From lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 1 15:01:18 2004 From: lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org (Lloyd Budd) Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2004 10:01:18 -0500 Subject: USB/Firewire IDE case Message-ID: <7D6418A6-54C7-11D8-B84E-0003931BD222@foolswisdom.com> Hi, Anyone here on the list have any experience with those USB/Firewire IDE cases? with Maxtor 160GB drives? one that is quite universal in the drives that it integrates with? Cheers, Lloyd -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jmm-TU2q2He6PgRlD5gtYiU6kEEOCMrvLtNR at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 1 16:37:30 2004 From: jmm-TU2q2He6PgRlD5gtYiU6kEEOCMrvLtNR at public.gmane.org (John Macdonald) Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2004 11:37:30 -0500 Subject: which language In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040201113729.T25483@algate.perlwolf.com> On Sun, Feb 01, 2004 at 12:33:30AM +0200, Peter L. Peres wrote: > To the point: I would like to use arity and type-based function > implementation matching, as is available in C++ and Prolog. Can this be > done in Perl or TCL or Python without reinventing the wheel ? I.e. is > there a straightforward syntax to write: > > function foo(a) { print a } > function foo(a,b) { print a+b } > > ? what now ? Lisp ? Scheme ? tia, If you can afford to wait a year or two, Perl 6 will support differentiating by both number and the type of the arguments. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 1 16:17:36 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Sun, 01 Feb 2004 11:17:36 -0500 Subject: USB/Firewire IDE case In-Reply-To: <7D6418A6-54C7-11D8-B84E-0003931BD222-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ@public.gmane.org> References: <7D6418A6-54C7-11D8-B84E-0003931BD222@foolswisdom.com> Message-ID: <401D26A0.1080303@alteeve.com> Not yet, but it looks like I will be buying an external USB2 chassis with removable 3.5" trays for backup of a server. If you aren't in a desperate push for time, I will be happy to report my findings shortly. Madison Lloyd Budd wrote: > Hi, > > Anyone here on the list have any experience with those USB/Firewire IDE > cases? with Maxtor 160GB drives? one that is quite universal in the > drives that it integrates with? > > Cheers, > Lloyd -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 1 19:33:21 2004 From: tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Tim Writer) Date: 01 Feb 2004 14:33:21 -0500 Subject: which language In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Peter L. Peres" writes: > I am working on my idea of writing state machine descriptions in a > 'language' of mine. I do not know what language is best to implement it. > To the point: I would like to use arity and type-based function > implementation matching, as is available in C++ and Prolog. Can this be > done in Perl or TCL or Python without reinventing the wheel ? I.e. is > there a straightforward syntax to write: > > function foo(a) { print a } > function foo(a,b) { print a+b } Henry already responded regarding arity and type matching for function calls. However, I'm curious, why you would require this feature for implementing a state machine. The states of state machines are quite naturally described as a mapping from an input (often a character) to an action (such as drop the character, shift the character onto the token buffer, goto another state, etc.). Consequently, a procedural representation of states (using functional composition) is a powerful and concise way to represent state machines. A detailed example in Scheme is given in "Essentials of Programming Languages" by Daniel Friedman et al. The more conventional table based approach is easy to implement in any of these languages and doesn't obviously benefit from arity and type matching for function calls. -- tim writer starnix inc. 905.771.0017 ext. 225 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 1 22:43:04 2004 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2004 17:43:04 -0500 (EST) Subject: USB/Firewire IDE case In-Reply-To: <401D26A0.1080303-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <7D6418A6-54C7-11D8-B84E-0003931BD222@foolswisdom.com> <401D26A0.1080303@alteeve.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 1 Feb 2004, Madison Kelly wrote: > Not yet, but it looks like I will be buying an external USB2 chassis > with removable 3.5" trays for backup of a server. If you aren't in a > desperate push for time, I will be happy to report my findings shortly. I've been happily using this sort of setup for personal backups for some years. I have 2 x Firewire cases each with an 80GB IDE drive. At no time are both of these drives onsite with my personal servers so I always have at least 1 offsite backup. Each night my boxes do a full or incremental backups to a "staging server". Every 2 weeks or so I bring one of firewire cases onsite and rsync the data from the staging area. This is all done with scripts. The exact frequency with which to take offsite backups is up to the administrators and owners of the data. In the end the frequency (or lack there-of) is a trade off between convenience and data protection. Cheers, Rob -- Robert Brockway Senior Technical Consultant, OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Phone: 416-669-3073, Email: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org, http://www.opentrend.net OpenTrend Solutions: Reliable, secure solutions to real world problems. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 1 22:56:48 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Sun, 01 Feb 2004 17:56:48 -0500 Subject: USB/Firewire IDE case In-Reply-To: References: <7D6418A6-54C7-11D8-B84E-0003931BD222@foolswisdom.com> <401D26A0.1080303@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <401D8430.6040702@alteeve.com> Hi Rob, What are the chances I could pawn those scripts off of you? :) Madison Robert Brockway wrote: > On Sun, 1 Feb 2004, Madison Kelly wrote: > > >>Not yet, but it looks like I will be buying an external USB2 chassis >>with removable 3.5" trays for backup of a server. If you aren't in a >>desperate push for time, I will be happy to report my findings shortly. > > > I've been happily using this sort of setup for personal backups for some > years. I have 2 x Firewire cases each with an 80GB IDE drive. At no time > are both of these drives onsite with my personal servers so I always have > at least 1 offsite backup. > > Each night my boxes do a full or incremental backups to a "staging > server". Every 2 weeks or so I bring one of firewire cases onsite and > rsync the data from the staging area. This is all done with scripts. > > The exact frequency with which to take offsite backups is up to the > administrators and owners of the data. In the end the frequency (or lack > there-of) is a trade off between convenience and data protection. > > Cheers, > Rob > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jzygmont-tEQKYFGiemxAYG7eUwYNkWD2FQJk+8+b at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 2 02:19:55 2004 From: jzygmont-tEQKYFGiemxAYG7eUwYNkWD2FQJk+8+b at public.gmane.org (Justin Zygmont) Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2004 21:19:55 -0500 (EST) Subject: off topic question Message-ID: I was wondering if anyone might know of a cheap place to lock up some things in storage for a few months? All I really need is a relatively small space for a gym bag, etc. It's been a bit harder to find, and I was hoping someone on here might have an idea. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 2 04:56:36 2004 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2004 23:56:36 -0500 (EST) Subject: USB/Firewire IDE case In-Reply-To: <401D8430.6040702-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <7D6418A6-54C7-11D8-B84E-0003931BD222@foolswisdom.com> <401D26A0.1080303@alteeve.com> <401D8430.6040702@alteeve.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 1 Feb 2004, Madison Kelly wrote: > Hi Rob, > > What are the chances I could pawn those scripts off of you? :) Sure. I'll knock up a few docs and put them on a web page. I'll mail the list when this is done. Right now the scripts come in a bzip2'd tar file. I do have plans to turn out a .deb. When I sat down to do this the other day I got interrupted by real work :) Cheers, Rob -- Robert Brockway Senior Technical Consultant, OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Phone: 416-669-3073, Email: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org, http://www.opentrend.net OpenTrend Solutions: Reliable, secure solutions to real world problems. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 2 11:20:35 2004 From: pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Paul King) Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 06:20:35 -0500 Subject: Debian finally accepts X with Radeon 9200 card Message-ID: <401DEC33.7678.559E6@localhost> Thanks for all of the help You need to add the line "ChipID 0x4242" (no quotes) to the "Devices" stanza of XF86Config-4. I then got it to work, (DRI still disabled) with new drivers and all. The mouse still doesn't work. Since gpm works, I configured it as gpmdata, but maybe I'll change it to psaux. Paul King ========================================================= Paul King http://www3.sympatico.ca/pking123/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From kenn-mwSrj/bF9lKNls3PewDF2w at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 2 12:29:41 2004 From: kenn-mwSrj/bF9lKNls3PewDF2w at public.gmane.org (Kenn Munro) Date: 02 Feb 2004 07:29:41 -0500 Subject: mounting digital camera sometimes causes system hang Message-ID: <1075724979.1054.10.camel@cable-216-104-106-170.lively.dyn.personainc.net> I have a Panasonic DMC-LC33 digital camera that I access using usb-storage. Once every month or two (maybe 10% of the time I connect it), mounting it makes my system hang. The keyboard is unresponsive and the num lock light remains on (doesn't flash and won't turn off). I'm using Red Hat 9, kernel 2.4.20-28.9. Does anyone have any suggestions as to what the problem might be or how to fix it? My fstab entry is: /dev/sda1 /mnt/camera msdos noauto,user,owner,rw 0 0 The last lines in /var/log/messages are: Feb 2 07:12:22 cable-216-104-106-170 kernel: hub.c: new USB device 00:04.2-2, assigned address 14 Feb 2 07:12:25 cable-216-104-106-170 /etc/hotplug/usb.agent: Setup usb-storage for USB product 4da/2372/10 Feb 2 07:12:27 cable-216-104-106-170 kernel: SCSI device sda: 246017 512-byte hdwr sectors (126 MB) Feb 2 07:12:27 cable-216-104-106-170 kernel: sda: Write Protect is off Feb 2 07:12:27 cable-216-104-106-170 kernel: sda:<4>usb-uhci.c: interrupt, status 2, frame# 1150 Feb 2 08:15:05 cable-216-104-106-170 syslogd 1.4.1: restart. Thanks... Kenn -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From forolinux-/E1597aS9LQAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 2 12:49:42 2004 From: forolinux-/E1597aS9LQAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Martin C) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 04:49:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: mounting digital camera sometimes causes system hang In-Reply-To: <1075724979.1054.10.camel-zGsQjP6gyKPS+5BON/3Up8JeNgE0HwA0S9G6yd3BABLEs4PmSCcXeW45/GSNgb/n@public.gmane.org> References: <1075724979.1054.10.camel@cable-216-104-106-170.lively.dyn.personainc.net> Message-ID: <20040202124942.83405.qmail@web14523.mail.yahoo.com> --- Kenn Munro wrote: > I have a Panasonic DMC-LC33 digital camera that I > access using > usb-storage. Once every month or two (maybe 10% of > the time I connect > it), mounting it makes my system hang. The keyboard > is unresponsive and > the num lock light remains on (doesn't flash and > won't turn off). I'm > using Red Hat 9, kernel 2.4.20-28.9. Does anyone > have any suggestions > as to what the problem might be or how to fix it? > > My fstab entry is: > > /dev/sda1 /mnt/camera msdos > noauto,user,owner,rw 0 0 I mount digital cameras and USB readers with vfat type, maybe you can try that. In KDE sometimes kdeinit keeps using the directory and I can't umount. I'm trying KDE 3.2, maybe it's a KDE bug. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 2 14:57:11 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 09:57:11 -0500 Subject: NON HTML Free WebMail In-Reply-To: <200401311444.40325.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200401311444.40325.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <401E6547.5020903@alteeve.com> http://mail.alteeve.com Mail me off list with the details (username/password) and I will set you up an account. Same for anyone who would like an account, just e-mail me. See ya! Madison Garth Meisel wrote: > Anyone know of any non-HTML yet free Webmail outfits so newcomers need not > worry about being dissed because they have no alternative except webmail like > HOTMAIL? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 2 14:50:55 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 09:50:55 -0500 Subject: generating .cue files In-Reply-To: <401C1377.1070004-F0u+EriZ6ihBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <401C1377.1070004@truxtar.com> Message-ID: <20040202145055.GA732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Sat, Jan 31, 2004 at 03:43:35PM -0500, Anton Markov wrote: > I have a .bin cd image file on my computer, but I can't burn it with any > software (K3B or xcdroast) without the accompaning .cue file, which I > don't have, and can't find. From what I understand, the .cue file > describes the .bin file such as the block size, track count, etc. Is > there a tool under Linux that would allow me to analyze a .bin file and > re-generate the cue file. Well you could try just mounting it with mount -t iso9660 -o loop file.bin /cdrom, and see if it's just an iso named .bin. Otherwise, what is the filesize of the .bin? Is it an excact multiple of 2048, 2324, 2336 or 2352 bytes? What is it supposed to contain? Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 2 14:53:39 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 09:53:39 -0500 Subject: which language In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040202145338.GB732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Sun, Feb 01, 2004 at 12:33:30AM +0200, Peter L. Peres wrote: > > I am working on my idea of writing state machine descriptions in a > 'language' of mine. I do not know what language is best to implement it. > To the point: I would like to use arity and type-based function > implementation matching, as is available in C++ and Prolog. Can this be > done in Perl or TCL or Python without reinventing the wheel ? I.e. is > there a straightforward syntax to write: > > function foo(a) { print a } > function foo(a,b) { print a+b } > > ? what now ? Lisp ? Scheme ? tia, Try an ML language, like ocaml. Strongly typed, multiple definitions of functions based on types and number of inputs and such, and rather fast when compiled too. Has an interpreter too. Allows partial functions too (as in part of the function execution that is constant is pre executed and can then be called with the remaining arguments later). Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From GHunter-kgJIzn72htc at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 2 15:33:02 2004 From: GHunter-kgJIzn72htc at public.gmane.org (Geoffrey Hunter) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 10:33:02 -0500 Subject: NON HTML Free WebMail In-Reply-To: <401E6547.5020903-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200401311444.40325.Garth@Webostics.com> <401E6547.5020903@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <1075735982.401e6daef1255@webmail.yorku.ca> Madison: Please open a WEB Email account for me. Thanks, Geoffrey Hunter Chemistry Building Room 318 York University, 4700 Keele Street Toronto, Ontario, Canada M3J1P3 Office: 416-736-5306 Cell: 416-802-5146 Residence: 905-880-5146 email: GHunter-4mebg6r7xUY at public.gmane.org __________________________________________ Quoting Madison Kelly : > http://mail.alteeve.com > > Mail me off list with the details (username/password) and I will set you > up an account. Same for anyone who would like an account, just e-mail me. > > See ya! > > Madison > > Garth Meisel wrote: > > Anyone know of any non-HTML yet free Webmail outfits so newcomers need not > > > worry about being dissed because they have no alternative except webmail > like > > HOTMAIL? > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 2 15:47:07 2004 From: tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Tim Writer) Date: 02 Feb 2004 10:47:07 -0500 Subject: mounting digital camera sometimes causes system hang In-Reply-To: <1075724979.1054.10.camel-zGsQjP6gyKPS+5BON/3Up8JeNgE0HwA0S9G6yd3BABLEs4PmSCcXeW45/GSNgb/n@public.gmane.org> References: <1075724979.1054.10.camel@cable-216-104-106-170.lively.dyn.personainc.net> Message-ID: Kenn Munro writes: > I have a Panasonic DMC-LC33 digital camera that I access using > usb-storage. Once every month or two (maybe 10% of the time I connect > it), mounting it makes my system hang. The keyboard is unresponsive and > the num lock light remains on (doesn't flash and won't turn off). I'm > using Red Hat 9, kernel 2.4.20-28.9. Does anyone have any suggestions > as to what the problem might be or how to fix it? Possibly an interrupt conflict. In my experience, the USB drivers don't like to share interrupts with other devices. Enabling APIC (in the BIOS) and in the kernel can help. I think it's already enabled in your RH kernel but make sure you aren't using the "noapic" option on the kernel command line. Unfortunately, it's difficult (impossible?) on most modern systems to get all the USB devices on their own interrupt because there are so many of them (usually four or more). Some BIOSes give you some amount of control, allowing you to reorganize devices according to function. -- tim writer starnix inc. 905.771.0017 ext. 225 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 2 15:49:59 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 10:49:59 -0500 Subject: mounting digital camera sometimes causes system hang In-Reply-To: References: <1075724979.1054.10.camel@cable-216-104-106-170.lively.dyn.personainc.net> Message-ID: <20040202154959.GC732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Mon, Feb 02, 2004 at 10:47:07AM -0500, Tim Writer wrote: > Possibly an interrupt conflict. In my experience, the USB drivers don't like > to share interrupts with other devices. Enabling APIC (in the BIOS) and in > the kernel can help. I think it's already enabled in your RH kernel but make > sure you aren't using the "noapic" option on the kernel command line. > Unfortunately, it's difficult (impossible?) on most modern systems to get all > the USB devices on their own interrupt because there are so many of them > (usually four or more). Some BIOSes give you some amount of control, > allowing you to reorganize devices according to function. Strange since I have never had a problem with USB's interrupt being shared. Most systems I have worked with don't even have any way to aboid it since it's hard wired to share with something else onboard. If something won't share IRQs with USB, I blame the other device. Most likely is buggy usb device drivers. Perhaps a kernel upgrade fixes it. There have also been a few buggy usb implementation on a few chipsets. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 2 16:15:05 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:15:05 -0500 Subject: USB/Firewire IDE case In-Reply-To: <7D6418A6-54C7-11D8-B84E-0003931BD222-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ@public.gmane.org> References: <7D6418A6-54C7-11D8-B84E-0003931BD222@foolswisdom.com> Message-ID: <20040202161505.GD732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Sun, Feb 01, 2004 at 10:01:18AM -0500, Lloyd Budd wrote: > Anyone here on the list have any experience with those USB/Firewire IDE > cases? with Maxtor 160GB drives? one that is quite universal in the > drives that it integrates with? Well if the controller chip handles LBA28 it can do up to 133GB, if it supports the new LBA48 it can do much much larger. Check the specs I suppose. Not sure how much of LBA28/LBA48 is software related and how much is hardware. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 1 20:17:56 2004 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter L. Peres) Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2004 22:17:56 +0200 (IST) Subject: which language In-Reply-To: <20040201113729.T25483-TU2q2He6PgRlD5gtYiU6kEEOCMrvLtNR@public.gmane.org> References: <20040201113729.T25483@algate.perlwolf.com> Message-ID: Thanks to all who replied. The answer seems to be no. I cannot wait a year or two for Perl 6. And I will not do it in C++. So Prolog, or restate the idea ... (I know very little Prolog). Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jingsu-26n5VD7DAF2Tm46uYYfjYg at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 2 19:09:09 2004 From: jingsu-26n5VD7DAF2Tm46uYYfjYg at public.gmane.org (Jing Su) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 14:09:09 -0500 Subject: which language In-Reply-To: References: <20040201113729.T25483@algate.perlwolf.com> Message-ID: Sorry, I haven't paid much attention to this thread and so my reply might not be within the context of what you want... Though Java isn't quite "scripting language", it is still much easier to play with than C++ and has a better set of support libraries. If you're willing to stray away from the standard Java language, try taking a look at MultiJava. MultiJava basically is a port to give Java some of the same function signature matching capabilities of languages like ML. http://multijava.sourceforge.net MultiJava is byte-code compatible with JVM's, so you don't have to worry about byte-code portability. All that's different is the compiler. I actually coded in MultiJava in my undergrad research project, and it does give you some very nice programming flexibilities. In particular, because the MultiMethods can be inherited and extended, it made the project quite a bit nicer to write, extend, and read. -Jing On Sun, 1 Feb 2004, Peter L. Peres wrote: > Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2004 15:17:56 -0500 > From: Peter L. Peres > Reply-To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: which language > > > Thanks to all who replied. The answer seems to be no. I cannot wait a year > or two for Perl 6. And I will not do it in C++. So Prolog, or restate the > idea ... (I know very little Prolog). > > Peter > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 2 19:19:51 2004 From: tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Tim Writer) Date: 02 Feb 2004 14:19:51 -0500 Subject: mounting digital camera sometimes causes system hang In-Reply-To: <20040202154959.GC732-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <1075724979.1054.10.camel@cable-216-104-106-170.lively.dyn.personainc.net> <20040202154959.GC732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) writes: > On Mon, Feb 02, 2004 at 10:47:07AM -0500, Tim Writer wrote: > > Possibly an interrupt conflict. In my experience, the USB drivers don't like > > to share interrupts with other devices. Enabling APIC (in the BIOS) and in > > the kernel can help. I think it's already enabled in your RH kernel but make > > sure you aren't using the "noapic" option on the kernel command line. > > Unfortunately, it's difficult (impossible?) on most modern systems to get all > > the USB devices on their own interrupt because there are so many of them > > (usually four or more). Some BIOSes give you some amount of control, > > allowing you to reorganize devices according to function. > > Strange since I have never had a problem with USB's interrupt being > shared. Most systems I have worked with don't even have any way to > aboid it since it's hard wired to share with something else onboard. > > If something won't share IRQs with USB, I blame the other device. The most recent case is an approx. 1 year old Gigabyte P4 board where there was a clear conflict with the on-board Promise RAID controller (used as an ordinary IDE controller) and the on-board USB. I blame the USB because the BIOS gave me enough control to have the USB share an interrupt with my SCSI controller or my video card (instead of the Promise RAID) and, in all cases, using USB consistently hung the system. APIC seems to have fixed it. We had another recent case with a firewall we built for a customer. We had USB enabled cuz we used a USB stick to load some packages. Under heavy network load, the NIC would hang. Disabling USB in the BIOS fixed the problem. > Most likely is buggy usb device drivers. Perhaps a kernel upgrade fixes > it. There have also been a few buggy usb implementation on a few > chipsets. I'm running 2.4.22. -- tim writer starnix inc. 905.771.0017 ext. 225 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 2 23:01:14 2004 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 18:01:14 -0500 Subject: USB/Firewire IDE case In-Reply-To: References: <7D6418A6-54C7-11D8-B84E-0003931BD222@foolswisdom.com> <401D26A0.1080303@alteeve.com> <401D8430.6040702@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <401ED6BA.5070800@rogers.com> Robert Brockway wrote: > On Sun, 1 Feb 2004, Madison Kelly wrote: > > >>Hi Rob, >> >> What are the chances I could pawn those scripts off of you? :) > > > Sure. I'll knock up a few docs and put them on a web page. I'll mail the > list when this is done. > > Right now the scripts come in a bzip2'd tar file. I do have plans to > turn out a .deb. When I sat down to do this the other day I got > interrupted by real work :) > > Cheers, > Rob > "I'll knock up a few docs" Hmmm... That doesn't sound quite right. ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 12:43:50 2004 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 07:43:50 -0500 Subject: OT: Great news!! In-Reply-To: <4015A684.7080302-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <4015A684.7080302@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <401F9786.2030203@sympatico.ca> Madison Kelly wrote: > Hi all, > > Many of you know Lance Squire here from the list. Well, his wife > early this morning gave birth to a healthy (and big!) baby boy named > Logan Falcon Squire at 8lb 10ozs (just under 3kg). Mom, baby and > playing the all-too-often forgotten supporting role dad are doing > great but are also very tired! Awesome name, mr & mrs Squire, and thanks for trumpetting the news MK. Just to bring it back on topic, young Logan isn't in any way shaped like a penguin, is he ? Just checking ;-) djp -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 12:57:34 2004 From: matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (G. Matthew Rice) Date: 03 Feb 2004 07:57:34 -0500 Subject: OT: Great news!! In-Reply-To: <401F9786.2030203-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <4015A684.7080302@alteeve.com> <401F9786.2030203@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: David J Patrick writes: > Just to bring it back on topic, young Logan isn't in any way shaped like a > penguin, is he ? No, but his mom _was_ (/me ducks for cover ;) -- g. matthew rice starnix inc. phone: 905-771-0017 x242 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 13:21:56 2004 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 08:21:56 -0500 Subject: OT: Great news!! In-Reply-To: <4015A684.7080302-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <4015A684.7080302@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <20040203082156.307e07c5.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Mon, 26 Jan 2004 18:45:08 -0500 Madison Kelly disseminated the following: > 8lb 10ozs All props due to the mother! Wow! -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 08:21:18 up 11:22, 3 users, load average: 0.69, 0.57, 0.39 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Linux 2.4.22-26mdk i686 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ "The gambling known as business looks with austere disfavor upon the business known as gambling."-- Ambrose Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 17:11:55 2004 From: lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org (Lloyd Budd) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 12:11:55 -0500 Subject: USB/Firewire IDE case In-Reply-To: References: <7D6418A6-54C7-11D8-B84E-0003931BD222@foolswisdom.com> <401D26A0.1080303@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <11110CC5-566C-11D8-8143-0003931BD222@foolswisdom.com> On 1-Feb-04, at 17:43, Robert Brockway wrote: > On Sun, 1 Feb 2004, Madison Kelly wrote: > >> Not yet, but it looks like I will be buying an external USB2 chassis >> with removable 3.5" trays for backup of a server. If you aren't in a >> desperate push for time, I will be happy to report my findings >> shortly. > > I've been happily using this sort of setup for personal backups for > some > years. I have 2 x Firewire cases each with an 80GB IDE drive. Are they external drives? or did you purchase the drives and the "cases" separately. If you purchased the case separately, what brand are they? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 17:24:09 2004 From: lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org (Lloyd Budd) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 12:24:09 -0500 Subject: faster than 7200 IDE drives? Message-ID: Hi, Is 7200 RPM the current limit for IDE drives? Is this bus bound? Cheers, Lloyd -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 17:33:50 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 12:33:50 -0500 Subject: faster than 7200 IDE drives? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <401FDB7E.8040600@alteeve.com> Currently, yes. Seagate has been threatening to release a 10k IDE drive for a while but it is not an easy feat to do at an affordable volume. The limit is not interface at all, simply logistics. Madison Lloyd Budd wrote: > Hi, > > Is 7200 RPM the current limit for IDE drives? Is this bus bound? > > Cheers, > Lloyd -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 2 19:06:22 2004 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter L. Peres) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 21:06:22 +0200 (IST) Subject: which language In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Sun, 1 Feb 2004, Tim Writer wrote: > Henry already responded regarding arity and type matching for function calls. > However, I'm curious, why you would require this feature for implementing a > state machine. The states of state machines are quite naturally described as ... You are assuming I will compile it. I would like it to be interpreted, and possibly self-modifying. I would also like to be be spared the effort to write each state and each transition. Instead I'd like to be able to write a set of clauses for each state, each clause encoding a test and a transition, and possibly clauses that generate sets or subsets of such clauses (that would be inheritance, the Prolog way, I guess). I could use a table or write a parser that interprets such a 'language'. Using functions with variable arguments (and default arguments) would be one easier way to implement such a thing, I think. Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 18:44:59 2004 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 13:44:59 -0500 (EST) Subject: USB/Firewire IDE case In-Reply-To: <11110CC5-566C-11D8-8143-0003931BD222-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ@public.gmane.org> References: <7D6418A6-54C7-11D8-B84E-0003931BD222@foolswisdom.com> <401D26A0.1080303@alteeve.com> <11110CC5-566C-11D8-8143-0003931BD222@foolswisdom.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 3 Feb 2004, Lloyd Budd wrote: > Are they external drives? or did you purchase the drives and the I purchased the cases and drives seperately but some companies do sell them together. The ones sold together are simply a stock standard IDE drive in the same case. The only difference is they put it in for you :) > "cases" separately. If you purchased the case separately, what brand > are they? You know something, neither of them has any visible brand markings. Strange. These cases are readily available in small computer shops. I got one of my two on "Computer Row" on Spadina where all the small computer shops are. I use Firewire but some people swear by the combo devices - allowing access via firewire or usb. The great thing is that if you absolutely _had_ to get at the data and had neither firewire or usb readily available (admittedly unlikely these days) you can take the drive out and mount it as an internal IDE drive. This gives tremendous ability to get at the data in an emergency. Cheers, Rob -- Robert Brockway Senior Technical Consultant, OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Phone: 416-669-3073, Email: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org, http://www.opentrend.net OpenTrend Solutions: Reliable, secure solutions to real world problems. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 18:54:16 2004 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 13:54:16 -0500 Subject: the box locks up ! Message-ID: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> For quite a while, I have been experiencing an annoying problem that has been making my Debian box feel like Win98 (1st edition!). When accessing partitions on hdb the box will frequently lock up solid. I haven't been able to pinpoint the offending partition, but whether using Konqueror, mc, or most recently QTParted (in an effort to find out more about these partitions) I hold my breath and 1 out of 5 times KLANGGGG .... sigh .. reboot. I have posted regarding this condition, in the past, but still have no idea how to properly diagnose the source of the offending behavior. Any ideas ? djp -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 19:11:24 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 14:11:24 -0500 Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <401FEE58.6060100-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <401FF25C.1030705@alteeve.com> First guess is that the hard drive I/O heads are slamming into either the platter spindle or inner chassis wall (based on the clang). Madison David J Patrick wrote: > For quite a while, I have been experiencing an annoying problem > that has been making my Debian box feel like Win98 (1st edition!). > When accessing partitions on hdb the box will frequently lock up solid. > I haven't been able to pinpoint the offending partition, but whether using > Konqueror, mc, or most recently QTParted (in an effort to find out more > about > these partitions) I hold my breath and 1 out of 5 times KLANGGGG .... > sigh .. reboot. > I have posted regarding this condition, in the past, but still have no idea > how to properly diagnose the source of the offending behavior. > Any ideas ? > djp -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 20:01:26 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 15:01:26 -0500 Subject: faster than 7200 IDE drives? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040203200125.GE732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Feb 03, 2004 at 12:24:09PM -0500, Lloyd Budd wrote: > Is 7200 RPM the current limit for IDE drives? Is this bus bound? No, WD makes some 10000 rpm drives, that are priced at about the level of a similar SCSI drive. They come in 36 and 74GB I think. Higher speed means much higher prices, more heat, lower density, less capacity. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 20:02:20 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 15:02:20 -0500 Subject: faster than 7200 IDE drives? In-Reply-To: <401FDB7E.8040600-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <401FDB7E.8040600@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <20040203200220.GF732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Feb 03, 2004 at 12:33:50PM -0500, Madison Kelly wrote: > Currently, yes. Seagate has been threatening to release a 10k IDE drive > for a while but it is not an easy feat to do at an affordable volume. > The limit is not interface at all, simply logistics. You don't think the WD Raptor series count as IDE drives? Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 20:23:13 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 15:23:13 -0500 Subject: faster than 7200 IDE drives? In-Reply-To: <20040203200220.GF732-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <401FDB7E.8040600@alteeve.com> <20040203200220.GF732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <40200331.4020600@alteeve.com> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Tue, Feb 03, 2004 at 12:33:50PM -0500, Madison Kelly wrote: > >>Currently, yes. Seagate has been threatening to release a 10k IDE drive >>for a while but it is not an easy feat to do at an affordable volume. >>The limit is not interface at all, simply logistics. > > > You don't think the WD Raptor series count as IDE drives? > > Lennart Sorensen Doh! I don't follow the Western Digital line these days... Too many failures in the past. As you mentioned though, the price is so high that you might as well go SCSI... Madison -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 21:09:45 2004 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 16:09:45 -0500 Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <401FF25C.1030705-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> <401FF25C.1030705@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <40200E19.5030603@sympatico.ca> Madison Kelly wrote: > First guess is that the hard drive I/O heads are slamming into either > the platter spindle or inner chassis wall (based on the clang). > > Madison Apology for the misinformation, Madison, he "KLANGG " in question was entirely metaphorical. The anti-event is perfectly silent and shows no other symptoms but FREEZE. On boot, BIOS indicates that both drives are S.M.A.R.T. capable but disabled, should I (have) enabled that feature ? djp -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 21:24:49 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 16:24:49 -0500 Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <40200E19.5030603-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> <401FF25C.1030705@alteeve.com> <40200E19.5030603@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <402011A1.1020009@alteeve.com> You can (usuallY) enable SMART monitoring in the system BIOS. It -may- tell you something, but that is rare. You may want to surface-scan /dev/hdb and see what is reported. Also, check SYSLOG to see if there are any "I/O " errors on 'hdb'. If you see that, replace the drive asap. Madison David J Patrick wrote: > Madison Kelly wrote: > >> First guess is that the hard drive I/O heads are slamming into either >> the platter spindle or inner chassis wall (based on the clang). >> >> Madison > > > Apology for the misinformation, Madison, he "KLANGG " in question was > entirely metaphorical. > The anti-event is perfectly silent and shows no other symptoms but FREEZE. > On boot, BIOS indicates that both drives are S.M.A.R.T. capable but > disabled, > should I (have) enabled that feature ? > djp -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 21:52:06 2004 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 16:52:06 -0500 Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <402011A1.1020009-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> <401FF25C.1030705@alteeve.com> <40200E19.5030603@sympatico.ca> <402011A1.1020009@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <40201806.7060609@sympatico.ca> Madison Kelly wrote: > You can (usuallY) enable SMART monitoring in the system BIOS. It -may- > tell you something, but that is rare. I read that, that's why I never bothered > You may want to surface-scan /dev/hdb and see what is reported. Also, > check SYSLOG to see if there are any "I/O " errors on > 'hdb'. If you see that, replace the drive asap. I have been unable to locate an executable named "surface-scan" and found no "I/O " errors in /var/log/syslog. I did find a bunch of crap that reminds me how lacking my admin skills are though. (modules don't need, etc.) for example and your amusement; Feb 3 15:40:02 PIII500 /USR/SBIN/CRON[3662]: (root) CMD ([ -d /etc/shaper ] && /etc/init.d/shaper timecheck) (repeated 6+ times, shaper's for balancing cluster loads, no ?) Feb 3 14:54:49 PIII500 modprobe: modprobe: Can't locate module char-major-116 (repeated 20+ times) Feb 3 14:51:22 PIII500 squid: Could not determine fully qualified hostname. Please set 'visible_h ostname' Feb 3 14:51:11 PIII500 kernel: Promise Fasttrak(tm) Softwareraid driver 0.03beta: No raid array fo und Feb 3 14:51:11 PIII500 kernel: Highpoint HPT370 Softwareraid driver for linux version 0.01-ww1 Feb 3 14:51:11 PIII500 kernel: No raid array found (maybe 'cause I 'm not using a raid ?) Is webmin the answer to my module management woes ? Should I just give up and use Knoppix day to day ? Is there anyone out there who offers custom kernel compiling services, for a reasonable fee ? djp .. I'm an EXCELLENT driver .. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 22:42:51 2004 From: tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Tim Writer) Date: 03 Feb 2004 17:42:51 -0500 Subject: which language In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Peter L. Peres" writes: > On Sun, 1 Feb 2004, Tim Writer wrote: > > > Henry already responded regarding arity and type matching for function calls. > > However, I'm curious, why you would require this feature for implementing a > > state machine. The states of state machines are quite naturally described as > ... > > You are assuming I will compile it. Not at all. > I would like it to be interpreted, and > possibly self-modifying. I would also like to be be spared the effort to > write each state and each transition. Instead I'd like to be able to write > a set of clauses for each state, each clause encoding a test and a > transition, and possibly clauses that generate sets or subsets of such > clauses (that would be inheritance, the Prolog way, I guess). I'm not terribly familiar with Prolog but this sounds like a perfect job for Lisp/Scheme. BTW, Common Lisp (CLOS anyway) does have multimethods in the form of generic functions. And on a related note, Paul Graham's "On Lisp" (which is available on line) contains an embedded implementation of Prolog. > I could use a table or write a parser that interprets such a 'language'. > Using functions with variable arguments (and default arguments) would be > one easier way to implement such a thing, I think. I'd have to see your design to understand where you're going with this. And maybe I'd have to be familiar with Prolog too. -- tim writer starnix inc. 905.771.0017 ext. 225 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 22:54:37 2004 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 17:54:37 -0500 Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <40201806.7060609-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> <401FF25C.1030705@alteeve.com> <40200E19.5030603@sympatico.ca> <402011A1.1020009@alteeve.com> <40201806.7060609@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <20040203175437.249fd53e.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Tue, 03 Feb 2004 16:52:06 -0500 David J Patrick disseminated the following: > found no "I/O " errors in /var/log/syslog. It's a big file, so try: grep error /var/log/syslog -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 17:53:54 up 5:39, 5 users, load average: 0.09, 0.09, 0.03 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Linux 2.4.22-21mdk i686 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Rule #2 (John Gilmore): "The Net interprets censorship as damage and routes around it." -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 23:20:44 2004 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 18:20:44 -0500 Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <20040203175437.249fd53e.joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> <401FF25C.1030705@alteeve.com> <40200E19.5030603@sympatico.ca> <402011A1.1020009@alteeve.com> <40201806.7060609@sympatico.ca> <20040203175437.249fd53e.joehill@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <40202CCC.9080906@sympatico.ca> JoeHill wrote: >On Tue, 03 Feb 2004 16:52:06 -0500 >David J Patrick disseminated the following: > > > >>found no "I/O " errors in /var/log/syslog. >> >> > >It's a big file, so try: > >grep error /var/log/syslog > > > Ever practical, Joe, your suggestion coughed out; Feb 3 09:02:53 PIII500 pppoe[287]: read (asyncReadFromPPP): Session 64958: Input/output error Feb 3 11:13:09 PIII500 kernel: hdb: dma_intr: error=0x84 { Drive StatusError BadCRC } Feb 3 14:40:46 PIII500 pppoe[323]: read (asyncReadFromPPP): Session 5285: Input/output error The pppoe errors could very well be a kink in the phone line, or something, but the BadCRC error makes the hair on the back of my neck stand up. anyone know what these might actually mean ? djp -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 18:25:07 2004 From: skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ at public.gmane.org (Sergey Kuznetsov) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 13:25:07 -0500 Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <40202CCC.9080906-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> <20040203175437.249fd53e.joehill@sympatico.ca> <40202CCC.9080906@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <200402031325.07839.skuznets@blueprint.org> On February 3, 2004 06:20 pm, David J Patrick wrote: > JoeHill wrote: > >On Tue, 03 Feb 2004 16:52:06 -0500 > > > >David J Patrick disseminated the following: > >>found no "I/O " errors in /var/log/syslog. > > > >It's a big file, so try: > > > >grep error /var/log/syslog > > Ever practical, Joe, your suggestion coughed out; > Feb 3 09:02:53 PIII500 pppoe[287]: read (asyncReadFromPPP): Session > 64958: Input/output error > Feb 3 11:13:09 PIII500 kernel: hdb: dma_intr: error=0x84 { Drive > StatusError BadCRC } > Feb 3 14:40:46 PIII500 pppoe[323]: read (asyncReadFromPPP): Session > 5285: Input/output error > > The pppoe errors could very well be a kink in the phone line, or something, > but the BadCRC error makes the hair on the back of my neck stand up. > anyone know what these might actually mean ? It means crappy data. Bad block per se. Do have that freezeup on hdb ( slave ) drive? -- All the Best! ----------------- Sergey Kuznetsov Senior Software Developer Blueprint Initiative Samuel Lunenfeld Research Institute at Mount Sinai Hospital -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 23:29:00 2004 From: blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Byron Sonne) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 18:29:00 -0500 Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <40202CCC.9080906-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> <401FF25C.1030705@alteeve.com> <40200E19.5030603@sympatico.ca> <402011A1.1020009@alteeve.com> <40201806.7060609@sympatico.ca> <20040203175437.249fd53e.joehill@sympatico.ca> <40202CCC.9080906@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <40202EBC.3060608@rogers.com> > but the BadCRC error makes the hair on the back of my neck stand up. > anyone know what these might actually mean ? I can't say for sure, but yeah, CRC errors on hd* devices would make me nervous too. Do your drives support SMART? I'd turn it on just in case it turns out to be useful. And do yer backups!!! 'Twould probably be good (potentially alarming as well :) if you were to peer into the logs a little further and take a look at what else (if anything) was going on around the time of those errors. If anyone has a quickie to grep for certain errors *and* display, let's say, the 25 lines before and after the errors it greps out, that would be handy. -- For Good, return Good. For Evil, return Justice. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 23:31:50 2004 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 18:31:50 -0500 Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <200402031325.07839.skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> <20040203175437.249fd53e.joehill@sympatico.ca> <40202CCC.9080906@sympatico.ca> <200402031325.07839.skuznets@blueprint.org> Message-ID: <40202F66.8070708@sympatico.ca> Sergey Kuznetsov wrote: >>Ever practical, Joe, your suggestion coughed out; >>Feb 3 09:02:53 PIII500 pppoe[287]: read (asyncReadFromPPP): Session >>64958: Input/output error >>Feb 3 11:13:09 PIII500 kernel: hdb: dma_intr: error=0x84 { Drive >>StatusError BadCRC } >>Feb 3 14:40:46 PIII500 pppoe[323]: read (asyncReadFromPPP): Session >>5285: Input/output error >> >>The pppoe errors could very well be a kink in the phone line, or something, >>but the BadCRC error makes the hair on the back of my neck stand up. >>anyone know what these might actually mean ? >> >> > >It means crappy data. Bad block per se. Do have that freezeup on hdb ( slave ) >drive? > > > yes -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 23:33:32 2004 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 18:33:32 -0500 Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <200402031325.07839.skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> <20040203175437.249fd53e.joehill@sympatico.ca> <40202CCC.9080906@sympatico.ca> <200402031325.07839.skuznets@blueprint.org> Message-ID: <40202FCC.7030004@sympatico.ca> Sergey Kuznetsov wrote: > Do have that freezeup on hdb ( slave ) >drive? > > > I should say that it is a full system freeze (sometimes) when reading from hdb djp -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 23:37:45 2004 From: taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 16:37:45 -0700 Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <40202EBC.3060608-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> <401FF25C.1030705@alteeve.com> <40200E19.5030603@sympatico.ca> <402011A1.1020009@alteeve.com> <40201806.7060609@sympatico.ca> <20040203175437.249fd53e.joehill@sympatico.ca> <40202CCC.9080906@sympatico.ca> <40202EBC.3060608@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20040203233745.GB62210@idiom.novusordo.net> On Tue, Feb 03, 2004 at 06:29:00PM -0500, Byron Sonne wrote: > If anyone has a quickie to grep for certain errors *and* display, let's > say, the 25 lines before and after the errors it greps out, that would > be handy. It's called a man page. "man grep" returns this nugget: -C NUM, --context=NUM Print NUM lines of output context. Places a line containing -- between contiguous groups of matches. -- taa A student recognizes Einstein in a train and asks: Excuse me, professor, but does New York stop by this train? /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 23:50:21 2004 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 18:50:21 -0500 Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <20040203233745.GB62210-7r3UYZMxfuqyvPIx3LBjwNHuzzzSOjJt@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> <401FF25C.1030705@alteeve.com> <40200E19.5030603@sympatico.ca> <402011A1.1020009@alteeve.com> <40201806.7060609@sympatico.ca> <20040203175437.249fd53e.joehill@sympatico.ca> <40202CCC.9080906@sympatico.ca> <40202EBC.3060608@rogers.com> <20040203233745.GB62210@idiom.novusordo.net> Message-ID: <402033BD.4060909@sympatico.ca> Taavi Burns wrote: >It's called a man page. > ooooh ! sounds rugged, handsome, yet sarcastic ! :p > "man grep" returns this nugget: > -C NUM, --context=NUM > Print NUM lines of output context. Places a line containing -- > between contiguous groups of matches. > > worked like a charm and revealed one more clue; the line preceding the { Drive StatusError BadCRC } bit o bad news, within the same time frame, was Feb 3 11:13:09 PIII500 kernel: hdb: dma_intr: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete Error } Feb 3 11:13:09 PIII500 kernel: hdb: dma_intr: error=0x84 { DriveStatusError BadCRC } then SPLAT ! (no actual splatting noises were heard) djp -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 23:57:04 2004 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 18:57:04 -0500 Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <40200E19.5030603-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> <401FF25C.1030705@alteeve.com> <40200E19.5030603@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <200402031857.05016.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> Do any interesting errors in the logs when you do this: grep /dev/hdb /var/log/messages > On boot, BIOS indicates that both drives are S.M.A.R.T. capable but > disabled, should I (have) enabled that feature ? Some BIOSes don't let you enable smart (some Gigabytes that I have) but once in the OS you can enable it if you wish with smartctl. I wouldn't bother; I've been running smart for over a year on all of my machines in that time every machine has had it's logs filled with useless messages like this: smartd: Device: /dev/hdc, S.M.A.R.T. Attribute: 195 Changed -1 Now if these messages were useful in predicting failure I'd be fine with seeing them, problem is they aren't useful. Since I've been using smart I've had two hard drive failures in neither case did smart see the failure, let alone predict failure (which is smart's intent). -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 3 23:59:31 2004 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 18:59:31 -0500 Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <40202CCC.9080906-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> <20040203175437.249fd53e.joehill@sympatico.ca> <40202CCC.9080906@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <200402031859.31684.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> On February 3, 2004 06:20 pm, David J Patrick wrote: > Feb ?3 11:13:09 PIII500 kernel: hdb: dma_intr: error=0x84 { Drive > StatusError BadCRC } Hopefully you live really high up so that when you drop the drive out your window it will make a cool splatter pattern ;-) -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 00:23:10 2004 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 19:23:10 -0500 Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <200402031859.31684.fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> <20040203175437.249fd53e.joehill@sympatico.ca> <40202CCC.9080906@sympatico.ca> <200402031859.31684.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: <40203B6E.30002@sympatico.ca> Fraser Campbell wrote: >On February 3, 2004 06:20 pm, David J Patrick wrote: > > > >>Feb 3 11:13:09 PIII500 kernel: hdb: dma_intr: error=0x84 { Drive >>StatusError BadCRC } >> >> > >Hopefully you live really high up so that when you drop the drive out your >window it will make a cool splatter pattern ;-) > > Is it bababaBAD ? can't I just run scandisk .. oh drat, blast and tarnation ! ! or _maybe_ you are just saying that, and it's a data error, or bad sector that can be isolated or if I wrap tinfoil around my desk the mind control rays will no longer affect hdb .. right ? djp -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 00:45:16 2004 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:45:16 -0500 (EST) Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <40203B6E.30002-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> <20040203175437.249fd53e.joehill@sympatico.ca> <40202CCC.9080906@sympatico.ca> <200402031859.31684.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> <40203B6E.30002@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: On Tue, 3 Feb 2004, David J Patrick wrote: > can't I just run scandisk .. oh drat, blast and tarnation ! ! > or _maybe_ you are just saying that, and it's a data error, or bad > sector that can be isolated > or if I wrap tinfoil around my desk the mind control rays will no longer > affect hdb .. right ? > djp I'm afraid I'm with these guys. Consider that disk with great suspicion. Do you have any important data on it or is it new? If there is any un-backed up data, get it off asap. Rob -- Robert Brockway Senior Technical Consultant, OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Phone: 416-669-3073, Email: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org, http://www.opentrend.net OpenTrend Solutions: Reliable, secure solutions to real world problems. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 00:46:27 2004 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:46:27 -0500 Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <40203B6E.30002-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> <200402031859.31684.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> <40203B6E.30002@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <200402031946.27054.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> On February 3, 2004 07:23 pm, David J Patrick wrote: > ? ? can't I just run scandisk .. oh drat, blast and tarnation ! ! > or _maybe_ you are just saying that, and it's a data error, or bad > sector that can be isolated Not likely to be worth the trouble but do confirm that the drive is bad. If you have a spare computer around that you can put the drive in do so, format it there with badblock checking (perhaps using a knoppix rescue disk). By moving it to a second computer you lessen the probability of ide controllers, memory or other things that might be screwing with you. Change the IDE ribbon as well when doing the reformat test. You could format it like this, be prepared to wait a very long time: mke2fs -c -c /dev/hdb Alternatively there's the badblocks program, never used it personally. -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jzygmont-tEQKYFGiemxAYG7eUwYNkWD2FQJk+8+b at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 01:40:04 2004 From: jzygmont-tEQKYFGiemxAYG7eUwYNkWD2FQJk+8+b at public.gmane.org (Justin Zygmont) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 20:40:04 -0500 (EST) Subject: farewell Message-ID: It was nice being on the list, and knowing a lot of you on here. I'm leaving the country next week, so this is the end of the line for me here. Hope all goes well for the tlug group, as I know it will. Take care guys! P.S. I've got a few things to sell off if anyone's interested, just email me: 13" TV/VCR combo ghetto blaster multimedia speakers (loud ones) P-200 with 128MB CD writer, 2 Hd's, sound, video, nic, drive trays, 15" monitor P-166 with 128MB Nics, 56k modem, sound, HD's, small 12" console monitor Various cat-5 cabling, 10BaseT hub, power bars, extention cables, books including professional apache 2.0 and C++ in 21 days, cables, nics, and more. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From peter.king-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 02:06:59 2004 From: peter.king-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Peter King) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:06:59 -0500 Subject: SCSI tape drive problem Message-ID: <20040204020659.GA13645@socrates> Here's the problem: I have two SCSI tape drives on two machines, theseus and plato. (Ancient Greek theme going here.) The tape drives are different brands; one's a Sony, the other an HP. They have each started to fail. Syslog records the following for theseus: Feb 3 18:23:57 theseus kernel: st: Version 20030811, fixed bufsize 32768, s/g segs 256 Feb 3 18:23:57 theseus kernel: Attached scsi tape st0 at scsi0, channel 0, id 5, lun 0 Feb 3 18:23:57 theseus kernel: st0: try direct i/o: yes, max page reachable by HBA 163840 Feb 3 18:24:18 theseus kernel: st0: Block limits 1 - 16777215 bytes. Feb 3 18:27:48 theseus kernel: st0: Error with sense data: Deferred st0: sense key Medium Error Feb 3 18:27:48 theseus kernel: Additional sense: Write error Feb 3 18:27:49 theseus kernel: st0: Error with sense data: Current st0: sense key Medium Error Feb 3 18:27:49 theseus kernel: Additional sense: Write error Feb 3 18:27:49 theseus kernel: st0: Error on write filemark. Pretty much the same for plato: Feb 3 18:26:50 plato kernel: st: Version 20011103, bufsize 32768, wrt 30720, max init. bufs 4, s/g segs 16 Feb 3 18:26:50 plato kernel: Attached scsi tape st0 at scsi0, channel 0, id 6, lun 0 Feb 3 18:46:59 plato kernel: st0: Block limits 1 - 16777215 bytes. Feb 3 18:50:17 plato kernel: st0: Error with sense data: Info fld=0x2800, Current st09:00: sense key Medium Error Feb 3 18:50:17 plato kernel: Additional sense indicates Write error Feb 3 18:51:08 plato kernel: st0: Error with sense data: Info fld=0x1, Deferred st09:00: sense key Medium Error Feb 3 18:51:08 plato kernel: Additional sense indicates Write error The drives are correctly detected by the BIOS and on boot, and, as you can see from the above, the st.(k)o module loads without any difficulty. Apparently there is a "medium error" -- I suppose an error in the tape -- detected by the kernel. And there could be. But the problem shows up on many different tapes, including brand-new ones (from two different manu- facturers). The symptoms are that the tape drives grind for a bit and then say that there is a nonrecoverable error, so 0 bytes have been written. This happens even when testing as root, so it shouldn't be a permissions problem. So what could the cause be? -- Peter King peter.king-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Philosophy Department University of Toronto (416)-978-3788 ofc Toronto, ON M5S 1A1 (416)-978-8703 fax CANADA All your base are belong to us... -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 03:37:56 2004 From: blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Byron Sonne) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 22:37:56 -0500 Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <20040203233745.GB62210-7r3UYZMxfuqyvPIx3LBjwNHuzzzSOjJt@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> <401FF25C.1030705@alteeve.com> <40200E19.5030603@sympatico.ca> <402011A1.1020009@alteeve.com> <40201806.7060609@sympatico.ca> <20040203175437.249fd53e.joehill@sympatico.ca> <40202CCC.9080906@sympatico.ca> <40202EBC.3060608@rogers.com> <20040203233745.GB62210@idiom.novusordo.net> Message-ID: <40206914.6090508@rogers.com> > It's called a man page. Easy there, no need to be rude. Sometimes we all forget the simplest of things ;) > -C NUM, --context=NUM In any case, thanks for showing me these options exist... will certainly make combing through logs easier in the future. -- For Good, return Good. For Evil, return Justice. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ttanski-iRg7kjdsKiH3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 03:49:43 2004 From: ttanski-iRg7kjdsKiH3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Terry Tanski) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 22:49:43 -0500 (EST) Subject: SCSI tape drive problem In-Reply-To: <20040204020659.GA13645-sKwiGYaqY94@public.gmane.org> References: <20040204020659.GA13645@socrates> Message-ID: On Tue, 3 Feb 2004, Peter King wrote: > The drives are correctly detected by the BIOS and on boot, and, as you > can see from the above, the st.(k)o module loads without any difficulty. > Apparently there is a "medium error" -- I suppose an error in the tape -- > detected by the kernel. And there could be. But the problem shows up on > many different tapes, including brand-new ones (from two different manu- > facturers). When was the last time you popped a cleaning tape in these drives? Terry -- Terry Tanski, B.Sc. Phone: (416) 863-2126 Canada NewsWire Ltd. Fax: (416) 863-4825 20 Bay Street, Suite 1500 Email: ttanski-BEj8/MhvOJIsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Toronto, ON M5J 2N8 Web: http://www.newswire.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 03:52:33 2004 From: blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Byron Sonne) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 22:52:33 -0500 Subject: farewell In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <40206C81.50808@rogers.com> > It was nice being on the list, and knowing a lot of you on here. I'm leaving > the country next week, so this is the end of the line for me here. Hope > all goes well for the tlug group, as I know it will. Take care guys! Best of luck to you in your future endeavours! Curiousity has ahold of me though... where are you planning to hang your hat from now on? Hopefully it's some place with nicer winters :) -- For Good, return Good. For Evil, return Justice. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jzygmont-tEQKYFGiemxAYG7eUwYNkWD2FQJk+8+b at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 03:58:19 2004 From: jzygmont-tEQKYFGiemxAYG7eUwYNkWD2FQJk+8+b at public.gmane.org (Justin Zygmont) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 22:58:19 -0500 (EST) Subject: farewell In-Reply-To: <40206C81.50808-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <40206C81.50808@rogers.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 3 Feb 2004, Byron Sonne wrote: > > It was nice being on the list, and knowing a lot of you on here. I'm leaving > > the country next week, so this is the end of the line for me here. Hope > > all goes well for the tlug group, as I know it will. Take care guys! > > Best of luck to you in your future endeavours! > > Curiousity has ahold of me though... where are you planning to hang your > hat from now on? Hopefully it's some place with nicer winters :) Great Britain -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jmm-TU2q2He6PgRlD5gtYiU6kEEOCMrvLtNR at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 06:00:30 2004 From: jmm-TU2q2He6PgRlD5gtYiU6kEEOCMrvLtNR at public.gmane.org (John Macdonald) Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 01:00:30 -0500 Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <40202EBC.3060608-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> <401FF25C.1030705@alteeve.com> <40200E19.5030603@sympatico.ca> <402011A1.1020009@alteeve.com> <40201806.7060609@sympatico.ca> <20040203175437.249fd53e.joehill@sympatico.ca> <40202CCC.9080906@sympatico.ca> <40202EBC.3060608@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20040204010029.V25483@algate.perlwolf.com> On Tue, Feb 03, 2004 at 06:29:00PM -0500, Byron Sonne wrote: > If anyone has a quickie to grep for certain errors *and* display, let's > say, the 25 lines before and after the errors it greps out, that would > be handy. While the context option to grep has been suggested as the direct answer to your question, I tend to use less on the file myself. It has regular expression search capability to look for the interesting parts, and you can use its forward and backward paging capabilities to examine the amount of context that is right for the particular query. Reverse search is often useful too. (When was the previous time that this process ID was mentioned?) A grep with context will almost always be too much or too little context, but it does have the advantage of finding all of the matches in one shot. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 04:22:45 2004 From: blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Byron Sonne) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 23:22:45 -0500 Subject: farewell In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <40207395.40201@rogers.com> >>> I'm leaving the country next week >> Curiousity has ahold of me though... where are you planning to hang your >> hat from now on? > Great Britain Man oh man! If I send you 40 or 50 pounds, think you could ship me back a crate of those 'Victory-V' candies? ;) -- For Good, return Good. For Evil, return Justice. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 04:25:36 2004 From: blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Byron Sonne) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 23:25:36 -0500 Subject: farewell In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <40207440.2090009@rogers.com> >>> I'm leaving the country next week >> Curiousity has ahold of me though... where are you planning to hang your >> hat from now on? > Great Britain Man oh man! If I send you 40 or 50 pounds, think you could ship me back a crate of those 'Victory-V' candies? ;) -- For Good, return Good. For Evil, return Justice. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 06:42:35 2004 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 01:42:35 -0500 (EST) Subject: farewell In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 3 Feb 2004, Justin Zygmont wrote: > It was nice being on the list, and knowing a lot of you on here. I'm leaving > the country next week, so this is the end of the line for me here. Hope > all goes well for the tlug group, as I know it will. Take care guys! You should stay on the list anyway :) I'm a permanent fixture on some Australian LUG lists and was on TLUG and OCLUG years before I came to Canada :) In any case, have fun in the UK. Rob -- Robert Brockway Senior Technical Consultant, OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Phone: 416-669-3073, Email: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org, http://www.opentrend.net OpenTrend Solutions: Reliable, secure solutions to real world problems. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 13:14:43 2004 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 08:14:43 -0500 Subject: farewell In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040204081443.17e61eb1.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Tue, 3 Feb 2004 20:40:04 -0500 (EST) Justin Zygmont disseminated the following: > It was nice being on the list, and knowing a lot of you on here. I'm leaving > the country next week, so this is the end of the line for me here. Hope > all goes well for the tlug group, as I know it will. Take care guys! So long, Justin. For the brief time I 'knew' you, it was a pleasure communicating. I would echo Robert's sentiments, though, the 'Net is 'non-local', so there's no reason you can't keep in touch. Anyhow, all the best, and try to stay out of trouble. -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 08:10:27 up 19:55, 5 users, load average: 0.19, 0.15, 0.39 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Linux 2.4.22-21mdk i686 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ The United States Drug Enforcement Agency estimates pot smuggling from the western province of British Columbia alone is worth more than $1 billion a year. This is *very* bad, because Bush and his pals are not seeing one dime of that. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 13:44:25 2004 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 08:44:25 -0500 Subject: XUL programmer wanted Message-ID: <4020F739.4080501@sympatico.ca> I have a project that requires expertise in XUL (Mozillas' application development language) Why XUL ? -platform independant -fast (or so I've read) -runs server-side or locally It promises to be a creative challenge and there's _pay_ involved ! If you know XUL (or, at least, JavaScript / css, and are willing to get yourself up to speed with XUL) swing that cursor up to "reply" djp -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 13:47:50 2004 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 08:47:50 -0500 Subject: farewell In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4020F806.6020608@sympatico.ca> Justin Zygmont wrote: >It was nice being on the list, and knowing a lot of you on here. I'm leaving >the country next week, so this is the end of the line for me here. Hope >all goes well for the tlug group, as I know it will. Take care guys! > Just think of TLUG as Terrific Linux User Group and stay in touch ! djp ps bring a raincoat (GoreTEX) and get a sunlamp bon voyage ! -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fcsoft-3Emkkp+1Olsmp8TqCH86vg at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 13:45:11 2004 From: fcsoft-3Emkkp+1Olsmp8TqCH86vg at public.gmane.org (bob findlay) Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 08:45:11 -0500 Subject: for cities like Toronto? Message-ID: <20040204135202.1D009B7D43@outbox.allstream.net> http://www.linuxdevcenter.com/pub/a/linux/2004/01/15/andy_stein_interview.html Couple these ideas with http://www.icanprogram.com/developersDilemma.html and you may actually have a business model which works. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 15:24:16 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 10:24:16 -0500 Subject: SCSI tape drive problem In-Reply-To: <20040204020659.GA13645-sKwiGYaqY94@public.gmane.org> References: <20040204020659.GA13645@socrates> Message-ID: <20040204152416.GG732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Tue, Feb 03, 2004 at 09:06:59PM -0500, Peter King wrote: > Here's the problem: I have two SCSI tape drives on two machines, > theseus and plato. (Ancient Greek theme going here.) The tape > drives are different brands; one's a Sony, the other an HP. They > have each started to fail. Syslog records the following for > theseus: If these are DAT drives (DDS) then how many times have you written those tapes, and as someone else already said, when did you last clean the drive. Helical scan tape drives put a lot of wear on the head and the tape, and do need regular cleaning and new tapes fairly frequently to work reliably. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 12:17:29 2004 From: skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ at public.gmane.org (Sergey Kuznetsov) Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 07:17:29 -0500 Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <40203B6E.30002-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> <200402031859.31684.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> <40203B6E.30002@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <200402040717.29013.skuznets@blueprint.org> On February 3, 2004 07:23 pm, David J Patrick wrote: > Fraser Campbell wrote: > >On February 3, 2004 06:20 pm, David J Patrick wrote: > >>Feb 3 11:13:09 PIII500 kernel: hdb: dma_intr: error=0x84 { Drive > >>StatusError BadCRC } > > > >Hopefully you live really high up so that when you drop the drive out your > >window it will make a cool splatter pattern ;-) > > Is it bababaBAD ? > can't I just run scandisk .. oh drat, blast and tarnation ! ! > or _maybe_ you are just saying that, and it's a data error, or bad > sector that can be isolated > or if I wrap tinfoil around my desk the mind control rays will no longer > affect hdb .. right ? If you got one bad sector, there will be many others soon. Better to fix. > djp > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- All the Best! ----------------- Sergey Kuznetsov Senior Software Developer Blueprint Initiative Samuel Lunenfeld Research Institute at Mount Sinai Hospital -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 17:17:24 2004 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 12:17:24 -0500 Subject: for cities like Toronto? In-Reply-To: <20040204135202.1D009B7D43-pwyU32sTfCqP7boJH+kiu+TW4wlIGRCZ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040204135202.1D009B7D43@outbox.allstream.net> Message-ID: <20040204171724.GA8607@node1.opengeometry.net> On Wed, Feb 04, 2004 at 08:45:11AM -0500, bob findlay wrote: > http://www.linuxdevcenter.com/pub/a/linux/2004/01/15/andy_stein_interview.html I think the first reply (Who to blame?) is right on the nail. -- William Park, Open Geometry Consulting, Linux solution for data management and processing. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 17:48:51 2004 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 12:48:51 -0500 Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <200402031946.27054.fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> <200402031859.31684.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> <40203B6E.30002@sympatico.ca> <200402031946.27054.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: <20040204124851.769ac520.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:46:27 -0500 Fraser Campbell disseminated the following: > Alternatively there's the badblocks program, never used it personally. I was just checking out the manpage for that, and it says it should never be done in on a mounted partition. If my / partition is the one I want to scan, how would I unmount it?...and if it's unmounted, how can I access the badblocks executable? -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 12:41:02 up 1 day, 26 min, 5 users, load average: 0.01, 0.05, 0.06 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Linux 2.4.22-21mdk i686 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ "There are three side effects of acid: enhanced long-term memory, decreased short-term memory, and I forget the third."