rm(1) NAME rm - Read Microsoft utility SYNOPSIS rm -rf file.doc DESCRIPTION This command reads and interprets Microsoft[tm]-formatted .doc files. It incorporates an advanced Artificial Intelligence which examines the document files in question and directs anything worth reading in them to standard output. For your safety, files containing virusses are deleted. OPTIONS -f "Fast" option; improves execution speed. -rf "Really Fast", further improving execution speed. HISTORY This command predates Microsoft[tm] Word[tm]. BUGS The implicit assumption that ``All the world's a Windows box'' is iden- tified as a virus. Unix Commands rm(1) -- Anthony de Boer -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 00:23:50 2005 From: amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org (Alex Maynard) Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 20:23:50 -0400 Subject: any suggestions for linux compatible laptop projector remote? In-Reply-To: <1123187566.30652.441.camel-csCcNl6ta60tuqGvh5Fqhg@public.gmane.org> References: <1123187566.30652.441.camel@holden.weait.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Aug 2005, interlug-list wrote: > On Thu, 2005-08-04 at 16:06, Alex Maynard wrote: > > Hello All, > > > > I was wondering if anyone has any suggestions on remotes for laptop > > projectors that work easily with linux? > I've been using a Targus PAWM001. Have a review from someone else ( > http://www.techlore.com/article/10807/ ) I find it is too small for use > as a mouse, but it's fine for going forward and back on presentation > slides. What did you have to do to get this working? Install software or drivers or add a module to/recompile the kernel? I know this sounds lazy, but I'm hoping to find something that isn't too much trouble to get working. This one sounded relatively simple (which for a newby like me is good). Thanks to everyone for all the good suggestions. Alex > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 00:37:04 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 20:37:04 -0400 (EDT) Subject: any suggestions for linux compatible laptop projector remote? Message-ID: <20050805003704.42681.qmail@web88207.mail.re2.yahoo.com> I sent this out earlier and it appears to have fallen down a TLUG black hole.... Anyway, I have been looking into Linux Infared stuff for other reasons, and you may want to look at: http://www.lirc.org These people note where you can buy Linux compatible IR receivers, as well as they offer plans for 4 different types of IR receivers (which their Linux software supports). The receivers are (in order of complexity/cost to build): - A serial port receiver that is NOT fully RS-232 compatible, but close enough it will work with MOST PCs (and VERY simple to build). - A parallel port receiver (that plays tricks with the printer port). - A serial port receiver that is FULLY RS-232 compatible. - A USB receiver (complex and far from simple to build). Now, a few years ago I got two IR detectors (just the detectors, not the parts that go around the detectors to tie into a PC) from Sayle (one of the electronic shops near Victoria Park and Steeles). I would like to get some more similar detectors (as per the lirc.org designs), but Sayle, Active (Components and Surplus), etc. do not now seem to carry what I am after, anyone know of a local source I have missed? Colin McGregor --- Alex Maynard wrote: > > Hello All, > > I was wondering if anyone has any suggestions on > remotes for laptop > projectors that work easily with linux? I'm not > sure if "remote" is > the correct name, what I mean is the thing that > forwards a pdf file > to the next page or bullet point standing away from > the laptop. > > Thanks in advance for any suggestions. > > Alex > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: > http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text > below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: > http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 00:52:28 2005 From: hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (D. Hugh Redelmeier) Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 20:52:28 -0400 (EDT) Subject: place to buy discontinued motherboard? (and, free Celeron/466) In-Reply-To: <20050803152458.GA2154-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20050803152458.GA2154@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: | From: William Park | After 6 years of faithful service, one of my dual-P3 is showing the | "symptoms". It's the motherboard. | | Does anyone know where I can buy a discontinued dual/single-P3 (S370) | motherboards? Excess-inventory motherboards would be ideal. Dual boards are a lot rarer than single. Lots of folks are getting rid of whole P3 systems for cheap prices. You might find a cheap system and extract the motherboard. Look at tor.forsale.computers, for example. Above All Electronics (Bloor & Markham) often has old motherboards. They have to make a living at it, so they may not be as cheap as you'd like. Or: give up. Much more powerful systems are available fairly cheaply. (This from someone how hasn't even let go of his eight-bit computers.) For example, you can buy a MB (choice of two) and Celeron D 340 CPU (just below 3GHz) for ~$100: This does not include a HSF (heat sink, fan). -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 01:03:37 2005 From: interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (interlug-list) Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 21:03:37 -0400 Subject: any suggestions for linux compatible laptop projector remote? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1123203817.30652.465.camel@holden.weait.net> On Thu, 2005-08-04 at 20:23, Alex Maynard wrote: > On Thu, 4 Aug 2005, interlug-list wrote: > > I've been using a Targus PAWM001. Have a review from someone else ( > > http://www.techlore.com/article/10807/ ) I find it is too small for use > > as a mouse, but it's fine for going forward and back on presentation > > slides. > > What did you have to do to get this working? Install software or drivers > or add a module to/recompile the kernel? I know this sounds lazy, but I'm > hoping to find something that isn't too much trouble to get working. > This one sounded relatively simple (which for a newby like me is good). I plugged it in to the USB port. No configuration required on Kubuntu. Probably the same on any system with hotplug. It's just a mouse. One button for forward, another for reverse. (plus the cool laser pointer ;-)) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 01:29:03 2005 From: amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org (Alex Maynard) Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 21:29:03 -0400 Subject: any suggestions for linux compatible laptop projector remote? In-Reply-To: <20050805003704.42681.qmail-2K+iNxKRQwOB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20050805003704.42681.qmail@web88207.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 4 Aug 2005, Colin McGregor wrote: > I sent this out earlier and it appears to have fallen > down a TLUG black hole.... Anyway, I have been looking > into Linux Infared stuff for other reasons, and you > may want to look at: > > http://www.lirc.org > > These people note where you can buy Linux compatible > IR receivers, as well as they offer plans for 4 > different types of IR receivers (which their Linux > software supports). The receivers are (in order of > complexity/cost to build): > > - A serial port receiver that is NOT fully RS-232 > compatible, but close enough it will work with MOST > PCs (and VERY simple to build). Thanks very much. This "VERY simple to build" one sounds good to me, but I can't quite figure out which model your pointing to. Is it a commercial or a home brew? Generally, I got the impression that www.lirc.org was more for experts than for newbies. For example, under documentation they have the warning that "Setting up LIRC currently is not an easy task". Maybe there isn't an easy way to do this yet? I was hoping it might be like the situation for printers, where some are difficult to use with linux but others work without much trouble. > - A parallel port receiver (that plays tricks with the > printer port). > - A serial port receiver that is FULLY RS-232 > compatible. > - A USB receiver (complex and far from simple to > build). > > Now, a few years ago I got two IR detectors (just the > detectors, not the parts that go around the detectors > to tie into a PC) from Sayle (one of the electronic > shops near Victoria Park and Steeles). I would like to > get some more similar detectors (as per the lirc.org > designs), but Sayle, Active (Components and Surplus), > etc. do not now seem to carry what I am after, anyone > know of a local source I have missed? > > Colin McGregor > > --- Alex Maynard wrote: > > > > > Hello All, > > > > I was wondering if anyone has any suggestions on > > remotes for laptop > > projectors that work easily with linux? I'm not > > sure if "remote" is > > the correct name, what I mean is the thing that > > forwards a pdf file > > to the next page or bullet point standing away from > > the laptop. > > > > Thanks in advance for any suggestions. > > > > Alex > > > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: > > http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text > > below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: > > http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 12:28:51 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 08:28:51 -0400 Subject: Free Monitors to a Good Home References: <20050720025351.GA954@localhost> <5.2.1.1.0.20041219150435.009dfd00@pop3.ilap.com> <20050804121058.GF6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <001901c598f0$247900d0$6501a8c0@ibm5b4y3a0pgrq> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lennart Sorensen" To: Cc: "Matt Price" Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2005 8:10 AM Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Free Monitors to a Good Home > Well I would love an LCD personally, although it is only recently that > some with fast enough transition times are starting to come out. Of > course there also doesn't seem to be any standard on how to measure the > responsiveness on a screen that gives any kind of useful data yet, well > unless you put a nice graph in the documentation, and apparently > marketing people prefer a nice simple number they can claim is better > than everyone elses. > > I don't know why they can't release 1280x960 or 1400x1050 displays > rather than all those cheap 1280x1024 stupid things everyone is making. > If I was going to use a non 4:3 resolution it better be because the > screen isn't 4:3 itself. The biggest market for LCD monitors is in the office workplace, where people use them with general word processing and spreadsheet applications on Windoze... no need for fast refresh rates and extreme graphics. Obviously the vendors make their decisions based on good ol' rules of economics and R&D costs. The next step up from LCD technology is plasma... Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 03:27:35 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 23:27:35 -0400 (EDT) Subject: any suggestions for linux compatible laptop projector remote? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050805032735.90852.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- Alex Maynard wrote: > On Thu, 4 Aug 2005, Colin McGregor wrote: > > I sent this out earlier and it appears to have > fallen > > down a TLUG black hole.... Anyway, I have been > looking > > into Linux Infared stuff for other reasons, and > you > > may want to look at: > > > > http://www.lirc.org > > > Thanks very much. This "VERY simple to build" one > sounds good to me, but I > can't quite figure out which model your pointing to. > Is it a commercial or a home brew? Both :-) . What happens is that you can build the hardware, such as the following examples: - The simple (not fully RS-232) home built design: http://www.lirc.org/receivers.html - The full RS-232 home built design: http://www.tb-electronic.de/vdr/lirc/lirc_rx.html - The home built USB design: http://usbirboy.sourceforge.net/ Or you can buy pre-built hardware from places like the following: - http://www.zapway.de/e_index1.htm As well the IR ports on SOME laptops and SOME TV capture cards is support by the LIRC people (details on their site). Are you comfortable holding a soldering iron? Do you want to try the simple design? If the answers are yes, then track down some parts (and except for the IR detector the parts are EASY to find and CHEAP), and warm up that soldering iron. If you can not handle a soldering iron, well get out your cash... > Generally, I got the impression that www.lirc.org > was more for experts > than for newbies. For example, under documentation > they have the warning > that "Setting up LIRC currently is not an easy > task". Maybe there isn't an > easy way to do this yet? I was hoping it might be > like the situation for > printers, where some are difficult to use with linux > but others work > without much trouble. Well, I am planning to take the plunge and actually build an interface this weekend as I plan weave that bit into an article I am planning to write :-) . So at this point I am not sure how easy/hard the software end of things will be. The hardware construction end of things I expect to be a very manageable challenge, as I have built some electronic kits before :-) . But again if anyone knows any local place where I could get more of the IR detectors listed on the following I would appreciate: http://www.lirc.org/receivers.html Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 12:00:00 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 08:00:00 -0400 Subject: Posting went thru? In-Reply-To: <42F18DA7.9050503-4CS0UopE6WdBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <1d085e5505080311125b96090a@mail.gmail.com> <20050803183229.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <42F16B1D.4080202@istop.com> <42F18DA7.9050503@almatau.com> Message-ID: <42F20340.6040506@rogers.com> Ilya Palagin wrote: > Zbigniew Koziol wrote: >> I did not keep my promisse this time ;( > > Sending rtf to those who want word works just fine. Assuming they don't reply with "wtf?". ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 12:10:58 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 08:10:58 -0400 Subject: Free Monitors to a Good Home In-Reply-To: References: <20050720025351.GA954@localhost> <5.2.1.1.0.20041219150435.009dfd00@pop3.ilap.com> Message-ID: <20050804121058.GF6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 03, 2005 at 08:04:48PM -0500, Sy wrote: > I recall Matt Price had some wierd monitor issues discussed on the > list a while back. I'm CCing him in case he's interested. > > My intuition is telling me that I need a new monitor, but I think I'll > invest in a fair quality LCD. I've been working with some basic Dell > LCDs at work (can I call it that if I like it?) and I am liking them a > lot. > > I used to be hard to please when it came to LCDs.. but I guess the > technology has improved. Well I would love an LCD personally, although it is only recently that some with fast enough transition times are starting to come out. Of course there also doesn't seem to be any standard on how to measure the responsiveness on a screen that gives any kind of useful data yet, well unless you put a nice graph in the documentation, and apparently marketing people prefer a nice simple number they can claim is better than everyone elses. of course I also want one that is 4:3 aspect ratio, and I won't work on a 15", which pretty much leaves 19"+ which isn't cheap. I don't know why they can't release 1280x960 or 1400x1050 displays rather than all those cheap 1280x1024 stupid things everyone is making. If I was going to use a non 4:3 resolution it better be because the screen isn't 4:3 itself. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 4 12:06:50 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 08:06:50 -0400 Subject: Posting went thru? In-Reply-To: References: <1d085e5505080311125b96090a@mail.gmail.com> <20050803183229.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20050804120650.GE6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 03, 2005 at 07:59:59PM -0500, Sy wrote: > Oh.. I'm sure any good Linux sysadmin can write a perl script to > interpret those. ;) Sure if someone had the specifications of MS Word's format, which of course doesn't exist. If it did, different versions of Word might actually succeed 100% of the time at reading files from other versions. :) Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From talexb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 12:45:40 2005 From: talexb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Alex Beamish) Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 08:45:40 -0400 Subject: Posting went thru? In-Reply-To: <20050804171325.GA2199-FexrNA+1sEo9RQMjcVF9lNBPR1lH4CV8@public.gmane.org> References: <1d085e5505080311125b96090a@mail.gmail.com> <20050803183229.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <42F2299F.7070701@sympatico.ca> <20050804171325.GA2199@lupus.perlwolf.com> Message-ID: On 8/4/05, John Macdonald wrote: > On Thu, Aug 04, 2005 at 11:14:56AM -0400, D. Hugh Redelmeier wrote: > > | From: Stewart C. Russell > > > > | strings evil.doc | fmt -s > > | > > | If you can't get the sense of the document out of that, it probably wasn't > > | worth reading. > > > > Unfortunately deleted text could show up without being distinguished. > > Could lead to much confusion. > > While it can lead to confusion for the reader, it can be an > even worse problem for the sender, who thought that the deleted > text was really gone and didn't want it to be seen at all. > > I seem to recall that Microsoft got badly embarassed by an > instance of this during their antitrust trial in the U.S. and > SCO was probably not intending to tell the world that their > lawsuit against Daimler-Chrysler was originally drafted to be > against (CitiBank? or BankOfAmerica?) and they changed targets > at the last minute. Bank of America. See http://www.groklaw.net/ for the details. Alex -- ---------- Linux, Firefox and GMail .. what a combination. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 13:27:24 2005 From: hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Howard Gibson) Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 09:27:24 -0400 Subject: Posting went thru? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050805092724.4a9a334d.hgibson@eol.ca> On 04 Aug 2005 11:41:33 -0400 Tim Writer wrote: > Henry Spencer writes: > > > On Wed, 3 Aug 2005, Sy wrote: > > > > Yes, including an evil MS word document. > > > > > > Oh.. I'm sure any good Linux sysadmin can write a perl script to > > > interpret those. ;) > > > > Nah, it just takes a shell script: > > > > rm -f *.doc > > I got a good chuckle out of that because I pretty much used to do exactly > that. But, if you do want to read it, > > strings whatever.doc > > has worked quite well for me in the past. And you get to see stuff (deleted > text) they may not have wanted you to see. In the past, I have seen AbiWord show deleted text. I haven't tried it lately. Perhaps people who send me Word documents have learned to be careful. -- Howard Gibson hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org howardg-PadmjKOQAFn3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org http://home.eol.ca/~hgibson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 15:57:21 2005 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 11:57:21 -0400 Subject: any suggestions for linux compatible laptop projector remote? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <42F38C61.4040306@telly.org> Alex Maynard wrote: >>I've been using a Targus PAWM001. Have a review from someone else ( >>http://www.techlore.com/article/10807/ ) I find it is too small for use >>as a mouse, but it's fine for going forward and back on presentation >>slides. >> >> > >What did you have to do to get this working? Install software or drivers >or add a module to/recompile the kernel? I know this sounds lazy, but I'm >hoping to find something that isn't too much trouble to get working. >This one sounded relatively simple (which for a newby like me is good). > > Many modern pointers just look to the system like a USB mouse, so as long as your X Windows setup can work with a USB mouse you should be fine with *most* of these solutions. I don't know the Targus but I've had good luck with the Gyration mouse (expensive, but you can move the pointer just by waving your hand around). http://www.gyration.com/ultrapro.htm - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 17:36:48 2005 From: amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org (Alex Maynard) Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 13:36:48 -0400 Subject: any suggestions for linux compatible laptop projector remote? In-Reply-To: <42F38C61.4040306-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg@public.gmane.org> References: <42F38C61.4040306@telly.org> Message-ID: On Fri, 5 Aug 2005, Evan Leibovitch wrote: > Alex Maynard wrote: > > Many modern pointers just look to the system like a USB mouse, so as > long as your X Windows setup can work with a USB mouse you should be > fine with *most* of these solutions. > > I don't know the Targus but I've had good luck with the Gyration mouse > (expensive, but you can move the pointer just by waving your hand around). > http://www.gyration.com/ultrapro.htm I tried running through my slides with just a mouse (pdfs created with latex and ppower4, which adds bullets). To go to the next bullet/slide you have to right click and then go down several items, as compared to just hitting the down arrow or page down key on the key board. That's not hard, but could be distracting during a presentation. I couldn't tell whether the Gyration mouse or Targus PAWM001 has the up/down keys or just the mouse key? The local computer store sells only the keyspan presentation remote PR-US2. The don't say anything about linux, but according to at least one page I found (http://silas.psfc.mit.edu/tp41setup.html#tth_sEc6.8) they can work on linux without much trouble. Also it is advertized to work without software installation in both MAC and recent windows version, which might be a good sign? Does any one have any experience with these on linux? Alex > > - Evan > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 17:38:34 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 13:38:34 -0400 Subject: any suggestions for linux compatible laptop projector remote? In-Reply-To: References: <42F38C61.4040306@telly.org> Message-ID: <20050805173834.GH6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Aug 05, 2005 at 01:36:48PM -0400, Alex Maynard wrote: > I tried running through my slides with just a mouse (pdfs created with > latex and ppower4, which adds bullets). To go to the next bullet/slide > you have to right click and then go down several items, as compared to > just hitting the down arrow or page down key on the key board. That's not > hard, but could be distracting during a presentation. I couldn't tell > whether the Gyration mouse or Targus PAWM001 has the up/down keys or just > the mouse key? Well most presentation programs allow left/right click to go back and forth in the presentation. PDF is of course NOT meant as a way to do presentations, but rather as a way to send documents/brochures to people in a consistent format. Thinks like openoffice.org and pointless do decent presentation programs. The openoffice.org one can certainly generate PDFs if it is anything like the rest of openoffice, and I suspect pointless is likely to have some way to generate output from it's presentations too (it iis a rather neat scriptable system with support for many file types in it). Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 17:43:43 2005 From: marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Marcus Brubaker) Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 13:43:43 -0400 Subject: any suggestions for linux compatible laptop projector remote? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <42F3A54F.5020408@utoronto.ca> Alex Maynard wrote: >On Fri, 5 Aug 2005, Evan Leibovitch wrote: > > > >>Alex Maynard wrote: >> >>Many modern pointers just look to the system like a USB mouse, so as >>long as your X Windows setup can work with a USB mouse you should be >>fine with *most* of these solutions. >> >>I don't know the Targus but I've had good luck with the Gyration mouse >>(expensive, but you can move the pointer just by waving your hand around). >>http://www.gyration.com/ultrapro.htm >> >> > >I tried running through my slides with just a mouse (pdfs created with >latex and ppower4, which adds bullets). To go to the next bullet/slide >you have to right click and then go down several items, as compared to >just hitting the down arrow or page down key on the key board. That's not >hard, but could be distracting during a presentation. I couldn't tell >whether the Gyration mouse or Targus PAWM001 has the up/down keys or just >the mouse key? > >The local computer store sells only the keyspan presentation remote >PR-US2. The don't say anything about linux, but according to at least one page I found >(http://silas.psfc.mit.edu/tp41setup.html#tth_sEc6.8) they can work on >linux without much trouble. Also it is advertized to work without >software installation in both MAC and recent windows version, which might >be a good sign? Does any one have any experience with these on linux? > > > That's just a matter of configuring you're PDF reader to do the right thing when you click a mouse button. Acrobat Reader 7 moves forward on a left click and backward on a right click when used in fullscreen mode which is what MS Powerpoint or OO Impress do. Regards, Marcus -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 17:48:31 2005 From: marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Marcus Brubaker) Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 13:48:31 -0400 Subject: any suggestions for linux compatible laptop projector remote? In-Reply-To: <20050805173834.GH6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <42F38C61.4040306@telly.org> <20050805173834.GH6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <42F3A66F.5020305@utoronto.ca> Lennart Sorensen wrote: >On Fri, Aug 05, 2005 at 01:36:48PM -0400, Alex Maynard wrote: > > >>I tried running through my slides with just a mouse (pdfs created with >>latex and ppower4, which adds bullets). To go to the next bullet/slide >>you have to right click and then go down several items, as compared to >>just hitting the down arrow or page down key on the key board. That's not >>hard, but could be distracting during a presentation. I couldn't tell >>whether the Gyration mouse or Targus PAWM001 has the up/down keys or just >>the mouse key? >> >> > >Well most presentation programs allow left/right click to go back and >forth in the presentation. PDF is of course NOT meant as a way to do >presentations, but rather as a way to send documents/brochures to people >in a consistent format. > >Thinks like openoffice.org and pointless do decent presentation >programs. The openoffice.org one can certainly generate PDFs if it is >anything like the rest of openoffice, and I suspect pointless is likely >to have some way to generate output from it's presentations too (it iis >a rather neat scriptable system with support for many file types in it). > > Actually, PDF is a remarkably good format to use for presentations when you're not presenting from a known machine. Acrobat Reader is practically universally available and works as needed in fullscreen mode. Plus, LaTeX is really the easiest way to create a good, notation heavy presentation which really only leaves you PS or PDF as an output format. Regards, Marcus -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 18:06:58 2005 From: amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org (Alex Maynard) Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 14:06:58 -0400 Subject: any suggestions for linux compatible laptop projector remote? In-Reply-To: <42F3A54F.5020408-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <42F3A54F.5020408@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: On Fri, 5 Aug 2005, Marcus Brubaker wrote: > Alex Maynard wrote: > > >On Fri, 5 Aug 2005, Evan Leibovitch wrote: > > > > > > > >>Alex Maynard wrote: > >> > >>Many modern pointers just look to the system like a USB mouse, so as > >>long as your X Windows setup can work with a USB mouse you should be > >>fine with *most* of these solutions. > >> > >>I don't know the Targus but I've had good luck with the Gyration mouse > >>(expensive, but you can move the pointer just by waving your hand around). > >>http://www.gyration.com/ultrapro.htm > >> > >> > > > >I tried running through my slides with just a mouse (pdfs created with > >latex and ppower4, which adds bullets). To go to the next bullet/slide > >you have to right click and then go down several items, as compared to > >just hitting the down arrow or page down key on the key board. That's not > >hard, but could be distracting during a presentation. I couldn't tell > >whether the Gyration mouse or Targus PAWM001 has the up/down keys or just > >the mouse key? > > > >The local computer store sells only the keyspan presentation remote > >PR-US2. The don't say anything about linux, but according to at least one page I found > >(http://silas.psfc.mit.edu/tp41setup.html#tth_sEc6.8) they can work on > >linux without much trouble. Also it is advertized to work without > >software installation in both MAC and recent windows version, which might > >be a good sign? Does any one have any experience with these on linux? > > > > > > > That's just a matter of configuring you're PDF reader to do the right > thing when you click a mouse button. Acrobat Reader 7 moves forward on > a left click and backward on a right click when used in fullscreen mode > which is what MS Powerpoint or OO Impress do. Did you do this using edit/preferences or by altering some type of configuration file? I don't see any options relating to the mouse in my acrobat reader. Maybe I need to update versions? I thought they had only a pretty old version for linux. Has that changed now? Thanks very much. Regards, Alex > > Regards, > Marcus > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 18:04:15 2005 From: marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Marcus Brubaker) Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 14:04:15 -0400 Subject: any suggestions for linux compatible laptop projector remote? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <42F3AA1F.1070007@utoronto.ca> Alex Maynard wrote: >On Fri, 5 Aug 2005, Marcus Brubaker wrote: > > > >>Alex Maynard wrote: >> >> >> >>>On Fri, 5 Aug 2005, Evan Leibovitch wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>>Alex Maynard wrote: >>>> >>>>Many modern pointers just look to the system like a USB mouse, so as >>>>long as your X Windows setup can work with a USB mouse you should be >>>>fine with *most* of these solutions. >>>> >>>>I don't know the Targus but I've had good luck with the Gyration mouse >>>>(expensive, but you can move the pointer just by waving your hand around). >>>>http://www.gyration.com/ultrapro.htm >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>I tried running through my slides with just a mouse (pdfs created with >>>latex and ppower4, which adds bullets). To go to the next bullet/slide >>>you have to right click and then go down several items, as compared to >>>just hitting the down arrow or page down key on the key board. That's not >>>hard, but could be distracting during a presentation. I couldn't tell >>>whether the Gyration mouse or Targus PAWM001 has the up/down keys or just >>>the mouse key? >>> >>>The local computer store sells only the keyspan presentation remote >>>PR-US2. The don't say anything about linux, but according to at least one page I found >>>(http://silas.psfc.mit.edu/tp41setup.html#tth_sEc6.8) they can work on >>>linux without much trouble. Also it is advertized to work without >>>software installation in both MAC and recent windows version, which might >>>be a good sign? Does any one have any experience with these on linux? >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>That's just a matter of configuring you're PDF reader to do the right >>thing when you click a mouse button. Acrobat Reader 7 moves forward on >>a left click and backward on a right click when used in fullscreen mode >>which is what MS Powerpoint or OO Impress do. >> >> > > >Did you do this using edit/preferences or by altering some type >of configuration file? I don't see any options relating to the mouse >in my acrobat reader. Maybe I need to update versions? I thought they had >only a pretty old version for linux. Has that changed now? > >Thanks very much. > > This is actually default behaviour when you're in full screen mode. Adobe released Acrobat Reader 7 for Linux (the same version as for that other OS) recently which is much nicer than 5. I strongly recommend upgrading. Regards, Marcus -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ryan-TmYVyGByI+TYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 18:25:15 2005 From: ryan-TmYVyGByI+TYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Ryan Sanders) Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 14:25:15 -0400 Subject: any suggestions for linux compatible laptop projector remote? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <42F3AF0B.6010706@iclei.org> > On Fri, 5 Aug 2005, Marcus Brubaker wrote: > > >>Alex Maynard wrote: >> >> >>>On Fri, 5 Aug 2005, Evan Leibovitch wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>>Alex Maynard wrote: >>>> >>>>Many modern pointers just look to the system like a USB mouse, so as >>>>long as your X Windows setup can work with a USB mouse you should be >>>>fine with *most* of these solutions. >>>> >>>>I don't know the Targus but I've had good luck with the Gyration mouse >>>>(expensive, but you can move the pointer just by waving your hand around). >>>>http://www.gyration.com/ultrapro.htm >>>> >>>> >>> >>>I tried running through my slides with just a mouse (pdfs created with >>>latex and ppower4, which adds bullets). To go to the next bullet/slide >>>you have to right click and then go down several items, as compared to >>>just hitting the down arrow or page down key on the key board. That's not >>>hard, but could be distracting during a presentation. I couldn't tell >>>whether the Gyration mouse or Targus PAWM001 has the up/down keys or just >>>the mouse key? >>> >>>The local computer store sells only the keyspan presentation remote >>>PR-US2. The don't say anything about linux, but according to at least one page I found >>>(http://silas.psfc.mit.edu/tp41setup.html#tth_sEc6.8) they can work on >>>linux without much trouble. Also it is advertized to work without >>>software installation in both MAC and recent windows version, which might >>>be a good sign? Does any one have any experience with these on linux? >>> >>> >>> >> >>That's just a matter of configuring you're PDF reader to do the right >>thing when you click a mouse button. Acrobat Reader 7 moves forward on >>a left click and backward on a right click when used in fullscreen mode >>which is what MS Powerpoint or OO Impress do. > > > > Did you do this using edit/preferences or by altering some type > of configuration file? I don't see any options relating to the mouse > in my acrobat reader. Maybe I need to update versions? I thought they had > only a pretty old version for linux. Has that changed now? > > Thanks very much. > > Regards, > > Alex > You can download Acrobat 7.0 for linux on the adobe ftp site: ftp://ftp.adobe.com/pub/adobe/reader/unix/7x/7.0/enu/ I am not sure if it is available on their website yet. Ryan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 18:42:14 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 14:42:14 -0400 Subject: any suggestions for linux compatible laptop projector remote? In-Reply-To: <42F3A66F.5020305-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <42F38C61.4040306@telly.org> <20050805173834.GH6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <42F3A66F.5020305@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <20050805184214.GI6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Aug 05, 2005 at 01:48:31PM -0400, Marcus Brubaker wrote: > Actually, PDF is a remarkably good format to use for presentations when > you're not presenting from a known machine. Acrobat Reader is > practically universally available and works as needed in fullscreen > mode. Plus, LaTeX is really the easiest way to create a good, notation > heavy presentation which really only leaves you PS or PDF as an output > format. pointless allows inserting latex in the presentation, along with gnuplot, eps, ps, etc. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 18:44:46 2005 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins) Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 14:44:46 -0400 Subject: Postfix -> Cyrus-IMAP? Message-ID: <20050805184446.GA3868@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> I have cyrus-imapd and postfix on my Debian stable box, and they both seem to work fine. They do not, however, work together. I was looking for the configuration needed to get postfix to deliver to the imapd, and this how-to isn't helping: http://www.delouw.ch/linux/Postfix-Cyrus-Web-cyradm-HOWTO/html/index.html It calls for programs that don't seem to be installed, and the documentation included in cyrus-imapd is not very helpful. Has anyone got a better/different resource, or perhaps know the settings required? Thanks. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 18:54:21 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 14:54:21 -0400 Subject: Postfix -> Cyrus-IMAP? In-Reply-To: <20050805184446.GA3868-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20050805184446.GA3868@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <20050805185421.GJ6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Aug 05, 2005 at 02:44:46PM -0400, William O'Higgins wrote: > I have cyrus-imapd and postfix on my Debian stable box, and they both > seem to work fine. They do not, however, work together. I was looking > for the configuration needed to get postfix to deliver to the imapd, and > this how-to isn't helping: > > http://www.delouw.ch/linux/Postfix-Cyrus-Web-cyradm-HOWTO/html/index.html > > It calls for programs that don't seem to be installed, and the > documentation included in cyrus-imapd is not very helpful. Has anyone > got a better/different resource, or perhaps know the settings required? Your mailserver delivers to your mail folder, the imap server looks there for mail. the mail server and imap server have noting to do with each other, other than having to agree on the location of the mail folder and the format of it. If you do virtual domains and virtual mailboxes for people that are not regular users, then things get more complicated of course but for normal use it should be really simple. I don't know cyrus, but I know that courier only works with Maildir, not mbox, so it won't work with most mail servers in the default setup. Most mailservers can be configured to deliver to Maildir though. cyrus may or may not support mbox or Maildir (it will support one of them if not both). Most common setups: /var/spool/mail/username (mbox format) /home/username/Maildir/ (Maildir format) Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 20:12:30 2005 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (psema4) Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 16:12:30 -0400 Subject: Semi-OT: Cisco PIX VPN - Linux Boxes left out. Message-ID: <99a6c38f05080513127c76f773@mail.gmail.com> Trying to help someone out with a Cisco PIX (506E) VPN connection to a mixed internal network. We can ping and communicate with any of the windows pc's on the internal network throught the VPN connection, but none of the linux boxes. I'm not terribly well versed in VPN and don't understand why a valid connection can ping & access windows but not linux - even though they're on the same network and subnet. Suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks. -- - SGE -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 20:26:08 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 16:26:08 -0400 Subject: Semi-OT: Cisco PIX VPN - Linux Boxes left out. In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f05080513127c76f773-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f05080513127c76f773@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050805202608.GK6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Aug 05, 2005 at 04:12:30PM -0400, psema4 wrote: > Trying to help someone out with a Cisco PIX (506E) VPN connection to a > mixed internal network. > > We can ping and communicate with any of the windows pc's on the > internal network throught the VPN connection, but none of the linux > boxes. > > I'm not terribly well versed in VPN and don't understand why a valid > connection can ping & access windows but not linux - even though > they're on the same network and subnet. > > Suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Do the windows and linux machines all have the same default gateway set? Perhaps the linux boxes are firewalling icmp. Can a windows machine and a linux machines at the same end of the connection ping each other? Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 20:45:15 2005 From: tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Tim Writer) Date: 05 Aug 2005 16:45:15 -0400 Subject: Semi-OT: Cisco PIX VPN - Linux Boxes left out. In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f05080513127c76f773-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f05080513127c76f773@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: psema4 writes: > Trying to help someone out with a Cisco PIX (506E) VPN connection to a > mixed internal network. > > We can ping and communicate with any of the windows pc's on the > internal network throught the VPN connection, but none of the linux > boxes. > > I'm not terribly well versed in VPN and don't understand why a valid > connection can ping & access windows but not linux - even though > they're on the same network and subnet. > > Suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Firewalling rules on the Linux boxes? Use: iptables -L to view installed firewalling fules. Different routing on the Linux boxes? Use one of: route netstat -r ip ro sh to view routing tables. Try running tcpdump on one of the Linux boxes to see if it is seeing the incoming pings. HTH, -- tim writer starnix inc. 647.722.5301 toronto, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 20:38:50 2005 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (psema4) Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 16:38:50 -0400 Subject: Semi-OT: Cisco PIX VPN - Linux Boxes left out. In-Reply-To: <20050805202608.GK6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f05080513127c76f773@mail.gmail.com> <20050805202608.GK6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <99a6c38f050805133866574b70@mail.gmail.com> > Do the windows and linux machines all have the same default gateway set? On the internal network, yes - with the exception of the VPN clients. When a vpn client connects, it uses it's internal network ip for it's gateway (which is on the same subnet as the windows/linux boxes we're trying to reach.) > Perhaps the linux boxes are firewalling icmp. Can a windows machine and > a linux machines at the same end of the connection ping each other? Inside the network (and without using the vpn connection) all boxes can ping each other. The problem only shows up when connecting through the VPN client. -- - SGE -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 20:48:53 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 16:48:53 -0400 Subject: Semi-OT: Cisco PIX VPN - Linux Boxes left out. In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f050805133866574b70-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f05080513127c76f773@mail.gmail.com> <20050805202608.GK6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <99a6c38f050805133866574b70@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050805204853.GL6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Aug 05, 2005 at 04:38:50PM -0400, psema4 wrote: > On the internal network, yes - with the exception of the VPN clients. > When a vpn client connects, it uses it's internal network ip for it's > gateway (which is on the same subnet as the windows/linux boxes we're > trying to reach.) So the clients are given an internal ip. does the VPN box do proper arp responses for those clients? I know windows seems to follow different rules on how to respond to ping requests than linux does. I find a broadcast ping on a subnet will get a response from all linux machines but very few windows machines. > Inside the network (and without using the vpn connection) all boxes > can ping each other. The problem only shows up when connecting > through the VPN client. How about ssh or anything else that isn't ICMP based? Does that work? Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 21:03:21 2005 From: amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org (Alex Maynard) Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 17:03:21 -0400 Subject: any suggestions for linux compatible laptop projector remote? In-Reply-To: <42F3AF0B.6010706-TmYVyGByI+TYtjvyW6yDsg@public.gmane.org> References: <42F3AF0B.6010706@iclei.org> Message-ID: On Fri, 5 Aug 2005, Ryan Sanders wrote: > > On Fri, 5 Aug 2005, Marcus Brubaker wrote: > > > > > >>Alex Maynard wrote: > >> > >> > >>>On Fri, 5 Aug 2005, Evan Leibovitch wrote: > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>>Alex Maynard wrote: > >>>> > >>>>Many modern pointers just look to the system like a USB mouse, so as > >>>>long as your X Windows setup can work with a USB mouse you should be > >>>>fine with *most* of these solutions. > >>>> > >>>>I don't know the Targus but I've had good luck with the Gyration mouse > >>>>(expensive, but you can move the pointer just by waving your hand around). > >>>>http://www.gyration.com/ultrapro.htm > >>>> > >>>> > >>> > >>>I tried running through my slides with just a mouse (pdfs created with > >>>latex and ppower4, which adds bullets). To go to the next bullet/slide > >>>you have to right click and then go down several items, as compared to > >>>just hitting the down arrow or page down key on the key board. That's not > >>>hard, but could be distracting during a presentation. I couldn't tell > >>>whether the Gyration mouse or Targus PAWM001 has the up/down keys or just > >>>the mouse key? > >>> > >>>The local computer store sells only the keyspan presentation remote > >>>PR-US2. The don't say anything about linux, but according to at least one page I found > >>>(http://silas.psfc.mit.edu/tp41setup.html#tth_sEc6.8) they can work on > >>>linux without much trouble. Also it is advertized to work without > >>>software installation in both MAC and recent windows version, which might > >>>be a good sign? Does any one have any experience with these on linux? > >>> > >>> > >>> > >> > >>That's just a matter of configuring you're PDF reader to do the right > >>thing when you click a mouse button. Acrobat Reader 7 moves forward on > >>a left click and backward on a right click when used in fullscreen mode > >>which is what MS Powerpoint or OO Impress do. > > > > > > > > Did you do this using edit/preferences or by altering some type > > of configuration file? I don't see any options relating to the mouse > > in my acrobat reader. Maybe I need to update versions? I thought they had > > only a pretty old version for linux. Has that changed now? > > > > Thanks very much. > > > > Regards, > > > > Alex > > > > You can download Acrobat 7.0 for linux on the adobe ftp site: > > ftp://ftp.adobe.com/pub/adobe/reader/unix/7x/7.0/enu/ > > I am not sure if it is available on their website yet. I was able to borrow and test out the Targus PAUM30 (http://www.targus.com/ca/CategorySearch.asp?SearchedTerms=PAUM30) on my linux (Libranet/Debian) laptop, it worked as soon as I plugged it in and I was able to go bullet point by bullet point even on Acrobat 5.0. Probably the other USB wireless pointers are just as easy and some my be better, but I ordered this one since I know it will work with what I'm using. Thank you all very much for your help and suggestions. Alex > > Ryan > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 21:12:02 2005 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (psema4) Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 14:12:02 -0700 Subject: Semi-OT: Cisco PIX VPN - Linux Boxes left out. In-Reply-To: <20050805204853.GL6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f05080513127c76f773@mail.gmail.com> <20050805202608.GK6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <99a6c38f050805133866574b70@mail.gmail.com> <20050805204853.GL6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <99a6c38f05080514125f05cef@mail.gmail.com> > So the clients are given an internal ip. does the VPN box do proper arp > responses for those clients? I know windows seems to follow different > rules on how to respond to ping requests than linux does. I find a > broadcast ping on a subnet will get a response from all linux machines > but very few windows machines. Not sure what the answer to that is - this is my first experience working with Cisco equipment. I'd assume that it does handle arp requests properly, but I can't be sure. > How about ssh or anything else that isn't ICMP based? Does that work? Apparently not. It almost looks like discrimination against linux (or selective amnesia) but I'm sure it isn't. When we pick this up again Monday morning, I'll try a broadcast ping through a vpn connection. Might turn something up. -- - SGE -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 5 22:24:41 2005 From: blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Byron L. Sonne) Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 18:24:41 -0400 Subject: Semi-OT: Cisco PIX VPN - Linux Boxes left out. In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f05080513127c76f773-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <99a6c38f05080513127c76f773@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <42F3E729.50503@rogers.com> > Suggestions would be greatly appreciated. I know it sounds retarded, but you may wish to also check your autonegotiation settings. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 6 01:21:34 2005 From: hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Howard Gibson) Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 21:21:34 -0400 Subject: KDE Sound In-Reply-To: <1123028288.24140.370.camel-csCcNl6ta60tuqGvh5Fqhg@public.gmane.org> References: <20050801150422.629cf73f.hgibson@eol.ca> <1123028288.24140.370.camel@holden.weait.net> Message-ID: <20050805212134.5c7cc22c.hgibson@eol.ca> On Tue, 02 Aug 2005 20:18:08 -0400 interlug-list wrote: > On Mon, 2005-08-01 at 15:04, Howard Gibson wrote: > > I reinstalled Fedora Core 3 and got my sound card working again. > > Now, it is not working again. > > The Fedoras start with alsa muted at times. From a console try > alsamixer. If any of the "VU meters" have an M over them that channel > is muted. Bingo! Exchange DAC must be turned off. CD-ROM and the various other volumes must be turned on. Various other buttons do stuff too. This this a Fedora thing, or KDE? It screws up in KDE, although it may be something I launched. I fixed this with alsamixer, and I have hacked with it since using kmix. It is possible I can launch KDE without screwing everything up now. -- Howard Gibson hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org howardg-PadmjKOQAFn3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org http://home.eol.ca/~hgibson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 6 02:17:16 2005 From: marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (Marc Lijour) Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 22:17:16 -0400 Subject: Converting DVD to mpeg with Linux Message-ID: <200508052217.16127.marc@lijour.net> Hi does anybody know of a tool to convert a DVD (.vob files) to mpeg or avi...? Thank you. Marc -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From saliola-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 6 02:27:45 2005 From: saliola-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Franco Saliola) Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 22:27:45 -0400 Subject: Converting DVD to mpeg with Linux In-Reply-To: <200508052217.16127.marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508052217.16127.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: mencoder, which is part of mplayer. See www.mplayerhq.hu On 8/5/05, Marc Lijour wrote: > does anybody know of a tool to convert a DVD (.vob files) to mpeg or avi...? See mencoder, which is part of mplayer. See www.mplayerhq.hu. Pop the DVD into the drive and run something like mencoder dvd://1 -vf scale -zoom -xy 640 -o title.avi -ovc lavc -oac copy The mplayer man pages are good. Franco -- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 6 02:51:49 2005 From: scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Stewart C. Russell) Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 22:51:49 -0400 Subject: Converting DVD to mpeg with Linux In-Reply-To: References: <200508052217.16127.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: <42F425C5.5010307@sympatico.ca> or there's dvd::rip, which is a friendly front-end to many tools. What I really need is a tool to read a region coded DVD, and dump out the vobs for reburning without a region. cheers, Stewart -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 6 02:54:44 2005 From: ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ansar Mohammed) Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 22:54:44 -0400 Subject: Semi-OT: Cisco PIX VPN - Linux Boxes left out. In-Reply-To: <20050805204853.GL6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050805204853.GL6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: Broadcast icmp is a really really bad thing. It was never a feature of the Windows IP stack and FreeBSD has it disabled by default years ago. I would guess that your remote vpn clients are getting an ip address on a separate subnet. You have two possible issues. 1. Your ipchains ruleset is most probably configured for "Local Area Network" access. i.e. only incoming requests from your local subnet are allowed otherwise all outbound allowed 2. Your IP configurations on linux are off.. could be subnet mask or dg. Either way the only way to be sure is to run tcpdump on your Linux box. -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org] On Behalf Of Lennart Sorensen Sent: August 5, 2005 4:49 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Semi-OT: Cisco PIX VPN - Linux Boxes left out. On Fri, Aug 05, 2005 at 04:38:50PM -0400, psema4 wrote: > On the internal network, yes - with the exception of the VPN clients. > When a vpn client connects, it uses it's internal network ip for it's > gateway (which is on the same subnet as the windows/linux boxes we're > trying to reach.) So the clients are given an internal ip. does the VPN box do proper arp responses for those clients? I know windows seems to follow different rules on how to respond to ping requests than linux does. I find a broadcast ping on a subnet will get a response from all linux machines but very few windows machines. > Inside the network (and without using the vpn connection) all boxes > can ping each other. The problem only shows up when connecting > through the VPN client. How about ssh or anything else that isn't ICMP based? Does that work? Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 6 03:19:28 2005 From: marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (Marc Lijour) Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 23:19:28 -0400 Subject: Converting DVD to mpeg with Linux In-Reply-To: <200508052217.16127.marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508052217.16127.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: <200508052319.28503.marc@lijour.net> On August 5, 2005 22:17, Marc Lijour wrote: > Hi > > does anybody know of a tool to convert a DVD (.vob files) to mpeg or > avi...? Thank you > > Thank you. > > Marc > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 6 13:48:11 2005 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 09:48:11 -0400 Subject: linuxcaffe.ca resurected Message-ID: <42F4BF9B.4010107@sympatico.ca> that's right folks, the website is in motion once again ! www.linuxcaffe.ca after spending several months waiting for a well intentioned (but overworked) webmaster to do the deed, Mr Rob Sutherland has stepped up to the plate and knocked this one deep into left field. OK, it's not done (and show me the website that's "done") but it /is/ ready for visitors. I hope to see you logged in to the site and at linuxcaffe, enjoying a fresh burned distro and a mochaccino. ciao, djp -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From zhunt-KdxWn004MjY at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 6 17:54:40 2005 From: zhunt-KdxWn004MjY at public.gmane.org (Zoltan) Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 12:54:40 -0500 Subject: test, pleae ignore. In-Reply-To: <1123203817.30652.465.camel-csCcNl6ta60tuqGvh5Fqhg@public.gmane.org> References: <1123203817.30652.465.camel@holden.weait.net> Message-ID: <42F4F960.1000407@zee4.com> test, please ignore. -- www.YYZTech.ca Toronto talks tech. www.Dine.TO Toronto's premier restaurant search engine. Get Thunderbird -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 6 17:18:20 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 13:18:20 -0400 Subject: test, pleae ignore. In-Reply-To: <42F4F960.1000407-KdxWn004MjY@public.gmane.org> References: <1123203817.30652.465.camel@holden.weait.net> <42F4F960.1000407@zee4.com> Message-ID: <42F4F0DC.8000102@rogers.com> Zoltan wrote: > test, please ignore. > Will do. ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From kru_tch-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 6 19:35:35 2005 From: kru_tch-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (Steve =?iso-8859-1?Q?=C5?=) Date: Sat, 6 Aug 2005 15:35:35 -0400 Subject: linuxcaffe.ca resurected In-Reply-To: <42F4BF9B.4010107-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <42F4BF9B.4010107@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <20050806193535.GA28793@sweetpig.dyndns.org> On Sat, Aug 06, 2005 at 09:48:11AM -0400 or thereabouts, David J Patrick wrote: > that's right folks, the website is in motion once again ! > > www.linuxcaffe.ca > > after spending several months waiting for a well intentioned (but > overworked) webmaster to do the deed, Mr Rob Sutherland has stepped up > to the plate and knocked this one deep into left field. OK, it's not > done (and show me the website that's "done") but it /is/ ready for > visitors. > > I hope to see you logged in to the site and at linuxcaffe, enjoying a > fresh burned distro and a mochaccino. Looks great ! Might I respectively suggest a Google Map for new visitors to peruse ? -- Steve A. ----------------------------------------------- Saturday Aug 06 2005 03:30:02 PM EDT ----------------------------------------------- BOFH excuse #33: piezo-electric interference -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From kru_tch-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 6 19:43:00 2005 From: kru_tch-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (Steve =?iso-8859-1?Q?=C5?=) Date: Sat, 6 Aug 2005 15:43:00 -0400 Subject: linuxcaffe.ca resurected In-Reply-To: <20050806193535.GA28793-eohoN97vg7Ai5CQI31g/s0B+6BGkLq7r@public.gmane.org> References: <42F4BF9B.4010107@sympatico.ca> <20050806193535.GA28793@sweetpig.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <20050806194300.GB28793@sweetpig.dyndns.org> Duh -- Sorry about the previous noise. There is a Google Map. -- Steve A. ----------------------------------------------- Saturday Aug 06 2005 03:40:01 PM EDT ----------------------------------------------- Don't plan any hasty moves. You'll be evicted soon anyway. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 6 21:53:07 2005 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 17:53:07 -0400 Subject: linuxcaffe.ca resurected In-Reply-To: <48f6a4$5mkptb-QCW8SR9EPqk/MCZexUuWkuTW4wlIGRCZ@public.gmane.org> References: <48f6a4$5mkptb@toip1.bellnexxia.net> Message-ID: <42F53143.7060704@sympatico.ca> Jon Thiele wrote: >nice website. if you don't mind - what cms did you use??? > dat'd be drupal. It's turning out to be a delightful solution, if not as module rich as Mambo. djp -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 7 02:19:50 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Sat, 6 Aug 2005 22:19:50 -0400 Subject: video-audio out of sync Message-ID: Hi, I just installed Ubuntu 5.04 a few days ago. Everything seems great except for when playing mpeg video. Originally the video itself was choppy using totem-gstreamer, then I changed to totem-xine and the video is now smooth. However it is out of sync with the audio (about 1/2 second, I think). I never had this problem in Fedora. I'm using an Asus A7N8X-X board with AMD 2500+ & 512MB RAM. I'm using the onboard sound with this motherboard. Any help would be appreciated... I've spent hours searching the net and haven't found a solution yet. Thanks. -Steve. -- Mozilla Firefox -rediscover the web- http://www.mozilla.org/products/firefox/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 7 04:49:41 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Sun, 07 Aug 2005 00:49:41 -0400 Subject: video-audio out of sync In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Steve wrote: > Hi, > > I just installed Ubuntu 5.04 a few days ago. Everything seems great > except for when playing mpeg video. Originally the video itself was > choppy using totem-gstreamer, then I changed to totem-xine and the > video is now smooth. However it is out of sync with the audio (about > 1/2 second, I think). > > I never had this problem in Fedora. > > I'm using an Asus A7N8X-X board with AMD 2500+ & 512MB RAM. I'm using > the onboard sound with this motherboard. > > Any help would be appreciated... I've spent hours searching the net > and haven't found a solution yet. > > Thanks. > > -Steve. Do you have dma enabled on your disc/drive? It makes a difference for DVD playback. Not sure about playing mpegs from hdd. I'm pretty sure Ubuntu has dma disabled by default for cd/dvd drives. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 7 13:03:06 2005 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 09:03:06 -0400 Subject: Converting DVD to mpeg with Linux In-Reply-To: <42F425C5.5010307-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508052217.16127.marc@lijour.net> <42F425C5.5010307@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <20050807130306.GA2732@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> On Fri, Aug 05, 2005 at 10:51:49PM -0400, Stewart C. Russell wrote: >or there's dvd::rip, which is a friendly front-end to many tools. > >What I really need is a tool to read a region coded DVD, and dump out >the vobs for reburning without a region. Also try dvdbackup - very, very easy to use, but if you are ripping a double-layer DVD you will get double-layer-sized VOBs. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 7 14:28:41 2005 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 10:28:41 -0400 Subject: Monitor correction chart? Message-ID: <20050807142841.GA1148@waltdnes.org> I don't know whether this question belongs on a computer group or a digital photography group, but here goes. Having recently bought a digital camera, I'll admit to taking the (ahem) occasional (cough cough) not-quite-perfect picture that needs some touching-up. I'm starting to play around with GIMP, and getting half-decent at fixing up under-exposed shots. I can make it look good on *MY* computer monitor. This raises the question of whether there is a "test pattern" for monitors like http://www.high-techproductions.com/colorbars.htm for TV. You'd need a paper printout and a digital file. Getting the paper printout right might be a bit expensive. Talking about computer monitors in general, is it just me, or has anyone else noticed that LCD displays seem to default to being *DAMN* bright? When I got one at work, the first thing I did was to crank the brightness way down. -- Walter Dnes My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 7 17:44:18 2005 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 20:44:18 +0300 (IDT) Subject: Monitor correction chart? In-Reply-To: <20050807142841.GA1148-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20050807142841.GA1148@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: There are ICCM color profiles for monitors. I am almost sure that higher end X servers support this. But I have seen no trace of that in XFree86. LCD monitors very rarely manage to render colors with sufficient precision for photo work. Move your head a little and the colors shift. Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 7 20:59:55 2005 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 16:59:55 -0400 Subject: Monitor correction chart? In-Reply-To: References: <20050807142841.GA1148@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <20050807205955.GA10008@waltdnes.org> On Sun, Aug 07, 2005 at 08:44:18PM +0300, Peter wrote > There are ICCM color profiles for monitors. I am almost sure that > higher end X servers support this. But I have seen no trace of that > in XFree86. It shouldn't matter what OS is running. It should be colour on a piece of paper versus colour on a screen. > LCD monitors very rarely manage to render colors with sufficient > precision for photo work. Move your head a little and the colors > shift. It's not as bad as it used to be. Angle of view is a bit wider now. -- Walter Dnes My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 7 22:20:40 2005 From: cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org (Chris F.A. Johnson) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 18:20:40 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Is there an August meeting? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 2 Aug 2005, Robert Brockway wrote: > > On Tue, 2 Aug 2005, Chris F.A. Johnson wrote: > >> On Tue, 2 Aug 2005, Sy wrote: >> >>> There is currently no information on the next meeting. Where will it >>> be held, and will there be a presentation? >> >> A few months ago Robert had me down tentatively for Aug. 9 for a >> presentation on my book; I have not had any confirmation, nor has >> anything been posted. > > Chris and I have ACKed and the wiki will be updated shortly. Date Tuesday August 9, 2005 Time 7:30 pm Topic Shell Scripting Recipes: A Problem-Solution Approach, by Chris F.A. Johnson, published May 2005 by Apress Speaker Chris F.A. Johnson Description Shell Scripting Recipes contains more than 200 scripts and functions that can be used on any Linux system without any modification. It is intended for all users who want to get more out of their computers. The book also demonstrates how the shell can be used as an all-purpose programming language. I can bring a few copies of the book for those who wish to purchase them. The price is $35.00 each. Please e-mail me (cfaj at freeshell.org) if you would like a copy. Location I assume that it will be the usual room. Perhaps Robert can confirm this. -- Chris F.A. Johnson ================================================================== Shell Scripting Recipes: A Problem-Solution Approach, 2005, Apress -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rickl-ZACYGPecefkm4kRHVhTciCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 7 23:07:01 2005 From: rickl-ZACYGPecefkm4kRHVhTciCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Rick Tomaschuk) Date: Sun, 07 Aug 2005 19:07:01 -0400 Subject: TorontoNUI.ca and Linuxworld 2006 Message-ID: <1123456021.29445.28.camel@spot1.localhost.com> LinuxWorld Conference & Expo Canada 2006 will be on April 24,25,26, 2006. Let me know if you have something Novell/Suse related so we can collaborate with NUI to provide some freebees, (magazines, novelties etc.) at your booth or presentation. http://www.linuxworldcanada.com/ We're looking ahead to Linuxworld 2006 since the call for papers is due October 31, 2005. http://www.plumcom.ca/lwnw_2006/call_papers.cfm What is NUI? Novell Users International (NUI http://www.nuinet.com) has evolved from the need for IT professionals to have an organization that keeps them up to date on rapid technological advances. Your local chapter and the NUI virtual community offer educational, networking and social events that help its members manage their careers, reap the benefits that come with being a trained professional in this highly specialized and complex field. TorontoNUI.ca is a member of of NUI at the partner level and is locally run. http://www.torontonui.ca/contact.htm We need your support. Regards, Rick Tomaschuk Toronto Area Novell Users Group http://www.TorontoNUI.ca info-PE4J8xSbImWvmauoTqQZlQ at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 7 23:33:57 2005 From: scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Stewart C. Russell) Date: Sun, 07 Aug 2005 19:33:57 -0400 Subject: Monitor correction chart? In-Reply-To: <20050807142841.GA1148-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20050807142841.GA1148@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <42F69A65.70007@sympatico.ca> Walter Dnes wrote: > > This raises the question of whether there is a "test pattern" for > monitors like http://www.high-techproductions.com/colorbars.htm for TV. > You'd need a paper printout and a digital file. Getting the paper > printout right might be a bit expensive. Is an ITU colour target what you want: ? Or do you just want to get the gamma of your monitor correct? If so, there are tools like Monica that can help: . Are you wanting a fully colour calibrated workflow? That is, from capture to display to print, doing what you'd expect? coloraid.de is fairly helpful for this sort of thing. It's a fiddly -- and occasionally expensive -- issue. cheers, Stewart -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 7 23:50:07 2005 From: marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (Marc Lijour) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 19:50:07 -0400 Subject: database vs filesystem performance Message-ID: <200508071950.07859.marc@lijour.net> Does somebody know the compared performance of the filesystem against a RDBMS? Thanks -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From saliola-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 00:35:31 2005 From: saliola-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Franco Saliola) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 20:35:31 -0400 Subject: Mission impossible In-Reply-To: <42F257A2.5030806-VFlxZYho3OA@public.gmane.org> References: <42F257A2.5030806@knet.ca> Message-ID: On 8/4/05, teddymills wrote: > Remember how in Mission Impossible 1, there was a keystroke logger? > Well not really...but i need to install a keystroke logger on a Linux > Redhat/Fedora Core server. Are you sure you want a keystroke logger? This is not a very nice thing to do to your users. I'd be mad as hell if someone did this to me without my knowledge as my passwords, gpg key, financial information, etc. would be compromised. If what you are really interested in is the commands that have been executed and not the keystrokes, then you should look into "process accounting". It logs commands exectuted by users. Franco -- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 00:52:20 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 20:52:20 -0400 Subject: database vs filesystem performance References: <200508071950.07859.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: <000801c59bb3$807cf010$6501a8c0@ibm5b4y3a0pgrq> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marc Lijour" To: Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2005 7:50 PM Subject: [TLUG]: database vs filesystem performance > Does somebody know the compared performance of the filesystem against a RDBMS? > > Thanks Bonjour Marc, Not an easy thing to compare, a RDBMS is immensely more complex than a filesystem, which it uses somehow as the physical repository of the data. Some products use raw files and bypass the O/S filesystem, some other use plain files which contain the indexing information and/or the data itself, usually organized in "pages" which are large records containing one or more tuples of a table. Most RDBMS use large caches of data to try to reduce the amount of I/O operations to/from the physical files. Plus, with a RDBMS we have the transactional aspect of processing the data, which adds another area of processing and disk operations everytime we want to update some data. My experienced with very large applications is that reading and processing lots of data (i.e. hundreds of thousands of records) was thousands of times faster with flat files compared to a RDBMS. But it is not really practical to try to compare the functionality of a RDBMS system with simple file operations. Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 00:52:52 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 20:52:52 -0400 Subject: Which DVD player? Message-ID: <20050808005252.GA2041@node1.opengeometry.net> Which DVD player do you use to view a DVD movie on Linux? I'm afraid I am total newbie in this matter. -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From saliola-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 00:55:03 2005 From: saliola-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Franco Saliola) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 20:55:03 -0400 Subject: get account balances from bank Web site? In-Reply-To: <4386c5b20508032011622f2b76-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <4386c5b205071517492027df1c@mail.gmail.com> <200507160849.44061.dbarkwell@pelism.com> <4386c5b20508032011622f2b76@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 8/3/05, Aaron Vegh wrote: > Hi Franco, > Thanks very much for this very informative script. I'm not very good > with perl (more a PHP guy, so I'm not completely lost!), so this > really helped. > > However, due to my ignorance I have not been able to finish this > script, so I was hoping for a little expertise to push me the final > few steps. > > I have five accounts that I would like to get the balances of, and > have written a loop that goes through the source code of the site > using HTML::TokeParser. The code looks like this: > > my $stream = HTML::TokeParser->new(\$mech->{content}); > while ($stream->get_tag("a")) { > if (rindex($stream->get_trimmed_text("/a"), $savingsacct) > 0) { > $stream->get_tag("td"); $stream->get_tag("td"); $stream->get_tag("td"); > print "Savings Account: " . $stream->get_trimmed_text("/td") . "\n"; > } > elsif (rindex($stream->get_trimmed_text("/a"), $chequingacct) > 0) { > $stream->get_tag("/td"); $stream->get_tag("/td"); $stream->get_tag("td"); > print "Chequing Account: " . $stream->get_trimmed_text("/td") . "\n"; > } > elsif (rindex($stream->get_trimmed_text("/a"), $dreamacct) > 0) { > $stream->get_tag("/td"); $stream->get_tag("/td"); $stream->get_tag("td"); > print "Dream Account: " . $stream->get_trimmed_text("/td") . "\n"; > } > elsif (rindex($stream->get_trimmed_text("/a"), $caracct) > 0) { > $stream->get_tag("/td"); $stream->get_tag("/td"); $stream->get_tag("td"); > print "Car Account: " . $stream->get_trimmed_text("/td") . "\n"; > } > elsif (rindex($stream->get_trimmed_text("/a"), $locacct) > 0) { > $stream->get_tag("/td"); $stream->get_tag("/td"); $stream->get_tag("td"); > print "Line of Credit: " . $stream->get_trimmed_text("/td") . "\n"; > } > } > > The result is, the script outputs the balance for the first account in > this loop ("Savings Account"), but nothing else. Am I doing something > wrong? I've been banging my head against the wall on this one. Hello Aaron, The code that you have here looks fine, so I suspect the problem is that the conditionals aren't satisfied except in the Savings Account case. Try putting some print statements (print "I'm trying to grab the Line of Credit balance...\n";) and see if the script actually enters the various cases. Perhaps the rindex isn't set correctly. How are you setting $dreamacct, etc.? Franco -- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From saliola-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 00:57:41 2005 From: saliola-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Franco Saliola) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 20:57:41 -0400 Subject: Which DVD player? In-Reply-To: <20050808005252.GA2041-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808005252.GA2041@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: On 8/7/05, William Park wrote: > Which DVD player do you use to view a DVD movie on Linux? I'm afraid I > am total newbie in this matter. I'm a big fan of mplayer. Xine is also good. Maybe better. Franco -- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 01:04:38 2005 From: marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (Marc Lijour) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 21:04:38 -0400 Subject: database vs filesystem performance In-Reply-To: <000801c59bb3$807cf010$6501a8c0@ibm5b4y3a0pgrq> References: <200508071950.07859.marc@lijour.net> <000801c59bb3$807cf010$6501a8c0@ibm5b4y3a0pgrq> Message-ID: <200508072104.38135.marc@lijour.net> On August 7, 2005 20:52, Francois Ouellette wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Marc Lijour" > To: > Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2005 7:50 PM > Subject: [TLUG]: database vs filesystem performance > > > Does somebody know the compared performance of the filesystem against a > > RDBMS? > > > Thanks > > Bonjour Marc, > > Not an easy thing to compare, a RDBMS is immensely more complex than a > filesystem, which it uses somehow as the physical repository of the data. > Some products use raw files and bypass the O/S filesystem, some other use > plain files which contain the indexing information and/or the data itself, > usually organized in "pages" which are large records containing one or more > tuples of a table. Most RDBMS use large caches of data to try to reduce the > amount of I/O operations to/from the physical files. Plus, with a RDBMS we > have the transactional aspect of processing the data, which adds another > area of processing and disk operations everytime we want to update some > data. > > My experienced with very large applications is that reading and processing > lots of data (i.e. hundreds of thousands of records) was thousands of times > faster with flat files compared to a RDBMS. But it is not really practical > to try to compare the functionality of a RDBMS system with simple file > operations. > > Fran?ois Ouellette > Bonjour Fran?ois! I know my question is quite vague. Let me try to throw a little more details. I am working on an application which pulls data from a cache at a very fast rate (configurable but it could be up to 3000 times by second) therefore performance -in terms of speed- is an issue. The data is in itself binary. Some people suggested to convert this into strings and to store it in the database (MS-SQL). I heard that databases are not that good with binary data and also that the filesystem has been designed to handle files efficiently. I wonder what is best between storing this data in the database (eventually as string or as a BLOB) or dumping it into a big file (or breaking it in a sequence of files eventually). The journaling filesystem would make this reliant to a system crash, right? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 01:19:06 2005 From: cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org (Chris F.A. Johnson) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 21:19:06 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Which DVD player? In-Reply-To: <20050808005252.GA2041-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808005252.GA2041@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: On Sun, 7 Aug 2005, William Park wrote: > Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 20:52:52 -0400 > From: William Park > Reply-To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > To: TLUG-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org, kwlug-disc-BDyrTanuHcXYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org > Subject: [TLUG]: Which DVD player? > > Which DVD player do you use to view a DVD movie on Linux? I'm afraid I > am total newbie in this matter. I have tried kaffeine, mplayer and gxine; all work well. If you want everything mouse controlled, kaffeine is probably best. -- Chris F.A. Johnson ================================================================== Shell Scripting Recipes: A Problem-Solution Approach, 2005, Apress -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 01:27:34 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 21:27:34 -0400 Subject: database vs filesystem performance References: <200508071950.07859.marc@lijour.net> <000801c59bb3$807cf010$6501a8c0@ibm5b4y3a0pgrq> <200508072104.38135.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: <002401c59bb8$6c54ed40$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marc Lijour" To: Sent: Sunday, 07 August, 2005 21:04 Subject: Re: [TLUG]: database vs filesystem performance On August 7, 2005 20:52, Francois Ouellette wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Marc Lijour" > To: > Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2005 7:50 PM > Subject: [TLUG]: database vs filesystem performance > > > Does somebody know the compared performance of the filesystem against a > > RDBMS? > > > Thanks > > Bonjour Marc, > > Not an easy thing to compare, a RDBMS is immensely more complex than a > filesystem, which it uses somehow as the physical repository of the data. > Some products use raw files and bypass the O/S filesystem, some other use > plain files which contain the indexing information and/or the data itself, > usually organized in "pages" which are large records containing one or more > tuples of a table. Most RDBMS use large caches of data to try to reduce the > amount of I/O operations to/from the physical files. Plus, with a RDBMS we > have the transactional aspect of processing the data, which adds another > area of processing and disk operations everytime we want to update some > data. > > My experienced with very large applications is that reading and processing > lots of data (i.e. hundreds of thousands of records) was thousands of times > faster with flat files compared to a RDBMS. But it is not really practical > to try to compare the functionality of a RDBMS system with simple file > operations. > > Fran?ois Ouellette > > > >Bonjour Fran?ois! > >I know my question is quite vague. Let me try to throw a little more details. >I am working on an application which pulls data from a cache at a very fast >rate (configurable but it could be up to 3000 times by second) therefore >performance -in terms of speed- is an issue. The data is in itself binary. >Some people suggested to convert this into strings and to store it in the >database (MS-SQL). I heard that databases are not that good with binary data >and also that the filesystem has been designed to handle files efficiently. I >wonder what is best between storing this data in the database (eventually as >string or as a BLOB) or dumping it into a big file (or breaking it in a >sequence of files eventually). The journaling filesystem would make this >reliant to a system crash, right? You may be able to read 3000+ records per second from a RDBMS once the data has been read and put into its server cache. However, as you say, RDBMS are not very good at storing binary data apart from the usual integer and float formats. BLOBS are a possibility but some RDBMS store them as single flat files too! Unless you really have to use a RDBMS because of some requirement of the application my suggestion would be to stick to flat files. My experience with journaled file systems available on most UNIX platforms and also Linux (reiserfs and ext3) systems has so far been positive, the best I had to work with was the Advanced File System of the declining Tru64 system, originally developed for DEC-OSF. Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 01:27:56 2005 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 04:27:56 +0300 (IDT) Subject: Monitor correction chart? In-Reply-To: <20050807205955.GA10008-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20050807142841.GA1148@waltdnes.org> <20050807205955.GA10008@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: On Sun, 7 Aug 2005, Walter Dnes wrote: > On Sun, Aug 07, 2005 at 08:44:18PM +0300, Peter wrote > >> There are ICCM color profiles for monitors. I am almost sure that >> higher end X servers support this. But I have seen no trace of that >> in XFree86. > > It shouldn't matter what OS is running. It should be colour on a > piece of paper versus colour on a screen. If you calibrate the screen to the printer output all your edited files will only print right with your printer, with the paper you are using, and likely only until you change ink or toner. However this is the most straightforward way to do it for a hobbyist who will never take his retouched photos to a digital printer. This is the worst way to do it. The goal is not to match the printer to the screen but to match the screen to the absolute colors. Then the printer is separately matched to absolute colors. Macs have all the necessary correction tables installed and usually you only need to choose the right one for your hardware. The PC is way behind it in this respect. Something has to fix it in real time. The something is the video driver in Windows, and it should be the X server in Linux. Or the application. Higher end video card drivers have color profile editing capability at least under Windows. I goofed when I wrote ICCM, it's ICC, from here: http://www.color.org/ They have a number of higher level tutorials. Here are my 'low tech' means to achieve what you seek (both methods are tested): One way to do it is to get hold of a color calibration slide or chart (any camera shop should have one). Put it on a lightbox, next to the monitor in a room with subdued light of the same color as the lightbox's (subdued skylight reflected off whitewashed walls is about right). Then adjust the color profile of the monitor until you can see no difference wrt. the chart/slide. This is best done with alternating color bars and grayscale log charts. Another less onerous way would be to get hold of a chart's file (pdf works great, pdf colors are accurate) and take it to a good (new, high quality machines) digital printer's and print it on photo paper. That and the correct light source should be able to replace the professional chart and lightbox in a pinch. Then start printing the chart on the printer and adjust the printer's color profile until that shows no differences either (using the same light as above). Unfortunately you will be wasting a lot of ink with this. You could save some by using a colorimeter to measure the color on the paper and dial precise changes into the printer color profile, thus achieving rapid correction. Offset printing machines use online colorimetry and tweak the printing process in real time to obtain constant calibrated colors (these machines print most glossy magazines and color advertising leaflets and brochures). A handheld colorimeter can be borrowed from a photo shop. >> LCD monitors very rarely manage to render colors with sufficient >> precision for photo work. Move your head a little and the colors >> shift. > > It's not as bad as it used to be. Angle of view is a bit wider now. A color editor (person) will claim to be able to discern 1-2% color saturation change on a screen. The saturation changes more than that when you move your head with a lcd screen. Therefore they don't like it. Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From aaronvegh-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 01:30:03 2005 From: aaronvegh-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Aaron Vegh) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 21:30:03 -0400 Subject: get account balances from bank Web site? In-Reply-To: References: <4386c5b205071517492027df1c@mail.gmail.com> <200507160849.44061.dbarkwell@pelism.com> <4386c5b20508032011622f2b76@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4386c5b205080718302da34cad@mail.gmail.com> Thanks Franco, It seems clear the conditionals are not being met, further confirmed by the lack of print statements showing up in the results. The conditions are set in the rindex statement by looking for my bank account number ($savingsacct, $chequingacct, etc. are all the account numberes), and the table is laid out like so: account numberbank card designation (i.e. "savings")funds availableaccount balance So the rindex finds the account number in the first cell, skips the next two cells ("$stream -> get_tag("/td")"), and outputs the contents of the fourth cell. However, it seems clear the rindex is not triggering on the account number after the first time. Also, when I comment out the first if statement (looking for the savings account), it now finds the chequing account, but again, nothing else! It seems clear that the construction of this code limits the number of returned results to one. I believe there is a fundamental error in this code. Any idea what that might be? Cheers, Aaron -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 01:34:03 2005 From: marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (Marc Lijour) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 21:34:03 -0400 Subject: database vs filesystem performance In-Reply-To: <002401c59bb8$6c54ed40$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> References: <200508071950.07859.marc@lijour.net> <200508072104.38135.marc@lijour.net> <002401c59bb8$6c54ed40$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: <200508072134.03560.marc@lijour.net> On August 7, 2005 21:27, Francois Ouellette wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Marc Lijour" > To: > Sent: Sunday, 07 August, 2005 21:04 > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: database vs filesystem performance > > On August 7, 2005 20:52, Francois Ouellette wrote: > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Marc Lijour" > > To: > > Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2005 7:50 PM > > Subject: [TLUG]: database vs filesystem performance > > > > > Does somebody know the compared performance of the filesystem against a > > > > RDBMS? > > > > > Thanks > > > > Bonjour Marc, > > > > Not an easy thing to compare, a RDBMS is immensely more complex than a > > filesystem, which it uses somehow as the physical repository of the data. > > Some products use raw files and bypass the O/S filesystem, some other use > > plain files which contain the indexing information and/or the data > > itself, usually organized in "pages" which are large records containing > > one or > > more > > > tuples of a table. Most RDBMS use large caches of data to try to reduce > > the > > > amount of I/O operations to/from the physical files. Plus, with a RDBMS > > we have the transactional aspect of processing the data, which adds > > another area of processing and disk operations everytime we want to > > update some data. > > > > My experienced with very large applications is that reading and > > processing lots of data (i.e. hundreds of thousands of records) was > > thousands of > > times > > > faster with flat files compared to a RDBMS. But it is not really > > practical to try to compare the functionality of a RDBMS system with > > simple file operations. > > > > Fran?ois Ouellette > > > > > > > >Bonjour Fran?ois! > > > >I know my question is quite vague. Let me try to throw a little more > > details. > > >I am working on an application which pulls data from a cache at a very > > fast rate (configurable but it could be up to 3000 times by second) > > therefore performance -in terms of speed- is an issue. The data is in > > itself binary. Some people suggested to convert this into strings and to > > store it in the database (MS-SQL). I heard that databases are not that > > good with binary > > data > > >and also that the filesystem has been designed to handle files > > efficiently. > > I > > >wonder what is best between storing this data in the database (eventually > > as > > >string or as a BLOB) or dumping it into a big file (or breaking it in a > >sequence of files eventually). The journaling filesystem would make this > >reliant to a system crash, right? > > You may be able to read 3000+ records per second from a RDBMS once the data > has been read and put into its server cache. > However, as you say, RDBMS are not very good at storing binary data apart > from the usual integer and float formats. > BLOBS are a possibility but some RDBMS store them as single flat files too! > Unless you really have to use a RDBMS because of some requirement of the > application my suggestion would be to stick to flat files. > > My experience with journaled file systems available on most UNIX platforms > and also Linux (reiserfs and ext3) systems has so far been positive, the > best I had to work with was the Advanced File System of the declining Tru64 > system, originally developed for DEC-OSF. Do you know how it does compare with MS NTFS? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 01:39:09 2005 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 21:39:09 -0400 Subject: database vs filesystem performance In-Reply-To: <200508071950.07859.marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508071950.07859.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: On 8/7/05, Marc Lijour wrote: > > Does somebody know the compared performance of the filesystem against a > RDBMS? Do you mean for storage of BLOBs? (Binary Large OBjects) There is likely to be somewhat more overhead for BLOBs in a DBMS than there is in storing the data in files in a filesystem as there are likely to be more things that they will be linked to in a DBMS. Mind you, filesystems and DBMSes have been converging in how they implement storage of data, as most of the modern systems use blocks and extents whether we're talking about a "database" or a "filesystem." Storing the data in a DBMS is a sword that cuts on both edges; on the useful side, BLOBs can be managed in a transactional fashion, which may be helpful to reliability of your application. (And if that's needful, it may be worth some overhead.) On the "other cutting edge," interfacing tends to be a bit of a pain, as the files won't be transparently available from the shell level. Informix was trying to push this usage of Version 10 of their database, and doubtless pushed out some benchmarks. You're doubtless better off constructing a benchmark for your own use case, as that's the only way you'll get a useful comparison. -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 01:45:37 2005 From: marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (Marc Lijour) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 21:45:37 -0400 Subject: database vs filesystem performance In-Reply-To: References: <200508071950.07859.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: <200508072145.37397.marc@lijour.net> On August 7, 2005 21:39, Christopher Browne wrote: > On 8/7/05, Marc Lijour wrote: > > Does somebody know the compared performance of the filesystem against a > > RDBMS? > > Do you mean for storage of BLOBs? (Binary Large OBjects) > > There is likely to be somewhat more overhead for BLOBs in a DBMS than there > is in storing the data in files in a filesystem as there are likely to be > more things that they will be linked to in a DBMS. Is it smart then to convert binary as human readable hex strings? It is likely to increase storage and what about performance (speed)? > Mind you, filesystems and DBMSes have been converging in how they implement > storage of data, as most of the modern systems use blocks and extents > whether we're talking about a "database" or a "filesystem." > > Storing the data in a DBMS is a sword that cuts on both edges; on the > useful side, BLOBs can be managed in a transactional fashion, which may be > helpful to reliability of your application. (And if that's needful, it may > be worth some overhead.) On the "other cutting edge," interfacing tends to > be a bit of a pain, as the files won't be transparently available from the > shell level. I don't need concurrency control. > Informix was trying to push this usage of Version 10 of their database, and > doubtless pushed out some benchmarks. > > You're doubtless better off constructing a benchmark for your own use case, > as that's the only way you'll get a useful comparison. That is a nice idea. I am just curious -I can not afford to be more than that because the design choices in this case come from far above myself :-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 01:53:15 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 21:53:15 -0400 Subject: database vs filesystem performance References: <200508071950.07859.marc@lijour.net> <200508072104.38135.marc@lijour.net> <002401c59bb8$6c54ed40$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <200508072134.03560.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: <003f01c59bbc$036f2620$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marc Lijour" To: Sent: Sunday, 07 August, 2005 21:34 Subject: Re: [TLUG]: database vs filesystem performance On August 7, 2005 21:27, Francois Ouellette wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Marc Lijour" > To: > Sent: Sunday, 07 August, 2005 21:04 > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: database vs filesystem performance > > On August 7, 2005 20:52, Francois Ouellette wrote: > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Marc Lijour" > > To: > > Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2005 7:50 PM > > Subject: [TLUG]: database vs filesystem performance > > > > > Does somebody know the compared performance of the filesystem against a > > RDBMS? > > > > > You may be able to read 3000+ records per second from a RDBMS once the data > has been read and put into its server cache. > However, as you say, RDBMS are not very good at storing binary data apart > from the usual integer and float formats. > BLOBS are a possibility but some RDBMS store them as single flat files too! > Unless you really have to use a RDBMS because of some requirement of the > application my suggestion would be to stick to flat files. > > My experience with journaled file systems available on most UNIX platforms > and also Linux (reiserfs and ext3) systems has so far been positive, the > best I had to work with was the Advanced File System of the declining Tru64 > system, originally developed for DEC-OSF. >========================================================== > > Do you know how it does compare with MS NTFS? There may not be data integrity problems with NTFS, but the Windoze system using it might be a bigger problem! Sorry, this may be a biased opinion but I have seen so many performance problems with Windoze SQL Servers systems, even MS have difficulties in helping how to tune the software to make it perform acceptably, even on monster Wintel machines with huge memory. The same hardware with Linux and an open source RDBMS worked immensely better... Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 01:56:50 2005 From: marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (Marc Lijour) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 21:56:50 -0400 Subject: database vs filesystem performance -> advocacy welcome! In-Reply-To: <003f01c59bbc$036f2620$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> References: <200508071950.07859.marc@lijour.net> <200508072134.03560.marc@lijour.net> <003f01c59bbc$036f2620$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: <200508072156.50721.marc@lijour.net> > > Do you know how it does compare with MS NTFS? > > There may not be data integrity problems with NTFS, but the Windoze system > using it might be a bigger problem! > > Sorry, this may be a biased opinion but I have seen so many performance > problems with Windoze SQL Servers systems, even MS have difficulties in > helping how to tune the software to make it perform acceptably, even on > monster Wintel machines with huge memory. > The same hardware with Linux and an open source RDBMS worked immensely > better... If you have some good links I could use, it would be my true pleasure to do a follow-up with my boss ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 02:01:37 2005 From: marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (Marc Lijour) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 22:01:37 -0400 Subject: Google hi-jacks konqueror right-clicks! Message-ID: <200508072201.38079.marc@lijour.net> Strange how google incorporates javascript into their links, I cannot choose to open the page in a new tab anymore :( -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 02:02:27 2005 From: scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Stewart C. Russell) Date: Sun, 07 Aug 2005 22:02:27 -0400 Subject: Monitor correction chart? In-Reply-To: References: <20050807142841.GA1148@waltdnes.org> <20050807205955.GA10008@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <42F6BD33.8080103@sympatico.ca> Peter wrote: > > Macs have all the necessary correction tables installed > and usually you only need to choose the right one for your hardware. The > PC is way behind it in this respect. Not quite so. To have really accurate colours on a Mac, you'll need a freshly calibrated long tube CRT reference monitor run in an almost dark room. I experienced this in prepress for multi-million $$ ad campaign printing, so it's not the affordable end of calibrated colour ;-) PCs have had adequate colour management since NT4 or so. We were doing book repro with it no problems about five years ago. cheers, Stewart -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 02:09:54 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sun, 07 Aug 2005 22:09:54 -0400 Subject: Google hi-jacks konqueror right-clicks! In-Reply-To: <200508072201.38079.marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508072201.38079.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: <42F6BEF2.1040408@rogers.com> Marc Lijour wrote: > Strange how google incorporates javascript into their links, I cannot choose > to open the page in a new tab anymore :( I don't have that problem in Google. I assume you're talking about the search engine. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 02:14:20 2005 From: marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (Marc Lijour) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 22:14:20 -0400 Subject: Google hi-jacks konqueror right-clicks! In-Reply-To: <42F6BEF2.1040408-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200508072201.38079.marc@lijour.net> <42F6BEF2.1040408@rogers.com> Message-ID: <200508072214.20461.marc@lijour.net> On August 7, 2005 22:09, James Knott wrote: > Marc Lijour wrote: > > Strange how google incorporates javascript into their links, I cannot > > choose to open the page in a new tab anymore :( > > I don't have that problem in Google. I assume you're talking about the > search engine. Ok. This is because I changed the agent identification for safari back in time when I wanted to visit my google account. Sorry. Now it works fine. Thanks. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 02:14:46 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 22:14:46 -0400 Subject: database vs filesystem performance -> advocacy welcome! References: <200508071950.07859.marc@lijour.net> <200508072134.03560.marc@lijour.net> <003f01c59bbc$036f2620$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <200508072156.50721.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: <004901c59bbf$043f4000$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marc Lijour" To: Sent: Sunday, 07 August, 2005 21:56 Subject: Re: [TLUG]: database vs filesystem performance -> advocacy welcome! > > If you have some good links I could use, it would be my true pleasure to do a > follow-up with my boss ;-) > -- Well, just put "SQL Server Performance" in the window of a search engine and you will see that there are a lot of companies out there specializing in tools and services just for that... not a good sign! Last year I worked at UNISYS, a vendor of Wintel mainframes, they also developed complex software tools to monitor and tune (way of speaking) SQL Server systems, I can tell you this isn't an easy subject. Again, the problem isn't only related to the SQL Server product, but also to the way Windoze Server in general can deal with high-throughput processing and I/O requirements. Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 02:49:02 2005 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 22:49:02 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Is there an August meeting? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Sun, 7 Aug 2005, Chris F.A. Johnson wrote: > I assume that it will be the usual room. Perhaps Robert can > confirm this. Unfortunately I don't usually get advanced warning on room changes. If there is a change we'll either announce it ahead of time or post something on the door. Cheers, Rob -- Robert Brockway B.Sc. Phone: +1-416-669-3073 Senior Technical Consultant Email: support-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Web: www.opentrend.net We are open 24x7x365 for technical support. Call us in a crisis. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jvetterli-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 03:10:28 2005 From: jvetterli-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org (John Vetterli) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2005 23:10:28 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Which DVD player? In-Reply-To: References: <20050808005252.GA2041@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: On Sun, 7 Aug 2005, Chris F.A. Johnson wrote: > On Sun, 7 Aug 2005, William Park wrote: >> Which DVD player do you use to view a DVD movie on Linux? I'm afraid I >> am total newbie in this matter. > I have tried kaffeine, mplayer and gxine; all work well. > If you want everything mouse controlled, kaffeine is probably best. I get good results from ogle: http://www.dtek.chalmers.se/groups/dvd/ JV -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 04:09:28 2005 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 00:09:28 -0400 Subject: database vs filesystem performance In-Reply-To: <200508072145.37397.marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508071950.07859.marc@lijour.net> <200508072145.37397.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: On 8/7/05, Marc Lijour wrote: > > On August 7, 2005 21:39, Christopher Browne wrote: > > On 8/7/05, Marc Lijour wrote: > > > Does somebody know the compared performance of the filesystem against > a > > > RDBMS? > > > > Do you mean for storage of BLOBs? (Binary Large OBjects) > > > > There is likely to be somewhat more overhead for BLOBs in a DBMS than > there > > is in storing the data in files in a filesystem as there are likely to > be > > more things that they will be linked to in a DBMS. > > Is it smart then to convert binary as human readable hex strings? > It is likely to increase storage and what about performance (speed)? That sort of conversion will *definitely* increase the cost in both storage consumption as well as performance. You can uuencode the data (or something equivalent); that'll be pretty expensive for each transition. It would be seriously tempting to use the DBMS's own BLOB support, whiich would eliminate that transition. > Mind you, filesystems and DBMSes have been converging in how they > implement > > storage of data, as most of the modern systems use blocks and extents > > whether we're talking about a "database" or a "filesystem." > > > > Storing the data in a DBMS is a sword that cuts on both edges; on the > > useful side, BLOBs can be managed in a transactional fashion, which may > be > > helpful to reliability of your application. (And if that's needful, it > may > > be worth some overhead.) On the "other cutting edge," interfacing tends > to > > be a bit of a pain, as the files won't be transparently available from > the > > shell level. > > I don't need concurrency control. That cuts out one of the possible benefits of storing as BLOB. > Informix was trying to push this usage of Version 10 of their database, > and > > doubtless pushed out some benchmarks. > > > > You're doubtless better off constructing a benchmark for your own use > case, > > as that's the only way you'll get a useful comparison. > > That is a nice idea. I am just curious -I can not afford to be more than > that > because the design choices in this case come from far above myself :-) Unfortunately, you can only get a good feel for the tradeoffs by doing at least a partial implementation. -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 04:10:56 2005 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 00:10:56 -0400 Subject: Monitor correction chart? In-Reply-To: References: <20050807142841.GA1148@waltdnes.org> <20050807205955.GA10008@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <20050808041056.GC12200@waltdnes.org> On Mon, Aug 08, 2005 at 04:27:56AM +0300, Peter wrote > If you calibrate the screen to the printer output all your edited files > will only print right with your printer, with the paper you are using, What I was trying to say was... go out and buy (yes, pay cash) for 1) a reference-chart/test-pattern printout that is guaranteed correct 2) the digital file that was used to generate the reference-chart ...and then load the digital file (gif, jpeg, whatever) with any viewer program and twiddle knobs as necessary until what I see on the screen matches what I see on the paper. -- Walter Dnes My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 04:30:28 2005 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 00:30:28 -0400 (EDT) Subject: database vs filesystem performance -> advocacy welcome! In-Reply-To: <004901c59bbf$043f4000$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> References: <200508071950.07859.marc@lijour.net> <200508072134.03560.marc@lijour.net> <003f01c59bbc$036f2620$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <200508072156.50721.marc@lijour.net> <004901c59bbf$043f4000$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: On Sun, 7 Aug 2005, Francois Ouellette wrote: > Again, the problem isn't only related to the SQL Server product, but also to > the way Windoze Server in general can deal with high-throughput processing > and I/O requirements. I read an interesting article last year written by a Windows guru. He set out to compare interprocess pipes for Linux (2.4 kernel), Win2K and WinXP. He admitted to being surprised by the results and I admire his integrity in putting them out in a (largely) unbiased form. He tried to play down Linux's success a bit but what it amounted to was the Linux was twice as fast at as Win2K and Win2K was twice as fast as WinXP in the area he was investigating. I originally found the report on ibm.com Rob -- Robert Brockway B.Sc. Phone: +1-416-669-3073 Senior Technical Consultant Email: support-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Web: www.opentrend.net We are open 24x7x365 for technical support. Call us in a crisis. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 04:29:46 2005 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 00:29:46 -0400 Subject: Monitor correction chart? In-Reply-To: <42F69A65.70007-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <20050807142841.GA1148@waltdnes.org> <42F69A65.70007@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <20050808042946.GD12200@waltdnes.org> On Sun, Aug 07, 2005 at 07:33:57PM -0400, Stewart C. Russell wrote > Is an ITU colour target what you want: > ? Or do you just want to get the > gamma of your monitor correct? If so, there are tools like Monica > that can help: . Getting the gamma correct is the main thing. I'll be putting up some photos at a photo-sharing site, and I want the gamma right. I assume that my colours aren't totally out to lunch. -- Walter Dnes My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 04:32:00 2005 From: ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ansar Mohammed) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 00:32:00 -0400 Subject: database vs filesystem performance In-Reply-To: <003f01c59bbc$036f2620$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> References: <003f01c59bbc$036f2620$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: I would suggest looking at www.tpc.org for benchmark info. This is an excellent resource for comparing different RDBMS systems performance. I don?t know if this application is home grown but from personal experience, most database performance issues have been from poorly written code. Also another thing to consider is that any high capacity system is going to require serious tuning. On my current project we are approaching 1TB on our SAN. At this level, it's an entirely new ballgame. > > Sorry, this may be a biased opinion but I have seen so many performance > problems with Windoze SQL Servers systems, even MS have difficulties in > helping how to tune the software to make it perform acceptably, even on > monster Wintel machines with huge memory. > The same hardware with Linux and an open source RDBMS worked immensely > better... > > Fran?ois Ouellette > > > > > > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 04:32:00 2005 From: ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ansar Mohammed) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 00:32:00 -0400 Subject: database vs filesystem performance In-Reply-To: <200508072104.38135.marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508072104.38135.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: It all comes down to the nature of your application and data. Is your application read only? Are you modifying data? How large are the files and what kind of files are they? Database servers are really for accessing searching and manipulating structured data not for just storing and accessing files. If you are storing searchable metadata *about* your files then the best solution is probably a hybrid where the metadata is on the database and the files are on a separate filesystem. If you are storing on a filesystem then you will have other disk IO issues, such as file fragmentation and locking. Most caching applications are based on similar principles, separate index and storage area, squid, ISA, even internet explorer ;) If your files are larger than the pagesize of your database, then I would not consider storing them on a database. There would simply be too much IO overhead. (remember that the data inside a database also gets fragmented and most modern database systems have to perform cleanup on a regular basis to ensure that the data remain as contiguous as possible). -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org] On Behalf Of Marc Lijour Sent: August 7, 2005 9:05 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: database vs filesystem performance On August 7, 2005 20:52, Francois Ouellette wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Marc Lijour" > To: > Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2005 7:50 PM > Subject: [TLUG]: database vs filesystem performance > > > Does somebody know the compared performance of the filesystem against a > > RDBMS? > > > Thanks > > Bonjour Marc, > > Not an easy thing to compare, a RDBMS is immensely more complex than a > filesystem, which it uses somehow as the physical repository of the data. > Some products use raw files and bypass the O/S filesystem, some other use > plain files which contain the indexing information and/or the data itself, > usually organized in "pages" which are large records containing one or more > tuples of a table. Most RDBMS use large caches of data to try to reduce the > amount of I/O operations to/from the physical files. Plus, with a RDBMS we > have the transactional aspect of processing the data, which adds another > area of processing and disk operations everytime we want to update some > data. > > My experienced with very large applications is that reading and processing > lots of data (i.e. hundreds of thousands of records) was thousands of times > faster with flat files compared to a RDBMS. But it is not really practical > to try to compare the functionality of a RDBMS system with simple file > operations. > > Fran?ois Ouellette > Bonjour Fran?ois! I know my question is quite vague. Let me try to throw a little more details. I am working on an application which pulls data from a cache at a very fast rate (configurable but it could be up to 3000 times by second) therefore performance -in terms of speed- is an issue. The data is in itself binary. Some people suggested to convert this into strings and to store it in the database (MS-SQL). I heard that databases are not that good with binary data and also that the filesystem has been designed to handle files efficiently. I wonder what is best between storing this data in the database (eventually as string or as a BLOB) or dumping it into a big file (or breaking it in a sequence of files eventually). The journaling filesystem would make this reliant to a system crash, right? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 04:37:21 2005 From: marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (Marc Lijour) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 00:37:21 -0400 Subject: database vs filesystem performance In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200508080037.21459.marc@lijour.net> On August 8, 2005 00:32, Ansar Mohammed wrote: > It all comes down to the nature of your application and data. > Is your application read only? Are you modifying data? How large are the > files and what kind of files are they? I am just getting a very fast stream of binary data which I have to store (fast) with the idea of retrieving later to process it. Hence it must be indexed in some way, but a coarse-grained indexing should work (many files may be). > Database servers are really for accessing searching and manipulating > structured data not for just storing and accessing files. If you are > storing searchable metadata *about* your files then the best solution is > probably a hybrid where the metadata is on the database and the files are > on a separate filesystem. > > If you are storing on a filesystem then you will have other disk IO issues, > such as file fragmentation and locking. > > Most caching applications are based on similar principles, separate index > and storage area, squid, ISA, even internet explorer ;) > > If your files are larger than the pagesize of your database, then I would > not consider storing them on a database. There would simply be too much IO > overhead. (remember that the data inside a database also gets fragmented > and most modern database systems have to perform cleanup on a regular basis > to ensure that the data remain as contiguous as possible). > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org] On Behalf Of Marc Lijour > Sent: August 7, 2005 9:05 PM > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: database vs filesystem performance > > On August 7, 2005 20:52, Francois Ouellette wrote: > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Marc Lijour" > > To: > > Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2005 7:50 PM > > Subject: [TLUG]: database vs filesystem performance > > > > > Does somebody know the compared performance of the filesystem against a > > > > RDBMS? > > > > > Thanks > > > > Bonjour Marc, > > > > Not an easy thing to compare, a RDBMS is immensely more complex than a > > filesystem, which it uses somehow as the physical repository of the data. > > Some products use raw files and bypass the O/S filesystem, some other use > > plain files which contain the indexing information and/or the data > > itself, usually organized in "pages" which are large records containing > > one or > > more > > > tuples of a table. Most RDBMS use large caches of data to try to reduce > > the > > > amount of I/O operations to/from the physical files. Plus, with a RDBMS > > we have the transactional aspect of processing the data, which adds > > another area of processing and disk operations everytime we want to > > update some data. > > > > My experienced with very large applications is that reading and > > processing lots of data (i.e. hundreds of thousands of records) was > > thousands of > > times > > > faster with flat files compared to a RDBMS. But it is not really > > practical to try to compare the functionality of a RDBMS system with > > simple file operations. > > > > Fran?ois Ouellette > > > > Bonjour Fran?ois! > > I know my question is quite vague. Let me try to throw a little more > details. > I am working on an application which pulls data from a cache at a very fast > rate (configurable but it could be up to 3000 times by second) therefore > performance -in terms of speed- is an issue. The data is in itself binary. > Some people suggested to convert this into strings and to store it in the > database (MS-SQL). I heard that databases are not that good with binary > data > > and also that the filesystem has been designed to handle files efficiently. > I > wonder what is best between storing this data in the database (eventually > as > > string or as a BLOB) or dumping it into a big file (or breaking it in a > sequence of files eventually). The journaling filesystem would make this > reliant to a system crash, right? > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 04:45:40 2005 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 00:45:40 -0400 Subject: Font size under X; question Message-ID: <20050808044540.GE12200@waltdnes.org> I'm running Gentoo linux, with Blackbox as the window manager. I normally run 1152X864 on a 19" CRT monitor. Working with 2560x1920 digital photos means Gimp comes up with width and height scaled down to 33% to fit it into the window; fair enough. I figured that I'd try 1600x1200, so that the image width and height only need to be scaled down to 50% to fit. Gimp is still bringing up the image at 33%. The font is the same pixel height as before. A reasonable font at 1152x864 is microscopic and virtually unreadable at 1600x1200. This isn't Gimp-only. The font for Blackbox menus and Firefox is also miniscule. I hope there's a generic setting somewhere to boost font sizes as resolution increases. What is the process? -- Walter Dnes My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 05:31:14 2005 From: marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Marcus Brubaker) Date: Mon, 08 Aug 2005 01:31:14 -0400 Subject: database vs filesystem performance In-Reply-To: <200508080037.21459.marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508080037.21459.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: <42F6EE22.7080204@utoronto.ca> Marc Lijour wrote: >On August 8, 2005 00:32, Ansar Mohammed wrote: > > >>It all comes down to the nature of your application and data. >>Is your application read only? Are you modifying data? How large are the >>files and what kind of files are they? >> >> > >I am just getting a very fast stream of binary data which I have to store >(fast) with the idea of retrieving later to process it. Hence it must be >indexed in some way, but a coarse-grained indexing should work (many files >may be). > > > If this is just an intermediary stage and all you need is coarse indexing (not searching) then just using the filesystem is probably the way to go but keep in mind that FS performance will generally suffer if you have too many files in a given directory. (There are ways around this though.) However, as others have said, to have a conclusive answer would require performance testing specific to your problem. BTW, is this on a Linux box? You've specified MS-SQL but left the other option vague. Just curious. Regards, Marcus -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 10:47:35 2005 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 06:47:35 -0400 Subject: database vs filesystem performance In-Reply-To: <200508080037.21459.marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508080037.21459.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: <20050808104735.GA13078@waltdnes.org> On Mon, Aug 08, 2005 at 12:37:21AM -0400, Marc Lijour wrote > On August 8, 2005 00:32, Ansar Mohammed wrote: > > It all comes down to the nature of your application and data. > > Is your application read only? Are you modifying data? How large are the > > files and what kind of files are they? > > I am just getting a very fast stream of binary data which I have to store > (fast) with the idea of retrieving later to process it. Hence it must be > indexed in some way, but a coarse-grained indexing should work (many files > may be). See http://www.unitedlinux.com/pdfs/whitepaper4.pdf for a discussion on file system limits. 3000 files/second adds up really quickly. [m1800][waltdnes][~] echo $(( 3000 * 3600 * 24 * 365 )) 94608000000 [m1800][waltdnes][~] echo $(( 3000 * 3600 * 24 * 366 )) 94867200000 That's over 94.5 *BILLION FILES* in a regular year, and pushing close to 95 billion in a leap year. That's over a *TRILLION FILES* in 11 years. Would it be considered "insider information" if I ran out and invested my life-savings in disk-drive manufacturers, based on your question. I really have my doubts about a regular file system handling this. According to the above paper, reiserfs 3 "only" allows 1 TB partition, and 4 billion files. Fuggedaboutit. Ext2 and 3 are limited to 4 TB partitions, with however many files you can cram in. JFS is a 64-bit system, and might be able to hold the files and data you need, but I don't really have a clue about speed. -- Walter Dnes My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 12:07:15 2005 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 15:07:15 +0300 (IDT) Subject: Monitor correction chart? In-Reply-To: <42F6BD33.8080103-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <20050807142841.GA1148@waltdnes.org> <20050807205955.GA10008@waltdnes.org> <42F6BD33.8080103@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: On Sun, 7 Aug 2005, Stewart C. Russell wrote: > Peter wrote: >> >> Macs have all the necessary correction tables installed and usually you >> only need to choose the right one for your hardware. The PC is way behind >> it in this respect. > > Not quite so. To have really accurate colours on a Mac, you'll need a freshly > calibrated long tube CRT reference monitor run in an almost dark room. I > experienced this in prepress for multi-million $$ ad campaign printing, so > it's not the affordable end of calibrated colour ;-) What I meant was, a Mac out of the box has the right ICC correction charts installed for all the supplied hardware (like the built-in monitor for example). The user simply selects the chart if it is not selected by default and that's about it unless they are in the printing business in which case *daily* calibration checks would be in order probably. > PCs have had adequate colour management since NT4 or so. We were doing book > repro with it no problems about five years ago. I am not at all sure about it. I mean, normal off the shelf equipment that would be used outside a professional shop. Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 12:13:11 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 08:13:11 -0400 Subject: database vs filesystem performance -> advocacy welcome! References: <200508071950.07859.marc@lijour.net> <200508072134.03560.marc@lijour.net> <003f01c59bbc$036f2620$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <200508072156.50721.marc@lijour.net> <004901c59bbf$043f4000$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: <004401c59c12$9d9fff20$6501a8c0@ibm5b4y3a0pgrq> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Brockway" To: Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 12:30 AM Subject: Re: [TLUG]: database vs filesystem performance -> advocacy welcome! > On Sun, 7 Aug 2005, Francois Ouellette wrote: > > > Again, the problem isn't only related to the SQL Server product, but also to > > the way Windoze Server in general can deal with high-throughput processing > > and I/O requirements. > > I read an interesting article last year written by a Windows guru. He set > out to compare interprocess pipes for Linux (2.4 kernel), Win2K and WinXP. > He admitted to being surprised by the results and I admire his integrity > in putting them out in a (largely) unbiased form. He tried to play down > Linux's success a bit but what it amounted to was the Linux was twice as > fast at as Win2K and Win2K was twice as fast as WinXP in the area he was > investigating. I originally found the report on ibm.com > > Rob > Interesting! Anyone who has done some application or system programming on Windoze and Linux/UNIX could attest of those results, even before doing any benchmarking! Windoze products were originally designed to run on top of DOS for single-user desktop officework applications. Then MS hired Dave Cutler from Digital Equipment Corp, who is the guy who was behind at least two immensely successful operating systems (RSX-11M and VAX/VMS), to design Windows-NT, which reached popularity as a small server platform but (to my opinion) was never in the same technology league as the other manufacturers' products, mainly due to the hardware platform it used and the fact that it had to retain the "Windoze" attributes and support the MFC environment. The NTFS part was a big improvement to the simplistic FAT system, but it was still a Windoze system with the annoying point-and-click user interface... This evolved into the other incarnations of the "server" flavour of O/S that we have seen since. Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 12:44:54 2005 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 15:44:54 +0300 (IDT) Subject: Monitor correction chart? In-Reply-To: <20050808041056.GC12200-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20050807142841.GA1148@waltdnes.org> <20050807205955.GA10008@waltdnes.org> <20050808041056.GC12200@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: On Mon, 8 Aug 2005, Walter Dnes wrote: > On Mon, Aug 08, 2005 at 04:27:56AM +0300, Peter wrote > >> If you calibrate the screen to the printer output all your edited files >> will only print right with your printer, with the paper you are using, > > What I was trying to say was... go out and buy (yes, pay cash) for > > 1) a reference-chart/test-pattern printout that is guaranteed correct You may find that that will cost you about as much as a cheap computer. The 'cheap' charts linked to by another poster were just about USD100 per and that *is* cheap for charts. A professional logarythmic grayscale chart is not printed, but assembled (with glue) from strips and masks of standard (chosen and manufactured by the maker) gray cardboard or similar. Each shade of gray is from a different material. It may set you back $500, new, depending on size and quality. Color charts are also assembled from dozens or hundreds of color fading-proof squares and other pieces of material. In a way it's just expensive origami but too many people depend on it for their work so the price is appropriate. They are also expected to last 5 years in studio use (i.e. under several 2000+Watt lights and in the sun) without fading or changing. Also many will argue that the professional chart is useless without a densitometer (colorimeter). And they are likely right. For 24 bit color each color must be resolved to about 0.5% to justify the system. You can't do that with your eyes. And you don't really need it for normal photo work, only in professional printing work. > 2) the digital file that was used to generate the reference-chart > > ...and then load the digital file (gif, jpeg, whatever) with any viewer > program and twiddle knobs as necessary until what I see on the screen > matches what I see on the paper. The point is that if you really want quality, there will not be enough knobs to twiddle. You have to define what you need, because there is no end to it. The ICC correction map uses a large dataset to achieve correction. It maps each R,G,B value to another R,G,B value either directly or by interpolation. You are talking about editing a dataset that can be 1MB in size and larger. I have not seen a tool that does this manually but it could be done (likely using bezier curve manipulations in a gui that represents an input/output cartesian space for each color - like gimp uses). I think that proper color correction requires more than that (like NAM) but it may be enough for visual purposes. By more I mean color interdependency especially at high saturation levels. The pigments in the printer ink overlap in absorption spectra and it is necessary to back off certain colors to get accurate shades depending on color mix and on which color gets printed over which. CRT screens have very narrow emission lines which are unable to render certain colors (the human eye integrates them so you see what you want to see but that's not what's there). LCD colors have broader spectra and their white backlights have a wide white spectrum so they have the same problem as the printers (overlap requires backoff). So it's a huge can of worms and it all depends on how much you want to spend and how good it has to be. The way I have shown, to find a chart file as pdf, go to a digital printer and have it printed on the best matte photo paper he has, A4 size (letter), and use it as I have shown will get you as near as possible to what you need for well under $50 and half a day's worth of work. It will also make you perfectly compatible with that digital printer should you ever need it. That's just my opinion. Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 12:46:32 2005 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 15:46:32 +0300 (IDT) Subject: Monitor correction chart? In-Reply-To: <20050808042946.GD12200-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20050807142841.GA1148@waltdnes.org> <42F69A65.70007@sympatico.ca> <20050808042946.GD12200@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: On Mon, 8 Aug 2005, Walter Dnes wrote: > On Sun, Aug 07, 2005 at 07:33:57PM -0400, Stewart C. Russell wrote > >> Is an ITU colour target what you want: >> ? Or do you just want to get the >> gamma of your monitor correct? If so, there are tools like Monica >> that can help: . > > Getting the gamma correct is the main thing. I'll be putting up some > photos at a photo-sharing site, and I want the gamma right. I assume > that my colours aren't totally out to lunch. Imho if the pictures come from a reputable digital camera, then the gamma is already much better than your monitor can ever achieve. Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 13:46:41 2005 From: jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 09:46:41 -0400 Subject: Mission impossible In-Reply-To: References: <42F257A2.5030806@knet.ca> Message-ID: On 8/7/05, Franco Saliola wrote: > On 8/4/05, teddymills wrote: > > > Remember how in Mission Impossible 1, there was a keystroke logger? > > Well not really...but i need to install a keystroke logger on a Linux > > Redhat/Fedora Core server. > > Are you sure you want a keystroke logger? This is not a very nice > thing to do to your users. I'd be mad as hell if someone did this to > me without my knowledge as my passwords, gpg key, financial > information, etc. would be compromised. It may also be illegal, depending on how and why it's done: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20050706.wcompu0706/BNStory/National/?page=rss&id=RTGAM.20050706.wcompu0706 http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/07/07/1354206 -- taa /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 14:02:01 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Mon, 08 Aug 2005 10:02:01 -0400 Subject: Font size under X; question In-Reply-To: <20050808044540.GE12200-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808044540.GE12200@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: Walter Dnes wrote: > I'm running Gentoo linux, with Blackbox as the window manager. I > normally run 1152X864 on a 19" CRT monitor. Working with 2560x1920 > digital photos means Gimp comes up with width and height scaled down to > 33% to fit it into the window; fair enough. I figured that I'd try > 1600x1200, so that the image width and height only need to be scaled > down to 50% to fit. > > Gimp is still bringing up the image at 33%. The font is the same > pixel height as before. A reasonable font at 1152x864 is microscopic > and virtually unreadable at 1600x1200. This isn't Gimp-only. The font > for Blackbox menus and Firefox is also miniscule. I hope there's a > generic setting somewhere to boost font sizes as resolution increases. > What is the process? > Are your fonts at 96dpi? Not sure if this will help you, though it certainly improved things for me moving from Gnome to KDE. Putting the following line in the monitor section of your xorg.conf (not sure about XFree) and restarting X should make your fonts much more legible: DisplaySize 423 318 # 1600x1400 96dpi This line comes from the following: displaysize = /96*25.4 You might also want to use gtf (if you haven't already) to compute an appropriate modeline for your monitor's refresh rate at that resolution. Hope this helps. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 14:11:31 2005 From: ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org (Andrew Hammond) Date: Mon, 08 Aug 2005 10:11:31 -0400 Subject: database vs filesystem performance In-Reply-To: <200508072104.38135.marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508071950.07859.marc@lijour.net> <000801c59bb3$807cf010$6501a8c0@ibm5b4y3a0pgrq> <200508072104.38135.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: <42F76813.10708@ca.afilias.info> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 > I know my question is quite vague. Let me try to throw a little more details. > I am working on an application which pulls data from a cache at a very fast > rate (configurable but it could be up to 3000 times by second) therefore > performance -in terms of speed- is an issue. The data is in itself binary. > Some people suggested to convert this into strings and to store it in the > database (MS-SQL). I heard that databases are not that good with binary data > and also that the filesystem has been designed to handle files efficiently. I > wonder what is best between storing this data in the database (eventually as > string or as a BLOB) or dumping it into a big file (or breaking it in a > sequence of files eventually). The journaling filesystem would make this > reliant to a system crash, right? If your cache will need to handle concurrency issues beyond simple expiration, or it will require multiple or non-trivial indexing, or it will manage relationships between data then it might make sense to use a database (Postgres is pretty good. Avoid MySQL at all costs). Otherwise, just the filesystem should be sufficient. In terms of performance, I've seen impressive results from reiser4. You'd want to test it before you put it into production, obviously. You might be able to tie into the reiser attributes system and get some significant performance improvements. Later in the thread you asked about NTFS. It's quite possibly the most dog-slow filesystem I've ever had the dubious pleasure of encountering. Absent political or marketing reasons which mandate using it, the technical drawbacks of Windows are so severe that I can't imagine anyone seriously recommending it as a development platform. - -- Andrew Hammond 416-673-4138 ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org Database Administrator, Afilias Canada Corp. CB83 2838 4B67 D40F D086 3568 81FC E7E5 27AF 4A9A -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (Darwin) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFC92gTgfzn5SevSpoRAsJgAJ9nkinXG3fb0yTQ8LRWshKJIEapHgCfaOdo 3pY97dmagfoKO7FmYuU5Hf4= =LWJw -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 14:57:13 2005 From: nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ian Zimmerman) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 10:57:13 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again Message-ID: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> I am sorry if this dead horse has been beaten enough already ... Just moved to the area (in 905 actually) and looking for a broadband ISP that is at least not Linux hostile. I have read the entire June-July thread about this. Rogers' blocking of outgoing port 25 would be a problem for me. In that thread, Look seems to be the winner; I went to their page, and I am a bit worried about this: >> Self-Install Most customers install Look UltraFast DSL themselves. With Look's easy-to-use installation kit and our plug & play DSL high-speed modem, you'll be up and running in no time. << >> Your modem will be shipped free in your DSL Installation Kit, which includes: High-speed DSL modem Two free phone filters (retail value of $12) Additional filters available for $6/each Installation software << >> Note: You may be required to have your Windows 95/98/NT 4.0 CD to install Look UltraFast Wireless. We cannot guarantee that the service will work with all types of computers. << I don't have a Windows system at all. People here using Look, have you been able to install it without Windows? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From presidentofthefuture-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 15:05:30 2005 From: presidentofthefuture-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Mike Newman) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 11:05:30 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <17af137805080807575893f2ef-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 8/8/05, Ian Zimmerman wrote: > I don't have a Windows system at all. People here using Look, have > you been able to install it without Windows? I currently have my connection going into a D-Link router, but I also tried it with Debian and both work fine. I can assure you that it uses standard PPPoE. I don't think that they offer USB modems but (just in case) ask for an ethernet-based modem. Basically you get the modem, some filters and a piece of paper with your username and password on it. Put the relevant info into your PPPoE config file, dial in and turn on your firewall! Mike -- Get Firefox - Take back the Web http://www.getfirefox.com/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 15:30:53 2005 From: nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ian Zimmerman) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 11:30:53 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <17af137805080808307733dc2a@mail.gmail.com> On 8/8/05, Mike Newman wrote: > On 8/8/05, Ian Zimmerman wrote: > > I don't have a Windows system at all. People here using Look, have > > you been able to install it without Windows? > I currently have my connection going into a D-Link router, but I also > tried it with Debian and both work fine. I can assure you that it uses > standard PPPoE. I don't think that they offer USB modems but (just in > case) ask for an ethernet-based modem. > Basically you get the modem, some filters and a piece of paper with > your username and password on it. Put the relevant info into your > PPPoE config file, dial in and turn on your firewall! What does the "installation software" in the package do, then? I confess to not having used PPPoE directly before. The routers I was connected to probably used it, but someone else always configured the routers. I plan to use one of those pointy-headed Linksys wireless routers; unfortunately it's still with the movers so I can't tell you the exact number; but I think there's only one B model, so that's the one. Can it handle this type of up-link? You say "dial in", but surely your router (and mine) doesn't know how to dial phone numbers? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 15:42:41 2005 From: clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (CLIFFORD ILKAY) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 11:42:41 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <17af137805080807575893f2ef-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200508081142.42012.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> On August 8, 2005 10:57, Ian Zimmerman wrote: > I am sorry if this dead horse has been beaten enough already ... > > Just moved to the area (in 905 actually) and looking for a > broadband ISP that is at least not Linux hostile. > > I have read the entire June-July thread about this. > Rogers' blocking of outgoing port 25 would be a problem for me. [snip] If Rogers blocking port 25 is a problem for you, then your choices should be limited to those ISPs that will provide you with a static IP address that is not on a RBL and quite likely one that will provide a reverse DNS that will resolve to the domain name you want to use. Even with Rogers Business High Speed, where port 25 was not blocked last time I checked, using a local SMTP server would result in messages being bounced or blocked by the anti spam measures of the ISPs of some of the recipients. The problem is that some RBLs classify the Rogers IP addresses as being on IP blocks assigned to dial up users. -- Regards, Clifford Ilkay Dinamis Corporation 3266 Yonge Street, Suite 1419 Toronto, ON Canada M4N 3P6 +1 416-410-3326 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 15:49:20 2005 From: nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ian Zimmerman) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 11:49:20 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <200508081142.42012.clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> <200508081142.42012.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> Message-ID: <17af1378050808084929e9491f@mail.gmail.com> On 8/8/05, CLIFFORD ILKAY wrote: > On August 8, 2005 10:57, Ian Zimmerman wrote: > > I am sorry if this dead horse has been beaten enough already ... > > > > Just moved to the area (in 905 actually) and looking for a > > broadband ISP that is at least not Linux hostile. > > > > I have read the entire June-July thread about this. > > Rogers' blocking of outgoing port 25 would be a problem for me. > [snip] > > If Rogers blocking port 25 is a problem for you, then your choices > should be limited to those ISPs that will provide you with a static > IP address that is not on a RBL and quite likely one that will > provide a reverse DNS that will resolve to the domain name you want > to use. Even with Rogers Business High Speed, where port 25 was not > blocked last time I checked, using a local SMTP server would result > in messages being bounced or blocked by the anti spam measures of the > ISPs of some of the recipients. The problem is that some RBLs > classify the Rogers IP addresses as being on IP blocks assigned to > dial up users. No, I don't connect directly to recip's MX addresses; I just want to use a smarthost different from Rogers', one that trusts me. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 15:54:24 2005 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 11:54:24 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <17af137805080808307733dc2a-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> <17af137805080808307733dc2a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050808155424.GA3867@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> On Mon, Aug 08, 2005 at 11:30:53AM -0400, Ian Zimmerman wrote: >What does the "installation software" in the package do, then? It makes sure that an idiot Windoze box can speak PPPoE. >I confess to not having used PPPoE directly before. The routers I was >connected to probably used it, but someone else always configured the routers. >I plan to use one of those pointy-headed Linksys wireless routers; unfortunately >it's still with the movers so I can't tell you the exact number; but I >think there's >only one B model, so that's the one. Can it handle this type of up-link? It will almost certainly be able to handle this link. I have never connected a Linux box to a modem - my firewall/router handles such things for me. Yours should too. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 15:57:57 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 11:57:57 -0400 Subject: video-audio out of sync In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 8/7/05, Jamon Camisso wrote: > Steve wrote: > > Hi, > > > > I just installed Ubuntu 5.04 a few days ago. Everything seems great > > except for when playing mpeg video. Originally the video itself was > > choppy using totem-gstreamer, then I changed to totem-xine and the > > video is now smooth. However it is out of sync with the audio (about > > 1/2 second, I think). > > > > I never had this problem in Fedora. > > > > I'm using an Asus A7N8X-X board with AMD 2500+ & 512MB RAM. I'm using > > the onboard sound with this motherboard. > > > > Any help would be appreciated... I've spent hours searching the net > > and haven't found a solution yet. > > > > Thanks. > > > > -Steve. > > Do you have dma enabled on your disc/drive? It makes a difference for > DVD playback. Not sure about playing mpegs from hdd. I'm pretty sure > Ubuntu has dma disabled by default for cd/dvd drives. > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > I have this problem even when watching an MPEG from the hard drive. And there is no jittering in the video... it plays smooth, just that the audio is delayed. I've upgraded to the Ubuntu Nvidia video driver as well. Do you think I should install the Nvidia NForce2 motherboard driver too? -- Mozilla Firefox -rediscover the web- http://www.mozilla.org/products/firefox/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 16:18:44 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Mon, 08 Aug 2005 12:18:44 -0400 Subject: Mission impossible In-Reply-To: References: <42F257A2.5030806@knet.ca> Message-ID: <42F785E4.3040407@rogers.com> Taavi Burns wrote: > On 8/7/05, Franco Saliola wrote: >>On 8/4/05, teddymills wrote: >> >>>Remember how in Mission Impossible 1, there was a keystroke logger? >>>Well not really...but i need to install a keystroke logger on a Linux >>>Redhat/Fedora Core server. >>Are you sure you want a keystroke logger? This is not a very nice >>thing to do to your users. I'd be mad as hell if someone did this to >>me without my knowledge as my passwords, gpg key, financial >>information, etc. would be compromised. > > It may also be illegal, depending on how and why it's done: > http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20050706.wcompu0706/BNStory/National/?page=rss&id=RTGAM.20050706.wcompu0706 > http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/07/07/1354206 > How are you supposed to read that article? When I try to read the full article, I'm taken to a page, where I can buy it. I only want to read it, not buy it. And yes, I am registered. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 16:44:54 2005 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Mon, 08 Aug 2005 12:44:54 -0400 Subject: consultant congracation Message-ID: <42F78C06.4080304@sympatico.ca> Things are cooking, here at linuxcaffe, and we've had considerable interest in consulting services. The www.linuxcaffe.ca website is finally shaping up and I would like to offer consultants pages as well as directing foot traffic to available tech talent. I'd like to host an evening of discussion with any freelance sysadmin with an opinion. How about Tuesday, Aug 16, 7pm, here, at linuxcaffe. (see website for location) How's that for you ? RSVP, k ? djp -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 17:03:08 2005 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Mon, 08 Aug 2005 13:03:08 -0400 Subject: consultant congregation In-Reply-To: <42F78C9B.5050604-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <42F78C06.4080304@sympatico.ca> <42F78C9B.5050604@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <42F7904C.80808@sympatico.ca> David J Patrick wrote: >don't send the spelling police; congregation > > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 17:05:18 2005 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 13:05:18 -0400 Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting Message-ID: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> My desktop machine is showing signs of flakiness, and I'm looking for advice as to how I should hunt the culprit(s). Symptom: When I boot I'll get a sad beep and a funny hard drive noise, and then the BIOS will fail to detect one of my hard drives (a relatively new WD 40G (IDE, slave)) which incidently is where / and /usr live. So I get a boot prompt, and then a complaint about the root dive not being present. Most times, a reboot and everything will come up fine. If I enter the BIOS, I notice a slight delay before the BIOS can see the drive. The same behavior happens if the BIOS auto-detects the drive or if I preset the cable to expect an IDE HD. I haven't had a chance to run fsck on the drive (I'll boot up from Knoppix and do that tonight), but I'm looking for advice as to how to isolate my problem without throwing a lot of money into buying replacement parts to swap around in testing. I don't have a spare HD kicking around right now, nor a motherboard. The IDE cables seem to be well seated. Any input is appreciated. Thanks. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 17:12:25 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Mon, 08 Aug 2005 13:12:25 -0400 Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: <20050808170518.GA4161-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: William O'Higgins wrote: > Symptom: When I boot I'll get a sad beep and a funny hard drive noise, > and then the BIOS will fail to detect one of my hard drives (a > relatively new WD 40G (IDE, slave)) which incidently is where / and /usr > live. So I get a boot prompt, and then a complaint about the root dive > not being present. Most times, a reboot and everything will come up > fine. Sounds like a powersupply problem. If you poweroff and the problem always occurs when restarting but not when rebooting I'd say that power would be the first thing to check. > If I enter the BIOS, I notice a slight delay before the BIOS can see the > drive. The same behavior happens if the BIOS auto-detects the drive or > if I preset the cable to expect an IDE HD. > Is this entering the BIOS after a reboot or a cold start? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 17:19:20 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 13:19:20 -0400 Subject: video-audio out of sync In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050808171920.GN6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Sat, Aug 06, 2005 at 10:19:50PM -0400, Steve wrote: > I just installed Ubuntu 5.04 a few days ago. Everything seems great > except for when playing mpeg video. Originally the video itself was > choppy using totem-gstreamer, then I changed to totem-xine and the > video is now smooth. However it is out of sync with the audio (about > 1/2 second, I think). > > I never had this problem in Fedora. > > I'm using an Asus A7N8X-X board with AMD 2500+ & 512MB RAM. I'm using > the onboard sound with this motherboard. > > Any help would be appreciated... I've spent hours searching the net > and haven't found a solution yet. Are you using OSS or ALSA drivers? Does mplayer work better (I find it to be the most reliable media player on Linux). Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 17:17:35 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 13:17:35 -0400 Subject: Converting DVD to mpeg with Linux In-Reply-To: <200508052217.16127.marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508052217.16127.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: <20050808171734.GM6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Aug 05, 2005 at 10:17:16PM -0400, Marc Lijour wrote: > does anybody know of a tool to convert a DVD (.vob files) to mpeg or avi...? transcode should do fine. Various tools can do it. THey are just mpeg2 streams, although split into 1GB pieces. Getting them off a commercial DVD requires other tools. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 17:29:28 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 13:29:28 -0400 Subject: Monitor correction chart? In-Reply-To: <20050807142841.GA1148-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20050807142841.GA1148@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <20050808172928.GO6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Sun, Aug 07, 2005 at 10:28:41AM -0400, Walter Dnes wrote: > I don't know whether this question belongs on a computer group or a > digital photography group, but here goes. > > Having recently bought a digital camera, I'll admit to taking the > (ahem) occasional (cough cough) not-quite-perfect picture that needs > some touching-up. I'm starting to play around with GIMP, and getting > half-decent at fixing up under-exposed shots. I can make it look good > on *MY* computer monitor. > > This raises the question of whether there is a "test pattern" for > monitors like http://www.high-techproductions.com/colorbars.htm for TV. > You'd need a paper printout and a digital file. Getting the paper > printout right might be a bit expensive. Hmm, I think personally I might try calibrating against a DVD with color bars and some grey patterns for setting the brightness. That's how I do the TV, might work for the computer, although TV and computers don't necesarily want the same thing. I remember Adobe has some program with photoshop for setting up the screen reasonbly well I think, not sure what something similar would be. Can't control what other people's monitors are set to of course, but that is quite literally their problem and there is nothing you can do about it. Perhaps one of these would help you: kgamma displaycalibrator.app > Talking about computer monitors in general, is it just me, or has > anyone else noticed that LCD displays seem to default to being *DAMN* > bright? When I got one at work, the first thing I did was to crank the > brightness way down. They like advertising high contrast ratios. That probably requries a crazy maximum brightness to pull off. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 17:31:36 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 13:31:36 -0400 Subject: Monitor correction chart? In-Reply-To: References: <20050807142841.GA1148@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <20050808173136.GP6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Sun, Aug 07, 2005 at 08:44:18PM +0300, Peter wrote: > There are ICCM color profiles for monitors. I am almost sure that higher > end X servers support this. But I have seen no trace of that in XFree86. > > LCD monitors very rarely manage to render colors with sufficient > precision for photo work. Move your head a little and the colors shift. Maybe liblcms would work? After all it is more of an application thing than an X server thing. Package: liblcms-utils Priority: optional Section: utils Installed-Size: 152 Maintainer: Shiju p. Nair Architecture: i386 Source: lcms Version: 1.13-1 Depends: libc6 (>= 2.3.2.ds1-4), libjpeg62, liblcms1 (>= 1.08-1), libtiff4, zlib1g (>= 1:1.2.1) Filename: pool/main/l/lcms/liblcms-utils_1.13-1_i386.deb Size: 37672 MD5sum: 2f8cbea7e6ab2a7a978c31bf28a782e7 Description: Color management library (Additional utilities) lcms is a standalone CMM engine, which deals with the color management. It implements a fast transformation between ICC profiles. The intention of it is to be portable across several platforms. This package contains additional utilities(jpegicc and tifficc) which comes with lcms. Tag: role::sw-utility Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 17:37:20 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 13:37:20 -0400 Subject: database vs filesystem performance In-Reply-To: <200508071950.07859.marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508071950.07859.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: <20050808173720.GQ6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Sun, Aug 07, 2005 at 07:50:07PM -0400, Marc Lijour wrote: > Does somebody know the compared performance of the filesystem against a RDBMS? Performance at doing what? Apples:Oranges. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 17:46:32 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 13:46:32 -0400 Subject: Which DVD player? In-Reply-To: <20050808005252.GA2041-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808005252.GA2041@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <20050808174632.GR6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Sun, Aug 07, 2005 at 08:52:52PM -0400, William Park wrote: > Which DVD player do you use to view a DVD movie on Linux? I'm afraid I > am total newbie in this matter. I use mplayer. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 17:59:04 2005 From: jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 13:59:04 -0400 Subject: Mission impossible In-Reply-To: <42F785E4.3040407-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <42F257A2.5030806@knet.ca> <42F785E4.3040407@rogers.com> Message-ID: On 8/8/05, James Knott wrote: > Taavi Burns wrote: > > It may also be illegal, depending on how and why it's done: > > http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20050706.wcompu0706/BNStory/National/?page=rss&id=RTGAM.20050706.wcompu0706 > > http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/07/07/1354206 > > > > How are you supposed to read that article? When I try to read the full > article, I'm taken to a page, where I can buy it. I only want to read > it, not buy it. And yes, I am registered. Doh. The fulltext was free when the article came out. I didn't notice the "register and buy" stuff below it; I saw the first couple of paragraphs off of Google and thought I'd hit it. The slashdot article is probably sufficient to get the gist of it. Other than that...google some more (news.google.com) or hit up your local library? -- taa /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 18:17:22 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 14:17:22 -0400 Subject: Which DVD player? In-Reply-To: <20050808005252.GA2041-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808005252.GA2041@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <20050808181722.GA2148@node1.opengeometry.net> On Sun, Aug 07, 2005 at 08:52:52PM -0400, William Park wrote: > Which DVD player do you use to view a DVD movie on Linux? I'm afraid I > am total newbie in this matter. I didn't know that Slackware already includes 'xine' package. But, I have encountered another problem... I have Samsung DVD and Via Apollo Pro 133A (Abit VP6 dual-P3). This motherboard is practically new, and all my RAMs are good (checked with www.memtest86.com over-night). When I try to run 'xine' (ie. xine -p dvd:/), I get an infinite loop of /var/log/syslog: hdc: irq timeout: status=0xd0 { Busy } ide: failed opcode was: unknown hdc: ATAPI reset complete end_request: I/O error, dev hdc, sector 299056 Buffer I/O error on device hdc, logical block 37382 /var/log/messages: ide-cd: cmd 0x28 timed out which repeat every minute. Has anyone encountered this before? A DVD drive without DMA is pretty useless. :-( -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 18:18:47 2005 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 14:18:47 -0400 Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: <42F79279.2040209-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <42F79279.2040209@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <20050808181847.GA4439@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> On Mon, Aug 08, 2005 at 01:12:25PM -0400, Jamon Camisso wrote: >William O'Higgins wrote: > > Symptom: When I boot I'll get a sad beep and a funny hard drive noise, >>and then the BIOS will fail to detect one of my hard drives (a >>relatively new WD 40G (IDE, slave)) which incidently is where / and /usr >>live. So I get a boot prompt, and then a complaint about the root dive >>not being present. Most times, a reboot and everything will come up >>fine. > >Sounds like a powersupply problem. If you poweroff and the problem >always occurs when restarting but not when rebooting I'd say that power >would be the first thing to check. Good idea. If the machine has been up for several hours it does not seem to want to find the HD even after reboot - but an hour later it comes up just fine. >>If I enter the BIOS, I notice a slight delay before the BIOS can see the >>drive. The same behavior happens if the BIOS auto-detects the drive or >>if I preset the cable to expect an IDE HD. >> > >Is this entering the BIOS after a reboot or a cold start? It doesn't matter - the machine rarely comes up cleanly on the first try, warm or cold. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 18:21:38 2005 From: clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (CLIFFORD ILKAY) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 14:21:38 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <17af1378050808084929e9491f-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> <200508081142.42012.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af1378050808084929e9491f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200508081421.39109.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> On August 8, 2005 11:49, Ian Zimmerman wrote: > On 8/8/05, CLIFFORD ILKAY wrote: > > On August 8, 2005 10:57, Ian Zimmerman wrote: > > > I am sorry if this dead horse has been beaten enough already > > > ... > > > > > > Just moved to the area (in 905 actually) and looking for a > > > broadband ISP that is at least not Linux hostile. > > > > > > I have read the entire June-July thread about this. > > > Rogers' blocking of outgoing port 25 would be a problem for me. > > > > [snip] > > > > If Rogers blocking port 25 is a problem for you, then your > > choices should be limited to those ISPs that will provide you > > with a static IP address that is not on a RBL and quite likely > > one that will provide a reverse DNS that will resolve to the > > domain name you want to use. Even with Rogers Business High > > Speed, where port 25 was not blocked last time I checked, using a > > local SMTP server would result in messages being bounced or > > blocked by the anti spam measures of the ISPs of some of the > > recipients. The problem is that some RBLs classify the Rogers IP > > addresses as being on IP blocks assigned to dial up users. > > No, I don't connect directly to recip's MX addresses; I just want > to use a smarthost different from Rogers', one that trusts me. Then blockage on port 25 should not be a problem at all. You can connect on another port or tunnel traffic for port 25 across ssh or ipsec. -- Regards, Clifford Ilkay Dinamis Corporation 3266 Yonge Street, Suite 1419 Toronto, ON Canada M4N 3P6 +1 416-410-3326 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 18:30:08 2005 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 14:30:08 -0400 (EDT) Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: <20050808181847.GA4439-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <42F79279.2040209@utoronto.ca> <20050808181847.GA4439@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: On Mon, 8 Aug 2005, William O'Higgins wrote: > Good idea. If the machine has been up for several hours it does not > seem to want to find the HD even after reboot - but an hour later it > comes up just fine. I had a problem very similar to this although in my case it would sometimes fail on the memory test and other times it would hang during drive detection. I thought the case might have a short circuit that was only appearing when the board was heated (ie, running for a while). After investigating various components and options it turned out to be a BIOS bug. One flash and the problem went away. When I first started looking into the problem the fixed BIOS had not been released of course - that only came later :) This was an Asus A7V m/b btw. Rob -- Robert Brockway B.Sc. Phone: +1-416-669-3073 Senior Technical Consultant Email: support-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Web: www.opentrend.net We are open 24x7x365 for technical support. Call us in a crisis. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 18:57:49 2005 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 14:57:49 -0400 Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <42F79279.2040209@utoronto.ca> <20050808181847.GA4439@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <20050808185749.GA4579@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> On Mon, Aug 08, 2005 at 02:30:08PM -0400, Robert Brockway wrote: >On Mon, 8 Aug 2005, William O'Higgins wrote: > >> Good idea. If the machine has been up for several hours it does not >> seem to want to find the HD even after reboot - but an hour later it >> comes up just fine. > >I had a problem very similar to this although in my case it would >sometimes fail on the memory test and other times it would hang during >drive detection. I thought the case might have a short circuit that was >only appearing when the board was heated (ie, running for a while). > >After investigating various components and options it turned out to be a >BIOS bug. One flash and the problem went away. When I first started >looking into the problem the fixed BIOS had not been released of course - >that only came later :) > >This was an Asus A7V m/b btw. I'm pretty sure that this isn't my problem - the board has been running nicely for at least a year now. Still, worth looking into. The MB is an Asus A7V8X-X. Thanks for the input. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From kcozens-qazKcTl6WRFWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 18:58:39 2005 From: kcozens-qazKcTl6WRFWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (Kevin Cozens) Date: Mon, 08 Aug 2005 14:58:39 -0400 Subject: Which DVD player? In-Reply-To: <20050808005252.GA2041-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808005252.GA2041@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <42F7AB5F.6090307@interlog.com> William Park wrote: > Which DVD player do you use to view a DVD movie on Linux? I'm afraid I > am total newbie in this matter. A few people have mentioned mplayer. I recently discovered it had menu items for playing DVDs but having tried it just now on a DVD I had to look at, I discovered it didn't show me the menu screen on the DVD. For DVD playback under Linux I have been using ogle originally with the ogle_gui front end but now I use the much nicer goggles front end. Information about the goggles front end can be found at: http://www.fifthplanet.net/goggles.html -- Cheers! Kevin. http://www.interlog.com/~kcozens/ |"What are we going to do today, Borg?" Owner of Elecraft K2 #2172 |"Same thing we always do, Pinkutus: | Try to assimilate the world!" #include | -Pinkutus & the Borg -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tleslie-RBVUpeUoHUc at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 19:24:13 2005 From: tleslie-RBVUpeUoHUc at public.gmane.org (ted leslie) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 15:24:13 -0400 Subject: [good]Re: Which DVD player? In-Reply-To: <20050808181722.GA2148-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808005252.GA2041@node1.opengeometry.net> <20050808181722.GA2148@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <20050808192413.GB2907@localhost> this often happens when you are not using a specific chipset driver in the kernel for your IDE instead your using a default. in your dmesg or boot up loads, does it say it identified the chip set and its ok? or does't it say, "unknown" this that and the other, I have had to do a kernel driver selection for ide/chipset/bridge drivers for almost every mother board i have ever bought, so i wouldn;t be surprized if this was your issue. there is probably a "via" chip set selection in the kernel you need to enable and recompile. Also, if your kernel is too old? I have a mother board that unless I have 2.6.9+ i have a similar issue to what you have, and 2.6.9 is pretty recent! -tl On Mon, Aug 08, 2005 at 02:17:22PM -0400, William Park wrote: > On Sun, Aug 07, 2005 at 08:52:52PM -0400, William Park wrote: > > Which DVD player do you use to view a DVD movie on Linux? I'm afraid I > > am total newbie in this matter. > > I didn't know that Slackware already includes 'xine' package. But, I > have encountered another problem... > > I have Samsung DVD and Via Apollo Pro 133A (Abit VP6 dual-P3). This > motherboard is practically new, and all my RAMs are good (checked with > www.memtest86.com over-night). > > When I try to run 'xine' (ie. xine -p dvd:/), I get an infinite loop of > > /var/log/syslog: > hdc: irq timeout: status=0xd0 { Busy } > ide: failed opcode was: unknown > hdc: ATAPI reset complete > end_request: I/O error, dev hdc, sector 299056 > Buffer I/O error on device hdc, logical block 37382 > > /var/log/messages: > ide-cd: cmd 0x28 timed out > > which repeat every minute. > > Has anyone encountered this before? A DVD drive without DMA is pretty > useless. :-( > > -- > William Park , Toronto, Canada > ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive > http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html > BashDiff: Super Bash shell > http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 19:56:31 2005 From: nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ian Zimmerman) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 15:56:31 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <200508081421.39109.clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> <200508081142.42012.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af1378050808084929e9491f@mail.gmail.com> <200508081421.39109.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> Message-ID: <17af13780508081256224e2435@mail.gmail.com> On 8/8/05, CLIFFORD ILKAY wrote: > On August 8, 2005 11:49, Ian Zimmerman wrote: > > On 8/8/05, CLIFFORD ILKAY wrote: > > > On August 8, 2005 10:57, Ian Zimmerman wrote: > > > > I am sorry if this dead horse has been beaten enough already > > > > ... > > > > > > > > Just moved to the area (in 905 actually) and looking for a > > > > broadband ISP that is at least not Linux hostile. > > > > > > > > I have read the entire June-July thread about this. > > > > Rogers' blocking of outgoing port 25 would be a problem for me. > > > > > > [snip] > > > > > > If Rogers blocking port 25 is a problem for you, then your > > > choices should be limited to those ISPs that will provide you > > > with a static IP address that is not on a RBL and quite likely > > > one that will provide a reverse DNS that will resolve to the > > > domain name you want to use. Even with Rogers Business High > > > Speed, where port 25 was not blocked last time I checked, using a > > > local SMTP server would result in messages being bounced or > > > blocked by the anti spam measures of the ISPs of some of the > > > recipients. The problem is that some RBLs classify the Rogers IP > > > addresses as being on IP blocks assigned to dial up users. > > > > No, I don't connect directly to recip's MX addresses; I just want > > to use a smarthost different from Rogers', one that trusts me. > > Then blockage on port 25 should not be a problem at all. You can > connect on another port or tunnel traffic for port 25 across ssh or > ipsec. Okay, maybe. Does anyone know if they block outgoing 465 or 587? Not likely? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 20:01:01 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Mon, 08 Aug 2005 16:01:01 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <17af13780508081256224e2435-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> <200508081142.42012.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af1378050808084929e9491f@mail.gmail.com> <200508081421.39109.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af13780508081256224e2435@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <42F7B9FD.4020800@rogers.com> Ian Zimmerman wrote: > Okay, maybe. Does anyone know if they block outgoing 465 or 587? > Not likely? > http://www.rogershelp.com/yahoo/mail/smtp.html#one -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 20:13:29 2005 From: nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ian Zimmerman) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 16:13:29 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <42F7B9FD.4020800-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> <200508081142.42012.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af1378050808084929e9491f@mail.gmail.com> <200508081421.39109.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af13780508081256224e2435@mail.gmail.com> <42F7B9FD.4020800@rogers.com> Message-ID: <17af1378050808131316fa3810@mail.gmail.com> On 8/8/05, James Knott wrote: > Ian Zimmerman wrote: > > > Okay, maybe. Does anyone know if they block outgoing 465 or 587? > > Not likely? > > > http://www.rogershelp.com/yahoo/mail/smtp.html#one I'm afraid this answers a different question - those are instructions from users outside Rogers network for connecting to these ports on Rogers servers. My question is about the opposite situation. If I get Rogers ISP, will I be able to connect to ports 465 and 587 on OTHER servers (such as smtp.gmail.com)? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 20:15:18 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 16:15:18 -0400 Subject: Which DVD player? In-Reply-To: <20050808192413.GB2907@localhost> References: <20050808005252.GA2041@node1.opengeometry.net> <20050808181722.GA2148@node1.opengeometry.net> <20050808192413.GB2907@localhost> Message-ID: <20050808201518.GA2737@node1.opengeometry.net> On Mon, Aug 08, 2005 at 03:24:13PM -0400, ted leslie wrote: > this often happens when you are not using a specific chipset driver in > the kernel for your IDE instead your using a default. in your dmesg > or boot up loads, does it say it identified the chip set and its ok? > or does't it say, "unknown" this that and the other, > > I have had to do a kernel driver selection for ide/chipset/bridge What do you mean by "selecting bridge"? I'm using a kernel with most IDE chipsets compiled in. # # ATA/ATAPI/MFM/RLL support # CONFIG_IDE=y CONFIG_BLK_DEV_IDE=y # # Please see Documentation/ide.txt for help/info on IDE drives # # CONFIG_BLK_DEV_IDE_SATA is not set # CONFIG_BLK_DEV_HD_IDE is not set CONFIG_BLK_DEV_IDEDISK=y # CONFIG_IDEDISK_MULTI_MODE is not set CONFIG_BLK_DEV_IDECD=m CONFIG_BLK_DEV_IDEFLOPPY=m # CONFIG_BLK_DEV_IDESCSI is not set # CONFIG_IDE_TASK_IOCTL is not set # # IDE chipset support/bugfixes # CONFIG_IDE_GENERIC=y # CONFIG_BLK_DEV_CMD640 is not set CONFIG_BLK_DEV_IDEPNP=y CONFIG_BLK_DEV_IDEPCI=y CONFIG_IDEPCI_SHARE_IRQ=y # CONFIG_BLK_DEV_OFFBOARD is not set CONFIG_BLK_DEV_GENERIC=y # CONFIG_BLK_DEV_RZ1000 is not set CONFIG_BLK_DEV_IDEDMA_PCI=y # CONFIG_BLK_DEV_IDEDMA_FORCED is not set CONFIG_IDEDMA_PCI_AUTO=y # CONFIG_IDEDMA_ONLYDISK is not set CONFIG_BLK_DEV_AEC62XX=y CONFIG_BLK_DEV_ALI15X3=y # CONFIG_WDC_ALI15X3 is not set CONFIG_BLK_DEV_AMD74XX=y CONFIG_BLK_DEV_ATIIXP=y CONFIG_BLK_DEV_CMD64X=y CONFIG_BLK_DEV_TRIFLEX=y CONFIG_BLK_DEV_CY82C693=y CONFIG_BLK_DEV_CS5530=y CONFIG_BLK_DEV_HPT34X=y CONFIG_BLK_DEV_HPT366=y CONFIG_BLK_DEV_SC1200=y CONFIG_BLK_DEV_PIIX=y CONFIG_BLK_DEV_IT821X=y CONFIG_BLK_DEV_NS87415=y CONFIG_BLK_DEV_PDC202XX_OLD=y CONFIG_PDC202XX_BURST=y CONFIG_BLK_DEV_PDC202XX_NEW=y CONFIG_PDC202XX_FORCE=y CONFIG_BLK_DEV_SVWKS=y CONFIG_BLK_DEV_SIIMAGE=y CONFIG_BLK_DEV_SIS5513=y CONFIG_BLK_DEV_SLC90E66=y CONFIG_BLK_DEV_TRM290=y CONFIG_BLK_DEV_VIA82CXXX=y # CONFIG_IDE_ARM is not set CONFIG_BLK_DEV_IDEDMA=y # CONFIG_IDEDMA_IVB is not set CONFIG_IDEDMA_AUTO=y # CONFIG_BLK_DEV_HD is not set For my motheroboard, only CONFIG_BLK_DEV_HPT366=y CONFIG_BLK_DEV_VIA82CXXX=y would be relevant. But, it detects Via chipset correctly on boot. > drivers for almost every mother board i have ever bought, so i > wouldn;t be surprized if this was your issue. there is probably a > "via" chip set selection in the kernel you need to enable and > recompile. Also, if your kernel is too old? I have a mother board > that unless I have 2.6.9+ i have a similar issue to what you have, and > 2.6.9 is pretty recent! Mine is 2.6.13-rc4. I'll recompile with only stuffs that I need. > On Mon, Aug 08, 2005 at 02:17:22PM -0400, William Park wrote: > > I have Samsung DVD and Via Apollo Pro 133A (Abit VP6 dual-P3). This > > motherboard is practically new, and all my RAMs are good (checked with > > www.memtest86.com over-night). > > > > When I try to run 'xine' (ie. xine -p dvd:/), I get an infinite loop of ... > > ide-cd: cmd 0x28 timed out ... > > which repeat every minute. -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 20:17:21 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 16:17:21 -0400 Subject: Which DVD player? In-Reply-To: <20050808181722.GA2148-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808005252.GA2041@node1.opengeometry.net> <20050808181722.GA2148@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <20050808201721.GS6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Mon, Aug 08, 2005 at 02:17:22PM -0400, William Park wrote: > I didn't know that Slackware already includes 'xine' package. But, I > have encountered another problem... > > I have Samsung DVD and Via Apollo Pro 133A (Abit VP6 dual-P3). This > motherboard is practically new, and all my RAMs are good (checked with > www.memtest86.com over-night). > > When I try to run 'xine' (ie. xine -p dvd:/), I get an infinite loop of > > /var/log/syslog: > hdc: irq timeout: status=0xd0 { Busy } > ide: failed opcode was: unknown > hdc: ATAPI reset complete > end_request: I/O error, dev hdc, sector 299056 > Buffer I/O error on device hdc, logical block 37382 > > /var/log/messages: > ide-cd: cmd 0x28 timed out > > which repeat every minute. > > Has anyone encountered this before? A DVD drive without DMA is pretty > useless. :-( Is DMA enabled or not on the drive right now? Any chance it is CSS region coding stuff related? Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 20:23:01 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 16:23:01 -0400 Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: <20050808185749.GA4579-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <42F79279.2040209@utoronto.ca> <20050808181847.GA4439@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050808185749.GA4579@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <20050808202301.GT6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Mon, Aug 08, 2005 at 02:57:49PM -0400, William O'Higgins wrote: > I'm pretty sure that this isn't my problem - the board has been running > nicely for at least a year now. Still, worth looking into. The MB is > an Asus A7V8X-X. Thanks for the input. Maybe the controller on the drive is failing and being hot makes it fail more often. An hour would be long enough to cool off. A 40GB is not usually new anymore. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fcsoft-3Emkkp+1Olsmp8TqCH86vg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 20:43:42 2005 From: fcsoft-3Emkkp+1Olsmp8TqCH86vg at public.gmane.org (bob) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 16:43:42 -0400 Subject: some demo code you can try Message-ID: <20050808204401.A98A31BB010@outbox.allstream.net> Some of you may have attended our presentation at KWLUG back in May. Graham (the engineer at IO Anywhere) has informed me that the latest IOA box installed at the "Try Me" tab on the IOA webpage (http://www.io-anywhere.ca) is their microIOA. ? ? This has been setup to read a temperature in their offices in Kitchener. This microIOA box is also accessable via the SIMPL protocol (https://sourceforge.net/projects/simpl) so you can actually write local code to read this temperature across the Internet. For the demo code below to run you'll need to be certain to have the following packages installed on your Linux box: a) Tcl/Tk b) SIMPL c) IOA library (http://www.allstream.net/~fcsoft/ioanywhere) b) and c) are very basic source tarballs that require that you create a couple of environment variables to allow them to operate. You can check out lesson #12 at for more info on how to do this: ????????http://www.icanprogram.com/34ux/main.html To get this demo to work all you need to do is run the SIMPL network surrogate processes as they are described in the lesson ?(you'll may need to open up ports 8000-8002) . Once these are up and running you should be able to run the program below as: ????????wish ? ?whateveryoucalledit.tcl As you can see this code is really very small, ? which is testimony to the powerful encapsulation offered by the SIMPL library itself. Have fun. bob PS. SIMPL has Python hooks built into it. ? ? I'd love to see someone create the equivalent Python demo. ============= code snip starts here ================ #!/usr/bin/wish #================================================= # demo script for temperature reading # version 1 #================================================= set this "kwlug" set TRACE_MASK(MISC) ???0x10 set logMask 0xff set myparam(temp.value) 0x0 set myparam(temp.label) .label set myparam(temp.button) .ioa lappend auto_path $env(SIMPL_HOME)/lib lappend auto_path $env(IOANYWHERE_HOME)/library/lib package require Fctclx package require ioalib #======================================== # read the temperature #======================================== proc readTemp { } { global myparam read_tc_IOA 1 2 retVal binary scan $retVal s1 mytemp $myparam(temp.label) config -text [format "%d C" $mytemp ] } ;#end readTemp #============================================ # main #============================================ wm geometry . 200x100+200+0 wm title . "Temperature Demo" wm resizable . 0 0 label $myparam(temp.label) -text "0 C" place $myparam(temp.label) -x 40 -y 20 button $myparam(temp.button) -text "grab temperature" -command [list readTemp] place $myparam(temp.button) -x 40 -y 40 button .quit -text Quit -command {set x 1} place .quit -x 150 -y 75 name_attach KWLUG set loggerID [name_locate LOGGER] #init_IOA BOBS init_IOA 65.48.172.249:IOA_temperature vwait x name_detach exit -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 20:54:03 2005 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 23:54:03 +0300 (IDT) Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: <20050808170518.GA4161-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: Turn on smart and look at the log. My hunch is it will be lit red like a nice sunset. You can run smartctl on the drive from external boot media (e.g. knoppix live cd). Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 20:58:50 2005 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 23:58:50 +0300 (IDT) Subject: Monitor correction chart? In-Reply-To: <20050808173136.GP6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050807142841.GA1148@waltdnes.org> <20050808173136.GP6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: On Mon, 8 Aug 2005, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > After all it is more of an application thing than an X server thing. In fact you can solve it once for the server or 1000 times for each application. So going for the server is more sane, but for occasional use application-based calibration should work fine. > Package: liblcms-utils That's a good idea but I would like to see how easy it is to use. The way I remember the little X11 programming I did adding more complexity to the API is not a good idea. I mean, correcting a colormap would work, but if you use 24 bit color the color map will have inetresting size and speed issues. Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 21:11:58 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Mon, 08 Aug 2005 17:11:58 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <17af1378050808131316fa3810-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> <200508081142.42012.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af1378050808084929e9491f@mail.gmail.com> <200508081421.39109.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af13780508081256224e2435@mail.gmail.com> <42F7B9FD.4020800@rogers.com> <17af1378050808131316fa3810@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <42F7CA9E.503@rogers.com> Ian Zimmerman wrote: > On 8/8/05, James Knott wrote: >>Ian Zimmerman wrote: >> >>>Okay, maybe. Does anyone know if they block outgoing 465 or 587? >>>Not likely? >>> >>http://www.rogershelp.com/yahoo/mail/smtp.html#one > > I'm afraid this answers a different question - those are instructions > from users outside > Rogers network for connecting to these ports on Rogers servers. My question is > about the opposite situation. If I get Rogers ISP, will I be able to > connect to ports > 465 and 587 on OTHER servers (such as smtp.gmail.com)? One might presume that if they allow it in one direction, they'd also do so in the reverse. However, I thought I'd try an experiment. I used my notebook computer to access a dial up account. I then tried to telent to the notebook's IP, using port numbers 465 and 587. Using Ethereal, I was able to see both attempts, so it's apparent that Rogers does not block outgoing connections to those ports. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 21:23:19 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Mon, 08 Aug 2005 17:23:19 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <17af1378050808131316fa3810-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> <200508081142.42012.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af1378050808084929e9491f@mail.gmail.com> <200508081421.39109.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af13780508081256224e2435@mail.gmail.com> <42F7B9FD.4020800@rogers.com> <17af1378050808131316fa3810@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Ian Zimmerman wrote: > > I'm afraid this answers a different question - those are instructions > from users outside > Rogers network for connecting to these ports on Rogers servers. My question is > about the opposite situation. If I get Rogers ISP, will I be able to > connect to ports > 465 and 587 on OTHER servers (such as smtp.gmail.com)? I setup email access from a Rogers account (outgoing smtp) to another server for a client. I used port 465. Gmail also works well with the same configuration. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 21:26:23 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 17:26:23 -0400 Subject: Monitor correction chart? In-Reply-To: References: <20050807142841.GA1148@waltdnes.org> <20050808173136.GP6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20050808212623.GU6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Mon, Aug 08, 2005 at 11:58:50PM +0300, Peter wrote: > In fact you can solve it once for the server or 1000 times for each > application. So going for the server is more sane, but for occasional > use application-based calibration should work fine. An application working in CMYK or some other color space may want to do the conversions differently than your web browser. Your web broser may quite honestly not give a hoot as long as it can display 24bit RGB. After all web sites don't have a standard for color space that I am aware of. > That's a good idea but I would like to see how easy it is to use. The > way I remember the little X11 programming I did adding more complexity > to the API is not a good idea. I mean, correcting a colormap would work, > but if you use 24 bit color the color map will have inetresting size and > speed issues. Well other than photo editors/viewers, print systems, the gimp, and such, what really cares about color accuracy? Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 21:46:44 2005 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 00:46:44 +0300 (IDT) Subject: Monitor correction chart? In-Reply-To: <20050808212623.GU6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050807142841.GA1148@waltdnes.org> <20050808173136.GP6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050808212623.GU6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: On Mon, 8 Aug 2005, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Mon, Aug 08, 2005 at 11:58:50PM +0300, Peter wrote: >> In fact you can solve it once for the server or 1000 times for each >> application. So going for the server is more sane, but for occasional >> use application-based calibration should work fine. > > An application working in CMYK or some other color space may want to do > the conversions differently than your web browser. Your web broser may > quite honestly not give a hoot as long as it can display 24bit RGB. > After all web sites don't have a standard for color space that I am > aware of. No, they all want *standard* color output. Maybe the web browser does not count so much but it's nice to know it's accurate when you visit a nice photography site or when you are trying to calibrate your *monitor* (grin). Color calibration is not about conversion, it's about making the result uniform and reliable, no matter where it coms from. >> That's a good idea but I would like to see how easy it is to use. The >> way I remember the little X11 programming I did adding more complexity >> to the API is not a good idea. I mean, correcting a colormap would work, >> but if you use 24 bit color the color map will have inetresting size and >> speed issues. > > Well other than photo editors/viewers, print systems, the gimp, and > such, what really cares about color accuracy? You just listed 50% of the popular applications run under guis ;-) So since the ICC correction device will likely be large and heavy to work well, why repeat it in every application ? One hack I have thought of is to use a xvfb style X server and teleport its contents through a ICC corrected second server to a real screen. It would be a slow and heavy hack but it should make it possible to apply correction to any software (until this makes its way into the X servers). It is also relatively easy to implement (I am not volunteering). Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From saliola-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 22:53:50 2005 From: saliola-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Franco Saliola) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 15:53:50 -0700 Subject: Mission impossible In-Reply-To: References: <42F257A2.5030806@knet.ca> <42F785E4.3040407@rogers.com> Message-ID: On 8/8/05, Taavi Burns wrote: > On 8/8/05, James Knott wrote: > > Taavi Burns wrote: > > > It may also be illegal, depending on how and why it's done: > > > http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20050706.wcompu0706/BNStory/National/?page=rss&id=RTGAM.20050706.wcompu0706 > > > http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/07/07/1354206 > > > > > > > How are you supposed to read that article? When I try to read the full > > article, I'm taken to a page, where I can buy it. I only want to read > > it, not buy it. And yes, I am registered. > > Doh. The fulltext was free when the article came out. I didn't > notice the "register and buy" stuff below it; I saw the first couple > of paragraphs off of Google and thought I'd hit it. The slashdot > article is probably sufficient to get the gist of it. Other than > that...google some more (news.google.com) or hit up your local > library? This is interesting. An I'm Feeling Lucky google search for "keystroke logging a no-no in alberta" brings up the whole globeandmail story without asking you to buy it. Thanks google. Franco -- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From saliola-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 22:56:05 2005 From: saliola-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Franco Saliola) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 15:56:05 -0700 Subject: video-audio out of sync In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 8/6/05, Steve wrote: > I just installed Ubuntu 5.04 a few days ago. Everything seems great > except for when playing mpeg video. Originally the video itself was > choppy using totem-gstreamer, then I changed to totem-xine and the > video is now smooth. However it is out of sync with the audio (about > 1/2 second, I think). Hello Steve. I am having similar experiences on Ubuntu 5.04. Previously I was running Debian and had no problems. Now mplayer is almost useless: slow playback for DVDs, mpegs, .... Before I was using mplayer-1.0pre5 but the current installed version is pre7. So I'm not sure if reverting to pre5 would fix it. I haven't tried it yet. Franco -- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 23:26:53 2005 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 19:26:53 -0400 Subject: Font size under X; question In-Reply-To: <42F765D9.4040908-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808044540.GE12200@waltdnes.org> <42F765D9.4040908@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <20050808232653.GA14005@waltdnes.org> On Mon, Aug 08, 2005 at 10:02:01AM -0400, Jamon Camisso wrote > Are your fonts at 96dpi? Not sure if this will help you, though it > certainly improved things for me moving from Gnome to KDE. How do I do it for all apps, versus going into the options for each app? > Putting the following line in the monitor section of your xorg.conf (not > sure about XFree) and restarting X should make your fonts much more legible: > > DisplaySize 423 318 # 1600x1400 96dpi > > This line comes from the following: > > displaysize = /96*25.4 Where did you find that... pretty please? It's *NOT* found in "man xorg.conf". Is there a man page somewhere that I've missed? It has improved things to the point where I might consider staying at 1600x1200 permanently. -- Walter Dnes My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 00:17:57 2005 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 03:17:57 +0300 (IDT) Subject: Monitor correction chart? In-Reply-To: References: <20050807142841.GA1148@waltdnes.org> <20050808173136.GP6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050808212623.GU6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: I found a site with downloadable charts and good explanations here: http://www.drycreekphoto.com/Learn/monitor_calibration.htm Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 00:28:44 2005 From: marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (Marc Lijour) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 20:28:44 -0400 Subject: database vs filesystem performance In-Reply-To: <42F6EE22.7080204-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <200508080037.21459.marc@lijour.net> <42F6EE22.7080204@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <200508082028.44582.marc@lijour.net> On August 8, 2005 01:31, Marcus Brubaker wrote: > Marc Lijour wrote: > >On August 8, 2005 00:32, Ansar Mohammed wrote: > >>It all comes down to the nature of your application and data. > >>Is your application read only? Are you modifying data? How large are the > >>files and what kind of files are they? > > > >I am just getting a very fast stream of binary data which I have to store > >(fast) with the idea of retrieving later to process it. Hence it must be > >indexed in some way, but a coarse-grained indexing should work (many files > >may be). > > If this is just an intermediary stage and all you need is coarse > indexing (not searching) then just using the filesystem is probably the > way to go but keep in mind that FS performance will generally suffer if > you have too many files in a given directory. (There are ways around > this though.) However, as others have said, to have a conclusive answer > would require performance testing specific to your problem. > > BTW, is this on a Linux box? You've specified MS-SQL but left the other > option vague. Just curious. Imagine the worse ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 00:29:44 2005 From: marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (Marc Lijour) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 20:29:44 -0400 Subject: database vs filesystem performance In-Reply-To: <20050808104735.GA13078-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <200508080037.21459.marc@lijour.net> <20050808104735.GA13078@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <200508082029.44613.marc@lijour.net> On August 8, 2005 06:47, Walter Dnes wrote: > On Mon, Aug 08, 2005 at 12:37:21AM -0400, Marc Lijour wrote > > > On August 8, 2005 00:32, Ansar Mohammed wrote: > > > It all comes down to the nature of your application and data. > > > Is your application read only? Are you modifying data? How large are > > > the files and what kind of files are they? > > > > I am just getting a very fast stream of binary data which I have to store > > (fast) with the idea of retrieving later to process it. Hence it must be > > indexed in some way, but a coarse-grained indexing should work (many > > files may be). > > See http://www.unitedlinux.com/pdfs/whitepaper4.pdf for a discussion > on file system limits. 3000 files/second adds up really quickly. > > [m1800][waltdnes][~] echo $(( 3000 * 3600 * 24 * 365 )) > 94608000000 > > [m1800][waltdnes][~] echo $(( 3000 * 3600 * 24 * 366 )) > 94867200000 In that case it would make sense to concatenate some of the info... > That's over 94.5 *BILLION FILES* in a regular year, and pushing close > to 95 billion in a leap year. That's over a *TRILLION FILES* in 11 > years. Would it be considered "insider information" if I ran out and > invested my life-savings in disk-drive manufacturers, based on your > question. > > I really have my doubts about a regular file system handling this. > According to the above paper, reiserfs 3 "only" allows 1 TB partition, > and 4 billion files. Fuggedaboutit. Ext2 and 3 are limited to 4 TB > partitions, with however many files you can cram in. JFS is a 64-bit > system, and might be able to hold the files and data you need, but I > don't really have a clue about speed. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 01:52:45 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 21:52:45 -0400 Subject: video-audio out of sync *FIXED* In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: http://www.ubuntuguide.org/#configuresoundproperly This fixed the problem for me. Thanks for the suggestions... I will check out the DMA thing too. -- Mozilla Firefox -rediscover the web- http://www.mozilla.org/products/firefox/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 02:24:18 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Mon, 08 Aug 2005 22:24:18 -0400 Subject: Font size under X; question In-Reply-To: <20050808232653.GA14005-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808044540.GE12200@waltdnes.org> <42F765D9.4040908@utoronto.ca> <20050808232653.GA14005@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: Walter Dines wrote: > Where did you find that... pretty please? It's *NOT* found in > "man xorg.conf". Is there a man page somewhere that I've missed? It > has improved things to the point where I might consider staying at > 1600x1200 permanently. > To be honest I can't tell you where I first found out about it. I've had it in my general configuration backup file long enough to have forgotten from whence it came. My line is uncommented so I found a posting on the ubuntu forum that had the formula I sent earlier. (http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=20976) If my memory serves me correctly, the line tells X what the aspect ratio of width to height should be for a line of text. The fancy multiplication is just a conversion to millimeters to tell X how large your screen is. Note that you may want to tweak the numbers a little (fudge them) per the following site that explains things is much more understandable detail: http://ed.asisaid.com/fontfight.html Good to hear that you like your new resolution. If your eyes can take it and things look sharp I rather like the smallness and spaciousness that it creates. Cheers. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 02:30:17 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Mon, 08 Aug 2005 22:30:17 -0400 Subject: video-audio out of sync *FIXED* In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Steve wrote: > http://www.ubuntuguide.org/#configuresoundproperly > > This fixed the problem for me. > > Thanks for the suggestions... I will check out the DMA thing too. > I can practically guarantee that DMA will make DVD playback seamless. Ubuntu turns it off by default, I suppose with the intention of supporting older hardware. That page has details on enabling DMA. Just scroll up and you'll see it. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mgjk-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 8 22:32:56 2005 From: mgjk-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Mike Kallies) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 18:32:56 -0400 (EDT) Subject: experiences with openssh automation Message-ID: <35596.32.97.110.142.1123540376.squirrel@32.97.110.142> Hello Everyone, I've been doing some work with OpenSSH for automation with Linux Redhat, and it seems time and time again I encounter problems where OpenSSH does not allow for graceful failure. It seems a nice simple: ssh servername command will fail in automation when it encounters a set of servers with new host key identifiers. 1. Is there a way to programmatically update the host key identifier? Kind of a "yes, this is the right server, I know it changed" flag, option or technique which I'm missing? The following has the host key identification fail gracefully, it spews an error about it and moves on, which is good. SSHCMD="ssh -q -o BatchMode=yes" $SSHCMD servername command (I have to add host keys by ssh'ing to the server manually and saying "yes" to let keep the keys up to date should they change.) All this was just barely acceptable until I encountered a server with a broken SSH daemon, now I'm considering writing a babysitting script which backgrounds, sleeps and kills the SSH command if it times out. I never had such problems with rsh... 2. Does anyone have any recommendations or experience as to how I can use OpenSSH in a robust and reasonably secure fashion, so that it won't freeze up on cron jobs, fail to time out and create a traffic jam of useless processes? 3. Finally, since ssh as root is harmful, and automation can be doled out on a piecemeal basis using sudo, does anyone have any tricks to integrate ssh, sudo and su so that automation IDs can run remote commands without having to handle multiple levels of escapes? For example, automation which requires auditing /etc/shadow (hey, it does happen!) begins to require scripts with statements like: ssh -q -o MatchMode=yes server sudo su root -c \"grep \\\"expression\\\" /etc/shadow\" v.s. rsh server grep \"expression\" /etc/shadow When regular expressions begin to get involved in double-escapes, bad things happen... simple statements begin to become easier to scp over and execute from uniquely named temp files in priviliged directories. It just gets ugly, but I'm sure I must not be the only one who's encountered this kind of problem. Any recommendations for books, websites or materials? The O'Reilly book seems to be more theory than practice on this stuff. -Mike -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From saliola-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 05:06:47 2005 From: saliola-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Franco Saliola) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 01:06:47 -0400 Subject: experiences with openssh automation In-Reply-To: <35596.32.97.110.142.1123540376.squirrel-Ux8c1wYVwPEYuHMApVWI8g@public.gmane.org> References: <35596.32.97.110.142.1123540376.squirrel@32.97.110.142> Message-ID: On 8/8/05, Mike Kallies wrote: > 1. Is there a way to programmatically update the host key identifier? > Kind of a "yes, this is the right server, I know it changed" flag, option > or technique which I'm missing? I use the StrictHostKeyChecking option to get around this. ssh -o StrictHostKeyChecking=no hostname Basically, I get the host key with ssh -o StrictHostKeyChecking=no hostname cat /etc/ssh/ssh_host_rsa_key.pub and add (or replace) the entry in the known_hosts file. Franco -- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 06:24:28 2005 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 02:24:28 -0400 (EDT) Subject: experiences with openssh automation In-Reply-To: <35596.32.97.110.142.1123540376.squirrel-Ux8c1wYVwPEYuHMApVWI8g@public.gmane.org> References: <35596.32.97.110.142.1123540376.squirrel@32.97.110.142> Message-ID: On Mon, 8 Aug 2005, Mike Kallies wrote: > 1. Is there a way to programmatically update the host key identifier? Yes as Frank points out. But you have to ask yourself if this is a path you want to follow. The host key identifier is there for a reason. In particular it helps to prevent man-in-the-middle attacks. > I never had such problems with rsh... You never had any security with rsh either :) > 2. Does anyone have any recommendations or experience as to how I can use > OpenSSH in a robust and reasonably secure fashion, so that it won't freeze Use host key identifiers ;) > up on cron jobs, fail to time out and create a traffic jam of useless > processes? Check for an active ssh connection? netstat -p will do this. > 3. Finally, since ssh as root is harmful, and automation can be doled out > on a piecemeal basis using sudo, does anyone have any tricks to integrate > ssh, sudo and su so that automation IDs can run remote commands without > having to handle multiple levels of escapes? > > For example, automation which requires auditing /etc/shadow (hey, it does > happen!) begins to require scripts with statements like: > > ssh -q -o MatchMode=yes server sudo su root -c \"grep \\\"expression\\\" > /etc/shadow\" IMHO if you have so many boxes that auditing /etc/shadow can't be done manually you need to look at some other form of authentication. Allowing automated access via ssh to an account that can sudo to root is just opening a window for exploitation. Rob -- Robert Brockway B.Sc. Phone: +1-416-669-3073 Senior Technical Consultant Email: support-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Web: www.opentrend.net We are open 24x7x365 for technical support. Call us in a crisis. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 11:38:15 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 07:38:15 -0400 Subject: Install fest Message-ID: <003b01c59cd6$d50f20c0$5001a8c0@ym.phub.net.cable.rogers.com> If I don't hear of any "show stopper" errors in the following by today noon (Tuesday Aug 9, 2005) I will submit the following as our install fest flyer to Centennial this afternoon. Yes, it might be nice if we had more GTALUG related e-mail addresses, but we need something fast... -=-=-=-=-=--=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Free Linux Installfest Curious about Linux but do not know where to start? Ever wanted to play with Linux but had problems getting it installed? This is your chance to have a volunteer from the GTALug (Greater Toronto Area Linux User Group) guide you through the available options and help you to install Linux on your computer. Cost: No charge When: Saturday August 27th, 2005 Where: Room 418, 755 Morningside Avenue (the Centennial HP Science and Technology Centre) Time: 9:30 a.m. to 2:00 p.m. To register: register-+7+y8uhm9Opg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Details: http://gtalug.org/events/installfest While the Installfest is free, you are responsible for paying any parking charges. - If you wish to join GTALug , you may do so at the Installfest for $20 annually Students $10 - There will be Linux distributions on CD media for $10 per set available on a first come, first served basis. Quantities are limited. - If you wish to bring more than one computer onto which you wish to have Linux installed, feel free to do so but be advised that any additional installations beyond the first will only be done if time permits. - Installations will be done on a first come, first served, best efforts basis as time permits with no guarantee of success. - Distributions we will be installing include Debian, Ubuntu, Fedora, and Mandriva but others may also be available. - There is always an element of risk when installing an operating system. Centennial College, GTAlug, and the volunteers, jointly or severally, do NOT assume any liability whatsoever for data loss, damage to your system, or any other losses. You will be expected to sign a consent form at the Installfest authorising the volunteer to install Linux on your computer(s) and releasing the aforementioned parties from liability before proceeding with the installation. Pre Installfest checklist - Perform a back up of your computer. This is essential! - Defragment your hard drive and set aside at least 3GB of disk space. Create new partitions by resizing pre-existing ones, if you can. Do not worry if you do not know how to do this. Someone at the Installfest can do it for you. - Tell us about your level of Linux experience. - Let us know in advance if you have a particular Linux distribution you are interested in having installed and we will try to accommodate you. - Let us know in advance about the chipset, model number, age, or other pertinent details about the hardware in your computer, especially graphics adapters, wireless network cards, PXE boot capabilities, and SATA controllers, if you can. If you can print those details and bring them with you to the Installfest, all the better. If possible, search the web for Linux compatibility information for your hardware. Bring power cords and manuals for your hardware. Some CRT Monitors, PS/2 mice and keyboards will be available. If your computer uses LCD or USB peripherals, or any unusual hardware, bring it with you. If you would like to volunteer at the Installfest, please email: volunteer-+7+y8uhm9Opg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 11:54:38 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 07:54:38 -0400 Subject: database vs filesystem performance References: <200508080037.21459.marc@lijour.net> <20050808104735.GA13078@waltdnes.org> <200508082029.44613.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: <001801c59cd9$31c4bb20$6501a8c0@ibm5b4y3a0pgrq> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marc Lijour" To: Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 8:29 PM Subject: Re: [TLUG]: database vs filesystem performance > On August 8, 2005 06:47, Walter Dnes wrote: > > On Mon, Aug 08, 2005 at 12:37:21AM -0400, Marc Lijour wrote > > > > > On August 8, 2005 00:32, Ansar Mohammed wrote: > > > > It all comes down to the nature of your application and data. > > > > Is your application read only? Are you modifying data? How large are > > > > the files and what kind of files are they? > > > > > > I am just getting a very fast stream of binary data which I have to store > > > (fast) with the idea of retrieving later to process it. Hence it must be > > > indexed in some way, but a coarse-grained indexing should work (many > > > files may be). > > > > See http://www.unitedlinux.com/pdfs/whitepaper4.pdf for a discussion > > on file system limits. 3000 files/second adds up really quickly. > > > > [m1800][waltdnes][~] echo $(( 3000 * 3600 * 24 * 365 )) > > 94608000000 > > > > [m1800][waltdnes][~] echo $(( 3000 * 3600 * 24 * 366 )) > > 94867200000 > > In that case it would make sense to concatenate some of the info... That was my thought too, you do not want to put every binary stream in its own file, do you? How will these things be identified, does each one has a key or name? Sometimes we can use a database to store the retrieval information while leaving the data in flat files. I have seen data warehousing products working like that. Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 13:10:01 2005 From: interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (interlug-list) Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 09:10:01 -0400 Subject: experiences with openssh automation In-Reply-To: <35596.32.97.110.142.1123540376.squirrel-Ux8c1wYVwPEYuHMApVWI8g@public.gmane.org> References: <35596.32.97.110.142.1123540376.squirrel@32.97.110.142> Message-ID: <1123593001.28785.270.camel@holden.weait.net> On Mon, 2005-08-08 at 18:32, Mike Kallies wrote: > Hello Everyone, > > I've been doing some work with OpenSSH for automation with Linux Redhat, > and it seems time and time again I encounter problems where OpenSSH does > not allow for graceful failure. Have you considered cfengine? from http://www.cfengine.org/ About Cfengine Cfengine, or the configuration engine ( http://www.cfengine.org/cfdetails.html ) is an autonomous agent ( http://www.cfengine.org/daystrom.html ) and a middle to high level policy language and agent for building expert systems to administrate and configure large computer networks. Cfengine is designed to be a part of a computer immune system. ( http://www.iu.hio.no/~mark/research/immune ) It is ideal for cluster management and has been adopted for use all over the world in small and huge organizations alike. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr.mcgregor-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 13:27:40 2005 From: mr.mcgregor-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (John McGregor) Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 09:27:40 -0400 Subject: installfest poster Message-ID: <42F8AF4C.1000000@rogers.com> > > >Curious about Linux but do not know where to start? Ever wanted to play with >Linux but had problems getting it installed? This is your chance to have a >volunteer from the GTALug (Greater Toronto Area Linux User Group) guide you >through the available options and help you to install Linux on your >computer. > I'd change the word "play" in the first line to "experiment" or "try out" etc. In the original context "play" could infer a toy-like quality to some potential users. I don't think that this is the message we want to send. John -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 13:35:09 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 09:35:09 -0400 Subject: Monitor correction chart? In-Reply-To: References: <20050807142841.GA1148@waltdnes.org> <20050808173136.GP6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050808212623.GU6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20050809133509.GV6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 09, 2005 at 12:46:44AM +0300, Peter wrote: > No, they all want *standard* color output. Maybe the web browser does > not count so much but it's nice to know it's accurate when you visit a > nice photography site or when you are trying to calibrate your > *monitor* (grin). Color calibration is not about conversion, it's about > making the result uniform and reliable, no matter where it coms from. What if your monitor is so crappy it can't be calibrated to anything useful? > You just listed 50% of the popular applications run under guis ;-) I hardly run any of them. > So since the ICC correction device will likely be large and heavy to > work well, why repeat it in every application ? > > One hack I have thought of is to use a xvfb style X server and teleport > its contents through a ICC corrected second server to a real screen. It > would be a slow and heavy hack but it should make it possible to apply > correction to any software (until this makes its way into the X > servers). It is also relatively easy to implement (I am not > volunteering). Or you could intercept the X calls in the standard X libraries so all calls to X could have all colour information modified before being passed to the X server for rendering. An X proxy might even be a good place to test it. :) Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 13:52:21 2005 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 09:52:21 -0400 Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> On Mon, Aug 08, 2005 at 11:54:03PM +0300, Peter wrote: > >Turn on smart and look at the log. My hunch is it will be lit red like a >nice sunset. You can run smartctl on the drive from external boot media >(e.g. knoppix live cd). I had SMART turned on, and the logs are clear - I booted off a knoppix disc (which work just fine) and fsck'ed my discs, and everything seems tickety-boo. The drives mounted fine, the data is all intact, and I could find no problems. This computer runs just fine (it's what I'm logged into to send this email), but it doesn't boot so well. I turned it off after pulling the knoppix disc, and it took a while to cool off before it would boot again. Could a power supply problem only affect a system when it is booting? Similarly, could a bad HD controller or be cranky when warm and booting, but not cool and booting? Thanks for all the suggestions so far. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 13:55:56 2005 From: jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 09:55:56 -0400 Subject: experiences with openssh automation In-Reply-To: <35596.32.97.110.142.1123540376.squirrel-Ux8c1wYVwPEYuHMApVWI8g@public.gmane.org> References: <35596.32.97.110.142.1123540376.squirrel@32.97.110.142> Message-ID: On 8/8/05, Mike Kallies wrote: > For example, automation which requires auditing /etc/shadow (hey, it does > happen!) begins to require scripts with statements like: > > ssh -q -o MatchMode=yes server sudo su root -c \"grep \\\"expression\\\" > /etc/shadow\" > > v.s. > > rsh server grep \"expression\" /etc/shadow You could not use quotes around the outside and escape the spaces: ssh -q -o MatchMode=yes server sudo su root -c grep\ \"expression\"\ /etc/shadow Or you could use different kinds of quotes (if you only need to nest 2 levels): ssh -q -o MatchMode=yes server sudo su root -c 'grep "expression" /etc/shadow' ssh -q -o MatchMode=yes server sudo su root -c "grep 'expression' /etc/shadow" Note that these last two have different meanings. If you have any $ENVVARs, the former will use what is defined on the remote host, and the latter will use what is defined on the local host (hint: read up on the different kinds of quotes and what they do). -- taa /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 14:12:48 2005 From: nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ian Zimmerman) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 10:12:48 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <17af137805080807575893f2ef-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <17af1378050809071212ddce79@mail.gmail.com> On 8/8/05, Ian Zimmerman wrote: > I am sorry if this dead horse has been beaten enough already ... > > Just moved to the area (in 905 actually) and looking for a broadband ISP > that is at least not Linux hostile. > > I have read the entire June-July thread about this. I looked at canadianisp.com as suggested; among the DSL crowd, cybernet and teksavvy look best, anyone here has experience with them? I find the site a bit suspect, as the people who submitted the ratings are not revealed or their reasons. For all I know, the ISPs could have simply paid for being placed well. Thanks, Ian -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 14:17:07 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 10:17:07 -0400 Subject: Install fest In-Reply-To: <003b01c59cd6$d50f20c0$5001a8c0-ki0Zr782rhv/m7utMz5sVUHTeQkJkYumVpNB7YpNyf8@public.gmane.org> References: <003b01c59cd6$d50f20c0$5001a8c0@ym.phub.net.cable.rogers.com> Message-ID: <20050809141707.GA2489@node1.opengeometry.net> On Tue, Aug 09, 2005 at 07:38:15AM -0400, Colin McGregor wrote: > While the Installfest is free, you are responsible for paying any parking > charges. Perhaps, you should tell them how much for parking, so that they have sufficient coins. > - If you wish to bring more than one computer onto which you wish to have > Linux installed, feel free to do so but be advised that any additional > installations beyond the first will only be done if time permits. Not needed. > - Installations will be done on a first come, first served, best efforts > basis as time permits with no guarantee of success. Not needed. > - Tell us about your level of Linux experience. Not needed. They are newbies. > - Let us know in advance if you have a particular Linux distribution you are > interested in having installed and we will try to accommodate you. Not needed. If we don't have it, we can't install it. > - Let us know in advance about the chipset, model number, age, or other > pertinent details about the hardware in your computer, especially graphics > adapters, wireless network cards, PXE boot capabilities, and SATA > controllers, if you can. If you can print those details and bring them with > you to the Installfest, all the better. If possible, search the web for > Linux compatibility information for your hardware. Not needed. It's too much to ask for newbies. > > Bring power cords and manuals for your hardware. Manual, yes. But, power cords? I got few. -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From dcbour-Uj1Tbf34OBsy5HIR1wJiBuOEVfOsBSGQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 14:23:10 2005 From: dcbour-Uj1Tbf34OBsy5HIR1wJiBuOEVfOsBSGQ at public.gmane.org (Dave Bour) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 10:23:10 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again Message-ID: I'll chime in a favorable for cybernet. Been on them about 6 months now, great service, and don't care about the linux boxes on my network D Dave Bour Desktop Solution Center 905.381.0077 dcbour at desktopsolutioncenter.ca For those who just want it to work... Giving you complete IT peace of mind. (Sent via Blackberry) PIN 30073084 (as of May 9,2005) -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug at ss.org To: tlug at ss.org Sent: Tue Aug 09 10:12:48 2005 Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Looking for ISP, again On 8/8/05, Ian Zimmerman wrote: > I am sorry if this dead horse has been beaten enough already ... > > Just moved to the area (in 905 actually) and looking for a broadband ISP > that is at least not Linux hostile. > > I have read the entire June-July thread about this. I looked at canadianisp.com as suggested; among the DSL crowd, cybernet and teksavvy look best, anyone here has experience with them? I find the site a bit suspect, as the people who submitted the ratings are not revealed or their reasons. For all I know, the ISPs could have simply paid for being placed well. Thanks, Ian -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mr.mcgregor-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 15:06:20 2005 From: mr.mcgregor-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (John McGregor) Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 11:06:20 -0400 Subject: OT -- Hardware Troubleshooting Message-ID: <42F8C66C.3070607@rogers.com> > > >Could a power supply problem only affect a system when it is booting? >Similarly, could a bad HD controller or be cranky when warm and booting, >but not cool and booting? > I think that it might be a good idea to remove the heat sink and give it a good cleaning. Even a thin coating of dust can provide enough insulation to render a heat sink almost useless during periods of heavy load -- like what happens during the boot process. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 15:08:53 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 11:08:53 -0400 (EDT) Subject: experiences with openssh automation In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 9 Aug 2005, Robert Brockway wrote: > ...Allowing > automated access via ssh to an account that can sudo to root is just > opening a window for exploitation. So is connecting the computer to a network in the first place. :-) These things are tradeoffs; they're not automatically and inherently bad ideas. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 15:15:38 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 11:15:38 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Install fest In-Reply-To: <20050809141707.GA2489-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20050809141707.GA2489@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <20050809151538.84914.qmail@web88204.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- William Park wrote: > On Tue, Aug 09, 2005 at 07:38:15AM -0400, Colin > McGregor wrote: > > While the Installfest is free, you are responsible > for paying any parking > > charges. > > Perhaps, you should tell them how much for parking, > so that they have > sufficient coins. Spoke to Centennial and they are talking to security about getting parking charges waived. If they can not get the chages waived they will be $6. I think leaving the wording "you are responsible for paying any parking charges." is for the moment best, but if I can get a straight answer on fees soon that should be noted (i.e.: "free parking" or "$6 parking"). > > - If you wish to bring more than one computer onto > which you wish to have > > Linux installed, feel free to do so but be advised > that any additional > > installations beyond the first will only be done > if time permits. > > Not needed. If someone has two PCs that they want software installed onto I want it clear that we would be happy to try and help, but... > > - Installations will be done on a first come, > first served, best efforts > > basis as time permits with no guarantee of > success. > > Not needed. > > > - Tell us about your level of Linux experience. > > Not needed. They are newbies. Fair point. > > - Let us know in advance if you have a particular > Linux distribution you are > > interested in having installed and we will try to > accommodate you. > > Not needed. If we don't have it, we can't install > it. This is needed, if someone say wants say Coyote Linux, (one of the micro (router) style distributions), I would be happy to help, but I will want some advance warning to make sure we have some floppies available :-) . > > - Let us know in advance about the chipset, model > number, age, or other > > pertinent details about the hardware in your > computer, especially graphics > > adapters, wireless network cards, PXE boot > capabilities, and SATA > > controllers, if you can. If you can print those > details and bring them with > > you to the Installfest, all the better. If > possible, search the web for > > Linux compatibility information for your hardware. > > Not needed. It's too much to ask for newbies. Some of these people MAY be Windows "profesionals", i.e. people who know the hardware, just they don't know Linux. If they know this stuff, great, if not, well, we will work around it. > > Bring power cords and manuals for your hardware. > > Manual, yes. But, power cords? I got few. Yes, and I will arrange for some keyboards / mice from my office, stillI hace seen a FEW boxes that use odd ball power cords and well, we don't want to be facing one of those... Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phillip-l+pbsqP8NtUm29vl6s1fFg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 15:14:55 2005 From: phillip-l+pbsqP8NtUm29vl6s1fFg at public.gmane.org (phil) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 11:14:55 -0400 Subject: Power-off trivia Message-ID: <57C7FC5E-08E8-11DA-AE96-00050249A5C8@millsgarthson.ca> I'm in the process of moving a machine from SuSE 8.1 to Debian (2.6.8 kernel) and it's generally going well, but one feature that I'd taken for granted isn't happening and I have no idea where to look next. When I told the old installation to shut down, it did. With the new one, it runs through the shutdown messages, prints out "Power down." and sits there. (I tried substituting 'poweroff' for 'halt' in the KDE shutdown settings, but with no change in result.) Oddly, I hear a kind of click (?) from the box as if something was *trying* to power it down, but.... Suggestions? ........................ Phillip Mills Multi-platform software development (416) 224-0714 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 15:22:06 2005 From: josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Joseph Kubik) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 11:22:06 -0400 Subject: Power-off trivia In-Reply-To: <57C7FC5E-08E8-11DA-AE96-00050249A5C8-l+pbsqP8NtUm29vl6s1fFg@public.gmane.org> References: <57C7FC5E-08E8-11DA-AE96-00050249A5C8@millsgarthson.ca> Message-ID: What type of machine hardware and firmware? The ability to power off is VERY bios dependant. -joseph- On 8/9/05, phil wrote: > I'm in the process of moving a machine from SuSE 8.1 to Debian (2.6.8 > kernel) and it's generally going well, but one feature that I'd taken > for granted isn't happening and I have no idea where to look next. > When I told the old installation to shut down, it did. With the new > one, it runs through the shutdown messages, prints out "Power down." > and sits there. (I tried substituting 'poweroff' for 'halt' in the KDE > shutdown settings, but with no change in result.) Oddly, I hear a kind > of click (?) from the box as if something was *trying* to power it > down, but.... > > Suggestions? > > ........................ > Phillip Mills > Multi-platform software development > (416) 224-0714 > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 15:22:12 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 11:22:12 -0400 Subject: Power-off trivia In-Reply-To: <57C7FC5E-08E8-11DA-AE96-00050249A5C8-l+pbsqP8NtUm29vl6s1fFg@public.gmane.org> References: <57C7FC5E-08E8-11DA-AE96-00050249A5C8@millsgarthson.ca> Message-ID: <20050809152212.GW6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 09, 2005 at 11:14:55AM -0400, phil wrote: > I'm in the process of moving a machine from SuSE 8.1 to Debian (2.6.8 > kernel) and it's generally going well, but one feature that I'd taken > for granted isn't happening and I have no idea where to look next. > When I told the old installation to shut down, it did. With the new > one, it runs through the shutdown messages, prints out "Power down." > and sits there. (I tried substituting 'poweroff' for 'halt' in the KDE > shutdown settings, but with no change in result.) Oddly, I hear a kind > of click (?) from the box as if something was *trying* to power it > down, but.... Power off requires apm or apci. Depending on which one your bios supports of course. I don't think debian enables it by default, although it may also just depend on your hardware. How old is the machine? Does the BIOS have anything about APM or APCI? Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1235-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 15:28:56 2005 From: sy1235-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 10:28:56 -0500 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <17af137805080807575893f2ef-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 8/8/05, Ian Zimmerman wrote: > >> > Note: You may be required to have your Windows 95/98/NT 4.0 CD to > install Look UltraFast Wireless. We cannot guarantee that the service > will work with all types of computers. > << > > I don't have a Windows system at all. People here using Look, have > you been able > to install it without Windows? Yes. In fact even when I was using windows XP years back and I called in for troubleshooting on it, the tech said "phew, you have windows xp.. we don't even need that setup disk because it supports pppoe directly". (btw, it turned out they just didn't set the account up right) Later efforts with just Linux have worked just fine.. I'd be using Look right now, but I've got disgusting line noise issues and Bell's gotta make repairs.. I figure staying with Sympatico would be a good idea to push that along. ;) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 15:32:34 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 11:32:34 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Revised Installfest flyer Message-ID: <20050809153234.96182.qmail@web88206.mail.re2.yahoo.com> In order to fit everything onto one page (comfortably, without using a 5 point font) I had to edit some stuff out, and I have incorporated some of the suggestions from William Park and John McGregor (no relation to the best of my knowledge :-) ). Any event I have forwarded the following on to Centennial for comment... Colin McGregor -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Free Linux Installfest Curious about Linux but do not know where to start? Ever wanted to try out Linux but had problems getting it installed? This is your chance to have a volunteer from the GTALug (Greater Toronto Area Linux User Group) guide you through the available options and help you to install Linux on your computer. Cost: No charge When: Saturday August 27th, 2005 Where: Room 418, 755 Morningside Avenue (the Centennial HP Science and Technology Centre) Time: 9:30 a.m. to 2:00 p.m. To register: register-+7+y8uhm9Opg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Details: http://gtalug.org/events/installfest While the Installfest is free, you are responsible for paying any transit/parking charges. Other Notes: ? If you wish to have Linux installed on more than one computer, please bring the extra computer(s) along but installations beyond the first will only be done if time permits. ? Installations will be done on a first come, first served basis. ? There is an element of risk when installing an operating system. You will be expected to sign a consent form at the Installfest authorizing the volunteer to install Linux on your computer(s) and releasing Centennial, GTAlug and the volunteers from liability before proceeding with the installation. Pre-Installfest checklist ? Perform a back up of your computer. This is essential! ? Defragment your hard drive and set aside at least 3GB of disk space. ? If you can, create new partitions by resizing pre-existing ones. If you do not know how to do this, someone at the Installfest can do it for you. ? Let us know in advance if you have a particular Linux distribution you are interested in having installed and we will try to accommodate you. ? Let us know in advance about the chipset, model number, age, or other details about the hardware in your computer, especially graphics adapters, wireless network cards, and SATA controllers, if you can. If you can print those details and bring them with you to the Installfest, all the better. If possible, search the web for Linux compatibility information for your hardware. ? Bring power cords and manuals for your hardware. Some CRT Monitors, PS/2 mice and PS/2 keyboards will be available. If your computer uses LCD or USB peripherals, or any unusual hardware, bring it with you. To volunteer at the Installfest, please email: volunteer-+7+y8uhm9Opg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1235-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 15:34:13 2005 From: sy1235-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 10:34:13 -0500 Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality Message-ID: I may as well bring this up. Has anyone else experienced severe line noise influencing a DSL connection? This is the case with me, and I've escalated the problem a few times and even had an ill-equipped and misinformed tech drop by (unannounced). I have repairs semi-arranged.. but I wanted to know if, aside from the obvious, there were any system / firewall settings or the like which might make my experience a little better. Running Sympatico regular DSL on a Bell line. I've done the obvious stuff with the handset/wiring and whatnot. At this point it's all in the preferences for my own setup I figure. I exchanged my modem for another one which seems to be much more aggressive with reconnecting during downtime. I occasionally stay connected but lose any actual use of the connection. Sometimes I drop out completely for a while.. sometimes there is lag which would make a gamer gnaw their own arm off. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phillip-l+pbsqP8NtUm29vl6s1fFg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 15:39:05 2005 From: phillip-l+pbsqP8NtUm29vl6s1fFg at public.gmane.org (phil) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 11:39:05 -0400 Subject: Power-off trivia In-Reply-To: <20050809152212.GW6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <57C7FC5E-08E8-11DA-AE96-00050249A5C8@millsgarthson.ca> <20050809152212.GW6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: On Aug 9, 2005, at 11:22 AM, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > How old is the machine? Does the BIOS have anything about APM or APCI? About 6 years old: Dell Dimension XPS B733. Flipping through the BIOS setup screens, all I see in power management is power saving options for fan, HD, video...no reference to the acronyms you mention. (In case it sheds any light, the SuSE system that was OK with shutting down this same computer featured kernel version 2.4.21.) ........................ Phillip Mills Multi-platform software development (416) 224-0714 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 15:48:36 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 11:48:36 -0400 Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <42F8D054.7000109@rogers.com> Sy wrote: > I may as well bring this up. Has anyone else experienced severe line > noise influencing a DSL connection? > > This is the case with me, and I've escalated the problem a few times > and even had an ill-equipped and misinformed tech drop by > (unannounced). > > I have repairs semi-arranged.. but I wanted to know if, aside from the > obvious, there were any system / firewall settings or the like which > might make my experience a little better. The tech should have a test set, with which he can test the DSL line. It will measure such things as noise level etc. Once he's done that, you'll have some idea about where the problem is. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 15:50:43 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 11:50:43 -0400 Subject: Power-off trivia In-Reply-To: References: <57C7FC5E-08E8-11DA-AE96-00050249A5C8@millsgarthson.ca> <20050809152212.GW6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20050809155043.GA3041@node1.opengeometry.net> On Tue, Aug 09, 2005 at 11:39:05AM -0400, phil wrote: > On Aug 9, 2005, at 11:22 AM, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > > >How old is the machine? Does the BIOS have anything about APM or APCI? > > About 6 years old: Dell Dimension XPS B733. Flipping through the BIOS > setup screens, all I see in power management is power saving options > for fan, HD, video...no reference to the acronyms you mention. > > (In case it sheds any light, the SuSE system that was OK with shutting > down this same computer featured kernel version 2.4.21.) Poweroff requires APM or ACPI. See if there is 'apm' or 'acpi' in /proc. If not, load kernel module. -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 15:57:18 2005 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 11:57:18 -0400 Subject: Power-off trivia In-Reply-To: <20050809152212.GW6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <57C7FC5E-08E8-11DA-AE96-00050249A5C8@millsgarthson.ca> <20050809152212.GW6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20050809155718.GA4541@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> On Tue, Aug 09, 2005 at 11:22:12AM -0400, Lennart Sorensen wrote: Try "apt-get install apmd" that may just take care of it for you. If not, take a look at your kernel to see if APM support is in there. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 16:00:55 2005 From: clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (CLIFFORD ILKAY) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 12:00:55 -0400 Subject: Install fest In-Reply-To: <20050809141707.GA2489-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <003b01c59cd6$d50f20c0$5001a8c0@ym.phub.net.cable.rogers.com> <20050809141707.GA2489@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <200508091200.55517.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> On August 9, 2005 10:17, William Park wrote: > On Tue, Aug 09, 2005 at 07:38:15AM -0400, Colin McGregor wrote: > > - Installations will be done on a first come, first served, best > > efforts basis as time permits with no guarantee of success. > > Not needed. I suggested we have it because if we have a crush of people, we do not want to guarantee that everyone can be served and that even if we manage to get to their machine, that there is no guarantee that we will be successful in installing Linux on their machine. Underpromise, overdeliver. -- Regards, Clifford Ilkay Dinamis Corporation 3266 Yonge Street, Suite 1419 Toronto, ON Canada M4N 3P6 +1 416-410-3326 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phillip-l+pbsqP8NtUm29vl6s1fFg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 16:10:48 2005 From: phillip-l+pbsqP8NtUm29vl6s1fFg at public.gmane.org (phil) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 12:10:48 -0400 Subject: Power-off trivia In-Reply-To: <20050809155718.GA4541-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <57C7FC5E-08E8-11DA-AE96-00050249A5C8@millsgarthson.ca> <20050809152212.GW6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050809155718.GA4541@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <264B03C6-08F0-11DA-AE96-00050249A5C8@millsgarthson.ca> On Aug 9, 2005, at 11:57 AM, William O'Higgins wrote: > Try "apt-get install apmd" that may just take care of it for you. That did it. Thank you. (Not that it was a show-stopper, but it has always bugged me that Windows NT refused to turn off the computer when told to shut down. With Mac experience, I had assumed it was a hardware limitation until I set up the Linux partition a few years ago and discovered that shutdown could actually mean what it said!) ........................ Phillip Mills Multi-platform software development (416) 224-0714 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 16:18:30 2005 From: josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Joseph Kubik) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 12:18:30 -0400 Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: <42F8D054.7000109-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <42F8D054.7000109@rogers.com> Message-ID: What you need to do is goto the D-Mark (the little box where the line comes in). Disconnect your house. wire the modem directly to the Dmark. If you continue to have problems it is Bell's issue. If you do not, just leave the modem there and rip all of the wires out of your building. re-wire with CAT4 or better (IMNSHO) -Joseph- On 8/9/05, James Knott wrote: > Sy wrote: > > I may as well bring this up. Has anyone else experienced severe line > > noise influencing a DSL connection? > > > > This is the case with me, and I've escalated the problem a few times > > and even had an ill-equipped and misinformed tech drop by > > (unannounced). > > > > I have repairs semi-arranged.. but I wanted to know if, aside from the > > obvious, there were any system / firewall settings or the like which > > might make my experience a little better. > > The tech should have a test set, with which he can test the DSL line. > It will measure such things as noise level etc. Once he's done that, > you'll have some idea about where the problem is. > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 16:22:00 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 12:22:00 -0400 Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: References: <42F8D054.7000109@rogers.com> Message-ID: <42F8D828.4090607@rogers.com> Joseph Kubik wrote: > What you need to do is goto the D-Mark (the little box where the line comes in). Actually, demarc, short for demarcation point. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 16:34:44 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 12:34:44 -0400 Subject: Power-off trivia In-Reply-To: References: <57C7FC5E-08E8-11DA-AE96-00050249A5C8@millsgarthson.ca> <20050809152212.GW6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20050809163444.GY6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 09, 2005 at 11:39:05AM -0400, phil wrote: > About 6 years old: Dell Dimension XPS B733. Flipping through the BIOS > setup screens, all I see in power management is power saving options > for fan, HD, video...no reference to the acronyms you mention. Ah Dell, the makers of the least standards compliant PCs ever. Also the people selling a 20" 1600x1050 FP monitor for $600 today (regular 950). I wish I could justify it. > (In case it sheds any light, the SuSE system that was OK with shutting > down this same computer featured kernel version 2.4.21.) If it is 6 years old it is almost certainly APM. Try loading the apm module (stick apm in /etc/modules) or modprobe apm, and see if poweroff works properly then. Len -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 16:32:10 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 12:32:10 -0400 Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050809163210.GX6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 09, 2005 at 10:34:13AM -0500, Sy wrote: > I may as well bring this up. Has anyone else experienced severe line > noise influencing a DSL connection? My DSL service when I lived on the 21th floor of an appartment building was certainly not great. Dropped sync frequently, never got beyond about 600kbps connection. I suspect replacing the wiring in the walls of the building woudl have helped, but that didn't seem like an option. Not like Bell or the ISP is at fault in any way if the building has garbage phone wire. > This is the case with me, and I've escalated the problem a few times > and even had an ill-equipped and misinformed tech drop by > (unannounced). > > I have repairs semi-arranged.. but I wanted to know if, aside from the > obvious, there were any system / firewall settings or the like which > might make my experience a little better. > > Running Sympatico regular DSL on a Bell line. I've done the obvious > stuff with the handset/wiring and whatnot. At this point it's all in > the preferences for my own setup I figure. > > I exchanged my modem for another one which seems to be much more > aggressive with reconnecting during downtime. I occasionally stay > connected but lose any actual use of the connection. Sometimes I drop > out completely for a while.. sometimes there is lag which would make a > gamer gnaw their own arm off. Certainly different modems behave differently. I had better luck getting a connection on bad days (when the A/C's were running) with a speedstream 5260, while a Sangoma S518 maintained the line better if it could get a link at all. The sangoma also had the option to specify a max speed to link at so I could lock it at 512kbps for example and it had a better chance of connecting and keeping the connection, but sometimes it just couldn't connect at all while the speedstream could (although it might drop the link 2 minutes later). Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 16:35:50 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 12:35:50 -0400 Subject: Power-off trivia In-Reply-To: <264B03C6-08F0-11DA-AE96-00050249A5C8-l+pbsqP8NtUm29vl6s1fFg@public.gmane.org> References: <57C7FC5E-08E8-11DA-AE96-00050249A5C8@millsgarthson.ca> <20050809152212.GW6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050809155718.GA4541@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <264B03C6-08F0-11DA-AE96-00050249A5C8@millsgarthson.ca> Message-ID: <20050809163550.GZ6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 09, 2005 at 12:10:48PM -0400, phil wrote: > (Not that it was a show-stopper, but it has always bugged me that > Windows NT refused to turn off the computer when told to shut down. > With Mac experience, I had assumed it was a hardware limitation until I > set up the Linux partition a few years ago and discovered that shutdown > could actually mean what it said!) IBM had a driver for NT to enable poweroff on shutdown. I used to load that on IBM M Pro workstations. Worked fine. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 18:04:02 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 13:04:02 -0500 Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: <20050809163210.GX6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050809163210.GX6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <1e55af9905080911044d632f51@mail.gmail.com> I don't have access to the demarc since I'm in an apartment building. In fact, the bell tech who came by went hunting for it and couldn't find the right equipment for my particular part of the building. It appears that his layout for the building was wrong. Of course, I couldn't get a hold of any of the staff here to confirm the right info, not that they'd know anyways.. I suspect the building's wiring is to blame.. although it's odd that it suddenly got bad one day. It's also odd that sometimes it has speeds which are better than I've ever know before this static issue. So from awesome to crap, to good with disconnections to dead air and no dialtone.. it's odd to be sure. I'm using IPCop for my firewall. I don't see a mention of a connection speed, but what I'll try is to throttle back my usage with its traffic shaping (which I wish had better configurability). I did do a bit of poking around to look into wireless or sattelite internet.. not really an option at this point. I'd rather move somewhere which can support my habit. I need to move to be closer to work anyways.. an hour and a half travel time each way sucks. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 14:42:58 2005 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 17:42:58 +0300 (IDT) Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: <20050809135221.GA3911-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: On Tue, 9 Aug 2005, William O'Higgins wrote: > On Mon, Aug 08, 2005 at 11:54:03PM +0300, Peter wrote: >> >> Turn on smart and look at the log. My hunch is it will be lit red like a >> nice sunset. You can run smartctl on the drive from external boot media >> (e.g. knoppix live cd). > > I had SMART turned on, and the logs are clear - I booted off a knoppix > disc (which work just fine) and fsck'ed my discs, and everything seems > tickety-boo. The drives mounted fine, the data is all intact, and I > could find no problems. This computer runs just fine (it's what I'm > logged into to send this email), but it doesn't boot so well. I turned > it off after pulling the knoppix disc, and it took a while to cool off > before it would boot again. > > Could a power supply problem only affect a system when it is booting? > Similarly, could a bad HD controller or be cranky when warm and booting, > but not cool and booting? After this I would asy, swap the power supply for a new one and see what happens. A no-name psu is about $25. Make sure you get the right type. Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 18:47:51 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 14:47:51 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <002d01c59d12$ea4d16e0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sy" To: Sent: Tuesday, 09 August, 2005 11:28 Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Looking for ISP, again On 8/8/05, Ian Zimmerman wrote: > >> > Note: You may be required to have your Windows 95/98/NT 4.0 CD to > install Look UltraFast Wireless. We cannot guarantee that the service > will work with all types of computers. > << > > I don't have a Windows system at all. People here using Look, have > you been able > to install it without Windows? Yes. In fact even when I was using windows XP years back and I called in for troubleshooting on it, the tech said "phew, you have windows xp.. we don't even need that setup disk because it supports pppoe directly". (btw, it turned out they just didn't set the account up right) Later efforts with just Linux have worked just fine.. I'd be using Look right now, but I've got disgusting line noise issues and Bell's gotta make repairs.. I figure staying with Sympatico would be a good idea to push that along. ;) -- I have been using Look's DSL service on both XP and Linux, also using a router, without any installation issue (or need for an installation CD). Except that lately there has been a few issues with the stability of the DSL service, but it seems resolved as we speak. Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 19:04:33 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 15:04:33 -0400 Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 09, 2005 at 05:42:58PM +0300, Peter wrote: > After this I would asy, swap the power supply for a new one and see what > happens. A no-name psu is about $25. Make sure you get the right type. A no name $25 power supply may also be causing such a problem in the first place. I sure won't buy no name power supplies again. I have learned from past mistakes. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 19:13:36 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 15:13:36 -0400 Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> > A no name $25 power supply may also be causing such a problem in the > first place. I sure won't buy no name power supplies again. I have > learned from past mistakes. > > Lennart Sorensen > -- Hmmmm....... you would be surprised to see what you find in "branded" power supplies... chances are they come from the same factories than the no-name ones! Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 19:26:48 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 15:26:48 -0400 Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: Francois Ouellette wrote: >>A no name $25 power supply may also be causing such a problem in the >>first place. I sure won't buy no name power supplies again. I have >>learned from past mistakes. >> >>Lennart Sorensen >>-- > > > Hmmmm....... you would be surprised to see what you find in "branded" power > supplies... chances are they come from the same factories than the no-name > ones! > > Fran?ois Ouellette > > True... but... Many of the branded supplies come with a separate 12v rail which makes all the difference in the world. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 19:32:52 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 15:32:52 -0400 Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 09, 2005 at 03:13:36PM -0400, Francois Ouellette wrote: > Hmmmm....... you would be surprised to see what you find in "branded" power > supplies... chances are they come from the same factories than the no-name > ones! Depends on the brand. Just because it has a name on it doesn't make it a name brand to me. To me a name brand power supply is a power supply from a brand I trust. I also don't expect to get power supplies for under $100 most of the time. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 19:57:28 2005 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 15:57:28 -0400 (EDT) Subject: experiences with openssh automation In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 9 Aug 2005, Henry Spencer wrote: > On Tue, 9 Aug 2005, Robert Brockway wrote: > > ...Allowing > > automated access via ssh to an account that can sudo to root is just > > opening a window for exploitation. > > So is connecting the computer to a network in the first place. :-) These > things are tradeoffs; they're not automatically and inherently bad ideas. Hi Henry. While that is true, it is a matter of degrees. Removing host key checking then allowing an account in without a passphrase and allowing it to sudo without a password is providing a vector directly to root access. The owner of the systems in question can do as they please but I really recommend against this course of action. It offers little and risks much. Not using a "default deny" policy on a firewall is not automatically and inherently a bad idea in security theory either, but you know what I'd want some pretty serious justification to do anything else. Rob -- Robert Brockway B.Sc. Phone: +1-416-669-3073 Senior Technical Consultant Email: support-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Web: www.opentrend.net We are open 24x7x365 for technical support. Call us in a crisis. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mgjk-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 20:23:27 2005 From: mgjk-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Mike Kallies) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 16:23:27 -0400 (EDT) Subject: experiences with openssh automation In-Reply-To: References: <35596.32.97.110.142.1123540376.squirrel@32.97.110.142> Message-ID: <3961.10.0.1.132.1123619007.squirrel@10.0.1.132> On Tue, August 9, 2005 2:24 am, Robert Brockway said: > On Mon, 8 Aug 2005, Mike Kallies wrote: > >> 1. Is there a way to programmatically update the host key identifier? > > Yes as Frank points out. But you have to ask yourself if this is a path > you want to follow. The host key identifier is there for a reason. In > particular it helps to prevent man-in-the-middle attacks. Frank's comments solve one of my problems. This is only for situations where a clump of known-new servers are introduced into the network and the host keys need to be added to the database. For general operation, host key checking is in place and won't be ignored. >> I never had such problems with rsh... > > You never had any security with rsh either :) True, but I'm referring to the problem where ssh freezes indefinately because of a bad sshd on a target server. I would hope that the OpenSSH client could timeout. Hmmm... not sure why I didn't see this earlier: ServerAliveInterval Sets a timeout interval in seconds after which if no data has been received from the server, ssh will send a message through the encrypted channel to request a response from the server. The default is 0, indicating that these messages will not be sent to the server. This option applies to protocol version 2 only. http://www.openbsd.org/cgi-bin/man.cgi?query=ssh_config I think describing the problem might have solved it. I'll follow up later with my results. ... > IMHO if you have so many boxes that auditing /etc/shadow can't be done > manually you need to look at some other form of authentication. Allowing > automated access via ssh to an account that can sudo to root is just > opening a window for exploitation. I've heard this argument many times, but I've never heard of any alternatives. Remote root access from ssh is risky somehow because the root account is common. (IMHO it's not such a big deal because you can force key-only authentication for root and spare everyone a lot of trouble... ) Remote access with a non-root account which has root-like priviliges through sudo is supposedly less risky because no password authentication is possible, making brute force password attacks on the account impossible. The private key would have to be guessed for brute force to work. It can be secured further by setting up the authorized_keys file to only allow access from known IP addresses. The only real danger as I can tell is if your automation servers are compromised... but that's unavoidable. If you need to have central servers from which you can install updates or monitor systems, those same servers can be used to install trojans or steal data. To protect against people stealing backup tapes, the private key can be encrypted by using a key agent to ask for the passphrase on the automation server at boot time... the private key is only ever decrypted to volatile system memory. For a very well-understood environment, like a cluster farm, I could see a situation where the servers could all be configured to report status, operational and security data without relying on a central server to poll, e.g. email everything you need PGP encrypted through SMTP, but there will still be a risk when a central server offers security updates, whether they're pulled or pushed... so there's no difference. I can't conceive of any other models, I don't know how any other tools would be any better. -Mike -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mgjk-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 20:41:15 2005 From: mgjk-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Mike Kallies) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 16:41:15 -0400 (EDT) Subject: experiences with openssh automation In-Reply-To: <1123593001.28785.270.camel-csCcNl6ta60tuqGvh5Fqhg@public.gmane.org> References: <35596.32.97.110.142.1123540376.squirrel@32.97.110.142> <1123593001.28785.270.camel@holden.weait.net> Message-ID: <4051.10.0.1.132.1123620075.squirrel@10.0.1.132> On Tue, August 9, 2005 9:10 am, interlug-list said: > On Mon, 2005-08-08 at 18:32, Mike Kallies wrote: >> Hello Everyone, >> >> I've been doing some work with OpenSSH for automation with Linux Redhat, >> and it seems time and time again I encounter problems where OpenSSH does >> not allow for graceful failure. > > Have you considered cfengine? First time I heard of it. Thanks for the link, it's something to consider long term if OpenSSH continues to show problems. I don't think some of the things they say about ssh are correct though: "Cfengine does not use ssh. The ssh protocol is not directly appropriate for a system management tool, because it provides only unilateral authentication of user to server. Cfengine authenticates these parties mutually, i.e. user to server, and server to user. Moreover, ssh requires a user to manually accept a key on trust, when the public keys are unknown to the parties, whereas cfengine works non-interactively. SSh uses the notion of binding to a trusted port, to confirm privileged user identity. Cfengine does not make this assumption." http://www.cfengine.org/confdir/copyv2.html -Mike -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 21:21:53 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 17:21:53 -0400 Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <000601c59d28$6ebd7590$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lennart Sorensen" To: Sent: Tuesday, 09 August, 2005 15:32 Subject: Re: [TLUG]: OT: Hardware troubleshooting > On Tue, Aug 09, 2005 at 03:13:36PM -0400, Francois Ouellette wrote: > > Hmmmm....... you would be surprised to see what you find in "branded" power > > supplies... chances are they come from the same factories than the no-name > > ones! > > Depends on the brand. Just because it has a name on it doesn't make it > a name brand to me. > > To me a name brand power supply is a power supply from a brand I trust. So, what does that statement mean exactly :-) > I also don't expect to get power supplies for under $100 most of the > time. Waste of money! I'd rather buy two at $25 and keep one as a spare! And spend the other $50 on memory... Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 21:40:27 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Tue, 09 Aug 2005 17:40:27 -0400 Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: <000601c59d28$6ebd7590$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <000601c59d28$6ebd7590$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: Francois Ouellette wrote: >>I also don't expect to get power supplies for under $100 most of the >>time. > > > Waste of money! > I'd rather buy two at $25 and keep one as a spare! And spend the other $50 > on memory... > > Fran?ois Ouellette > > What if because of voltage fluctuation the memory or cpu goes bad before its time because of 2 cheap supplies versus 1 quality unit? Then you've spent $100 and are no better off. A power supply is just like your ethernet cable -- it is a point of entry into your computer. A cheap supply would be like connecting an unpatched unfirewalled M$ box to the internet and hoping that things work out. While decent power supply does not guarantee that things will be fine, purchasing a quality unit seems like a fairly inexpensive insurance policy against intermittent and catastrophic hardware problems. I can tell you from experience (waking up in the middle of the night to a capacitor explosion and dead computer) that the extra $50 is worth the peace of mind if nothing else. $100 is only middle of the road for a desktop PS: http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?majorcatid=100&minorcatid=1066 Just my opinion(s) though ;) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 21:48:19 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 17:48:19 -0400 (EDT) Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: <000601c59d28$6ebd7590$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> References: <000601c59d28$6ebd7590$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: On Tue, 9 Aug 2005, Francois Ouellette wrote: > > I also don't expect to get power supplies for under $100 most of the > > time. > > Waste of money! > I'd rather buy two at $25 and keep one as a spare! Not a waste of money. The biggest problem with cheap power supplies is not that they die, but that sometimes they're flakey, and make other things misbehave in subtle ways. It's the wrong place to pinch pennies. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 22:03:13 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 18:03:13 -0400 Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <000601c59d28$6ebd7590$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: <002201c59d2e$35446b60$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jamon Camisso" To: Sent: Tuesday, 09 August, 2005 17:40 Subject: Re: [TLUG]: OT: Hardware troubleshooting > > > >$100 is only middle of the road for a desktop PS: >http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?majorcatid=100&minorcatid=1066 > >Just my opinion(s) though ;) >-- Depends where you buy, I have seen the Enermax at least 25% cheaper that these prices. Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 9 23:50:00 2005 From: marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (Marc Lijour) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 19:50:00 -0400 Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: <42F8D054.7000109-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <42F8D054.7000109@rogers.com> Message-ID: <200508091950.00794.marc@lijour.net> On August 9, 2005 11:48, James Knott wrote: > Sy wrote: > > I may as well bring this up. Has anyone else experienced severe line > > noise influencing a DSL connection? > > > > This is the case with me, and I've escalated the problem a few times > > and even had an ill-equipped and misinformed tech drop by > > (unannounced). > > > > I have repairs semi-arranged.. but I wanted to know if, aside from the > > obvious, there were any system / firewall settings or the like which > > might make my experience a little better. > > The tech should have a test set, with which he can test the DSL line. > It will measure such things as noise level etc. Once he's done that, > you'll have some idea about where the problem is. Where I lived before, the person below me would get twice the speed I got and they told me I could get connected with a bad line to a further located CO even if we were living in the same house... What can a customer answer to that? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From dwarmstrong-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 03:33:13 2005 From: dwarmstrong-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Daniel Armstrong) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 23:33:13 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <17af1378050809071212ddce79-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> <17af1378050809071212ddce79@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <61e9e2b10508092033578fe020@mail.gmail.com> On 8/9/05, Ian Zimmerman wrote: > I looked at canadianisp.com as suggested; among the DSL crowd, cybernet > and teksavvy look best, anyone here has experience with them? I am one of the "Istop refugees" that had to seek out a new ISP - switched to Teksavvy the beginning of July, and have been happy with the service so far. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rfk-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 04:21:55 2005 From: rfk-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Robert F. Kennedy) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 00:21:55 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <61e9e2b10508092033578fe020-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <61e9e2b10508092033578fe020@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <031501c59d63$0afcccf0$1902a8c0@coilnetworks.com> I am another "Istop refugee" but I stayed with Cybersurf. So far: nonexistent tech support, downloads speeds just above dialup for the first several weeks and more recently up around 750 Kb. I am going to switch some time this month so I am interested in this thread. I am running a mail server and DNS server so I really need a server friendly service. Best, Robert -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org] On Behalf Of Daniel Armstrong Sent: August 09, 2005 11:33 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Looking for ISP, again On 8/9/05, Ian Zimmerman wrote: > I looked at canadianisp.com as suggested; among the DSL crowd, > cybernet and teksavvy look best, anyone here has experience with them? I am one of the "Istop refugees" that had to seek out a new ISP - switched to Teksavvy the beginning of July, and have been happy with the service so far. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From presidentofthefuture-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 05:36:12 2005 From: presidentofthefuture-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Mike Newman) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 01:36:12 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 8/9/05, Sy wrote: > I'd be using Look right now, but I've got disgusting line noise issues > and Bell's gotta make repairs.. I figure staying with Sympatico would > be a good idea to push that along. ;) I don't know if this is coincidence or not, but I had terrible line noise when I had Sympatico DSL. When I switched to Look I also dumped an old cordless phone that wasn't getting much use anymore. The line noise cleared up and I started getting another 50 KB/sec downstream. I guess it was either the cordless or the modem. A friend of mine had four Sympatico modems burn out on him... guess it could be either! -- Get Firefox - Take back the Web http://www.getfirefox.com/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From edward.chin-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 06:05:15 2005 From: edward.chin-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (echin) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 02:05:15 -0400 Subject: Revised Installfest flyer In-Reply-To: <20050809153234.96182.qmail-p6KvMhi7PWKB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20050809153234.96182.qmail@web88206.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <42F9991B.8000704@sympatico.ca> > To volunteer at the Installfest, please email: > volunteer-+7+y8uhm9Opg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org > Volunteers should take a quick look at: http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/Installfest-HOWTO/index.html Note especially: 2. Roles 3. Before, During and After > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > -- "...when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth..." Sherlock Holmes -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 267.10.1 - Release Date: 04-Aug-05 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From dwarmstrong-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 06:37:00 2005 From: dwarmstrong-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Daniel Armstrong) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 02:37:00 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <031501c59d63$0afcccf0$1902a8c0-B7WYQ2cLakwWhyVFc8JwjA@public.gmane.org> References: <61e9e2b10508092033578fe020@mail.gmail.com> <031501c59d63$0afcccf0$1902a8c0@coilnetworks.com> Message-ID: <61e9e2b105080923374cc2952a@mail.gmail.com> On 8/10/05, Robert F. Kennedy wrote: > I am another "Istop refugee" but I stayed with Cybersurf. So far: > nonexistent tech support, downloads speeds just above dialup for the > first several weeks and more recently up around 750 Kb. I am going to > switch some time this month so I am interested in this thread. I am > running a mail server and DNS server so I really need a server friendly > service. I know when I originally called Cybersurf to inquire about changing my account over to their service that their "stay with us or go - we could care less" attitude was so off-putting that I could just imagine how they run their shop. Another bonus: I saw my speeds increase when I switched to Teksavvy - with the 3 Meg account with Istop I achieved 1500-1600 kbps down, 200-300 kbps up; with Teksavvy I routinely get 2400-2500 down, 550-650 up. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 06:54:49 2005 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 02:54:49 -0400 (EDT) Subject: experiences with openssh automation In-Reply-To: <3961.10.0.1.132.1123619007.squirrel-BCYzWckODjyzYbK/QorSrw@public.gmane.org> References: <35596.32.97.110.142.1123540376.squirrel@32.97.110.142> <3961.10.0.1.132.1123619007.squirrel@10.0.1.132> Message-ID: On Tue, 9 Aug 2005, Mike Kallies wrote: [Refering to alternatives to using ssh to get access to /etc/shadow] > I've heard this argument many times, but I've never heard of any > alternatives. LDAPS, NIS+ (the latter is hard to set up). NIS is easy to setup but not secure. > Remote root access from ssh is risky somehow because the root account is > common. (IMHO it's not such a big deal because you can force key-only > authentication for root and spare everyone a lot of trouble... ) I prefer to encourage the use of ssh through a user a/c and additional authentication to get root. IMHO it should be a bit annoying to get root. It's easy for an admin to get lazy and do stuff as root that could be done through an unprivileged account. > Remote access with a non-root account which has root-like priviliges > through sudo is supposedly less risky because no password authentication > is possible, making brute force password attacks on the account Directly over ssh - yes. Brute force attacks on ssh are very common today as many of us know. > impossible. The private key would have to be guessed for brute force to > work. And the passphrase if there is one. With a strong passphrase in place this is considered an intractible problem with 1024bit RSA keys today. > The only real danger as I can tell is if your automation servers are > compromised... but that's unavoidable. If you need to have central > servers from which you can install updates or monitor systems, those same > servers can be used to install trojans or steal data. They sure can. I do patching manually everywhere. For one thing very few vendors are doing security patching properly - where you can be sure the box will just get the updates it needs. I've seen many a vendor break functionality on supposedly safe security updates. I rarely touch MS-Windows and I can understand MS-Windows admins needing to patch large numbers of workstations. I strongly support the use of thin clients in the unix environment, one of the reasons being the reduced admin overhead (no patching of workstations :) There are other reasons too. http://www.opentrend.net goes into this a bit but we plan to add more information on thin clients. In cases where the number of boxes is very large or where backend servers are being built and rebuild (eg, for testing) I usually use something like kickstart or jumpstart. IMHO if the number of individual (unix) servers is so large that it is infeasible for the admins to do manual security updates then they probably need to expand the admin team since they are probably lacking the staff to do proper administration as well. Cheers, Rob -- Robert Brockway B.Sc. Phone: +1-416-669-3073 Senior Technical Consultant Email: support-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Web: www.opentrend.net We are open 24x7x365 for technical support. Call us in a crisis. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 13:00:19 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 09:00:19 -0400 Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: <200508091950.00794.marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org> References: <42F8D054.7000109@rogers.com> <200508091950.00794.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: <42F9FA63.7060703@rogers.com> Marc Lijour wrote: > Where I lived before, the person below me would get twice the speed I got and > they told me I could get connected with a bad line to a further located CO > even if we were living in the same house... What can a customer answer to > that? While you may have to live with the greater distance, if there's a bad line, it's the phone company's problem and their responsibility to fix it. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 13:13:03 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 09:13:03 -0400 Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: <000601c59d28$6ebd7590$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <000601c59d28$6ebd7590$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: <20050810131303.GC6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 09, 2005 at 05:21:53PM -0400, Francois Ouellette wrote: > So, what does that statement mean exactly :-) If a power supply is made by a company named 'SuperPower Inc' and I have never heard of them before, I consider it a no name power supply. If it says 'Antec' and I have heard about them and only good things, then I consider it a nice name brand power supply I would consider buying. > Waste of money! > I'd rather buy two at $25 and keep one as a spare! And spend the other $50 > on memory... I would rather not have the cheap crap destroy my expensive hardware or cause odd crashes and reboots (I have seen cheap power supplies do that). My time is worth something to me, and I don't want fried HDs or CPUs or motherboards due to cheap power supplies. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 13:15:36 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 09:15:36 -0400 Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: <200508091950.00794.marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org> References: <42F8D054.7000109@rogers.com> <200508091950.00794.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: <20050810131536.GD6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 09, 2005 at 07:50:00PM -0400, Marc Lijour wrote: > Where I lived before, the person below me would get twice the speed I got and > they told me I could get connected with a bad line to a further located CO > even if we were living in the same house... What can a customer answer to > that? Does the customer ever really know where the phone line goes physically once it leaves their house? I sure don't have a clue, other than I imagine it usually goes to the nearest CO, although it may not always. At my previous job, we had ADSL and it worked great. We could see the local CO out the window (it was about 100m down the road). No problems with ADSL ever (other than the day the original ADSL modem died). Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 13:54:13 2005 From: tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Tim Writer) Date: 10 Aug 2005 09:54:13 -0400 Subject: Power-off trivia In-Reply-To: <264B03C6-08F0-11DA-AE96-00050249A5C8-l+pbsqP8NtUm29vl6s1fFg@public.gmane.org> References: <57C7FC5E-08E8-11DA-AE96-00050249A5C8@millsgarthson.ca> <20050809152212.GW6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050809155718.GA4541@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <264B03C6-08F0-11DA-AE96-00050249A5C8@millsgarthson.ca> Message-ID: phil writes: > On Aug 9, 2005, at 11:57 AM, William O'Higgins wrote: > > > Try "apt-get install apmd" that may just take care of it for you. > > That did it. Thank you. You don't need apmd just to be able to power down, you need only load the apm kernel module. Installing apmd likely did this for you but that's overkill. Just do this: # echo apm >> /etc/modules Then you can also: # apt-get --purge remove apmd -- tim writer starnix inc. 647.722.5301 toronto, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 13:51:21 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 09:51:21 -0400 Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: <20050810131536.GD6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <42F8D054.7000109@rogers.com> <200508091950.00794.marc@lijour.net> <20050810131536.GD6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <42FA0659.9000904@rogers.com> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > Does the customer ever really know where the phone line goes physically > once it leaves their house? No. > > I sure don't have a clue, other than I imagine it usually goes to the > nearest CO, although it may not always. If you're near the CO, you're probably connected there. However, as you get further away, you may be connected to another office. The phone company tries to balance subscriber loads. Also, there might not be free pairs available to the nearest CO. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 13:57:38 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 09:57:38 -0400 Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: <42FA0659.9000904-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <42F8D054.7000109@rogers.com> <200508091950.00794.marc@lijour.net> <20050810131536.GD6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <42FA0659.9000904@rogers.com> Message-ID: <42FA07D2.6020309@rogers.com> James Knott wrote: > Lennart Sorensen wrote: > >>Does the customer ever really know where the phone line goes physically >>once it leaves their house? > > No. > >>I sure don't have a clue, other than I imagine it usually goes to the >>nearest CO, although it may not always. > > If you're near the CO, you're probably connected there. However, as you > get further away, you may be connected to another office. The phone > company tries to balance subscriber loads. Also, there might not be > free pairs available to the nearest CO. Forgot to mention. You might not be connected directly to the CO. There may be a "point of presence", near your location, where your phone line terminates. You'd then be connected back to the CO via fibre. This is common in large office buildings etc. Things get a bit more interesting, if you get your phone/ADSL service from another provider. In that case, you'd be physically connected to a Bell office, but your provider would have equipment located there, which connects to their system. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 15:12:27 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 11:12:27 -0400 Subject: Best Filesystems? Message-ID: Hi, I have a question about filesystem types. I've got an 80GB drive that I'm planning to reformat and install Ubuntu. I plan to create 3 partitions: 9.0 GB - For the OS and system files. 512 MB - SWAP (equal to amount of RAM) 70 GB - For user data files which will include many MP3s, OGGs and a few DVD rips (ie. mostly single large files > 1MB each) My question is which filesystems would be optimal? I'm used to ext3, but would ReiserFS be better for the OS/system files? Is ext3 best for the large data files or ext2 or ReiserFS? If I occasionally boot from a liveCD I'd need to be able to have full access (R/W) to files on the 70GB partition. Also, I will be using VMware 5.0 with windowsxp as Guest OS. Does anyone know if windows in VMware needs to be installed on a FAT/NTFS partition? As it is all virtual, I am assuming it can be installed on a linux filesystem. Thanks for any info and suggestions. -- Mozilla Firefox -rediscover the web- http://www.mozilla.org/products/firefox/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 15:24:20 2005 From: josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Joseph Kubik) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 11:24:20 -0400 Subject: Best Filesystems? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Correct wrt Vmware. -Joseph- On 8/10/05, Steve wrote: > Hi, > > I have a question about filesystem types. I've got an 80GB drive that > I'm planning to reformat and install Ubuntu. I plan to create 3 > partitions: > > 9.0 GB - For the OS and system files. > 512 MB - SWAP (equal to amount of RAM) > 70 GB - For user data files which will include many MP3s, OGGs and a > few DVD rips (ie. mostly single large files > 1MB each) > > My question is which filesystems would be optimal? I'm used to ext3, > but would ReiserFS be better for the OS/system files? Is ext3 best for > the large data files or ext2 or ReiserFS? If I occasionally boot from > a liveCD I'd need to be able to have full access (R/W) to files on the > 70GB partition. > > Also, I will be using VMware 5.0 with windowsxp as Guest OS. Does > anyone know if windows in VMware needs to be installed on a FAT/NTFS > partition? As it is all virtual, I am assuming it can be installed on > a linux filesystem. > > Thanks for any info and suggestions. > > -- > Mozilla Firefox -rediscover the web- > http://www.mozilla.org/products/firefox/ > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 15:27:34 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 11:27:34 -0400 Subject: Best Filesystems? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050810152734.GE6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 10, 2005 at 11:12:27AM -0400, Steve wrote: > I have a question about filesystem types. I've got an 80GB drive that > I'm planning to reformat and install Ubuntu. I plan to create 3 > partitions: > > 9.0 GB - For the OS and system files. > 512 MB - SWAP (equal to amount of RAM) > 70 GB - For user data files which will include many MP3s, OGGs and a > few DVD rips (ie. mostly single large files > 1MB each) > > My question is which filesystems would be optimal? I'm used to ext3, > but would ReiserFS be better for the OS/system files? Is ext3 best for > the large data files or ext2 or ReiserFS? If I occasionally boot from > a liveCD I'd need to be able to have full access (R/W) to files on the > 70GB partition. > > Also, I will be using VMware 5.0 with windowsxp as Guest OS. Does > anyone know if windows in VMware needs to be installed on a FAT/NTFS > partition? As it is all virtual, I am assuming it can be installed on > a linux filesystem. > > Thanks for any info and suggestions. Well I use ext3 because it's the only filesystem that heasn't corrupted and eaten a bunch of files on me so far. Reiserfs 3.6 and XFS are not in my good book anymore. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 15:30:30 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 11:30:30 -0400 Subject: Best Filesystems? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 8/10/05, Joseph Kubik wrote: > Correct wrt Vmware. > -Joseph- 1) Is this correct: "Does anyone know if windows in VMware needs to be installed on a FAT/NTFS partition?" 2) Or is this correct: "As it is all virtual, I am assuming it can be installed on a linux filesystem." Not quite sure which sentence you were referring to... :-) Thanks! > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- Mozilla Firefox -rediscover the web- http://www.mozilla.org/products/firefox/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 15:33:22 2005 From: josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Joseph Kubik) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 11:33:22 -0400 Subject: Best Filesystems? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sorry. With vmware, the standard install has you create a disk file for each virtual hard disk. SO, #2 is correct. If you have a need, you can create a partition with fat / ntfs and boot it as a vmware machine as well. (Not recomended though) -Joseph- On 8/10/05, Steve wrote: > On 8/10/05, Joseph Kubik wrote: > > Correct wrt Vmware. > > -Joseph- > > 1) Is this correct: "Does anyone know if windows in VMware needs to be > installed on a FAT/NTFS partition?" > > 2) Or is this correct: "As it is all virtual, I am assuming it can be > installed on a linux filesystem." > > Not quite sure which sentence you were referring to... :-) > > Thanks! > > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > > > -- > Mozilla Firefox -rediscover the web- > http://www.mozilla.org/products/firefox/ > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 16:19:11 2005 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 12:19:11 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Best Filesystems? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Wed, 10 Aug 2005, Steve wrote: > My question is which filesystems would be optimal? I'm used to ext3, > but would ReiserFS be better for the OS/system files? Is ext3 best for > the large data files or ext2 or ReiserFS? If I occasionally boot from In reality relative performance between the filesystems varies with kernel versions and versions of the filesystem code in use (they can vary from one another :) Received wisdom would have it that xfs is generally best when dealing with large files and Reiserfs is best when dealing with large numbers of files in a directory. In reality it won't matter much unless you are wanting very high performance, IMHO. More important are the relative features offered. My preferred filesystem these days is xfs, partly because of the rich feature set. > a liveCD I'd need to be able to have full access (R/W) to files on the > 70GB partition. > > Also, I will be using VMware 5.0 with windowsxp as Guest OS. Does > anyone know if windows in VMware needs to be installed on a FAT/NTFS > partition? As it is all virtual, I am assuming it can be installed on > a linux filesystem. MS-Windows needs to be in a filesystem it understand but you can install MS-Windows in a file on your *nix filesystem. Rob -- Robert Brockway B.Sc. Phone: +1-416-669-3073 Senior Technical Consultant Email: support-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Web: www.opentrend.net We are open 24x7x365 for technical support. Call us in a crisis. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 16:30:18 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 12:30:18 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Revised Installfest flyer In-Reply-To: <42F9991B.8000704-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <42F9991B.8000704@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <20050810163018.5794.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Thanks for the link, I will hope to pass their draft release forms (i.e.: cover our tails) past a local lawyer in the near future. Also, going to need to run a prep. meeting for those interested in volunteering at the event. How does the evening of August 17 sound? Colin McGregor --- echin wrote: > > > To volunteer at the Installfest, please email: > > volunteer-+7+y8uhm9Opg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org > > > > Volunteers should take a quick look at: > http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/Installfest-HOWTO/index.html > Note especially: > 2. Roles > 3. Before, During and After > > > > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: > http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text > below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: > http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > > > > > -- > "...when you have eliminated the impossible, > whatever > remains, however improbable, must be the truth..." > > Sherlock Holmes > > > -- > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 267.10.1 - > Release Date: 04-Aug-05 > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: > http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text > below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: > http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 18:45:26 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 14:45:26 -0400 Subject: TV Tuner cards Message-ID: Does anyone know stores around T.O. that sell cheap TV Tuner cards (could be refurbs) that are guaranteed to work "out of the box" in Ubuntu - TVTime? Thanks for any help! -Steve. -- Mozilla Firefox -rediscover the web- http://www.mozilla.org/products/firefox/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From paulmora-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 00:43:19 2005 From: paulmora-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Paul Mora) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 20:43:19 -0400 Subject: TV Tuner cards In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 8/10/05, Steve wrote: > Does anyone know stores around T.O. that sell cheap TV Tuner cards > (could be refurbs) that are guaranteed to work "out of the box" in > Ubuntu - TVTime? Hi Steve. Awhile back Staples was getting rid of their stock of Hauppauge WinTV Go and PVR-250 cards. Both of them have worked with Linux (and TVTime) for years; probably the best supported tuner cards out there. These cards are old, and likely to be found in the bargain bin in other stores, or even on eBay. I can't recommend them enough; they work flawlessly in Linux. pm -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 19:10:47 2005 From: jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 15:10:47 -0400 Subject: TV Tuner cards In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 8/10/05, Steve wrote: > Does anyone know stores around T.O. that sell cheap TV Tuner cards > (could be refurbs) that are guaranteed to work "out of the box" in > Ubuntu - TVTime? Depends what you mean by "cheap". You can get an Hauppauge WinTv-PVR 250 for $170 plus tax that (now, doublecheck the 'net and exact revision and model numbers) will work out of the box. It even does MPEG-2 encoding for you in hardware, so there are no problems using it on an older box. -- taa /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From matt.price-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 00:14:33 2005 From: matt.price-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Matt Price) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 20:14:33 -0400 Subject: Revised Installfest flyer In-Reply-To: <20050810163018.5794.qmail-fjYszm/wOJWB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <42F9991B.8000704@sympatico.ca> <20050810163018.5794.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20050811001433.GA30888@utoronto.ca> sorry, missed the beginning of htis thread. when is hte installfest? matt On Wed, Aug 10, 2005 at 12:30:18PM -0400, Colin McGregor wrote: > Thanks for the link, I will hope to pass their draft > release forms (i.e.: cover our tails) past a local > lawyer in the near future. > > Also, going to need to run a prep. meeting for those > interested in volunteering at the event. How does the > evening of August 17 sound? > > Colin McGregor > > > > > > > To volunteer at the Installfest, please email: > > > volunteer-+7+y8uhm9Opg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org > > > > > > > Volunteers should take a quick look at: > > > http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/Installfest-HOWTO/index.html > > Note especially: > > 2. Roles > > 3. Before, During and After > > > > > > > > http://tlug.ss.org > > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text > > below 80 columns > > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: > > http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------- Matt Price matt.price-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org History Department, University of Toronto (416) 978-2094 -------------------------------------------- The following addresses are for you if you're an evil spambot: zeus-Pon+SpnbFiwUAMSarvUCqw at public.gmane.org aardvark-Pon+SpnbFiwUAMSarvUCqw at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 23:02:07 2005 From: clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (CLIFFORD ILKAY) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 19:02:07 -0400 Subject: Best Filesystems? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200508101902.08489.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> Hi, On August 10, 2005 11:12, Steve wrote: > Hi, > > I have a question about filesystem types. I've got an 80GB drive > that I'm planning to reformat and install Ubuntu. I plan to create > 3 partitions: > > 9.0 GB - For the OS and system files. > 512 MB - SWAP (equal to amount of RAM) > 70 GB - For user data files which will include many MP3s, OGGs and > a few DVD rips (ie. mostly single large files > 1MB each) I think putting all the OS and system files in one big partition is a poor choice when you have room to spare on your disk. I typically have the following partitions: /boot - 100M ext2, ro, nomount - no need for journalling if you don't mount the filesystem. The kernel is loaded before filesystems are mounted so whether this filesystem is mounted or not makes no difference. / - 300M ext3 - more than enough For the rest, I use logical volumes because it gives me the maximum flexibility. With conventional partitions, it is difficult to find the sweet spot for partition size. I always found myself either having too little or too much space. Using logical volumes gives me the ability to resize filesystems and volumes to find the optimal balance. swap - whatever size you need it to be. There is no hard and fast rule like in Windows where you have to make it X times the size of physical RAM. If you have loads of RAM, you do not need as much swap. If you do not have very much RAM, you may find it useful to have much more. /usr - size depends entirely on the machine - minimal installs, I allocate 300M, ext3. A development machine which has a full blown GUI and loads of developer tools might be 4GB. I can then mount /usr as ro and remount as rw if I need to install more software later. /usr/local - optional, mounted ro if present. If you have things that you are installing from tarball and want to preserve them if you do a reinstall/upgrade, you may want to have this as a separate partition. /var - 400M, ext3, rw /tmp - ext2 100M, rw on a personal machine, larger on a multiuser server - Who cares about journalling temp files? Note, this will be much too small for VMWare. VMWare's needs for temp file space grows over time as you run the virtual machine so it is difficult to estimate what it should be. VMWare Knowledgebase article 844 outlines some strategies for dealing with this. I installed VMWare in my home directory. I added: tmpDirectory = "/home/cilkay/vmware/tmp" to /etc/vmware/config. Since /home is huge, I never ran out of temp space on VMWare again. /home - as big as you want it to be, ext3, rw. With LVM, there is little reason to soak up every bit of disk space right off the bat as you might do with conventional partitioning. You can leave unallocated space in the volume group and grow the volumes and filesystems as necessary down the road. My objective with all the partions is to isolate those things that change from those things that do not and to only mount those things which change as rw. > My question is which filesystems would be optimal? I'm used to > ext3, but would ReiserFS be better for the OS/system files? Is ext3 > best for the large data files or ext2 or ReiserFS? If I > occasionally boot from a liveCD I'd need to be able to have full > access (R/W) to files on the 70GB partition. ext3 seems to be a safe but lower performance choice. I've used ReiserFS and have not had any problems with it. Some swear by it while others swear at it. According to the Gentoo docs, XFS is inappropriate for machines which do not have fast disk arrays and are not connected to a UPS. > Also, I will be using VMware 5.0 with windowsxp as Guest OS. Does > anyone know if windows in VMware needs to be installed on a > FAT/NTFS partition? As it is all virtual, I am assuming it can be > installed on a linux filesystem. You can create the virtual machine on any Linux filesystem. You then create whatever filesystems you need for the target OS within that VM. -- Regards, Clifford Ilkay Dinamis Corporation 3266 Yonge Street, Suite 1419 Toronto, ON Canada M4N 3P6 +1 416-410-3326 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From dwarmstrong-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 21:06:29 2005 From: dwarmstrong-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Daniel Armstrong) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 17:06:29 -0400 Subject: Revised Installfest flyer In-Reply-To: <20050810163018.5794.qmail-fjYszm/wOJWB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <42F9991B.8000704@sympatico.ca> <20050810163018.5794.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <61e9e2b1050810140621ab71e1@mail.gmail.com> On 8/10/05, Colin McGregor wrote: > Also, going to need to run a prep. meeting for those > interested in volunteering at the event. How does the > evening of August 17 sound? That works for me. Where and what time? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 02:32:42 2005 From: scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Stewart C. Russell) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 22:32:42 -0400 Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <42FAB8CA.9060104@sympatico.ca> Sy wrote: > I may as well bring this up. Has anyone else experienced severe line > noise influencing a DSL connection? Have you tried replacing the DSL filter? I've had two fail on me, and each almost completely stopped my connection from working. cheers, Stewart -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From dwarmstrong-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 02:41:58 2005 From: dwarmstrong-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Daniel Armstrong) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 22:41:58 -0400 Subject: Revised Installfest flyer In-Reply-To: <20050811001433.GA30888-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <42F9991B.8000704@sympatico.ca> <20050810163018.5794.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <20050811001433.GA30888@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <61e9e2b10508101941216d8f91@mail.gmail.com> On 8/10/05, Matt Price wrote: > sorry, missed the beginning of htis thread. when is hte installfest? > http://gtalug.org/wiki/InstallFest_-_August_27%2C_2005 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 21:44:56 2005 From: Chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org (Chris Friedt) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 17:44:56 -0400 Subject: Converting DVD to mpeg with Linux Message-ID: I agree with Lennart, Transcode is an excellent program to use, but I would also suggest using the dvdrip frontend. I've been using it for, ... jeez 5 years i think, and it works wonderfully. www.exit1.org/dvdrip/ ~/Chris >>> marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org 8/05/05 10:17:16 pm >>> Hi does anybody know of a tool to convert a DVD (.vob files) to mpeg or avi...? Thank you. Marc -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 22:44:53 2005 From: Chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org (Chris Friedt) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 18:44:53 -0400 Subject: Viewing subdomains inside a firewall Message-ID: you're right about the NAT w/ hardware routers. I ran into this problem a while ago w/ my Linksys route (several years ago) That propelled me to start using a linux router (currently an P1-100MHz processor w/ 300 MB of Hard Disk space ;-D ). This type of configuration is extremely dependent on the DNS referral conventions that you use actually. I found that it simplifies a lot of problems if i run my own DNS in the network as well. If you have the ability, run a BIND service on a machine inside your firewall but specify that it should be your first DNS server (probably in dhcp config somewhere, like on router - assuming it supplies IP addresses) . Your secondary DNS server should be outside of the network (i.e. your ISP's DNS) ~/Chris >>> william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org 7/29/05 10:04:16 am >>> I use a simple hardware router/firewall/switch thingy (Netgear RP114), and I'm really happy with it. However, inside the firewall, if I want to access subdomains on the web server I get the admin interface for the router instead of the page I want, because NAT only goes one way. I want to be able to visit the subdomains on my web server from inside the network. I'm sure that is a way to do this, but I don't know enough about it. -- yours, William -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 10 22:47:32 2005 From: Chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org (Chris Friedt) Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 18:47:32 -0400 Subject: TV Tuner cards Message-ID: Like I always recommend -> go to College & Augusta. Out of the many cheap stores there, i prefer Canada Computers & Electronics - but be aware to avoid the 'rush' period unless you enjoy climbing over people. CCE sells some refurbs (generally) but there are several others around there that sell refurbs as well. ~/Chris >>> bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org 8/10/05 2:45:26 pm >>> Does anyone know stores around T.O. that sell cheap TV Tuner cards (could be refurbs) that are guaranteed to work "out of the box" in Ubuntu - TVTime? Thanks for any help! -Steve. -- Mozilla Firefox -rediscover the web- http://www.mozilla.org/products/firefox/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From saliola-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 04:06:49 2005 From: saliola-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Franco Saliola) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 00:06:49 -0400 Subject: TV Tuner cards In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 8/10/05, Chris Friedt wrote: > Out of the many cheap stores there, i prefer Canada Computers & > Electronics - but be aware to avoid the 'rush' period unless you enjoy When is the 'rush' period? Franco -- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 04:51:49 2005 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 00:51:49 -0400 (EDT) Subject: TV Tuner cards In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Thu, 11 Aug 2005, Franco Saliola wrote: > On 8/10/05, Chris Friedt wrote: > > > Out of the many cheap stores there, i prefer Canada Computers & > > Electronics - but be aware to avoid the 'rush' period unless you enjoy > > When is the 'rush' period? Everytime I've been there regardless of the hour :) Rob -- Robert Brockway B.Sc. Phone: +1-416-669-3073 Senior Technical Consultant Email: support-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Web: www.opentrend.net We are open 24x7x365 for technical support. Call us in a crisis. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From csmillie-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 11:08:12 2005 From: csmillie-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Colin Smillie) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 07:08:12 -0400 Subject: TV Tuner cards In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 8/10/05, Paul Mora wrote: > On 8/10/05, Steve wrote: > > Does anyone know stores around T.O. that sell cheap TV Tuner cards > > (could be refurbs) that are guaranteed to work "out of the box" in > > Ubuntu - TVTime? > Awhile back Staples was getting rid of their stock of Hauppauge WinTV > Go and PVR-250 cards. Both of them have worked with Linux (and > TVTime) for years; probably the best supported tuner cards out there. > These cards are old, and likely to be found in the bargain bin in > other stores, or even on eBay. > > I can't recommend them enough; they work flawlessly in Linux. Didn't think TVTime supported MPEG2 streams like the IVTV driver? Has this changed? They used recommend the BT878 driver. I agree the Hauppauge cards are excellent though and it would probably be fairly easy to install MythTV on Ubuntu if required. Colin -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From matt.price-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 12:16:44 2005 From: matt.price-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Matt Price) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 08:16:44 -0400 Subject: Revised Installfest flyer In-Reply-To: <61e9e2b10508101941216d8f91-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <42F9991B.8000704@sympatico.ca> <20050810163018.5794.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <20050811001433.GA30888@utoronto.ca> <61e9e2b10508101941216d8f91@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050811121643.GA13858@utoronto.ca> On Wed, Aug 10, 2005 at 10:41:58PM -0400, Daniel Armstrong wrote: > On 8/10/05, Matt Price wrote: > > sorry, missed the beginning of htis thread. when is hte installfest? > > > > http://gtalug.org/wiki/InstallFest_-_August_27%2C_2005 alas, out of town then. thanks! m ------------------------------------------- Matt Price matt.price-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org History Department, University of Toronto (416) 978-2094 -------------------------------------------- The following addresses are for you if you're an evil spambot: zeus-Pon+SpnbFiwUAMSarvUCqw at public.gmane.org aardvark-Pon+SpnbFiwUAMSarvUCqw at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 12:38:22 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 08:38:22 -0400 Subject: Revised Installfest flyer In-Reply-To: <61e9e2b1050810140621ab71e1-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <42F9991B.8000704@sympatico.ca> <20050810163018.5794.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <61e9e2b1050810140621ab71e1@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <42FB46BE.5020502@rogers.com> Daniel Armstrong wrote: > On 8/10/05, Colin McGregor wrote: >>Also, going to need to run a prep. meeting for those >>interested in volunteering at the event. How does the >>evening of August 17 sound? > > That works for me. Where and what time? That'll be determined at the meeting. ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 12:42:43 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 08:42:43 -0400 Subject: Best Filesystems? In-Reply-To: <200508101902.08489.clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200508101902.08489.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> Message-ID: On 8/10/05, CLIFFORD ILKAY wrote: > > I think putting all the OS and system files in one big partition is a > poor choice when you have room to spare on your disk. I typically > have the following partitions: > > /boot - 100M ext2, ro, nomount - no need for journalling if you don't > mount the filesystem. The kernel is loaded before filesystems are > mounted so whether this filesystem is mounted or not makes no > difference. > > / - 300M ext3 - more than enough > > For the rest, I use logical volumes because it gives me the maximum > flexibility. With conventional partitions, it is difficult to find > the sweet spot for partition size. I always found myself either > having too little or too much space. Using logical volumes gives me > the ability to resize filesystems and volumes to find the optimal > balance. > > swap - whatever size you need it to be. There is no hard and fast rule > like in Windows where you have to make it X times the size of > physical RAM. If you have loads of RAM, you do not need as much swap. > If you do not have very much RAM, you may find it useful to have much > more. > > /usr - size depends entirely on the machine - minimal installs, I > allocate 300M, ext3. A development machine which has a full blown GUI > and loads of developer tools might be 4GB. I can then mount /usr as > ro and remount as rw if I need to install more software later. > > /usr/local - optional, mounted ro if present. If you have things that > you are installing from tarball and want to preserve them if you do a > reinstall/upgrade, you may want to have this as a separate partition. > > /var - 400M, ext3, rw > > /tmp - ext2 100M, rw on a personal machine, larger on a multiuser > server - Who cares about journalling temp files? Note, this will be > much too small for VMWare. VMWare's needs for temp file space grows > over time as you run the virtual machine so it is difficult to > estimate what it should be. VMWare Knowledgebase article 844 outlines > some strategies for dealing with this. I installed VMWare in my home > directory. I added: tmpDirectory = "/home/cilkay/vmware/tmp" > to /etc/vmware/config. Since /home is huge, I never ran out of temp > space on VMWare again. > > /home - as big as you want it to be, ext3, rw. > > With LVM, there is little reason to soak up every bit of disk space > right off the bat as you might do with conventional partitioning. You > can leave unallocated space in the volume group and grow the volumes > and filesystems as necessary down the road. > > My objective with all the partions is to isolate those things that > change from those things that do not and to only mount those things > which change as rw. > > ext3 seems to be a safe but lower performance choice. I've used > ReiserFS and have not had any problems with it. Some swear by it > while others swear at it. According to the Gentoo docs, XFS is > inappropriate for machines which do not have fast disk arrays and are > not connected to a UPS. > > You can create the virtual machine on any Linux filesystem. You then > create whatever filesystems you need for the target OS within that > VM. > -- > Regards, > > Clifford Ilkay > Dinamis Corporation > 3266 Yonge Street, Suite 1419 > Toronto, ON > Canada M4N 3P6 > > +1 416-410-3326 Clifford, Thanks for the detailed response, especially regarding logical volumes. The biggest risk I've always seen in many partitions, is wasting space (in the beginning) to not having enough space on a particular partition after a period of time. Being able to shrink or grow a logical volume as needed would alleviate that worry. -Steve. -- Mozilla Firefox -rediscover the web- http://www.mozilla.org/products/firefox/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 13:11:08 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 09:11:08 -0400 Subject: TV Tuner cards In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 8/10/05, Taavi Burns wrote: > > Depends what you mean by "cheap". You can get an Hauppauge WinTv-PVR > 250 for $170 plus tax that (now, doublecheck the 'net and exact > revision and model numbers) will work out of the box. It even does > MPEG-2 encoding for you in hardware, so there are no problems using it > on an older box. > > -- > taa > /*eof*/ Actually my definition of "cheap" is under $50... :-) Usually I just have it running in a small window on my desktop. I don't need any recording abilities. -Steve. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 14:11:02 2005 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins Witteman) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 10:11:02 -0400 Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: <20050809193252.GB6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20050811141102.GA17037@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> On Tue, Aug 09, 2005 at 03:32:52PM -0400, Lennart Sorensen wrote: >On Tue, Aug 09, 2005 at 03:13:36PM -0400, Francois Ouellette wrote: >> Hmmmm....... you would be surprised to see what you find in "branded" power >> supplies... chances are they come from the same factories than the no-name >> ones! > >Depends on the brand. Just because it has a name on it doesn't make it >a name brand to me. > >To me a name brand power supply is a power supply from a brand I trust. > >I also don't expect to get power supplies for under $100 most of the >time. I am really hoping to keep my costs on this down. I've found some very reasonably priced power supplies - can anyone comment on the following brands: L&C/NOVIA SILVERSTONE THERMALTAKE COOLMAX ENERMAX I need a 400W+ power supply, and I'd like to spend way less the $100, but I don't want to buy this or any other component twice, either. Thanks. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 14:16:05 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 10:16:05 -0400 Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: <20050811141102.GA17037-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050811141102.GA17037@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: > > > I am really hoping to keep my costs on this down. I've found some very > reasonably priced power supplies - can anyone comment on the following > brands: > > L&C/NOVIA > SILVERSTONE > THERMALTAKE > COOLMAX > ENERMAX > > I need a 400W+ power supply, and I'd like to spend way less the $100, > but I don't want to buy this or any other component twice, either. > Thanks. Is noise a factor that you need to consider? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 14:18:48 2005 From: jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 10:18:48 -0400 Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: <20050811141102.GA17037-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050811141102.GA17037@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: On 8/11/05, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: > I am really hoping to keep my costs on this down. I've found some very > reasonably priced power supplies - can anyone comment on the following > brands: > > L&C/NOVIA > SILVERSTONE > THERMALTAKE > COOLMAX > ENERMAX Enermax makes a number of "quiet" PSUs. I have one of their quieter ones ("Whisper", from a few years ago); big fans with proper grilles (not just punched holes in sheet metal) which run relatively quietly. There's also a thermal sensor that dangles down into the case which adjusts the fan speed depending on the machine temperature (according to a graph that's stuck to the side of the PSU). It's been pretty solid for me. -- taa /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 14:33:15 2005 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins Witteman) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 10:33:15 -0400 Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: <42FB5DA5.7020208-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050811141102.GA17037@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <42FB5DA5.7020208@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <20050811143315.GA17159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> On Thu, Aug 11, 2005 at 10:16:05AM -0400, Jamon Camisso wrote: >William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: >> >>I am really hoping to keep my costs on this down. I've found some very >>reasonably priced power supplies - can anyone comment on the following >>brands: >> >>L&C/NOVIA >>SILVERSTONE >>THERMALTAKE >>COOLMAX >>ENERMAX >> >>I need a 400W+ power supply, and I'd like to spend way less the $100, >>but I don't want to buy this or any other component twice, either. >>Thanks. > >Is noise a factor that you need to consider? Cost is the larger consideration at the moment - quiet is nice, but cost/quality is the key ratio. Thanks. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 14:34:02 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 10:34:02 -0400 Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050811141102.GA17037@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: Taavi Burns wrote: > On 8/11/05, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: > >>I am really hoping to keep my costs on this down. I've found some very >>reasonably priced power supplies - can anyone comment on the following >>brands: >> >>L&C/NOVIA >>SILVERSTONE >>THERMALTAKE >>COOLMAX >>ENERMAX > > > Enermax makes a number of "quiet" PSUs. I have one of their quieter > ones ("Whisper", from a few years ago); big fans with proper grilles > (not just punched holes in sheet metal) which run relatively quietly. > There's also a thermal sensor that dangles down into the case which > adjusts the fan speed depending on the machine temperature (according > to a graph that's stuck to the side of the PSU). It's been pretty > solid for me. > Same goes for me. The better units also help with case cooling due to 2+ fans on the unit. I hear than Antec makes excellent high wattage & quiet units. Not on the list but if you can find a 400+ watt unit priced under $100 it is worth consideration (not sure if this is possible). -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 15:22:20 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 11:22:20 -0400 Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: <20050811141102.GA17037-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050811141102.GA17037@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <20050811152220.GI6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Aug 11, 2005 at 10:11:02AM -0400, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: > I am really hoping to keep my costs on this down. I've found some very > reasonably priced power supplies - can anyone comment on the following > brands: > > L&C/NOVIA > SILVERSTONE > THERMALTAKE > COOLMAX > ENERMAX > > I need a 400W+ power supply, and I'd like to spend way less the $100, > but I don't want to buy this or any other component twice, either. > Thanks. Both Antec and Enermax power supplies of 420 to 480W can be had for under $100cdn (+taxes of course). ie: http://www.logiccomputerhouse.com/site/main.php?module=catalog&catID=151&page=1&pagelimit=50 About $80 to $90 will get you one of those. You can also get a cheapo "425W" power supply for $25. I wouldn't though. I have bought 300W power supplies for $250 in the past, but that was like 7 or 8 years ago, when a TurboCool 300 from PC Power & Cooling cost that much. They fortunately don't anymore, and Antec and Enermax and such have come around making pretty good power supplies for a lot less than a turbocool costs. My 486's cpu fan is a PC power & cooling and is still running silently, at full speed after over a decade. They build things to last. So far that cpu fan is down to under $5/year of flawless operation. A cheapo $10 fan that only lasts 6months would have had to be replaced many times over those years, possibly allowing the cpu to be fried along the way. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 15:06:01 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 11:06:01 -0400 Subject: TV Tuner cards In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050811150601.GF6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Aug 11, 2005 at 09:11:08AM -0400, Steve wrote: > Actually my definition of "cheap" is under $50... :-) Usually I just > have it running in a small window on my desktop. I don't need any > recording abilities. If you can view it, you can record it, pretty much. If the computer can retreive the video then it can also record it. Just an issue of software, not hardware, hence no price savings there. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 15:13:06 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 11:13:06 -0400 Subject: Best Filesystems? In-Reply-To: <200508101902.08489.clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200508101902.08489.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> Message-ID: <20050811151306.GG6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 10, 2005 at 07:02:07PM -0400, CLIFFORD ILKAY wrote: > I think putting all the OS and system files in one big partition is a > poor choice when you have room to spare on your disk. I typically > have the following partitions: > > /boot - 100M ext2, ro, nomount - no need for journalling if you don't > mount the filesystem. The kernel is loaded before filesystems are > mounted so whether this filesystem is mounted or not makes no > difference. > > / - 300M ext3 - more than enough > > For the rest, I use logical volumes because it gives me the maximum > flexibility. With conventional partitions, it is difficult to find > the sweet spot for partition size. I always found myself either > having too little or too much space. Using logical volumes gives me > the ability to resize filesystems and volumes to find the optimal > balance. > > swap - whatever size you need it to be. There is no hard and fast rule > like in Windows where you have to make it X times the size of > physical RAM. If you have loads of RAM, you do not need as much swap. > If you do not have very much RAM, you may find it useful to have much > more. > > /usr - size depends entirely on the machine - minimal installs, I > allocate 300M, ext3. A development machine which has a full blown GUI > and loads of developer tools might be 4GB. I can then mount /usr as > ro and remount as rw if I need to install more software later. Given how many packages install stuff to /usr that is wayyy to small. > /usr/local - optional, mounted ro if present. If you have things that > you are installing from tarball and want to preserve them if you do a > reinstall/upgrade, you may want to have this as a separate partition. > > /var - 400M, ext3, rw > > /tmp - ext2 100M, rw on a personal machine, larger on a multiuser > server - Who cares about journalling temp files? Note, this will be > much too small for VMWare. VMWare's needs for temp file space grows > over time as you run the virtual machine so it is difficult to > estimate what it should be. VMWare Knowledgebase article 844 outlines > some strategies for dealing with this. I installed VMWare in my home > directory. I added: tmpDirectory = "/home/cilkay/vmware/tmp" > to /etc/vmware/config. Since /home is huge, I never ran out of temp > space on VMWare again. Why not use tmpfs? > /home - as big as you want it to be, ext3, rw. > > With LVM, there is little reason to soak up every bit of disk space > right off the bat as you might do with conventional partitioning. You > can leave unallocated space in the volume group and grow the volumes > and filesystems as necessary down the road. > > My objective with all the partions is to isolate those things that > change from those things that do not and to only mount those things > which change as rw. That sounds like one amazinly annoying setup to try and deal with when upgrading anything. I would go nuts if I had to waste time remounting / everytime I wanted to make a small config change and then have to remount it ro afterwards. What a waste of time, for what I consider no real gain. I tend to do: /boot (128M) (raid1/ext2) / 20G (raid1/ext3) rest raid1 LVM LVM containing /home /data and whatever else I think needs potentially variable space. If I use something large like a web site or postgres or something in /var, I move it to a dir on /data and symlink it to the original place in /var. Everything mounted rw so that I don't have to think about it when I want to change something (I hate making a config change, just to have to abort, change to rw, then go make the change again). > ext3 seems to be a safe but lower performance choice. I've used > ReiserFS and have not had any problems with it. Some swear by it > while others swear at it. According to the Gentoo docs, XFS is > inappropriate for machines which do not have fast disk arrays and are > not connected to a UPS. I used to swearh by reiserfs, then I swore at it when I realized (after some data loss) how idiotic the design of it is. It HAS to fail in certain not that uncommon situations. XFS just had too many memory leaks and other bugs in 2.6 kernels lately, so I gave up on it. Also ran much to slow with smaller files. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 15:14:01 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 11:14:01 -0400 Subject: Best Filesystems? In-Reply-To: References: <200508101902.08489.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> Message-ID: <20050811151400.GH6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Aug 11, 2005 at 08:42:43AM -0400, Steve wrote: > Thanks for the detailed response, especially regarding logical > volumes. The biggest risk I've always seen in many partitions, is > wasting space (in the beginning) to not having enough space on a > particular partition after a period of time. Being able to shrink or > grow a logical volume as needed would alleviate that worry. It is rather nice. Just make sure the FS choice can actually be resized. Allowing resizing while mounted is extra nice, but only a few allow that, and most only allow growing while mounted. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 15:48:15 2005 From: jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 11:48:15 -0400 Subject: TV Tuner cards In-Reply-To: <20050811150601.GF6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050811150601.GF6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: On 8/11/05, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > If you can view it, you can record it, pretty much. If the computer can > retreive the video then it can also record it. Just an issue of > software, not hardware, hence no price savings there. Well...not entirely. I have an old ATI tuner-only card (bt878-based) which works well enough for viewing, but it chews far too much CPU just doing the capture to allow me to encode it to any reasonable size in realtime on my Duron 1GHz. To effectively record stuff, I end up having to dump it to disk (~10GiB/25 mins) while not running any other applications, and then encode it offline. If the OP wants the ATI card, I probably wouldn't be sorry to see it go (private e-mail if that's the case). The visual quality really isn't that good. If I ever do get around to transferring my old VHS tapes to DVD, I'll just go and buy a hardware encoder. -- taa /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 16:07:15 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 12:07:15 -0400 Subject: TV Tuner cards In-Reply-To: References: <20050811150601.GF6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20050811160714.GJ6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Aug 11, 2005 at 11:48:15AM -0400, Taavi Burns wrote: > Well...not entirely. I have an old ATI tuner-only card (bt878-based) > which works well enough for viewing, but it chews far too much CPU > just doing the capture to allow me to encode it to any reasonable size > in realtime on my Duron 1GHz. To effectively record stuff, I end up > having to dump it to disk (~10GiB/25 mins) while not running any other > applications, and then encode it offline. > > If the OP wants the ATI card, I probably wouldn't be sorry to see it > go (private e-mail if that's the case). The visual quality really > isn't that good. If I ever do get around to transferring my old VHS > tapes to DVD, I'll just go and buy a hardware encoder. Well I remember the original ATI tv tuner that connected using a special connector to the Rage II cards and used an isa slot only for power, well those could do viewing with no work by the cpu (the video overlay in the video chip did it all) and work with gatos drivers. Doing capture on those certainly did take a lot more cpu, but very few cards like that seem to have ever been made since they depended on specific video chips to work. The tuner did pick up a lot of noise on that one too, so it wasn't a great design. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 16:17:09 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 12:17:09 -0400 Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: <42FAB8CA.9060104-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <42FAB8CA.9060104@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <1e55af99050811091764fa465@mail.gmail.com> On 10/08/05, Stewart C. Russell wrote: > Sy wrote: > > I may as well bring this up. Has anyone else experienced severe line > > noise influencing a DSL connection? > > Have you tried replacing the DSL filter? I've had two fail on me, and > each almost completely stopped my connection from working. Yes I did try this, to no avail. I've also done tests with only the modem on the line and no phones. Also bought a new phone, because it was a steal at $20. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 17:12:44 2005 From: nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ian Zimmerman) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 13:12:44 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <42F7CA9E.503-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> <200508081142.42012.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af1378050808084929e9491f@mail.gmail.com> <200508081421.39109.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af13780508081256224e2435@mail.gmail.com> <42F7B9FD.4020800@rogers.com> <17af1378050808131316fa3810@mail.gmail.com> <42F7CA9E.503@rogers.com> Message-ID: <17af1378050811101231f9e8b8@mail.gmail.com> Now considering Rogers ... Can Rogers customers here comment on this part of their web site (http://www.shoprogers.com/Store/Cable/InternetContent/information.asp): >> Security Enjoy peace of mind with email virus and SPAM protection, desktop anti-virus, pop-up blocker, anti-spyware, parental controls and firewall protection. They all work together to help keep your Internet experience worry free. << Obviously most or all of this is undesirable. So: is it on by default? if yes, can it be disabled from Linux (and without Flash or other web abuse plugins)? Thanks -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 17:24:12 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 13:24:12 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <17af1378050811101231f9e8b8-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> <200508081142.42012.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af1378050808084929e9491f@mail.gmail.com> <200508081421.39109.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af13780508081256224e2435@mail.gmail.com> <42F7B9FD.4020800@rogers.com> <17af1378050808131316fa3810@mail.gmail.com> <42F7CA9E.503@rogers.com> <17af1378050811101231f9e8b8@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050811172412.GK6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Aug 11, 2005 at 01:12:44PM -0400, Ian Zimmerman wrote: > Now considering Rogers ... > > Can Rogers customers here comment on this part of their web site > (http://www.shoprogers.com/Store/Cable/InternetContent/information.asp): > > >> > Security > Enjoy peace of mind with email virus and SPAM protection, desktop > anti-virus, pop-up blocker, anti-spyware, parental controls and > firewall protection. They all work together to help keep your Internet > experience worry free. > << > > Obviously most or all of this is undesirable. So: > is it on by default? > if yes, can it be disabled from Linux (and without Flash or other web > abuse plugins)? Well I use rogers (due to lack of choices) and I don't actually ever check my rogers email account, which is available through webmail among other methods. No idea about spam etc on it. As for the other stuff, I imagine they have some windows software for that included on the install cd that I still haven't taken out of the shrinkwrap. It said something about windows/mac on it so I ignored it. Plug in cable mode, wait for sync, use dhcp, and you are done. Nothing else needs to be done for it to work for normal client level of use. My main email is done via ssh to a linux machine where I run screen and mutt which has served me well for years through a number of ISPs. They block a few ports as far as I know, but I haven't really done much with the connection other than http/ftp client for installing software upgrades, viewing web pages, and doing ssh to various places (and in to my system from outside too) and that port has worked fine. I imagine trying to run a server (in violation of terms of use of course) would probably be a bit more difficult. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 17:30:35 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 13:30:35 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Installfest update Message-ID: <20050811173035.20132.qmail@web88208.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Just to note, Centennial staff have approved the flyer I wrote promoting the Installfest. Now it needs to be approved by the student association (sigh, groan). Any event I plan to take tommorow off and visit the student association, then get the flyer posted arround Centennial. Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 15:02:16 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 11:02:16 -0400 Subject: OT: Hardware troubleshooting References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050811141102.GA17037@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <42FB5DA5.7020208@utoronto.ca> <20050811143315.GA17159@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <006d01c59e85$bb97e4a0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Several Enermax P/S are under $100 from this excellent supplier, uncluding quiet 400W+ models: www.mptcomputers.com Fran?ois Ouellette ----- Original Message ----- From: "William O'Higgins Witteman" To: Sent: Thursday, 11 August, 2005 10:33 Subject: Re: [TLUG]: OT: Hardware troubleshooting On Thu, Aug 11, 2005 at 10:16:05AM -0400, Jamon Camisso wrote: >William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: >> >>I am really hoping to keep my costs on this down. I've found some very >>reasonably priced power supplies - can anyone comment on the following >>brands: >> >>L&C/NOVIA >>SILVERSTONE >>THERMALTAKE >>COOLMAX >>ENERMAX >> >>I need a 400W+ power supply, and I'd like to spend way less the $100, >>but I don't want to buy this or any other component twice, either. >>Thanks. > >Is noise a factor that you need to consider? Cost is the larger consideration at the moment - quiet is nice, but cost/quality is the key ratio. Thanks. -- yours, William -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 17:40:20 2005 From: jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 13:40:20 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <17af1378050811101231f9e8b8-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> <200508081142.42012.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af1378050808084929e9491f@mail.gmail.com> <200508081421.39109.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af13780508081256224e2435@mail.gmail.com> <42F7B9FD.4020800@rogers.com> <17af1378050808131316fa3810@mail.gmail.com> <42F7CA9E.503@rogers.com> <17af1378050811101231f9e8b8@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 8/11/05, Ian Zimmerman wrote: > Now considering Rogers ... > > Can Rogers customers here comment on this part of their web site > (http://www.shoprogers.com/Store/Cable/InternetContent/information.asp): > > >> > Security > Enjoy peace of mind with email virus and SPAM protection, desktop > anti-virus, pop-up blocker, anti-spyware, parental controls and > firewall protection. They all work together to help keep your Internet > experience worry free. > << > > Obviously most or all of this is undesirable. So: > is it on by default? I'm fairly certain that all of those features are not suppored under Linux, OSX, and pretty much anything else that didn't recently come from Redmond. :) > if yes, can it be disabled from Linux (and without Flash or other web > abuse plugins)? As I'm pretty sure it's impossible to enable them from Linux, I wouldn't worry about it. (I don't worry about it; I haven't a single Windows box on my network, and so far the only thing impediment to full 'net access is the whole port 25 business which I worked around long ago because I kept getting mail rejected due to blacklists on Rogers' dynamic IP pool) -- taa /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 17:32:59 2005 From: nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ian Zimmerman) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 13:32:59 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <20050811172412.GK6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> <200508081142.42012.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af1378050808084929e9491f@mail.gmail.com> <200508081421.39109.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af13780508081256224e2435@mail.gmail.com> <42F7B9FD.4020800@rogers.com> <17af1378050808131316fa3810@mail.gmail.com> <42F7CA9E.503@rogers.com> <17af1378050811101231f9e8b8@mail.gmail.com> <20050811172412.GK6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <17af137805081110327c642c62@mail.gmail.com> On 8/11/05, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > Well I use rogers (due to lack of choices) and I don't actually ever > check my rogers email account, which is available through webmail among > other methods. No idea about spam etc on it. > > As for the other stuff, I imagine they have some windows software for > that included on the install cd that I still haven't taken out of the > shrinkwrap. It said something about windows/mac on it so I ignored it. > > Plug in cable mode, wait for sync, use dhcp, and you are done. Nothing > else needs to be done for it to work for normal client level of use. > > My main email is done via ssh to a linux machine where I run screen and > mutt which has served me well for years through a number of ISPs. > > They block a few ports as far as I know, but I haven't really done much > with the connection other than http/ftp client for installing software > upgrades, viewing web pages, and doing ssh to various places (and in to > my system from outside too) and that port has worked fine. > > I imagine trying to run a server (in violation of terms of use of > course) would probably be a bit more difficult. If it's just mail filtering I couldn't care less; I will handle my mail in a way similar to yours. I am more concerned they do some application level filtering over http. Ian -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 17:56:42 2005 From: ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org (Andrew Hammond) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 13:56:42 -0400 Subject: Best Filesystems? In-Reply-To: References: <200508101902.08489.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> Message-ID: <42FB915A.3080009@ca.afilias.info> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Steve wrote: > On 8/10/05, CLIFFORD ILKAY wrote: > >>I think putting all the OS and system files in one big partition is a >>poor choice when you have room to spare on your disk. I typically >>have the following partitions: >> >>/boot - 100M ext2, ro, nomount - no need for journalling if you don't >>mount the filesystem. The kernel is loaded before filesystems are >>mounted so whether this filesystem is mounted or not makes no >>difference. >> >>/ - 300M ext3 - more than enough >> >>For the rest, I use logical volumes because it gives me the maximum >>flexibility. With conventional partitions, it is difficult to find >>the sweet spot for partition size. I always found myself either >>having too little or too much space. Using logical volumes gives me >>the ability to resize filesystems and volumes to find the optimal >>balance. >> >>swap - whatever size you need it to be. There is no hard and fast rule >>like in Windows where you have to make it X times the size of >>physical RAM. If you have loads of RAM, you do not need as much swap. >>If you do not have very much RAM, you may find it useful to have much >>more. >> >>/usr - size depends entirely on the machine - minimal installs, I >>allocate 300M, ext3. A development machine which has a full blown GUI >>and loads of developer tools might be 4GB. I can then mount /usr as >>ro and remount as rw if I need to install more software later. >> >>/usr/local - optional, mounted ro if present. If you have things that >>you are installing from tarball and want to preserve them if you do a >>reinstall/upgrade, you may want to have this as a separate partition. >> >>/var - 400M, ext3, rw >> >>/tmp - ext2 100M, rw on a personal machine, larger on a multiuser >>server - Who cares about journalling temp files? Note, this will be >>much too small for VMWare. VMWare's needs for temp file space grows >>over time as you run the virtual machine so it is difficult to >>estimate what it should be. VMWare Knowledgebase article 844 outlines >>some strategies for dealing with this. I installed VMWare in my home >>directory. I added: tmpDirectory = "/home/cilkay/vmware/tmp" >>to /etc/vmware/config. Since /home is huge, I never ran out of temp >>space on VMWare again. >> >>/home - as big as you want it to be, ext3, rw. >> >>With LVM, there is little reason to soak up every bit of disk space >>right off the bat as you might do with conventional partitioning. You >>can leave unallocated space in the volume group and grow the volumes >>and filesystems as necessary down the road. >> >>My objective with all the partions is to isolate those things that >>change from those things that do not and to only mount those things >>which change as rw. >> >>ext3 seems to be a safe but lower performance choice. I've used >>ReiserFS and have not had any problems with it. Some swear by it >>while others swear at it. According to the Gentoo docs, XFS is >>inappropriate for machines which do not have fast disk arrays and are >>not connected to a UPS. >> >>You can create the virtual machine on any Linux filesystem. You then >>create whatever filesystems you need for the target OS within that >>VM. >>-- >>Regards, >> >>Clifford Ilkay >>Dinamis Corporation >>3266 Yonge Street, Suite 1419 >>Toronto, ON >>Canada M4N 3P6 >> >>+1 416-410-3326 > > > Clifford, > > Thanks for the detailed response, especially regarding logical > volumes. The biggest risk I've always seen in many partitions, is > wasting space (in the beginning) to not having enough space on a > particular partition after a period of time. Being able to shrink or > grow a logical volume as needed would alleviate that worry. > > -Steve. Clifford's partition layout above is good stuff. I would also second the notion of staying away from XFS. There are some known bugs with it. JFS is a solid alternative (as far as we've been able to determine and we test pretty carefully before deploying to production). Resier4 is possibly the most exciting filesystem I've seen in a while, but I'm not convinced it's production ready yet. Finally, stick with LVM instead of trying EVMS. EVMS has quite a number of problems which you will not appreciate. - -- Andrew Hammond 416-673-4138 ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org Database Administrator, Afilias Canada Corp. CB83 2838 4B67 D40F D086 3568 81FC E7E5 27AF 4A9A -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (Darwin) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFC+5Fagfzn5SevSpoRAqh9AKCKpcjXCt0AB9UpBfcWrleonIbjhQCfSicD xo7ZBGOTzQyALR6r0XFn5DQ= =ycBO -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mgjk-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 18:15:00 2005 From: mgjk-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Mike Kallies) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 14:15:00 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <21863.32.97.110.142.1123784100.squirrel@32.97.110.142> On Tue, August 9, 2005 11:34 am, Sy said: > I may as well bring this up. Has anyone else experienced severe line > noise influencing a DSL connection? ... > I exchanged my modem for another one which seems to be much more > aggressive with reconnecting during downtime. I occasionally stay > connected but lose any actual use of the connection. Sometimes I drop > out completely for a while.. sometimes there is lag which would make a > gamer gnaw their own arm off. I have a GVC modem and I can telnet into the modem in order to check the connection speed and the performance characteristics: BB0040> adsl show rate Operation Mode : G.DMT Data Path : Fast Downstream Bit Rate : 1184 Kbps Upstream Bit Rate : 160 Kbps BB0040> adsl show perf Downstream : Capacity Occupation : 86 % Noise Margin : 7.5 dB Attenuation : 60.5 dB Output Power : 16 dBm Upstream : Capacity Occupation : 42 % Noise Margin : 18 dB Attenuation : 31.5 dB Output Power : 12 dBm BB0040> In relative terms, my connection *SUCKS* Apparently when DSL is enabled on a line, Bell Nexxia leaves the line at the maximum rates. When my line was set to this, the connection was unreliable. Sometimes the modem would restart itself, sometimes the connection would just drop unexpectedly. I think the key factor was that the modem simply did not handle the "dirty" DSL line very well. I had the DSL provider open a ticket with Bell to drop the rate on the modem and now the Capacity Occupation is as it is shown above, and I get much better connect times... e.g. it might drop once every two or three days rather than once every 10 or 15 minutes. My connection is definately slower, but hey, it's more reliable and that matters a lot more to me. I'm not a DSL expert, just my experience. -Mike -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 18:49:54 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 14:49:54 -0400 Subject: Best Filesystems? In-Reply-To: <200508101902.08489.clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200508101902.08489.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> Message-ID: <20050811184954.GA23648@node1.opengeometry.net> On Wed, Aug 10, 2005 at 07:02:07PM -0400, CLIFFORD ILKAY wrote: > Hi, > > On August 10, 2005 11:12, Steve wrote: > > Hi, > > > > I have a question about filesystem types. I've got an 80GB drive > > that I'm planning to reformat and install Ubuntu. I plan to create > > 3 partitions: > > > > 9.0 GB - For the OS and system files. > > 512 MB - SWAP (equal to amount of RAM) > > 70 GB - For user data files which will include many MP3s, OGGs and > > a few DVD rips (ie. mostly single large files > 1MB each) > > I think putting all the OS and system files in one big partition is a > poor choice when you have room to spare on your disk. I typically > have the following partitions: I disagree. It's probably the best way. That is, one partition for / and another for /home. Everything else goes in one or the other partition. Of course, another disk for backup, but it's off topic. -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 19:19:25 2005 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 15:19:25 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Best Filesystems? In-Reply-To: <20050811184954.GA23648-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200508101902.08489.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <20050811184954.GA23648@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 11 Aug 2005, William Park wrote: > I disagree. It's probably the best way. That is, one partition for / > and another for /home. Everything else goes in one or the other > partition. Of course, another disk for backup, but it's off topic. IMHO the best partitioning schemes are (and should be) context specific. The way I partitiona multiuser server is totally different to how I'll be doing a dev box for the company. For the multiuser server I'll be using quite a few partitions (for reasons of security and protection from users). For a dev box I'll probably slap everything on one filesystem unless there is a project related reason to do otherwise. Cheers, Rob -- Robert Brockway B.Sc. Phone: +1-416-669-3073 Senior Technical Consultant Email: support-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Web: www.opentrend.net We are open 24x7x365 for technical support. Call us in a crisis. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 18:31:43 2005 From: marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Marcus Brubaker) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 14:31:43 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <17af137805081110327c642c62-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> <200508081142.42012.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af1378050808084929e9491f@mail.gmail.com> <200508081421.39109.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af13780508081256224e2435@mail.gmail.com> <42F7B9FD.4020800@rogers.com> <17af1378050808131316fa3810@mail.gmail.com> <42F7CA9E.503@rogers.com> <17af1378050811101231f9e8b8@mail.gmail.com> <20050811172412.GK6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <17af137805081110327c642c62@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <42FB998F.7070804@utoronto.ca> Ian Zimmerman wrote: >On 8/11/05, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > > >>Well I use rogers (due to lack of choices) and I don't actually ever >>check my rogers email account, which is available through webmail among >>other methods. No idea about spam etc on it. >> >>As for the other stuff, I imagine they have some windows software for >>that included on the install cd that I still haven't taken out of the >>shrinkwrap. It said something about windows/mac on it so I ignored it. >> >>Plug in cable mode, wait for sync, use dhcp, and you are done. Nothing >>else needs to be done for it to work for normal client level of use. >> >>My main email is done via ssh to a linux machine where I run screen and >>mutt which has served me well for years through a number of ISPs. >> >>They block a few ports as far as I know, but I haven't really done much >>with the connection other than http/ftp client for installing software >>upgrades, viewing web pages, and doing ssh to various places (and in to >>my system from outside too) and that port has worked fine. >> >>I imagine trying to run a server (in violation of terms of use of >>course) would probably be a bit more difficult. >> >> > >If it's just mail filtering I couldn't care less; I will handle my >mail in a way similar to yours. > >I am more concerned they do some application level filtering over http. > > The mail filtering just puts a [BULK] tag in the subject line if it thinks it's junk and I think that can be turned off if you want. (I haven't, since it hasn't annoyed me enough that I'm willing to work with their stuff.) I don't think they're doing any HTTP filtering. I expect the firewall/parental filters/etc are done by software that you can install. (Well, not on Linux, but I don't think that's what you're worried about.) I've been using Rogers cable internet service for 4 or 5 years now and while it's not perfect and their staff are (with some notable exceptions) remarkably stupid, I can't really complain too much. Regards, Marcus -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 19:52:28 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 15:52:28 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Best Filesystems? In-Reply-To: <20050811184954.GA23648-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20050811184954.GA23648@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <20050811195228.95190.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- William Park wrote: > On Wed, Aug 10, 2005 at 07:02:07PM -0400, CLIFFORD > ILKAY wrote: > > Hi, > > > > On August 10, 2005 11:12, Steve wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > > > I have a question about filesystem types. I've > got an 80GB drive > > > that I'm planning to reformat and install > Ubuntu. I plan to create > > > 3 partitions: > > > > > > 9.0 GB - For the OS and system files. > > > 512 MB - SWAP (equal to amount of RAM) > > > 70 GB - For user data files which will include > many MP3s, OGGs and > > > a few DVD rips (ie. mostly single large files > > 1MB each) > > > > I think putting all the OS and system files in one > big partition is a > > poor choice when you have room to spare on your > disk. I typically > > have the following partitions: > > I disagree. It's probably the best way. That is, > one partition for / > and another for /home. Everything else goes in one > or the other > partition. Of course, another disk for backup, but > it's off topic. Under normal conditions I would have to disagree with this VERY strongly, and for an example as two why I can go back to earlier this week. FreeBSD box in my office acting as mail server. Elsewhere in the building umpteen Windows boxes, one of which became virus infected on Tuesday. Windows box starts spewing 10^n th copies of itself. Ok, so /var on the FreeBSD box gets filled, and the mail server part of the box falls down (a pain I "shared" with a Windows user ), but the other functions on the box remained up, web pages were served off the box, name service continued, and most importantly I could still log in and see where the problems were. All this because /tmp and the other directories other than /var were writeable. Now, there are only two situations where I would even consider 1/2 partions. For the Linux World Canada show I did everything into 1 partition, this was a Linux install that was supposed to last less than 48 hours, and Knoppix gave me the option of doing a quick/dirty 1 partition install (not ideal, but for 48 hours, I could tolerate it). The other situation came up a few years ago when I attempted to install a conventional Linux on to an LS-120 floppy (a special 120 MB floppy disk). When you only have 120 MB to play with you are SO tight for space, you have to make some less than ideal compromises... For "normal" installs I want the safety of the extra partions. Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 20:41:33 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 16:41:33 -0400 Subject: Best Filesystems? In-Reply-To: <20050811195228.95190.qmail-DooQHYYYUaiB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20050811184954.GA23648@node1.opengeometry.net> <20050811195228.95190.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On 8/11/05, Colin McGregor wrote: > > Under normal conditions I would have to disagree with > this VERY strongly, and for an example as two why I > can go back to earlier this week. FreeBSD box in my > office acting as mail server. Elsewhere in the > building umpteen Windows boxes, one of which became > virus infected on Tuesday. Windows box starts spewing > 10^n th copies of itself. > > Ok, so /var on the FreeBSD box gets filled, and the > mail server part of the box falls down (a pain I > "shared" with a Windows user ), but the > other functions on the box remained up, web pages were > served off the box, name service continued, and most > importantly I could still log in and see where the > problems were. All this because /tmp and the other > directories other than /var were writeable. > > Now, there are only two situations where I would even > consider 1/2 partions. For the Linux World Canada show > I did everything into 1 partition, this was a Linux > install that was supposed to last less than 48 hours, > and Knoppix gave me the option of doing a quick/dirty > 1 partition install (not ideal, but for 48 hours, I > could tolerate it). The other situation came up a few > years ago when I attempted to install a conventional > Linux on to an LS-120 floppy (a special 120 MB floppy > disk). When you only have 120 MB to play with you are > SO tight for space, you have to make some less than > ideal compromises... > > For "normal" installs I want the safety of the extra > partions. > > Colin McGregor Colin, I do agree with your points and that others have made regarding multiple partitions... but I also see the point of a single or double partition. Multiple partitions are optimal for work and server boxes, no doubt. When they have to deal with many other users/machines interacting with them, they need as much self-protection as possible. For home uses, without running any servers, I can see the simplicity of only one or two partitions. For a home machine that is only on a few hours a day, and running very few processes when it is, several partitions can become overkill, especially if you frequently re-install OSes or like to "test-drive" many OSes in a multi-boot scenario. -Steve. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 20:32:37 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 16:32:37 -0400 Subject: Best Filesystems? In-Reply-To: <20050811195228.95190.qmail-DooQHYYYUaiB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20050811184954.GA23648@node1.opengeometry.net> <20050811195228.95190.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20050811203237.GA24143@node1.opengeometry.net> On Thu, Aug 11, 2005 at 03:52:28PM -0400, Colin McGregor wrote: > Under normal conditions I would have to disagree with > this VERY strongly, and for an example as two why I > can go back to earlier this week. FreeBSD box in my > office acting as mail server. Elsewhere in the > building umpteen Windows boxes, one of which became > virus infected on Tuesday. Windows box starts spewing > 10^n th copies of itself. > > Ok, so /var on the FreeBSD box gets filled, and the > mail server part of the box falls down (a pain I > "shared" with a Windows user ), but the > other functions on the box remained up, web pages were > served off the box, name service continued, and most > importantly I could still log in and see where the > problems were. All this because /tmp and the other > directories other than /var were writeable. > > Now, there are only two situations where I would even > consider 1/2 partions. For the Linux World Canada show > I did everything into 1 partition, this was a Linux > install that was supposed to last less than 48 hours, > and Knoppix gave me the option of doing a quick/dirty > 1 partition install (not ideal, but for 48 hours, I > could tolerate it). The other situation came up a few > years ago when I attempted to install a conventional > Linux on to an LS-120 floppy (a special 120 MB floppy > disk). When you only have 120 MB to play with you are > SO tight for space, you have to make some less than > ideal compromises... > > For "normal" installs I want the safety of the extra > partions. There is one answer for 500MB harddisks, and another answer for 500GB harddisks. I'm well aware of /var, /tmp, and mount option arguments. But, not formatting wrong partition is also good argument. -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 21:40:08 2005 From: clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (CLIFFORD ILKAY) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 17:40:08 -0400 Subject: Best Filesystems? In-Reply-To: <20050811203237.GA24143-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20050811184954.GA23648@node1.opengeometry.net> <20050811195228.95190.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <20050811203237.GA24143@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <200508111740.09415.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> On August 11, 2005 16:32, William Park wrote: > On Thu, Aug 11, 2005 at 03:52:28PM -0400, Colin McGregor wrote: > > For "normal" installs I want the safety of the extra > > partions. > > There is one answer for 500MB harddisks, and another answer for > 500GB harddisks. Straw man argument. You will notice that I started this by saying "I think putting all the OS and system files in one big partition is a poor choice when you have room to spare on your disk." Note the "room to spare". I do not think anyone was advocating lots of partitions with 500M disks. Steve mentioned that he has an 80GB hard disk. > I'm well aware of /var, /tmp, and mount option > arguments. But, not formatting wrong partition is also good > argument. I do not understand. Are you suggesting that having more partitions increases the odds of accidental formatting of the wrong partition? If so, that seems like a dubious argument. -- Regards, Clifford Ilkay Dinamis Corporation 3266 Yonge Street, Suite 1419 Toronto, ON Canada M4N 3P6 +1 416-410-3326 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 21:53:55 2005 From: clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (CLIFFORD ILKAY) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 17:53:55 -0400 Subject: Best Filesystems? In-Reply-To: References: <20050811184954.GA23648@node1.opengeometry.net> <20050811195228.95190.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <200508111753.55631.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> On August 11, 2005 16:41, Steve wrote: > Colin, > > I do agree with your points and that others have made regarding > multiple partitions... but I also see the point of a single or > double partition. Sure, if you are constrained for disk space. > Multiple partitions are optimal for work and server boxes, no > doubt. When they have to deal with many other users/machines > interacting with them, they need as much self-protection as > possible. > > For home uses, without running any servers, I can see the > simplicity of only one or two partitions. For a home machine that > is only on a few hours a day, and running very few processes when > it is, several partitions can become overkill, especially if you > frequently re-install OSes or like to "test-drive" many OSes in a > multi-boot scenario. Actually, if you frequently reinstall or like to test drive many operating systems, this is all the more reason to isolate things that you would not want to lose, e.g. /usr/local and /home, on separate partitions. You are making a strong argument not only for more partitions but also for LVM because with LVM, you can create, grow, shrink, or destroy logical volumes with ease. You may also be making an argument for Xen but that is yet another topic. -- Regards, Clifford Ilkay Dinamis Corporation 3266 Yonge Street, Suite 1419 Toronto, ON Canada M4N 3P6 +1 416-410-3326 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 11 23:36:17 2005 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 19:36:17 -0400 Subject: Best Filesystems? In-Reply-To: <200508111740.09415.clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20050811184954.GA23648@node1.opengeometry.net> <20050811195228.95190.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <20050811203237.GA24143@node1.opengeometry.net> <200508111740.09415.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> Message-ID: <20050811193617.06b5f5d8.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Thu, 11 Aug 2005 17:40:08 -0400 CLIFFORD ILKAY got hold of an infinite number of monkeys to write: > Straw man argument. Repetitive observation. -- JoeHill / RLU #282046 / www.freeyourmachine.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ "Tax the rich, feed the poor, Till there are no rich no more" -- Ten Years After -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From zkoziol-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 12 00:40:42 2005 From: zkoziol-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Zbigniew Koziol) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 20:40:42 -0400 Subject: Netopia R7100 SDSL router In-Reply-To: <20050811172412.GK6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> <200508081142.42012.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af1378050808084929e9491f@mail.gmail.com> <200508081421.39109.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af13780508081256224e2435@mail.gmail.com> <42F7B9FD.4020800@rogers.com> <17af1378050808131316fa3810@mail.gmail.com> <42F7CA9E.503@rogers.com> <17af1378050811101231f9e8b8@mail.gmail.com> <20050811172412.GK6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <42FBF00A.1070002@istop.com> Well, I am not a someone experienced with networking. At the place where I do my little money for surviving, loosers did not write down what is the password to this device. So, I am going to reset it to default factory settings and start configuring it again. My problem is, however, that while a thick (250 pages) manual is around, and I did similar configuration of simpler devices, I did not on that one. And now, all the people there strongly depand on the Internet access. Is there perhaps a soul around that would be willing to give advice is something was going terribly wrong? In a case I was unable to deal with possible problems we would call for payable help. It would be good simply to have a contact in advance. Thanks a lot, zb. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 12 03:16:56 2005 From: clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (CLIFFORD ILKAY) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 23:16:56 -0400 Subject: Netopia R7100 SDSL router In-Reply-To: <42FBF00A.1070002-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> <20050811172412.GK6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <42FBF00A.1070002@istop.com> Message-ID: <200508112316.56830.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> On August 11, 2005 20:40, you wrote: > Well, I am not a someone experienced with networking. > > At the place where I do my little money for surviving, loosers did > not write down what is the password to this device. So, I am going > to reset it to default factory settings and start configuring it > again. > > My problem is, however, that while a thick (250 pages) manual is > around, and I did similar configuration of simpler devices, I did > not on that one. > > And now, all the people there strongly depand on the Internet > access. > > Is there perhaps a soul around that would be willing to give advice > is something was going terribly wrong? In a case I was unable to > deal with possible problems we would call for payable help. It > would be good simply to have a contact in advance. Hi Zbigniew, I suggest before you make any changes to the Netopia box, you configure a Linux box to act as a router/firewall and test it to make sure that it will work. I highly recommend IPCop . It is small and full featured. You can install it on a low end machine quite easily. Once you have that, then you can tinker with the Netopia more confidently knowing that in the worst case scenario, you would not be left without Internet access. It should not take you more than 60 minutes from the time you download to the time you have IPCop configured and ready to go. There is an IRC channel for it at irc.freenode.org, #ipcop, in case you need help. I am usually not there but if you need to raise me on IRC, my nick is cilkay. You can just /msg cilkay once you connect to FreeNode, or call me if you need help. -- Regards, Clifford Ilkay Dinamis Corporation 3266 Yonge Street, Suite 1419 Toronto, ON Canada M4N 3P6 +1 416-410-3326 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 12 04:17:59 2005 From: interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (interlug-list) Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 00:17:59 -0400 Subject: [Fwd: HLUG September Meeting - Special Guest Speaker] Message-ID: <1123820278.26128.62.camel@holden.weait.net> -----Forwarded Message----- From: Jennifer Harwood To: hlug-announce-17grO+dxGucXhy9q4Lf3Ug at public.gmane.org Subject: HLUG September Meeting - Special Guest Speaker Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 22:48:40 -0400 Hello Everyone! I know this is really early for this mailing, but as we're having a special guest speaker, I wanted to give you plenty of notice. First, the nitty gritty: Location: McMaster University, Hamilton Hall Room 217 When: Wednesday, September 7, 7pm Our guest speaker that night will be... (drum roll please!)... Ren Bucholz. http://www.eff.org/about/staff/#ren_bucholz Ren is the Electronic Frontier Foundation's Policy Coordinator, Americas. He is based in Toronto where he works on international policy issues. His primary focus is on Canada and South America, but he occasionally finds himself in other places as well. Ren will be speaking about pending Canadian policy fights that the EFF is following. The Canadian equivalent of the USA's Digital Millennium Copyright Act DMCA, software patents and other topics pertinent to the interests of both open source software users and those interested their "digital freedom" will be discussed. I hope you all can make it, I'm sure it will make for an interesting evening. And don't worry, I'll mail out again closer to the meeting (although you should all be running to your calendar now to mark it down! : ) Cheers, Jennifer -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 12 12:09:59 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 08:09:59 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <17af1378050811101231f9e8b8-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> <200508081142.42012.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af1378050808084929e9491f@mail.gmail.com> <200508081421.39109.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af13780508081256224e2435@mail.gmail.com> <42F7B9FD.4020800@rogers.com> <17af1378050808131316fa3810@mail.gmail.com> <42F7CA9E.503@rogers.com> <17af1378050811101231f9e8b8@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <42FC9197.1070407@rogers.com> Ian Zimmerman wrote: > Now considering Rogers ... > > Can Rogers customers here comment on this part of their web site > (http://www.shoprogers.com/Store/Cable/InternetContent/information.asp): > > Security > Enjoy peace of mind with email virus and SPAM protection, desktop > anti-virus, pop-up blocker, anti-spyware, parental controls and > firewall protection. They all work together to help keep your Internet > experience worry free. > << > > Obviously most or all of this is undesirable. So: > is it on by default? > if yes, can it be disabled from Linux (and without Flash or other web > abuse plugins)? Some of that stuff, such as desktop antivirus, is for download to Windows boxes. However, the on-line spam filtering is configurable with any browser and can be turned off. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 12 13:06:32 2005 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins Witteman) Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 09:06:32 -0400 Subject: UPDATE Re: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: <20050811152220.GI6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050811141102.GA17037@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050811152220.GI6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20050812130632.GA2373@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Update: I friend of mine recently upgraded his power supply (he has too much running off his 5V lead for a 410W power supply), and lent me his perfectly servicable PC Power & Cooling 410W unit. I've plugged that in, and it seems to have fixed the problem - but with intermittent problems I'll need more than the half-dozen flawless power cycles I've done to really be sure. Thanks to everyone who provided an opinion/suggestion or recommendation. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 12 13:26:53 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 09:26:53 -0400 Subject: UPDATE Re: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: <20050812130632.GA2373-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050811141102.GA17037@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050811152220.GI6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050812130632.GA2373@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <20050812132653.GM6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Aug 12, 2005 at 09:06:32AM -0400, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: > Update: > > I friend of mine recently upgraded his power supply (he has too much > running off his 5V lead for a 410W power supply), and lent me his > perfectly servicable PC Power & Cooling 410W unit. A real 410W. Nice. Their rediculous air flow can make them a little noisy depending on the case you put it in. According to the maker, they rate their power supplies at typical operating temperature, rather than room temperature (which is apparently where the real cheap power supplies rate their power). Might be why I never had a problem with running 3 scsi drives, a jaz drive, 3 dvd/cd drives, an athlon 2500+, 512M ram, 64M nvidia, etc off a 300W turbocool. Many people tried to tell me I needed a much bigger power supply for that load. > I've plugged that in, and it seems to have fixed the problem - but with > intermittent problems I'll need more than the half-dozen flawless power > cycles I've done to really be sure. Thanks to everyone who provided an > opinion/suggestion or recommendation. Reliable power makes a big difference. I do remember a few years ago a friend's win98 kept crashing and corrupting until he changed the no name power supply to a turbocool 300, and the problems vanished. Power supplies can make a difference. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 12 13:38:27 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 09:38:27 -0400 Subject: UPDATE Re: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: <20050812130632.GA2373-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050811141102.GA17037@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050811152220.GI6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050812130632.GA2373@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: > Update: > > I friend of mine recently upgraded his power supply (he has too much > running off his 5V lead for a 410W power supply), and lent me his > perfectly servicable PC Power & Cooling 410W unit. > > I've plugged that in, and it seems to have fixed the problem - but with > intermittent problems I'll need more than the half-dozen flawless power > cycles I've done to really be sure. Thanks to everyone who provided an > opinion/suggestion or recommendation. Is a very satisfying thing to have resolved no? Good to hear that it (likely) wasn't something more difficult to troubleshoot and pin down. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 12 13:42:11 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 09:42:11 -0400 Subject: UPDATE Re: OT: Hardware troubleshooting References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050811141102.GA17037@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050811152220.GI6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050812130632.GA2373@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050812132653.GM6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <002701c59f43$b7c03760$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lennart Sorensen" To: Sent: Friday, 12 August, 2005 9:26 Subject: Re: [TLUG]: UPDATE Re: OT: Hardware troubleshooting > > > Reliable power makes a big difference. I do remember a few years ago a > friend's win98 kept crashing and corrupting until he changed the no name > power supply to a turbocool 300, and the problems vanished. Power > supplies can make a difference. > > Lennart Sorensen You can say that, I once had an issue with what seemed to be the keyboard doing funny things, and the power supply was the culprit! Was not a no-name though... nothing's perfect :-( Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 12 09:29:02 2005 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter) Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 12:29:02 +0300 (IDT) Subject: Best Filesystems? In-Reply-To: <20050811184954.GA23648-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200508101902.08489.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <20050811184954.GA23648@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 11 Aug 2005, William Park wrote: > On Wed, Aug 10, 2005 at 07:02:07PM -0400, CLIFFORD ILKAY wrote: >> Hi, >> >> On August 10, 2005 11:12, Steve wrote: >>> Hi, >>> >>> I have a question about filesystem types. I've got an 80GB drive >>> that I'm planning to reformat and install Ubuntu. I plan to create >>> 3 partitions: >>> >>> 9.0 GB - For the OS and system files. >>> 512 MB - SWAP (equal to amount of RAM) >>> 70 GB - For user data files which will include many MP3s, OGGs and >>> a few DVD rips (ie. mostly single large files > 1MB each) >> >> I think putting all the OS and system files in one big partition is a >> poor choice when you have room to spare on your disk. I typically >> have the following partitions: > > I disagree. It's probably the best way. That is, one partition for / > and another for /home. Everything else goes in one or the other > partition. Of course, another disk for backup, but it's off topic. Imnsho the best way is / ro, /usr ro, /var rw, /tmp rw or dynamic fs, /home rw and maybe /home/$USER nfs or partition or on-the-fly decompressed archive from disk-on-key depending on needs. Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pwa.linux-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 12 15:39:25 2005 From: pwa.linux-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (PW Armstrong) Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 11:39:25 -0400 Subject: Cheap/inexpensive (free?) images In-Reply-To: <20050812132653.GM6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050811141102.GA17037@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050811152220.GI6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050812130632.GA2373@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050812132653.GM6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <42FCC2AD.8040806@gmail.com> Just wondering if any one can recommend a source of inexpensive or free images for use on a web site. I did check the creative commons web site, but didn't have much success there (http://creativecommons.org/) are there other sources any one is aware of? thx. -peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 12 15:51:32 2005 From: interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (interlug-list) Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 11:51:32 -0400 Subject: Cheap/inexpensive (free?) images In-Reply-To: <42FCC2AD.8040806-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050811141102.GA17037@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050811152220.GI6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050812130632.GA2373@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050812132653.GM6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <42FCC2AD.8040806@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1123861892.26128.85.camel@holden.weait.net> On Fri, 2005-08-12 at 11:39, PW Armstrong wrote: > Just wondering if any one can recommend a source of inexpensive or free > images for use on a web site. http://www.istockphoto.com/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From kcozens-qazKcTl6WRFWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 12 16:35:46 2005 From: kcozens-qazKcTl6WRFWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (Kevin Cozens) Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 12:35:46 -0400 Subject: Cheap/inexpensive (free?) images In-Reply-To: <42FCC2AD.8040806-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050811141102.GA17037@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050811152220.GI6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050812130632.GA2373@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050812132653.GM6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <42FCC2AD.8040806@gmail.com> Message-ID: <42FCCFE2.7030700@interlog.com> PW Armstrong wrote: > Just wondering if any one can recommend a source of inexpensive or free > images for use on a web site. http://gimp-savvy.com/PHOTO-ARCHIVE/ -- Cheers! Kevin. http://www.interlog.com/~kcozens/ |"What are we going to do today, Borg?" Owner of Elecraft K2 #2172 |"Same thing we always do, Pinkutus: | Try to assimilate the world!" #include | -Pinkutus & the Borg -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 12 17:53:02 2005 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 13:53:02 -0400 Subject: Cups/printer problem; queue dies is printer is shut off during a job Message-ID: <42FCE1FE.3070000@alteeve.com> Hi all, I've got a problem here where I've got two network laser printers (a Kyocera FS-3830N and an HP LaserJet 2430dtn). They are running off of Fedora Core 3 machines (the problem happens to all of them). If you turn off either printer and then turn it back on while there is no job being sent to it, everything is fine. On the other hand, if you do turn off either printer while a job is being sent to the printer the queue just seems to up and die. Only deleting and recreating the printer seems to get the printer(s) working again. I know the easy answer is "well, don't turn them off in the middle of a job!" but that isn't so easy. This is an office where they print a lot and the office workers occasionally send the wrong job to the printer (often being a 100 pages or more) so they run to the printer and turn it off so that they don't waste the paper. Does anyone know what is actually going wrong? Resetting the 'cups' service isn't enough... Is there a way I can restore the queues after this happens? I am afraid my printing/cups knowledge isn't the best. Thanks all! Madison -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From presidentofthefuture-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 12 17:58:14 2005 From: presidentofthefuture-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Mike Newman) Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 13:58:14 -0400 Subject: Looking to hire a student? Message-ID: Hi list! I'm currently taking the Computer Programmer/Analyst programme at Centennial College, but I'm looking to get out into the working world for a bit to broaden my horizons before finishing. I've done desktop support, networking, web design and programmer for small and large businesses, churches and academic institutions. I know C/C++/C#/Java and SQL (primarily in Oracle but some MySQL and (ugh) Access as well). I've run Debian, Ubuntu, Slackware, LFS, Gentoo and Mandrake, and I'm very experienced in setting up GNU/Linux-based servers and desktops. Of course I've also supplied lots of support to Windows (9x and 2000/XP) machines (because they always seem to need the most attention.) Sorry for spamming you all with this but it seems like everyone on this list is always working on something cool and interesting. I'd really appreciate the opportunity to send my proper CV to anyone looking to hire an enthusiastic student. Thanks! Mike Newman -- Get Firefox - Take back the Web http://www.getfirefox.com/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From kru_tch-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 12 17:58:00 2005 From: kru_tch-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (Steve =?iso-8859-1?Q?=C5?=) Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 13:58:00 -0400 Subject: Cheap/inexpensive (free?) images In-Reply-To: <42FCCFE2.7030700-qazKcTl6WRFWk0Htik3J/w@public.gmane.org> References: <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050811141102.GA17037@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050811152220.GI6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050812130632.GA2373@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050812132653.GM6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <42FCC2AD.8040806@gmail.com> <42FCCFE2.7030700@interlog.com> Message-ID: <20050812175800.GA25638@sweetpig.dyndns.org> On Fri, Aug 12, 2005 at 12:35:46PM -0400 or thereabouts, Kevin Cozens wrote: > PW Armstrong wrote: > >Just wondering if any one can recommend a source of inexpensive or free > >images for use on a web site. > > http://gimp-savvy.com/PHOTO-ARCHIVE/ Hm Doesn't resolve for me. Anyone else ? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 12 18:29:49 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 14:29:49 -0400 Subject: Cups/printer problem; queue dies is printer is shut off during a job In-Reply-To: <42FCE1FE.3070000-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <42FCE1FE.3070000@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <20050812182949.GN6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Aug 12, 2005 at 01:53:02PM -0400, Madison Kelly wrote: > I've got a problem here where I've got two network laser printers (a > Kyocera FS-3830N and an HP LaserJet 2430dtn). They are running off of > Fedora Core 3 machines (the problem happens to all of them). > > If you turn off either printer and then turn it back on while there > is no job being sent to it, everything is fine. On the other hand, if > you do turn off either printer while a job is being sent to the printer > the queue just seems to up and die. Only deleting and recreating the > printer seems to get the printer(s) working again. > > I know the easy answer is "well, don't turn them off in the middle of > a job!" but that isn't so easy. This is an office where they print a lot > and the office workers occasionally send the wrong job to the printer > (often being a 100 pages or more) so they run to the printer and turn it > off so that they don't waste the paper. So teach people to use the job queue to cancel the job, or hit the cancel button on the printer (many nice printers have such a button now). > Does anyone know what is actually going wrong? Resetting the 'cups' > service isn't enough... Is there a way I can restore the queues after > this happens? The enable command might help. > I am afraid my printing/cups knowledge isn't the best. The web interface may even have job queue control so you can delete the 'canceled' job and reenable the printer. You certainly shouldn't need to delete the printer queue. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 12 18:39:14 2005 From: pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org) Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 14:39:14 -0400 Subject: Cheap/inexpensive (free?) images In-Reply-To: <42FCC2AD.8040806-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> References: <20050812132653.GM6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <42FCB492.13200.13375476@localhost> At Compubooks (3595 St. Clair Avenue near the corner of St. Clair and Kennedy in Scarborough) they are trying to get rid of a book full of royalty-free graphics (with CD), which you can make use of. I almost bought it, but I am not running a commercial website where graphics have to be an issue, so I decided not to use it. I forget the title. Sorry. However, the salesperson there is pretty knowledgeable. As far as el-cheapo bookstores are concerned, I believe Compubooks of Scarborough is the last one in existence in the Greater Toronto Area. Last month, PC Maniak bit the dust. They say it is due to publishers selling to Amazon, Chapters and the like at a rate that undercuts independent doscount booksellers such as Compubooks. Their real name is "Compubooks.com", but as far as I can tell there is no registered domain by that name. But I've been to their brick- and-mortar location many times. On Saturdays, they have sales of many and sundry items of computer hardware in the room next door. > > Just wondering if any one can recommend a source of inexpensive or > free images for use on a web site. > > I did check the creative commons web site, but didn't have much > success there (http://creativecommons.org/) > > are there other sources any one is aware of? > > thx. > > -peter > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > __________ NOD32 1.1192 (20050811) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 12 19:51:15 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 15:51:15 -0400 Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: <21863.32.97.110.142.1123784100.squirrel-Ux8c1wYVwPEYuHMApVWI8g@public.gmane.org> References: <21863.32.97.110.142.1123784100.squirrel@32.97.110.142> Message-ID: <1e55af9905081212512eb114a0@mail.gmail.com> On 11/08/05, Mike Kallies wrote: > I had the DSL provider open a ticket with Bell to drop the rate on the > modem and now the Capacity Occupation is as it is shown above, and I get > much better connect times... e.g. it might drop once every two or three > days rather than once every 10 or 15 minutes. > > My connection is definately slower, but hey, it's more reliable and that > matters a lot more to me. That's exactly my thinking nowadays. I'll look into this further, but we're fast approaching my next tech appointment and I'm still hoping for a complete restoration. =) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 12 20:12:25 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 16:12:25 -0400 Subject: Cheap/inexpensive (free?) images In-Reply-To: <42FCB492.13200.13375476@localhost> References: <20050812132653.GM6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <42FCC2AD.8040806@gmail.com> <42FCB492.13200.13375476@localhost> Message-ID: <1e55af9905081213126ba96b1a@mail.gmail.com> Until I get back home and can paste my link collections for this topic, I'll recommend you check out the mediawiki commons: http://commons.wikimedia.org Also keep in mind that the pictures in the wikipedia are either GPL or (and becoming more commonly) are released into the public domain. http://en.wikipedia.org Neither of these are what I would consider a complete resources, so I did go looking for others when I wanted to spruce up my own website. I'll report back with more this evening. Also, do some searches for clipart or cartoons or other such non-photographic pictures and you may find some nice archives of them. Personally, I tend to like cartoon or clipart type images for a website.. but photographs, especially when edited, can come out looking fantastic. I hacked up a cool barbed wire fence photograph I found on the wikimedia commons to make my website logo. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From denisov-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 13 03:03:52 2005 From: denisov-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Igor Denisov) Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 23:03:52 -0400 Subject: U of T campus network security Message-ID: <96aa4e8f050812200369ea5a91@mail.gmail.com> Hi, Soon, I'll be a student at U of T and my linux box will be part of the U of T network. I'm worried about both crackers and the script kiddie haxxorz that might lurk there. For those of you that have worked/studied/used a computer at U of T, are either of those two types present? Are computers broken into/messed around with? What would you suggest I do to secure my linux box (currently SUSE 9.3 Pro)? Currently, it has little besides a firewall and an virus scanner (BitDefender). I've considered repatrtitioning and separating /, /var, /tmp, /usr, and /home and chrooting each service running on my box. Thanks in advance, Igor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 13 03:20:52 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 23:20:52 -0400 Subject: U of T campus network security In-Reply-To: <96aa4e8f050812200369ea5a91-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <96aa4e8f050812200369ea5a91@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050813032052.GA2178@node1.opengeometry.net> On Fri, Aug 12, 2005 at 11:03:52PM -0400, Igor Denisov wrote: > Hi, > > Soon, I'll be a student at U of T and my linux box will be part of the > U of T network. > > I'm worried about both crackers and the script kiddie haxxorz that > might lurk there. > > For those of you that have worked/studied/used a computer at U of T, > are either of those two types present? Are computers broken > into/messed around with? > > What would you suggest I do to secure my linux box (currently SUSE 9.3 Pro)? > Currently, it has little besides a firewall and an virus scanner (BitDefender). > > I've considered repatrtitioning and separating /, /var, /tmp, /usr, > and /home and chrooting each service running on my box. > > Thanks in advance, Lock and key. Theft is still the number one problem. -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 13 04:36:55 2005 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 00:36:55 -0400 Subject: U of T campus network security In-Reply-To: <96aa4e8f050812200369ea5a91-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <96aa4e8f050812200369ea5a91@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 8/12/05, Igor Denisov wrote: > > Soon, I'll be a student at U of T and my linux box will be part of the > U of T network. > > I'm worried about both crackers and the script kiddie haxxorz that > might lurk there. > > For those of you that have worked/studied/used a computer at U of T, > are either of those two types present? Are computers broken > into/messed around with? > > What would you suggest I do to secure my linux box (currently SUSE 9.3Pro)? > Currently, it has little besides a firewall and an virus scanner > (BitDefender). > > I've considered repatrtitioning and separating /, /var, /tmp, /usr, > and /home and chrooting each service running on my box. I'd suggest that you look into PortSentry; this is a package that watches for port probes, and whenever it finds offenders, it can both add them to ipchains/iptables (to block them at network interface level) as well as adding them to /etc/hosts.deny. I have found that very useful; the key, for you, is most likely to be Understand Your "Firewall" Software. -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pwa.linux-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 13 11:30:16 2005 From: pwa.linux-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (PW Armstrong) Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 07:30:16 -0400 Subject: Cheap/inexpensive (free?) images In-Reply-To: <1e55af9905081213126ba96b1a-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <20050812132653.GM6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <42FCC2AD.8040806@gmail.com> <42FCB492.13200.13375476@localhost> <1e55af9905081213126ba96b1a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <42FDD9C8.4030002@gmail.com> Hey everyone who suggested different sites/sources, thx very much, they are all helpful. -Peter p.s. and if I can get to that Compubooks store, I'll see if they still have that book with the CD of royalty-free images. Sy wrote: >Until I get back home and can paste my link collections for this >topic, I'll recommend you check out the mediawiki commons: > >http://commons.wikimedia.org > >Also keep in mind that the pictures in the wikipedia are either GPL or >(and becoming more commonly) are released into the public domain. > >http://en.wikipedia.org > >Neither of these are what I would consider a complete resources, so I >did go looking for others when I wanted to spruce up my own website. >I'll report back with more this evening. > >Also, do some searches for clipart or cartoons or other such >non-photographic pictures and you may find some nice archives of them. > >Personally, I tend to like cartoon or clipart type images for a >website.. but photographs, especially when edited, can come out >looking fantastic. I hacked up a cool barbed wire fence photograph I >found on the wikimedia commons to make my website logo. >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Nezumikozo-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 13 12:24:37 2005 From: Nezumikozo-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Nezumikozo) Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 08:24:37 -0400 Subject: Cheap/inexpensive (free?) images In-Reply-To: <42FCC2AD.8040806-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050811141102.GA17037@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050811152220.GI6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050812130632.GA2373@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050812132653.GM6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <42FCC2AD.8040806@gmail.com> Message-ID: <42FDE685.2090406@sympatico.ca> There is also: http://www.openclipart.org/ You can download individual images or the whole package. Jay PW Armstrong wrote: > > Just wondering if any one can recommend a source of inexpensive or > free images for use on a web site. > > I did check the creative commons web site, but didn't have much > success there (http://creativecommons.org/) > > are there other sources any one is aware of? > > thx. > > -peter > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 13 13:27:51 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 09:27:51 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Install Fest update. Message-ID: <20050813132751.9268.qmail@web88202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Took Friday off as a vacation day from the office in order to do some prep. work for the Install Fest. In order to be allowed to post things on Centennial bulletin boards you must have approval from the college and the student association (with any signs having a student association stamp on them). The approval of the college I got via a few phone calls and sending a fax. For the student association I had to go to the Progress Campus (yes the Install Fest will be at the Centennial HP Science and Technology Centre campus, but the only student association office that approves signs is at the Progress campus). The student association office at Progress is to be closed all next week so I had to at least get that part done before end of business yesterday. In getting the approval from student association I heard the rules: - No more than 3 signs per campus - All signs must have the student association stamp - Can only post on designated boards - Signs must be posted with tacks/push pins Got 12 signs stamped (Centennial has 4 campuses), and before I left the Progress campus I got 3 in place. After getting the approval of the folks at the Progress Campus I went over the Centennial HP Science and Technology Centre. I did briefly meet with Ralph Harington who has been doing a fair bit of the grunt work associated with the Centennial side of the Install Fest. Ralph offered to post signs for me, so I left him with 3 signs. I also took a few images of the room where the Install Fest is to happen. After that I went to the Ashtonbee Campus which turned into a wast of time as nobody there seemed to know where the appropriate boards were that I could post the signs. I have not yet made it to the campus on Carlaw. After the above "fun" I went down to the PC clone dealers along College where I went looking for an expansion card for my desktop PC and to spread the unstamped signs I had. All told 44 fliers went out yesterday. Tasks still to be dealt with: - Put more fliers out at Centennial, and computer shops. - Get people who can do Centennial similar leg work at the other educational institutions (UofT, Seneca, Humber, York, Ryerson, George Brown, etc.). - See what notice we can get in the print media ("Now", "Eye", etc.) - Double check release form with lawyer (I have e-mailed a lawyer I know, but not yet heard back). - Print "N" copies of release form once approved by lawyer. - Attract and co-ordinate more volunteer installers. Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 13 16:15:31 2005 From: josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Joseph Kubik) Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 12:15:31 -0400 Subject: consultant congracation In-Reply-To: <42F78C06.4080304-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <42F78C06.4080304@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: I am officially RSVPing. -Joseph- On 8/8/05, David J Patrick wrote: > Things are cooking, here at linuxcaffe, and we've had considerable > interest in consulting services. The www.linuxcaffe.ca website is > finally shaping up and I would like to offer consultants pages as well > as directing foot traffic to available tech talent. > > I'd like to host an evening of discussion with any freelance sysadmin > with an opinion. > How about Tuesday, Aug 16, 7pm, here, at linuxcaffe. > (see website for location) > How's that for you ? RSVP, k ? > > djp > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 13 17:02:03 2005 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 13:02:03 -0400 Subject: consultant congracation In-Reply-To: References: <42F78C06.4080304@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <42FE278B.7020105@sympatico.ca> Joseph Kubik wrote: >I am officially RSVPing. >-Joseph- > > yeah ! djp -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tenger-ew0EfhANLmVEfu+5ix1nRw at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 13 18:50:28 2005 From: tenger-ew0EfhANLmVEfu+5ix1nRw at public.gmane.org (Terrence Enger) Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 14:50:28 -0400 Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.20050813145028.006931b8@pop.istop.com> Greetings, I have experienced one source of lost sync that I have not seen mentioned elsewhere: With my laser printer turned on, my DSL modem lose sync. Terry. At 10:34 2005-08-09 -0500, you wrote: >I may as well bring this up. Has anyone else experienced severe line >noise influencing a DSL connection? > >This is the case with me, and I've escalated the problem a few times >and even had an ill-equipped and misinformed tech drop by >(unannounced). > >I have repairs semi-arranged.. but I wanted to know if, aside from the >obvious, there were any system / firewall settings or the like which >might make my experience a little better. > >Running Sympatico regular DSL on a Bell line. I've done the obvious >stuff with the handset/wiring and whatnot. At this point it's all in >the preferences for my own setup I figure. > > >I exchanged my modem for another one which seems to be much more >aggressive with reconnecting during downtime. I occasionally stay >connected but lose any actual use of the connection. Sometimes I drop >out completely for a while.. sometimes there is lag which would make a >gamer gnaw their own arm off. >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From right_maple_nut-/E1597aS9LT10XsdtD+oqA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 13 18:57:09 2005 From: right_maple_nut-/E1597aS9LT10XsdtD+oqA at public.gmane.org (Amos H. Weatherill) Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 14:57:09 -0400 Subject: consultant congracation In-Reply-To: <42FE278B.7020105-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <42FE278B.7020105@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: I also am RSVP'ing. The Proposed date is fine with me. Signed. Amos "The Compudoc" Weatherill -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org]On Behalf Of David J Patrick Sent: Saturday, August 13, 2005 1:02 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: consultant congracation Joseph Kubik wrote: >I am officially RSVPing. >-Joseph- > > yeah ! djp -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 13 19:59:21 2005 From: pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org) Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 15:59:21 -0400 Subject: Computer bookstores in GTA Message-ID: <42FE18D9.23771.18A708E7@localhost> I thought what I said in an earlier thread beared repeating, and probably its own discussion. To repeat: As far as el-cheapo bookstores are concerned, I believe Compubooks of Scarborough is the last one in existence in the Greater Toronto Area. Last month, PC Maniak bit the dust. They say it is due to publishers selling to Amazon, Chapters and the like at a rate that undercuts independent doscount booksellers such as Compubooks. Their real name is "Compubooks.com", but as far as I can tell there is no registered domain by that name. It appears that the domain is for sale. But what is killing the bookstores is not so much the big box stores (though it plays a big part), but the publishers who sell at prices that undercut independent operators. According to the manager at Compubooks, publishers such as O'Reilly are the biggest culprits. I know. I like O'Reilly books too. But they were among the first ones to use this marketing scheme. Whatever overstock they can't sell used to go to the discount sellers. Now the books are being destroyed. She cancelled the account with O'Reilly, fearing having to sell at a loss. When you have to be driven to extremes like that, it's pretty sad. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 13 20:48:29 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 16:48:29 -0400 Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.20050813145028.006931b8-t0oGnNQ4pjr3oGB3hsPCZA@public.gmane.org> References: <3.0.3.32.20050813145028.006931b8@pop.istop.com> Message-ID: <42FE5C9D.6090704@rogers.com> Terrence Enger wrote: > Greetings, > > I have experienced one source of lost sync that I have not > seen mentioned elsewhere: With my laser printer turned on, > my DSL modem lose sync. Are they on the same power bar or circuit? A laser printer can draw significant amounts of power. It may be dragging down the voltage, which then causes problems for the modem. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tenger-ew0EfhANLmVEfu+5ix1nRw at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 13 22:06:46 2005 From: tenger-ew0EfhANLmVEfu+5ix1nRw at public.gmane.org (Terrence Enger) Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 18:06:46 -0400 Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: <42FE5C9D.6090704-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <3.0.3.32.20050813145028.006931b8@pop.istop.com> <3.0.3.32.20050813145028.006931b8@pop.istop.com> <42FE5C9D.6090704@rogers.com> Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.20050813180646.0150810c@pop.istop.com> At 16:48 2005-08-13 -0400, James Knott wrote: > Terrence Enger wrote: > > Greetings, > > > > I have experienced one source of lost sync that I have not > > seen mentioned elsewhere: With my laser printer turned on, > > my DSL modem lose sync. > > Are they on the same power bar or circuit? A laser printer can draw > significant amounts of power. It may be dragging down the voltage, > which then causes problems for the modem. Yes, they are on the same power bar. My apartment is in a house coming up to the end of its first century, and the wiring seems not to be up to modern standards. A UPS *should* be in my near future, but I am resisting the expense. ( Sigh. If you bring some chheese to go with this fine whine, we can have a party. ) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 13 22:25:36 2005 From: amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org (Alex Maynard) Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 18:25:36 -0400 Subject: Linux equivalent of dumpbin /exports filename.dll ? Message-ID: Hello All, I know very little about libraries, so I apologize if this this turns out to be a very basic question. I was wondering if any one happens to know the linux equivalent of the following command in windows, used to find the function names in a shared library?: dumpbin /exports filename.dll The problem I'm having is that I have compiled a function to a .so file (using a unix matlab compiler) but have trouble calling it from a second application (Gauss). I found a posting on the web indicating that such functions are often given different names by compilers (the compilers append extra info. to the original name). So to call the function, I need to find out its new name. I found some instructions for doing this in MSDos at: http://www.eco.utexas.edu/cgi-bin/http2gophermail?server=gopher.eco.utexas.edu&request=R97754-102253-/mailing/gaussians.archive.1997 which suggest using the dos command: dumpbin /exports filename.dll but haven't figured out how to translate this into linux. Cheers, Alex -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 13 22:42:14 2005 From: josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Joseph Kubik) Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 18:42:14 -0400 Subject: Linux equivalent of dumpbin /exports filename.dll ? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: objdump -t foo.so This, or some other option to objdump may help you out. Also, 'ldd Guass' will show you what libraries Guass is trying to load. -Joseph- On 8/13/05, Alex Maynard wrote: > > Hello All, > > I know very little about libraries, so I apologize if this > this turns out to be a very basic question. > > I was wondering if any one happens to know the linux equivalent of > the following command in windows, used to find the function names in a > shared library?: > > dumpbin /exports filename.dll > > The problem I'm having is that I have compiled a function to a .so > file (using a unix matlab compiler) but have trouble calling it from a > second application (Gauss). I found a posting on the web indicating that such > functions are often given different names by compilers (the compilers > append extra info. to the original name). So to call the function, I need to > find out its new name. I found some instructions for doing this in MSDos > at: > http://www.eco.utexas.edu/cgi-bin/http2gophermail?server=gopher.eco.utexas.edu&request=R97754-102253-/mailing/gaussians.archive.1997 > which suggest using the dos command: dumpbin /exports filename.dll but > haven't figured out how to translate this into linux. > > Cheers, > > Alex > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 13 23:36:52 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 19:36:52 -0400 Subject: consultant congracation In-Reply-To: <42FE278B.7020105-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <42F78C06.4080304@sympatico.ca> <42FE278B.7020105@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <20050813233652.GA2172@node1.opengeometry.net> On Sat, Aug 13, 2005 at 01:02:03PM -0400, David J Patrick wrote: > Joseph Kubik wrote: > >I am officially RSVPing. > yeah ! What time and day? -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 00:30:57 2005 From: hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Howard Gibson) Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 20:30:57 -0400 Subject: Power-off trivia In-Reply-To: <20050809152212.GW6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <57C7FC5E-08E8-11DA-AE96-00050249A5C8@millsgarthson.ca> <20050809152212.GW6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20050813203057.5c7123e7.hgibson@eol.ca> On Tue, 9 Aug 2005 11:22:12 -0400 lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) wrote: > On Tue, Aug 09, 2005 at 11:14:55AM -0400, phil wrote: > > > Power off requires apm or apci. Depending on which one your bios > supports of course. I don't think debian enables it by default, > although it may also just depend on your hardware. > > How old is the machine? Does the BIOS have anything about APM or APCI? Lennart, I now have Fedora Core 3 running on my six or seven year old PII/350. When it boots, I get a message claiming something like my BIOS out too out of date to run ACPI. I have been meaning to investigate this sometime. My machine powers off when I tell it too. -- Howard Gibson hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org howardg-PadmjKOQAFn3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org http://home.eol.ca/~hgibson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From kcozens-qazKcTl6WRFWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 01:57:40 2005 From: kcozens-qazKcTl6WRFWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (Kevin Cozens) Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 21:57:40 -0400 Subject: experiences with openssh automation In-Reply-To: <35596.32.97.110.142.1123540376.squirrel-Ux8c1wYVwPEYuHMApVWI8g@public.gmane.org> References: <35596.32.97.110.142.1123540376.squirrel@32.97.110.142> Message-ID: <42FEA514.5070008@interlog.com> Mike Kallies wrote: > Any recommendations for books, websites or materials? The O'Reilly book > seems to be more theory than practice on this stuff. The Paranoid Penguin column on page 30 of the September 2005 issue of Linux Journal is titled "Managing SSH for Script and cron jobs". -- Cheers! Kevin. http://www.interlog.com/~kcozens/ |"What are we going to do today, Borg?" Owner of Elecraft K2 #2172 |"Same thing we always do, Pinkutus: | Try to assimilate the world!" #include | -Pinkutus & the Borg -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 02:52:05 2005 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 22:52:05 -0400 Subject: Library path question Message-ID: <20050814025204.GA13234@waltdnes.org> Having gotten a digital camera recently, I will admit to taking the (ahem) occasional not-quite-perfect (cough cough) picture that could stand a little bit of touching up via Gimp. Since each successive save+reload of JPEGs loses quality in the translation, the best approach is to start with the TIFF. Use JPEG only to upload final results to hobbyist photo websites, where a 14.5 meg TIFF would not be appreciated. Since libtiff doesn't read exif data from TIFFs, Gimp (which uses libtiff) can't access or save the exif data to any JPEG copies of the same file. To the rescue comes "exiftool",a perl module that can read and write a whole bunch of metadata, including exif. My use right now is copying exif data from TIFFs to their JPEG descendants. One thing I noticed is that when you uncompress the tarball, the commandline utility can be run without installing if you cd to to the directory containing it. To get it to run from anywhere, you need to perl Makefile.PL make make test make install with the last step requiring root access. I assume this copies libs to some place on the libpath? Would it be possible to just uncompress it to a regular user's directory, and append the path to LIBPATH, or whatever? -- Walter Dnes My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 03:23:40 2005 From: josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Joseph Kubik) Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 23:23:40 -0400 Subject: Library path question In-Reply-To: <20050814025204.GA13234-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20050814025204.GA13234@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: You say you cannot execute the application by doing: /home/untar_dir/progname ??? -Joseph- On 8/13/05, Walter Dnes wrote: > Having gotten a digital camera recently, I will admit to taking the > (ahem) occasional not-quite-perfect (cough cough) picture that could > stand a little bit of touching up via Gimp. Since each successive > save+reload of JPEGs loses quality in the translation, the best approach > is to start with the TIFF. Use JPEG only to upload final results to > hobbyist photo websites, where a 14.5 meg TIFF would not be appreciated. > Since libtiff doesn't read exif data from TIFFs, Gimp (which uses > libtiff) can't access or save the exif data to any JPEG copies of the > same file. > > To the rescue comes "exiftool",a perl module that can read and write a > whole bunch of metadata, including exif. My use right now is copying > exif data from TIFFs to their JPEG descendants. > > One thing I noticed is that when you uncompress the tarball, the > commandline utility can be run without installing if you cd to to the > directory containing it. To get it to run from anywhere, you need to > > perl Makefile.PL > make > make test > make install > > with the last step requiring root access. I assume this copies libs to > some place on the libpath? Would it be possible to just uncompress it > to a regular user's directory, and append the path to LIBPATH, or > whatever? > > -- > Walter Dnes > My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 05:17:17 2005 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 01:17:17 -0400 Subject: Is my computer dying? Message-ID: <20050814051717.GA13692@waltdnes.org> Thursday evening I decided that I wanted to go from... - 10 user consoles and one X session (and kernel messages going to console 12), to... - 9 user consoles and two X sessions (and kernel messages going to console 12) on my machine named "m1800" (1800 mhz speed... dohhh). This would accomadate Gimp editing digital photos at 1600 X 1200, and regular X usage (surfing, etc) at a more reasonable 1152 X 864. To get rid of console 10, I deleted the appropriate line from /etc/inittab and rebooted, and waited for m1800 to come back up... and waited... and waited... and got "L 99 99 99 99"... etc. after the PCI device listings. After a couple of unsuccessful reboot attempts, I had a look at the BIOS. The clock was correct, but the BIOS couldn't find my hard drive or my CD-ROM burner or my DVD-ROM. I switched over to "m450", my "hot backup" machine, a 6-year-old Dell 450 mhz PIII with 128 megs of RAM. Let's just say that working on a 2560 X 1920 digital photo in Gimp is not "fun" on that machine. Oh well, thanks to redundant backups, I only lost a few days of email. I've started looking for a new machine. I downloaded and burned the Gentoo 2005.1 ISO, to be ready when I got the new machine. I tried it on the "dead machine" and got various failures. After a bit of screwing around with BIOS settings, I managed to get it to recognize the CD-ROM today, and boot the Gentoo install CD. The hard drive looked OK, I got the CHS (Cylinder/Head/Sector) numbers from "fdisk -l" and rebooted and entered them manually into the BIOS, but no luck. I booted the install CD again, chrooted as per the install procedure, ran lilo, and rebooted... successfully this time. I'm sending this email from m1800. Was that a "cosmic ray" event? Do I trust it, or do I keep looking for a new machine? -- Walter Dnes My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 13:18:56 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 09:18:56 -0400 Subject: U of T campus network security In-Reply-To: <96aa4e8f050812200369ea5a91-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <96aa4e8f050812200369ea5a91@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Igor Denisov wrote: > Hi, > > Soon, I'll be a student at U of T and my linux box will be part of the > U of T network. > > I'm worried about both crackers and the script kiddie haxxorz that > might lurk there. > > For those of you that have worked/studied/used a computer at U of T, > are either of those two types present? Are computers broken > into/messed around with? > None present in my experience. There is a decent perimeter firewall that picks up any unusual activity on known problem ports (trojans, p2p, etc.). Internally everyone is off busy with file sharing -- no skiddies to worry about. > What would you suggest I do to secure my linux box (currently SUSE 9.3 Pro)? > Currently, it has little besides a firewall and an virus scanner (BitDefender). > > I've considered repatrtitioning and separating /, /var, /tmp, /usr, > and /home and chrooting each service running on my box. That seems a little drastic. Why not install that IDS that I know you've been thinking about. Good practice if nothing else... but then, I suppose repartitioning would be too ;) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 13:23:33 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 09:23:33 -0400 Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.20050813180646.0150810c-t0oGnNQ4pjr3oGB3hsPCZA@public.gmane.org> References: <3.0.3.32.20050813145028.006931b8@pop.istop.com> <3.0.3.32.20050813145028.006931b8@pop.istop.com> <3.0.3.32.20050813180646.0150810c@pop.istop.com> Message-ID: Terrence Enger wrote: > > Yes, they are on the same power bar. My apartment is in a > house coming up to the end of its first century, and the > wiring seems not to be up to modern standards. A UPS > *should* be in my near future, but I am resisting the > expense. > I'm not totally sure on this one, but where printers are involved I think most UPS units only ground and stabilize the voltage for a printer. It should still fix your problem, but don't expect to be printing if the power goes out -- some units have specific plugs for printer/faxes that do not connect to the internal battery. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 13:35:35 2005 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 09:35:35 -0400 Subject: linuxcaffe consultant meeting WEDNESDAY ! In-Reply-To: <42F78C06.4080304-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <42F78C06.4080304@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <42FF48A7.4050408@sympatico.ca> In regards to the proposed meeting of open-source service providers; please be advised that, due to scheduling conflicts of early responders, the meeting date has been fixed on Wednesday, August 17th 7:30 pm - 9 pm (?) for full details, see http://www.memeshadow.net/linuxcaffe/node/129 I hope to see you there, djp -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 12:18:47 2005 From: scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Stewart C. Russell) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 08:18:47 -0400 Subject: Converting DVD to mpeg with Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <42FF36A7.2080508@sympatico.ca> Chris Friedt wrote: > > Transcode is an excellent program to use, but I would also suggest > using the dvdrip frontend. I've been using it for, ... jeez 5 years i > think, and it works wonderfully. How do you get dvd::rip to encode multiple chapters? It seems to only want to do the first selected one for me. While that's okay for a movie, a series has many equally-important chapters. thanks, Stewart -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 13:49:58 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 08:49:58 -0500 Subject: Installfest update In-Reply-To: <20050811173035.20132.qmail-JoSsSUNfUciB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20050811173035.20132.qmail@web88208.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1e55af9905081406492711ad12@mail.gmail.com> You rock! =) On 11/08/05, Colin McGregor wrote: > Just to note, Centennial staff have approved the flyer > I wrote promoting the Installfest. Now it needs to be > approved by the student association (sigh, groan). Any > event I plan to take tommorow off and visit the > student association, then get the flyer posted arround > Centennial. > > Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 13:53:26 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 08:53:26 -0500 Subject: Cheap/inexpensive (free?) images In-Reply-To: <42FDE685.2090406-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050811141102.GA17037@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050811152220.GI6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050812130632.GA2373@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050812132653.GM6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <42FCC2AD.8040806@gmail.com> <42FDE685.2090406@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <1e55af99050814065334775ca8@mail.gmail.com> I might be duplicating some suggestions: * http://pdphoto.org * http://commons.wikimedia.org * http://www.bigfoto.com/ * http://geekphilosopher.com/MainPage/photos.htm * http://www.freemediagoo.com * http://www.morguefile.com/forum/search.php * http://aarinfreephoto.com/gallery/index.shtml * http://www.animalu.com/pics/photos.htm -- Black and white photos, released under the creative commons license. Clip-Art (cartoony) * http://www.barrysclipart.com/ I update a free pics resources topics every so often: http://jrandomhacker.info/mw/index.php/Free_pics -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 13:54:52 2005 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 09:54:52 -0400 Subject: Computer bookstores in GTA In-Reply-To: <42FE18D9.23771.18A708E7@localhost> References: <42FE18D9.23771.18A708E7@localhost> Message-ID: On 8/13/05, pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org wrote: > > I thought what I said in an earlier thread beared repeating, and > probably its own discussion. To repeat: > > As far as el-cheapo bookstores are concerned, I believe Compubooks > of Scarborough is the last one in existence in the Greater Toronto > Area. Last month, PC Maniak bit the dust. They say it is due to > publishers selling to Amazon, Chapters and the like at a rate that > undercuts independent doscount booksellers such as Compubooks. Amazon and Chapters (in "Internet form", at least) can offer something that "brick and mortar stores" can't, and that is a guarantee of relatively low return rates. In effect, they get in a few boxes of each book, and ship to customers out of that box. In contrast, book stores have the *massive* added costs of evaluating and pushing inventory throughout their store networks. This leads to an inherent inefficiency, namely that unless they HEAVILY overstock, it is likely that they will run out of a book at some locations whilst copies remain unsold elsewhere. That doesn't happen for Amazon and Chapters; the books are only at one location, and the way they "run out" is if there truly is no stock left. The "sell via Internet" model allows APress to sell books with smaller production runs (e.g. - recent works on zsh, Lisp) where they can get low wastage out of the fact that the inventory doesn't get pushed 2000 ways (e.g. - copies going to each "brick store" outlet of Barnes & Noble, Borders, Chapters), but can rather stay in a very few central locations. This is changing the book industry; O'Reilly is still wedded to the need to push their books out to 2000 "big box store" locations, so they have to sell to a lowest common denominator which means that I'm not interested in the kinds of books they publish anymore. I doubt I'm the only one... This does leave "Compubooks" in a sticky place; the "new way" of bookselling described above leaves them out. I don't have an answer to that... -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 13:56:42 2005 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 09:56:42 -0400 Subject: Installfest update In-Reply-To: <20050811173035.20132.qmail-JoSsSUNfUciB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20050811173035.20132.qmail@web88208.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On 8/11/05, Colin McGregor wrote: > > Just to note, Centennial staff have approved the flyer > I wrote promoting the Installfest. Now it needs to be > approved by the student association (sigh, groan). Any > event I plan to take tommorow off and visit the > student association, then get the flyer posted arround > Centennial. > I saw a copy posted at Canada Computers on College (nice new location that isn't so ridiculously cramped, FYI); I was very pleased to see that. -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 14:02:28 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 09:02:28 -0500 Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.3.32.20050813145028.006931b8@pop.istop.com> <3.0.3.32.20050813180646.0150810c@pop.istop.com> Message-ID: <1e55af9905081407027d8d260d@mail.gmail.com> On 14/08/05, Jamon Camisso wrote: > Terrence Enger wrote: > > > > Yes, they are on the same power bar. My apartment is in a > > house coming up to the end of its first century, and the > > wiring seems not to be up to modern standards. A UPS > > *should* be in my near future, but I am resisting the > > expense. > > > > I'm not totally sure on this one, but where printers are involved I > think most UPS units only ground and stabilize the voltage for a > printer. It should still fix your problem, but don't expect to be > printing if the power goes out -- some units have specific plugs for > printer/faxes that do not connect to the internal battery. I understand that it's one of those rules that one *never* plugs a printer into a UPS because printers play havok with power quality on that line. I didn't realise there were dedicated printer plugs on UPS' these days. For sure they'd be bypassing the battery. A line conditioning UPS for the modem would solve the problem to be sure.. then again, if there are issues like that, a line conditioning UPS for everything would be a good idea. I'd hate to be your computer.. getting noisy power like that. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 15:19:11 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 11:19:11 -0400 Subject: Computer bookstores in GTA In-Reply-To: References: <42FE18D9.23771.18A708E7@localhost> Message-ID: <20050814151911.GA2114@node1.opengeometry.net> On Sun, Aug 14, 2005 at 09:54:52AM -0400, Christopher Browne wrote: > The "sell via Internet" model allows APress to sell books with smaller > production runs (e.g. - recent works on zsh, Lisp) where they can get > low wastage out of the fact that the inventory doesn't get pushed 2000 > ways (e.g. - copies going to each "brick store" outlet of Barnes & > Noble, Borders, Chapters), but can rather stay in a very few central > locations. Mail order has its advanatages. But, I suspect most books are still sold in-store. My personal feeling is that if books come down to $20 level, then more books will be sold. $80 for books, that I will read only once and only few pages will be of use to me, is a bit too much. -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 17:24:39 2005 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 20:24:39 +0300 (IDT) Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.20050813145028.006931b8-t0oGnNQ4pjr3oGB3hsPCZA@public.gmane.org> References: <3.0.3.32.20050813145028.006931b8@pop.istop.com> Message-ID: On Sat, 13 Aug 2005, Terrence Enger wrote: > Greetings, > > I have experienced one source of lost sync that I have not > seen mentioned elsewhere: With my laser printer turned on, > my DSL modem lose sync. Imho take the laser printer to service. Its switching power supply may be jamming the DSL frequencies. Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 16:08:34 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 12:08:34 -0400 Subject: Computer bookstores in GTA In-Reply-To: References: <42FE18D9.23771.18A708E7@localhost> Message-ID: <42FF6C82.9060507@rogers.com> Christopher Browne wrote: > In contrast, book stores have the *massive* added costs of evaluating > and pushing inventory throughout their store networks. This leads to an > inherent inefficiency, namely that unless they HEAVILY overstock, it is > likely that they will run out of a book at some locations whilst copies > remain unsold elsewhere. > > That doesn't happen for Amazon and Chapters; the books are only at one > location, and the way they "run out" is if there truly is no stock left. Chapters stores will check stock at other stores and also ask the other store to hold a copy. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From stephen-d-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 17:57:06 2005 From: stephen-d-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Stephen) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 13:57:06 -0400 Subject: Computer bookstores in GTA In-Reply-To: <20050814151911.GA2114-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <42FE18D9.23771.18A708E7@localhost> <20050814151911.GA2114@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <42FF85F2.4060402@rogers.com> William Park wrote: >Mail order has its advanatages. But, I suspect most books are still >sold in-store. My personal feeling is that if books come down to $20 >level, then more books will be sold. $80 for books, that I will read >only once and only few pages will be of use to me, is a bit too much. > > I think the people behind this site: http://www.sitepoint.com/ have figured out how to address a niche. And I would describe all serious computer related topics a niche. They focus on web development and stuff like PHP and MySQL. I have purchased over $200 worth of books from them and just ordered two more. They have forums and useful articles. Well worth checking out! Stephen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 18:06:56 2005 From: blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Byron L. Sonne) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 14:06:56 -0400 Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.3.32.20050813145028.006931b8@pop.istop.com> Message-ID: <42FF8840.9020705@rogers.com> > Imho take the laser printer to service. Its switching power supply may > be jamming the DSL frequencies. Interesting... I've run into numerous problems over the year using gear of all kinds and recording music (I had all my music gear and computer stuff, printers, etc in the same room on the same 2 circuits). For problematic devices that were causing interference (not just 60/120Hz hum, though that was the most common), often times we'd swap in a new power cable that had the ground lifted (i.e. we did it on the cheap and just sawed the grounding prong off!). Doing that solved more problems than I thought it should, so I'd be interested to know if that helps out your situation. Try running it from another circuit via extension cord first. And if it's been sitting at waist level, get yer sperm count checked ;) Regards, Byron -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From zkoziol-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 18:08:16 2005 From: zkoziol-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Zbigniew Koziol) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 14:08:16 -0400 Subject: Computer bookstores in GTA In-Reply-To: <20050814151911.GA2114-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <42FE18D9.23771.18A708E7@localhost> <20050814151911.GA2114@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <42FF8890.7040206@istop.com> First of all, why do you buy computer books when everything (or close to that) is on the Internet? OK, I did buy a few compter related books in the past as well, but... I dont think I ever read them and certainly they were not very helpfull... ;) Perl? Go and use it. Figure out yourself, how... PHP? It is pretty simple and full documentation is available for free. Apache? Install and configure it - thats it. Web development? Common... That can not be learned from books. Perhaps as a reference, in some rare cases, books might be usefull. But not for learning ;) zb. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From right_maple_nut-/E1597aS9LT10XsdtD+oqA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 18:32:38 2005 From: right_maple_nut-/E1597aS9LT10XsdtD+oqA at public.gmane.org (Amos H. Weatherill) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 14:32:38 -0400 Subject: linuxcaffe consultant meeting WEDNESDAY ! In-Reply-To: <42FF48A7.4050408-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <42FF48A7.4050408@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: What happened to Tuesday the 16th? I might not be able to make it on Wednesday. Signed. Amos -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org]On Behalf Of David J Patrick Sent: Sunday, August 14, 2005 9:36 AM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org; talk-Q3LYrvjeUVfMLq2q1+GOoQ at public.gmane.org Subject: [TLUG]: linuxcaffe consultant meeting WEDNESDAY ! In regards to the proposed meeting of open-source service providers; please be advised that, due to scheduling conflicts of early responders, the meeting date has been fixed on Wednesday, August 17th 7:30 pm - 9 pm (?) for full details, see http://www.memeshadow.net/linuxcaffe/node/129 I hope to see you there, djp -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 18:35:36 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 14:35:36 -0400 Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: <42FF8840.9020705-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <3.0.3.32.20050813145028.006931b8@pop.istop.com> <42FF8840.9020705@rogers.com> Message-ID: <42FF8EF8.7050803@rogers.com> Byron L. Sonne wrote: > For problematic devices that were causing interference (not just > 60/120Hz hum, though that was the most common), often times we'd swap in > a new power cable that had the ground lifted (i.e. we did it on the > cheap and just sawed the grounding prong off!). Doing that solved more > problems than I thought it should, so I'd be interested to know if that > helps out your situation. That is a violation of electrical codes and sufficient to void your fire insurance, not to mention potentially lethal. Don't *EVER* do that!!! -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 18:57:00 2005 From: pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 14:57:00 -0400 Subject: Computer bookstores in GTA In-Reply-To: <42FF8890.7040206-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> References: <20050814151911.GA2114@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <42FF5BBC.27078.1D945169@localhost> > First of all, why do you buy computer books when everything (or close > to that) is on the Internet? I don't think the internet would ever replace books for me, so it is not a valid comparison. First of all, the 'net is a fluid medium. Web content changes and rearranges itself all the time. Pages get deleted. Sites close down. Not so for books. I can rely on my books whether or not web pages exist for it. This is not to say that I exclude the internet. I make use of all available resources of learning that I can. Like William Park alluded to: I also am unwilling to shuck out $80 for a book where only a few pages will be useful, but if I can find it for less than $20 somewhere, I will often buy it if I think I can make some use of it. I realise that Perl can be leared through the net, however, that wasn't so true when I had to learn it. I was given a book to learn from (O'Reilly's "Programming Perl" and one on the Perl DBI), and had to do even more learning from on-line docs, such as perldoc. With books, I can dog-ear pages, underline or highlight key points, and take it with me anywhere, even to the lakeside near my house. And unlike a laptop, it doesn't need batteries. Books don't make a noise; they don't have power supplies that can malfunction; no mice that can clog up; no screen that gives off radiation. Books don't get destroyed if there's a power surge. You just read, and when you run out of stuff to read, you flip over the page, and hey! There's more! Then, all you have to do is keep repeating this process until you are done. True, I find I don't need to do a lot of reading to feel that I know enough to do something with a language. I read a few pages of a book on CSS that I recently purchased at discount, and before I finished chapter 1, I already completed a CSS for my website. But the book has 14 chapters, and why don't I consider it money wasted? Because it stays as a reference. I noticed that there are still some improvements I can add, so when I have some more time, I will refer back to the book and make my improvements. But while I do that, I am likely to cast out into the internet for further examples and explanations. I try to make use of all resources available to me. To be fair, paper probably contains less than 1% radioactive carbon which will probably emit the odd alpha or beta particle which is 0.0000000000001% likely to cause leukemia or skin cancer. :-) Paul King -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From zkoziol-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 19:23:10 2005 From: zkoziol-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Zbigniew Koziol) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 15:23:10 -0400 Subject: Computer bookstores in GTA In-Reply-To: <42FF5BBC.27078.1D945169@localhost> References: <20050814151911.GA2114@node1.opengeometry.net> <42FF5BBC.27078.1D945169@localhost> Message-ID: <42FF9A1E.9000804@istop.com> pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org wrote: > [...] > To be fair, paper probably contains less than 1% radioactive carbon > which will probably emit the odd alpha or beta particle which is > 0.0000000000001% likely to cause leukemia or skin cancer. :-) A good point. Unfortunately, we do not really know how harmfull is using computers, especially for people like most of us on this list. Simply, there is no data on that, as far as I am aware of. But I have no doubts that sitting behind the monitor almost all the time is probably like to be exposed to X-rays at least a few times during the year. These using laptops are more lucky. Not mentioning demage that computer usage does to our psychic and interpersonal relations with these who do not care much about computers or the Internet... zb. P.s.: I am reading a lot of books but when going to my work, on subway or busses. These though are not technical books ;) When I am at home, I use the Internet only. rense.com (funny? - no!). Even Google News section (silly). rense.com is a good starting point for finding out other outstanding sources of alternative, non-corporately controlled information. Though they are a bit too leftist as for me, while I am looking for the truth. > Paul King > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From zkoziol-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 19:52:32 2005 From: zkoziol-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Zbigniew Koziol) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 15:52:32 -0400 Subject: X-rays and computers In-Reply-To: <42FF9A1E.9000804-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> References: <20050814151911.GA2114@node1.opengeometry.net> <42FF5BBC.27078.1D945169@localhost> <42FF9A1E.9000804@istop.com> Message-ID: <42FFA100.7070200@istop.com> I googled for "computer monitor radiation" (without quotes). The first pages that are shown is a mambo-jumbo. There is something about low frequency electromagnetic fields from monitor. Silly. Low frequencies have no effect at all on health, in this case. There is no mention of X-ray radiation! And that one is strong, I have no doubts. X-rays are produced when electrons traveling with a high velocity are stopped abruptly (thats how it happens in monitors; this is also the physical principle how X-rays generators are working). Perhaps we should demand that producers of monitors should inform about X-rays intensity these monitors generate? Better if they were able to provide a 3D map of these intensities. zb. Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org wrote: > > [...] > >> To be fair, paper probably contains less than 1% radioactive carbon >> which will probably emit the odd alpha or beta particle which is >> 0.0000000000001% likely to cause leukemia or skin cancer. :-) > > > A good point. > > Unfortunately, we do not really know how harmfull is using computers, > especially for people like most of us on this list. Simply, there is no > data on that, as far as I am aware of. But I have no doubts that sitting > behind the monitor almost all the time is probably like to be exposed to > X-rays at least a few times during the year. These using laptops are > more lucky. Not mentioning demage that computer usage does to our > psychic and interpersonal relations with these who do not care much > about computers or the Internet... > > zb. > > P.s.: I am reading a lot of books but when going to my work, on subway > or busses. These though are not technical books ;) When I am at home, I > use the Internet only. rense.com (funny? - no!). Even Google News > section (silly). rense.com is a good starting point for finding out > other outstanding sources of alternative, non-corporately controlled > information. Though they are a bit too leftist as for me, while I am > looking for the truth. > >> Paul King >> > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- Zbigniew Koziol, SoftQuake^(tm) Open Source Business Solutions Web Development, Linux, Web Mail Fax Voice Servers, Networking Consultations, Innovative Technologies Tel/Fax: 1-416-530-2780 Toronto, Canada, http://www.softquake.ca, info-lcEyp1+e+UdAFePFGvp55w at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 20:02:07 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 16:02:07 -0400 Subject: X-rays and computers In-Reply-To: <42FFA100.7070200-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> References: <20050814151911.GA2114@node1.opengeometry.net> <42FF5BBC.27078.1D945169@localhost> <42FF9A1E.9000804@istop.com> <42FFA100.7070200@istop.com> Message-ID: <42FFA33F.4090606@rogers.com> Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > I googled for "computer monitor radiation" (without quotes). The first > pages that are shown is a mambo-jumbo. There is something about low > frequency electromagnetic fields from monitor. Silly. Low frequencies > have no effect at all on health, in this case. There is no mention of > X-ray radiation! And that one is strong, I have no doubts. X-rays are > produced when electrons traveling with a high velocity are stopped > abruptly (thats how it happens in monitors; this is also the physical > principle how X-rays generators are working). > > > Perhaps we should demand that producers of monitors should inform about > X-rays intensity these monitors generate? Better if they were able to > provide a 3D map of these intensities. Production of X-rays requires voltages higher than those permitted in TVs and monitors. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From zkoziol-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 20:16:09 2005 From: zkoziol-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Zbigniew Koziol) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 16:16:09 -0400 Subject: X-rays and computers In-Reply-To: <42FFA33F.4090606-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <20050814151911.GA2114@node1.opengeometry.net> <42FF5BBC.27078.1D945169@localhost> <42FF9A1E.9000804@istop.com> <42FFA100.7070200@istop.com> <42FFA33F.4090606@rogers.com> Message-ID: <42FFA689.9000205@istop.com> James Knott wrote: > Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > >>I googled for "computer monitor radiation" (without quotes). The first >>pages that are shown is a mambo-jumbo. There is something about low >>frequency electromagnetic fields from monitor. Silly. Low frequencies >>have no effect at all on health, in this case. There is no mention of >>X-ray radiation! And that one is strong, I have no doubts. X-rays are >>produced when electrons traveling with a high velocity are stopped >>abruptly (thats how it happens in monitors; this is also the physical >>principle how X-rays generators are working). >> >> >>Perhaps we should demand that producers of monitors should inform about >>X-rays intensity these monitors generate? Better if they were able to >>provide a 3D map of these intensities. > > > Production of X-rays requires voltages higher than those permitted in > TVs and monitors. No. From the physical point of view, there is no borderline betweem safe and unsafe. X-rays produced by monitors might be more safe than these produced by special devices for X-ray examination at hospital. But we still need data about how monitors are safe. There are no such data available, as far as I know. zb. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 20:45:37 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 16:45:37 -0400 (EDT) Subject: X-rays and computers In-Reply-To: <42FFA100.7070200-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> References: <42FFA100.7070200@istop.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 14 Aug 2005, Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > ...There is no mention of > X-ray radiation! And that one is strong, I have no doubts... So strong and so obvious that the issue was noticed long ago, way back in the days when CRTs were mostly for television sets. TV/monitor manufacturers have been required for decades to ensure that their products have essentially zero X-ray emissions, and yes, they are tested for it. The voltages are not high enough to generate very penetrating X-rays, but precautions are taken to stop even the fairly feeble ones that do get produced. For example, there is often considerable lead content in the front glass. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 21:01:38 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 17:01:38 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Computer bookstores in GTA In-Reply-To: <42FF9A1E.9000804-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> References: <42FF9A1E.9000804@istop.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 14 Aug 2005, Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > ...But I have no doubts that sitting > behind the monitor almost all the time is probably like to be exposed to > X-rays at least a few times during the year... There is data on X-ray exposure from monitors going back over half a century. (People working in TV production spent their days looking closely at monitors well before there were computers involved.) As I noted in an earlier posting, X-ray emissions from monitors have long been regulated and tested for. > ...Not mentioning demage that computer usage does to our > psychic and interpersonal relations with these who do not care much > about computers or the Internet... Years ago, I had the pleasure of attending a talk by Grace Hopper; she was generally very optimistic about the effects of the spread of computers. In the Q&A at the end, somebody asked her about the "depersonalizing" effects of computer communication. She smiled and said: "you know, I can remember when they said that about telephones". > P.s.: I am reading a lot of books but when going to my work, on subway > or busses. These though are not technical books ;) When I am at home, I > use the Internet only... You're missing a lot. There are still many things not online. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From kburtch-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 22:07:26 2005 From: kburtch-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ken Burtch) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 18:07:26 -0400 Subject: PegaSoft's Summer Programming Challenge In-Reply-To: <1123861892.26128.85.camel-csCcNl6ta60tuqGvh5Fqhg@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050811141102.GA17037@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050811152220.GI6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050812130632.GA2373@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050812132653.GM6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <42FCC2AD.8040806@gmail.com> <1123861892.26128.85.camel@holden.weait.net> Message-ID: <1124057246.2808.26.camel@rosette.pegasoft.ca> For anyone who is unaware, PegaSoft is holding it's annual Linux programming challenge. The winner will have their entry featured on the PegaSoft web site and a small prize will be awarded. The main goal is to have some fun this summer. The 2005 challenge is to create an Linux application that listens to sound, either through the microphone jack or from a file, and interprets the sound in some way. For example, drawing patterns in response to sounds. Entries can be written in any language and the deadline has been extended to September 1. Past challenges can be viewed at http://www.pegasoft.ca/challenge.html So have fun with Linux! ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ken O. Burtch Phone: 905-562-0848 Author "Linux Shell Scripting with Bash" Fax: 905-562-0848 http://www.pegasoft.ca Email: ken-8VyUGRzHQ8IsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org ------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 22:42:01 2005 From: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (Peter Hiscocks) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 18:42:01 -0400 Subject: Computer bookstores in GTA In-Reply-To: References: <42FF9A1E.9000804@istop.com> Message-ID: <20050814224201.GA1713@ee.ryerson.ca> One important point about books vs the Internet as a source of information. Books (and some other forms of communication, such as journals and conference proceedings) have some sort of peer review, which prevents some totally wrong-headed ideas from finding their way into print. There is no such quality control on the Internet: anyone can post anything. At one point, one of my students obtained a circuit from the Internet for a stepper motor driver. I advised him that it wouldn't work and indeed, that proved to be the case. (One of the joys of teaching is occasionally being proven right.) That said, the quality of information on the internet (where I have been able to verify it, in my own specialty of electronics) is surprisingly good and in some cases amazingly comprehensive and complete. However, one has to view it in the same way one would view a self-published manuscript. Peter On Sun, Aug 14, 2005 at 05:01:38PM -0400, Henry Spencer wrote: > On Sun, 14 Aug 2005, Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > > ...But I have no doubts that sitting > > behind the monitor almost all the time is probably like to be exposed to > > X-rays at least a few times during the year... > > There is data on X-ray exposure from monitors going back over half a > century. (People working in TV production spent their days looking > closely at monitors well before there were computers involved.) As I > noted in an earlier posting, X-ray emissions from monitors have long > been regulated and tested for. > > > ...Not mentioning demage that computer usage does to our > > psychic and interpersonal relations with these who do not care much > > about computers or the Internet... > > Years ago, I had the pleasure of attending a talk by Grace Hopper; she was > generally very optimistic about the effects of the spread of computers. > In the Q&A at the end, somebody asked her about the "depersonalizing" > effects of computer communication. She smiled and said: "you know, I can > remember when they said that about telephones". > > > P.s.: I am reading a lot of books but when going to my work, on subway > > or busses. These though are not technical books ;) When I am at home, I > > use the Internet only... > > You're missing a lot. There are still many things not online. > > Henry Spencer > henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- Peter D. Hiscocks Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering Ryerson University, 350 Victoria Street, Toronto, Ontario, M5B 2K3, Canada Phone: (416) 979-5000 Ext 6109 Fax: (416) 979-5280 Email: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org URL: http://www.ee.ryerson.ca/~phiscock -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 23:02:44 2005 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 02:02:44 +0300 (IDT) Subject: Computer bookstores in GTA In-Reply-To: <42FF8890.7040206-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> References: <42FE18D9.23771.18A708E7@localhost> <20050814151911.GA2114@node1.opengeometry.net> <42FF8890.7040206@istop.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 14 Aug 2005, Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > First of all, why do you buy computer books when everything (or close to > that) is on the Internet? > > OK, I did buy a few compter related books in the past as well, but... I dont > think I ever read them and certainly they were not very helpfull... ;) > > Perl? Go and use it. Figure out yourself, how... PHP? It is pretty simple and > full documentation is available for free. Apache? Install and configure it - > thats it. Web development? Common... That can not be learned from books. > > Perhaps as a reference, in some rare cases, books might be usefull. But not > for learning ;) It is said that experience is the best friend and the worst teacher. The worst teacher, because it will show you all the mistakes after you make them. Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 23:03:41 2005 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 02:03:41 +0300 (IDT) Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: <42FF8EF8.7050803-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <3.0.3.32.20050813145028.006931b8@pop.istop.com> <42FF8840.9020705@rogers.com> <42FF8EF8.7050803@rogers.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 14 Aug 2005, James Knott wrote: > Byron L. Sonne wrote: > >> For problematic devices that were causing interference (not just >> 60/120Hz hum, though that was the most common), often times we'd swap in >> a new power cable that had the ground lifted (i.e. we did it on the >> cheap and just sawed the grounding prong off!). Doing that solved more >> problems than I thought it should, so I'd be interested to know if that >> helps out your situation. > > That is a violation of electrical codes and sufficient to void your fire > insurance, not to mention potentially lethal. Don't *EVER* do that!!! Agree. Investing into audio transformers is much better. Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 23:06:47 2005 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 02:06:47 +0300 (IDT) Subject: X-rays and computers In-Reply-To: <42FFA100.7070200-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> References: <20050814151911.GA2114@node1.opengeometry.net> <42FF5BBC.27078.1D945169@localhost> <42FF9A1E.9000804@istop.com> <42FFA100.7070200@istop.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 14 Aug 2005, Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > I googled for "computer monitor radiation" (without quotes). The first pages > that are shown is a mambo-jumbo. There is something about low frequency > electromagnetic fields from monitor. Silly. Low frequencies have no effect at > all on health, in this case. There is no mention of X-ray radiation! And that > one is strong, I have no doubts. X-rays are produced when electrons traveling > with a high velocity are stopped abruptly (thats how it happens in monitors; > this is also the physical principle how X-rays generators are working). > > > Perhaps we should demand that producers of monitors should inform about > X-rays intensity these monitors generate? Better if they were able to provide > a 3D map of these intensities. The way it works is, the electrons hit the backside of the screen and emit some X rays (soft ones). The 1/2 inch glass between you and them contains lead and is the shield. If this is scary, use a lcd monitor. Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 14 23:55:54 2005 From: ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ansar Mohammed) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 19:55:54 -0400 Subject: Power Consumption Message-ID: Hello All, Many of us here have more than one computer at home. Some of us I believe have as maybe a small network. I was wondering how does everyone deal with the impact on your hydro bill? One of my hopes as I came to Canada was to have my own little server farm in my basement. (I am a retro computing guy so I really am not interested in new stuff) Now everyone I meet is warning me about the impact on my power bill. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From presidentofthefuture-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 00:20:41 2005 From: presidentofthefuture-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Mike Newman) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 20:20:41 -0400 Subject: Power Consumption In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 8/14/05, Ansar Mohammed wrote: > Many of us here have more than one computer at home. Some of us I believe > have as maybe a small network. I was wondering how does everyone deal with > the impact on your hydro bill? I like playing video games, and if I want to play any recent ones that means firing up the power-hungry monster that I'm using right now. Unfortunately 3D card manufacturers would rather sell you an air conditioner to attach to your case than produce something efficient and cool. CPUs used to be the same way but I hear that some motherboard manufacturers are making desktop boards that take mobile processors! On the other hand, when I walk through my neighbourhood and realise that 75% of the houses on my block run their central AC all the time, I don't feel so bad about running a 300W power supply and a CRT. My network only has two machines at the moment and unless I can replace this one with something more efficient I think it's going to stay that way. You might want to think about the kinds of services that you need and pick your hardware from there. For example, the Linksys NSLU2 is a cheap, efficient, Linux-based file and print server. Simply hook up an external hard drive and attach it to your network. There's also an active hacking community at http://www.nslu2-linux.org/ If you need something more capable, consider building an EPIA box. If you really wanted to be serious about it you could put the OS on a CF card, then host files off of external hard drives. When you don't need them, you just turn them off! Finally, I don't mean to blaspheme, but if you're looking for a family computer, you could do a lot worse than a Mac Mini, power-wise. Just some suggestions! Mike -- Get Firefox - Take back the Web http://www.getfirefox.com/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 00:23:46 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 20:23:46 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Install fest registration... Message-ID: <20050815002346.29197.qmail@web88205.mail.re2.yahoo.com> I got the following e-mail, any suggestions as to how I should reply to this person? I have checked, and the IBM M Pro Server was (depending on model) a Pentium II 350 or 400 MHz box, so should be if anything overkill for the sort of stuff this person suggests... Colin McGregor > I am planning to bring an IBM M Pro server (6889 > 10U) with one processor. I > would like to put in a secont network card and run > it as my broadband router > and internal file server. I might like to also run > a server using dynamic > nameserver hostin (is that what it's called?) > > > > This isn't to confirm it (yet) as I may have a > schedule conflict, however, > besides detailed listings of my hardware from > Windows hardware manager, what > else can I do to facilitate this install? > > > > Thanks -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 00:31:02 2005 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 20:31:02 -0400 Subject: Computer bookstores in GTA In-Reply-To: <42FF6C82.9060507-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <42FE18D9.23771.18A708E7@localhost> <42FF6C82.9060507@rogers.com> Message-ID: On 8/14/05, James Knott wrote: > > Christopher Browne wrote: > > In contrast, book stores have the *massive* added costs of evaluating > > and pushing inventory throughout their store networks. This leads to an > > inherent inefficiency, namely that unless they HEAVILY overstock, it is > > likely that they will run out of a book at some locations whilst copies > > remain unsold elsewhere. > > > > That doesn't happen for Amazon and Chapters; the books are only at one > > location, and the way they "run out" is if there truly is no stock left. > > Chapters stores will check stock at other stores and also ask the other > store to hold a copy. > Chapters is an ambiguous case because they combine "brick and mortar store" with an Internet "shipping from central locations" operation. In the above, I was referring to them as "Internet sale from central location", NOT in their role as having multiple locations. The same ambiguity is true for Barnes & Noble who have both stores and an internet operation... At any rate, the point should be clear. In a *centralized* operation such as Amazon and others that operate *centralized operations*, there is no need for the numerous costs of transshipment. -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 00:35:13 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 20:35:13 -0400 Subject: Power Consumption References: Message-ID: <002f01c5a131$451c5000$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> >----- Original Message ----- >From: Ansar Mohammed >To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org >Sent: Sunday, 14 August, 2005 19:55 >Subject: [TLUG]: Power Consumption > >Hello All, >Many of us here have more than one computer at home. Some of us I believe have as maybe a small network. I was wondering how >does everyone deal with the impact on your hydro bill? >One of my hopes as I came to Canada was to have my own little server farm in my basement. (I am a retro computing guy so I really am >not interested in new stuff) Now everyone I meet is warning me about the impact on my power bill. It definitely costs something! Looking at the added wattage of everything I have at home (2 desktops with tube monitors, 1 laptop, router, printers, etc) it easily adds up to over 2500 watts when many things are in use at the same time. This costs easily a few dollars every day. I guess you can check the labels on your equipment and figure out how much power each will typically consume. At 4.3 cents per kW-hour you can easily figure out how much your equipment costs per day. If you are in business you can declare this (estimated) portion of your Hydro bill as an expense. Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 00:38:25 2005 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 20:38:25 -0400 Subject: Power Consumption In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 8/14/05, Mike Newman wrote: > > For example, the Linksys NSLU2 is a cheap, efficient, Linux-based file > and print server. Simply hook up an external hard drive and attach it > to your network. There's also an active hacking community at > http://www.nslu2-linux.org/ Yeah, I'm keen on messing with one of those. There's an option of hooking up a USB key so that it'll have no moving parts and be silent. -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From imranqau-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 00:38:51 2005 From: imranqau-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Muhammad Imran) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 00:38:51 +0000 Subject: Computer bookstores in GTA In-Reply-To: <20050814224201.GA1713-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w@public.gmane.org> References: <20050814224201.GA1713@ee.ryerson.ca> Message-ID: Well, i don't know why we are so much into [A "vs" B ] thing all the time....... I mean everything has its benefits and drawbacks, there is always a tradeoff involved in almost every decision....... I believe books and internet both are a beautiful medium of communication, learning and teaching. Each has some positive and negative points, but that doesn't mean that we have to fight if one is SUPERIOR than other...... let's learn from CO-OPERATION of internet and books. not the COMPETITION Lets be more open minded and accept and enjoy the positive side of things, and yes also accept and compromise negative side of things, as there yet has to be a thing that can be called PERFECT. cheers, Imran >From: Peter Hiscocks >Reply-To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org >To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org >Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Computer bookstores in GTA >Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 18:42:01 -0400 > > >One important point about books vs the Internet as a source of information. >Books (and some other forms of communication, such as journals and >conference proceedings) have some sort of peer review, which prevents some >totally wrong-headed ideas from finding their way into print. There is no >such quality control on the Internet: anyone can post anything. > >At one point, one of my students obtained a circuit from the Internet for a >stepper motor driver. I advised him that it wouldn't work and indeed, that >proved to be the case. (One of the joys of teaching is occasionally being >proven right.) > >That said, the quality of information on the internet (where I have been >able to verify it, in my own specialty of electronics) is surprisingly good >and in some cases amazingly comprehensive and complete. However, one has to >view it in the same way one would view a self-published manuscript. > >Peter > > > > >On Sun, Aug 14, 2005 at 05:01:38PM -0400, Henry Spencer wrote: > > On Sun, 14 Aug 2005, Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > > > ...But I have no doubts that sitting > > > behind the monitor almost all the time is probably like to be exposed >to > > > X-rays at least a few times during the year... > > > > There is data on X-ray exposure from monitors going back over half a > > century. (People working in TV production spent their days looking > > closely at monitors well before there were computers involved.) As I > > noted in an earlier posting, X-ray emissions from monitors have long > > been regulated and tested for. > > > > > ...Not mentioning demage that computer usage does to our > > > psychic and interpersonal relations with these who do not care much > > > about computers or the Internet... > > > > Years ago, I had the pleasure of attending a talk by Grace Hopper; she >was > > generally very optimistic about the effects of the spread of computers. > > In the Q&A at the end, somebody asked her about the "depersonalizing" > > effects of computer communication. She smiled and said: "you know, I >can > > remember when they said that about telephones". > > > > > P.s.: I am reading a lot of books but when going to my work, on subway > > > or busses. These though are not technical books ;) When I am at home, >I > > > use the Internet only... > > > > You're missing a lot. There are still many things not online. > > > > Henry Spencer > > >henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org > > > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > >-- >Peter D. Hiscocks >Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering >Ryerson University, >350 Victoria Street, >Toronto, Ontario, M5B 2K3, Canada > >Phone: (416) 979-5000 Ext 6109 >Fax: (416) 979-5280 >Email: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org >URL: http://www.ee.ryerson.ca/~phiscock >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 00:42:58 2005 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 20:42:58 -0400 Subject: Power Consumption In-Reply-To: <002f01c5a131$451c5000$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> References: <002f01c5a131$451c5000$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: On 8/14/05, Francois Ouellette wrote: > > It definitely costs something! > > Looking at the added wattage of everything I have at home (2 desktops with > tube monitors, 1 laptop, router, printers, etc) it easily adds up to over > 2500 watts when many things are in use at the same time. This costs easily > a > few dollars every day. It's not nearly as simple as that. Power supplies have to be rated for peak load, and, not unlike with aircraft, that peak is normally required only for a brief period of time, at start up time. Once the system is up, it likely consumes quite a lot less than the 300W that is the common rating for PSUs... -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 00:50:22 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 20:50:22 -0400 Subject: Power Consumption References: <002f01c5a131$451c5000$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: <004701c5a133$63477a80$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> I typically cut the rating in half, but for estimating a cost for business purposes one tends to stay on the high side... Fran?ois Ouellette ----- Original Message ----- From: Christopher Browne To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Sent: Sunday, 14 August, 2005 20:42 Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Power Consumption On 8/14/05, Francois Ouellette wrote: It definitely costs something! Looking at the added wattage of everything I have at home (2 desktops with tube monitors, 1 laptop, router, printers, etc) it easily adds up to over 2500 watts when many things are in use at the same time. This costs easily a few dollars every day. It's not nearly as simple as that. Power supplies have to be rated for peak load, and, not unlike with aircraft, that peak is normally required only for a brief period of time, at start up time. Once the system is up, it likely consumes quite a lot less than the 300W that is the common rating for PSUs... -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.8/71 - Release Date: 12/8/05 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 01:05:32 2005 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 21:05:32 -0400 Subject: Power Consumption In-Reply-To: <004701c5a133$63477a80$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> References: <002f01c5a131$451c5000$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <004701c5a133$63477a80$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: <42FFEA5C.8000403@alteeve.com> Keep in mind that switching power supplies are not 100% efficient. They tend to be most efficient at around 75% of their maximum draw (225w draw on a 300w PSU). Even at that they tend to be 65% efficient (though the quality of your PSU could vary this a lot). Sooo... If even if you have peak efficiency drawing 225w with 65% efficiency you will be pulling roughly 300+w (someone correct me if my math is wrong). The concept is there though, a 300w PSU draws more than 300w from the mains at 100% load. Madison Francois Ouellette wrote: > I typically cut the rating in half, but for estimating a cost for > business purposes one tends to stay on the high side... > > Fran?ois Ouellette > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* Christopher Browne > *To:* tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > *Sent:* Sunday, 14 August, 2005 20:42 > *Subject:* Re: [TLUG]: Power Consumption > > On 8/14/05, *Francois Ouellette* > wrote: > > It definitely costs something! > > Looking at the added wattage of everything I have at home (2 > desktops with > tube monitors, 1 laptop, router, printers, etc) it easily adds > up to over > 2500 watts when many things are in use at the same time. This > costs easily a > few dollars every day. > > > It's not nearly as simple as that. > > Power supplies have to be rated for peak load, and, not unlike with > aircraft, that peak is normally required only for a brief period of > time, at start up time. > > Once the system is up, it likely consumes quite a lot less than the > 300W that is the common rating for PSUs... > -- > http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html > > "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him > absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 01:46:11 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 21:46:11 -0400 Subject: Power Consumption In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <42FFF3E3.1040705@rogers.com> Ansar Mohammed wrote: > Hello All, > > Many of us here have more than one computer at home. Some of us I > believe have as maybe a small network. I was wondering how does everyone > deal with the impact on your hydro bill? > > One of my hopes as I came to Canada was to have my own little server > farm in my basement. (I am a retro computing guy so I really am not > interested in new stuff) Now everyone I meet is warning me about the > impact on my power bill. well, if you use it, you pay for it. To find out how much it costs, measure the power drawn by your computers and calculate how many kilowatt hours they consume. You'll then be able to determine the cost. If you're really worried, shut down the computers you're not using. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 01:50:05 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 21:50:05 -0400 Subject: Power Consumption In-Reply-To: <002f01c5a131$451c5000$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> References: <002f01c5a131$451c5000$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: <42FFF4CD.6020107@rogers.com> Francois Ouellette wrote: >>----- Original Message ----- >>From: Ansar Mohammed >>To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org >>Sent: Sunday, 14 August, 2005 19:55 >>Subject: [TLUG]: Power Consumption >> >>Hello All, >>Many of us here have more than one computer at home. Some of us I believe > have as maybe a small network. I was wondering how >does everyone deal with > the impact on your hydro bill? >>One of my hopes as I came to Canada was to have my own little server farm > in my basement. (I am a retro computing guy so I really am >not interested > in new stuff) Now everyone I meet is warning me about the impact on my power > bill. > > > It definitely costs something! > > Looking at the added wattage of everything I have at home (2 desktops with > tube monitors, 1 laptop, router, printers, etc) it easily adds up to over > 2500 watts when many things are in use at the same time. This costs easily a > few dollars every day. > > I guess you can check the labels on your equipment and figure out how much > power each will typically consume. > At 4.3 cents per kW-hour you can easily figure out how much your equipment > costs per day. That will determine the maximum they're likely to draw. Also, many devices are rated in volt amps, not watts, and not so easy (without knowing power factor) to convert into actual watts that you're paying for. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 01:52:09 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 21:52:09 -0400 Subject: Computer bookstores in GTA In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <42FFF549.8010007@rogers.com> Muhammad Imran wrote: > Well, i don't know why we are so much into [A "vs" B ] thing all the > time....... I mean everything has its benefits and drawbacks, there is > always a tradeoff involved in almost every decision....... I believe > books and internet both are a beautiful medium of communication, > learning and teaching. Each has some positive and negative points, but > that doesn't mean that we have to fight if one is SUPERIOR than > other...... let's learn from CO-OPERATION of internet and books. not the > COMPETITION > > Lets be more open minded and accept and enjoy the positive side of > things, and yes also accept and compromise negative side of things, as > there yet has to be a thing that can be called PERFECT. What I tend to do, is browse through the books in the Chapters store, then when I find one I want, order it from the Chapters web site, as it's much cheaper there. ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 01:54:46 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 21:54:46 -0400 Subject: Power Consumption In-Reply-To: <42FFEA5C.8000403-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <002f01c5a131$451c5000$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <004701c5a133$63477a80$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <42FFEA5C.8000403@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <42FFF5E6.1010807@rogers.com> Madison Kelly wrote: > Keep in mind that switching power supplies are not 100% efficient. They > tend to be most efficient at around 75% of their maximum draw (225w draw > on a 300w PSU). Even at that they tend to be 65% efficient (though the > quality of your PSU could vary this a lot). Sooo... If even if you have > peak efficiency drawing 225w with 65% efficiency you will be pulling > roughly 300+w (someone correct me if my math is wrong). > > The concept is there though, a 300w PSU draws more than 300w from the > mains at 100% load. No. The rating is the maximum power drawn, not the amount delivered to the load. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 02:34:37 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 22:34:37 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Power Consumption In-Reply-To: <004701c5a133$63477a80$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> References: <004701c5a133$63477a80$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: On Sun, 14 Aug 2005, Francois Ouellette wrote: > I typically cut the rating in half, but for estimating a cost for > business purposes one tends to stay on the high side... Properly, to claim it as a business expense, you must be able to document the amount spent, not just guess at it. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 02:54:40 2005 From: scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Stewart C. Russell) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 22:54:40 -0400 Subject: Power Consumption In-Reply-To: <42FFF4CD.6020107-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <002f01c5a131$451c5000$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <42FFF4CD.6020107@rogers.com> Message-ID: <430003F0.7050707@sympatico.ca> James Knott wrote: > > That will determine the maximum they're likely to draw. Also, many > devices are rated in volt amps, not watts, and not so easy (without > knowing power factor) to convert into actual watts that you're paying A Kill-A-Watt meter (terrible name, well-designed product: ) will show you power usage and power factor. Electricity is so absurdly cheap here that you'd basically have to be smelting aluminium in the basement to notice the cost. It'll be a while before we're paying the 25? I used to pay ... cheers, Stewart -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 03:43:06 2005 From: ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ansar Mohammed) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 23:43:06 -0400 Subject: Power Consumption In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I have a via EPIA board with a travla aluminum case and 2 external 160GB drives.. They have served me well but really wanted to get faster (SCSI) drives. > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org] On Behalf Of Mike > Newman > Sent: August 14, 2005 8:21 PM > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Power Consumption > > On 8/14/05, Ansar Mohammed wrote: > > Many of us here have more than one computer at home. Some of us I > believe > > have as maybe a small network. I was wondering how does everyone deal > with > > the impact on your hydro bill? > > I like playing video games, and if I want to play any recent ones that > means firing up the power-hungry monster that I'm using right now. > Unfortunately 3D card manufacturers would rather sell you an air > conditioner to attach to your case than produce something efficient > and cool. CPUs used to be the same way but I hear that some > motherboard manufacturers are making desktop boards that take mobile > processors! > > On the other hand, when I walk through my neighbourhood and realise > that 75% of the houses on my block run their central AC all the time, > I don't feel so bad about running a 300W power supply and a CRT. > > My network only has two machines at the moment and unless I can > replace this one with something more efficient I think it's going to > stay that way. You might want to think about the kinds of services > that you need and pick your hardware from there. > > For example, the Linksys NSLU2 is a cheap, efficient, Linux-based file > and print server. Simply hook up an external hard drive and attach it > to your network. There's also an active hacking community at > http://www.nslu2-linux.org/ > > If you need something more capable, consider building an EPIA box. If > you really wanted to be serious about it you could put the OS on a CF > card, then host files off of external hard drives. When you don't need > them, you just turn them off! > > Finally, I don't mean to blaspheme, but if you're looking for a family > computer, you could do a lot worse than a Mac Mini, power-wise. > > Just some suggestions! > > Mike > > -- > Get Firefox - Take back the Web > http://www.getfirefox.com/ > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 04:02:25 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 23:02:25 -0500 Subject: X-rays and computers In-Reply-To: References: <20050814151911.GA2114@node1.opengeometry.net> <42FF5BBC.27078.1D945169@localhost> <42FF9A1E.9000804@istop.com> <42FFA100.7070200@istop.com> Message-ID: <1e55af99050814210213ae0539@mail.gmail.com> I thought that the majority of x-rays produced were sent out the back of the monitor.. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 04:08:05 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 23:08:05 -0500 Subject: Install fest registration... In-Reply-To: <20050815002346.29197.qmail-nQt9QCl3sx2B9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20050815002346.29197.qmail@web88205.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1e55af990508142108419853c8@mail.gmail.com> They box may be overkill (and it's ok to say so), but they may already know that.. or this box may be the only spare lying around for those purpose. My firewall is "overkill" at P2 266, but I've seen 1+ gig firewalls .. Maybe they're interested in the installation for academic reasons.. and the box will get re-used once this Linux installation experience is understood. Who knows.. On 14/08/05, Colin McGregor wrote: > I got the following e-mail, any suggestions as to how > I should reply to this person? I have checked, and the > IBM M Pro Server was (depending on model) a Pentium II > 350 or 400 MHz box, so should be if anything overkill > for the sort of stuff this person suggests... > > Colin McGregor > > > I am planning to bring an IBM M Pro server (6889 > > 10U) with one processor. I > > would like to put in a secont network card and run > > it as my broadband router > > and internal file server. I might like to also run > > a server using dynamic > > nameserver hostin (is that what it's called?) > > > > > > > > This isn't to confirm it (yet) as I may have a > > schedule conflict, however, > > besides detailed listings of my hardware from > > Windows hardware manager, what > > else can I do to facilitate this install? > > > > > > > > Thanks -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 04:03:48 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 23:03:48 -0500 Subject: X-rays and computers In-Reply-To: References: <20050814151911.GA2114@node1.opengeometry.net> <42FF5BBC.27078.1D945169@localhost> <42FF9A1E.9000804@istop.com> <42FFA100.7070200@istop.com> Message-ID: <1e55af990508142103701a59e4@mail.gmail.com> I thought that the majority of x-rays produced were sent out the back of the monitor.. Well, that aside.. I'm more worried about the magnetic field.. my magnetic field sensitivity means that I get raging headaches when a case is left open near me. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 05:11:36 2005 From: josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Joseph Kubik) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 01:11:36 -0400 Subject: Power Consumption In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: The math I just did, correct me if I'm wrong, is 2 Amp * 120 Volt *24 Hour * 30 Day / 1000 = 172 KW/H * 4.3 C = $7.43. 2 Amps is what an IBM / Dell / HP 1U dual cpu dual ultra scsi server pulls. (I measured last month for UPS sizing) If you are cooling it in a server room double the cost, 'cause almost all of that electricity is producing heat. -Joseph- On 8/14/05, Ansar Mohammed wrote: > I have a via EPIA board with a travla aluminum case and 2 external 160GB > drives.. They have served me well but really wanted to get faster (SCSI) > drives. > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org] On Behalf Of Mike > > Newman > > Sent: August 14, 2005 8:21 PM > > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Power Consumption > > > > On 8/14/05, Ansar Mohammed wrote: > > > Many of us here have more than one computer at home. Some of us I > > believe > > > have as maybe a small network. I was wondering how does everyone deal > > with > > > the impact on your hydro bill? > > > > I like playing video games, and if I want to play any recent ones that > > means firing up the power-hungry monster that I'm using right now. > > Unfortunately 3D card manufacturers would rather sell you an air > > conditioner to attach to your case than produce something efficient > > and cool. CPUs used to be the same way but I hear that some > > motherboard manufacturers are making desktop boards that take mobile > > processors! > > > > On the other hand, when I walk through my neighbourhood and realise > > that 75% of the houses on my block run their central AC all the time, > > I don't feel so bad about running a 300W power supply and a CRT. > > > > My network only has two machines at the moment and unless I can > > replace this one with something more efficient I think it's going to > > stay that way. You might want to think about the kinds of services > > that you need and pick your hardware from there. > > > > For example, the Linksys NSLU2 is a cheap, efficient, Linux-based file > > and print server. Simply hook up an external hard drive and attach it > > to your network. There's also an active hacking community at > > http://www.nslu2-linux.org/ > > > > If you need something more capable, consider building an EPIA box. If > > you really wanted to be serious about it you could put the OS on a CF > > card, then host files off of external hard drives. When you don't need > > them, you just turn them off! > > > > Finally, I don't mean to blaspheme, but if you're looking for a family > > computer, you could do a lot worse than a Mac Mini, power-wise. > > > > Just some suggestions! > > > > Mike > > > > -- > > Get Firefox - Take back the Web > > http://www.getfirefox.com/ > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From foolswisdom-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 02:32:29 2005 From: foolswisdom-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Lloyd D Budd) Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 19:32:29 -0700 Subject: Community QA ? Message-ID: <9712993f050814193214f52bf0@mail.gmail.com> Hello all ! I will soon be working for an open source company continuing to work in a QA role . This role includes a larger Community QA aspect then professional roles I have previously had . It seems to be young field , and I do not know of any fantastic success stories that do not involve a lot of person power . Instead of first considering what software to try for issue tracking , bug tracking , forums , I am interested in what companies or projects that you like telling them about *their* problems ? * and please , not because they take all the abuse you dish out ;-) * your example does not have What are the factors ? - responsiveness ? - problem management ? Only one community QA effort has ever knocked my socks off , fink.sf.net . For the few years that I monitored it , it was (and still appears to be) primarily a single person (+ some developers) and an excellent FAQ ( and good documentation ) : Alexander K. Hansen + http://fink.sourceforge.net/faq/index.php?phpLang=en I have never used their product , but I have always liked the feel of CodeWeavers support , and "show me the money" : http://www.codeweavers.com/support/ example show me : http://www.codeweavers.com/site/compatibility/browse/rank/?app_id=157 Thank you in advance , Lloyd D Budd -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pwa.linux-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 13:37:09 2005 From: pwa.linux-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (PW Armstrong) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 09:37:09 -0400 Subject: Cheap/inexpensive (free?) images In-Reply-To: <1e55af99050814065334775ca8-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <20050808170518.GA4161@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050811141102.GA17037@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050811152220.GI6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050812130632.GA2373@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050812132653.GM6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <42FCC2AD.8040806@gmail.com> <42FDE685.2090406@sympatico.ca> <1e55af99050814065334775ca8@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <43009A85.1010002@gmail.com> Sy, great list, thx very much. -Peter Sy wrote: -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Cheap/inexpensive (free?) images Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2005 08:53:26 -0500 From: Sy Reply-To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org >I might be duplicating some suggestions: > >* http://pdphoto.org >* http://commons.wikimedia.org >* http://www.bigfoto.com/ >* http://geekphilosopher.com/MainPage/photos.htm >* http://www.freemediagoo.com >* http://www.morguefile.com/forum/search.php >* http://aarinfreephoto.com/gallery/index.shtml >* http://www.animalu.com/pics/photos.htm -- Black and white photos, >released under the creative commons license. > >Clip-Art >(cartoony) > >* http://www.barrysclipart.com/ > > > >I update a free pics resources topics every so often: > >http://jrandomhacker.info/mw/index.php/Free_pics >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 14:19:38 2005 From: nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ian Zimmerman) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 10:19:38 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <42FB998F.7070804-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> <200508081421.39109.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af13780508081256224e2435@mail.gmail.com> <42F7B9FD.4020800@rogers.com> <17af1378050808131316fa3810@mail.gmail.com> <42F7CA9E.503@rogers.com> <17af1378050811101231f9e8b8@mail.gmail.com> <20050811172412.GK6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <17af137805081110327c642c62@mail.gmail.com> <42FB998F.7070804@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <17af13780508150719422e6951@mail.gmail.com> On 8/11/05, Marcus Brubaker wrote: > I've been using Rogers cable internet service for 4 or > 5 years now and while it's not perfect and their staff are (with some > notable exceptions) remarkably stupid, I can't really complain too much. So I scheduled a Rogers setup. Ominously, though, the phone rep asked what version of Windoze I used. I said why, he said making sure "my computer could handle the speed". I said I knew it could because I'd built it myself . That was good enough for him, but if the install tech is on the same level, I'll need to be prepared. The Linksys router which I want to connect behind the modem has the following options for connection type. So you know which is the correct setting for Rogers cable? >> The following are Internet Connection Types : If your ISP is running a DHCP server, select the Obtain an IP automatically option. Your ISP will provide you with an IP address. Your ISP may require you to fill in both the Host Name and Domain Name fields. If your ISP requires MAC address validation, this can be done from the Setup -> MAC address clone screen. If your ISP provides a static or fixed IP address, Subnet Mask, Gateway and DNS setting, select the Static IP option. If your ISP provides a PPPoE connection, follow the configuration steps below: 1. Enter your User Name and Password. 2. Check the Connect on Demand or Keep Alive option. If your ISP provides RAS (for SingTel)connection, follow the steps below: 1. Enter your User Name and Password. 2. Select your RAS Plan. For example, a 512k user should choose 512k Ethernet. 3. Check the Connect on Demand or Keep Alive option. SingTel Magix uses Alcatel Remote Access Service (RAS) as the main method to authenticate their ADSL servers. This method uses TCP port 5555. If your ISP provides a PPTP connection, follow the steps below: 1. Enter the IP Address, Subnet Mask, and Default Gateway Address 2. Enter your User Name and Password. 3. Check the Connect on Demand or Keep Alive option. If your ISP provides Heart Beat Signal connection, follow the instructions below: 1. Enter your User Name and Password. 2. Enter your Heart Beat Server address. 3. Check the Connect on Demand or Keep Alive option. You need to fill in both the User Name and Password fields, as directed by your ISP. You can also select the Connect on Demand option for automatic connection. After you select the Connect on Demand feature in the status screen, the connection will be disconnected if it has been idle for a period longer than the Max Idle Time setting. If you check the Keep Alive option, the Router will always try to keep the line connected. << Thanks again, Ian -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 14:22:32 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 10:22:32 -0400 (EDT) Subject: X-rays and computers In-Reply-To: <1e55af990508142103701a59e4-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <1e55af990508142103701a59e4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 14 Aug 2005, Sy wrote: > I thought that the majority of x-rays produced were sent out the back > of the monitor.. No, when you smack electrons into a target, the X-rays go out the way the electrons were headed -- forward. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 14:27:02 2005 From: jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 10:27:02 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <17af13780508150719422e6951-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> <17af13780508081256224e2435@mail.gmail.com> <42F7B9FD.4020800@rogers.com> <17af1378050808131316fa3810@mail.gmail.com> <42F7CA9E.503@rogers.com> <17af1378050811101231f9e8b8@mail.gmail.com> <20050811172412.GK6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <17af137805081110327c642c62@mail.gmail.com> <42FB998F.7070804@utoronto.ca> <17af13780508150719422e6951@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 8/15/05, Ian Zimmerman wrote: > So I scheduled a Rogers setup. Ominously, though, the phone rep asked > what version of Windoze I used. I said why, he said making sure "my computer > could handle the speed". I said I knew it could because I'd built it > myself . They just want to make sure you're not using win3.11 (though really, why not? There probably aren't any more active exploits for it...). Just in case the service tech knows more than the customer about getting on the 'net, I imagine. > That was good enough for him, but if the install tech is on the same level, > I'll need to be prepared. The Linksys router which I want to connect behind > the modem has the following options for connection type. So you know > which is the correct setting for Rogers cable? They're usually quite happy to install the cablemodem hardware and let you do the rest if you show the initiative. I had no problem two years ago or three years ago, each when I signed up for Rogers. > >> > The following are Internet Connection Types : > > If your ISP is running a DHCP server, select the Obtain an IP > automatically option. Your ISP will provide you with an IP address. Yes, this is what Rogers does. > Your ISP may require you to fill in both the Host Name and Domain Name > fields. If your ISP requires MAC address validation, this can be done > from the Setup -> MAC address clone screen. You don't need to worry about any of that; it's irrelevant on Rogers' network. -- taa /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 14:34:16 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 10:34:16 -0400 Subject: Convert FAT32 to ext3? Message-ID: Hi, I have a large FAT32 partition with still a bunch of stuff on it, that I want to convert to ext3. Is this possible, keeping the data on it? I'm trying to avoid burning onto a bunch of DVDs! Thanks for any help. -Steve. -- Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] ubuntulinux.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 14:44:13 2005 From: nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ian Zimmerman) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 10:44:13 -0400 Subject: Library path question In-Reply-To: <20050814025204.GA13234-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20050814025204.GA13234@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <17af1378050815074456084ff@mail.gmail.com> On 8/13/05, Walter Dnes wrote: > One thing I noticed is that when you uncompress the tarball, the > commandline utility can be run without installing if you cd to to the > directory containing it. To get it to run from anywhere, you need to > > perl Makefile.PL > make > make test > make install > > with the last step requiring root access. I assume this copies libs to > some place on the libpath? Would it be possible to just uncompress it > to a regular user's directory, and append the path to LIBPATH, or > whatever? > For a Perl script, that would be PERL5LIB or PERLLIB. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 15:06:04 2005 From: nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ian Zimmerman) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 11:06:04 -0400 Subject: Picnic Message-ID: <17af137805081508062200068b@mail.gmail.com> Hi, I saw the pictures of the picnic - but when I came to the Bickford park on that day around 1pm (it was raining very lightly) I saw nobody who looked even remotely linuxy. Just some soccer and frisbee players. I as said I am new in town, so I could have made a dumb mistake, such as coming to the wrong park. When did the picnic actually start? Ian -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 16:02:47 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 12:02:47 -0400 Subject: X-rays and computers In-Reply-To: References: <1e55af990508142103701a59e4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1e55af9905081509024afee800@mail.gmail.com> On 15/08/05, Henry Spencer wrote: > On Sun, 14 Aug 2005, Sy wrote: > > I thought that the majority of x-rays produced were sent out the back > > of the monitor.. > > No, when you smack electrons into a target, the X-rays go out the way the > electrons were headed -- forward. Aah, you're right. I also did a bit of reading because I was curious to learn more. =) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X-ray -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 16:25:22 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 12:25:22 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <17af13780508150719422e6951-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> <200508081421.39109.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af13780508081256224e2435@mail.gmail.com> <42F7B9FD.4020800@rogers.com> <17af1378050808131316fa3810@mail.gmail.com> <42F7CA9E.503@rogers.com> <17af1378050811101231f9e8b8@mail.gmail.com> <20050811172412.GK6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <17af137805081110327c642c62@mail.gmail.com> <42FB998F.7070804@utoronto.ca> <17af13780508150719422e6951@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4300C1F2.9060100@rogers.com> On 8/11/05, Marcus Brubaker wrote: >I've been using Rogers cable internet service for 4 or >5 years now and while it's not perfect and their staff are (with some >notable exceptions) remarkably stupid, I can't really complain too much. While a few of the "help" desk staff, while I've talked to are OK, others are somewhat numb between the ears. Prior to running Linux, I used OS/2 exclusively. It was always "fun" when the help desk person started with "click on the start button" and couldn't understand that OS/2 didn't have one. ;-) Recently, I had a problem accessing the news server. One of the people I was talking to insisted that I reboot my modem, to see if that would fix the problem. He actually seemed to believe that even when everything else was working fine, a modem could cause nntp problems! Another issue is they seem to think Linux comes with Outlook Express and Internet Explorer. Even after I've told them I'm running Linux, they tend to want me to check the settings for those apps. ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 16:34:15 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 12:34:15 -0400 Subject: Convert FAT32 to ext3? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4300C407.8030808@rogers.com> Steve wrote: > Hi, > > I have a large FAT32 partition with still a bunch of stuff on it, that I > want to convert to ext3. Is this possible, keeping the data on it? I'm > trying to avoid burning onto a bunch of DVDs! I haven't heard of such a thing. Don't you have some disk space somewhere to hold the files temporarily? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 16:33:11 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 12:33:11 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <17af13780508150719422e6951-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805080807575893f2ef@mail.gmail.com> <200508081421.39109.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af13780508081256224e2435@mail.gmail.com> <42F7B9FD.4020800@rogers.com> <17af1378050808131316fa3810@mail.gmail.com> <42F7CA9E.503@rogers.com> <17af1378050811101231f9e8b8@mail.gmail.com> <20050811172412.GK6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <17af137805081110327c642c62@mail.gmail.com> <42FB998F.7070804@utoronto.ca> <17af13780508150719422e6951@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4300C3C7.3010408@rogers.com> Ian Zimmerman wrote: > On 8/11/05, Marcus Brubaker wrote: >>I've been using Rogers cable internet service for 4 or >>5 years now and while it's not perfect and their staff are (with some >>notable exceptions) remarkably stupid, I can't really complain too much. > > So I scheduled a Rogers setup. Ominously, though, the phone rep asked > what version of Windoze I used. I said why, he said making sure "my computer > could handle the speed". I said I knew it could because I'd built it > myself . I suspect most computers today are capable of providing sufficient performance. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From teddymills-VFlxZYho3OA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 16:35:15 2005 From: teddymills-VFlxZYho3OA at public.gmane.org (teddymills) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 12:35:15 -0400 Subject: OT-Distance-Geography Message-ID: <4300C443.7040305@knet.ca> I needed to measure an exact mile from my house to any point. I though about using a scaled ratio map, but unless the map is very large, it is difficult to get a good reading. I thought about city blocks, but that is not very precise either. I thought about surveyors optics, but I did not have the hardware. I thought about using a car or bike odometer, but not sure how precise that would be. I even though about using a a few 120 minute cassette tapes. Then I remembered Google Earth. It has a longitude/latitude but these are not even needed. There is a distance feature that can be used with the mouse navigation disabled. I can only assume the distance is accurate over longer distances (as the crow flies) Indeed Google is your friend. Then I found the NASA World Winds Project. I installed it but have not seen it in action. Apparently the NASA World Winds is quite amazing. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 16:47:00 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 12:47:00 -0400 (EDT) Subject: OT-Distance-Geography In-Reply-To: <4300C443.7040305-VFlxZYho3OA@public.gmane.org> References: <4300C443.7040305@knet.ca> Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Aug 2005, teddymills wrote: > I thought about using a car or bike odometer, but not sure how precise > that would be. Most any handheld GPS receiver -- they're quite cheap now -- will have an "elapsed distance" or "distance from waypoint" or etc. function that will give you such information exact to within meters. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 16:54:28 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 12:54:28 -0400 Subject: Convert FAT32 to ext3? References: <4300C407.8030808@rogers.com> Message-ID: <004101c5a1ba$120c1d60$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> ----- Original Message ----- From: "James Knott" To: Sent: Monday, 15 August, 2005 12:34 Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Convert FAT32 to ext3? > Steve wrote: > > Hi, > > > > I have a large FAT32 partition with still a bunch of stuff on it, that I > > want to convert to ext3. Is this possible, keeping the data on it? I'm > > trying to avoid burning onto a bunch of DVDs! > > I haven't heard of such a thing. Don't you have some disk space > somewhere to hold the files temporarily? > -- Why not leave it as FAT32 and mount it as such in your Linux system?!? Eventually you can create a ext3 partition and move the files to the Linux side, then re-format the FAT32 to ext3 and recover the space. Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 16:56:15 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 12:56:15 -0400 Subject: OT-Distance-Geography In-Reply-To: <4300C443.7040305-VFlxZYho3OA@public.gmane.org> References: <4300C443.7040305@knet.ca> Message-ID: teddymills wrote: > > I thought about using a car or bike odometer, but not sure how precise > that would be. You could measure your average stride and use a pedometer. There and back would make for a decent 2 mile walk too. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 17:09:37 2005 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 20:09:37 +0300 (IDT) Subject: OT-Distance-Geography In-Reply-To: <4300C443.7040305-VFlxZYho3OA@public.gmane.org> References: <4300C443.7040305@knet.ca> Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Aug 2005, teddymills wrote: > I needed to measure an exact mile from my house to any point. > > I though about using a scaled ratio map, but unless the map is very large, it > is difficult to get a good reading. > I thought about city blocks, but that is not very precise either. > I thought about surveyors optics, but I did not have the hardware. > I thought about using a car or bike odometer, but not sure how precise that > would be. > I even though about using a a few 120 minute cassette tapes. > > Then I remembered Google Earth. > It has a longitude/latitude but these are not even needed. > There is a distance feature that can be used with the mouse navigation > disabled. > I can only assume the distance is accurate over longer distances (as the crow > flies) > > Indeed Google is your friend. Maybe, but so far Gogle Earth requires XP. It does not even support Macs. > Then I found the NASA World Winds Project. > I installed it but have not seen it in action. > Apparently the NASA World Winds is quite amazing. Also Windows-only. Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 17:21:44 2005 From: marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Marcus Brubaker) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 13:21:44 -0400 Subject: OT-Distance-Geography In-Reply-To: References: <4300C443.7040305@knet.ca> Message-ID: <4300CF28.4040701@utoronto.ca> Peter wrote: > > On Mon, 15 Aug 2005, teddymills wrote: > >> I needed to measure an exact mile from my house to any point. >> >> I though about using a scaled ratio map, but unless the map is very >> large, it is difficult to get a good reading. >> I thought about city blocks, but that is not very precise either. >> I thought about surveyors optics, but I did not have the hardware. >> I thought about using a car or bike odometer, but not sure how >> precise that would be. >> I even though about using a a few 120 minute cassette tapes. >> >> Then I remembered Google Earth. >> It has a longitude/latitude but these are not even needed. >> There is a distance feature that can be used with the mouse >> navigation disabled. >> I can only assume the distance is accurate over longer distances (as >> the crow flies) >> >> Indeed Google is your friend. > > > Maybe, but so far Gogle Earth requires XP. It does not even support Macs. > I've heard that Google Earth works under Wine. Has anyone tried this? Marcus -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 17:27:38 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 13:27:38 -0400 Subject: Convert FAT32 to ext3? In-Reply-To: <004101c5a1ba$120c1d60$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> References: <4300C407.8030808@rogers.com> <004101c5a1ba$120c1d60$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: On 8/15/05, Francois Ouellette wrote: > > > Why not leave it as FAT32 and mount it as such in your Linux system?!? > Eventually you can create a ext3 partition and move the files to the Linux > side, then re-format the FAT32 to ext3 and recover the space. > > Fran?ois Ouellette > Hi Francois, That's what I am doing now... just wanted to finally get rid of it... and the maximum 2GB/file idiosyncracy! -Steve. -- Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] ubuntulinux.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 17:30:16 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 13:30:16 -0400 Subject: Convert FAT32 to ext3? In-Reply-To: <4300C407.8030808-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <4300C407.8030808@rogers.com> Message-ID: On 8/15/05, James Knott wrote: > > > I haven't heard of such a thing. Don't you have some disk space > somewhere to hold the files temporarily? Actually I don't have much disk space spare on other partitions. I was pretty sure I knew what my options were... just wanted to double-check with the "knowledge base" that is TLUG. Thanks. -Steve. -- Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] ubuntulinux.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 17:33:40 2005 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 20:33:40 +0300 (IDT) Subject: X-rays and computers In-Reply-To: <1e55af9905081509024afee800-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <1e55af990508142103701a59e4@mail.gmail.com> <1e55af9905081509024afee800@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Aug 2005, Sy wrote: > On 15/08/05, Henry Spencer wrote: >> On Sun, 14 Aug 2005, Sy wrote: >>> I thought that the majority of x-rays produced were sent out the back >>> of the monitor.. >> >> No, when you smack electrons into a target, the X-rays go out the way the >> electrons were headed -- forward. > > Aah, you're right. I also did a bit of reading because I was curious > to learn more. =) > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X-ray X-ray emission from a target is isotropic or nearly so. The only trick is that emission occurs at the surface of the target and the direction with highest radiation is perpendicular to this surface and away from it (any rays passing through the target are attenuated). The same link you refer to has a schematic drawing of a tube with arrows indicating the emerging rays. Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 17:49:42 2005 From: scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Stewart C. Russell) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 13:49:42 -0400 Subject: OT-Distance-Geography In-Reply-To: <4300C443.7040305-VFlxZYho3OA@public.gmane.org> References: <4300C443.7040305@knet.ca> Message-ID: <4300D5B6.5080108@sympatico.ca> teddymills wrote: > > I needed to measure an exact mile from my house to any point. Asa a first attempt, try the Google Maps Pedometer: . It's surprising accurate (if used correctly). I was within a few metres for a route I know to be 1089m. I think the Google Maps API might make this very simple. cheers, Stewart -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 18:08:34 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 14:08:34 -0400 (EDT) Subject: X-rays and computers In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, 15 Aug 2005, Peter wrote: > X-ray emission from a target is isotropic or nearly so. Sigh, Peter is of course correct -- don't know what I was thinking of... Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 18:19:53 2005 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 14:19:53 -0400 Subject: Convert FAT32 to ext3? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 8/15/05, Steve wrote: > I have a large FAT32 partition with still a bunch of stuff on it, that I > want to convert to ext3. Is this possible, keeping the data on it? I'm > trying to avoid burning onto a bunch of DVDs! No, that sort of thing is not supported. The problem is that a "FS1 to FS2" convertor would require a complete comprehension of BOTH filesystems, which would be orders of magnitude more difficult than merely understanding one of them. Furthermore, if power was interrupted half way through, what would you expect would happen? Parts of the partition would be in "FS1" format and other parts would be in "FS2" format. And what if both expected to use certain portions of the partition to store some of the basic lookup information? Every time you "turn over a stone" you find another set of Really Ugly Conditions associated with such a process. You would be WAY better off grabbing a cheap USB disk (I grabbed a 40GB one that runs off USB power for $150 a little while back) and temporarily copy the data onto something like that. If you had a Terabyte of data to move around, LaCie sells a 1TB FireWire disk array for about $1K USD, at the "ridiculously large" side of things :-). -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 18:20:03 2005 From: amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org (Alex Maynard) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 14:20:03 -0400 Subject: Linux equivalent of dumpbin /exports filename.dll ? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Sat, 13 Aug 2005, Joseph Kubik wrote: > objdump -t foo.so > This, or some other option to objdump may help you out. > Also, 'ldd Guass' will show you what libraries Guass is trying to load. > > -Joseph- Joseph, Thank you very much for the suggestion. I've tried both objdump -t foo.so and objdump -Ct foo.so. I'm not quite sure how to read the output I get. In other words, I'm not quite sure which name refers to the function. The orginal function name in the Matlab code was ptv. The entries in objdump -t foo.so that include the term ptv are: 00000000 l df *ABS* 00000000 ptv.c 00000000 l df *ABS* 00000000 ptv_mcc_component_data.c 00001200 g O .rodata 00000101 __MCC_ptv_session_data 000027b0 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_lib_path_data 0000130c g O .rodata 00000004 __MCC_ptv_lib_path_data_count 000027b8 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_mcr_runtime_options 00001310 g O .rodata 00000004 __MCC_ptv_mcr_application_option_count 00000f38 g F .text 0000002e ptvInitialize 000027ac g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_classpath_data 00002704 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_root_data 00000e80 g F .text 000000b7 ptvInitializeWithHandlers 00000fd0 g F .text 00000058 mlfPtv 00002700 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_name_data 00000f9a g F .text 00000036 mlxPtv 00002720 g O .data 0000008c __MCC_ptv_matlabpath_data 000027b4 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_mcr_application_options 00000f66 g F .text 00000033 ptvTerminate 000010a0 g O .rodata 00000141 __MCC_ptv_public_data 00001308 g O .rodata 00000004 __MCC_ptv_classpath_data_count 00001314 g O .rodata 00000004 __MCC_ptv_mcr_runtime_option_count 00001304 g O .rodata 00000004 __MCC_ptv_matlabpath_data_count I have tried some of these out, but so far haven't found the right function name. Thanks again very much. Alex Below is the full output of objdump. ptv.so: file format elf32-i386 SYMBOL TABLE: 000000b4 l d .hash 00000000 00000250 l d .dynsym 00000000 00000650 l d .dynstr 00000000 00000952 l d .gnu.version 00000000 000009d4 l d .gnu.version_r 00000000 00000a24 l d .rel.dyn 00000000 00000c04 l d .rel.plt 00000000 00000c4c l d .init 00000000 00000c64 l d .plt 00000000 00000d04 l d .text 00000000 0000105c l d .fini 00000000 00001080 l d .rodata 00000000 00001680 l d .eh_frame_hdr 00000000 000026e0 l d .data 00000000 000027bc l d .eh_frame 00000000 00002930 l d .dynamic 00000000 00002a08 l d .ctors 00000000 00002a10 l d .dtors 00000000 00002a18 l d .jcr 00000000 00002a1c l d .got 00000000 00002a90 l d .bss 00000000 00000000 l d .comment 00000000 00000000 l d .debug_aranges 00000000 00000000 l d .debug_info 00000000 00000000 l d .debug_abbrev 00000000 00000000 l d .debug_line 00000000 00000000 l d *ABS* 00000000 00000000 l d *ABS* 00000000 00000000 l d *ABS* 00000000 00000000 l df *ABS* 00000000 initfini.c 00000d04 l F .text 00000000 call_gmon_start 00000000 l df *ABS* 00000000 crtstuff.c 00002a08 l O .ctors 00000000 __CTOR_LIST__ 00002a10 l O .dtors 00000000 __DTOR_LIST__ 000027bc l O .eh_frame 00000000 __EH_FRAME_BEGIN__ 00002a18 l O .jcr 00000000 __JCR_LIST__ 000026e4 l O .data 00000000 p.0 00002a90 l O .bss 00000001 completed.1 00000d28 l F .text 00000000 __do_global_dtors_aux 00000d90 l F .text 00000000 frame_dummy 00000000 l df *ABS* 00000000 crtstuff.c 00002a0c l O .ctors 00000000 __CTOR_END__ 00002a14 l O .dtors 00000000 __DTOR_END__ 0000292c l O .eh_frame 00000000 __FRAME_END__ 00002a18 l O .jcr 00000000 __JCR_END__ 00001028 l F .text 00000000 __do_global_ctors_aux 00000000 l df *ABS* 00000000 initfini.c 00000000 l df *ABS* 00000000 ptv.c 000026e8 l O .data 00000004 _mcr_inst 00000dd0 l F .text 0000003b mclDefaultPrintHandler 00000e0c l F .text 00000074 mclDefaultErrorHandler 00000000 l df *ABS* 00000000 ptv_mcc_component_data.c 000026e0 l O .data 00000000 .hidden __dso_handle 00001200 g O .rodata 00000101 __MCC_ptv_session_data 000027b0 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_lib_path_data 00002930 g O *ABS* 00000000 _DYNAMIC 0000130c g O .rodata 00000004 __MCC_ptv_lib_path_data_count 00000000 F *UND* 00000033 mclFeval@@v7.0 000027b8 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_mcr_runtime_options 00001310 g O .rodata 00000004 __MCC_ptv_mcr_application_option_count 00000c4c g F .init 00000000 _init 00000f38 g F .text 0000002e ptvInitialize 000027ac g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_classpath_data 00002704 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_root_data 00000000 O *UND* 00000004 stdout@@GLIBC_2.0 00000000 O *UND* 00000004 stderr@@GLIBC_2.0 00000000 F *UND* 0000005c mclInitializeComponentInstance@@v7.0 00000000 F *UND* 000000df mclmcrInitialize@@v7.0 00000e80 g F .text 000000b7 ptvInitializeWithHandlers 00000000 F *UND* 00000024 mclTerminateInstance@@v7.0 00002a90 g *ABS* 00000000 __bss_start 00000fd0 g F .text 00000058 mlfPtv 00002700 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_name_data 0000105c g F .fini 00000000 _fini 00000000 F *UND* 00000037 mclMlfFeval@@v7.0 00000000 w F *UND* 00000098 __cxa_finalize@@GLIBC_2.1.3 00000f9a g F .text 00000036 mlxPtv 00002a90 g *ABS* 00000000 _edata 00002a1c g O *ABS* 00000000 _GLOBAL_OFFSET_TABLE_ 00002a94 g *ABS* 00000000 _end 00002720 g O .data 0000008c __MCC_ptv_matlabpath_data 000027b4 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_mcr_application_options 00000f66 g F .text 00000033 ptvTerminate 000010a0 g O .rodata 00000141 __MCC_ptv_public_data 00001308 g O .rodata 00000004 __MCC_ptv_classpath_data_count 00000000 F *UND* 00000171 fwrite@@GLIBC_2.0 00000000 w *UND* 00000000 _Jv_RegisterClasses 00001314 g O .rodata 00000004 __MCC_ptv_mcr_runtime_option_count 00001304 g O .rodata 00000004 __MCC_ptv_matlabpath_data_count 00000000 w *UND* 00000000 __gmon_start__ > > On 8/13/05, Alex Maynard wrote: > > > > Hello All, > > > > I know very little about libraries, so I apologize if this > > this turns out to be a very basic question. > > > > I was wondering if any one happens to know the linux equivalent of > > the following command in windows, used to find the function names in a > > shared library?: > > > > dumpbin /exports filename.dll > > > > The problem I'm having is that I have compiled a function to a .so > > file (using a unix matlab compiler) but have trouble calling it from a > > second application (Gauss). I found a posting on the web indicating that such > > functions are often given different names by compilers (the compilers > > append extra info. to the original name). So to call the function, I need to > > find out its new name. I found some instructions for doing this in MSDos > > at: > > http://www.eco.utexas.edu/cgi-bin/http2gophermail?server=gopher.eco.utexas.edu&request=R97754-102253-/mailing/gaussians.archive.1997 > > which suggest using the dos command: dumpbin /exports filename.dll but > > haven't figured out how to translate this into linux. > > > > Cheers, > > > > Alex > > > > > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 19:23:09 2005 From: josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Joseph Kubik) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 15:23:09 -0400 Subject: Linux equivalent of dumpbin /exports filename.dll ? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: The .text lines are functions *most* of the time. -Joseph- On 8/15/05, Alex Maynard wrote: > > On Sat, 13 Aug 2005, Joseph Kubik wrote: > > > objdump -t foo.so > > This, or some other option to objdump may help you out. > > Also, 'ldd Guass' will show you what libraries Guass is trying to load. > > > > -Joseph- > > Joseph, > > Thank you very much for the suggestion. I've tried both objdump -t foo.so > and objdump -Ct foo.so. I'm not quite sure how to read the output I get. > In other words, I'm not quite sure which name refers to the function. The > orginal function name in the Matlab code was ptv. The entries in > objdump -t foo.so that include the term ptv are: > > 00000000 l df *ABS* 00000000 ptv.c > 00000000 l df *ABS* 00000000 ptv_mcc_component_data.c > 00001200 g O .rodata 00000101 __MCC_ptv_session_data > 000027b0 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_lib_path_data > 0000130c g O .rodata 00000004 __MCC_ptv_lib_path_data_count > 000027b8 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_mcr_runtime_options > 00001310 g O .rodata 00000004 __MCC_ptv_mcr_application_option_count > 00000f38 g F .text 0000002e ptvInitialize > 000027ac g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_classpath_data > 00002704 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_root_data > 00000e80 g F .text 000000b7 ptvInitializeWithHandlers > 00000fd0 g F .text 00000058 mlfPtv > 00002700 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_name_data > 00000f9a g F .text 00000036 mlxPtv > 00002720 g O .data 0000008c __MCC_ptv_matlabpath_data > 000027b4 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_mcr_application_options > 00000f66 g F .text 00000033 ptvTerminate > 000010a0 g O .rodata 00000141 __MCC_ptv_public_data > 00001308 g O .rodata 00000004 __MCC_ptv_classpath_data_count > 00001314 g O .rodata 00000004 __MCC_ptv_mcr_runtime_option_count > 00001304 g O .rodata 00000004 __MCC_ptv_matlabpath_data_count > > I have tried some of these out, but so far haven't found the right > function name. > > Thanks again very much. > > Alex > > > Below is the full output of objdump. > > > > > ptv.so: file format elf32-i386 > > SYMBOL TABLE: > 000000b4 l d .hash 00000000 > 00000250 l d .dynsym 00000000 > 00000650 l d .dynstr 00000000 > 00000952 l d .gnu.version 00000000 > 000009d4 l d .gnu.version_r 00000000 > 00000a24 l d .rel.dyn 00000000 > 00000c04 l d .rel.plt 00000000 > 00000c4c l d .init 00000000 > 00000c64 l d .plt 00000000 > 00000d04 l d .text 00000000 > 0000105c l d .fini 00000000 > 00001080 l d .rodata 00000000 > 00001680 l d .eh_frame_hdr 00000000 > 000026e0 l d .data 00000000 > 000027bc l d .eh_frame 00000000 > 00002930 l d .dynamic 00000000 > 00002a08 l d .ctors 00000000 > 00002a10 l d .dtors 00000000 > 00002a18 l d .jcr 00000000 > 00002a1c l d .got 00000000 > 00002a90 l d .bss 00000000 > 00000000 l d .comment 00000000 > 00000000 l d .debug_aranges 00000000 > 00000000 l d .debug_info 00000000 > 00000000 l d .debug_abbrev 00000000 > 00000000 l d .debug_line 00000000 > 00000000 l d *ABS* 00000000 > 00000000 l d *ABS* 00000000 > 00000000 l d *ABS* 00000000 > 00000000 l df *ABS* 00000000 initfini.c > 00000d04 l F .text 00000000 call_gmon_start > 00000000 l df *ABS* 00000000 crtstuff.c > 00002a08 l O .ctors 00000000 __CTOR_LIST__ > 00002a10 l O .dtors 00000000 __DTOR_LIST__ > 000027bc l O .eh_frame 00000000 __EH_FRAME_BEGIN__ > 00002a18 l O .jcr 00000000 __JCR_LIST__ > 000026e4 l O .data 00000000 p.0 > 00002a90 l O .bss 00000001 completed.1 > 00000d28 l F .text 00000000 __do_global_dtors_aux > 00000d90 l F .text 00000000 frame_dummy > 00000000 l df *ABS* 00000000 crtstuff.c > 00002a0c l O .ctors 00000000 __CTOR_END__ > 00002a14 l O .dtors 00000000 __DTOR_END__ > 0000292c l O .eh_frame 00000000 __FRAME_END__ > 00002a18 l O .jcr 00000000 __JCR_END__ > 00001028 l F .text 00000000 __do_global_ctors_aux > 00000000 l df *ABS* 00000000 initfini.c > 00000000 l df *ABS* 00000000 ptv.c > 000026e8 l O .data 00000004 _mcr_inst > 00000dd0 l F .text 0000003b mclDefaultPrintHandler > 00000e0c l F .text 00000074 mclDefaultErrorHandler > 00000000 l df *ABS* 00000000 ptv_mcc_component_data.c > 000026e0 l O .data 00000000 .hidden __dso_handle > 00001200 g O .rodata 00000101 > __MCC_ptv_session_data > 000027b0 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_lib_path_data > 00002930 g O *ABS* 00000000 _DYNAMIC > 0000130c g O .rodata 00000004 > __MCC_ptv_lib_path_data_count > 00000000 F *UND* 00000033 mclFeval@@v7.0 > 000027b8 g O .data 00000004 > __MCC_ptv_mcr_runtime_options > 00001310 g O .rodata 00000004 > __MCC_ptv_mcr_application_option_count > 00000c4c g F .init 00000000 _init > 00000f38 g F .text 0000002e ptvInitialize > 000027ac g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_classpath_data > 00002704 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_root_data > 00000000 O *UND* 00000004 stdout@@GLIBC_2.0 > 00000000 O *UND* 00000004 stderr@@GLIBC_2.0 > 00000000 F *UND* 0000005c > mclInitializeComponentInstance@@v7.0 > 00000000 F *UND* 000000df mclmcrInitialize@@v7.0 > 00000e80 g F .text 000000b7 ptvInitializeWithHandlers > 00000000 F *UND* 00000024 mclTerminateInstance@@v7.0 > 00002a90 g *ABS* 00000000 __bss_start > 00000fd0 g F .text 00000058 mlfPtv > 00002700 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_name_data > 0000105c g F .fini 00000000 _fini > 00000000 F *UND* 00000037 mclMlfFeval@@v7.0 > 00000000 w F *UND* 00000098 __cxa_finalize@@GLIBC_2.1.3 > 00000f9a g F .text 00000036 mlxPtv > 00002a90 g *ABS* 00000000 _edata > 00002a1c g O *ABS* 00000000 _GLOBAL_OFFSET_TABLE_ > 00002a94 g *ABS* 00000000 _end > 00002720 g O .data 0000008c __MCC_ptv_matlabpath_data > 000027b4 g O .data 00000004 > __MCC_ptv_mcr_application_options > 00000f66 g F .text 00000033 ptvTerminate > 000010a0 g O .rodata 00000141 > __MCC_ptv_public_data > 00001308 g O .rodata 00000004 > __MCC_ptv_classpath_data_count > 00000000 F *UND* 00000171 fwrite@@GLIBC_2.0 > 00000000 w *UND* 00000000 _Jv_RegisterClasses > 00001314 g O .rodata 00000004 > __MCC_ptv_mcr_runtime_option_count > 00001304 g O .rodata 00000004 > __MCC_ptv_matlabpath_data_count > 00000000 w *UND* 00000000 __gmon_start__ > > > > > > > > On 8/13/05, Alex Maynard wrote: > > > > > > Hello All, > > > > > > I know very little about libraries, so I apologize if this > > > this turns out to be a very basic question. > > > > > > I was wondering if any one happens to know the linux equivalent of > > > the following command in windows, used to find the function names in a > > > shared library?: > > > > > > dumpbin /exports filename.dll > > > > > > The problem I'm having is that I have compiled a function to a .so > > > file (using a unix matlab compiler) but have trouble calling it from a > > > second application (Gauss). I found a posting on the web indicating that such > > > functions are often given different names by compilers (the compilers > > > append extra info. to the original name). So to call the function, I need to > > > find out its new name. I found some instructions for doing this in MSDos > > > at: > > > http://www.eco.utexas.edu/cgi-bin/http2gophermail?server=gopher.eco.utexas.edu&request=R97754-102253-/mailing/gaussians.archive.1997 > > > which suggest using the dos command: dumpbin /exports filename.dll but > > > haven't figured out how to translate this into linux. > > > > > > Cheers, > > > > > > Alex > > > > > > > > > -- > > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 20:04:31 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 16:04:31 -0400 Subject: Power-off trivia In-Reply-To: <20050813203057.5c7123e7.hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <57C7FC5E-08E8-11DA-AE96-00050249A5C8@millsgarthson.ca> <20050809152212.GW6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050813203057.5c7123e7.hgibson@eol.ca> Message-ID: <20050815200431.GO6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Sat, Aug 13, 2005 at 08:30:57PM -0400, Howard Gibson wrote: > I now have Fedora Core 3 running on my six or seven year old PII/350. When it boots, I get a message claiming something like my BIOS out too out of date to run ACPI. I have been meaning to investigate this sometime. > > My machine powers off when I tell it too. Then I guess it uses apm successfully. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From billt-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 20:15:04 2005 From: billt-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org (billt-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 16:15:04 -0400 Subject: Picnic In-Reply-To: <17af137805081508062200068b-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org>; from nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org on Mon, Aug 15, 2005 at 11:06:04AM -0400 References: <17af137805081508062200068b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050815161504.B24730@diamond.ss.org> There was people loitering there from about noon onward, but I don't think anything really started until about 2 pm. The problem was that we didn't make it obvious that we were there until the BBQ started. Sorry about that. Bill On Mon, Aug 15, 2005 at 11:06:04AM -0400, Ian Zimmerman wrote: > Hi, I saw the pictures of the picnic - but when I came to the Bickford park > on that day around 1pm > (it was raining very lightly) I saw nobody who looked even remotely linuxy. > Just some soccer and frisbee players. > > I as said I am new in town, so I could have made a dumb mistake, such as coming > to the wrong park. When did the picnic actually start? > > Ian > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From edward.chin-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 21:00:11 2005 From: edward.chin-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (echin) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 17:00:11 -0400 Subject: Picnic In-Reply-To: <20050815161504.B24730-l+PWtdWbHAuXFJAUJl40Xg@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805081508062200068b@mail.gmail.com> <20050815161504.B24730@diamond.ss.org> Message-ID: <4301025B.6010207@sympatico.ca> billt-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org wrote: > There was people loitering there from about noon onward, but I don't think anything really started until about 2 pm. > > The problem was that we didn't make it obvious that we were there until the BBQ started. > > Sorry about that. > > Bill > > On Mon, Aug 15, 2005 at 11:06:04AM -0400, Ian Zimmerman wrote: > >>Hi, I saw the pictures of the picnic - but when I came to the Bickford park >>on that day around 1pm >>(it was raining very lightly) I saw nobody who looked even remotely linuxy. >>Just some soccer and frisbee players. >> >>I as said I am new in town, so I could have made a dumb mistake, such as coming >>to the wrong park. When did the picnic actually start? >> >>Ian If you saw soccer and frisbee players, you may have been in the wrong part of the park. We were in the SE corner - across the street from the Linuxcaffe where most of the loitering took place before the actual BBQing began. We hesitated because of the threatening rain; then we decided "What the Hell" - the acid in the rain isn't that strong. When looking out across the park, it is possible to overlook where we were since that area is (as is the whole park) well below street level - aptly described by its former name Christie Pits South Next time we'll have our banner/sign out to mark the spot. -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 267.10.7 - Release Date: 11-Aug-05 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 15 21:10:26 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 17:10:26 -0400 Subject: X-rays and computers In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <430104C2.1080505@rogers.com> Henry Spencer wrote: > On Mon, 15 Aug 2005, Peter wrote: >>X-ray emission from a target is isotropic or nearly so. > > Sigh, Peter is of course correct -- don't know what I was thinking of... Perhaps too many X-rays hitting your brain? ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 16 03:27:47 2005 From: ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ansar Mohammed) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 23:27:47 -0400 Subject: X-rays and computers In-Reply-To: <430104C2.1080505-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <430104C2.1080505@rogers.com> Message-ID: Fascinating.. Now I know why I am the only bald guy in my family. > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org] On Behalf Of James > Knott > Sent: August 15, 2005 5:10 PM > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: X-rays and computers > > Henry Spencer wrote: > > On Mon, 15 Aug 2005, Peter wrote: > >>X-ray emission from a target is isotropic or nearly so. > > > > Sigh, Peter is of course correct -- don't know what I was thinking of... > > Perhaps too many X-rays hitting your brain? ;-) > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rfk-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 16 05:37:20 2005 From: rfk-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Robert F. Kennedy) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 01:37:20 -0400 Subject: NAS or RAID In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <005901c5a224$92d397b0$1902a8c0@coilnetworks.com> Hello, Has anyone created a large storage system like NAS or a RAID subsystem? I am thinking of creating a large hard drive storage system and was wondering what others have created. Thanks, Robert -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jweissig-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 16 08:45:03 2005 From: jweissig-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Justin Weissig) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 01:45:03 -0700 Subject: NAS or RAID In-Reply-To: <005901c5a224$92d397b0$1902a8c0-B7WYQ2cLakwWhyVFc8JwjA@public.gmane.org> References: <005901c5a224$92d397b0$1902a8c0@coilnetworks.com> Message-ID: <217ddce005081601456380d5cf@mail.gmail.com> Sure, I've build some. System: P4 2.8GHz with 1GB RAM. Drives: 4 x MAXTOR 300GB SATA 7200RPM 16MB Then pick your raid card: Highpoint, PROMISE, 3Ware. Some people might say not to use hardware raid and just use software raid but hardware offers features that are easily to use when things go wrong. Something like the above will give you a little less than 900GB in a RAID 5 for around $2100. Great for office NAS server. Install samba with winbind and you have a drop in replacement for many of the windows options. - Justin On 8/15/05, Robert F. Kennedy wrote: > Hello, > > Has anyone created a large storage system like NAS or a RAID subsystem? > I am thinking of creating a large hard drive storage system and was > wondering what others have created. > > Thanks, > Robert > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From scotta-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 16 11:10:59 2005 From: scotta-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Scott Allen) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 07:10:59 -0400 Subject: X-rays and computers In-Reply-To: ; from henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg@public.gmane.org on Mon, Aug 15, 2005 at 14:08:34 -0400 References: Message-ID: <20050816111059.GE3141@localhost> On Mon Aug 15,2005 02:08:34 PM Henry Spencer wrote: > On Mon, 15 Aug 2005, Peter wrote: > > X-ray emission from a target is isotropic or nearly so. > > Sigh, Peter is of course correct -- don't know what I was thinking > of... So, does Peter get an "I corrected Henry" T-shirt, or is that just in the UseNet "space" groups? ;-) -- ** Scott Allen scotta-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org ** ** Toronto, Ontario, Canada ** -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From dcbour-Uj1Tbf34OBsy5HIR1wJiBuOEVfOsBSGQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 16 15:39:00 2005 From: dcbour-Uj1Tbf34OBsy5HIR1wJiBuOEVfOsBSGQ at public.gmane.org (Dave Bour) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 11:39:00 -0400 Subject: Power Consumption Message-ID: Francois, Check your bill for that hydro cost. I'd love to know how you've got 4.3 cent hydro. That must be only the base hydro cost (mine's 5.0 and 5.8 over 1500 kWh). Add in delivery, reg charges and debt retirement that must be common to all, comes out 10.1 cents +GST average cost based on my current consumption - or ~ $75 / month per kilowatt hour. Figuring typical desktop runs 200 - 250 kWh with monitor without the monitor active (based on the measurements I did a couple years back for this same question). Based on this, I tell most clients to expect $20 per machine they leave on 7X24. Servers, if loaded up, double it. Mine run nearly 350 watts so it still applies. Dave Bour Desktop Solution Center 905.381.0077 dcbour-Uj1Tbf34OBsy5HIR1wJiBuOEVfOsBSGQ at public.gmane.org http://www.desktopsolutioncenter.ca For people who just want it to work... Giving you complete IT peace of mind -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org] On Behalf Of Francois Ouellette Sent: Sunday, August 14, 2005 8:35 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Power Consumption >----- Original Message ----- >From: Ansar Mohammed >To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org >Sent: Sunday, 14 August, 2005 19:55 >Subject: [TLUG]: Power Consumption > >Hello All, >Many of us here have more than one computer at home. Some of us I >believe have as maybe a small network. I was wondering how >does everyone deal with the impact on your hydro bill? >One of my hopes as I came to Canada was to have my own little server >farm in my basement. (I am a retro computing guy so I really am >not interested in new stuff) Now everyone I meet is warning me about the impact on my power bill. It definitely costs something! Looking at the added wattage of everything I have at home (2 desktops with tube monitors, 1 laptop, router, printers, etc) it easily adds up to over 2500 watts when many things are in use at the same time. This costs easily a few dollars every day. I guess you can check the labels on your equipment and figure out how much power each will typically consume. At 4.3 cents per kW-hour you can easily figure out how much your equipment costs per day. If you are in business you can declare this (estimated) portion of your Hydro bill as an expense. Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 16 16:08:20 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 12:08:20 -0400 (EDT) Subject: X-rays and computers In-Reply-To: <20050816111059.GE3141@localhost> References: <20050816111059.GE3141@localhost> Message-ID: On Tue, 16 Aug 2005, Scott Allen wrote: > > Sigh, Peter is of course correct -- don't know what I was thinking > > of... > > So, does Peter get an "I corrected Henry" T-shirt, or is that just in > the UseNet "space" groups? ;-) That's just in the space newsgroups. :-) (The T-shirts are [so far] mythical in any case, but even so...) Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 16 16:17:44 2005 From: scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Stewart C. Russell) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 12:17:44 -0400 Subject: Power Consumption In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <430211A8.9020402@sympatico.ca> Dave Bour wrote: > > ... ~ $75 / month per kilowatt hour. wouldn't that be $75/kW, per month? > Figuring typical desktop runs 200 - 250 kWh 200 - 250W? I think you have your energy [kWh] and power [W] units confused. cheers, Stewart -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From dcbour-Uj1Tbf34OBsy5HIR1wJiBuOEVfOsBSGQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 16 16:30:22 2005 From: dcbour-Uj1Tbf34OBsy5HIR1wJiBuOEVfOsBSGQ at public.gmane.org (Dave Bour) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 12:30:22 -0400 Subject: Power Consumption Message-ID: Duh... Thanks for the correction. It's been a long day already D Dave Bour Desktop Solution Center 905.381.0077 dcbour at desktopsolutioncenter.ca For those who just want it to work... Giving you complete IT peace of mind. (Sent via Blackberry) PIN 30073084 (as of May 9,2005) -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug at ss.org To: tlug at ss.org Sent: Tue Aug 16 12:17:44 2005 Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Power Consumption Dave Bour wrote: > > ... ~ $75 / month per kilowatt hour. wouldn't that be $75/kW, per month? > Figuring typical desktop runs 200 - 250 kWh 200 - 250W? I think you have your energy [kWh] and power [W] units confused. cheers, Stewart -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 16 16:39:41 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 12:39:41 -0400 Subject: Power Consumption References: Message-ID: <006f01c5a281$2be81c80$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> You are right, it's 5 cents! Plus the outrageous delivery charge (read: cables) which costs more than the electricity itself :-( It typically costs me around $120 per month in summer and $150 in winter for everything (gas heating and hot mwater, everything else electrical). Fran?ois Ouellette ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Bour" To: Sent: Tuesday, 16 August, 2005 11:39 Subject: RE: [TLUG]: Power Consumption Francois, Check your bill for that hydro cost. I'd love to know how you've got 4.3 cent hydro. That must be only the base hydro cost (mine's 5.0 and 5.8 over 1500 kWh). Add in delivery, reg charges and debt retirement that must be common to all, comes out 10.1 cents +GST average cost based on my current consumption - or ~ $75 / month per kilowatt hour. Figuring typical desktop runs 200 - 250 kWh with monitor without the monitor active (based on the measurements I did a couple years back for this same question). Based on this, I tell most clients to expect $20 per machine they leave on 7X24. Servers, if loaded up, double it. Mine run nearly 350 watts so it still applies. Dave Bour Desktop Solution Center 905.381.0077 dcbour-Uj1Tbf34OBsy5HIR1wJiBuOEVfOsBSGQ at public.gmane.org http://www.desktopsolutioncenter.ca For people who just want it to work... Giving you complete IT peace of mind -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org] On Behalf Of Francois Ouellette Sent: Sunday, August 14, 2005 8:35 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Power Consumption >----- Original Message ----- >From: Ansar Mohammed >To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org >Sent: Sunday, 14 August, 2005 19:55 >Subject: [TLUG]: Power Consumption > >Hello All, >Many of us here have more than one computer at home. Some of us I >believe have as maybe a small network. I was wondering how >does everyone deal with the impact on your hydro bill? >One of my hopes as I came to Canada was to have my own little server >farm in my basement. (I am a retro computing guy so I really am >not interested in new stuff) Now everyone I meet is warning me about the impact on my power bill. It definitely costs something! Looking at the added wattage of everything I have at home (2 desktops with tube monitors, 1 laptop, router, printers, etc) it easily adds up to over 2500 watts when many things are in use at the same time. This costs easily a few dollars every day. I guess you can check the labels on your equipment and figure out how much power each will typically consume. At 4.3 cents per kW-hour you can easily figure out how much your equipment costs per day. If you are in business you can declare this (estimated) portion of your Hydro bill as an expense. Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 16 17:27:30 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 12:27:30 -0500 Subject: NAS or RAID In-Reply-To: <005901c5a224$92d397b0$1902a8c0-B7WYQ2cLakwWhyVFc8JwjA@public.gmane.org> References: <005901c5a224$92d397b0$1902a8c0@coilnetworks.com> Message-ID: <1e55af99050816102718043363@mail.gmail.com> I've worked with small ones a while back. I would say that purchasing a prebuilt NAS device is a huge waste of money compared to building a Linux RAID storage box. However, such a regular box needs to come with a small amount of knowhow and administrative overhead. As an aside, I understand that the Apple X-serv RAID thingies are good bang for the buck. My old work had a couple and administration was said to be great. Also, working with huge files was said to be a good experience. http://www.apple.com/xserve/ http://www.apple.com/xserve/raid/ On 8/16/05, Robert F. Kennedy wrote: > Hello, > > Has anyone created a large storage system like NAS or a RAID subsystem? > I am thinking of creating a large hard drive storage system and was > wondering what others have created. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 16 17:38:23 2005 From: josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Joseph Kubik) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 13:38:23 -0400 Subject: NAS or RAID In-Reply-To: <1e55af99050816102718043363-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <005901c5a224$92d397b0$1902a8c0@coilnetworks.com> <1e55af99050816102718043363@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Please define large. What purpose? Is cost an issue? Is speed an issue? How long can it be offline if it crashes and you have to restore from backup? what method of backup do you have in mind? -Joseph- On 8/16/05, Sy wrote: > I've worked with small ones a while back. I would say that purchasing > a prebuilt NAS device is a huge waste of money compared to building a > Linux RAID storage box. However, such a regular box needs to come > with a small amount of knowhow and administrative overhead. > > > As an aside, I understand that the Apple X-serv RAID thingies are good > bang for the buck. My old work had a couple and administration was > said to be great. Also, working with huge files was said to be a good > experience. > > http://www.apple.com/xserve/ > http://www.apple.com/xserve/raid/ > > > > On 8/16/05, Robert F. Kennedy wrote: > > Hello, > > > > Has anyone created a large storage system like NAS or a RAID subsystem? > > I am thinking of creating a large hard drive storage system and was > > wondering what others have created. > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 16 20:59:17 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 16:59:17 -0400 Subject: Convert FAT32 to ext3? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050816205917.GP6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Mon, Aug 15, 2005 at 10:34:16AM -0400, Steve wrote: > I have a large FAT32 partition with still a bunch of stuff on it, that I > want to convert to ext3. Is this possible, keeping the data on it? I'm > trying to avoid burning onto a bunch of DVDs! Assuming the filesystem is not full but has some space left, you could try something like: 1: Shrink FAT32 filesystem with a partition resizing tool as much as you can, then create a new partition in the free space and make an ext3 filesystem there, Move as many files as you can from fat32 to ext3. 2: Shrink fat32 filesystem as much as you can after moving files. Enlarge ext3 as much as you can. Move as many more files as you can. 3: Repeat step 2 until FAT32 is empty. 4: Remove fat32 partition and resize ext3 to full size. Buying another HD or even borrowing one from a friend to use as temporary storage would be much faster and simpler of course. There is a filesystem convertion tool for linux that does this for you without using multiple partitions, but it has the requirement that the source filesystem supports sparse files, and fat32 doesn't, so it won't work for your case. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 16 21:06:35 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 17:06:35 -0400 Subject: NAS or RAID In-Reply-To: <217ddce005081601456380d5cf-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <005901c5a224$92d397b0$1902a8c0@coilnetworks.com> <217ddce005081601456380d5cf@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050816210634.GQ6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 16, 2005 at 01:45:03AM -0700, Justin Weissig wrote: > Sure, I've build some. > > System: P4 2.8GHz with 1GB RAM. > Drives: 4 x MAXTOR 300GB SATA 7200RPM 16MB > > Then pick your raid card: Highpoint, PROMISE, 3Ware. > > Some people might say not to use hardware raid and just use software > raid but hardware offers features that are easily to use when things > go wrong. Nothing wrong with hardware raid, except it can be slower. Unfortunately many cards from highpoint and promise are not "hardware" raid, but just software raid in a bios, causing lots of confusion for people. > Something like the above will give you a little less than 900GB in a > RAID 5 for around $2100. Why so little space for so much money? 400GB $330 each * 4= 1200GB raid5 for $1320 Add cost of 4 port raid card which can't be that much. Now if you mean $2100 for the whole system, then it seems reasonable although technically a leftover P2 or so with a hardware raid card and those drives would be able to be a perfectly good fileserver. The P4 is certainly beyond overkill and a semptron would be way cheaper (and use quite a bit less power too). > Great for office NAS server. Install samba with winbind and you have a > drop in replacement for many of the windows options. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 16 21:08:33 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 17:08:33 -0400 Subject: Convert FAT32 to ext3? References: <20050816205917.GP6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <000a01c5a2a6$bb208a70$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Nice idea, but FAT32 does not indicate file placement information! After deleting files it may well be that a file still occupies space at the physical end of the partition... Only a defrag job would move files to the beginning, adding to the time of the whole process. Fran?ois Ouellette ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lennart Sorensen" To: Sent: Tuesday, 16 August, 2005 16:59 Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Convert FAT32 to ext3? > On Mon, Aug 15, 2005 at 10:34:16AM -0400, Steve wrote: > > I have a large FAT32 partition with still a bunch of stuff on it, that I > > want to convert to ext3. Is this possible, keeping the data on it? I'm > > trying to avoid burning onto a bunch of DVDs! > > Assuming the filesystem is not full but has some space left, you could > try something like: > > 1: Shrink FAT32 filesystem with a partition resizing tool as much as > you can, then create a new partition in the free space and make an ext3 > filesystem there, Move as many files as you can from fat32 to ext3. > > 2: Shrink fat32 filesystem as much as you can after moving files. > Enlarge ext3 as much as you can. Move as many more files as you can. > > 3: Repeat step 2 until FAT32 is empty. > > 4: Remove fat32 partition and resize ext3 to full size. > > Buying another HD or even borrowing one from a friend to use as > temporary storage would be much faster and simpler of course. > > There is a filesystem convertion tool for linux that does this for you > without using multiple partitions, but it has the requirement that the > source filesystem supports sparse files, and fat32 doesn't, so it won't > work for your case. > > Lennart Sorensen > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.10/73 - Release Date: 15/8/05 > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 16 21:11:47 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 17:11:47 -0400 Subject: Convert FAT32 to ext3? In-Reply-To: <20050816205917.GP6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050816205917.GP6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: On 8/16/05, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > > > Assuming the filesystem is not full but has some space left, you could > try something like: > > 1: Shrink FAT32 filesystem with a partition resizing tool as much as > you can, then create a new partition in the free space and make an ext3 > filesystem there, Move as many files as you can from fat32 to ext3. > > 2: Shrink fat32 filesystem as much as you can after moving files. > Enlarge ext3 as much as you can. Move as many more files as you can. > > 3: Repeat step 2 until FAT32 is empty. > > 4: Remove fat32 partition and resize ext3 to full size. > > Lennart Sorensen Lennart, Thanks for the suggestion. Actually that is a very good idea and should work perfect for me. Sometimes you just don't see the obvious! :-) -Steve. -- Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] ubuntulinux.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 16 21:14:25 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 17:14:25 -0400 Subject: Convert FAT32 to ext3? In-Reply-To: <000a01c5a2a6$bb208a70$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> References: <20050816205917.GP6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <000a01c5a2a6$bb208a70$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: On 8/16/05, Francois Ouellette wrote: > > Nice idea, but FAT32 does not indicate file placement information! > > After deleting files it may well be that a file still occupies space at > the > physical end of the partition... > Only a defrag job would move files to the beginning, adding to the time of > the whole process. > > Fran?ois Ouellette > Good point. I think I will defrag first. Thanks for all the suggestions. -Steve. -- Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] ubuntulinux.