-- Timothy Leary -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 17:50:22 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 12:50:22 -0500 Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <20040204124851.769ac520.joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> <200402031859.31684.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> <40203B6E.30002@sympatico.ca> <200402031946.27054.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> <20040204124851.769ac520.joehill@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <20040204175022.GH732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Feb 04, 2004 at 12:48:51PM -0500, JoeHill wrote: Use a rescue boot CD or floppy to do it. tomsrtbt or such might do. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 13:40:18 2004 From: skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ at public.gmane.org (Sergey Kuznetsov) Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 08:40:18 -0500 Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <20040204175022.GH732-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> <20040204124851.769ac520.joehill@sympatico.ca> <20040204175022.GH732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <200402040840.18985.skuznets@blueprint.org> On February 4, 2004 12:50 pm, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Wed, Feb 04, 2004 at 12:48:51PM -0500, JoeHill wrote: > Use a rescue boot CD or floppy to do it. > > tomsrtbt or such might do. > or to make initrd disk + netboot as I did. > Lennart Sorensen > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- All the Best! ----------------- Sergey Kuznetsov Senior Software Developer Blueprint Initiative Samuel Lunenfeld Research Institute at Mount Sinai Hospital -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 13:44:04 2004 From: skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ at public.gmane.org (Sergey Kuznetsov) Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 08:44:04 -0500 Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <200402040840.18985.skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> <20040204175022.GH732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <200402040840.18985.skuznets@blueprint.org> Message-ID: <200402040844.04736.skuznets@blueprint.org> On February 4, 2004 08:40 am, Sergey Kuznetsov wrote: > On February 4, 2004 12:50 pm, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > > On Wed, Feb 04, 2004 at 12:48:51PM -0500, JoeHill wrote: > > Use a rescue boot CD or floppy to do it. > > > > tomsrtbt or such might do. > > or to make initrd disk + netboot as I did. > BTW, I can put my initrd.gz image + kernel parameters on my web-site if someone needs it. -- All the Best! ----------------- Sergey Kuznetsov Senior Software Developer Blueprint Initiative Samuel Lunenfeld Research Institute at Mount Sinai Hospital -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From anton-F0u+EriZ6ihBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 22:41:07 2004 From: anton-F0u+EriZ6ihBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Anton Markov) Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 17:41:07 -0500 Subject: the box locks up ! In-Reply-To: <20040204175022.GH732-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <401FEE58.6060100@sympatico.ca> <200402031859.31684.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> <40203B6E.30002@sympatico.ca> <200402031946.27054.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> <20040204124851.769ac520.joehill@sympatico.ca> <20040204175022.GH732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <40217503.60104@truxtar.com> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Wed, Feb 04, 2004 at 12:48:51PM -0500, JoeHill wrote: > Use a rescue boot CD or floppy to do it. > > tomsrtbt or such might do. Or take a look at Mindi from Mondo Rescue. It makes a wonderful system startup CD that includes all the kernel modules you currently use, and I think you can include your own files too. Especially great if you must use LVM or other less-common technology. The address is: Or if you have Debian, use # apt-get install mindi hope this helps -- Anton Markov <("anton" + "@" + "truxtar" + "." + "com")> GnuPG Key fingerprint = 5546 A6E2 1FFB 9BB8 15C3 CE34 46B7 8D93 3AD1 44B4 *** LINUX - MAY THE SOURCE BE WITH YOU! *** -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From anton-F0u+EriZ6ihBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 4 23:17:47 2004 From: anton-F0u+EriZ6ihBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Anton Markov) Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 18:17:47 -0500 Subject: generating .cue files In-Reply-To: <20040202145055.GA732-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <401C1377.1070004@truxtar.com> <20040202145055.GA732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <40217D9B.1030809@truxtar.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Lennart Sorensen wrote: > Well you could try just mounting it with mount -t iso9660 -o loop > file.bin /cdrom, and see if it's just an iso named .bin. Otherwise, > what is the filesize of the .bin? > > Is it an excact multiple of 2048, 2324, 2336 or 2352 bytes? I tried mounting it as my first step, but it failed with "invalid superblock" or something similar... basically NOT an ISO file. I then did a net search for info on CUE files and came up with some generic cue files from: Using your suggestion of looking at the file size, I figured out mine image matched the "CD-ROM SOFTWARE" type (2352 bytes per block) as it should. I created a simple text file using the templates below, and K3b burned it without a problem! I have included the generic cue files below: > > For Movies: > Code: > > FILE "FILNENAMEHERE.bin" BINARY > TRACK 01 MODE2/2352 > INDEX 01 00:00:00 > TRACK 02 MODE2/2352 > INDEX 01 00:06:00 > > > > Video Games: > Code: > > FILE "image-name.BIN" BINARY > TRACK 1 MODE2/2352 > INDEX 1 00:00:00 > > > > CD-ROM GAMES/SOFTWARE > > Code: > > FILE "image-name.BIN" BINARY > TRACK 01 MODE1/2352 > INDEX 01 00:00:00 - -- Anton Markov <("anton" + "@" + "truxtar" + "." + "com")> GnuPG Key fingerprint = 5546 A6E2 1FFB 9BB8 15C3 CE34 46B7 8D93 3AD1 44B4 *** LINUX - MAY THE SOURCE BE WITH YOU! *** -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFAIX2rRreNkzrRRLQRAq82AJ9C6WytBJMxkJDgc9C/2bpi8i0cHgCfcgId bHpY66nwjbE72ILZZLESvUw= =O0pz -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 5 03:09:04 2004 From: taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 20:09:04 -0700 Subject: generating .cue files In-Reply-To: <40217D9B.1030809-F0u+EriZ6ihBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <401C1377.1070004@truxtar.com> <20040202145055.GA732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <40217D9B.1030809@truxtar.com> Message-ID: <20040205030904.GB5464@idiom.novusordo.net> On Wed, Feb 04, 2004 at 06:17:47PM -0500, Anton Markov wrote: > > I tried mounting it as my first step, but it failed with "invalid > superblock" or something similar... basically NOT an ISO file. As an aside, that sounds like it tried to mount as ext2 or ext3. I don't think ISO images have superblocks. Next time be sure to issue -t iso9660 in the mount command. Glad to hear it burnt well in the end! -- taa The three most dangerous things are a programmer with a soldering iron, a manager who codes, and a user who gets ideas. /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 5 03:09:41 2004 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 22:09:41 -0500 Subject: Anything besides RealPlayer that plays Real ? Message-ID: <20040205030941.GC9071@m450> The subject says it all. Is there any non-spyware that runs on linux and plays Real's audio+video ? -- Walter Dnes Email users are divided into two classes; 1) Those who have effective spam-blocking 2) Those who wish they did -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 5 03:25:39 2004 From: taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 20:25:39 -0700 Subject: Anything besides RealPlayer that plays Real ? In-Reply-To: <20040205030941.GC9071-Mb8sf/rG248@public.gmane.org> References: <20040205030941.GC9071@m450> Message-ID: <20040205032539.GD5464@idiom.novusordo.net> On Wed, Feb 04, 2004 at 10:09:41PM -0500, Walter Dnes wrote: > The subject says it all. Is there any non-spyware that runs on linux > and plays Real's audio+video ? MPlayer? It plays pretty much anything else, particularly on Intel (they end up using the windows codecs in a WINE-ish way). I'd take this as a good sign: http://zebra.fh-weingarten.de/~maxi/html/mplayer-dev-eng/2002-06/msg00269.html MPlayer can also handle certain RTSP streams (but, IIRC, RealPlayer servers use a brainfscked RTSP variant which is not compatible). -- taa Real s don't . /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 5 14:28:33 2004 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 09:28:33 -0500 Subject: Anything besides RealPlayer that plays Real ? In-Reply-To: <20040205142155.GA1942-nbgvvMGgeqgU0MpeLeotoQ@public.gmane.org>; from mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ@public.gmane.org on Thu, Feb 05, 2004 at 09:21:55 -0500 References: <20040205030941.GC9071@m450> <20040205134811.GA1656@my.wing.nut> <20040205142155.GA1942@my.wing.nut> Message-ID: <20040205142833.GA1950@my.wing.nut> On 02/04/2004 10:09:41 PM, Walter Dnes wrote: > The subject says it all. Is there any non-spyware that runs on > linux > and plays Real's audio+video? Please excuse my ignorance in this regard, but what exactly does RealPlayer do that it could be classified as "SpyWare"? And is this something found in more recent versions of RealPlayer for Linux? The reason I ask is because I never installed any new releases of RealPlayer for Linux. I use an rpm from an old boxed set of RH7.0 and then perform post-install repairs to mailcap etc. Just curious, farmer6re9 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jingsu-26n5VD7DAF2Tm46uYYfjYg at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 5 14:55:29 2004 From: jingsu-26n5VD7DAF2Tm46uYYfjYg at public.gmane.org (Jing Su) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 09:55:29 -0500 Subject: Anything besides RealPlayer that plays Real ? In-Reply-To: <20040205142833.GA1950-nbgvvMGgeqgU0MpeLeotoQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040205030941.GC9071@m450> <20040205134811.GA1656@my.wing.nut> <20040205142155.GA1942@my.wing.nut> <20040205142833.GA1950@my.wing.nut> Message-ID: There was one version of RP that apparently sent back some kind of statistic back to their servers. There was quite a bit of backlash against this, and Real has subsequently removed it. Of course, I'm not sure if anyone has actually done packet traces to see if there is still 'spyware' data being sent. There is an option in the preferences to disable sending traffic data back to their servers for analysis. I usually leave it on just to help then gather data and hopefully improve their product. -Jing On Thu, 5 Feb 2004, Gregory D Hough wrote: > Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 09:28:33 -0500 > From: Gregory D Hough > Reply-To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Anything besides RealPlayer that plays Real ? > > On 02/04/2004 10:09:41 PM, Walter Dnes wrote: > > The subject says it all. Is there any non-spyware that runs on > > linux > > and plays Real's audio+video? > > Please excuse my ignorance in this regard, but what exactly does > RealPlayer do that it could be classified as "SpyWare"? And is this > something found in more recent versions of RealPlayer for Linux? > > The reason I ask is because I never installed any new releases of > RealPlayer for Linux. I use an rpm from an old boxed set of RH7.0 and > then perform post-install repairs to mailcap etc. > > Just curious, > farmer6re9 > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From verbum-qazKcTl6WRFWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 5 15:24:00 2004 From: verbum-qazKcTl6WRFWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (verbum-qazKcTl6WRFWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 15:24:00 +0000 (UTC) Subject: SCO Mydoom: complaint to BBC re intemperate coverage Message-ID: Material below is FYI....! Very rapidly, Tom = Tom Karmo ((FYI-COPY)) Universal Coordinated Time (= UTC = EST+5 = EDT+4): 20040205T142503Z Dear BBC Feedback (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/help/3281777.stm): (A) Your North America Business Correspondent Stephen Evans today crosses the line separating reporting from commentary in his "Linux cyber-battle turns nasty", offered as a bylined factual piece at http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/3457823.stm. In exploring, as it is appropriate, even necessary, for him to do, the possibility that the Linux community is at the bottom of the Mydoom denial-of-service attack on SCO, he uses language ("sacred principles", "as they would see it") inconsistent with BBC reader expectations of courtesy and impartiality: * ((QUOTE)) the wrath of internet zealots who believe that code should be free to all (open source)((/QUOTE)) * (QUOTE))SCO is the big, bad company that violates one of their sacred principles, as they would see it((/QUOTE)) (B) I would like to call your attention to inadequate depth in Mr Evans's sentence on the technicalities of the SCO denial-of-service attack: ((QUOTE)) It's hard to see how any website could withstand that kind of clever evil.((/QUOTE)) It has been claimed on slashdot.org that the attack was a TCP/IP SYN flood, and that simple means have been available since the late 1990s for coping with such a flood. If the slashdot allegation were to be true, then SCO, claiming as it does to be a victim, would be in a difficult position. A quick check of the Computer Emergency Reponse Team document www.cert.org/advisories/CA-1996-21.html casts doubt on the slashdot allegation. Nevertheless, Mr Evans should not have published his sentence without first scanning slashdot (a necessary precaution in handling any cybercrime story), then phoning a security firm to ask whether the blocking of SYN-flooding is easy or difficult. Mr Evans's final draft should have read something like ((HYPOTHETICAL-QUOTE)) According to Dr A.Guru, head of TCP/IP Analysis Services at London-based security consultancy Sophoteros PLC, 'Even current best security measures will not deflect that kind of clever evil.' ((/HYPOTHETICAL-QUOTE)), or even ((HYPOTHETICAL-QUOTE)) According to Dr A.Guru, head of TCP/IP Analysis Services at London-based security consultancy Sophoteros PLC, 'Even current best security measures, like the portsentry tool, will not deflect that kind of clever evil.' ((/HYPOTHETICAL-QUOTE)), (C) Finally, I should try your patience by repeating for you some astute, even if semiliterate, feedback from a recent slashdot writer, probably already in your BBC feedback-form mailbox. The feedback is on the publicly accessible Web at ((LINEBROKEN_URL)) http://slashdot.org/articles/04/02/05/ 0818229.shtml?tid=106&tid=185&tid=187&tid=88 ((/LINEBROKEN_URL)): ((FEEDACK)) I would like to make a rather strong complaint regarding Stephen Evans's article "Linux cyber battle turns nasty", as featured as a front-page article on the 5th of Feburary. This article is presented as a factual piece, not an opinion column, and draws patently incorrect conclusions. Whilst the MyDoom virus does indeed target SCO and (in it's -B varient) Microsoft, the main payload of this virus is a spam gateway. As someone whos main source of income deeply involves computer security, I find it insulting that Mr. Evans has apparantly made no attempt to research the history of these forms of virii, nor has he apparantly contacted any reputable anti-virus company regarding it. Meanwhile he postulates claims such as "it [revenge] must be one of the theories at the top of any investigator's list", and "in the case of the MyDoom computer worm, the motivation seems clearer". I find it very bad reporting that these claims are made WITHOUT actually asking any of the investigators opinion of the virus. It is a widely expressed opinion (see 'references' at the end of this message) by these security professionals that the Denial of Service attack is the SECONDARY function of the virus, and not at all related to it's true purpose. A simple search on Google, let alone contacting even local London- based security firms such as mi2g, would easily prove how factually incorrect this article is. In fact, to be harsh, it is a downright lie against common knowledge and opinion. It is current common understanding in the anti-virus community that this virus is indeed designed specifically to facilitate commercial spammers, and that the inbuilt Denial of Service attack against SCO and Microsoft are a secondary effect and not intended as part of the original design. Current monitoring of activity through infected machines indicate that the spamming functionality appears to be used by a very organised group of individuals, indicating the virus was possibly contract-coded. Current belief holds that the Denial of Service payload was added by said contracted coder. As such, I do not belief it fair, nor good reporting, to use a proproted factual article to attribute the secondary (and in my opinion far easily avoidable!) of the virus as it's "purpose". The secondary effects may indeed by the result of a Linux user seeking revenge, but is currently understood to be more of a diversion from the viruses demonstratable true intent. There is a long tradition of this type of 'smoke screen' in many viruses intended for commercial benefit, as Mr. Evans would no doubt have discovered if he had researched the article more instead of using it as a pure propeganda platform and drawing unconfirmed conclusions. I request that the article either be re-labeled as an OPINION piece, removed, or an more factually correct article be posted. References: These other news sites, containing articles by researchers willing to do actual research, contain quotes from reputable security and virus research firms confirming the opinion above: http://thewhir.com/marketwatch/myd012704.cfm - Contains opinion by London-based firm mi2g http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4113278/ - Contains quotes from researchers at well-known antivirus developer F-Secure and Symantec http://www.ajc.com/business/content/business/0104/ 28worm.html - Contains quotes from various other computer security researchers ((/FEEDACK)) After mailing this present letter to you via the BBC Feedback form. I will take some minor steps to help colleagues monitor the BBC: I will mail copies to the Toronto Linux User Group, to the Editors' Association of Canada listserv (reaching editors in diverse trades, in most cases freelance), the (Toronto) _Globe and Mail_, and Ross Anderson (a Reader in security at the Computer Laboratory, Cambridge). (Canadian readers, and Ross Anderson: Please forward this mail as necessary, as we work to maintain journalistic rigour at the BBC.) Sincerely, Dr Toomas Karmo +1 416-971-6955 verbum-qazKcTl6WRFWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org http://www.metascientia.com ((/FYI-COPY)) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From aitken-BwLjziHGQLusTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 5 17:25:20 2004 From: aitken-BwLjziHGQLusTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (Chris Aitken) Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 12:25:20 -0500 Subject: debian: what sound drivers ? References: <200401172133.50603.fraser@wehave.net> Message-ID: <40227C80.F55264B4@onlink.net> Fraser Campbell wrote: > On January 17, 2004 04:04 pm, Peter L. Peres wrote: > > > What sound drivers does Debian use ? OSS ? > > Whichever ones you want it to. > > 2.4 kernels come only with OSS drivers as far as I know. Do an "apt-cache > search alsa" and you'll see modules for alsa that can be installed if that is > what you want. If you're running kernel-image-2.4.22-1-686 then you would > have to "apt-get install alsa-modules-2.4.22-1-686". I hope I'm not being too thick here. This thread started at the same time as one I had started about getting sound working in rh 7.3 (so VMware will be able to work with that module as well). This stuff you have here is not supposed to work with rh 7.3 is it? It's referring to Debian. If it's no good for rh 7.3, I'll ignore this thread and pick up where I left off on the 'CM8738 "Sound Blaster compatible"?' thread: [lsf-5jgDBJOV2nY at public.gmane.org lsf]$ su Password: [root-5jgDBJOV2nY at public.gmane.org lsf]# apt-cache search alsa bash: apt-cache: command not found [root-5jgDBJOV2nY at public.gmane.org lsf]# find / -name apt-cache [root-5jgDBJOV2nY at public.gmane.org lsf]# apt-get install alsa-modules-2.4.18-3-686 bash: apt-get: command not found [root-5jgDBJOV2nY at public.gmane.org lsf]# find / -name apt-get [root-5jgDBJOV2nY at public.gmane.org lsf]# [..] Chris -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From forolinux-/E1597aS9LQAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 5 17:33:05 2004 From: forolinux-/E1597aS9LQAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Martin C) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 09:33:05 -0800 (PST) Subject: SCO Mydoom: complaint to BBC re intemperate coverage In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040205173305.41221.qmail@web14524.mail.yahoo.com> I've e-mailed too after reading the news posted in Slashdot. I think they had received several e-mails right now... __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online. http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From aitken-BwLjziHGQLusTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 5 17:36:23 2004 From: aitken-BwLjziHGQLusTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (Chris Aitken) Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 12:36:23 -0500 Subject: debian: what sound drivers ? References: <20040118034323.GG7177@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <40227F17.C60E8CB0@onlink.net> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Sat, Jan 17, 2004 at 11:04:48PM +0200, Peter L. Peres wrote: > > What sound drivers does Debian use ? OSS ? > > Debian gives you choice of ALSA and OSS. Debian doesn't tell you what > to do. Hence why it ships with half a dozen mail servers. :) shameless plug ; ) > > Use ALSA whenever possible. Seems more cpu efficient, has more > features, more complete support, and better maintained. What about OSS/Linux? People on this list write about OSS like there is only one OSS. My understanding is that there are three options for sound in linux: OSS/Free (so-so; free; available with every distribution) Alsa (better; free; does not come with every distribution) OSS/Linux (best; $20; 4Front Technologies) I want the *best* solution as I'll be making part of my living from multitrack recording in a W98 SE VMware vm at first, and, hopefully soon after that, directly in a linux multi-track recording application like SLab, Multi-track or Mix. Is OSS/Linux the best? Do we not want 4Front Technologies to have our 20 bucks? Chris -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From aitken-BwLjziHGQLusTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 5 17:46:27 2004 From: aitken-BwLjziHGQLusTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (Chris Aitken) Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 12:46:27 -0500 Subject: CM8738 "Sound Blaster compatible"? References: <4006CED8.1B1118CB@onlink.net> <20040115180102.GX7177@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <400C9E14.7DA6D69B@onlink.net> <20040120142718.GE2384@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <40228173.A0030B5F@onlink.net> Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Mon, Jan 19, 2004 at 10:18:44PM -0500, Chris Aitken wrote: > > OK. I'm beginning to see that "Make sound work" is a little deeper than "I can > > play CDs OK". : ) > > Playing CDs doesn't use anything but the amplifier in the sound card. > It really tells you nothing. > > > OK. There is one there, but obviously not the one Pro Tools Free likes - maybe > > that's the one that plays CDs. > > Well if you use vmware 4.x it is emulating an ess1371 PCI sound card. > > > OK...we're assuming that that will work with the CM8738..or is that not > > relevant? > > Irrelevant. Question is: Is Linux working with the CM8738 at the > moment? I guess not - I can play CDs and I clicked 'Enable sound server startup' and 'Sound Events' (which work OK - sounds when I log on, click on things, etc.) in [GNOME footprint] > Programs > Settings > Multimedia > Sound. But as you pointed out I guess this only means that the amplifier in the card is working. If it is, and nothing else is using the sound (ESS, ARTS, etc) > then VMware should be able to connect to it and emulate the SB PCI128. > > Did you install the vmware tools in windows yet? If not do that. Yeah, but that only got the video card working properly. Maybe that would let VMware use the linux sound module if it was loaded, but I guess it's not so it won't. [...] Chris -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 5 18:20:14 2004 From: matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (G. Matthew Rice) Date: 05 Feb 2004 13:20:14 -0500 Subject: debian: what sound drivers ? In-Reply-To: <40227F17.C60E8CB0-BwLjziHGQLusTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org> References: <20040118034323.GG7177@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <40227F17.C60E8CB0@onlink.net> Message-ID: Chris Aitken writes: > Is OSS/Linux the best? Do we not want 4Front Technologies to have our 20 > bucks? It seems hit or miss for me. On an old version of Caldera, OSS/Linux was the only sound driver that would work. The last time I tried [forget which distro and sound card], only ALSA would work. If I was still using that version of Caldera, I would have paid for OSS/Linux. You're probably going to have to try them all. Regards, -- g. matthew rice starnix inc. phone: 905-771-0017 x242 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 5 18:52:15 2004 From: blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Byron Sonne) Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 13:52:15 -0500 Subject: SCO Mydoom: complaint to BBC re intemperate coverage In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <402290DF.8070707@rogers.com> > Material below is FYI....! > Dear BBC Feedback I responded likewise, rather politely too. Don't know how much they care about email, perhaps sending over some hardcopies would help too. -- For Good, return Good. For Evil, return Justice. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From JimS-pFJmkVL1u50 at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 5 14:19:31 2004 From: JimS-pFJmkVL1u50 at public.gmane.org (Jim Skehill) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 09:19:31 -0500 Subject: [TLUG] Configuring my laptop's wireless card using Drakconf Message-ID: <33678E78A2DD4D418396703A750048D4BD1E8E@RIKER> I'm finally getting around to setting up my laptop's wireless card in Linux (Mandrake 9.1). When my wireless hub broadcasts the SSID it works fine. However when I set it not to broadcast the SSID, and need to configure the card with the SSID so it can find the network, that's when the confusion arises. I first tried to do this using drakconf - it didn't work. I then found out that the card reads its settings from the file /etc/pcmcia/wireless.opts. But when I look at this file I see that it hasn't been modified recently. So where is drakconf writing the settings that I tried earlier? Any suggestions would be welcome. Regards, Jim. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 5 20:55:25 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 15:55:25 -0500 Subject: debian: what sound drivers ? In-Reply-To: <40227C80.F55264B4-BwLjziHGQLusTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org> References: <200401172133.50603.fraser@wehave.net> <40227C80.F55264B4@onlink.net> Message-ID: <20040205205525.GI732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Feb 05, 2004 at 12:25:20PM -0500, Chris Aitken wrote: > I hope I'm not being too thick here. This thread started at the same time as one > I had started about getting sound working in rh 7.3 (so VMware will be able to > work with that module as well). This stuff you have here is not supposed to work > with rh 7.3 is it? It's referring to Debian. If it's no good for rh 7.3, I'll > ignore this thread and pick up where I left off on the 'CM8738 "Sound Blaster > compatible"?' thread: > > [lsf-5jgDBJOV2nY at public.gmane.org lsf]$ su > Password: > [root-5jgDBJOV2nY at public.gmane.org lsf]# apt-cache search alsa > bash: apt-cache: command not found > [root-5jgDBJOV2nY at public.gmane.org lsf]# find / -name apt-cache > [root-5jgDBJOV2nY at public.gmane.org lsf]# apt-get install alsa-modules-2.4.18-3-686 > bash: apt-get: command not found > [root-5jgDBJOV2nY at public.gmane.org lsf]# find / -name apt-get > [root-5jgDBJOV2nY at public.gmane.org lsf]# apt-get is debian. You can still use alsa modules with redhat assuming they include that (I sure hope so). VMware will still want an ess1371 driver in the guest OS and a native driver for the hardware in the host OS. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 5 21:02:03 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 16:02:03 -0500 Subject: debian: what sound drivers ? In-Reply-To: <40227F17.C60E8CB0-BwLjziHGQLusTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org> References: <20040118034323.GG7177@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <40227F17.C60E8CB0@onlink.net> Message-ID: <20040205210203.GJ732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Feb 05, 2004 at 12:36:23PM -0500, Chris Aitken wrote: > shameless plug ; ) Was not. :) > What about OSS/Linux? > > People on this list write about OSS like there is only one OSS. My > understanding is that there are three options for sound in linux: > > OSS/Free (so-so; free; available with every distribution) > > Alsa (better; free; does not come with every distribution) Comes with 2.6 kernel, has been available seperately in many distributions (and from www.alsa-project.org) for 2.x kernels for some years. > OSS/Linux (best; $20; 4Front Technologies) Pathetic compared to ALSA. All it is is OSS interface with support for some NDA requiring sound chips. No additional features over OSS/free really. > I want the *best* solution as I'll be making part of my living from > multitrack recording in a W98 SE VMware vm at first, and, hopefully soon > after that, directly in a linux multi-track recording application like > SLab, Multi-track or Mix. > > Is OSS/Linux the best? Do we not want 4Front Technologies to have our 20 > bucks? ALSA is by far the best sound driver in Linux. I am disgusted by some of the drivers OSS passes of as working (they expected you to run the interwave in gf1 emulation mode, throwing away half the sample rate, and limiting recording to 8bit and required adding memory to the card). Meanwhile the predecessor to alsa was doing native support of the chip fully and for free. What 4Front has was better than nothing when they originally didi it, but not by much. ALSA actually tries to make somethingimpresive and useful that is fully featured and efficient. 4Front did a good job hurting sound support in linux for a while. They were willing to sign an NDA to get programing specs on a chip, sell the driver for $20 to the users, and then when the linux kernel people and alsa asked for specs on the chip they were told, but we already have linux support so we don't want to release the specs without an NDA now. Never mind that midi didn't work, joystick port didn't work, only stereo 16bit output and maybe input, limited mixer support, etc. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 5 21:19:45 2004 From: IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Ilya Palagin) Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 16:19:45 -0500 Subject: VRM for RISC/6000 Message-ID: <4022B371.3080206@rogers.com> Hi, Does anyone happen to know where to get spares for an old IBM RISC/6000 43P Model 140, 332 Mhz? There is one almost :) freely available, but without a Voltage Regulator Module (VRM). It would be nice to play with it, at least with AIX, if Linux doesn't get alone with this dinosaur. Thanks a lot, Ilya. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 5 22:31:21 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 17:31:21 -0500 Subject: CM8738 "Sound Blaster compatible"? In-Reply-To: <40228173.A0030B5F-BwLjziHGQLusTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org> References: <4006CED8.1B1118CB@onlink.net> <20040115180102.GX7177@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <400C9E14.7DA6D69B@onlink.net> <20040120142718.GE2384@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <40228173.A0030B5F@onlink.net> Message-ID: <20040205223121.GK732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Feb 05, 2004 at 12:46:27PM -0500, Chris Aitken wrote: > I guess not - I can play CDs and I clicked 'Enable sound server startup' and 'Sound > Events' (which work OK - sounds when I log on, click on things, etc.) in [GNOME > footprint] > Programs > Settings > Multimedia > Sound. But as you pointed out I > guess this only means that the amplifier in the card is working. If you enable sound server in gnome (ESD) then that would probably explain VMware not being able to use the sound card. Try turning off sound events in gnome. > Yeah, but that only got the video card working properly. Maybe that would let > VMware use the linux sound module if it was loaded, but I guess it's not so it > won't. I think gnome locking the sound device for it's own use is the real problem. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From aacton-B71PBEe7S7Y at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 5 23:58:22 2004 From: aacton-B71PBEe7S7Y at public.gmane.org (aacton-B71PBEe7S7Y at public.gmane.org) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 18:58:22 -0500 Subject: [TLUG] Configuring my laptop's wireless card using Drakconf In-Reply-To: <33678E78A2DD4D418396703A750048D4BD1E8E-zjka4IdDAzw@public.gmane.org> References: <33678E78A2DD4D418396703A750048D4BD1E8E@RIKER> Message-ID: <1076025502.4022d89e7b78c@mymail.yorku.ca> Quoting Jim Skehill : > I then found out that the card reads its settings from the file > /etc/pcmcia/wireless.opts. But when I look at this file I see that it hasn't > been modified recently. > > So where is drakconf writing the settings that I tried earlier? Mandrake 9.1 and 9.2 had only very preliminary wireless config at best. Mandrake 10 has a totally new drakconnect. Hopefully it will work better for you. BTW, I'm a Mandrake developer, I have two wireless cards, and I've yet to find a way to get either of them working as quickly and easily as Windows does. It's one of the few thorns in my side. Austin -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From aacton-B71PBEe7S7Y at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 00:02:24 2004 From: aacton-B71PBEe7S7Y at public.gmane.org (aacton-B71PBEe7S7Y at public.gmane.org) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 19:02:24 -0500 Subject: smtp advice needed Message-ID: <1076025744.4022d990766df@mymail.yorku.ca> I need to mail sending help... I just recently bought a router for my home network. I needed it to be able to use my new Prismiq media player (VERY cool, prismiq.com). Now it seems I cannot send email from home though... My SMTP server at school seems to do some sort of reverse DNS on my IP, and since it's a local (192.168.) address, it can't find me, and thinks I'm a spambot. I also tried using postfix directly, but it tries to do a DNS lookup on my hostname. My router assigns me an arbitrary hostname (ususally: localhost) so that doesn't work either. How the hell do people send email from behind a router? Thanks, Austin -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From anton-F0u+EriZ6ihBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 00:51:48 2004 From: anton-F0u+EriZ6ihBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Anton Markov) Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 19:51:48 -0500 Subject: debian: what sound drivers ? In-Reply-To: <20040205205525.GI732-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <200401172133.50603.fraser@wehave.net> <40227C80.F55264B4@onlink.net> <20040205205525.GI732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <4022E524.1010405@truxtar.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Actually, there is an RPM version of apt-get available for Redhat, and the last time I checked there where alsa drivers available using apt-get for the stock Redhat kernels. Sorry I don't have the download link for you for apt-get. By the way, you should use synaptic (a GUI for apt-get) to find the package. MUCH easier than apt-cache. Do note that apt-get doesn't work 10% as well on Redhat as it does on Debian (which I am loving now!), but it is still better than pure rpm. Lennart Sorensen wrote: >> >>[lsf-5jgDBJOV2nY at public.gmane.org lsf]$ su >>Password: >>[root-5jgDBJOV2nY at public.gmane.org lsf]# apt-cache search alsa >>bash: apt-cache: command not found >>[root-5jgDBJOV2nY at public.gmane.org lsf]# find / -name apt-cache >>[root-5jgDBJOV2nY at public.gmane.org lsf]# apt-get install alsa-modules-2.4.18-3-686 >>bash: apt-get: command not found >>[root-5jgDBJOV2nY at public.gmane.org lsf]# find / -name apt-get >>[root-5jgDBJOV2nY at public.gmane.org lsf]# > > > apt-get is debian. > > You can still use alsa modules with redhat assuming they include that (I > sure hope so). VMware will still want an ess1371 driver in the guest OS > and a native driver for the hardware in the host OS. > - -- Anton Markov <("anton" + "@" + "truxtar" + "." + "com")> GnuPG Key fingerprint = 5546 A6E2 1FFB 9BB8 15C3 CE34 46B7 8D93 3AD1 44B4 *** LINUX - MAY THE SOURCE BE WITH YOU! *** -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFAIuUrRreNkzrRRLQRAuR0AJ90XeN3vj1FlNOxw4kXTSt2ky86EQCdFRr+ RdIHoDL0LPZ5hUvdFdPSNqU= =PhuI -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 01:23:23 2004 From: tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Tim Writer) Date: 05 Feb 2004 20:23:23 -0500 Subject: smtp advice needed In-Reply-To: <1076025744.4022d990766df-L/ZuoSt+y0q45YHtStHL6Q@public.gmane.org> References: <1076025744.4022d990766df@mymail.yorku.ca> Message-ID: aacton-B71PBEe7S7Y at public.gmane.org writes: > I need to mail sending help... > > I just recently bought a router for my home network. I needed it to be able to > use my new Prismiq media player (VERY cool, prismiq.com). Now it seems I cannot > send email from home though... My SMTP server at school seems to do some sort > of reverse DNS on my IP, and since it's a local (192.168.) address, it can't > find me, and thinks I'm a spambot. I also tried using postfix directly, but it > tries to do a DNS lookup on my hostname. My router assigns me an arbitrary > hostname (ususally: localhost) so that doesn't work either. How the hell do > people send email from behind a router? Most commonly via direct SMTP to their ISP's SMTP server. Another common approach is to configure your MTA (postfix, sendmail, whatever) to forward all outgoing e-mail to a "smart host", again usually your ISP's SMTP server. There are other approaches but these are the simplest. -- tim writer starnix inc. 905.771.0017 ext. 225 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From aacton-B71PBEe7S7Y at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 01:42:44 2004 From: aacton-B71PBEe7S7Y at public.gmane.org (aacton-B71PBEe7S7Y at public.gmane.org) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 20:42:44 -0500 Subject: smtp advice needed In-Reply-To: References: <1076025744.4022d990766df@mymail.yorku.ca> Message-ID: <1076031764.4022f1147c5bd@mymail.yorku.ca> Quoting Tim Writer : > Most commonly via direct SMTP to their ISP's SMTP server. Another common > approach is to configure your MTA (postfix, sendmail, whatever) to forward > all outgoing e-mail to a "smart host", again usually your ISP's SMTP server. > There are other approaches but these are the simplest. Hehe, thanks Tim, but the school IS my ISP. When I try to SMTP to them, I get this error: Error while performing operation: RCPT TO failed: ... Relaying denied. IP name lookup failed [199.212.73.21] My router has obviously been assigned to 199.212.73.21 by the school, but my PC is 192.168.0.100 as assigned by the router's DHCP. I think that's the problem, right? I tried relaying through postfix as you suggested, but postfix refuses to run until I provide it with a valid complete hostname, which I of course don't have, since the router just calls me 'localhost'. I hate networking! Thanks for your assistance, Austin -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 02:20:54 2004 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 21:20:54 -0500 Subject: debian: what sound drivers ? In-Reply-To: <4022E524.1010405-F0u+EriZ6ihBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040205205525.GI732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <4022E524.1010405@truxtar.com> Message-ID: <200402052120.55068.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> On February 5, 2004 07:51 pm, Anton Markov wrote: > Actually, there is an RPM version of apt-get available for Redhat, and > the last time I checked there where alsa drivers available using apt-get > for the stock Redhat kernels. > > Sorry I don't have the download link for you for apt-get. There are quite a few apt repositories for redhat these days. The one I've used is http://apt.freshrpms.net/ -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 02:42:04 2004 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 21:42:04 -0500 Subject: smtp advice needed In-Reply-To: <1076025744.4022d990766df-L/ZuoSt+y0q45YHtStHL6Q@public.gmane.org> References: <1076025744.4022d990766df@mymail.yorku.ca> Message-ID: <20040206024204.GA2844@node1.opengeometry.net> On Thu, Feb 05, 2004 at 07:02:24PM -0500, aacton-B71PBEe7S7Y at public.gmane.org wrote: > I need to mail sending help... > > I just recently bought a router for my home network. I needed it to be able to > use my new Prismiq media player (VERY cool, prismiq.com). Now it seems I cannot > send email from home though... My SMTP server at school seems to do some sort > of reverse DNS on my IP, and since it's a local (192.168.) address, it can't > find me, and thinks I'm a spambot. I also tried using postfix directly, but it > tries to do a DNS lookup on my hostname. My router assigns me an arbitrary > hostname (ususally: localhost) so that doesn't work either. How the hell do > people send email from behind a router? What error do you get? -- William Park, Open Geometry Consulting, Linux solution for data management and processing. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-HInyCGIudOg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 02:52:42 2004 From: cbbrowne-HInyCGIudOg at public.gmane.org (cbbrowne-HInyCGIudOg at public.gmane.org) Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 21:52:42 -0500 Subject: G&M Does the Same As BBC Message-ID: <20040206025243.6C14E3FE2@cbbrowne.com> If you were irritated by the "Beeb's" article, and wanted to respond, then the Globe and Mail has offered the same opportunity. http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20040204.gtkapica0205_HP/BNPrint/Front/ -- output = reverse("gro.mca" "@" "enworbbc") http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linuxdistributions.html Should vegetarians eat animal crackers? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-HInyCGIudOg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 03:04:37 2004 From: cbbrowne-HInyCGIudOg at public.gmane.org (cbbrowne-HInyCGIudOg at public.gmane.org) Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 22:04:37 -0500 Subject: Options for LEGITIMATE mail relaying... Message-ID: <20040206030438.84FEF3FE2@cbbrowne.com> My brother has recently started to get bitten by the problem that his ISP (down in Texas, so it's not one of the locals) is refusing to let him use his own domain name's address on his email. That sort of thing would certainly "crimp my style;" I commonly use an @acm.org address... Apparently the only way he has, at present, to get mail to come out of his "@his-domain.com" address is to scp messages over to the host where his web site and such resides, and inject messages straight into /usr/lib/sendmail :-(. Someone else manages the server, and he can't relay mail into that SMTP server (I'm not sure what flavor it is); his ISP rejects attempts to send mail out as if it's from "@his-domain.com". I hate to admit that he's running "That Other Operating System," at home... Are there any "free mail relays" out there, for those that _aren't_ rewriting addresses for evil? The one thought that comes to mind is that if there's an SMTP server that will relay so long as you connect as an authenticated user, that might do the trick... -- let name="aa454" and tld="freenet.carleton.ca" in name ^ "@" ^ tld;; http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linuxxian.html If a cow laughed, would milk come out its nose? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From glayng-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 04:05:58 2004 From: glayng-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Gary Layng) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 23:05:58 -0500 Subject: G&M Does the Same As BBC In-Reply-To: <20040206025243.6C14E3FE2-xzRQuAxiFLNWk0Htik3J/w@public.gmane.org> References: <20040206025243.6C14E3FE2@cbbrowne.com> Message-ID: <000301c3ec66$86a33c90$b151fea9@omoekane> I sent e-mails to both the BBC and to Kapica. I also referenced Groklaw, which should help them get to speed fairly quickly. Assuming, of course that they actually WANT to get up to speed... -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org] On Behalf Of cbbrowne-HInyCGIudOg at public.gmane.org Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2004 9:53 PM To: tlug-HcP7FbCj2GFAfugRpC6u6w at public.gmane.org Subject: [TLUG]: G&M Does the Same As BBC If you were irritated by the "Beeb's" article, and wanted to respond, then the Globe and Mail has offered the same opportunity. http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20040204.gtkapica0205_HP/ BNPrint/Front/ -- output = reverse("gro.mca" "@" "enworbbc") http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/linuxdistributions.html Should vegetarians eat animal crackers? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 04:08:14 2004 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 23:08:14 -0500 Subject: G&M Does the Same As BBC In-Reply-To: <20040206025243.6C14E3FE2-xzRQuAxiFLNWk0Htik3J/w@public.gmane.org> References: <20040206025243.6C14E3FE2@cbbrowne.com> Message-ID: <200402052308.14792.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> On February 5, 2004 09:52 pm, cbbrowne-HInyCGIudOg at public.gmane.org wrote: > If you were irritated by the "Beeb's" article, and wanted to respond, > then the Globe and Mail has offered the same opportunity. > > http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20040204.gtkapica0205_HP >/BNPrint/Front/ -- That is one of the most incoherent pieces of trash that I have read in quite some time. He will be receiving a (polite) email from me. -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 06:25:28 2004 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 01:25:28 -0500 Subject: Business case for moving to Linux Message-ID: <20040206062528.GA7854@node1.opengeometry.net> Does anyone have URLs which outline "business case" for moving to Linux? It would be helpful to see few samples, before writing my own. -- William Park, Open Geometry Consulting, Linux solution for data management and processing. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jerome-mhXWc29+iYPyG1zEObXtfA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 09:40:17 2004 From: jerome-mhXWc29+iYPyG1zEObXtfA at public.gmane.org (JM) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 17:40:17 +0800 Subject: OT: Hardware Raid 1 on linux Message-ID: <200402061740.17655.jerome@gmanmi.tv> hi, how does a system on raid 1 act when one of its drive fails? Will it still function properly? How would I know if one of my drive fails? (without physically looking at it)... would linux inform me? i have a box which is not a hot swap capable.. if one disk fails i have to bring the system down and replace it with the new one.. do i have to make sure that the new disk has been partitioned like the one w/c ill be replacing? or will i just make a filesystem similar to the one ill be replacing... TIA jm -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From dbmacg-j4iOX5ZKO4mumhQq9Hcxfg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 12:31:26 2004 From: dbmacg-j4iOX5ZKO4mumhQq9Hcxfg at public.gmane.org (Duncan MacGregor) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 07:31:26 -0500 Subject: Business case for moving to Linux In-Reply-To: <20040206062528.GA7854-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040206062528.GA7854@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <200402060731.27010.dbmacg@mail.rosecom.ca> The following United Nations (UNCTAD) reference is a good one: -- http://www.unctad.org/en/docs/ecdr2003ch4_en.pdf Worth mentioning is that Open systems are usually adept in a network. Also, it seems you get better pricing from proprietary vendors when you have at least some open systems. Duncan On February 6, 2004 01:25 am, William Park wrote: > Does anyone have URLs which outline "business case" for moving to Linux? > It would be helpful to see few samples, before writing my own. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 10:47:51 2004 From: skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ at public.gmane.org (Sergey Kuznetsov) Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 05:47:51 -0500 Subject: Slackware-current Message-ID: <200402060547.51732.skuznets@blueprint.org> Hollo to everybody! KDE-3.2.0 officially on slackware-current now. I kinda like it =) BTW, ftp://mirrors.secsup.org - is my favourite mirror site for major distributions. -- All the Best! ----------------- Sergey Kuznetsov Senior Software Developer Blueprint Initiative Samuel Lunenfeld Research Institute at Mount Sinai Hospital -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 16:56:14 2004 From: tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Tim Writer) Date: 06 Feb 2004 11:56:14 -0500 Subject: smtp advice needed In-Reply-To: <1076031764.4022f1147c5bd-L/ZuoSt+y0q45YHtStHL6Q@public.gmane.org> References: <1076025744.4022d990766df@mymail.yorku.ca> <1076031764.4022f1147c5bd@mymail.yorku.ca> Message-ID: aacton-B71PBEe7S7Y at public.gmane.org writes: > Quoting Tim Writer : > > Most commonly via direct SMTP to their ISP's SMTP server. Another common > > approach is to configure your MTA (postfix, sendmail, whatever) to forward > > all outgoing e-mail to a "smart host", again usually your ISP's SMTP server. > > There are other approaches but these are the simplest. > > Hehe, thanks Tim, but the school IS my ISP. What do you mean by that? You have dialup/DSL service provided by your school? By ISP, I mean the provider of your networking service, not your e-mail or web provider. Your school could be your e-mail provider while you have another ISP (Bell Sympatico, Rogers, etc.) providing the networking service. > When I try to SMTP to them, I get > this error: > > Error while performing operation: > RCPT TO failed: ... Relaying denied. IP name lookup > failed [199.212.73.21] If your school really is your ISP, that's a configuration error on their end. They should allow you to realy through them (and should also provide reversed DNS service). > My router has obviously been assigned to 199.212.73.21 by the school, but > my PC is 192.168.0.100 as assigned by the router's DHCP. I think that's > the problem, right? I doubt it. Your router will be doing NAT so that outbound packets passing through your router will be translated to appear to come from 199.212.73.21. They don't know you're 192.168.0.100 and don't care. This is a fairly standard setup. -- tim writer starnix inc. 905.771.0017 ext. 225 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From aacton-B71PBEe7S7Y at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 17:06:59 2004 From: aacton-B71PBEe7S7Y at public.gmane.org (Austin) Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 12:06:59 -0500 Subject: smtp advice needed In-Reply-To: References: <1076025744.4022d990766df@mymail.yorku.ca> <1076031764.4022f1147c5bd@mymail.yorku.ca> Message-ID: <1076087219.3939.9.camel@groundstate.chem.yorku.ca> On Fri, 2004-02-06 at 11:56, Tim Writer wrote: > What do you mean by that? You have dialup/DSL service provided by your > school? By ISP, I mean the provider of your networking service, not your > e-mail or web provider. Your school could be your e-mail provider while you > have another ISP (Bell Sympatico, Rogers, etc.) providing the networking > service. No, the school is my ISP. I'm on their lan. (10 Mb/s is NICE) > If your school really is your ISP, that's a configuration error on their end. > They should allow you to realy through them (and should also provide reversed > DNS service). Yeah, but I'm afraid to ask them... we're not supposed to use routers, only hubs (stupid rules), but I need the router to get other ethernet devices working (non-computers). It's because they want to know the MAC of every machine on their network, so they say no routers, which is stupid, cause you can easily spoof any MAC you want, if you have reason to. > I doubt it. Your router will be doing NAT so that outbound packets passing > through your router will be translated to appear to come from 199.212.73.21. > They don't know you're 192.168.0.100 and don't care. This is a fairly > standard setup. Gotcha. But that makes the problem even weirder, because it DOES work without going through the router. I'll mess with it some more. Thanks for your help, Austin -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 17:40:08 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 12:40:08 -0500 Subject: bash character substitution? Need help Message-ID: <4023D178.2010206@alteeve.com> Hi all, I am working on an iptables bash script but am handicapped by not being a programmer (or, just barely being one). Anyway, I've been able to figure out how to take a string and read out variables based on a character to split on but now what I need it to read a value into the same variable over and over again based on the split. Here is my specific issue: I have the variable: # Enter as (MAC address)>Port(-range),Port(-range),..,Port(-range) TRUSTED_IB_TCP=00:11:22:33:44:55>21,53,80-85 Now I want to check and see if ports are defined. If not, allow all ports from the given MAC address. If so, read out the ports one after another in a 'for/while' style loop splitting on the ','. Then inside each of those, split on '-' and check to see if there is a value after the '-'. The problem is, I know how to split on the ',' (IFS=',' ...) but this doesn't seem like it is going to help me because I want to run a 'for/while' loop for each value, not assign new variables based on the split (like I have done so far). Is there some way to substitute the ',' with ' ' and then do a 'for/while' loop? I am Googling now but I am having trouble finding the answer. I am hoping someone here might be able to point me in the right direction. Thanks! Madison PS - If it will help, I'll post what I have of the relevant parts of the script. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 17:36:00 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 12:36:00 -0500 Subject: OT: Hardware Raid 1 on linux In-Reply-To: <200402061740.17655.jerome-mhXWc29+iYPyG1zEObXtfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200402061740.17655.jerome@gmanmi.tv> Message-ID: <20040206173600.GL732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Feb 06, 2004 at 05:40:17PM +0800, JM wrote: > how does a system on raid 1 act when one of its drive fails? Will it still > function properly? How would I know if one of my drive fails? (without > physically looking at it)... would linux inform me? i have a box which is not > a hot swap capable.. if one disk fails i have to bring the system down and > replace it with the new one.. do i have to make sure that the new disk has > been partitioned like the one w/c ill be replacing? or will i just make a > filesystem similar to the one ill be replacing... If what you have is a hardware raid card, then the syrtem should continue running if a drive fails. The only exception to this that I know of is if you are using IDE disks and have two disks sharing one cable, in which case one drive dying can stop access to the other drive on the same cable. No proper raid card would allow multiple ide drives on one cable. SCSI deals with shared cable and dead drives just fine. If the system does not permit hotswap, you have to shut it down to replace the drive. The raid card should automatically start rebuilding the raid on powerup. Partitions are after all an OS thing done on top of the raid, and what the raid card stores physically on the disks really shouldn't interest the end user much. As for finding out, well some drivers in linux will have utilities for monitoring the raid, others report their status in /proc somewhere, a few seem to do nothing at all that I know of. On some systems with hotswap scsi raid, a light on the case will come on when there is a fault and a light on the defective drive will come on and it might start beeping. There is no single method used. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From grant.cullen-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 18:23:57 2004 From: grant.cullen-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Grant Cullen) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 13:23:57 -0500 Subject: bash character substitution? Need help In-Reply-To: <4023D178.2010206-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <4023D178.2010206@alteeve.com> Message-ID: Madison, the following will give the basic parsing. Good luck #!/bin/bash X='00:11:22:33:44:55>21,53,80-85' MAC=${X,1,17} [ ${#X} -gt 18 ] && { # we have ports - length greater than 18 IFS=',' for PORT in ${x:18} do echo "iptable entry with port " $PORT done } || { # no ports echo "iptable entry without ports" } Grant Cullen JADALL Consulting Ltd. grant.cullen-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org 416-706-4447 -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org]On Behalf Of Madison Kelly Sent: Friday, February 06, 2004 12:40 To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: [TLUG]: bash character substitution? Need help Hi all, I am working on an iptables bash script but am handicapped by not being a programmer (or, just barely being one). Anyway, I've been able to figure out how to take a string and read out variables based on a character to split on but now what I need it to read a value into the same variable over and over again based on the split. Here is my specific issue: I have the variable: # Enter as (MAC address)>Port(-range),Port(-range),..,Port(-range) TRUSTED_IB_TCP=00:11:22:33:44:55>21,53,80-85 Now I want to check and see if ports are defined. If not, allow all ports from the given MAC address. If so, read out the ports one after another in a 'for/while' style loop splitting on the ','. Then inside each of those, split on '-' and check to see if there is a value after the '-'. The problem is, I know how to split on the ',' (IFS=',' ...) but this doesn't seem like it is going to help me because I want to run a 'for/while' loop for each value, not assign new variables based on the split (like I have done so far). Is there some way to substitute the ',' with ' ' and then do a 'for/while' loop? I am Googling now but I am having trouble finding the answer. I am hoping someone here might be able to point me in the right direction. Thanks! Madison PS - If it will help, I'll post what I have of the relevant parts of the script. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 19:07:21 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 14:07:21 -0500 Subject: bash character substitution? Need help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4023E5E9.7000701@alteeve.com> Hi Grant, and thank you for replying. May I ask another question? How does this part work? MAC=${X,1,17} [ ${#X} -gt 18 ] && { I hope it isn't an overly junior question but it looks quite different from the code I have been building on. Thanks again!! Madison Grant Cullen wrote: > Madison, the following will give the basic parsing. > > Good luck > > #!/bin/bash > X='00:11:22:33:44:55>21,53,80-85' > MAC=${X,1,17} > [ ${#X} -gt 18 ] && > { > # we have ports - length greater than 18 > IFS=',' > for PORT in ${x:18} > do > echo "iptable entry with port " $PORT > done > } || > { > # no ports > echo "iptable entry without ports" > } > > Grant Cullen > JADALL Consulting Ltd. > grant.cullen-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org > 416-706-4447 > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org]On Behalf Of Madison > Kelly > Sent: Friday, February 06, 2004 12:40 > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: [TLUG]: bash character substitution? Need help > > > Hi all, > > I am working on an iptables bash script but am handicapped by not > being a programmer (or, just barely being one). Anyway, I've been able > to figure out how to take a string and read out variables based on a > character to split on but now what I need it to read a value into the > same variable over and over again based on the split. Here is my > specific issue: > > I have the variable: > > # Enter as (MAC address)>Port(-range),Port(-range),..,Port(-range) > TRUSTED_IB_TCP=00:11:22:33:44:55>21,53,80-85 > > Now I want to check and see if ports are defined. If not, allow all > ports from the given MAC address. If so, read out the ports one after > another in a 'for/while' style loop splitting on the ','. Then inside > each of those, split on '-' and check to see if there is a value after > the '-'. > > The problem is, I know how to split on the ',' (IFS=',' ...) but this > doesn't seem like it is going to help me because I want to run a > 'for/while' loop for each value, not assign new variables based on the > split (like I have done so far). Is there some way to substitute the ',' > with ' ' and then do a 'for/while' loop? > > I am Googling now but I am having trouble finding the answer. I am > hoping someone here might be able to point me in the right direction. > Thanks! > > Madison > > PS - If it will help, I'll post what I have of the relevant parts of the > script. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 19:14:47 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 14:14:47 -0500 Subject: bash character substitution? Need help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4023E7A7.8040709@alteeve.com> Quick note, I tried running the script (to see if I could decypher it) and I got this; ./test-parse: line 3: ${X,1,17}: bad substitution Madison Grant Cullen wrote: > Madison, the following will give the basic parsing. > > Good luck > > #!/bin/bash > X='00:11:22:33:44:55>21,53,80-85' > MAC=${X,1,17} > [ ${#X} -gt 18 ] && > { > # we have ports - length greater than 18 > IFS=',' > for PORT in ${x:18} > do > echo "iptable entry with port " $PORT > done > } || > { > # no ports > echo "iptable entry without ports" > } > > Grant Cullen > JADALL Consulting Ltd. > grant.cullen-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org > 416-706-4447 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 19:10:31 2004 From: tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Tim Writer) Date: 06 Feb 2004 14:10:31 -0500 Subject: OT: Hardware Raid 1 on linux In-Reply-To: <200402061740.17655.jerome-mhXWc29+iYPyG1zEObXtfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200402061740.17655.jerome@gmanmi.tv> Message-ID: JM writes: > hi, > > how does a system on raid 1 act when one of its drive fails? Will it still > function properly? It should -- that's the whole point -- although I've seen h/w RAID fail altogether when one drive fails. I prefer software RAID. > How would I know if one of my drive fails? (without > physically looking at it)... would linux inform me? With h/w RAID, you'll need a Linux monitoring tool. IBM ServeRAID, for example, has such a tool. With software, you can monitor /proc/mdstat or use mdadm. > i have a box which is not > a hot swap capable.. if one disk fails i have to bring the system down and > replace it with the new one.. do i have to make sure that the new disk has > been partitioned like the one w/c ill be replacing? Not usually with h/w RAID but it depends on the RAID controller. With software RAID, the drives should be partitioned more or less the same. > or will i just make a > filesystem similar to the one ill be replacing... No, you don't make a file system. Once the failed drive has been replaced, RAID (hardware or software) should rebuild the RAID volume automatically. Normally, you need only notify the RAID controller (or software RAID subsystem) that the drive has been replaced. -- tim writer starnix inc. 905.771.0017 ext. 225 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From emmajane-MHIYrZpDPrNWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 19:17:51 2004 From: emmajane-MHIYrZpDPrNWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (Emma Jane Hogbin) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 14:17:51 -0500 Subject: DNS confusion Message-ID: <20040206191751.GH2331@smeagol> hey everyone, I'm hoping someone will have some ideas as to what I did wrong... www.backdirt.net is hosted on 66.98.212.88 www.geekent.com is hosted on 205.207.28.66 These machines are not at all related. When I access http://geekent.com all is as it should be. But when I try to access http://www.geekent.com I get the current web site of www.backdirt.net (it's not even the old contents from where backdirt.net used to be hosted). The part that I find especially confusing is that backdirt.net isn't even the first item in the Apache config file on 205.207.28.66. It's the SECOND item (the first item is www.appearance-reality.com which is working fine). I must have done something wrong? Or did my ISP do something wrong? I'm so confused! emma -- Emma Jane Hogbin [[ 416 417 2868 ][ www.xtrinsic.com ]] -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-cOjNTMaGA5U at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 19:26:00 2004 From: linux-cOjNTMaGA5U at public.gmane.org (Ian Goldberg) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 14:26:00 -0500 Subject: DNS confusion In-Reply-To: <20040206191751.GH2331-Kz9ENIl45+A@public.gmane.org> References: <20040206191751.GH2331@smeagol> Message-ID: <20040206192600.GV32438@paip.net> On Fri, Feb 06, 2004 at 02:17:51PM -0500, Emma Jane Hogbin wrote: > hey everyone, > > I'm hoping someone will have some ideas as to what I did wrong... > > www.backdirt.net is hosted on 66.98.212.88 > www.geekent.com is hosted on 205.207.28.66 > > These machines are not at all related. When I access http://geekent.com > all is as it should be. But when I try to access http://www.geekent.com I > get the current web site of www.backdirt.net (it's not even the old > contents from where backdirt.net used to be hosted). The part that I find > especially confusing is that backdirt.net isn't even the first item in the > Apache config file on 205.207.28.66. It's the SECOND item (the first item > is www.appearance-reality.com which is working fine). iang-gDXiyAWc/v0 at public.gmane.org:~$ host geekent.com geekent.com A 205.207.28.100 iang-gDXiyAWc/v0 at public.gmane.org:~$ host www.geekent.com www.geekent.com CNAME emmajane.net emmajane.net A 66.98.212.88 You need to point www.geekent.com to the right address. Whoever is doing DNS for geekent.com (samurai.com, it seems) should fix it. - Ian -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 19:40:37 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 14:40:37 -0500 Subject: Got it!! Re:bash character substitution? Need help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4023EDB5.6040101@alteeve.com> Hi again Grant, No worries about replying now, I figured out a way to make it work. Here is what I did (for the archives)... #!/bin/bash X='00:11:22:33:44:55>21,53,80-85' for rule in ${X} ; do echo "Rule: "${X} echo "$rule" | { IFS='>' read mac port echo "MAC: "$mac" Ports: "$port echo "$port" | { IFS=',' for num in ${port} ; do echo "Individual Port: "$num echo "$num" | { IFS='-' read fsp lsp if [ "${lsp}" != "" ] ; then echo "Port Range: "${fsp}":"${lsp} else echo "Single Port: "${fsp} fi } done } } done Many thanks again!! Madison Grant Cullen wrote: > Madison, the following will give the basic parsing. > > Good luck > > #!/bin/bash > X='00:11:22:33:44:55>21,53,80-85' > MAC=${X,1,17} > [ ${#X} -gt 18 ] && > { > # we have ports - length greater than 18 > IFS=',' > for PORT in ${x:18} > do > echo "iptable entry with port " $PORT > done > } || > { > # no ports > echo "iptable entry without ports" > } > > Grant Cullen > JADALL Consulting Ltd. > grant.cullen-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org > 416-706-4447 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From emmajane-MHIYrZpDPrNWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 19:37:40 2004 From: emmajane-MHIYrZpDPrNWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (Emma Jane Hogbin) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 14:37:40 -0500 Subject: DNS confusion In-Reply-To: <20040206192600.GV32438-cOjNTMaGA5U@public.gmane.org> References: <20040206191751.GH2331@smeagol> <20040206192600.GV32438@paip.net> Message-ID: <20040206193740.GL2331@smeagol> On Fri, Feb 06, 2004 at 02:26:00PM -0500, Ian Goldberg wrote: > iang-gDXiyAWc/v0 at public.gmane.org:~$ host geekent.com > geekent.com A 205.207.28.100 > iang-gDXiyAWc/v0 at public.gmane.org:~$ host www.geekent.com > www.geekent.com CNAME emmajane.net > emmajane.net A 66.98.212.88 > > You need to point www.geekent.com to the right address. Whoever is > doing DNS for geekent.com (samurai.com, it seems) should fix it. Thanks! emma -- Emma Jane Hogbin [[ 416 417 2868 ][ www.xtrinsic.com ]] -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 19:58:03 2004 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 14:58:03 -0500 Subject: Slackware-current In-Reply-To: <200402060547.51732.skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200402060547.51732.skuznets@blueprint.org> Message-ID: <20040206195803.GA9101@node1.opengeometry.net> On Fri, Feb 06, 2004 at 05:47:51AM -0500, Sergey Kuznetsov wrote: > Hollo to everybody! > > KDE-3.2.0 officially on slackware-current now. > I kinda like it =) I refuse to burn any more CD !!! -- William Park, Open Geometry Consulting, Linux solution for data management and processing. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 20:15:34 2004 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 15:15:34 -0500 Subject: bash character substitution? Need help In-Reply-To: References: <4023D178.2010206@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <20040206201534.GA9335@node1.opengeometry.net> > I have the variable: > > # Enter as (MAC address)>Port(-range),Port(-range),..,Port(-range) > TRUSTED_IB_TCP=00:11:22:33:44:55>21,53,80-85 > > Now I want to check and see if ports are defined. If not, allow all > ports from the given MAC address. If so, read out the ports one after > another in a 'for/while' style loop splitting on the ','. Then inside > each of those, split on '-' and check to see if there is a value after > the '-'. > > The problem is, I know how to split on the ',' (IFS=',' ...) but this > doesn't seem like it is going to help me because I want to run a > 'for/while' loop for each value, not assign new variables based on the > split (like I have done so far). Is there some way to substitute the ',' > with ' ' and then do a 'for/while' loop? > > I am Googling now but I am having trouble finding the answer. I am > hoping someone here might be able to point me in the right direction. > Thanks! Hint: read mac ports <<< "${TRUSTED_IB_TCP/>/ }" for p in ${ports//,/ }; do case $p in *-?*) echo $p is 'x-y' ;; *-) echo $p is 'x-' ;; *) echo $p is 'x' ;; esac done -- William Park, Open Geometry Consulting, Linux solution for data management and processing. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 20:29:44 2004 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 15:29:44 -0500 Subject: DNS confusion In-Reply-To: <20040206191751.GH2331-Kz9ENIl45+A@public.gmane.org> References: <20040206191751.GH2331@smeagol> Message-ID: <20040206202944.GA9961@node1.opengeometry.net> On Fri, Feb 06, 2004 at 02:17:51PM -0500, Emma Jane Hogbin wrote: > hey everyone, > > I'm hoping someone will have some ideas as to what I did wrong... > > www.backdirt.net is hosted on 66.98.212.88 > www.geekent.com is hosted on 205.207.28.66 > > These machines are not at all related. When I access http://geekent.com > all is as it should be. But when I try to access http://www.geekent.com I > get the current web site of www.backdirt.net (it's not even the old > contents from where backdirt.net used to be hosted). The part that I find > especially confusing is that backdirt.net isn't even the first item in the > Apache config file on 205.207.28.66. It's the SECOND item (the first item > is www.appearance-reality.com which is working fine). > > I must have done something wrong? Or did my ISP do something wrong? I'm so > confused! Hint: host www.geekent.com dig geekent.com ping www.geekent.com -- William Park, Open Geometry Consulting, Linux solution for data management and processing. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 20:30:29 2004 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 15:30:29 -0500 Subject: Slackware-current In-Reply-To: <200402060547.51732.skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200402060547.51732.skuznets@blueprint.org> Message-ID: <200402061530.29559.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> On February 6, 2004 05:47 am, Sergey Kuznetsov wrote: > KDE-3.2.0 officially on slackware-current now. > I kinda like it =) I like it a lot and the claimed speed improvements seem to be real. Startup times for me (first login) have gone from 22 seconds to 15 seconds. On subsequent logins the difference is quite small but it's marginally faster (roughly 5 seconds instead of 6). kmail is also significantly faster, my maildir contains over 165,000 messages, kmail was becoming quite slow now it's very fast even on the largest mailboxes (except first time, it must be doing some caching). This is comparing kde 3.1.5 and 3.2.0. OTOH, I've found a number of sites in the last few days that make konqueror crash, that was extremely rare on the konqueror from 3.1.5. > BTW, ftp://mirrors.secsup.org - is my favourite mirror site for major > distributions. For Debian stable users add the following to /etc/apt/sources.list: deb http://download.kde.org/stable/3.1.4/Debian/ woody main -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mark-/2gyfjYZF1k at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 21:32:10 2004 From: mark-/2gyfjYZF1k at public.gmane.org (Mark Wadden) Date: 06 Feb 2004 16:32:10 -0500 Subject: transparent firewall (proxy arp?) Message-ID: <1076103130.13401.91.camel@chaos.verus.ca> Greetings all, I'm hoping someone can help me with a networking issue. I'm trying to set up what I would call a "transparent firewall". Basically, I want to stick a machine running iptables between my ISP-supplied router and the switch, without having it masquarade the IPs of the machines it's protecting. I had no idea where to start so I originally looked into some Linux bridging docs. Then I came across this Proxy Arp how-to, which essentially describes my exact scenario (http://www.sjdjweis.com/linux/proxyarp/). As promising as this article sounds, I couldn't get it to work. I set up a RedHat 9 box as per the instructions in the how-to. But when I hooked everything up (and rebooted the router and switch to clear out any arp tables) it wouldn't route any packets through. From the Proxy Arp machine I could ping both sides (router and DMZ) but I couldn't get anything to go THROUGH the machine. At one point I was able to ping from the DMZ side to the router, but nothing else was going through. Another strange thing is that I tried a tcpdump on the Proxy Arp box and it was only picking up a few packets here and there (even though there was a lot of stuff trying to get through). So, at this point I'm really stuck. I should also mention that I don't have enough hardware to setup a test network first, so every time I try to "test" a change I've made I have to put this machine onto the live network (essentially screwing up all traffic in and out of the company... not a good thing since we provide hosting services for clients). I'd appreciate any commentary anyone may have on this issue. I'm also completely open to different approaches if this one has some obvious flaws. I'm just trying to avoid IP masquarading since that's what I have now and it's causing a lot of DNS headaches (maybe I should just fix the dns problems instead...). thanks, -mark -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 22:27:39 2004 From: amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org (Alex Maynard) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 17:27:39 -0500 Subject: problems printing pdf In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hello All, I'm afraid this may be an embarrassingly basic question, but I'm having trouble printing pdf files from a new printer and am not sure what I'm doing wrong. The printer is a HP Laserjet 1300 which is listed http://www.linuxprinting.org as needing a postscript driver. Using Redhat's printer configuration I deleted the old printer, and added this one as /dev/lp0 with a postscript printer. The lpr command now works okay for text and postscript files, but does not seem to work for pdf files (it prints garbage). Did I do something wrong or am I missing something obvious? Alex ------------ Alex Maynard Assistant Professor Department of Economics University of Toronto 150 St. George St., N304 Toronto ON M5S 3G7 Canada e-mail: amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org tel: (416) 978-4358 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jingsu-26n5VD7DAF2Tm46uYYfjYg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 22:26:02 2004 From: jingsu-26n5VD7DAF2Tm46uYYfjYg at public.gmane.org (Jing Su) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 17:26:02 -0500 Subject: problems printing pdf In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Maybe your setup isn't filtering the PDF into PS first... What are you using to view the PDF? Try pdf2ps [myfile.pdf] [myfile.ps] and then print the converted PS file. On Fri, 6 Feb 2004, Alex Maynard wrote: > Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 17:27:39 -0500 > From: Alex Maynard > Reply-To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: [TLUG]: problems printing pdf > > > Hello All, > > I'm afraid this may be an embarrassingly basic question, but I'm having > trouble printing pdf files from a new printer and am not sure what I'm > doing wrong. > > The printer is a HP Laserjet 1300 which is listed > http://www.linuxprinting.org as needing a postscript driver. > Using Redhat's printer configuration I deleted the old printer, and added > this one as /dev/lp0 with a postscript printer. The lpr command now works > okay for text and postscript files, but does not seem to work for pdf > files (it prints garbage). Did I do something wrong or am I missing > something obvious? > > Alex > > > > > > ------------ > Alex Maynard > Assistant Professor > Department of Economics > University of Toronto > 150 St. George St., N304 > Toronto ON M5S 3G7 > Canada > e-mail: amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org > tel: (416) 978-4358 > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lists-tZhE6lH4Esk+k03BA+Hq9g at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 22:33:25 2004 From: lists-tZhE6lH4Esk+k03BA+Hq9g at public.gmane.org (Oliver Meyn) Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 17:33:25 -0500 Subject: transparent firewall (proxy arp?) In-Reply-To: <1076103130.13401.91.camel-U7+7E62mzGnZuBtHeHyC2A@public.gmane.org> References: <1076103130.13401.91.camel@chaos.verus.ca> Message-ID: <1076106805.20130.3.camel@theconstruct.mineallmeyn.net> Hi Mark, On Fri, 2004-02-06 at 16:32, Mark Wadden wrote: > I had no idea where to start so I originally looked into some Linux > bridging docs. Then I came across this Proxy Arp how-to, which > essentially describes my exact scenario > (http://www.sjdjweis.com/linux/proxyarp/). As promising as this article > sounds, I couldn't get it to work. > I think I understand what you're trying to do, and I'm doing it using the proxy arping abilities of shorewall (shoreline firewall). > I set up a RedHat 9 box as per the instructions in the how-to. But when > I hooked everything up (and rebooted the router and switch to clear out > any arp tables) it wouldn't route any packets through. From the Proxy > Arp machine I could ping both sides (router and DMZ) but I couldn't get > anything to go THROUGH the machine. At one point I was able to ping > from the DMZ side to the router, but nothing else was going through. > Another strange thing is that I tried a tcpdump on the Proxy Arp box and > it was only picking up a few packets here and there (even though there > was a lot of stuff trying to get through). > The big issue most people have when setting this up (according to the shorewall list archive) is arp caching upstream of you screwing things up. It doesn't sound like that's your problem, but it might be. > So, at this point I'm really stuck. I should also mention that I don't > have enough hardware to setup a test network first, so every time I try > to "test" a change I've made I have to put this machine onto the live > network (essentially screwing up all traffic in and out of the > company... not a good thing since we provide hosting services for > clients). > You _really_ want a test setup because no way is this going to work "just like that". Two machines and a spare ip should do it... Cheers, Oliver -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jason-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 22:25:49 2004 From: jason-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/ at public.gmane.org (Jason Shein) Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 17:25:49 -0500 Subject: transparent firewall (proxy arp?) In-Reply-To: <1076103130.13401.91.camel-U7+7E62mzGnZuBtHeHyC2A@public.gmane.org> References: <1076103130.13401.91.camel@chaos.verus.ca> Message-ID: <4024146D.8060700@pcsecurityonline.com> http://www.ipcop.org works like a charm. Mark Wadden wrote: > Greetings all, > > I'm hoping someone can help me with a networking issue. > > I'm trying to set up what I would call a "transparent firewall". > Basically, I want to stick a machine running iptables between my > ISP-supplied router and the switch, without having it masquarade the IPs > of the machines it's protecting. > > I had no idea where to start so I originally looked into some Linux > bridging docs. Then I came across this Proxy Arp how-to, which > essentially describes my exact scenario > (http://www.sjdjweis.com/linux/proxyarp/). As promising as this article > sounds, I couldn't get it to work. > > I set up a RedHat 9 box as per the instructions in the how-to. But when > I hooked everything up (and rebooted the router and switch to clear out > any arp tables) it wouldn't route any packets through. From the Proxy > Arp machine I could ping both sides (router and DMZ) but I couldn't get > anything to go THROUGH the machine. At one point I was able to ping > from the DMZ side to the router, but nothing else was going through. > Another strange thing is that I tried a tcpdump on the Proxy Arp box and > it was only picking up a few packets here and there (even though there > was a lot of stuff trying to get through). > > So, at this point I'm really stuck. I should also mention that I don't > have enough hardware to setup a test network first, so every time I try > to "test" a change I've made I have to put this machine onto the live > network (essentially screwing up all traffic in and out of the > company... not a good thing since we provide hosting services for > clients). > > I'd appreciate any commentary anyone may have on this issue. I'm also > completely open to different approaches if this one has some obvious > flaws. I'm just trying to avoid IP masquarading since that's what I > have now and it's causing a lot of DNS headaches (maybe I should just > fix the dns problems instead...). > > > thanks, > > > -mark > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- " Eventually people tire of repairing broken Windows, And decide to replace them with something stronger" (o_ //\ Linux - The Choice Of A GNU Generation V_/_ Jason Shein Linux Registered User #281100 jason-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/@public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mark-/2gyfjYZF1k at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 22:47:55 2004 From: mark-/2gyfjYZF1k at public.gmane.org (Mark Wadden) Date: 06 Feb 2004 17:47:55 -0500 Subject: transparent firewall (proxy arp?) In-Reply-To: <1076106805.20130.3.camel-0lXLkTl3c71ptQ/RaucIWavRY+knis1x5NbjCUgZEJk@public.gmane.org> References: <1076103130.13401.91.camel@chaos.verus.ca> <1076106805.20130.3.camel@theconstruct.mineallmeyn.net> Message-ID: <1076107675.15813.14.camel@chaos.verus.ca> Thanks to everyone who responded! It turns out I'm just a tool. :) Proxy Arp works just fine, provided that: 1) You make sure you have a default route configured. D'oh. 2) Even though I wasn't using any iptables rules yet, the default policy on the FORWARD chain was set to 'DROP'. 'Tis all good now. Thanks again! -mark -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 23:00:19 2004 From: amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org (Alex Maynard) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 18:00:19 -0500 Subject: problems printing pdf In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks very much. Turning it into ps as you suggested seems to work. I tried printing the pdf files directly using the lpr command from the command line and also using xpdf and ghostscript. If I typed lpr file.pdf is it supposed to do something like pdf2ps file.pdf lpr file.pdf Alex On Fri, 6 Feb 2004, Jing Su wrote: > Maybe your setup isn't filtering the PDF into PS first... > What are you using to view the PDF? > > Try pdf2ps [myfile.pdf] [myfile.ps] > > and then print the converted PS file. > > > On Fri, 6 Feb 2004, Alex Maynard wrote: > > > Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 17:27:39 -0500 > > From: Alex Maynard > > Reply-To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > > Subject: [TLUG]: problems printing pdf > > > > > > Hello All, > > > > I'm afraid this may be an embarrassingly basic question, but I'm having > > trouble printing pdf files from a new printer and am not sure what I'm > > doing wrong. > > > > The printer is a HP Laserjet 1300 which is listed > > http://www.linuxprinting.org as needing a postscript driver. > > Using Redhat's printer configuration I deleted the old printer, and added > > this one as /dev/lp0 with a postscript printer. The lpr command now works > > okay for text and postscript files, but does not seem to work for pdf > > files (it prints garbage). Did I do something wrong or am I missing > > something obvious? > > > > Alex > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------ > > Alex Maynard > > Assistant Professor > > Department of Economics > > University of Toronto > > 150 St. George St., N304 > > Toronto ON M5S 3G7 > > Canada > > e-mail: amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org > > tel: (416) 978-4358 > > > > > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > ------------ Alex Maynard Assistant Professor Department of Economics University of Toronto 150 St. George St., N304 Toronto ON M5S 3G7 Canada e-mail: amaynard-vQ8rsROW2HJSpjfjxSPG1fd9D2ou9A/h at public.gmane.org tel: (416) 978-4358 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 7 00:30:45 2004 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 19:30:45 -0500 Subject: Anything besides RealPlayer that plays Real ? In-Reply-To: <20040205142833.GA1950-nbgvvMGgeqgU0MpeLeotoQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040205030941.GC9071@m450> <20040205134811.GA1656@my.wing.nut> <20040205142155.GA1942@my.wing.nut> <20040205142833.GA1950@my.wing.nut> Message-ID: <20040207003045.GB10208@m450> On Thu, Feb 05, 2004 at 09:28:33AM -0500, Gregory D Hough wrote > Please excuse my ignorance in this regard, but what exactly does > RealPlayer do that it could be classified as "SpyWare"? And is this > something found in more recent versions of RealPlayer for Linux? At least some Windows versions were known to call home a lot. > The reason I ask is because I never installed any new releases of > RealPlayer for Linux. I use an rpm from an old boxed set of RH7.0 and > then perform post-install repairs to mailcap etc. The fact that one needs to do that makes me distrust Real in general. -- Walter Dnes Email users are divided into two classes; 1) Those who have effective spam-blocking 2) Those who wish they did -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From grant.cullen-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 7 00:59:50 2004 From: grant.cullen-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Grant Cullen) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 19:59:50 -0500 Subject: bash character substitution? Need help In-Reply-To: <4023E5E9.7000701-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <4023E5E9.7000701@alteeve.com> Message-ID: I should have added more comments. The ${X:1:17} is a sub-string 1 is the offset and 17 the length The ${#X} gives the number of characters in variable X. Do a man bash and search for OFFSET. There are other variable manipulators described in that area. Happy scripting. Grant -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org]On Behalf Of Madison Kelly Sent: Friday, February 06, 2004 14:07 To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: bash character substitution? Need help Hi Grant, and thank you for replying. May I ask another question? How does this part work? MAC=${X,1,17} [ ${#X} -gt 18 ] && { I hope it isn't an overly junior question but it looks quite different from the code I have been building on. Thanks again!! Madison Grant Cullen wrote: > Madison, the following will give the basic parsing. > > Good luck > > #!/bin/bash > X='00:11:22:33:44:55>21,53,80-85' > MAC=${X,1,17} > [ ${#X} -gt 18 ] && > { > # we have ports - length greater than 18 > IFS=',' > for PORT in ${x:18} > do > echo "iptable entry with port " $PORT > done > } || > { > # no ports > echo "iptable entry without ports" > } > > Grant Cullen > JADALL Consulting Ltd. > grant.cullen-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org > 416-706-4447 > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org]On Behalf Of Madison > Kelly > Sent: Friday, February 06, 2004 12:40 > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: [TLUG]: bash character substitution? Need help > > > Hi all, > > I am working on an iptables bash script but am handicapped by not > being a programmer (or, just barely being one). Anyway, I've been able > to figure out how to take a string and read out variables based on a > character to split on but now what I need it to read a value into the > same variable over and over again based on the split. Here is my > specific issue: > > I have the variable: > > # Enter as (MAC address)>Port(-range),Port(-range),..,Port(-range) > TRUSTED_IB_TCP=00:11:22:33:44:55>21,53,80-85 > > Now I want to check and see if ports are defined. If not, allow all > ports from the given MAC address. If so, read out the ports one after > another in a 'for/while' style loop splitting on the ','. Then inside > each of those, split on '-' and check to see if there is a value after > the '-'. > > The problem is, I know how to split on the ',' (IFS=',' ...) but this > doesn't seem like it is going to help me because I want to run a > 'for/while' loop for each value, not assign new variables based on the > split (like I have done so far). Is there some way to substitute the ',' > with ' ' and then do a 'for/while' loop? > > I am Googling now but I am having trouble finding the answer. I am > hoping someone here might be able to point me in the right direction. > Thanks! > > Madison > > PS - If it will help, I'll post what I have of the relevant parts of the > script. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From grant.cullen-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 7 01:01:00 2004 From: grant.cullen-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Grant Cullen) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 20:01:00 -0500 Subject: bash character substitution? Need help In-Reply-To: <4023E7A7.8040709-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <4023E7A7.8040709@alteeve.com> Message-ID: My fault bad typing, should be ${X:1:17} Grant -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org]On Behalf Of Madison Kelly Sent: Friday, February 06, 2004 14:15 To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: bash character substitution? Need help Quick note, I tried running the script (to see if I could decypher it) and I got this; ./test-parse: line 3: ${X,1,17}: bad substitution Madison Grant Cullen wrote: > Madison, the following will give the basic parsing. > > Good luck > > #!/bin/bash > X='00:11:22:33:44:55>21,53,80-85' > MAC=${X,1,17} > [ ${#X} -gt 18 ] && > { > # we have ports - length greater than 18 > IFS=',' > for PORT in ${x:18} > do > echo "iptable entry with port " $PORT > done > } || > { > # no ports > echo "iptable entry without ports" > } > > Grant Cullen > JADALL Consulting Ltd. > grant.cullen-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org > 416-706-4447 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 7 04:44:55 2004 From: srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org (SRB) Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 20:44:55 -0800 Subject: New user and questions Message-ID: <40246D47.6090603@softhome.net> Hi, I'm new to this group (and Linux). I'd like to know if there's anywhere to get training on Linux around T.O. Not exactly beginner stuff, but intermediate knowledge. Although being new to Linux, I have experience with M$ windows and Mac OS. Unfortunately no experience with any UNIX-related OSes. I've got a few books and a few different distributions, so every spare moment I have, I am diving in. Hopefully I won't be asking too many stupid questions here! I'm impressed by the elegant and structured format of Linux so far, as well as the Open Source development philosophy. Would a person in my position find it useful to attend any TLUG meetings? Or is it advisable to educate myself a bit more first? Thanks a bunch for any pointers in the right direction. -Steve. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cael-JTkAzvGkdyMrpQx6IzTi3laTQe2KTcn/ at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 7 02:11:14 2004 From: cael-JTkAzvGkdyMrpQx6IzTi3laTQe2KTcn/ at public.gmane.org (Jeremy Wakeman) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 21:11:14 -0500 Subject: New user and questions In-Reply-To: <40246D47.6090603-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ@public.gmane.org> References: <40246D47.6090603@softhome.net> Message-ID: <20040207021114.GB1503@dmz> There are many different schools around TO that offer linux training. I am currently taking a few courses through Centennial College (fees are ~$240 per course). I have found the courses a bit slow moving, but I used linux on several different systems for several years before starting the courses. As far as meetings goes, I think any opportunity to discuss linux related topics will teach you something, even if most stuff is over your head. :) -Jeremy -- Jeremy John Wakeman cael-JTkAzvGkdyMrpQx6IzTi3laTQe2KTcn/@public.gmane.org www.polarhome.com/~cael linux registered user #125171 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 7 05:52:42 2004 From: srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org (SRB) Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 21:52:42 -0800 Subject: Linux ISP w/USR 56K modem? Message-ID: <40247D2A.2050603@softhome.net> Hi, Currently I'm using 3web as my dial-up ISP. They use a Windows log-on, but I want to be able to access the internet from Linux. Does anyone know of any ISPs that offer Linux connectivity (preferably dial-up)? This is currently my most important hurtle for full Linux migration from windows... :-\ PS... my modem is a USRobotics "56K Faxmodem PCI for Windows" model 5699B. Are there any issues (ie. driver) getting this to work properly in any Linux distros? ...hopefully not... :~o Thanks for any advice! -Steve. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 7 05:26:11 2004 From: blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Byron Sonne) Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2004 00:26:11 -0500 Subject: New user and questions In-Reply-To: <40246D47.6090603-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ@public.gmane.org> References: <40246D47.6090603@softhome.net> Message-ID: <402476F3.5070907@rogers.com> > Although being new to Linux, I have experience with M$ windows and Mac > OS. Unfortunately no experience with any UNIX-related OSes. If you've been exposed to NT or 2000, more specifically as a server, you'll find some of the concepts, if not alot, translate fairly well at a high level. Things called 'services' in NT can be considered 'daemons' in unix, the separate drive letters presented in windows are akin to 'mount points' in unix, that kind of thing. Within reason, of course. Mailing lists such as this are definitely one of your best resources, and google is (usually) always your friend. There is alot of good documentation out there, some of it obsolete, but a large amount of it quite good and geared for people starting out. Trust me, we want people to switch! Muahahaha... When I started out, I found http://www.linux.org/ quite handy too. If you're serious about being an admin/'power user' there is *no* avoiding the command line interface, or the 'shell' as it is often referred to. Also, generally speaking, most programs have their own config files, and the OS has a bunch of them for itself too. You can tweak these by hand, but most distros can manage them all for you, and are usually set to do that by default. Some good articles here well worth reading: http://polylithic.net/cli/articles.html May I ask if you've considered any particular linux distribution yet? If you haven't, hold off for a while until you can get the opinions of more list members (I'll vouch for SuSE http://www.suse.com). Linux is just a kernel, but what you dress it up with can profoundly affect your personal experience. What configuration 'wizards', what desktop environment, software management, etc, can vary fairly widely between distributions. Most of all, use what feels best to you... or rather, make it feel the way you want. You can always roll your own! Invest the time, it can be a very rewarding experience :) Regards, Byron -- For Good, return Good. For Evil, return Justice. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 7 06:35:44 2004 From: blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Byron Sonne) Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2004 01:35:44 -0500 Subject: Linux ISP w/USR 56K modem? In-Reply-To: <40247D2A.2050603-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ@public.gmane.org> References: <40247D2A.2050603@softhome.net> Message-ID: <40248740.50208@rogers.com> > Currently I'm using 3web as my dial-up ISP. They use a Windows log-on, > but I want to be able to access the internet from Linux. Does anyone > know of any ISPs that offer Linux connectivity (preferably dial-up)? What you need to do is to find out what protocol is used for establishing the connection. I'm guessing it's PPP of some kind, need more details... i.e. describe your logon process and what kind of things it asks you for, tell us about the windows client, what kind of options does it provide, etc. Shouldn't be too big a deal. > PS... my modem is a USRobotics "56K Faxmodem PCI for Windows" model > 5699B. Are there any issues (ie. driver) getting this to work properly > in any Linux distros? ...hopefully not... :~o Doesn't look promising... http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/archive/18/2003/07/4/75498 Thing looks to be a 'winmodem' which requires the OS to do alot of the work so it's very windows specific. However, progress has been made in linux supporting these devices: http://www.linmodems.org/ , http://start.at/modem ... but upon checking, it looks like you're S.O.L. on this one. Chances are someone on the list will have a spare/unused modem that will work for you, and probably for free or at a very reasonable price. Regards, Byron -- For Good, return Good. For Evil, return Justice. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 7 06:55:55 2004 From: tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Tim Writer) Date: 07 Feb 2004 01:55:55 -0500 Subject: smtp advice needed In-Reply-To: <1076087219.3939.9.camel-248nrIFxrsEvhQDQrEiaqAi/Dn5oqdb4930Pai70D+E@public.gmane.org> References: <1076025744.4022d990766df@mymail.yorku.ca> <1076031764.4022f1147c5bd@mymail.yorku.ca> <1076087219.3939.9.camel@groundstate.chem.yorku.ca> Message-ID: Austin writes: > On Fri, 2004-02-06 at 11:56, Tim Writer wrote: > > What do you mean by that? You have dialup/DSL service provided by your > > school? By ISP, I mean the provider of your networking service, not your > > e-mail or web provider. Your school could be your e-mail provider while you > > have another ISP (Bell Sympatico, Rogers, etc.) providing the networking > > service. > > No, the school is my ISP. I'm on their lan. (10 Mb/s is NICE) > > > If your school really is your ISP, that's a configuration error on their end. > > They should allow you to realy through them (and should also provide reversed > > DNS service). > > Yeah, but I'm afraid to ask them... we're not supposed to use routers, > only hubs (stupid rules), but I need the router to get other ethernet > devices working (non-computers). It's because they want to know the MAC > of every machine on their network, so they say no routers, which is > stupid, cause you can easily spoof any MAC you want, if you have reason > to. > > > I doubt it. Your router will be doing NAT so that outbound packets passing > > through your router will be translated to appear to come from 199.212.73.21. > > They don't know you're 192.168.0.100 and don't care. This is a fairly > > standard setup. > > Gotcha. But that makes the problem even weirder, because it DOES work > without going through the router. How is the IP of your router assigned? If it's via DHCP, it may be that they're assinging a different address (from your previous setup) and that address is not allowed to relay. Can you change the MAC address of your router match your old one? If so, that might help. -- tim writer starnix inc. 905.771.0017 ext. 225 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 6 23:40:31 2004 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter L. Peres) Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 01:40:31 +0200 (IST) Subject: smtp advice needed In-Reply-To: <1076025744.4022d990766df-L/ZuoSt+y0q45YHtStHL6Q@public.gmane.org> References: <1076025744.4022d990766df@mymail.yorku.ca> Message-ID: > hostname (ususally: localhost) so that doesn't work either. How the hell do > people send email from behind a router? By using the MTA of whoever operates the link that connects the router to the network. i.e. your ISP. Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From adam-+Gnyv3l5ckaNFgfkp0FINA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 7 12:24:25 2004 From: adam-+Gnyv3l5ckaNFgfkp0FINA at public.gmane.org (Adam Tworkowski) Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 07:24:25 -0500 Subject: New user and questions In-Reply-To: <40246D47.6090603-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ@public.gmane.org> References: <40246D47.6090603@softhome.net> Message-ID: <200402070724.25864.adam@tworkowski.com> I'm not sure how much time you want to dedicate towards Linux training but Seneca College has a good, very intensive Post-Diploma program aimed at systems administrators. I'm not sure sure if you can take individual courses. http://cs.senecac.on.ca/curriculum/isa/pages/general.html -Adam -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From scotta-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 7 12:57:35 2004 From: scotta-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Scott Allen) Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 07:57:35 -0500 Subject: bash character substitution? Need help In-Reply-To: <4023D178.2010206-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org>; from linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org on Fri, Feb 06, 2004 at 12:40:08 -0500 References: <4023D178.2010206@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <20040207125735.GA1959@localhost> On Fri Feb 06,2004 12:40:08 PM Madison Kelly wrote: > I am working on an iptables bash script but am handicapped by not > being a programmer (or, just barely being one). [...] Just for reference or examples, you may wish to take a look at FireHOL, which is a bash script for generating iptables firewalls. http://firehol.sourceforge.net/ -- ** Scott Allen scotta-cpI+UMyWUv9BDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org ** ** Toronto, Ontario, Canada ** -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 7 18:27:21 2004 From: srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org (SRB) Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2004 10:27:21 -0800 Subject: New user and questions In-Reply-To: <402476F3.5070907-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <40246D47.6090603@softhome.net> <402476F3.5070907@rogers.com> Message-ID: <40252E09.4050908@softhome.net> Byron Sonne wrote: >> Although being new to Linux, I have experience with M$ windows and >> Mac OS. Unfortunately no experience with any UNIX-related OSes. > > > If you've been exposed to NT or 2000, more specifically as a server, > you'll find some of the concepts, if not alot, translate fairly well > at a high level. Things called 'services' in NT can be considered > 'daemons' in unix, the separate drive letters presented in windows are > akin to 'mount points' in unix, that kind of thing. Within reason, of > course. Yes I have been using NT exclusively in my work environment for the past decade I think! I've done some Server Admin (though nothing too extreme) as well as some Oracle admin (mainly just a tiny bit of SQL). I've installed/configured/troubleshot (is that a real word? :-) ) NT on many different platforms (desktop/laptop). I use 2000 at home currently. Someone gave me the advice when moving from windows to Linux "to forget all you know", although I understand that the underlying principles are the same for every OS... just the road you take to get there can be very different. > Mailing lists such as this are definitely one of your best resources, > and google is (usually) always your friend. There is alot of good > documentation out there, some of it obsolete, but a large amount of it > quite good and geared for people starting out. Trust me, we want > people to switch! Muahahaha... When I started out, I found > http://www.linux.org/ quite handy too. > > If you're serious about being an admin/'power user' there is *no* > avoiding the command line interface, or the 'shell' as it is often > referred to. Also, generally speaking, most programs have their own > config files, and the OS has a bunch of them for itself too. You can > tweak these by hand, but most distros can manage them all for you, and > are usually set to do that by default. Some good articles here well > worth reading: http://polylithic.net/cli/articles.html Luckily my experience does go back to DOS days. I got serious into computers in 1991... DOS with windows 3.1 on top. I always feel more in control when using a CLI/shell. > May I ask if you've considered any particular linux distribution yet? > > If you haven't, hold off for a while until you can get the opinions of > more list members (I'll vouch for SuSE http://www.suse.com). Linux is > just a kernel, but what you dress it up with can profoundly affect > your personal experience. What configuration 'wizards', what desktop > environment, software management, etc, can vary fairly widely between > distributions. Most of all, use what feels best to you... or rather, > make it feel the way you want. You can always roll your own! Currently, due to my dial-up connection I have installed Red Hat 9 that came with "Red Hat Linux 9 for Dummies" book. The reason I bought it is from my previous experience with "Mac OS 8.5 for Dummies" book which I really liked. I've also downloaded the small Live CD distro Morphix (http://morphix.sourceforge.net/). I believe strongly in the Open Source model and want to select and use non-commercial distros exclusively (even though I indirectly paid for Red Hat with the book LOL). I don't mind getting my hands dirty and in fact I prefer to be able to customize as much as possible. I also have O'Reilly's "Linux in a Nutshell" which I like because it lists a whole bunch of commands. :-> > Invest the time, it can be a very rewarding experience :) > > Regards, > Byron I do intend to invest a lot of time. From my experiences in the past I have always enjoyed learning more to achieve more. Thanks for your detailed response. -Steve. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 7 16:36:30 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2004 11:36:30 -0500 Subject: New user and questions In-Reply-To: <40252E09.4050908-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ@public.gmane.org> References: <40246D47.6090603@softhome.net> <402476F3.5070907@rogers.com> <40252E09.4050908@softhome.net> Message-ID: <4025140E.20608@alteeve.com> Hi Steve! I was exactly in your shoes two years ago. I had dabled in Linux, and with the help of a friend I had my web server running Linux, but that was about it. I had threatened to switch a few times and even setup dual-boot on my home machine several times. In the end though, dual-booting, having other test machines and so forth wasn't enough. It was just too easy to come home, feel times and un-motivated to learn, and would simply boot win2k. Finally, about two years ago, MS came out with their "All your installs are belong to us" trojan EULA and that was that. I ditched MS on all of my home machines and ran strictly Linux (RH 7.3 in the day, now Fedora Core 1). If I may, I'll address some of your comments... SRB wrote: > Yes I have been using NT exclusively in my work environment for the past > decade I think! I've done some Server Admin (though nothing too extreme) > as well as some Oracle admin (mainly just a tiny bit of SQL). I've > installed/configured/troubleshot (is that a real word? :-) ) NT on many > different platforms (desktop/laptop). I use 2000 at home currently. > Someone gave me the advice when moving from windows to Linux "to forget > all you know", although I understand that the underlying principles are > the same for every OS... just the road you take to get there can be very > different. The underlying principles from a level of how this service or that service works is similar but implementation is rather different. First off, Linux as an OS and as a collection of apps is very modular. For example, have you ever installed AD on Win2k server? Witness the foolish level of "you need this before you can install that"-ness? Ie: needing to have DHCP and DNS up and running before you can even think about the AD tree :). In Linux some programs may well need other programs but they aren't tied together. The most you will find is that during install some RPMs (or whatever your package manager of choice is) requires previously installed RPMs. Also, when installing from source (tarballs; .tar.gz) you may find that some libraries or such are missing. In the end though, everything is FAR more independant. There is no central registry. With -very- few exceptions a programs configuration is in one place, a single raw text config file. Any GUI tools you find will likely be simple front ends that write the text file for you based on what you enter. Also, there is very little chance that one setting here will affect a program way over there (as is the case often with MMC). Again, with a programs configuration being in a single text file, that is all you need to look at to troubleshoot a program. As the other person said, using Linux at any level really does require use of the shell. Though on the surface it looks like DOS, it is anything but. Now, when I occasionally have to work on a MS machine I usually hit the 'cmd' line and it is simple so unbelievably unsophisticated that it is madening. Realising the power of the shell (in my case, and yours if you use RH, the Bash shell) was probably the single biggest selling feature of Linux. > Luckily my experience does go back to DOS days. I got serious into > computers in 1991... DOS with windows 3.1 on top. I always feel more in > control when using a CLI/shell. As I mentioned, the Linux shell(s) are vastly different than DOS/WinCLI as to be laughable however, what you know from DOS -will- be completely useful. You are far better off than a user who has not see a DOS shell! A few key notes though, some of which you may already have discovered... For info on any command, simply type 'man ' or 'info '. 'dir' is 'ls' in Linux, personally I used 'ls -lah' for detailed view. 'copy' is 'cp' 'move' is 'mv' 'cd..' doesn't work, you must always leave a space 'cp ..', otherwise it is the same 'edit' is (so many!). Personally, I used 'pico' in earlier RH distro (part of the 'pine' package) which is now 'nano' in Fedora Core 1 (they are identical, though). On Emacs and Vi; people will fight over which editor to use until the cows come home. I like 'pico/nano' because it is simple to use and straight forward. 'type ' is 'cat ' from shell, type 'top' to get an equiv. to the task manager from shell, type 'ps (I use the switches -ax)' to get a list of running processes. To kill one, type 'kill ' (PID = process ID, the number to the left of the process name). If the process won't die, send 'kill -9 '. That always kills a process but not nicely. Perhaps my single favorite feature of the shell, the key!!! If you start to type a directory name, command or file name and then press , it will fill in the rest of the name so long as you have typed enough in to be unique. Even if you have a few options though, it will fill in as much of the given name as the two or more options are similar and then beep. Press a second time and it will list your remaining options. type a character or two to make the name mroe unique and press again to either finish off the name or progress until you have a diverging option. It may not be clear to explain but you will see what I mean in a hurry! Now, whenever I go back to a MS CLI I am contantly hitting only to advance the prompt five characters (and cuss under my breath :) ). > Currently, due to my dial-up connection I have installed Red Hat 9 that > came with "Red Hat Linux 9 for Dummies" book. The reason I bought it is > from my previous experience with "Mac OS 8.5 for Dummies" book which I > really liked. I've also downloaded the small Live CD distro Morphix > (http://morphix.sourceforge.net/). I believe strongly in the Open Source > model and want to select and use non-commercial distros exclusively > (even though I indirectly paid for Red Hat with the book LOL). I don't > mind getting my hands dirty and in fact I prefer to be able to customize > as much as possible. > > I also have O'Reilly's "Linux in a Nutshell" which I like because it > lists a whole bunch of commands. :-> Redhat is a great place to start. I found it a nice balance between ease of use and easy exposure to the guts underneath. Others here -DO- have their own opinions on their distro of choice, so be careful when asking opinions of distros!! Personally now, I run Fedora Core 1 which is a community project extension of Redhat 9, run by Redhat. If you need/want a copy and can get downtown, I would be happy to burn you a copy if you can pick it up near Adelaid and Yonge (1blk N or King). >> Invest the time, it can be a very rewarding experience :) >> >> Regards, >> Byron > > > I do intend to invest a lot of time. From my experiences in the past I > have always enjoyed learning more to achieve more. > > Thanks for your detailed response. > > -Steve. After two years, I would, with absolute honesty, leave computers before going back to MS. Obviously then, I felt getting through the learning curve was worth it! Again, the trick is to -only- run Linux at home for a while. If you have MS there, you will often just boot it and use it out of familiarity. Then, once all your files and setting are up then you won't boot Linux because, well, you can't really work on it because your files and setting (bookmarks, e-mail) aren't there. Conversly, if you only have Linux then when you run into something you don't know, you will always find it faster/easier to learn whatever you need to in order to move on than it would be to re-install MS. The net effect then is that you start learning the details of Linux daily and then one day, like I did, I suddenly realised that I was more comfortable (and -much- happier) in Linux than in MS. Anywho, the $0.02 from a Linux convert and devotee! ;) Madison -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 7 23:57:53 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 18:57:53 -0500 Subject: Slackware-current In-Reply-To: <200402061530.29559.fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <200402060547.51732.skuznets@blueprint.org> <200402061530.29559.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: <20040207235753.GM732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Feb 06, 2004 at 03:30:29PM -0500, Fraser Campbell wrote: > I like it a lot and the claimed speed improvements seem to be real. Startup > times for me (first login) have gone from 22 seconds to 15 seconds. On > subsequent logins the difference is quite small but it's marginally faster > (roughly 5 seconds instead of 6). kmail is also significantly faster, my > maildir contains over 165,000 messages, kmail was becoming quite slow now > it's very fast even on the largest mailboxes (except first time, it must be > doing some caching). This is comparing kde 3.1.5 and 3.2.0. Sounds impresive. > OTOH, I've found a number of sites in the last few days that make konqueror > crash, that was extremely rare on the konqueror from 3.1.5. Well to me that is normal for a kde x.x.0 release. > For Debian stable users add the following to /etc/apt/sources.list: > > deb http://download.kde.org/stable/3.1.4/Debian/ woody main Or replace 3.1.4 with 'latest' and never worry about it again. :) At least that's what I recall using in the past. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 8 03:36:43 2004 From: IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Ilya Palagin) Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2004 22:36:43 -0500 Subject: New user and questions In-Reply-To: <4025140E.20608-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <40246D47.6090603@softhome.net> <402476F3.5070907@rogers.com> <40252E09.4050908@softhome.net> <4025140E.20608@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <4025AECB.6000600@rogers.com> Madison Kelly wrote: ... > explain but you will see what I mean in a hurry! Now, whenever I go back > to a MS CLI I am contantly hitting only to advance the prompt five > characters (and cuss under my breath :) ). HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Command Processor Entry "CompletionChar", set to 0x9 And take Tab with you into M$ world! (well, it works for directory names only) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cinetron-uEvt2TsIf2EsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 8 05:06:41 2004 From: cinetron-uEvt2TsIf2EsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jim Ruxton) Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2004 00:06:41 -0500 Subject: PC slot stopped working?? Message-ID: <4025C3E1.2050509@passport.ca> Hi , My PC slot on my laptop appears to have stopped working suddenly. I'm wondering if it is a hardware or configuration problem. It has stopped working in Linux and windows which makes me think it's the hardware. :-( Is there any way to know for sure. Here is my /var/log/messages file with the section that appears when I insert a PC card (wireless modem) . Can anyone decipher this and tell me what may be going wrong. I always get the warnings ignoring port_type, channel and station_name. Any thoughts? It's tough being tethered after going wireless for a while. Thanks! Feb 6 20:33:23 localhost gconfd (root-1488): starting (version 1.0.4), pid 1488 user 'root' Feb 6 20:33:23 localhost gconfd (root-1488): Successfully registered `OAFIID:gconfd:19991118' Feb 6 20:34:56 localhost kernel: cs: socket d6d33800 timed out during reset. Try increasing setup_delay. Feb 6 20:35:29 localhost cardmgr[941]: exiting Feb 6 20:35:29 localhost kernel: unloading Kernel Card Services Feb 6 20:35:29 localhost kernel: Linux Kernel Card Services 3.1.22 Feb 6 20:35:29 localhost kernel: options: [pci] [cardbus] [pm] Feb 6 20:35:29 localhost kernel: PCI: Found IRQ 10 for device 02:04.0 Feb 6 20:35:29 localhost kernel: PCI: Sharing IRQ 10 with 00:1d.0 Feb 6 20:35:29 localhost kernel: PCI: Sharing IRQ 10 with 01:00.0 Feb 6 20:35:29 localhost kernel: PCI: Sharing IRQ 10 with 02:00.0 Feb 6 20:35:29 localhost kernel: PCI: Found IRQ 10 for device 02:04.1 Feb 6 20:35:29 localhost kernel: PCI: Sharing IRQ 10 with 00:1f.3 Feb 6 20:35:29 localhost kernel: PCI: Sharing IRQ 10 with 00:1f.5 Feb 6 20:35:29 localhost kernel: PCI: Sharing IRQ 10 with 00:1f.6 Feb 6 20:35:29 localhost kernel: PCI: Sharing IRQ 10 with 02:01.0 Feb 6 20:35:29 localhost kernel: Yenta IRQ list 08b8, PCI irq10 Feb 6 20:35:29 localhost kernel: Socket status: 30000084 Feb 6 20:35:29 localhost cardmgr[1621]: starting, version is 3.1.22 Feb 6 20:35:29 localhost cardmgr[1621]: config error, file './config.opts' line 8: no function bindings Feb 6 20:35:29 localhost cardmgr[1621]: watching 1 sockets Feb 6 20:35:29 localhost kernel: cs: IO port probe 0x0c00-0x0cff: clean. Feb 6 20:35:29 localhost kernel: cs: IO port probe 0x0100-0x04ff: excluding 0x4d0-0x4d7 Feb 6 20:35:29 localhost kernel: cs: IO port probe 0x0a00-0x0aff: clean. Feb 6 20:35:29 localhost kernel: Yenta IRQ list 08b8, PCI irq10 Feb 6 20:35:29 localhost kernel: Socket status: 30000084 Feb 6 20:38:23 localhost gconfd (root-1488): 1 items remain in the cache after cleaning already-synced items older than 300 seconds Feb 6 20:51:51 localhost kernel: spurious 8259A interrupt: IRQ7. Feb 6 20:51:59 localhost kernel: cs: socket d6d33800 timed out during reset. Try increasing setup_delay. Feb 6 20:54:10 localhost cardmgr[1621]: initializing socket 0 Feb 6 20:54:10 localhost cardmgr[1621]: socket 0: Lucent Technologies WaveLAN/IEEE Adapter Feb 6 20:54:10 localhost kernel: cs: memory probe 0xa0000000-0xa0ffffff: clean. Feb 6 20:54:10 localhost cardmgr[1621]: executing: 'modprobe orinoco_cs port_type=3 channel=1 station_name=MY_PC' Feb 6 20:54:10 localhost cardmgr[1621]: + Warning: ignoring port_type=3, no such parameter in this module Feb 6 20:54:10 localhost cardmgr[1621]: + Warning: ignoring channel=1, no such parameter in this module Feb 6 20:54:10 localhost cardmgr[1621]: + Warning: ignoring station_name=MY_PC, no such parameter in this module Feb 6 20:54:10 localhost cardmgr[1621]: + Module orinoco_cs loaded, with warnings Feb 6 20:54:10 localhost cardmgr[1621]: get dev info on socket 0 failed: No such device Feb 6 20:54:11 localhost cardmgr[1621]: shutting down socket 0 Feb 6 20:54:11 localhost cardmgr[1621]: executing: 'modprobe -r orinoco_cs' Feb 6 20:54:15 localhost kernel: cs: socket d6d33800 timed out during reset. Try increasing setup_delay. Feb 6 21:11:31 localhost kernel: cs: socket d6d33800 timed out during reset. Try increasing setup_delay. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 8 20:12:26 2004 From: srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org (SRB) Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2004 12:12:26 -0800 Subject: New user and questions In-Reply-To: <4025140E.20608-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <40246D47.6090603@softhome.net> <402476F3.5070907@rogers.com> <40252E09.4050908@softhome.net> <4025140E.20608@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <4026982A.2090700@softhome.net> Madison Kelly wrote: > Redhat is a great place to start. I found it a nice balance between > ease of use and easy exposure to the guts underneath. Others here -DO- > have their own opinions on their distro of choice, so be careful when > asking opinions of distros!! Personally now, I run Fedora Core 1 which > is a community project extension of Redhat 9, run by Redhat. If you > need/want a copy and can get downtown, I would be happy to burn you a > copy if you can pick it up near Adelaid and Yonge (1blk N or King). > > After two years, I would, with absolute honesty, leave computers > before going back to MS. Obviously then, I felt getting through the > learning curve was worth it! Again, the trick is to -only- run Linux > at home for a while. If you have MS there, you will often just boot it > and use it out of familiarity. Then, once all your files and setting > are up then you won't boot Linux because, well, you can't really work > on it because your files and setting (bookmarks, e-mail) aren't there. > Conversly, if you only have Linux then when you run into something you > don't know, you will always find it faster/easier to learn whatever > you need to in order to move on than it would be to re-install MS. The > net effect then is that you start learning the details of Linux daily > and then one day, like I did, I suddenly realised that I was more > comfortable (and -much- happier) in Linux than in MS. > > Anywho, the $0.02 from a Linux convert and devotee! ;) > > Madison Thank for you very much for the Fedora CD offer. I may take you up on that one day. I'm glad to hear someone else was in the same situation I'm currently in. It gives me hope! LOL. I completely DO want to dump M$ for Linux ASAP, but until I get an internet connection working in Linux, I'm stuck dual-booting to death! Thanks for all the shell command tips! I was aware of some of those but not all. I've started getting into O'Reilly's Linux in a Nutshell, so as soon as I can spend more time in the Linux OS, I can really begin to learn stuff. -Steve. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From robert-yzlPDbdf3LosA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 8 17:26:18 2004 From: robert-yzlPDbdf3LosA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Robert McDonald) Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2004 12:26:18 -0500 Subject: Speaking of Cities using linux References: <40246D47.6090603@softhome.net> <402476F3.5070907@rogers.com> <40252E09.4050908@softhome.net> <4025140E.20608@alteeve.com> <4026982A.2090700@softhome.net> Message-ID: <001d01c3ee68$adab4cc0$0b01a8c0@win98p4> http://www.westonfl.org/ I know its only a website but its running on redhat, using a combination of flash php and mysql.. LAMP- once people see the light it's hard to use anything else... ( as far as web servers anyways ) Robert M -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 8 17:55:32 2004 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2004 12:55:32 -0500 Subject: OT: DSL modems Message-ID: <200402081255.32700.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> Hi, I'm going to be helping a few family members with getting their DSL setup soon. Does anyone know of a good source for used DSL modems, preferably SpeedStream 5260 or 5360. I paid istop around $90 for mine but since I might be buying 3 of these I'd like to try and get a deal. Thanks -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From transoxania-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 8 18:49:28 2004 From: transoxania-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Transoxania) Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2004 13:49:28 -0500 Subject: OT: DSL modems In-Reply-To: <200402081255.32700.fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <200402081255.32700.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: <402684B8.103@sympatico.ca> Fraser Campbell wrote: > Hi, > > I'm going to be helping a few family members with getting their DSL setup > soon. Does anyone know of a good source for used DSL modems, preferably > SpeedStream 5260 or 5360. I paid istop around $90 for mine but since I might > be buying 3 of these I'd like to try and get a deal. > > Thanks Try tor.forsale.computers. They often sell SpeedStream modems on there. There is a 5360 just posted for $69. You could post a WTB offer and possibly get 3 from the same person at a good price. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 00:39:38 2004 From: davidjpatrick-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (David J Patrick) Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2004 19:39:38 -0500 Subject: PC slot stopped working?? In-Reply-To: <4025C3E1.2050509-uEvt2TsIf2EsA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <4025C3E1.2050509@passport.ca> Message-ID: <4026D6CA.8020208@sympatico.ca> Jim Ruxton wrote: > Hi , > > My PC slot on my laptop appears to have stopped working suddenly. I'm > wondering if it is a hardware or configuration problem. It has stopped > working in Linux and windows which makes me think it's the hardware. :-( Hi Jim ! Long time no see ! Yup, I'd say that if it no longer works in linux OR Windoze it's BROKEN. but that's just me. good luck, djp -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 02:17:58 2004 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2004 21:17:58 -0500 Subject: Is Windows a Virus? Message-ID: <019601c3eeb2$ef6ea0e0$4201a8c0@ym.phub.net.cable.rogers.com> Is Windows a Virus? No, Windows is not a virus. Here's what viruses do: * They replicate quickly - okay, Windows does that. * Viruses use up valuable system resources, slowing down the system as they do so - okay, Windows does that. * Viruses will, from time to time, trash your hard disk - okay, Windows does that too. * Viruses are usually carried, unknown to the user, along with valuable programs and systems. Sigh... Windows does that, too. * Viruses will occasionally make the user suspect their system is too slow (see 2) and the user will buy new hardware. Yup, that's with Windows, too. Until now it seems Windows is a virus but there are fundamental differences:Viruses are well supported by their authors, are running on most systems, their program code is fast, compact and efficient and they tend to become more sophisticated as they mature. So Windows is not a virus. It's a bug. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jason-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 01:59:52 2004 From: jason-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/ at public.gmane.org (Jason Shein) Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2004 20:59:52 -0500 Subject: SME Server 6.0 Message-ID: <4026E998.2020405@pcsecurityonline.com> Does anyone on this list have any experiences with SME server 6.0? Just looking for some general advice or experiences -- " Eventually people tire of repairing broken Windows, And decide to replace them with something stronger" (o_ //\ Linux - The Choice Of A GNU Generation V_/_ Jason Shein Linux Registered User #281100 jason-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/@public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 04:24:50 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2004 23:24:50 -0500 Subject: PC slot stopped working?? In-Reply-To: <4026D6CA.8020208-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <4025C3E1.2050509@passport.ca> <4026D6CA.8020208@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <40270B92.8010808@alteeve.com> Just to be sure, see if there is a way to reset your BIOS or if a BIOS update exists. Madison David J Patrick wrote: > Jim Ruxton wrote: > >> Hi , >> >> My PC slot on my laptop appears to have stopped working suddenly. I'm >> wondering if it is a hardware or configuration problem. It has stopped >> working in Linux and windows which makes me think it's the hardware. :-( > > > Hi Jim ! Long time no see ! > Yup, I'd say that if it no longer works in linux OR Windoze it's BROKEN. > but that's just me. > good luck, > djp -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 05:06:28 2004 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 00:06:28 -0500 Subject: Linux ISP w/USR 56K modem? In-Reply-To: <40247D2A.2050603-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ@public.gmane.org> References: <40247D2A.2050603@softhome.net> Message-ID: <20040209050628.GA12653@m450> On Fri, Feb 06, 2004 at 09:52:42PM -0800, SRB wrote > Currently I'm using 3web as my dial-up ISP. They use a Windows log-on, > but I want to be able to access the internet from Linux. Does anyone > know of any ISPs that offer Linux connectivity (preferably dial-up)? There's no unique "Linux connectivity" per se. If it can be done via a standard connection with the Windows dial-up wizard, it can be done in linux. (On the other hand, if they insist on using their Windows dialer, you're SOL) What will often happen is that an ISP will only have dialup instructions for Windows dialup on their website, and it's up to you to figure out how to do it in linux. Right now, I'm with 295.ca (guess how much they charge per month). It was only supposed to be my backup account. However, after buying my new place I found out that it's phone service is Futureway, and the ADSL situation is rather fuzzy. So I've been toughing it out on dialup whilst waiting for clarification. Back to the original question, 295.ca charges $2.95/month, plus there's a connect fee the first month. The connection instructions on their website only show how to connect under Windows, but I am living proof that it works under linux. I'm running Debian stable, using pon to connect and poff to disconnect. pppconfig configures things. > PS... my modem is a USRobotics "56K Faxmodem PCI for Windows" model *********** *********** Ouch! Forget it. You'll need a real external modem with RS-232 connection. Do *NOT* get a USB toy ! -- Walter Dnes Email users are divided into two classes; 1) Those who have effective spam-blocking 2) Those who wish they did -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 08:33:00 2004 From: srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org (SRB) Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 00:33:00 -0800 Subject: Linux ISP w/USR 56K modem? In-Reply-To: <20040209050628.GA12653-Mb8sf/rG248@public.gmane.org> References: <40247D2A.2050603@softhome.net> <20040209050628.GA12653@m450> Message-ID: <402745BC.2060404@softhome.net> Walter Dnes wrote: > Back to the original question, 295.ca charges $2.95/month, plus >there's a connect fee the first month. The connection instructions on >their website only show how to connect under Windows, but I am living >proof that it works under linux. I'm running Debian stable, using pon >to connect and poff to disconnect. pppconfig configures things. > That sounds like a great deal... As soon as I get a "real" modem that will work! :-) Thanks for the tip! -Steve. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 08:39:26 2004 From: srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org (SRB) Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 00:39:26 -0800 Subject: Anyone have a spare (no longer needed) 56k modem that will work in Linux Message-ID: <4027473E.2090000@softhome.net> Hi, I've decided to take Byron's advice and ask if there is anyone on the list that has a 56k modem they no longer need (that will work in Linux). I've got a winmodem (USR PCI faxmodem) that every site I've checked says will definitely not work in Linux (but I will trade it for one that does LOL). Please feel free to e-mail me privately off-list if you can help. Thanks for all the help so far from the members that have answered my questions! -Steve. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 13:32:47 2004 From: matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (G. Matthew Rice) Date: 09 Feb 2004 08:32:47 -0500 Subject: Is Windows a Virus? In-Reply-To: <019601c3eeb2$ef6ea0e0$4201a8c0-ki0Zr782rhv/m7utMz5sVUHTeQkJkYumVpNB7YpNyf8@public.gmane.org> References: <019601c3eeb2$ef6ea0e0$4201a8c0@ym.phub.net.cable.rogers.com> Message-ID: "Colin McGregor" writes: > So Windows is not a virus. > It's a bug. I thought that everyone agreed years ago that Windows is: A thirty-two bit extension and graphical shell to a sixteen-bit patch to an eight-bit operating system originally coded for a four-bit microprocessor which was written by a two-bit company that can't stand one bit of competition. -- Author Unknown [to me, at least] -- g. matthew rice starnix inc. phone: 905-771-0017 x242 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 16:33:41 2004 From: taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 09:33:41 -0700 Subject: Is Windows a Virus? In-Reply-To: References: <019601c3eeb2$ef6ea0e0$4201a8c0@ym.phub.net.cable.rogers.com> Message-ID: <20040209163341.GA44291@idiom.novusordo.net> On Mon, Feb 09, 2004 at 08:32:47AM -0500, G. Matthew Rice wrote: > I thought that everyone agreed years ago that Windows is: > > A thirty-two bit extension and graphical shell to a sixteen-bit patch > to an eight-bit operating system originally coded for a four-bit > microprocessor which was written by a two-bit company that can't > stand one bit of competition. Or, more succinctly: Windows is a 32 bit patch for a 16 bit shell for an 8 bit operating ... > -- Author Unknown [to me, at least] I don't know who said it either. :/ -- taa The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement. But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth. --Niels Bohr, physicist (1885-1962) /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr.mcgregor-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 16:39:25 2004 From: mr.mcgregor-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (John McGregor) Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 11:39:25 -0500 Subject: Mouse cursor size Message-ID: <4027B7BD.8040605@sympatico.ca> My mother (79 yr. old) got her first computer recently, on which I installed Mandrake 9.2 and selected KDE. She really likes it, however she sometimes has a problem seeing the mouse cursor even when the larger one supplied by KDE is selected. I searched through Google and there are some mentions of editing the .Xresources file, but on closer examination that doesn't seem to make a lot of sense. I also looked in /usr/share/applnk and while the mouse is referenced there are no configuration files that can be edited for effect. The KDE site wasn't a lot of help either. I'm hoping that there is someone on this list that has encountered this problem and can point me in the right direction. John -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jingsu-26n5VD7DAF2Tm46uYYfjYg at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 16:50:05 2004 From: jingsu-26n5VD7DAF2Tm46uYYfjYg at public.gmane.org (Jing Su) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 11:50:05 -0500 Subject: Mouse cursor size In-Reply-To: <4027B7BD.8040605-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <4027B7BD.8040605@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: Is it just trouble finding the cursor? or trying to see it in general? Gnome has a feature where pressing CTRL will draw an animation sequence around the cursor to help you find its location. If you're running with the NVIDIA drivers, you could try adding a drop-shadow around the cursor, to make it stand out from the rest of the screen's contents. I know that many people adept at computer UIs make fun of the cursor drop-shadow, but it does give a useful visual cue to some people (my parents, for example, love it). Alternatively, maybe some more colourful cursors? http://themes.freshmeat.net/projects/yellowdot/ On Mon, 9 Feb 2004, John McGregor wrote: > Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 11:39:25 -0500 > From: John McGregor > Reply-To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > To: tlug > Subject: [TLUG]: Mouse cursor size > > My mother (79 yr. old) got her first computer recently, on which I > installed Mandrake 9.2 and selected KDE. She really likes it, however > she sometimes has a problem seeing the mouse cursor even when the larger > one supplied by KDE is selected. I searched through Google and there are > some mentions of editing the .Xresources file, but on closer examination > that doesn't seem to make a lot of sense. I also looked in > /usr/share/applnk and while the mouse is referenced there are no > configuration files that can be edited for effect. > > The KDE site wasn't a lot of help either. > > I'm hoping that there is someone on this list that has encountered this > problem and can point me in the right direction. > > John > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 14:58:16 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 09:58:16 -0500 Subject: Linux ISP w/USR 56K modem? In-Reply-To: <402745BC.2060404-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ@public.gmane.org> References: <40247D2A.2050603@softhome.net> <20040209050628.GA12653@m450> <402745BC.2060404@softhome.net> Message-ID: <20040209145816.GN732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Mon, Feb 09, 2004 at 12:33:00AM -0800, SRB wrote: > That sounds like a great deal... As soon as I get a "real" modem that > will work! :-) Thanks for the tip! Any hardware PCI or external serial modem is usually fine. Internal modems that work are thing like USR 2976, 2977, 5610 among a few others. I am using a USR V.Everything EXT. Never had a problem with it. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jmyshrall-6duGhz7i8susTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 14:46:12 2004 From: jmyshrall-6duGhz7i8susTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (John Myshrall) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 09:46:12 -0500 Subject: OT: DSL modems In-Reply-To: <200402081255.32700.fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <200402081255.32700.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: <20040209094612.6e4d9ed1.jmyshrall@golden.net> On Sun, 8 Feb 2004 12:55:32 -0500 Fraser Campbell wrote: > Hi, > > I'm going to be helping a few family members with getting their DSL > setup soon. Does anyone know of a good source for used DSL modems, > preferably SpeedStream 5260 or 5360. I paid istop around $90 for mine > but since I might be buying 3 of these I'd like to try and get a deal. > > Thanks > -- > Fraser Campbell > http://www.wehave.net/ > Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian > GNU/Linux There is someone in Scarborough selling *New* 5360 for $99.00 CD. The problem is that it is through ebay.ca. They do allow pick ups though. Seller id is xeonzu. Perhaps they'll deal. John -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 17:43:38 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 12:43:38 -0500 Subject: Another BASH Scripting question Message-ID: <4027C6CA.3030206@alteeve.com> Hi all, Sorry for asking so many questions! I am on quite the learning curve at the moment! :) I am on the last portion of my firewall script and I need something like an array (though judging from what I have read on array's, not exactly one). Here is what I am trying to do: I have rules for multiple servers. Later on we will add more servers. I already will have to copy/paste the variables and update the data for the servers but I don't want to have to edit the actual script. To do this, I want to have the script read the value from a variable but have part of that variable name itself be dynamic. This is what is stumping me... In my head, I am trying to do this: # How many servers do we have? SRV_NAME="SRV1 SRV2" # Rules for server SRV1_SNAT_IP="192.168.2.10:111.222.333.44 SRV1_IB_TCP="22 25 53 80 110" SRV1_IB_UDP="22 25 53 80 110" SRV1_LAN_TCP="22>192.168.1.12" SRV1_LAN_TCP="22>192.168.1.12" # Rules for server SRV2_SNAT_IP="192.168.2.11:111.222.333.45 SRV2_IB_TCP="22 80" SRV2_IB_UDP="22 80" SRV2_LAN_TCP="22>192.168.1.16" SRV2_LAN_TCP="22>192.168.1.16" echo -n "Checking to see if we have servers: " if [ "${SRV_NAME}" != "" ] ; then echo "we do!" echo "Setting up rules for each public server: " for server in ${SRV_NAME} ; do echo "Processing: "${server} # Here is where things break! echo "${server}_SNAT_IP" | { IFS=':' read pubip inetip echo "Internal IP: "${pubip} echo "Internet IP: "${inetip} } done fi The output is: Checking to see if we have servers: we do! Setting up rules for each server: Processing: SRV1 Internal IP: SRV1_SNAT_IP Internet IP: Processing: SRV2 Internal IP: SRV2_SNAT_IP Internet IP: So, my problem is that the variable name is becoming the value... How can I go about getting the value of to cobbled together variable name instead? Thank you all so much again!! Madison -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From c.f.a.johnson-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 17:53:47 2004 From: c.f.a.johnson-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Chris F.A. Johnson) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 12:53:47 -0500 (EST) Subject: Another BASH Scripting question In-Reply-To: <4027C6CA.3030206-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <4027C6CA.3030206@alteeve.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 9 Feb 2004, Madison Kelly wrote: > Hi all, > > Sorry for asking so many questions! I am on quite the learning curve > at the moment! :) > > I am on the last portion of my firewall script and I need something > like an array (though judging from what I have read on array's, not > exactly one). > > Here is what I am trying to do: I have rules for multiple servers. > Later on we will add more servers. I already will have to copy/paste the > variables and update the data for the servers but I don't want to have > to edit the actual script. To do this, I want to have the script read > the value from a variable but have part of that variable name itself be > dynamic. This is what is stumping me... [snip] > # Here is where things break! > > echo "${server}_SNAT_IP" | { > IFS=':' read pubip inetip > echo "Internal IP: "${pubip} > echo "Internet IP: "${inetip} > } > done > fi Use eval: eval var=${server}_SNAT_IP echo "$var | { ....... Once you have the value, you could use set to break down the variable, instead of piping to read: eval var=${server}_SNAT_IP IFS=: set $var echo "Internal IP: ${1}" echo "Internet IP: ${2}" Or use parameter expansion: eval var=${server}_SNAT_IP echo "Internal IP: ${var%:*}" echo "Internet IP: ${var#*:}" -- Chris F.A. Johnson ================================================================= cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org http://cfaj.freeshell.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 18:35:52 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 13:35:52 -0500 Subject: Another BASH Scripting question In-Reply-To: References: <4027C6CA.3030206@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <4027D308.6030806@alteeve.com> Thank you very much for replying but I can't seem to implement properly your advice... With all three methods the output is the same; the variable name instead of the variable data... Here is the modified script and the output: -= Your first suggestion: # How many servers do we have? SRV_NAME="SRV1 SRV2" # Rules for server SRV1_SNAT_IP="192.168.2.10:111.222.333.44 SRV1_IB_TCP="22 25 53 80 110" SRV1_IB_UDP="22 25 53 80 110" SRV1_LAN_TCP="22>192.168.1.12" SRV1_LAN_TCP="22>192.168.1.12" # Rules for server SRV2_SNAT_IP="192.168.2.11:111.222.333.45 SRV2_IB_TCP="22 80" SRV2_IB_UDP="22 80" SRV2_LAN_TCP="22>192.168.1.16" SRV2_LAN_TCP="22>192.168.1.16" echo -n "Checking to see if we have servers: " if [ "${SRV_NAME}" != "" ] ; then echo "we do!" echo "Setting up rules for each public server: " for server in ${SRV_NAME} ; do echo "Processing: "${server} eval var=${server}_SNAT_IP echo $var | { IFS=':' read pubip inetip echo "Internal IP: ${pubip}" echo "Internet IP: ${inetip}" } } done fi The output is: Checking to see if we have servers: we do! Setting up rules for each server: Processing: SRV1 Internal IP: SRV1_SNAT_IP Internet IP: Processing: SRV2 Internal IP: SRV2_SNAT_IP Internet IP: -= Second suggestion echo -n "Checking to see if we have servers: " if [ "${SRV_NAME}" != "" ] ; then echo "we do!" echo "Setting up rules for each public server: " for server in ${SRV_NAME} ; do echo "Processing: "${server} eval var=${server}_SNAT_IP IFS=: set $var echo "Internal IP: ${1}" echo "Internet IP: ${2}" } done fi The output is the same: Checking to see if we have servers: we do! Setting up rules for each server: Processing: SRV1 Internal IP: SRV1_SNAT_IP Internet IP: Processing: SRV2 Internal IP: SRV2_SNAT_IP Internet IP: -= Third suggestiong echo -n "Checking to see if we have servers: " if [ "${SRV_NAME}" != "" ] ; then echo "we do!" echo "Setting up rules for each public server: " for server in ${SRV_NAME} ; do echo "Processing: "${server} eval var=${server}_SNAT_IP echo "Internal IP: ${var%:*}" echo "Internet IP: ${var#*:}" } done fi The output is slightly different: Checking to see if we have servers: we do! Setting up rules for each server: Processing: SRV1 Internal IP: SRV1_SNAT_IP Internet IP: SRV1_SNAT_IP Processing: SRV2 Internal IP: SRV2_SNAT_IP Internet IP: SRV2_SNAT_IP Can you see what I have done wrong?? Thanks again! Madison Chris F.A. Johnson wrote: > On Mon, 9 Feb 2004, Madison Kelly wrote: > > >>Hi all, >> >> Sorry for asking so many questions! I am on quite the learning curve >>at the moment! :) >> >> I am on the last portion of my firewall script and I need something >>like an array (though judging from what I have read on array's, not >>exactly one). >> >> Here is what I am trying to do: I have rules for multiple servers. >>Later on we will add more servers. I already will have to copy/paste the >>variables and update the data for the servers but I don't want to have >>to edit the actual script. To do this, I want to have the script read >>the value from a variable but have part of that variable name itself be >>dynamic. This is what is stumping me... > > [snip] > > >># Here is where things break! >> >> echo "${server}_SNAT_IP" | { >> IFS=':' read pubip inetip >> echo "Internal IP: "${pubip} >> echo "Internet IP: "${inetip} >> } >> done >>fi > > > Use eval: > > eval var=${server}_SNAT_IP > echo "$var | { ....... > > Once you have the value, you could use set to break down the > variable, instead of piping to read: > > eval var=${server}_SNAT_IP > IFS=: > set $var > echo "Internal IP: ${1}" > echo "Internet IP: ${2}" > > Or use parameter expansion: > > eval var=${server}_SNAT_IP > echo "Internal IP: ${var%:*}" > echo "Internet IP: ${var#*:}" > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 18:40:44 2004 From: hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (D. Hugh Redelmeier) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 13:40:44 -0500 (EST) Subject: Another BASH Scripting question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: | From: Chris F.A. Johnson | On Mon, 9 Feb 2004, Madison Kelly wrote: | Use eval: | | eval var=${server}_SNAT_IP | echo "$var | { ....... If I understand what you are suggesting, then it does not work: $ server=SRV2 $ SRV2_IB_TCP="22 80" $ eval var=${server}_SNAT_IP $ echo $var SRV2_SNAT_IP I think that this is closer to what is needed: $ eval z='$'${server}_IB_TCP $ echo $z 22 80 How can you read this ugly eval? The operand expands into z=$SRV2_IB_TCP And then it is evaluated. The single quotes prevent the enclosed $ from being "executed" during operand expansion. My personal religion frowns on eval. eval is a rather powerful, subtle, dangerous, and confusing instument. Anything involving IFS is also somewhat suspect. If I'd designed the Bourne Shell, the following would work: $ echo ${${server}_IB_TCP} bash: ${${server}_IB_TCP}: bad substitution Hugh Redelmeier hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org voice: +1 416 482-8253 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 18:42:28 2004 From: lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org (Lloyd Budd) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 13:42:28 -0500 Subject: SME Server 6.0 In-Reply-To: <4026E998.2020405-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/@public.gmane.org> References: <4026E998.2020405@pcsecurityonline.com> Message-ID: On 8-Feb-04, at 20:59, Jason Shein wrote: > Does anyone on this list have any experiences with SME server 6.0? > Just looking for some general advice or experiences A friend of mine is a big fan of e-smith , a search for 'esmith' on his website http://www.bmannconsulting.com/search will list a number of relevant discussions. HTH, Lloyd -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 18:46:38 2004 From: clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (CLIFFORD ILKAY) Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 13:46:38 -0500 Subject: Mouse cursor size In-Reply-To: <4027B7BD.8040605-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <4027B7BD.8040605@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.0.20040209134221.03fb12d8@localhost> At 11:39 09/02/2004 -0500, John McGregor wrote: >My mother (79 yr. old) got her first computer recently, on which I >installed Mandrake 9.2 and selected KDE. She really likes it, [snip] Hi John, We should start a TLUG SIG called GERITLUG:) Our mothers can be the charter members. I have mine using MDK 9.2 with KDE as well. Regards, Clifford Ilkay Dinamis Corporation 3266 Yonge Street, Suite 1419 Toronto, Ontario Canada M4N 3P6 Tel: 416-410-3326 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From c.f.a.johnson-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 18:54:52 2004 From: c.f.a.johnson-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Chris F.A. Johnson) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 13:54:52 -0500 (EST) Subject: Another BASH Scripting question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, 9 Feb 2004, D. Hugh Redelmeier wrote: > | From: Chris F.A. Johnson > | On Mon, 9 Feb 2004, Madison Kelly wrote: > > | Use eval: > | > | eval var=${server}_SNAT_IP > | echo "$var | { ....... > > If I understand what you are suggesting, then it does not work: > > $ server=SRV2 > $ SRV2_IB_TCP="22 80" > $ eval var=${server}_SNAT_IP > $ echo $var > SRV2_SNAT_IP > > I think that this is closer to what is needed: > $ eval z='$'${server}_IB_TCP > $ echo $z > 22 80 Right. I meant: eval var=$\${server}_SNAT_IP That what happens when I post before my first cup of coffee. > How can you read this ugly eval? It just takes a little practice. > The operand expands into z=$SRV2_IB_TCP > And then it is evaluated. > The single quotes prevent the enclosed $ from being "executed" during operand > expansion. Exactly. I prefer the backslash. It can get pretty hairy using backslashes with eval, but if I need more than 2 consecutive backslashes, I use a different syntax. > My personal religion frowns on eval. eval is a rather powerful, > subtle, dangerous, and confusing instument. Anything involving IFS is > also somewhat suspect. Eval is indispensible, and changing IFS is frequently the best way to accomplish a task (though less so in bash than in an old Bourne shell). > If I'd designed the Bourne Shell, the following would work: > > $ echo ${${server}_IB_TCP} > bash: ${${server}_IB_TCP}: bad substitution In bash, you can use: v=${server}_SNAT_IP var=${!v} -- Chris F.A. Johnson ================================================================= cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org http://cfaj.freeshell.