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 16 21:19:10 2005 From: Chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org (Chris Friedt) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 17:19:10 -0400 Subject: U of T campus network security Message-ID: Hi Igor, universities are extremely prone to being bludgeoned to death by remote attackers, residences are particularly susceptable. I've been working in network security at Ryerson for several years and have seen this frst hand. you've already made a good choice in operating systems, which puts you ahead of the game ;-) 1) set up a good iptables firewall with logging / check your pam logs (you'd be surprised at how many ssh access attempts happen per minute) 2) don't run a web / ftp or whatever service - you will get loads of flack from the network admins 3) if you REALLY need to run a service, run ssh 4) don't allow arbitrary login via ssh - NO ROOT - use public dsa keys (i.e. any user must have a public key pair set up to login) 5) keep all of your open services off of the common ports to avoid port scans - i use port 6811 ;-) you don't need to set up partitions for each major directory, and many distros will complain if you do (/usr for instance) ClamAV is a popular open source antivirus solution, but you're really only going to be doing your friends a favor if you're using samba. A good chkrootkit solution is suggested, plus using a file alteration monitor is a good idea. you should always compile your base binaries statically to avoid possible swapping with foreign shared objects by some vindictive attacker. If you would like an effective iptables firewall script i've written an iptables tutorial (with a script i've been running solidly for the last 4 years, requires very little maintenance) Good luck ;-) ~/Chris >>> denisov-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org 8/12/05 11:03:52 pm >>> Hi, Soon, I'll be a student at U of T and my linux box will be part of the U of T network. I'm worried about both crackers and the script kiddie haxxorz that might lurk there. For those of you that have worked/studied/used a computer at U of T, are either of those two types present? Are computers broken into/messed around with? What would you suggest I do to secure my linux box (currently SUSE 9.3 Pro)? Currently, it has little besides a firewall and an virus scanner (BitDefender). I've considered repatrtitioning and separating /, /var, /tmp, /usr, and /home and chrooting each service running on my box. Thanks in advance, Igor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 16 21:23:18 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 17:23:18 -0400 Subject: VMware shared folder Message-ID: Hi, I hope this isn't OT, but I have a question about running VMware in Ubuntu. After setting up VMware in Ubuntu, I installed winxp as the guest OS, allocating the default 4GB and placed it on a FAT32 partition. Everything works great so far. I created a folder on this FAT32 partition and chose it as my shared folder in VMware. I am able to access it within VMware/winxp. All is fine so far. My problem is that in the guest OS (winxp) it says that there is only 3.5GBfree in this shared folder, even though I know that the drive has over 10GB free. Is there a setting somewhere that denotes the size of the shared folder in VMware? I could not find any. Is it an idiosyncrasy of the filesystem it is on (FAT32)? Is it a limitation of VMware? Any help would be appreciated! Thanks! -Steve. -- Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] ubuntulinux.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 16 21:31:03 2005 From: josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Joseph Kubik) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 17:31:03 -0400 Subject: VMware shared folder In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: When you say "shared folder" are you talking about the Vmware "special" hgfs folder? Or, is this a real partition that both the Host and Guest OS are using at the same time? -Joseph- On 8/16/05, Steve wrote: > Hi, > > I hope this isn't OT, but I have a question about running VMware in Ubuntu. > > After setting up VMware in Ubuntu, I installed winxp as the guest OS, > allocating the default 4GB and placed it on a FAT32 partition. Everything > works great so far. > > I created a folder on this FAT32 partition and chose it as my shared folder > in VMware. I am able to access it within VMware/winxp. All is fine so far. > > My problem is that in the guest OS (winxp) it says that there is only 3.5GB > free in this shared folder, even though I know that the drive has over 10GB > free. Is there a setting somewhere that denotes the size of the shared > folder in VMware? I could not find any. Is it an idiosyncrasy of the > filesystem it is on (FAT32)? Is it a limitation of VMware? > > Any help would be appreciated! > > Thanks! > > -Steve. > -- > Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] ubuntulinux.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 16 21:34:21 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 17:34:21 -0400 Subject: VMware shared folder In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 8/16/05, Joseph Kubik wrote: > > When you say "shared folder" are you talking about the Vmware > "special" hgfs folder? Or, is this a real partition that both the Host > and Guest OS are using at the same time? > -Joseph- > Hi Joseph, This is a "real" folder that resides on a FAT32 partition. Thanks. -Steve. -- Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] ubuntulinux.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 16 21:37:15 2005 From: josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Joseph Kubik) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 17:37:15 -0400 Subject: VMware shared folder In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: And, how are you accessing it from the Guest OS? Did you add a disk device and choose to access a Physical device? Or, is this a vmware shared folder as configured through the vmware tools package? -Joseph- On 8/16/05, Steve wrote: > On 8/16/05, Joseph Kubik wrote: > > When you say "shared folder" are you talking about the Vmware > > "special" hgfs folder? Or, is this a real partition that both the Host > > and Guest OS are using at the same time? > > -Joseph- > > > > Hi Joseph, > > This is a "real" folder that resides on a FAT32 partition. > > > Thanks. > > -Steve. > -- > Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] ubuntulinux.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 16 21:45:56 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 17:45:56 -0400 Subject: VMware shared folder In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 8/16/05, Joseph Kubik wrote: > > And, how are you accessing it from the Guest OS? > Did you add a disk device and choose to access a Physical device? Or, > is this a vmware shared folder as configured through the vmware tools > package? > -Joseph- I am accessing it in the guest OS as a network folder (mapped to drive z: as per vmware instructions). Is there another way to access it? -Steve. -- Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] ubuntulinux.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 16 21:53:59 2005 From: amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org (Alex Maynard) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 17:53:59 -0400 Subject: Linux equivalent of dumpbin /exports filename.dll ? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks very much! Alex On Mon, 15 Aug 2005, Joseph Kubik wrote: > The .text lines are functions *most* of the time. > -Joseph- > > On 8/15/05, Alex Maynard wrote: > > > > On Sat, 13 Aug 2005, Joseph Kubik wrote: > > > > > objdump -t foo.so > > > This, or some other option to objdump may help you out. > > > Also, 'ldd Guass' will show you what libraries Guass is trying to load. > > > > > > -Joseph- > > > > Joseph, > > > > Thank you very much for the suggestion. I've tried both objdump -t foo.so > > and objdump -Ct foo.so. I'm not quite sure how to read the output I get. > > In other words, I'm not quite sure which name refers to the function. The > > orginal function name in the Matlab code was ptv. The entries in > > objdump -t foo.so that include the term ptv are: > > > > 00000000 l df *ABS* 00000000 ptv.c > > 00000000 l df *ABS* 00000000 ptv_mcc_component_data.c > > 00001200 g O .rodata 00000101 __MCC_ptv_session_data > > 000027b0 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_lib_path_data > > 0000130c g O .rodata 00000004 __MCC_ptv_lib_path_data_count > > 000027b8 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_mcr_runtime_options > > 00001310 g O .rodata 00000004 __MCC_ptv_mcr_application_option_count > > 00000f38 g F .text 0000002e ptvInitialize > > 000027ac g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_classpath_data > > 00002704 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_root_data > > 00000e80 g F .text 000000b7 ptvInitializeWithHandlers > > 00000fd0 g F .text 00000058 mlfPtv > > 00002700 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_name_data > > 00000f9a g F .text 00000036 mlxPtv > > 00002720 g O .data 0000008c __MCC_ptv_matlabpath_data > > 000027b4 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_mcr_application_options > > 00000f66 g F .text 00000033 ptvTerminate > > 000010a0 g O .rodata 00000141 __MCC_ptv_public_data > > 00001308 g O .rodata 00000004 __MCC_ptv_classpath_data_count > > 00001314 g O .rodata 00000004 __MCC_ptv_mcr_runtime_option_count > > 00001304 g O .rodata 00000004 __MCC_ptv_matlabpath_data_count > > > > I have tried some of these out, but so far haven't found the right > > function name. > > > > Thanks again very much. > > > > Alex > > > > > > Below is the full output of objdump. > > > > > > > > > > ptv.so: file format elf32-i386 > > > > SYMBOL TABLE: > > 000000b4 l d .hash 00000000 > > 00000250 l d .dynsym 00000000 > > 00000650 l d .dynstr 00000000 > > 00000952 l d .gnu.version 00000000 > > 000009d4 l d .gnu.version_r 00000000 > > 00000a24 l d .rel.dyn 00000000 > > 00000c04 l d .rel.plt 00000000 > > 00000c4c l d .init 00000000 > > 00000c64 l d .plt 00000000 > > 00000d04 l d .text 00000000 > > 0000105c l d .fini 00000000 > > 00001080 l d .rodata 00000000 > > 00001680 l d .eh_frame_hdr 00000000 > > 000026e0 l d .data 00000000 > > 000027bc l d .eh_frame 00000000 > > 00002930 l d .dynamic 00000000 > > 00002a08 l d .ctors 00000000 > > 00002a10 l d .dtors 00000000 > > 00002a18 l d .jcr 00000000 > > 00002a1c l d .got 00000000 > > 00002a90 l d .bss 00000000 > > 00000000 l d .comment 00000000 > > 00000000 l d .debug_aranges 00000000 > > 00000000 l d .debug_info 00000000 > > 00000000 l d .debug_abbrev 00000000 > > 00000000 l d .debug_line 00000000 > > 00000000 l d *ABS* 00000000 > > 00000000 l d *ABS* 00000000 > > 00000000 l d *ABS* 00000000 > > 00000000 l df *ABS* 00000000 initfini.c > > 00000d04 l F .text 00000000 call_gmon_start > > 00000000 l df *ABS* 00000000 crtstuff.c > > 00002a08 l O .ctors 00000000 __CTOR_LIST__ > > 00002a10 l O .dtors 00000000 __DTOR_LIST__ > > 000027bc l O .eh_frame 00000000 __EH_FRAME_BEGIN__ > > 00002a18 l O .jcr 00000000 __JCR_LIST__ > > 000026e4 l O .data 00000000 p.0 > > 00002a90 l O .bss 00000001 completed.1 > > 00000d28 l F .text 00000000 __do_global_dtors_aux > > 00000d90 l F .text 00000000 frame_dummy > > 00000000 l df *ABS* 00000000 crtstuff.c > > 00002a0c l O .ctors 00000000 __CTOR_END__ > > 00002a14 l O .dtors 00000000 __DTOR_END__ > > 0000292c l O .eh_frame 00000000 __FRAME_END__ > > 00002a18 l O .jcr 00000000 __JCR_END__ > > 00001028 l F .text 00000000 __do_global_ctors_aux > > 00000000 l df *ABS* 00000000 initfini.c > > 00000000 l df *ABS* 00000000 ptv.c > > 000026e8 l O .data 00000004 _mcr_inst > > 00000dd0 l F .text 0000003b mclDefaultPrintHandler > > 00000e0c l F .text 00000074 mclDefaultErrorHandler > > 00000000 l df *ABS* 00000000 ptv_mcc_component_data.c > > 000026e0 l O .data 00000000 .hidden __dso_handle > > 00001200 g O .rodata 00000101 > > __MCC_ptv_session_data > > 000027b0 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_lib_path_data > > 00002930 g O *ABS* 00000000 _DYNAMIC > > 0000130c g O .rodata 00000004 > > __MCC_ptv_lib_path_data_count > > 00000000 F *UND* 00000033 mclFeval@@v7.0 > > 000027b8 g O .data 00000004 > > __MCC_ptv_mcr_runtime_options > > 00001310 g O .rodata 00000004 > > __MCC_ptv_mcr_application_option_count > > 00000c4c g F .init 00000000 _init > > 00000f38 g F .text 0000002e ptvInitialize > > 000027ac g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_classpath_data > > 00002704 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_root_data > > 00000000 O *UND* 00000004 stdout@@GLIBC_2.0 > > 00000000 O *UND* 00000004 stderr@@GLIBC_2.0 > > 00000000 F *UND* 0000005c > > mclInitializeComponentInstance@@v7.0 > > 00000000 F *UND* 000000df mclmcrInitialize@@v7.0 > > 00000e80 g F .text 000000b7 ptvInitializeWithHandlers > > 00000000 F *UND* 00000024 mclTerminateInstance@@v7.0 > > 00002a90 g *ABS* 00000000 __bss_start > > 00000fd0 g F .text 00000058 mlfPtv > > 00002700 g O .data 00000004 __MCC_ptv_name_data > > 0000105c g F .fini 00000000 _fini > > 00000000 F *UND* 00000037 mclMlfFeval@@v7.0 > > 00000000 w F *UND* 00000098 __cxa_finalize@@GLIBC_2.1.3 > > 00000f9a g F .text 00000036 mlxPtv > > 00002a90 g *ABS* 00000000 _edata > > 00002a1c g O *ABS* 00000000 _GLOBAL_OFFSET_TABLE_ > > 00002a94 g *ABS* 00000000 _end > > 00002720 g O .data 0000008c __MCC_ptv_matlabpath_data > > 000027b4 g O .data 00000004 > > __MCC_ptv_mcr_application_options > > 00000f66 g F .text 00000033 ptvTerminate > > 000010a0 g O .rodata 00000141 > > __MCC_ptv_public_data > > 00001308 g O .rodata 00000004 > > __MCC_ptv_classpath_data_count > > 00000000 F *UND* 00000171 fwrite@@GLIBC_2.0 > > 00000000 w *UND* 00000000 _Jv_RegisterClasses > > 00001314 g O .rodata 00000004 > > __MCC_ptv_mcr_runtime_option_count > > 00001304 g O .rodata 00000004 > > __MCC_ptv_matlabpath_data_count > > 00000000 w *UND* 00000000 __gmon_start__ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 8/13/05, Alex Maynard wrote: > > > > > > > > Hello All, > > > > > > > > I know very little about libraries, so I apologize if this > > > > this turns out to be a very basic question. > > > > > > > > I was wondering if any one happens to know the linux equivalent of > > > > the following command in windows, used to find the function names in a > > > > shared library?: > > > > > > > > dumpbin /exports filename.dll > > > > > > > > The problem I'm having is that I have compiled a function to a .so > > > > file (using a unix matlab compiler) but have trouble calling it from a > > > > second application (Gauss). I found a posting on the web indicating that such > > > > functions are often given different names by compilers (the compilers > > > > append extra info. to the original name). So to call the function, I need to > > > > find out its new name. I found some instructions for doing this in MSDos > > > > at: > > > > http://www.eco.utexas.edu/cgi-bin/http2gophermail?server=gopher.eco.utexas.edu&request=R97754-102253-/mailing/gaussians.archive.1997 > > > > which suggest using the dos command: dumpbin /exports filename.dll but > > > > haven't figured out how to translate this into linux. > > > > > > > > Cheers, > > > > > > > > Alex > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > > > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > > > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > > > > > -- > > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 16 23:09:01 2005 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 19:09:01 -0400 Subject: NAS or RAID In-Reply-To: <005901c5a224$92d397b0$1902a8c0-B7WYQ2cLakwWhyVFc8JwjA@public.gmane.org> References: <005901c5a224$92d397b0$1902a8c0@coilnetworks.com> Message-ID: <1124233741.15362.11.camel@shieldaig.wehave.net> On Tue, 2005-16-08 at 01:37 -0400, Robert F. Kennedy wrote: > Has anyone created a large storage system like NAS or a RAID subsystem? > I am thinking of creating a large hard drive storage system and was > wondering what others have created. Pretty much depends on what you want it for: - if money is no object SAN might work - NAS can be quite inexpensive but NFS seemed a bit slow in Linux (probably improved now in 2.6 kernel) - direct attached storage can be big, fast, cheap and good but limited space if you're trying to fit it in typical server case If you care about availability then definitely make sure whatever solution you choose is RAIDed. For internal storage I've heard good reviews on 3ware RAID controllers, last time I looked they had controllers that supported up to 12 IDE disks in whichever RAID configuration you wanted, that's serious storage with 500GB disks available these days! For direct attached storage in addition to internal drives you can look at USB, SCSI, firewire, SATA and (no doubt) other types of enclosures. -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 00:59:19 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 20:59:19 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Installfest Volunteer Meeting Message-ID: <20050817005919.83850.qmail@web88207.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Ok folks, I would like to have a meeting for Install Fest volunteers Date/Time; August 18th, 7:00 PM Place: Starbucks inside Indigo Books, 2300 Yonge Street (JUST north of the Eglinton Subway station). Things that I want to sort out at the meeting, - Who will be available to help? - Who can install what Linux versions? - Levels of expertise? - Help with passing out promotional flyers? Thanks all. Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rfk-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 02:45:10 2005 From: rfk-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Robert F. Kennedy) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 22:45:10 -0400 Subject: NAS or RAID In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <008c01c5a2d5$afcd2c80$1902a8c0@coilnetworks.com> Hello Joseph and everyone who has replied, >Please define large. I would like to start with two 200GB drives and just add extra drives as the need arises. >What purpose? photos, videos, assorted downloaded trash, PVR and backup >Is cost an issue? Yes >Is speed an issue? Probably not so critical for these applications, I don't know if speed is a big issue for PVR. I generally like to have as much speed as I can get. I've always had 10,000RPM SCSI disks but prices for these drives is crazy compared to what I can get in SATA. >How long can it be offline if it crashes and you have to restore from backup? >what method of backup do you have in mind? I won't backup this file server but it will be a backup for a server and a PC (not large amounts, just data) Basically due to a very limited computer budget I've been getting along on about 50GB among three computers (very tight) for three years now so there are probably lots of things I will start doing that I can't even think of doing right now. Along those lines does anyone have any suggestions on what to fill the file server with that I haven't anticipated? Thanks for the many replies. On 8/16/05, Sy wrote: > I've worked with small ones a while back. I would say that purchasing > a prebuilt NAS device is a huge waste of money compared to building a > Linux RAID storage box. However, such a regular box needs to come > with a small amount of knowhow and administrative overhead. > > > As an aside, I understand that the Apple X-serv RAID thingies are good > bang for the buck. My old work had a couple and administration was > said to be great. Also, working with huge files was said to be a good > experience. > > http://www.apple.com/xserve/ http://www.apple.com/xserve/raid/ > > > > On 8/16/05, Robert F. Kennedy wrote: > > Hello, > > > > Has anyone created a large storage system like NAS or a RAID > > subsystem? I am thinking of creating a large hard drive storage > > system and was wondering what others have created. > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How > to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 03:27:01 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 23:27:01 -0400 Subject: NAS or RAID In-Reply-To: <1124233741.15362.11.camel-AAi/R+4n306+l9Osf+KsGeTW4wlIGRCZ@public.gmane.org> References: <005901c5a224$92d397b0$1902a8c0@coilnetworks.com> <1124233741.15362.11.camel@shieldaig.wehave.net> Message-ID: <20050817032701.GA2074@node1.opengeometry.net> On Tue, Aug 16, 2005 at 07:09:01PM -0400, Fraser Campbell wrote: > - NAS can be quite inexpensive but NFS seemed a bit slow in Linux > (probably improved now in 2.6 kernel) I can report that 2.6.13-rc4 gives me 10MB/s, which is about the theoretical max for 100Mbit network. -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 03:53:24 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 22:53:24 -0500 Subject: VMware shared folder In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1e55af990508162053868a0d1@mail.gmail.com> I'd assume that if you allocated 4GB the guest OS only sees a total capacity of 4GB.. so 3.5GB left sounds right. I had a setup where I had various windows' storing their information on a real partition. Thinking this was a great way for the guest and host OS' to trade files. I ended up silently destroying my data. Please do not do this. Set up some kind of standard method like FTP or network folders to trade files between the systems. I tinkered briefly with the hgfs stuff and couldn't get it working.. I gave up. I use FTP to trade files back and forth when I need to, which is rare. Sy, On 8/16/05, Steve wrote: > Hi, > > I hope this isn't OT, but I have a question about running VMware in Ubuntu. > > After setting up VMware in Ubuntu, I installed winxp as the guest OS, > allocating the default 4GB and placed it on a FAT32 partition. Everything > works great so far. > > I created a folder on this FAT32 partition and chose it as my shared folder > in VMware. I am able to access it within VMware/winxp. All is fine so far. > > My problem is that in the guest OS (winxp) it says that there is only 3.5GB > free in this shared folder, even though I know that the drive has over 10GB > free. Is there a setting somewhere that denotes the size of the shared > folder in VMware? I could not find any. Is it an idiosyncrasy of the > filesystem it is on (FAT32)? Is it a limitation of VMware? > > Any help would be appreciated! > > Thanks! -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 06:34:51 2005 From: clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (CLIFFORD ILKAY) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 02:34:51 -0400 Subject: U of T campus network security In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200508170234.52646.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> On August 16, 2005 17:19, Chris Friedt wrote: [snip] > you don't need to set up partitions for each major directory, and > many distros will complain if you do (/usr for instance) Which distros complain about /usr being on a separate partition? -- Regards, Clifford Ilkay Dinamis Corporation 3266 Yonge Street, Suite 1419 Toronto, ON Canada M4N 3P6 +1 416-410-3326 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 09:22:04 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 05:22:04 -0400 (EDT) Subject: U of T campus network security In-Reply-To: <200508170234.52646.clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200508170234.52646.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> Message-ID: <20050817092204.10232.qmail@web88201.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- CLIFFORD ILKAY wrote: > On August 16, 2005 17:19, Chris Friedt wrote: > [snip] > > you don't need to set up partitions for each major > directory, and > > many distros will complain if you do (/usr for > instance) > > Which distros complain about /usr being on a > separate partition? Excellent question, which I don't have an answer to, but I would be very interested in hearing an answer. I know Knoppix will, if you just run through the default hard disk install proccedure only acknowedge 2 partions, swap and a / that Knoppix expects to contain EVERYTHING else (the Knoppix hard disk install package is brain dead, which is ok as Knoppix expects MOST users will never touch the hard drive, just running things off the CD). Even Knoppix though which is the worst player that I know will not complain if you manually go in then set up say /usr on a seperate partition, just Knoppix will not let you do this as part of the default hard disk install... Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 13:08:38 2005 From: Chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org (Chris Friedt) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 09:08:38 -0400 Subject: U of T campus network security Message-ID: it was a long time ago, but an older version of gentoo would complain if /usr was on a different partition. I'm not sure exactly why this was the case (maybe something to do with the portage tree), but i eventually got around the problem by nfs mounting my /usr/portage directory from another machine. >>> colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org 8/17/05 5:22:04 am >>> --- CLIFFORD ILKAY wrote: > On August 16, 2005 17:19, Chris Friedt wrote: > [snip] > > you don't need to set up partitions for each major > directory, and > > many distros will complain if you do (/usr for > instance) > > Which distros complain about /usr being on a > separate partition? Excellent question, which I don't have an answer to, but I would be very interested in hearing an answer. I know Knoppix will, if you just run through the default hard disk install proccedure only acknowedge 2 partions, swap and a / that Knoppix expects to contain EVERYTHING else (the Knoppix hard disk install package is brain dead, which is ok as Knoppix expects MOST users will never touch the hard drive, just running things off the CD). Even Knoppix though which is the worst player that I know will not complain if you manually go in then set up say /usr on a seperate partition, just Knoppix will not let you do this as part of the default hard disk install... Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From agtnews-PeCUgM4zDv73fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 14:29:05 2005 From: agtnews-PeCUgM4zDv73fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Allen Taylor) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 10:29:05 -0400 Subject: Convert FAT32 to ext3? In-Reply-To: <000a01c5a2a6$bb208a70$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> References: <20050816205917.GP6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <000a01c5a2a6$bb208a70$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: <20050817142905.GA10845@thecat.localnet> On Tue, Aug 16, 2005 at 05:08:33PM -0400, Francois Ouellette wrote: > Nice idea, but FAT32 does not indicate file placement information! > > After deleting files it may well be that a file still occupies space at the > physical end of the partition... > Only a defrag job would move files to the beginning, adding to the time of > the whole process. > > Fran?ois Ouellette > I'm pretty sure I've used parted to shrink FAT32 partitions without defragging first. Parted apparently "knows" the file structure for FAT32 (and others) and will move files as needed. As usual, any activity involving changing the size/structure of a disk partition is subject to some (small) risk. If the data is important, so are backups. :-) Allen > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Lennart Sorensen" > To: > Sent: Tuesday, 16 August, 2005 16:59 > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Convert FAT32 to ext3? > > > > On Mon, Aug 15, 2005 at 10:34:16AM -0400, Steve wrote: > > > I have a large FAT32 partition with still a bunch of stuff on it, that I > > > want to convert to ext3. Is this possible, keeping the data on it? I'm > > > trying to avoid burning onto a bunch of DVDs! > > > > Assuming the filesystem is not full but has some space left, you could > > try something like: > > > > 1: Shrink FAT32 filesystem with a partition resizing tool as much as > > you can, then create a new partition in the free space and make an ext3 > > filesystem there, Move as many files as you can from fat32 to ext3. > > . . . -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 14:58:39 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 10:58:39 -0400 Subject: Convert FAT32 to ext3? In-Reply-To: <000a01c5a2a6$bb208a70$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> References: <20050816205917.GP6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <000a01c5a2a6$bb208a70$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: <20050817145839.GR6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 16, 2005 at 05:08:33PM -0400, Francois Ouellette wrote: > Nice idea, but FAT32 does not indicate file placement information! > > After deleting files it may well be that a file still occupies space at the > physical end of the partition... > Only a defrag job would move files to the beginning, adding to the time of > the whole process. I imagine some resize programs are smart enough to move files to the start of the disk, even if it isn't a very good defrag, but at least implementing free space at end of drive defrag would help a resize program a lot. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 15:03:44 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 11:03:44 -0400 Subject: VMware shared folder In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050817150344.GS6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 16, 2005 at 05:23:18PM -0400, Steve wrote: > I hope this isn't OT, but I have a question about running VMware in Ubuntu. > > After setting up VMware in Ubuntu, I installed winxp as the guest OS, > allocating the default 4GB and placed it on a FAT32 partition. Everything > works great so far. > > I created a folder on this FAT32 partition and chose it as my shared folder > in VMware. I am able to access it within VMware/winxp. All is fine so far. > > My problem is that in the guest OS (winxp) it says that there is only > 3.5GBfree in this shared folder, even though I know that the drive has > over 10GB > free. Is there a setting somewhere that denotes the size of the shared > folder in VMware? I could not find any. Is it an idiosyncrasy of the > filesystem it is on (FAT32)? Is it a limitation of VMware? > > Any help would be appreciated! But if you allocate a 4GB virtual disk, wouldn't having something less than 4GB free be about right? If you setup samba on the host and exported a folder from it, then I would expect to see the 10G or so free space on it, which you could then access from windows inside vmware. There are also some cases of showing only a certain amount of free space even on drives much bigger with more free space on older versions of windows. Some seem to think any disk bigger than x GB will be shown as a fixed maximum with a equaliy large but limited amount of free space. As long as no program needs more than that amount free at any given time that it checks, it really doesn't matter. It's the older windows versions way of saying 'this disk is plenty big and has plenty of free space where plenty is X GB' I think 2 or 4GB used to be the limit for some versions of dos/windows. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 15:05:39 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 11:05:39 -0400 Subject: NAS or RAID In-Reply-To: <1124233741.15362.11.camel-AAi/R+4n306+l9Osf+KsGeTW4wlIGRCZ@public.gmane.org> References: <005901c5a224$92d397b0$1902a8c0@coilnetworks.com> <1124233741.15362.11.camel@shieldaig.wehave.net> Message-ID: <20050817150539.GT6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 16, 2005 at 07:09:01PM -0400, Fraser Campbell wrote: > Pretty much depends on what you want it for: > > - if money is no object SAN might work > - NAS can be quite inexpensive but NFS seemed a bit slow in Linux > (probably improved now in 2.6 kernel) > - direct attached storage can be big, fast, cheap and good but > limited space if you're trying to fit it in typical server case > > If you care about availability then definitely make sure whatever > solution you choose is RAIDed. > > For internal storage I've heard good reviews on 3ware RAID controllers, > last time I looked they had controllers that supported up to 12 IDE > disks in whichever RAID configuration you wanted, that's serious storage > with 500GB disks available these days! > > For direct attached storage in addition to internal drives you can look > at USB, SCSI, firewire, SATA and (no doubt) other types of enclosures. Of course some people have been saying good things about areca controllers lately. They have some with 24 SATA ports on them, and also have drivers for linux (open source and all). I believe I read somewhere that their drivers will be included in the kernel sometime soonish. THey suppsedly also cost less than a 3ware. Some benchmarks show them as slower than a 3ware, other benchmarks show the reverse. Who knows. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 15:06:25 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 11:06:25 -0400 Subject: Convert FAT32 to ext3? In-Reply-To: <20050817145839.GR6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050816205917.GP6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <000a01c5a2a6$bb208a70$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050817145839.GR6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: Lennart Sorensen wrote: > I imagine some resize programs are smart enough to move files to the > start of the disk, even if it isn't a very good defrag, but at least > implementing free space at end of drive defrag would help a resize > program a lot. > > Lennart Sorensen Bootdisc Partition Magic has always worked for me. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 15:22:42 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 11:22:42 -0400 Subject: VMware shared folder In-Reply-To: <20050817150344.GS6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050817150344.GS6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: On 8/17/05, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > > > But if you allocate a 4GB virtual disk, wouldn't having something less > than 4GB free be about right? If you setup samba on the host and > exported a folder from it, then I would expect to see the 10G or so free > space on it, which you could then access from windows inside vmware. > > There are also some cases of showing only a certain amount of free space > even on drives much bigger with more free space on older versions of > windows. Some seem to think any disk bigger than x GB will be shown as > a fixed maximum with a equaliy large but limited amount of free space. > As long as no program needs more than that amount free at any given time > that it checks, it really doesn't matter. It's the older windows > versions way of saying 'this disk is plenty big and has plenty of free > space where plenty is X GB' I think 2 or 4GB used to be the limit for > some versions of dos/windows. > > Lennart Sorensen Hi Lennart, I was under the impression that the 4GB I allocated to the guest OS was for the OS's files (ie. C: in the case of windows). winxp uses nearly 2GB on install, so I only have around 2GB left there. The shared folder (which is on the host) should not be limited. If it was limited in this way, then it should only show around 2GB, not 3.5GB. I think I may try setting up Samba on the host and access it from the guest. I've never done that before so it will give me good practice anyway. :-) -Steve. -- Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] ubuntulinux.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 15:36:36 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 10:36:36 -0500 Subject: Convert FAT32 to ext3? In-Reply-To: References: <20050816205917.GP6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <000a01c5a2a6$bb208a70$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050817145839.GR6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <1e55af99050817083611a79a67@mail.gmail.com> On 8/17/05, Jamon Camisso wrote: > Bootdisc Partition Magic has always worked for me. I rather liked being able to boot off of pclinuxos and running qtparted. In this case I resized an ntfs partition if I'm not mistaken. That was wicked-slick. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 15:39:07 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 10:39:07 -0500 Subject: VMware shared folder In-Reply-To: References: <20050817150344.GS6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <1e55af9905081708396701cfc7@mail.gmail.com> On 8/17/05, Steve wrote: > I think I may try setting up Samba on the host and access it from the > guest. I've never done that before so it will give me good practice anyway. > :-) On that note, it was a nightmare when I was first playing around with it. This was my last successful smb.conf, some years ago: [global] netbios name = SERVER server string = "will it work?" workgroup = WORKGROUP security = share log file = /var/log/samba.log socket options = TCP_NODELAY SO_RCVBUF=8192 SO_SNDBUF=8192 encrypt passwords = no wins support = yes ;guest account = nobody os level = 2 ;hosts allow = 192.168.16.33 ;hosts allow = 192.168.16.34 [mp3] path = /your/path/ guest ok = yes writeable = yes browsable = yes create mode = 0750 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 16:34:46 2005 From: josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Joseph Kubik) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 12:34:46 -0400 Subject: NAS or RAID In-Reply-To: <20050817150539.GT6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <005901c5a224$92d397b0$1902a8c0@coilnetworks.com> <1124233741.15362.11.camel@shieldaig.wehave.net> <20050817150539.GT6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: One interesting thing to note about NAS vs Local storage. There are actually situations where NAS is faster than local storage, because the server can be a cheap server but still have fast IO compared to a laptop, or an older workstation with slow drives. Personally, if I were setting something like this up, I'd do SATA raid with linux as a nas server and place in on a dedicated UPS, and NEVER do anything else to it as a server. -Joseph- On 8/17/05, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Tue, Aug 16, 2005 at 07:09:01PM -0400, Fraser Campbell wrote: > > Pretty much depends on what you want it for: > > > > - if money is no object SAN might work > > - NAS can be quite inexpensive but NFS seemed a bit slow in Linux > > (probably improved now in 2.6 kernel) > > - direct attached storage can be big, fast, cheap and good but > > limited space if you're trying to fit it in typical server case > > > > If you care about availability then definitely make sure whatever > > solution you choose is RAIDed. > > > > For internal storage I've heard good reviews on 3ware RAID controllers, > > last time I looked they had controllers that supported up to 12 IDE > > disks in whichever RAID configuration you wanted, that's serious storage > > with 500GB disks available these days! > > > > For direct attached storage in addition to internal drives you can look > > at USB, SCSI, firewire, SATA and (no doubt) other types of enclosures. > > Of course some people have been saying good things about areca > controllers lately. They have some with 24 SATA ports on them, and also > have drivers for linux (open source and all). I believe I read > somewhere that their drivers will be included in the kernel sometime > soonish. > > THey suppsedly also cost less than a 3ware. Some benchmarks show them > as slower than a 3ware, other benchmarks show the reverse. Who knows. > > Lennart Sorensen > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 16:58:25 2005 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins Witteman) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 12:58:25 -0400 Subject: UPDATE Re: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: <42FCA653.5050406-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050811141102.GA17037@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050811152220.GI6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050812130632.GA2373@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <42FCA653.5050406@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <20050817165825.GA4256@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> On Fri, Aug 12, 2005 at 09:38:27AM -0400, Jamon Camisso wrote: >William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: >>Update: >> >>I friend of mine recently upgraded his power supply (he has too much >>running off his 5V lead for a 410W power supply), and lent me his >>perfectly servicable PC Power & Cooling 410W unit. >> >>I've plugged that in, and it seems to have fixed the problem - but with >>intermittent problems I'll need more than the half-dozen flawless power >>cycles I've done to really be sure. Thanks to everyone who provided an >>opinion/suggestion or recommendation. > >Is a very satisfying thing to have resolved no? > >Good to hear that it (likely) wasn't something more difficult to >troubleshoot and pin down. Sadly, you spoke too soon (so did I). The incidences of the BIOS not finding the boot drive (which is hdb1 - MBR is on hda1) have gone right down since getting the new power supply in place, but they are still occuring. I will pick up a new HD and move everything over and see what that gets me, but I am beginning to fear a bad motherboard, which is very, very tiresome. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 17:05:42 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 13:05:42 -0400 Subject: Looking for ISP, again In-Reply-To: <17af13780508150719422e6951-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508081421.39109.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> <17af13780508081256224e2435@mail.gmail.com> <42F7B9FD.4020800@rogers.com> <17af1378050808131316fa3810@mail.gmail.com> <42F7CA9E.503@rogers.com> <17af1378050811101231f9e8b8@mail.gmail.com> <20050811172412.GK6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <17af137805081110327c642c62@mail.gmail.com> <42FB998F.7070804@utoronto.ca> <17af13780508150719422e6951@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050817170542.GU6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Mon, Aug 15, 2005 at 10:19:38AM -0400, Ian Zimmerman wrote: > So I scheduled a Rogers setup. Ominously, though, the phone rep asked > what version of Windoze I used. I said why, he said making sure "my computer > could handle the speed". I said I knew it could because I'd built it > myself . > That was good enough for him, but if the install tech is on the same level, > I'll need to be prepared. The Linksys router which I want to connect behind > the modem has the following options for connection type. So you know > which is the correct setting for Rogers cable? Hmm, I think I did my order on their web site and just clicked that my computer was fast enough. The tech just install the cable modem, checked that the lights came on for sync. I said that was good enough for me and then I hooked it up to a router later when I found out which box that had been packed in. > The following are Internet Connection Types : > > If your ISP is running a DHCP server, select the Obtain an IP > automatically option. Your ISP will provide you with an IP address. > Your ISP may require you to fill in both the Host Name and Domain Name > fields. If your ISP requires MAC address validation, this can be done > from the Setup -> MAC address clone screen. Well rogers would be dhcp. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 17:08:19 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 13:08:19 -0400 Subject: UPDATE Re: OT: Hardware troubleshooting In-Reply-To: <20050817165825.GA4256-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20050809135221.GA3911@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050809190433.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004e01c59d16$8594ccd0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> <20050809193252.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050811141102.GA17037@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <20050811152220.GI6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050812130632.GA2373@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> <42FCA653.5050406@utoronto.ca> <20050817165825.GA4256@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: >>Good to hear that it (likely) wasn't something more difficult to >>troubleshoot and pin down. > > > Sadly, you spoke too soon (so did I). The incidences of the BIOS not > finding the boot drive (which is hdb1 - MBR is on hda1) have gone right > down since getting the new power supply in place, but they are still > occuring. I will pick up a new HD and move everything over and see what > that gets me, but I am beginning to fear a bad motherboard, which is > very, very tiresome. I felt bad for including the conditional there... Strange that the number of incidences would go down but not stop entirely. Combination of factors perhaps? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 17:17:36 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 13:17:36 -0400 Subject: Install fest registration... In-Reply-To: <20050815002346.29197.qmail-nQt9QCl3sx2B9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20050815002346.29197.qmail@web88205.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20050817171736.GV6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Sun, Aug 14, 2005 at 08:23:46PM -0400, Colin McGregor wrote: > I got the following e-mail, any suggestions as to how > I should reply to this person? I have checked, and the > IBM M Pro Server was (depending on model) a Pentium II > 350 or 400 MHz box, so should be if anything overkill > for the sort of stuff this person suggests... As far as I recall on the M Pro 6889 models, they are single cpu, 400 or so MHz P2 on an intel 440BX chipset, can be upgraded to dual cpu (at least some models) often have onboard adaptec 2940 dual channel scsi, and some models run scsi disks, others ide. The cdrom is ide. NIC is intel e100. Ram must be ECC/parity on the models I worked with in the past PC100 or better SDRAM but that only matters if trying to upgrade it. I have never seen one refered to as 10U, but well people call towers funny things sometimes and I suppose there were server rather than workstation models in different cases. The ones I worked with had Matrox MGA200 or 400 video cards in them, but I suspect that was just an ordering option on the workstations. Any linux distribution should install without a glitch at all as far as I can tell, since I never had a problem with linux on them 4 or 5 years ago. Lennart Sorensen > > I am planning to bring an IBM M Pro server (6889 > > 10U) with one processor. I > > would like to put in a secont network card and run > > it as my broadband router > > and internal file server. I might like to also run > > a server using dynamic > > nameserver hostin (is that what it's called?) > > > > This isn't to confirm it (yet) as I may have a > > schedule conflict, however, > > besides detailed listings of my hardware from > > Windows hardware manager, what > > else can I do to facilitate this install? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 17:19:59 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 13:19:59 -0400 Subject: Is my computer dying? In-Reply-To: <20050814051717.GA13692-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20050814051717.GA13692@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <20050817171959.GW6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Sun, Aug 14, 2005 at 01:17:17AM -0400, Walter Dnes wrote: > Thursday evening I decided that I wanted to go from... > - 10 user consoles and one X session (and kernel messages going to > console 12), to... > - 9 user consoles and two X sessions (and kernel messages going to > console 12) > on my machine named "m1800" (1800 mhz speed... dohhh). > > This would accomadate Gimp editing digital photos at 1600 X 1200, and > regular X usage (surfing, etc) at a more reasonable 1152 X 864. To get > rid of console 10, I deleted the appropriate line from /etc/inittab and > rebooted, and waited for m1800 to come back up... and waited... and > waited... and got "L 99 99 99 99"... etc. after the PCI device listings. > > After a couple of unsuccessful reboot attempts, I had a look at the > BIOS. The clock was correct, but the BIOS couldn't find my hard drive > or my CD-ROM burner or my DVD-ROM. I switched over to "m450", my "hot > backup" machine, a 6-year-old Dell 450 mhz PIII with 128 megs of RAM. > Let's just say that working on a 2560 X 1920 digital photo in Gimp is > not "fun" on that machine. Oh well, thanks to redundant backups, I only > lost a few days of email. > > I've started looking for a new machine. I downloaded and burned the > Gentoo 2005.1 ISO, to be ready when I got the new machine. I tried it > on the "dead machine" and got various failures. After a bit of screwing > around with BIOS settings, I managed to get it to recognize the CD-ROM > today, and boot the Gentoo install CD. > > The hard drive looked OK, I got the CHS (Cylinder/Head/Sector) numbers > from "fdisk -l" and rebooted and entered them manually into the BIOS, but > no luck. I booted the install CD again, chrooted as per the install > procedure, ran lilo, and rebooted... successfully this time. > > I'm sending this email from m1800. Was that a "cosmic ray" event? Do > I trust it, or do I keep looking for a new machine? You may have upgraded lilo at some point, and not rerun the lilo command to update the sector map of the upgraded files, and then on next reboot, things go splat badly for lilo. Yet another reason I switched to grub some years ago. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 17:21:56 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 13:21:56 -0400 Subject: OT-Distance-Geography In-Reply-To: References: <4300C443.7040305@knet.ca> Message-ID: <20050817172156.GX6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Mon, Aug 15, 2005 at 08:09:37PM +0300, Peter wrote: > Maybe, but so far Gogle Earth requires XP. It does not even support > Macs. Just give it a little wine and see what happens. :) Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 17:27:20 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 13:27:20 -0400 Subject: Is my computer dying? In-Reply-To: <20050817171959.GW6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050814051717.GA13692@waltdnes.org> <20050817171959.GW6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: Lennart Sorensen wrote: >> I'm sending this email from m1800. Was that a "cosmic ray" event? Do >>I trust it, or do I keep looking for a new machine? > > > You may have upgraded lilo at some point, and not rerun the lilo command > to update the sector map of the upgraded files, and then on next reboot, > things go splat badly for lilo. > > Yet another reason I switched to grub some years ago. > Strange thing is -- I rebooted this morning for some reason and was greeted with a Grub Error 17 message. Not sure what the problem is. Could be the 1024 cylinder thing. I wonder if it will happen again when I have to reboot next. Sigh. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 17:45:42 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 12:45:42 -0500 Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.3.32.20050813145028.006931b8@pop.istop.com> <42FF8840.9020705@rogers.com> <42FF8EF8.7050803@rogers.com> Message-ID: <1e55af99050817104556856b0f@mail.gmail.com> Just to bring the thread (hopefully) to a close. The problem was multifold. * the original bell tech was incompatent. * the demarcation point wasn't what I was using * the demarcation point had a horrible jack on it * the point I was using was split off of that and while it had a better jack and therefore less noise, the line was terrible. * my building has horrible wiring * They were allowing me far too much speed, letting in more noise/errors. Ok.. so hopefully things are better. Maybe now I can start working from home. =) Notes: http://jrandomhacker.info/mw/index.php/Template:Wl:Connectivity_nightmare_3 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 18:07:20 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 14:07:20 -0400 Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality References: <3.0.3.32.20050813145028.006931b8@pop.istop.com> <42FF8840.9020705@rogers.com> <42FF8EF8.7050803@rogers.com> <1e55af99050817104556856b0f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <006501c5a356$94cb17e0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sy" To: Sent: Wednesday, 17 August, 2005 13:45 Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Phone line static influencing DSL quality Just to bring the thread (hopefully) to a close. The problem was multifold. * the original bell tech was incompatent. * the demarcation point wasn't what I was using * the demarcation point had a horrible jack on it * the point I was using was split off of that and while it had a better jack and therefore less noise, the line was terrible. * my building has horrible wiring * They were allowing me far too much speed, letting in more noise/errors. Ok.. so hopefully things are better. Maybe now I can start working from home. =) ===================== Well, I recently had issues with my DSL service too, I am using Look Communications basic 3Mbits service through a Bell line. Everything started on August 2nd exactly right after the long week-end. Consistently, at around 8:45am my DSL was becoming flaky, with the connection going up and down sometimes with only 20 or 30 seconds of connection at a time between the failures. Then everything was progressively coming back to normal around 11:00am. Then, at around 1:15pm, same thing... Then back to normal a few hours later. Then at around 5:15pm going up, down, up... until about 9:00pm. They eventually admitted that they received several complaints from subscribers in Toronto about this same problem. The official answer from Look was that my router was bad. I connected the modem directly to my computer and the same problem occurred. Then they said that my modem was bad... Why, I asked them, that it only went bad at specific times of the day? Duhhh... O.K. let's open a ticket with Bell. Bell also blamed it on my modem, saying that my line had been checked (not true, no one ever came to my place to check the quality of the line). Then last week suddently everything came back to normal. I strongly suspect that an idiot at Bell decided to run backups or some heavy job on their servers at specific hours, with a schedule starting on the first workday of August! Then realized it was causing lots of problems and stopped doing it. Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 17 18:14:41 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 14:14:41 -0400 Subject: Phone line static influencing DSL quality In-Reply-To: <006501c5a356$94cb17e0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> References: <3.0.3.32.20050813145028.006931b8@pop.istop.com> <42FF8840.9020705@rogers.com> <42FF8EF8.7050803@rogers.com> <1e55af99050817104556856b0f@mail.gmail.com> <006501c5a356$94cb17e0$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: <43037E91.4030305@rogers.com> Francois Ouellette wrote: > Then last week suddently everything came back to normal. > > I strongly suspect that an idiot at Bell decided to run backups or some > heavy job on their servers at specific hours, with a schedule starting on > the first workday of August! Then realized it was causing lots of problems > and stopped doing it. What would Bell server loads have to do with your ADSL connection? It would only affect service from that server, not internet access. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 03:13:43 2005 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 23:13:43 -0400 Subject: Is my computer dying? Answer; YES In-Reply-To: <20050814051717.GA13692-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20050814051717.GA13692@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <20050818031343.GA9413@waltdnes.org> On Sun, Aug 14, 2005 at 01:17:17AM -0400, Walter Dnes wrote > Was that a "cosmic ray" event? Do I trust it, or do I keep looking > for a new machine? Tuesday evening, whilst reading usenet news and trying to respond, I got some "Data Bus" error messages on my console on m1800, and had to turn off the machine manually, because it stopped responding. I'm definitely looking for a new machine now. I was able to boot up m1800 after work today, and after ReiserFS did its "replay" thing, I was able to "scp -r" my Maildir over to m450. I haven't even lost any email. It's nice to... a) have a machine die with warning like that b) have a "hot backup" that you can jump to immediately. Once I get my new machine, m450 will inherit a second hard drive, and have a video card upgrade. Its 8 megabyte ATI Rage Pro (a Mach 64 chip, *NOT* a Rage 128) will be replaced by the 64 megabyte Radeon 7000 from m1800. The rest of m1800 goes to the landfill. -- Walter Dnes My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jay-ZPnsNkHkFjk at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 04:29:01 2005 From: jay-ZPnsNkHkFjk at public.gmane.org (Jason Carson) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 00:29:01 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Linux Benchmarking Message-ID: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel@cbits.ca> Greetings, I am thinking about doing a Linux comparison by benchmarking various distros then posting the results on my website. Does anyone have any recommendations as to what software I can use to do the benchmarking. I found this page with a bunch of tests (http://lbs.sourceforge.net/) -- Jason Carson http://cbits.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 07:31:06 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 03:31:06 -0400 Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel-ZPnsNkHkFjk@public.gmane.org> References: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel@cbits.ca> Message-ID: <20050818073106.GA3333@node1.opengeometry.net> On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 12:29:01AM -0400, Jason Carson wrote: > Greetings, > > I am thinking about doing a Linux comparison by benchmarking various > distros then posting the results on my website. > > Does anyone have any recommendations as to what software I can use to do > the benchmarking. I found this page with a bunch of tests > (http://lbs.sourceforge.net/) You'll only be benchmarking different compile options. But, if you really insist, how about kernel compile? -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 13:00:31 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 09:00:31 -0400 Subject: Is my computer dying? Answer; YES In-Reply-To: <20050818031343.GA9413-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20050814051717.GA13692@waltdnes.org> <20050818031343.GA9413@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <20050818130031.GY6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 17, 2005 at 11:13:43PM -0400, Walter Dnes wrote: > Tuesday evening, whilst reading usenet news and trying to respond, I > got some "Data Bus" error messages on my console on m1800, and had to > turn off the machine manually, because it stopped responding. I'm > definitely looking for a new machine now. Well that sounds mostly like a problem between the cpu and the chipset, so it could be broken cpu or broken chipset/motherboard. Of course a bad power supply could have slowly damaged either one. Perhaps the ram is still OK. > I was able to boot up m1800 after work today, and after ReiserFS did > its "replay" thing, I was able to "scp -r" my Maildir over to m450. I > haven't even lost any email. It's nice to... > > a) have a machine die with warning like that > b) have a "hot backup" that you can jump to immediately. > > Once I get my new machine, m450 will inherit a second hard drive, and > have a video card upgrade. Its 8 megabyte ATI Rage Pro (a Mach 64 chip, > *NOT* a Rage 128) will be replaced by the 64 megabyte Radeon 7000 from > m1800. The rest of m1800 goes to the landfill. You need to have computers disposed of properly. Too much lead and crap in them. The local recycling depot should know what to do with them. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 13:02:56 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 09:02:56 -0400 Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel-ZPnsNkHkFjk@public.gmane.org> References: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel@cbits.ca> Message-ID: <20050818130256.GZ6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 12:29:01AM -0400, Jason Carson wrote: > I am thinking about doing a Linux comparison by benchmarking various > distros then posting the results on my website. For the most part they use the same sources with the same compiler and the same libraries. What exactly are you expecting to get out of that besides wasting many hours of your life? And what is a good benchmark? Boot time? Irrelevant given it depends mostly on how many services you run and how often do you reboot a linux system? Time to run a certain program on a certain task? Unlikely to differ. Maybe some distribution used a slightly more agresive (and potentially buggy) optimization level in gcc making a program run a few percent faster, although in some cases it may also be broken for the same reason. > Does anyone have any recommendations as to what software I can use to do > the benchmarking. I found this page with a bunch of tests > (http://lbs.sourceforge.net/) I recomend not wasting your time. Speed is not a real factor when picking a distribution. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 14:43:56 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 10:43:56 -0400 Subject: Is my computer dying? Answer; YES References: <20050814051717.GA13692@waltdnes.org> <20050818031343.GA9413@waltdnes.org> <20050818130031.GY6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <001801c5a403$54fe0d40$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> > On Wed, Aug 17, 2005 at 11:13:43PM -0400, Walter Dnes wrote: > > Tuesday evening, whilst reading usenet news and trying to respond, I > > got some "Data Bus" error messages on my console on m1800, and had to > > turn off the machine manually, because it stopped responding. I'm > > definitely looking for a new machine now. > > Well that sounds mostly like a problem between the cpu and the chipset, > so it could be broken cpu or broken chipset/motherboard. Of course a > bad power supply could have slowly damaged either one. Perhaps the ram > is still OK. > > > I was able to boot up m1800 after work today, and after ReiserFS did > > its "replay" thing, I was able to "scp -r" my Maildir over to m450. I > > haven't even lost any email. It's nice to... > > > > a) have a machine die with warning like that > > b) have a "hot backup" that you can jump to immediately. Have you tried re-flashing the BIOS? Sometimes the BIOS flash memory "looses" information making the BIOS unpredictable. Some motherboards have two BIOS memories exactly for this purpose, if one gets somehow damaged or erased your motherboard has a backup it can use. Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 14:51:46 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 10:51:46 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet Message-ID: Hi, Can someone give me a few pointers on setting up a network and sharing a dialup (don't laugh) internet connection? Here are my details: BOX#1: OS: Ubuntu 5.04 (Gnome) Modem: internal USR hardware (ppp0) INTERNET CONNECTION NIC: integrated NForce2 BOX#2: OS: Windows XP NIC: integrated (IBM Thinkpad) 1. Do I require a "crossover" ethernet cable to connect BOX#2 to BOX#1? 2. What is the best (most secure) way to share internet? NAT? DHCP? What steps are involved? 3. Do I need to run samba to share files on BOX#1 with BOX#2? 4. Currently I am using Firestarter on BOX#1. Would it be better to use an iptables scipt? If so, does anyone have an iptables file that I can use for this purpose? Also, how do I enable iptables at boot time (instead of using "iptables-restore ")? Thanks a lot for any help... please feel free to contact me privately (offlist) if you want. -Steve. -- Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] ubuntulinux.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 15:05:20 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 11:05:20 -0400 Subject: fstab entry to mount ext3 rw for all users? Message-ID: Hi, What is the proper fstab entry in order to mount an ext3 partition at boot-time with full rights (rw) for any/all users? I tried a bunch of different things still get a permissions error when I try to copy a file to this partition as a regular user. Also, what does "suid" mean? Should I be mounting "suid" or "nosuid"? Thanks in advance! -Steve. -- Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] ubuntulinux.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kcozens-qazKcTl6WRFWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 15:12:23 2005 From: kcozens-qazKcTl6WRFWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (Kevin Cozens) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 11:12:23 -0400 Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel-ZPnsNkHkFjk@public.gmane.org> References: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel@cbits.ca> Message-ID: <4304A557.9050001@interlog.com> Jason Carson wrote: > I am thinking about doing a Linux comparison by benchmarking various > distros then posting the results on my website. Benchmarking distributions would be a waste of time. How are you going to compare a distribution where everything is compiled for i386 vs. one where everything is compiled for i686? Then you will encounter the differences due to the kernel being used, the number of background processes each distro starts by default, the use of GNOME vs. KDE, and even different window managers. What is it you really want to know about the different distributions? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From zero-zgL5Owk5LsjZLAS6AT9qEw at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 15:14:48 2005 From: zero-zgL5Owk5LsjZLAS6AT9qEw at public.gmane.org (dan sinclair) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 11:14:48 -0400 (EDT) Subject: fstab entry to mount ext3 rw for all users? Message-ID: <6961814422455943257HTDVSZUWRY.dsinclair@trekspace.com> > Hi, > > What is the proper fstab entry in order to mount an ext3 partition at > boot-time with full rights (rw) for any/all users? I tried a bunch of > different things still get a permissions error when I try to copy a file to > this partition as a regular user. > > Also, what does "suid" mean? Should I be mounting "suid" or "nosuid"? > This sounds more like an issue with your directory permissions then with the fstab. The fstab entry would look something like: /dev/hda1 /foo ext3 noatime 0 0 But, as I said, once you have the filesystem mounted take a look at the permissions you have set on the directory. Make sure they are liberal enough for all users to read/write to the filesystem. dan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 15:17:10 2005 From: interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (interlug-list) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 11:17:10 -0400 Subject: fstab entry to mount ext3 rw for all users? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1124378229.23625.298.camel@holden.weait.net> On Thu, 2005-08-18 at 11:05, Steve wrote: > Hi, > > What is the proper fstab entry in order to mount an ext3 partition at > boot-time with full rights (rw) for any/all users? I tried a bunch of > different things still get a permissions error when I try to copy a > file to this partition as a regular user. use the mount command to tell you what is properly mounted. $ mount /dev/hde2 on / type ext3 (rw) <-- this tells you hde2 is mounted The permissions error is from a lack of permission, not improper mounting. Mounted rw or not, some users just aren't allowed to overwrite files in /sbin. This is a good thing. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 15:19:51 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 11:19:51 -0400 Subject: fstab entry to mount ext3 rw for all users? In-Reply-To: <6961814422455943257HTDVSZUWRY.dsinclair-dZvLt6Hxk25l57MIdRCFDg@public.gmane.org> References: <6961814422455943257HTDVSZUWRY.dsinclair@trekspace.com> Message-ID: On 8/18/05, dan sinclair wrote: > > > This sounds more like an issue with your directory permissions then with > the fstab. The fstab entry would look something like: > /dev/hda1 /foo ext3 noatime 0 0 > > But, as I said, once you have the filesystem mounted take a look at the > permissions you have set on the directory. Make sure they are liberal enough > for all users to read/write to the filesystem. > > dan That's what I was wondering too. So, as root, what should I do to set permissions on /mnt/foo so any/all users can read-write? Thanks! -Steve. -- Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] ubuntulinux.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 15:22:03 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 11:22:03 -0400 Subject: fstab entry to mount ext3 rw for all users? In-Reply-To: <1124378229.23625.298.camel-csCcNl6ta60tuqGvh5Fqhg@public.gmane.org> References: <1124378229.23625.298.camel@holden.weait.net> Message-ID: On 8/18/05, interlug-list wrote: > > > use the mount command to tell you what is properly mounted. > > $ mount > /dev/hde2 on / type ext3 (rw) <-- this tells you hde2 is mounted > > The permissions error is from a lack of permission, not improper > mounting. Mounted rw or not, some users just aren't allowed to > overwrite files in /sbin. This is a good thing. I agree! However this partition I want to mount is an empty ext3 one... for the sole purpose of allowing all users full access... -Steve. -- Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] ubuntulinux.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 15:36:37 2005 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 11:36:37 -0400 Subject: fstab entry to mount ext3 rw for all users? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4304AB05.9040808@alteeve.com> Steve wrote: > Also, what does "suid" mean? Should I be mounting "suid" or "nosuid"? Hehe, I just learned about 'suid' over the last couple of days on the TPM mailing list :) An executable can have a 'setuid' or 'setgid' bit set. When the set(u|g)id-program is run the effective user is set to be that of the owner of the script (typically 'root') instead of the user who executed the script. This is primarily used when a program author wants to let their program be used by any user as though it was launched by root. An example of this is 'pmount'. It set's the 'setuid' bit so that any regular user can use it to mount a partition (so long as the conditions of that mount meet an internal list of criteria). So, when you define 'nosuid' on a partition when that partition is mounted the 'set(u|g)id' bits are ignored. So, if 'pmount' was on a partition that was mounted with 'nosuid' it wouldn't be able to run. This is a safety thing so that a user couldn't, for example, mount a drive (floppy, flash drive) with a 'setuid' program on it (ie: a setuid version of 'sh' or 'bash'.) HTH! Madison -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 15:46:05 2005 From: interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (interlug-list) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 11:46:05 -0400 Subject: fstab entry to mount ext3 rw for all users? In-Reply-To: References: <1124378229.23625.298.camel@holden.weait.net> Message-ID: <1124379965.23625.333.camel@holden.weait.net> On Thu, 2005-08-18 at 11:22, Steve wrote: > I agree! However this partition I want to mount is an empty ext3 > one... for the sole purpose of allowing all users full access... $ ls -l /mnt/public what are the permissions? How do they compare with the descriptions here? http://www.zzee.com/solutions/linux-permissions.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 15:47:44 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 11:47:44 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050818154744.GA2134@node1.opengeometry.net> On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 10:51:46AM -0400, Steve wrote: > Hi, > > Can someone give me a few pointers on setting up a network and sharing a > dialup (don't laugh) internet connection? Here are my details: > > BOX#1: > OS: Ubuntu 5.04 (Gnome) > Modem: internal USR hardware (ppp0) INTERNET CONNECTION > NIC: integrated NForce2 > > BOX#2: > OS: Windows XP > NIC: integrated (IBM Thinkpad) > > 1. Do I require a "crossover" ethernet cable to connect BOX#2 to BOX#1? Sharing dialup is no different from sharing DSL or Cable. Box1 is gateway of your internal network. For 2 boxes only, you can use crossover cable. > 2. What is the best (most secure) way to share internet? NAT? DHCP? > What steps are involved? NAT and DHCP are two different thing. NAT is for masquerading the Box2 as Box1 when connecting to Internet, so outside will only see one box, ie. Box1. > 3. Do I need to run samba to share files on BOX#1 with BOX#2? Samba or NFS are the 2 things that comes mind. > 4. Currently I am using Firestarter on BOX#1. Would it be better to > use an iptables scipt? If so, does anyone have an iptables file that I > can use for this purpose? Also, how do I enable iptables at boot time > (instead of using "iptables-restore ")? I thought 'iptables-restore' does exactly that. > > Thanks a lot for any help... please feel free to contact me privately > (offlist) if you want. -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 15:48:55 2005 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins Witteman) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 11:48:55 -0400 Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel-ZPnsNkHkFjk@public.gmane.org> References: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel@cbits.ca> Message-ID: <20050818154855.GA14773@localhost.localdomain> On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 12:29:01AM -0400, Jason Carson wrote: > >I am thinking about doing a Linux comparison by benchmarking various >distros then posting the results on my website. As others have suggested, this is an odd, possibly meaningless goal. It is like trying to determine the fastest butterfly - there are a bunch of confounding factors and difficulties in measurement, and when you're done, what have you got? -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 15:50:45 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 11:50:45 -0400 Subject: (quick question) Where/when is the meeting for Install Fest? Message-ID: <20050818155045.GA2187@node1.opengeometry.net> I accidently deleted one TLUG email buried amongst spams. Where/when is the meeting for Install Fest people? -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 15:48:45 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 11:48:45 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Is my computer dying? Answer; YES In-Reply-To: <20050818130031.GY6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050818130031.GY6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Aug 2005, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > > ...The rest of m1800 goes to the landfill. > > You need to have computers disposed of properly. Too much lead and crap > in them. The local recycling depot should know what to do with them. This is, unfortunately, an area Toronto doesn't handle well. Some of the city recycling depots will take computers, at some hours (see the city recyling calendar for details). But this doesn't work if you don't have a car -- not an issue most places, but a serious possibility in Toronto. Moreover, for some reason they take *only* computers, not other forms of electronics. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From zero-zgL5Owk5LsjZLAS6AT9qEw at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 15:55:43 2005 From: zero-zgL5Owk5LsjZLAS6AT9qEw at public.gmane.org (dan sinclair) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 11:55:43 -0400 (EDT) Subject: fstab entry to mount ext3 rw for all users? Message-ID: <5594990819003750966VYMJWOLJUP.dsinclair@trekspace.com> > That's what I was wondering too. So, as root, what should I do to set > permissions on /mnt/foo so any/all users can read-write? > If you want to make full permissions on the directory the something like: chmod -R 777 /mnt/foo should do the trick for you. dan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 15:56:50 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 11:56:50 -0400 Subject: fstab entry to mount ext3 rw for all users? In-Reply-To: <5594990819003750966VYMJWOLJUP.dsinclair-dZvLt6Hxk25l57MIdRCFDg@public.gmane.org> References: <5594990819003750966VYMJWOLJUP.dsinclair@trekspace.com> Message-ID: On 8/18/05, dan sinclair wrote: > > > > That's what I was wondering too. So, as root, what should I do to set > > permissions on /mnt/foo so any/all users can read-write? > > > > If you want to make full permissions on the directory the something like: > > chmod -R 777 /mnt/foo > > should do the trick for you. > > dan Thanks! -Steve. -- Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] ubuntulinux.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 15:59:26 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 11:59:26 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: <20050818154744.GA2134-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20050818154744.GA2134@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: On 8/18/05, William Park wrote: > > > > 1. Do I require a "crossover" ethernet cable to connect BOX#2 to BOX#1? > > Sharing dialup is no different from sharing DSL or Cable. Box1 is > gateway of your internal network. For 2 boxes only, you can use > crossover cable. Is there a way where I would not require a crossover cable? Can I make my Linux machine a router, and would that mean I could use a normal ethernet cable out of the NIC port to run into the laptop? Thanks. -Steve. -- Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] ubuntulinux.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 16:15:47 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:15:47 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: References: <20050818154744.GA2134@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <4304B433.2070100@rogers.com> Steve wrote: > On 8/18/05, *William Park* > wrote: > > > > 1. Do I require a "crossover" ethernet cable to connect BOX#2 to > BOX#1? > > Sharing dialup is no different from sharing DSL or Cable. Box1 is > gateway of your internal network. For 2 boxes only, you can use > crossover cable. > > > Is there a way where I would not require a crossover cable? Can I make > my Linux machine a router, and would that mean I could use a normal > ethernet cable out of the NIC port to run into the laptop? The only way to avoid a cross over cable, is to modify the NIC or use a switch or hub. The software using the NIC cannot perform physical changes. Devices, such as switches and hubs reverse the connections, so that they can directly communicate with computers. Many models also have a switch to reverse the connections to one port, for cascading. Incidentally, you don't need a crossover for those "router" boxes, as they also include a switch, for connecting multiple computers. Otherwise, you'd have a router connected to a switch or hub, which would eliminate the need for a crossover. Incidentally, another way to avoid a crossover, is to switch to gigabit ethernet, where this problem doesn't occur. BTW, a crossover cable is cheap. Go buy one, if you need it. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 16:18:51 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:18:51 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Aug 2005, Steve wrote: > 1. Do I require a "crossover" ethernet cable to connect BOX#2 to BOX#1? Generally, yes. Some network interfaces are now smart enough to deal with this internally, so they'll work with either crossover or straight cables, but that's not yet widespread. > 2. What is the best (most secure) way to share internet? NAT? DHCP? Neither NAT nor DHCP is something you have much choice about. DHCP is for dynamically configuring (among other things) host addresses; you use it if your ISP does things that way, and not otherwise. If memory serves, PPP has its own facilities for that and DHCP would not be involved. NAT is for making several machines look like one. If your ISP is supplying you with only one network address -- which is most assuredly the case unless you negotiated a special (more expensive) deal -- then you must use NAT to get two machines onto the net. Generally, the best way to get one or more machines onto the net is to have a dedicated firewall box between them and the outside world. (Note, the dedicated firewall box *can* be a carefully-configured Linux machine; the point is that it shouldn't be doing anything else.) Then you can have your own private internal network, with any number of machines on it, behind the firewall, and all of them can reach the Internet via the firewall. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 16:30:18 2005 From: interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (interlug-list) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:30:18 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: References: <20050818154744.GA2134@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <1124382618.23625.371.camel@holden.weait.net> On Thu, 2005-08-18 at 11:59, Steve wrote: > On 8/18/05, William Park wrote: > > 1. Do I require a "crossover" ethernet cable to connect > BOX#2 to BOX#1? > > Sharing dialup is no different from sharing DSL or > Cable. Box1 is > gateway of your internal network. For 2 boxes only, you can > use > crossover cable. > > Is there a way where I would not require a crossover cable? Can I make > my Linux machine a router, and would that mean I could use a normal > ethernet cable out of the NIC port to run into the laptop? All the cool kids use this. ;-) http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/tools/7470/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jay-ZPnsNkHkFjk at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 16:33:55 2005 From: jay-ZPnsNkHkFjk at public.gmane.org (Jason Carson) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:33:55 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: <4304A557.9050001-qazKcTl6WRFWk0Htik3J/w@public.gmane.org> References: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel@cbits.ca> <4304A557.9050001@interlog.com> Message-ID: <42922.66.11.182.5.1124382835.squirrel@cbits.ca> > Jason Carson wrote: >> I am thinking about doing a Linux comparison by benchmarking various >> distros then posting the results on my website. > > Benchmarking distributions would be a waste of time. How are you going to > compare a distribution where everything is compiled for i386 vs. one where > everything is compiled for i686? Then you will encounter the differences > due to the kernel being used, the number of background processes each > distro starts by default, the use of GNOME vs. KDE, and even different > window managers. > > What is it you really want to know about the different distributions? Which distro is the fastest. > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- Jason Carson http://cbits.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 16:34:27 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:34:27 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Aug 2005, Steve wrote: > Is there a way where I would not require a crossover cable? An Ethernet port transmits on one pair of wires and receives on another, and to connect two together, there *must* be a crossover somewhere, so that each port's transmitter pair is connected to the other's receiver. Ethernet hubs (switches, etc.) have built-in crossovers, so you use straight cables to connect hosts to hubs. You can avoid needing a crossover cable by buying a hub instead, and using two straight cables to connect the two hosts to the hub. If you're going to have more than two machines eventually, that's what you should do, because a crossover cable works only for exactly two machines -- there is no cable-only method for larger numbers. However, if you're only concerned about two, a crossover cable will be cheaper than a hub plus two straight cables. As I noted earlier, *some* Ethernet ports have built-in crossovers which they can turn on and off, and are smart enough to adapt themselves to whatever's on the other end. This is starting to be common in hubs, but is not yet widespread in hosts. (Terminology: a "switch" is just a smart hub. Most hubs you can buy now are in fact switches; for your purposes the difference is unimportant.) > Can I make my > Linux machine a router, and would that mean I could use a normal ethernet > cable out of the NIC port to run into the laptop? No. Making your Linux machine a router just affects how it handles incoming packets; that's a higher-level issue, done in software. Making it talk to the laptop at all still requires a crossover somewhere; that's a hardware requirement, not something software can change. (Boxes built as routers, like hubs, will often have built-in crossovers in their hardware, so hosts can connect to them with straight cables.) Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 16:37:07 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:37:07 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: <1124382618.23625.371.camel-csCcNl6ta60tuqGvh5Fqhg@public.gmane.org> References: <20050818154744.GA2134@node1.opengeometry.net> <1124382618.23625.371.camel@holden.weait.net> Message-ID: On 8/18/05, interlug-list wrote: > > > All the cool kids use this. ;-) > http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/tools/7470/ Hey, that *IS* cool! To me, anyway... As long as it will fit beside my "churchkey"... -Steve. -- Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] ubuntulinux.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 16:39:48 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:39:48 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: <42922.66.11.182.5.1124382835.squirrel-ZPnsNkHkFjk@public.gmane.org> References: <42922.66.11.182.5.1124382835.squirrel@cbits.ca> Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Aug 2005, Jason Carson wrote: > > What is it you really want to know about the different distributions? > > Which distro is the fastest. As others have already explained, there is unlikely to be any meaningful difference. They're all running pretty much the same kernel and pretty much the same compilers and libraries; speed differences will most likely be accidents of how up-to-date they are and how well configured they are for a particular set of hardware. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 16:39:46 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:39:46 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: <1124382618.23625.371.camel-csCcNl6ta60tuqGvh5Fqhg@public.gmane.org> References: <20050818154744.GA2134@node1.opengeometry.net> <1124382618.23625.371.camel@holden.weait.net> Message-ID: <4304B9D2.1070802@rogers.com> interlug-list wrote: >>Is there a way where I would not require a crossover cable? Can I make >>my Linux machine a router, and would that mean I could use a normal >>ethernet cable out of the NIC port to run into the laptop? > > All the cool kids use this. ;-) > http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/tools/7470/ A couple of years ago, I made a crossover from a straight through coupler. I paid about $2.50 for the coupler. If you were to buy a crossover wired coupler, you'd be paying about $15 for it. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 16:41:43 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:41:43 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4304BA47.4000005@rogers.com> Henry Spencer wrote: > On Thu, 18 Aug 2005, Steve wrote: >>Is there a way where I would not require a crossover cable? > > An Ethernet port transmits on one pair of wires and receives on another, > and to connect two together, there *must* be a crossover somewhere, so > that each port's transmitter pair is connected to the other's receiver. Except for Gigabit, which transmits and receives on all four pairs. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 16:48:50 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:48:50 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 8/18/05, Henry Spencer wrote: > > On Thu, 18 Aug 2005, Steve wrote: > > Is there a way where I would not require a crossover cable? > > An Ethernet port transmits on one pair of wires and receives on another, > and to connect two together, there *must* be a crossover somewhere, so > that each port's transmitter pair is connected to the other's receiver. > > Ethernet hubs (switches, etc.) have built-in crossovers, so you use > straight cables to connect hosts to hubs. You can avoid needing a > crossover cable by buying a hub instead, and using two straight cables to > connect the two hosts to the hub. If you're going to have more than two > machines eventually, that's what you should do, because a crossover cable > works only for exactly two machines -- there is no cable-only method for > larger numbers. However, if you're only concerned about two, a crossover > cable will be cheaper than a hub plus two straight cables. > > As I noted earlier, *some* Ethernet ports have built-in crossovers which > they can turn on and off, and are smart enough to adapt themselves to > whatever's on the other end. This is starting to be common in hubs, but > is not yet widespread in hosts. > > (Terminology: a "switch" is just a smart hub. Most hubs you can buy now > are in fact switches; for your purposes the difference is unimportant.) > > > Can I make my > > Linux machine a router, and would that mean I could use a normal > ethernet > > cable out of the NIC port to run into the laptop? > > No. Making your Linux machine a router just affects how it handles > incoming packets; that's a higher-level issue, done in software. Making > it talk to the laptop at all still requires a crossover somewhere; that's > a hardware requirement, not something software can change. > > (Boxes built as routers, like hubs, will often have built-in crossovers > in their hardware, so hosts can connect to them with straight cables.) > > Henry Spencer > henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Henry, Thanks for taking the time. I know more now than 2 minutes ago... that is always good! -Steve. -- Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] ubuntulinux.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 16:48:30 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:48:30 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: <4304BA47.4000005-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <4304BA47.4000005@rogers.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Aug 2005, James Knott wrote: > > An Ethernet port transmits on one pair of wires and receives on another, > > and to connect two together, there *must* be a crossover somewhere, so > > that each port's transmitter pair is connected to the other's receiver. > > Except for Gigabit, which transmits and receives on all four pairs. It's also smart enough to handle the crossover issue itself, so it doesn't come into this particular discussion. (It will when it gets common enough that ordinary machines start coming with it by default, but that'll be a little while yet.) There was also a variant of 100BaseT which used all four, although it's essentially defunct. It did need crossover cables. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 16:55:55 2005 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:55:55 -0400 Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4304BD9B.8050205@telly.org> Henry Spencer wrote: >>> Which distro is the fastest. >> >> > >As others have already explained, there is unlikely to be any meaningful >difference. They're all running pretty much the same kernel and pretty >much the same compilers and libraries; speed differences will most likely >be accidents of how up-to-date they are and how well configured they are >for a particular set of hardware. > The "how well configured" IMO is part of the original question. How well are various distros tuned for certain environments? How much work do they need to be reasonably optimized? Ie, I recall that some distros were faster than others to ship with kernels pre-configured to run better with Pentiums at the expense of 486 operation. Now that we have 64-bit coming along, some distros are now shipping versions optimized for that. Yeah, anyone could eventually figure out how to do this, but for the newcomer obviously it's best to find something that comes out of the box reasonably well tuned. Also, aren't there also some source-based distros that probe the hardware and then set compile-time options based on what's found? Wouldn't they run faster (all else equal) than an installation that was more one-size-fits-all, in exchange for a more-complex install process? - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 16:55:42 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:55:42 -0400 Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: <42922.66.11.182.5.1124382835.squirrel-ZPnsNkHkFjk@public.gmane.org> References: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel@cbits.ca> <4304A557.9050001@interlog.com> <42922.66.11.182.5.1124382835.squirrel@cbits.ca> Message-ID: <20050818165542.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 12:33:55PM -0400, Jason Carson wrote: > Which distro is the fastest. None of them are. Unless a distribution has a serously misconfigured kernel, or runs things it shouldn't, it will be the same speed as all the others. Any distribution that claims to be faster than everyone else is full of it. The only speed that really matters is how fast you can do your work on it like updating and managing it. That's where the real time saving is since even if something actually ran faster, computers tend to spend over 95% of their time waiting for the user, so any real improvements have to be made in reducing the amount of interaction with the user that is required. For me that means debian with it's wonderful packagemangement and great package quality, and ready to use packages of almost any program I could want. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 16:59:27 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 12:59:27 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050818165927.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 10:51:46AM -0400, Steve wrote: > Can someone give me a few pointers on setting up a network and sharing a > dialup (don't laugh) internet connection? Here are my details: > > BOX#1: > OS: Ubuntu 5.04 (Gnome) > Modem: internal USR hardware (ppp0) INTERNET CONNECTION > NIC: integrated NForce2 > > BOX#2: > OS: Windows XP > NIC: integrated (IBM Thinkpad) > > 1. Do I require a "crossover" ethernet cable to connect BOX#2 to BOX#1? Yes, or a hub/switch. > 2. What is the best (most secure) way to share internet? NAT? DHCP? What > steps are involved? DHCP is for assigning IPs from a pool. Nothing to do with sharing except if the sharing box runs dhcp to tell the other machines what settings to use to go through it (gateway ip and dns info is about all). > 3. Do I need to run samba to share files on BOX#1 with BOX#2? You can use samba. Probably the simplest one. > 4. Currently I am using Firestarter on BOX#1. Would it be better to use an > iptables scipt? If so, does anyone have an iptables file that I can use for > this purpose? Also, how do I enable iptables at boot time (instead of using > "iptables-restore ")? Most likely firestarter IS an iptables script. I use shorewall to manage iptables with the rules I think make sense for my needs. The firewall scripts will also take care of the MASQ/NAT settings needed for the connection sharing. All you have left to do then is set the default gateway on box 2 to the ethernet ip of box 1 and fill in some valid dns settings on box 2. > Thanks a lot for any help... please feel free to contact me privately > (offlist) if you want. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 17:01:13 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 13:01:13 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: References: <20050818154744.GA2134@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <20050818170113.GC6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 11:59:26AM -0400, Steve wrote: > Is there a way where I would not require a crossover cable? Can I make my > Linux machine a router, and would that mean I could use a normal ethernet > cable out of the NIC port to run into the laptop? The wiring is a function of the hardware. Some network cards can do auto MDI/MDI-X switching. Many modern switches do so, and some higher end network cards do. Gigabit networks NEVER use crossoever cables. Only 10/100 does. The port wiring has nothing to do with what software you load, it is just how the hardware is made. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 17:04:53 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 13:04:53 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: References: <4304BA47.4000005@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20050818170453.GD6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 12:48:30PM -0400, Henry Spencer wrote: > It's also smart enough to handle the crossover issue itself, so it doesn't > come into this particular discussion. (It will when it gets common enough > that ordinary machines start coming with it by default, but that'll be a > little while yet.) > > There was also a variant of 100BaseT which used all four, although it's > essentially defunct. It did need crossover cables. That was 100BaseT4 rather than the now more common 100BaseTX. The idea with T4 was to use cat3 wiring that "everyone" had in their walls. Of course the cards never took off since many people thought replacing wiring and using only 2 pairs was much simpler. That and T4 is half duplex only which was really a deal breaker for many people. TX grew much faster than the T4 advocates had imagined and the prices dropped so fast that T4 quickly died. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 17:06:09 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 13:06:09 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4304C001.9050204@rogers.com> Henry Spencer wrote: > On Thu, 18 Aug 2005, James Knott wrote: >>>An Ethernet port transmits on one pair of wires and receives on another, >>>and to connect two together, there *must* be a crossover somewhere, so >>>that each port's transmitter pair is connected to the other's receiver. >>Except for Gigabit, which transmits and receives on all four pairs. > > It's also smart enough to handle the crossover issue itself, so it doesn't > come into this particular discussion. (It will when it gets common enough > that ordinary machines start coming with it by default, but that'll be a > little while yet.) Actually, it's already happening. I've recently worked on many computers, that come with gigabit by default. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 17:09:44 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 13:09:44 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: <4304C001.9050204-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <4304C001.9050204@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20050818170944.GF6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 01:06:09PM -0400, James Knott wrote: > Actually, it's already happening. I've recently worked on many > computers, that come with gigabit by default. All the machines I have bought in the last 18 months have had gigabit built in. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 17:09:03 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 13:09:03 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: <20050818165927.GB6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050818165927.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: On 8/18/05, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > > > The firewall scripts will also take care of the MASQ/NAT settings needed > for the connection sharing. All you have left to do then is set the > default gateway on box 2 to the ethernet ip of box 1 and fill in some > valid dns settings on box 2. Thanks Lennart, It's starting to come together now... I'm reading some networking docs at aboutdebian.com , as well as Madison's iptables PDF doc from a while ago (thanks for the info, Madison). -Steve. -- Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] ubuntulinux.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 17:08:51 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 13:08:51 -0400 Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: <4304BD9B.8050205-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg@public.gmane.org> References: <4304BD9B.8050205@telly.org> Message-ID: <20050818170851.GE6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 12:55:55PM -0400, Evan Leibovitch wrote: > The "how well configured" IMO is part of the original question. How well > are various distros tuned for certain environments? How much work do > they need to be reasonably optimized? Thea features you select and the settings you make will affect it a lot. Tuning depends on your application needs. If there was one optimal tuning, you would think that would be the kernel default or application default. Why would only one distribution have figured out that magical tuning value that is better than all others in all cases? > Ie, I recall that some distros were faster than others to ship with > kernels pre-configured to run better with Pentiums at the expense of 486 > operation. Now that we have 64-bit coming along, some distros are now > shipping versions optimized for that. Yeah, anyone could eventually > figure out how to do this, but for the newcomer obviously it's best to > find something that comes out of the box reasonably well tuned. All distributions ship with kernels optimized for different cpus. You just have to install the one matching your cpu. Some libraries have assembly optimizations in them, and at least I have seen on debian a few like libssl where the ld-linux loader will load the one for your cpu automatically when a program request that library. Multiple versions of the library are installed at once. > Also, aren't there also some source-based distros that probe the > hardware and then set compile-time options based on what's found? > Wouldn't they run faster (all else equal) than an installation that was > more one-size-fits-all, in exchange for a more-complex install process? Waste of time. You will never gain back the wasted compile time no matter how good those cpu specific optimizations ever get. And gcc has lousy optimizations in general. Really there are not that many different cpu types to pick from on x86, and most of them actually being based on the previous design will like the same general kind of optimizations. It really doesn't make a difference in general. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 19:24:18 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 15:24:18 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: <20050818170453.GD6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050818170453.GD6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Aug 2005, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > That was 100BaseT4 rather than the now more common 100BaseTX. The idea > with T4 was to use cat3 wiring that "everyone" had in their walls. Of > course the cards never took off since many people thought replacing > wiring and using only 2 pairs was much simpler. And most people who'd been putting new network wiring into their walls had been using Cat5 anyway. > That and T4 is half > duplex only which was really a deal breaker for many people. Or they thought so, anyway. (People tend to have really exaggerated ideas about how much network bandwidth they need; mass-market LAN-hardware evolution is driven much more by marketing and by what's easy in silicon than by real need. Most of today's LAN users still don't really need 100Mbit, let alone 1000.) > TX grew > much faster than the T4 advocates had imagined and the prices dropped so > fast that T4 quickly died. Exactly. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 19:40:33 2005 From: clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (CLIFFORD ILKAY) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 15:40:33 -0400 Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: <20050818170851.GE6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <4304BD9B.8050205@telly.org> <20050818170851.GE6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <200508181540.34374.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> On August 18, 2005 13:08, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 12:55:55PM -0400, Evan Leibovitch wrote: > > The "how well configured" IMO is part of the original question. > > How well are various distros tuned for certain environments? How > > much work do they need to be reasonably optimized? > > Thea features you select and the settings you make will affect it a > lot. Tuning depends on your application needs. If there was one > optimal tuning, you would think that would be the kernel default or > application default. Why would only one distribution have figured > out that magical tuning value that is better than all others in all > cases? > > > Ie, I recall that some distros were faster than others to ship > > with kernels pre-configured to run better with Pentiums at the > > expense of 486 operation. Now that we have 64-bit coming along, > > some distros are now shipping versions optimized for that. Yeah, > > anyone could eventually figure out how to do this, but for the > > newcomer obviously it's best to find something that comes out of > > the box reasonably well tuned. > > All distributions ship with kernels optimized for different cpus. > You just have to install the one matching your cpu. Case in point - urpmi -y kernel in Mandriva 10.2 reports: kernel-2.4.28.0.rc1.5mdk kernel-2.6.11.12mdk kernel-2.6.11.6mdk kernel-enterprise-2.4.28.0.rc1.5mdk kernel-i586-up-1GB-2.4.28.0.rc1.5mdk kernel-i586-up-1GB-2.6.11.12mdk kernel-i586-up-1GB-2.6.11.6mdk kernel-i686-up-4GB-2.6.11.12mdk kernel-i686-up-4GB-2.6.11.6mdk kernel-multimedia-2.6.10-3.mm.24mdk kernel-multimedia-enterprise-2.6.10-3.mm.24mdk kernel-multimedia-i686-up-4GB-2.6.10-3.mm.24mdk kernel-multimedia-source kernel-multimedia-win4lin-2.6.10-3.mm.24mdk kernel-multimedia-win4lin-enterprise-2.6.10-3.mm.24mdk kernel-multimedia-win4lin-i686-up-4GB-2.6.10-3.mm.24mdk kernel-smp-2.4.28.0.rc1.5mdk kernel-smp-2.6.11.12mdk kernel-smp-2.6.11.6mdk kernel-source-2.6 kernel-source-stripped-2.6 kernel-uml-2.4-2.4.22-2mdk kernel-uml-2.6.10-2mdk kernel-xbox-2.6.11.12mdk kernel-xbox-2.6.11.6mdk The original poster wants to know which distro is the fastest but the question remains, faster at what? -- Regards, Clifford Ilkay Dinamis Corporation 3266 Yonge Street, Suite 1419 Toronto, ON Canada M4N 3P6 +1 416-410-3326 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 19:43:28 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 15:43:28 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: References: <20050818170453.GD6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20050818194328.GA1997@node1.opengeometry.net> On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 03:24:18PM -0400, Henry Spencer wrote: > Or they thought so, anyway. (People tend to have really exaggerated ideas > about how much network bandwidth they need; mass-market LAN-hardware > evolution is driven much more by marketing and by what's easy in silicon > than by real need. Most of today's LAN users still don't really need > 100Mbit, let alone 1000.) Sliver lining is, with that cheap commodity 1000Mbit, you can easily accommodate 100 users. Enter thin-client... :-) -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From dwarmstrong-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 20:31:58 2005 From: dwarmstrong-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Daniel Armstrong) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 16:31:58 -0400 Subject: (quick question) Where/when is the meeting for Install Fest? In-Reply-To: <20050818155045.GA2187-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20050818155045.GA2187@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <61e9e2b105081813314ccba4cd@mail.gmail.com> On 8/18/05, William Park wrote: > I accidently deleted one TLUG email buried amongst spams. Where/when is > the meeting for Install Fest people? Date/Time; August 18th, 7:00 PM Place: Starbucks inside Indigo Books, 2300 Yonge Street (JUST north of the Eglinton Subway station). -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 21:26:55 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 17:26:55 -0400 Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel-ZPnsNkHkFjk@public.gmane.org> References: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel@cbits.ca> Message-ID: <1e55af990508181426268912f@mail.gmail.com> On 8/18/05, Jason Carson wrote: > I am thinking about doing a Linux comparison by benchmarking various > distros then posting the results on my website. > > Does anyone have any recommendations as to what software I can use to do > the benchmarking. Having just come from a hotly-argued "which programming language is fastest", I also recommend against this notion. *However*, it would be interesting to see a comparison of different benchmarking methods and programs for Linux. * How fast is my memory? * How fast is my cache? * How fast is my video card? * How fast is my hard drive? humour: BUT, if you manage to get a "linux distribution speed comparison" website put together, I'd love to see "proof" that stock-Slackware is better than the best-tweaked Gentoo setup. That'll shut 'em up! ;) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From agtnews-PeCUgM4zDv73fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 21:28:15 2005 From: agtnews-PeCUgM4zDv73fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Allen Taylor) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 17:28:15 -0400 Subject: (quick question) Where/when is the meeting for Install Fest? In-Reply-To: <20050818155045.GA2187-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20050818155045.GA2187@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <20050818212815.GA12266@thecat.localnet> On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 11:50:45AM -0400, William Park wrote: > I accidently deleted one TLUG email buried amongst spams. Where/when is > the meeting for Install Fest people? In about 1.5 hours! Date/Time; August 18th, 7:00 PM Place: Starbucks inside Indigo Books, 2300 Yonge Street (JUST north of the Eglinton Subway station). -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From edward.chin-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 21:22:10 2005 From: edward.chin-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (echin) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 17:22:10 -0400 Subject: Installfest Volunteer Meeting In-Reply-To: <20050817005919.83850.qmail-2K+iNxKRQwOB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20050817005919.83850.qmail@web88207.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4304FC02.1090706@sympatico.ca> Colin McGregor wrote: > Ok folks, I would like to have a meeting for Install > Fest volunteers > > Date/Time; August 18th, 7:00 PM > Place: Starbucks inside Indigo Books, 2300 Yonge > Street > (JUST north of the Eglinton Subway station). > > Things that I want to sort out at the meeting, > > - Who will be available to help? > - Who can install what Linux versions? > - Levels of expertise? > - Help with passing out promotional flyers? > Cannot attend but Release forms and Hardware Data sheets have been printed. Also, I have most of the live cd distros available. Ed -- "...when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth..." Sherlock Holmes -- Internal Virus Database is out-of-date. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 267.10.7 - Release Date: 11-Aug-05 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 21:31:35 2005 From: Chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org (Chris Friedt) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 17:31:35 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet Message-ID: 1) crossover, yes if connecting directly (w/o switch/hub) 2) NAT would be recommended, and in this case, IP Masquerading would be useful 3) since the 2nd machine uses windows XP you would probably benefit from using samba 4) iptables is quite easy to control, and with a little experience you can tweak it, along with other userspace tools, to do practically anything you like. I'm going to post this as a gzipped tarball for you to download, since it's quite lengthy http://www.perpetual-notion.myftp.org/iptables_howto.tar.gz along with my howto, there are a few other scripts 1) the firewall_h.sh file, contains all of the bash functions utilized throughout the actual script - you may need to edit a few settings in this, and also edit the filenames / where they're saved for your system 2) the firewall.sh file, contains the actual firewall script 3) /etc/init.d/firewall (may have . functions dependencies from gentoo) starts / stops the firewall when necessary i.e. /etc/init.d/firewall {start|stop|restart} - you may need to edit a few settings in this, and also edit the filenames / where they're saved for your system njoy! ~/Chris -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 21:38:02 2005 From: Chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org (Chris Friedt) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 17:38:02 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet Message-ID: I'm fairly sure that iptables-restore will restore your ruleset, however for many people on a connection with a varying ip address, you would need something dynamically at lease-time (or boot time, whichever) to figure out what the ip address is that you've been assigned. this would do the trick: --------------------------------------------------------------- #!/bin/bash # you may change eth0 to whatever, although I've never tried w/ a dial-up/ppp only minor changes in any event IFC=/sbin/ifconfig AWK=/bin/awk EXTIF=eth0 ... EXTIP="`get_ip $EXTIF`" ... function get_ip() { IF=$1 $IFC $IF | $AWK /$IF/'{next}//{split($0,a,":");split(a[2],a," ");print a[1]; exit}'; } ------------------------------------------------------------- ~/Chris > 4. Currently I am using Firestarter on BOX#1. Would it be better to > use an iptables scipt? If so, does anyone have an iptables file that I > can use for this purpose? Also, how do I enable iptables at boot time > (instead of using "iptables-restore ")? I thought 'iptables-restore' does exactly that. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 21:39:04 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 17:39:04 -0400 Subject: Power Consumption In-Reply-To: <006f01c5a281$2be81c80$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> References: <006f01c5a281$2be81c80$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: <1e55af9905081814392ab43ffc@mail.gmail.com> http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/electronic/7657/ The Kill-A-Watt allows you to connect your appliances and assess how efficient they are. A large LCD display counts consumption by the Kilowatt-hour, just like utility companies. You can figure out your electrical expenses by the hour, day, week, month, even an entire year. Monitor the quality of your power by displaying Voltage, Line Frequency, and Power Factor. =) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 21:41:15 2005 From: Chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org (Chris Friedt) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 17:41:15 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet Message-ID: >>> james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org 8/18/05 12:15:47 pm >>> BTW, a crossover cable is cheap. Go buy one, if you need it. It's a lot cheaper to cut one yourself ;-) ($1 + 2 x $0.85) parts - crimper vs. $7-$15 or whatever at computer shops -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 22:06:49 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 18:06:49 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Aug 2005, Chris Friedt wrote: >> BTW, a crossover cable is cheap. Go buy one, if you need it. > > It's a lot cheaper to cut one yourself ;-) ($1 + 2 x $0.85) parts - > crimper vs. $7-$15 or whatever at computer shops Unfortunately, it takes some practice to make them right and do it reasonably quickly; it's easy to get details wrong. It's advisable to be set up to *test* the resulting cables. (Quite apart from the possibility of sheer miswiring, there are other things that can go wrong. I once made a perfectly fine-looking cable that turned out to have a *short* in one connector, between the two wires of one pair. I've never figured out how that could have happened -- maybe a manufacturing defect in the connector? -- but it unquestionably did.) Especially if you put some value on your time, DIY network cables no longer make much sense, unless you're doing a lot of them or you need something unusual. I'm still set up to make my own, but for ordinary requirements I buy the commercial ones. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 22:08:57 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 18:08:57 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <430506F9.8040906@rogers.com> Chris Friedt wrote: >>>>james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org 8/18/05 12:15:47 pm >>> > BTW, a crossover cable is cheap. Go buy one, if you need it. > > It's a lot cheaper to cut one yourself ;-) ($1 + 2 x $0.85) parts - > crimper vs. $7-$15 or whatever at computer shops It's cheaper, if you have a crimper and know how to use it. I suspect someone who thinks software can cause a NIC to crossover doesn't qualify for either. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 22:34:33 2005 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 18:34:33 -0400 Subject: Is my computer dying? Answer; YES In-Reply-To: References: <20050818130031.GY6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20050818223433.GA11993@waltdnes.org> On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 11:48:45AM -0400, Henry Spencer wrote > On Thu, 18 Aug 2005, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > > > ...The rest of m1800 goes to the landfill. > > > > You need to have computers disposed of properly. Too much lead and crap > > in them. The local recycling depot should know what to do with them. > > This is, unfortunately, an area Toronto doesn't handle well. Some of the > city recycling depots will take computers, at some hours (see the city > recyling calendar for details). But this doesn't work if you don't have a > car -- not an issue most places, but a serious possibility in Toronto. > Moreover, for some reason they take *only* computers, not other forms of > electronics. I live in Thornhill, which is part of the City of Vaughan. The URL covering my situation is (mind the linewrap)... http://www.region.york.on.ca/Services/Recycling/Electronic+Equipment+Recycling.htm "Landfill" is a generic term that I probably shouldn't have used, because it seems to be mis-understood. -- Walter Dnes My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 22:44:29 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 18:44:29 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Is my computer dying? Answer; YES In-Reply-To: <20050818223433.GA11993-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20050818223433.GA11993@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Aug 2005, Walter Dnes wrote: > > This is, unfortunately, an area Toronto doesn't handle well... > > I live in Thornhill, which is part of the City of Vaughan. The URL > covering my situation is (mind the linewrap)... > http://www.region.york.on.ca/Services/Recycling/Electronic+Equipment+Recycling.htm Hmm, interesting pilot program. Don't delay, though, since it ends at the end of September! It'll be interesting to see if it turns into something more permanent; perhaps Toronto will follow. (Odd that they'll take monitors but not TV sets...) Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 18 23:15:23 2005 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 19:15:23 -0400 Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel-ZPnsNkHkFjk@public.gmane.org> References: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel@cbits.ca> Message-ID: <1124406923.28031.19.camel@shieldaig.wehave.net> On Thu, 2005-18-08 at 00:29 -0400, Jason Carson wrote: > I am thinking about doing a Linux comparison by benchmarking various > distros then posting the results on my website. > > Does anyone have any recommendations as to what software I can use to do > the benchmarking. I found this page with a bunch of tests > (http://lbs.sourceforge.net/) If you want to do some benchmarking you might instead consider benchmarking given applications (apache, postgres, postfix, ???) on your distro of choice. IMO benchmarking server apps is useful/interesting, typical desktop apps just sit waiting for input, desktop "performance" is not easy to measure. Once you have baseline numbers for your server app of choice then try to improve the results, performance tuning can be a lot of fun and you will learn a lot. Even though your findings are likely specific to your hardware, software and workload they can still be of interest to others (depending on what you benchmark). Perf tuning is quite hardware specific. For example, a given I/O scheduler can be the beez knees on local SCSI/RAID disks but might be an awful choice if you disks are SAN. Perf tuning is also software specific, kernel 2.6.5 and 2.6.12 might exhibit quite different performance characteristics and reactions to the same tuning options. -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mggagne-oUREY1nl/XXQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 00:26:35 2005 From: mggagne-oUREY1nl/XXQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Marcel (Writer and Free Thinker at Large) =?iso-8859-1?q?Gagn=E9?=) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 20:26:35 -0400 Subject: My new book is finally available! Message-ID: <200508182026.35867.mggagne@salmar.com> Hello everyone, Warning! Shameless self-promotion follows! Feel free to skip to the next message. You have been warned! [ insert appropriate smiley here ] Yes, it's finally available! Last week, Friday, I got my copy of the new "Moving to Linux : Kiss the Blue Screen of Death Goodbye!". There were two copies, actually, hot off the press. One was the regular edition and one the Barnes & Noble special edition. Granted, I'm a little biased, but I think it looks fantastic. Anyhow, the news gets even better. The official release date for the new book was supposed to be August 19th, but a look at various online outlets shows it to be shipping! Brick and mortar bookstores should follow in a couple of weeks. Check out the book's page for a list of links to various e-tailers. http://www.marcelgagne.com/mtl2nd.html There's also a very cool review of the book by Peter H. Salus on UnixReview.com . http://www.unixreview.com/documents/s=9846/ur0508k/ur0508k.html Thus endeth this episode of gratuitous self-promotion. Take care out there. -- Marcel (Writer and Free Thinker at Large) Gagn? Note: This massagee wos nat speel or gramer-checkered. Mandatory home page reference - http://www.marcelgagne.com/ Author : "Moving to the Linux Business Desktop" "Moving to Linux: Kiss the Blue Screen of Death Goodbye!" "Linux System Administration, A User's Guide" Join the WFTL-LUG : http://www.marcelgagne.com/wftllugform.html -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jay-ZPnsNkHkFjk at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 01:26:34 2005 From: jay-ZPnsNkHkFjk at public.gmane.org (Jason Carson) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 21:26:34 -0400 (EDT) Subject: My new book is finally available! In-Reply-To: <200508182026.35867.mggagne-oUREY1nl/XXQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200508182026.35867.mggagne@salmar.com> Message-ID: <35030.66.11.182.5.1124414794.squirrel@cbits.ca> I posted this on my website, not that I get much traffic. Congrats! > > Hello everyone, > > Warning! Shameless self-promotion follows! Feel free to skip to the next > message. You have been warned! [ insert appropriate smiley here ] > > Yes, it's finally available! Last week, Friday, I got my copy of the new > "Moving to Linux : Kiss the Blue Screen of Death Goodbye!". There were two > copies, actually, hot off the press. One was the regular edition and one > the > Barnes & Noble special edition. Granted, I'm a little biased, but I think > it > looks fantastic. Anyhow, the news gets even better. > > The official release date for the new book was supposed to be August 19th, > but > a look at various online outlets shows it to be shipping! Brick and mortar > bookstores should follow in a couple of weeks. Check out the book's page > for > a list of links to various e-tailers. > > http://www.marcelgagne.com/mtl2nd.html > > There's also a very cool review of the book by Peter H. Salus on > UnixReview.com . > > http://www.unixreview.com/documents/s=9846/ur0508k/ur0508k.html > > Thus endeth this episode of gratuitous self-promotion. > > Take care out there. > > -- > Marcel (Writer and Free Thinker at Large) Gagn? > Note: This massagee wos nat speel or gramer-checkered. > Mandatory home page reference - http://www.marcelgagne.com/ > Author : "Moving to the Linux Business Desktop" > "Moving to Linux: Kiss the Blue Screen of Death Goodbye!" > "Linux System Administration, A User's Guide" > Join the WFTL-LUG : http://www.marcelgagne.com/wftllugform.html > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- Jason Carson http://cbits.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 01:29:38 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 21:29:38 -0400 (EDT) Subject: My new book is finally available! In-Reply-To: <200508182026.35867.mggagne-oUREY1nl/XXQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200508182026.35867.mggagne@salmar.com> Message-ID: <20050819012938.10102.qmail@web88205.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Congratulations Marcel, and let me toss in my bit of self promotion, my new article is up on the Linux Journal website: http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/8511 This is my 5th article to show up on the Linux Journal website. Colin McGregor --- "Marcel (Writer and Free Thinker at Large) Gagn?" wrote: > > Hello everyone, > > Warning! Shameless self-promotion follows! Feel > free to skip to the next > message. You have been warned! [ insert appropriate > smiley here ] > > Yes, it's finally available! Last week, Friday, I > got my copy of the new > "Moving to Linux : Kiss the Blue Screen of Death > Goodbye!". There were two > copies, actually, hot off the press. One was the > regular edition and one the > Barnes & Noble special edition. Granted, I'm a > little biased, but I think it > looks fantastic. Anyhow, the news gets even better. > > The official release date for the new book was > supposed to be August 19th, but > a look at various online outlets shows it to be > shipping! Brick and mortar > bookstores should follow in a couple of weeks. Check > out the book's page for > a list of links to various e-tailers. > > http://www.marcelgagne.com/mtl2nd.html > > There's also a very cool review of the book by Peter > H. Salus on > UnixReview.com . > > > http://www.unixreview.com/documents/s=9846/ur0508k/ur0508k.html > > Thus endeth this episode of gratuitous > self-promotion. > > Take care out there. > > -- > Marcel (Writer and Free Thinker at Large) Gagn? > Note: This massagee wos nat speel or > gramer-checkered. > Mandatory home page reference - > http://www.marcelgagne.com/ > Author : "Moving to the Linux Business Desktop" > "Moving to Linux: Kiss the Blue Screen of > Death Goodbye!" > "Linux System Administration, A User's > Guide" > Join the WFTL-LUG : > http://www.marcelgagne.com/wftllugform.html > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: > http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text > below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: > http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 01:56:47 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 21:56:47 -0400 Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: <1e55af990508181426268912f-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel@cbits.ca> <1e55af990508181426268912f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050819015647.GA2180@node1.opengeometry.net> On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 05:26:55PM -0400, Sy wrote: > humour: BUT, if you manage to get a "linux distribution speed > comparison" website put together, I'd love to see "proof" that > stock-Slackware is better than the best-tweaked Gentoo setup. That'll > shut 'em up! ;) It's true. :-) -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 02:27:16 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 22:27:16 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Installfest planning meeting. Message-ID: <20050819022716.7359.qmail@web88203.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Here is a summery of the installfest planning meeting. The first discussion regarded what things need to be brought, and who will bring them. Keep in mind that the College has promised 4 monitors, so the omission of monitors from the following list was deliberate: - 4 x PS/2 keyboards/mice - William Park - 1 x Extension cord - William Park - 1 x CD-ROM drive - William Park - 1 x 4 port router - Daniel Armstrong - 6 x Knoppix CD-ROMs - Daniel Armstrong - 3 x Ethernet cables - Daniel Armstrong - 1 x Ubuntu x86 CD-ROM - Daniel Armstrong - 2 x Ubuntu PowerPC CD-ROM - Colin McGregor - 8 x Ubuntu x86 CD-ROM - Colin McGregor - 1 x Slackware server - William Park - 1 x table cloth - Colin McGregor - 1 x Power Bar - Seneca Cunningham - 1 x Power Bar - Danial Armstrong For who is comfortable with what distribution: Gordon - Various RedHat releases Seneca - Debian, SUSe Amos - Mandriva, SUSe Daniel - Debian, Ubuntu William - Slackware Allen - Slackware, RedHat Colin - Debian, Fedora, Coyote, Knoppix Things still to be done: - Get release form approved by lawyer - Generate more PR for event. - Post pictures of the room. Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 02:49:18 2005 From: blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Byron L. Sonne) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 22:49:18 -0400 Subject: My new book is finally available! In-Reply-To: <200508182026.35867.mggagne-oUREY1nl/XXQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200508182026.35867.mggagne@salmar.com> Message-ID: <430548AE.6020100@rogers.com> > Warning! Shameless self-promotion follows! A book is hella work, congratulations man! -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jerome-mhXWc29+iYPyG1zEObXtfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 10:12:40 2005 From: jerome-mhXWc29+iYPyG1zEObXtfA at public.gmane.org (JM) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 18:12:40 +0800 Subject: OT: Suggestion on a Data Center Message-ID: <200508191812.40710.jerome@gmanmi.tv> Hi ALL, Im looking for a datacenter in the US where we can rent a box. They should be able to provide bandwidth monitoring and a 24x7 technical support. I would exclude ServePath on this list for some reasons. Thanks, -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 10:46:41 2005 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 06:46:41 -0400 Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: <20050818165542.GA6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel@cbits.ca> <4304A557.9050001@interlog.com> <42922.66.11.182.5.1124382835.squirrel@cbits.ca> <20050818165542.GA6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20050819104641.GA12387@waltdnes.org> On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 12:55:42PM -0400, Lennart Sorensen wrote > For me that means debian with it's wonderful packagemangement and > great package quality, and ready to use packages of almost any > program I could want. Gentoo can make the same claim. My standard "torture test" is to do a basic console-only install of Gentoo. Then tell it to install Gimp or Gnumeric... and watch it pull in Xorg and its dependancies, plus all the other base libs that Gimp or Gnumeric need. It ends up building a working TWM that will run the app. IMHO, Redhat 7.3 was probably the best end-user distro of its time. When Redhat announced the impending end of support for 7.3, I switched to Debian almost two years ago (Sept 2003). After the Windows-like upgrade treadmill of RH 7.0, 7.1, 7.2, 7.3, 8, and 9, I actively sought out a stable slowly-changing distro, and Debian had that reputation. I was happily using Debian for about a year when its "stability" bit me. The latest versions of Realplayer and Firefox refused to install due to outdated gtk (and other) libs. These versions fixed security holes in previous versions, so running with the old version was not an option. I switched to CRUX linux (which assumes -march=i686 and -O2) for a few months. I was looking for more optimization, and people suggested I try Gentoo... so here I am. My initial goal with Gentoo wasn't bragging rights on benchmarks, but rather to extend the useful life of my 450 mhz PIII Dell which will soon be celebrating its 6th anniversary. Due to the recent demise of my P4, the PIII has been pressed into temporary service as my main machine until I purchase a new one. It does 90%+ of apps OK. However, it drops frames on some internet TV sites under mplayer, and manipulating 2560 X 1920 images in Gimp happens at "a rather liesurely pace". -- Walter Dnes My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 10:49:19 2005 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 06:49:19 -0400 Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel-ZPnsNkHkFjk@public.gmane.org> References: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel@cbits.ca> Message-ID: <20050819104919.GB12387@waltdnes.org> On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 12:29:01AM -0400, Jason Carson wrote > Greetings, > > I am thinking about doing a Linux comparison by benchmarking various > distros then posting the results on my website. > > Does anyone have any recommendations as to what software I can use to do > the benchmarking. I found this page with a bunch of tests > (http://lbs.sourceforge.net/) I'm old enough to remember the NEC V20 chip getting 20% better results on Norton SI (System Info) than the stock Intel 8088. Real-world tests showed *AT MOST* 5-to-8 percent improvement. Eventually, NEC got out of the 8088-clone-chip business. And of course, RISC-chip manufacturers just *LOVE* comparing their chips doing no-op loops versus X86 CPUs doing no-op loops. That's because no-op is almost the only instruction where it doesn't take umpteen RISC instructions to emulate one CISC instruction. A meaningful test would be the same application doing the same real-world tasks on the same machine running the same WM. You'd probably need some serious scripting to ensure repeatability. Also, remember to create separate tests for first access after bootup and repeated accesses thereafter. For many tasks, e.g. reading/writing email, it would take monstrous misconfiguration to slow down things to the point where any difference is noticable. Speed only matters in heavy-duty stuff. E.g. I've had mplayer warn me that my 6-year-old Dell (450 mhz PIII with 128 megs of RAM) is too slow to handle internet TV. Yes, it does drop frames. I am not heavily into gaming, but that's another area where you'll probably see a difference. After switching from Debian to Gentoo, I had to patch the delay loop in Xboing to slow it down so that I could play it. No, I'm not kidding. -- Walter Dnes My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 10:49:33 2005 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 06:49:33 -0400 Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: <1e55af990508181426268912f-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel@cbits.ca> <1e55af990508181426268912f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050819104933.GC12387@waltdnes.org> On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 05:26:55PM -0400, Sy wrote > humour: BUT, if you manage to get a "linux distribution speed > comparison" website put together, I'd love to see "proof" that > stock-Slackware is better than the best-tweaked Gentoo setup. That'll > shut 'em up! ;) Speaking from the Gentoo side of things, I'd be interested in the results too. Maybe we could get together and produce a Slackware vs Gentoo showdown... for the April meeting. -- Walter Dnes My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 12:19:28 2005 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 08:19:28 -0400 Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: <20050819104919.GB12387-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel@cbits.ca> <20050819104919.GB12387@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: On 8/19/05, Walter Dnes wrote: > > On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 12:29:01AM -0400, Jason Carson wrote > > Greetings, > > > > I am thinking about doing a Linux comparison by benchmarking various > > distros then posting the results on my website. > > > > Does anyone have any recommendations as to what software I can use to do > > the benchmarking. I found this page with a bunch of tests > > (http://lbs.sourceforge.net/) > > I'm old enough to remember the NEC V20 chip getting 20% better results > on Norton SI (System Info) than the stock Intel 8088. Real-world tests > showed *AT MOST* 5-to-8 percent improvement. Eventually, NEC got out of > the 8088-clone-chip business. And of course, RISC-chip manufacturers > just *LOVE* comparing their chips doing no-op loops versus X86 CPUs > doing no-op loops. That's because no-op is almost the only instruction > where it doesn't take umpteen RISC instructions to emulate one CISC > instruction. A couple weeks ago, I was visiting OSDL and had the amusement of reading one of the spec sheets on a TPCD benchmark. OSDL has been running some database performance benchmarks, of late; the point being to try to find any bottlenecks in the Linux kernel that might prevent it from being as fast as it ought to be at such. I was there with a group of PostgreSQL folk; the discussions validated that the core PostgreSQL guys were using all the APIs sanely and that there isn't any "magick bullet out there" such that using some extra system call might speed things up radically. Anyways, back to that spec sheet. It was documenting a system used for some Itanium/Linux-based database benchmark that got some pretty good numbers. The machine was pretty expensive, and the specs seemed sensible, until you got to the fine print at the end where they mentioned the number of 15K RPM SCSI disks required to accomplish the benchmark. If memory serves, it was 112 disks. It was not a number of disks that I would normally expect to be able to hook up to a database server. It was an outrageous number that would require more SCSI controllers for than you have PCI slots for on other than a seriously mutant server. In effect, the TPC benchmarks have led to vendors constructing the computing equivalents to Formula 1 race cars. Things that, on a suitably restricted track, and when driven by suitably trained operators, provide speed you can't really comprehend. But not of much use in evaluating the merits of any of the things that travel on "more pedestrian roads." A meaningful test would be the same application doing the same > real-world tasks on the same machine running the same WM. You'd > probably need some serious scripting to ensure repeatability. Also, > remember to create separate tests for first access after bootup and > repeated accesses thereafter. And it's common that the bottlenecks fall into particular places, whether: a) Disk I/O, in which case the distribution can be quite irrelevant; b) Human I/O, in which case the distribution is sure to be irrelevant; c) Memory usage, in which case, having a bit more or less RAM will mess with things a *LOT*, and where having extra daemons running or having more languages configured in GLIBC can hurt... -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 12:19:58 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 07:19:58 -0500 Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: <20050819104933.GC12387-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel@cbits.ca> <1e55af990508181426268912f@mail.gmail.com> <20050819104933.GC12387@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <1e55af9905081905192bc3825c@mail.gmail.com> On 8/19/05, Walter Dnes wrote: > On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 05:26:55PM -0400, Sy wrote > > > humour: BUT, if you manage to get a "linux distribution speed > > comparison" website put together, I'd love to see "proof" that > > stock-Slackware is better than the best-tweaked Gentoo setup. That'll > > shut 'em up! ;) > > Speaking from the Gentoo side of things, I'd be interested in the > results too. Maybe we could get together and produce a Slackware vs > Gentoo showdown... for the April meeting. Except I dropped Slackware for the desktop variation of its "it just works" philosophy.. pclinuxos. I'm now liking the idea that crap just works out of the box without my having to learn a new skill. For me, speed isn't such a big deal. It's responsiveness. The experience as a user is the frustration in waiting during moments when waiting is not expected. I always expect to be able to be able to wiggle my mouse. I don't expect to be able to interact with a program which I just told to do something complecated. I expect that when hovering over a button which brightens it for me to interact with, I can click on it to do something. i.e. an application shouldn't paint an interactive thing unless it's prepared to have it interacted with. Stuff like that. I was happily running a p266 (96MB RAM) with an X+blackbox setup.. and I could run a low-traffic apache+mysql server underneath, while surfing and downloading, while ripping audio tracks from cd, while encoding multiple tracks simultaneously. While playing mp3s.. without skipping. Linux won a lot of contests at that point. I still remember when colour and graphics was a wet dream, so I appreciate what I can get. Right now I just want a setup to do what I expect when I expect it.. the rest doesn't matter to me. So even though there's tweaking that's possible.. and even though I still have some leftover choices from when speed mattered a lot more (i.e. blackbox, a tcl/tk file manager, console applications vs gui..).. even though I'm still stuck in the dark ages as a desktop user, I no longer care about raw data about speed. I'd care more about "blackbox is faster than x, and this is why.." or "tweaking mplayer". So if someone told me that stock gentoo was faster for an average user than stock slackware, then I'd listen. Such a concept doesn't really exist though. Ok, there's sortof a stock gentoo.. sortof. But if someone told me that gentoo has a slick newbie-friendly installer, I'd perk up. Sure.. I'd have it compiling stuff in a virtual machine for a few days to check it out.. Blah, I'm going off onto a tangent. "distro vs distro" just isn't healthy from the perspective of speeds, because it's the user experience that matters. Users are individual, so there's no real way to satisfy everyone. HOWEVER, application versus application is more interesting.. tweaking guides, howtos, etc etc.. or, as I said.. I'd love to see a concise listing of tools and methods for benchmarking my own stuff. I wouldn't mind learning to test the capabilities of my own server in new ways, for example. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 12:45:49 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 08:45:49 -0400 Subject: Linux Benchmarking References: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel@cbits.ca> <20050819104919.GB12387@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <002701c5a4bb$ff6bed70$6501a8c0@ibm5b4y3a0pgrq> ----- Original Message ----- From: Christopher Browne To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 8:19 AM Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Linux Benchmarking On 8/19/05, Walter Dnes wrote: On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 12:29:01AM -0400, Jason Carson wrote > Greetings, > > I am thinking about doing a Linux comparison by benchmarking various > distros then posting the results on my website. > > Does anyone have any recommendations as to what software I can use to do > the benchmarking. I found this page with a bunch of tests > (http://lbs.sourceforge.net/ ) > > I'm old enough to remember the NEC V20 chip getting 20% better results >on Norton SI (System Info) than the stock Intel 8088. Real-world tests >showed *AT MOST* 5-to-8 percent improvement. Eventually, NEC got out of >the 8088-clone-chip business. And of course, RISC-chip manufacturers >just *LOVE* comparing their chips doing no-op loops versus X86 CPUs >doing no-op loops. That's because no-op is almost the only instruction >where it doesn't take umpteen RISC instructions to emulate one CISC >instruction. > >A couple weeks ago, I was visiting OSDL and had the amusement of reading one of the spec sheets on a TPCD >benchmark. > >OSDL has been running some database performance benchmarks, of late; the point being to try to find any bottlenecks in >the Linux kernel that might prevent it from being as fast as it ought to be at such. > > A meaningful test would be the same application doing the same >real-world tasks on the same machine running the same WM. You'd >probably need some serious scripting to ensure repeatability. Also, >remember to create separate tests for first access after bootup and >repeated accesses thereafter. > >And it's common that the bottlenecks fall into particular places, whether: >a) Disk I/O, in which case the distribution can be quite irrelevant; >b) Human I/O, in which case the distribution is sure to be irrelevant; >c) Memory usage, in which case, having a bit more or less RAM will mess with things a *LOT*, and where having extra >daemons running or having more languages configured in GLIBC can hurt... ===================== Having worked for well-known vendors of hardware and software during my long carreer I can guarantee you that ALL benchmarks I have seen them putting together were made using outrageous tweaks to the hardware and/or software. Even today Big Blue publishes "benchmarks" on its web site where there are always two or tree of its machines in the top five of, say, an Oracle on Linux "benchmark", which only proves that one can make things run faster given enough time and $$$ to build a fast performer, which is usually NOT the type of configuration that a normal customer will buy. Benchmarking what? Trying 5 different flavours of a Linux kernel on the same hardware will only measure that specific hardware's performance running those specific kernels and applications with a very specific set of parameters in place, which may not be the ones that a real client will use. A faster car does not make a bad driver drive better! Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 12:54:31 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 08:54:31 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: <430506F9.8040906-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <430506F9.8040906@rogers.com> Message-ID: On 8/18/05, James Knott wrote: > > > It's cheaper, if you have a crimper and know how to use it. I suspect > someone who thinks software can cause a NIC to crossover doesn't qualify for > either. I barely know how to use a mouse and keyboard! But I'm geting bettr! -Steve. -- Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] ubuntulinux.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 13:02:56 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 09:02:56 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: References: <20050818170453.GD6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20050819130256.GG6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 03:24:18PM -0400, Henry Spencer wrote: > Or they thought so, anyway. (People tend to have really exaggerated ideas > about how much network bandwidth they need; mass-market LAN-hardware > evolution is driven much more by marketing and by what's easy in silicon > than by real need. Most of today's LAN users still don't really need > 100Mbit, let alone 1000.) I like having at least 100 when I have a new cd image and want to transfer it to the machine with the burner in it. 10mbit is awfully painful to wait for. No one has any reason to use less than 100mbit anymore. Of course 1000 would be lovely and all, but I doubt most machines can get anywhere near using that to its potential, and gigabit switches aren't practically free yet. Now just because people don't use full duplex most of the time, doesn't mean they don't think they should want it. :) Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 14:04:47 2005 From: interlug-vSRlqIl1h/9eoWH0uzbU5w at public.gmane.org (interlug-list) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 10:04:47 -0400 Subject: Distro Makeover! Message-ID: <1124460287.30560.116.camel@holden.weait.net> A Distro-statement that might just keep us entertained for the weekend. "Any sufficiently advanced Linux Guru can modify any distribution to make it appear to be any other distribution. " I support this statement by starting with the easy stuff. Even a low level user like me could select a theme in Fedora that makes the desktop appear to be Win(something) at a quick glance. By changing icons, key mappings and file names the makeover is a little more convincing, perhaps even during use. But what about a more knowledgeable user? Can a person start with (say) Ubuntu and make it appear to be (say) Slackware? Or Fedora to Gentoo? Will the makeover stand up to analysis? How much? When you do a makeover like this, when does the distro change from being the original distro, to a modified-original distro, to an emulated target distro, to the target distro? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 14:18:05 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 10:18:05 -0400 Subject: Distro Makeover! In-Reply-To: <1124460287.30560.116.camel-csCcNl6ta60tuqGvh5Fqhg@public.gmane.org> References: <1124460287.30560.116.camel@holden.weait.net> Message-ID: <20050819141805.GH6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Aug 19, 2005 at 10:04:47AM -0400, interlug-list wrote: > A Distro-statement that might just keep us entertained for the weekend. > > "Any sufficiently advanced Linux Guru can modify any distribution to > make it appear to be any other distribution. " > > I support this statement by starting with the easy stuff. Even a low > level user like me could select a theme in Fedora that makes the desktop > appear to be Win(something) at a quick glance. By changing icons, key > mappings and file names the makeover is a little more convincing, > perhaps even during use. > > But what about a more knowledgeable user? Can a person start with (say) > Ubuntu and make it appear to be (say) Slackware? Or Fedora to Gentoo? > Will the makeover stand up to analysis? How much? > > When you do a makeover like this, when does the distro change from being > the original distro, to a modified-original distro, to an emulated > target distro, to the target distro? Well the main feature of each distribution is the version of each piece of software, what options they are compiled with, and of course which package management system is in use, and where it stores configuration files for various things along with the scripts to start and stop various daemons. If you change any of those (possibly not counting the version/options of a given piece of software) then you are really running your own customized distribution at that point since you are no longer likely to be compatible with upgrades to the original distribution. On the other hand short of changing _everything_ about your system to match the target distribution, you can't claim to be running the target distribution. Of course this is sometimes how a new distribution is tarted. You start with something and then you change things until they are how you want them and continue from there as a new distribution. I really doubt you could easily change one distrubion to appear to be another to someone very familiar with the target distribution, unless willing to totally replace everything at which point any nice features of the original distribution are likely lost. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 14:24:47 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 10:24:47 -0400 Subject: Indigo cutting back Linux magazines? Message-ID: Maybe it's just me, but for over a month the Indigo store that USED to have lots of Linux magazines (ones with discs) has been nearly empty of Linux mags! Haven't seen a single copy of Linux Format or Linux Magazine for instance. Has anyone else noticed this? Don't worry, because there's still tons of Windows mags... and even Mac mags. While I'm on a rant, I was in Staples too and they even have Windows mags and Mac mags. No Linux mags though. I'm sure it's a coincidence... it's not like MS would ever pressure companies in any sort anti-competition way... nah. I'm just dreaming. Even Shoppers Drug Marts carry Windows AND Mac mags... no Linux. -Steve. -- Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] ubuntulinux.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 14:52:28 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 10:52:28 -0400 Subject: Indigo cutting back Linux magazines? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Steve wrote: > Maybe it's just me, but for over a month the Indigo store that USED to > have lots of Linux magazines (ones with discs) has been nearly empty of > Linux mags! Haven't seen a single copy of Linux Format or Linux Magazine > for instance. Has anyone else noticed this? Don't worry, because there's > still tons of Windows mags... and even Mac mags. Could be they are just out of stock because they don't carry many copies to begin with. Could also be Heather's corporate mandate that her stores promote "cultural experience" and carry up to %40 gift ware i.e. all those candles and crap by the registers. If the cultural experience hypothesis bears thinking about, does this mean that Linux users are not considered a profitable niche within popular culture at large? Perhaps it has something to do with that free operating system thing that I keep hearing about... But seriously -- and I may be giving the chain (and others) too much credit with this -- if there was money to be made in mass market Linux magazines I would like to think that the large stores would be smart/greedy enough carry them. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 15:07:16 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 11:07:16 -0400 Subject: Indigo cutting back Linux magazines? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 8/19/05, Jamon Camisso wrote: > > > If the cultural experience hypothesis bears thinking about, does this > mean that Linux users are not considered a profitable niche within > popular culture at large? Perhaps it has something to do with that free > operating system thing that I keep hearing about... > > But seriously -- and I may be giving the chain (and others) too much > credit with this -- if there was money to be made in mass market Linux > magazines I would like to think that the large stores would be > smart/greedy enough carry them. > But... Indigo/Chapters specializes in carrying thousands of magazines (OK, maybe hundreds)... there are so many niche magazines, I cannot believe EVERY one of which is "profitable"... I think I'll boycott them now! :-) ...And Staples... The $20 I was going to spend on a magazine there will surely bring them down! I'm losing track of all the companies I'm boycotting on ethical grounds... Is there an open-source app that can help me track this?! lol -Steve. -- Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] ubuntulinux.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 15:12:10 2005 From: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (Peter Hiscocks) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 11:12:10 -0400 Subject: Indigo cutting back Linux magazines? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050819151210.GB12340@ee.ryerson.ca> The News & Cigar store near the Chester subway station on the Danforth (north side of Danforth, just west of Chester), has many Linux magazines for sale. Indigo has now passed the stage where it's not even worth looking for books and magazines on Linux. Their mathematics and science section is still worth a (brief) look. However, even that is significantly inferior to the math and science collection in Book City, especially the one in the Annex. Anyone here remember the Coles stores? In some cases they were huge, and as far as I could see, there was not one book worth reading. Cole's Business Plan: sell cheap, remaindered books that no one reads. Maybe Indigo is heading in that direction. Small bookstores such as Book City and Pages show that they can be competitive by intelligent selection of the books they stock. Vote with your dollars. Peter On Fri, Aug 19, 2005 at 10:24:47AM -0400, Steve wrote: > Maybe it's just me, but for over a month the Indigo store that USED to have > lots of Linux magazines (ones with discs) has been nearly empty of Linux > mags! Haven't seen a single copy of Linux Format or Linux Magazine for > instance. Has anyone else noticed this? Don't worry, because there's still > tons of Windows mags... and even Mac mags. > > While I'm on a rant, I was in Staples too and they even have Windows mags > and Mac mags. No Linux mags though. I'm sure it's a coincidence... it's not > like MS would ever pressure companies in any sort anti-competition way... > nah. I'm just dreaming. Even Shoppers Drug Marts carry Windows AND Mac > mags... no Linux. > > -Steve. > -- > Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] > ubuntulinux.org -- Peter D. Hiscocks Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering Ryerson University, 350 Victoria Street, Toronto, Ontario, M5B 2K3, Canada Phone: (416) 979-5000 Ext 6109 Fax: (416) 979-5280 Email: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org URL: http://www.ee.ryerson.ca/~phiscock -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 15:43:09 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 11:43:09 -0400 Subject: Indigo cutting back Linux magazines? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4305FE0D.3000903@rogers.com> Steve wrote: > Maybe it's just me, but for over a month the Indigo store that USED to > have lots of Linux magazines (ones with discs) has been nearly empty of > Linux mags! Haven't seen a single copy of Linux Format or Linux Magazine > for instance. Has anyone else noticed this? Don't worry, because there's > still tons of Windows mags... and even Mac mags. > > While I'm on a rant, I was in Staples too and they even have Windows > mags and Mac mags. No Linux mags though. I'm sure it's a coincidence... > it's not like MS would ever pressure companies in any sort > anti-competition way... nah. I'm just dreaming. Even Shoppers Drug Marts > carry Windows AND Mac mags... no Linux. Indigo seems to be intent on dumbing down the population. Chapters used to have a far better technical section. When they were bought by Indigo, I was afraid that wouldn't last and it appears I was unfortunately right. They also announce a while ago, that they were planning on moving more to gifts etc., instead of being just a book store. Indigo should never have been allowed to buy Chapters as they've pretty well destroyed the book business. Years ago, I used to buy at Coles, World's Biggest Bookstore, WH Smith, and Litchman's (never cared for Classic Books). Now, most of have been absorbed by Indigo and the book selection has taken a dramatic turn for the worst. Even PC-Maniak is gone. :-( -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From saliola-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 15:45:25 2005 From: saliola-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Franco Saliola) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 11:45:25 -0400 Subject: Indigo cutting back Linux magazines? In-Reply-To: <20050819151210.GB12340-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w@public.gmane.org> References: <20050819151210.GB12340@ee.ryerson.ca> Message-ID: On 8/19/05, Peter Hiscocks wrote: > Indigo has now passed the stage where it's not even worth looking for books > and magazines on Linux. Their mathematics and science section is still worth > a (brief) look. However, even that is significantly inferior to the math and > science collection in Book City, especially the one in the Annex. The mathematics section just sucks. I few years back you'd be able to get some "real" mathematics books: graduate-level texts; researcher-level books. Now you'll only find things like "Math Made Easy" and "All The Mathematics You'll Ever Need to Know". > Anyone here remember the Coles stores? In some cases they were huge, and as > far as I could see, there was not one book worth reading. Cole's Business > Plan: sell cheap, remaindered books that no one reads. Maybe Indigo is > heading in that direction. I thought Coles was owned by Chapters, which is now owned by Indigo. Am I wrong? And I think there are a few Coles stores around. > Small bookstores such as Book City and Pages show that they can be > competitive by intelligent selection of the books they stock. > > Vote with your dollars. I realized a while ago that pretty much the only power an individual has is deciding who gets her money, so I try to be conscious of who gets my money and encourage others to do the same. Franco -- > Peter > > > > > On Fri, Aug 19, 2005 at 10:24:47AM -0400, Steve wrote: > > Maybe it's just me, but for over a month the Indigo store that USED to have > > lots of Linux magazines (ones with discs) has been nearly empty of Linux > > mags! Haven't seen a single copy of Linux Format or Linux Magazine for > > instance. Has anyone else noticed this? Don't worry, because there's still > > tons of Windows mags... and even Mac mags. > > > > While I'm on a rant, I was in Staples too and they even have Windows mags > > and Mac mags. No Linux mags though. I'm sure it's a coincidence... it's not > > like MS would ever pressure companies in any sort anti-competition way... > > nah. I'm just dreaming. Even Shoppers Drug Marts carry Windows AND Mac > > mags... no Linux. > > > > -Steve. > > -- > > Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] > > ubuntulinux.org > > -- > Peter D. Hiscocks > Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering > Ryerson University, > 350 Victoria Street, > Toronto, Ontario, M5B 2K3, Canada > > Phone: (416) 979-5000 Ext 6109 > Fax: (416) 979-5280 > Email: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org > URL: http://www.ee.ryerson.ca/~phiscock > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 15:47:17 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 11:47:17 -0400 Subject: Is my computer dying? Answer; YES In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4305FF05.7030504@rogers.com> Henry Spencer wrote: > (Odd that they'll take monitors but not TV sets...) That's probably due to all the garbage on TV these days. ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 15:56:20 2005 From: jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 11:56:20 -0400 Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: References: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel@cbits.ca> <20050819104919.GB12387@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: On 8/19/05, Christopher Browne wrote: > Anyways, back to that spec sheet. It was documenting a system used for > some Itanium/Linux-based database benchmark that got some pretty good > numbers. The machine was pretty expensive, and the specs seemed sensible, > until you got to the fine print at the end where they mentioned the number > of 15K RPM SCSI disks required to accomplish the benchmark. If memory > serves, it was 112 disks. Only 112? Pfft. That's nothing. http://www.tpc.org/tpcc/results/tpcc_result_detail.asp?id=104111801 It had 6400 36.4GB 15krpm FC disks, 140 73.4GB 15krpm FC disks, and 8 36.4GB 15krpm SCSI. That puppy had 90 FC PCI-X adapters. :) The 6400 disks accounted for $7 136 000 of the total system cost, beat only by the cost of 2TB or RAM: $8 912 896. -- taa /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jweissig-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 16:21:04 2005 From: jweissig-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Justin Weissig) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 09:21:04 -0700 Subject: OT: Suggestion on a Data Center In-Reply-To: <200508191812.40710.jerome-mhXWc29+iYPyG1zEObXtfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200508191812.40710.jerome@gmanmi.tv> Message-ID: <217ddce005081909212654030@mail.gmail.com> Try http://serverbeach.com/catalog/ they are run by http://peer1.net out of Vancouver but both of their data centers are in the US. They are awesome. I use them and am extremely impressed. It is a self-managed solution. If you're looking for a managed solution, try http://tilted.com/index.html. I hear great things about these guys but have never used them personally. Cheers, - Justin On 8/19/05, JM wrote: > Hi ALL, > > Im looking for a datacenter in the US where we can rent a box. They should > be able to provide bandwidth monitoring and a 24x7 technical support. I > would exclude ServePath on this list for some reasons. > > Thanks, > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 16:35:00 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 12:35:00 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: <20050819130256.GG6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050818170453.GD6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050819130256.GG6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <43060A34.4040402@rogers.com> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > Now just because people don't use full duplex most of the time, doesn't > mean they don't think they should want it. :) With TCP, you've always got some data going in the reverse direction, so if you're using FDUX, you can improve throughput. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cdasilva-q6EoVN9bke6w5LPnMra/2Q at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 16:46:46 2005 From: cdasilva-q6EoVN9bke6w5LPnMra/2Q at public.gmane.org (Clive DaSilva) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 12:46:46 -0400 Subject: Indigo cutting back Linux magazines? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200508191246.47121.cdasilva@iprimus.ca> Hmmn I was in the one at bay & Bloor last Sunday and they had about 4 different Linux mags. Maybe you just caught them when they were re-stocking ? On August 19, 2005 10:24 am, Steve wrote: > Maybe it's just me, but for over a month the Indigo store that USED to have > lots of Linux magazines (ones with discs) has been nearly empty of Linux > mags! Haven't seen a single copy of Linux Format or Linux Magazine for > instance. Has anyone else noticed this? Don't worry, because there's still > tons of Windows mags... and even Mac mags. > > While I'm on a rant, I was in Staples too and they even have Windows mags > and Mac mags. No Linux mags though. I'm sure it's a coincidence... it's not > like MS would ever pressure companies in any sort anti-competition way... > nah. I'm just dreaming. Even Shoppers Drug Marts carry Windows AND Mac > mags... no Linux. > > -Steve. -- Clive DaSilva Tel : 416-421-2480 Cell: 416-560-8820 Mandrake Linux 10.1 Kernel 2.6.8.1.10mdk -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pwa.linux-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 16:48:00 2005 From: pwa.linux-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (PW Armstrong) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 12:48:00 -0400 Subject: Open-source 'mailto' scripts for use with forms Message-ID: <43060D40.30202@gmail.com> Can anyone recommend a good open-source 'mailto' script for use with forms, preferably one that allows a link/response/confirmation to a 'form-submitted' web page once the submit button is clicked? thx very much -peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 16:39:17 2005 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 19:39:17 +0300 (IDT) Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: References: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel@cbits.ca> <20050819104919.GB12387@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: On Fri, 19 Aug 2005, Taavi Burns wrote: > On 8/19/05, Christopher Browne wrote: >> Anyways, back to that spec sheet. It was documenting a system used for >> some Itanium/Linux-based database benchmark that got some pretty good >> numbers. The machine was pretty expensive, and the specs seemed sensible, >> until you got to the fine print at the end where they mentioned the number >> of 15K RPM SCSI disks required to accomplish the benchmark. If memory >> serves, it was 112 disks. > > Only 112? Pfft. That's nothing. > > http://www.tpc.org/tpcc/results/tpcc_result_detail.asp?id=104111801 > > It had 6400 36.4GB 15krpm FC disks, 140 73.4GB 15krpm FC disks, and 8 > 36.4GB 15krpm SCSI. That puppy had 90 FC PCI-X adapters. :) > > The 6400 disks accounted for $7 136 000 of the total system cost, beat > only by the cost of 2TB or RAM: $8 912 896. Would such a machine double as a cosmic radiation detector ? ;-) With that volume of active silicon it should be able to be used for radio astronomy imho. Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 16:51:30 2005 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins Witteman) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 12:51:30 -0400 Subject: xmms has stopped working after a reinstall Message-ID: <20050819165129.GA6736@localhost.localdomain> I reinstalled Debian on a new 160GB disk, as part of an effort to get some odd hardware flakiness subside. I now have everything back to normal except xine (which no longer seems to be in testing), mplayer (which I need to download again) and xmms. xmms seemed to be missing a couple of .so files, which I found via apt-file, but when I press play xmms just cycles through the playlist at an incredible speed, and makes no output. vlc plays mp3s just fine, so that's not the problem, but I haven't found any solutions online, and I was hoping that this would sound familiar to someone. Thanks. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From lists-tZhE6lH4Esk+k03BA+Hq9g at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 17:19:40 2005 From: lists-tZhE6lH4Esk+k03BA+Hq9g at public.gmane.org (Oliver Meyn) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 13:19:40 -0400 Subject: broken x install Message-ID: <430614AC.5010903@mineallmeyn.com> Hi all, I managed to break an x install on debian by doing it piece-meal and now am not sure how to fix it. My wm of choice is kde and kdm starts fine, the login prompt is ok, but after logging in I'm presented with only an xterm. If I type "startkde" in there everything starts as it should and away I go. What I can't find is what to change so that startkde is automatically called after login. Any pointers? This is debian unstable on x86. Thanks, Oliver -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 17:24:55 2005 From: matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (G. Matthew Rice) Date: 19 Aug 2005 13:24:55 -0400 Subject: Open-source 'mailto' scripts for use with forms In-Reply-To: <43060D40.30202-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> References: <43060D40.30202@gmail.com> Message-ID: PW Armstrong writes: > Can anyone recommend a good open-source 'mailto' script for use with forms, > preferably one that allows a link/response/confirmation to a 'form-submitted' > web page once the submit button is clicked? Take a look at formmail.pl at: http://sourceforge.net/projects/nms-cgi I think that this is what you mean. HTH, -- g. matthew rice starnix, toronto, ontario, ca phone: 647.722.5301 x242 gpg id: EF9AAD20 http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 18:23:45 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 14:23:45 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: <43060A34.4040402-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <20050818170453.GD6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20050819130256.GG6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <43060A34.4040402@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20050819182345.GI6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Aug 19, 2005 at 12:35:00PM -0400, James Knott wrote: > With TCP, you've always got some data going in the reverse direction, so > if you're using FDUX, you can improve throughput. Well you have an acknowledgement after your receive something. If you use a large transfer window with delayed ack, then you have even less responses coming back. It can give a slight performance improvement, but it would often be very little. I prefer full duplex, given there really is no reason not to use it when it is an option. Most transfers seem to be rather asymetric, so full duplex is probably less important to speed than most people believe. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 18:25:50 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 14:25:50 -0400 Subject: xmms has stopped working after a reinstall In-Reply-To: <20050819165129.GA6736-bi+AKbBUZKY6gyzm1THtWbp2dZbC/Bob@public.gmane.org> References: <20050819165129.GA6736@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050819182550.GJ6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Aug 19, 2005 at 12:51:30PM -0400, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: > I reinstalled Debian on a new 160GB disk, as part of an effort to get > some odd hardware flakiness subside. I now have everything back to > normal except xine (which no longer seems to be in testing), > mplayer (which I need to download again) and xmms. > > xmms seemed to be missing a couple of .so files, which I found via > apt-file, but when I press play xmms just cycles through the playlist at > an incredible speed, and makes no output. vlc plays mp3s just fine, so > that's not the problem, but I haven't found any solutions online, and I > was hoping that this would sound familiar to someone. Thanks. If you are using testing or unstable, expect some library package breakage until the C++ ABI transition is completed. Even thought most stuff has avoided moving into testing, not everything has unfortunately. stable on the other hand just works as it should. :) Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 18:27:45 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 14:27:45 -0400 Subject: broken x install In-Reply-To: <430614AC.5010903-tZhE6lH4Esk+k03BA+Hq9g@public.gmane.org> References: <430614AC.5010903@mineallmeyn.com> Message-ID: <20050819182745.GK6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Aug 19, 2005 at 01:19:40PM -0400, Oliver Meyn wrote: > I managed to break an x install on debian by doing it piece-meal and now > xterm. If I type "startkde" in there everything starts as it should and > away I go. What I can't find is what to change so that startkde is > automatically called after login. Any pointers? This is debian > unstable on x86. Well debian unstable has (at least as far as I can tell) some library breakage still happening, and kde seems to be one of the big victims of it (being c++ based after all). So maybe it will fix itself, maybe you need to apt-get install kde, or maybe you have to make sure your session type is actually selected as kde when you login from kdm. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 18:36:15 2005 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 14:36:15 -0400 Subject: Firefox and Thunderbird not getting along Message-ID: <4306269F.6030405@telly.org> If someone sends me a URL embedded in an email, Thunderbird highlights it but clicking on the link does nothing. I literally have to cut and paste the link if I want to go there. Similarly, if a page I'm viewing in Firefox includes a "mailto" link, clicking that link doesn't do anything (usually it's supposed to call up a mail composer, right?) Any pointers are appreciated. Both packages are release 1.0.2. - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 18:39:47 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 14:39:47 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: <20050819130256.GG6744-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050819130256.GG6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: On Fri, 19 Aug 2005, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > > Or they thought so, anyway. (People tend to have really exaggerated ideas > > about how much network bandwidth they need... > > I like having at least 100 when I have a new cd image and want to > transfer it to the machine with the burner in it. 10mbit is awfully > painful to wait for. If it's an occasional requirement, go have coffee or otherwise stretch your legs for ten minutes. :-) Or just work on something else meanwhile -- there are advantages to having an operating system that can walk and chew gum simultaneously! If you have to do it *often*, yes, it gets tiresome very quickly. > No one has any reason to use less than 100mbit anymore. Almost true. That's why I mentioned "what's easy in silicon": the chip that holds a 10Mbit interface now almost always comes with a 100Mbit one bundled in, so there's little reason *not* to use 100. (Note that I hedge by saying "almost" and "little": there are still circumstances in which the choice is made for you by external factors. Very-low-end embedded-control devices may speak only 10, and 10 is more tolerant of long runs of lousy cable.) Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tgoodaire-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 19 19:23:31 2005 From: tgoodaire-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org (Tim Goodaire) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 15:23:31 -0400 Subject: Firefox and Thunderbird not getting along In-Reply-To: <4306269F.6030405-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg@public.gmane.org> References: <4306269F.6030405@telly.org> Message-ID: <20050819192330.GB17588@dahmer> On Fri, Aug 19, 2005 at 02:36:15PM -0400, Evan Leibovitch wrote: > > If someone sends me a URL embedded in an email, Thunderbird highlights > it but clicking on the link does nothing. I literally have to cut and > paste the link if I want to go there. You _literally_ cut and paste? Don't you find that the scissors and glue are a little hard on your monitor? Tim -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From denisov-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 20 02:10:04 2005 From: denisov-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Igor Denisov) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 22:10:04 -0400 Subject: xmms has stopped working after a reinstall In-Reply-To: <20050819165129.GA6736-bi+AKbBUZKY6gyzm1THtWbp2dZbC/Bob@public.gmane.org> References: <20050819165129.GA6736@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <96aa4e8f05081919107b6a7832@mail.gmail.com> >xmms just cycles through the playlist at > an incredible speed, and makes no output. Does xmms play individual mp3 files fine? I've experienced and solved this problem with playlists (both .m3u and .pls) in xmms Try to open the same playlist in juk (or some other jukebox-type app) and copy and resave the list. Hope this works for you. Igor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 21 04:32:05 2005 From: marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (Marc Lijour) Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 00:32:05 -0400 Subject: looking for DNS provider (magma) Message-ID: <200508210032.06050.marc@lijour.net> Hi Magma came up with a new policy, they won't do my DNS for free anymore. I was a happy client of dsl.ca which got bought by Wiznet which got acquired by Magma (a Primus company). All this time I was enjoying the service from my provider.. for free. I am looking for some recommendations you may have. Also does it make sense to do it myself? (After all if my DNS is down so is my site...!?) One thing I have noticed with Magma, is that recently I got cut-off for some period of time, usually at night. It happened twice this week -that I know of. If I do my DNS myself, this could be an issue? Thanks Marc -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jay-ZPnsNkHkFjk at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 20 22:22:43 2005 From: jay-ZPnsNkHkFjk at public.gmane.org (Jason Carson) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 18:22:43 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Not receiving any mail from the group Message-ID: <35396.66.11.182.5.1124576563.squirrel@cbits.ca> Have I been removed from the list? I am not receiving any mail from the group. -- Jason Carson http://cbits.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 22 13:04:21 2005 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins Witteman) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 09:04:21 -0400 Subject: Not getting root's mail - Postfix Message-ID: <20050822130421.GA3936@localhost.localdomain> Up until recently, I would get mail destined for root, presumably because in /etc/aliases I had lines like: postmaster: $me root: $me Now, after a reinstall, but using the same configuration, I no longer get root's mail. A visit to /var/log/mail.log shows me that mail for root is getting forwarded to my defined smarthost. I'm using Postfix version 2.2.4-1. Any have any ideas? -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From jay-ZPnsNkHkFjk at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 20 22:12:59 2005 From: jay-ZPnsNkHkFjk at public.gmane.org (Jason Carson) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 18:12:59 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Test Message-ID: <35298.66.11.182.5.1124575979.squirrel@cbits.ca> Testing -- Jason Carson http://cbits.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 22 23:13:14 2005 From: marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (Marc Lijour) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 19:13:14 -0400 Subject: The best OS to deal with Flash Cards Message-ID: <200508221913.14811.marc@lijour.net> Hi what is would be the best OS + the best filesystem to deal with flash cards? I see a lot of linux resources on the web... Thanks Marc -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 22 23:13:25 2005 From: marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (Marc Lijour) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 19:13:25 -0400 Subject: Test In-Reply-To: <35298.66.11.182.5.1124575979.squirrel-ZPnsNkHkFjk@public.gmane.org> References: <35298.66.11.182.5.1124575979.squirrel@cbits.ca> Message-ID: <200508221913.25755.marc@lijour.net> On August 20, 2005 18:12, Jason Carson wrote: > Testing Hi! -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From zkoziol-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 22 23:22:37 2005 From: zkoziol-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Zbigniew Koziol) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 19:22:37 -0400 Subject: looking for DNS provider (magma) In-Reply-To: <200508210032.06050.marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508210032.06050.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: <430A5E3D.908@istop.com> zoneedit.com does it for free. zb. Marc Lijour wrote: > Hi > > Magma came up with a new policy, they won't do my DNS for free anymore. > > I was a happy client of dsl.ca which got bought by Wiznet which got acquired > by Magma (a Primus company). All this time I was enjoying the service from my > provider.. for free. > > I am looking for some recommendations you may have. > Also does it make sense to do it myself? (After all if my DNS is down so is my > site...!?) > > One thing I have noticed with Magma, is that recently I got cut-off for some > period of time, usually at night. It happened twice this week -that I know > of. If I do my DNS myself, this could be an issue? > > Thanks > Marc > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- Zbigniew Koziol, SoftQuake^(tm) Open Source Business Solutions Web Development, Linux, Web Mail Fax Voice Servers, Networking Consultations, Innovative Technologies Tel/Fax: 1-416-530-2780 Toronto, Canada, http://www.softquake.ca, info-lcEyp1+e+UdAFePFGvp55w at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 20 17:11:09 2005 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 13:11:09 -0400 Subject: Power Failure, Maybe? Message-ID: I've got a box (Athlon / ~1700MHz) which, after the storm fun of yesterday, won't boot. It was hooked to a UPS, so I'm reasonably confident it didn't get fried, but maybe something's up with the PSU... Some parts do seem to work: - When 'switched on', the NIC lights up - When 'switched on', an assortment of LEDs on the motherboard fire up But pressing the switch on the front that normally tells the mobo to tell disks to fire up and then boot doesn't do anything. Does this seem like 'silly PSU failure'? That's my suspicion... What's irritating is that what I'd rather do than fix it is to migrate files to the AMD64 box (nice Antec Sonata case), but that means having to power it up :-(. -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 22 23:41:12 2005 From: josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Joseph Kubik) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 19:41:12 -0400 Subject: Power Failure, Maybe? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Do you have the motherboard manual? Does it tell you what those LEDs mean? Have you tried unplugging the power from the PSU and letting the whole thing sit for a bit? then turn it on? Why did the machine power off if the UPS did its job yesterday? -Joseph- On 8/20/05, Christopher Browne wrote: > I've got a box (Athlon / ~1700MHz) which, after the storm fun of > yesterday, won't boot. > > It was hooked to a UPS, so I'm reasonably confident it didn't get > fried, but maybe something's up with the PSU... > > Some parts do seem to work: > - When 'switched on', the NIC lights up > - When 'switched on', an assortment of LEDs on the motherboard fire up > > But pressing the switch on the front that normally tells the mobo to > tell disks to fire up and then boot doesn't do anything. > > Does this seem like 'silly PSU failure'? That's my suspicion... > What's irritating is that what I'd rather do than fix it is to migrate > files to the AMD64 box (nice Antec Sonata case), but that means having > to power it up :-(. > -- > http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html > "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him > absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 22 14:29:19 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 10:29:19 -0400 Subject: BASH scripting tutorials for beginners Message-ID: Hi, I was wondering if anyone can recommend any websites with good BASH scripting tutorials for beginners. Also, if there are any book recommendations for the same. Thanks a lot for any suggestions! -Steve. -- Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings [Intelx86/AMD64/PowerPC] ubuntulinux.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From arpadtoth-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 22 23:42:19 2005 From: arpadtoth-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (Arpad Toth) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 19:42:19 -0400 (EDT) Subject: xmms has stopped working after a reinstall In-Reply-To: <96aa4e8f05081919107b6a7832-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <96aa4e8f05081919107b6a7832@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050822234220.33446.qmail@web50608.mail.yahoo.com> --- Igor Denisov wrote: > >xmms just cycles through the playlist at > > an incredible speed, and makes no output. > > Does xmms play individual mp3 files fine? > > I've experienced and solved this problem with > playlists (both .m3u and > .pls) in xmms > Try to open the same playlist in juk (or some other > jukebox-type app) > and copy and resave the list. > Hope this works for you. > > Igor > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: > http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text > below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: > http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml hi, try to check which "output" plugin is in use. I have OSS driver, yours maybe defer, try to pick different drivers and give it a shot... (goto Options ---> preferences ---> audio IO plugins) and check out a few... Hope it helps, ciao RP __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From nastos-JAjqph6Yjy8fbXvGcxQkLSwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 22 23:49:52 2005 From: nastos-JAjqph6Yjy8fbXvGcxQkLSwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Fred Nastos) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 19:49:52 -0400 Subject: BASH scripting tutorials for beginners In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200508221949.52275.nastos@physics.utoronto.ca> On August 22, 2005 10:29 am, Steve wrote: > Hi, > > I was wondering if anyone can recommend any websites with good BASH > scripting tutorials for beginners. http://www.tldp.org/LDP/abs/html/ Although the title uses the word "advanced", it's very accessible. Maybe they mean that the guide is advanced. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 22 18:53:34 2005 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 14:53:34 -0400 Subject: Max size of swapspace - 2GB? Message-ID: <430A1F2E.3010206@georgetown.wehave.net> Hi, I have been creating >2GB swapspaces for quite a while. Recently I read the manpage: The maximum useful size of a swap area now depends on the architecture. It is roughly 2GiB on i386, PPC, m68k, ARM, 1GiB on sparc, 512MiB on mips, 128GiB on alpha and 3TiB on sparc64. As a test I just created a 3GB swapspace (single logical volume) and then had a few programs suck up all the RAM. I saw 3GB of real RAM used and 3GB of swapspace used before the server ran out of memory. Based on my test I assume that the manpage is just out of date, or am I missing something? My test was with 2.6.5 kernel (SuSE 9). Thanks, Fraser -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 00:08:59 2005 From: cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org (Chris F.A. Johnson) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 20:08:59 -0400 (EDT) Subject: BASH scripting tutorials for beginners In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, 22 Aug 2005, Steve wrote: > Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 10:29:19 -0400 > From: Steve > Reply-To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > To: TLUG > Subject: [TLUG]: BASH scripting tutorials for beginners > > Hi, > > I was wondering if anyone can recommend any websites with good BASH > scripting tutorials for beginners. There are a number of links on the page listed in my .sig. > Also, if there are any book recommendations for the same. See the second URL in my .sig. -- Chris F.A. Johnson ================================================================== Shell Scripting Recipes: A Problem-Solution Approach, 2005, Apress -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jay-ZPnsNkHkFjk at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 00:22:58 2005 From: jay-ZPnsNkHkFjk at public.gmane.org (Jason Carson) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 20:22:58 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Not receiving any mail from the group In-Reply-To: <35396.66.11.182.5.1124576563.squirrel-ZPnsNkHkFjk@public.gmane.org> References: <35396.66.11.182.5.1124576563.squirrel@cbits.ca> Message-ID: <33379.66.11.182.5.1124756578.squirrel@cbits.ca> Nevermind, it is working now, but wasn't for a couple of days...wierd > Have I been removed from the list? I am not receiving any mail from the > group. > > > -- > Jason Carson > http://cbits.ca > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- Jason Carson http://cbits.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From foolswisdom-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 21 17:36:42 2005 From: foolswisdom-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Lloyd D Budd) Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2005 10:36:42 -0700 Subject: Community QA ? In-Reply-To: <9712993f050814193214f52bf0-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <9712993f050814193214f52bf0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9712993f0508211036e009656@mail.gmail.com> I am a bit bummed that no one responded. For the four years that I lived in TO, you guys were a real source of inspiration. I guess no one wanted to get in on the Flock.com private beta :p I look forward to your feedback when Flock goes public beta, Lloyd On 8/14/05, Lloyd D Budd wrote: > Hello all ! > > I will soon be working for an open source company continuing to work > in a QA role . This role includes a larger Community QA aspect then > professional roles I have previously had . It seems to be young field > , and I do not know of any fantastic success stories that do not > involve a lot of person power . > > Instead of first considering what software to try for issue tracking , > bug tracking , forums , I am interested in what companies or projects > that you like telling them about *their* problems ? > * and please , not because they take all the abuse you dish out ;-) > * your example does not have > What are the factors ? > - responsiveness ? > - problem management ? > > Only one community QA effort has ever knocked my socks off , > fink.sf.net . For the few years that I monitored it , it was (and > still appears to be) primarily a single person (+ some developers) and > an excellent FAQ ( and good documentation ) : > > Alexander K. Hansen > + > http://fink.sourceforge.net/faq/index.php?phpLang=en > > > I have never used their product , but I have always liked the feel of > CodeWeavers support , and "show me the money" : > http://www.codeweavers.com/support/ > example show me : > http://www.codeweavers.com/site/compatibility/browse/rank/?app_id=157 -- Peace be in you , Lloyd D Budd -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 20 17:00:45 2005 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 13:00:45 -0400 Subject: Indigo cutting back Linux magazines? In-Reply-To: <4305FE0D.3000903-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <4305FE0D.3000903@rogers.com> Message-ID: On 8/19/05, James Knott wrote: > Indigo should never have been allowed to buy Chapters as they've > pretty well destroyed the book business. Years ago, I used to buy at > Coles, World's Biggest Bookstore, WH Smith, and Litchman's (never cared > for Classic Books). Now, most of have been absorbed by Indigo and the > book selection has taken a dramatic turn for the worst. Even PC-Maniak > is gone. :-( Their effective exit from the book business ought to mean there is room for someone to enter the book business anew, no? There are several directions for new entries: 1. For individual presses to jump in and arrange for "niche" displays at "niche" stores. Such as folks like Wrox/Apress/O'Reilly/... to set up displays of their entire selections at one computer store or another. I'm not sure how that works for Oracle Press or other "even nicheier" sorts of publishers, but I'll bet they could work a deal with a computer store. An interesting one would be Dover... 2. For specialized bookstores to pop up that go after "niche" areas. There are a couple in Ottawa; they seem not to have survived in Toronto. Hey, it might make sense for LinuxCaffe to put in a bookshelf or two with this in mind... Prices will have to be premium due to lower quantities, but that's a way to get the specialized books. 3. We already have the option of amazon.whatever, which has the merit of making practical distribution of books that were never economically feasible when books had to pushed into the inventory of 150 stores... -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From john-Z7w/En0MP3xWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 01:20:08 2005 From: john-Z7w/En0MP3xWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (John Macdonald) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 21:20:08 -0400 Subject: Indigo cutting back Linux magazines? In-Reply-To: References: <4305FE0D.3000903@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20050823012007.GA12609@lupus.perlwolf.com> On Sat, Aug 20, 2005 at 01:00:45PM -0400, Christopher Browne wrote: > On 8/19/05, James Knott wrote: > > Indigo should never have been allowed to buy Chapters as they've > > pretty well destroyed the book business. Years ago, I used to buy at > > Coles, World's Biggest Bookstore, WH Smith, and Litchman's (never cared > > for Classic Books). Now, most of have been absorbed by Indigo and the > > book selection has taken a dramatic turn for the worst. Even PC-Maniak > > is gone. :-( > > Their effective exit from the book business ought to mean there is > room for someone to enter the book business anew, no? I suspect you've got cause and effect backwards here and that it is the competition from online booksellers (like Amazon and their own chapters.ca) that makes them look for something to make a brick and mortar bookstore have extra appeal. > There are several directions for new entries: > > 1. For individual presses to jump in and arrange for "niche" displays > at "niche" stores. Such as folks like Wrox/Apress/O'Reilly/... to set > up displays of their entire selections at one computer store or > another. > > I'm not sure how that works for Oracle Press or other "even nicheier" > sorts of publishers, but I'll bet they could work a deal with a > computer store. > > An interesting one would be Dover... > > 2. For specialized bookstores to pop up that go after "niche" areas. > > There are a couple in Ottawa; they seem not to have survived in Toronto. > > Hey, it might make sense for LinuxCaffe to put in a bookshelf or two > with this in mind... Prices will have to be premium due to lower > quantities, but that's a way to get the specialized books. Premium prices are hard to justify because of the same online competition. Arranging a deal with Amazon that allows stocking a bookshelf but being able to sell them at Amazon's standard (discounted) price, with no shipping charges, and no delay (if it is in stock on the shelf) could work. > 3. We already have the option of amazon.whatever, which has the merit > of making practical distribution of books that were never economically > feasible when books had to pushed into the inventory of 150 stores... Exactly. -- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 01:18:50 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 21:18:50 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet Message-ID: <20050823011850.16355.qmail@web88201.mail.re2.yahoo.com> The following message bounced during the recent mail list problems, so here it is again... --- Henry Spencer wrote: > On Fri, 19 Aug 2005, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > > > Or they thought so, anyway. (People tend to > have really exaggerated ideas > > > about how much network bandwidth they need... > > > > I like having at least 100 when I have a new cd > image and want to > > transfer it to the machine with the burner in it. > 10mbit is awfully > > painful to wait for. > > If it's an occasional requirement, go have coffee or > otherwise stretch > your legs for ten minutes. :-) Or just work on > something else meanwhile -- > there are advantages to having an operating system > that can walk and chew > gum simultaneously! My first network was 10 MB 10Base2 (done just so I could play Duke Nukem 3D against my brother, and if you need to JUST connect 2 machines, 10Base2 can make for a great solution). When I started wanting to connect more than 2 machines I moved to 10BaseT, and for several years that was just fine. Then came the events I described here: http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/7127 where I was creating as many as 3 "new" CD images a day and moving them across my home network. This is what caused me to move to 100BaseT, sort of. To (greatly) simply the cable runs though the house there is a 10/100 MB switch in the basement (for basement and first floor) and a 10 MB hub in the attic (for the bedrooms). Point is that the server/development boxes that I will shift CD images between do need the speed, and are in the basement or first floor den. When I take my laptop up to my bedroom for a bit of light duty web surfing then the bottleneck (if any) will be the speed of my connection to the outside world. Also, if I ever do run into a situation where a machine that is on the 10 MB network needs the extra speed, I can haul it downstairs. When you are setting up a network you may have part of the network where speed is not a real issue, and if you can get a 10 MB hub for free (or effectively so), you might as well go for it. Mind you I should also note that when pulling cable I put in Cat 5 (or Cat 5e) everywhere. Replacing the 10 MB hub with a 100 MB hub would be a 15 minute job, most of that climbing into/crawling through attic, replacing cable would be a real nightmare... > If you have to do it *often*, yes, it gets tiresome > very quickly. > > > No one has any reason to use less than 100mbit > anymore. > > Almost true. That's why I mentioned "what's easy in > silicon": the chip > that holds a 10Mbit interface now almost always > comes with a 100Mbit one > bundled in, so there's little reason *not* to use > 100. > > (Note that I hedge by saying "almost" and "little": > there are still > circumstances in which the choice is made for you by > external factors. > Very-low-end embedded-control devices may speak only > 10, and 10 is more > tolerant of long runs of lousy cable.) Another situation is if you are playing with old hardware, for example I have a Sun SPARCstation IPX (a cute little box). There is no easy way to get that machine to support 100MB... > > Henry Spencer > > henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 01:26:41 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 21:26:41 -0400 Subject: Power Failure, Maybe? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <430A7B51.1090703@rogers.com> Christopher Browne wrote: > I've got a box (Athlon / ~1700MHz) which, after the storm fun of > yesterday, won't boot. > > It was hooked to a UPS, so I'm reasonably confident it didn't get > fried, but maybe something's up with the PSU... > > Some parts do seem to work: > - When 'switched on', the NIC lights up > - When 'switched on', an assortment of LEDs on the motherboard fire up > > But pressing the switch on the front that normally tells the mobo to > tell disks to fire up and then boot doesn't do anything. > > Does this seem like 'silly PSU failure'? That's my suspicion... > What's irritating is that what I'd rather do than fix it is to migrate > files to the AMD64 box (nice Antec Sonata case), but that means having > to power it up :-(. Try unplugging it from the power for several minutes and try again. It's possible it's locked in some state, that it can't get out of. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 01:30:09 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 21:30:09 -0400 Subject: Max size of swapspace - 2GB? In-Reply-To: <430A1F2E.3010206-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <430A1F2E.3010206@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: <430A7C21.2070509@rogers.com> Fraser Campbell wrote: > Hi, > > I have been creating >2GB swapspaces for quite a while. Recently I read > the manpage: > > The maximum useful size of a swap area now depends on the > architecture. It is roughly 2GiB on i386, PPC, m68k, ARM, 1GiB > on sparc, 512MiB on mips, 128GiB on alpha and 3TiB on sparc64. > > As a test I just created a 3GB swapspace (single logical volume) and > then had a few programs suck up all the RAM. I saw 3GB of real RAM used > and 3GB of swapspace used before the server ran out of memory. > > Based on my test I assume that the manpage is just out of date, or am I > missing something? My test was with 2.6.5 kernel (SuSE 9). It might be the the info is out of data, as I seem to recall some changes in that area not that long ago. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 01:39:38 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 21:39:38 -0400 Subject: Power Failure, Maybe? References: <430A7B51.1090703@rogers.com> Message-ID: <002f01c5a783$9868b340$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> ----- Original Message ----- From: "James Knott" To: Sent: Monday, 22 August, 2005 21:26 Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Power Failure, Maybe? > Christopher Browne wrote: > > I've got a box (Athlon / ~1700MHz) which, after the storm fun of > > yesterday, won't boot. > > > > It was hooked to a UPS, so I'm reasonably confident it didn't get > > fried, but maybe something's up with the PSU... > > > > Some parts do seem to work: > > - When 'switched on', the NIC lights up > > - When 'switched on', an assortment of LEDs on the motherboard fire up > > > > But pressing the switch on the front that normally tells the mobo to > > tell disks to fire up and then boot doesn't do anything. > > > > Does this seem like 'silly PSU failure'? That's my suspicion... > > What's irritating is that what I'd rather do than fix it is to migrate > > files to the AMD64 box (nice Antec Sonata case), but that means having > > to power it up :-(. > > Try unplugging it from the power for several minutes and try again. > It's possible it's locked in some state, that it can't get out of. Maybe the BIOS has been zapped? Try re-flashing it from a boot diskette with the appropriate utility and BIOS binary image. Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 01:42:58 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 21:42:58 -0400 Subject: Power Failure, Maybe? In-Reply-To: <002f01c5a783$9868b340$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> References: <430A7B51.1090703@rogers.com> <002f01c5a783$9868b340$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: <430A7F22.3040708@rogers.com> Francois Ouellette wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "James Knott" > To: > Sent: Monday, 22 August, 2005 21:26 > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Power Failure, Maybe? > > >>Christopher Browne wrote: >>>I've got a box (Athlon / ~1700MHz) which, after the storm fun of >>>yesterday, won't boot. >>> >>>It was hooked to a UPS, so I'm reasonably confident it didn't get >>>fried, but maybe something's up with the PSU... >>> >>>Some parts do seem to work: >>>- When 'switched on', the NIC lights up >>>- When 'switched on', an assortment of LEDs on the motherboard fire up >>> >>>But pressing the switch on the front that normally tells the mobo to >>>tell disks to fire up and then boot doesn't do anything. >>> >>>Does this seem like 'silly PSU failure'? That's my suspicion... >>>What's irritating is that what I'd rather do than fix it is to migrate >>>files to the AMD64 box (nice Antec Sonata case), but that means having >>>to power it up :-(. >>Try unplugging it from the power for several minutes and try again. >>It's possible it's locked in some state, that it can't get out of. > > > Maybe the BIOS has been zapped? > Try re-flashing it from a boot diskette with the appropriate utility and > BIOS binary image. That'll be a tad difficult to do, if he can't get it to power up. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 22 13:50:06 2005 From: nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ian Zimmerman) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 09:50:06 -0400 Subject: [OT] Linksys routers, DHCP, and DNS Message-ID: <17af137805082206503b9efff8@mail.gmail.com> I got the Rogers cable connection yesterday and it works fine, even living up to the advertised speed (well, on Sunday night...) While reconfiguring my boxes I noticed one oddity. The Linksys router I brought from my past life now seems to run a proxy DNS server and advertises itself (192.168.1.1) as such in DHCP replies. It works just fine if I list it as the only nameserver entry in resolv.conf. The thing is I can swear it didn't do this before - with the Comcast cable connection I had in California it just passed on the IP#s of Comcast's nameservers. Anyone with an idea what could cause this different behaviour? Ian -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 02:24:39 2005 From: ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ansar Mohammed) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 22:24:39 -0400 Subject: Not receiving any mail from the group In-Reply-To: <33379.66.11.182.5.1124756578.squirrel-ZPnsNkHkFjk@public.gmane.org> References: <33379.66.11.182.5.1124756578.squirrel@cbits.ca> Message-ID: I wasn't either.. my guess is that the storm took out something... > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org] On Behalf Of Jason > Carson > Sent: August 22, 2005 8:23 PM > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Not receiving any mail from the group > > > Nevermind, it is working now, but wasn't for a couple of days...wierd > > > Have I been removed from the list? I am not receiving any mail from the > > group. > > > > > > -- > > Jason Carson > > http://cbits.ca > > > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > > > -- > Jason Carson > http://cbits.ca > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From agtnews-PeCUgM4zDv73fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 02:52:47 2005 From: agtnews-PeCUgM4zDv73fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Allen Taylor) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 22:52:47 -0400 Subject: looking for DNS provider (magma) In-Reply-To: <200508210032.06050.marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508210032.06050.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: <20050823025247.GA15418@thecat.localnet> On Sun, Aug 21, 2005 at 12:32:05AM -0400, Marc Lijour wrote: > Hi > > Magma came up with a new policy, they won't do my DNS for free anymore. > . . . > I am looking for some recommendations you may have. I've been using zoneedit.com for about 4 years now with both web forwarding and dynamic DSL (for my home based web server), admittedly with very low volume sites. They are also forwarding my domains' email as part of the service. Up to five zone entries free. No complaints so far. Allen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 03:25:01 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 23:25:01 -0400 Subject: Power Failure, Maybe? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050823032501.GA2034@node1.opengeometry.net> On Sat, Aug 20, 2005 at 01:11:09PM -0400, Christopher Browne wrote: > I've got a box (Athlon / ~1700MHz) which, after the storm fun of > yesterday, won't boot. > > It was hooked to a UPS, so I'm reasonably confident it didn't get > fried, but maybe something's up with the PSU... > > Some parts do seem to work: > - When 'switched on', the NIC lights up > - When 'switched on', an assortment of LEDs on the motherboard fire up > > But pressing the switch on the front that normally tells the mobo to > tell disks to fire up and then boot doesn't do anything. If the disk spins but motherboard doesn't boot, then it's probably motherboard or disk. If your PS is anything decent, I doubt it's it. > > Does this seem like 'silly PSU failure'? That's my suspicion... > What's irritating is that what I'd rather do than fix it is to migrate > files to the AMD64 box (nice Antec Sonata case), but that means having > to power it up :-(. For moving the files, why not move the harddisks? -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 03:33:57 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 23:33:57 -0400 Subject: BASH scripting tutorials for beginners In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050823033357.GB2034@node1.opengeometry.net> On Mon, Aug 22, 2005 at 10:29:19AM -0400, Steve wrote: > Hi, > > I was wondering if anyone can recommend any websites with good BASH > scripting tutorials for beginners. > > Also, if there are any book recommendations for the same. > > Thanks a lot for any suggestions! >From the same place you got the source, you'll find official documentations (bash-doc-3.0.tar.gz) in PS/PDF/HTML. Bourne shell syntax hasn't changed. Lots of new expressions got added and are still being added (:-), but the old syntax still runs. -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 03:40:13 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 23:40:13 -0400 Subject: The best OS to deal with Flash Cards In-Reply-To: <200508221913.14811.marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508221913.14811.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: <20050823034013.GC2034@node1.opengeometry.net> On Mon, Aug 22, 2005 at 07:13:14PM -0400, Marc Lijour wrote: > Hi > > what is would be the best OS + the best filesystem to deal with flash cards? OS is less relevant. Ext2 filesystem with mount options and ramdisk for /var should be good enough. That's what I use for my thin-client on USB key (which is flash memory). -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 03:43:11 2005 From: marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (Marc Lijour) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 23:43:11 -0400 Subject: The best OS to deal with Flash Cards In-Reply-To: <20050823034013.GC2034-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200508221913.14811.marc@lijour.net> <20050823034013.GC2034@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <200508222343.11697.marc@lijour.net> On August 22, 2005 23:40, William Park wrote: > On Mon, Aug 22, 2005 at 07:13:14PM -0400, Marc Lijour wrote: > > Hi > > > > what is would be the best OS + the best filesystem to deal with flash > > cards? > > OS is less relevant. Ext2 filesystem with mount options and ramdisk for > /var should be good enough. That's what I use for my thin-client on USB > key (which is flash memory). I heard that Windows Server 2003 was not very good at Flash cards :-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hgr-FjoMob2a1F7QT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 04:13:47 2005 From: hgr-FjoMob2a1F7QT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Herb Richter) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 00:13:47 -0400 (EDT) Subject: This month's NewTLUG meeting (Aug'05) - canceled (fwd) Message-ID: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 12:09:16 -0400 (EDT) From: Herb Richter To: tlug-announce-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: This month's NewTLUG meeting (Aug'05) - canceled Unfortunately, our usual meeting room for this month and our back-up are unavailable. This, in addition to other factors, means that we will have to cancel this month's NewTLUG meeting. :-( We have re-scheduled one of the talks*1 that would have been given this month to the next meeting Sept 27th. At this time, we have speakers scheduled for *some* of the planned meetings this fall but can (always) use other volunteer speakers. Please do contact me if you have a talk/demonstration that you would like to present at a future NewTLUG meeting. As noted before in other posts, your talk could be the whole meeting, 1/2 of the meeting or a "mini" talk/topic of 10-20 minutes. TIA, Herb Richter Toronto, Ontario http://PartsAndService.com http://PartsAndService.ca P.S. if sending an e-mail to me, please include the word NewTLUG or something similar in the Subject: line so that your messages does not get spam-filtered :-| -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 04:30:52 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 00:30:52 -0400 (EDT) Subject: BASH scripting tutorials for beginners In-Reply-To: <20050823033357.GB2034-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20050823033357.GB2034@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: On Mon, Aug 22, 2005 at 10:29:19AM -0400, Steve wrote: > I was wondering if anyone can recommend any websites with good BASH > scripting tutorials for beginners. > Also, if there are any book recommendations for the same. O'Reilly has just published "Classic Shell Scripting", by Robbins & Beebe. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 04:35:52 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 23:35:52 -0500 Subject: The best OS to deal with Flash Cards In-Reply-To: <200508221913.14811.marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508221913.14811.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: <1e55af9905082221355cc43921@mail.gmail.com> On 8/22/05, Marc Lijour wrote: > what is would be the best OS + the best filesystem to deal with flash cards? > > I see a lot of linux resources on the web... I've had good experience with them with PCLinuxOS. My hardware got autodetected and everything. It's been a good experience, but I suspect just about any distribution these days would work fine with a flash card. Pick your preference and work from there.. Filesystem.. I second ext2, although I prefer to include journalling (ext3). Keep in mind that wherever you go with that flash card would have to read the filesystem. It is for this reason that some people pick fat16/32.. Also remember that OSX can read ext2. =) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 04:56:56 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 23:56:56 -0500 Subject: Indigo cutting back Linux magazines? In-Reply-To: References: <4305FE0D.3000903@rogers.com> Message-ID: <1e55af990508222156fc3d05c@mail.gmail.com> On 8/20/05, Christopher Browne wrote: > Hey, it might make sense for LinuxCaffe to put in a bookshelf or two > with this in mind... Prices will have to be premium due to lower > quantities, but that's a way to get the specialized books. What would win me over is their website having detailed reviews of books which are for sale at the cafe. Or.. user groups (e.g. four friends) can sign up to O'Reilly and get free books (on any topic), if they review them. Those books could be turned around and stamped/donated to a cafe library of sorts: I'm thinking.. any stamped book purchased for $20, refunded if returned (in good condition). You could borrow a book for $20 down and read it in-cafe. Return it when you go. This concept creates a network of recommendations and extends (and embraces!) knowledge. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From scotta-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 10:05:17 2005 From: scotta-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Scott Allen) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 06:05:17 -0400 Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: <20050819104933.GC12387-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org>; from waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org on Fri, Aug 19, 2005 at 06:49:33 -0400 References: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel@cbits.ca> <1e55af990508181426268912f@mail.gmail.com> <20050819104933.GC12387@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <20050823100517.GA1966@localhost> On Fri Aug 19,2005 06:49:33 AM Walter Dnes wrote: > On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 05:26:55PM -0400, Sy wrote > > > humour: BUT, if you manage to get a "linux distribution speed > > comparison" website put together, I'd love to see "proof" that > > stock-Slackware is better than the best-tweaked Gentoo setup. > That'll > > shut 'em up! ;) > > Speaking from the Gentoo side of things, I'd be interested in the > results too. Maybe we could get together and produce a Slackware vs > Gentoo showdown... for the April meeting. You have to watch Gentoo. Being a source based system that makes it easy to choose the optimisation flags, a "best-tweaked" system can also become unstable. It might win in the benchmark tests but break certain common app's. (Of course you can modify the optimisation on a per app' basis if you want to get your hands just a little dirty). To be a useful test though, I would think that you would want to compare stock-Slackware with "best-tweaked but still likely to be stable" Gentoo without individual app' tuning. -- ** Scott Allen scotta-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org ** ** Toronto, Ontario, Canada ** -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 20 16:24:02 2005 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 19:24:02 +0300 (IDT) Subject: what do I not understand about the following fud: Message-ID: http://www.tomshardware.com/hardnews/20050819_170647.html a) Why are they imprecise about describing what companies were told to pay up. I understand that those are companies which make Linux based products and use the Linux name in their description or title. No ? b) Why is this not explained anywhere in the articles ? Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From scotta-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 10:08:03 2005 From: scotta-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Scott Allen) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 06:08:03 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: ; from henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg@public.gmane.org on Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 12:34:27 -0400 References: Message-ID: <20050823100803.GB1966@localhost> On Thu Aug 18,2005 12:34:27 PM Henry Spencer wrote: > Ethernet hubs (switches, etc.) have built-in crossovers, so you use > straight cables to connect hosts to hubs. You can avoid needing a > crossover cable by buying a hub instead, and using two straight > cables to connect the two hosts to the hub. If you're going to > have more than two machines eventually, that's what you should do, > because a crossover cable works only for exactly two machines -- > there is no cable-only method for larger numbers. However, if > you're only concerned about two, a crossover cable will be cheaper > than a hub plus two straight cables. Points below mosly for educational purposes: Actually, there are cable-only methods for more than two machines, called 10-base2 or 10-base5. They link 10M ethernet over a coaxial cable without hubs. The are small differences between using a crossover cable or a hub/switch, which can slighty affect the way the systems behave. 1) With a hub you will get a half-duplex connection. With a switch or crossover it will likely be full-duplex. As already noted in another posting in this thread, the difference is generally insignificant. 2) The hub/switch will usually always be powered up. Therefore when one machine is powered off or disconnected, the network connection on the other machine will still be "alive". With a crossover, when one machine is powered off or disconnected, the other may see a dead ethernet link. (I say "may" because some machines will keep the ethernet active using standby power when "off" to allow for power up control via ethernet). This may result in more or different error messages, logs, etc. between one or the other method. -- ** Scott Allen scotta-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org ** ** Toronto, Ontario, Canada ** -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 11:25:23 2005 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 07:25:23 -0400 Subject: Power Failure, Maybe? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 8/22/05, Joseph Kubik wrote: > Do you have the motherboard manual? > Does it tell you what those LEDs mean? No :-( > Have you tried unplugging the power from the PSU and letting the whole > thing sit for a bit? then turn it on? Yup, for the better part of a day. > Why did the machine power off if the UPS did its job yesterday? Because there was about a 6h period between the power failing and my getting home... The UPS hasn't an infinite lifespan :-). -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 11:26:35 2005 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 07:26:35 -0400 Subject: Power Failure, Maybe? In-Reply-To: <002f01c5a783$9868b340$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> References: <430A7B51.1090703@rogers.com> <002f01c5a783$9868b340$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: On 8/22/05, Francois Ouellette wrote: > > Christopher Browne wrote: > > > I've got a box (Athlon / ~1700MHz) which, after the storm fun of > > > yesterday, won't boot. > > > > > > It was hooked to a UPS, so I'm reasonably confident it didn't get > > > fried, but maybe something's up with the PSU... > > > > > > Some parts do seem to work: > > > - When 'switched on', the NIC lights up > > > - When 'switched on', an assortment of LEDs on the motherboard fire up > > > > > > But pressing the switch on the front that normally tells the mobo to > > > tell disks to fire up and then boot doesn't do anything. > > > > > > Does this seem like 'silly PSU failure'? That's my suspicion... > > > What's irritating is that what I'd rather do than fix it is to migrate > > > files to the AMD64 box (nice Antec Sonata case), but that means having > > > to power it up :-(. > > > > Try unplugging it from the power for several minutes and try again. > > It's possible it's locked in some state, that it can't get out of. > > > Maybe the BIOS has been zapped? > Try re-flashing it from a boot diskette with the appropriate utility and > BIOS binary image. The disks don't power up, so there's no way to get to the point where I could do this, assuming that "BIOS zapping" were the problem... -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 12:58:15 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 08:58:15 -0400 Subject: what do I not understand about the following fud: In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <430B1D67.40005@rogers.com> Peter wrote: > > http://www.tomshardware.com/hardnews/20050819_170647.html > > a) Why are they imprecise about describing what companies were told to > pay up. I understand that those are companies which make Linux based > products and use the Linux name in their description or title. No ? > b) Why is this not explained anywhere in the articles ? There's some info here. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lists-tZhE6lH4Esk+k03BA+Hq9g at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 12:59:55 2005 From: lists-tZhE6lH4Esk+k03BA+Hq9g at public.gmane.org (Oliver Meyn) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 08:59:55 -0400 Subject: Power Failure, Maybe? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <430B1DCB.5040109@mineallmeyn.com> Christopher Browne wrote: > > Some parts do seem to work: > - When 'switched on', the NIC lights up > - When 'switched on', an assortment of LEDs on the motherboard fire up > Not sure what 'switched on' means, so this maybe silly, but is the cable connecting the power on switch to the mobo still connected? And even if so, does shorting those pins (say with a screwdriver) accomplish anything (eg fans spinning up for even a short span)? Cheers, Oliver -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 13:05:06 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 09:05:06 -0400 Subject: The best OS to deal with Flash Cards In-Reply-To: <1e55af9905082221355cc43921-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508221913.14811.marc@lijour.net> <1e55af9905082221355cc43921@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <430B1F02.2070309@rogers.com> Sy wrote: > Filesystem.. I second ext2, although I prefer to include journalling (ext3). Doesn't the ext3 journal take up a signficant amount of space, on the smaller devices? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 13:15:58 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 09:15:58 -0400 Subject: The best OS to deal with Flash Cards In-Reply-To: <430B1F02.2070309-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200508221913.14811.marc@lijour.net> <1e55af9905082221355cc43921@mail.gmail.com> <430B1F02.2070309@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20050823131558.GA2263@node1.opengeometry.net> On Tue, Aug 23, 2005 at 09:05:06AM -0400, James Knott wrote: > Sy wrote: > > Filesystem.. I second ext2, although I prefer to include journalling (ext3). > > Doesn't the ext3 journal take up a signficant amount of space, on the > smaller devices? Yes. I think the main point of journal is for fsck'ing in case you just pull it out. Downside is that it will shorten lifetime, because all flash memory has finite write-cycle. -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From kburtch-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 13:23:17 2005 From: kburtch-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ken Burtch) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 09:23:17 -0400 Subject: BUSH 1.0.2 Released Message-ID: <1124803397.2826.6.camel@rosette.pegasoft.ca> For Linux developers who are interested: BUSH is my reliable and secure enterprise scripting and web template system that cuts training costs, reduces debugging time and promotes reusable source code. BUSH code can be ported to GCC, .Net and Java applets with minimal changes. BUSH is an all-in-one replacement for BASH, PHP, Python and Perl. The latest version supports the PostgreSQL and MySQL databases. Learn more at the BUSH home page: http://www.pegasoft.ca/bush.html -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ken O. Burtch Phone: 905-562-0848 Author "Linux Shell Scripting with Bash" Fax: 905-562-0848 http://www.pegasoft.ca Email: ken-8VyUGRzHQ8IsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org ------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 13:23:40 2005 From: nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ian Zimmerman) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 09:23:40 -0400 Subject: Not getting root's mail - Postfix In-Reply-To: <20050822130421.GA3936-bi+AKbBUZKY6gyzm1THtWbp2dZbC/Bob@public.gmane.org> References: <20050822130421.GA3936@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <17af1378050823062360c0806f@mail.gmail.com> On 8/22/05, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: > Up until recently, I would get mail destined for root, presumably > because in /etc/aliases I had lines like: > > postmaster: $me > root: $me > > Now, after a reinstall, but using the same configuration, I no longer > get root's mail. A visit to /var/log/mail.log shows me that mail for > root is getting forwarded to my defined smarthost. I'm using Postfix > version 2.2.4-1. Any have any ideas? I use Exim not Postfix but: does postmaster behave the same way? Is "me" a real configuration variable or just your way of guarding your privacy here? if the former, what is it defined to? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 13:25:40 2005 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins Witteman) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 09:25:40 -0400 Subject: xmms has stopped working after a reinstall In-Reply-To: <96aa4e8f05081919107b6a7832-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <20050819165129.GA6736@localhost.localdomain> <96aa4e8f05081919107b6a7832@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050823132540.GA3704@localhost.localdomain> On Fri, Aug 19, 2005 at 10:10:04PM -0400, Igor Denisov wrote: >>xmms just cycles through the playlist at >> an incredible speed, and makes no output. > >Does xmms play individual mp3 files fine? > >I've experienced and solved this problem with playlists (both .m3u and >.pls) in xmms >Try to open the same playlist in juk (or some other jukebox-type app) >and copy and resave the list. >Hope this works for you. Aha! I didn't think to check this, but you have found the source of my difficulties. I regenerated my playlists and all is well. The suggestion to look into my output plugin is a good one as well, but not relevant in this case. Last time I had xmms trouble though, it was output plugin issues. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 13:44:11 2005 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins Witteman) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 09:44:11 -0400 Subject: Not getting root's mail - Postfix In-Reply-To: <17af1378050823062360c0806f-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <20050822130421.GA3936@localhost.localdomain> <17af1378050823062360c0806f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050823134411.GA3917@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, Aug 23, 2005 at 09:23:40AM -0400, Ian Zimmerman wrote: >On 8/22/05, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: >> Up until recently, I would get mail destined for root, presumably >> because in /etc/aliases I had lines like: >> >> postmaster: $me >> root: $me >> >> Now, after a reinstall, but using the same configuration, I no longer >> get root's mail. A visit to /var/log/mail.log shows me that mail for >> root is getting forwarded to my defined smarthost. I'm using Postfix >> version 2.2.4-1. Any have any ideas? > >I use Exim not Postfix but: > >does postmaster behave the same way? Yes. >Is "me" a real configuration variable or just your way of guarding >your privacy here? Just a privacy measure - the file itself uses my actual login. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 13:45:56 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 09:45:56 -0400 Subject: Power Failure, Maybe? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050823134556.GA28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Sat, Aug 20, 2005 at 01:11:09PM -0400, Christopher Browne wrote: > I've got a box (Athlon / ~1700MHz) which, after the storm fun of > yesterday, won't boot. > > It was hooked to a UPS, so I'm reasonably confident it didn't get > fried, but maybe something's up with the PSU... > > Some parts do seem to work: > - When 'switched on', the NIC lights up > - When 'switched on', an assortment of LEDs on the motherboard fire up > > But pressing the switch on the front that normally tells the mobo to > tell disks to fire up and then boot doesn't do anything. > > Does this seem like 'silly PSU failure'? That's my suspicion... > What's irritating is that what I'd rather do than fix it is to migrate > files to the AMD64 box (nice Antec Sonata case), but that means having > to power it up :-(. No you just have to move the HD over and mount it to read your files. Unless you ran XFS, then oh dear. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 13:49:03 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 09:49:03 -0400 Subject: Max size of swapspace - 2GB? In-Reply-To: <430A1F2E.3010206-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <430A1F2E.3010206@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: <20050823134903.GB28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Mon, Aug 22, 2005 at 02:53:34PM -0400, Fraser Campbell wrote: > I have been creating >2GB swapspaces for quite a while. Recently I read > the manpage: > > The maximum useful size of a swap area now depends on the > architecture. It is roughly 2GiB on i386, PPC, m68k, ARM, 1GiB > on sparc, 512MiB on mips, 128GiB on alpha and 3TiB on sparc64. > > As a test I just created a 3GB swapspace (single logical volume) and > then had a few programs suck up all the RAM. I saw 3GB of real RAM used > and 3GB of swapspace used before the server ran out of memory. > > Based on my test I assume that the manpage is just out of date, or am I > missing something? My test was with 2.6.5 kernel (SuSE 9). The man pages often become out of date. I think this is such a case. I believe 2.6 kernels can handle much larger than 2GB swap space. On the other hand I can't imagine how awful the system must run when it is using even 1GB of swap. :) Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 13:52:01 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 09:52:01 -0400 Subject: The best OS to deal with Flash Cards In-Reply-To: <200508221913.14811.marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508221913.14811.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: <20050823135201.GC28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Mon, Aug 22, 2005 at 07:13:14PM -0400, Marc Lijour wrote: > what is would be the best OS + the best filesystem to deal with flash cards? > > I see a lot of linux resources on the web... Well given people use flash cards for moving files around, I agree in general with using VFAT. As for OS, well watch out for redhat/fedora and a few others that have auto mounting of usb memory devices, since they have sync enabled by default in a lot of cases, and vfat with sync enabled is very slow and causes a ton of extra updates of the FAT tables and can actually wear out a flash card very quickly if it doesn't have decent wear leveling (and even if it does, it will still reduce its life span). Not sure where the hotplug or udev or whatever scripts are that decide on the mount options for new devices, but hunt it down to be sure. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 13:52:50 2005 From: nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ian Zimmerman) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 09:52:50 -0400 Subject: BUSH 1.0.2 Released In-Reply-To: <1124803397.2826.6.camel-sLtTAFnw5m7xXJQZHMdDwiwD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <1124803397.2826.6.camel@rosette.pegasoft.ca> Message-ID: <17af13780508230652b0873d9@mail.gmail.com> On 8/23/05, Ken Burtch wrote: > For Linux developers who are interested: > > BUSH is my reliable and secure enterprise scripting and web template > system that cuts training costs, reduces debugging time and promotes > reusable source code. BUSH code can be ported to GCC, .Net and Java > applets with minimal changes. BUSH is an all-in-one replacement for > BASH, PHP, Python and Perl. But what about the name? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 13:57:53 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 09:57:53 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: <20050823100803.GB1966@localhost> References: <20050823100803.GB1966@localhost> Message-ID: <20050823135753.GD28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 23, 2005 at 06:08:03AM -0400, Scott Allen wrote: > Points below mosly for educational purposes: > > Actually, there are cable-only methods for more than two machines, > called > 10-base2 or 10-base5. They link 10M ethernet over a coaxial cable > without > hubs. I don't think I have ever seen 10base-5 myself. Few places seemed to want single segments of 10mbit ethernet running for up to 500m. 200m was plenty for most, and much cheaper to wire too given 10base-2 was much more common and the wire much cheaper. Of course it was a bit of a pain that to add machines you have to split the cable, put in a T and add it to the new machine, causing an interruption in the network. > The are small differences between using a crossover cable or a > hub/switch, which can slighty affect the way the systems behave. > 1) With a hub you will get a half-duplex connection. With a switch or > crossover it will likely be full-duplex. As already noted in another > posting in this thread, the difference is generally insignificant. > 2) The hub/switch will usually always be powered up. Therefore when > one machine is powered off or disconnected, the network connection on > the other machine will still be "alive". With a crossover, when one > machine is powered off or disconnected, the other may see a dead > ethernet link. (I say "may" because some machines will keep the > ethernet active using standby power when "off" to allow for power up > control via ethernet). This may result in more or different error > messages, logs, etc. between one or the other method. I think the ability to add and remove machines at will, nice cheap twisted pair wire, not having to run the network around through each machine, but instead having a central point to connect to just makes way more sense, and I sure don't miss 10base-2 at all. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 13:59:10 2005 From: nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ian Zimmerman) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 09:59:10 -0400 Subject: Not getting root's mail - Postfix In-Reply-To: <20050823134411.GA3917-bi+AKbBUZKY6gyzm1THtWbp2dZbC/Bob@public.gmane.org> References: <20050822130421.GA3936@localhost.localdomain> <17af1378050823062360c0806f@mail.gmail.com> <20050823134411.GA3917@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <17af137805082306596c4355e3@mail.gmail.com> On 8/23/05, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: > On Tue, Aug 23, 2005 at 09:23:40AM -0400, Ian Zimmerman wrote: > >On 8/22/05, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: > >> Up until recently, I would get mail destined for root, presumably > >> because in /etc/aliases I had lines like: > >> > >> postmaster: $me > >> root: $me > >> > >> Now, after a reinstall, but using the same configuration, I no longer > >> get root's mail. A visit to /var/log/mail.log shows me that mail for > >> root is getting forwarded to my defined smarthost. I'm using Postfix > >> version 2.2.4-1. Any have any ideas? > > > >I use Exim not Postfix but: > > > >does postmaster behave the same way? > > Yes. > > >Is "me" a real configuration variable or just your way of guarding > >your privacy here? > > Just a privacy measure - the file itself uses my actual login. Hmm. When it gets sent to the smarthost, what is the address? To me it looks like the aliases file is just ignored completely. Is it in the right place? Has a crucial symlink vanished? Did the permissions change? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 14:02:01 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 10:02:01 -0400 Subject: Max size of swapspace - 2GB? In-Reply-To: <20050823134903.GB28567-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <430A1F2E.3010206@georgetown.wehave.net> <20050823134903.GB28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <430B2C59.40802@rogers.com> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Mon, Aug 22, 2005 at 02:53:34PM -0400, Fraser Campbell wrote: >>I have been creating >2GB swapspaces for quite a while. Recently I read >>the manpage: >> >> The maximum useful size of a swap area now depends on the >> architecture. It is roughly 2GiB on i386, PPC, m68k, ARM, 1GiB >> on sparc, 512MiB on mips, 128GiB on alpha and 3TiB on sparc64. >> >>As a test I just created a 3GB swapspace (single logical volume) and >>then had a few programs suck up all the RAM. I saw 3GB of real RAM used >>and 3GB of swapspace used before the server ran out of memory. >> >>Based on my test I assume that the manpage is just out of date, or am I >>missing something? My test was with 2.6.5 kernel (SuSE 9). > > The man pages often become out of date. I think this is such a case. I > believe 2.6 kernels can handle much larger than 2GB swap space. On the > other hand I can't imagine how awful the system must run when it is > using even 1GB of swap. :) That would depend on how often you're hitting the swap. If it's simply holding a lot of recently, but not currently accessed stuff, it could have decent performance. I seem to recall reading that it's often faster to pull data from swap, than to re-load from disk. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 14:03:54 2005 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins Witteman) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 10:03:54 -0400 Subject: SCP Timeout? Message-ID: <20050823140354.GA4008@localhost.localdomain> I was transferring a large volume of data from my wife's Windoze machine to mine, via WinSCP, and I noticed that it was timing out (the host machine (mine) stopped responding) after 20 minutes. I looked through ssh_config and sshd_config, but I didn't find anything that looked like the culprit. I need to push 12 GB or so across the network, and I'd like to be able to do it in one go. Thanks. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 14:03:22 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 10:03:22 -0400 Subject: The best OS to deal with Flash Cards In-Reply-To: <20050823135201.GC28567-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <200508221913.14811.marc@lijour.net> <20050823135201.GC28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <430B2CAA.5080800@rogers.com> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Mon, Aug 22, 2005 at 07:13:14PM -0400, Marc Lijour wrote: >>what is would be the best OS + the best filesystem to deal with flash cards? >> >>I see a lot of linux resources on the web... > > Well given people use flash cards for moving files around, I agree in > general with using VFAT. Which version of FAT? My pen drive originally came with FAT16. I then reformated for FAT32. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 14:04:04 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 10:04:04 -0400 Subject: BUSH 1.0.2 Released In-Reply-To: <17af13780508230652b0873d9-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <1124803397.2826.6.camel@rosette.pegasoft.ca> <17af13780508230652b0873d9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <430B2CD4.6000809@rogers.com> Ian Zimmerman wrote: > On 8/23/05, Ken Burtch wrote: >>For Linux developers who are interested: >> >>BUSH is my reliable and secure enterprise scripting and web template >>system that cuts training costs, reduces debugging time and promotes >>reusable source code. BUSH code can be ported to GCC, .Net and Java >>applets with minimal changes. BUSH is an all-in-one replacement for >>BASH, PHP, Python and Perl. > > But what about the name? Dubya? ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 14:07:05 2005 From: nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ian Zimmerman) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 10:07:05 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: <20050823135753.GD28567-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050823100803.GB1966@localhost> <20050823135753.GD28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <17af1378050823070721d381fb@mail.gmail.com> On 8/23/05, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Tue, Aug 23, 2005 at 06:08:03AM -0400, Scott Allen wrote: > > Points below mosly for educational purposes: > > > > Actually, there are cable-only methods for more than two machines, > > called > > 10-base2 or 10-base5. They link 10M ethernet over a coaxial cable > > without > > hubs. > > I don't think I have ever seen 10base-5 myself. Few places seemed to > want single segments of 10mbit ethernet running for up to 500m. 200m > was plenty for most, and much cheaper to wire too given 10base-2 was > much more common and the wire much cheaper. > > Of course it was a bit of a pain that to add machines you have to split > the cable, put in a T and add it to the new machine, causing an > interruption in the network. > > > The are small differences between using a crossover cable or a > > hub/switch, which can slighty affect the way the systems behave. > > 1) With a hub you will get a half-duplex connection. With a switch or > > crossover it will likely be full-duplex. As already noted in another > > posting in this thread, the difference is generally insignificant. > > 2) The hub/switch will usually always be powered up. Therefore when > > one machine is powered off or disconnected, the network connection on > > the other machine will still be "alive". With a crossover, when one > > machine is powered off or disconnected, the other may see a dead > > ethernet link. (I say "may" because some machines will keep the > > ethernet active using standby power when "off" to allow for power up > > control via ethernet). This may result in more or different error > > messages, logs, etc. between one or the other method. > > I think the ability to add and remove machines at will, nice cheap > twisted pair wire, not having to run the network around through each > machine, but instead having a central point to connect to just makes way > more sense, and I sure don't miss 10base-2 at all. > And debugging a coaxial network is a nightmare. I remember crawling around the office on all 4s, disconnecting each machine in turn and unsplitting/resplitting the cable ... With 10baseT you just disconnect them at the hub. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 14:14:41 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 10:14:41 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: <20050823135753.GD28567-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050823100803.GB1966@localhost> <20050823135753.GD28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <430B2F51.3030608@rogers.com> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Tue, Aug 23, 2005 at 06:08:03AM -0400, Scott Allen wrote: >>Points below mosly for educational purposes: >> >>Actually, there are cable-only methods for more than two machines, >>called >>10-base2 or 10-base5. They link 10M ethernet over a coaxial cable >>without >>hubs. > > I don't think I have ever seen 10base-5 myself. Few places seemed to > want single segments of 10mbit ethernet running for up to 500m. 200m > was plenty for most, and much cheaper to wire too given 10base-2 was > much more common and the wire much cheaper. I have worked on one 10base5 installation. It was a DECNET connecting several VAX 11/780 computers. That was my first experience with ethernet. However, my first experience with LANs predates that by several years (1977). I used to work on a Collins 8500C system, which used TDM loops, instead of packets, to create a local area network. A device that wanted to send data reserverd a time slot and "owned" it, until released. IIRC, the high speed "TDX" loop ran at 8 Mb/s and the low speed TDM loop was 2 Mb. Devices such as the CPU, tape stands, disk drives etc., were connected to the TDX loop. Slower devices, such as the printer, card reader and a bunch of PDP-11 computers were connected via the TDM loop. The interface between the two speeds, was a box that sat on both the TDX and TDM loops. The TDM loop used coax, but the TDX loop used triaxial (two separate shields) cable. > > Of course it was a bit of a pain that to add machines you have to split > the cable, put in a T and add it to the new machine, causing an > interruption in the network. > >>The are small differences between using a crossover cable or a >>hub/switch, which can slighty affect the way the systems behave. >>1) With a hub you will get a half-duplex connection. With a switch or >>crossover it will likely be full-duplex. As already noted in another >>posting in this thread, the difference is generally insignificant. >>2) The hub/switch will usually always be powered up. Therefore when >>one machine is powered off or disconnected, the network connection on >>the other machine will still be "alive". With a crossover, when one >>machine is powered off or disconnected, the other may see a dead >>ethernet link. (I say "may" because some machines will keep the >>ethernet active using standby power when "off" to allow for power up >>control via ethernet). This may result in more or different error >>messages, logs, etc. between one or the other method. > > I think the ability to add and remove machines at will, nice cheap > twisted pair wire, not having to run the network around through each > machine, but instead having a central point to connect to just makes way > more sense, and I sure don't miss 10base-2 at all. > In the Collins network that I mentioned above, the connections were similar to token ring, in that there were relays, that connected a device to the loop. However, the relays were located under the floor, near the equipment, not at a central location. Adding or dropping a device would cause the loop synchronizer to "chirp", while it re-synced. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 14:18:30 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 10:18:30 -0400 Subject: The best OS to deal with Flash Cards In-Reply-To: <430B2CAA.5080800-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200508221913.14811.marc@lijour.net> <20050823135201.GC28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <430B2CAA.5080800@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20050823141830.GE28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 23, 2005 at 10:03:22AM -0400, James Knott wrote: > Which version of FAT? My pen drive originally came with FAT16. I then > reformated for FAT32. Doesn't really matter. They work the same in general, FAT32 just uses smaller clusters (making it more space efficient) and has room for more entries in the root dir than older versions of FAT. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 14:20:56 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 10:20:56 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: <430B2F51.3030608-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <20050823100803.GB1966@localhost> <20050823135753.GD28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <430B2F51.3030608@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20050823142056.GF28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 23, 2005 at 10:14:41AM -0400, James Knott wrote: > I have worked on one 10base5 installation. It was a DECNET connecting > several VAX 11/780 computers. That was my first experience with > ethernet. However, my first experience with LANs predates that by > several years (1977). I used to work on a Collins 8500C system, which > used TDM loops, instead of packets, to create a local area network. A > device that wanted to send data reserverd a time slot and "owned" it, > until released. IIRC, the high speed "TDX" loop ran at 8 Mb/s and the > low speed TDM loop was 2 Mb. Devices such as the CPU, tape stands, disk > drives etc., were connected to the TDX loop. Slower devices, such as > the printer, card reader and a bunch of PDP-11 computers were connected > via the TDM loop. The interface between the two speeds, was a box that > sat on both the TDX and TDM loops. The TDM loop used coax, but the TDX > loop used triaxial (two separate shields) cable. Hmm, never heard of triaxial. I have seen twinax used to connect IBM terminals. I always thought those looked weird enough (and at close to an inch thick, they looked expensive to wire). > In the Collins network that I mentioned above, the connections were > similar to token ring, in that there were relays, that connected a > device to the loop. However, the relays were located under the floor, > near the equipment, not at a central location. Adding or dropping a > device would cause the loop synchronizer to "chirp", while it re-synced. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From kburtch-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 14:43:29 2005 From: kburtch-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ken Burtch) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 10:43:29 -0400 Subject: BUSH 1.0.2 Released In-Reply-To: <17af13780508230652b0873d9-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <1124803397.2826.6.camel@rosette.pegasoft.ca> <17af13780508230652b0873d9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1124808209.7073.0.camel@rosette.pegasoft.ca> On Tue, 2005-08-23 at 09:52 -0400, Ian Zimmerman wrote: > On 8/23/05, Ken Burtch wrote: > > For Linux developers who are interested: > > > > BUSH is my reliable and secure enterprise scripting and web template > > system that cuts training costs, reduces debugging time and promotes > > reusable source code. BUSH code can be ported to GCC, .Net and Java > > applets with minimal changes. BUSH is an all-in-one replacement for > > BASH, PHP, Python and Perl. > > But what about the name? Name?? BUSH stands for BUsiness SHell. It has no relationship with violent military presidents. > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ken O. Burtch Phone: 905-562-0848 Author "Linux Shell Scripting with Bash" Fax: 905-562-0848 http://www.pegasoft.ca Email: ken-8VyUGRzHQ8IsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Caution: Comments may be less negative than they appear. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From kburtch-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 14:47:14 2005 From: kburtch-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ken Burtch) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 10:47:14 -0400 Subject: BUSH 1.0.2 Released In-Reply-To: <430B2CD4.6000809-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <1124803397.2826.6.camel@rosette.pegasoft.ca> <17af13780508230652b0873d9@mail.gmail.com> <430B2CD4.6000809@rogers.com> Message-ID: <1124808434.7073.4.camel@rosette.pegasoft.ca> On Tue, 2005-08-23 at 10:04 -0400, James Knott wrote: > Ian Zimmerman wrote: > > On 8/23/05, Ken Burtch wrote: > >>For Linux developers who are interested: > >> > >>BUSH is my reliable and secure enterprise scripting and web template > >>system that cuts training costs, reduces debugging time and promotes > >>reusable source code. BUSH code can be ported to GCC, .Net and Java > >>applets with minimal changes. BUSH is an all-in-one replacement for > >>BASH, PHP, Python and Perl. > > > > But what about the name? > > Dubya? ;-) Oooh, I like that. My next open source project will be michaelmoorewasrightthewrongguywontheelection. Any relationship to American politics is purely coincidental. :) KB > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ken O. Burtch Phone: 905-562-0848 Author "Linux Shell Scripting with Bash" Fax: 905-562-0848 http://www.pegasoft.ca Email: ken-8VyUGRzHQ8IsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Caution: Comments may be less negative than they appear. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 13:23:16 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 09:23:16 -0400 Subject: Power Failure, Maybe? In-Reply-To: References: <430A7B51.1090703@rogers.com> <002f01c5a783$9868b340$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: <20050823132316.GA2281@node1.opengeometry.net> On Tue, Aug 23, 2005 at 07:26:35AM -0400, Christopher Browne wrote: > On 8/22/05, Francois Ouellette wrote: > > Maybe the BIOS has been zapped? Try re-flashing it from a boot > > diskette with the appropriate utility and BIOS binary image. > > The disks don't power up, so there's no way to get to the point where > I could do this, assuming that "BIOS zapping" were the problem... Then, 1. Disconnect all disks. Boot with only motherboard connected. 2. If you have multimeter, check +5, -5, +12, -12 V output of power supply. (But, it's difficult to tell simply by DC reading.) 3. Swap the power supply. If still won't boot, then it's your motherboard. -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From agtnews-PeCUgM4zDv73fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 14:55:44 2005 From: agtnews-PeCUgM4zDv73fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Allen Taylor) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 10:55:44 -0400 Subject: [OT] Linksys routers, DHCP, and DNS In-Reply-To: <17af137805082206503b9efff8-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805082206503b9efff8@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050823145544.GB15929@thecat.localnet> On Mon, Aug 22, 2005 at 09:50:06AM -0400, Ian Zimmerman wrote: > I got the Rogers cable connection yesterday and it works fine, even > living up to the > advertised speed (well, on Sunday night...) While reconfiguring my > boxes I noticed > one oddity. The Linksys router I brought from my past life now seems to run a > proxy DNS server and advertises itself (192.168.1.1) as such in DHCP replies. > It works just fine if I list it as the only nameserver entry in > resolv.conf. The thing is > I can swear it didn't do this before - with the Comcast cable > connection I had in > California it just passed on the IP#s of Comcast's nameservers. Anyone with an > idea what could cause this different behaviour? Basically, you can use any name server you want. When I was with Rogers, I used their name servers directly on each box. When I switched to Primus DSL, I decided not to have to change all boxes every time I changed providers, so I set my router up like your Linksys, proxying the DNS service for all internal machines. So you're OK either way. Allen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jvetterli-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 14:58:25 2005 From: jvetterli-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org (John Vetterli) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 10:58:25 -0400 (EDT) Subject: what do I not understand about the following fud: In-Reply-To: <430B1D67.40005-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <430B1D67.40005@rogers.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 23 Aug 2005, James Knott wrote: > There's some info here. > I wonder if we can expect this to happen to images of Tux as well. JV -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr.mcgregor-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 14:59:01 2005 From: mr.mcgregor-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (John McGregor) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 10:59:01 -0400 Subject: Firefox and Thunderbird Message-ID: <1124809141.10164.1.camel@localhost> I had the same problem on my Mandriva system.I had to tell Gnome what applications to use. Click Start --> System --> Configuration --> Gnome --> Gnome Control Center --> Advanced --> Preferred Applications --> mail Readers and then enter your choice. HTH John -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 15:02:49 2005 From: nobrowser-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ian Zimmerman) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 11:02:49 -0400 Subject: [OT] Linksys routers, DHCP, and DNS In-Reply-To: <20050823145544.GB15929-70WplSiaoiAG/9ncUZ6upg@public.gmane.org> References: <17af137805082206503b9efff8@mail.gmail.com> <20050823145544.GB15929@thecat.localnet> Message-ID: <17af137805082308027fde8c40@mail.gmail.com> On 8/23/05, Allen Taylor wrote: > On Mon, Aug 22, 2005 at 09:50:06AM -0400, Ian Zimmerman wrote: > > I got the Rogers cable connection yesterday and it works fine, even > > living up to the > > advertised speed (well, on Sunday night...) While reconfiguring my > > boxes I noticed > > one oddity. The Linksys router I brought from my past life now seems to run a > > proxy DNS server and advertises itself (192.168.1.1) as such in DHCP replies. > > It works just fine if I list it as the only nameserver entry in > > resolv.conf. The thing is > > I can swear it didn't do this before - with the Comcast cable > > connection I had in > > California it just passed on the IP#s of Comcast's nameservers. Anyone with an > > idea what could cause this different behaviour? > > Basically, you can use any name server you want. When I was with Rogers, > I used their name servers directly on each box. When I switched to > Primus DSL, I decided not to have to change all boxes every time I > changed providers, so I set my router up like your Linksys, proxying the > DNS service for all internal machines. > > So you're OK either way. I know. It's just the mystery, why the router acts differently. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 16:17:55 2005 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 12:17:55 -0400 Subject: Power Failure, Maybe? In-Reply-To: <20050823134556.GA28567-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050823134556.GA28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: On 8/23/05, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Sat, Aug 20, 2005 at 01:11:09PM -0400, Christopher Browne wrote: > > I've got a box (Athlon / ~1700MHz) which, after the storm fun of > > yesterday, won't boot. > > > > It was hooked to a UPS, so I'm reasonably confident it didn't get > > fried, but maybe something's up with the PSU... > > > > Some parts do seem to work: > > - When 'switched on', the NIC lights up > > - When 'switched on', an assortment of LEDs on the motherboard fire up > > > > But pressing the switch on the front that normally tells the mobo to > > tell disks to fire up and then boot doesn't do anything. > > > > Does this seem like 'silly PSU failure'? That's my suspicion... > > What's irritating is that what I'd rather do than fix it is to migrate > > files to the AMD64 box (nice Antec Sonata case), but that means having > > to power it up :-(. > > No you just have to move the HD over and mount it to read your files. > Unless you ran XFS, then oh dear. Oh dear :-(. Most of the important data was indeed on XFS :-(. The disk drive headed in to work where there are plenty o IA-32 boxes, and I had no difficulty building suitable tarballs of the XFS filesystems and dropping them onto an ext2 FS mountable on knuth the 64 bit box. I'm getting some odd segfaults here and there on some of the 64 bit bins, but mail is now working, at least :-). -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 17:08:27 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 13:08:27 -0400 Subject: Power Failure, Maybe? In-Reply-To: References: <20050823134556.GA28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20050823170827.GG28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 23, 2005 at 12:17:55PM -0400, Christopher Browne wrote: > Oh dear :-(. Most of the important data was indeed on XFS :-(. You can mount XFS on amd64 from ia32 IFF it was cleanly unmounted on an IA32 first. The journal data is not compatible, so a non clean unmount can not be mounted on another architecture. Very dumb "bug/feature" of XFS. > The disk drive headed in to work where there are plenty o IA-32 boxes, > and I had no difficulty building suitable tarballs of the XFS > filesystems and dropping them onto an ext2 FS mountable on knuth the > 64 bit box. > > I'm getting some odd segfaults here and there on some of the 64 bit > bins, but mail is now working, at least :-). Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 17:13:59 2005 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 13:13:59 -0400 Subject: Max size of swapspace - 2GB? In-Reply-To: <20050823134903.GB28567-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <430A1F2E.3010206@georgetown.wehave.net> <20050823134903.GB28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <430B5957.1080505@georgetown.wehave.net> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > The man pages often become out of date. I think this is such a case. I > believe 2.6 kernels can handle much larger than 2GB swap space. On the > other hand I can't imagine how awful the system must run when it is > using even 1GB of swap. :) It's surprising how well a machine with 7GB of RAM used and 4GB of occupied swap can function. Of course if your tomcat instance has been dormant for a long time the first hit might be a little slow ;-) Fraser -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fcsoft-3Emkkp+1Olsmp8TqCH86vg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 19:01:26 2005 From: fcsoft-3Emkkp+1Olsmp8TqCH86vg at public.gmane.org (bob) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 15:01:26 -0400 Subject: neat online appliance demo Message-ID: <20050823190020.B357BEB309@outbox.allstream.net> I am preparing to update my iCanProgram course lesson on network appliances soon (the old version is at http://www.icanprogram.com/34ux/lesson12/lesson12.html). I thought that I would share this neat piece of demo code I've been working on with you. I'm too close into this stuff to spot rough edges and bugs easily. Hopefully a couple more eyes can help nail those. NOTE: The iCanProgram courses have been offered without fees since early 2002 and several thousand students have taken them since then. All I ask of the students is that they make a contribution to their local Cancer research charity. (http://www.icanprogram.com/nofeecourses.html) The network appliance the students interface with is the box connected to the "Try Me" tab at the IO Anywhere website (http://www.io-anywhere.ca). The folks at IO Anywhere have generously allowed my students to write code which bangs at this box over the Internet. The newest variation of IOA appliance to be connected to the "Try Me" tab is what they are calling the micro IOA. The engineers have connected this box up to an X.10 lamp module which in turn controls a small 7W night light. A temperature sensor is also connected into this appliance and the working end of the sensor is placed in close enough proximity to the light that it warms up when the lamp is on. The Tcl/Tk program below is a prototype of what the students will be working with and it does the following sequence: i) reads the temperature sensor and sets the temperature trip point 3 C above the ambient reading ii) configures the event message which will be issued as the temperature crosses that trip point iii) presents a Tk window with a button which allows the user to activate the X.10 lamp module ie. turn on the light iv) accept the message from the appliance when the temperature rises above the trip point At the moment the code doesn't turn off the lamp automatically but with a single line addition it could do this. If you want to run this demo you'll need to be sure that the following packages are installed and configured on your Linux box: a) Tcl/Tk b) SIMPL (https://sourceforge.net/projects/simpl) (someone was working on a Debian package for this code but I haven't heard if it was completed as yet) c) IOA library (https://sourceforge.net/projects/ioanywhere) You'll need to temporarily open ports 8001 and 8002 through the firewall while running this code to allow the SIMPL messages to be exchanged. If you examine the script files: $IOANYWHERE_HOME/testing/testb011/scripts/runtest $IOANYWHERE_HOME/testing/testb011/scripts/auxtest you'll see how to run the couple of other SIMPL processes you'll need to enable this network transparent messaging. All suggestions for improvement are welcome. bob =============== start of Tcl/Tk demo snip =============== #!/usr/bin/wish #================================================= # demo script for temperature reading # version 2 #================================================= set IOA_SIMPL_name "65.48.172.249:IOA_temperature" set myeventstr "this is from bob" set this "kwlug" set TRACE_MASK(MISC) 0x10 set logMask 0xff set myparam(temp.value) 0x0 set myparam(temp.label) .label set myparam(X10.value) 0x0 set myparam(X10.button) .ioa set myparam(X10.ioaLabel) heater lappend auto_path $env(SIMPL_HOME)/lib lappend auto_path $env(IOANYWHERE_HOME)/library/lib package require Fctclx package require ioalib #======================================== # toggle the output #======================================== proc toggleX10 { } { global myparam if { $myparam(X10.value) & 0x1000000 } { X10_IOA $myparam(X10.ioaLabel) 0 0 0 set retval 0 } else { X10_IOA $myparam(X10.ioaLabel) 0 0 1 set retval 0x1000000 } set myparam(X10.value) $retval if { $retval & 0x1000000 } { $myparam(X10.button) config -text "turn lamp OFF" -bg green -activebackground green } else { $myparam(X10.button) config -text "turn lamp ON" -bg red -activebackground red } } ;#end toggleX10 #======================================== # read the temperature #======================================== proc readTemp { } { global myparam read_tc_IOA 1 2 retVal binary scan $retVal s1 mytemp $myparam(temp.label) config -text [format "%d C" $mytemp ] return $mytemp } ;#end readTemp #============================================= # doReceive - entry point #============================================= proc doReceive {} { global this global loggerID global TRACE_MASK global logMask set fn doReceive set buf [Receive] binary scan $buf i1i1 fromWhom nbytes logit $loggerID $this $fn $TRACE_MASK(MISC) $logMask [format "received %d bytes from %d" $nbytes $fromWhom] binary scan $buf x8a$nbytes msg hndlMsg $fromWhom $msg };# end doReceive #============================================= # hndlMsg - entry point #============================================= proc hndlMsg {fromWhom msg} { set fn hndlMsg global TEXT_MSG global this global loggerID global TRACE_MASK global logMask binary scan $msg s1 token logit $loggerID $this $fn $TRACE_MASK(MISC) $logMask \ [format "token=0x%X fromWhom=%d" $token $fromWhom] Reply $fromWhom NULL 0 #======================================== # TEXT_MSG #======================================== if { $token == $TEXT_MSG } { binary scan $msg x16a* smsg # # display the text from that TEXT message # .msgtext config -text $smsg logit $loggerID $this $fn $TRACE_MASK(MISC) $logMask \ [format "msg=%s" $smsg] readTemp } else { logit $loggerID $this $fn $TRACE_MASK(MISC) $logMask \ [format "token=0x%X unsupported" $token] };#end TEXT_MSG };#end hndlMsg #============================================ # main #============================================ set fn main wm geometry . 400x200+200+0 wm title . "Temperature Demo" wm resizable . 0 0 label $myparam(temp.label) -text "0 C" place $myparam(temp.label) -x 40 -y 20 button $myparam(X10.button) -text "turn lamp ON" -command [list toggleX10] place $myparam(X10.button) -x 40 -y 40 label .msgtext -justify left -text "" place .msgtext -x 40 -y 80 button .quit -text Quit -command {set x 1} place .quit -x 350 -y 175 set myslot [name_attach KWLUG] set myFifo [ format "%s/%s" $env(FIFO_PATH) $myslot] set recvid [ open $myFifo {RDWR}] set loggerID [name_locate LOGGER] init_IOA $IOA_SIMPL_name set mytemp [readTemp] # # configure the temperature limit on microIOA # to be 3 C above the ambient just measured # set templimit [expr $mytemp + 3] logit $loggerID $this $fn $TRACE_MASK(MISC) $logMask \ [format "current temp=%d C limit=%d C" $mytemp $templimit] # # configure the event message and lower temp limit here # configure_IOA [format "msg_3=%s;event_limit_3L=%d" $myeventstr $templimit] fileevent $recvid readable doReceive vwait x close $recvid name_detach exit -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pwa.linux-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 19:49:23 2005 From: pwa.linux-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (PW Armstrong) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 15:49:23 -0400 Subject: Open-source 'mailto' scripts for use with forms In-Reply-To: References: <43060D40.30202@gmail.com> Message-ID: <430B7DC3.5080603@gmail.com> Matt - that's great, thx. -peter G. Matthew Rice wrote: -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Open-source 'mailto' scripts for use with forms Date: 19 Aug 2005 13:24:55 -0400 From: G. Matthew Rice To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org >PW Armstrong writes: > > >>Can anyone recommend a good open-source 'mailto' script for use with forms, >>preferably one that allows a link/response/confirmation to a 'form-submitted' >>web page once the submit button is clicked? >> >> > >Take a look at formmail.pl at: > > http://sourceforge.net/projects/nms-cgi > >I think that this is what you mean. > >HTH, > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kcozens-qazKcTl6WRFWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 23:37:40 2005 From: kcozens-qazKcTl6WRFWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (Kevin Cozens) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 19:37:40 -0400 Subject: Power Failure, Maybe? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <430BB344.1090801@interlog.com> Christopher Browne wrote: >>Have you tried unplugging the power from the PSU and letting the whole >>thing sit for a bit? then turn it on? > > Yup, for the better part of a day. If my computer was on when a power failure occurs I also find that after the power is restored that nothing happens when I push the power switch. What I find I need to do is to turn the switch on the back of the power supply to off, wait a moment or two for good measure, then turn it on again. After I do that, the power switch on the front works once again allowing me to turn on the computer in the usual way. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 23 23:37:02 2005 From: pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 19:37:02 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? Message-ID: <430B7ADE.18954.25ABA8AB@localhost> Check out the computer shown on some graphics I found at: http://alimantarus.net/ComputerGiqueChic (my web site) I was wondering if anyone knew if this computer was for real (namely the keyboard and monitor) and who makes it? The keyboard and monitor are see-through glass. If such a thing exists, is the monitor actually in color? Is the monitor any good (fast)? Curious. I just saw some pictures of these and wondered about it. I understand that they can make see-through LCD clocks nowadays, but you don't expect or need fast components in household clocks. I cropped out the model (a too-serious looking businessman who didn't look as if he was actually using the computer). Paul King Attachments: I:\Multimedia-Created\funky-computer.jpg ------- End of forwarded message ------- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 00:04:06 2005 From: pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 20:04:06 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) Message-ID: <430B8136.6393.25C470AD@localhost> The URL below has been corrected. Sorry about the confusion. Check out the computer shown on some graphics I found at: http://alimentarus.net/ComputerGiqueChic (my web site) I was wondering if anyone knew if this computer was for real (namely the keyboard and monitor) and who makes it? The keyboard and monitor are see-through glass. If such a thing exists, is the monitor actually in color? Is the monitor any good (fast)? Curious. I just saw some pictures of these and wondered about it. I understand that they can make see-through LCD clocks nowadays, but you don't expect or need fast components in household clocks. Paul King -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 01:00:41 2005 From: pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 21:00:41 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <430B8136.6393.25C470AD@localhost> References: <430B8136.6393.25C470AD@localhost> Message-ID: <430B8E79.21263.25F84079@localhost> BTW, please ignore the bimboes posing in front of them. > > Check out the computer shown on some graphics I found at: > http://alimentarus.net/ComputerGiqueChic (my web site) > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 01:33:21 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 20:33:21 -0500 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <430B8E79.21263.25F84079@localhost> References: <430B8136.6393.25C470AD@localhost> <430B8E79.21263.25F84079@localhost> Message-ID: <1e55af9905082318338f15f51@mail.gmail.com> On 8/23/05, pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org wrote: > > Check out the computer shown on some graphics I found at: > > http://alimentarus.net/ComputerGiqueChic (my web site) They're obviously stylized.. not intended to show off any kind of technology. Looking carefully you can see a cable from the "screen", but I'm not sure there's anything from the keyboard. I suppose the computer could be in the hollowed-out legs of that desk, which does look custom. I think the screen cable passes through a hole in the tabletop. Do you have any background on these pics? They just look like bad fashion pics to me.. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 02:01:39 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 22:01:39 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: <20050823100803.GB1966@localhost> References: <20050823100803.GB1966@localhost> Message-ID: On Tue, 23 Aug 2005, Scott Allen wrote: > > ...a crossover cable works only for exactly two machines -- > > there is no cable-only method for larger numbers... > > Actually, there are cable-only methods for more than two machines, > called 10-base2 or 10-base5. They link 10M ethernet over a coaxial cable > without hubs. Trouble is, there's no cable-only solution that will hook a modern machine to a 10Base2 or 10Base5 network at all. They require that the machines have either 10Base2 or AUI interfaces (and for AUI, transceivers are also needed, which hardly qualifies as "cable-only"). Nobody builds those into machines any more, and interface cards which have them are scarce and costly (and, again, don't really qualify as "cable-only"). The signalling conventions of 10Base5/10Base2 are not compatible with those of 10BaseT; you can't plug a 10BaseT-only machine into 10Base5 or 10Base2 without electronics in between. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 02:53:37 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 22:53:37 -0400 (EDT) Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <430B8E79.21263.25F84079@localhost> References: <430B8E79.21263.25F84079@localhost> Message-ID: <20050824025337.21886.qmail@web88208.mail.re2.yahoo.com> I was trying to locate stills from the short lived (so-so) TV show "Century City", as the computer shown on the web site below look similar to (the same as?!?!) to the computers on "Century City". I was not able to turn up any pictures of the computers in "Century City", so I am not sure if that is where the images below came from. Anyway "Century City" was set in the year 2030, and the computers were NOT real (very plausable that we would have computers looking like before the year 2030, but not today). Colin McGregor --- pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org wrote: > BTW, please ignore the bimboes posing in front of > them. > > > > > Check out the computer shown on some graphics I > found at: > > http://alimentarus.net/ComputerGiqueChic (my > web site) > > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: > http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text > below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: > http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 03:34:52 2005 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 23:34:52 -0400 Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: <20050823100517.GA1966@localhost> References: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel@cbits.ca> <1e55af990508181426268912f@mail.gmail.com> <20050819104933.GC12387@waltdnes.org> <20050823100517.GA1966@localhost> Message-ID: <20050824033452.GA16120@waltdnes.org> On Tue, Aug 23, 2005 at 06:05:17AM -0400, Scott Allen wrote > You have to watch Gentoo. Being a source based system that makes it > easy to choose the optimisation flags, a "best-tweaked" system can > also become unstable. That's *NOT* my definition of "best tweaked". > It might win in the benchmark tests but break certain common app's. > (Of course you can modify the optimisation on a per app' basis if you > want to get your hands just a little dirty). > > To be a useful test though, I would think that you would want to compare > stock-Slackware with "best-tweaked but still likely to be stable"... I call *THAT* "best tweaked". > Gentoo without individual app' tuning. What about... - /etc/portage/package.keywords (allows to bring packages from outside the stable branch). Even Debian allows, and sometimes requires, it. - /etc/portage/package.mask (lists stuff that is not allowed to pollute my system). I've got "sys-libs/pam" in there. - /etc/portage/package.use There are *VERY* few packages that need to be built with the "static" flag. However, if busybox is going to be a "rescue package" when libraries get accidentally deleted, it damn well better be compiled static, so it can run standalone. - Some apps also have app-specific flags, listed in /usr/portage/profiles/use.local.desc, which can be implemented by including them in /etc/portage/package.use. E.g. mplayer has a "realplayer" flag that affects what happens when it runs across a RealPlayer URL (which it can't handle). Rather than exiting with an error flag, it fires up Real Player to handle the URL. I'm working on putting together YAF (Yet Another FAQ) for Gentoo newbies. It's almost as much of a HOW_NOT_TO as it is a HOW_TO. It will mention stuff like... - *NOT* unrolling every last single loop or implementing every last single exotic generic compiler "optimization" - *NOT* exceeding -O2 - *NOT* exceeding "MAKEOPTS=-j1" - *NOT* using fbsplash until you have Gentoo up and running first. For that matter, avoid framebuffer altogether if you can. This may not be an option on non-X86 architectures. - *NOT* using PAM unless you are already familiar with it. Gentoo has a steep learning curve. PAM has a steep learning curve. Learning *BOTH OF THEM AT THE SAME TIME* is more like climbing up the side of a cliff. -- Walter Dnes My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 04:17:47 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 00:17:47 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <20050824025337.21886.qmail-JoSsSUNfUciB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20050824025337.21886.qmail@web88208.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Colin McGregor wrote: > I was trying to locate stills from the short lived > (so-so) TV show "Century City", as the computer shown > on the web site below look similar to (the same > as?!?!) to the computers on "Century City". I was not > able to turn up any pictures of the computers in > "Century City", so I am not sure if that is where the > images below came from. Anyway "Century City" was set > in the year 2030, and the computers were NOT real > (very plausable that we would have computers looking > like before the year 2030, but not today). > > Colin McGregor Part of me hopes that a transparent LCD screen won't ever have the vibrance and saturation of colours that is the norm on mid range and up CRTs. The age old function vs. form dilemma I suppose. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 07:44:08 2005 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 10:44:08 +0300 (IDT) Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 23 Aug 2005, Henry Spencer wrote: > On Tue, 23 Aug 2005, Scott Allen wrote: >>> ...a crossover cable works only for exactly two machines -- >>> there is no cable-only method for larger numbers... >> >> Actually, there are cable-only methods for more than two machines, >> called 10-base2 or 10-base5. They link 10M ethernet over a coaxial cable >> without hubs. > > Trouble is, there's no cable-only solution that will hook a modern machine > to a 10Base2 or 10Base5 network at all. They require that the machines > have either 10Base2 or AUI interfaces (and for AUI, transceivers are also > needed, which hardly qualifies as "cable-only"). Nobody builds those into > machines any more, and interface cards which have them are scarce and > costly (and, again, don't really qualify as "cable-only"). > > The signalling conventions of 10Base5/10Base2 are not compatible with > those of 10BaseT; you can't plug a 10BaseT-only machine into 10Base5 > or 10Base2 without electronics in between. My older hub has one 10Base2 and 5 (?) 10BaseT sockets. While not cable-only this 10MBps hub will likely cost less than a cable crimper (2nd hand) ;-) I also have a few NICs with 10Base2 BNCs. At least one is PCI. They are the cheap no-name kind with RTL8109/8139 chips. I think it cost $12. Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 11:09:56 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 07:09:56 -0400 (EDT) Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050824110956.40438.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- Jamon Camisso wrote: > Colin McGregor wrote: > > I was trying to locate stills from the short lived > > (so-so) TV show "Century City", as the computer > shown > > on the web site below look similar to (the same > > as?!?!) to the computers on "Century City". I was > not > > able to turn up any pictures of the computers in > > "Century City", so I am not sure if that is where > the > > images below came from. Anyway "Century City" was > set > > in the year 2030, and the computers were NOT real > > (very plausable that we would have computers > looking > > like before the year 2030, but not today). > > > > Colin McGregor > > Part of me hopes that a transparent LCD screen won't > ever have the > vibrance and saturation of colours that is the norm > on mid range and up > CRTs. The age old function vs. form dilemma I > suppose. I have a 21" CRT monitor on my desk, and yes I love the size, sharpness, etc. of the screen. On the other hand I would also be VERY happy to have a LOT less of my desktop chewed up with that hulking monster. So, give me a cheap large transparent LCD screen that matches the vibrance and saturation of a CRT and I'll be very interested. As for the keyboard in the picture, it is a flat slab, and yes there are flat slab keyboards sort of like that today, in industrial settings (where they have to worry about chemicals being spilled on the keyboard, and want something that can be just wiped clean). But normally people WANT the touch of a keyboard that moves when they hit a key, and unless there is some pressing reason to do otherwise (i.e. some industrial settings) that is the way people go. In my case I hate the look, but love the feel of the "natural" keyboards and would want a comfortable keyboard in the future. Pleasantly ironic, the keyboard and mouse on my main home Linux box were built by Microsoft, a company that does @#$% software, but comfortable (and ugly) keyboards/mice. Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From scotta-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 11:07:27 2005 From: scotta-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Scott Allen) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 07:07:27 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: ; from plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg@public.gmane.org on Wed, Aug 24, 2005 at 03:44:08 -0400 References: Message-ID: <20050824110727.GA9443@localhost> On Wed Aug 24,2005 03:44:08 AM Peter wrote: > On Tue, 23 Aug 2005, Henry Spencer wrote: >> Trouble is, there's no cable-only solution that will hook a modern >> machine to a 10Base2 or 10Base5 network at all. [...] This is what I was trying to imply when I said "mosly for educational purposes". I guess I should have also stated "mostly impractical". > My older hub has one 10Base2 and 5 (?) 10BaseT sockets. While not > cable-only this 10MBps hub will likely cost less than a cable > crimper (2nd hand) ;-) I also have a few NICs with 10Base2 BNCs. At > least one is PCI. They are the cheap no-name kind with RTL8109/8139 > chips. I think it cost $12. Unless you already have everything you need, I would think that setting up a 10BaseT network instead of 10Base2 would end up to costing about the same or be cheaper. The cost of a (used/obsolete) 10M only hub would be the same or less without the 10base2 or AUI connector. New 100M PCI ethernet cards, that will also do 10M, can be had for around $8 from places like Factory Direct. The UTP cable would be cheaper than the coax cable and terminators required for 10Base2. -- ** Scott Allen scotta-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org ** ** Toronto, Ontario, Canada ** -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 12:06:42 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 08:06:42 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? In-Reply-To: <430B7ADE.18954.25ABA8AB@localhost> References: <430B7ADE.18954.25ABA8AB@localhost> Message-ID: <430C62D2.6030101@rogers.com> pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org wrote: > Check out the computer shown on some graphics I found at: > http://alimantarus.net/ComputerGiqueChic (my web site) > > I was wondering if anyone knew if this computer was for real (namely > the keyboard and monitor) and who makes it? The keyboard and monitor > are see-through glass. If such a thing exists, is the monitor > actually in color? Is the monitor any good (fast)? > > Curious. I just saw some pictures of these and wondered about it. I > understand that they can make see-through LCD clocks nowadays, but > you don't expect or need fast components in household clocks. > > I cropped out the model (a too-serious looking businessman who didn't > look as if he was actually using the computer). I couldn't see that stuff, because I couldn't get to that web site. However, one thing to consider about those computers etc., in clear plastic or glass cases is that they might not be legal, due to lack of shielding. A computer requires a shield around it, to prevent interference to radio etc. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 12:09:23 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 08:09:23 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <430B8136.6393.25C470AD@localhost> References: <430B8136.6393.25C470AD@localhost> Message-ID: <430C6373.9000502@rogers.com> pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org wrote: > The URL below has been corrected. Sorry about the confusion. > > Check out the computer shown on some graphics I found at: > http://alimentarus.net/ComputerGiqueChic (my web site) > > I was wondering if anyone knew if this computer was for real (namely > the keyboard and monitor) and who makes it? The keyboard and monitor > are see-through glass. If such a thing exists, is the monitor > actually in color? Is the monitor any good (fast)? > > Curious. I just saw some pictures of these and wondered about it. I > understand that they can make see-through LCD clocks nowadays, but > you don't expect or need fast components in household clocks. Now that I've seen the pictures, I'd suspect they're non-functional. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 12:17:09 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 08:17:09 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) References: <430B8136.6393.25C470AD@localhost> <430C6373.9000502@rogers.com> Message-ID: <000801c5a8a5$d1f287d0$6501a8c0@ibm5b4y3a0pgrq> ----- Original Message ----- From: "James Knott" To: Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 8:09 AM Subject: Re: [TLUG]: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) > pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org wrote: > > The URL below has been corrected. Sorry about the confusion. > > > > Check out the computer shown on some graphics I found at: > > http://alimentarus.net/ComputerGiqueChic (my web site) > > > > I was wondering if anyone knew if this computer was for real (namely > > the keyboard and monitor) and who makes it? The keyboard and monitor > > are see-through glass. If such a thing exists, is the monitor > > actually in color? Is the monitor any good (fast)? > > > > Curious. I just saw some pictures of these and wondered about it. I > > understand that they can make see-through LCD clocks nowadays, but > > you don't expect or need fast components in household clocks. > > Now that I've seen the pictures, I'd suspect they're non-functional. > -- Just look at the web site name ! "Computer Geek" spelled to sound French... Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 12:35:27 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 08:35:27 -0400 (EDT) Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? In-Reply-To: <430C62D2.6030101-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <430C62D2.6030101@rogers.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 24 Aug 2005, James Knott wrote: > However, one thing to consider about those computers etc., in clear > plastic or glass cases is that they might not be legal, due to lack of > shielding. A computer requires a shield around it, to prevent > interference to radio etc. Transparent shielding is possible, although not entirely easy. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 12:48:10 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 08:48:10 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Wed, 24 Aug 2005, Peter wrote: > My older hub has one 10Base2 and 5 (?) 10BaseT sockets. While not > cable-only this 10MBps hub will likely cost less than a cable crimper > (2nd hand) ;-) Admittedly, I should have qualified my comment about price with "unless you frequent the surplus stores". :-) I've likewise got a hub which also speaks 10Base2, and a couple of cards which do. Never used that capability, though. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 13:33:27 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 09:33:27 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <430B8136.6393.25C470AD@localhost> References: <430B8136.6393.25C470AD@localhost> Message-ID: <20050824133327.GH28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 23, 2005 at 08:04:06PM -0400, pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org wrote: > The URL below has been corrected. Sorry about the confusion. > > Check out the computer shown on some graphics I found at: > http://alimentarus.net/ComputerGiqueChic (my web site) > > I was wondering if anyone knew if this computer was for real (namely > the keyboard and monitor) and who makes it? The keyboard and monitor > are see-through glass. If such a thing exists, is the monitor > actually in color? Is the monitor any good (fast)? > > Curious. I just saw some pictures of these and wondered about it. I > understand that they can make see-through LCD clocks nowadays, but > you don't expect or need fast components in household clocks. My guess is that no it isn't for real. Looks like something hollywood would dream up though. The keyboard certainly appears to have no feed back at all, and no current LCD technology I have heard off can make a screen that think yet (and they all require backlights to be useful at the moment, which whatever that one is, doesn't have). Looks neat though. Maybe someday we can have something like that. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 13:35:37 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 09:35:37 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <20050824110956.40438.qmail-fjYszm/wOJWB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20050824110956.40438.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20050824133537.GI28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 24, 2005 at 07:09:56AM -0400, Colin McGregor wrote: > I have a 21" CRT monitor on my desk, and yes I love > the size, sharpness, etc. of the screen. On the other > hand I would also be VERY happy to have a LOT less of > my desktop chewed up with that hulking monster. So, > give me a cheap large transparent LCD screen that > matches the vibrance and saturation of a CRT and I'll > be very interested. Heck I would settle for a cheap large LCD that is not transparent if it can match a CRT. I won't even mind if it is 2 or 3" thick either. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 13:38:25 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 09:38:25 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050824133825.GJ28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 24, 2005 at 10:44:08AM +0300, Peter wrote: > My older hub has one 10Base2 and 5 (?) 10BaseT sockets. While not > cable-only this 10MBps hub will likely cost less than a cable crimper > (2nd hand) ;-) I also have a few NICs with 10Base2 BNCs. At least one is > PCI. They are the cheap no-name kind with RTL8109/8139 chips. I think it > cost $12. Of course if you don't have any 10base2 cable around, and Ts and terminators, then it would be cheaper to go find a 10baseT card to replace in the machine in question. Of course if it is old and has the network port built in and has no AUI and only a BNC connector, well then you just have to deal with it and the hub is handy. Fortunately my old machines use AUI and I have 10baseT transceivers for them (well at least for a few of them). Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 13:45:28 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 09:45:28 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <20050824110956.40438.qmail-fjYszm/wOJWB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20050824110956.40438.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <430C79F8.9060200@rogers.com> Colin McGregor wrote: > Pleasantly ironic, the keyboard and mouse on my main > home Linux box were built by Microsoft, a company that > does @#$% software, but comfortable (and ugly) > keyboards/mice. Their CP/M cards were also decent. Perhaps MS should have been a hardware company. ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 13:49:52 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 09:49:52 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <430C7B00.3090608@rogers.com> Henry Spencer wrote: > On Wed, 24 Aug 2005, James Knott wrote: >>However, one thing to consider about those computers etc., in clear >>plastic or glass cases is that they might not be legal, due to lack of >>shielding. A computer requires a shield around it, to prevent >>interference to radio etc. > > Transparent shielding is possible, although not entirely easy. I think you'll find it's not quite transparent, if you look close enough. There will be some shielding material, either as a fine screen or very thin layer. Those clear acrylic cases, that some people like, are not shielded. While it's not illegal to make, import or sell those cases, a computer built with one would be illegal. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 13:52:40 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 09:52:40 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <430C79F8.9060200-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <20050824110956.40438.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <430C79F8.9060200@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20050824135240.GK28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 24, 2005 at 09:45:28AM -0400, James Knott wrote: > Their CP/M cards were also decent. Perhaps MS should have been a > hardware company. ;-) What is a CP/M card? Personally I only think the first Microsoft keyboard was decent. The rest had the key layout all screwed up (and the current don't even have function keys by default). Never did like their mice, I am a logitech mouse fan. It is amazingly hard to find a decent keyboard. They all have screwed up key layouts it seems. Microsoft does something stupid, everyone else goes to copy it. Aaarrrhh!!! Anyone know a store that sells Keytronic KT800PS2US-C or similar model? Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 13:52:22 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 09:52:22 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <430C7B96.40404@rogers.com> Henry Spencer wrote: > On Wed, 24 Aug 2005, Peter wrote: >>My older hub has one 10Base2 and 5 (?) 10BaseT sockets. While not >>cable-only this 10MBps hub will likely cost less than a cable crimper >>(2nd hand) ;-) > > Admittedly, I should have qualified my comment about price with "unless > you frequent the surplus stores". :-) > > I've likewise got a hub which also speaks 10Base2, and a couple of cards > which do. Never used that capability, though. One thing 10 Mb hubs are still useful for, is testing. You can insert a computer running ethereal between a computer and switch. The disadvantage is that you've now changed the connection to half duplex and possible also forced a 100 Mb or gigabit NIC to run at 10 Mb. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 13:53:50 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 09:53:50 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: <430C7B96.40404-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <430C7B96.40404@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20050824135350.GL28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 24, 2005 at 09:52:22AM -0400, James Knott wrote: > One thing 10 Mb hubs are still useful for, is testing. You can insert a > computer running ethereal between a computer and switch. The > disadvantage is that you've now changed the connection to half duplex > and possible also forced a 100 Mb or gigabit NIC to run at 10 Mb. Well any hub is useful for that, even a 100mbit one. Of course so is a decent switch with port mirroring option. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 13:56:29 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 09:56:29 -0400 (EDT) Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? In-Reply-To: <430C7B00.3090608-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <430C7B00.3090608@rogers.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 24 Aug 2005, James Knott wrote: > > Transparent shielding is possible, although not entirely easy. > > I think you'll find it's not quite transparent, if you look close > enough. There will be some shielding material, either as a fine screen > or very thin layer... It's possible to make transparent conductive layers. Any time you look at an LCD, you're looking through one. Whether cheap acrylic PC cases have one is another question. But it *can* be done. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 14:06:03 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 10:06:03 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: <430C7B96.40404-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <430C7B96.40404@rogers.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 24 Aug 2005, James Knott wrote: > One thing 10 Mb hubs are still useful for, is testing. You can insert a > computer running ethereal between a computer and switch. The > disadvantage is that you've now changed the connection to half duplex > and possible also forced a 100 Mb or gigabit NIC to run at 10 Mb. That can be avoided by giving the eavesdropping computer two Ethernets, and setting it up to act as a bridge (so it doesn't have its own IP addresses etc. to mess up the picture). It can provide full duplex, and at least a cheap imitation :-) of full speed, depending on how well it can keep up. Moreover, not only can it eavesdrop on the packets it's relaying, but it can alter them as well, which is sometimes very useful. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 14:06:08 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 10:06:08 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? In-Reply-To: <430C7B00.3090608-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <430C7B00.3090608@rogers.com> Message-ID: James Knott wrote: > I think you'll find it's not quite transparent, if you look close > enough. There will be some shielding material, either as a fine screen > or very thin layer. Those clear acrylic cases, that some people like, > are not shielded. While it's not illegal to make, import or sell those > cases, a computer built with one would be illegal. I've always wondered, if a computer/device cannot create any electronic interference but must accept any given, where is the magical device that is creating said given interference in the first place if it too cannot (by writ of the omnipresent silver FCC sticker of course) create any interference? Plain silliness, I know -- but I rather detest those little stickers. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 14:08:53 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 10:08:53 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: <20050824135350.GL28567-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <430C7B96.40404@rogers.com> <20050824135350.GL28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <430C7F75.4050801@rogers.com> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Wed, Aug 24, 2005 at 09:52:22AM -0400, James Knott wrote: >>One thing 10 Mb hubs are still useful for, is testing. You can insert a >>computer running ethereal between a computer and switch. The >>disadvantage is that you've now changed the connection to half duplex >>and possible also forced a 100 Mb or gigabit NIC to run at 10 Mb. > > Well any hub is useful for that, even a 100mbit one. Of course so is a > decent switch with port mirroring option. I thought we were talking about "cheap" hardware. ;-) I just happen to have a spare 10 Mb hub, with a 10base2 connector. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 14:07:40 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 10:07:40 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <20050824135240.GK28567-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050824110956.40438.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <430C79F8.9060200@rogers.com> <20050824135240.GK28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <430C7F2C.5030904@rogers.com> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Wed, Aug 24, 2005 at 09:45:28AM -0400, James Knott wrote: >>Their CP/M cards were also decent. Perhaps MS should have been a >>hardware company. ;-) > > What is a CP/M card? Way back in the dark ages, computers, based on the Intel 8080 or Zilog Z80 CPU, often ran an operating system called CP/M. The Apple II computers used a 6502 CPU, which could not run the popular CP/M software. Since at that time, Microsoft was selling CP/M BASIC and compilers, they couldn't sell to Apple users, unless they could figure out a way to run CP/M in those Apples. The alternative was to rewrite all their code in 6502 (back in those days, most apps were written in assembler, not C etc). They then decided to create a card, built around the Z80, for the Apples, which could run CP/M and apps. Incidentally, the original MS-DOS was a poor clone of CP/M. It was developed by a hardware manufacturer Seattle Computer Products, as a development system, while waiting for CP/M-86 (for the 8086 CPU) to be released. Many of the DOS calls can be traced back to CP/M. > > Personally I only think the first Microsoft keyboard was decent. The > rest had the key layout all screwed up (and the current don't even have > function keys by default). Never did like their mice, I am a logitech > mouse fan. It is amazingly hard to find a decent keyboard. They all > have screwed up key layouts it seems. Microsoft does something stupid, > everyone else goes to copy it. Aaarrrhh!!! I've never cared for those keyboards. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 14:11:13 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 10:11:13 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <430C8001.2020105@rogers.com> Henry Spencer wrote: > On Wed, 24 Aug 2005, James Knott wrote: >>>Transparent shielding is possible, although not entirely easy. >>I think you'll find it's not quite transparent, if you look close >>enough. There will be some shielding material, either as a fine screen >>or very thin layer... > > It's possible to make transparent conductive layers. Any time you look at > an LCD, you're looking through one. > > Whether cheap acrylic PC cases have one is another question. But it *can* > be done. Truly transparent? Or very close to? Even glass isn't completely transparent. Nothing short of a vacuum is. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 14:19:09 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 10:19:09 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? In-Reply-To: References: <430C7B00.3090608@rogers.com> Message-ID: <430C81DD.20408@rogers.com> Jamon Camisso wrote: > James Knott wrote: >> I think you'll find it's not quite transparent, if you look close >> enough. There will be some shielding material, either as a fine screen >> or very thin layer. Those clear acrylic cases, that some people like, >> are not shielded. While it's not illegal to make, import or sell those >> cases, a computer built with one would be illegal. > > I've always wondered, if a computer/device cannot create any electronic > interference but must accept any given, where is the magical device that > is creating said given interference in the first place if it too cannot > (by writ of the omnipresent silver FCC sticker of course) create any > interference? > > Plain silliness, I know -- but I rather detest those little stickers. Any licensed radio transmitter generates a signal that may cause interference to a device that's not supposed to be sensitive to such signals. For example many of the cable TV channels are on frequencies used by various radio services. It is the responsibility of the cable company, to ensure that they don't interfere with those services. They also have to accept any interference to their services, caused by those transmitters or find a way to block them. Fortunately, steps taken to prevent signal leakage work both ways. In the case of devices such as cordless phones, WiFi cards, Bluetooth etc., the fundamental understanding is that they operate in potentially polluted spectrum and can expect no legal recourse for any resulting interference. Also, some of that spectrum is shared with licenced users and the unlicenced devices are legally bound to do what's required, including cease operations, in order to avoid interference to the licenced service. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From foolswisdom-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 14:20:58 2005 From: foolswisdom-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Lloyd D Budd) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 07:20:58 -0700 Subject: Ubuntu conference comes to Canada -was- Fwd: Announcing Ubuntu Below Zero Conference In-Reply-To: <20050824043945.GA28300-YBxt/M6Ji85g9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20050824043945.GA28300@yukidoke.org> Message-ID: <9712993f05082407206872a99c@mail.gmail.com> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Benj. Mako Hill Date: Aug 23, 2005 9:39 PM Subject: Announcing Ubuntu Below Zero Conference To: ubuntu-announce-nLRlyDuq1AZFpShjVBNYrg at public.gmane.org Canonical is proud to announce the third Ubuntu conference! Most people who made it to Sydney and Matar? can vouch for the fact that it was an intense, productive and fun experience for everyone. Here are the things you need to know: --> What: Ubuntu Below Zero --> Where: Montreal, Canada --> When: 30 Oct - 10 Nov 2005 (important schedule details on the wiki) --> Who: Open to the Public Trying to organize an even better event, the conference will be structured a little differently this time and will be broken down like this: OCT30 -> Ubuntu Love Day (Interesting to Everyone) OCT31-NOV05 -> Ubuntu/Launchpad Developer Summit (Interesting Primarily to Ubuntu and Launchpad Developers) NOV07-NOV10 -> Launchpad Development Summit Cont'd (Interesting Primarily to Launchpad Hackers) Folks from the community should definitely come on October 30th. The rest of the conference is going to be focused around developers brainstorming and writing specifications. While all are welcome at all points, everyone should expect to contribute in a hands on manner to the technical direction of Ubuntu and Launchpad if you're there after Love Day. Also, we would appreciate being told in advance if you will attend. There is information at the link below on how to do this. While there's not a huge amount of information online, everything we do have is here or linked from this wiki page: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBelowZero As we get more information, we will be updating that page. Like the previous conferences, there is a limited amount of money for sponsorship. Anyone is welcome to apply for sponsorship although we will give preference to people who are active, visible, and known in the community and who are from the general geographical area. Our conferences move around globally so it's folks in the Americas that will get precedent this time. More information on sponsorship linked from the conference page. All requests for sponsorship must be made no later than September 11th. Any specific questions not answered on that page can be directed to info-GeWIH/nMZzKXj1p+fO2waQ at public.gmane.org Regards, Mako -- Benjamin Mako Hill mako-GeWIH/nMZzLQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org | mako-Z7WLFzj8eWMS+FvcfC7Uqw at public.gmane.org -- ubuntu-announce mailing list ubuntu-announce-nLRlyDuq1AZFpShjVBNYrg at public.gmane.org http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-announce -- Peace be in you , Lloyd D Budd From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 14:51:08 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 10:51:08 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? In-Reply-To: <430C7ED0.8060607-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <430C7B00.3090608@rogers.com> <430C7ED0.8060607@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <20050824145108.GM28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 24, 2005 at 10:06:08AM -0400, Jamon Camisso wrote: > I've always wondered, if a computer/device cannot create any electronic > interference but must accept any given, where is the magical device that > is creating said given interference in the first place if it too cannot > (by writ of the omnipresent silver FCC sticker of course) create any > interference? > > Plain silliness, I know -- but I rather detest those little stickers. Radio transmitters are licensed to generate interference. Like a cell phone for example. Your computer is not licensed to do so and hence must not do so. If a device broadcasts on the wrong frequency, then it is broken and/or violating it's license and hence illegal to use. Stories of baby monitors broadcasting at aircraft communications frequencies or other important radio frequencies have certainly been claimed. Cases of bad design or bad QA. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 14:53:10 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 10:53:10 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: References: <430C7B96.40404@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20050824145310.GN28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 24, 2005 at 10:06:03AM -0400, Henry Spencer wrote: > That can be avoided by giving the eavesdropping computer two Ethernets, > and setting it up to act as a bridge (so it doesn't have its own IP > addresses etc. to mess up the picture). It can provide full duplex, > and at least a cheap imitation :-) of full speed, depending on how well > it can keep up. Moreover, not only can it eavesdrop on the packets it's > relaying, but it can alter them as well, which is sometimes very useful. The truly transparent firewall setup relies on this. A firewall that sits on the wire between two points and can filter traffic without either end needing to know about the existence of the firewall. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 14:55:02 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 10:55:02 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <430C7F2C.5030904-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <20050824110956.40438.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <430C79F8.9060200@rogers.com> <20050824135240.GK28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <430C7F2C.5030904@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20050824145502.GO28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 24, 2005 at 10:07:40AM -0400, James Knott wrote: > Way back in the dark ages, computers, based on the Intel 8080 or Zilog > Z80 CPU, often ran an operating system called CP/M. The Apple II > computers used a 6502 CPU, which could not run the popular CP/M > software. Since at that time, Microsoft was selling CP/M BASIC and > compilers, they couldn't sell to Apple users, unless they could figure > out a way to run CP/M in those Apples. The alternative was to rewrite > all their code in 6502 (back in those days, most apps were written in > assembler, not C etc). They then decided to create a card, built around > the Z80, for the Apples, which could run CP/M and apps. I didn't know MS had made such a thing. I know there was such a device for the C64, and the C128 had one built in of course. > Incidentally, the original MS-DOS was a poor clone of CP/M. It was > developed by a hardware manufacturer Seattle Computer Products, as a > development system, while waiting for CP/M-86 (for the 8086 CPU) to be > released. Many of the DOS calls can be traced back to CP/M. Yeah that I know. :) Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From glayng-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 14:59:26 2005 From: glayng-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Gary Layng) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 10:59:26 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <20050824110956.40438.qmail-fjYszm/wOJWB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20050824110956.40438.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <200508241059.26399.glayng@sympatico.ca> And here I thought I was the only one with a Microsoft keyboard and mouse attached to his Linux box. ^_^ On August 24, 2005 07:09, Colin McGregor wrote: > --- Jamon Camisso wrote: > > Colin McGregor wrote: > > > I was trying to locate stills from the short lived > > > (so-so) TV show "Century City", as the computer > > > > shown > > > > > on the web site below look similar to (the same > > > as?!?!) to the computers on "Century City". I was > > > > not > > > > > able to turn up any pictures of the computers in > > > "Century City", so I am not sure if that is where > > > > the > > > > > images below came from. Anyway "Century City" was > > > > set > > > > > in the year 2030, and the computers were NOT real > > > (very plausable that we would have computers > > > > looking > > > > > like before the year 2030, but not today). > > > > > > Colin McGregor > > > > Part of me hopes that a transparent LCD screen won't > > ever have the > > vibrance and saturation of colours that is the norm > > on mid range and up > > CRTs. The age old function vs. form dilemma I > > suppose. > > I have a 21" CRT monitor on my desk, and yes I love > the size, sharpness, etc. of the screen. On the other > hand I would also be VERY happy to have a LOT less of > my desktop chewed up with that hulking monster. So, > give me a cheap large transparent LCD screen that > matches the vibrance and saturation of a CRT and I'll > be very interested. > > As for the keyboard in the picture, it is a flat slab, > and yes there are flat slab keyboards sort of like > that today, in industrial settings (where they have to > worry about chemicals being spilled on the keyboard, > and want something that can be just wiped clean). But > normally people WANT the touch of a keyboard that > moves when they hit a key, and unless there is some > pressing reason to do otherwise (i.e. some industrial > settings) that is the way people go. In my case I hate > the look, but love the feel of the "natural" keyboards > and would want a comfortable keyboard in the future. > Pleasantly ironic, the keyboard and mouse on my main > home Linux box were built by Microsoft, a company that > does @#$% software, but comfortable (and ugly) > keyboards/mice. > > Colin McGregor > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- there's no place like 127.0.0.1 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 15:24:14 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 11:24:14 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: <20050824145310.GN28567-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050824145310.GN28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: On Wed, 24 Aug 2005, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > > That can be avoided by giving the eavesdropping computer two Ethernets, > > and setting it up to act as a bridge (so it doesn't have its own IP > > addresses etc. to mess up the picture)... > > The truly transparent firewall setup relies on this. A firewall that > sits on the wire between two points and can filter traffic without > either end needing to know about the existence of the firewall. Yes, a bridging firewall is a nice trick. Not only need there be no knowledge of the firewall's existence among users, but it's hard for a bad guy to attack, because he can't *see* it. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 15:40:03 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 11:40:03 -0400 (EDT) Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? In-Reply-To: <430C8001.2020105-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <430C8001.2020105@rogers.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 24 Aug 2005, James Knott wrote: > > It's possible to make transparent conductive layers. Any time you look at > > an LCD, you're looking through one... > > Truly transparent? Or very close to? Even glass isn't completely > transparent. Nothing short of a vacuum is. Even vacuum isn't, if we are being really strict and paying attention to quantum-mechanics issues. Which says that being strict is silly; a more pragmatic definition of "transparent" is needed for normal purposes. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 16:09:20 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 12:09:20 -0400 Subject: Setting up a network and sharing internet In-Reply-To: <20050824145310.GN28567-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <430C7B96.40404@rogers.com> <20050824145310.GN28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <430C9BB0.5010307@rogers.com> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Wed, Aug 24, 2005 at 10:06:03AM -0400, Henry Spencer wrote: >>That can be avoided by giving the eavesdropping computer two Ethernets, >>and setting it up to act as a bridge (so it doesn't have its own IP >>addresses etc. to mess up the picture). It can provide full duplex, >>and at least a cheap imitation :-) of full speed, depending on how well >>it can keep up. Moreover, not only can it eavesdrop on the packets it's >>relaying, but it can alter them as well, which is sometimes very useful. > > The truly transparent firewall setup relies on this. A firewall that > sits on the wire between two points and can filter traffic without > either end needing to know about the existence of the firewall. For that matter, a router can be configured as a firewall, as I have done here. The other computers on the network "know" about the router, but have no idea about the firewall or VPN functions it provides. I can also run Ethereal etc., on the firewall/router (an old Dell computer, running SuSE 9.1). -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 16:14:23 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 12:14:23 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <20050824145502.GO28567-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050824110956.40438.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <430C79F8.9060200@rogers.com> <20050824135240.GK28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <430C7F2C.5030904@rogers.com> <20050824145502.GO28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <430C9CDF.5070509@rogers.com> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Wed, Aug 24, 2005 at 10:07:40AM -0400, James Knott wrote: >>Way back in the dark ages, computers, based on the Intel 8080 or Zilog >>Z80 CPU, often ran an operating system called CP/M. The Apple II >>computers used a 6502 CPU, which could not run the popular CP/M >>software. Since at that time, Microsoft was selling CP/M BASIC and >>compilers, they couldn't sell to Apple users, unless they could figure >>out a way to run CP/M in those Apples. The alternative was to rewrite >>all their code in 6502 (back in those days, most apps were written in >>assembler, not C etc). They then decided to create a card, built around >>the Z80, for the Apples, which could run CP/M and apps. > > I didn't know MS had made such a thing. > > I know there was such a device for the C64, and the C128 had one built > in of course. > >>Incidentally, the original MS-DOS was a poor clone of CP/M. It was >>developed by a hardware manufacturer Seattle Computer Products, as a >>development system, while waiting for CP/M-86 (for the 8086 CPU) to be >>released. Many of the DOS calls can be traced back to CP/M. > > Yeah that I know. :) You might be interested in reading a book "fire in the valley" by Paul Freiberger and Michael Swaine. It's a history of personal computers and contains lots of interesting info. I recall a lot of that history, from reading the various magazines of the time and I still have *EVERY* issue of Byte magazine, which contains a lot of history, including the history of Seattle Computer Products' Q-DOS, which became MS-DOS. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 16:17:11 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 12:17:11 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <430C9D87.3080504@rogers.com> Henry Spencer wrote: > On Wed, 24 Aug 2005, James Knott wrote: >>>It's possible to make transparent conductive layers. Any time you look at >>>an LCD, you're looking through one... >>Truly transparent? Or very close to? Even glass isn't completely >>transparent. Nothing short of a vacuum is. > > Even vacuum isn't, if we are being really strict and paying attention to > quantum-mechanics issues. Hmmm... I'd better get my vacuum cleaner out, to get rid of all those sub-atomic particles that are cluttering up my vacuum. ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 16:57:25 2005 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins Witteman) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 12:57:25 -0400 Subject: SOLVED-Not getting root's mail - Postfix In-Reply-To: <17af137805082306596c4355e3-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <20050822130421.GA3936@localhost.localdomain> <17af1378050823062360c0806f@mail.gmail.com> <20050823134411.GA3917@localhost.localdomain> <17af137805082306596c4355e3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050824165725.GC5286@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> On Tue, Aug 23, 2005 at 09:59:10AM -0400, Ian Zimmerman wrote: >On 8/23/05, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: >> On Tue, Aug 23, 2005 at 09:23:40AM -0400, Ian Zimmerman wrote: >> >On 8/22/05, William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: >> >> Up until recently, I would get mail destined for root, presumably >> >> because in /etc/aliases I had lines like: >> >> >> >> postmaster: $me >> >> root: $me >> >> >> >> Now, after a reinstall, but using the same configuration, I no longer >> >> get root's mail. A visit to /var/log/mail.log shows me that mail for >> >> root is getting forwarded to my defined smarthost. I'm using Postfix >> >> version 2.2.4-1. Any have any ideas? >> > >> >I use Exim not Postfix but: >> > >> >does postmaster behave the same way? >> >> Yes. >> >> >Is "me" a real configuration variable or just your way of guarding >> >your privacy here? >> >> Just a privacy measure - the file itself uses my actual login. > >Hmm. When it gets sent to the smarthost, what is the address? >To me it looks like the aliases file is just ignored completely. >Is it in the right place? Has a crucial symlink vanished? Did >the permissions change? The problem was that the value of /etc/mailname had changed, and no longer pointed somewhere that Postfix recognized as local. Once I fixed that and restarted Postfix (necessary) it worked again. Thanks for the help. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 17:28:29 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 13:28:29 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Microsoft hardware, wasOT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <200508241059.26399.glayng-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508241059.26399.glayng@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <20050824172829.40384.qmail@web88205.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- Gary Layng wrote: > And here I thought I was the only one with a > Microsoft keyboard and mouse > attached to his Linux box. ^_^ Your not the only one, I have a Microsoft Natural Multimedia keyboard and a Microsoft wireless mouse (either one of which can be had for under $10 if you wait for the right sale to come up at the right surplus shop). So question is, how many other local Linux users are running with a Linux box with a Microsoft keyboard and/or mouse? Back when questions were being raised about how to punish Microsoft for taking illegal actions as a monoloply(*) I was of the view that Microsoft should have been forced to become a pure hardware company. Regretably, one of the (many) mistakes made by the current Bush administration was to hand Microsoft a punishment so light that it doesn't even count as a slap on the wrist. Colin McGregor (*) Keep in mind that it isn't illegal to have a (near) monopoly, as for example Heinz has some 90% of the ketchup market. What is illegal is how you obtain that monopoly, and how you use that monopoly position. For example, a supermarket does not have to sell Heinz marinade sauce in order to be able to sell Heinz ketchup. Likewise Heinz does not use their ketchup profits to sell their baby food below cost (with a view to getting a monopoly in that area too). > On August 24, 2005 07:09, Colin McGregor wrote: > > --- Jamon Camisso > wrote: > > > Colin McGregor wrote: > > > > I was trying to locate stills from the short > lived > > > > (so-so) TV show "Century City", as the > computer > > > > > > shown > > > > > > > on the web site below look similar to (the > same > > > > as?!?!) to the computers on "Century City". I > was > > > > > > not > > > > > > > able to turn up any pictures of the computers > in > > > > "Century City", so I am not sure if that is > where > > > > > > the > > > > > > > images below came from. Anyway "Century City" > was > > > > > > set > > > > > > > in the year 2030, and the computers were NOT > real > > > > (very plausable that we would have computers > > > > > > looking > > > > > > > like before the year 2030, but not today). > > > > > > > > Colin McGregor > > > > > > Part of me hopes that a transparent LCD screen > won't > > > ever have the > > > vibrance and saturation of colours that is the > norm > > > on mid range and up > > > CRTs. The age old function vs. form dilemma I > > > suppose. > > > > I have a 21" CRT monitor on my desk, and yes I > love > > the size, sharpness, etc. of the screen. On the > other > > hand I would also be VERY happy to have a LOT less > of > > my desktop chewed up with that hulking monster. > So, > > give me a cheap large transparent LCD screen that > > matches the vibrance and saturation of a CRT and > I'll > > be very interested. > > > > As for the keyboard in the picture, it is a flat > slab, > > and yes there are flat slab keyboards sort of like > > that today, in industrial settings (where they > have to > > worry about chemicals being spilled on the > keyboard, > > and want something that can be just wiped clean). > But > > normally people WANT the touch of a keyboard that > > moves when they hit a key, and unless there is > some > > pressing reason to do otherwise (i.e. some > industrial > > settings) that is the way people go. In my case I > hate > > the look, but love the feel of the "natural" > keyboards > > and would want a comfortable keyboard in the > future. > > Pleasantly ironic, the keyboard and mouse on my > main > > home Linux box were built by Microsoft, a company > that > > does @#$% software, but comfortable (and ugly) > > keyboards/mice. > > > > Colin McGregor > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: > http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text > below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: > http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > -- > there's no place like 127.0.0.1 > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: > http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text > below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: > http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 17:27:49 2005 From: jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 13:27:49 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <430C9CDF.5070509-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <20050824110956.40438.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <430C79F8.9060200@rogers.com> <20050824135240.GK28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <430C7F2C.5030904@rogers.com> <20050824145502.GO28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <430C9CDF.5070509@rogers.com> Message-ID: On 8/24/05, James Knott wrote: > You might be interested in reading a book "fire in the valley" by Paul > Freiberger and Michael Swaine. It's a history of personal computers and > contains lots of interesting info. I recall a lot of that history, from > reading the various magazines of the time and I still have *EVERY* issue > of Byte magazine, which contains a lot of history, including the history > of Seattle Computer Products' Q-DOS, which became MS-DOS. I keep the manuals for Microsoft C 5.1 lying around for a similar purpose: as proof that at one time there was IBM OS/2 and MS OS/2. :) (then MS ditched OS/2 and went with Windows, a shell on top of DOS) -- taa /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 17:32:54 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 13:32:54 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: References: <20050824110956.40438.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <430C79F8.9060200@rogers.com> <20050824135240.GK28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <430C7F2C.5030904@rogers.com> <20050824145502.GO28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <430C9CDF.5070509@rogers.com> Message-ID: <430CAF46.3050409@rogers.com> Taavi Burns wrote: > On 8/24/05, James Knott wrote: >>You might be interested in reading a book "fire in the valley" by Paul >>Freiberger and Michael Swaine. It's a history of personal computers and >>contains lots of interesting info. I recall a lot of that history, from >>reading the various magazines of the time and I still have *EVERY* issue >>of Byte magazine, which contains a lot of history, including the history >>of Seattle Computer Products' Q-DOS, which became MS-DOS. > > I keep the manuals for Microsoft C 5.1 lying around for a similar > purpose: as proof that at one time there was IBM OS/2 and MS OS/2. :) > (then MS ditched OS/2 and went with Windows, a shell on top of DOS) > Somewhere around here, I've got a set of MS C compiler for OS/2 floppies. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 17:58:33 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 13:58:33 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <430CAF46.3050409-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <20050824110956.40438.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <430C79F8.9060200@rogers.com> <20050824135240.GK28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <430C7F2C.5030904@rogers.com> <20050824145502.GO28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <430C9CDF.5070509@rogers.com> <430CAF46.3050409@rogers.com> Message-ID: <1e55af99050824105853c77665@mail.gmail.com> On 8/24/05, James Knott wrote: > Taavi Burns wrote: > > I keep the manuals for Microsoft C 5.1 lying around for a similar > > purpose: as proof that at one time there was IBM OS/2 and MS OS/2. :) > > (then MS ditched OS/2 and went with Windows, a shell on top of DOS) > > Somewhere around here, I've got a set of MS C compiler for OS/2 floppies. Keep this up, and someone's going to bring up that they have a stack of punched cards with something strange coded into them. =) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 18:04:36 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 14:04:36 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <1e55af99050824105853c77665-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <20050824110956.40438.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <430C79F8.9060200@rogers.com> <20050824135240.GK28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <430C7F2C.5030904@rogers.com> <20050824145502.GO28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <430C9CDF.5070509@rogers.com> <430CAF46.3050409@rogers.com> <1e55af99050824105853c77665@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <430CB6B4.6070009@rogers.com> Sy wrote: > On 8/24/05, James Knott wrote: >>Taavi Burns wrote: >>>I keep the manuals for Microsoft C 5.1 lying around for a similar >>>purpose: as proof that at one time there was IBM OS/2 and MS OS/2. :) >>>(then MS ditched OS/2 and went with Windows, a shell on top of DOS) >>Somewhere around here, I've got a set of MS C compiler for OS/2 floppies. > > Keep this up, and someone's going to bring up that they have a stack > of punched cards with something strange coded into them. =) Well, now that you mention it, I do have some core memory here. :-) BTW, I've also got an old Morse sounder. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 18:17:58 2005 From: josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Joseph Kubik) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 14:17:58 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <430CB6B4.6070009-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <20050824110956.40438.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <430C79F8.9060200@rogers.com> <20050824135240.GK28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <430C7F2C.5030904@rogers.com> <20050824145502.GO28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <430C9CDF.5070509@rogers.com> <430CAF46.3050409@rogers.com> <1e55af99050824105853c77665@mail.gmail.com> <430CB6B4.6070009@rogers.com> Message-ID: This isn't off topic.... just off century. -Joseph- On 8/24/05, James Knott wrote: > Sy wrote: > > On 8/24/05, James Knott wrote: > >>Taavi Burns wrote: > >>>I keep the manuals for Microsoft C 5.1 lying around for a similar > >>>purpose: as proof that at one time there was IBM OS/2 and MS OS/2. :) > >>>(then MS ditched OS/2 and went with Windows, a shell on top of DOS) > >>Somewhere around here, I've got a set of MS C compiler for OS/2 floppies. > > > > Keep this up, and someone's going to bring up that they have a stack > > of punched cards with something strange coded into them. =) > > Well, now that you mention it, I do have some core memory here. :-) > > BTW, I've also got an old Morse sounder. > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 18:21:39 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 14:21:39 -0400 Subject: Alternatives to Trac Message-ID: <1e55af9905082411211d64e79d@mail.gmail.com> Trac is really young, and I'm not particularly happy with it. The two solutions I have are to either work with them in some kind of SQA / suggestion capacity, or to find an alternative. We're using it as a GUI for an SVN repository. Things like ticket tracking and a pretty display for file changes. Also .. the wiki would be cool it it were at least syntax-compatible with MediaWiki. =/ I'm wondering if there's an alternative project management-oriented tool out there. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 18:33:57 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 14:33:57 -0400 Subject: Microsoft hardware, wasOT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <20050824172829.40384.qmail-nQt9QCl3sx2B9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <200508241059.26399.glayng@sympatico.ca> <20050824172829.40384.qmail@web88205.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1e55af990508241133392b99@mail.gmail.com> On 8/24/05, Colin McGregor wrote: > So question is, how many other local Linux users are > running with a Linux box with a Microsoft keyboard > and/or mouse? Mice are generally Logitech. Keyboard is always an IBM Model-M or M2. I intend to buy a usb adapter so I can use these keyboards on newer systems, although I understand that some people have been making fair duplicates. They're asking $200++ for them, but when it comes time for that, I'll pay. I understand that Microsoft's original Sidewinder joystick rocked the niche and are famous as the best ever made. However, I also understand that their later revisions were garbage in comparison. This is on my long list of toys to get. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 18:44:37 2005 From: rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org (Rob Sutherland) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 18:44:37 +0000 Subject: Alternatives to Trac In-Reply-To: <1e55af9905082411211d64e79d-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <1e55af9905082411211d64e79d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <430CC015.80907@cheapersafer.com> Sy wrote: > >I'm wondering if there's an alternative project management-oriented >tool out there. > > There's Gforge, http://gforge.org/ ...I don't think it has a wiki though. Rob -- Rob Sutherland - http://www.cheapersafer.com Business Computer Support and Training -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From glayng-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 19:13:00 2005 From: glayng-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Gary Layng) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 15:13:00 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <1e55af99050824105853c77665-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <20050824110956.40438.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <430CAF46.3050409@rogers.com> <1e55af99050824105853c77665@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200508241513.00635.glayng@sympatico.ca> I have a keepsake of my late mother: a computer card storage box. It's a very fine box, made of wood with middle-lapped joints, stained, and with the logo of the computer company embossed on the front, right above the brass label holder. (I still use it for the purpose my mother did: a recipe card holder.) The computer company? Remington-Rand. She stopped working when she became pregnant with her first child, back in 1950/1951. On August 24, 2005 13:58, Sy wrote: > On 8/24/05, James Knott wrote: > > Taavi Burns wrote: > > > I keep the manuals for Microsoft C 5.1 lying around for a similar > > > purpose: as proof that at one time there was IBM OS/2 and MS OS/2. :) > > > (then MS ditched OS/2 and went with Windows, a shell on top of DOS) > > > > Somewhere around here, I've got a set of MS C compiler for OS/2 floppies. > > Keep this up, and someone's going to bring up that they have a stack > of punched cards with something strange coded into them. =) > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- there's no place like 127.0.0.1 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From denisov-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 19:24:20 2005 From: denisov-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Igor Denisov) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 15:24:20 -0400 Subject: Microsoft hardware, wasOT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <1e55af990508241133392b99-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508241059.26399.glayng@sympatico.ca> <20050824172829.40384.qmail@web88205.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <1e55af990508241133392b99@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <96aa4e8f05082412243bb941fa@mail.gmail.com> > So question is, how many other local Linux users are > running with a Linux box with a Microsoft keyboard > and/or mouse? I use a Logitech MX700 wireless mouse and keyboard, with most of the hotkeys enabled (like the volume control dial, awesome :-) by Lineak. That said, I've seen Microsoft optical mice sold for under 10 bucks in regular retail stores and that's what connected to my other box... Igor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jmyshrall-6duGhz7i8susTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 19:39:35 2005 From: jmyshrall-6duGhz7i8susTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (John Myshrall) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 15:39:35 -0400 Subject: Microsoft hardware, wasOT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <20050824172829.40384.qmail-nQt9QCl3sx2B9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20050824172829.40384.qmail@web88205.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <430CCCF7.4040904@golden.net> Colin McGregor wrote: >--- Gary Layng wrote: > > > >>And here I thought I was the only one with a >>Microsoft keyboard and mouse >>attached to his Linux box. ^_^ >> >> > >Your not the only one, I have a Microsoft Natural >Multimedia keyboard and a Microsoft wireless mouse >(either one of which can be had for under $10 if you >wait for the right sale to come up at the right >surplus shop). > >So question is, how many other local Linux users are >running with a Linux box with a Microsoft keyboard >and/or mouse? > > > Not this guy. I've been using Logitech for years. Rock solid & not suporting the evil empire. John -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 20:07:06 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 16:07:06 -0400 Subject: Microsoft hardware, wasOT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <96aa4e8f05082412243bb941fa-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508241059.26399.glayng@sympatico.ca> <20050824172829.40384.qmail@web88205.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <1e55af990508241133392b99@mail.gmail.com> <96aa4e8f05082412243bb941fa@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050824200706.GP28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 24, 2005 at 03:24:20PM -0400, Igor Denisov wrote: > I use a Logitech MX700 wireless mouse and keyboard, with most of the > hotkeys enabled (like the volume control dial, awesome :-) by Lineak. > > That said, I've seen Microsoft optical mice sold for under 10 bucks in > regular retail stores and that's what connected to my other box... I can buy logitech optical mice for $10 to $13 each, so why not get that? I just picked up an MX1000 for $77 which is rather nice to use. I still have to figure out what to use all the buttons for. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 20:29:18 2005 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 16:29:18 -0400 Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: <20050824033452.GA16120-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel@cbits.ca> <1e55af990508181426268912f@mail.gmail.com> <20050819104933.GC12387@waltdnes.org> <20050823100517.GA1966@localhost> <20050824033452.GA16120@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <430CD89E.60302@georgetown.wehave.net> Walter Dnes wrote: > I'm working on putting together YAF (Yet Another FAQ) for Gentoo > newbies. It's almost as much of a HOW_NOT_TO as it is a HOW_TO. It > will mention stuff like... > - *NOT* unrolling every last single loop or implementing every last > single exotic generic compiler "optimization" > - *NOT* exceeding -O2 > - *NOT* exceeding "MAKEOPTS=-j1" > - *NOT* using fbsplash until you have Gentoo up and running first. > For that matter, avoid framebuffer altogether if you can. This may > not be an option on non-X86 architectures. > - *NOT* using PAM unless you are already familiar with it. Gentoo has > a steep learning curve. PAM has a steep learning curve. Learning > *BOTH OF THEM AT THE SAME TIME* is more like climbing up the side of > a cliff. Sounds good, you just missed the final obvious caveat ;-) - *NOT* wasting your time compiling software Fraser -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 20:33:52 2005 From: pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 16:33:52 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <000801c5a8a5$d1f287d0$6501a8c0@ibm5b4y3a0pgrq> References: <000801c5a8a5$d1f287d0$6501a8c0@ibm5b4y3a0pgrq> Message-ID: <430CA170.24197.2A2A55F8@localhost> > > > http://alimentarus.net/ComputerGiqueChic (my web site) > Just look at the web site name ! > > "Computer Geek" spelled to sound French... > Glad it amused somebody. I named the directory that way to reflect the over-the-top, stylish mood conveyed by the photography. Paul -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 20:33:52 2005 From: pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 16:33:52 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <1e55af9905082318338f15f51-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <430B8E79.21263.25F84079@localhost> Message-ID: <430CA170.22910.2A2A558A@localhost> > On 8/23/05, pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org wrote: > > > Check out the computer shown on some graphics I found at: > > > http://alimentarus.net/ComputerGiqueChic (my web site) > > Do you have any background on these pics? They just look like bad > fashion pics to me.. No, unfortunately not. They are just d/l'ed from the newsgroup alt.binaries.pictures.wallpaper, out of context, and without photo credits. Paul King -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 20:41:11 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 16:41:11 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) References: <430CA170.24197.2A2A55F8@localhost> Message-ID: <005f01c5a8ec$3bc2fd70$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, 24 August, 2005 16:33 Subject: Re: [TLUG]: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) > > > > http://alimentarus.net/ComputerGiqueChic (my web site) > > Just look at the web site name ! > > > > "Computer Geek" spelled to sound French... > > Glad it amused somebody. I named the directory that way to reflect > the over-the-top, stylish mood conveyed by the photography. > > Paul ... I bet the computer and keyboard came from "Radio Shaque", ah! non: "La Source" :-) Oh la la ! Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From teddymills-VFlxZYho3OA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 20:58:00 2005 From: teddymills-VFlxZYho3OA at public.gmane.org (teddy mills) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 16:58:00 -0400 Subject: MTAs ISPs and Virtual Domains Message-ID: <430CDF58.9050806@knet.ca> Well in the past I have installed a qmail server(from qmailrocks.org) with all the bells and whistles and it worked with virtual domains easily. Well I tried installing a similar Postfix server that could handle virtual domains, squirrelmail, dovecot, saslauth, postfixadmin. Well everything does seem to work, but the virtual domains does not. Only users known locally to the system get authenticated. Now I am looking at getting virtual domains working in postfix, and it is starting to get complex. I would try EXIM, but methinks I had better return to the MTA I know best and that I know how to make it work with virtual domains. No. I refuse to use SendMail. (that .cf file is scary) Back to qmail! -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From teddymills-VFlxZYho3OA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 21:04:47 2005 From: teddymills-VFlxZYho3OA at public.gmane.org (teddy mills) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 17:04:47 -0400 Subject: Dynamic DNS provider needed Message-ID: <430CE0EF.3010700@knet.ca> For us linux users who run linux servers on dynamic ips here in Toronto, what Dynamic DNS providers would one recommend and why? (Obviously this is not a good business solution, just something one would use at home or a quick hack ?) (and preferrably in the free category, otherwise I would just go get a static ip) (im sure this thread will be a mile long) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 21:09:32 2005 From: pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 17:09:32 -0400 Subject: Microsoft hardware, wasOT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <20050824172829.40384.qmail-nQt9QCl3sx2B9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <200508241059.26399.glayng@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <430CA9CC.26148.2A4AFA70@localhost> Mouse - Logitech Keyboard - Microsoft standard (with internet buttons) > --- Gary Layng wrote: > > > And here I thought I was the only one with a > > Microsoft keyboard and mouse > > attached to his Linux box. ^_^ > > Your not the only one, I have a Microsoft Natural > Multimedia keyboard and a Microsoft wireless mouse > (either one of which can be had for under $10 if you > wait for the right sale to come up at the right > surplus shop). > > So question is, how many other local Linux users are > running with a Linux box with a Microsoft keyboard > and/or mouse? > > Back when questions were being raised about how to > punish Microsoft for taking illegal actions as a > monoloply(*) I was of the view that Microsoft should > have been forced to become a pure hardware company. > Regretably, one of the (many) mistakes made by the > current Bush administration was to hand Microsoft a > punishment so light that it doesn't even count as a > slap on the wrist. > > Colin McGregor > > (*) Keep in mind that it isn't illegal to have a > (near) monopoly, as for example Heinz has some 90% of > the ketchup market. What is illegal is how you obtain > that monopoly, and how you use that monopoly position. > For example, a supermarket does not have to sell Heinz > marinade sauce in order to be able to sell Heinz > ketchup. Likewise Heinz does not use their ketchup > profits to sell their baby food below cost (with a > view to getting a monopoly in that area too). > > > > On August 24, 2005 07:09, Colin McGregor wrote: > > > --- Jamon Camisso > > wrote: > > > > Colin McGregor wrote: > > > > > I was trying to locate stills from the short > > lived > > > > > (so-so) TV show "Century City", as the > > computer > > > > > > > > shown > > > > > > > > > on the web site below look similar to (the > > same > > > > > as?!?!) to the computers on "Century City". I > > was > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > able to turn up any pictures of the computers > > in > > > > > "Century City", so I am not sure if that is > > where > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > images below came from. Anyway "Century City" > > was > > > > > > > > set > > > > > > > > > in the year 2030, and the computers were NOT > > real > > > > > (very plausable that we would have computers > > > > > > > > looking > > > > > > > > > like before the year 2030, but not today). > > > > > > > > > > Colin McGregor > > > > > > > > Part of me hopes that a transparent LCD screen > > won't > > > > ever have the > > > > vibrance and saturation of colours that is the > > norm > > > > on mid range and up > > > > CRTs. The age old function vs. form dilemma I > > > > suppose. > > > > > > I have a 21" CRT monitor on my desk, and yes I > > love > > > the size, sharpness, etc. of the screen. On the > > other > > > hand I would also be VERY happy to have a LOT less > > of > > > my desktop chewed up with that hulking monster. > > So, > > > give me a cheap large transparent LCD screen that > > > matches the vibrance and saturation of a CRT and > > I'll > > > be very interested. > > > > > > As for the keyboard in the picture, it is a flat > > slab, > > > and yes there are flat slab keyboards sort of like > > > that today, in industrial settings (where they > > have to > > > worry about chemicals being spilled on the > > keyboard, > > > and want something that can be just wiped clean). > > But > > > normally people WANT the touch of a keyboard that > > > moves when they hit a key, and unless there is > > some > > > pressing reason to do otherwise (i.e. some > > industrial > > > settings) that is the way people go. In my case I > > hate > > > the look, but love the feel of the "natural" > > keyboards > > > and would want a comfortable keyboard in the > > future. > > > Pleasantly ironic, the keyboard and mouse on my > > main > > > home Linux box were built by Microsoft, a company > > that > > > does @#$% software, but comfortable (and ugly) > > > keyboards/mice. > > > > > > Colin McGregor > > > -- > > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: > > http://tlug.ss.org > > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text > > below 80 columns > > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: > > http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > > -- > > there's no place like 127.0.0.1 > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: > > http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text > > below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: > > http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 21:12:06 2005 From: marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Marcus Brubaker) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 17:12:06 -0400 Subject: Dynamic DNS provider needed In-Reply-To: <430CE0EF.3010700-VFlxZYho3OA@public.gmane.org> References: <430CE0EF.3010700@knet.ca> Message-ID: <430CE2A6.5000104@utoronto.ca> I use dynup.net. I setup a script to update it when I get a new address from DHCP and haven't thought about for a few years now. Marcus teddy mills wrote: > > For us linux users who run linux servers on dynamic ips here in Toronto, > what Dynamic DNS providers would one recommend and why? > > (Obviously this is not a good business solution, just something one > would use at home or a quick hack ?) > (and preferrably in the free category, otherwise I would just go get a > static ip) > (im sure this thread will be a mile long) > > > > > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From talexb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 21:15:07 2005 From: talexb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Alex Beamish) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 17:15:07 -0400 Subject: Dynamic DNS provider needed In-Reply-To: <430CE0EF.3010700-VFlxZYho3OA@public.gmane.org> References: <430CE0EF.3010700@knet.ca> Message-ID: On 8/24/05, teddy mills wrote: > > For us linux users who run linux servers on dynamic ips here in Toronto, > what Dynamic DNS providers would one recommend and why? > > (Obviously this is not a good business solution, just something one > would use at home or a quick hack ?) > (and preferrably in the free category, otherwise I would just go get a > static ip) I can highly recommend dyndns.org. Instead of writing down an IP address that changes every now and again, now I just ssh to my dyndns.org domain and I'm in. Very cool -- and additional services are available at a very good price. Alex Beamish > (im sure this thread will be a mile long) > > > > > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- ---------- Linux, Firefox and GMail .. what a combination. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 21:19:30 2005 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (psema4) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 17:19:30 -0400 Subject: Dynamic DNS provider needed In-Reply-To: <430CE0EF.3010700-VFlxZYho3OA@public.gmane.org> References: <430CE0EF.3010700@knet.ca> Message-ID: <99a6c38f05082414196bfa5c5a@mail.gmail.com> On 8/24/05, teddy mills wrote: > For us linux users who run linux servers on dynamic ips here in Toronto, > what Dynamic DNS providers would one recommend and why? When I need it, dyndns (http://www.dyndns.com/). There are auto-update clients for it though I haven't used them a whole lot. Using it just because a friend told me about it. I have no reason for complaints with them - it's always been fairly reliable. -- - SGE -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 21:41:53 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 17:41:53 -0400 Subject: Dynamic DNS provider needed In-Reply-To: References: <430CE0EF.3010700@knet.ca> Message-ID: <430CE9A1.7090705@rogers.com> Alex Beamish wrote: > On 8/24/05, teddy mills wrote: >>For us linux users who run linux servers on dynamic ips here in Toronto, >>what Dynamic DNS providers would one recommend and why? >> >>(Obviously this is not a good business solution, just something one >>would use at home or a quick hack ?) >>(and preferrably in the free category, otherwise I would just go get a >>static ip) > > I can highly recommend dyndns.org. Instead of writing down an IP > address that changes every now and again, now I just ssh to my > dyndns.org domain and I'm in. > > Very cool -- and additional services are available at a very good price. I'm on Rogers and while they use DHCP, the addresses are virtually static. Also, the host names, being derived from MAC addresses are consistent, so even if the IP changes the host name doesn't. >>(im sure this thread will be a mile long) Perhaps 1.6 KM? ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 21:46:10 2005 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 17:46:10 -0400 Subject: Alternatives to Trac In-Reply-To: <1e55af9905082411211d64e79d-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <1e55af9905082411211d64e79d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 8/24/05, Sy wrote: > Trac is really young, and I'm not particularly happy with it. The two > solutions I have are to either work with them in some kind of SQA / > suggestion capacity, or to find an alternative. Trac is pretty old, as far as I can tell; it was documented in CACM back in volume 9 (e.g. - 1966). And I remember seeing it in _Computer Lib_ many moons ago... There's a reimplementation project (look for project "trac2001" at SourceForge) ML/I is probably of more interest; it was originally written in PDP7 assembler, but Parzival has redone it in C... Parzival argues it's way better than M4; it looks pretty similar to SNOBOL to me, but I don't see it being likely that it'll become more popular than M4. I'd much rather try to deploy ML/I than Trac, at any rate. It seems to me that the world could indeed use a better macro-oriented text rewriting language, but I'm not quite sure what it ought to look like. cpp isn't the answer; I'm not quite sure what is... -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 22:10:59 2005 From: scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Stewart C. Russell) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 18:10:59 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <430CB6B4.6070009-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <20050824110956.40438.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <430C79F8.9060200@rogers.com> <20050824135240.GK28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <430C7F2C.5030904@rogers.com> <20050824145502.GO28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <430C9CDF.5070509@rogers.com> <430CAF46.3050409@rogers.com> <1e55af99050824105853c77665@mail.gmail.com> <430CB6B4.6070009@rogers.com> Message-ID: <430CF073.3080904@sympatico.ca> James Knott wrote: > > Well, now that you mention it, I do have some core memory here. :-) Hah, that's way new-fangled. I'll raise you a cast-iron-and-brass Monotype matrix, probably from some time in the mid-1900s: . They -- along with the Linotype -- were the forerunner of computerized typesetting systems. cheers, Stewart -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jay-ZPnsNkHkFjk at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 22:29:08 2005 From: jay-ZPnsNkHkFjk at public.gmane.org (Jason Carson) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 18:29:08 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: <430CD89E.60302-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel@cbits.ca> <1e55af990508181426268912f@mail.gmail.com> <20050819104933.GC12387@waltdnes.org> <20050823100517.GA1966@localhost> <20050824033452.GA16120@waltdnes.org> <430CD89E.60302@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: <42401.66.11.182.5.1124922548.squirrel@cbits.ca> > Walter Dnes wrote: > >> I'm working on putting together YAF (Yet Another FAQ) for Gentoo >> newbies. It's almost as much of a HOW_NOT_TO as it is a HOW_TO. It >> will mention stuff like... >> - *NOT* unrolling every last single loop or implementing every last >> single exotic generic compiler "optimization" >> - *NOT* exceeding -O2 My gentoo optimizations are the following and everything works fine -O3 -march=athlon-xp -fomit-frame-pointer -funroll-loops -pipe -m3dnow -mmmx -msse >> - *NOT* exceeding "MAKEOPTS=-j1" >> - *NOT* using fbsplash until you have Gentoo up and running first. >> For that matter, avoid framebuffer altogether if you can. This may >> not be an option on non-X86 architectures. >> - *NOT* using PAM unless you are already familiar with it. Gentoo has >> a steep learning curve. PAM has a steep learning curve. Learning >> *BOTH OF THEM AT THE SAME TIME* is more like climbing up the side of >> a cliff. > > Sounds good, you just missed the final obvious caveat ;-) > > - *NOT* wasting your time compiling software > > Fraser > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- Jason Carson http://cbits.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 22:28:24 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 18:28:24 -0400 Subject: Microsoft hardware, wasOT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <430CA9CC.26148.2A4AFA70@localhost> References: <200508241059.26399.glayng@sympatico.ca> <20050824172829.40384.qmail@web88205.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <430CA9CC.26148.2A4AFA70@localhost> Message-ID: <1e55af9905082415282d5788aa@mail.gmail.com> I just happened upon it on a break, so I picked up an IBM model m2 keyboard for the office. It's nice and quiet. mmmm.. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 22:31:29 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 18:31:29 -0400 Subject: Dynamic DNS provider needed In-Reply-To: <430CE0EF.3010700-VFlxZYho3OA@public.gmane.org> References: <430CE0EF.3010700@knet.ca> Message-ID: <1e55af99050824153168a06e65@mail.gmail.com> On 8/24/05, teddy mills wrote: > what Dynamic DNS providers would one recommend and why? I have used dyndns.org for years. I just recently checked out no-ip for a domain registration and I have dynamic dns with them as well. I highly recommend dyndns.. setting it up with my IPCop firewall was trivial, and it takes care of the magic for me.. FYI, dyndns doesn't recommend using a hardware client to update their service, as they've had plenty of manufacturers make broken devices. They recommend trying one of the many software IP updating clients. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 22:33:05 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 18:33:05 -0400 Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <430CA170.22910.2A2A558A@localhost> References: <430B8E79.21263.25F84079@localhost> <1e55af9905082318338f15f51@mail.gmail.com> <430CA170.22910.2A2A558A@localhost> Message-ID: <1e55af990508241533265eb30e@mail.gmail.com> On 8/24/05, pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org wrote: > > On 8/23/05, pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org wrote: > > > > Check out the computer shown on some graphics I found at: > > > > http://alimentarus.net/ComputerGiqueChic (my web site) > > > > Do you have any background on these pics? They just look like bad > > fashion pics to me.. > > No, unfortunately not. They are just d/l'ed from the newsgroup > alt.binaries.pictures.wallpaper, out of context, and without photo > credits. The pictures may have EXIF or other data in them.. maybe the gimp can peek inside for more information? You never know... -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 22:34:38 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 18:34:38 -0400 Subject: Microsoft hardware, wasOT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <1e55af9905082415282d5788aa-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508241059.26399.glayng@sympatico.ca> <20050824172829.40384.qmail@web88205.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <430CA9CC.26148.2A4AFA70@localhost> <1e55af9905082415282d5788aa@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <430CF5FE.9050005@rogers.com> Sy wrote: > I just happened upon it on a break, so I picked up an IBM model m2 > keyboard for the office. It's nice and quiet. mmmm.. > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml I picked up a few Model M keyboards for $5 each, a few years ago. I'm using one as I tpe^H^Hype this note. ;-) They are a very nice keyboard, far better than most. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 22:40:28 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 18:40:28 -0400 Subject: Alternatives to Trac In-Reply-To: References: <1e55af9905082411211d64e79d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1e55af9905082415402372c5c2@mail.gmail.com> On 8/24/05, Christopher Browne wrote: > On 8/24/05, Sy wrote: > > Trac is really young, and I'm not particularly happy with it. The two > > solutions I have are to either work with them in some kind of SQA / > > suggestion capacity, or to find an alternative. > > Trac is pretty old, as far as I can tell; it was documented in CACM > back in volume 9 (e.g. - 1966). And I remember seeing it in _Computer > Lib_ many moons ago... > > There's a reimplementation project (look for project "trac2001" at SourceForge) > > ML/I is probably of more interest; it was originally written in PDP7 > assembler, but Parzival has redone it in C... > > > > Parzival argues it's way better than M4; it looks pretty similar to > SNOBOL to me, but I don't see it being likely that it'll become more > popular than M4. > > I'd much rather try to deploy ML/I than Trac, at any rate. > > It seems to me that the world could indeed use a better macro-oriented > text rewriting language, but I'm not quite sure what it ought to look > like. cpp isn't the answer; I'm not quite sure what is... That was extremely eery to read.. and as I don't see any sarcasm in it.. I'll just link to The SCM/Project management Trac: http://www.edgewall.com/trac/ And back away slowly... -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 23:07:38 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 19:07:38 -0400 Subject: Alternatives to Trac In-Reply-To: <430CC015.80907-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw@public.gmane.org> References: <1e55af9905082411211d64e79d@mail.gmail.com> <430CC015.80907@cheapersafer.com> Message-ID: <1e55af990508241607185313c2@mail.gmail.com> On 8/24/05, Rob Sutherland wrote: > There's Gforge, http://gforge.org/ ...I don't think it has a wiki though. I checked it out: http://gforge.org/ They do have one of the lesser wikis, but that's fine.. I wasn't expecting mediawiki compatibility. Looking them up, I can't seem to fine a decent demo. I did bump into eduforge: http://eduforge.org/ Maybe I should make an account with them to hack around with it.. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 23:20:03 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 19:20:03 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Microsoft hardware, wasOT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <20050824200706.GP28567-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050824200706.GP28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20050824232003.96463.qmail@web88205.mail.re2.yahoo.com> --- Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Wed, Aug 24, 2005 at 03:24:20PM -0400, Igor > Denisov wrote: > > I use a Logitech MX700 wireless mouse and > keyboard, with most of the > > hotkeys enabled (like the volume control dial, > awesome :-) by Lineak. > > > > That said, I've seen Microsoft optical mice sold > for under 10 bucks in > > regular retail stores and that's what connected to > my other box... > > I can buy logitech optical mice for $10 to $13 each, > so why not get > that? Because if you hit the right sale you can get a Microsoft wireless optical mouse for $10 (ok, so I've stuffed the mouse with a pair of AA rechargeable lithium batteries (leftovers from another project), which in a sense should be added in to the cost, still...). I have not yet figured out how to make the side-to-side thing with the wheel work, but one problem at a time :-) . Colin McGregor > I just picked up an MX1000 for $77 which is rather > nice to use. I still > have to figure out what to use all the buttons for. > > Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 23:26:57 2005 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 19:26:57 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Alternatives to Trac In-Reply-To: <1e55af9905082415402372c5c2-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <1e55af9905082415402372c5c2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 24 Aug 2005, Sy wrote: > > > Trac is really young, and I'm not particularly happy with it... > > Trac is pretty old, as far as I can tell; it was documented in CACM > > back in volume 9 (e.g. - 1966)... > > That was extremely eery to read.. and as I don't see any sarcasm in > it... You two are talking about two completely different pieces of software which happen to share the same name. > http://www.edgewall.com/trac/ The folks at Edgewall don't seem to be aware, at first glance, that they're re-using the name of a slightly-weird 1960s programming language. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From andrew-2KHxOkysSnqmy7d5DmSz6TlRY1/6cnIP at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 25 04:01:57 2005 From: andrew-2KHxOkysSnqmy7d5DmSz6TlRY1/6cnIP at public.gmane.org (Andrew Cowie) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 14:01:57 +1000 Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: <20050823100517.GA1966@localhost> References: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel@cbits.ca> <1e55af990508181426268912f@mail.gmail.com> <20050819104933.GC12387@waltdnes.org> <20050823100517.GA1966@localhost> Message-ID: <1124942517.4627.17.camel@sirius.syd.operationaldynamics.com> On Tue, 2005-23-08 at 06:05 -0400, Scott Allen wrote: > You have to watch Gentoo. Being a source based system that makes it > easy to choose the optimisation flags, [but] a "best-tweaked" system > can also become unstable. Big time. Conversely, having been conservative in both my CFLAGS and in choosing when to do upgrades (ie only when I need them, allowing dependencies to evolve slowly as a result, and only running bleeding edge packages when I know what I'm getting into) I have had a number of extremely stable systems. You really don't want anything more than: CFLAGS=-02 -pipe -march=pentium3 O2 is more than a sufficient optimizations (not to mention generally common in other distros so quite safe) whereas I *have* found that the ability to specify the processor architecture results a fairly significant gain. [That's subjective, but compared against the Debian installation that proceeded the Gentoo installation on one particular system, switching from generic x86 machine code to machine code that included Pentium3 specific instructions gave me a 5% or so boost on the tasks for which I had reasonably accurate time experience. ] Trying to optimize any further on a system wide basis is sheer foolishness. I once ran into an idiot who had built his X server (along with everything else) with -ffast-math. Uh, mate, fast-math means that floating point libraries are approximated away with integer operations. Good for crypto. Bad for measuring distance. Needless to say his machine was crashing left and right. AfC Sydney -- Andrew Frederick Cowie Managing Director Toronto: (416) 848 6072 http://www.operationaldynamics.com/ Management Consultants specializing in strategy, organizational architecture, procedures to survive change, and performance hardening for the people and systems behind the mission critical enterprise. Sydney New York Toronto London -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 24 01:15:20 2005 From: hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Howard Gibson) Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 21:15:20 -0400 Subject: The best OS to deal with Flash Cards In-Reply-To: <200508221913.14811.marc-bbkyySd1vPWsTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508221913.14811.marc@lijour.net> Message-ID: <20050823211520.1cdc134d.hgibson@eol.ca> On Mon, 22 Aug 2005 19:13:14 -0400 Marc Lijour wrote: > Hi > > what is would be the best OS + the best filesystem to deal with flash cards? > > I see a lot of linux resources on the web... > > Thanks Marc, I am using VFAT filesystems on my flash card because I access the thing on my Microsoft XP PC at work. All the files on the flash card are interpreted by Linux as executable, which make it somewhat inconvenient to transfer things back and forth between flash to hard drive. If only XP understood ext3. Or would that make ext3 evil. :( -- Howard Gibson hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org howard-42qnO8ePF9cV+D8aMU/kSg at public.gmane.org http://home.eol.ca/~hgibson -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 25 04:59:34 2005 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 00:59:34 -0400 (EDT) Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: References: <20050824110956.40438.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <430C79F8.9060200@rogers.com> <20050824135240.GK28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <430C7F2C.5030904@rogers.com> <20050824145502.GO28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <430C9CDF.5070509@rogers.com> <430CAF46.3050409@rogers.com> <1e55af99050824105853c77665@mail.gmail.com> <430CB6B4.6070009@rogers.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 24 Aug 2005, Joseph Kubik wrote: > This isn't off topic.... just off century. The anomalous temporal event has been detected by TIME (the Temporal Investigative and Monitoring Executive)[1] and has now been corrected. No further verifiable evidence of these monitors will be found. Thank you for your assistance in this matter. [1] I can't take credit for this cool acronym, it appears in several SciFi books. Rob -- Robert Brockway B.Sc. Phone: +1-416-669-3073 Senior Technical Consultant Email: support-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Web: www.opentrend.net We are open 24x7x365 for technical support. Call us in a crisis. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 25 05:37:56 2005 From: hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (D. Hugh Redelmeier) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 01:37:56 -0400 (EDT) Subject: OT - Is this computer for real? (CORRECTION) In-Reply-To: <200508241513.00635.glayng-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <20050824110956.40438.qmail@web88209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <430CAF46.3050409@rogers.com> <1e55af99050824105853c77665@mail.gmail.com> <200508241513.00635.glayng@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: | From: Gary Layng | I have a keepsake of my late mother: a computer card storage box. | The computer company? Remington-Rand. She stopped working when she became | pregnant with her first child, back in 1950/1951. Remington-Rand only became (the owner of) a computer company in 1950 when they bought the Eckert-Mauchly Computer Corporation. So the box may predate that. They surely didn't sell any computers in Canada for a few years. Remington Rand cards were different from IBM cards. They had 90 characters (two rows of 45 columns) unlike IBM cards with 80 characters in 80 columns. (IBM introduced a new format of punch card in the 1970's that was a lot like the RR punch card: 96 characters in two rows of 48 columns.) http://www.fourmilab.ch/documents/univac/cards.html IBM cards were totally dominant. In all the years I used punch cards, I never saw a Remington Rand card. I did see a Univac keypunch, but it punched IBM cards. I still use punch cards, but only as "index cards" (I write notes on the back). I sometimes look at what was punched on the front and remember when I wrote that program. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From scotta-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 25 11:33:55 2005 From: scotta-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Scott Allen) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 07:33:55 -0400 Subject: Dynamic DNS provider needed In-Reply-To: <430CE0EF.3010700-VFlxZYho3OA@public.gmane.org>; from teddymills-VFlxZYho3OA@public.gmane.org on Wed, Aug 24, 2005 at 17:04:47 -0400 References: <430CE0EF.3010700@knet.ca> Message-ID: <20050825113355.GA2022@localhost> On Wed Aug 24,2005 05:04:47 PM teddy mills wrote: > For us linux users who run linux servers on dynamic ips here in > Toronto, > what Dynamic DNS providers would one recommend and why? I'm using for a Coyote Linux based firewall. It's worked fine for me so far (only a month or so). I chose them because they're one of the ones supported by the Coyote Linux dynamic DNS package that I found, and they appear to be a Toronto based company. You can get a dynserv.ca subdomain. They list clients available for Linux and many other OS's. -- ** Scott Allen scotta-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org ** ** Toronto, Ontario, Canada ** -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 25 12:25:47 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 07:25:47 -0500 Subject: The best OS to deal with Flash Cards In-Reply-To: <20050823211520.1cdc134d.hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200508221913.14811.marc@lijour.net> <20050823211520.1cdc134d.hgibson@eol.ca> Message-ID: <1e55af99050825052574d00ccc@mail.gmail.com> On 8/23/05, Howard Gibson wrote: > If only XP understood ext3. Or would that make ext3 evil. :( Does anyone know of an ext2 driver for Windows.. I seem to remember hearing about such a thing... http://e2fsprogs.sourceforge.net/ext2.html http://www.yipton.demon.co.uk/ # FSDEXT2 --- A (read-only) ext2 filesystem driver for Windows 95, implemented as Windows 95 File System Driver (FSD). This driver is maintained by Peter van Sebille (pese-Cy+3ovh/KPEjqkaaLfIQMvP6llvjuJOh at public.gmane.org). http://www.sourceforge.net/projects/ext2fsd # Ext2fsd, An ext2 filesystem driver for Windows NT/2K/XP. The most recent version has read-write support. If you have control of the windows box, this might be a good thing to check out. It would, of course, remove compatibility to random windows boxes in the world at large. A separate partition on the device or a cd with the drivers might be an alternative to that. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 25 12:53:41 2005 From: Chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org (Chris Friedt) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 08:53:41 -0400 Subject: Dynamic DNS provider needed Message-ID: I would suggest using www.no-ip.com . I've been running several servers / networks from their free services for ... jeez ... a donkey's years. They include an easily rc-scriptable binary and source as well. ~/Chris ~/Chris ______________________________ Christopher Friedt Ryerson University Computing & Communication Services (416) 979-5000 x6831 chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org >>> teddymills-VFlxZYho3OA at public.gmane.org 8/24/05 5:04:47 pm >>> For us linux users who run linux servers on dynamic ips here in Toronto, what Dynamic DNS providers would one recommend and why? (Obviously this is not a good business solution, just something one would use at home or a quick hack ?) (and preferrably in the free category, otherwise I would just go get a static ip) (im sure this thread will be a mile long) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 25 13:46:11 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 09:46:11 -0400 Subject: The best OS to deal with Flash Cards In-Reply-To: <1e55af99050825052574d00ccc-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <200508221913.14811.marc@lijour.net> <20050823211520.1cdc134d.hgibson@eol.ca> <1e55af99050825052574d00ccc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Sy wrote: > On 8/23/05, Howard Gibson wrote: > >> If only XP understood ext3. Or would that make ext3 evil. :( > > > Does anyone know of an ext2 driver for Windows.. I seem to remember > hearing about such a thing... > > http://e2fsprogs.sourceforge.net/ext2.html > > http://www.yipton.demon.co.uk/ > # FSDEXT2 --- A (read-only) ext2 filesystem driver for Windows 95, > implemented as Windows 95 File System Driver (FSD). This driver is > maintained by Peter van Sebille (pese-Cy+3ovh/KPEjqkaaLfIQMvP6llvjuJOh at public.gmane.org). > > http://www.sourceforge.net/projects/ext2fsd > # Ext2fsd, An ext2 filesystem driver for Windows NT/2K/XP. The most > recent version has read-write support. > How about reiserfs? Anyone familiar with this driver? http://rfsd.sourceforge.net/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 25 14:20:39 2005 From: jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 10:20:39 -0400 Subject: Dynamic DNS provider needed In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Just adding to the list, I've been using dhs.org for many years now and have no complaints. -- taa /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 25 16:47:21 2005 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 12:47:21 -0400 Subject: The best OS to deal with Flash Cards In-Reply-To: References: <200508221913.14811.marc@lijour.net> <20050823211520.1cdc134d.hgibson@eol.ca> <1e55af99050825052574d00ccc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 8/25/05, Jamon Camisso wrote: > Sy wrote: > > On 8/23/05, Howard Gibson wrote: > > > >> If only XP understood ext3. Or would that make ext3 evil. :( > > > > > > Does anyone know of an ext2 driver for Windows.. I seem to remember > > hearing about such a thing... > > > > http://e2fsprogs.sourceforge.net/ext2.html > > > > http://www.yipton.demon.co.uk/ > > # FSDEXT2 --- A (read-only) ext2 filesystem driver for Windows 95, > > implemented as Windows 95 File System Driver (FSD). This driver is > > maintained by Peter van Sebille (pese-Cy+3ovh/KPEjqkaaLfIQMvP6llvjuJOh at public.gmane.org). > > > > http://www.sourceforge.net/projects/ext2fsd > > # Ext2fsd, An ext2 filesystem driver for Windows NT/2K/XP. The most > > recent version has read-write support. > > > How about reiserfs? Anyone familiar with this driver? > http://rfsd.sourceforge.net/ It seems to me that a journalling filesystem is the very last thing I want to use on a flash card which has the vital property of limited numbers of writes that can be applied to it. The journal is, by its nature, designed to be a "hot spot" on the disk that is updated extremely heavily, which will, by its design, shorten the lifespan of the flash device. For a flash device, there are only three filesystems I'd consider: 1. VFAT - because so many kinds of devices understand it including my PalmOS device and even my digital camera 2. ext2 - because various OSes can mount it, including Linux, Windows, and *BSD. 3. minixfs - not as easily portable, but a very simple filesystem for what amounts to a "big floppy disk". And there are "minitools" for DOS as well as a FreeBSD 4.x driver... VFAT is at the top of that list, BTW... I may despise it as a choice for use on one's "system hard drive," but as an extension of the CP/M filesystems originally created for use with small disks, there is actually a decent fit between design/purpose and use, for this application... -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Aug 25 17:07:18 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 13:07:18 -0400 Subject: The best OS to deal with Flash Cards In-Reply-To: References: <200508221913.14811.marc@lijour.net> <20050823211520.1cdc134d.hgibson@eol.ca> <1e55af99050825052574d00ccc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050825170718.GQ28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Aug 25, 2005 at 12:47:21PM -0400, Christopher Browne wrote: > It seems to me that a journalling filesystem is the very last thing I > want to use on a flash card which has the vital property of limited > numbers of writes that can be applied to it. > > The journal is, by its nature, designed to be a "hot spot" on the disk > that is updated extremely heavily, which will, by its design, shorten > the lifespan of the flash device. Do you think the journal is a problem compared to the superblock and other meta data blocks of almost all normal filesystems? Only things like jffs that explicitly have rotating blocks used for the superblock info are properly designed for flash use. Of course since _most_ decent flash media does wear leveling in hardware, you shouldn't have to worry about it to much. I use ext3 on compact flash and certainly the reduced fsck problems in case of a power failure far outweigh the issues of the journal. > For a flash device, there are only three filesystems I'd consider: > > 1. VFAT - because so many kinds of devices understand it including my > PalmOS device and even my digital camera > > 2. ext2 - because various OSes can mount it, including Linux, > Windows, and *BSD. > > 3. minixfs - not as easily portable, but a very simple filesystem for > what amounts to a "big floppy disk". And there are "minitools" for > DOS as well as a FreeBSD 4.x driver... > > VFAT is at the top of that list, BTW... I may despise it as a choice > for use on one's "system hard drive," but as an extension of the CP/M > filesystems originally created for use with small disks, there is > actually a decent fit between design/purpose and use, for this > application... Well VFAT is common since everyone supports it, I wouldn't personally consider either of the other two. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phillip-l+pbsqP8NtUm29vl6s1fFg at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 26 00:19:02 2005 From: phillip-l+pbsqP8NtUm29vl6s1fFg at public.gmane.org (phil) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 20:19:02 -0400 Subject: is bigger better? (istop vs. cybersurf) In-Reply-To: <430E5E9E.4080808-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> References: <1d085e5505080311125b96090a@mail.gmail.com> <20050803183229.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <42F16B1D.4080202@istop.com> <20050803235508.27929660.hgibson@eol.ca> <430E5E9E.4080808@istop.com> Message-ID: <01903E30-15C7-11DA-974A-00050249A5C8@millsgarthson.ca> On Aug 25, 2005, at 8:13 PM, Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > Good at least that they give me three weeks to make the payement ;) > But why to send that sort of ugly messages? > > The funniest thing in that is that the message was send from > help-AgaWndgeMsnWXxRugSxzZg at public.gmane.org, but when I replied, I thought I will fell off my > chair: "User unknown" ... The same thing happened to me today and I had the same kind of reaction to the abrupt threat in the message. Now we know: there is no "help" at cybersurf. :-) ........................ Phillip Mills Multi-platform software development (416) 224-0714 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From zkoziol-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 26 00:13:18 2005 From: zkoziol-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Zbigniew Koziol) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 20:13:18 -0400 Subject: is bigger better? (istop vs. cybersurf) In-Reply-To: <20050803235508.27929660.hgibson-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <1d085e5505080311125b96090a@mail.gmail.com> <20050803183229.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <42F16B1D.4080202@istop.com> <20050803235508.27929660.hgibson@eol.ca> Message-ID: <430E5E9E.4080808@istop.com> Some think so. Though my wife who left me says thats not always true ;) Some think also that globalization is "good"... Well, yes, it is, but for whom? My observations lead me to the following conclussion: smaller companies usually have better technical support. A two weeks ago I send email from the web site of cybersurfe asking, how much should I pay and when? I explained that I was told (by someone from Istop) that I will receive an invoice by email, as it was in case of Istop. There was no response. Today I am receiving a wwarning that my connection will be terminated in 3 weeks if I do not make two past payements (one month was free). Good at least that they give me three weeks to make the payement ;) But why to send that sort of ugly messages? The funniest thing in that is that the message was send from help-AgaWndgeMsnWXxRugSxzZg at public.gmane.org, but when I replied, I thought I will fell off my chair: "User unknown" ... zb. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 26 02:08:58 2005 From: ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ansar Mohammed) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 22:08:58 -0400 Subject: Dynamic DNS provider needed In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Dyndns.org Excellent !! > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org] On Behalf Of Taavi > Burns > Sent: August 25, 2005 10:21 AM > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Dynamic DNS provider needed > > Just adding to the list, I've been using dhs.org for many years now > and have no complaints. > > -- > taa > /*eof*/ > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From magalex-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 26 11:05:37 2005 From: magalex-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Anthony Alex) Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 07:05:37 -0400 (EDT) Subject: X troubleshoorint on labtop Message-ID: <20050826110537.54293.qmail@web88108.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Hi Guys, I have a notebook (Thinkpad iseries type 2611) on which i had installed Debian, although I ran into some minor caveats but overall the system is usable. I have Gnome as my desktop. Recently I have installed Suse9 desktop on the same system in a dual boot scenario. The install was complete but evertime I boot up the windows portion will halt with no display at all. I can however use the console ctrl+f1... in command line mode. I was hoping to get some pointers to fix the windows portion. TIA MA -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From stephenc-1+gBmcx5sBQ at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 26 13:30:59 2005 From: stephenc-1+gBmcx5sBQ at public.gmane.org (Stephen Clarke) Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 09:30:59 -0400 Subject: FC4 httpd won't start when sslengine set to on Message-ID: <20050826133057.GTOB16985.tomts36-srv.bellnexxia.net@xendor> Hey guys, OK. I set up FC4 to replace an FC2 box that got CHDS (Crunchy Hard Drive Syndrome) due to a bonehead that turned the system off by the switch. Anyway most of the stuff has gone rather well except for the ssl installation I've installed openssl and mod_ssl. When the sslengine is set to on in the ssl.conf httpd will not start {FAILED]. When sslengine is commented out the httpd error_log gives the following: [Fri Aug 26 08:55:56 2005] [notice] suEXEC mechanism enabled (wrapper: /usr/sbin/suexec) [Fri Aug 26 08:55:57 2005] [warn] Init: (host.domain:443) You configured HTTP(80) on the standard HTTPS(443) port! [Fri Aug 26 08:55:58 2005] [notice] Digest: generating secret for digest authentication ... [Fri Aug 26 08:55:58 2005] [notice] Digest: done [Fri Aug 26 08:55:58 2005] [notice] LDAP: Built with OpenLDAP LDAP SDK [Fri Aug 26 08:55:58 2005] [notice] LDAP: SSL support unavailable [Fri Aug 26 08:55:58 2005] [notice] mod_python: Creating 4 session mutexes based on 256 max processes and 0 max threads. [Fri Aug 26 08:55:59 2005] [warn] Init: (host.domain:443) You configured HTTP(80) on the standard HTTPS(443) port! [Fri Aug 26 08:55:59 2005] [notice] Apache/2.0.54 (Fedora) configured -- resuming normal operations I'm figuring that the [warn] is telling me that it can see the LISTEN 80 in my httpd.conf but I don't know why. Any and all suggestions are welcome. Thanks, Stephen My httpd.conf file is as follows: ServerTokens OS ServerRoot "/etc/httpd" PidFile run/http.pid Timeout 120 KeepAlive Off MaxKeepAliveRequests 100 KeepAlive Timeout 15 StartServers 8 MinSpareServers 5 MaxSpareServers 20 ServerLimit 256 MaxClients 256 MaxRequestsPerChild 4000 StartServers 2 MaxClients 150 MinSpareThreads 25 MaxSpareThreads 75 ThreadsPerChild 25 MaxRequestsPerChild 0 Listen 80 LoadModule access_module modules/mod_access.so LoadModule auth_module modules/mod_auth.so LoadModule auth_anon_module modules/mod_auth_anon.so LoadModule auth_dbm_module modules/mod_auth_dbm.so LoadModule auth_digest_module modules/mod_auth_digest.so LoadModule ldap_module modules/mod_ldap.so LoadModule auth_ldap_module modules/mod_auth_ldap.so LoadModule include_module modules/mod_include.so LoadModule log_config_module modules/mod_log_config.so LoadModule logio_module modules/mod_logio.so LoadModule env_module modules/mod_env.so LoadModule mime_magic_module modules/mod_mime_magic.so LoadModule cern_meta_module modules/mod_cern_meta.so LoadModule expires_module modules/mod_expires.so LoadModule deflate_module modules/mod_deflate.so LoadModule headers_module modules/mod_headers.so LoadModule usertrack_module modules/mod_usertrack.so LoadModule setenvif_module modules/mod_setenvif.so LoadModule mime_module modules/mod_mime.so LoadModule dav_module modules/mod_dav.so LoadModule status_module modules/mod_status.so LoadModule autoindex_module modules/mod_autoindex.so LoadModule asis_module modules/mod_asis.so LoadModule info_module modules/mod_info.so LoadModule dav_fs_module modules/mod_dav_fs.so LoadModule vhost_alias_module modules/mod_vhost_alias.so LoadModule negotiation_module modules/mod_negotiation.so LoadModule dir_module modules/mod_dir.so LoadModule actions_module modules/mod_actions.so LoadModule speling_module modules/mod_speling.so LoadModule userdir_module modules/mod_userdir.so LoadModule alias_module modules/mod_alias.so LoadModule rewrite_module modules/mod_rewrite.so LoadModule proxy_module modules/mod_proxy.so LoadModule proxy_ftp_module modules/mod_proxy_ftp.so LoadModule proxy_http_module modules/mod_proxy_http.so LoadModule proxy_connect_module modules/mod_proxy_connect.so LoadModule cache_module modules/mod_cache.so LoadModule suexec_module modules/mod_suexec.so LoadModule disk_cache_module modules/mod_disk_cache.so LoadModule file_cache_module modules/mod_file_cache.so LoadModule mem_cache_module modules/mod_mem_cache.so LoadModule cgi_module modules/mod_cgi.so Include conf.d/*.conf User apache Group apache ServerAdmin name at domain ServerName host.domain:80 UseCanonicalName Off DocumentRoot "/var/www/html" Options FollowSymLinks AllowOverride None Options Indexes FollowSymLinks AllowOverride None Order allow,deny Allow from all UserDir disable DirectoryIndex index.php index.htm index.html index.html.var AccessFileName .htaccess Order allow,deny Deny from all TypesConfig /etc/mime.types DefaultType text/plain MIMEMagicFile conf/magic HostnameLookups On ErrorLog logs/error_log LogLevel warn LogFormat "%h %l %u %t \"%r\" %>s %b \"%{Referer}i\" \"%{User-Agent}i\"" combined LogFormat "%h %l %u %t \"%r\" %>s %b" common LogFormat "%{Referer}i -> %U" referer LogFormat "%{User-agent}i" agent CustomLog logs/access_log combined ServerSignature EMail Alias /icons/ "/var/www/icons/" Options Indexes MultiViews AllowOverride None Order allow,deny Allow from all # Location of the WebDAV lock database. DAVLockDB /var/lib/dav/lockdb ScriptAlias /cgi-bin/ "/var/www/cgi-bin/" AllowOverride None Options None Order allow,deny Allow from all IndexOptions FancyIndexing VersionSort NameWidth=* AddIconByEncoding (CMP,/icons/compressed.gif) x-compress x-gzip AddIconByType (TXT,/icons/text.gif) text/* AddIconByType (IMG,/icons/image2.gif) image/* AddIconByType (SND,/icons/sound2.gif) audio/* AddIconByType (VID,/icons/movie.gif) video/* AddIcon /icons/binary.gif .bin .exe AddIcon /icons/binhex.gif .hqx AddIcon /icons/tar.gif .tar AddIcon /icons/world2.gif .wrl .wrl.gz .vrml .vrm .iv AddIcon /icons/compressed.gif .Z .z .tgz .gz .zip AddIcon /icons/a.gif .ps .ai .eps AddIcon /icons/layout.gif .html .shtml .htm .pdf AddIcon /icons/text.gif .txt AddIcon /icons/c.gif .c AddIcon /icons/p.gif .pl .py AddIcon /icons/f.gif .for AddIcon /icons/dvi.gif .dvi AddIcon /icons/uuencoded.gif .uu AddIcon /icons/script.gif .conf .sh .shar .csh .ksh .tcl AddIcon /icons/tex.gif .tex AddIcon /icons/bomb.gif core AddIcon /icons/back.gif .. AddIcon /icons/hand.right.gif README AddIcon /icons/folder.gif ^^DIRECTORY^^ AddIcon /icons/blank.gif ^^BLANKICON^^ DefaultIcon /icons/unknown.gif ReadmeName README.html HeaderName HEADER.html AddLanguage ca .ca AddLanguage cs .cz .cs AddLanguage da .dk AddLanguage de .de AddLanguage el .el AddLanguage en .en AddLanguage eo .eo AddLanguage es .es AddLanguage et .et AddLanguage fr .fr AddLanguage he .he AddLanguage hr .hr AddLanguage it .it AddLanguage ja .ja AddLanguage ko .ko AddLanguage ltz .ltz AddLanguage nl .nl AddLanguage nn .nn AddLanguage no .no AddLanguage pl .po AddLanguage pt .pt AddLanguage pt-BR .pt-br AddLanguage ru .ru AddLanguage sv .sv AddLanguage zh-CN .zh-cn AddLanguage zh-TW .zh-tw LanguagePriority en ca cs da de el eo es et fr he hr it ja ko ltz nl nn no pl pt pt-BR ru sv zh-CN zh-TW ForceLanguagePriority Prefer Fallback AddDefaultCharset UTF-8 AddType application/x-compress .Z AddType application/x-gzip .gz .tgz AddHandler type-map var AddType text/html .shtml AddOutputFilter INCLUDES .shtml Alias /error/ "/var/www/error/" AllowOverride None Options IncludesNoExec AddOutputFilter Includes html AddHandler type-map var Order allow,deny Allow from all LanguagePriority en es de fr ForceLanguagePriority Prefer Fallback BrowserMatch "Mozilla/2" nokeepalive BrowserMatch "MSIE 4\.0b2;" nokeepalive downgrade-1.0 force-response-1.0 BrowserMatch "RealPlayer 4\.0" force-response-1.0 BrowserMatch "Java/1\.0" force-response-1.0 BrowserMatch "JDK/1\.0" force-response-1.0 BrowserMatch "Microsoft Data Access Internet Publishing Provider" redirect-carefully BrowserMatch "^WebDrive" redirect-carefully BrowserMatch "^WebDAVFS/1.[012]" redirect-carefully BrowserMatch "^gnome-vfs" redirect-carefully -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 26 13:55:34 2005 From: rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org (Rob Sutherland) Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 13:55:34 +0000 Subject: is bigger better? (istop vs. cybersurf) In-Reply-To: <01903E30-15C7-11DA-974A-00050249A5C8-l+pbsqP8NtUm29vl6s1fFg@public.gmane.org> References: <1d085e5505080311125b96090a@mail.gmail.com> <20050803183229.GB6744@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <42F16B1D.4080202@istop.com> <20050803235508.27929660.hgibson@eol.ca> <430E5E9E.4080808@istop.com> <01903E30-15C7-11DA-974A-00050249A5C8@millsgarthson.ca> Message-ID: <430F1F56.20909@cheapersafer.com> phil wrote: > On Aug 25, 2005, at 8:13 PM, Zbigniew Koziol wrote: > >> Good at least that they give me three weeks to make the payement ;) >> But why to send that sort of ugly messages? >> >> The funniest thing in that is that the message was send from >> help-AgaWndgeMsnWXxRugSxzZg at public.gmane.org, but when I replied, I thought I will fell off my >> chair: "User unknown" ... > > > The same thing happened to me today and I had the same kind of > reaction to the abrupt threat in the message. Now we know: there is no > "help" at cybersurf. :-) We've been having nothing but trouble with Cybersurf at the Linuxcaffe. I talked to a guy at Teksavvy and he said that they've been more or less overwhelmed by all the Istop people and problems. Rob -- Rob Sutherland - http://www.cheapersafer.com Business Computer Support and Training -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 26 14:12:27 2005 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 10:12:27 -0400 Subject: X troubleshoorint on labtop In-Reply-To: <20050826110537.54293.qmail-7tcjwRQUPBmB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20050826110537.54293.qmail@web88108.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <430F234B.2080902@alteeve.com> Anthony Alex wrote: > Hi Guys, > > I have a notebook (Thinkpad iseries type 2611) on > which i had installed Debian, although I ran into some > minor caveats but overall the system is usable. I have > Gnome as my desktop. Recently I have installed Suse9 > desktop on the same system in a dual boot scenario. > > The install was complete but evertime I boot up the > windows portion will halt with no display at all. I > can however use the console ctrl+f1... in command line > mode. > > I was hoping to get some pointers to fix the windows > portion. > > TIA > MA Is X working in Debian but not Suse? When you are at the blank screen, press ++, that should kill and re-invoke X. Does that seem to do anything at all? I've got a Thinkpad A22m running Debian and I've had good luck with Debian. I haven't tried Suse yet though. Madison -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 26 15:45:28 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 11:45:28 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Linux InstallFest Waiver Message-ID: <20050826154528.49014.qmail@web88201.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Exchanged e-mails with and talked to a lawyer today, and here is a waiver that will pass here in Ontario. I will print off say 20 copies for tommorow (i.e. more copies than I expect we will need...). -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Linux InstallFest Waiver I, _______________________________ acknowledge that I am participating in the "Linux Install Festival" entirely at my own risk. By participating I assume all responsibility for the integrity of the data on my computer system, have backed up all important data, and I explicitly agree that I will not hold the Greater Toronto Area Linux User's Group or any of its volunteer helpers responsible for any loss or damage to my computer system, to my data, or for any other damages, loss or liability, to person or property, howsoever caused, that may result from my attendance or participation in this event. I further agree to be responsible for any licensing fees, shareware registrations, or other licensing requirements that may apply to the software I will receive. The purpose of this event is to distribute software packages that are Open Source, legally distributable with no charge to the user. Every reasonable effort will be made to ensure that my system operates correctly before and after the installation, but I recognize that because the software installed at this event is licensed free of charge, the copyright holder(s), the Greater Toronto Area Linux User's Group and volunteer helpers and/or other parties provide this material "as is" without warranty of any kind, either expressed or implied, including, but not limited to, the implied warranties of merchantability and fitness for a particular purpose. The entire risk as to the quality and performance of this software, and the accuracy of its associated documentation, any effect it may have on my hardware, software or system is entirely with me. Should this software or its associated documentation prove defective, I assume the cost of all necessary servicing, repair, or correction. Signature: __________________________________ Date: ___________ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 26 17:08:19 2005 From: josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Joseph Kubik) Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 13:08:19 -0400 Subject: X troubleshoorint on labtop In-Reply-To: <430F234B.2080902-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20050826110537.54293.qmail@web88108.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <430F234B.2080902@alteeve.com> Message-ID: There should be one or more files in /var/log/ named X* that have the error messages from X failing to start. Either what are those errors, or can you post the most recent error file? -Joseph- On 8/26/05, Madison Kelly wrote: > Anthony Alex wrote: > > Hi Guys, > > > > I have a notebook (Thinkpad iseries type 2611) on > > which i had installed Debian, although I ran into some > > minor caveats but overall the system is usable. I have > > Gnome as my desktop. Recently I have installed Suse9 > > desktop on the same system in a dual boot scenario. > > > > The install was complete but evertime I boot up the > > windows portion will halt with no display at all. I > > can however use the console ctrl+f1... in command line > > mode. > > > > I was hoping to get some pointers to fix the windows > > portion. > > > > TIA > > MA > > Is X working in Debian but not Suse? When you are at the blank screen, > press ++, that should kill and re-invoke X. Does > that seem to do anything at all? I've got a Thinkpad A22m running Debian > and I've had good luck with Debian. I haven't tried Suse yet though. > > Madison > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 26 19:29:13 2005 From: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org) Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 15:29:13 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Pathcom Tech Supports Linux Message-ID: <50086.207.188.66.19.1125084553.squirrel@207.188.66.19> I just got off the phone with the tech help support line at Pathway Communications, our family ISP. In the past, I've always worked from a Windows machine to sort out technical problems, but this time the tech guy was quite happy to work with Linux, and we tracked down the problem - a software issue at my end. He was also unfazed by the presence of the Linksys router. The fact that Pathway will troubleshoot linux connections might be a consideration for anyone setting up non-technical friends and family on a linux-based machine. Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 26 19:45:26 2005 From: Chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org (Chris Friedt) Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 15:45:26 -0400 Subject: X troubleshoorint on labtop Message-ID: Ctrl+Alt+Backspace will actually kill the current X-session, but usually if xdm / gdm or whatever is running it will try to restart the X-session almost immediately. I've noticed in the past (specifically w/ gdm) that sometimes you really have to fight with it before it will give up!! ~/Chris ______________________________ Christopher Friedt Ryerson University Computing & Communication Services (416) 979-5000 x6831 chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org >>> linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org 8/26/05 10:12:27 am >>> Anthony Alex wrote: > Hi Guys, > > I have a notebook (Thinkpad iseries type 2611) on > which i had installed Debian, although I ran into some > minor caveats but overall the system is usable. I have > Gnome as my desktop. Recently I have installed Suse9 > desktop on the same system in a dual boot scenario. > > The install was complete but evertime I boot up the > windows portion will halt with no display at all. I > can however use the console ctrl+f1... in command line > mode. > > I was hoping to get some pointers to fix the windows > portion. > > TIA > MA Is X working in Debian but not Suse? When you are at the blank screen, press ++, that should kill and re-invoke X. Does that seem to do anything at all? I've got a Thinkpad A22m running Debian and I've had good luck with Debian. I haven't tried Suse yet though. Madison -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Fri Aug 26 23:07:44 2005 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 19:07:44 -0400 Subject: Linux Benchmarking In-Reply-To: <42401.66.11.182.5.1124922548.squirrel-ZPnsNkHkFjk@public.gmane.org> References: <42042.66.11.182.5.1124339341.squirrel@cbits.ca> <1e55af990508181426268912f@mail.gmail.com> <20050819104933.GC12387@waltdnes.org> <20050823100517.GA1966@localhost> <20050824033452.GA16120@waltdnes.org> <430CD89E.60302@georgetown.wehave.net> <42401.66.11.182.5.1124922548.squirrel@cbits.ca> Message-ID: <20050826230744.GA20539@waltdnes.org> On Wed, Aug 24, 2005 at 06:29:08PM -0400, Jason Carson wrote > > > Walter Dnes wrote: > > > >> I'm working on putting together YAF (Yet Another FAQ) for Gentoo > >> newbies. It's almost as much of a HOW_NOT_TO as it is a HOW_TO. It > >> will mention stuff like... > >> - *NOT* unrolling every last single loop or implementing every last > >> single exotic generic compiler "optimization" > >> - *NOT* exceeding -O2 > > My gentoo optimizations are the following and everything works fine > > -O3 -march=athlon-xp -fomit-frame-pointer -funroll-loops -pipe -m3dnow > -mmmx -msse Change the the "-O3" to "-O2" and drop "-funroll-loops", and you'll be stable. You can add "-mfpmath=sse", unless you have one of the early, buggy AMDs. -- Walter Dnes My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From billmudry-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 27 01:15:46 2005 From: billmudry-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Bill Mudry) Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 21:15:46 -0400 Subject: Next PHLUG meeting this Tuesday. Message-ID: <6.2.0.14.0.20050826210720.042c4d40@mail.eol.ca> It is time for our next PHLUG meeting next Tuesday. As with our other meetings: - the start time as 6:30 PM., moved a bit earlier since some programmers like coming earlier - The Location will be Mulligans again at the Woodchester Mall in Mississauga (off Dundas between Erin Mills Parkway and Winston Churchill). There is lots of good food for you to chose from and all the Linux talk you care to dive into --- no constraints here on tech-talk. The weather proves to be a huge improvement on the storm we had last month. I have heard that there will be a flock of penguin lovers coming .................. You are cordially invited. Bill Mudry -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 27 01:45:27 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 21:45:27 -0400 Subject: demo at installfest Message-ID: <20050827014527.GA25750@node1.opengeometry.net> GTALUG is putting on InstallFest at Centennial College, 755 Morningside Ave, room 418 (NE corner of Ellesmere & Morningside in Scarborough) Aug 27, Sat, 9:30am-2pm Yes, it's tomorrow. Sorry for the short notice. I forgot. I'll be demoing my Linux thin-client on USB key and NFS root. So, if you would like to see a demo, then you're invited. A bit far from Kitchener/Waterloo, but, just in case, you have nothing to do. :-) Yours truly, -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 27 02:01:36 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 22:01:36 -0400 Subject: Next PHLUG meeting this Tuesday. In-Reply-To: <6.2.0.14.0.20050826210720.042c4d40-9yrvbIq3RigsA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <6.2.0.14.0.20050826210720.042c4d40@mail.eol.ca> Message-ID: <430FC980.9000607@rogers.com> I thought it was the first Tuesday of the month, not the last. Bill Mudry wrote: > It is time for our next PHLUG meeting next Tuesday. As with our other > meetings: > > - the start time as 6:30 PM., moved a bit earlier since some > programmers like coming earlier > - The Location will be Mulligans again at the Woodchester Mall in > Mississauga > (off Dundas between Erin Mills Parkway and Winston Churchill). > > There is lots of good food for you to chose from and all the Linux talk > you care to dive into --- no constraints > here on tech-talk. The weather proves to be a huge improvement on the > storm we had last month. > I have heard that there will be a flock of penguin lovers coming > .................. > > You are cordially invited. > > Bill Mudry > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From erebus-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 27 10:41:16 2005 From: erebus-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Frank McCarron (Erebus)) Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 06:41:16 -0400 Subject: Next PHLUG meeting this Tuesday. In-Reply-To: <430FC980.9000607-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <430FC980.9000607@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20050827104121.7BDF6121347@acheron.ss.org> I think it's the first Tuesday as well (which would be like Sept 6) Frank -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org] On Behalf Of James Knott Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 10:02 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Next PHLUG meeting this Tuesday. I thought it was the first Tuesday of the month, not the last. Bill Mudry wrote: > It is time for our next PHLUG meeting next Tuesday. As with our other > meetings: > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Aug 27 11:54:16 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2005 07:54:16 -0400 Subject: Next PHLUG meeting this Tuesday. In-Reply-To: <20050827104121.7BDF6121347-mb4phVZFrfSXFJAUJl40Xg@public.gmane.org> References: <20050827104121.7BDF6121347@acheron.ss.org> Message-ID: <43105468.3090000@rogers.com> Frank McCarron (Erebus) wrote: > I think it's the first Tuesday as well (which would be like Sept 6) It's the 6th on my calendar too. ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 28 05:55:36 2005 From: jaaaarel-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 01:55:36 -0400 Subject: Indigo cutting back Linux magazines? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 8/19/05, Steve wrote: > Maybe it's just me, but for over a month the Indigo store that USED to have > lots of Linux magazines (ones with discs) has been nearly empty of Linux > mags! Haven't seen a single copy of Linux Format or Linux Magazine for > instance. Has anyone else noticed this? Don't worry, because there's still > tons of Windows mags... and even Mac mags. I was at the Chapters on Highway 7 between Woodbine and Warden, and managed to find Linux Format (and a few others) in the "Investing" section. I thought that was fitting, until I found some Windows mags right beside the Linux ones. It looked like there wasn't a computer section; just a games section, and then other stuff lumped together with poor taste. ;) There was also discussion on the list about computer book stores. I found one that carries older titles along Yonge, directly across from Sam the Record Man (a few storefronts South of Elm). The storefront is pretty small, but the store goes waaaaaaaay into the back, and has a whole room full of older titles, along with older software. I grabbed a copy of Prince of Persia 2, but they also had copies of Mandrake 8.2 for sale, and a book on writing software with Gnome and GTK+ (albeit from 2000). Any book w/out an extra sale sticker goes for 1/2 of the publisher's recommended rate (I also snagged one book for $10 that had no sale sticker and was listed for $28USD; no clue on that one, but no complaints either!). -- taa /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 28 14:41:03 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 10:41:03 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Installfest thoughts Message-ID: <20050828144103.2485.qmail@web88208.