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 18:59:40 2004 From: hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (D. Hugh Redelmeier) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 13:59:40 -0500 (EST) Subject: New user and questions In-Reply-To: <40246D47.6090603-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ@public.gmane.org> References: <40246D47.6090603@softhome.net> Message-ID: | From: SRB | I'm new to this group (and Linux). I'd like to know if there's anywhere | to get training on Linux around T.O. Not exactly beginner stuff, but | intermediate knowledge. Why do you want to learn about LINUX? What are your goals? Without knowing that, it is hard to give an appropriate answer. LINUX is much to big to learn in its entirety. So you have to be selective. Example: playing around with a bunch of distros is probably not the first thing to do. Pick a reasonable one and dive in. I'd suggest going with Red Hat 9 that you already have (and have a paper manual for). | Would a person in my position find it useful to attend any TLUG | meetings? Or is it advisable to educate myself a bit more first? Meetings are probably worthwhile, even if you don't understand everything. The next meeting ought to be tomorrow, but the details have not been announced. Pick folks' brains in the bar after the meeting. Hugh Redelmeier hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org voice: +1 416 482-8253 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 19:07:29 2004 From: tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Tim Writer) Date: 09 Feb 2004 14:07:29 -0500 Subject: Mouse cursor size In-Reply-To: <4027B7BD.8040605-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <4027B7BD.8040605@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: John McGregor writes: > My mother (79 yr. old) got her first computer recently, on which I installed > Mandrake 9.2 and selected KDE. She really likes it, however she sometimes has > a problem seeing the mouse cursor even when the larger one supplied by KDE is > selected. I searched through Google and there are some mentions of editing > the .Xresources file, but on closer examination that doesn't seem to make a > lot of sense. I also looked in /usr/share/applnk and while the mouse is > referenced there are no configuration files that can be edited for effect. > > > The KDE site wasn't a lot of help either. > > I'm hoping that there is someone on this list that has encountered this > problem and can point me in the right direction. Yep, this was covered in the recent thread about xterm. Try adding this to her ~/.Xresources: ! Set to true to revert to old fashioned cursors Xcursor.core: false ! Available themes are redglass, whiteglass, and default (currently an ! alias for whiteglass. Xcursor.theme: redglass which will make the pointer a translucent red instead of the translucent white default. Alternatively, use: Xcursor.core: true in which case, the theme is ignored and X reverts to the old fashioned behaviour (fully opaque cursors which can usually be controlled by pointerColor resources [the defaults are usually reasonable]). These resources may be usefult: http://www.xfree86.org/4.3.0/RELNOTES2.html#5 http://www.cs.umn.edu/help/linux/xcursor.html BTW, this is only for XFree86 4.3.0 or higher. If you're using something older than that, this is not the problem. -- tim writer starnix inc. 905.771.0017 ext. 225 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 19:11:12 2004 From: matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (G. Matthew Rice) Date: 09 Feb 2004 14:11:12 -0500 Subject: Another BASH Scripting question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "Chris F.A. Johnson" writes: > eval var=$\${server}_SNAT_IP > > That what happens when I post before my first cup of coffee. Better have another cup. I think that you mean: eval var=\$${server}_SNAT_IP Much more readable, now ;) -- g. matthew rice starnix inc. phone: 905-771-0017 x242 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 19:17:20 2004 From: hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (D. Hugh Redelmeier) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 14:17:20 -0500 (EST) Subject: Another BASH Scripting question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: | From: Chris F.A. Johnson | On Mon, 9 Feb 2004, D. Hugh Redelmeier wrote: | | > | From: Chris F.A. Johnson | > | On Mon, 9 Feb 2004, Madison Kelly wrote: | > | > | Use eval: | > | | > | eval var=${server}_SNAT_IP | > | echo "$var | { ....... | > | > If I understand what you are suggesting, then it does not work: | > | > $ server=SRV2 | > $ SRV2_IB_TCP="22 80" | > $ eval var=${server}_SNAT_IP | > $ echo $var | > SRV2_SNAT_IP | > | > I think that this is closer to what is needed: | > $ eval z='$'${server}_IB_TCP | > $ echo $z | > 22 80 | | Right. I meant: | | eval var=$\${server}_SNAT_IP I don't think so: $ server=SRV2 $ SRV2_IB_TCP="22 80" $ eval var=$\${server}_SNAT_IP $ echo $var 23484{server}_SNAT_IP I think you meant: $ eval var=\$${server}_IB_TCP $ echo $var 22 80 This just shows how easy it is to make a mistake with this corner of the language. Test before publishing. | That what happens when I post before my first cup of coffee. More coffee! | Exactly. I prefer the backslash. Single quotes seem a little more explicit to me. In this case, either will do. | It can get pretty hairy using backslashes with eval, but if I need | more than 2 consecutive backslashes, I use a different syntax. Backslashes come in quatities that are a power of two :-) | > If I'd designed the Bourne Shell, the following would work: | > | > $ echo ${${server}_IB_TCP} | > bash: ${${server}_IB_TCP}: bad substitution | | In bash, you can use: | | v=${server}_SNAT_IP | var=${!v} Right. I'd vaguely remembered this, but could not see it in the man page. The reason is that ! is written as "exclamation point" in that section of the man page :-( I avoid bashisms as much as possible, but this one looks like the best approach. It avoids the dreaded eval. It does seem awkward compared with my design. It requires an extra variable and an extra statement. Hugh Redelmeier hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org voice: +1 416 482-8253 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 19:26:39 2004 From: tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Tim Writer) Date: 09 Feb 2004 14:26:39 -0500 Subject: Another BASH Scripting question In-Reply-To: <4027D308.6030806-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <4027C6CA.3030206@alteeve.com> <4027D308.6030806@alteeve.com> Message-ID: Madison Kelly writes: > Thank you very much for replying but I can't seem to implement properly your > advice... With all three methods the output is the same; the variable name > instead of the variable data... > > > Here is the modified script and the output: [snip] > echo -n "Checking to see if we have servers: " > if [ "${SRV_NAME}" != "" ] ; then > echo "we do!" > echo "Setting up rules for each public server: " > for server in ${SRV_NAME} ; do > echo "Processing: "${server} > eval var=${server}_SNAT_IP > echo $var | { The last two lines should read: var=${server}_SNAT_IP eval echo \$$var | { Roughly speaking, when evaluating a command, the shell performs the following steps: 1. Read in the command and break it into words, yielding these three strings (for the first command in the pipeline) eval echo \$$var 2. Perform substitutions on the words of the command. The first two words have no substitutions, the third has two, namely "\$" and "$var" which yield "$" and "SRV1_SNAT_IP" respectively. After this step we have: eval echo $SRV1_SNAT_IP 3. Execute the command, in this case "eval" which is a shell builtin. From the manpage: The args are read and concatenated together into a single command. This command is then read and executed by the shell. In other words, go to step 1 with the command "echo $SRV1_SNAT_IP" To see this for yourself, try the following test: % cat > /tmp/test.sh SRV1_SNAT_IP=1.2.3.4 server=SRV1 var=${server}_SNAT_IP eval echo \$$var ^D % bash -vx /tmp/test.sh -- tim writer starnix inc. 905.771.0017 ext. 225 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From c.f.a.johnson-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 19:56:21 2004 From: c.f.a.johnson-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Chris F.A. Johnson) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 14:56:21 -0500 (EST) Subject: Another BASH Scripting question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, 9 Feb 2004, D. Hugh Redelmeier wrote: > | From: Chris F.A. Johnson > > | On Mon, 9 Feb 2004, D. Hugh Redelmeier wrote: > | > | > | From: Chris F.A. Johnson > | > | On Mon, 9 Feb 2004, Madison Kelly wrote: > | > > | > | Use eval: > | > | > | > | eval var=${server}_SNAT_IP > | > | echo "$var | { ....... > | > > | > If I understand what you are suggesting, then it does not work: > | > > | > $ server=SRV2 > | > $ SRV2_IB_TCP="22 80" > | > $ eval var=${server}_SNAT_IP > | > $ echo $var > | > SRV2_SNAT_IP > | > > | > I think that this is closer to what is needed: > | > $ eval z='$'${server}_IB_TCP > | > $ echo $z > | > 22 80 > | > | Right. I meant: > | > | eval var=$\${server}_SNAT_IP > > I don't think so: > $ server=SRV2 > $ SRV2_IB_TCP="22 80" > $ eval var=$\${server}_SNAT_IP > $ echo $var > 23484{server}_SNAT_IP > > I think you meant: > $ eval var=\$${server}_IB_TCP > $ echo $var > 22 80 > > This just shows how easy it is to make a mistake with this corner of > the language. Test before publishing. > > | That what happens when I post before my first cup of coffee. > > More coffee! I should have finished it; I was half way through my first cup. > | Exactly. I prefer the backslash. > > Single quotes seem a little more explicit to me. In this case, either > will do. > > | It can get pretty hairy using backslashes with eval, but if I need > | more than 2 consecutive backslashes, I use a different syntax. > > Backslashes come in quatities that are a power of two :-) They can come in any number. :( I don't remember exactly what I was doing, but I recall a situation in which there was NO correct number of backslashes; X wasn't enough; X+1 was too many! > | > If I'd designed the Bourne Shell, the following would work: > | > > | > $ echo ${${server}_IB_TCP} > | > bash: ${${server}_IB_TCP}: bad substitution > | > | In bash, you can use: > | > | v=${server}_SNAT_IP > | var=${!v} > > Right. I'd vaguely remembered this, but could not see it in the man > page. The reason is that ! is written as "exclamation point" in that > section of the man page :-( > > I avoid bashisms as much as possible, but this one looks like the best > approach. It avoids the dreaded eval. I use bashisms when they're more efficient; this is one I never use, as there is a portable equivalent. > It does seem awkward compared with my design. It requires an extra > variable and an extra statement. -- Chris F.A. Johnson ================================================================= cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org http://cfaj.freeshell.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 19:56:18 2004 From: hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (D. Hugh Redelmeier) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 14:56:18 -0500 (EST) Subject: meeting tomorrow? Message-ID: Is there a TLUG meeting tomorrow? If so: Do we have a room this month? What is the topic? Who is the speaker? Hugh Redelmeier hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org voice: +1 416 482-8253 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 17:56:29 2004 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 12:56:29 -0500 Subject: Another BASH Scripting question In-Reply-To: <4027C6CA.3030206-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <4027C6CA.3030206@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <20040209175629.GA7671@node1.opengeometry.net> On Mon, Feb 09, 2004 at 12:43:38PM -0500, Madison Kelly wrote: > Hi all, > > Sorry for asking so many questions! I am on quite the learning curve > at the moment! :) > > I am on the last portion of my firewall script and I need something > like an array (though judging from what I have read on array's, not > exactly one). > > Here is what I am trying to do: I have rules for multiple servers. > Later on we will add more servers. I already will have to copy/paste the > variables and update the data for the servers but I don't want to have > to edit the actual script. To do this, I want to have the script read > the value from a variable but have part of that variable name itself be > dynamic. This is what is stumping me... > > In my head, I am trying to do this: > > # How many servers do we have? > SRV_NAME="SRV1 SRV2" > > # Rules for server > SRV1_SNAT_IP="192.168.2.10:111.222.333.44 > SRV1_IB_TCP="22 25 53 80 110" > SRV1_IB_UDP="22 25 53 80 110" > SRV1_LAN_TCP="22>192.168.1.12" > SRV1_LAN_TCP="22>192.168.1.12" > > # Rules for server > SRV2_SNAT_IP="192.168.2.11:111.222.333.45 > SRV2_IB_TCP="22 80" > SRV2_IB_UDP="22 80" > SRV2_LAN_TCP="22>192.168.1.16" > SRV2_LAN_TCP="22>192.168.1.16" > > > echo -n "Checking to see if we have servers: " > if [ "${SRV_NAME}" != "" ] ; then > echo "we do!" > echo "Setting up rules for each public server: " > for server in ${SRV_NAME} ; do > echo "Processing: "${server} > > # Here is where things break! > > echo "${server}_SNAT_IP" | { > IFS=':' read pubip inetip > echo "Internal IP: "${pubip} > echo "Internet IP: "${inetip} > } > done > fi > > The output is: > > Checking to see if we have servers: we do! > Setting up rules for each server: > Processing: SRV1 > Internal IP: SRV1_SNAT_IP > Internet IP: > Processing: SRV2 > Internal IP: SRV2_SNAT_IP > Internet IP: > > > So, my problem is that the variable name is becoming the value... How > can I go about getting the value of to cobbled together variable name > instead? Hint: for i in $SRV_NAME; do IFS=: read pubip inetip <<< "`eval echo \$${i}_SNAT_IP`" done -- William Park, Open Geometry Consulting, Linux solution for data management and processing. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 20:12:13 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 15:12:13 -0500 Subject: IT WORKS!! Re:Another BASH Scripting question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4027E99D.7060804@alteeve.com> Thank you to everyone!! This is what finally worked for me. Trying the different implementations of the backslash didn't... Anywho, now time to actually put this to use! Again, thank you all SO much!! Madison > I think that this is closer to what is needed: > $ eval z='$'${server}_IB_TCP > $ echo $z > 22 80 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 20:25:01 2004 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 15:25:01 -0500 (EST) Subject: meeting tomorrow? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, 9 Feb 2004, D. Hugh Redelmeier wrote: > Is there a TLUG meeting tomorrow? There certainly is... > If so: > Do we have a room this month? > What is the topic? > Who is the speaker? Drew's putting a meeting announcement out this evening which will confirm all the details. Where looking at getting the announcment out ahead of time in the future to avoid last minute announcments like this. Rob -- Robert Brockway Senior Technical Consultant, OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Phone: 416-669-3073, Email: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org, http://www.opentrend.net OpenTrend Solutions: Reliable, secure solutions to real world problems. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 20:34:35 2004 From: matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (G. Matthew Rice) Date: 09 Feb 2004 15:34:35 -0500 Subject: meeting tomorrow? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: "D. Hugh Redelmeier" writes: > Is there a TLUG meeting tomorrow? Ah, c'mon. You should know by now that the meeting will be announced 5 minutes after it starts. -- g. matthew rice starnix inc. phone: 905-771-0017 x242 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 10 00:08:22 2004 From: srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org (SRB) Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 16:08:22 -0800 Subject: New user and questions In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <402820F6.6030809@softhome.net> D. Hugh Redelmeier wrote: >| I'm new to this group (and Linux). I'd like to know if there's anywhere >| to get training on Linux around T.O. Not exactly beginner stuff, but >| intermediate knowledge. > >Why do you want to learn about LINUX? What are your goals? Without >knowing that, it is hard to give an appropriate answer. > I've had that question before. :-) My immediate goals are to achieve a comfort level in Linux that I currently have in windows. The knowledge to do just about anything I fancy at the moment. To not have a mental roadblock of "how do I do this?" or "is this possible?". I understand it is always an ongoing process and that is what I enjoy as well; knowing that no matter how much I know, there is always more to learn. This is what has drawn me to Linux. I've grown bored of windows "one-flavour is supposed to suit all". I love how customizable Linux is. As well as the philosophy of open-source which enables people from around the globe to contribute as opposed to a handful of people in office buildings. :-) I have no doubt now that I am on the right track and this group is exactly the kind of support I need! I've also been on a few Yahoo Linux groups for a while and even when things are over my head, I still file them away mentally for future reference. Thanks to everyone who offers advice and support for newbies like me. Hopefully I'll be able to do that soon for others as well. -Steve. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rufmetal-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 9 23:14:13 2004 From: rufmetal-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Chris Keelan) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 18:14:13 -0500 Subject: New user and questions In-Reply-To: <402820F6.6030809-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ@public.gmane.org> References: <402820F6.6030809@softhome.net> Message-ID: <20040209181413.633113ca.rufmetal@eol.ca> On Mon, 09 Feb 2004 16:08:22 -0800 SRB wrote: > I've had that question before. :-) My immediate goals are to achieve a > comfort level in Linux that I currently have in windows. The knowledge > to do just about anything I fancy at the moment. To not have a mental > roadblock of "how do I do this?" or "is this possible?". Sorry if this is a dupe, but has anyone pointed you at the IBM Developer Works Linux library? http://makeashorterlink.com/?U39C51A57 ~ C -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From aitken-BwLjziHGQLusTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 10 00:02:04 2004 From: aitken-BwLjziHGQLusTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (aitken-BwLjziHGQLusTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org) Date: 10 Feb 2004 00:02:04 -0000 Subject: Linux ISP w/USR 56K modem? Message-ID: <20040210000204.31574.qmail@onlink8.onlink.net> -------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2004 Feb 07 - 01:35 -------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> Currently I'm using 3web as my dial-up ISP. They use a Windows log-on, What does that mean? If this is a paid-for dial-up account to an ISP they shouldn't care what OS you use. All you need is the names of the smtp and pop3 servers, and the phone number for dialup, you account name and password. That's it. >> but I want to be able to access the internet from Linux. Does anyone >> know of any ISPs that offer Linux connectivity (preferably dial-up)? Again, no such thing (as far as I know) as "Linux connectivity" - smtp and pop3 server names, account, password and dial-up phone number are all you need. Chris >What you need to do is to find out what protocol is used for >establishing the connection. I'm guessing it's PPP of some kind, need >more details... i.e. describe your logon process and what kind of things >it asks you for, tell us about the windows client, what kind of options >does it provide, etc. Shouldn't be too big a deal. > >> PS... my modem is a USRobotics "56K Faxmodem PCI for Windows" model >> 5699B. Are there any issues (ie. driver) getting this to work properly >> in any Linux distros? ...hopefully not... :~o > >Doesn't look promising... >http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/archive/18/2003/07/4/75498 >Thing looks to be a 'winmodem' which requires the OS to do alot of the >work so it's very windows specific. > >However, progress has been made in linux supporting these devices: >http://www.linmodems.org/ , http://start.at/modem ... but upon checking, >it looks like you're S.O.L. on this one. > >Chances are someone on the list will have a spare/unused modem that will >work for you, and probably for free or at a very reasonable price. > >Regards, >Byron > >-- > >For Good, return Good. For Evil, return Justice. > >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > From lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 10 00:02:23 2004 From: lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org (Lloyd Budd) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 19:02:23 -0500 Subject: Speaking of Cities using linux In-Reply-To: <001d01c3ee68$adab4cc0$0b01a8c0-VMKVZpoZl3s@public.gmane.org> References: <40246D47.6090603@softhome.net> <402476F3.5070907@rogers.com> <40252E09.4050908@softhome.net> <4025140E.20608@alteeve.com> <4026982A.2090700@softhome.net> <001d01c3ee68$adab4cc0$0b01a8c0@win98p4> Message-ID: <677498EE-5B5C-11D8-8404-0003931BD222@foolswisdom.com> On 8-Feb-04, at 12:26, Robert McDonald wrote: > http://www.westonfl.org/ Holy excessive, batman. "You would think" that cities would get together and come up with a common layout to encourage accessibility (pun intended). -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 10 03:27:28 2004 From: srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org (SRB) Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 19:27:28 -0800 Subject: Linux ISP w/USR 56K modem? In-Reply-To: <20040210000204.31574.qmail-mH9TDIkfHeMHAuPOIcZAu6xOck334EZe@public.gmane.org> References: <20040210000204.31574.qmail@onlink8.onlink.net> Message-ID: <40284FA0.3060905@softhome.net> aitken-BwLjziHGQLusTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org wrote: >>>Currently I'm using 3web as my dial-up ISP. They use a Windows log-on, >>> >>> > >What does that mean? If this is a paid-for dial-up account to an ISP they shouldn't care what OS you use. All you need is the names of the smtp and pop3 servers, and the phone number for dialup, you account name and password. That's it. > > > >>>but I want to be able to access the internet from Linux. Does anyone >>>know of any ISPs that offer Linux connectivity (preferably dial-up)? >>> >>> > >Again, no such thing (as far as I know) as "Linux connectivity" - smtp and pop3 server names, account, password and dial-up phone number are all you need. > >Chris > > They use a windows program to connect using an encrypted authentication technique. Even the phone number is hidden. I think if I had the phone number and any other info, their end would still check to see if the windows program was running on my end, or it would fail. Sort of like Netzero and AOL I think. Not to worry though, I fully intend to contact 295.ca (thanks to Walter's tip) for dialup. I've found a place that's selling the USR 2976 modem for $59, so I'll probably pick one up this week and be surfing from linux by the weekend! :-) -Steve. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pjc-6duGhz7i8susTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 10 00:29:08 2004 From: pjc-6duGhz7i8susTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (Paul Croft) Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 19:29:08 -0500 Subject: SME Server 6.0 In-Reply-To: <4026E998.2020405-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/@public.gmane.org> References: <4026E998.2020405@pcsecurityonline.com> Message-ID: <1076372948.955.16.camel@alien> It's in my opinion a very good product. I have set it up 5 or 6 different times from version 5.0 (I think) 5.6, and 6 beta. It is by far the easiest setup for a standalone server or server gateway out there. It's based on redat 7.3 stil I believe. Mail server,web server, virtual domains, webmail, User accounts and disk allocation, you name it's there out of the box and easily configurable through their browser based configuration panel. It runs very nicely on lower end hardware too. I had a p166 64mb ram running as a gateway,mail server, webmail, 3 post nuke sites, and a file server for around 8-10 clients for about 4 months without a problem (just for giggles). Give ti a try, I'm sure you will pleasantly surprised.... On Sun, 2004-02-08 at 20:59, Jason Shein wrote: > Does anyone on this list have any experiences with SME server 6.0? > Just looking for some general advice or experiences -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 10 03:36:35 2004 From: srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org (SRB) Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 19:36:35 -0800 Subject: New user and questions In-Reply-To: <20040209181413.633113ca.rufmetal-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <402820F6.6030809@softhome.net> <20040209181413.633113ca.rufmetal@eol.ca> Message-ID: <402851C3.3050803@softhome.net> Chris Keelan wrote: >On Mon, 09 Feb 2004 16:08:22 -0800 >SRB wrote: > > > >>I've had that question before. :-) My immediate goals are to achieve a >>comfort level in Linux that I currently have in windows. The knowledge >>to do just about anything I fancy at the moment. To not have a mental >>roadblock of "how do I do this?" or "is this possible?". >> >> > >Sorry if this is a dupe, but has anyone pointed you at the IBM >Developer Works Linux library? > >http://makeashorterlink.com/?U39C51A57 > >~ C > No, I wasn't aware of those tutorials. Thanks for the link! -Steve. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jason-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 10 00:33:05 2004 From: jason-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/ at public.gmane.org (Jason Shein) Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 19:33:05 -0500 Subject: SME Server 6.0 In-Reply-To: <1076372948.955.16.camel-Nmv5/9HX7RA@public.gmane.org> References: <4026E998.2020405@pcsecurityonline.com> <1076372948.955.16.camel@alien> Message-ID: <402826C1.8040905@pcsecurityonline.com> I am currently working on it for my website. It was a bit of a pain to set up for mambo, but it is working. I am currently working out some webmail bugs, but I think this will be just fine for what I need. For sone reason, when I had my server on my local network the webmail services worked fine, but now that It is located on site, when I login to the webmail it sends me to a blank page. if i refresh the page once or twice it allows the login to complete. Any ideas? Paul Croft wrote: > It's in my opinion a very good product. I have set it up 5 or 6 > different times from version > 5.0 (I think) 5.6, and 6 beta. It is by far the easiest setup for a > standalone server or server gateway out there. It's based on redat 7.3 > stil I believe. Mail server,web server, virtual domains, webmail, User > accounts and disk allocation, you name it's there out of the box and > easily configurable through their browser based configuration panel. It > runs very nicely on lower end hardware too. I had a p166 64mb ram > running as a gateway,mail server, webmail, 3 post nuke sites, and a file > server for around 8-10 clients for about 4 months without a problem > (just for giggles). Give ti a try, I'm sure you will pleasantly > surprised.... > > On Sun, 2004-02-08 at 20:59, Jason Shein wrote: > >>Does anyone on this list have any experiences with SME server 6.0? >>Just looking for some general advice or experiences > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- " Eventually people tire of repairing broken Windows, And decide to replace them with something stronger" (o_ //\ Linux - The Choice Of A GNU Generation V_/_ Jason Shein Linux Registered User #281100 jason-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/@public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pjc-6duGhz7i8susTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 10 00:47:24 2004 From: pjc-6duGhz7i8susTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (Paul Croft) Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 19:47:24 -0500 Subject: SME Server 6.0 In-Reply-To: <402826C1.8040905-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/@public.gmane.org> References: <4026E998.2020405@pcsecurityonline.com> <1076372948.955.16.camel@alien> <402826C1.8040905@pcsecurityonline.com> Message-ID: <1076374044.955.23.camel@alien> I had never run into that problem, sounds like it may be a beta3 issue if that's what you are using. If you continue to have problems you might look into installing squirrel mail over Horde. I remember doing it once on a slightly older version but it was quite nice. I believe there was even a step by step tutorial on e-smith's website under the contributed howto's good luck! On Mon, 2004-02-09 at 19:33, Jason Shein wrote: > I am currently working on it for my website. It was a bit of a pain to > set up for mambo, but it is working. I am currently working out some > webmail bugs, but I think this will be just fine for what I need. > > For sone reason, when I had my server on my local network the webmail > services worked fine, but now that It is located on site, when I login > to the webmail it sends me to a blank page. if i refresh the page once > or twice it allows the login to complete. > > Any ideas? > > > Paul Croft wrote: > > It's in my opinion a very good product. I have set it up 5 or 6 > > different times from version > > 5.0 (I think) 5.6, and 6 beta. It is by far the easiest setup for a > > standalone server or server gateway out there. It's based on redat 7.3 > > stil I believe. Mail server,web server, virtual domains, webmail, User > > accounts and disk allocation, you name it's there out of the box and > > easily configurable through their browser based configuration panel. It > > runs very nicely on lower end hardware too. I had a p166 64mb ram > > running as a gateway,mail server, webmail, 3 post nuke sites, and a file > > server for around 8-10 clients for about 4 months without a problem > > (just for giggles). Give ti a try, I'm sure you will pleasantly > > surprised.... > > > > On Sun, 2004-02-08 at 20:59, Jason Shein wrote: > > > >>Does anyone on this list have any experiences with SME server 6.0? > >>Just looking for some general advice or experiences > > > > > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 10 00:55:42 2004 From: rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org (Rob Sutherland) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 19:55:42 -0500 Subject: SME Server 6.0 In-Reply-To: <402826C1.8040905-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/@public.gmane.org> References: <4026E998.2020405@pcsecurityonline.com> <1076372948.955.16.camel@alien> <402826C1.8040905@pcsecurityonline.com> Message-ID: <20040209195542.00df2dd1.rob@cheapersafer.com> On Mon, 09 Feb 2004 19:33:05 -0500 Jason Shein wrote: > > > > On Sun, 2004-02-08 at 20:59, Jason Shein wrote: > > > >>Does anyone on this list have any experiences with SME server 6.0? > >>Just looking for some general advice or experiences I've been using it for several months now as a general office server, mail gateway etc. Pretty solid product. I put a few links to useful e-smith sites and Howto's here... http://www.memeshadow.net/multi/html/index.php?op=modload&name=phpWiki&file=index&pagename=Esmith Rob -- Rob Sutherland - rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org Computer Support at http://www.cheapersafer.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 10 01:30:49 2004 From: mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Merv Curley) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 20:30:49 -0500 Subject: Debian and KDE 3.2 In-Reply-To: <20040207235753.GM732-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <200402060547.51732.skuznets@blueprint.org> <200402061530.29559.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> <20040207235753.GM732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <200402092030.49461.mervc@eol.ca> On February 7, 2004 06:57 pm, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > > > For Debian stable users add the following to /etc/apt/sources.list: > > > > deb http://download.kde.org/stable/3.1.4/Debian/ woody main > > Or replace 3.1.4 with 'latest' and never worry about it again. :) At > least that's what I recall using in the past. > Well KDE state 3.2 instead of 3.1.4 when I visited. I have it in my sources.list and when I tried to install kdebase there was a ton of dependancy problems and I gave up. I don't think the deb is ready for us yet. -- Merv Curley Scarborough, Ont Libranet Linux 2.8 KDE 3.1.4 KMail 1.5.4 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pegasoft-iRg7kjdsKiH3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 10 02:15:11 2004 From: pegasoft-iRg7kjdsKiH3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (pegasoft-iRg7kjdsKiH3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 21:15:11 -0500 Subject: Another BASH Scripting question In-Reply-To: <4027C6CA.3030206-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <4027C6CA.3030206@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <000401c3ef7b$b6640550$c864a8c0@tardis.dyn.dhs.org> Hi All, If anyone is looking for a good read! http://www.chapters.indigo.ca/item.asp?N=35&R=241439&act=A03&Item=978067 232642&Section=books&Catalog=Books&Lang=en&mscssid=K5FHLP4657LA9M57VLK96 7CJM3DP54TE&WSID=21024D0DF54C3AF04228A279447B26D0E9FD1209 Linux Shell Scripting with Bash Author: Ken Burtch Published By: Sams Trade Paperback ISBN:0672326426 Published: January 2004 Usually ships in 24 hours List Price:$49.99 Our Price: $34.99 Dan Braun -- Dan Braun - PegaSoft Canada / CityTV danb.nospam-iRg7kjdsKiH3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org] On Behalf Of Madison Kelly Sent: Monday, February 09, 2004 12:44 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: [TLUG]: Another BASH Scripting question Hi all, Sorry for asking so many questions! I am on quite the learning curve at the moment! :) I am on the last portion of my firewall script and I need something like an array (though judging from what I have read on array's, not exactly one). Here is what I am trying to do: I have rules for multiple servers. Later on we will add more servers. I already will have to copy/paste the variables and update the data for the servers but I don't want to have to edit the actual script. To do this, I want to have the script read the value from a variable but have part of that variable name itself be dynamic. This is what is stumping me... In my head, I am trying to do this: # How many servers do we have? SRV_NAME="SRV1 SRV2" # Rules for server SRV1_SNAT_IP="192.168.2.10:111.222.333.44 SRV1_IB_TCP="22 25 53 80 110" SRV1_IB_UDP="22 25 53 80 110" SRV1_LAN_TCP="22>192.168.1.12" SRV1_LAN_TCP="22>192.168.1.12" # Rules for server SRV2_SNAT_IP="192.168.2.11:111.222.333.45 SRV2_IB_TCP="22 80" SRV2_IB_UDP="22 80" SRV2_LAN_TCP="22>192.168.1.16" SRV2_LAN_TCP="22>192.168.1.16" echo -n "Checking to see if we have servers: " if [ "${SRV_NAME}" != "" ] ; then echo "we do!" echo "Setting up rules for each public server: " for server in ${SRV_NAME} ; do echo "Processing: "${server} # Here is where things break! echo "${server}_SNAT_IP" | { IFS=':' read pubip inetip echo "Internal IP: "${pubip} echo "Internet IP: "${inetip} } done fi The output is: Checking to see if we have servers: we do! Setting up rules for each server: Processing: SRV1 Internal IP: SRV1_SNAT_IP Internet IP: Processing: SRV2 Internal IP: SRV2_SNAT_IP Internet IP: So, my problem is that the variable name is becoming the value... How can I go about getting the value of to cobbled together variable name instead? Thank you all so much again!! Madison -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jthiele-bux5bdj6uGJBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 10 02:26:10 2004 From: jthiele-bux5bdj6uGJBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Jon Thiele) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 21:26:10 -0500 Subject: SME Server 6.0 In-Reply-To: <402826C1.8040905-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/@public.gmane.org> References: <402826C1.8040905@pcsecurityonline.com> Message-ID: <000601c3ef7d$3f818870$6501a8c0@plex8> why don't you ask for help on the official site here: http://contribs.org/modules/pbboard/ a search for "mambo" brings up 5 hits... -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org] On Behalf Of Jason Shein Sent: Monday, February 09, 2004 07:33 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: SME Server 6.0 I am currently working on it for my website. It was a bit of a pain to set up for mambo, but it is working. I am currently working out some webmail bugs, but I think this will be just fine for what I need. For sone reason, when I had my server on my local network the webmail services worked fine, but now that It is located on site, when I login to the webmail it sends me to a blank page. if i refresh the page once or twice it allows the login to complete. Any ideas? Paul Croft wrote: > It's in my opinion a very good product. I have set it up 5 or 6 > different times from version > 5.0 (I think) 5.6, and 6 beta. It is by far the easiest setup for a > standalone server or server gateway out there. It's based on redat 7.3 > stil I believe. Mail server,web server, virtual domains, webmail, User > accounts and disk allocation, you name it's there out of the box and > easily configurable through their browser based configuration panel. It > runs very nicely on lower end hardware too. I had a p166 64mb ram > running as a gateway,mail server, webmail, 3 post nuke sites, and a file > server for around 8-10 clients for about 4 months without a problem > (just for giggles). Give ti a try, I'm sure you will pleasantly > surprised.... > > On Sun, 2004-02-08 at 20:59, Jason Shein wrote: > >>Does anyone on this list have any experiences with SME server 6.0? >>Just looking for some general advice or experiences > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- " Eventually people tire of repairing broken Windows, And decide to replace them with something stronger" (o_ //\ Linux - The Choice Of A GNU Generation V_/_ Jason Shein Linux Registered User #281100 jason-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/@public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 10 02:34:09 2004 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 21:34:09 -0500 Subject: Another BASH Scripting question In-Reply-To: <000401c3ef7b$b6640550$c864a8c0-40qIwYH5687wQaAp52fGBB2eb7JE58TQ@public.gmane.org> References: <000401c3ef7b$b6640550$c864a8c0@tardis.dyn.dhs.org> Message-ID: <40284321.9080706@rogers.com> If you're going to e-mail a long URL, please include it in < >, so that it gets read as one line. Such as: pegasoft-iRg7kjdsKiH3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org wrote: > Hi All, > > If anyone is looking for a good read! > > http://www.chapters.indigo.ca/item.asp?N=35&R=241439&act=A03&Item=978067 > 232642&Section=books&Catalog=Books&Lang=en&mscssid=K5FHLP4657LA9M57VLK96 > 7CJM3DP54TE&WSID=21024D0DF54C3AF04228A279447B26D0E9FD1209 > > > Linux Shell Scripting with Bash > Author: Ken Burtch > Published By: Sams > Trade Paperback > ISBN:0672326426 > Published: January 2004 > Usually ships in 24 hours > List Price:$49.99 > Our Price: $34.99 > > Dan Braun > > > -- > Dan Braun - PegaSoft Canada / CityTV > danb.nospam-iRg7kjdsKiH3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org] On Behalf Of Madison > Kelly > Sent: Monday, February 09, 2004 12:44 PM > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: [TLUG]: Another BASH Scripting question > > Hi all, > > Sorry for asking so many questions! I am on quite the learning curve > at the moment! :) > > I am on the last portion of my firewall script and I need something > like an array (though judging from what I have read on array's, not > exactly one). > > Here is what I am trying to do: I have rules for multiple servers. > Later on we will add more servers. I already will have to copy/paste the > > variables and update the data for the servers but I don't want to have > to edit the actual script. To do this, I want to have the script read > the value from a variable but have part of that variable name itself be > dynamic. This is what is stumping me... > > In my head, I am trying to do this: > > # How many servers do we have? > SRV_NAME="SRV1 SRV2" > > # Rules for server > SRV1_SNAT_IP="192.168.2.10:111.222.333.44 > SRV1_IB_TCP="22 25 53 80 110" > SRV1_IB_UDP="22 25 53 80 110" > SRV1_LAN_TCP="22>192.168.1.12" > SRV1_LAN_TCP="22>192.168.1.12" > > # Rules for server > SRV2_SNAT_IP="192.168.2.11:111.222.333.45 > SRV2_IB_TCP="22 80" > SRV2_IB_UDP="22 80" > SRV2_LAN_TCP="22>192.168.1.16" > SRV2_LAN_TCP="22>192.168.1.16" > > > echo -n "Checking to see if we have servers: " > if [ "${SRV_NAME}" != "" ] ; then > echo "we do!" > echo "Setting up rules for each public server: " > for server in ${SRV_NAME} ; do > echo "Processing: "${server} > > # Here is where things break! > > echo "${server}_SNAT_IP" | { > IFS=':' read pubip inetip > echo "Internal IP: "${pubip} > echo "Internet IP: "${inetip} > } > done > fi > > The output is: > > Checking to see if we have servers: we do! > Setting up rules for each server: > Processing: SRV1 > Internal IP: SRV1_SNAT_IP > Internet IP: > Processing: SRV2 > Internal IP: SRV2_SNAT_IP > Internet IP: > > > So, my problem is that the variable name is becoming the value... How > > can I go about getting the value of to cobbled together variable name > instead? > > Thank you all so much again!! > > Madison > > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cinetron-uEvt2TsIf2EsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 10 04:30:07 2004 From: cinetron-uEvt2TsIf2EsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jim Ruxton) Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 23:30:07 -0500 Subject: PC slot stopped working?? References: <4025C3E1.2050509@passport.ca> <4026D6CA.8020208@sympatico.ca> <40270B92.8010808@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <40285E4F.4020208@passport.ca> > Just to be sure, see if there is a way to reset your BIOS or if a BIOS > update exists. Thanks for the suggestion. I tried upgrading my BIOS but it didn't fix it. It seems strange to me that the pc card is recognized but just won't start up. Any hardware gurus out there have any thoughts on this. I've cracked open my laptop before and repaired it but I have an ominous feeling about this one ... jim > > > Madison > > David J Patrick wrote: > >> Jim Ruxton wrote: >> >>> Hi , >>> >>> My PC slot on my laptop appears to have stopped working suddenly. >>> I'm wondering if it is a hardware or configuration problem. It has >>> stopped working in Linux and windows which makes me think it's the >>> hardware. :-( >> >> >> >> Hi Jim ! Long time no see ! >> Yup, I'd say that if it no longer works in linux OR Windoze it's >> BROKEN. but that's just me. >> good luck, >> djp > > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 10 05:46:28 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 00:46:28 -0500 Subject: PC slot stopped working?? In-Reply-To: <40285E4F.4020208-uEvt2TsIf2EsA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <4025C3E1.2050509@passport.ca> <4026D6CA.8020208@sympatico.ca> <40270B92.8010808@alteeve.com> <40285E4F.4020208@passport.ca> Message-ID: <40287034.4060405@alteeve.com> I assume you have tried other PC cards, right? If so with the same result than I am afraid you may be out of luck. If you need that to work for your machine to be useful e-mail me the exact make and model and I will see if I can dig up a replacement mainboard and swap it out for you. (Once I get some free time!! :) ). Madison Jim Ruxton wrote: > >> Just to be sure, see if there is a way to reset your BIOS or if a BIOS >> update exists. > > > Thanks for the suggestion. I tried upgrading my BIOS but it didn't fix > it. It seems strange to me that the pc card is recognized but just won't > start up. Any hardware gurus out there have any thoughts on this. I've > cracked open my laptop before and repaired it but I have an ominous > feeling about this one ... > jim -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pegasoft-iRg7kjdsKiH3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 10 09:44:42 2004 From: pegasoft-iRg7kjdsKiH3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (pegasoft-iRg7kjdsKiH3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 04:44:42 -0500 Subject: Another BASH Scripting question In-Reply-To: <40284321.9080706-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <40284321.9080706@rogers.com> Message-ID: <000001c3efba$82225730$c864a8c0@tardis.dyn.dhs.org> Oops, sorry about that... -- Dan Braun - PegaSoft Canada / CityTV danb.nospam-iRg7kjdsKiH3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org If you're going to e-mail a long URL, please include it in < >, so that it gets read as one line. Such as: -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 10 10:56:53 2004 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 05:56:53 -0500 Subject: Debian and KDE 3.2 In-Reply-To: <200402092030.49461.mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200402060547.51732.skuznets@blueprint.org> <20040207235753.GM732@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <200402092030.49461.mervc@eol.ca> Message-ID: <200402100556.53303.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> On February 9, 2004 08:30 pm, Merv Curley wrote: > > > For Debian stable users add the following to /etc/apt/sources.list: > > > > > > ? ? deb http://download.kde.org/stable/3.1.4/Debian/ woody main > > > > Or replace 3.1.4 with 'latest' and never worry about it again. :) ?At > > least that's what I recall using in the past. > > Well KDE state 3.2 instead of 3.1.4 when I visited. ?I have it in my > sources.list and when I tried to install kdebase there was a ton of > dependancy problems and I gave up. ?I don't think the deb is ready for us > yet. Doh, as Lennart suggested use http://download.kde.org/stable/latest/ Debian/ ... I copied the wrong line from my sources. I'm not sure what problems you're having, I'd originally installed kde 3.1.4 right from kde and the upgrade to 3.2.0 was trivial. It might have been a little tougher on the original upgrade from Debian's kde 2.2 to kde 3.1.x but I can't recall right now. -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pmills-5bG9SNWDbRX3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 10 18:10:40 2004 From: pmills-5bG9SNWDbRX3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Phillip Mills) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:10:40 -0500 Subject: Update dependencies In-Reply-To: References: <019601c3eeb2$ef6ea0e0$4201a8c0@ym.phub.net.cable.rogers.com> Message-ID: <200402101310.40885.pmills@axxent.ca> So far I've been in the habit of installing things one of two ways. Use my SuSE distribution CDs for whatever is there or download simple programs as source, build, and go. Now I'm trying to install some more-complicated things and seem to be falling into a pit. RPM. I get using it for local installations, but it seems to have http/ftp ability as well. And it doesn't actually *deny* that it can resolve dependencies. But I'm not sure how to get started. My favorite thing about Perl is CPAN where it will help you find servers, recursively check packages and version numbers.... I guess I'm hoping RPM can do equally well given the right incantation. I discovered rpmfind.org, but it seems to be more a catalog than an archive. Hints? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From adb-tlug-AbAJl/g/NLXk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 10 18:55:25 2004 From: adb-tlug-AbAJl/g/NLXk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org (Anthony de Boer) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:55:25 -0500 Subject: Options for LEGITIMATE mail relaying... In-Reply-To: <20040206030438.84FEF3FE2-xzRQuAxiFLNWk0Htik3J/w@public.gmane.org>; from cbbrowne-HInyCGIudOg@public.gmane.org on Thu, Feb 05, 2004 at 10:04:37PM -0500 References: <20040206030438.84FEF3FE2@cbbrowne.com> Message-ID: <20040210135525.R19596@leftmind.net> cbbrowne-HInyCGIudOg at public.gmane.org wrote: > Apparently the only way he has, at present, to get mail to come out of > his "@his-domain.com" address is to scp messages over to the host where > his web site and such resides, and inject messages straight into > /usr/lib/sendmail :-(. He could consider ssh'ing to that host and running mutt there; that beats having to deal with some gooeyware on his nonpenguin at home. -- Anthony de Boer -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 10 18:49:29 2004 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter L. Peres) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:49:29 +0200 (IST) Subject: Another BASH Scripting question In-Reply-To: <20040209175629.GA7671-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <4027C6CA.3030206@alteeve.com> <20040209175629.GA7671@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: > > Hint: > for i in $SRV_NAME; do > IFS=: read pubip inetip <<< "`eval echo \$${i}_SNAT_IP`" > done This command refuses to work on my system (bash 2.02) Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 10 18:58:51 2004 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter L. Peres) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:58:51 +0200 (IST) Subject: PC slot stopped working?? In-Reply-To: <40285E4F.4020208-uEvt2TsIf2EsA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <4025C3E1.2050509@passport.ca> <4026D6CA.8020208@sympatico.ca> <40270B92.8010808@alteeve.com> <40285E4F.4020208@passport.ca> Message-ID: Try another card (known to work in another system - f.ex. a CF card in its adapter). Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From c.f.a.johnson-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 10 23:32:41 2004 From: c.f.a.johnson-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Chris F.A. Johnson) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:32:41 -0500 (EST) Subject: Another BASH Scripting question In-Reply-To: References: <4027C6CA.3030206@alteeve.com> <20040209175629.GA7671@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: On Tue, 10 Feb 2004, Peter L. Peres wrote: > > > > Hint: > > for i in $SRV_NAME; do > > IFS=: read pubip inetip <<< "`eval echo \$${i}_SNAT_IP`" > > done > > This command refuses to work on my system (bash 2.02) It was introduced in bash2.05b. -- Chris F.A. Johnson ================================================================= cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org http://cfaj.freeshell.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 10 23:58:16 2004 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:58:16 -0500 Subject: Options for LEGITIMATE mail relaying... In-Reply-To: <20040206030438.84FEF3FE2-xzRQuAxiFLNWk0Htik3J/w@public.gmane.org> References: <20040206030438.84FEF3FE2@cbbrowne.com> Message-ID: <200402101858.16136.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> On February 5, 2004 10:04 pm, cbbrowne-HInyCGIudOg at public.gmane.org wrote: > Apparently the only way he has, at present, to get mail to come out of > his "@his-domain.com" address is to scp messages over to the host where > his web site and such resides, and inject messages straight into > /usr/lib/sendmail :-(. Have him tunnel smtp over ssh to his mail server. -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cinetron-uEvt2TsIf2EsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 11 00:04:36 2004 From: cinetron-uEvt2TsIf2EsA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Jim Ruxton) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:04:36 -0500 Subject: PC slot stopped working?? References: <4025C3E1.2050509@passport.ca> <4026D6CA.8020208@sympatico.ca> <40270B92.8010808@alteeve.com> <40285E4F.4020208@passport.ca> Message-ID: <40297194.2040609@passport.ca> Thanks for the suggestion Peter. I have 2 cards, a modem and a wireless card. Neither are working so I don't think it's the card. jim >Try another card (known to work in another system - f.ex. a CF card in its >adapter). > >Peter >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 11 07:08:04 2004 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 02:08:04 -0500 Subject: Another BASH Scripting question In-Reply-To: References: <4027C6CA.3030206@alteeve.com> <20040209175629.GA7671@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <20040211070804.GA3609@node1.opengeometry.net> On Tue, Feb 10, 2004 at 08:49:29PM +0200, Peter L. Peres wrote: > > > > Hint: > > for i in $SRV_NAME; do > > IFS=: read pubip inetip <<< "`eval echo \$${i}_SNAT_IP`" > > done > > This command refuses to work on my system (bash 2.02) Try latest Zsh or Bash. It is called "here-string", along the line as "here-document". -- William Park, Open Geometry Consulting, Linux solution for data management and processing. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linuxprogrammer2003-/E1597aS9LQxFYw1CcD5bw at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 11 11:36:38 2004 From: linuxprogrammer2003-/E1597aS9LQxFYw1CcD5bw at public.gmane.org (=?iso-8859-1?q?Alex=20Bobby?=) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 11:36:38 +0000 (GMT) Subject: #define ANSI_COMPILE In-Reply-To: <3386.216.138.194.32.1074729898.squirrel-16UnNR4aCrhlws70yGkXPA@public.gmane.org> References: <3386.216.138.194.32.1074729898.squirrel@www.beechtree.ca> Message-ID: <20040211113638.91178.qmail@web8301.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hello, I went through man page about GCC for '-ansi' compilalation and am not clear about the usage. How can the code be customized if the macro #define ANSI_COMPILE is used at the beginning of the implementation file. Regards Alex Yahoo! India Education Special: Study in the UK now. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 11 13:55:33 2004 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:55:33 -0500 Subject: [Hostname] Message-ID: <20040211135533.GA9598@my-wing> Hello all, There may actually be a simple fix for this but it has elluded me for years. How to prevent HOSTNAME lookups to external DNS. It's customary to give a machine a name, is it not? Localhost is bland and unoriginal. So how to deal with a standalone box using rp-pppoe and the ISP's primary DNS is my question. I'm weary at seeing "no such name" and "Hostname lookup failure." The lookup is useless, unecessary and downright stupid in this situation. Are there any magical entries to /etc/resolv.conf? Do I need to tweak /etc/nsswitch.conf? It already has files first for virtually everything. Am I missing a key file? The only option I haven't tried is db. Will that work and if so where can I look for help? It boils down to this; some applications insist upon determining hostname --fqdn even when domainname returns Embarrassed, farmer6re9 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 11 14:11:11 2004 From: lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org (Lloyd Budd) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 09:11:11 -0500 Subject: [Hostname] In-Reply-To: <20040211135533.GA9598-B5vlSFeRxX4@public.gmane.org> References: <20040211135533.GA9598@my-wing> Message-ID: <251B02DA-5C9C-11D8-8C2E-0003931BD222@foolswisdom.com> Append HOSTNAME to the 127.0.01 localhost line in /etc/hosts On 11-Feb-04, at 8:55, Gregory D Hough wrote: > There may actually be a simple fix for this but it has elluded me for > years. How to prevent HOSTNAME lookups to external DNS. > > It's customary to give a machine a name, is it not? Localhost is bland > and unoriginal. So how to deal with a standalone box using rp-pppoe > and the ISP's primary DNS is my question. I'm weary at seeing "no such > name" and "Hostname lookup failure." The lookup is useless, unecessary > and downright stupid in this situation. > > Are there any magical entries to /etc/resolv.conf? > > Do I need to tweak /etc/nsswitch.conf? It already has files first for > virtually everything. Am I missing a key file? The only option I > haven't tried is db. Will that work and if so where can I look for > help? > > It boils down to this; some applications insist upon determining > hostname --fqdn even when domainname returns -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lance-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 11 14:39:39 2004 From: lance-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Lance F. Squire) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 09:39:39 -0500 Subject: CD-RW install Message-ID: <402A3EAB.1000207@alteeve.com> I've added an HP CD-Writer Plus 8100 to my Linux box. Currently Fedora 1 grub loader. I can find how toos for after configuration, eg. How to burn But nothing on how to configure to be recognised as a burner. Kudzu currently sees it as a regular cd. I know I have to add something to the boot line...i think. But I'm not sure how and/or proper format. Thanks Lance F. Squire -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lists-tZhE6lH4Esk+k03BA+Hq9g at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 11 15:43:05 2004 From: lists-tZhE6lH4Esk+k03BA+Hq9g at public.gmane.org (Oliver Meyn) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 10:43:05 -0500 Subject: CD-RW install In-Reply-To: <402A3EAB.1000207-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <402A3EAB.1000207@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <1076514185.4460.10.camel@theconstruct.mineallmeyn.net> Hi Lance, On Wed, 2004-02-11 at 09:39, Lance F. Squire wrote: > I've added an HP CD-Writer Plus 8100 to my Linux box. Currently Fedora 1 > grub loader. > > I can find how toos for after configuration, eg. How to burn > But nothing on how to configure to be recognised as a burner. > > Kudzu currently sees it as a regular cd. > > I know I have to add something to the boot line...i think. But I'm not > sure how and/or proper format. > on your kernel line you want something like hdX=ide-scsi at the end, where hdX is your drive (eg hdc). Cheers, Oliver -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tiliescu-ZdyLq7YhDA8hunQcOVOuvCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 11 15:43:00 2004 From: tiliescu-ZdyLq7YhDA8hunQcOVOuvCwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Teodor Iliescu) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 10:43:00 -0500 (EST) Subject: CD-RW install In-Reply-To: <402A3EAB.1000207-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <402A3EAB.1000207@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <20040211103741.D35015@df.com> On Wed, 11 Feb 2004, Lance F. Squire wrote: > I know I have to add something to the boot line...i think. But I'm not > sure how and/or proper format. See what your kernel picks up the burner as (most likely hdd). dmesg | grep hd. Afterwards as root, in your /boot/grub/menu.lst, you should add something like this: --- title Fedora Core (2.4.22-1.2115.nptl) root (hd0,X) kernel /vmlinuz-2.4.22-1.2115.nptl ro root=LABEL=/ hdd=ide-scsi rhgb vga=791 initrd /initrd-2.4.22-1.2115.nptl.img --- Now this may vary, but you get the idea of where to insert the ide-scsi flags. This just tells the kernel to enable scsi emulation for that device. Afterwards, run cdrecord -scanbus, to see that it is listed. Additionally, if you run lsmod, you should see some extra modules loaded, such as ide-scsi. "Unix is simple, but it takes a genius to understand the simplicity." - Dennis Ritchie Teodor I. http://penguincomputing.iwarp.com GPG key fingerprint : 9AC8 A05C 78AD AD73 91DB CBE4 B644 F402 FBFD 5927 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 11 16:02:57 2004 From: taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 09:02:57 -0700 Subject: CD-RW install In-Reply-To: <1076514185.4460.10.camel-0lXLkTl3c71ptQ/RaucIWavRY+knis1x5NbjCUgZEJk@public.gmane.org> References: <402A3EAB.1000207@alteeve.com> <1076514185.4460.10.camel@theconstruct.mineallmeyn.net> Message-ID: <20040211160257.GA23134@idiom.novusordo.net> On Wed, Feb 11, 2004 at 10:43:05AM -0500, Oliver Meyn wrote: > Hi Lance, > > On Wed, 2004-02-11 at 09:39, Lance F. Squire wrote: > > I've added an HP CD-Writer Plus 8100 to my Linux box. Currently Fedora 1 > > grub loader. > > > > I can find how toos for after configuration, eg. How to burn > > But nothing on how to configure to be recognised as a burner. > > > > Kudzu currently sees it as a regular cd. > > > > I know I have to add something to the boot line...i think. But I'm not > > sure how and/or proper format. > > > on your kernel line you want something like > hdX=ide-scsi > > at the end, where hdX is your drive (eg hdc). Note that this is no longer required with recent kernels (should definitely include fedora) and cdrecord 2.0. cdrdao still requires it, though, AFAIK. -- taa It is the primary caretaking relationships of infancy and childhood which determine the core neurobiological organization of the human individual. --Bruce D. Perry /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 11 16:09:09 2004 From: taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 09:09:09 -0700 Subject: #define ANSI_COMPILE In-Reply-To: <20040211113638.91178.qmail-T8J7+eYq8PYn1dgYqARqB/xNefe2kvS0AL8bYrjMMd8@public.gmane.org> References: <3386.216.138.194.32.1074729898.squirrel@www.beechtree.ca> <20040211113638.91178.qmail@web8301.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20040211160909.GB23134@idiom.novusordo.net> On Wed, Feb 11, 2004 at 11:36:38AM +0000, Alex Bobby wrote: > > Hello, > > I went through man page about GCC for '-ansi' compilalation and am not clear about the usage. gcc source.c -o program -ansi That will require strict ANSI C compliance from the source code. There are some things which gcc allows which are not strictly ANSI; that flag disables those things. > How can the code be customized if the macro > > #define ANSI_COMPILE > > is used at the beginning of the implementation file. That question makes no sense to me. The -ansi flag probably enables a #define or two so that source code can 'know' that it's being compiled by a strictly ANSI compiler. your question does not make sense, though. What customisation are you talking about? The #define directive simply defines that symbol for the C preprocessor. Look elsewhere in the code to see any #if ANSI_COMPILE statements which would cause parts of the code to be stripped/enabled. The -ansi flag will have no effect on the line of code you quoted. Or are you saying that the GCC manpage specifies that -ansi causes the equivalent to #define ANSI_COMPILE for the preprocessor? In that case one would do the following in the code: #if ANSI_COMPILE // Code here that is ANSI-only #else // Code here that is non-ANSI #endif If you've never seen C preprocessor constructs, go find a good tutorial on C, or pick up a good C book. Opinions vary, but invariably include K&R's "The C Programming Language, 2nd ed" as a reference manual. -- taa In order to solve the problems of violence, we need to transform our culture. --Bruce D. Perry /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 11 17:00:44 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 12:00:44 -0500 Subject: CD-RW install In-Reply-To: <402A3EAB.1000207-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <402A3EAB.1000207@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <20040211170044.GA9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Feb 11, 2004 at 09:39:39AM -0500, Lance F. Squire wrote: > I've added an HP CD-Writer Plus 8100 to my Linux box. Currently Fedora 1 > grub loader. > > I can find how toos for after configuration, eg. How to burn > But nothing on how to configure to be recognised as a burner. > > Kudzu currently sees it as a regular cd. > > I know I have to add something to the boot line...i think. But I'm not > sure how and/or proper format. If you have cdrecord 2.x and 2.4.x kernel, try this: cdrecord -scabbus -dev ATAPI: If that works, then you have nothing else to do, just doing this should work: cdrecord -dev ATAPI:0,0,0 (replace by what scanbus said) -speed x -eject etc blah.iso mkisofs makes the .iso. If you don't have cdrecord 2.x or you want to use cdrdao for some reason, you will need to enable ide-scsi for the device in question (cdrdao cvs at the moment does support ATAPI burning but the latest release doesn't). You do get significatly better performance by not using ide-scsi since you can then do DMA when writing audio and weird block size CDs, not just 2048byte block data CDs. I certainly don't use ide-scsi anymore. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 11 17:02:15 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 12:02:15 -0500 Subject: CD-RW install In-Reply-To: <20040211160257.GA23134-7r3UYZMxfuqyvPIx3LBjwNHuzzzSOjJt@public.gmane.org> References: <402A3EAB.1000207@alteeve.com> <1076514185.4460.10.camel@theconstruct.mineallmeyn.net> <20040211160257.GA23134@idiom.novusordo.net> Message-ID: <20040211170215.GB9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Feb 11, 2004 at 09:02:57AM -0700, Taavi Burns wrote: > Note that this is no longer required with recent kernels (should definitely > include fedora) and cdrecord 2.0. cdrdao still requires it, though, AFAIK. cdrdao CVS has support for ATAPI burners now. Latest release doesn't. There are RPMs available for the CVS release with support. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pmills-5bG9SNWDbRX3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 11 17:20:43 2004 From: pmills-5bG9SNWDbRX3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Phillip Mills) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 12:20:43 -0500 Subject: Samba/VPN novice In-Reply-To: <1076514185.4460.10.camel-0lXLkTl3c71ptQ/RaucIWavRY+knis1x5NbjCUgZEJk@public.gmane.org> References: <402A3EAB.1000207@alteeve.com> <1076514185.4460.10.camel@theconstruct.mineallmeyn.net> Message-ID: <200402111220.43979.pmills@axxent.ca> I'm trying to use my Linux system (SuSE 8.1) to talk via VPN to a network of PCs. I built the vpn module, installed it, and I'm able to ping systems through the tunnel. I installed everything I could find (:-) related to samba or smb. I defined a share on my system, started smbd and nmbd, and I'm able to use 'smbclient -L 127.0.0.1' and get a reasonable view of my own services. However, any attempt to use smbclient or smbmount through the VPN is getting me messages of the form: "timeout connecting to xx.xx.xx.xx:139 Error connecting to xx.xx.xx.xx (Operation already in progress) 2903: Connection to ABC failed SMB connection failed" In spite of ping working, I *think* the problem is on the VPN side because telnet to port 139 on the target system hangs also. Any suggestions? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 11 18:00:21 2004 From: rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org (Rob Sutherland) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 13:00:21 -0500 Subject: GPL tools for inventorying NT networks Message-ID: <20040211130021.795cc64e.rob@cheapersafer.com> Hi, I'm looking for tools that will allow you to do a software inventory of a a network of Windows NT machines. I've already checked out things like http://www.trackbird.com/ etc. - I'm not looking for a big ticket item that will track licensing etc, just a tool that will get you the basic info on how many of what is installed and where it is, preferably GPL'd, but in any event, cheap :-) Rob -- Rob Sutherland - rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org Computer Support at http://www.cheapersafer.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lance-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 11 18:32:47 2004 From: lance-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Lance F. Squire) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 13:32:47 -0500 Subject: CD-RW install In-Reply-To: <20040211103741.D35015-8bLLHpYfZlI@public.gmane.org> References: <402A3EAB.1000207@alteeve.com> <20040211103741.D35015@df.com> Message-ID: <402A754F.8060507@alteeve.com> Teodor Iliescu wrote: > > > See what your kernel picks up the burner as (most likely hdd). > dmesg | grep hd. > Actually knew it was hdd when I installed it. > Afterwards as root, in your /boot/grub/menu.lst, you should add something > like this: > > --- > title Fedora Core (2.4.22-1.2115.nptl) > root (hd0,X) > kernel /vmlinuz-2.4.22-1.2115.nptl ro root=LABEL=/ hdd=ide-scsi rhgb vga=791 > initrd /initrd-2.4.22-1.2115.nptl.img > --- > Much Thanks! A variation of this worked flawlessly! This reply is late due to much burning taking place in root account. > > Afterwards, run cdrecord -scanbus, to see that it is listed. > This is how I knew it wasn't set-up properly. :) Again Thanks, Lance F. Squire -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 11 18:34:51 2004 From: matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (G. Matthew Rice) Date: 11 Feb 2004 13:34:51 -0500 Subject: laptop/computer rentals Message-ID: Hi there, John Terpstra is hoping to setup a one day workshop on Samba for during real world linux in March. Does anyone know a place [or ball park prices] on renting 20-ish laptops or desktops? Thanks, -- g. matthew rice starnix inc. phone: 905-771-0017 x242 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 11 21:51:40 2004 From: mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Merv Curley) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:51:40 -0500 Subject: Debian and KDE 3.2 In-Reply-To: <200402100556.53303.fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <200402060547.51732.skuznets@blueprint.org> <200402092030.49461.mervc@eol.ca> <200402100556.53303.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: <200402111651.40220.mervc@eol.ca> On February 10, 2004 05:56 am, Fraser Campbell wrote: > On February 9, 2004 08:30 pm, Merv Curley wrote: > > > > For Debian stable users add the following to /etc/apt/sources.list: > > > > > > > > ? ? deb http://download.kde.org/stable/3.1.4/Debian/ woody main > > > > > > Or replace 3.1.4 with 'latest' and never worry about it again. :) ?At > > > least that's what I recall using in the past. > > > > Well KDE state 3.2 instead of 3.1.4 when I visited. ?I have it in my > > sources.list and when I tried to install kdebase there was a ton of > > dependancy problems and I gave up. ?I don't think the deb is ready for > > us yet. > > Doh, as Lennart suggested use http://download.kde.org/stable/latest/ > Debian/ ... I copied the wrong line from my sources. > > I'm not sure what problems you're having, I'd originally installed kde > 3.1.4 right from kde and the upgrade to 3.2.0 was trivial. It might have > been a little tougher on the original upgrade from Debian's kde 2.2 to > kde 3.1.x but I can't recall right now. I have since read that the KDE 3.2 was compiled only to be compatible with 'woody'. Since I am to a large state 'unstable' that explains the dependancy problems. I might just try the 12 hour compile of 3.2, until the frustration level gets too high anyway. -- Merv Curley Scarborough, Ont Libranet Linux 2.8 KDE 3.1.4 KMail 1.5.4 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From anton-F0u+EriZ6ihBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 11 22:55:05 2004 From: anton-F0u+EriZ6ihBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Anton Markov) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 17:55:05 -0500 Subject: Update dependencies In-Reply-To: <200402101310.40885.pmills-5bG9SNWDbRX3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> References: <019601c3eeb2$ef6ea0e0$4201a8c0@ym.phub.net.cable.rogers.com> <200402101310.40885.pmills@axxent.ca> Message-ID: <402AB2C9.9090004@truxtar.