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Well, a summay of the events, I got out to Centenial by about 8:15, and found that Seneca, and Ralph Harrington (our contact at Centenial College) were already at the room. Ralph had been kind enough to bring in some coffee and some "Tim Bits". Over the next bit other volunteers showed up, now the list of people who came included (and sorry if I missed anyone): - Danial Armstrong - Gordon Chillcott - Edward Chin - David C. Chipman - Seneca Cunningham - Teddy Mills - William Park - Allen Taylor - Amos Weatherhill Since I had assumed that I would be on my own for snacks, I had brought some mini-carrots, pita bread, and home made humus (disgusting healthy stuff, but mixed in with some Tim Bits I think it all balances out). At least two of the Centenial instructors turned up. The one thing that didn't happen was people who needed help getting Linux installed. So it became a TLUG meeting away from TLUG. Still everyone seemed to have come away fairly happy... Something to be discussed, I passed out some 300 flyers promoting this event, nobody showed, what went wrong? - Was the flyer wrong look/layout? - Did I not promote the event in the right places? - Was the date wrong (i.e.: end of summer)? - Was the place wrong (too far from subway)? - Something else? Other concerns, who speaks for GTALUG? I arranged for a release form (not needed this time out) to be checked and vetted by a local lawyer. Part way through the event I found those forms had been hidden under a pile of release forms that as far as I could tell had NOT been checked by an Ontario lawyer (never mind by one that I trust). Now, again the comes questions comes up, who speaks for GTALUG, at least for this this event I thought I was... Further could these other release forms expose myself and/or GTALUG to legal liability? On the way home I did stop off at Computer Warehouse Outlet (25 foot Cat 5 cables for $2.49 :-) also (while I didn't buy any as I already have 2), they had Microsoft Wireless mice (model 1008) for $9.99). This not far off my way home at Kennedy and Ellesmere. Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 28 16:05:49 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 12:05:49 -0400 Subject: Installfest thoughts In-Reply-To: <20050828144103.2485.qmail-JoSsSUNfUciB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20050828144103.2485.qmail@web88208.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20050828160549.GA2116@node1.opengeometry.net> On Sun, Aug 28, 2005 at 10:41:03AM -0400, Colin McGregor wrote: > Something to be discussed, I passed out some 300 > flyers promoting this event, nobody showed, what went > wrong? > > - Was the flyer wrong look/layout? > - Did I not promote the event in the right places? > - Was the date wrong (i.e.: end of summer)? > - Was the place wrong (too far from subway)? > - Something else? 1. Perhaps, the emphasis on "old computers" is misplaced. This just reinforces stereotype that Linux is for poor and cheapskates. Meaning, when you have real money, then, you should upgrade from Windows emulators to the real thing. Also, this kind of InstallFest reinforces idea that Linux is free. The software is "free" (you can do whatever with it), but everything else has cost. In fact, by the time you have another person install Linux, it costs about the same as Windows from set go. Linux lowers maintenance cost. But, here's the catch. Whereas we see this as problem to solve. There are whole IT staffs who see this as job security. 2. Perhaps, we should target local businesses and organizations with "free install promo". But, they could install Linux themselves. What's can we offer, then? Maybe, we can do something like "3-month free trial". - target local organization, business, NGO, charity, church, etc. - we'll install Linux and do custom configuration for free for 3-month (or 6, 12 month). - if they are satisfied, then they can hire GTALUG on retainer for tech support and development. > > Other concerns, who speaks for GTALUG? I arranged for a release form > (not needed this time out) to be checked and vetted by a local lawyer. > ... Unless this guy is retained by GTALUG, this point is moot. -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 28 21:13:53 2005 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 17:13:53 -0400 Subject: Serial connector stuck to computer Message-ID: <20050828211353.GA9646@waltdnes.org> This happened on my dead computer which I'm sending off to the York Region recycling depot soon, so I'm not too pee'd off. I *DONT'T* want it to happen to my bright shiny (would you believe dull beige-coloured?) new toy. I was disconnecting the peripherals from my dead machine. As an IStop customer, I got to use my backup dialup account (a totally separate ISP) on occasion. I have an old USR X2 which was flashed to v90. Anyhow, when I was taking things apart, I ended up with the thumbscrew in my hand, and the 9-pin connector was still firmly inserted into the PC's serial port... oops. After several minutes of inserting and wiggling the thing, I finally got it out. The big end came out of the modem without incident, but it was a bit balky. I'm tempted to remove the thumbscrews altogether, and simply insert the connecters when hooking up the new machine, to prevent this from happening again. Anybody ever run into this? -- Walter Dnes My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Aug 28 22:31:36 2005 From: josephkubik-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Joseph Kubik) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 18:31:36 -0400 Subject: Serial connector stuck to computer In-Reply-To: <20050828211353.GA9646-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20050828211353.GA9646@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: Err, so the screws came out fine, but the connector was still stuck? If so, not using the screws is beside the point. If you are having corrosion problems, there is a product you can buy at autoparts stores call "dialectric grease". It does not decrease conductivity, yet it keeps moisture out. Good luck, -Joseph- On 8/28/05, Walter Dnes wrote: > This happened on my dead computer which I'm sending off to the York > Region recycling depot soon, so I'm not too pee'd off. I *DONT'T* want > it to happen to my bright shiny (would you believe dull beige-coloured?) > new toy. > > I was disconnecting the peripherals from my dead machine. As an IStop > customer, I got to use my backup dialup account (a totally separate ISP) > on occasion. I have an old USR X2 which was flashed to v90. Anyhow, > when I was taking things apart, I ended up with the thumbscrew in my > hand, and the 9-pin connector was still firmly inserted into the PC's > serial port... oops. After several minutes of inserting and wiggling > the thing, I finally got it out. The big end came out of the modem > without incident, but it was a bit balky. > > I'm tempted to remove the thumbscrews altogether, and simply insert > the connecters when hooking up the new machine, to prevent this from > happening again. Anybody ever run into this? > > -- > Walter Dnes > My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jay-ZPnsNkHkFjk at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 29 01:39:30 2005 From: jay-ZPnsNkHkFjk at public.gmane.org (Jason Carson) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 21:39:30 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Hourly Rate Message-ID: <48157.66.11.182.5.1125279570.squirrel@cbits.ca> Greetings, I have my A+ certification and am thinking about doing my LPI (Linux Professional Institute). I occasionaly get jobs doing computer work, what is a good hourly rate to charge people. -- Jason Carson http://cbits.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From itz-4SqnbbNSRR0 at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 29 02:17:14 2005 From: itz-4SqnbbNSRR0 at public.gmane.org (Ian Zimmerman) Date: 28 Aug 2005 22:17:14 -0400 Subject: Next PHLUG meeting this Tuesday. In-Reply-To: <43105468.3090000-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <20050827104121.7BDF6121347@acheron.ss.org> <43105468.3090000@rogers.com> Message-ID: <87r7cdbi6t.fsf@buug.org> Frank> I think it's the first Tuesday as well James> It's the 6th on my calendar too. ;-) So which is it? Not driving, I won't risk going unless I'm sure it's supposed to take place. -- Optimist: We're only two weeks behind schedule. Pessimist: The schedule is a whole two weeks ahead of us. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tux-4CS0UopE6WdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 29 03:23:44 2005 From: tux-4CS0UopE6WdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Ilya Palagin) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2005 23:23:44 -0400 Subject: Hourly Rate In-Reply-To: <48157.66.11.182.5.1125279570.squirrel-ZPnsNkHkFjk@public.gmane.org> References: <48157.66.11.182.5.1125279570.squirrel@cbits.ca> Message-ID: <43127FC0.1040502@almatau.com> Jason Carson wrote: >Greetings, > >I have my A+ certification and am thinking about doing my LPI (Linux >Professional Institute). I occasionaly get jobs doing computer work, what >is a good hourly rate to charge people. > > > $100/hour -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 29 04:10:33 2005 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 00:10:33 -0400 Subject: Hourly Rate In-Reply-To: <43127FC0.1040502-4CS0UopE6WdBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <48157.66.11.182.5.1125279570.squirrel@cbits.ca> <43127FC0.1040502@almatau.com> Message-ID: <20050829041033.GA2498@node1.opengeometry.net> On Sun, Aug 28, 2005 at 11:23:44PM -0400, Ilya Palagin wrote: > Jason Carson wrote: > > >Greetings, > > > >I have my A+ certification and am thinking about doing my LPI (Linux > >Professional Institute). I occasionaly get jobs doing computer work, what > >is a good hourly rate to charge people. > > > > > > > $100/hour It depends. You have tailor your fee to client. :-) -- William Park , Toronto, Canada ThinFlash: Linux thin-client on USB key (flash) drive http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/thinflash.html BashDiff: Super Bash shell http://freshmeat.net/projects/bashdiff/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pwa.linux-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 29 10:10:36 2005 From: pwa.linux-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (PW Armstrong) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 06:10:36 -0400 Subject: Hourly Rate In-Reply-To: <20050829041033.GA2498-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <48157.66.11.182.5.1125279570.squirrel@cbits.ca> <43127FC0.1040502@almatau.com> <20050829041033.GA2498@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <4312DF1C.8010607@gmail.com> Yes, it depends, it's quite competitive out there, and, depending on what your doing, you may be competing with people anywhere on the globe. check out http://www.digitalworldtech.com/ ('We have the best rates $30-$50 per hour'). -peter William Park wrote: -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Hourly Rate Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 00:10:33 -0400 From: William Park To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org >On Sun, Aug 28, 2005 at 11:23:44PM -0400, Ilya Palagin wrote: > > >>Jason Carson wrote: >> >> >> >>>Greetings, >>> >>>I have my A+ certification and am thinking about doing my LPI (Linux >>>Professional Institute). I occasionaly get jobs doing computer work, what >>>is a good hourly rate to charge people. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>$100/hour >> >> > >It depends. You have tailor your fee to client. :-) > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 29 12:32:47 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 08:32:47 -0400 Subject: Next PHLUG meeting this Tuesday. In-Reply-To: <87r7cdbi6t.fsf-4SqnbbNSRR0@public.gmane.org> References: <20050827104121.7BDF6121347@acheron.ss.org> <43105468.3090000@rogers.com> <87r7cdbi6t.fsf@buug.org> Message-ID: <4313006F.5050303@rogers.com> Ian Zimmerman wrote: > Frank> I think it's the first Tuesday as well > > James> It's the 6th on my calendar too. ;-) > > So which is it? Not driving, I won't risk going unless I'm sure > it's supposed to take place. > I suspect Bill may have goofed. It's always been on the 1st Tuesday and I haven't heard any other discussion about changing that. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 29 13:07:24 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 09:07:24 -0400 Subject: Hourly Rate References: <48157.66.11.182.5.1125279570.squirrel@cbits.ca> Message-ID: <001501c5ac9a$ab1d6aa0$6501a8c0@pcfrancois> The Toronto marketplace is e-x-t-r-e-m-e-l-y competitive. I have been in the freelance market for many years and the rates of today came back to about the same as they were back in 1995! When one position is advertised there might me hundreds of applicants. After putting together a shortlist there might be 5 to 10 candidates and if they have the same profile and skills the client will usually pick the cheapest one. Many public organizations have a cap on the rate they can pay. For a special one-off job that lasts a few days your hourly rate may go as high as $100 but for contract work that lasts a few months you may have to go for $50-$60, no more than that. Sometimes less, if the contract is more than 3 months. Hope this helps! Fran?ois Ouellette ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jason Carson" To: Sent: Sunday, 28 August, 2005 21:39 Subject: [TLUG]: Hourly Rate Greetings, I have my A+ certification and am thinking about doing my LPI (Linux Professional Institute). I occasionaly get jobs doing computer work, what is a good hourly rate to charge people. -- Jason Carson http://cbits.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.16/83 - Release Date: 26/8/05 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 29 14:24:02 2005 From: jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Jason Shein) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 10:24:02 -0400 Subject: Next PHLUG meeting this Tuesday. In-Reply-To: <4313006F.5050303-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <20050827104121.7BDF6121347@acheron.ss.org> <87r7cdbi6t.fsf@buug.org> <4313006F.5050303@rogers.com> Message-ID: <200508291024.03042.jason@detachednetworks.ca> On August 29, 2005 08:32 am, James Knott wrote: > Ian Zimmerman wrote: > > Frank> I think it's the first Tuesday as well > > > > James> It's the 6th on my calendar too. ;-) > > > > So which is it? Not driving, I won't risk going unless I'm sure > > it's supposed to take place. > > I suspect Bill may have goofed. It's always been on the 1st Tuesday and > I haven't heard any other discussion about changing that. > First Tuesday on my calendar. -- Jason Shein Director of Networking, Operations and Systems Detached Networks jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org ( 905 ) - 876 - 4158 Voice ( 905 ) - 876 - 5817 Mobile http://www.detachednetworks.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 29 15:08:22 2005 From: hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (D. Hugh Redelmeier) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 11:08:22 -0400 (EDT) Subject: The best OS to deal with Flash Cards In-Reply-To: <20050823135201.GC28567-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <200508221913.14811.marc@lijour.net> <20050823135201.GC28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: | From: Lennart Sorensen | As for OS, well watch out for redhat/fedora and a few others that have | auto mounting of usb memory devices, since they have sync enabled by | default in a lot of cases, and vfat with sync enabled is very slow and | causes a ton of extra updates of the FAT tables and can actually wear | out a flash card very quickly if it doesn't have decent wear leveling | (and even if it does, it will still reduce its life span). | | Not sure where the hotplug or udev or whatever scripts are that decide | on the mount options for new devices, but hunt it down to be sure. This worried me. I'd not heard it before. So I did some googling. Michael Warfield has been making this claim. Not all agree wholeheartedly, but it looks as if he is at least partly right. Starts of threads: https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-list/2005-May/msg01859.html http://www.ussg.iu.edu/hypermail/linux/kernel/0505.1/1249.html Redhat bugzilla entry: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=157674 Here is the fix recommended by Michael for a Fedora system. Who knows if it applies to others. Appears to not be needed on Fedora Core 4. https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-list/2005-May/msg02183.html Plugging in a USB flash memory on a Fedora Core 3 system, I get the following line added to /etc/fstab: /dev/sda /media/DHR_Cigar vfat pamconsole,exec,noauto,iocharset=utf8,noatime,sync,fscontext=system_u:object_r:removable_t,managed 0 0 Notice "sync". BTW, also notice "noatime" (good for flash, but does not matter for VFAT in any case). On Fedora Core 4, I get: /dev/sdi /media/DHR_Cigar vfat pamconsole,exec,noauto,fscontext=system_u:object_r:removable_t,managed 0 0 It mounted automatically, like this: /dev/sdi on /media/DHR_Cigar type vfat (rw,nosuid,nodev,_netdev,fscontext=system_u:object_r:removable_t,user=hugh) Notice the lack of "sync" (good for flash). Notice the lack of "noatime" (questionable). These settings don't appear to be under easy control of the user. The control files are encrypted in XML. The man pages don't seem to explain what to do to take control of the settings. Linux sure is growing a lot of fancy cruft. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 29 16:03:04 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 12:03:04 -0400 Subject: The best OS to deal with Flash Cards References: <200508221913.14811.marc@lijour.net> <20050823135201.GC28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <004201c5acb3$353eaab0$6501a8c0@pcfrancois> ----- Original Message ----- From: "D. Hugh Redelmeier" To: Sent: Monday, 29 August, 2005 11:08 Subject: Re: [TLUG]: The best OS to deal with Flash Cards > | From: Lennart Sorensen > > | As for OS, well watch out for redhat/fedora and a few others that have > | auto mounting of usb memory devices, since they have sync enabled by > | default in a lot of cases, and vfat with sync enabled is very slow and > | causes a ton of extra updates of the FAT tables and can actually wear > | out a flash card very quickly if it doesn't have decent wear leveling > | (and even if it does, it will still reduce its life span). > | > | Not sure where the hotplug or udev or whatever scripts are that decide > | on the mount options for new devices, but hunt it down to be sure. > > This worried me. I'd not heard it before. So I did some googling. Flash cards have a maximum number of times they can be written to. As simple as this! I remember seeing specs talking of about 1000 as a maximum, but this can vary between brands. So don't use them as an external disk device! They can be read as much as you like, but writing is limited... Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lance-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 29 16:44:32 2005 From: lance-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Lance F. Squire) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 12:44:32 -0400 Subject: Mandrake/Mandriva dependancy handeling... Message-ID: <43133B70.2090607@alteeve.com> My Wife is running a Mandriva desktop, and is trying to install a program she downloaded. The program is having dependency issues. Is there a program on Mandriva that will sort this out for her? I usually use YUM or Apt-Get on my FC4 systems to avoid this, but was unable to locate such for Mandrake in the past... Lance F. Squire P.S. Don't even think of suggesting she change to a different Linux. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr.mcgregor-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 29 16:57:08 2005 From: mr.mcgregor-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (John McGregor) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 12:57:08 -0400 Subject: Mandriva dependencies Message-ID: <43133E64.2070203@rogers.com> Your wife should be using urpmi which is Mandriva's equivalent to YUM etc. There is an online utility that helps greatly in configuring it. http://easyurpmi.zarb.org/ FWIW, I use the University of Wisconsin as the source of choice from the lists provided on the site. HTH John -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pkay-Wu5PbJhdqlKw5LPnMra/2Q at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 29 17:01:21 2005 From: pkay-Wu5PbJhdqlKw5LPnMra/2Q at public.gmane.org (Philip Kay) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 13:01:21 -0400 Subject: Mandrake/Mandriva dependancy handeling... In-Reply-To: <43133B70.2090607-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <43133B70.2090607@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <1125334881.20362.3.camel@X-Server.tyndale.ca> Lance, On Mon, 2005-08-29 at 12:44 -0400, Lance F. Squire wrote: > My Wife is running a Mandriva desktop, and is trying to install a > program she downloaded. > > The program is having dependency issues. Is there a program on Mandriva > that will sort this out for her? > > I usually use YUM or Apt-Get on my FC4 systems to avoid this, but was > unable to locate such for Mandrake in the past... > I think urpmi is one of the best for this. Set up external sources using this website: http://easyurpmi.zarb.org/ Once you have that in place installing applications is as easy as "urpmi " or "urpmi *.rpm" Even better, you can upgrade versions of Mandriva without a reboot using urpmi (if you skip kernel). -- Philip Kay -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lance-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 29 17:05:47 2005 From: lance-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Lance F. Squire) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 13:05:47 -0400 Subject: Mandrake/Mandriva dependancy handeling... In-Reply-To: <1125334881.20362.3.camel-R5zirFu31xm/Gl43I4GFmiwD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <43133B70.2090607@alteeve.com> <1125334881.20362.3.camel@X-Server.tyndale.ca> Message-ID: <4313406B.4080904@alteeve.com> Philip Kay wrote: > > I think urpmi is one of the best for this. Set up external sources using > this website: http://easyurpmi.zarb.org/ > > Once you have that in place installing applications is as easy as "urpmi > " or "urpmi *.rpm" > > Even better, you can upgrade versions of Mandriva without a reboot using > urpmi (if you skip kernel). > Thanks Philip and John, I'll pass this no to her. Lance -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 29 17:30:17 2005 From: clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (CLIFFORD ILKAY) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 13:30:17 -0400 Subject: Mandrake/Mandriva dependancy handeling... In-Reply-To: <43133B70.2090607-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <43133B70.2090607@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <200508291330.20260.clifford_ilkay@dinamis.com> On August 29, 2005 12:44, Lance F. Squire wrote: > My Wife is running a Mandriva desktop, and is trying to install a > program she downloaded. From where? If it is not a Mandriva RPM, I would hesitate to install it. > The program is having dependency issues. Is there a program on > Mandriva that will sort this out for her? urpmi Set up urpmi repositories using as a guide. urpmi.update -a # to update the local metadata for all the repositories, in case you had some previously set up urpmi --auto-select # updates all packages but the kernel to the latest release from the repos that you had previously configured. Will prompt you for dependencies. After doing that, assuming you want to install a package named foo, type: urpmi foo and if the package exists in any of the repos, it will either install or prompt you if it has unsatisfied dependencies. If you are notified of a missing dependency for a file as opposed to a package name, e.g. "need bar.so.1", type: urpmf bar.so.1 This will return a list of packages that contain that file. Using urpmi, install the one that makes sense. This does not happen very often. Usually, you will be notified of a package dependency, not a file dependency. If no such package is found, it is possible that it exists but with a different name. Use a substring of the name, e.g. urpmi kde will return all package names containing "kde". You might also try searching the package headers, which takes much longer by typing: urpmi --fuzzy foo # same as urpmi -y foo There is a GUI front end to all of the above in the Mandrake Control Center, if you prefer. What happens if you find no such package in the repositories? You can try installing from tarball, which I avoid not because I do not know how but because it breaks the whole idea of dependency management that urpmi is intended to address. The better option is to see if there is an RPM for another distro or for Cooker, the development version of Mandriva, download the SRPM, modify the SPEC file as necessary, and rebuild it for the version of Mandriva on which you intend to install. That is my preferred choice so I have a small private urpmi repository with some packages that are not available in contrib either due to licensing restrictions, e.g. the Sun JDK, or simply because no one had packaged them for Mandriva, e.g. Webware for Python. I am quite excited about the next generation of package management that is now in Cooker, Smart Package Manager . It will not only resolve dependencies, which many package managers do, but work out the optimal combinations of versions to arrive at a desired goal. > I usually use YUM or Apt-Get on my FC4 systems to avoid this, but > was unable to locate such for Mandrake in the past... That is a shame as urpmi does at least as good a job as them and is much faster than YUM. > Lance F. Squire > > P.S. > > Don't even think of suggesting she change to a different Linux. Wouldn't dream of it as I think it is one of the most polished distros out there:) -- Regards, Clifford Ilkay Dinamis Corporation 3266 Yonge Street, Suite 1419 Toronto, ON Canada M4N 3P6 +1 416-410-3326 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 29 18:15:54 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 14:15:54 -0400 Subject: The best OS to deal with Flash Cards In-Reply-To: <004201c5acb3$353eaab0$6501a8c0@pcfrancois> References: <200508221913.14811.marc@lijour.net> <20050823135201.GC28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004201c5acb3$353eaab0$6501a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: Francois Ouellette wrote: > Flash cards have a maximum number of times they can be written to. As simple > as this! > I remember seeing specs talking of about 1000 as a maximum, but this can > vary between brands. > > So don't use them as an external disk device! They can be read as much as > you like, but writing is limited... > Indeed they are capable of only so many writes before the blocks become oxidized. However, 10,000 writes seems like it was the standard a few years ago. Many are capable of over 1,000,000 writes. Combine that with built-in wear leveling and you can easily see how I'd still be using an old 128mb usb drive and 64mb CF card (with at least 10,000+ photos taken) after 3 years. Many manufacturers include a 3 year warranty on such devices as well. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jvetterli-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 29 18:23:38 2005 From: jvetterli-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org (John Vetterli) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 14:23:38 -0400 (EDT) Subject: The best OS to deal with Flash Cards In-Reply-To: <004201c5acb3$353eaab0$6501a8c0@pcfrancois> References: <200508221913.14811.marc@lijour.net> <20050823135201.GC28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004201c5acb3$353eaab0$6501a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: On Mon, 29 Aug 2005, Francois Ouellette wrote: > Flash cards have a maximum number of times they can be written to. As simple > as this! > I remember seeing specs talking of about 1000 as a maximum, but this can > vary between brands. I think lifetimes are on the order of millions of writes. I tried going to Sandisk's website to check, but they don't seem to have the information in an easy-to-find location. JV -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 29 18:30:13 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 14:30:13 -0400 Subject: The best OS to deal with Flash Cards References: <200508221913.14811.marc@lijour.net> <20050823135201.GC28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <004201c5acb3$353eaab0$6501a8c0@pcfrancois> Message-ID: <002601c5acc7$c4046960$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Vetterli" To: Sent: Monday, 29 August, 2005 14:23 Subject: Re: [TLUG]: The best OS to deal with Flash Cards > On Mon, 29 Aug 2005, Francois Ouellette wrote: > > Flash cards have a maximum number of times they can be written to. As simple > > as this! > > I remember seeing specs talking of about 1000 as a maximum, but this can > > vary between brands. > > I think lifetimes are on the order of millions of writes. I tried going > to Sandisk's website to check, but they don't seem to have the information > in an easy-to-find location. Typo... I meant to say 10000 (ten thousands) but I think this has improved since. Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cdasilva-q6EoVN9bke6w5LPnMra/2Q at public.gmane.org Mon Aug 29 19:46:23 2005 From: cdasilva-q6EoVN9bke6w5LPnMra/2Q at public.gmane.org (Clive DaSilva) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2005 15:46:23 -0400 Subject: Mandrake/Mandriva dependancy handeling... In-Reply-To: <43133B70.2090607-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <43133B70.2090607@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <1125344783.14301.3.camel@Mandrake101.iprimus.ca> Hello Uprmi in my experience does this, warns of dependency issues, and at least indicates indicates what additional files are required. Also the Mandrake Control Centre in the install or update section , ads to the list of files that you download to install, files needed from a dependency perspective. On Mon, 2005-08-29 at 12:44 -0400, Lance F. Squire wrote: > My Wife is running a Mandriva desktop, and is trying to install a > program she downloaded. > > The program is having dependency issues. Is there a program on Mandriva > that will sort this out for her? > > I usually use YUM or Apt-Get on my FC4 systems to avoid this, but was > unable to locate such for Mandrake in the past... > > Lance F. Squire > > P.S. > > Don't even think of suggesting she change to a different Linux. > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- Clive DaSilva Tel: 416-421-2480 Cell: 416-560-8820 Mandrake Linux 10.1 Kernel 2.6.8.1.10mdk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 30 04:36:42 2005 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 00:36:42 -0400 Subject: Serial connector stuck to computer In-Reply-To: References: <20050828211353.GA9646@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <20050830043642.GA13010@waltdnes.org> On Sun, Aug 28, 2005 at 06:31:36PM -0400, Joseph Kubik wrote > Err, so the screws came out fine, but the connector was still stuck? > If so, not using the screws is beside the point. I didn't make myself clear. A picture is worth a thousand words. To avoid attachments to this list, I've uploaded a small jpeg to my website. See http://www.waltdnes.org/misc/connector.jpg. The arrow from the left points to the top of the thumbscrew. The arrow from the bottom points to the small connector screw that holds the serial-port cable tightly to the computer's serial port. The thumbscrew (left arrow) came off. The small connector screw (bottom arrow) was still screwed in. Merely pulling was not going to get it out. -- Walter Dnes My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From paulmora-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 30 05:04:21 2005 From: paulmora-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Paul Mora) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 01:04:21 -0400 Subject: Installfest thoughts In-Reply-To: <20050828144103.2485.qmail-JoSsSUNfUciB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20050828144103.2485.qmail@web88208.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On 8/28/05, Colin McGregor wrote: > Something to be discussed, I passed out some 300 > flyers promoting this event, nobody showed, what went > wrong? > > - Was the flyer wrong look/layout? > - Did I not promote the event in the right places? > - Was the date wrong (i.e.: end of summer)? > - Was the place wrong (too far from subway)? > - Something else? > Perhaps it was a combination of things. The date may have something to do with it... lots of people are on summer vacation, and may not have seen the notices (I'm not sure where you handed them out, but I imagine they got to all the "hot spots"). One thing that came to me today, was that maybe the projected audience was at fault. Who were we targeting here? The average Joe User, who runs Windows on his/her machine? Small business owners? So-called "power" users, or other techies? It seems to me that most Installfests are geared towards people who have already made the decision to switch to Linux, and have had difficulties. Perhaps there just aren't that many people out there... :-) One thing to consider for the next Installfest is to combine it with some sort of series of talks or lectures, sort of like a trade show, so to speak. Break the day into two, and have some information sessions in the morning, with the Installfest in the afternoon. You could entice the end-users with freebies; stuff from some of the major "user" distros like Mandriva, Xandros, Linspire, Ubuntu, etc. Get someone to sponsor the event and provide a simple lunch (pizza for example). Have a question/answer period just before lunch. You could also arrange it so that there are some talks for the end-user, and also talks for the business community. I'd figure the talks be between 30 and 45 minutes; you could start off generally, by defining things like "open source", "GNU GPL", then narrowing the scope to Linux, why you'd want to use it. A talk about the different distributions is also good. Anyway, there's my $0.02. pm -- Paul Mora email: paulmora-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From edward.chin-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 30 10:42:04 2005 From: edward.chin-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (echin) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 06:42:04 -0400 Subject: Installfest thoughts In-Reply-To: <20050828144103.2485.qmail-JoSsSUNfUciB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20050828144103.2485.qmail@web88208.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <431437FC.5070500@sympatico.ca> Colin McGregor wrote: > > Other concerns, who speaks for GTALUG? Excellent question! The simple answer is the Board of Directors, their designated representatives, and/or responsible employees. (No, we don't have employees - we are still a volunteer driven group!) However, this question does lead us to the important issue of how our voices may be heard. As most of us now know, GTAlug is an incorporated non-profit organization chartered in the province of Ontario and bound by the laws gouverning that province. Well, Good News! This September, at the regular meeting, we will be holding our first Annual General Meeting (AGM) to elect the Board of Directors. Details from the Election Committee should be forthcoming to the voting members, soon. Now is the time, for everyone interested, to become a voting member and to run for office.(You aren't really required to run for office.) Parties interested will be able to join up until the call for elections. The annual Membership fee is: $20 Voting; $10 Student A special Membership Offering this year will enable those joining now to be eligible to vote/run in two elections as all memberships expire in September. We encourage everyone to come, be heard, to run, to participate and contribute to making our group an example for the Linux community. We would especially like to have those with some accounting or legal experience to join us. Thanks for the question, Colin! -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 267.10.16 - Release Date: 26-Aug-05 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From edward.chin-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 30 10:49:56 2005 From: edward.chin-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (echin) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 06:49:56 -0400 Subject: Installfest thoughts In-Reply-To: <431437FC.5070500-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <20050828144103.2485.qmail@web88208.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <431437FC.5070500@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <431439D4.8010403@sympatico.ca> Please note the correction. Student members are also Voting members. > Colin McGregor wrote: > >> >> Other concerns, who speaks for GTALUG? > > > Excellent question! > > The simple answer is the Board of Directors, their designated > representatives, and/or responsible employees. (No, we don't have > employees - we are still a volunteer driven group!) > > However, this question does lead us to the important issue of how our > voices may be heard. As most of us now know, GTAlug is an incorporated > non-profit organization chartered in the province of Ontario and bound > by the laws gouverning that province. Well, Good News! > > This September, at the regular meeting, we will be holding our first > Annual General Meeting (AGM) to elect the Board of Directors. Details > from the Election Committee should be forthcoming to the voting members, > soon. > > Now is the time, for everyone interested, to become a voting member and > to run for office.(You aren't really required to run for office.) > Parties interested will be able to join up until the call for elections. > The annual Membership fee is: $20 Voting; $10 Student Voting > A special Membership Offering this year will enable those joining now to > be eligible to vote/run in two elections as all memberships expire in > September. > > We encourage everyone to come, be heard, to run, to participate and > contribute to making our group an example for the Linux community. We > would especially like to have those with some accounting or legal > experience to join us. > > Thanks for the question, Colin! > > > -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 267.10.16 - Release Date: 26-Aug-05 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 30 11:46:13 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 07:46:13 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Serial connector stuck to computer In-Reply-To: <20050830043642.GA13010-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw@public.gmane.org> References: <20050830043642.GA13010@waltdnes.org> Message-ID: <20050830114613.11621.qmail@web88204.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Needle nose pliers are your friend. If there isn't enough left at the top thumbscrew for the pliers to get at then you will have to attack the small nut that the cable screws into (a proccess you will have to take care with as there MAY be a small nut inside the case that could come loose and bounce around inside the case (NOT good)). Either way, you will be going into the sorts of tight spaces that needle nose pliers do well at... Colin McGregor --- Walter Dnes wrote: > On Sun, Aug 28, 2005 at 06:31:36PM -0400, Joseph > Kubik wrote > > Err, so the screws came out fine, but the > connector was still stuck? > > If so, not using the screws is beside the point. > > I didn't make myself clear. A picture is worth a > thousand words. To > avoid attachments to this list, I've uploaded a > small jpeg to my website. > See http://www.waltdnes.org/misc/connector.jpg. The > arrow from the left > points to the top of the thumbscrew. The arrow from > the bottom points > to the small connector screw that holds the > serial-port cable tightly to > the computer's serial port. The thumbscrew (left > arrow) came off. The > small connector screw (bottom arrow) was still > screwed in. Merely > pulling was not going to get it out. > > -- > Walter Dnes > My musings on technology and security at > http://tech_sec.blog.ca > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: > http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text > below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: > http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 30 14:52:29 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 10:52:29 -0400 Subject: NVidia or ATI - which has better Linux support? Message-ID: Hi, A friend of mine is looking at getting a new computer, so I'm trying to help him make some choices. So far he is still using windows, but I suspect (hope) he'll cross over to Linux in the near future. In selecting hardware, I want to recommend things that are "Linux-friendly". Specifically for video... I use an Nvidia chipset AGP card and find it has great Linux compatibility/support. I do not know much about ATI anymore though, as I don't use ATI cards anymore. This person is not into 3D-gaming so he does not require the fastest 3D accelerated video. However I'm pretty sure he would require Video In, Video Out (VIVO) as he has a camcorder as well as being a big movie fan. Can anyone give me any impressions of NVidia vs. ATI cards with these features in Linux? As well, any observations of which company seems to be more committed to Linux? Thanks a lot for any info! -Steve. -- Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings :: ubuntulinux.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jvetterli-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 30 14:58:29 2005 From: jvetterli-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org (John Vetterli) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 10:58:29 -0400 (EDT) Subject: TLUG membership (was: Installfest thoughts) In-Reply-To: <431437FC.5070500-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <20050828144103.2485.qmail@web88208.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <431437FC.5070500@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: On Tue, 30 Aug 2005, echin wrote: > Now is the time, for everyone interested, to become a voting member and to > run for office.(You aren't really required to run for office.) Parties > interested will be able to join up until the call for elections. > The annual Membership fee is: $20 Voting; $10 Student > A special Membership Offering this year will enable those joining now to be > eligible to vote/run in two elections as all memberships expire in September. Is the charter available for viewing online anywhere? I would hate to sign a membership form stating I agree to abide by the charter when I haven't even read the charter yet. JV -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 30 16:28:53 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 11:28:53 -0500 Subject: Serial connector stuck to computer In-Reply-To: <20050830114613.11621.qmail-iE2/U85ktn6B9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20050830043642.GA13010@waltdnes.org> <20050830114613.11621.qmail@web88204.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1e55af99050830092819847125@mail.gmail.com> On 8/30/05, Colin McGregor wrote: > Needle nose pliers are your friend. If there isn't > enough left at the top thumbscrew for the pliers to > get at then you will have to attack the small nut that > the cable screws into (a proccess you will have to > take care with as there MAY be a small nut inside the > case that could come loose and bounce around inside > the case (NOT good)). Either way, you will be going > into the sorts of tight spaces that needle nose pliers > do well at... I've faced this same problem. I ended up removing the little hexagonal receptical the way you describe. As an aside, I've also had a random nut bouncing around my case (a few times). I remember finding one sometime later. I moved it a bit.. intuited something funny.. shook the computer and noted the sound.. openned it and shook the nut out. I've also dropped a screw onto a live motherboard. I was even stupid enough to fish it off while everything was live. Aah, those were the days. I remember once pulling an isa card out of a live system. It rebooted. Nothing got fried. I have no idea what I was thinking. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 30 17:37:55 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 13:37:55 -0400 (EDT) Subject: NVidia or ATI - which has better Linux support? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050830173755.75848.qmail@web88211.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Short answer is go with NVidia. I would like to support local firms (i.e. ATI), but at least for now their drivers are NOT up to standard. For the long answer see what I wrote here: http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/8511 Colin McGregor --- Steve wrote: > Hi, > > A friend of mine is looking at getting a new > computer, so I'm trying > to help him make some choices. So far he is still > using windows, but I > suspect (hope) he'll cross over to Linux in the near > future. > > In selecting hardware, I want to recommend things > that are > "Linux-friendly". Specifically for video... I use an > Nvidia chipset > AGP card and find it has great Linux > compatibility/support. I do not > know much about ATI anymore though, as I don't use > ATI cards anymore. > > This person is not into 3D-gaming so he does not > require the fastest > 3D accelerated video. However I'm pretty sure he > would require Video > In, Video Out (VIVO) as he has a camcorder as well > as being a big > movie fan. > > Can anyone give me any impressions of NVidia vs. ATI > cards with these > features in Linux? As well, any observations of > which company seems to > be more committed to Linux? > > Thanks a lot for any info! > > -Steve. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 30 18:10:36 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 14:10:36 -0400 Subject: NVidia or ATI - which has better Linux support? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050830181036.GR28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 30, 2005 at 10:52:29AM -0400, Steve wrote: > A friend of mine is looking at getting a new computer, so I'm trying > to help him make some choices. So far he is still using windows, but I > suspect (hope) he'll cross over to Linux in the near future. > > In selecting hardware, I want to recommend things that are > "Linux-friendly". Specifically for video... I use an Nvidia chipset > AGP card and find it has great Linux compatibility/support. I do not > know much about ATI anymore though, as I don't use ATI cards anymore. ATI's drivers are no where near the quality of the nvidia drivers, and support for new cards can be a long time in coming (nvidia will tend to release new linux drivers at the same time as the windows drivers with support for all their cards, including mobile chips, which ati just about refuses to support at all). Nvidia even has drivers all the way back to win98 for all their cards (including new ones). Win95 driver is limited to the GF6 generation last I checked. > This person is not into 3D-gaming so he does not require the fastest > 3D accelerated video. However I'm pretty sure he would require Video > In, Video Out (VIVO) as he has a camcorder as well as being a big > movie fan. I don't have much experience with video in/out. I am quite sure the nvidia drivers support output. No idea about input. Must people that want video in tend to get a bt484/878 based card or one of the PVR250/350 series cards with the ivtv chip on them. > Can anyone give me any impressions of NVidia vs. ATI cards with these > features in Linux? As well, any observations of which company seems to > be more committed to Linux? Well I know I won't be buying and ati card for a long time if I can help it. Maybe some day when they support all their chips in their drivers AND they write reliable drivers, I will consider it. I am still bitter about the Rage II/Win 98 driver fiasco. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 30 18:14:40 2005 From: Chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org (Chris Friedt) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 14:14:40 -0400 Subject: NVidia or ATI - which has better Linux support? Message-ID: >>> Can anyone give me any impressions of NVidia vs. ATI cards with these features in Linux? As well, any observations of which company seems to be more committed to Linux? ______________________________ Christopher Friedt Ryerson University Computing & Communication Services (416) 979-5000 x6831 chfriedt-0jnyayh6ARPqzrOJbVgLALDks+cytr/Z at public.gmane.org >>> I use an ATI card, w/ the ati-drivers and it works like a charm. I don't play games either, except on one occasion - doom 3 ;-) and it was fantastic in both desktop / gl environments. ATI is canadian too :D ~/Chris -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 30 18:18:51 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 13:18:51 -0500 Subject: NVidia or ATI - which has better Linux support? In-Reply-To: <20050830173755.75848.qmail-N/0UzftCW16B9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20050830173755.75848.qmail@web88211.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1e55af99050830111873b01f6f@mail.gmail.com> I had excellent success with an ATI Radeon 9600 XT on PCLinuxOS.. everything was automagical. I never did get around to playing with anything 3d though. I should snag a demo and try it out.. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 30 18:26:33 2005 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 14:26:33 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Installfest thoughts In-Reply-To: <431437FC.5070500-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <431437FC.5070500@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <20050830182633.20840.qmail@web88207.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Eddie, The attached does not answer my central concern. At the Install Fest there were two release forms present, one of which was checked by a local lawyer then offered to this list for inspection by anyone who was interested. The other release form was NOT checked by a local lawyer, was NOT offered to the volunteers so those that were interested to review the form. The second form was just dropped on us and was used to cover up the checked release form. Now, let us consider a "nightmare" scenario. Several people come in, they sign the not checked form, then something goes wrong with their computers. We then find out the not checked form has a flaw in the wording (something that does not apply in Ontario), so the people can and then do sue. Ok, so as volunteers and GTAlug is looking at tens of thousands of dollars in compensation and/or legal fees. In other words what happened on Saturday was insane on several levels as: - It potentially exposes us (volunteers and GTAlug) to unnecessary legal liability. - If Centennial noticed (and I hope they didn't) it makes us look like we don't have our act together with 2 release forms. - It make me feel like the executive views me with contempt as I am not trusted to do things right. Now, if the executive wants to tell volunteers up front we would like you to put in a lot of hours work performing task X and along the way we will: - Expose you to $10,000+ dollars worth of liability and we will not let you take steps to limit that liability. - Try to make you look like an ass in front of people who you would like to respect you. - Treat you with contempt. Then fine, volunteers might consider the above (granted I would not consider it for long or seriously, but there are others who may be more charitable). Colin McGregor --- echin wrote: > Colin McGregor wrote: > > > > > Other concerns, who speaks for GTALUG? > > Excellent question! > > The simple answer is the Board of Directors, their > designated representatives, > and/or responsible employees. (No, we don't have > employees - we are still a > volunteer driven group!) > > However, this question does lead us to the important > issue of how our voices may > be heard. As most of us now know, GTAlug is an > incorporated non-profit > organization chartered in the province of Ontario > and bound by the laws > gouverning that province. Well, Good News! > > This September, at the regular meeting, we will be > holding our first Annual > General Meeting (AGM) to elect the Board of > Directors. Details from the Election > Committee should be forthcoming to the voting > members, soon. > > Now is the time, for everyone interested, to become > a voting member and to run > for office.(You aren't really required to run for > office.) Parties interested > will be able to join up until the call for > elections. > The annual Membership fee is: $20 Voting; $10 > Student > A special Membership Offering this year will enable > those joining now to be > eligible to vote/run in two elections as all > memberships expire in September. > > We encourage everyone to come, be heard, to run, to > participate and contribute > to making our group an example for the Linux > community. We would especially like > to have those with some accounting or legal > experience to join us. > > Thanks for the question, Colin! -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From teddymills-VFlxZYho3OA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 30 18:32:34 2005 From: teddymills-VFlxZYho3OA at public.gmane.org (teddy mills) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 14:32:34 -0400 Subject: Installfest Market Message-ID: <4314A642.5070405@knet.ca> I think they next installfest should be targeted for Enterprise and Servers. The target should be people who want to use Linux in business and for their servers. Less of a "installfest" and more of a "demofest" Because no one is going to bring enterprise class hardware for us to install Linux on. But they will come to a demofest to see the various solutions they can install on their enterprise class servers. Call it something like is "Linux Servers in Business" A symposium presented by GTALug. Free!. And its not like we have to do anything, but kind of show up and talk shop. The question remains, what are the 3 best methods to get this message to the Toronto IT Business community? Might even get some sponsership from HP or IBM so we can show their e-servers or something like that. . -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 30 18:39:55 2005 From: jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Jason Shein) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 14:39:55 -0400 Subject: NVidia or ATI - which has better Linux support? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200508301439.55476.jason@detachednetworks.ca> On August 30, 2005 02:14 pm, Chris Friedt wrote: > Can anyone give me any impressions of NVidia vs. ATI cards with these > features in Linux? As well, any observations of which company seems to > be more committed to Linux? > December 2004 review here. A little old, but still relevant. http://www.anandtech.com/linux/showdoc.aspx?i=2302 -- Jason Shein Director of Networking, Operations and Systems Detached Networks jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org ( 905 ) - 876 - 4158 Voice ( 905 ) - 876 - 5817 Mobile http://www.detachednetworks.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Phillip.Qin-szgMhqSEIEG+XT7JhA+gdA at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 30 19:00:35 2005 From: Phillip.Qin-szgMhqSEIEG+XT7JhA+gdA at public.gmane.org (Phillip Qin) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 15:00:35 -0400 Subject: TLUG membership (was: Installfest thoughts) Message-ID: Me too. I would like to run for the office.:) -----Original Message----- From: John Vetterli [mailto:jvetterli-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org] Sent: August 30, 2005 10:58 AM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: [TLUG]: TLUG membership (was: Installfest thoughts) On Tue, 30 Aug 2005, echin wrote: > Now is the time, for everyone interested, to become a voting member and to > run for office.(You aren't really required to run for office.) Parties > interested will be able to join up until the call for elections. > The annual Membership fee is: $20 Voting; $10 Student > A special Membership Offering this year will enable those joining now to be > eligible to vote/run in two elections as all memberships expire in September. Is the charter available for viewing online anywhere? I would hate to sign a membership form stating I agree to abide by the charter when I haven't even read the charter yet. JV -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml !DSPAM:431497d039181315787956! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 30 20:51:01 2005 From: pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 16:51:01 -0400 Subject: FC4: Ways to use PalmPilot Message-ID: <43148E75.12330.324AF5@localhost> Last night, I noticed that FC4 (Fedora 4) was able to read my PalmPilot m105 (the first one to do so after much on again/off again trying. Now, emboldened, I would like to know if there are any Linux applications, similar to the Palm Desktop that can be used to add updates to things like the Date Book and the To-Do list? Any suggestions? I would even accept suggestions on the level of using vi, emacs, or whatnot. The problem is that the To-Do list and the Datebook appear to have some kind of special format (upon checking it with 'less') that would make it seem that vi/emacs is not the way to go, except to add ascii files. Thanks Paul King -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 30 21:02:14 2005 From: bassix-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 17:02:14 -0400 Subject: FC4: Ways to use PalmPilot In-Reply-To: <43148E75.12330.324AF5@localhost> References: <43148E75.12330.324AF5@localhost> Message-ID: On 8/30/05, pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org wrote: > Last night, I noticed that FC4 (Fedora 4) was able to read my > PalmPilot m105 (the first one to do so after much on again/off again > trying. > > Now, emboldened, I would like to know if there are any Linux > applications, similar to the Palm Desktop that can be used to add > updates to things like the Date Book and the To-Do list? > > Any suggestions? I would even accept suggestions on the level of > using vi, emacs, or whatnot. The problem is that the To-Do list and > the Datebook appear to have some kind of special format (upon > checking it with 'less') that would make it seem that vi/emacs is not > the way to go, except to add ascii files. > > Thanks > > Paul King Paul, Evolution can sync with the Palm: Addresses, Datebook & To-do. I've used and it worked about 99%... the ONLY issue I noticed occasionally (and I wasn't able to really find any permanent fix), is that sometimes it will duplicate repeating events. For example, I had a repeating event on weekdays called "Wake Up" with an alarm... I noticed a few times after syncing that there were 2 events on each day in both Evolution and on the Palm. I would then go through and delete the dupes. I'm not sure, but it may have to do with me modifying some of those repeating events (creating "exceptions", ie, deleting the event for a holiday, or changing the time of a particular day). I'm not sure what caused it in my case, but other than that it worked fine. The To-dos and Addresses worked flawlessly for me. PS... this was using FC3 at the time. -Steve. -- Ubuntu :: Linux for Human Beings :: ubuntulinux.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 30 21:17:52 2005 From: scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Stewart C. Russell) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 17:17:52 -0400 Subject: FC4: Ways to use PalmPilot In-Reply-To: <43148E75.12330.324AF5@localhost> References: <43148E75.12330.324AF5@localhost> Message-ID: <4314CD00.2040005@sympatico.ca> pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org wrote: > > Now, emboldened, I would like to know if there are any Linux > applications, similar to the Palm Desktop that can be used to add > updates to things like the Date Book and the To-Do list? jpilot does all I need. cheers, Stewart -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Aug 30 21:33:57 2005 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 17:33:57 -0400 Subject: FC4: Ways to use PalmPilot In-Reply-To: <43148E75.12330.324AF5@localhost> References: <43148E75.12330.324AF5@localhost> Message-ID: On 8/30/05, pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org wrote: > Last night, I noticed that FC4 (Fedora 4) was able to read my > PalmPilot m105 (the first one to do so after much on again/off again > trying. > > Now, emboldened, I would like to know if there are any Linux > applications, similar to the Palm Desktop that can be used to add > updates to things like the Date Book and the To-Do list? > > Any suggestions? I would even accept suggestions on the level of > using vi, emacs, or whatnot. The problem is that the To-Do list and > the Datebook appear to have some kind of special format (upon > checking it with 'less') that would make it seem that vi/emacs is not > the way to go, except to add ascii files. Unfortunately, the Fedora people have evidently been plucking versions of JPilot and pilot-link out of the development streams that the developers warn people not to use for production purposes. The following came over the JPilot mailing list today... http://www.jpilot.org/pipermail/jpilot/2005-August/005379.html "This hollow laugh seemed worth sharing here: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraMyths#head-60f1f50c131102346be18e1ea2b97f39de37a096 The Fedora Team's brave truth-squad states that, in fact, their rapid-release cycle means "...that Fedora is often running in uncharted innovative territory, but not that it is using too-new code. The programs in Fedora are generally stable releases or well-tested pre-release versions. There are guidelines behind the inclusion of pre-release software, and thorough testing is always done prior to Fedora Core releases." I would have to say that the FC4/pilot-link/j-pilot case study pretty much contradicts every substantive part of this statement. As David reported, they happily packaged -pre versions despite explicit warnings not to do so because these versions were "too new", and their "testing" apparently missed the fact that the distributed version failed to sync nearly every Palm device. I'm sure they have "guidelines", but these don't appear to have anything to do with validating the integrity of important sub-systems like PDA synchronization. There's more happy-talk about FCX providing a stable, reliable platform that is adequate even for "critical infrastructure". This appears to contradict the reports that the Fedora team repeatedly states that the distribution is "not meant for production", statements that appear intended to brush off the seriousness and urgency of some bug reports. I suppose one could take an optimistic view: perhaps this statement represents more than just self-deluding marketing noise. Perhaps it is actually a statement of the ideals that the Fedora people would like to live up to. If this is the case, they sure need a lot of help." -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ray-UsHhwO8CmvuakBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 00:18:22 2005 From: ray-UsHhwO8CmvuakBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Ray Payne) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 20:18:22 -0400 Subject: Linux terminal server for educational purposes In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200508310018.j7V0I1vB013593@mail262.megamailservers.com> I am somewhat new to Linux and want to know if anyone has done this before I start researching too much since Google didn't come up with obvious matches right away. While it's very easy to use a shell across the internet on a Linux box, I'd like to try to set up a machine that could run multiple client graphical interfaces for remote users on Windows PCs. This is entirely just a way for me to help a couple of friends that can't (or won't) load the knoppix CD on their systems. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From edward.chin-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 00:19:23 2005 From: edward.chin-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (echin) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 20:19:23 -0400 Subject: Installfest thoughts In-Reply-To: <20050830182633.20840.qmail-2K+iNxKRQwOB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20050830182633.20840.qmail@web88207.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4314F78B.2050709@sympatico.ca> 1) If I understand your concern correctly, you are worried about the liability that Colin McGregor might incur. My concern is that GTAlug and all the volunteers (including Colin McGregor) are covered. 2) As an officer of GTAlug, it is my responsibility to protect the interests of GTAlug to the best of my ability. 3) The GTAlug Installfest Release Form was prepared based on the form at http://ldp.rtin.bz/HOWTO/html_single/Installfest-HOWTO/ which is part of The Linux Documentation Project. Added detail came from the Victoria Linux User Group http://distributions.linux.com/howtos/Installfest-HOWTO/legalprotection.shtml and the Kitchener-Waterloo Linux User Group http://www.thinkers.org/kwlug/waiver.php 4) It may be noted that the Seneca College version, http://linux.senecac.on.ca/survey.html although brief, would probably suffice. 5) To respond to the question of checking by a local lawyer, I trusted KWLUG and Seneca College.(A mistake, perhaps?) As to a review of the release/waiver, I posted a link on 10 Aug 05 to the mailing list - well before 26 Aug 05. 6) With regards to multiple release/waiver forms, the more; the better. Personally, I would like to have every version, I could find, signed. Then there might be less likelihood that there could be a claim that all the release/waivers were not understood. 7) Since the GTAlug Installfest Release Form was prepared and printed by 18 Aug 05(see mailing list)well before Colin McGregor prepared his 26 Aug 05 version, it might imply that Mr. McGregor has less confidence in the GTAlug or any other version. Also, there was NEVER any suggestion that Mr. McGregor nor any volunteer could not have their own personal waiver form. NOR was there any suggestion that volunteers (we are all volunteers) could not take steps to indemnify themselves. To suggest that GTAlug or any of its members would expose volunteers or anyone to liability is a very unworthy comment to make. It is an insulting and libelous lie. Colin McGregor wrote: > Eddie, > > The attached does not answer my central concern. At > the Install Fest there were two release forms present, > one of which was checked by a local lawyer then > offered to this list for inspection by anyone who was > interested. The other release form was NOT checked by > a local lawyer, was NOT offered to the volunteers so > those that were interested to review the form. The > second form was just dropped on us and was used to > cover up the checked release form. > > Now, let us consider a "nightmare" scenario. Several > people come in, they sign the not checked form, then > something goes wrong with their computers. We then > find out the not checked form has a flaw in the > wording (something that does not apply in Ontario), so > the people can and then do sue. Ok, so as volunteers > and GTAlug is looking at tens of thousands of dollars > in compensation and/or legal fees. > > In other words what happened on Saturday was insane on > several levels as: > - It potentially exposes us (volunteers and GTAlug) to > unnecessary legal liability. > - If Centennial noticed (and I hope they didn't) it > makes us look like we don't have our act together > with 2 release forms. > - It make me feel like the executive views me with > contempt as I am not trusted to do things right. > > Now, if the executive wants to tell volunteers up > front we would like you to put in a lot of hours work > performing task X and along the way we will: > - Expose you to $10,000+ dollars worth of liability > and we will not let you take steps to limit that > liability. > - Try to make you look like an ass in front of people > who you would like to respect you. > - Treat you with contempt. > > Then fine, volunteers might consider the above > (granted I would not consider it for long or > seriously, but there are others who may be more > charitable). > > Colin McGregor > > --- echin wrote: > > >>Colin McGregor wrote: >> >> >>>Other concerns, who speaks for GTALUG? >> >>Excellent question! >> >>The simple answer is the Board of Directors, their >>designated representatives, >>and/or responsible employees. (No, we don't have >>employees - we are still a >>volunteer driven group!) >> >>However, this question does lead us to the important >>issue of how our voices may >>be heard. As most of us now know, GTAlug is an >>incorporated non-profit >>organization chartered in the province of Ontario >>and bound by the laws >>gouverning that province. Well, Good News! >> >>This September, at the regular meeting, we will be >>holding our first Annual >>General Meeting (AGM) to elect the Board of >>Directors. Details from the Election >>Committee should be forthcoming to the voting >>members, soon. >> >>Now is the time, for everyone interested, to become >>a voting member and to run >>for office.(You aren't really required to run for >>office.) Parties interested >>will be able to join up until the call for >>elections. >>The annual Membership fee is: $20 Voting; $10 >>Student >>A special Membership Offering this year will enable >>those joining now to be >>eligible to vote/run in two elections as all >>memberships expire in September. >> >>We encourage everyone to come, be heard, to run, to >>participate and contribute >>to making our group an example for the Linux >>community. We would especially like >>to have those with some accounting or legal >>experience to join us. >> >>Thanks for the question, Colin! > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > -- "...when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth..." Sherlock Holmes -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 267.10.16 - Release Date: 26-Aug-05 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ryan-TmYVyGByI+TYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 01:19:30 2005 From: ryan-TmYVyGByI+TYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Ryan Sanders) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 21:19:30 -0400 Subject: Linux terminal server for educational purposes In-Reply-To: <200508310018.j7V0I1vB013593-GxWLXbzlQ2hgiG138/CrgVtbJ1z/TtoqQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <200508310018.j7V0I1vB013593@mail262.megamailservers.com> Message-ID: <431505A2.8090200@iclei.org> Ray Payne wrote: > I am somewhat new to Linux and want to know if anyone has done this before I > start researching too much since Google didn't come up with obvious matches > right away. While it's very easy to use a shell across the internet on a > Linux box, I'd like to try to set up a machine that could run multiple > client graphical interfaces for remote users on Windows PCs. This is > entirely just a way for me to help a couple of friends that can't (or won't) > load the knoppix CD on their systems. Have a look at software that implements VNC. TightVNC is a good option that allows remote desktop connections from both Windows and Linux to both Windows and Linux. The Tight in TightVNC means that it can run reasonably well over slow links. If you are connecting from Linux to Linux, you can even tunnel the whole connection through ssh for a secure connection. Ryan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pkay-Wu5PbJhdqlKw5LPnMra/2Q at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 02:05:26 2005 From: pkay-Wu5PbJhdqlKw5LPnMra/2Q at public.gmane.org (Phil Kay) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 22:05:26 -0400 Subject: Linux terminal server for educational purposes In-Reply-To: <200508310018.j7V0I1vB013593-GxWLXbzlQ2hgiG138/CrgVtbJ1z/TtoqQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <200508310018.j7V0I1vB013593@mail262.megamailservers.com> Message-ID: <1125453926.28566.15.camel@athlonlinux.thekays.ca> Ray, On Tue, 2005-08-30 at 20:18 -0400, Ray Payne wrote: > I am somewhat new to Linux and want to know if anyone has done this before I > start researching too much since Google didn't come up with obvious matches > right away. While it's very easy to use a shell across the internet on a > Linux box, I'd like to try to set up a machine that could run multiple > client graphical interfaces for remote users on Windows PCs. This is > entirely just a way for me to help a couple of friends that can't (or won't) > load the knoppix CD on their systems. > I've just started to use the nxclient from NoMachine. www.nomachine.com While the server portion from nomachine is a paid product it seems to be implemented pretty well as a FreeNX as well. It seems to do a better job of session management than vnc and even promises sound support. It also works over ssh so nothing major needs to be done to the box other than installing FreeNX. BTW, the clients (Windows or Linux) from nomachine are provided free of charge. Unfortunately, I am still having some difficulty tweaking it to my liking. Sound support is giving me trouble. Also, I'd like to use pam_mount upon authentication, but it is failing so far. I'm still figuring out why. It works perfectly with ssh, but the nomachine client dies in the midst of the mount procedure. Phil -- Phil Kay -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 03:25:50 2005 From: psema4-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (psema4) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 23:25:50 -0400 Subject: Serial connector stuck to computer In-Reply-To: <1e55af99050830092819847125-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <20050830043642.GA13010@waltdnes.org> <20050830114613.11621.qmail@web88204.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <1e55af99050830092819847125@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <99a6c38f05083020256b82e081@mail.gmail.com> On 8/30/05, Sy wrote: > > On 8/30/05, Colin McGregor wrote: > > Needle nose pliers are your friend. If there isn't > > enough left at the top thumbscrew for the pliers to > > get at then you will have to attack the small nut that > > the cable screws into (a proccess you will have to > > take care with as there MAY be a small nut inside the > > case that could come loose and bounce around inside > > the case (NOT good)). Either way, you will be going > > into the sorts of tight spaces that needle nose pliers > > do well at... > > I've faced this same problem. I ended up removing the little > hexagonal receptical the way you describe. Ended up in a similar spot a few years back with an old vga monitor's cable. Attacked the nut inside the case after much frustration trying to get to the inner screw. As an aside... I remember once pulling an isa card out of a live > system. It > rebooted. Nothing got fried. I have no idea what I was thinking. > Lol - I envy your "skill": About 6 months ago I pulled power from a hard drive (ide) in a running system. I was way too tired to realize the power was still on and went ahead with it. Fried the mobo completely. I went to sleep immediately after laughing wildly and turning the power off. Stupid, stupid mistake ran me about $1k. (Fortunately, it was my machine and not a clients!) -- - SGE -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From paulmora-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 03:50:02 2005 From: paulmora-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Paul Mora) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2005 23:50:02 -0400 Subject: FC4: Ways to use PalmPilot In-Reply-To: <43148E75.12330.324AF5@localhost> References: <43148E75.12330.324AF5@localhost> Message-ID: On 8/30/05, pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org wrote: > Now, emboldened, I would like to know if there are any Linux > applications, similar to the Palm Desktop that can be used to add > updates to things like the Date Book and the To-Do list? > > Any suggestions? I would even accept suggestions on the level of > using vi, emacs, or whatnot. The problem is that the To-Do list and > the Datebook appear to have some kind of special format (upon > checking it with 'less') that would make it seem that vi/emacs is not > the way to go, except to add ascii files. > Hi. I have used both Evolution, and KPilot (the KDE sync program). Both are pretty good, but both also have their issues. Right now, I'm using the KPilot program from KDE 3.4, and it seems to work well. It will sync pretty much everything, but it only syncs it into e KDE PIM (Kontact), and it's components (KAddressbook, KOrganizer, etc.) If you're looking for something exactly like the Palm desktop, look no further than JPilot. pm -- Paul Mora email: paulmora-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From imranqau-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 06:20:10 2005 From: imranqau-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Muhammad Imran) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 06:20:10 +0000 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux Message-ID: An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From agtnews-PeCUgM4zDv73fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 08:18:48 2005 From: agtnews-PeCUgM4zDv73fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Allen Taylor) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 04:18:48 -0400 Subject: Installfest thoughts In-Reply-To: <20050828144103.2485.qmail-JoSsSUNfUciB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20050828144103.2485.qmail@web88208.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20050831081848.GA2472@thecat.localnet> Some intemperate remarks have been made by some of the players involved in this discussion. I just want to add my interpretation to the discussion and I hope I'm actually contributing and not just fanning the flames. Please forgive me for quoting but not attributing. I want these comments to be aimed at the structural problems and not being critical of specific individuals So, some disjoint thoughts and comments on TLUG, GTAlug, and intallfests. By nature (typical geek I suspect), I am not a social type. Helping out at things like an installfest or at a "TLUG" booth at a trade show is one way I can give back to the community without stretching my social aversions too far (It's also one of the reasons I teach basic computer courses at my wife's church). Due to some of the points in the discussion here and the general tone, I'm having to rethink whether TLUG / GTAlug events are something I want to continue to help out with in my small way. Things we wonder about at this stage (who speaks for GTALUG?): - Was this an official GTAlug event, sanctioned by an agent of the legal entity referred to here as GTAlug? - Was Colin McGregor authorized to volunteer to invest a lot of his time and effort in setting up this event as a GTAlug event? This mailing list [TLUG] is *not* an official communications vehicle for GTAlug that I'm aware of (please correct me if I'm wrong). This mailing list *was* the primary vehicle, as far as I'm aware, in setting up the installfest in question. As has happened before, using the TLUG list to discuss what was apparently a sanctioned GTAlug event has led to confusion as to who is in charge and what are we really getting involved in. My feeling is that the TLUG mailing list is a good vehicle for discussing the details (including waiver forms and other legal matters) of an event such as this installfest because it keeps the event in the public eye (the public being local linux enthusiasts in this case) and hopefully encourages other to become involved. This good publicity is of course offset by serious and personal attacks by some of the involved parties. > With regards to multiple release/waiver forms, the more; the better. > Personally, I would like to have every version, I could find, signed. > Then there might be less likelihood that there could be a claim that > all the release/waivers were not understood. This statement has me very worried about the attitude of the GTAlug executive towards legal issues (I was originally going to say that is scared the sh*t out of me!). I have not had formal legal training but, from my limited layman's background, having more forms to sign is much worse than just having one form because it can easily open up more loop holes and conflicting statements that a good lawyer can use to advantage in front of a judge / jury. Apparently the GTAlug Installfest Release Form was prepared using input from a sample form from The Linux Documentation Project, with added input from the web sites of the Victoria Linux User Group, and the Kitchener-Waterloo Linux User Group. Again, major red flags here unless this document was created by someone with some legal training and vetted by an Ontario based solicitor. A legal document created out of bits and pieces of multiple sample legal documents is not automatically a solid legal document, no matter how solid the source documents were. Summary: I think a lot of people are going to be very wary of involvement in future TLUG / GTAlug events and our public image, such as it is, is going to suffer unless we can get a handle on some of these issues and concerns. Allen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 12:52:43 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 08:52:43 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux References: Message-ID: <001201c5ae2a$f2fa8150$6501a8c0@ibm5b4y3a0pgrq> > >----- Original Message ----- >From: Muhammad Imran >To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org >Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 2:20 AM >Subject: [TLUG]: Best Laptop for Linux > >Hi guys, >I am buying a Laptop for Linux. If anybody bought a laptop recently that works fine with Linux (without lot of trouble), >please let me know which one. >I am thinking to buy Dell Inspiron 6000 or Sony VAIO FS645PH. has anybody tried linux on these? > >any thoughts.... >thanks guys. Might be faster to ask which laptop model is known NOT to work well with Linux! There is some support on the Thinkpad series from the supplier, might be a start point: http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site.wss/MIGR-48NT8D.html Hp also offers some Linux support on its destop and laptops. Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 13:15:58 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 08:15:58 -0500 Subject: Serial connector stuck to computer In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f05083020256b82e081-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <20050830043642.GA13010@waltdnes.org> <20050830114613.11621.qmail@web88204.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <1e55af99050830092819847125@mail.gmail.com> <99a6c38f05083020256b82e081@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1e55af9905083106154e0b9d4c@mail.gmail.com> On 8/30/05, psema4 wrote: > > Lol - I envy your "skill": About 6 months ago I pulled power from a hard > drive (ide) in a running system. I was way too tired to realize the power > was still on and went ahead with it. > > Fried the mobo completely. I went to sleep immediately after laughing > wildly and turning the power off. Stupid, stupid mistake ran me about $1k. > (Fortunately, it was my machine and not a clients!) I wouldn't be laughing at losing 1k for a mistake like that.. =/ But I guess laughing is better than crying. ;) I seem to have excellent "skill" with my parts. I'm even running my primary setup on a narcoleptic HDD .. it likes to go to sleep and not wake up again. Needless to say my setup locks hard when its filesystem suddenly goes away.. but it recovers wonderfully from it. Yes, arranging a new storage solution is high on my list. Heck, let me start a new thread on that. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 13:22:16 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 08:22:16 -0500 Subject: Storage solutions Message-ID: <1e55af9905083106225c49db8a@mail.gmail.com> I need to arrange a *proper* storage solution. I'm working with an older EIDE setup and it seems expensive to buy a raid card or purchase a new setup which has raid on-board (which I don't trust anyways). I'm not so sure I want to consider a separate fileserver box at this point. I figure I'll get two EIDE drives in this beater box, softraided via an EVMS solution with one external USB drive for occasional backups/restores (later I'll get two) and a remote storage solution at work. I should note that I don't like the idea of using a cvs-style or is the term "staged backup" (i.e. back up changes into new archives) setup. I like having a complete backup via rsync. Maybe I should change my mind on this? What parts and tools do you all use? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From emmajane-MHIYrZpDPrNWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 13:59:14 2005 From: emmajane-MHIYrZpDPrNWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (Emma Jane Hogbin) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 09:59:14 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050831135914.GA4829@smeagol> On Wed, Aug 31, 2005 at 06:20:10AM +0000, Muhammad Imran wrote: > I am buying a Laptop for Linux. If anybody bought a laptop recently > that works fine with Linux (without lot of trouble), please let me > know which one. The computers at www.sub500.com come with Linux already installed. You may want to change the distro, but at least you know it works! regards, emma -- Emma Jane Hogbin www.xtrinsic.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 14:07:15 2005 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 10:07:15 -0400 Subject: Storage solutions In-Reply-To: <1e55af9905083106225c49db8a-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <1e55af9905083106225c49db8a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4315B993.2050103@georgetown.wehave.net> Sy wrote: > I should note that I don't like the idea of using a cvs-style or is > the term "staged backup" (i.e. back up changes into new archives) > setup. I like having a complete backup via rsync. Maybe I should > change my mind on this? I've been using rdiff-backup for over a year. It combines rsync with diff storage, so I can retrieve a backup from any point in time. Periodically I prune the backup filesystem with options like --remove-older-than 30D. I like it a lot, bandwidth and diskspace efficient since both transfer and storage are done using diffs. -- Fraser -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 14:13:39 2005 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 10:13:39 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4315BB13.1040807@telly.org> Muhammad Imran wrote: > Hi guys, > I am buying a Laptop for Linux. If anybody bought a laptop recently > that works fine with Linux (without lot of trouble), please let me > know which one. > I am thinking to buy Dell Inspiron 6000 or Sony VAIO FS645PH. has > anybody tried linux on these? > Hi Muhammad, I've had good experiences with a number of IBM^H^H^HLenovo Thinkpads and Fujitsus over the years. Most laptops are well supported, because they use fairly standard hardware. What you need to be aware of are: - oddball BIOSs - oddball (and unsupported) hardware - different levels of Linux support for suspend/hibernate Bleeding-edge stuff should be avoided, since some new hardware is often well-supported for a long time under Windows before getting Linux support. A good case in point is the Centrino wireless component, which has received reasonable support only recently -- even then, some of the driver is binary-only and installation is often poorly documented. I seem to recall that at least one Sony in the past -- the V505 series -- was particularly badly supported when I was shopping at one time. It had features (special mouse controls, built-in cameras, weird video and aspect ratio) for which no reasonable support was available, and Sony was Linux-hostile at that time. (Don't know if they still are). A very good resource is http://www.linux-laptop.net/ -- this site collects people's experiences, sorted by brand and model. It's probably a good idea to see what people have already had to say about installing Linux on the make/model you're considering. You may also want to consider using a distribution which is known for particular strength with desktops and laptops. In my experience Ubuntu and Mandrake have tended to have more things working (without the need to spend much time under the hood) than most others. YMMV. Hope this helps! - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From emmajane-MHIYrZpDPrNWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 14:15:19 2005 From: emmajane-MHIYrZpDPrNWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (Emma Jane Hogbin) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 10:15:19 -0400 Subject: external modem for laptop Message-ID: <20050831141519.GA4901@smeagol> Hello, I need to pick up two external modems for two Linux laptops. Does anyone have any recommendations on who in Toronto has something that would work for me? I've tried calling around, but I'm finding it near impossible to get someone on the phone who even knows what's in stock, let alone whether or not it will work for me. regards, emma -- Emma Jane Hogbin www.xtrinsic.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pking123 at sympatico.ca Wed Aug 31 14:26:06 2005 From: pking123 at sympatico.ca (pking123 at sympatico.ca) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 10:26:06 -0400 Subject: [TLUG]: FC4: Ways to use PalmPilot In-Reply-To: References: <43148E75.12330.324AF5@localhost> Message-ID: <431585BE.28632.1ED828@localhost> I found I was able to use JPilot, and it appears to do what I want. But I seem to have run into a "feature" in FC4 which resets the permissions on /dev/ttyS0 to 660 from 666. I have looked through the kernel docs, and I do not suspect the kernel is doing this. Any suggestions as to what is responsible for resetting these permissions, and how do I make these changes permanent? Paul King > Paul Mora (paulmora at gmail.com) wrote: > > Hi. > > I have used both Evolution, and KPilot (the KDE sync program). Both > are pretty good, but both also have their issues. > > Right now, I'm using the KPilot program from KDE 3.4, and it seems to > work well. It will sync pretty much everything, but it only syncs it > into e KDE PIM (Kontact), and it's components (KAddressbook, > KOrganizer, etc.) > > If you're looking for something exactly like the Palm desktop, look no > further than JPilot. > > pm > > -- > Paul Mora > email: paulmora at gmail.com > -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list at redhat.com To unsubscribe: http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list From scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 13:07:57 2005 From: scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Stewart C. Russell) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 09:07:57 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4315ABAD.1030008@sympatico.ca> Muhammad Imran wrote: > > I am thinking to buy Dell Inspiron 6000 or Sony VAIO FS645PH. has > anybody tried linux on these? I've found Dells to be pretty shoddy; they can crack and fail in numerous ways. Whatever you get, get it with the most elaborate warranty you can. Laptops take a beating, and you need them to work. There will probably be one little component that you won't be able to get working properly -- something like CPU scaling, hibernate to disk, or sound restored after sleep. You'd be horrified to know what I'm running now; check the headers, if you must ... cheers, Stewart -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From christoph.wickert at gmx.de Wed Aug 31 14:46:18 2005 From: christoph.wickert at gmx.de (Christoph Wickert) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 16:46:18 +0200 Subject: [TLUG]: FC4: Ways to use PalmPilot In-Reply-To: <431585BE.28632.1ED828@localhost> References: <43148E75.12330.324AF5@localhost> <431585BE.28632.1ED828@localhost> Message-ID: <1125499578.4036.14.camel@hal9000.local.lan> Am Mittwoch, den 31.08.2005, 10:26 -0400 schrieb pking123 at sympatico.ca: > I found I was able to use JPilot, and it appears to do what I want. > But I seem to have run into a "feature" in FC4 which resets the > permissions on /dev/ttyS0 to 660 from 666. > > I have looked through the kernel docs, and I do not suspect the > kernel is doing this. Any suggestions as to what is responsible for > resetting these permissions, and how do I make these changes > permanent? > echo " 0660 /dev/ttyS0 0666 root.uucp" > /etc/security/console.perms.d/10-pilot.perms (single line!) > Paul King > Christoph -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list at redhat.com To unsubscribe: http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 14:53:48 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 10:53:48 -0400 Subject: Serial connector stuck to computer In-Reply-To: <99a6c38f05083020256b82e081-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <20050830043642.GA13010@waltdnes.org> <20050830114613.11621.qmail@web88204.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <1e55af99050830092819847125@mail.gmail.com> <99a6c38f05083020256b82e081@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050831145348.GS28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Aug 30, 2005 at 11:25:50PM -0400, psema4 wrote: > Lol - I envy your "skill": About 6 months ago I pulled power from a hard > drive (ide) in a running system. I was way too tired to realize the power > was still on and went ahead with it. > > Fried the mobo completely. I went to sleep immediately after laughing wildly > and turning the power off. Stupid, stupid mistake ran me about $1k. > (Fortunately, it was my machine and not a clients!) How odd. That is excactly how I laways got my HD out of power down mode on my 486. I couldn't sleep if all 3 drives were running, so I sent power down commands to two of them, which elliminated the extra noise made by having 3 different drive RPMs running at the same time. Unfortunately it never had a clue how to spin them up again on access, so I power cycled the drives to get them going again, which so far has never caused a problem. I don't encourage the practice though. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tgoodaire-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 14:54:58 2005 From: tgoodaire-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org (Tim Goodaire) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 10:54:58 -0400 Subject: FC4: Ways to use PalmPilot In-Reply-To: <431585BE.28632.1ED828@localhost> References: <43148E75.12330.324AF5@localhost> <431585BE.28632.1ED828@localhost> Message-ID: <20050831145458.GB32153@dahmer> On Wed, Aug 31, 2005 at 10:26:06AM -0400, pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org wrote: > I found I was able to use JPilot, and it appears to do what I want. > But I seem to have run into a "feature" in FC4 which resets the > permissions on /dev/ttyS0 to 660 from 666. > > I have looked through the kernel docs, and I do not suspect the > kernel is doing this. Any suggestions as to what is responsible for > resetting these permissions, and how do I make these changes > permanent? Maybe udev or devfs is handling your device files and resetting the permissions on them? Tim -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 15:01:39 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 11:01:39 -0400 Subject: Storage solutions In-Reply-To: <1e55af9905083106225c49db8a-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org> References: <1e55af9905083106225c49db8a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050831150139.GU28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 31, 2005 at 08:22:16AM -0500, Sy wrote: > I need to arrange a *proper* storage solution. > > I'm working with an older EIDE setup and it seems expensive to buy a > raid card or purchase a new setup which has raid on-board (which I > don't trust anyways). > > I'm not so sure I want to consider a separate fileserver box at this point. > > I figure I'll get two EIDE drives in this beater box, softraided via > an EVMS solution with one external USB drive for occasional > backups/restores (later I'll get two) and a remote storage solution at > work. Why evms and not just the standard LVM that linux supports natively without patching the kernel? > I should note that I don't like the idea of using a cvs-style or is > the term "staged backup" (i.e. back up changes into new archives) > setup. I like having a complete backup via rsync. Maybe I should > change my mind on this? > > What parts and tools do you all use? I just backup stuff that is important to DVD (using tob + some growisofs scripts). I run rsnapshot to make hourly rsync snapshots of everything important too, and run everything on md raid1 on a pair of sata drives. Once every few hours important stuff is also rsync'd to another server and vice versa. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 14:59:03 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 10:59:03 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050831145903.GT28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 31, 2005 at 06:20:10AM +0000, Muhammad Imran wrote: >
I am buying a Laptop for Linux. If anybody bought a laptop recently that works fine with Linux (without lot of trouble), please let me know which one.
>
I am thinking to buy Dell Inspiron 6000 or Sony VAIO FS645PH. has anybody tried linux on these?
>
 
>
any thoughts....
>
thanks guys.
>
 
Turn of HTML please. In my experience, Dells are often the most painful things you can install linux on. I have yet to get X running properly on my Boss's Dell, because it has one of those stupid ATI mobile chips which ATI doesn't currently support. It also has an SATA HD stuck in emulation mode, which requires the kernel to have the unfinished ATAPI SATA supported compiled in or you can only see the HD or the DVD but never both at the same time. Of course they offer no option to switch to native mode in the SATA/IDE controller because then they might get support calls from people trying to reinstall XP going "it won't see my hd, and I can't load a driver from disk because I have no floppy drive". Sony's I have very little experience with. I remember in the past reading about many very odd proprietary things in them that was causing a lot of headaches for getting linux on them. That may have changed. I have had very little trouble installing onto my wife's Compaq R3240 (Athlon 64 Mobile 3200+ with nvidia MX 440 video). Main problem was the broadcom wireless which requires ndiswrapper to operate with linux. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 15:01:17 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 11:01:17 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Muhammad Imran wrote: > Hi guys, > I am buying a Laptop for Linux. If anybody bought a laptop recently that > works fine with Linux (without lot of trouble), please let me know which > one. > I am thinking to buy Dell Inspiron 6000 or Sony VAIO FS645PH. has > anybody tried linux on these? > > any thoughts.... > thanks guys. I've been using an Asus M6Bne since February with a few different distros. All have worked very well out of the box. The only thing needed is to customize the extra buttons (like browser, email, wireless etc.) with an easily found hotkey -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 15:09:44 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 11:09:44 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Jamon Camisso wrote: > I've been using an Asus M6Bne since February with a few different > distros. All have worked very well out of the box. The only thing needed > is to customize the extra buttons (like browser, email, wireless etc.) > with an easily found hotkey What I meant to say was, "with an easily found hotkey.sh script." I momentarily forgot that Thunderbird's Spell button != Thunderbird's send button. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 15:12:06 2005 From: ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ansar Mohammed) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 11:12:06 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7m Type: application/x-pkcs7-mime Size: 12643 bytes Desc: not available URL: From evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 15:11:59 2005 From: evan-ieNeDk6JonTYtjvyW6yDsg at public.gmane.org (Evan Leibovitch) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 11:11:59 -0400 Subject: external modem for laptop In-Reply-To: <20050831141519.GA4901@smeagol> References: <20050831141519.GA4901@smeagol> Message-ID: <4315C8BF.1030709@telly.org> Emma Jane Hogbin wrote: >Hello, > >I need to pick up two external modems for two Linux laptops. Does anyone >have any recommendations on who in Toronto has something that would work for >me? I've tried calling around, but I'm finding it near impossible to get >someone on the phone who even knows what's in stock, let alone whether or >not it will work for me. > > That's because, in these days of cable and wireless and DSL Internet, modems are fast becoming redundant for many. Sales staff want to be bleeding edge and modems are old school. Getting modems that work well under Linux IMO means no "winmodems", in which most of the modem work is done by software (always proprietary and often Windows-only). There is some Winmodem support under Linux, but it's sporadic and my personal experiences have been unsatisfiying. See http://www.linmodems.org/ for more info on this. For my own modem use (right now limited to fax-only use with Hylafax) I have always stuck to the Multitech brand. Solid hardware, Linux-friendly techs, and reasonably (if not commodity-level) priced. I note that the same ZDX that I bought years ago is still available: http://www.multitech.com/PRODUCTS/Families/MultiModemZDX/ The new development I see from them is a USB external modem explicitly designed for laptop use (since an increasing number of laptops are shipping without serial ports). Very small, and it doesn't even need external power -- but it's no cheaper than the ZDX. http://www.multitech.com/PRODUCTS/Families/MultiMobileUSB/ True to form, the company has supplied a note regarding the modem's use with Linux: ftp://ftp.multitech.com/usb/usb-linux2.txt One thing: you will never find these at Futureshop or Staples, you'll have to buy them direct or find out from Multitech who's selling them locally. Still, I like to support vendors who not only recognize but actively support Linux. Hope this helps. - Evan -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 15:11:08 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 11:11:08 -0400 Subject: external modem for laptop In-Reply-To: <20050831141519.GA4901@smeagol> References: <20050831141519.GA4901@smeagol> Message-ID: <20050831151108.GV28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 31, 2005 at 10:15:19AM -0400, Emma Jane Hogbin wrote: > I need to pick up two external modems for two Linux laptops. Does anyone > have any recommendations on who in Toronto has something that would work for > me? I've tried calling around, but I'm finding it near impossible to get > someone on the phone who even knows what's in stock, let alone whether or > not it will work for me. Well Signa.com seems to list GVC and USR external modems for $110 to $150 range. I doubt they stock them, but it often doesn't take stores long to get things in. Best buy lists this one from Creative for $100: http://www.bestbuy.ca/catalog/proddetail.asp?logon=&langid=EN&sku_id=0926INGFS10018903&catid= Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 15:25:31 2005 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins Witteman) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 11:25:31 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050831152531.GA8567@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> I am a huge fan of the ThinkPads. I have a 600X that works out of the box (though getting wireless working took some kicking - but only because I didn't have wireless drivers in the kernel - who knew that would be a problem? ;-). You can get ThinkPads used (refurbished after short leases) for very good prices, and there are a lot of people selling parts for them, so you'll be able to keep it running if something goes awry. -- yours, William -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature URL: From fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 15:34:52 2005 From: fouellet-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Francois Ouellette) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 11:34:52 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux References: <20050831152531.GA8567@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <001901c5ae41$9a81eb00$6401a8c0@pcfrancois> >----- Original Message ----- >From: "William O'Higgins Witteman" >To: >Sent: Wednesday, 31 August, 2005 11:25 >Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Best Laptop for Linux >I am a huge fan of the ThinkPads. I have a 600X that works out of thebox (though getting wireless working took some kicking - but only >because I didn't have wireless drivers in the kernel - who knew thatwould be a problem? ;-). You can get ThinkPads used (refurbished after> >short leases) for very good prices, and there are a lot of peopleselling parts for them, so you'll be able to keep it running ifsomething goes awry. A good place for off-lease Thinkpads is "Like New Computers" www.likenewcomputers.com Lots of used genuine Thinkpad (pre-Lenovo) accessories too. Fran?ois Ouellette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 15:37:38 2005 From: ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ansar Mohammed) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 11:37:38 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7m Type: application/x-pkcs7-mime Size: 14897 bytes Desc: not available URL: From ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 15:40:59 2005 From: ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ansar Mohammed) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 11:40:59 -0400 Subject: FW:Best Laptop for Linux Message-ID: Sorry, I had a bit of a snafu with my MIME settings. I am turning it off for now. _____ From: Ansar Mohammed [mailto:ansarm-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org] Sent: August 31, 2005 11:12 AM To: 'tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org' Subject: RE: [TLUG]: Best Laptop for Linux My 2cents. 1. Whatever laptop you get make sure that if you want to run Linux it supports at least 1280x1024 or better yet 1400x1050. Personally 1024x768 does not cut it for gnome or kde. 2. Check individual components to make sure that there are existing drivers for sound, video, network and wireless Bluetooth and 802.11x). 3. Make sure you get a 3 year warranty. 4. Read a review of the laptop if you can. Laptops from the same manufacturer vary between model numbers (eg. I had 2 Compaqs an m700 and an evo n610.. the evo was a POS the m700 was a joy to own, everyone here is complaining about dell. I have never had any issues running a linux or freebsd on a dell laptop) _____ From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org] On Behalf Of Muhammad Imran Sent: August 31, 2005 2:20 AM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: [TLUG]: Best Laptop for Linux Hi guys, I am buying a Laptop for Linux. If anybody bought a laptop recently that works fine with Linux (without lot of trouble), please let me know which one. I am thinking to buy Dell Inspiron 6000 or Sony VAIO FS645PH. has anybody tried linux on these? any thoughts.... thanks guys. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 15:55:33 2005 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 11:55:33 -0400 Subject: Installfest Market In-Reply-To: <4314A642.5070405-VFlxZYho3OA@public.gmane.org> References: <4314A642.5070405@knet.ca> Message-ID: On 8/30/05, teddy mills wrote: > I think they next installfest should be targeted for Enterprise and Servers. > The target should be people who want to use Linux in business and for > their servers. > Might even get some sponsership from HP or IBM so we can show their > e-servers > or something like that. This sort of thing is something that folks like HP or IBM ought to want to run themselves, there being no particular value to GTALUG participation in the matter. That is a sales presentation, something GTALUG hasn't really got relevant resources for. -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From kburtch-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 16:13:23 2005 From: kburtch-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ken Burtch) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 12:13:23 -0400 Subject: BUSH 1.0.3 Released Message-ID: <1125504803.2833.49.camel@rosette.pegasoft.ca> For those developers who are interested: BUSH is my high-reliability BUsiness SHell. It can be used as interactive command shell, scripting language with a source code debugger, a database client and a web template engine. With third-party support for the ABEE standard for GCC binaries, Java Virtual Machine and .Net, BUSH is an all-in-one replacement for Bash, PHP, etc. Version 1.0.3 features some bug fixes and a new GCC-compatible directory_operations package. The BUSH home page is http://www.pegasoft.ca/bush.html -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ken O. Burtch Phone: 905-562-0848 Author "Linux Shell Scripting with Bash" Fax: 905-562-0848 http://www.pegasoft.ca Email: ken-8VyUGRzHQ8IsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org ------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 16:16:03 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 12:16:03 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050831161603.GW28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 31, 2005 at 11:12:06AM -0400, Ansar Mohammed wrote: [-- OpenSSL output follows (current time: Wed Aug 31 12:14:36 2005) --] Error loading file /users/lsorense/.smime/ca-bundle.crt 1158:error:02001002:system library:fopen:No such file or directory:bss_file.c:104:fopen('/users/lsorense/.smime/ca-bundle.crt','r') 1158:error:2006D080:BIO routines:BIO_new_file:no such file:bss_file.c:107: 1158:error:0B084002:x509 certificate routines:X509_load_cert_crl_file:system lib:by_file.c:274: [-- End of OpenSSL output --] [-- The following data is S/MIME signed --] [-- End of S/MIME signed data. --] Well that was spectacularly useless. Was there any content in that message? Does someone actually use S/MIME in real life? At least GPG signed messages can be read even without support for GPG. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 16:25:10 2005 From: ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org (Andrew Hammond) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 12:25:10 -0400 Subject: Installfest Market In-Reply-To: References: <4314A642.5070405@knet.ca> Message-ID: <3043EA71-189D-4B03-8D7A-9890A23D8E33@ca.afilias.info> On 31-Aug-05, at 11:55, Christopher Browne wrote: > On 8/30/05, teddy mills wrote: > >> I think they next installfest should be targeted for Enterprise >> and Servers. >> The target should be people who want to use Linux in business and for >> their servers. > > This sort of thing is something that folks like HP or IBM ought to > want to run themselves, there being no particular value to GTALUG > participation in the matter. > > That is a sales presentation, something GTALUG hasn't really got > relevant resources for. More to the point, who would bring a server to an install fest? Given how trivial it has become to install and configure linux (at least to the level which can be expected at an install fest), any business that doesn't have sufficient skills in house (or under contract) for the install wouldn't have the skills for ongoing maintenance. That's a recipe for failure. I don't think that's the kind of word-of-mouth that Linux either needs or wants. I suggest that small business is still really a domain for contractors. If a bunch of contractors want to organize under the auspices of TLUG to offer free installs as a loss-leader for maintenance contracts, well, that's a different thing. LinuxCaffe is currently organizing a linux contractors contact list (or something like that anyway). Perhaps that would be the right forum to set up something like this. __________________________________________________ Andrew Hammond 416-673-4138 ahammond-swQf4SbcV9C7WVzo/KQ3Mw at public.gmane.org Database Administrator, Afilias Canada Corp. CB83 2838 4B67 D40F D086 3568 81FC E7E5 27AF 4A9A -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: PGP.sig Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 16:30:35 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 12:30:35 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4315DB2B.1030602@rogers.com> Muhammad Imran wrote: > Hi guys, > I am buying a Laptop for Linux. If anybody bought a laptop recently that > works fine with Linux (without lot of trouble), please let me know which > one. > I am thinking to buy Dell Inspiron 6000 or Sony VAIO FS645PH. has > anybody tried linux on these? IBM/Lenovo Thinkpads tend to be good. On the other hand, I'm helping a friend get a Toshiba Satellite going, but there are issues with it. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 16:37:07 2005 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 12:37:07 -0400 Subject: Installfest thoughts In-Reply-To: <20050828144103.2485.qmail-JoSsSUNfUciB9c0Qi4KiSl5cfvJIxWXgQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org> References: <20050828144103.2485.qmail@web88208.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On 8/28/05, Colin McGregor wrote: > Something to be discussed, I passed out some 300 > flyers promoting this event, nobody showed, what went > wrong? > > - Was the flyer wrong look/layout? > - Did I not promote the event in the right places? I saw a flyer at the College St "Canada Computers," which impressed me at least a little bit. > - Was the date wrong (i.e.: end of summer)? I'll bet it wasn't nearly ideal. > - Was the place wrong (too far from subway)? > - Something else? It is equally possible that the place could have been "too close to subway." The one thing that struck me on the notice was the whole "oh, you'll be responsible for paying for parking" thing. The closer you get to the subway, the more likely the need for parking to be somewhat costly. It's also entirely likely that this sort of thing starts small and grows. When I was part of NTLUG (), they started their "Linux Installation Project" as something that started a couple hours before each meeting. It grew into being fairly active; it didn't suddenly burst into something giant. Summer time was generally not terribly busy. > Other concerns, who speaks for GTALUG? I arranged for > a release form (not needed this time out) to be > checked and vetted by a local lawyer. Part way through > the event I found those forms had been hidden under a > pile of release forms that as far as I could tell had > NOT been checked by an Ontario lawyer (never mind by > one that I trust). Now, again the comes questions > comes up, who speaks for GTALUG, at least for this > this event I thought I was... Further could these > other release forms expose myself and/or GTALUG to > legal liability? My reaction to this is "Isn't there a risk of legal paralysis in this paranoia???" Putting myself in the shoes of an outsider for a moment, if I saw a "slickly-lawyerly-worded form," I would wonder why a bunch of "computer hackers" felt the activity to be SO risky that they consider it vital to so conspicuously and *precisely legally* disclaim responsibility. It would definitely leave me suspicious, and more than a little disinclined to sign off. Taking off those shoes again, I certainly don't object to the notion of having a lawyer look at release forms, but if it NEEDS to lead to a whole diarrhea of legal verbiage, I start to wonder if this doesn't mean that running an InstallFest is a "supremely legally risky" endeavour that perhaps we need to steer clear of. That is, if avoiding legal entanglements in some given activity makes it mandatory to have a frightening, unreadable set of technical legal disclaimers, perhaps the activity has become one which Legal Dangers has essentially rendered into a state where we can't do it. Shall I reword that a third time? If putting on an InstallFest is *so* unsafe, legally speaking, that we need for participants to sign off on fairly intense legal contracts, doesn't that suggest that an InstallFest is too risky (from a legal perspective) for a volunteer organization to run? -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 16:35:27 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 12:35:27 -0400 Subject: Free Opera Download and License In-Reply-To: <20050831151108.GV28567-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050831141519.GA4901@smeagol> <20050831151108.GV28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: A friend pointed out that Opera is giving away licenses to celebrate their 10th anniversary. I'm not sure when this expires as it is a 24 hour thing. Check it out here: http://my.opera.com/community/party/reg.dml When you enter *any* email address you'll get a list of licenses for all platforms on which Opera is designed to run. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 16:44:05 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 12:44:05 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux In-Reply-To: <20050831161603.GW28567-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050831161603.GW28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <4315DE55.4050305@rogers.com> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Wed, Aug 31, 2005 at 11:12:06AM -0400, Ansar Mohammed wrote: > [-- OpenSSL output follows (current time: Wed Aug 31 12:14:36 2005) --] > Error loading file /users/lsorense/.smime/ca-bundle.crt > 1158:error:02001002:system library:fopen:No such file or > directory:bss_file.c:104:fopen('/users/lsorense/.smime/ca-bundle.crt','r') > 1158:error:2006D080:BIO routines:BIO_new_file:no such > file:bss_file.c:107: > 1158:error:0B084002:x509 certificate > routines:X509_load_cert_crl_file:system lib:by_file.c:274: > [-- End of OpenSSL output --] > > [-- The following data is S/MIME signed --] > > [-- End of S/MIME signed data. --] > > Well that was spectacularly useless. Was there any content in that > message? > > Does someone actually use S/MIME in real life? At least GPG signed > messages can be read even without support for GPG. S/MIME signed messages can be read without S/MIME. I've even read them with web mail without problems. Let me know if you can't read this signed message. ;-) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 553 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 16:49:06 2005 From: jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Jason Shein) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 12:49:06 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200508311249.06757.jason@detachednetworks.ca> On August 31, 2005 02:20 am, Muhammad Imran wrote: > Hi guys, > I am buying a Laptop for Linux. If anybody bought a laptop recently that > works fine with Linux (without lot of trouble), please let me know which > one. I am thinking to buy Dell Inspiron 6000 or Sony VAIO FS645PH. has > anybody tried linux on these? > any thoughts.... > thanks guys. > ? I just bought, and am in the middle of installing Ubuntu / Kubuntu on an Acer Travelmate 4400. AMD Turion Mobile 64 CPU http://acer.ca/acerpanam/page4.do?dau22.oid=10353&UserCtxParam=0&GroupCtxParam=0&dctx1=27&CountryISOCtxParam=CA&LanguageISOCtxParam=en&crc=3492506094 All the information I found around the net said it works well. Will post my final thoughts on how it went later this afternoon. > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG > requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- Jason Shein Director of Networking, Operations and Systems Detached Networks jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org ( 905 ) - 876 - 4158 Voice ( 905 ) - 876 - 5817 Mobile http://www.detachednetworks.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 16:48:24 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 12:48:24 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux In-Reply-To: <4315DE55.4050305-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <20050831161603.GW28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <4315DE55.4050305@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20050831164824.GX28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 31, 2005 at 12:44:05PM -0400, James Knott wrote: > S/MIME signed messages can be read without S/MIME. I've even read them > with web mail without problems. > > Let me know if you can't read this signed message. ;-) Yes that one worked. Maybe the first one had no content at all then. Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 16:47:05 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 12:47:05 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux In-Reply-To: <20050831161603.GW28567-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050831161603.GW28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <4315DF09.9010809@rogers.com> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Wed, Aug 31, 2005 at 11:12:06AM -0400, Ansar Mohammed wrote: > [-- OpenSSL output follows (current time: Wed Aug 31 12:14:36 2005) --] > Error loading file /users/lsorense/.smime/ca-bundle.crt > 1158:error:02001002:system library:fopen:No such file or > directory:bss_file.c:104:fopen('/users/lsorense/.smime/ca-bundle.crt','r') > 1158:error:2006D080:BIO routines:BIO_new_file:no such > file:bss_file.c:107: > 1158:error:0B084002:x509 certificate > routines:X509_load_cert_crl_file:system lib:by_file.c:274: > [-- End of OpenSSL output --] > > [-- The following data is S/MIME signed --] > > [-- End of S/MIME signed data. --] > > Well that was spectacularly useless. Was there any content in that > message? > > Does someone actually use S/MIME in real life? At least GPG signed > messages can be read even without support for GPG. S/MIME signed messages can be read without S/MIME. I've even read them with web mail without problems. Let me know if you can't read this signed message. ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 16:48:04 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 12:48:04 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux In-Reply-To: <20050831161603.GW28567-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050831161603.GW28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <4315DF44.3050807@rogers.com> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Wed, Aug 31, 2005 at 11:12:06AM -0400, Ansar Mohammed wrote: > [-- OpenSSL output follows (current time: Wed Aug 31 12:14:36 2005) --] > Error loading file /users/lsorense/.smime/ca-bundle.crt > 1158:error:02001002:system library:fopen:No such file or > directory:bss_file.c:104:fopen('/users/lsorense/.smime/ca-bundle.crt','r') > 1158:error:2006D080:BIO routines:BIO_new_file:no such > file:bss_file.c:107: > 1158:error:0B084002:x509 certificate > routines:X509_load_cert_crl_file:system lib:by_file.c:274: > [-- End of OpenSSL output --] > > [-- The following data is S/MIME signed --] > > [-- End of S/MIME signed data. --] > > Well that was spectacularly useless. Was there any content in that > message? > > Does someone actually use S/MIME in real life? At least GPG signed > messages can be read even without support for GPG. S/MIME signed messages can be read without S/MIME. I've even read them with web mail without problems. Let me know if you can't read this signed message. ;-) (sorry, forgot to sign the previous copy) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 2839 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 16:51:26 2005 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 12:51:26 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux In-Reply-To: <20050831164824.GX28567-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20050831161603.GW28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <4315DE55.4050305@rogers.com> <20050831164824.GX28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <4315E00E.90703@rogers.com> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Wed, Aug 31, 2005 at 12:44:05PM -0400, James Knott wrote: >>S/MIME signed messages can be read without S/MIME. I've even read them >>with web mail without problems. >> >>Let me know if you can't read this signed message. ;-) > > Yes that one worked. Maybe the first one had no content at all then. This one that you replied to managed to escape before I signed it. Try the next one. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 2839 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 16:51:45 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 12:51:45 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux In-Reply-To: <200508311249.06757.jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <200508311249.06757.jason@detachednetworks.ca> Message-ID: <20050831165145.GY28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 31, 2005 at 12:49:06PM -0400, Jason Shein wrote: > I just bought, and am in the middle of installing Ubuntu / Kubuntu on an Acer > Travelmate 4400. > > AMD Turion Mobile 64 CPU > > http://acer.ca/acerpanam/page4.do?dau22.oid=10353&UserCtxParam=0&GroupCtxParam=0&dctx1=27&CountryISOCtxParam=CA&LanguageISOCtxParam=en&crc=3492506094 > > All the information I found around the net said it works well. > > Will post my final thoughts on how it went later this afternoon. Well hopefulyl you can get X running. ATI supports teh X700, but has no mention of the X700 mobility in their release notes. I think the Dell I have had trouble with has the same video chip and I still haven't managed to get X to work with it. Best bet for support is avoid ati video chips unless you know for SURE it is a supported one. Len Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 16:59:26 2005 From: cbbrowne-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 12:59:26 -0400 Subject: Installfest thoughts In-Reply-To: <20050831081848.GA2472-70WplSiaoiAG/9ncUZ6upg@public.gmane.org> References: <20050828144103.2485.qmail@web88208.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <20050831081848.GA2472@thecat.localnet> Message-ID: On 8/31/05, Allen Taylor wrote: > This statement has me very worried about the attitude of the GTAlug > executive towards legal issues (I was originally going to say that is > scared the sh*t out of me!). I have not had formal legal training > but, from my limited layman's background, having more forms to sign is > much worse than just having one form because it can easily open up more > loop holes and conflicting statements that a good lawyer can use to > advantage in front of a judge / jury. There's another thing; having a multiplicity of legal forms, particularly if any of them look really "legally interesting," is going to SCARE the would-be participant out of involvement. "Huh??? I thought this Linux thing was claimed to be more reliable than Windows. And these Linux guys keep making fun of the ridiculous EULAs. If they feel the need to have me sign off on an equally preposterous waiver before they'll help me install Linux, then maybe all those claims were so much rubbish..." > Apparently the GTAlug Installfest Release Form was prepared using input > from a sample form from The Linux Documentation Project, with added > input from the web sites of the Victoria Linux User Group, and the > Kitchener-Waterloo Linux User Group. Again, major red flags here unless > this document was created by someone with some legal training and vetted > by an Ontario based solicitor. A legal document created out of bits and > pieces of multiple sample legal documents is not automatically a solid > legal document, no matter how solid the source documents were. ... And if a document is filled with all sorts of legal equivocations that make it appear that it has the "Weasel Nature," who will want to sign off on it? Major "red flags" to the would-be signers... > Summary: I think a lot of people are going to be very wary of > involvement in future TLUG / GTAlug events and our public image, such as > it is, is going to suffer unless we can get a handle on some of these > issues and concerns. Yeah. And when people *start* by throwing around words like "libel," that can't be good. -- http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linux.html "The true measure of a man is how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good." -- Samuel Johnson, lexicographer (1709-1784) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 17:11:17 2005 From: jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Jason Shein) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 13:11:17 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux In-Reply-To: <20050831165145.GY28567-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <200508311249.06757.jason@detachednetworks.ca> <20050831165145.GY28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <200508311311.17128.jason@detachednetworks.ca> On August 31, 2005 12:51 pm, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Wed, Aug 31, 2005 at 12:49:06PM -0400, Jason Shein wrote: > > I just bought, and am in the middle of installing Ubuntu / Kubuntu on an > > Acer Travelmate 4400. > > > > AMD Turion Mobile 64 CPU > > > > http://acer.ca/acerpanam/page4.do?dau22.oid=10353&UserCtxParam=0&GroupCtx > >Param=0&dctx1=27&CountryISOCtxParam=CA&LanguageISOCtxParam=en&crc=34925060 > >94 > > > > All the information I found around the net said it works well. > > > > Will post my final thoughts on how it went later this afternoon. > > Well hopefulyl you can get X running. ATI supports teh X700, but has no > mention of the X700 mobility in their release notes. > > I think the Dell I have had trouble with has the same video chip and I > still haven't managed to get X to work with it. > > Best bet for support is avoid ati video chips unless you know for SURE > it is a supported one. > > Len Sorensen I found out ( before I purchased ) that after installation X will not start. The simple fix is to login on a terminal after installation and just add: Option "MonitorLayout" "LVDS,AUTO" to the Card-Section in xorg.conf So it will look like Section "Device" Identifier "ATI Technologies, Inc. Radeon Mobility X700 (RV410)" Driver "ati" BusID "PCI:1:0:0" Option "MonitorLayout" "LVDS,AUTO" -- Jason Shein Director of Networking, Operations and Systems Detached Networks jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org ( 905 ) - 876 - 4158 Voice ( 905 ) - 876 - 5817 Mobile http://www.detachednetworks.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From saliola-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 17:12:13 2005 From: saliola-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Franco Saliola) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 13:12:13 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: emperorlinux.com sells a range of laptops from different vendors with linux installed for you. You can specify which distro you want them to install. Even if you don't buy from them, their existence is proof that linux will work on those laptops. Franco -- On 8/31/05, Muhammad Imran wrote: > > Hi guys, > I am buying a Laptop for Linux. If anybody bought a laptop recently that > works fine with Linux (without lot of trouble), please let me know which > one. > I am thinking to buy Dell Inspiron 6000 or Sony VAIO FS645PH. has anybody > tried linux on these? > > any thoughts.... > thanks guys. > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG > requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 17:29:48 2005 From: marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Marcus Brubaker) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 13:29:48 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4315E90C.70600@utoronto.ca> Muhammad Imran wrote: > Hi guys, > I am buying a Laptop for Linux. If anybody bought a laptop recently > that works fine with Linux (without lot of trouble), please let me > know which one. > I am thinking to buy Dell Inspiron 6000 or Sony VAIO FS645PH. has > anybody tried linux on these? > I'm currently running Fedora on a Dell Inspiron 8600. Now, for all the complaints I've heard about getting Linux to work on Dells, this one was relatively painless. Had to tweak my xorg.conf to take advantage of the wider screen and install some binary drivers to get video and wireless working well but other than that, it's been fine. Someone else suggested looking to ensure that the individual components are support and I think that's a good idea. Most NVIDIA graphics chips will work well with their drivers and if you get an intel wireless card the ipw2[12]00 drivers are fairly good now. Those were my requirements when I looked for my laptop: NVIDIA graphics and Intel wireless and I'm happy with my purchase. Regards, Marcus -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 17:39:58 2005 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 13:39:58 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux In-Reply-To: <200508311311.17128.jason-xgs8i/e9EeWTtA8H5PvdGCwD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <200508311249.06757.jason@detachednetworks.ca> <20050831165145.GY28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <200508311311.17128.jason@detachednetworks.ca> Message-ID: <20050831173958.GZ28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Aug 31, 2005 at 01:11:17PM -0400, Jason Shein wrote: > I found out ( before I purchased ) that after installation X will not start. > The simple fix is to login on a terminal after installation and just add: > > Option "MonitorLayout" "LVDS,AUTO" > > to the Card-Section in xorg.conf > > So it will look like > > Section "Device" > Identifier "ATI Technologies, Inc. Radeon Mobility X700 (RV410)" > Driver "ati" > BusID "PCI:1:0:0" > Option "MonitorLayout" "LVDS,AUTO" I think I tried that before, but I will try that next time it is in the office. All it ever did was show a black screen and crash the system when trying to start X. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 17:47:19 2005 From: sy1234-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Sy) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 13:47:19 -0400 Subject: Storage solutions In-Reply-To: <20050831150139.GU28567-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <1e55af9905083106225c49db8a@mail.gmail.com> <20050831150139.GU28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <1e55af9905083110475a0d57ea@mail.gmail.com> On 8/31/05, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > Why evms and not just the standard LVM that linux supports natively > without patching the kernel? It's supported out of the box by pclinux, so I don't have to worry about kernel patching. I thought evms was superior than lvm.. I don't know the differences yet, I'll research these today. I would think that LVM would be clearly superior, especially for restoration purposes, because I wouldn't have to have a specialized tool to get at the setup. One of my fears with EVMS is that I'd have to make a custom rescue disk. That's actually as trivial as making an old DOS boot disk, and I'm doing that anyways.. so it's not so big a concern, but it's not something I want to *require*. Anyways.. I'll look into LVM more closely. > I just backup stuff that is important to DVD (using tob + some growisofs > scripts). I don't trust optical storage. Actually, with my standards I probably shouldn't trust magnetic storage either.. hrm. Well, I don't have a DVD writer so the point is moot. I'll consider this stuff later. > I run rsnapshot to make hourly rsync snapshots of everything important > too, and run everything on md raid1 on a pair of sata drives. Once > every few hours important stuff is also rsync'd to another server and > vice versa. I'll look at this tool and reconsider my dislike of diff'd backups. My fear, as above, is that recovery in the face of a disaster would be annoying with a diff'd setup. Fraser, I'll look at rdiff-backup and some other tools, thanks. So far, the idea is thus: 2 HDDs, softraided somehow. Diff-backupd to an external solution. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 17:53:48 2005 From: jamon.camisso-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jamon Camisso) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 13:53:48 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux In-Reply-To: <20050831173958.GZ28567-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <200508311249.06757.jason@detachednetworks.ca> <20050831165145.GY28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <200508311311.17128.jason@detachednetworks.ca> <20050831173958.GZ28567@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Wed, Aug 31, 2005 at 01:11:17PM -0400, Jason Shein wrote: > >>I found out ( before I purchased ) that after installation X will not start. >>The simple fix is to login on a terminal after installation and just add: >> >>Option "MonitorLayout" "LVDS,AUTO" >> >>to the Card-Section in xorg.conf >> >>So it will look like >> >>Section "Device" >> Identifier "ATI Technologies, Inc. Radeon Mobility X700 (RV410)" >> Driver "ati" >> BusID "PCI:1:0:0" >> Option "MonitorLayout" "LVDS,AUTO" > > > I think I tried that before, but I will try that next time it is in the > office. All it ever did was show a black screen and crash the system > when trying to start X. > > Lennart Sorensen Another thing to try would be the radeon or fglrx driver(s) if you have one installed. I've found that replacing "ati" with "radeon" works well with my 9700 mobility. Not sure how this would work with an X700 though. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 17:57:24 2005 From: scruss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Stewart C. Russell) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 13:57:24 -0400 Subject: Best Laptop for Linux In-Reply-To: <20050831152531.GA8567-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20050831152531.GA8567@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <4315EF84.1070901@sympatico.ca> William O'Higgins Witteman wrote: > > You can get ThinkPads used (refurbished after > short leases) for very good prices, and there are a lot of people > selling parts for them, so you'll be able to keep it running if > something goes awry. Yes, but if the screen/battery/case goes, repairs are kind of expensive. My T21 hit the awful trifecta, and was not worth repairing. cheers, Stewart -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From dchipman-rYHPKw+MWrk at public.gmane.org Wed Aug 31 18:24:55 2005 From: dchipman-rYHPKw+MWrk at public.gmane.org (David C. Chipman) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 14:24:55 -0400 Subject: [TLUG] Local Linux-friendly System Builder Loses Distro CDs Message-ID: <1125512696.2615.19.camel@david.chipman> Hi all, I just heard that Sub500.com no longer installs distributions other than Linspire (meh!). It seems their Linux expoert left, and took the master Cds with them. Could we help out a local company, and get CDs to them? Later, -David Chipman -- There are 10 kinds of people in the world; those who understand binary, and those who don't -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pking123 at sympatico.ca Wed Aug 31 21:22:03 2005 From: pking123 at sympatico.ca (pking123 at sympatico.ca) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 17:22:03 -0400 Subject: [TLUG]: FC4: Ways to use PalmPilot In-Reply-To: <1125504154.2761.23.camel@rltp40f4.ralii.com> References: <431585BE.28632.1ED828@localhost> Message-ID: <4315E73B.2821.19BA8D1@localhost> I wonder what would happen if I created a directory for the device, and in that directory, I created the device statically with the permissions and ownerships I want and then udev can go do whatever it likes. It seems to be a better than delving into /etc/udev, and dealing with a whole other set of intricacies. It's an idea I have, and I am just going to try it. Thanks for everyone's help so far! Paul King > Robert Locke (lists at ralii.com) wrote: > > You are battling with udev.... Turns out that every time you reboot, > the /dev/ directory is wiped out. The files are regenerated by udev > when the system boots or you and I dynamically plug something in. > > Now you can look to manipulate the udev rules to automatically create > your symlink of /dev/pilot, for example, there are several examples in > the archives. But the system should probably already have a rule to > assign the "logged-in user" as the owner of the serial port or any > dynamically created USB ports.... You can see some of this in > /etc/udev/rules.d/.... > > --Rob > -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list at redhat.com To unsubscribe: http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list