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 I don't know about the pure RPM, but you can use "apt-get" to automatically download RPM packages along with all necessary dependencies and install them automatically. I have used apt-get on Redhat with RPMs, so I am sure someone can point you to the SuSE port. Phillip Mills wrote: > > My favorite thing about Perl is CPAN where it will help you find servers, > recursively check packages and version numbers.... I guess I'm hoping RPM > can do equally well given the right incantation. I discovered rpmfind.org, > but it seems to be more a catalog than an archive. > > Hints? - -- Anton Markov <("anton" + "@" + "truxtar" + "." + "com")> GnuPG Key fingerprint = 5546 A6E2 1FFB 9BB8 15C3 CE34 46B7 8D93 3AD1 44B4 *** LINUX - MAY THE SOURCE BE WITH YOU! *** -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFAKrLXRreNkzrRRLQRAis4AKCaw6fFwSd34+C02j277BGluNiX/QCgjEG/ KiLAqQHBH/A1QQL+hBTLodA= =EHAh -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 12 04:19:40 2004 From: taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 21:19:40 -0700 Subject: Update dependencies In-Reply-To: <402AB2C9.9090004-F0u+EriZ6ihBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <019601c3eeb2$ef6ea0e0$4201a8c0@ym.phub.net.cable.rogers.com> <200402101310.40885.pmills@axxent.ca> <402AB2C9.9090004@truxtar.com> Message-ID: <20040212041940.GA42017@idiom.novusordo.net> On Wed, Feb 11, 2004 at 05:55:05PM -0500, Anton Markov wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > I don't know about the pure RPM, but you can use "apt-get" to > automatically download RPM packages along with all necessary > dependencies and install them automatically. I have used apt-get on > Redhat with RPMs, so I am sure someone can point you to the SuSE port. On Mandrake at least there's urpmi. -- taa I am suggesting we examine the damage to children whose childhoods might not even be called strict. --Karen Walant /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fcsoft-3Emkkp+1Olsmp8TqCH86vg at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 12 16:17:51 2004 From: fcsoft-3Emkkp+1Olsmp8TqCH86vg at public.gmane.org (bob findlay) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 11:17:51 -0500 Subject: how to teach a Linux browser to get through to this URL? Message-ID: <20040212161444.9AAAD8EEB@outbox.allstream.net> Here's a site that a friend of mine would like to access from his Linux box at home. http://support.learnflex.net How can one get a Linux browser to send the authentication header that this site is requiring? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From talexb-SBdzbUvMQDunS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 12 16:24:57 2004 From: talexb-SBdzbUvMQDunS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (talexb-SBdzbUvMQDunS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 11:24:57 -0500 (EST) Subject: how to teach a Linux browser to get through to this URL? In-Reply-To: <20040212161444.9AAAD8EEB-pwyU32sTfCqP7boJH+kiu+TW4wlIGRCZ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040212161444.9AAAD8EEB@outbox.allstream.net> Message-ID: Hi Bob, How about using Opera, and configuring it to look like IE? On Thu, 12 Feb 2004, bob findlay wrote: > Here's a site that a friend of mine would like to access from his Linux box > at home. > > http://support.learnflex.net > > How can one get a Linux browser to send the authentication header that this > site is requiring? > > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From steven.meyer-bdq14YP6qtRg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 12 16:47:39 2004 From: steven.meyer-bdq14YP6qtRg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (steven meyer) Date: 12 Feb 2004 11:47:39 -0500 Subject: how to teach a Linux browser to get through to this URL? In-Reply-To: <20040212161444.9AAAD8EEB-pwyU32sTfCqP7boJH+kiu+TW4wlIGRCZ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040212161444.9AAAD8EEB@outbox.allstream.net> Message-ID: <1076604458.2532.204.camel@XANDROS> It works using IE5 under wine... This site may only work with IE in other areas as well - who knows? Regards, Steven On Thu, 2004-02-12 at 11:17, bob findlay wrote: > Here's a site that a friend of mine would like to access from his Linux box > at home. > > http://support.learnflex.net > > How can one get a Linux browser to send the authentication header that this > site is requiring? > > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mcg2-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 12 16:57:40 2004 From: mcg2-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Matthew Godycki) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 11:57:40 -0500 Subject: how to teach a Linux browser to get through to this Message-ID: <20040212165740.IGPZ490347.web02-imail.rogers.com@localhost> I get the authorization window using Mozilla Firebird... > > From: steven meyer > Date: 2004/02/12 Thu AM 11:47:39 EST > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: how to teach a Linux browser to get through to this > URL? > > It works using IE5 under wine... This site may only work with IE in > other areas as well - who knows? > > Regards, > > Steven > > On Thu, 2004-02-12 at 11:17, bob findlay wrote: > > Here's a site that a friend of mine would like to access from his Linux box > > at home. > > > > http://support.learnflex.net > > > > How can one get a Linux browser to send the authentication header that this > > site is requiring? > > > > > > > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From kcozens-qazKcTl6WRFWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 12 16:46:24 2004 From: kcozens-qazKcTl6WRFWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (Kevin Cozens) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 11:46:24 -0500 Subject: how to teach a Linux browser to get through to this URL? In-Reply-To: <20040212161444.9AAAD8EEB-pwyU32sTfCqP7boJH+kiu+TW4wlIGRCZ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040212161444.9AAAD8EEB@outbox.allstream.net> Message-ID: <6.0.1.1.2.20040212114322.027e83b0@mail.interlog.com> At 11:17 AM 02/12/2004, you wrote: >http://support.learnflex.net > >How can one get a Linux browser to send the authentication header that this >site is requiring? I get an authentication error when I access the site from Netscape under Windows. The site uses IIS so perhaps it might just be their way of saying that you need to use IE to view the site and not Netscape/Mozilla. As soon as I tried to connect via IE I get the dialog box popping up asking me for user name, password, and domain. Cheers! Kevin. (http://www.interlog.com/~kcozens/) Owner of Elecraft K2 #2172 |"What are we going to do today, Borg?" E-mail:kcozens at interlog dot com|"Same thing we always do, Pinkutus: Packet:ve3syb-XXPEJ3/fxIc at public.gmane.org#con.on.ca.na| Try to assimilate the world!" #include | -Pinkutus & the Borg -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rfk-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 00:13:59 2004 From: rfk-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Robert F. Kennedy) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:13:59 -0500 Subject: DNS question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <008401c3f1c6$477f2780$1902a8c0@coilnetworks.com> Hello, I am trying to set up a DNS server for shambhalatoronto.org using a machine with a fresh install of RH9 fully updated. I get the following error: named-xfer[20373]: connect(66.11.164.95) for zone shamabhalatoronto.org failed: Connection timed out It seems that my firewall is not letting signals through to port 53 (used www.dnsreport.com) which named is listening on. My Linksys router is forwarding port 53 among others to my local IP 192.168.2.27. Another strange thing that has gone wrong while trying to get DNS working and is probably related is that my Mozilla browser can find sites by IP number but can't resolve hosts using domain names. If anyone has any ideas of what I might be doing wrong, please advise me. I have been struggling with this for weeks now. I have cut and pasted all the relevant configuration files below, please let me know if there is another file that I should include. Plug: Istop is providing free DNS secondary name serving and has helped me out a lot with this problem. Thanks for any assistance, Robert Named.conf file: options { query-source address * port 53; listen-on { 192.168.2.27; }; directory "/var/named"; forward first; forwarders { 66.11.168.195; 66.11.168.198; }; }; - - - zone "shambhalatoronto.org" { type master; file "db.shambhalatoronto.org"; allow-transfer { 66.11.168.199; }; }; db.shambhalatoronto.org file: $TTL 600 @ IN SOA shambhalatoronto.org. hostmaster.shambhalatoronto.org. ( 14 ; Serial 288 ; Refresh 14400 ; Retry 3600000 ; Expire 600 ) ; Minimum ; Name servers IN NS ns1.shambhalatoronto.org. IN NS ns.istop.com. ; Mail server for domain IN MX 10 ns1.shambhalatoronto.org. ; Public servers localhost IN A 127.0.0.1 ns1 IN A 66.11.164.95 mail IN A 66.11.164.95 www IN A 66.11.164.95 ftp IN A 66.11.164.95 ; EOF Network Configuration (GUI): Host - ns1.shambhalatoronto.org Primary DNS - 66.11.164.95 Secondary DNS - 66.11.168.199 Tertiary DNS - 192.168.2.27 DNS Search Path - shambhalatoronto.org Resolve.conf file: ; generated by /sbin/dhclient-script - Rfk added local IP line search shambhalatoronto.org nameserver 66.11.164.95 nameserver 66.11.168.199 nameserver 192.168.2.27 hosts file: # Do not remove the following line, or various programs # that require network functionality will fail. 127.0.0.1 localhost.localdomain localhost 66.11.164.95 ns1.shambhalatoronto.org ns1 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 00:59:28 2004 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:59:28 -0500 Subject: Business case for moving to Linux In-Reply-To: <20040206062528.GA7854-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040206062528.GA7854@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <20040213005928.GA5176@m450> On Fri, Feb 06, 2004 at 01:25:28AM -0500, William Park wrote > Does anyone have URLs which outline "business case" for moving to Linux? > It would be helpful to see few samples, before writing my own. If you run into the old saw "but there ain't no linux desktop apps", here are a couple of good sites with lists of linux equivalents to Windows "must-have" apps. http://www.chlug.org/oss_equiv.php http://linuxshop.ru/linuxbegin/win-lin-soft-en/table.shtml -- Walter Dnes Email users are divided into two classes; 1) Those who have effective spam-blocking 2) Those who wish they did -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From constantine.k-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 01:54:21 2004 From: constantine.k-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Constantine Karbaliotis) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:54:21 -0500 Subject: how to teach a Linux browser to get through to this In-Reply-To: <20040212165740.IGPZ490347.web02-imail.rogers.com-bi+AKbBUZKZeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org> References: <20040212165740.IGPZ490347.web02-imail.rogers.com@localhost> Message-ID: <402C2E4D.8020105@rogers.com> With Firebird, you can install an extension called User Agent Switcher; works fine to con websites into thinking you have IE. Matthew Godycki wrote: >I get the authorization window using Mozilla Firebird... > > >>From: steven meyer >>Date: 2004/02/12 Thu AM 11:47:39 EST >>To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org >>Subject: Re: [TLUG]: how to teach a Linux browser to get through to this >> URL? >> >>It works using IE5 under wine... This site may only work with IE in >>other areas as well - who knows? >> >>Regards, >> >>Steven >> >>On Thu, 2004-02-12 at 11:17, bob findlay wrote: >> >> >>>Here's a site that a friend of mine would like to access from his Linux box >>>at home. >>> >>>http://support.learnflex.net >>> >>>How can one get a Linux browser to send the authentication header that this >>>site is requiring? >>> >>> >>> >>>-- >>>The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >>>TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >>>How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml >>> >>> >>-- >>The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >>TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >>How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml >> >> >> > >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From kru_tch-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 02:07:53 2004 From: kru_tch-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (Steve) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 21:07:53 -0500 Subject: how to teach a Linux browser to get through to this In-Reply-To: <402C2E4D.8020105-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <20040212165740.IGPZ490347.web02-imail.rogers.com@localhost> <402C2E4D.8020105@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20040213020753.GC1330@barnyard.192.168.0.1> On Thu, Feb 12, 2004 at 08:54:21PM -0500 or thereabouts, Constantine Karbaliotis wrote: > With Firebird, you can install an extension called User Agent Switcher; > works fine to con websites into thinking you have IE. Offically announced yesterday, is the release of Firefox 0.8. Yep, it's no longer called Firebird. :) Might wanna upgrade... -- A man's best friend is his dogma. ================================= Stephen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From anton-F0u+EriZ6ihBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 02:15:18 2004 From: anton-F0u+EriZ6ihBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Anton Markov) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 21:15:18 -0500 Subject: Debian Package Management and Firefox Message-ID: <402C3336.5030409@truxtar.com> Hello guys, Well, I've been running Debian now for two weeks, and I love it, especially the package management system! Except for one thing: Now that Firefox 0.8 browser (Mozilla Firebird 0.8 renamed) (YAY!) has come out along with Thunderbird 0.5 e-mail client, I want to install them on my system. For now I just decompressed them to a folder in my home directory and run them from there, but I want to make them the default browser/e-mail. I have read about the update-alternatives command, but I am not very clear whether it will work with a non-dpkg'ed application (there are no Firefox packages for Debian that I know of). Any suggestions are appreciated. P.S. The Firefox website: -- Anton Markov <("anton" + "@" + "truxtar" + "." + "com")> GnuPG Key fingerprint = 5546 A6E2 1FFB 9BB8 15C3 CE34 46B7 8D93 3AD1 44B4 *** LINUX - MAY THE SOURCE BE WITH YOU! *** -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 02:28:37 2004 From: rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org (Rob Sutherland) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 21:28:37 -0500 Subject: how to teach a Linux browser to get through to this In-Reply-To: <20040213020753.GC1330-o7t0nEE3I5NAPr+L1dq8bsJ5zM57E+Gt@public.gmane.org> References: <20040212165740.IGPZ490347.web02-imail.rogers.com@localhost> <402C2E4D.8020105@rogers.com> <20040213020753.GC1330@barnyard.192.168.0.1> Message-ID: <20040212212837.62c32b1b.rob@cheapersafer.com> On Thu, 12 Feb 2004 21:07:53 -0500 Steve wrote: > On Thu, Feb 12, 2004 at 08:54:21PM -0500 or thereabouts, Constantine Karbaliotis wrote: > > With Firebird, you can install an extension called User Agent Switcher; > > works fine to con websites into thinking you have IE. > > Offically announced yesterday, is the release of Firefox 0.8. Yep, it's > no longer called Firebird. :) Might wanna upgrade... > I've been using it - pretty nice. A lot faster than moz... Rob -- Rob Sutherland - rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org Computer Support at http://www.cheapersafer.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 03:43:07 2004 From: IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Ilya Palagin) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 22:43:07 -0500 Subject: Debian Package Management and Firefox In-Reply-To: <402C3336.5030409-F0u+EriZ6ihBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <402C3336.5030409@truxtar.com> Message-ID: <402C47CB.7080101@rogers.com> Anton Markov wrote: > Hello guys, > > Well, I've been running Debian now for two weeks, and I love it, > especially the package management system! Except for one thing: dpkg is absolutely the best > > Now that Firefox 0.8 browser (Mozilla Firebird 0.8 renamed) (YAY!) has > come out along with Thunderbird 0.5 e-mail client, I want to install > them on my system. For now I just decompressed them to a folder in my > home directory and run them from there, but I want to make them the > default browser/e-mail. > > I have read about the update-alternatives command, but I am not very > clear whether it will work with a non-dpkg'ed application (there are no > Firefox packages for Debian that I know of). Any suggestions are > appreciated. > Convert the tarball to deb with 'alien' utility, install it with dpkg and create softlinks to /usr/bin Actually, these tasks used to be completed by setting environment variables like $BROWSER, but KDE and Gnome will definitely ignore it. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 04:56:25 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 23:56:25 -0500 Subject: Debian Package Management and Firefox In-Reply-To: <402C3336.5030409-F0u+EriZ6ihBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <402C3336.5030409@truxtar.com> Message-ID: <20040213045624.GC9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Feb 12, 2004 at 09:15:18PM -0500, Anton Markov wrote: > Well, I've been running Debian now for two weeks, and I love it, > especially the package management system! Except for one thing: > > Now that Firefox 0.8 browser (Mozilla Firebird 0.8 renamed) (YAY!) has > come out along with Thunderbird 0.5 e-mail client, I want to install > them on my system. For now I just decompressed them to a folder in my > home directory and run them from there, but I want to make them the > default browser/e-mail. > > I have read about the update-alternatives command, but I am not very > clear whether it will work with a non-dpkg'ed application (there are no > Firefox packages for Debian that I know of). Any suggestions are > appreciated. > > > P.S. The Firefox website: > You could check www.apt-get.org and www.backports.org for things like that. I know firebird is in unstable at least (I run it at times, although I find plain mozilla way more compatible with most web sites, beating konqueror, opera and firebird. At least for flash sites.) Anyhow, at least it should be possible to get a backport if not now, within a few days. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 04:57:58 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 23:57:58 -0500 Subject: Debian Package Management and Firefox In-Reply-To: <402C47CB.7080101-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <402C3336.5030409@truxtar.com> <402C47CB.7080101@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20040213045758.GD9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Feb 12, 2004 at 10:43:07PM -0500, Ilya Palagin wrote: > Convert the tarball to deb with 'alien' utility, install it with dpkg > and create softlinks to /usr/bin That won't create a quality package that deals with alternatives and the like. It creates a rather icky mess (although one the package manager knows how to install/uninstall.) > Actually, these tasks used to be completed by setting environment > variables like $BROWSER, but KDE and Gnome will definitely ignore it. Certainly another option. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From clark-FcERjQtIsMjQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 09:37:08 2004 From: clark-FcERjQtIsMjQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Robert J. Clark) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 04:37:08 -0500 Subject: how to teach a Linux browser to get through to this URL? References: <20040212161444.9AAAD8EEB@outbox.allstream.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 12 Feb 2004 11:17:51 -0500, Bob Findlay wrote: > Here's a site that a friend of mine would like to access from his Linux box > at home. > > http://support.learnflex.net > > How can one get a Linux browser to send the authentication header that this > site is requiring? The site is using an (obsolete) Mircosoft-only authentication mechanism called NTLM (NT loadable module). Most non-IE browsers do not (and probably will not) support it. Mozilla Fire(bird|fox) does have support for this mechanism, but you have to get the latest version to use the newly added feature. - Rob -- (sigless) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 14:06:34 2004 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:06:34 -0500 Subject: [StartingOver] Message-ID: <20040213140634.GA2023@my-wing> Greetings tlug, Although I have four years of Linux under my belt, the more I learn the less I know. My Lin/Win network fell apart, rather I TOOK it apart. I saw things I didn't understand and felt it best to start over from scratch. I wish to begin rebuilding from the firewall. One thing I noticed right from the get-go is the way a default firewall is handling certain connection requests. Most notably is the way Shorewall on Mandrake (out-of-the-box) treats ICMP (8) and port 135. Pings are dropped which is a good thing, but SYN packets to 135 go to a reject chain and are ultimately sent a ZeroWindow RST ACK. I thought this port was akin to a Windows specific vulnerability with DCOM services. Why would a Linux firewall be treating it diffently in not just dropping it altogether? Secondly, call me a geek, but I get more enjoyment watching tcpdump than network TV and this just came in: 65.203.175.213:666 > 66.203.175.213:1026 in the form of a Messenger NetrSendMessage request DCE RPC trying to tell me how to disable pop- ups and to go to www dot messagestop dot net. I'm not concerned with this traffic on this machine, but as I rebuild the network I've had to give the kids a WinNT box to run that cludge called MSN Messenger. And although I've done my best to DCOMbobulate that machine, I'd feel a whole lot better putting it back behind a real firewall ASAP. This particular set of packets is brand new to me, and the remarkable similarity to my current IP address is disturbing. I believe it is no coincidence and wish to bring the new network back up prepared for such. Perhaps if someone could briefly explain the 135 RST ACK (RFC reference?) and the IP address similarity in part II, I can better prepare the new firewall for the network. Stacked Heaps Of Thanks, farmer6re9 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tchitow-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 14:20:36 2004 From: tchitow-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Martin Duclos) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:20:36 -0500 Subject: [StartingOver] Message-ID: This is slightly off topic, but why don't you chuck the winNT box alltogether if only used for MSN messenger. Gaim is a great gui for instant messenger type things. I don't personally use that one cause I prefer AMSN. It's a great MSNMessenger clone. I'm using that one. Work great without a hick. Well, I remember having to upgrade the software once when microsoft decided to sneeze a protocol change. Well, the new complient verson of the app was released 2 days before the new protocol was in place. A google search should direct you to the AMSN webpage. Also on source forge. Anyhow, just a little note to say that there IS a better way! Martin Duclos ----Original Message Follows---- From: Gregory D Hough Reply-To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: [TLUG]: [StartingOver] Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:06:34 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: from lethe.ss.org ([206.108.5.1]) by mc3-f16.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6824); Fri, 13 Feb 2004 06:07:29 -0800 Received: by lethe.ss.org (Postfix)id 1DBF06D528; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:06:43 -0500 (EST) Received: by lethe.ss.org (Postfix, from userid 54)id E4A4612381; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:06:42 -0500 (EST) X-Message-Info: JGTYoYF78jGz3Hv98pSDEafj5f7YfJcz Delivered-To: tlug-route-MHjupGqSvN5g9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org X-Original-To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Delivered-To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Message-ID: <20040213140634.GA2023-B5vlSFeRxX4 at public.gmane.org> X-Mailer: Balsa 2.0.14 Lines: 37 Precedence: list Return-Path: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Feb 2004 14:07:30.0198 (UTC) FILETIME=[B7C9B360:01C3F23A] Greetings tlug, Although I have four years of Linux under my belt, the more I learn the less I know. My Lin/Win network fell apart, rather I TOOK it apart. I saw things I didn't understand and felt it best to start over from scratch. I wish to begin rebuilding from the firewall. One thing I noticed right from the get-go is the way a default firewall is handling certain connection requests. Most notably is the way Shorewall on Mandrake (out-of-the-box) treats ICMP (8) and port 135. Pings are dropped which is a good thing, but SYN packets to 135 go to a reject chain and are ultimately sent a ZeroWindow RST ACK. I thought this port was akin to a Windows specific vulnerability with DCOM services. Why would a Linux firewall be treating it diffently in not just dropping it altogether? Secondly, call me a geek, but I get more enjoyment watching tcpdump than network TV and this just came in: 65.203.175.213:666 > 66.203.175.213:1026 in the form of a Messenger NetrSendMessage request DCE RPC trying to tell me how to disable pop- ups and to go to www dot messagestop dot net. I'm not concerned with this traffic on this machine, but as I rebuild the network I've had to give the kids a WinNT box to run that cludge called MSN Messenger. And although I've done my best to DCOMbobulate that machine, I'd feel a whole lot better putting it back behind a real firewall ASAP. This particular set of packets is brand new to me, and the remarkable similarity to my current IP address is disturbing. I believe it is no coincidence and wish to bring the new network back up prepared for such. Perhaps if someone could briefly explain the 135 RST ACK (RFC reference?) and the IP address similarity in part II, I can better prepare the new firewall for the network. Stacked Heaps Of Thanks, farmer6re9 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/features&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.msn.com%2f%3fpage%3dmisc%2fspecialoffers%26pgmarket%3den-ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mike-DlQxw/23Tq2aMJb+Lgu22Q at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 14:42:00 2004 From: mike-DlQxw/23Tq2aMJb+Lgu22Q at public.gmane.org (Mike Waychison) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:42:00 -0500 Subject: how to teach a Linux browser to get through to this URL? In-Reply-To: <20040212161444.9AAAD8EEB-pwyU32sTfCqP7boJH+kiu+TW4wlIGRCZ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040212161444.9AAAD8EEB@outbox.allstream.net> Message-ID: <402CE238.1070400@waychison.com> bob findlay wrote: > Here's a site that a friend of mine would like to access from his Linux box > at home. > > http://support.learnflex.net > > How can one get a Linux browser to send the authentication header that this > site is requiring? > NTLM (NT Lan Manager, a cheap challenge response mechanism) over HTTP support was added to mozilla in version 1.4. I do get a username/password dialog here in mozilla 1.6 HTH, Mike Waychison -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From shijialee-/E1597aS9LQAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 14:53:00 2004 From: shijialee-/E1597aS9LQAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (James) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 06:53:00 -0800 (PST) Subject: compaq deskpro for linux - HD problem Message-ID: <20040213145300.45646.qmail@web40207.mail.yahoo.com> hello, list this maybe little OT, but i am desperate. I am hitting a dead end on this problem. The HD in my deskpro 4000 (Pentium 200) died couple days ago. I am trying to replace it with a 8.4G HD. however, this machine seems to use some hidden partition to store BIOS information and the new HD won't get recognized. so i download the setup/diagnostics utility from compaq site. following is what i did. I fdisk the new HD so there is no partition at all. then i load the diagnostics disk and choose to create diagnostics partition. This process seems run fine( however i choose to 'delete diagnostics partition' after the create operation and got error saying 'operation failed on diagnostics partition'. then i starts the computer with setup disk to 'install computer setup', and i got 'A diagnostic partition does not exist. use the pc diagnostics diskette to create a partition'. seems the diagnostics partition never created. what is going on ? I am using the sp4129.exe to generate the setup and diagnostics diskettes. found it here http://h18000.www1.hp.com/support/files/diags.html thanks, Qiang __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online. http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From anton-F0u+EriZ6ihBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 15:04:50 2004 From: anton-F0u+EriZ6ihBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Anton Markov) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:04:50 -0500 Subject: [StartingOver] In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <402CE792.5080203@truxtar.com> Martin Duclos wrote: > This is slightly off topic, but why don't you chuck the winNT box > alltogether if only used for MSN messenger. Gaim is a great gui for > instant messenger type things. I don't personally use that one cause I > prefer AMSN. It's a great MSNMessenger clone. I'm using that one. Work > great without a hick. Well, I remember having to upgrade the software > once when microsoft decided to sneeze a protocol change. Well, the new > complient verson of the app was released 2 days before the new > protocol > was in place. A google search should direct you to the AMSN webpage. > Also on source forge. Anyhow, just a little note to say that there IS > a better way! Another great messaging program for Linux is Kopete. It supports MSN, AIM, ICQ, etc. It has all the admirable traits of Gaim including ability to re-name contacts, but also has support for MSN file transfer. Personally, I found that AMSN has some severe memory leaks, and it doesn't allow renaming of contacts, which is important when the average nickname on my list is about 20 characters long! Anyway, if you're not one of those people who just hate KDE, try out Kopete. Just my 2 cents. -- Anton Markov <("anton" + "@" + "truxtar" + "." + "com")> GnuPG Key fingerprint = 5546 A6E2 1FFB 9BB8 15C3 CE34 46B7 8D93 3AD1 44B4 *** LINUX - MAY THE SOURCE BE WITH YOU! *** -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mike-DlQxw/23Tq2aMJb+Lgu22Q at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 15:06:18 2004 From: mike-DlQxw/23Tq2aMJb+Lgu22Q at public.gmane.org (Mike Waychison) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:06:18 -0500 Subject: [StartingOver] In-Reply-To: <20040213140634.GA2023-B5vlSFeRxX4@public.gmane.org> References: <20040213140634.GA2023@my-wing> Message-ID: <402CE7EA.1050308@waychison.com> Gregory D Hough wrote: > Greetings tlug, > > Although I have four years of Linux under my belt, the more I learn the > less I know. My Lin/Win network fell apart, rather I TOOK it apart. I > saw things I didn't understand and felt it best to start over from > scratch. > > I wish to begin rebuilding from the firewall. One thing I noticed right > from the get-go is the way a default firewall is handling certain > connection requests. Most notably is the way Shorewall on Mandrake > (out-of-the-box) treats ICMP (8) and port 135. Pings are dropped which > is a good thing, but SYN packets to 135 go to a reject chain and are > ultimately sent a ZeroWindow RST ACK. I thought this port was akin to a > Windows specific vulnerability with DCOM services. Why would a Linux > firewall be treating it diffently in not just dropping it altogether? It isn't treating it differently. A RST|ACK packet is sent in reply to a SYN packet when the port in question does not have anything listening on it. This is normal and complies with RFC 793 (page 65, "SEGMENT ARRIVES - State is CLOSED"). > > Secondly, call me a geek, but I get more enjoyment watching tcpdump > than network TV and this just came in: > > 65.203.175.213:666 > 66.203.175.213:1026 in the form of a Messenger > NetrSendMessage request DCE RPC trying to tell me how to disable pop- > ups and to go to www dot messagestop dot net. I'm not concerned with > this traffic on this machine, but as I rebuild the network I've had to > give the kids a WinNT box to run that cludge called MSN Messenger. And > although I've done my best to DCOMbobulate that machine, I'd feel a > whole lot better putting it back behind a real firewall ASAP. This > particular set of packets is brand new to me, and the remarkable > similarity to my current IP address is disturbing. I believe it is no > coincidence and wish to bring the new network back up prepared for such. First off, the Messenger warning and all the 'ads' popping up on people's computers has nothing to do with the MSN Messenger IM service. It is a different Messenger RPC service enable by default on many windows hosts. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 15:15:21 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:15:21 -0500 Subject: compaq deskpro for linux - HD problem In-Reply-To: <20040213145300.45646.qmail-TA4Gc7jPiWaA/QwVtaZbd3CJp6faPEW9@public.gmane.org> References: <20040213145300.45646.qmail@web40207.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <402CEA09.6030704@alteeve.com> Hi Qiang, The only thing I could think to suggest is that something with the MBR is messed up. I remember back years ago when I started playing with Linux that when I tried to reinstall MS (win9x?), even though I used FDISK to re-write the MBR, Lilo would still attempt to load at boot and die. What I had to do back then was use a hex editor (Norton's diskedit on a Win9x boot disk works great) to "zero" the first few sectors. After that, everything worked like a charm. E-mail me off list at "linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org" if you would like more infor on how to do this. Best of luck! James wrote: > hello, list > > this maybe little OT, but i am desperate. > > I am hitting a dead end on this problem. The HD in my deskpro 4000 (Pentium 200) died couple days > ago. I am trying to replace it with a 8.4G HD. however, this machine seems to use some hidden > partition to store BIOS information and the new HD won't get recognized. > > so i download the setup/diagnostics utility from compaq site. > > following is what i did. > > I fdisk the new HD so there is no partition at all. then i load the diagnostics disk and choose to > create diagnostics partition. This process seems run fine( however i choose to 'delete diagnostics > partition' after the create operation and got error saying 'operation failed on diagnostics > partition'. then i starts the computer with setup disk to 'install computer setup', and i got 'A > diagnostic partition does not exist. use the pc diagnostics diskette to create a partition'. > > seems the diagnostics partition never created. what is going on ? > > I am using the sp4129.exe to generate the setup and diagnostics diskettes. found it here > http://h18000.www1.hp.com/support/files/diags.html > > > thanks, > > Qiang -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mike-DlQxw/23Tq2aMJb+Lgu22Q at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 15:25:59 2004 From: mike-DlQxw/23Tq2aMJb+Lgu22Q at public.gmane.org (Mike Waychison) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:25:59 -0500 Subject: compaq deskpro for linux - HD problem In-Reply-To: <20040213145300.45646.qmail-TA4Gc7jPiWaA/QwVtaZbd3CJp6faPEW9@public.gmane.org> References: <20040213145300.45646.qmail@web40207.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <402CEC87.5020304@waychison.com> James wrote: > hello, list > > this maybe little OT, but i am desperate. > > I am hitting a dead end on this problem. The HD in my deskpro 4000 (Pentium 200) died couple days > ago. I am trying to replace it with a 8.4G HD. however, this machine seems to use some hidden > partition to store BIOS information and the new HD won't get recognized. > > so i download the setup/diagnostics utility from compaq site. > > following is what i did. > > I fdisk the new HD so there is no partition at all. then i load the diagnostics disk and choose to > create diagnostics partition. This process seems run fine( however i choose to 'delete diagnostics > partition' after the create operation and got error saying 'operation failed on diagnostics > partition'. then i starts the computer with setup disk to 'install computer setup', and i got 'A > diagnostic partition does not exist. use the pc diagnostics diskette to create a partition'. > > seems the diagnostics partition never created. what is going on ? Why do you 'delete diagnotics partition'? Some machines insist on diag partitions for their OS installs to complete.. Mike Waychison -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jingsu-26n5VD7DAF2Tm46uYYfjYg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 15:31:43 2004 From: jingsu-26n5VD7DAF2Tm46uYYfjYg at public.gmane.org (Jing Su) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:31:43 -0500 Subject: compaq deskpro for linux - HD problem In-Reply-To: <402CEC87.5020304-DlQxw/23Tq2aMJb+Lgu22Q@public.gmane.org> References: <20040213145300.45646.qmail@web40207.mail.yahoo.com> <402CEC87.5020304@waychison.com> Message-ID: Do you have the BIOS "Boot Sector Virus Protection" option turned off? On Fri, 13 Feb 2004, Mike Waychison wrote: > > seems the diagnostics partition never created. what is going on ? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 15:36:42 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:36:42 -0500 Subject: compaq deskpro for linux - HD problem In-Reply-To: <20040213145300.45646.qmail-TA4Gc7jPiWaA/QwVtaZbd3CJp6faPEW9@public.gmane.org> References: <20040213145300.45646.qmail@web40207.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20040213153642.GE9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Feb 13, 2004 at 06:53:00AM -0800, James wrote: > hello, list > > this maybe little OT, but i am desperate. > > I am hitting a dead end on this problem. The HD in my deskpro 4000 (Pentium 200) died couple days > ago. I am trying to replace it with a 8.4G HD. however, this machine seems to use some hidden > partition to store BIOS information and the new HD won't get recognized. > > so i download the setup/diagnostics utility from compaq site. > > following is what i did. > > I fdisk the new HD so there is no partition at all. then i load the diagnostics disk and choose to > create diagnostics partition. This process seems run fine( however i choose to 'delete diagnostics > partition' after the create operation and got error saying 'operation failed on diagnostics > partition'. then i starts the computer with setup disk to 'install computer setup', and i got 'A > diagnostic partition does not exist. use the pc diagnostics diskette to create a partition'. > > seems the diagnostics partition never created. what is going on ? > > I am using the sp4129.exe to generate the setup and diagnostics diskettes. found it here > http://h18000.www1.hp.com/support/files/diags.html What size was the original disk. Some machines of that era had a problem with disks over 8.something GB (later ones had a problem with 32GB, then 137GB). If the machine had a driver smaller than 8GB before, check if the drive has an 'alternate jumper' setting, that clips it down below the limit of those older machines, and perhaps it won't have a problem anymore. I believe it creates the special partition at the end of the disk, and if the disk is bigger than the limit the machine supports, it may be wrapping around or just getting plain confused. Not sure really, but it could simply be a 1024 cylinder limit problem. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 15:47:27 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:47:27 -0500 Subject: compaq deskpro for linux - HD problem In-Reply-To: <402CEC87.5020304-DlQxw/23Tq2aMJb+Lgu22Q@public.gmane.org> References: <20040213145300.45646.qmail@web40207.mail.yahoo.com> <402CEC87.5020304@waychison.com> Message-ID: <402CF18F.5040506@alteeve.com> Mike Waychison wrote: > James wrote: > >> hello, list >> >> this maybe little OT, but i am desperate. >> >> I am hitting a dead end on this problem. The HD in my deskpro 4000 >> (Pentium 200) died couple days >> ago. I am trying to replace it with a 8.4G HD. however, this machine >> seems to use some hidden >> partition to store BIOS information and the new HD won't get recognized. >> so i download the setup/diagnostics utility from compaq site. >> >> following is what i did. >> >> I fdisk the new HD so there is no partition at all. then i load the >> diagnostics disk and choose to >> create diagnostics partition. This process seems run fine( however i >> choose to 'delete diagnostics >> partition' after the create operation and got error saying 'operation >> failed on diagnostics >> partition'. then i starts the computer with setup disk to 'install >> computer setup', and i got 'A >> diagnostic partition does not exist. use the pc diagnostics diskette >> to create a partition'. >> >> seems the diagnostics partition never created. what is going on ? > > > Why do you 'delete diagnotics partition'? Some machines insist on diag > partitions for their OS installs to complete.. Hi Mike, Many Compaq's only have a very basic BIOS for booting to an OS. The Extended BIOS (known as the F10 or VP BIOS program) is used to allow for advanced configuration of Compaq machines. In a way it is a smart idea but in another it is a bad one. First, it is very much not needed for a Compaq machine as some of the same advanced configuration options can be effected by OS level applications (though rarely if ever possible from Linux). If you have your machine setup the way you want, then technically you don't need that ~8MB partition any more. It is also something of a way to make sure your machine isn't messed with at the BIOS level. Personally though, I always leave it... just in case. Madison -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From dougish-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 16:23:45 2004 From: dougish-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (dougish-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:23:45 -0500 Subject: Store in Toronto for Linux Ware Message-ID: <1076689425.402cfa11023e9@webmail.eol.ca> One of my co-workers wants to give a tux doll (plush or plastic) to his wife for Valentine's Day. (I didn't want to ask why!) Does anyone know of a store in the GTA where he could find one? He knows he's left it too late for an on-line purchase. Doug Isherwood -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 16:23:04 2004 From: srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org (SRB) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:23:04 -0500 Subject: compaq deskpro for linux - HD problem References: <20040213145300.45646.qmail@web40207.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <009501c3f24d$a9947bf0$3b0000c0@mastec.ca> > I am hitting a dead end on this problem. The HD in my deskpro 4000 (Pentium 200) died couple days > ago. I am trying to replace it with a 8.4G HD. however, this machine seems to use some hidden > partition to store BIOS information and the new HD won't get recognized. > > so i download the setup/diagnostics utility from compaq site. > > following is what i did. > > I fdisk the new HD so there is no partition at all. then i load the diagnostics disk and choose to > create diagnostics partition. This process seems run fine( however i choose to 'delete diagnostics > partition' after the create operation and got error saying 'operation failed on diagnostics > partition'. then i starts the computer with setup disk to 'install computer setup', and i got 'A > diagnostic partition does not exist. use the pc diagnostics diskette to create a partition'. > > seems the diagnostics partition never created. what is going on ? > > I am using the sp4129.exe to generate the setup and diagnostics diskettes. found it here > http://h18000.www1.hp.com/support/files/diags.html > > > thanks, > > Qiang I used to have a Compaq Deskpro 2000 with a Pentium Pro CPU, so I know what you are talking about. First of all, make sure that you do indeed have the "setup" boot floppy available (can download from Compaq once you find it on theri site). You will need this if you ever need to enter the board's BIOS. Other than that, you do not really need the "diagnostics" partition. I just formatted the new hard drive as normal and never missed the compaq diagnostics. HTH. -Steve. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fcsoft-3Emkkp+1Olsmp8TqCH86vg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 16:31:45 2004 From: fcsoft-3Emkkp+1Olsmp8TqCH86vg at public.gmane.org (fcsoft-3Emkkp+1Olsmp8TqCH86vg at public.gmane.org) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:31:45 -0500 Subject: how to teach a Linux browser to get through to this URL? Message-ID: <63340-220042513163145503@M2W037.mail2web.com> Thanks. Original Message: ----------------- From: Robert J. Clark clark-mxwZcha1xYo at public.gmane.org.com Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 04:37:08 -0500 To: tlug-GezYG1x/Qbs at public.gmane.org.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: how to teach a Linux browser to get through to this URL? On Thu, 12 Feb 2004 11:17:51 -0500, Bob Findlay wrote: > Here's a site that a friend of mine would like to access from his Linux box > at home. > > http://support.learnflex.net > > How can one get a Linux browser to send the authentication header that this > site is requiring? The site is using an (obsolete) Mircosoft-only authentication mechanism called NTLM (NT loadable module). Most non-IE browsers do not (and probably will not) support it. Mozilla Fire(bird|fox) does have support for this mechanism, but you have to get the latest version to use the newly added feature. - Rob -- (sigless) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mcg2-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 16:49:12 2004 From: mcg2-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Matthew Godycki) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:49:12 -0500 Subject: Store in Toronto for Linux Ware Message-ID: <20040213164912.RUVU189272.fep03-mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com@localhost> > > From: dougish-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org > Date: 2004/02/13 Fri AM 11:23:45 EST > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: [TLUG]: Store in Toronto for Linux Ware > > One of my co-workers wants to give a tux doll (plush or plastic) to his > wife for Valentine's Day. (I didn't want to ask why!) > > Does anyone know of a store in the GTA where he could find one? He > knows he's left it too late for an on-line purchase. > > Doug Isherwood > The UofT bookstore used to carry them at one point. I'm not sure whether they still do or not. May be worthwhile to give'em a call =) -Matt -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 16:50:12 2004 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:50:12 -0500 Subject: Store in Toronto for Linux Ware In-Reply-To: <1076689425.402cfa11023e9-2RFepEojUI0zBwpOZ4pU1A@public.gmane.org> References: <1076689425.402cfa11023e9@webmail.eol.ca> Message-ID: <200402131150.12072.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> On February 13, 2004 11:23 am, dougish-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org wrote: > Does anyone know of a store in the GTA where he could find one? He > knows he's left it too late for an on-line purchase. Ikea has small penguins that look a lot like tux, they're under $2. I don't remember if they had a larger version. -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 16:53:15 2004 From: IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Ilya Palagin) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:53:15 -0500 Subject: DNS question In-Reply-To: <008401c3f1c6$477f2780$1902a8c0-B7WYQ2cLakwWhyVFc8JwjA@public.gmane.org> References: <008401c3f1c6$477f2780$1902a8c0@coilnetworks.com> Message-ID: <402D00FB.3050606@rogers.com> Robert F. Kennedy wrote: > Hello, > > I am trying to set up a DNS server for shambhalatoronto.org using a > machine with a fresh install of RH9 fully updated. > > I get the following error: > named-xfer[20373]: connect(66.11.164.95) for zone shamabhalatoronto.org > failed: Connection timed out > > It seems that my firewall is not letting signals through to port 53 > (used www.dnsreport.com) which named is listening on. My Linksys router > is forwarding port 53 among others to my local IP 192.168.2.27. What happens when you disable the firewall? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From wmcgilvery-6d3DWWOeJtE at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 17:11:38 2004 From: wmcgilvery-6d3DWWOeJtE at public.gmane.org (Wil McGilvery) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 12:11:38 -0500 Subject: DNS question Message-ID: <65B7B304AA3DE147BBD33938FE204E288A16C6@lynchmail.lynch.msft> I tried a whois for shamabhalatoronto.org and came up with no match for that domain name. I tried a nslookup and got host doesn't exist. Port 53 on your linksys is open. Have you registered the Domain name? I can't resolve any names against your DNS. It responds with host record doesn't exist. I guess the next question is how is your DNS setup? Are you trying to access the DNS using the external ip address from inside the LAN? Regards, Wil McGilvery Manager Lynch Digital Media Inc 416-744-7949 416-716-3964 (cell) 1-866-314-4678 416-744-0406? FAX www.LynchDigital.com -----Original Message----- From: Robert F. Kennedy [mailto:rfk-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org] Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2004 7:14 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: [TLUG]: DNS question Hello, I am trying to set up a DNS server for shambhalatoronto.org using a machine with a fresh install of RH9 fully updated. I get the following error: named-xfer[20373]: connect(66.11.164.95) for zone shamabhalatoronto.org failed: Connection timed out It seems that my firewall is not letting signals through to port 53 (used www.dnsreport.com) which named is listening on. My Linksys router is forwarding port 53 among others to my local IP 192.168.2.27. Another strange thing that has gone wrong while trying to get DNS working and is probably related is that my Mozilla browser can find sites by IP number but can't resolve hosts using domain names. If anyone has any ideas of what I might be doing wrong, please advise me. I have been struggling with this for weeks now. I have cut and pasted all the relevant configuration files below, please let me know if there is another file that I should include. Plug: Istop is providing free DNS secondary name serving and has helped me out a lot with this problem. Thanks for any assistance, Robert Named.conf file: options { query-source address * port 53; listen-on { 192.168.2.27; }; directory "/var/named"; forward first; forwarders { 66.11.168.195; 66.11.168.198; }; }; - - - zone "shambhalatoronto.org" { type master; file "db.shambhalatoronto.org"; allow-transfer { 66.11.168.199; }; }; db.shambhalatoronto.org file: $TTL 600 @ IN SOA shambhalatoronto.org. hostmaster.shambhalatoronto.org. ( 14 ; Serial 288 ; Refresh 14400 ; Retry 3600000 ; Expire 600 ) ; Minimum ; Name servers IN NS ns1.shambhalatoronto.org. IN NS ns.istop.com. ; Mail server for domain IN MX 10 ns1.shambhalatoronto.org. ; Public servers localhost IN A 127.0.0.1 ns1 IN A 66.11.164.95 mail IN A 66.11.164.95 www IN A 66.11.164.95 ftp IN A 66.11.164.95 ; EOF Network Configuration (GUI): Host - ns1.shambhalatoronto.org Primary DNS - 66.11.164.95 Secondary DNS - 66.11.168.199 Tertiary DNS - 192.168.2.27 DNS Search Path - shambhalatoronto.org Resolve.conf file: ; generated by /sbin/dhclient-script - Rfk added local IP line search shambhalatoronto.org nameserver 66.11.164.95 nameserver 66.11.168.199 nameserver 192.168.2.27 hosts file: # Do not remove the following line, or various programs # that require network functionality will fail. 127.0.0.1 localhost.localdomain localhost 66.11.164.95 ns1.shambhalatoronto.org ns1 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ross.ethier-3lMcvJ4bqjgAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 17:47:06 2004 From: ross.ethier-3lMcvJ4bqjgAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ross Ethier) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 12:47:06 -0500 Subject: Zope/Plone opportunity on Linux using Python Message-ID: <402D0D9A.8080303@setal.com> Hi All, Looking for someone in the tDot with the above mentioned skill sets available for a short term contract. Please contact me if you know of anyone. Rate is between $350 - $480 per day depending on level. Cheers, Ross -- _________________________ Ross Ethier Director of Technology, SETAL BEYOND LINUX, WHAT IS YOUR OPEN SOURCE STRATEGY? SETAL.com ross.ethier-3lMcvJ4bqjgAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org 416.820.9297 __________________________ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 19:40:24 2004 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 14:40:24 -0500 Subject: Zope/Plone opportunity on Linux using Python In-Reply-To: <402D0D9A.8080303-3lMcvJ4bqjgAvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> References: <402D0D9A.8080303@setal.com> Message-ID: <200402131440.24668.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> On February 13, 2004 12:47 pm, Ross Ethier wrote: > Looking for someone in the tDot with the above mentioned skill sets > available for a short term contract. > Please contact me if you know of anyone. Rate is between $350 - $480 > per day depending on level. I'm sure you'll get some offers here but you might also want to most to the Toronto Python User Group, you can get info on that list at http://web.engcorp.com:8032/mailman/listinfo/pygta-general -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ross.ethier-3lMcvJ4bqjgAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 20:46:32 2004 From: ross.ethier-3lMcvJ4bqjgAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ross Ethier) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 15:46:32 -0500 Subject: Zope/Plone opportunity on Linux using Python In-Reply-To: <200402131440.24668.fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <402D0D9A.8080303@setal.com> <200402131440.24668.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: <402D37A8.10701@setal.com> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dougish-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 21:48:55 2004 From: dougish-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (dougish-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 16:48:55 -0500 Subject: Store in Toronto for Linux Ware In-Reply-To: <20040213164912.RUVU189272.fep03-mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com-bi+AKbBUZKZeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org> References: <20040213164912.RUVU189272.fep03-mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com@localhost> Message-ID: On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:49:12 -0500, Matt wrote: > >> >> From: dougish-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org >> Date: 2004/02/13 Fri AM 11:23:45 EST >> To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org >> Subject: [TLUG]: Store in Toronto for Linux Ware >> >> One of my co-workers wants to give a tux doll (plush or plastic) to his >> wife for Valentine's Day. (I didn't want to ask why!) >> >> Does anyone know of a store in the GTA where he could find one? He >> knows he's left it too late for an on-line purchase. >> >> Doug Isherwood >> > >The UofT bookstore used to carry them at one point. I'm not sure whether they still do or not. May be worthwhile to give'em a call =) > >-Matt Thanks Matt. My co-worker called and they do have a few. Doug -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From dougish-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 21:49:40 2004 From: dougish-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (dougish-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 16:49:40 -0500 Subject: Store in Toronto for Linux Ware In-Reply-To: <200402131150.12072.fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <1076689425.402cfa11023e9@webmail.eol.ca> <200402131150.12072.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:50:12 -0500, Fraser wrote: >On February 13, 2004 11:23 am, dougish-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org wrote: > >> Does anyone know of a store in the GTA where he could find one? He >> knows he's left it too late for an on-line purchase. > >Ikea has small penguins that look a lot like tux, they're under $2. I don't >remember if they had a larger version. > >-- >Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ >Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux Thanks Fraser. Doug -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From adb-tlug-AbAJl/g/NLXk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 22:30:22 2004 From: adb-tlug-AbAJl/g/NLXk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org (Anthony de Boer) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 17:30:22 -0500 Subject: DNS question In-Reply-To: <008401c3f1c6$477f2780$1902a8c0-B7WYQ2cLakwWhyVFc8JwjA@public.gmane.org>; from rfk-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org on Thu, Feb 12, 2004 at 07:13:59PM -0500 References: <008401c3f1c6$477f2780$1902a8c0@coilnetworks.com> Message-ID: <20040213173022.J317@leftmind.net> Robert F. Kennedy wrote: > ; Name servers > IN NS ns1.shambhalatoronto.org. > IN NS ns.istop.com. > > ; Mail server for domain > IN MX 10 ns1.shambhalatoronto.org. The "IN" bit is normally indented, and might be getting misparsed. One of the first things you should be doing is checking /var/log/messages for things named is saying. (Note: syslog might be putting it in a different file, depending on your distribution.) > Host - ns1.shambhalatoronto.org > Primary DNS - 66.11.164.95 > Secondary DNS - 66.11.168.199 > Tertiary DNS - 192.168.2.27 > DNS Search Path - shambhalatoronto.org WHOIS indicates the domain's not even registered, and you want to do that before someone squats it for you. Also, never publish a private address (the tertiary you list) in a public zonefile. Other things to check: depending on what you're using for a firewall, it might be catching DNS queries and resolving them itself. You need to have UDP port 53 open to the world, for normal queries, but TCP 53 can be restricted to allow only your secondaries to AXFR the domain. The only case in which the world needs TCP/53 is if you have so many DNS records of a particular type that a response doesn't fit in a UDP packet and a resolver has to fall back on TCP to get the whole answer from your nameserver (and the right thing to do is to keep large recordsets under the limit) Locally, for people allowed to use your nameserver as a resolver, some clients do want TCP/53. Also, http://cr.yp.to/djbdns.html is homepage of a nameserver implementation I trust enough to use; I've seen too many people get r00ted by bugs in named. Bernstein's stuff is quite a bit simpler, too, although he does spread it out in a bunch of modular pieces instead of loading it all into one monolithic program. -- Anthony de Boer -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From adb-tlug-AbAJl/g/NLXk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 22:36:03 2004 From: adb-tlug-AbAJl/g/NLXk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org (Anthony de Boer) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 17:36:03 -0500 Subject: DNS question In-Reply-To: <402D00FB.3050606-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>; from IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org on Fri, Feb 13, 2004 at 11:53:15AM -0500 References: <008401c3f1c6$477f2780$1902a8c0@coilnetworks.com> <402D00FB.3050606@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20040213173603.K317@leftmind.net> Ilya Palagin wrote: > What happens when you disable the firewall? He gets r00ted. Disabling a firewall to solve a problem you don't understand is the last resort of the incompetent. Actually understanding the protocols you're trying to forward is step one, step two is to make sure the firewall logs every packet it drops or rejects and every connection it refuses so that you can see what's not going through, and step three can be running tcpdump or a similar tool to look at the traffic. Or maybe it's just that I've been firewalling for so long that it just looks easy. But the Internet has become a sufficiently hostile place that I wouldn't even dream of connecting anything that wasn't firmly secured first. -- Anthony de Boer -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rfk-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 23:07:41 2004 From: rfk-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Robert F. Kennedy) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 18:07:41 -0500 Subject: DNS question In-Reply-To: <20040213173022.J317-AbAJl/g/NLXk1uMJSBkQmQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040213173022.J317@leftmind.net> Message-ID: <000001c3f286$2e70f500$1902a8c0@coilnetworks.com> Hello, Thanks for the many helpful comments. > ; Name servers > IN NS ns1.shambhalatoronto.org. > IN NS ns.istop.com. > > ; Mail server for domain > IN MX 10 ns1.shambhalatoronto.org. >The "IN" bit is normally indented, and might be getting misparsed. I just indented the IN lines and then checked syslog and got the following: Feb 13 17:46:50 ns1 named[1063]: loading configuration from '/etc/named.conf' Feb 13 17:46:50 ns1 named[1063]: no IPv6 interfaces found Feb 13 17:46:50 ns1 named[1063]: zone shambhalatoronto.org/IN: loaded serial 15 Feb 13 17:46:50 ns1 named[1063]: zone shambhalatoronto.org/IN: sending notifies (serial 15) Feb 13 17:46:50 ns1 named: named reload succeeded syslog had never reported lines four and five before so perhaps things are working now. However, odd thing is typing #host ns1.shambhalatoronto.org is returning the incorrect IP address. It returns 11.66.164.95 instead of 66.11.164.95. I can't figure out where this typo occurred. The domain is registered with directnic.com. The only data I've given them is my nameserver and istop.com's secondary nameserver. >You need to have UDP port 53 open to the world, for normal queries, but TCP 53 can be >restricted to allow only your secondaries to AXFR the domain. The only case in which the >world needs TCP/53 is if you have so many DNS records of a particular type that a response >doesn't fit in a UDP packet and a resolver has to fall back on TCP to get the whole answer >from your nameserver (and the right thing to do is to keep large recordsets under the limit) At first I hadn't opened :53 for UDP and got error messages in syslog, then corrected that problem, so it's not that. Thanks for the help, Robert Robert F. Kennedy Toronto H. 416-538-3904 C. 647-224-3904 Cell email: 6472243904-0QqZKF9DVJhqQkARBuupfiwD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org] On Behalf Of Anthony de Boer Sent: Friday, February 13, 2004 5:30 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: DNS question Robert F. Kennedy wrote: > ; Name servers > IN NS ns1.shambhalatoronto.org. > IN NS ns.istop.com. > > ; Mail server for domain > IN MX 10 ns1.shambhalatoronto.org. The "IN" bit is normally indented, and might be getting misparsed. One of the first things you should be doing is checking /var/log/messages for things named is saying. (Note: syslog might be putting it in a different file, depending on your distribution.) > Host - ns1.shambhalatoronto.org > Primary DNS - 66.11.164.95 > Secondary DNS - 66.11.168.199 > Tertiary DNS - 192.168.2.27 > DNS Search Path - shambhalatoronto.org WHOIS indicates the domain's not even registered, and you want to do that before someone squats it for you. Also, never publish a private address (the tertiary you list) in a public zonefile. Other things to check: depending on what you're using for a firewall, it might be catching DNS queries and resolving them itself. You need to have UDP port 53 open to the world, for normal queries, but TCP 53 can be restricted to allow only your secondaries to AXFR the domain. The only case in which the world needs TCP/53 is if you have so many DNS records of a particular type that a response doesn't fit in a UDP packet and a resolver has to fall back on TCP to get the whole answer from your nameserver (and the right thing to do is to keep large recordsets under the limit) Locally, for people allowed to use your nameserver as a resolver, some clients do want TCP/53. Also, http://cr.yp.to/djbdns.html is homepage of a nameserver implementation I trust enough to use; I've seen too many people get r00ted by bugs in named. Bernstein's stuff is quite a bit simpler, too, although he does spread it out in a bunch of modular pieces instead of loading it all into one monolithic program. -- Anthony de Boer -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 23:59:45 2004 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 18:59:45 -0500 Subject: Samba/VPN novice In-Reply-To: <200402111220.43979.pmills-5bG9SNWDbRX3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> References: <402A3EAB.1000207@alteeve.com> <1076514185.4460.10.camel@theconstruct.mineallmeyn.net> <200402111220.43979.pmills@axxent.ca> Message-ID: <402D64F1.3040806@rogers.com> Phillip Mills wrote: > I'm trying to use my Linux system (SuSE 8.1) to talk via VPN to a network of > PCs. I built the vpn module, installed it, and I'm able to ping systems > through the tunnel. > > I installed everything I could find (:-) related to samba or smb. I defined a > share on my system, started smbd and nmbd, and I'm able to use 'smbclient -L > 127.0.0.1' and get a reasonable view of my own services. > > However, any attempt to use smbclient or smbmount through the VPN is getting > me messages of the form: > "timeout connecting to xx.xx.xx.xx:139 > Error connecting to xx.xx.xx.xx (Operation already in progress) > 2903: Connection to ABC failed > SMB connection failed" > > In spite of ping working, I *think* the problem is on the VPN side because > telnet to port 139 on the target system hangs also. > > Any suggestions? Yes, the interfaces option in smb.conf. In the [global] section of smb.conf, add a line like the one below, but use the values appropriate to your system. In the example below, the first address range is the ethernet connection for my notebook computer and the other is the vpn range. This tells Samba to use the ethernet and vpn interfaces. Otherwise, it will not try to use the vpn, since it is not broadcast capable. interfaces = 192.168.1.0/24 192.168.2.0/24 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 18:59:04 2004 From: IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Ilya Palagin) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 18:59:04 +0000 Subject: DNS question In-Reply-To: <20040213173603.K317-AbAJl/g/NLXk1uMJSBkQmQ@public.gmane.org> References: <008401c3f1c6$477f2780$1902a8c0@coilnetworks.com> <402D00FB.3050606@rogers.com> <20040213173603.K317@leftmind.net> Message-ID: <402D1E78.1030105@rogers.com> Anthony de Boer wrote: > Ilya Palagin wrote: > >>What happens when you disable the firewall? > > > He gets r00ted. It depends on what else is running on the server, what kind of network is behing the firewall and how long the firewall will be off :-) 5 seconds is enough to see if firewall drops wrong packets, and it's probably insufficient for cracking RH9 server with installed updates (if it isn't under permanent attack and if there is just bind running :-) > > Disabling a firewall to solve a problem you don't understand is the last > resort of the incompetent. Actually understanding the protocols you're > trying to forward is step one, step two is to make sure the firewall logs > every packet it drops or rejects and every connection it refuses so that > you can see what's not going through, and step three can be running > tcpdump or a similar tool to look at the traffic. > > Or maybe it's just that I've been firewalling for so long that it just > looks easy. But the Internet has become a sufficiently hostile place > that I wouldn't even dream of connecting anything that wasn't firmly > secured first. > You're offering an excellent professional way for solving this problem, but for the current context (freshly installed server not in the production environment yet, being configured from GUI) this task can be a little bit more simple :-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 14 01:23:48 2004 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 20:23:48 -0500 Subject: Store in Toronto for Linux Ware In-Reply-To: <1076689425.402cfa11023e9-2RFepEojUI0zBwpOZ4pU1A@public.gmane.org> References: <1076689425.402cfa11023e9@webmail.eol.ca> Message-ID: <402D78A4.3080105@rogers.com> dougish-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org wrote: > One of my co-workers wants to give a tux doll (plush or plastic) to his > wife for Valentine's Day. (I didn't want to ask why!) > > Does anyone know of a store in the GTA where he could find one? He > knows he's left it too late for an on-line purchase. I have one of each. The problem is, they've got "Caldera" printed on them. :-( -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 14 02:02:08 2004 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 21:02:08 -0500 Subject: compaq deskpro for linux - HD problem In-Reply-To: <20040213145300.45646.qmail-TA4Gc7jPiWaA/QwVtaZbd3CJp6faPEW9@public.gmane.org> References: <20040213145300.45646.qmail@web40207.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20040214020208.GA6524@m450> On Fri, Feb 13, 2004 at 06:53:00AM -0800, James wrote > I fdisk the new HD so there is no partition at all. then i load the > diagnostics disk and choose to create diagnostics partition. This > process seems run fine( however i choose to 'delete diagnostics > partition' after the create operation Why ? The point of the diagnostics diskette is to create the partition. Compaqs *MUST* have the hidden diagnostics partition to boot *REGARDLESS OF YOUR OS*. We went through that at work with a Compaq server, before we got linux working on it. Compaqs are the most damn proprietary "Win-tel" machines on the planet. It's to late for you, but I suggest everybody else stay away from Compaqs. BTW, how much do the weird screwdrivers cost ? -- Walter Dnes Email users are divided into two classes; 1) Those who have effective spam-blocking 2) Those who wish they did -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From teddymills-VFlxZYho3OA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 14 03:30:48 2004 From: teddymills-VFlxZYho3OA at public.gmane.org (Teddy Mills) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 22:30:48 -0500 Subject: compaq deskpro for linux - HD problem References: <20040213145300.45646.qmail@web40207.mail.yahoo.com> <20040214020208.GA6524@m450> Message-ID: <000901c3f2aa$f0e5f3f0$0301a8c0@amazon> What is this mumbo-jumbo? I use Compaqs and Linux all the time. Never a problem. The Compaq diagnostic partition is purely optional. If you dont know Compaqs thats fine, but dont denegrate Compaqs if your not qualified to use them. As for Torx screw-drivers...pretty common fair. (you can also use a flat-head) /teddy > Why ? The point of the diagnostics diskette is to create the > partition. Compaqs *MUST* have the hidden diagnostics partition to boot > *REGARDLESS OF YOUR OS*. We went through that at work with a Compaq > server, before we got linux working on it. Compaqs are the most damn > proprietary "Win-tel" machines on the planet. It's to late for you, but > I suggest everybody else stay away from Compaqs. BTW, how much do the > weird screwdrivers cost ? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Walter Dnes" To: Sent: Friday, February 13, 2004 9:02 PM Subject: Re: [TLUG]: compaq deskpro for linux - HD problem > On Fri, Feb 13, 2004 at 06:53:00AM -0800, James wrote > > > I fdisk the new HD so there is no partition at all. then i load the > > diagnostics disk and choose to create diagnostics partition. This > > process seems run fine( however i choose to 'delete diagnostics > > partition' after the create operation > > Why ? The point of the diagnostics diskette is to create the > partition. Compaqs *MUST* have the hidden diagnostics partition to boot > *REGARDLESS OF YOUR OS*. We went through that at work with a Compaq > server, before we got linux working on it. Compaqs are the most damn > proprietary "Win-tel" machines on the planet. It's to late for you, but > I suggest everybody else stay away from Compaqs. BTW, how much do the > weird screwdrivers cost ? > > -- > Walter Dnes > Email users are divided into two classes; > 1) Those who have effective spam-blocking > 2) Those who wish they did > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 14 03:40:26 2004 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 22:40:26 -0500 Subject: [StartingOver] In-Reply-To: <402CE7EA.1050308-DlQxw/23Tq2aMJb+Lgu22Q@public.gmane.org>; from mike-DlQxw/23Tq2aMJb+Lgu22Q@public.gmane.org on Fri, Feb 13, 2004 at 10:06:18 -0500 References: <20040213140634.GA2023@my-wing> <402CE7EA.1050308@waychison.com> Message-ID: <20040214034026.GA1677@my-wing> On 02/13/2004 10:06:18 AM, Mike Waychison wrote: > Gregory D Hough wrote: >> >> default firewall is >> handling certain connection requests. Most notably is the way >> Shorewall on Mandrake (out-of-the-box) treats ICMP (8) and port 135. >> Pings are dropped which is a good thing, but SYN packets to 135 go >> to a reject chain and are ultimately sent a ZeroWindow RST ACK. I >> thought this port was akin to a Windows specific vulnerability with >> DCOM services. Why would a Linux firewall be treating it differently >> in not just dropping it altogether? > > It isn't treating it differently. A RST|ACK packet is sent in reply > to a SYN packet when the port in question does not have anything > listening on it. This is normal and complies with RFC 793 (page 65, > "SEGMENT ARRIVES - State is CLOSED"). Thanks for the RFC...But, No other ports without a listening service return an RST ACK to the sending host. They are merely dropped. Only 135 is treated in this way. I believe there is a more important reason why...besides, as I understand it, this is a normal response for ALL closed ports with NO firewall in place. > >> >> 65.203.175.213:666 > 66.203.175.213:1026 in the form of a Messenger >> NetrSendMessage request DCE RPC trying to tell me how to disable >> pop-ups and to go to www dot messagestop dot net. > > First off, the Messenger warning and all the 'ads' popping up on > people's computers has nothing to do with the MSN Messenger IM > service. It is a different Messenger RPC service enable by default on > many windows hosts. I knew that, but it's not the CRUX of the biscuit I'm gnawing on. My concern is the source address resembling the destination except for the left most bit. I don't know enough about broadcast, multicast, unicast, netmask etc. to dismiss it as mere coincidence. To me it looks sinister in nature, a weird kind of spoofing or bit juggling. Martin Duclos wrote: > This is slightly off topic, but why don't you chuck the winNT box > alltogether if only used for MSN messenger. Gaim is a great gui for > instant messenger It's just the tip of the venerable iceberg of irregularities I observed, eminating from nat'd winboxes on the old network. I choose NT this time around because it was cheap and offered me a little more security control than Win98 did. I'd ditch Windows completely if all hardware were fully supported on Linux. One doesn't buy a young person an expensive digital camera (with Linux support) especially when he/she is clumsy. The 50 buck model will do until the young ones mature, learn the value of a dollar and gain some balance. Hence the need to keep a Winbox on the network. Anton Markov wrote: > Another great messaging program for Linux is Kopete. It supports MSN, > AIM, ICQ, etc. It has all the admirable traits of Gaim including > ability to re-name contacts, but also has support for MSN file > transfer. I appreciate the suggestion, but if the kids got wind of that file transfer thing in Linux, there would be no end to my troubles. Let me rephrase the original question for part II. What are the odds of a class A host getting hit by the identical host on the next lowest class A? About 4 billion to one give or take a couple hundred million? It's Friday the 13th, I should just leave it at that. BTW- Thanks for the MSN messenger alternatives. farmer6re9 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 13 23:50:48 2004 From: IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Ilya Palagin) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 23:50:48 +0000 Subject: compaq deskpro for linux - HD problem In-Reply-To: <20040214020208.GA6524-Mb8sf/rG248@public.gmane.org> References: <20040213145300.45646.qmail@web40207.mail.yahoo.com> <20040214020208.GA6524@m450> Message-ID: <402D62D8.1060307@rogers.com> Walter Dnes wrote: > On Fri, Feb 13, 2004 at 06:53:00AM -0800, James wrote > > >>I fdisk the new HD so there is no partition at all. then i load the >>diagnostics disk and choose to create diagnostics partition. This >>process seems run fine( however i choose to 'delete diagnostics >>partition' after the create operation > > > Why ? The point of the diagnostics diskette is to create the > partition. Compaqs *MUST* have the hidden diagnostics partition to boot > *REGARDLESS OF YOUR OS*. We went through that at work with a Compaq > server, before we got linux working on it. Compaqs are the most damn > proprietary "Win-tel" machines on the planet. It's to late for you, but > I suggest everybody else stay away from Compaqs. BTW, how much do the > weird screwdrivers cost ? > It's definitely too late :-) I remember my searching for memory for Compaq's "mono" - monitor and computer in one case, I can't remember the model name (must be Presario?). Regular EDO SIMMs just didn't work, as well as regular FastPage, it required something specific, being a regular desktop. Compaq service centre could order it for me, but the price would be HUGE. Once upon a time I was replacing floppy drive in a Compaq desktop. Of course, it didn't fit well, and there was a gap between the drive and the case :-) Shortly - stay away from any Brand Names! Build computers from widely available parts, only in this case they'll work for years independently from its manufacturer. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From shijialee-/E1597aS9LQAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 14 05:46:36 2004 From: shijialee-/E1597aS9LQAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (James) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 21:46:36 -0800 (PST) Subject: To be more clear ----compaq deskpro for linux - HD problem In-Reply-To: <009501c3f24d$a9947bf0$3b0000c0-v1hdsqwqw2f3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> References: <009501c3f24d$a9947bf0$3b0000c0@mastec.ca> Message-ID: <20040214054636.36837.qmail@web40209.mail.yahoo.com> thanks for everyone's input. If you have read my original email, this is a new HD with 8.4G capacity. so the hidden partition is no way there. as someone pointed out, it's optional to have a hidden partition. i am wondering how do you do without it? I tried couple of combinations of using setup diskettes or/and diagnostics diskette. although the Hardware inspection come with compaq diagnostics diskette shows the HD correctly (maxtor 8.6 and the correct model number), but i don't think the system remembers it. maybe that's why a hidden partition is required to save these kinda information? but the operation of create diagnosticis partition failed. I also boot the computer right from setup diskettes and the HD is not recognized. the dead HD was installed linux and the boot wrote on MBR, but the computer still boots without the diagnostics partition. do i or do i not need the diagnostics partition? many thanks! Qiang __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online. http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From ronjscott-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 14 06:37:49 2004 From: ronjscott-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Ron Scott) Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 01:37:49 -0500 Subject: [Fwd:compaq deskpro for linux - HD problem] Message-ID: <402DC23D.7BA662E7@sympatico.ca> One of my other computers is a Compaq Deskpro, 733 Mhz, loads and runs RH 9.0 no problem. Older Compaqs were more particular. Ron -------------- next part -------------- An embedded message was scrubbed... From: "Teddy Mills" Subject: Re: [TLUG]: compaq deskpro for linux - HD problem Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 22:30:48 -0500 Size: 3936 URL: From dougish-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 14 15:01:56 2004 From: dougish-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (dougish-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org) Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 10:01:56 -0500 Subject: Store in Toronto for Linux Ware In-Reply-To: <402D78A4.3080105-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <1076689425.402cfa11023e9@webmail.eol.ca> <402D78A4.3080105@rogers.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 20:23:48 -0500, James wrote: >dougish-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org wrote: >> One of my co-workers wants to give a tux doll (plush or plastic) to his >> wife for Valentine's Day. (I didn't want to ask why!) >> >> Does anyone know of a store in the GTA where he could find one? He >> knows he's left it too late for an on-line purchase. > >I have one of each. The problem is, they've got "Caldera" printed on >them. :-( Similar problem. The one I have sitting on the top of my computer at work has HP printed on it. I offered it to my co-worker, but he declined because of the HP logo. Doug -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 14 15:16:43 2004 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 10:16:43 -0500 Subject: compaq deskpro for linux - HD problem In-Reply-To: <20040214020208.GA6524-Mb8sf/rG248@public.gmane.org> References: <20040213145300.45646.qmail@web40207.mail.yahoo.com> <20040214020208.GA6524@m450> Message-ID: <20040214101643.5a642c56.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 21:02:08 -0500 Walter Dnes disseminated the following: > Compaqs are the most damn proprietary "Win-tel" machines on the planet. It's > to late for you, but I suggest everybody else stay away from Compaqs. BTW, > how much do the weird screwdrivers cost ? I'll second that emotion...IME, without having that extra bit on the HD, you can't change the hardware settings, specifically the 'sleep' option, which means that the machine will go to sleep and shut down all running processes, and I mean all. -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 10:09:47 up 8 days, 21:57, 3 users, load average: 0.05, 0.03, 0.02 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Linux 2.4.22-21mdk i686 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Rule #2 (John Gilmore): "The Net interprets censorship as damage and routes around it." -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 14 15:21:01 2004 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 10:21:01 -0500 Subject: compaq deskpro for linux - HD problem In-Reply-To: <000901c3f2aa$f0e5f3f0$0301a8c0-vAnPq90cUBg@public.gmane.org> References: <20040213145300.45646.qmail@web40207.mail.yahoo.com> <20040214020208.GA6524@m450> <000901c3f2aa$f0e5f3f0$0301a8c0@amazon> Message-ID: <20040214102101.4b7dc050.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 22:30:48 -0500 Teddy Mills disseminated the following: > If you dont know Compaqs thats fine, but dont denegrate > Compaqs if your not qualified to use them. Lemme get this straight. They make it more difficult to use unless you are running Windows, adding totally unnecessary levels of complexity, deviating from standard PC architecture for no valid reason, and it's the end user's fault for being 'not qualified'. That's a knee-slapper. -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 10:17:15 up 8 days, 22:04, 3 users, load average: 0.03, 0.02, 0.00 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Linux 2.4.22-21mdk i686 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ "Behind every great fortune is a crime." -- Balzac -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 14 18:02:17 2004 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 13:02:17 -0500 Subject: Store in Toronto for Linux Ware In-Reply-To: References: <1076689425.402cfa11023e9@webmail.eol.ca> <402D78A4.3080105@rogers.com> Message-ID: <402E62A9.3040207@rogers.com> dougish-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org wrote: > On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 20:23:48 -0500, James wrote: > > >>dougish-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org wrote: >> >>>One of my co-workers wants to give a tux doll (plush or plastic) to his >>>wife for Valentine's Day. (I didn't want to ask why!) >>> >>>Does anyone know of a store in the GTA where he could find one? He >>>knows he's left it too late for an on-line purchase. >> >>I have one of each. The problem is, they've got "Caldera" printed on >>them. :-( > > > Similar problem. The one I have sitting on the top of my computer at > work has HP printed on it. I offered it to my co-worker, but he > declined because of the HP logo. I'd suspect Caldera is less popular in the Linux world these days, than HP. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From adb-tlug-AbAJl/g/NLXk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 14 22:57:47 2004 From: adb-tlug-AbAJl/g/NLXk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org (Anthony de Boer) Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 17:57:47 -0500 Subject: DNS question In-Reply-To: <000001c3f286$2e70f500$1902a8c0-B7WYQ2cLakwWhyVFc8JwjA@public.gmane.org>; from rfk-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org on Fri, Feb 13, 2004 at 06:07:41PM -0500 References: <20040213173022.J317@leftmind.net> <000001c3f286$2e70f500$1902a8c0@coilnetworks.com> Message-ID: <20040214175747.P317@leftmind.net> Robert F. Kennedy wrote: > syslog had never reported lines four and five before so perhaps things > are working now. The domain resolves here now, so you must have tweaked the right thing. -- Anthony de Boer -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 15 03:10:06 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 22:10:06 -0500 Subject: compaq deskpro for linux - HD problem In-Reply-To: <20040214102101.4b7dc050.joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <20040213145300.45646.qmail@web40207.mail.yahoo.com> <20040214020208.GA6524@m450> <000901c3f2aa$f0e5f3f0$0301a8c0@amazon> <20040214102101.4b7dc050.joehill@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <20040215031006.GF9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Sat, Feb 14, 2004 at 10:21:01AM -0500, JoeHill wrote: > Lemme get this straight. They make it more difficult to use unless you are > running Windows, adding totally unnecessary levels of complexity, deviating from > standard PC architecture for no valid reason, and it's the end user's fault for > being 'not qualified'. > > That's a knee-slapper. Did compaq ever fix the bios problem they had causing OSs to have to do weird tricks to detect the real amount of memory they have? Stupid company. Standards are meant to be followed, not ignored. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rfk-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 15 05:49:08 2004 From: rfk-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Robert F. Kennedy) Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 00:49:08 -0500 Subject: DNS question - thanks, got it working In-Reply-To: <20040214175747.P317-AbAJl/g/NLXk1uMJSBkQmQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040214175747.P317@leftmind.net> Message-ID: <000501c3f387$6dc13920$1902a8c0@coilnetworks.com> When I registered the domain I made a dyslexic error entering my static IP. It should have started with 66.11 instead I entered 11.66. Again, thanks for all the help. Best, Robert -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org] On Behalf Of Anthony de Boer Sent: Saturday, February 14, 2004 5:58 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: DNS question Robert F. Kennedy wrote: > syslog had never reported lines four and five before so perhaps things > are working now. The domain resolves here now, so you must have tweaked the right thing. -- Anthony de Boer -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From shijialee-/E1597aS9LQAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 15 07:31:02 2004 From: shijialee-/E1597aS9LQAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (James) Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 23:31:02 -0800 (PST) Subject: kernel config question. Message-ID: <20040215073102.23845.qmail@web40204.mail.yahoo.com> I am reading the README from the kernel file. under INSTALLING the kernel: it mentions that - make sure your /usr/include/asm, /usr/include/linux, and /usr/include/scsi directories are just symlinks to the kernel sources: cd /usr/include rm -rf asm linux scsi ln -s /usr/src/linux/include/asm-i386 asm ln -s /usr/src/linux/include/linux linux ln -s /usr/src/linux/include/scsi scsi is this necessary ? i did it without backup the original directories( which i am now regret ). then i got error while trying to compile the procps(the ps package). the error is In file included from /usr/include/linux/errno.h:4, from /usr/include/bits/errno.h:25, from /usr/include/errno.h:36, from proc/ksym.c:17: /usr/include/asm/errno.h:4: asm-generic/errno.h: No such file or directory this is debian 3.0. kernel 2.2.20-idepci. what should i do now ? __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online. http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From shijialee-/E1597aS9LQAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 15 07:47:14 2004 From: shijialee-/E1597aS9LQAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (James) Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 23:47:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: kernel config question. Message-ID: <20040215074714.73338.qmail@web40208.mail.yahoo.com> err, i really shouldn't compile kernel at such late night.. i was reading the 2.0.x kernel readme http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/README now i need to think of how to get /usr/include/asm, /usr/include/linux, and /usr/include/scsi back ... Qiang. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online. http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 15 03:10:48 2004 From: IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Ilya Palagin) Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 03:10:48 +0000 Subject: kernel config question. In-Reply-To: <20040215073102.23845.qmail-FiucmvnviNqA/QwVtaZbd3CJp6faPEW9@public.gmane.org> References: <20040215073102.23845.qmail@web40204.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <402EE338.8060502@rogers.com> James wrote: ... > > In file included from /usr/include/linux/errno.h:4, > from /usr/include/bits/errno.h:25, > from /usr/include/errno.h:36, > from proc/ksym.c:17: > /usr/include/asm/errno.h:4: asm-generic/errno.h: No such file or directory > > > this is debian 3.0. kernel 2.2.20-idepci. > > what should i do now ? > See ... If you're seeing this then your /usr/include/{asm,linux} are symlinks to your current kernel source. These directories must contain a copy of the kernel header files that were used to build glibc with, not the copy that came with the kernel you're currently running. ... -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 15 03:17:13 2004 From: IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Ilya Palagin) Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 03:17:13 +0000 Subject: kernel config question. In-Reply-To: <402EE338.8060502-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <20040215073102.23845.qmail@web40204.mail.yahoo.com> <402EE338.8060502@rogers.com> Message-ID: <402EE4B9.7000809@rogers.com> Ilya Palagin wrote: > James wrote: > ... > >> >> In file included from /usr/include/linux/errno.h:4, >> from /usr/include/bits/errno.h:25, >> from /usr/include/errno.h:36, >> from proc/ksym.c:17: >> /usr/include/asm/errno.h:4: asm-generic/errno.h: No such file or >> directory >> >> >> this is debian 3.0. kernel 2.2.20-idepci. >> what should i do now ? >> > > See > ... > If you're seeing this then your /usr/include/{asm,linux} are symlinks to > your current kernel source. These directories must contain a copy of > the kernel header files that were used to build glibc with, not the > copy that came with the kernel you're currently running. > ... > > And if you need to retrieve those kernel headers you removed, just apt-get them with --reinstall option. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 15 03:23:14 2004 From: IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Ilya Palagin) Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 03:23:14 +0000 Subject: kernel config question. In-Reply-To: <20040215074714.73338.qmail-YVEKlzFy1tWA/QwVtaZbd3CJp6faPEW9@public.gmane.org> References: <20040215074714.73338.qmail@web40208.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <402EE622.8010803@rogers.com> James wrote: > err, i really shouldn't compile kernel at such late night.. Kernels, compiled between 1am and 6am, are proven to be robust :-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 15 14:06:31 2004 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 09:06:31 -0500 Subject: compaq deskpro for linux - HD problem In-Reply-To: <20040215031006.GF9627-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20040213145300.45646.qmail@web40207.mail.yahoo.com> <20040214020208.GA6524@m450> <000901c3f2aa$f0e5f3f0$0301a8c0@amazon> <20040214102101.4b7dc050.joehill@sympatico.ca> <20040215031006.GF9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20040215090631.0e25aa0c.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Sat, 14 Feb 2004 22:10:06 -0500 Lennart Sorensen disseminated the following: > Standards are meant to be followed, not ignored. Exactement. -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 09:06:12 up 9 days, 20:53, 3 users, load average: 0.62, 0.68, 0.49 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Linux 2.4.22-21mdk i686 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Microsoft Palladium: The world is a fearful place (because we allowed it to be by introducing vulnerable designs followed by clueless security initiatives) so let us fix it for you.--Cringely -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 16 03:53:09 2004 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 22:53:09 -0500 (EST) Subject: Happy Valentines everyone! (ok, a little late) Message-ID: http://zxvf.se/bilder/baselove3.jpg -- Robert Brockway Senior Technical Consultant, OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Phone: 416-669-3073, Email: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org, http://www.opentrend.net OpenTrend Solutions: Reliable, secure solutions to real world problems. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 16 13:27:45 2004 From: sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org (Sidney Shapiro) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 08:27:45 -0500 Subject: Pen and pad - The city should get digital [OT] Message-ID: <000e01c3f490$ad104b20$6401a8c0@main> I was recently witness to an incident and I called 911 to report an emergency. After the police arrived, and I repeated what had happened to several police officers, the sergeant in charge, and some by standers, the sergeant asked me to give a statement. This entailed dictating my statement word for word to a police officer who wrote out a dozen or so pages in his notebook in capital letters over the course of a couple hours. He then proceeded to write out his questions and my answers and after letting me read over everything he had written, I signed the statement in his notebook. This was an incident which took place in about thirty seconds, recounting it took over three hours. All the while I stood there wishing the city would just get some electronic way of doing this, and making everyone's life so much easier. The lesson I took away from this is twofold. First, always have a camera next to the phone; a picture is worth a thousand words. Secondly, try to get as much detail as possible and then condense it into a couple of sentences if it is going to be dictated in the old fashion manner. Sid -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 16 15:04:04 2004 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 10:04:04 -0500 Subject: [Router/SNMP] Message-ID: <20040216150404.GA9545@my-wing> Tlug, Starting over from scratch is a daunting task for a Linux hobbyist. I needed a quick fix so we could have two machines sharing a connection. The fix is a hardware Firewall/Router (Linksys BEFSX41-CA). I chose this model because it was available and inexpensive. The only problem I had with the setup was the default MTU of 1492. An MTU of 1400 solved the browser hiccups. This model includes 4 ports. One port may be designated for DMZ. The unit does provide some simple logging capabilities that can be stored on a designated machine on the network. The problem is that the LogViewing software provided on the manufactures disc is for Windows. I can view the current logs with a browser but I'd like them to go to a dedicated Linux machine for storage. However, the protocol it uses (SNMPv1) to me, is anything BUT Simple. I have done some initial googling for SNMP, enough to learn the current version of this protocol is v3 and that I'll need a slew of new software. Is anyone out there familiar with snmp-trap/routers that could point me to a well-written condensed tutorial? I need just enough info to store/ view the logs for now. Thanks, farmer6re9 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 16 11:40:08 2004 From: IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Ilya Palagin) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 11:40:08 +0000 Subject: [Router/SNMP] In-Reply-To: <20040216150404.GA9545-B5vlSFeRxX4@public.gmane.org> References: <20040216150404.GA9545@my-wing> Message-ID: <4030AC18.50401@rogers.com> Gregory D Hough wrote: > Tlug, > > Starting over from scratch is a daunting task for a Linux hobbyist. I > needed a quick fix so we could have two machines sharing a connection. > The fix is a hardware Firewall/Router (Linksys BEFSX41-CA). I chose > this model because it was available and inexpensive. The only problem I > had with the setup was the default MTU of 1492. An MTU of 1400 solved > the browser hiccups. > > This model includes 4 ports. One port may be designated for DMZ. The > unit does provide some simple logging capabilities that can be stored > on a designated machine on the network. The problem is that the > LogViewing software provided on the manufactures disc is for Windows. I > can view the current logs with a browser but I'd like them to go to a > dedicated Linux machine for storage. However, the protocol it uses > (SNMPv1) to me, is anything BUT Simple. > > I have done some initial googling for SNMP, enough to learn the current > version of this protocol is v3 and that I'll need a slew of new software. > > Is anyone out there familiar with snmp-trap/routers that could point me > to a well-written condensed tutorial? I need just enough info to store/ > view the logs for now. Hi, look at this thread: It would be nice to know if linux' snmptrapd really can catch datastream from Linksys. Regards, Ilya. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 16 16:59:58 2004 From: mervc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Merv Curley) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 11:59:58 -0500 Subject: Debian Package Management and Firefox In-Reply-To: <402C3336.5030409-F0u+EriZ6ihBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <402C3336.5030409@truxtar.com> Message-ID: <200402161159.58338.mervc@eol.ca> On February 12, 2004 21:15, Anton Markov wrote: > Hello guys, > > Well, I've been running Debian now for two weeks, and I love it, > especially the package management system! Except for one thing: > > Now that Firefox 0.8 browser (Mozilla Firebird 0.8 renamed) (YAY!) has > come out along with Thunderbird 0.5 e-mail client, I want to install > them on my system. For now I just decompressed them to a folder in my > home directory and run them from there, but I want to make them the > default browser/e-mail. > I would suggest that you don't get too hung up on installing everything only by .debs. Untar it to /opt, create a Desktop icon to the firefox executable and your off and running. When the next version comes out do the same thing, a new directory will be created and change the properties of the icon to the new directory. After a bit more time we can help get Flash, Java etc working by creating the symlinks that you need. A bit much for a newbie right now > > -- Merv Curley Scarborough, Ont Libranet Linux 2.8 KDE 3.1.4 KMail 1.5.4 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From john.southern-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 16 17:08:37 2004 From: john.southern-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (John R. Southern) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 12:08:37 -0500 Subject: [Router/SNMP] In-Reply-To: <20040216150404.GA9545-B5vlSFeRxX4@public.gmane.org> References: <20040216150404.GA9545@my-wing> Message-ID: Hi Gregory, how about something like this: http://net-snmp.sourceforge.net/tutorial/ A while back when I was doing some work with SNMP, this was one of the sites that was a helpful reference. I believe that NET-SNMP comes installed with most distributions, so it'll be helpful for more than one reason. And, if you're a Python user, then have a look at this one too: http://pysnmp.sourceforge.net/ Hope this helps you out. Cheers.... .... John -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org]On Behalf Of Gregory D Hough Sent: February 16, 2004 10:04 AM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: [TLUG]: [Router/SNMP] Tlug, Starting over from scratch is a daunting task for a Linux hobbyist. I needed a quick fix so we could have two machines sharing a connection. The fix is a hardware Firewall/Router (Linksys BEFSX41-CA). I chose this model because it was available and inexpensive. The only problem I had with the setup was the default MTU of 1492. An MTU of 1400 solved the browser hiccups. This model includes 4 ports. One port may be designated for DMZ. The unit does provide some simple logging capabilities that can be stored on a designated machine on the network. The problem is that the LogViewing software provided on the manufactures disc is for Windows. I can view the current logs with a browser but I'd like them to go to a dedicated Linux machine for storage. However, the protocol it uses (SNMPv1) to me, is anything BUT Simple. I have done some initial googling for SNMP, enough to learn the current version of this protocol is v3 and that I'll need a slew of new software. Is anyone out there familiar with snmp-trap/routers that could point me to a well-written condensed tutorial? I need just enough info to store/ view the logs for now. Thanks, farmer6re9 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 15 17:58:00 2004 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter L. Peres) Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 19:58:00 +0200 (IST) Subject: compaq deskpro for linux - HD problem In-Reply-To: <20040215031006.GF9627-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20040213145300.45646.qmail@web40207.mail.yahoo.com> <20040214020208.GA6524@m450> <000901c3f2aa$f0e5f3f0$0301a8c0@amazon> <20040214102101.4b7dc050.joehill@sympatico.ca> <20040215031006.GF9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: On Sat, 14 Feb 2004, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > Standards are meant to be followed, not ignored. Unless you are large enough to write your own. Which they are. Not that it helps them much. I have an ancient Compaq i386 laptop with a nonstandard parallel port that caused me a lot of grief in the past. But it works for printing (I used it for something else). Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lada-h8kxHjy+vg4AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 16 17:50:23 2004 From: lada-h8kxHjy+vg4AvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Ladislav Svatos) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 12:50:23 -0500 Subject: [Router/SNMP] In-Reply-To: <20040216150404.GA9545-B5vlSFeRxX4@public.gmane.org> References: <20040216150404.GA9545@my-wing> Message-ID: <200402161250.23996.lada@agawa.com> On February 16, 2004 10:04 am, Gregory D Hough wrote: I did not try myself, but it seems to do what you want: http://woogie.net/linksysmon/ Lada > Tlug, > > Starting over from scratch is a daunting task for a Linux hobbyist. I > needed a quick fix so we could have two machines sharing a connection. > The fix is a hardware Firewall/Router (Linksys BEFSX41-CA). I chose > this model because it was available and inexpensive. The only problem I > had with the setup was the default MTU of 1492. An MTU of 1400 solved > the browser hiccups. > > This model includes 4 ports. One port may be designated for DMZ. The > unit does provide some simple logging capabilities that can be stored > on a designated machine on the network. The problem is that the > LogViewing software provided on the manufactures disc is for Windows. I > can view the current logs with a browser but I'd like them to go to a > dedicated Linux machine for storage. However, the protocol it uses > (SNMPv1) to me, is anything BUT Simple. > > I have done some initial googling for SNMP, enough to learn the current > version of this protocol is v3 and that I'll need a slew of new > software. > > Is anyone out there familiar with snmp-trap/routers that could point me > to a well-written condensed tutorial? I need just enough info to store/ > view the logs for now. > > Thanks, > farmer6re9 > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 16 18:58:51 2004 From: lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org (Lloyd Budd) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 13:58:51 -0500 Subject: 'find' ignore hidden (dot) files Message-ID: <291AA958-60B2-11D8-8C78-0003931BD222@foolswisdom.com> Hi, I am already "past it" (piped through grep), but I am surprised that I cannot figure out how to make find not "match" hidden files. I imagine that I am missing something? Thanks, Lloyd -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 16 19:55:05 2004 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 14:55:05 -0500 (EST) Subject: 'find' ignore hidden (dot) files In-Reply-To: <291AA958-60B2-11D8-8C78-0003931BD222-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ@public.gmane.org> References: <291AA958-60B2-11D8-8C78-0003931BD222@foolswisdom.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 16 Feb 2004, Lloyd Budd wrote: > I am already "past it" (piped through grep), but I am surprised that I > cannot figure out how to make find not "match" hidden files... find ..... ! -name '.*' ..... Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 16 20:35:15 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 15:35:15 -0500 Subject: OT: Looking for a specific KVM Message-ID: <40312983.5050906@alteeve.com> Hi all, I am hoping that I might luck into one or two specific KVM switches through someone here on the list (or someone might know where I can get these for a decent price). I already have a Belkin F1D104 switch which has the ability to cascade to other KVMs and most importantly to me the ability to switch through the ports and cascaded switches from the keyboard. They are a few years out now so I can't get them new and eBay is such a pain in the arse so if anyone can help me I would be very much appreciative! Oh, I need ideally two more switches (10 computers already) but if the price is good I would take three just to have it for later. Well, here's to hoping someone has one buried in a closet somewhere!! Madison -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 16 21:18:42 2004 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter L. Peres) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 23:18:42 +0200 (IST) Subject: 'find' ignore hidden (dot) files In-Reply-To: <291AA958-60B2-11D8-8C78-0003931BD222-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ@public.gmane.org> References: <291AA958-60B2-11D8-8C78-0003931BD222@foolswisdom.com> Message-ID: plp-NSb0HxlTAbs at public.gmane.org:~/tmp > touch .a plp-NSb0HxlTAbs at public.gmane.org:~/tmp > find ./ -regex '\./\..*' ./.a plp-NSb0HxlTAbs at public.gmane.org:~/tmp > regex can be tricky. Try to match just the tail using an expression that starts in / and ends in $. Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidm-6UJY8ib/KiBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 16 22:18:37 2004 From: davidm-6UJY8ib/KiBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (David Mayerlen) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 17:18:37 -0500 (EST) Subject: Postal Code/Locator Message-ID: Hey, Anybody ever build a store locator? Something along the idea of having a user enter a postal code and then showing them a list of nearby stores? Any suggestions much appreciated. I wrote a locator in Perl that worked on a little bit of a drill-down scenario with a few maps that broke down Ontario into regions and gave lists of stores for those regions BUT I'm pulling my hair out trying to find the darn thing!!! ========================================================= | David Mayerlen | Mayerlen Consulting Inc | davidm-6UJY8ib/KiBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org | 416-505-9470 ========================================================= -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 16 23:19:08 2004 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 18:19:08 -0500 Subject: Postal Code/Locator In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040216231908.GA6624@node1.opengeometry.net> On Mon, Feb 16, 2004 at 05:18:37PM -0500, David Mayerlen wrote: > Hey, > > Anybody ever build a store locator? Something along the idea of having a > user enter a postal code and then showing them a list of nearby stores? > > Any suggestions much appreciated. > > I wrote a locator in Perl that worked on a little bit of a drill-down > scenario with a few maps that broke down Ontario into regions and gave > lists of stores for those regions BUT I'm pulling my hair out trying to > find the darn thing!!! Isn't this matter of grep'ing a file with store addresses? -- William Park, Open Geometry Consulting, Linux solution for data management and processing. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From davidm-6UJY8ib/KiBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 17 01:22:55 2004 From: davidm-6UJY8ib/KiBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (David Mayerlen) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 20:22:55 -0500 (EST) Subject: Postal Code/Locator In-Reply-To: <20040216231908.GA6624-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040216231908.GA6624@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: > > Anybody ever build a store locator? Something along the idea of having a > > user enter a postal code and then showing them a list of nearby stores? > > > > Any suggestions much appreciated. > > > > I wrote a locator in Perl that worked on a little bit of a drill-down > > scenario with a few maps that broke down Ontario into regions and gave > > lists of stores for those regions BUT I'm pulling my hair out trying to > > find the darn thing!!! > > Isn't this matter of grep'ing a file with store addresses? > More than that. Need to compare a user's postal code to the available store postal codes and determine which ones are sorta nearby. > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 16 20:49:43 2004 From: IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Ilya Palagin) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 20:49:43 +0000 Subject: Postal Code/Locator In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <40312CE7.4010806@rogers.com> David Mayerlen wrote: >>> Anybody ever build a store locator? Something along the idea of having a >>>user enter a postal code and then showing them a list of nearby stores? >>> >>> Any suggestions much appreciated. >>> >>> I wrote a locator in Perl that worked on a little bit of a drill-down >>>scenario with a few maps that broke down Ontario into regions and gave >>>lists of stores for those regions BUT I'm pulling my hair out trying to >>>find the darn thing!!! >> >>Isn't this matter of grep'ing a file with store addresses? >> > > > More than that. Need to compare a user's postal code to the available > store postal codes and determine which ones are sorta nearby. > Clumsy, but cheap solution: with LWP (WWW library for Perl) you can send requests to http://ca.maps.yahoo.com, doing "Driving directions" requests between several points you've broken down Ontarion into and your client's location. Just compare distances then. If your traffic isn't too hard, and yahoo doesn't change its Canada Maps interface too often, this may work. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 17 01:51:55 2004 From: lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org (Lloyd Budd) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 20:51:55 -0500 Subject: Malformed recipient address ? Message-ID: Hi , I received an email that my spam filter says contains a Malformed recipient address as defined by RFC 2822 . The email is coming from CBS Radio and they appear to use MS Exchange 6, and I want to let them know about their problem ;-) In the header, the only recipient is me: To: I am looking @ Section 3.4 of the RFC and this lay(me)-person is not certain that the problem is the greater-than and less-than signs . Am I correct that these should not supplied for this scenario? Thank you, Lloyd -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 17 02:13:20 2004 From: lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org (Lloyd Budd) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 21:13:20 -0500 Subject: Pen and pad - The city should get digital [OT] In-Reply-To: <000e01c3f490$ad104b20$6401a8c0-UxDKcUsq0RM@public.gmane.org> References: <000e01c3f490$ad104b20$6401a8c0@main> Message-ID: Hi Sidney, I do not think that you have justified why or the benefit of the city going digital. The writing process is unlikely responsible for the amount of time required. Ironically, I also witnessed an accident the other day. It was cold and late at night, and the process for an instant event took ~ 1hr. On 16-Feb-04, at 8:27, Sidney Shapiro wrote: > First, always have a camera next to the phone; a picture is worth a > thousand words. Or a camera in your phone ;-) > Secondly, try to get as much detail as possible and then condense it > into a couple of sentences if it is going to be dictated in the old > fashion manner. What you are proposing is dangerous. Most witness accounts are "bad". As you wrote, the event occurred very quickly. The human mind is not good at identify all relevant details in a sequence that they are not familiar with -- a procedure programmer's may be the exception. Our minds are intuitive, and like to fill in details. Most witness accounts are poor. I am not an expert, but I know the following considerations are of value: 1. discuss the events as little as possible , otherwise there is a tendency for unintentional collaboration 2. when your mind is ready , and as new details come to the surface , record what you witnessed , in as verbose and exact language as possible * focus on what you are certain of , and make sure what you not sure of , is represented in that manner. Identify what assumptions you are making and conclusions you are reaching. *** do not be pressured into answering questions, or filling in details . You are normal and it is not your fault if you are not certain on details. Make sure that your statement accurately reflects your confidence in the data. * it can take weeks for details to surface I think I was the only "witness", although there were many people that witnessed the event :-( Thinking on the topic I cannot see the benefits of going digital outweighing the costs at this time, relative to our issues. Police are quite digital. Many cop cars seem to be equipped with laptops. Cheers, Lloyd D Budd -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From wmcgilvery-6d3DWWOeJtE at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 17 02:51:09 2004 From: wmcgilvery-6d3DWWOeJtE at public.gmane.org (Wil McGilvery) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 21:51:09 -0500 Subject: Postal Code/Locator Message-ID: <65B7B304AA3DE147BBD33938FE204E284A9935@lynchmail.lynch.msft> This one is $60.00 US. It will probably do want you want and isn't that expensive. http://zipcodelocators.com/ Regards, Wil McGilvery Manager Lynch Digital Media Inc 416-744-7949 416-716-3964 (cell) 1-866-314-4678 416-744-0406? FAX www.LynchDigital.com -----Original Message----- From: Ilya Palagin [mailto:IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org] Sent: Monday, February 16, 2004 3:50 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Postal Code/Locator David Mayerlen wrote: >>> Anybody ever build a store locator? Something along the idea of having a >>>user enter a postal code and then showing them a list of nearby stores? >>> >>> Any suggestions much appreciated. >>> >>> I wrote a locator in Perl that worked on a little bit of a drill-down >>>scenario with a few maps that broke down Ontario into regions and gave >>>lists of stores for those regions BUT I'm pulling my hair out trying to >>>find the darn thing!!! >> >>Isn't this matter of grep'ing a file with store addresses? >> > > > More than that. Need to compare a user's postal code to the available > store postal codes and determine which ones are sorta nearby. > Clumsy, but cheap solution: with LWP (WWW library for Perl) you can send requests to http://ca.maps.yahoo.com, doing "Driving directions" requests between several points you've broken down Ontarion into and your client's location. Just compare distances then. If your traffic isn't too hard, and yahoo doesn't change its Canada Maps interface too often, this may work. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From wmcgilvery-6d3DWWOeJtE at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 17 02:53:23 2004 From: wmcgilvery-6d3DWWOeJtE at public.gmane.org (Wil McGilvery) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 21:53:23 -0500 Subject: Postal Code/Locator Message-ID: <65B7B304AA3DE147BBD33938FE204E284A9936@lynchmail.lynch.msft> Here is another one. Last post I promise. http://www.findbystate.com/ Regards, Wil McGilvery Manager Lynch Digital Media Inc 416-744-7949 416-716-3964 (cell) 1-866-314-4678 416-744-0406? FAX www.LynchDigital.com -----Original Message----- From: Ilya Palagin [mailto:IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org] Sent: Monday, February 16, 2004 3:50 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Postal Code/Locator David Mayerlen wrote: >>> Anybody ever build a store locator? Something along the idea of having a >>>user enter a postal code and then showing them a list of nearby stores? >>> >>> Any suggestions much appreciated. >>> >>> I wrote a locator in Perl that worked on a little bit of a drill-down >>>scenario with a few maps that broke down Ontario into regions and gave >>>lists of stores for those regions BUT I'm pulling my hair out trying to >>>find the darn thing!!! >> >>Isn't this matter of grep'ing a file with store addresses? >> > > > More than that. Need to compare a user's postal code to the available > store postal codes and determine which ones are sorta nearby. > Clumsy, but cheap solution: with LWP (WWW library for Perl) you can send requests to http://ca.maps.yahoo.com, doing "Driving directions" requests between several points you've broken down Ontarion into and your client's location. Just compare distances then. If your traffic isn't too hard, and yahoo doesn't change its Canada Maps interface too often, this may work. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 16 22:54:18 2004 From: IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Ilya Palagin) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 22:54:18 +0000 Subject: Postal Code/Locator In-Reply-To: <65B7B304AA3DE147BBD33938FE204E284A9935-49iW0tF5bQXl9+zcyUE9hx1TMoFmMu2o@public.gmane.org> References: <65B7B304AA3DE147BBD33938FE204E284A9935@lynchmail.lynch.msft> Message-ID: <40314A1A.6000108@rogers.com> Wil McGilvery wrote: > This one is $60.00 US. It will probably do want you want and isn't that expensive. > > http://zipcodelocators.com/ "We simply do not have location data for Canada, Mexico, or any locations outside of the states and territories of the United States." > http://www.findbystate.com "displaying information on Dealers, Contacts, Sales Reps, Associations, Members or Store Locations around the United States." It's interesting - I failed to find a Canadian locator. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From wmcgilvery-6d3DWWOeJtE at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 17 03:53:35 2004 From: wmcgilvery-6d3DWWOeJtE at public.gmane.org (Wil McGilvery) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 22:53:35 -0500 Subject: Postal Code/Locator Message-ID: <65B7B304AA3DE147BBD33938FE204E284A9938@lynchmail.lynch.msft> I think they are both perl scripts. Maybe they could be hacked to show Canadian postal codes. Regards, Wil McGilvery Manager Lynch Digital Media Inc 416-744-7949 416-716-3964 (cell) 1-866-314-4678 416-744-0406? FAX www.LynchDigital.com -----Original Message----- From: Ilya Palagin [mailto:IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org] Sent: Monday, February 16, 2004 5:54 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Postal Code/Locator Wil McGilvery wrote: > This one is $60.00 US. It will probably do want you want and isn't that expensive. > > http://zipcodelocators.com/ "We simply do not have location data for Canada, Mexico, or any locations outside of the states and territories of the United States." > http://www.findbystate.com "displaying information on Dealers, Contacts, Sales Reps, Associations, Members or Store Locations around the United States." It's interesting - I failed to find a Canadian locator. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 17 04:07:03 2004 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 23:07:03 -0500 Subject: [Router/SNMP] In-Reply-To: <200402161250.23996.lada-h8kxHjy+vg4AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>; from lada-h8kxHjy+vg4AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org on Mon, Feb 16, 2004 at 12:50:23 -0500 References: <20040216150404.GA9545@my-wing> <200402161250.23996.lada@agawa.com> Message-ID: <20040217040703.GA10686@my-wing> Thank's for the excellent references to net-snmp! I wish I had six months and a few good books to learn it all and implement. Truth is I just want to save these logs until I set up the DMZ. At that point I'll have the usual /var/log/messages once again. I feel blinded without my verbose logs. On 02/16/2004 12:50:23 PM, Ladislav Svatos wrote: > On February 16, 2004 10:04 am, Gregory D Hough wrote: > > > to a well-written condensed tutorial? I need just enough info to > > store/view the logs for now. > > > I did not try myself, but it seems to do what you want: > > http://woogie.net/linksysmon/ > > Lada > It does exactly what I want! It's small, a snap to install and easy to use. I have a couple notes for the archives. >From http://woogie.net/linksysmon/?INSTALL in quotes. 1) "If you wish to enable extended logging, go to http://192.168.1.1/LogManage.htm." > this feature is not available for model BEFSX41. The log format is very basic. 2) "gzip -cd linksysmon-X.Y.tar.gz | tar xf - cd linksysmon-X.Y" > this command didn't work for me, I used: gunzip -v linksysmon-x.y.z.tar.gz | tar -xvf linksysmon.x.y.z.tar 3) "Next, you must make the perl module: perl Makefile.PL make" > best to have the perl-devel package installed beforehand. 4) "Edit /etc/linksysmon.conf to your liking" > when you edit this file, be sure to leave some value for each variable. Empty port or host lists will cause linksysmon to fail. Muchas Gracias Tlug, farmer6re9 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 16 23:32:55 2004 From: IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Ilya Palagin) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 23:32:55 +0000 Subject: Postal Code/Locator In-Reply-To: <65B7B304AA3DE147BBD33938FE204E284A9938-49iW0tF5bQXl9+zcyUE9hx1TMoFmMu2o@public.gmane.org> References: <65B7B304AA3DE147BBD33938FE204E284A9938@lynchmail.lynch.msft> Message-ID: <40315327.806@rogers.com> Wil McGilvery wrote: > I think they are both perl scripts. Maybe they could be hacked to show Canadian postal codes. > > Regards, > > Wil McGilvery > Manager > Lynch Digital Media Inc > > > > 416-744-7949 > 416-716-3964 (cell) > 1-866-314-4678 > 416-744-0406 FAX > www.LynchDigital.com > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Ilya Palagin [mailto:IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org] > Sent: Monday, February 16, 2004 5:54 PM > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Postal Code/Locator > > Wil McGilvery wrote: > >>This one is $60.00 US. It will probably do want you want and isn't that expensive. >> >>http://zipcodelocators.com/ > > "We simply do not have location data for Canada, Mexico, or any > locations outside of the states and territories of the United States." > > >>http://www.findbystate.com > > "displaying information on Dealers, Contacts, Sales Reps, Associations, > Members or Store Locations around the United States." > > It's interesting - I failed to find a Canadian locator. There is nothing to hack :-), they just don't have Canadian postal codes in their databases. These guys do: http://www.mapquest.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 17 04:55:24 2004 From: reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (rh) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 23:55:24 -0500 Subject: Pen and pad - The city should get digital [OT] In-Reply-To: References: <000e01c3f490$ad104b20$6401a8c0@main> Message-ID: <20040216235524.5da9e230.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> I have to agree with you. There are reasons most things are done a certain way. Just because there is a new fancy way of getting a job done does not mean it is the best way to do it. Taking a statement the old fashion way may have taken a few hours of your precious time but hopefully it will help and giving that time, in my opinion, is a civic duty as opposed to just adopting the FIDO priciple like everyone else. On Mon, 16 Feb 2004 21:13:20-0500 Lloyd Budd wrote: > Hi Sidney, > > I do not think that you have justified why or the benefit of the city > going digital. The writing process is unlikely responsible for the > amount of time required. > > Ironically, I also witnessed an accident the other day. It was cold > and late at night, and the process for an instant event took ~ 1hr. > > On 16-Feb-04, at 8:27, Sidney Shapiro wrote: > > > First, always have a camera next to the phone; a picture is worth a > > thousand words. > Or a camera in your phone ;-) > > > > Secondly, try to get as much detail as possible and then condense it > > into a couple of sentences if it is going to be dictated in the old > > fashion manner. > What you are proposing is dangerous. Most witness accounts are "bad". > > As you wrote, the event occurred very quickly. The human mind is not > good at identify all relevant details in a sequence that they are not > familiar with -- a procedure programmer's may be the exception. Our > minds are intuitive, and like to fill in details. Most witness > accounts are poor. > > I am not an expert, but I know the following considerations are of > value: > 1. discuss the events as little as possible , otherwise there is a > tendency for unintentional collaboration > 2. when your mind is ready , and as new details come to the surface , > record what you witnessed , in as verbose and exact language as > possible > * focus on what you are certain of , and make sure what you not sure > of , is represented in that manner. Identify what assumptions you are > making and conclusions you are reaching. > *** do not be pressured into answering questions, or filling in > details . You are normal and it is not your fault if you are not > certain on details. Make sure that your statement accurately reflects > your confidence in the data. > * it can take weeks for details to surface > > I think I was the only "witness", although there were many people that > witnessed the event :-( > > Thinking on the topic I cannot see the benefits of going digital > outweighing the costs at this time, relative to our issues. Police > are quite digital. Many cop cars seem to be equipped with laptops. > > > Cheers, > Lloyd D Budd > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 17 06:41:24 2004 From: sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org (Sidney Shapiro) Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 01:41:24 -0500 Subject: Pen and pad - The city should get digital [OT] In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <005401c3f521$1363a850$6401a8c0@main> > Thinking on the topic I cannot see the benefits of going digital > outweighing the costs at this time, relative to our issues. Police are > quite digital. Many cop cars seem to be equipped with laptops. > > > Cheers, > Lloyd D Budd Funny you should mention that Lloyd, the policeman did return to his car and was typing on his laptop for a while, I assume he was entering details of what I had told him into it. He did call out pertinent facts over the radio as we were discussing the matter. I know it was a civic duty, and I'm not complaining about the time I spent, I just wish everyone was a stenographer or we had voice dictation that actually works. I just can't wait for the star trek era. (Well, without the nuclear war of course) Sid -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 17 06:42:51 2004 From: sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org (Sidney Shapiro) Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 01:42:51 -0500 Subject: Postal Code/Locator In-Reply-To: <65B7B304AA3DE147BBD33938FE204E284A9938-49iW0tF5bQXl9+zcyUE9hx1TMoFmMu2o@public.gmane.org> References: <65B7B304AA3DE147BBD33938FE204E284A9938@lynchmail.lynch.msft> Message-ID: <005501c3f521$47948ef0$6401a8c0@main> > > Wil McGilvery wrote: > > This one is $60.00 US. It will probably do want you want and isn't that > expensive. > > > > http://zipcodelocators.com/ > "We simply do not have location data for Canada, Mexico, or any > locations outside of the states and territories of the United States." > > > http://www.findbystate.com > "displaying information on Dealers, Contacts, Sales Reps, Associations, > Members or Store Locations around the United States." > > It's interesting - I failed to find a Canadian locator. I remember seeing one a while back, I think it may have been from infousa, but I can't be sure. I will do some digging and see if I can find it. Sid -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jason-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 17 13:41:28 2004 From: jason-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/ at public.gmane.org (Jason Shein) Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 08:41:28 -0500 Subject: OT: Looking for a specific KVM Message-ID: <3fdf03d1bd261e30a722e89abdcb1902@www.pcsecurityonline.com> Look into the Zonet's line of products. http://www.zonetusa.com/ You can get these locally and they work well. http://www.zonetusa.com/kvm3008z.htm 8 port http://www.zonetusa.com/kvm3016z.htm 16 port just be aware when you buy your cables that the video port on these switches are female, so you will need to buy a male to female adaptor for the normal style of cables. [Features:] * Access multiple computers from one keyboard, mouse and monitor without extra interface card or software. * Support IBM PS/2 or PC/AT compatibility computer (PC, Notebook PC, Server, Work Station). * Support Win95/98/NT/2000/ME/XP, DOS, Linux, Unix, Novell, Free BSD. * Control from panel buttons, hot-key or OSD menu. * LED indicator and buzzer sound for switching confirmation. * Auto-scan interval setting both OSD and Non-OSD model. * Two way button, can be push from front or press from top. * Intelligent keyboard and mouse simulation, all PCs can booting in the same time. * Auto convert serial mouse to PS/2 mouse. * Support Microsoft IntelliMouse (Pro), Optical Mouse, Logitech Mouse Man, Wheel Mouse, Scroll Point. * Auto-scan automatically selects computer sequentially. * (OSD: 5 sec. interval, Non-OSD: 1 sec. interval.) * Keyboard states automatically saved and restored when switching computer. * Automatically restored mouse type when switching computer. * Cascade configuration expands system capability * Plug and Play system configuration, hot plugged PC or keyboard, mouse any time. * Support VGA, SVGA, XVGA, resolution: 1960 x 1440. / 200 MHz * Support DDC 1/2B * PC port keep alive capability, KVM powering down all PCs still keep active. * KVM3008 series can be fixed to standard 19'' rack. * Hot-key selectable scroll lock / caps lock. * Security lock function .(OSD) * Hot Plug- Add PCs or remove connected PCs for maintenance without powering down KVM Switch or PCs * No software required - Easy PC selection via On Screen Display Manual (OSD), Push Buttons, Hot Keys * Support 8 characters Password Protection & Search PC Server Name * Auto scan-mode for monitoring PCs * Keyboard status restored when switching PCs * LED display for easy status check * Buzzer sound for switching port confirmation * Using Standard Keybaord, VGA, Mouse Cable * Built-in one extra daisy chain port and no waste any PC port * No DIP Switch setting needed and Auto-Detection Daisy Chain Bank Madison Kelly wrote: >Hi all, > > I am hoping that I might luck into one or two specific KVM switches >through someone here on the list (or someone might know where I can get >these for a decent price). I already have a Belkin F1D104 switch which >has the ability to cascade to other KVMs and most importantly to me the >ability to switch through the ports and cascaded switches from the >keyboard. > > They are a few years out now so I can't get them new and eBay is such >a pain in the arse so if anyone can help me I would be very much >appreciative! Oh, I need ideally two more switches (10 computers >already) but if the price is good I would take three just to have it for >later. > > Well, here's to hoping someone has one buried in a closet somewhere!! > >Madison > >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- " Eventually people tire of repairing broken Windows, And decide to replace them with something stronger" (o_ // Linux - The Choice Of A GNU Generation V_/_ Jason Shein Linux Registered User #281100 jason-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/@public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 17 13:48:32 2004 From: matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (G. Matthew Rice) Date: 17 Feb 2004 08:48:32 -0500 Subject: Postal Code/Locator In-Reply-To: <40314A1A.6000108-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <65B7B304AA3DE147BBD33938FE204E284A9935@lynchmail.lynch.msft> <40314A1A.6000108@rogers.com> Message-ID: Ilya Palagin writes: > "We simply do not have location data for Canada, Mexico, or any > locations outside of the states and territories of the United States." Sure. You can download the zipcode database [with lat/long positions] for free from the USPS. > It's interesting - I failed to find a Canadian locator. That's because you have to pay for the Canadian equivalent of the above US information. And even then you have to access it through a crappy windows application that restricts you to a 100 entry response limit [maybe there's a more expensive version but I think that this one is $2000]. And even using a windows 'event' recorder to automatically extract those records, 100 at a time, is against the license that you agree to [let me know if you need a URL for a good event recorder :)]. So much for freedom of information, eh? -- g. matthew rice starnix inc. phone: 905-771-0017 x242 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mark-/2gyfjYZF1k at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 17 14:06:17 2004 From: mark-/2gyfjYZF1k at public.gmane.org (Mark Wadden) Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 09:06:17 -0500 Subject: Postal Code/Locator References: Message-ID: <000e01c3f55f$36490840$a87d8b3f@sarcodine> I've got just the thing for you.... http://www.zipinfo.com/products/z5ll/z5ll.htm This is basically a large text file with all the info you'll need. A sample record follows: "City Name","State Code","ZIP code","Area code","County FIPS code","County Name","Time zone","DST","Latitude","Longitude","ZIP Code Type" "Austin","TX","73301","512","48453","Travis","CST","Y","30.2669","97.7429" I'm not 100% sure if that's the right link above, but they do have Canadian data as well. I've built the exact type of locator you're looking for with this data. We dumped the file into mysql and wrote a perl mod to do the searches. It uses the two postal codes and the longitude/latitude to compute the distance. Here's a couple examples of store locators that I've built for my clients using this: http://www.nikon.ca/dealers/ http://www.coffeetime.ca/findastore-1.esp Let me know if you choose to go this way and I can forward on the perl code I have. Hope this helps! -- Mark Wadden Chief Software Engineer Grey Matter Intelligent and Interactive Inc. http://www.greymatter.ca/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Mayerlen" To: Sent: Monday, February 16, 2004 5:18 PM Subject: [TLUG]: Postal Code/Locator > Hey, > > Anybody ever build a store locator? Something along the idea of having a > user enter a postal code and then showing them a list of nearby stores? > > Any suggestions much appreciated. > > I wrote a locator in Perl that worked on a little bit of a drill-down > scenario with a few maps that broke down Ontario into regions and gave > lists of stores for those regions BUT I'm pulling my hair out trying to > find the darn thing!!! > > ========================================================= > | David Mayerlen > | Mayerlen Consulting Inc > | davidm-6UJY8ib/KiBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org > | 416-505-9470 > ========================================================= > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 17 14:08:02 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 09:08:02 -0500 Subject: Into NAT'ed server okay, can't get out... Message-ID: <40322042.10104@alteeve.com> Hi all, I have a test network here that I am trying to write a firewall script for with three NICs; eth0 = LAN, eth1 = NAT'ed serrvers and eth2 = Internet (Fedora Core 1, iptables 1.2.9, 2.4.2149 kernel). I have the LAN clients behind the firewall connecting to the internet fine (LAN is on 192.168.1.0/24 being SNAT'ed behind the firewall's static public IP) and from the outside world I can connect via SSH (port 22) to the public servers which are DNAT/SNAT'ed behind the firewall with one IP a piece (they are on a seperate local LAN subnet of 192.168.2.0/24) but for some reason I can't figure out I can not get the server client to get out onto the Internet itself. I have tried inserting rules at the top of the FORWARD chain to say; '/sbin/iptables -t filter -I FORWARD -i eth1 -o eth2 -j ACCEPT' '/sbin/iptables -t filter -I FORWARD -i eth2 -o eth1 -j ACCEPT' Which should have allowed communication through (though no protection I realize) but even that didn't work. I think I've got SNAT and DNAT setup right because I can SSH into a test server from the Internet (as I should) but I just can't get out on that same server. Here is the output (cleaned) from 'iptables-save'... Can anyone tell me where I have gaffed? Thanks!! Madison PS - The script I am using to create these rules is a -heavily- modified Monmotha firewall script. -= From 'iptables-savew >iptables.out' =- Generated by iptables-save v1.2.9 on Mon Feb 16 16:45:08 2004 *mangle :PREROUTING ACCEPT [66:3456] :INPUT ACCEPT [66:3456] :FORWARD ACCEPT [0:0] :OUTPUT ACCEPT [66:13144] :POSTROUTING ACCEPT [66:13144] COMMIT # Completed on Mon Feb 16 16:45:08 2004 # Generated by iptables-save v1.2.9 on Mon Feb 16 16:45:08 2004 *nat :PREROUTING ACCEPT [0:0] :POSTROUTING ACCEPT [0:0] :OUTPUT ACCEPT [0:0] -A PREROUTING -d 111.222.33.44 -j DNAT --to-destination 192.168.2.12 -A PREROUTING -d 111.222.33.45 -j DNAT --to-destination 192.168.2.11 -A POSTROUTING -s 192.168.1.0/255.255.255.0 -o eth2 -j SNAT --to-source 111.222.33.43 -A POSTROUTING -s 192.168.2.12 -j SNAT --to-source 111.222.33.44 -A POSTROUTING -s 192.168.2.11 -j SNAT --to-source 111.222.33.45 COMMIT # Completed on Mon Feb 16 16:45:08 2004 # Generated by iptables-save v1.2.9 on Mon Feb 16 16:45:08 2004 *filter :INPUT DROP [2:116] :FORWARD DROP [0:0] :OUTPUT ACCEPT [46:11032] :INETIN - [0:0] :INETOUT - [0:0] :LDROP - [0:0] :LREJECT - [0:0] :LTREJECT - [0:0] :PUBIN - [0:0] :PUBOUT - [0:0] :TCPACCEPT - [0:0] :TREJECT - [0:0] :UDPACCEPT - [0:0] :ULDROP - [0:0] :ULREJECT - [0:0] :ULTREJECT - [0:0] -A INPUT -p tcp -m mac --mac-source 00:11:22:33:44:55 -m tcp --dport 22 -j TCPACCEPT -A INPUT -p tcp -m mac --mac-source 00:11:22:33:44:56 -m tcp --dport 22 -j TCPACCEPT -A INPUT -p tcp -m mac --mac-source 00:11:22:33:44:57 -m tcp --dport 22 -j TCPACCEPT -A INPUT -p udp -m mac --mac-source 00:11:22:33:44:55 -m udp --dport 22 -j UDPACCEPT -A INPUT -p udp -m mac --mac-source 00:11:22:33:44:56 -m udp --dport 22 -j UDPACCEPT -A INPUT -p udp -m mac --mac-source 00:11:22:33:44:57 -m udp --dport 22 -j UDPACCEPT -A INPUT -i eth2 -j INETIN -A INPUT -i eth1 -j INETIN -A INPUT -i eth0 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 53 -j TCPACCEPT -A INPUT -i eth0 -p udp -m udp --dport 53 -j UDPACCEPT -A INPUT -i eth1 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 53 -j TCPACCEPT -A INPUT -i eth1 -p udp -m udp --dport 53 -j UDPACCEPT -A INPUT -s 192.168.1.0/255.255.255.0 -j INETIN -A INPUT -i lo -j ACCEPT -A INPUT -i eth0 -p udp -m udp --dport 67 -j ACCEPT -A FORWARD -i eth2 -o eth0 -j INETIN -A FORWARD -i eth0 -o eth2 -j INETOUT -A FORWARD -i eth1 -o eth0 -j PUBOUT -A FORWARD -i eth0 -o eth1 -j PUBIN -A FORWARD -i eth2 -o eth1 -j PUBIN -A FORWARD -i eth1 -o eth2 -j PUBOUT -A FORWARD -s 192.168.1.0/255.255.255.0 -i ! eth2 -o ! eth2 -j ACCEPT -A OUTPUT -o eth2 -j INETOUT -A OUTPUT -o eth1 -j PUBOUT -A INETIN -m state --state INVALID -j TREJECT -A INETIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 5 -j TREJECT -A INETIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 9 -j TREJECT -A INETIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 10 -j TREJECT -A INETIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 15 -j TREJECT -A INETIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 16 -j TREJECT -A INETIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 17 -j TREJECT -A INETIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 18 -j TREJECT -A INETIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 8 -m limit --limit 1/sec -j ACCEPT -A INETIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 8 -j TREJECT -A INETIN -p icmp -m icmp ! --icmp-type 8 -j ACCEPT -A INETIN -m state --state ESTABLISHED -j ACCEPT -A INETIN -p tcp -m tcp --dport 1024:65535 -m state --state RELATED -j TCPACCEPT -A INETIN -p udp -m udp --dport 1024:65535 -m state --state RELATED -j UDPACCEPT -A INETIN -j TREJECT -A INETOUT -j ACCEPT -A LDROP -p tcp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "TCP Dropped " --log-level 6 -A LDROP -p udp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "UDP Dropped " --log-level 6 -A LDROP -p icmp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "ICMP Dropped " --log-level 6 -A LDROP -f -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "FRAGMENT Dropped " -A LDROP -j DROP -A LREJECT -p tcp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "TCP Rejected " --log-level 6 -A LREJECT -p udp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "UDP Rejected " --log-level 6 -A LREJECT -p icmp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "ICMP Rejected " --log-level 6 -A LREJECT -f -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "FRAGMENT Rejected " -A LREJECT -j REJECT --reject-with icmp-port-unreachable -A LTREJECT -p tcp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "TCP Rejected " --log-level 6 -A LTREJECT -p udp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "UDP Rejected " --log-level 6 -A LTREJECT -p icmp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "ICMP Rejected " --log-level 6 -A LTREJECT -f -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "FRAGMENT Rejected " -A LTREJECT -j TREJECT -A PUBIN -d 192.168.2.12 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 22 -j TCPACCEPT -A PUBIN -d 192.168.2.12 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 25 -j TCPACCEPT -A PUBIN -d 192.168.2.12 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 53 -j TCPACCEPT -A PUBIN -d 192.168.2.12 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 80 -j TCPACCEPT -A PUBIN -d 192.168.2.12 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 110 -j TCPACCEPT -A PUBIN -d 192.168.2.12 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 443 -j TCPACCEPT -A PUBIN -d 192.168.2.12 -p udp -m udp --dport 22 -j UDPACCEPT -A PUBIN -d 192.168.2.12 -p udp -m udp --dport 25 -j UDPACCEPT -A PUBIN -d 192.168.2.12 -p udp -m udp --dport 53 -j UDPACCEPT -A PUBIN -d 192.168.2.12 -p udp -m udp --dport 80 -j UDPACCEPT -A PUBIN -d 192.168.2.12 -p udp -m udp --dport 110 -j UDPACCEPT -A PUBIN -d 192.168.2.12 -p udp -m udp --dport 443 -j UDPACCEPT -A PUBIN -d 192.168.2.11 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 22 -j TCPACCEPT -A PUBIN -d 192.168.2.11 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 25 -j TCPACCEPT -A PUBIN -d 192.168.2.11 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 53 -j TCPACCEPT -A PUBIN -d 192.168.2.11 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 80 -j TCPACCEPT -A PUBIN -d 192.168.2.11 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 110 -j TCPACCEPT -A PUBIN -d 192.168.2.11 -p udp -m udp --dport 22 -j UDPACCEPT -A PUBIN -d 192.168.2.11 -p udp -m udp --dport 25 -j UDPACCEPT -A PUBIN -d 192.168.2.11 -p udp -m udp --dport 53 -j UDPACCEPT -A PUBIN -d 192.168.2.11 -p udp -m udp --dport 80 -j UDPACCEPT -A PUBIN -d 192.168.2.11 -p udp -m udp --dport 110 -j UDPACCEPT -A PUBIN -j TREJECT -A PUBOUT -o eth1 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 53 -j TCPACCEPT -A PUBOUT -o eth1 -p udp -m udp --dport 53 -j UDPACCEPT -A PUBOUT -s 192.168.2.12 -d 192.168.2.1 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 22 -j TCPACCEPT -A PUBOUT -s 192.168.2.12 -d 192.168.2.1 -p udp -m udp --dport 22 -j UDPACCEPT -A PUBOUT -s 192.168.2.11 -o eth0 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 22 -j TCPACCEPT -A PUBOUT -s 192.168.2.11 -o eth0 -p udp -m udp --dport 22 -j UDPACCEPT -A PUBOUT -o eth0 -j INETIN -A PUBOUT -j ACCEPT -A TCPACCEPT -p tcp -m tcp --tcp-flags SYN,RST,ACK SYN -m limit --limit 20/sec -j ACCEPT -A TCPACCEPT -p tcp -m tcp --tcp-flags SYN,RST,ACK SYN -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "Possible SynFlood " -A TCPACCEPT -p tcp -m tcp --tcp-flags SYN,RST,ACK SYN -j TREJECT -A TCPACCEPT -p tcp -m tcp ! --tcp-flags SYN,RST,ACK SYN -j ACCEPT -A TCPACCEPT -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "Mismatch in TCPACCEPT " -A TCPACCEPT -j TREJECT -A TREJECT -p tcp -j REJECT --reject-with tcp-reset -A TREJECT -p udp -j REJECT --reject-with icmp-port-unreachable -A TREJECT -p icmp -j DROP -A TREJECT -j REJECT --reject-with icmp-port-unreachable -A UDPACCEPT -p udp -j ACCEPT -A UDPACCEPT -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "Mismatch on UDPACCEPT " -A UDPACCEPT -j TREJECT -A ULDROP -p tcp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j ULOG --ulog-prefix "LDROP_TCP" -A ULDROP -p udp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j ULOG --ulog-prefix "LDROP_UDP" -A ULDROP -p icmp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j ULOG --ulog-prefix "LDROP_ICMP" -A ULDROP -f -m limit --limit 2/sec -j ULOG --ulog-prefix "LDROP_FRAG" -A ULDROP -j DROP -A ULREJECT -p tcp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j ULOG --ulog-prefix "LREJECT_TCP" -A ULREJECT -p udp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j ULOG --ulog-prefix "LREJECT_UDP" -A ULREJECT -p icmp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j ULOG --ulog-prefix "LREJECT_UDP" -A ULREJECT -f -m limit --limit 2/sec -j ULOG --ulog-prefix "LREJECT_FRAG" -A ULREJECT -j REJECT --reject-with icmp-port-unreachable -A ULTREJECT -p tcp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j ULOG --ulog-prefix "LTREJECT_TCP" -A ULTREJECT -p udp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j ULOG --ulog-prefix "LTREJECT_UDP" -A ULTREJECT -p icmp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j ULOG --ulog-prefix "LTREJECT_ICMP" -A ULTREJECT -f -m limit --limit 2/sec -j ULOG --ulog-prefix "LTREJECT_FRAG" -A ULTREJECT -p tcp -j REJECT --reject-with tcp-reset -A ULTREJECT -p udp -j REJECT --reject-with icmp-port-unreachable -A ULTREJECT -p icmp -j DROP -A ULTREJECT -j REJECT --reject-with icmp-port-unreachable COMMIT # Completed on Mon Feb 16 16:45:08 2004 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lists-tZhE6lH4Esk+k03BA+Hq9g at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 17 14:23:40 2004 From: lists-tZhE6lH4Esk+k03BA+Hq9g at public.gmane.org (Oliver Meyn) Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 09:23:40 -0500 Subject: Postal Code/Locator In-Reply-To: <000e01c3f55f$36490840$a87d8b3f-YpAK90VGuyOzQB+pC5nmwQ@public.gmane.org> References: <000e01c3f55f$36490840$a87d8b3f@sarcodine> Message-ID: <1077027819.2392.14.camel@theconstruct.mineallmeyn.net> On Tue, 2004-02-17 at 09:06, Mark Wadden wrote: > I've got just the thing for you.... > > http://www.zipinfo.com/products/z5ll/z5ll.htm > > This is basically a large text file with all the info you'll need. A sample > record follows: This is a great resource - thanks! Oliver -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tchitow-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 17 18:35:43 2004 From: tchitow-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Martin Duclos) Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 13:35:43 -0500 Subject: remap_page_range compiling question Message-ID: Hi all, I have a quick question. I'm using a redhat 9.0 machine trying to compile a driver for webcams. I get a compile error about rempa_page_range. After a little looking around I found out that the mm.h where the prototype is located has changed and now takes 5 parameters. int remap_page_range(struct vm_area_struct *vma, unsigned long from, unsigned long to, unsigned long size, pgprot_t prot); The call to that function have only 4 parameters. The first one (vm_area_struct *) is missing. Any idea where it's coming from? Is there a constant somewhere I can throw in there? Has anyone had problems compiling drivers on redhat 9.0 machine in regard to a call to remap_page_rnage? Martin _________________________________________________________________ Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee when you click here. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 17 20:41:00 2004 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter L. Peres) Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 22:41:00 +0200 (IST) Subject: Malformed recipient address ? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: The email address is correct and it should be accepted by you. Should not and Must not are different in RFC lingo. The best way to parse email addresses is using a regexp. Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 17 23:13:52 2004 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 18:13:52 -0500 (EST) Subject: Calling all potential speakers Message-ID: Hi all. We need a speaker for the coming month. Even if you don't consider yourself an expert, consider doing a talk on a particular topic. It's great - you get to talk about your favourite topic or Linux/computer/networking related subject to your heart's content (limit 90 minutes :) The choice of topic is virtually unlimited. A few examples to help potential speakers along: 1) Favourite application. 2) Recent project that has been completed. 3) Project still in progress. 4) Technical topic that is of use to Linux users/admins. Eg, my recent CIDR talk. 5) Favourite obscure distribution. 6) Discussion of some highly technical aspect of Linux/Unix. Eg, What is the O(1) scheduler in the 2.6 kernel and how does it work. 7) Discussion of some not so highly technical aspect of Linux/Unix. Eg, cool stuff you can do with a shell. 8) Discussion of some non-technical aspect of Linux/Unix Eg, what is the Unix philosophy, and how does it apply to various applications. Anyone interested in doing a talk for the next meeting, which I believe will be March 9 2004, please send me a quick email. We also have a place open for April. And finally, to make sure everyone is still awake, a quick quiz: QUIZ QUESTION: How did a penguin become the Linux mascott? or CORROLLARY QUESTION: What sort of penguin is Tux? Cheers, Rob -- Robert Brockway Senior Technical Consultant, OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Phone: 416-669-3073, Email: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org, http://www.opentrend.net OpenTrend Solutions: Reliable, secure solutions to real world problems. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 17 23:25:48 2004 From: blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Byron Sonne) Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 18:25:48 -0500 Subject: Calling all potential speakers In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4032A2FC.4020400@rogers.com> > QUIZ QUESTION: How did a penguin become the Linux mascott? I believe Torvalds was charged by a penguin at a zoo, and as a result came to respect it. It's appearance belies it's ferocity ;) -- For Good, return Good. For Evil, return Justice. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 18 00:53:10 2004 From: hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (D. Hugh Redelmeier) Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 19:53:10 -0500 (EST) Subject: Preventing the next MyDoom (fwd) Message-ID: I sent the following letter to a local commercial newsletter. I thought some TLUGgers might be interested. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 19:50:22 -0500 (EST) From: "D. Hugh Redelmeier" To: rdutt-baJCGVF0K2RfOZc0+OmrVg at public.gmane.org cc: swexler-5fEA2WC4m+QrCQQS9T2b3QC/G2K4zDHf at public.gmane.org Subject: Preventing the next MyDoom I just read your column. You seem to blame everyone for MyDoom except the maker of the fundamental mistakes: Microsoft. "opening" an attachment should not be a problem. It isn't a problem on my computer (it runs LINUX). It is crazy to let opening a document run potentially dangerous code. Microsoft has made a whole bunch of decisions that leave its customers open to attack. I'm not talking about bugs: all code has bugs. I'm talking about design mistakes that were made years ago and have not been fixed: - Microsoft Excel, PowerPoint, Word, and so on allow embedded Visual BASIC for Applications scripts. This turns what should be passive documents into active threats. (This problem is wider than email attachments.) - "opening" a .exe file is interpreted as: please run this. This is a crazy default for email attachments. Aside from the danger, it probably makes no sense in the MS Windows environment where programs generally have to be installed to be runnable. As far as I can tell, the major use for freestanding .exe files is as self-extracting archives. Surely this could be replaced by a sensible archive file type (perhaps .zip). Then there would be no reason to allow "opening" a .exe anywhere. - There are many other extensions that are dangerous to "open" (eg. .pif, .com). And Microsoft didn't even disclose all of them (eg. .scr). - Microsoft tools, by default, don't show the file extension. Combine this with the fact that the user has to protect himself from some of them (because Microsoft tools don't) and you are in a Catch 22 situation. - As I understand it, in the past, Outlook used to "open" mail attachments automatically to create thumbnails. Wow. All these problems have been well known for a decade or more. And yet Microsoft hasn't fixed them (except for the thumbnail problem). Why are you not holding Microsoft accountable? Isn't it about time? For related (but slightly different) view, look at this item from the current issue of Crypto-Gram: Bruce Schneier is a very well respected security expert. I recommend subscribing to his free newsletter. Hugh Redelmeier hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org voice: +1 416 482-8253 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 18 04:22:32 2004 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 23:22:32 -0500 (EST) Subject: Calling all potential speakers In-Reply-To: <4032A2FC.4020400-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <4032A2FC.4020400@rogers.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 17 Feb 2004, Byron Sonne wrote: > > QUIZ QUESTION: How did a penguin become the Linux mascott? > > I believe Torvalds was charged by a penguin at a zoo, and as a result > came to respect it. It's appearance belies it's ferocity ;) Not bad :) He was infact _bitten_ by a Little (Fairy) Penguin at Sydney Zoo while visiting Australia for a Linux conference in the mid 90s. He joked about subsequently getting "penguinitis" and being forced to put penguins everywhere :) I recommend anyone visiting Melbourne, Australia try to get to Phillip Island to see the Penguin Parade. Quite amazing. There is plenty of other stuff to do on the Island as well. http://www.penguins.org.au/02/sec_02_html/penguin_pg.html http://goaustralia.about.com/cs/vicsightseeing/a/phillip1.htm Rob -- Robert Brockway Senior Technical Consultant, OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Phone: 416-669-3073, Email: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org, http://www.opentrend.net OpenTrend Solutions: Reliable, secure solutions to real world problems. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 18 04:37:03 2004 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 23:37:03 -0500 (EST) Subject: Calling all potential speakers In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Tue, 17 Feb 2004, Robert Brockway wrote: > He was infact _bitten_ by a Little (Fairy) Penguin at Sydney Zoo while > visiting Australia for a Linux conference in the mid 90s... Fairy penguins, for those who haven't heard of them, come as little as 15cm tall. I dimly recall Arthur C. Clarke once saying that they were the cutest things imaginable until you unwisely try to pick one up, "at which point it starts shrieking curses and systematically removing the flesh from your hand with its needle-sharp beak". Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 18 05:31:39 2004 From: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 00:31:39 -0500 (EST) Subject: Preventing the next MyDoom (fwd) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4590.207.194.61.133.1077082299.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> Good info, Hugh. Peter > I sent the following letter to a local commercial newsletter. > > I thought some TLUGgers might be interested. > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 19:50:22 -0500 (EST) > From: "D. Hugh Redelmeier" > To: rdutt-baJCGVF0K2RfOZc0+OmrVg at public.gmane.org > cc: swexler-5fEA2WC4m+QrCQQS9T2b3QC/G2K4zDHf at public.gmane.org > Subject: Preventing the next MyDoom > > I just read your column. > > > You seem to blame everyone for MyDoom except the maker of the > fundamental mistakes: Microsoft. > > "opening" an attachment should not be a problem. It isn't a problem > on my computer (it runs LINUX). It is crazy to let opening a document > run potentially dangerous code. > > Microsoft has made a whole bunch of decisions that leave its > customers open to attack. I'm not talking about bugs: all code has > bugs. I'm talking about design mistakes that were made years ago and > have not been fixed: > > - Microsoft Excel, PowerPoint, Word, and so on allow embedded Visual > BASIC for Applications scripts. This turns what should be passive > documents into active threats. (This problem is wider than email > attachments.) > > - "opening" a .exe file is interpreted as: please run this. This is a > crazy default for email attachments. Aside from the danger, it > probably makes no sense in the MS Windows environment where programs > generally have to be installed to be runnable. > > As far as I can tell, the major use for freestanding .exe files is as > self-extracting archives. Surely this could be replaced by a > sensible archive file type (perhaps .zip). Then there would be > no reason to allow "opening" a .exe anywhere. > > - There are many other extensions that are dangerous to "open" (eg. > .pif, .com). And Microsoft didn't even disclose all of them (eg. > .scr). > > - Microsoft tools, by default, don't show the file extension. Combine > this with the fact that the user has to protect himself from some of > them (because Microsoft tools don't) and you are in a Catch 22 > situation. > > - As I understand it, in the past, Outlook used to "open" mail > attachments automatically to create thumbnails. Wow. > > All these problems have been well known for a decade or more. And yet > Microsoft hasn't fixed them (except for the thumbnail problem). > > Why are you not holding Microsoft accountable? Isn't it about time? > > For related (but slightly different) view, look at this item from the > current issue of Crypto-Gram: > > Bruce Schneier is a very well respected security expert. I recommend > subscribing to his free newsletter. > > Hugh Redelmeier > hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org voice: +1 416 482-8253 > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jvetterli-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 18 15:56:54 2004 From: jvetterli-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org (John Vetterli) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 10:56:54 -0500 (EST) Subject: Tux (was: Calling all potential speakers) In-Reply-To: References: <4032A2FC.4020400@rogers.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 17 Feb 2004, Robert Brockway wrote: > On Tue, 17 Feb 2004, Byron Sonne wrote: > > > QUIZ QUESTION: How did a penguin become the Linux mascott? > > I believe Torvalds was charged by a penguin at a zoo, and as a result > > came to respect it. It's appearance belies it's ferocity ;) > He was infact _bitten_ by a Little (Fairy) Penguin at Sydney Zoo while > visiting Australia for a Linux conference in the mid 90s. He joked about > subsequently getting "penguinitis" and being forced to put penguins > everywhere :) I've heard a few variations of the story (charged, pecked, bitten; Australia, Antarctica) that make me wonder if this is just folklore. Can anyone point me at a reliable source? JV PS: A search for "Torvalds" on snopes.com turned up nothing. I don't know how reliable that is, though. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jason-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/ at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 18 19:10:45 2004 From: jason-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/ at public.gmane.org (Jason Shein) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 14:10:45 -0500 Subject: Tux (was: Calling all potential speakers) Message-ID: <32178d401992739275ec0673e994d6d9@www.pcsecurityonline.com> http://www.wired.com/news/culture/0,1284,42209,00.html John Vetterli wrote: >On Tue, 17 Feb 2004, Robert Brockway wrote: >> On Tue, 17 Feb 2004, Byron Sonne wrote: >> > > QUIZ QUESTION: How did a penguin become the Linux mascott? >> > I believe Torvalds was charged by a penguin at a zoo, and as a result >> > came to respect it. It's appearance belies it's ferocity ;) >> He was infact _bitten_ by a Little (Fairy) Penguin at Sydney Zoo while >> visiting Australia for a Linux conference in the mid 90s. He joked >about >> subsequently getting "penguinitis" and being forced to put penguins >> everywhere :) > >I've heard a few variations of the story (charged, pecked, bitten; >Australia, Antarctica) that make me wonder if this is just folklore. >Can anyone point me at a reliable source? > >JV > >PS: A search for "Torvalds" on snopes.com turned up nothing. I don't know >how reliable that is, though. >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- " Eventually people tire of repairing broken Windows, And decide to replace them with something stronger" (o_ // Linux - The Choice Of A GNU Generation V_/_ Jason Shein Linux Registered User #281100 jason-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/@public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 18 19:21:42 2004 From: blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Byron Sonne) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 14:21:42 -0500 Subject: Tux (was: Calling all potential speakers) In-Reply-To: <32178d401992739275ec0673e994d6d9-7jFVryfAA11UGDHsjQPuKOng/wJstic1@public.gmane.org> References: <32178d401992739275ec0673e994d6d9@www.pcsecurityonline.com> Message-ID: <4033BB46.6060605@rogers.com> > http://www.wired.com/news/culture/0,1284,42209,00.html Oh well, guess I'm wrong. The rabid man-eating 100mph penguin story sounds even better though. Followed an amusing link to the penguin gallery (http://lwn.net/Gallery/) and 1/3 of the way down the page saw the mascot for the c't Linux-Notebooks Thema which is, IMHO, phenomenally hilarious. -- For Good, return Good. For Evil, return Justice. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 18 19:41:31 2004 From: sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org (Sidney Shapiro) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 14:41:31 -0500 Subject: Tux (was: Calling all potential speakers) In-Reply-To: <4033BB46.6060605-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <4033BB46.6060605@rogers.com> Message-ID: <014201c3f657$3a2d70b0$6401a8c0@main> > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org] On Behalf Of Byron > Sonne > Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2004 2:22 PM > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Tux (was: Calling all potential speakers) > > > http://www.wired.com/news/culture/0,1284,42209,00.html > > Oh well, guess I'm wrong. The rabid man-eating 100mph penguin story > sounds even better though. > > Followed an amusing link to the penguin gallery > (http://lwn.net/Gallery/) and 1/3 of the way down the page saw the > mascot for the c't Linux-Notebooks Thema which is, IMHO, phenomenally > hilarious. > TLUG should have something like that :) Sid -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 18 20:06:29 2004 From: blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Byron Sonne) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 15:06:29 -0500 Subject: Tux (was: Calling all potential speakers) In-Reply-To: <014201c3f657$3a2d70b0$6401a8c0-UxDKcUsq0RM@public.gmane.org> References: <014201c3f657$3a2d70b0$6401a8c0@main> Message-ID: <4033C5C5.5090605@rogers.com> >>Followed an amusing link to the penguin gallery > TLUG should have something like that :) I know! It can be Tux hanging off the CN Tower like Frank Sinatra hanging off the lamppost in that 'Singing In The Rain' bit... and he's wearing a white surgical mask. Substitute a hockey stick for the umbrella, maybe? ;) -- For Good, return Good. For Evil, return Justice. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From serge_ss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 18 20:48:41 2004 From: serge_ss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (serge_ss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 15:48:41 -0500 Subject: This is both hillarious and appauling ... Message-ID: <20040218204841.RAVO20454.tomts35-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp.bellnexxia.net> Just came across something... Have fun. Comments? Suggestions? I only have couple of for him f#@cks in my pocket. http://www.globeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20040213.wwiwa14/BNStory/International -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 18 20:56:53 2004 From: blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Byron Sonne) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 15:56:53 -0500 Subject: Calling all potential speakers In-Reply-To: References: <4032A2FC.4020400@rogers.com> Message-ID: <4033D195.9020101@rogers.com> > I recommend anyone visiting Melbourne, Australia I am asking the following in all seriousness: how come I've never heard anything about kangaroo riding? I searched yahoo and google and couldn't find anything! I know it sounds like a really brain-damaged thing to do, actually I'm quite sure it is ;) but people ride bulls quite a bit and other odd things too. I've seen men riding ostriches and racing them... any wacky 'roo stories in this regard? -- For Good, return Good. For Evil, return Justice. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 18 21:03:41 2004 From: rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org (Rob Sutherland) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 16:03:41 -0500 Subject: This is both hillarious and appalling ... In-Reply-To: <20040218204841.RAVO20454.tomts35-srv.bellnexxia.net-dxTHOwpelHWiNGDy/dcMHtHuzzzSOjJt@public.gmane.org> References: <20040218204841.RAVO20454.tomts35-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp.bellnexxia.net> Message-ID: <20040218160341.79c687d2.rob@cheapersafer.com> On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 15:48:41 -0500 wrote: > > Just came across something... Have fun. Comments? Suggestions? I only have couple of for him f#@cks in my pocket. > > http://www.globeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20040213.wwiwa14/BNStory/International Hard to know where to start with this guy... "...SCO has the patents for one version of computer language, Unix. Linux is a rival language ___ let's say Linux is Arabic, and SCO English." Gosh, Linux is a computer language? Dear me, and here I've been logging on to it every day as though it was an operating system :-> Gotta love the nuancing here as well...what an idiot. Rob -- Rob Sutherland - rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org Computer Support at http://www.cheapersafer.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 18 21:11:23 2004 From: blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Byron Sonne) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 16:11:23 -0500 Subject: This is both hillarious and appauling ... In-Reply-To: <20040218204841.RAVO20454.tomts35-srv.bellnexxia.net-dxTHOwpelHWiNGDy/dcMHtHuzzzSOjJt@public.gmane.org> References: <20040218204841.RAVO20454.tomts35-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp.bellnexxia.net> Message-ID: <4033D4FB.9080405@rogers.com> > Just came across something... Have fun. Comments? Suggestions? I only have couple of for him f#@cks in my pocket. > http://www.globeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20040213.wwiwa14/BNStory/International The good thing about this is that it is readily apparent the author has some issues to work through in terms of completing his understanding of what the *whole* linux/OSS movement is about, not just the lunatic fringe. Basically, he makes it readily apparent that he, himself, is a fool. The bad thing is that too many people tend to be sheep and can fall for lame shit like this, and start some kind of dangerous movement or raise some other issue. Sigh. Sometimes all you can do is be content that at least *you* didn't fall for it. -- For Good, return Good. For Evil, return Justice. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tchitow-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 18 21:13:34 2004 From: tchitow-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Martin Duclos) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 16:13:34 -0500 Subject: This is both hillarious and appalling ... Message-ID: > > Just came across something... Have fun. Comments? Suggestions? I only have couple of for him f#@cks in my pocket. > > http://www.globeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20040213.wwiwa14/BNStory/International Hard to know where to start with this guy... "...SCO has the patents for one version of computer language, Unix. Linux is a rival language ___ let's say Linux is Arabic, and SCO English." Gosh, Linux is a computer language? Dear me, and here I've been logging on to it every day as though it was an operating system :-> Gotta love the nuancing here as well...what an idiot. Rob I think the quote in question is an analogy; a way for the public at large to get an understanding of the point he's trying to get across. Hey, a friend of mine asked me what operating system he should use with his new pc: "windows or macintosh?" Martin _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/bcomm&pgmarket=en-ca&RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin.msn.com%2f%3fpage%3dmisc%2fspecialoffers%26pgmarket%3den-ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From serge_ss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 18 21:25:00 2004 From: serge_ss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (serge_ss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 16:25:00 -0500 Subject: This is both hillarious and appauling ... Message-ID: <20040218212459.OAPE18182.tomts7-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp.bellnexxia.net> The most offensive part is, I guess: "The virus was not targeted at innocent PC users; it was meant to terrorize software corporations that had angered hackers who are fans of the Linux open-source operating system and who resent anyone trying to control the Linux threat." This asshole has no idea that Linux and applications developed for itis an effort of thousands of dedicated programmers who work hard, very often receiving very little or no money for their efforts, and do it just to make (IT) world different, more open and reliable. And Linux is only a "threat" to the companies like M$ and SCO, who can not be competitive if they don't reach deep into your pocket, and waste tonns of your time. Sergey > > From: Byron Sonne > Date: 2004/02/18 Wed PM 04:11:23 EST > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: This is both hillarious and appauling ... > > > Just came across something... Have fun. Comments? Suggestions? I only have couple of for him f#@cks in my pocket. > > http://www.globeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20040213.wwiwa14/BNStory/International > > The good thing about this is that it is readily apparent the author has > some issues to work through in terms of completing his understanding of > what the *whole* linux/OSS movement is about, not just the lunatic > fringe. Basically, he makes it readily apparent that he, himself, is a fool. > > The bad thing is that too many people tend to be sheep and can fall for > lame shit like this, and start some kind of dangerous movement or raise > some other issue. > > Sigh. Sometimes all you can do is be content that at least *you* didn't > fall for it. > > -- > > For Good, return Good. For Evil, return Justice. > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From robert-yzlPDbdf3LosA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 18 21:27:33 2004 From: robert-yzlPDbdf3LosA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Robert McDonald) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 16:27:33 -0500 Subject: This is both hillarious and appauling ... References: <20040218204841.RAVO20454.tomts35-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp.bellnexxia.net> Message-ID: <001201c3f666$09940ae0$0b01a8c0@win98p4> ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2004 3:48 PM Subject: [TLUG]: This is both hillarious and appauling ... > > Just came across something... Have fun. Comments? Suggestions? I only have couple of for him f#@cks in my pocket. > http://www.globeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20040213.wwiwa14/BNStory/International In effect, the Linux camp believes that everyone should be free to use the Linux "alphabet" to write software. What if "Post Alphabets" joined in this battle of O/S versus Language.. would it be parallel or serial ? :) R M -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 18 22:21:53 2004 From: hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (D. Hugh Redelmeier) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 17:21:53 -0500 (EST) Subject: This is both hillarious and appauling ... In-Reply-To: <20040218204841.RAVO20454.tomts35-srv.bellnexxia.net-dxTHOwpelHWiNGDy/dcMHtHuzzzSOjJt@public.gmane.org> References: <20040218204841.RAVO20454.tomts35-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp.bellnexxia.net> Message-ID: | From: serge_ss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org | Just came across something... Have fun. Comments? Suggestions? I only have couple of for him f#@cks in my pocket. | | http://www.globeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20040213.wwiwa14/BNStory/International I've read a few of his columns in the past. I've wanted to like them, but I've found them lacking in insight. He does have an interesting background. His father was executed in 1995 by the Nigerian government, essentially for terrorism. But it is doubtful that he was a terrorist. He (the son) grew up in Nigeria and Britain. He now lives in Toronto. That, in itself, ought to give him unique insights. I think that the analogies he's trying to draw in this column are very strained. But then I would, wouldn't I? I'm one of those LINUX fans and not an Islamic terrorist. His facts are actually distant approximations. Then again, most newspaper articles that are about subjects with which I am familiar seem to be quite inaccurate. From this I extrapolate to believe that most newspaper articles are inaccurate. But newspapers are head and shoulders above TV for accuracy. Hugh Redelmeier hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org voice: +1 416 482-8253 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 18 23:13:34 2004 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 18:13:34 -0500 Subject: Pen and pad - The city should get digital [OT] In-Reply-To: <005401c3f521$1363a850$6401a8c0-UxDKcUsq0RM@public.gmane.org> References: <005401c3f521$1363a850$6401a8c0@main> Message-ID: <4033F19E.1030608@rogers.com> Sidney Shapiro wrote: >>Thinking on the topic I cannot see the benefits of going digital >>outweighing the costs at this time, relative to our issues. Police > > are > >>quite digital. Many cop cars seem to be equipped with laptops. >> >> >>Cheers, >>Lloyd D Budd > > > Funny you should mention that Lloyd, the policeman did return to his car > and was typing on his laptop for a while, I assume he was entering > details of what I had told him into it. He did call out pertinent facts > over the radio as we were discussing the matter. I know it was a civic > duty, and I'm not complaining about the time I spent, I just wish > everyone was a stenographer or we had voice dictation that actually > works. I just can't wait for the star trek era. (Well, without the > nuclear war of course) I suspect it may have to do with presenting evidence in court. The police would need a secure, tamperproof method of recording the info, that will stand up in court. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 18 23:30:29 2004 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 18:30:29 -0500 (EST) Subject: Tux (was: Calling all potential speakers) In-Reply-To: References: <4032A2FC.4020400@rogers.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 18 Feb 2004, John Vetterli wrote: > I've heard a few variations of the story (charged, pecked, bitten; > Australia, Antarctica) that make me wonder if this is just folklore. > Can anyone point me at a reliable source? Interesting. This is the first time I've heard the suggest that this may be folklaw. I was involved with Linux at the time. I remember original reports of the incident and saw various web pages of Linus' visit to Canberra[1]. So I had to find some form of proof... http://www.linuxjournal.com/article.php?sid=0036 I can't seem to find the web pages I saw all those years ago which is kind of a shame[2]. [1] It was Canberra not Sydney please excuse my faulty memory. I even visited http://www.clug.org.au to see if there was a link but surprisingly there was not. [2] No they don't actually show Linus being bitten :) More trivia: Until a penguin (later called Tux) was chosen it was seriously looking like a platypus was going to be the mascot for Linux. This is why various Linux cdrom sets dating from 1994-1995 appear with platypi on the cover and why HUMBUG[3] (which I've mentioned to a few of you before) has a platypus for a Mascot. HUMBUG's is called "Ping" btw :) [3] http://www.humbug.org.au Rob -- Robert Brockway Senior Technical Consultant, OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Phone: 416-669-3073, Email: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org, http://www.opentrend.net OpenTrend Solutions: Reliable, secure solutions to real world problems. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 18 23:43:52 2004 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 18:43:52 -0500 (EST) Subject: Calling all potential speakers In-Reply-To: <4033D195.9020101-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <4032A2FC.4020400@rogers.com> <4033D195.9020101@rogers.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 18 Feb 2004, Byron Sonne wrote: > I am asking the following in all seriousness: how come I've never heard > anything about kangaroo riding? I searched yahoo and google and couldn't > find anything! Were you expecting to find something? :) I'm just trying to imagine the challenge of attempting to saddle a kangaroo :) > I know it sounds like a really brain-damaged thing to do, actually I'm > quite sure it is ;) but people ride bulls quite a bit and other odd > things too. I've seen men riding ostriches and racing them... any wacky > 'roo stories in this regard? I don't recall having ever heard of anyone considering or attempting to ride a kangaroo, or any other form of Australian fauna for that matter :) Now if some of the Megafauna had survived maybe - until only maybe 50000 years ago there was a giant relative of the wombat in Australia called the Diprotodon: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diprotodon I remember seeing a skeleton in a zoo many years ago. Rob -- Robert Brockway Senior Technical Consultant, OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Phone: 416-669-3073, Email: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org, http://www.opentrend.net OpenTrend Solutions: Reliable, secure solutions to real world problems. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 00:04:35 2004 From: matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (G. Matthew Rice) Date: 18 Feb 2004 19:04:35 -0500 Subject: Calling all potential speakers In-Reply-To: References: <4032A2FC.4020400@rogers.com> <4033D195.9020101@rogers.com> Message-ID: Robert Brockway writes: > I don't recall having ever heard of anyone considering or attempting to > ride a kangaroo, or any other form of Australian fauna for that matter :) I hear that they like to mount sheep ;) Or is that New Zealand? -- g. matthew rice starnix inc. phone: 905-771-0017 x242 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 00:43:24 2004 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 19:43:24 -0500 (EST) Subject: Linux kernel: local root exploit Message-ID: http://isec.pl/vulnerabilities/isec-0014-mremap-unmap.txt Rob -- Robert Brockway Senior Technical Consultant, OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Phone: 416-669-3073, Email: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org, http://www.opentrend.net OpenTrend Solutions: Reliable, secure solutions to real world problems. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 00:39:32 2004 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 19:39:32 -0500 (EST) Subject: Calling all potential speakers In-Reply-To: References: <4032A2FC.4020400@rogers.com> <4033D195.9020101@rogers.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 18 Feb 2004, G. Matthew Rice wrote: > Robert Brockway writes: > > I don't recall having ever heard of anyone considering or attempting to > > ride a kangaroo, or any other form of Australian fauna for that matter :) > > I hear that they like to mount sheep ;) You know, I really did walk right into that :) > Or is that New Zealand? No comment :) Rob -- Robert Brockway Senior Technical Consultant, OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Phone: 416-669-3073, Email: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org, http://www.opentrend.net OpenTrend Solutions: Reliable, secure solutions to real world problems. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From serge_ss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 01:48:05 2004 From: serge_ss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Sergey Semenyuk) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 20:48:05 -0500 Subject: This is both hillarious and appauling ... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000101c3f68a$6b3f5be0$0101010a@winxp> I don't get you. Sorry. Lots of people around you have you have unusual fates...but it barely gives them a right to make this sort of conclusions, and have a chance to make them public. We say IMHO, he says, "I barely know anything about the subject, but I will speculate about it...". My boss survived German concentration camp as a child. He's quiet and reasonable. -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org] On Behalf Of D. Hugh Redelmeier Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2004 5:22 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: This is both hillarious and appauling ... | From: serge_ss-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org | Just came across something... Have fun. Comments? Suggestions? I only have couple of for him f#@cks in my pocket. | | http://www.globeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20040213.wwiwa14/BNStory/Int ernational I've read a few of his columns in the past. I've wanted to like them, but I've found them lacking in insight. He does have an interesting background. His father was executed in 1995 by the Nigerian government, essentially for terrorism. But it is doubtful that he was a terrorist. He (the son) grew up in Nigeria and Britain. He now lives in Toronto. That, in itself, ought to give him unique insights. I think that the analogies he's trying to draw in this column are very strained. But then I would, wouldn't I? I'm one of those LINUX fans and not an Islamic terrorist. His facts are actually distant approximations. Then again, most newspaper articles that are about subjects with which I am familiar seem to be quite inaccurate. From this I extrapolate to believe that most newspaper articles are inaccurate. But newspapers are head and shoulders above TV for accuracy. Hugh Redelmeier hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org voice: +1 416 482-8253 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 04:29:29 2004 From: taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 21:29:29 -0700 Subject: Tux (was: Calling all potential speakers) In-Reply-To: References: <4032A2FC.4020400@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20040219042929.GA98445@idiom.novusordo.net> On Wed, Feb 18, 2004 at 06:30:29PM -0500, Robert Brockway wrote: > More trivia: Until a penguin (later called Tux) was chosen it was > seriously looking like a platypus was going to be the mascot for Linux. > This is why various Linux cdrom sets dating from 1994-1995 appear with > platypi on the cover and why HUMBUG[3] (which I've mentioned to a few of > you before) has a platypus for a Mascot. HUMBUG's is called "Ping" btw :) That is most interesting, consideringthe mascot for Darwin: http://www.hexley.com/ -- Taavi Burns ASCII stupid question, get a stupid ANSI! /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 05:06:23 2004 From: sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org (Sidney Shapiro) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 00:06:23 -0500 Subject: Simple Q Message-ID: <001101c3f6a6$229797b0$6401a8c0@main> I have a very simple question. I am using RedHat 9 and 7.3 I type in something like: cd /home/ home# cd pizza home/pizza# In this example, how would I go back up a level (back to home) Thanks Sid -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 05:12:10 2004 From: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 00:12:10 -0500 (EST) Subject: Simple Q In-Reply-To: <001101c3f6a6$229797b0$6401a8c0-UxDKcUsq0RM@public.gmane.org> References: <001101c3f6a6$229797b0$6401a8c0@main> Message-ID: <1193.207.194.61.130.1077167530.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> cd .. takes you up one level. cd - takes you back to the previous directory you were in. Peter > I have a very simple question. I am using RedHat 9 and 7.3 > > I type in something like: > > cd /home/ > home# cd pizza > home/pizza# > > In this example, how would I go back up a level (back to home) > > Thanks > > Sid > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 05:13:25 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 00:13:25 -0500 Subject: Simple Q In-Reply-To: <001101c3f6a6$229797b0$6401a8c0-UxDKcUsq0RM@public.gmane.org> References: <001101c3f6a6$229797b0$6401a8c0@main> Message-ID: <403445F5.5080205@alteeve.com> cd .. (note the space, in MS you didn't need a space and 'cd..' would have worked but linux is more strict). HTH! Madison Sidney Shapiro wrote: > I have a very simple question. I am using RedHat 9 and 7.3 > > > > I type in something like: > > > > cd /home/ > > home# cd pizza > > home/pizza# > > > > In this example, how would I go back up a level (back to home) > > > > Thanks > > > > Sid > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 05:16:30 2004 From: sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org (Sidney Shapiro) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 00:16:30 -0500 Subject: Simple Q In-Reply-To: <403445F5.5080205-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <403445F5.5080205@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <001c01c3f6a7$8cfd07b0$6401a8c0@main> Thanks for the help guys > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org] On Behalf Of Madison > Kelly > Sent: Thursday, February 19, 2004 12:13 AM > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Simple Q > > cd .. (note the space, in MS you didn't need a space and 'cd..' would > have worked but linux is more strict). > > HTH! > > Madison > > Sidney Shapiro wrote: > > I have a very simple question. I am using RedHat 9 and 7.3 > > > > > > > > I type in something like: > > > > > > > > cd /home/ > > > > home# cd pizza > > > > home/pizza# > > > > > > > > In this example, how would I go back up a level (back to home) > > > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > > > Sid > > > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 05:48:13 2004 From: noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Noah John Gellner) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 00:48:13 -0500 Subject: SSH session + Japanese mail in mutt Message-ID: <20040219054813.GA3855@butters.southtrak> I would be extremely grateful if anyone can help me. I want to read and write Japanese mail in an ssh session, preferably using mutt. I will be sshing in from a windows box and thus will be using windows IME for Japanese input. A second best solution would be to only be able to read Japanese mail. Currently when I get Japanese mail it is garbled. I stays garbled when I forward it to yahoo webmail where I can read Japanese mail. I am running Gentoo linux as a headless server. The computer serves files and hosts a simple web site and a personal mail system. I fetchmail, and deposit into my mailboxes using procmail. I use both bogofilter and spamassassin to filter junk. I set up webmail using Squirrelmail. I use Courier imap with ssl. I haven't set up locales because I don't completely understand how to. I am also not sure if they will work over ssh. I use putty for ssh. I am flexible about changing anything if it will solve my problem. Thank you all again. -- Noah John Gellner J.D. Candidate (2006) University of Toronto Faculty of Law (416) 364-7550 noah.gellner_at_utoronto.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From glayng-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 05:53:49 2004 From: glayng-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Gary Layng) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 00:53:49 -0500 Subject: SSH session + Japanese mail in mutt In-Reply-To: <20040219054813.GA3855-y6Pr2RmEDtN2c7wgCBzOK1pr/1R2p/CL@public.gmane.org> References: <20040219054813.GA3855@butters.southtrak> Message-ID: <200402190053.49288.glayng@sympatico.ca> Have you checked out Linuxquestions.org? On February 19, 2004 12:48 am, Noah John Gellner wrote: > I would be extremely grateful if anyone can help me. I want to read and > write Japanese mail in an ssh session, preferably using mutt. I will be > sshing in from a windows box and thus will be using windows IME for > Japanese input. > > A second best solution would be to only be able to read Japanese mail. > Currently when I get Japanese mail it is garbled. I stays garbled when I > forward it to yahoo webmail where I can read Japanese mail. > > I am running Gentoo linux as a headless server. The computer serves files > and hosts a simple web site and a personal mail system. I fetchmail, and > deposit into my mailboxes using procmail. I use both bogofilter and > spamassassin to filter junk. I set up webmail using Squirrelmail. I use > Courier imap with ssl. > > I haven't set up locales because I don't completely understand how to. I > am also not sure if they will work over ssh. > > I use putty for ssh. > > I am flexible about changing anything if it will solve my problem. > > Thank you all again. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jingsu-26n5VD7DAF2Tm46uYYfjYg at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 06:06:00 2004 From: jingsu-26n5VD7DAF2Tm46uYYfjYg at public.gmane.org (Jing Su) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 01:06:00 -0500 Subject: SSH session + Japanese mail in mutt In-Reply-To: <200402190053.49288.glayng-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <20040219054813.GA3855@butters.southtrak> <200402190053.49288.glayng@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: First question, do you know if putty is indeed able to show multi-byte characters? It would be pointless to try and wrangle multi-byte characters out of the linux box if putty can't show them. Second question, when you log into your linux machine, type in: echo $LANG echo $LC_CTYPE what does it say? When I want to do Chinese on my computer, I first set the locale to zh_TW.big5. I'm not sure what the locale identifier for Japanese is... anyone else know? I think the Japanese ones start with 'ja'. Though I'm not sure how many different enconding types there are. Try: cat /etc/sysconfig/i18n what does it say? If you don't want to permanently change your locale, you can set it in the console you're working out of before running the programs you want to run. for example: export LANG="ja" and then running 'mutt'. Assuming mutt knows how to read the locale identifier and show the right fonts and encodings. Hope this helps a bit.... -Jing > On February 19, 2004 12:48 am, Noah John Gellner wrote: > > I would be extremely grateful if anyone can help me. I want to read and > > write Japanese mail in an ssh session, preferably using mutt. I will be > > sshing in from a windows box and thus will be using windows IME for > > Japanese input. > > > > A second best solution would be to only be able to read Japanese mail. > > Currently when I get Japanese mail it is garbled. I stays garbled when I > > forward it to yahoo webmail where I can read Japanese mail. > > > > I am running Gentoo linux as a headless server. The computer serves files > > and hosts a simple web site and a personal mail system. I fetchmail, and > > deposit into my mailboxes using procmail. I use both bogofilter and > > spamassassin to filter junk. I set up webmail using Squirrelmail. I use > > Courier imap with ssl. > > > > I haven't set up locales because I don't completely understand how to. I > > am also not sure if they will work over ssh. > > > > I use putty for ssh. > > > > I am flexible about changing anything if it will solve my problem. > > > > Thank you all again. > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 06:50:54 2004 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 01:50:54 -0500 (EST) Subject: This is both hillarious and appalling ... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Wed, 18 Feb 2004, Martin Duclos wrote: > I think the quote in question is an analogy; a way for the public at large > to get an understanding of the point he's trying to get across. Hey, a > friend of mine asked me what operating system he should use with his new pc: > "windows or macintosh?" I'm sure that is what he is trying to do but I don't think he has been successful. I've noticed that many people try to simplfy complex computer terminology by substituting different terminology. I have observed that the substituted terminology is often no more insightful than the original terminology and has the disadvantage of being misleading or just plain wrong. Substituting "language" for "operating system" is no use if laypeople don't understand what a programming language is any better than they do an operating system. I actually think most people today are more comfortable with the idea of an operating system[1] than they are a programming language. I was speaking with a relative recently. We got onto the topic of computers and OSS came up (since the person in question knows I am involved with OSS from previous conversations). I started to talk about source code but had to stop and explain this. I had long ago forgotten that not everyone immediately understands what source code is. IT specialists really are worlds away from the general public. [1] Most computer users seem to me to be comfortable with the distinction between MS-Windows and apps that run on MS-Windows. Thus when describing an operating system it is easy to point out that MS-Windows 2000 is an operating system. Linux and SCO Openserver are two other operating systems. Rob -- Robert Brockway Senior Technical Consultant, OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Phone: 416-669-3073, Email: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org, http://www.opentrend.net OpenTrend Solutions: Reliable, secure solutions to real world problems. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 12:59:20 2004 From: colinmc151-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Colin McGregor) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 07:59:20 -0500 Subject: This is both hillarious and appauling ... References: <20040218204841.RAVO20454.tomts35-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp.bellnexxia.net> Message-ID: <007c01c3f6e8$311f8260$4201a8c0@ym.phub.net.cable.rogers.com> on Wednesday, February 18, 2004 3:48 PM wrote: > Just came across something... Have fun. Comments? Suggestions? I only have couple of for him f#@cks in my pocket. > > http://www.globeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20040213.wwiwa14/BNStory/International I trust everyone here knows that one of the things the MyDoom virus left behind in infected machines was zombie software (making infected machines act as open mail relays). Something the above Globe and Mail author should likely be made aware of. Put another way, spammers looking for a way to get their @#$% out there and make extra $$. A story about that here: http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20040218161420770 Bottom line a 15% increase in spam just due to MyDoom.... Colin McGregor -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 13:46:47 2004 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 08:46:47 -0500 Subject: Simple Q In-Reply-To: <1193.207.194.61.130.1077167530.squirrel-2RFepEojUI2DznVbVsZi4adLQS1dU2Lr@public.gmane.org> References: <001101c3f6a6$229797b0$6401a8c0@main> <1193.207.194.61.130.1077167530.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> Message-ID: <20040219084647.078043c9.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Thu, 19 Feb 2004 00:12:10 -0500 (EST) phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org disseminated the following: > cd .. > takes you up one level. > > cd - > takes you back to the previous directory you were in. or if you ever want to just jump back to your home dir, just type 'cd' and you will be in the home dir of whatever user you are logged in as. -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 08:45:23 up 13 days, 20:31, 5 users, load average: 1.16, 1.28, 1.27 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Linux 2.4.22-21mdk i686 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ "In the long run, there is no capitalism without conscience; there is no wealth without character."-- George W. Bush on Wall Street, July 9, 2002 "It was like watching a whore pretend to be dean of Southern Methodist University's School of Theology."-- Molly Ivins and Lou Dubose, "Bushwhacked" -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 14:13:06 2004 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 09:13:06 -0500 Subject: [OT-diagnosis-help] Message-ID: <20040219141306.GA31770@my-wing> Greetings tlug, This darn linksys (BEFSX41-CA) is becoming more troublesome by the minute. The linksysmon utility (thanks again Lada) occasionally shows a slurry of activity to port 69 (multiple src's) which incidently is where the hardware listens for a firmware upgrade, supposedly only on the LAN side. Not only that, but the hardware is having a propensity to live a month into the future, insisting that it should be March 14th. Within minutes of an NTP server reset (which I have no control over), it jumps into a time machine and heads for March again. tcpdump also shows unclean ICMP's LANside (invalid checksums). Oh, and it will not accept my dhclient send hostname either. Support suggests I attempt the firmware upgrade before returning it for a full refund. I will try it tonight. Whether I'm successful or not, I won't be able to return it until Saturday. I wish for a tlugger or two to nmap this thing for me. I'm curious to know what's going on and how it appears from the external side. It's primative reporting gives me very little info. Friday night would be great if anyone's interested. Thanks, farmer6re9 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 15:09:35 2004 From: srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org (SRB) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 10:09:35 -0500 Subject: Simple Q References: <001101c3f6a6$229797b0$6401a8c0@main> <1193.207.194.61.130.1077167530.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> Message-ID: <005c01c3f6fa$6638a0f0$3b0000c0@mastec.ca> cd By itself will take you back to your home directory no matter which directory you are in currently. > cd .. > takes you up one level. > > cd - > takes you back to the previous directory you were in. > > Peter > > > > I have a very simple question. I am using RedHat 9 and 7.3 > > > > I type in something like: > > > > cd /home/ > > home# cd pizza > > home/pizza# > > > > In this example, how would I go back up a level (back to home) > > > > Thanks > > > > Sid > > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From stewsinc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 15:09:36 2004 From: stewsinc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Stewart Sinclair) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 10:09:36 -0500 Subject: Preventing the next MyDoom (fwd) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.0.20040219012829.02fb2080@mail.eol.ca> Your points are well taken and it seems so simple and obvious once it's explained. There is another type of problem besides the dumb user that this "dumb writer" seems to over look. I have a friend who is a technical editor for an automotive magazine. He gets dozens of emails with attached PDF's, graphics, etc. (that also include zip's and self extractors) with minimal explanations every day - that he has to open (and dispose of rapidly) to do his job at all. He is also at the mercy of the publisher's IT department which is overloaded due to cut backs for his protection as well as being required to use the client software that they choose. This may be an extreme case but I suspect that there are many such situations on corporate LANs - users overloaded with legitimate incoming mail with attachments accompanied by minimal or no explanations. Stew **** At 07:53 PM 17/02/04 -0500, D. Hugh Redelmeier wrote: >I sent the following letter to a local commercial newsletter. > >I thought some TLUGgers might be interested. > > >I just read your column. > > >You seem to blame everyone for MyDoom except the maker of the >fundamental mistakes: Microsoft. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lists-tZhE6lH4Esk+k03BA+Hq9g at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 15:33:49 2004 From: lists-tZhE6lH4Esk+k03BA+Hq9g at public.gmane.org (Oliver Meyn) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 10:33:49 -0500 Subject: This is both hillarious and appauling ... In-Reply-To: <001201c3f666$09940ae0$0b01a8c0-VMKVZpoZl3s@public.gmane.org> References: <20040218204841.RAVO20454.tomts35-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp.bellnexxia.net> <001201c3f666$09940ae0$0b01a8c0@win98p4> Message-ID: <1077204829.2391.0.camel@theconstruct.mineallmeyn.net> On Wed, 2004-02-18 at 16:27, Robert McDonald wrote: > In effect, the Linux camp believes that everyone should be free to use the > Linux "alphabet" to write software. > > What if "Post Alphabets" joined in this battle of O/S versus Language.. > would it be parallel or serial ? *laugh* _nice_ :) Oliver -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 15:38:06 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 10:38:06 -0500 Subject: iptables; still can't get out from DNAT'ed servers... help please?! :) Message-ID: <4034D85E.6010309@alteeve.com> Hi all, A few days ago I posted a problem I had with 'iptables' (Fedora Core 1, 2.4.2166 kernel) and NAT'ed servers. I never got a reply but I also found some big problems so I re-wrote a good chunk of my script but the problem remains. I hope no one minds me asking again for help with the new info in 'iptables-save' :) I have my network setup like this: LAN clients - 192.168.1.0/24, eth0 SRV clients - 192.168.2.0/24, eth1 Public IPs - 111.222.33.32/27, eth2 eth0 - 192.168.1.1 eth1 - 192.168.2.1 eth2 - 111.222.33.34 eth2:0 - 111.222.33.46 eth2:1 - 111.222.33.47 eth2:2 - 111.222.33.48 I have all of my LAN SNAT'ed behind the firewall's IP address and that network is working great. I have each Server client DNAT/SNAT'ed behind a single public IP address. For example, the machine I am currently testing from is DNAT to 192.168.2.12 and SNAT'ed to 111.222.33.47. I have a test web server up and 'sshd' running and I specifically allowed ports 22 and 80 into that server. Internet and LAN clients -can- connect to the server just fine. The problem lies in that the server -cannot- connect out to the Internet. I think it has something to do with the DNAT because when I simply SNAT the 192.168.2.0/24 subnet behind the firewall (as though it too where a LAN subnet) then I can connect out fine. Does anyone have any suggestions as to what I could be doing wrong? I admit the script is still being debug'ed so there may still be unrelated problems, too. Thanks again for any potential help! Madison PS - Watch the answer end up being one that was staring me in the face! :) -= 'iptables-save' =- # Generated by iptables-save v1.2.9 on Thu Feb 19 10:20:06 2004 *mangle :PREROUTING ACCEPT [39:3516] :INPUT ACCEPT [0:0] :FORWARD ACCEPT [39:3516] :OUTPUT ACCEPT [0:0] :POSTROUTING ACCEPT [36:3216] COMMIT # Completed on Thu Feb 19 10:20:06 2004 # Generated by iptables-save v1.2.9 on Thu Feb 19 10:20:06 2004 *nat :PREROUTING ACCEPT [4:400] :POSTROUTING ACCEPT [0:0] :OUTPUT ACCEPT [0:0] -A PREROUTING -d 111.222.33.47 -j DNAT --to-destination 192.168.2.12 -A PREROUTING -d 111.222.33.48 -j DNAT --to-destination 192.168.2.11 -A PREROUTING -d 111.222.33.46 -j DNAT --to-destination 192.168.2.15 -A POSTROUTING -s 192.168.1.0/255.255.255.0 -o eth2 -j SNAT --to-source 111.222.33.34 -A POSTROUTING -s 192.168.2.12 -j SNAT --to-source 111.222.33.47 -A POSTROUTING -s 192.168.2.11 -j SNAT --to-source 111.222.33.48 -A POSTROUTING -s 192.168.2.15 -j SNAT --to-source 111.222.33.46 COMMIT # Completed on Thu Feb 19 10:20:06 2004 # Generated by iptables-save v1.2.9 on Thu Feb 19 10:20:06 2004 *filter :INPUT DROP [0:0] :FORWARD DROP [3:300] :OUTPUT ACCEPT [0:0] :FWIN - [0:0] :FWOUT - [0:0] :LANIN - [0:0] :LANOUT - [0:0] :LDROP - [0:0] :LREJECT - [0:0] :LTREJECT - [0:0] :SRVIN - [0:0] :SRVOUT - [0:0] :TCPACCEPT - [0:0] :TREJECT - [0:0] :UDPACCEPT - [0:0] :ULDROP - [0:0] :ULREJECT - [0:0] :ULTREJECT - [0:0] -A INPUT -i eth2 -j FWIN -A INPUT -i eth0 -j FWIN -A INPUT -i eth1 -j FWIN -A INPUT -i lo -j ACCEPT -A INPUT -i eth0 -p udp -m udp --dport 67 -j ACCEPT -A FORWARD -i eth2 -o eth0 -j LANIN -A FORWARD -i eth0 -o eth2 -j LANOUT -A FORWARD -i eth2 -o eth1 -j SRVIN -A FORWARD -i eth1 -o eth2 -j SRVOUT -A FORWARD -i eth1 -o eth0 -j LANIN -A FORWARD -i eth0 -o eth1 -j LANOUT -A OUTPUT -o eth2 -j FWOUT -A OUTPUT -o eth0 -j FWOUT -A OUTPUT -o eth1 -j FWOUT -A FWIN -m state --state INVALID -j TREJECT -A FWIN -p tcp -m mac --mac-source 00:50:BA:D2:31:0F -m tcp --dport 22 -j TCPACCEPT -A FWIN -p tcp -m mac --mac-source 00:02:B3:07:F6:1A -m tcp --dport 22 -j TCPACCEPT -A FWIN -p tcp -m mac --mac-source 00:60:97:6D:A1:0E -m tcp --dport 22 -j TCPACCEPT -A FWIN -p udp -m mac --mac-source 00:50:BA:D2:31:0F -m udp --dport 22 -j UDPACCEPT -A FWIN -p udp -m mac --mac-source 00:02:B3:07:F6:1A -m udp --dport 22 -j UDPACCEPT -A FWIN -p udp -m mac --mac-source 00:60:97:6D:A1:0E -m udp --dport 22 -j UDPACCEPT -A FWIN -i eth0 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 53 -j TCPACCEPT -A FWIN -i eth0 -p udp -m udp --dport 53 -j UDPACCEPT -A FWIN -i eth1 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 53 -j TCPACCEPT -A FWIN -i eth1 -p udp -m udp --dport 53 -j UDPACCEPT -A FWIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 5 -j TREJECT -A FWIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 9 -j TREJECT -A FWIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 10 -j TREJECT -A FWIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 15 -j TREJECT -A FWIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 16 -j TREJECT -A FWIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 17 -j TREJECT -A FWIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 18 -j TREJECT -A FWIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 8 -m limit --limit 1/sec -j ACCEPT -A FWIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 8 -j TREJECT -A FWIN -p icmp -m icmp ! --icmp-type 8 -j ACCEPT -A FWIN -m state --state ESTABLISHED -j ACCEPT -A FWIN -p tcp -m tcp --dport 1024:65535 -m state --state RELATED -j TCPACCEPT -A FWIN -p udp -m udp --dport 1024:65535 -m state --state RELATED -j UDPACCEPT -A FWIN -j TREJECT -A FWOUT -j ACCEPT -A LANIN -m state --state INVALID -j TREJECT -A LANIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 5 -j TREJECT -A LANIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 9 -j TREJECT -A LANIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 10 -j TREJECT -A LANIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 15 -j TREJECT -A LANIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 16 -j TREJECT -A LANIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 17 -j TREJECT -A LANIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 18 -j TREJECT -A LANIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 8 -m limit --limit 1/sec -j ACCEPT -A LANIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 8 -j TREJECT -A LANIN -p icmp -m icmp ! --icmp-type 8 -j ACCEPT -A LANIN -m state --state ESTABLISHED -j ACCEPT -A LANIN -p tcp -m tcp --dport 1024:65535 -m state --state RELATED -j TCPACCEPT -A LANIN -p udp -m udp --dport 1024:65535 -m state --state RELATED -j UDPACCEPT -A LANIN -s 192.168.2.12 -d 192.168.1.100 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 22 -j TCPACCEPT -A LANIN -s 192.168.2.12 -d 192.168.1.100 -p udp -m udp --dport 22 -j UDPACCEPT -A LANIN -j TREJECT -A LANOUT -s 192.168.1.0/255.255.255.0 -o eth2 -j ACCEPT -A LANOUT -j ACCEPT -A LDROP -p tcp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "TCP Dropped " --log-level 6 -A LDROP -p udp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "UDP Dropped " --log-level 6 -A LDROP -p icmp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "ICMP Dropped " --log-level 6 -A LDROP -f -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "FRAGMENT Dropped " -A LDROP -j DROP -A LREJECT -p tcp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "TCP Rejected " --log-level 6 -A LREJECT -p udp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "UDP Rejected " --log-level 6 -A LREJECT -p icmp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "ICMP Rejected " --log-level 6 -A LREJECT -f -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "FRAGMENT Rejected " -A LREJECT -j REJECT --reject-with icmp-port-unreachable -A LTREJECT -p tcp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "TCP Rejected " --log-level 6 -A LTREJECT -p udp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "UDP Rejected " --log-level 6 -A LTREJECT -p icmp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "ICMP Rejected " --log-level 6 -A LTREJECT -f -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "FRAGMENT Rejected " -A LTREJECT -j TREJECT -A SRVIN -m state --state INVALID -j TREJECT -A SRVIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 5 -j TREJECT -A SRVIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 9 -j TREJECT -A SRVIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 10 -j TREJECT -A SRVIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 15 -j TREJECT -A SRVIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 16 -j TREJECT -A SRVIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 17 -j TREJECT -A SRVIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 18 -j TREJECT -A SRVIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 8 -m limit --limit 1/sec -j ACCEPT -A SRVIN -p icmp -m icmp --icmp-type 8 -j TREJECT -A SRVIN -p icmp -m icmp ! --icmp-type 8 -j ACCEPT -A SRVIN -m state --state ESTABLISHED -j ACCEPT -A SRVIN -p tcp -m tcp --dport 1024:65535 -m state --state RELATED -j TCPACCEPT -A SRVIN -p udp -m udp --dport 1024:65535 -m state --state RELATED -j UDPACCEPT -A SRVIN -d 192.168.2.12 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 22 -j TCPACCEPT -A SRVIN -d 192.168.2.12 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 53 -j TCPACCEPT -A SRVIN -d 192.168.2.12 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 80 -j TCPACCEPT -A SRVIN -d 192.168.2.12 -p udp -m udp --dport 22 -j UDPACCEPT -A SRVIN -d 192.168.2.12 -p udp -m udp --dport 53 -j UDPACCEPT -A SRVIN -d 192.168.2.12 -p udp -m udp --dport 80 -j UDPACCEPT -A SRVIN -d 192.168.2.11 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 22 -j TCPACCEPT -A SRVIN -d 192.168.2.11 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 25 -j TCPACCEPT -A SRVIN -d 192.168.2.11 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 53 -j TCPACCEPT -A SRVIN -d 192.168.2.11 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 80 -j TCPACCEPT -A SRVIN -d 192.168.2.11 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 110 -j TCPACCEPT -A SRVIN -d 192.168.2.11 -p udp -m udp --dport 22 -j UDPACCEPT -A SRVIN -d 192.168.2.11 -p udp -m udp --dport 25 -j UDPACCEPT -A SRVIN -d 192.168.2.11 -p udp -m udp --dport 53 -j UDPACCEPT -A SRVIN -d 192.168.2.11 -p udp -m udp --dport 80 -j UDPACCEPT -A SRVIN -d 192.168.2.11 -p udp -m udp --dport 110 -j UDPACCEPT -A SRVIN -d 192.168.2.15 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 22 -j TCPACCEPT -A SRVIN -d 192.168.2.15 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 53 -j TCPACCEPT -A SRVIN -d 192.168.2.15 -p tcp -m tcp --dport 80 -j TCPACCEPT -A SRVIN -d 192.168.2.15 -p udp -m udp --dport 22 -j UDPACCEPT -A SRVIN -d 192.168.2.15 -p udp -m udp --dport 53 -j UDPACCEPT -A SRVIN -d 192.168.2.15 -p udp -m udp --dport 80 -j UDPACCEPT -A SRVIN -j TREJECT -A SRVOUT -s 192.168.2.0/255.255.255.0 -o eth2 -j ACCEPT -A SRVOUT -j ACCEPT -A TCPACCEPT -p tcp -m tcp --tcp-flags SYN,RST,ACK SYN -m limit --limit 20/sec -j ACCEPT -A TCPACCEPT -p tcp -m tcp --tcp-flags SYN,RST,ACK SYN -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "Possible SynFlood " -A TCPACCEPT -p tcp -m tcp --tcp-flags SYN,RST,ACK SYN -j TREJECT -A TCPACCEPT -p tcp -m tcp ! --tcp-flags SYN,RST,ACK SYN -j ACCEPT -A TCPACCEPT -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "Mismatch in TCPACCEPT " -A TCPACCEPT -j TREJECT -A TREJECT -p tcp -j REJECT --reject-with tcp-reset -A TREJECT -p udp -j REJECT --reject-with icmp-port-unreachable -A TREJECT -p icmp -j DROP -A TREJECT -j REJECT --reject-with icmp-port-unreachable -A UDPACCEPT -p udp -j ACCEPT -A UDPACCEPT -m limit --limit 2/sec -j LOG --log-prefix "Mismatch on UDPACCEPT " -A UDPACCEPT -j TREJECT -A ULDROP -p tcp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j ULOG --ulog-prefix "LDROP_TCP" -A ULDROP -p udp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j ULOG --ulog-prefix "LDROP_UDP" -A ULDROP -p icmp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j ULOG --ulog-prefix "LDROP_ICMP" -A ULDROP -f -m limit --limit 2/sec -j ULOG --ulog-prefix "LDROP_FRAG" -A ULDROP -j DROP -A ULREJECT -p tcp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j ULOG --ulog-prefix "LREJECT_TCP" -A ULREJECT -p udp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j ULOG --ulog-prefix "LREJECT_UDP" -A ULREJECT -p icmp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j ULOG --ulog-prefix "LREJECT_UDP" -A ULREJECT -f -m limit --limit 2/sec -j ULOG --ulog-prefix "LREJECT_FRAG" -A ULREJECT -j REJECT --reject-with icmp-port-unreachable -A ULTREJECT -p tcp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j ULOG --ulog-prefix "LTREJECT_TCP" -A ULTREJECT -p udp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j ULOG --ulog-prefix "LTREJECT_UDP" -A ULTREJECT -p icmp -m limit --limit 2/sec -j ULOG --ulog-prefix "LTREJECT_ICMP" -A ULTREJECT -f -m limit --limit 2/sec -j ULOG --ulog-prefix "LTREJECT_FRAG" -A ULTREJECT -p tcp -j REJECT --reject-with tcp-reset -A ULTREJECT -p udp -j REJECT --reject-with icmp-port-unreachable -A ULTREJECT -p icmp -j DROP -A ULTREJECT -j REJECT --reject-with icmp-port-unreachable COMMIT # Completed on Thu Feb 19 10:20:06 2004 -= 'iptables-save' =- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From legrady-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 15:49:48 2004 From: legrady-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Tom Legrady) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 10:49:48 -0500 Subject: Preventing the next MyDoom (fwd) In-Reply-To: <5.2.1.1.0.20040219012829.02fb2080-9yrvbIq3RigsA/PxXw9srA@public.gmane.org> References: <5.2.1.1.0.20040219012829.02fb2080@mail.eol.ca> Message-ID: <4034DB1C.20504@rogers.com> Perhaps he and his employer should consider a crappy old PC, not connected to the network, and a transport mechanism such as a flashdisk / USB memory pen / ... That way, he can move his mail to a system which is welcome to slash & burn, without risking the entire corporation. Of course, converting the corp to Unix would provide even better protection, since Unix viruses are practically unknown. Tom Stewart Sinclair wrote: > Your points are well taken and it seems so simple and obvious once > it's explained. > > There is another type of problem besides the dumb user that this "dumb > writer" seems to over look. I have a friend who is a technical > editor for an automotive magazine. He gets dozens of emails with > attached PDF's, graphics, etc. (that also include zip's and self > extractors) with minimal explanations every day - that he has to open > (and dispose of rapidly) to do his job at all. > > He is also at the mercy of the publisher's IT department which is > overloaded due to cut backs for his protection as well as being > required to use the client software that they choose. > > This may be an extreme case but I suspect that there are many such > situations on corporate LANs - users overloaded with legitimate > incoming mail with attachments accompanied by minimal or no explanations. > > Stew > **** > > At 07:53 PM 17/02/04 -0500, D. Hugh Redelmeier wrote: > >> I sent the following letter to a local commercial newsletter. >> >> I thought some TLUGgers might be interested. >> >> >> I just read your column. >> >> >> You seem to blame everyone for MyDoom except the maker of the >> fundamental mistakes: Microsoft. > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 15:49:49 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 10:49:49 -0500 Subject: iptables; still can't get out from DNAT'ed servers... help please?! :) In-Reply-To: <4034D85E.6010309-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <4034D85E.6010309@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <4034DB1D.9070804@alteeve.com> Ah! I hate it when I do this... Ping isn't getting out or in but the Internet -is- working from the servers now after all... So, if someone knows why the icmp packets aren't getting through then by all means let me know but it is low priority. Thanks guys and gals! Madison Madison Kelly wrote: > Hi all, > > A few days ago I posted a problem I had with 'iptables' (Fedora Core > 1, 2.4.2166 kernel) and NAT'ed servers. I never got a reply but I also > found some big problems so I re-wrote a good chunk of my script but the > problem remains. I hope no one minds me asking again for help with the > new info in 'iptables-save' :) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 16:16:34 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 11:16:34 -0500 Subject: Mail routing problem... Message-ID: <4034E162.5080804@alteeve.com> Hi all, How nice... I finish 'iptables' and your truly gets to move right into the next problem, mail routing. Hope someone can help! :) I have a problem routing my mail and I am not sure why. I am trying to get mail working for "user-pgLVY6gkuiiyKdaMMURGoWiJhflN2719 at public.gmane.org" which is hosted on the same machine as my other domain "alteeve.com" (a RH7.3 server using Sendmail). When I first wrote the DNS record to 'thelinuxexperience.com' I set 'mail.alteeve.com' as the first destination (my bad) and 'mail.thelinuxexperience.com' as the secondary mail server. A few days I fixed that and made 'mail.thelinuxexperience.com' the only mail server for TLE. The TTL on the record is only 1d and the mail server is itself a slave DNS server to the master server so I -know- it has a recent copy of the records. -= From the mail server =- $ dig -t MX thelinuxexperience.com ; <<>> DiG 9.2.1 <<>> -t MX thelinuxexperience.com ;; global options: printcmd ;; Got answer: ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 53685 ;; flags: qr aa rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 1, AUTHORITY: 2, ADDITIONAL: 2 ;; QUESTION SECTION: ;thelinuxexperience.com. IN MX ;; ANSWER SECTION: thelinuxexperience.com. 38400 IN MX 10 mail.thelinuxexperience.com. ;; AUTHORITY SECTION: thelinuxexperience.com. 38400 IN NS ns2.madisonave.ca. thelinuxexperience.com. 38400 IN NS ns1.madisonave.ca. ;; ADDITIONAL SECTION: ns1.madisonave.ca. 38400 IN A 209.167.86.46 ns2.madisonave.ca. 38400 IN A 209.167.86.38 ;; Query time: 3 msec ;; SERVER: 209.167.86.46#53(209.167.86.46) ;; WHEN: Thu Feb 19 11:06:33 2004 ;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 142 Despite all this, when I try to send a message to a user (ie: 'mkelly at thelinuxexperience dot com') the mail bounces back to the sender and to 'postmaster at alteeve dot com' claiming that the MX record (still) points back to 'alteeve.com'. Here is the header and error: -= Bounced Message =- From - Thu Feb 19 10:59:05 2004 X-UIDL: 402677c800003373 X-Mozilla-Status: 0001 X-Mozilla-Status2: 00000000 Return-Path: Received: from localhost (localhost) by alteeve.com (8.11.6/linuxconf) id i1JFteV12015; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 10:55:40 -0500 Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 10:55:40 -0500 From: Mail Delivery Subsystem Message-Id: <200402191555.i1JFteV12015-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org> To: postmaster-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/report; report-type=delivery-status; boundary="i1JFteV12015.1077206140/alteeve.com" Subject: Returned mail: see transcript for details Auto-Submitted: auto-generated (failure) Status: This is a MIME-encapsulated message --i1JFteV12015.1077206140/alteeve.com The original message was received at Thu, 19 Feb 2004 10:55:40 -0500 from [209.167.86.34] ----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors ----- ----- Transcript of session follows ----- 554 5.0.0 MX list for thelinuxexperience.com. points back to alteeve.com 554 5.3.5 Local configuration error --i1JFteV12015.1077206140/alteeve.com Content-Type: message/delivery-status Reporting-MTA: dns; alteeve.com Received-From-MTA: DNS; [209.167.86.34] Arrival-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 10:55:40 -0500 Final-Recipient: RFC822; mkelly-pgLVY6gkuiiyKdaMMURGoWiJhflN2719 at public.gmane.org Action: failed Status: 5.5.0 Remote-MTA: DNS; thelinuxexperience.com Last-Attempt-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 10:55:40 -0500 --i1JFteV12015.1077206140/alteeve.com Content-Type: message/rfc822 Return-Path: Received: from alteeve.com ([209.167.86.34]) by alteeve.com (8.11.6/linuxconf) with ESMTP id i1JFtZV12013 for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 10:55:40 -0500 Message-ID: <4034DD3D.5090400-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org> Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 10:58:53 -0500 From: Madison Kelly User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031016 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mkelly-pgLVY6gkuiiyKdaMMURGoWiJhflN2719 at public.gmane.org Subject: test mail Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Well? --i1JFteV12015.1077206140/alteeve.com-- -= End message =- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 16:22:49 2004 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 11:22:49 -0500 (EST) Subject: iptables; still can't get out from DNAT'ed servers... help please?! :) In-Reply-To: <4034DB1D.9070804-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <4034D85E.6010309@alteeve.com> <4034DB1D.9070804@alteeve.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 19 Feb 2004, Madison Kelly wrote: > Ah! I hate it when I do this... > > Ping isn't getting out or in but the Internet -is- working from the > servers now after all... So, if someone knows why the icmp packets > aren't getting through then by all means let me know but it is low > priority. A couple of thoughts: 1. Are you SNATing icmp out? 2. Is your firwall blocking icmp type 0 or 8? Rob -- Robert Brockway Senior Technical Consultant, OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Phone: 416-669-3073, Email: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org, http://www.opentrend.net OpenTrend Solutions: Reliable, secure solutions to real world problems. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 16:35:19 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 11:35:19 -0500 Subject: iptables; still can't get out from DNAT'ed servers... help please?! :) In-Reply-To: References: <4034D85E.6010309@alteeve.com> <4034DB1D.9070804@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <4034E5C7.1010704@alteeve.com> Robert Brockway wrote: > On Thu, 19 Feb 2004, Madison Kelly wrote: > > >>Ah! I hate it when I do this... >> >>Ping isn't getting out or in but the Internet -is- working from the >>servers now after all... So, if someone knows why the icmp packets >>aren't getting through then by all means let me know but it is low >>priority. > > > A couple of thoughts: > > 1. Are you SNATing icmp out? > > 2. Is your firwall blocking icmp type 0 or 8? > > Rob Hi Rob, 1. I would assume I am because the rule simply states: -A POSTROUTING -s 192.168.1.12 -j SNAT --to-source 111.222.33.47 and -A PREROUTING -d 111.222.33.47 -j DNAT --to-destination 192.168.1.12 These place no other restrictions so I would assume that ICMP are caught. 2. Inbound I DROP icmp 5 9 10 15 16 17 and 18 (same as the FW itself and LAN which both can ping properly). I do have a limit on icmp message 8 to avoid ping floods but again, it is the same as the FW and LAN which work. Madison -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 16:46:32 2004 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 11:46:32 -0500 Subject: Mail routing problem... In-Reply-To: <4034E162.5080804-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <4034E162.5080804@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <200402191146.32507.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> On February 19, 2004 11:16 am, Madison Kelly wrote: > Sendmail). When I first wrote the DNS record to 'thelinuxexperience.com' > I set 'mail.alteeve.com' as the first destination (my bad) and > 'mail.thelinuxexperience.com' as the secondary mail server. A few days I > fixed that and made 'mail.thelinuxexperience.com' the only mail server > for TLE. I'm not sure what you mean by saying that mail.alteeve.com was a problem, as long as mail.alteeve.com resolves to the correct A record the name is irrelevant. Here is one problem: fraser-74b65gqZ7FE at public.gmane.org% host -t mx thelinuxexperience.com thelinuxexperience.com MX 10 mail.thelinuxexperience.com !!! thelinuxexperience.com MX host mail.thelinuxexperience.com is not canonical MX records should points to hosts that are A records, not CNAMEs. > ----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors ----- > > > ----- Transcript of session follows ----- > 554 5.0.0 MX list for thelinuxexperience.com. points back to alteeve.com > 554 5.3.5 Local configuration error It's possible that the CNAME problem is enough to cause this but I'm not sure. Have you made your mailserver aware that it is the mailserver for the new domain. IIRC, sendmail wants you to list your local domains in a file somewhere (look for sendmail.cw or local-host-names or something). -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 19:04:35 2004 From: lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org (Lloyd Budd) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 14:04:35 -0500 Subject: This is both hillarious and appauling ... In-Reply-To: <20040218212459.OAPE18182.tomts7-srv.bellnexxia.net-dxTHOwpelHWiNGDy/dcMHtHuzzzSOjJt@public.gmane.org> References: <20040218212459.OAPE18182.tomts7-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp.bellnexxia.net> Message-ID: <7509457D-630E-11D8-8C78-0003931BD222@foolswisdom.com> On 18-Feb-04, at 16:25, wrote: > The most offensive part is, I guess: Umm, I think the most offensive thing about the article is the very attempt to draw parallels between murder, and exploiting software. I trust that many readers stopped reading there. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mwilson-4YeSL8/OYKRWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 20:32:17 2004 From: mwilson-4YeSL8/OYKRWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (Mel Wilson) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 15:32:17 -0500 Subject: Simple Q References: <001101c3f6a6$229797b0$6401a8c0@main> <1193.207.194.61.130.1077167530.squirrel@webmail.ee.ryerson.ca> <005c01c3f6fa$6638a0f0$3b0000c0@mastec.ca> Message-ID: In article <005c01c3f6fa$6638a0f0$3b0000c0-v1hdsqwqw2f3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org>, "SRB" wrote: >cd > >By itself will take you back to your home directory no matter which >directory you are in currently. :-/ Did I tell everybody about the time I typed cd #cvs_locks and wound up in my home directory without noticing? Mel. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From shijialee-/E1597aS9LQAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 22:11:07 2004 From: shijialee-/E1597aS9LQAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (James) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 14:11:07 -0800 (PST) Subject: copy & paste Message-ID: <20040219221107.427.qmail@web40208.mail.yahoo.com> Hi, My newly installed debian 3.0 doesn't do copy(highlight) && paste (right mouse click) in terminal. i know the copy&paste is the default behaviour. how do i enable it ? Qiang. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard - Read only the mail you want. http://antispam.yahoo.com/tools -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 22:22:31 2004 From: srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org (SRB) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 17:22:31 -0500 Subject: copy & paste References: <20040219221107.427.qmail@web40208.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <00d601c3f736$defe7aa0$3b0000c0@mastec.ca> > My newly installed debian 3.0 doesn't do copy(highlight) && paste (right mouse click) in terminal. > i know the copy&paste is the default behaviour. > > how do i enable it ? > > > Qiang. In Red Hat, the MIDDLE mouse button pastes. Maybe that works in Debian too? -Steve. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 22:59:02 2004 From: blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Byron Sonne) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 17:59:02 -0500 Subject: copy & paste In-Reply-To: <20040219221107.427.qmail-YVEKlzFy1tWA/QwVtaZbd3CJp6faPEW9@public.gmane.org> References: <20040219221107.427.qmail@web40208.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <40353FB6.1070103@rogers.com> > how do i enable it ? I believe the utility is called gpm, can't remember the exact options but check the man page. -- For Good, return Good. For Evil, return Justice. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 23:09:07 2004 From: noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Noah John Gellner) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 18:09:07 -0500 Subject: SSH session + Japanese mail in mutt In-Reply-To: References: <20040219054813.GA3855@butters.southtrak> <200402190053.49288.glayng@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <20040219230907.GA3718@butters.southtrak> Thanks to this advice I got down and dirty with my locales. I used localedef to create the ja_JP.UTF-8 locale; created 02locale in /etc/env.d/ did and env-update and a source /etc/profile rebooted and things looked different, but still didn't quite work. I changed the font setting on putty to MS Mincho:Japanese and now things seem to work. This is really great. Thank you again. On 01:06 Thu 19 Feb , Jing Su wrote: > Second question, when you log into your linux machine, type in: > echo $LANG > echo $LC_CTYPE > > what does it say? > When I want to do Chinese on my computer, I first set the locale to > zh_TW.big5. I'm not sure what the locale identifier for Japanese is... > anyone else know? I think the Japanese ones start with 'ja'. Though I'm > not sure how many different enconding types there are. > > Try: > cat /etc/sysconfig/i18n > > what does it say? -- Noah John Gellner J.D. Candidate (2006) University of Toronto Faculty of Law (416) 364-7550 noah.gellner_at_utoronto.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 23:41:34 2004 From: sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org (Sidney Shapiro) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 18:41:34 -0500 Subject: Uninstalling Message-ID: <003901c3f741$e9573f90$6401a8c0@main> On a RH9 box, how can I uninstall an RPM? I installed spamassassin, but a later version of the one I needed. How can I find what the exact name of the one installed is and how do I get rid of it? Thanks, Sid -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 23:56:56 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 17:56:56 -0600 Subject: Uninstalling In-Reply-To: <003901c3f741$e9573f90$6401a8c0-UxDKcUsq0RM@public.gmane.org> References: <003901c3f741$e9573f90$6401a8c0@main> Message-ID: <200402191756.56810.Garth@Webostics.com> On Thu February 19 2004 5:41 pm, Sidney Shapiro wrote: > On a RH9 box, how can I uninstall an RPM? I installed spamassassin, but > a later version of the one I needed. How can I find what the exact name > of the one installed is and how do I get rid of it? > > Thanks, > > Sid How about: rpm -e package_name -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jingsu-26n5VD7DAF2Tm46uYYfjYg at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 23:57:20 2004 From: jingsu-26n5VD7DAF2Tm46uYYfjYg at public.gmane.org (Jing Su) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 18:57:20 -0500 Subject: Uninstalling In-Reply-To: <003901c3f741$e9573f90$6401a8c0-UxDKcUsq0RM@public.gmane.org> References: <003901c3f741$e9573f90$6401a8c0@main> Message-ID: you can uninstall a package via the -e flag... For example, to remove ntp-4.1.1a-9, rpm -e ntp Note that you only need the package name, not the version. You can get a list of all packages installed in your system via: rpm -qa You can pipe it to 'less' to scroll around. You can see the description of a package via: rpm -qi ntp and a list of its files: rpm -ql ntp and you can find out what package owns what particular files: rpm -q --whatprovides /bin/sh Hope that helps! -Jing On Thu, 19 Feb 2004, Sidney Shapiro wrote: > Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 18:41:34 -0500 > From: Sidney Shapiro > Reply-To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: [TLUG]: Uninstalling > > On a RH9 box, how can I uninstall an RPM? I installed spamassassin, but > a later version of the one I needed. How can I find what the exact name > of the one installed is and how do I get rid of it? > > Thanks, > > Sid > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 19 23:57:54 2004 From: sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org (Sidney Shapiro) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 18:57:54 -0500 Subject: Uninstalling In-Reply-To: <200402191756.56810.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200402191756.56810.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <004801c3f744$347956f0$6401a8c0@main> > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org] On Behalf Of Garth > Meisel > Sent: Thursday, February 19, 2004 6:57 PM > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Uninstalling > > On Thu February 19 2004 5:41 pm, Sidney Shapiro wrote: > > On a RH9 box, how can I uninstall an RPM? I installed spamassassin, but > > a later version of the one I needed. How can I find what the exact name > > of the one installed is and how do I get rid of it? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Sid > > How about: > rpm -e package_name But where can I see a list of installed packages? Sid -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 00:27:14 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 19:27:14 -0500 Subject: copy & paste In-Reply-To: <20040219221107.427.qmail-YVEKlzFy1tWA/QwVtaZbd3CJp6faPEW9@public.gmane.org> References: <20040219221107.427.qmail@web40208.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20040220002714.GG9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Feb 19, 2004 at 02:11:07PM -0800, James wrote: > My newly installed debian 3.0 doesn't do copy(highlight) && paste (right mouse click) in terminal. > i know the copy&paste is the default behaviour. > > how do i enable it ? Doing copy and paste on the console is done by a utility called gpm, which probably is not installed by default given it wouldn't make sense for many systems to have it. Install the gpm package and see if that helps. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 00:33:23 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 18:33:23 -0600 Subject: copy & paste In-Reply-To: <20040220002714.GG9627-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20040219221107.427.qmail@web40208.mail.yahoo.com> <20040220002714.GG9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <200402191833.23534.Garth@Webostics.com> I thought gpm was to allow mouse on the console. I didn't say anything before because I don't know the actual daemon for copy/pasting in the shell. All I know is that there is a box in KDE that says "Start Write Daemon." If somebody does know the actual name of the daemon or if it is actually the gpm daemon, let me know. Thanks. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 00:33:36 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 19:33:36 -0500 Subject: copy & paste In-Reply-To: <200402191833.23534.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040219221107.427.qmail@web40208.mail.yahoo.com> <20040220002714.GG9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <200402191833.23534.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <20040220003336.GH9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Feb 19, 2004 at 06:33:23PM -0600, Garth Meisel wrote: > I thought gpm was to allow mouse on the console. I didn't say anything before > because I don't know the actual daemon for copy/pasting in the shell. All I > know is that there is a box in KDE that says "Start Write Daemon." If > somebody does know the actual name of the daemon or if it is actually the gpm > daemon, let me know. Thanks. gpm is a deamon that allows console applications to use the mouse using libgpm or something like that, similar to how they can use the mouse in an xterm. For programs that don't use the mouse, gpm simply provides copy and paste of the text on the console. It is all done by one daemon. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 00:59:20 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 18:59:20 -0600 Subject: copy & paste In-Reply-To: <20040220003336.GH9627-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20040219221107.427.qmail@web40208.mail.yahoo.com> <200402191833.23534.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040220003336.GH9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <200402191859.20490.Garth@Webostics.com> Thanks. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cael-JTkAzvGkdyMrpQx6IzTi3laTQe2KTcn/ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 01:19:06 2004 From: cael-JTkAzvGkdyMrpQx6IzTi3laTQe2KTcn/ at public.gmane.org (Jeremy Wakeman) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 20:19:06 -0500 Subject: use function keys in bash Message-ID: <20040220011906.GA1858@dmz> Hi. I have used tcsh for several years, but I am tired of having to relearn commands/syntax/settings/rc files everytime I use a linux box that does not have tcsh installed. So, I am in the process of switching to bash. The one thing that I cannot seem to get bash to do that tcsh does is to execute a command when I press a function key. In my .tcshrc, I have several entries as follows: bindkey -c [18~ "screen -d -r mutt || screen -S mutt mutt" bindkey -c [19~ "screen -d -r mang || screen -S mang mang" bindkey -c [21~ "screen -d -r mp3blaster || screen -S mp3blaster mp3blaster -a ~/.playlist_01.lst -t=500" bindkey -c [23~ "screen -d -r topcheck || screen -S topcheck topcheck" bindkey -c [24~ "screen -list" With this setup, I can just press F7 to call forward the mutt screen (or, start one if there isn't one running), F10 for mp3blaster, etc. I read through the readline stuff in bash(1), but I don't see anything about executing non-builtin commands, and none of the things I tried in .inputrc worked. Is there a way to do this, or am I stuck? -- Jeremy John Wakeman cael-JTkAzvGkdyMrpQx6IzTi3laTQe2KTcn/@public.gmane.org www.polarhome.com/~cael linux registered user #125171 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mysticsound-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 02:08:52 2004 From: mysticsound-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Carruthers) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 21:08:52 -0500 Subject: Got my feet wet - now getting cold feet. Message-ID: <003a01c3f756$7cace6a0$6501a8c0@JamesDell> Hi, This is the first time I bring a question to this group. I've only started to get my feet wet with Linux. I installed it (RH 9 and 7.3) on a couple of boxes at work to see how it might benefit us. It doesn't look like management will go with it, however, I am personally quite impressed. I've explored around a little bit in KDE and Gnome and installed simple things like flash player. I am considering installing Linux on my own inspiron 1100 (upgraded to 640MB RAM and soon to have an 80GB drive). However, I have some very strong concerns. I'd like to hear some thoughts on this to help me make the best decision. Some of the many problems I have to learn how to solve are: * Will the Linux OS properly recognize all my hardware? I've done some reading on the internet and found that installing Linux on the inspiron 1100 "is not easy" and that certain things won't work no matter what, like the power, but I don't know if that goes for all distros or maybe I was reading out-dated material? Should I stop before I start? * How to extract the volumes of information from my outlook pst file and import it into something like evolution? (I have noticed that it won't import that format.) * How to synch with my axim X5?, and would I need a new OS for it too? * Is there an open source pdf writer in the Linux OS? * I do graphic design and layout work, mainly using Coreldraw 10 - is there open source software to replace this and will it read my cdr files or would I need to save them all as eps or something else? * Will the Linux OS properly recognize my usb 2.0 wireless mouse and my plextor PX-708UF external drive? Will I be able to "plug and play" with the PC card slot - for instance I need to get a fire-wire jack to connect to the semi-professional digital video camera I'll soon be using? * Is there open source DVD creation software available that will make full use of my px-708uf for creating and editing digital footage? * Plus, I'm moving to India in 2 weeks. My work will keep me there indefinitely. If I make the shift and things start to go wrong how hard is it to switch back to XP? * I don't want to have 2 OS on my laptop, as I'll be creating videos and I'll need all my hard-drive space for memory swapping and writing the movies and software (although, I might keep my old 20GB drive apart and separate with XP on it, just in case, but I'd rather plug it in to one of my USB 2.0 ports as additional storage - it's not the biggest drive, but it is of good quality and speed.) * Which distro would be best for me? * And, finally, what questions did I forget to ask? Cautiously curious, James -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 03:07:22 2004 From: noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Noah John Gellner) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 22:07:22 -0500 Subject: Got my feet wet - now getting cold feet. In-Reply-To: <003a01c3f756$7cace6a0$6501a8c0-P1N1ExEQE7tmR6Xm/wNWPw@public.gmane.org> References: <003a01c3f756$7cace6a0$6501a8c0@JamesDell> Message-ID: <20040220030722.GB27296@butters.southtrak> I can answer some of your questions On 21:08 Thu 19 Feb , James Carruthers wrote: > > * Will the Linux OS properly recognize all my hardware? I've done some > reading on the internet and found that installing Linux on the inspiron > 1100 "is not easy" and that certain things won't work no matter what, like > the power, but I don't know if that goes for all distros or maybe I was > reading out-dated material? Should I stop before I start? I expect that the BIOS is similar to the 5100, which I have. There were initially problems with APIC, but there are now patches to make it work well. > * How to extract the volumes of information from my outlook pst file and > import it into something like evolution? (I have noticed that it won't > import that format.) Install Mozilla Mail under windows. It will act as a "swing". You can import your .pst into Mozilla Mail and then export to a Linux friendly format like mbox. > * How to synch with my axim X5?, and would I need a new OS for it too? > * Is there an open source pdf writer in the Linux OS? There are a number of pdf writers for Linux. I write pdf files using open office writer but there are many other apps. Perhaps also of interest, there are apps to convert pdf files into text which can be very useful for extracting the information. > * I do graphic design and layout work, mainly using Coreldraw 10 - is there > open source software to replace this and will it read my cdr files or would > I need to save them all as eps or something else? Carefully check for hardware support. Best place to go is to check the various distribution websites for example SUSE, debian, Mandrake, gentoo, Redhat > * Will the Linux OS properly recognize my usb 2.0 wireless mouse and my > plextor PX-708UF external drive? Will I be able to "plug and play" with the > PC card slot - for instance I need to get a fire-wire jack to connect to > the semi-professional digital video camera I'll soon be using? > * Is there open source DVD creation software available that will make full > use of my px-708uf for creating and editing digital footage? > * Plus, I'm moving to India in 2 weeks. My work will keep me there > indefinitely. If I make the shift and things start to go wrong how hard is > it to switch back to XP? If you want to switch back to XP you will need to basically rebuild your system. My experience is that this is typically a 4-5 hour process. If you have the equipment you can speed this up considerably using software to take a "picture" of your XP machine and then rebuild using that image. The software I have used for this at work is Symantec Ghost. I don't know if there are free tools to do same. > * I don't want to have 2 OS on my laptop, as I'll be creating videos and I'll > need all my hard-drive space for memory swapping and writing the movies and > software (although, I might keep my old 20GB drive apart and separate with > XP on it, just in case, but I'd rather plug it in to one of my USB 2.0 > ports as additional storage - it's not the biggest drive, but it is of good > quality and speed.) > * Which distro would be best for me? picking a distro is a very personal decision. I like gentoo, but it is a pain to first install because you compile a lot of your software. I compiled all of it. The advantage is that if done properly the system is optimized for your machine and use. The downside should be obvious. I also use and recommend Debian for stability and ease of upgrades. I have heard good things about SUSE and Mandrake. I have used Redhat, but find their customized scripts and settings a hassle to upgrade. > * And, finally, what questions did I forget to ask > > Cautiously curious, > James My advice, perhaps heretical, is that if you are leaving for India in two weeks and only have one computer you should be very sure that you want Linux. I have a mixed OS network at home because there are a sufficient number of annoyances that keep me from taking the full plunge. Best of luck. > -- Noah John Gellner J.D. Candidate (2006) University of Toronto Faculty of Law (416) 364-7550 noah.gellner_at_utoronto.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 03:57:30 2004 From: taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 20:57:30 -0700 Subject: Got my feet wet - now getting cold feet. In-Reply-To: <20040220030722.GB27296-y6Pr2RmEDtN2c7wgCBzOK1pr/1R2p/CL@public.gmane.org> References: <003a01c3f756$7cace6a0$6501a8c0@JamesDell> <20040220030722.GB27296@butters.southtrak> Message-ID: <20040220035730.GA9460@idiom.novusordo.net> On Thu, Feb 19, 2004 at 10:07:22PM -0500, Noah John Gellner wrote: > I expect that the BIOS is similar to the 5100, which I have. There were > initially problems with APIC, but there are now patches to make it work well. Is that APIC or ACPI? They are two very different things. APIC is the Advanced Programmable Interrupt Controller, which gives you 32 interrupts instead of the old 15 (or 7, if you're REALLY old). No more IRQ sharing! ACPI is more closely related to power management, and replaces APM. You probably meant ACPI; I've never heard of a laptop with APIC, and ACPI is far more useful on a laptop than on a desktop. > > * Will the Linux OS properly recognize my usb 2.0 wireless mouse and my > > plextor PX-708UF external drive? Will I be able to "plug and play" with the > > PC card slot - for instance I need to get a fire-wire jack to connect to > > the semi-professional digital video camera I'll soon be using? The mouse should, afaik, just show up as a normal USB HID device, and should work. I'll guess that your Plextor is a USB2.0 external CD burner; I don't see why it shouldn't work, too, but I have no personal experience to back up that claim. > > * Is there open source DVD creation software available that will make full > > use of my px-708uf for creating and editing digital footage? There is a version of cdrecord which can burn DVDs. Google for 'cdrecord'. > > * Plus, I'm moving to India in 2 weeks. My work will keep me there > > indefinitely. If I make the shift and things start to go wrong how hard > > is it to switch back to XP? > > If you want to switch back to XP you will need to basically rebuild your > system. My experience is that this is typically a 4-5 hour process. If you > have the equipment you can speed this up considerably using software to take > a "picture" of your XP machine and then rebuild using that image. The > software I have used for this at work is Symantec Ghost. I don't know if > there are free tools to do same. Mondo will do bootable CDs that you can use to re-image a system: http://www.microwerks.net/~hugo/ > My advice, perhaps heretical, is that if you are leaving for India in two > weeks and only have one computer you should be very sure that you want Linux. > I have a mixed OS network at home because there are a sufficient number of > annoyances that keep me from taking the full plunge. If you're just about to move to India, need to do work, and do not already have a Linux support net there, I'd say wait until you get there and see how things are. In moving you do NOT need more headaches. :) Perhaps better to stick with the gangrenous dull ache of windoze until you're in a good position to amputate it. ;) (my, what a horrible, smelly analogy) GOOD LUCK! -- ? Is this the end of the fil...!#$!#@$!#$%!NO CARRIER -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 04:56:03 2004 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 23:56:03 -0500 Subject: [OT] Where can I get CD jewel cases ? Message-ID: <20040220045603.GA2241@m450> I do backups every couple of weeks (doesn't everybody?). I backup static directories separately. My dynamic backups are my local user and /etc plus the backup scripts themselves. Result is just over 200 megs *.tar.bz2 file. I put the latest backup, plus the two previous versions on one CD. I originally tried storing backup CD's in cheap paper sleeves. Bad move. The adhesive holding the sleeve together would stick to the CD, and tearing it off would damage the recording surface. So I've switched over to jewel cases and have just about used up my stock. Where can I get a bunch of jewel cases for a reasonable price ? -- Walter Dnes Email users are divided into two classes; 1) Those who have effective spam-blocking 2) Those who wish they did -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From robert-yzlPDbdf3LosA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 05:01:01 2004 From: robert-yzlPDbdf3LosA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Robert McDonald) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 00:01:01 -0500 Subject: New Google - Kinda off topic References: <20040219221107.427.qmail@web40208.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <001101c3f76e$8d5ab0a0$0b01a8c0@win98p4> With the Buzz about the new Google Search index rolling out on http://64.233.161.105/ I really wonder how searching for miserable failure Brings up the page it does in the number one spot ? Any Idea's ? Is this the beginning of A.I. in search engine technology ? Robert -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 05:29:54 2004 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 00:29:54 -0500 (EST) Subject: [OT] Where can I get CD jewel cases ? In-Reply-To: <20040220045603.GA2241-Mb8sf/rG248@public.gmane.org> References: <20040220045603.GA2241@m450> Message-ID: On Thu, 19 Feb 2004, Walter Dnes wrote: > I originally tried storing backup CD's in cheap paper sleeves. Bad > move. The adhesive holding the sleeve together would stick to the CD, > and tearing it off would damage the recording surface. So I've switched > over to jewel cases and have just about used up my stock. Where can I > get a bunch of jewel cases for a reasonable price ? You might check Above All Electronics, on Bloor just over a block west of Bathurst -- I believe they've got them in quantity. Alternatively, I'd suggest using the "CD wallets" you can buy in places like Business Depot. I use the 48-CD ones, which fit on a bookshelf quite conveniently (size of a slightly tall book) and are much more compact than jewel cases. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 06:19:44 2004 From: sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org (Sidney Shapiro) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 01:19:44 -0500 Subject: [OT] Where can I get CD jewel cases ? In-Reply-To: <20040220045603.GA2241-Mb8sf/rG248@public.gmane.org> References: <20040220045603.GA2241@m450> Message-ID: <003701c3f779$8be5e9f0$6401a8c0@main> I have hundreds of brand new ones left over from a job, I can give you some for a good price. Just give me a call Sid 416 782 2761 > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org] On Behalf Of Walter > Dnes > Sent: Thursday, February 19, 2004 11:56 PM > To: Toronto Linux Users Group > Subject: [TLUG]: [OT] Where can I get CD jewel cases ? > > I do backups every couple of weeks (doesn't everybody?). I backup > static directories separately. My dynamic backups are my local user and > /etc plus the backup scripts themselves. Result is just over 200 megs > *.tar.bz2 file. I put the latest backup, plus the two previous versions > on one CD. > > I originally tried storing backup CD's in cheap paper sleeves. Bad > move. The adhesive holding the sleeve together would stick to the CD, > and tearing it off would damage the recording surface. So I've switched > over to jewel cases and have just about used up my stock. Where can I > get a bunch of jewel cases for a reasonable price ? > > -- > Walter Dnes > Email users are divided into two classes; > 1) Those who have effective spam-blocking > 2) Those who wish they did > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 06:21:05 2004 From: sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org (Sidney Shapiro) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 01:21:05 -0500 Subject: New Google - Kinda off topic In-Reply-To: <001101c3f76e$8d5ab0a0$0b01a8c0-VMKVZpoZl3s@public.gmane.org> References: <001101c3f76e$8d5ab0a0$0b01a8c0@win98p4> Message-ID: <003801c3f779$bc53ae10$6401a8c0@main> > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org] On Behalf Of Robert > McDonald > Sent: Friday, February 20, 2004 12:01 AM > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: [TLUG]: New Google - Kinda off topic > > With the Buzz about the new Google Search index rolling out on > http://64.233.161.105/ > > I really wonder how searching for > > miserable failure > > Brings up the page it does in the number one spot ? > > Any Idea's ? > Is this the beginning of A.I. in search engine technology ? > > Robert I don?t know if youre setting me up, but this is what I got on that search. Biography of President George W. Bush Home > President > Biography President George W. Bush En Espa?ol. George W. Bush is the 43rd President of the United States. He ... Description: Biography of the president from the official White House web site. Category: Kids and Teens > School Time > ... > Bush, George Walker www.whitehouse.gov/president/gwbbio.html - 29k - Cached - Similar pages Sid -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From kenn-mwSrj/bF9lKNls3PewDF2w at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 11:34:19 2004 From: kenn-mwSrj/bF9lKNls3PewDF2w at public.gmane.org (Kenn Munro) Date: 20 Feb 2004 06:34:19 -0500 Subject: Got my feet wet - now getting cold feet. In-Reply-To: <003a01c3f756$7cace6a0$6501a8c0-P1N1ExEQE7tmR6Xm/wNWPw@public.gmane.org> References: <003a01c3f756$7cace6a0$6501a8c0@JamesDell> Message-ID: <1077276858.30801.209.camel@cable-216-104-106-170.lively.dyn.personainc.net> Its good to see that you are interested in Linux. You might want to try booting to a "live" Linux CD (such as Knoppix) to see how well your hardware might be supported, although it may vary between distributions. For PDF writing on Linux, you can print to a postscript file and then convert it to PDF using the ps2pdf command. I would seriously suggest dual booting until you are comfortable with the change, especially if you don't have a lot of time to be installing/configuring new software in an unfamiliar environment. An extra few gigs on an 80 gig drive shouldn't make *that* much of a difference. Good luck... Kenn On Thu, 2004-02-19 at 21:08, James Carruthers wrote: > Hi, > This is the first time I bring a question to this group. I've only > started to get my feet wet with Linux. I installed it (RH 9 and 7.3) > on a couple of boxes at work to see how it might benefit us. It > doesn't look like management will go with it, however, I am personally > quite impressed. I've explored around a little bit in KDE and Gnome > and installed simple things like flash player. > > I am considering installing Linux on my own inspiron 1100 (upgraded to > 640MB RAM and soon to have an 80GB drive). However, I have some very > strong concerns. I'd like to hear some thoughts on this to help me > make the best decision. > > Some of the many problems I have to learn how to solve are: > > * Will the Linux OS properly recognize all my hardware? I've > done some reading on the internet and found that installing > Linux on the inspiron 1100 "is not easy" and that certain > things won't work no matter what, like the power, but I don't > know if that goes for all distros or maybe I was reading > out-dated material? Should I stop before I start? > * How to extract the volumes of information from my outlook pst > file and import it into something like evolution? (I have > noticed that it won't import that format.) > * How to synch with my axim X5?, and would I need a new OS for > it too? > * Is there an open source pdf writer in the Linux OS? > * I do graphic design and layout work, mainly using Coreldraw 10 > - is there open source software to replace this and will it > read my cdr files or would I need to save them all as eps or > something else? > * Will the Linux OS properly recognize my usb 2.0 wireless mouse > and my plextor PX-708UF external drive? Will I be able to > "plug and play" with the PC card slot - for instance I need to > get a fire-wire jack to connect to the semi-professional > digital video camera I'll soon be using? > * Is there open source DVD creation software available that will > make full use of my px-708uf for creating and editing digital > footage? > * Plus, I'm moving to India in 2 weeks. My work will keep me > there indefinitely. If I make the shift and things start to go > wrong how hard is it to switch back to XP? > * I don't want to have 2 OS on my laptop, as I'll be creating > videos and I'll need all my hard-drive space for memory > swapping and writing the movies and software (although, I > might keep my old 20GB drive apart and separate with XP on it, > just in case, but I'd rather plug it in to one of my USB 2.0 > ports as additional storage - it's not the biggest drive, but > it is of good quality and speed.) > * Which distro would be best for me? > * And, finally, what questions did I forget to ask? > > > > Cautiously curious, > James > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From c.f.a.johnson-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 11:43:23 2004 From: c.f.a.johnson-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Chris F.A. Johnson) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 06:43:23 -0500 (EST) Subject: use function keys in bash In-Reply-To: <20040220011906.GA1858-oDRTo6QHVhA@public.gmane.org> References: <20040220011906.GA1858@dmz> Message-ID: On Thu, 19 Feb 2004, Jeremy Wakeman wrote: > Hi. > > I have used tcsh for several years, but I am tired of having to relearn > commands/syntax/settings/rc files everytime I use a linux box that does > not have tcsh installed. So, I am in the process of switching to bash. > The one thing that I cannot seem to get bash to do that tcsh does is to > execute a command when I press a function key. > > In my .tcshrc, I have several entries as follows: > > bindkey -c [18~ "screen -d -r mutt || screen -S mutt mutt" > bindkey -c [19~ "screen -d -r mang || screen -S mang mang" > bindkey -c [21~ "screen -d -r mp3blaster || screen -S mp3blaster mp3blaster -a ~/.playlist_01.lst -t=500" > bindkey -c [23~ "screen -d -r topcheck || screen -S topcheck topcheck" > bindkey -c [24~ "screen -list" > > With this setup, I can just press F7 to call forward the mutt screen (or, > start one if there isn't one running), F10 for mp3blaster, etc. > > I read through the readline stuff in bash(1), but I don't see anything > about executing non-builtin commands, and none of the things I tried in > .inputrc worked. > > Is there a way to do this, or am I stuck? This function reads a single key; as written, it doesn't check for function keys, just cursor keys and mouse button presses (there's another function that actually decodes the mouse clicks), but it's quite easy to add function keys. There are variables that need to be defined, as well. There are couple of scripts on my website that use this function, in one form or another. See the URL below. The scripts are mouse-demo and pop3ck. There are more portable ways of doing it; this is purely bash: get_key() { #== store keypress from list of permissible characters local OKchars=${1:-"$allkeys"} local k local error=0 local gk_tmo=${getkey_time:-${DFLT_TIME_OUT:-600}} local ESC_END=[a-zA-NP-Z~^$] type read_mouse >/dev/null 2>&1 || read_mouse() { :; } mouse_x=0 mouse_y=0 mouse_b=0 mouse_line=0 printf "$mouse_on" stty -echo while :; do IFS= read -r -d '' -sn1 -t$gk_tmo _GET_KEY &1 || break index "$OKchars" "$_GET_KEY" if [ "$_INDEX" -gt 0 ] then case $_GET_KEY in ${ESC}) while :; do IFS= read -rst1 -d '' -n1 k References: <003801c3f779$bc53ae10$6401a8c0@main> Message-ID: <4035F3E7.1000909@qef.com> See other links listed by the search such as: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/3298443.stm and http://www.newsday.com/business/ny-bzgoog1206,0,2339508.story?coll=ny-business-headlines Sidney Shapiro wrote: >>-----Original Message----- >>From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org] On Behalf Of Robert >>McDonald >>Sent: Friday, February 20, 2004 12:01 AM >>To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org >>Subject: [TLUG]: New Google - Kinda off topic >> >>With the Buzz about the new Google Search index rolling out on >>http://64.233.161.105/ >> >>I really wonder how searching for >> >>miserable failure >> >>Brings up the page it does in the number one spot ? >> >>Any Idea's ? >>Is this the beginning of A.I. in search engine technology ? >> >>Robert > > > I don?t know if youre setting me up, but this is what I got on that > search. > > Biography of President George W. Bush > Home > President > Biography President George W. Bush En Espa?ol. > George W. Bush is the 43rd President of the United States. He ... > Description: Biography of the president from the official White House > web site. > Category: Kids and Teens > School Time > ... > Bush, George Walker > www.whitehouse.gov/president/gwbbio.html - 29k - Cached - Similar pages > > Sid > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fcsoft-3Emkkp+1Olsmp8TqCH86vg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 12:52:53 2004 From: fcsoft-3Emkkp+1Olsmp8TqCH86vg at public.gmane.org (bob findlay) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 07:52:53 -0500 Subject: this business model actually works Message-ID: <20040220124839.0E05AB4A75@outbox.allstream.net> A while ago I proposed a variation of the open source model for custom software which I called private source ????????http://www.icanprogram.com/developersDilemma.html The darkhorse group (www.darkhorse.com) has now actually implemented this in practice ????????http://www.osnews.com/story.php?news_id=6078 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jmm-TU2q2He6PgRlD5gtYiU6kEEOCMrvLtNR at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 14:44:29 2004 From: jmm-TU2q2He6PgRlD5gtYiU6kEEOCMrvLtNR at public.gmane.org (John Macdonald) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 09:44:29 -0500 Subject: [OT] Where can I get CD jewel cases ? In-Reply-To: References: <20040220045603.GA2241@m450> Message-ID: <20040220094428.Y25483@algate.perlwolf.com> On Fri, Feb 20, 2004 at 12:29:54AM -0500, Henry Spencer wrote: > On Thu, 19 Feb 2004, Walter Dnes wrote: > > I originally tried storing backup CD's in cheap paper sleeves. Bad > > move. The adhesive holding the sleeve together would stick to the CD, > > and tearing it off would damage the recording surface. So I've switched > > over to jewel cases and have just about used up my stock. Where can I > > get a bunch of jewel cases for a reasonable price ? > > You might check Above All Electronics, on Bloor just over a block west of > Bathurst -- I believe they've got them in quantity. > > Alternatively, I'd suggest using the "CD wallets" you can buy in places > like Business Depot. I use the 48-CD ones, which fit on a bookshelf quite > conveniently (size of a slightly tall book) and are much more compact than > jewel cases. I once saw instructions for an Origami CD case. A sheet of standard paper was folded into a case with no glue required. You could try searching for that if price was every object. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 13:46:20 2004 From: matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (G. Matthew Rice) Date: 20 Feb 2004 08:46:20 -0500 Subject: [OT] Where can I get CD jewel cases ? In-Reply-To: <20040220094428.Y25483-TU2q2He6PgRlD5gtYiU6kEEOCMrvLtNR@public.gmane.org> References: <20040220045603.GA2241@m450> <20040220094428.Y25483@algate.perlwolf.com> Message-ID: John Macdonald writes: > I once saw instructions for an Origami CD case. A sheet > of standard paper was folded into a case with no glue > required. You could try searching for that if price was > every object. You mean: http://www.merrimack.edu/~thull/ There's a cool looking application for it already at: http://www.papercdcase.com -- g. matthew rice starnix inc. phone: 905-771-0017 x242 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 14:30:23 2004 From: rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org (Rob Sutherland) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 09:30:23 -0500 Subject: Papers on FOSS In-Reply-To: <20040220124839.0E05AB4A75-pwyU32sTfCqP7boJH+kiu+TW4wlIGRCZ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040220124839.0E05AB4A75@outbox.allstream.net> Message-ID: <20040220093023.2af25bb9.rob@cheapersafer.com> I got this link off the do-code mailing list - it's a latge collection of academic papers... http://opensource.mit.edu/ Rob -- Rob Sutherland - rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org Computer Support at http://www.cheapersafer.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jason-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 14:38:13 2004 From: jason-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/ at public.gmane.org (Jason Shein) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 09:38:13 -0500 Subject: Intel to Increase Linux Support, Release Centrino Drivers Message-ID: Intel to Increase Linux Support, Release Centrino Drivers Yes! it's about time :) -snip- "ZDNet UK is reporting that Intel has promised to increase Linux support by releasing Linux drivers at the same time it releases Windows drivers for its hardware. According to the general manager of Intel's Software and Solutions Group, Intel wants Linux users to be able to use their hardware as easily, or easier, than any other hardware on the planet." Pingla writes in with more good news: "Intel promises to release Linux drivers for its Centrino chipset at the same time it releases drivers for Windows." -snip- http://news.zdnet.co.uk/business/0,39020645,39146677,00.htm -- " Eventually people tire of repairing broken Windows, And decide to replace them with something stronger" (o_ // Linux - The Choice Of A GNU Generation V_/_ Jason Shein Linux Registered User #281100 jason-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/@public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From JimS-pFJmkVL1u50 at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 14:47:49 2004 From: JimS-pFJmkVL1u50 at public.gmane.org (Jim Skehill) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 09:47:49 -0500 Subject: this business model actually works Message-ID: <33678E78A2DD4D418396703A750048D4BD1EA9@RIKER> Got the wrong link there, should be http://www.darkhorsecrm.com/. -----Original Message----- From: bob findlay [mailto:fcsoft-3Emkkp+1Olsmp8TqCH86vg at public.gmane.org] Sent: Friday, February 20, 2004 7:53 AM To: TLUG Subject: [TLUG]: this business model actually works A while ago I proposed a variation of the open source model for custom software which I called private source ????????http://www.icanprogram.com/developersDilemma.html The darkhorse group (www.darkhorse.com) has now actually implemented this in practice ????????http://www.osnews.com/story.php?news_id=6078 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rico.juan-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 16:01:00 2004 From: rico.juan-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Rico Juan) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 11:01:00 -0500 Subject: US National Security Agency working with Linux Message-ID: <20040220160100.HYAS28144.tomts9-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp.bellnexxia.net> For those interested in security I came across today with this website where this guys released their own linux distro http://www.nsa.gov/selinux --------- Juan Rico -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 16:12:49 2004 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 11:12:49 -0500 Subject: US National Security Agency working with Linux In-Reply-To: <20040220160100.HYAS28144.tomts9-srv.bellnexxia.net-dxTHOwpelHWiNGDy/dcMHtHuzzzSOjJt@public.gmane.org> References: <20040220160100.HYAS28144.tomts9-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp.bellnexxia.net> Message-ID: <200402201112.49843.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> On February 20, 2004 11:01 am, Rico Juan wrote: > For those interested in security I came across today with this website > where this guys released their own linux distro > > http://www.nsa.gov/selinux Not quite correct. They aren't releasing a complete distribution just security enhancements to the Linux kernel. These enhancements provide a lot of security benefits unfortunately most of the major distributions don't support them out of the box. -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From kcozens-qazKcTl6WRFWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 17:31:00 2004 From: kcozens-qazKcTl6WRFWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (Kevin Cozens) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 12:31:00 -0500 Subject: Uninstalling In-Reply-To: <004801c3f744$347956f0$6401a8c0-UxDKcUsq0RM@public.gmane.org> References: <200402191756.56810.Garth@Webostics.com> <004801c3f744$347956f0$6401a8c0@main> Message-ID: <6.0.1.1.2.20040220122557.027d2a20@mail.interlog.com> At 06:57 PM 02/19/2004, Sid wrote: > > On Thu February 19 2004 5:41 pm, Sidney Shapiro wrote: > > > On a RH9 box, how can I uninstall an RPM? I installed spamassassin, >but > > > a later version of the one I needed. How can I find what the exact >name > > > of the one installed is and how do I get rid of it? [snip] >But where can I see a list of installed packages? As was mentioned by someone else, 'rpm -qa' will give you a list of ALL installed packages. If you want to check the version of one in particular, you can use 'rpm -qa |grep spamassassin' for example. If you have installed an older version of the spamassassin RPM and you need a newer one (its not clear from your original message), you just run 'rpm -Uvh ', where '' is the full name of the rpm you want to install. You do not need to remove the old package before upgrading to the new package. Cheers! Kevin. (http://www.interlog.com/~kcozens/) Owner of Elecraft K2 #2172 |"What are we going to do today, Borg?" E-mail:kcozens at interlog dot com|"Same thing we always do, Pinkutus: Packet:ve3syb-XXPEJ3/fxIc at public.gmane.org#con.on.ca.na| Try to assimilate the world!" #include | -Pinkutus & the Borg -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 18:46:05 2004 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 13:46:05 -0500 (EST) Subject: this business model actually works In-Reply-To: <20040220124839.0E05AB4A75-pwyU32sTfCqP7boJH+kiu+TW4wlIGRCZ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040220124839.0E05AB4A75@outbox.allstream.net> Message-ID: On Fri, 20 Feb 2004, bob findlay wrote: > A while ago I proposed a variation of the open source model for custom > software which I called private source > ????????http://www.icanprogram.com/developersDilemma.html If I'm not mistaken, this is at most a minor variant of traditional source licensing -- such as, for example, the terms on which Unix was originally licensed. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 19:08:17 2004 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 14:08:17 -0500 Subject: New Google - Kinda off topic In-Reply-To: <001101c3f76e$8d5ab0a0$0b01a8c0-VMKVZpoZl3s@public.gmane.org> References: <20040219221107.427.qmail@web40208.mail.yahoo.com> <001101c3f76e$8d5ab0a0$0b01a8c0@win98p4> Message-ID: <200402201408.18008.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> On February 20, 2004 12:01 am, Robert McDonald wrote: > With the Buzz about the new Google Search index rolling out on > http://64.233.161.105/ > > I really wonder how searching for > > miserable failure > > Brings up the page it does in the number one spot ? Try searching for weapons of mass destruction ... -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 19:29:10 2004 From: IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Ilya Palagin) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 14:29:10 -0500 Subject: New Google - Kinda off topic In-Reply-To: <200402201408.18008.fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <20040219221107.427.qmail@web40208.mail.yahoo.com> <001101c3f76e$8d5ab0a0$0b01a8c0@win98p4> <200402201408.18008.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: <40366006.6040101@rogers.com> Fraser Campbell wrote: > On February 20, 2004 12:01 am, Robert McDonald wrote: > > >>With the Buzz about the new Google Search index rolling out on >>http://64.233.161.105/ >> >>I really wonder how searching for >> >>miserable failure >> >>Brings up the page it does in the number one spot ? > > > Try searching for weapons of mass destruction ... > The whole story. 'Miserable failure' links to Bush -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 20:48:30 2004 From: tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Tim Writer) Date: 20 Feb 2004 15:48:30 -0500 Subject: Got my feet wet - now getting cold feet. In-Reply-To: <003a01c3f756$7cace6a0$6501a8c0-P1N1ExEQE7tmR6Xm/wNWPw@public.gmane.org> References: <003a01c3f756$7cace6a0$6501a8c0@JamesDell> Message-ID: "James Carruthers" writes: > I am considering installing Linux on my own inspiron 1100 (upgraded to > 640MB RAM and soon to have an 80GB drive). However, I have some very > strong concerns. I'd like to hear some thoughts on this to help me make > the best decision. > > Some of the many problems I have to learn how to solve are: > > * Will the Linux OS properly recognize all my hardware? I've done > some reading on the internet and found that installing Linux on the > inspiron 1100 "is not easy" and that certain things won't work no matter > what, like the power, but I don't know if that goes for all distros or > maybe I was reading out-dated material? I have an Inspiron 1100 running Debian stable with XFree 4.3 and KDE 3.1.3. It works well but it wasn't easy to setup. Currenlty, I believe all of the hardware is working including: o USB 2.0; o the builtin software modem (using beta drivers from http://www.linuxant.com); o on-board sound (Intel i810) which works best with the Alsa drivers but also works with OSS; o on-board Intel i830 graphics with DRI/DRM for 3D accelation; o on-board Broadcomm NIC (I'm using the bcm4400 driver from Broadcomm although recent kernels [2.4.22 and later IIRC]) have a driver); o PCMCIA with various Ethernet NICs and an Orinoco WiFi card; o ACPI for power management. Power management is only functional to a point. I can use it to monitor battery status, etc. and it will warn me when the battery is low but suspend doesn't work. I understand "software suspend" is supposed to work but it seems to be a work in progress and I don't travel enough to be overly worried about it. You will need to upgrade the BIOS to get this to work. The latest version of KNOPPIX boots nicely. If you decide to install Debian stable, I can provide you with my kernel package. > * Will the Linux OS properly recognize my usb 2.0 wireless mouse > and my plextor PX-708UF external drive? I have the ATA version of the same Plextor in my home desktop (also running Debian stable) and it works like a charm. Since USB 2.0 is working and USB DVD[+-]RW drives are supposed to work, yours should. However, I have no direct experience. > Will I be able to "plug and > play" with the PC card slot - for instance I need to get a fire-wire > jack to connect to the semi-professional digital video camera I'll soon > be using? I can't speak for firewire but I haven't had any problems using the PCMCIA with several NICs as wells as an Orinoco WiFi card. > Cautiously curious, I agree with the other posters though that it might not be wise to rush into this before leaving for India. -- tim writer starnix inc. 905.771.0017 ext. 225 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 20:51:44 2004 From: tim-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Tim Writer) Date: 20 Feb 2004 15:51:44 -0500 Subject: Intel to Increase Linux Support, Release Centrino Drivers In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Jason Shein writes: > Intel to Increase Linux Support, Release Centrino Drivers > > Yes! it's about time :) We'll see. They promised to release Centrino drivers shortly after they announced it, then backed off blaming it on the FCC. Meanwhile, other wireless vendors had no problem either releasing drivers or assiting Linux kernel developers. -- tim writer starnix inc. 905.771.0017 ext. 225 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 22:21:12 2004 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 17:21:12 -0500 Subject: [OT] Where can I get CD jewel cases ? In-Reply-To: <20040220045603.GA2241-Mb8sf/rG248@public.gmane.org> References: <20040220045603.GA2241@m450> Message-ID: <40368858.5040703@rogers.com> Walter Dnes wrote: > I do backups every couple of weeks (doesn't everybody?). I backup > static directories separately. My dynamic backups are my local user and > /etc plus the backup scripts themselves. Result is just over 200 megs > *.tar.bz2 file. I put the latest backup, plus the two previous versions > on one CD. > > I originally tried storing backup CD's in cheap paper sleeves. Bad > move. The adhesive holding the sleeve together would stick to the CD, > and tearing it off would damage the recording surface. So I've switched > over to jewel cases and have just about used up my stock. Where can I > get a bunch of jewel cases for a reasonable price ? > You're buying the wrong sleeves. Mine don't have any glue on 'em. However, you can buy jewel cases at many computer suppliers. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 22:53:14 2004 From: noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Noah John Gellner) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 17:53:14 -0500 Subject: Advocacy & Law Message-ID: <20040220225314.GA3490@butters.southtrak> I am both a law student and a Linux enthusiast. I am interested in joining these two qualities and wonder if anyone has any recommendations. Cheers, Noah -- Noah John Gellner J.D. Candidate (2006) University of Toronto Faculty of Law (416) 364-7550 noah.gellner_at_utoronto.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-HInyCGIudOg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 23:20:08 2004 From: cbbrowne-HInyCGIudOg at public.gmane.org (cbbrowne-HInyCGIudOg at public.gmane.org) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 18:20:08 -0500 Subject: Advocacy & Law In-Reply-To: Message from Noah John Gellner of "Fri, 20 Feb 2004 17:53:14 EST." <20040220225314.GA3490-y6Pr2RmEDtN2c7wgCBzOK1pr/1R2p/CL@public.gmane.org> References: <20040220225314.GA3490@butters.southtrak> Message-ID: <20040220232009.A9441405A@cbbrowne.com> > I am both a law student and a Linux enthusiast. I am interested in > joining these two qualities and wonder if anyone has any > recommendations. Cheers, Noah A MAJOR component of legal work is that of preparing documents in quasi-standard formats. I knew one lawyer (in Texas) that sponsored production of some TeX document classes that were helpful for producing the kinds of documents he used a lot. -- output = reverse("gro.gultn" "@" "enworbbc") http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/advocacy.html Rules of the Evil Overlord #155. "If I know of any heroes in the land, I will not under any circumstance kill their mentors, teachers, and/or best friends." -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 23:21:28 2004 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 18:21:28 -0500 Subject: Advocacy & Law In-Reply-To: <20040220225314.GA3490-y6Pr2RmEDtN2c7wgCBzOK1pr/1R2p/CL@public.gmane.org> References: <20040220225314.GA3490@butters.southtrak> Message-ID: <20040220232128.GA16496@node1.opengeometry.net> On Fri, Feb 20, 2004 at 05:53:14PM -0500, Noah John Gellner wrote: > I am both a law student and a Linux enthusiast. I am interested in > joining these two qualities and wonder if anyone has any > recommendations. LaTeX style files for lawyers comes to mind. -- William Park, Open Geometry Consulting, Linux solution for data management and processing. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 23:25:50 2004 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 18:25:50 -0500 Subject: Got my feet wet - now getting cold feet. In-Reply-To: <1077276858.30801.209.camel-zGsQjP6gyKPS+5BON/3Up8JeNgE0HwA0S9G6yd3BABLEs4PmSCcXeW45/GSNgb/n@public.gmane.org> References: <003a01c3f756$7cace6a0$6501a8c0@JamesDell> <1077276858.30801.209.camel@cable-216-104-106-170.lively.dyn.personainc.net> Message-ID: <4036977E.1010805@rogers.com> Kenn Munro wrote: > For PDF writing on Linux, you can print to a postscript file and then > convert it to PDF using the ps2pdf command. The KDE Kprinter can print to PDF, as can Star/OpenOffice. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 20 23:56:47 2004 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 18:56:47 -0500 Subject: US National Security Agency working with Linux In-Reply-To: <20040220160100.HYAS28144.tomts9-srv.bellnexxia.net-dxTHOwpelHWiNGDy/dcMHtHuzzzSOjJt@public.gmane.org> References: <20040220160100.HYAS28144.tomts9-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp.bellnexxia.net> Message-ID: <40369EBF.5060600@rogers.com> Rico Juan wrote: > For those interested in security I came across today with this website where this guys released their own linux distro > > http://www.nsa.gov/selinux Actually, it came out about 2 - 3 years ago. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jmm-TU2q2He6PgRlD5gtYiU6kEEOCMrvLtNR at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 21 01:44:11 2004 From: jmm-TU2q2He6PgRlD5gtYiU6kEEOCMrvLtNR at public.gmane.org (John Macdonald) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 20:44:11 -0500 Subject: Advocacy & Law In-Reply-To: <20040220225314.GA3490-y6Pr2RmEDtN2c7wgCBzOK1pr/1R2p/CL@public.gmane.org> References: <20040220225314.GA3490@butters.southtrak> Message-ID: <20040220204411.Z25483@algate.perlwolf.com> On Fri, Feb 20, 2004 at 05:53:14PM -0500, Noah John Gellner wrote: > I am both a law student and a Linux enthusiast. I am interested in joining these two qualities and wonder if anyone has any recommendations. > Cheers, > Noah If you don't already know of it, you may be interested in the web site www.groklaw.net which is run by paralegal Pamela Jones and discusses issues relating the law and open source. It has largely been dominated by the various legal cases involving SCO. (In fact, it started with a blog that discussed the SCO-IBM case and has grown significantly.) However, there have been many related issues like discussion of the GPL and its legal implications. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 21 00:28:05 2004 From: noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Noah John Gellner) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 19:28:05 -0500 Subject: Advocacy & Law In-Reply-To: <20040220204411.Z25483-TU2q2He6PgRlD5gtYiU6kEEOCMrvLtNR@public.gmane.org> References: <20040220225314.GA3490@butters.southtrak> <20040220204411.Z25483@algate.perlwolf.com> Message-ID: <20040221002805.GA3960@butters.southtrak> My interest is finding something like Groklaw, the FSF but in the Canadian context. For example the legal advisor for the FSF is a law professor at Columbia. I am wondering about think tanks or academics in Canada, preferably in the Toronto area with interests in Linux and free software. On 20:44 Fri 20 Feb , John Macdonald wrote: > > If you don't already know of it, you may be > interested in the web site www.groklaw.net which is -- Noah John Gellner J.D. Candidate (2006) University of Toronto Faculty of Law (416) 364-7550 noah.gellner_at_utoronto.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 21 00:46:36 2004 From: blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Byron Sonne) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 19:46:36 -0500 Subject: Advocacy & Law In-Reply-To: <20040221002805.GA3960-y6Pr2RmEDtN2c7wgCBzOK1pr/1R2p/CL@public.gmane.org> References: <20040220225314.GA3490@butters.southtrak> <20040220204411.Z25483@algate.perlwolf.com> <20040221002805.GA3960@butters.southtrak> Message-ID: <4036AA6C.3060603@rogers.com> > My interest is finding something like Groklaw, the FSF but in the Canadian context. > For example the legal advisor for the FSF is a law professor at Columbia. > I am wondering about think tanks or academics in Canada, preferably in the > Toronto area with interests in Linux and free software. If there isn't something, then perhaps you could make it or start it up. A local chapter, an association, or a whole new entity. Intrepid adventurers are always required! -- For Good, return Good. For Evil, return Justice. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mysticsound-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 21 02:48:07 2004 From: mysticsound-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Carruthers) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 21:48:07 -0500 Subject: Got my feet wet - now getting cold feet. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <001a01c3f825$2307ad90$6401a8c0@JamesDell> Thank you to everyone who offered me advice on putting Linux on my inspiron 1100. Your responses were very informative and helpful. I've filed your advice for future reference, when I'm in a better position to implement it and delve deeper into the Linux OS for my personal use. Thanks again, James -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org] On Behalf Of Tim Writer Sent: February 20, 2004 3:49 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Got my feet wet - now getting cold feet. "James Carruthers" writes: > I am considering installing Linux on my own inspiron 1100 (upgraded to > 640MB RAM and soon to have an 80GB drive). However, I have some very > strong concerns. I'd like to hear some thoughts on this to help me > make the best decision. > > Some of the many problems I have to learn how to solve are: > > * Will the Linux OS properly recognize all my hardware? I've done > some reading on the internet and found that installing Linux on the > inspiron 1100 "is not easy" and that certain things won't work no > matter what, like the power, but I don't know if that goes for all > distros or maybe I was reading out-dated material? I have an Inspiron 1100 running Debian stable with XFree 4.3 and KDE 3.1.3. It works well but it wasn't easy to setup. Currenlty, I believe all of the hardware is working including: o USB 2.0; o the builtin software modem (using beta drivers from http://www.linuxant.com); o on-board sound (Intel i810) which works best with the Alsa drivers but also works with OSS; o on-board Intel i830 graphics with DRI/DRM for 3D accelation; o on-board Broadcomm NIC (I'm using the bcm4400 driver from Broadcomm although recent kernels [2.4.22 and later IIRC]) have a driver); o PCMCIA with various Ethernet NICs and an Orinoco WiFi card; o ACPI for power management. Power management is only functional to a point. I can use it to monitor battery status, etc. and it will warn me when the battery is low but suspend doesn't work. I understand "software suspend" is supposed to work but it seems to be a work in progress and I don't travel enough to be overly worried about it. You will need to upgrade the BIOS to get this to work. The latest version of KNOPPIX boots nicely. If you decide to install Debian stable, I can provide you with my kernel package. > * Will the Linux OS properly recognize my usb 2.0 wireless mouse > and my plextor PX-708UF external drive? I have the ATA version of the same Plextor in my home desktop (also running Debian stable) and it works like a charm. Since USB 2.0 is working and USB DVD[+-]RW drives are supposed to work, yours should. However, I have no direct experience. > Will I be able to "plug and > play" with the PC card slot - for instance I need to get a fire-wire > jack to connect to the semi-professional digital video camera I'll > soon be using? I can't speak for firewire but I haven't had any problems using the PCMCIA with several NICs as wells as an Orinoco WiFi card. > Cautiously curious, I agree with the other posters though that it might not be wise to rush into this before leaving for India. -- tim writer starnix inc. 905.771.0017 ext. 225 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From btraynor-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 21 04:57:23 2004 From: btraynor-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org (bill traynor) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 23:57:23 -0500 Subject: Advocacy & Law In-Reply-To: <20040220225314.GA3490-y6Pr2RmEDtN2c7wgCBzOK1pr/1R2p/CL@public.gmane.org> References: <20040220225314.GA3490@butters.southtrak> Message-ID: <1077339442.687.11.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> On Fri, 2004-02-20 at 17:53, Noah John Gellner wrote: > I am both a law student and a Linux enthusiast. I am interested in joining these two qualities and wonder if anyone has any recommendations. Noah, Of recent note is the launch of "The Canadian File Sharing Information Network" based out of Windsor http://www.canfli.org/index.php They recently posted the IP Address List being targeted by CRIA which can be found http://www.canfli.org/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&t=24 There's also a Ottawa Law & Technology Journal which can be found at: http://www.commonlaw.uottawa.ca/tech/html/lawjournal.html There's also the ITLS at http://web5.uottawa.ca/itls/ Those links should lead you to many other good sources of information. Cheers Bill > Cheers, > Noah -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fcsoft-3Emkkp+1Olsmp8TqCH86vg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 21 14:39:44 2004 From: fcsoft-3Emkkp+1Olsmp8TqCH86vg at public.gmane.org (fcsoft-3Emkkp+1Olsmp8TqCH86vg at public.gmane.org) Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2004 09:39:44 -0500 Subject: this business model actually works Message-ID: <313220-220042621143944351@M2W071.mail2web.com> I make no claims that my private source ideas are original. I'm simply struggling to find a business model which can revive the dying (or dead) custom software industry in the GTA before it is too late. I maintain that for most custom software (which by definition has a limited scope) this Community Licence or Private Source Licence scheme retains most of the benefits of user control afforded by the Open Source licences but at the same time provides a mechanism whereby the actual developers and maintainers can get compensated. Private source licences don't make sense for generic utilities and or programming tools, but they might make sense for a PHP/mySQL/C code system to manage the local muffler shop franchise. Original Message: ----------------- From: Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo31P9xLtpHBDw at public.gmane.org.net Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 13:46:05 -0500 (EST) To: tlug-GezYG1x/Qbs at public.gmane.org.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: this business model actually works On Fri, 20 Feb 2004, bob findlay wrote: > A while ago I proposed a variation of the open source model for custom > software which I called private source > ????????http://www.icanprogram.com/developersDilemma.html If I'm not mistaken, this is at most a minor variant of traditional source licensing -- such as, for example, the terms on which Unix was originally licensed. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo31P9xLtpHBDw at public.gmane.org.net -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From btraynor-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 21 15:17:05 2004 From: btraynor-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org (bill traynor) Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2004 10:17:05 -0500 Subject: this business model actually works In-Reply-To: <313220-220042621143944351-2w826xyIdhOZ8YYJsr7BYUEOCMrvLtNR@public.gmane.org> References: <313220-220042621143944351@M2W071.mail2web.com> Message-ID: <1077376624.800.13.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> On Sat, 2004-02-21 at 09:39, fcsoft-3Emkkp+1Olsmp8TqCH86vg at public.gmane.org wrote: > I make no claims that my private source ideas are original. > > I'm simply struggling to find a business model which can revive the dying > (or dead) custom software industry in the GTA before it is too late. > What do you mean by custom software? I'd interpret that as a client hiring me to write code for a specific itch that they have. I'd also expect that the client would have exclusive rights to all code I provide them. This sucks of cuorse, but it's the nature of being hired to code. Similarly, if I built a house for someone, I wouldn't expect to have any rights to the house afterward. > I maintain that for most custom software (which by definition has a limited > scope) this Community Licence or Private Source Licence scheme > retains most of the benefits of user control afforded by the Open Source > licences but at the same time provides a mechanism whereby the actual > developers and maintainers can get compensated. > > Private source licences don't make sense for generic utilities and or > programming tools, but they might make sense for a PHP/mySQL/C > code system to manage the local muffler shop franchise. I've read the "developers dilemma" page and I think I prefer the dual license model used by MySQL or SleepyCatSoftware, for now. In that model, clients have a choice of going with the GPL'd version of the software, or the (for lack of a better term) the business user license. Yes, all changes the client makes if they choose the business user license does not feed back to the community. But it does allow a company to prosper while developing open source software. Technology based differentiation for a client/company using any piece of software is inherent in the modifications they make to it. The core package is usually considered commoditized, as anyone can buy it. And who better to make the changes then the company who wrote the original GPL'd code. NOTE: There's way more money in services than licenses or seats. This then allows a company like MySQL to continue to fund development on the core package and release improvements back to the community. I'm having difficulty finding flaws in this model given the current conservative nature of most coporate IT decision makers, but I'm open to hear suggestions. Also, I didn't go research this model or anything, so I may have it slightly wrong, but I think I got the gist of it. Thanks Bill > > Original Message: > ----------------- > From: Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org > Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 13:46:05 -0500 (EST) > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: this business model actually works > > > On Fri, 20 Feb 2004, bob findlay wrote: > > A while ago I proposed a variation of the open source model for > custom > > software which I called private source > > http://www.icanprogram.com/developersDilemma.html > > If I'm not mistaken, this is at most a minor variant of traditional source > licensing -- such as, for example, the terms on which Unix was originally > licensed. > > Henry Spencer > henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > mail2web - Check your email from the web at > http://mail2web.com/ . > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 21 17:34:43 2004 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2004 12:34:43 -0500 Subject: this business model actually works In-Reply-To: <313220-220042621143944351-2w826xyIdhOZ8YYJsr7BYUEOCMrvLtNR@public.gmane.org> References: <313220-220042621143944351@M2W071.mail2web.com> Message-ID: <20040221173443.GB4310@m450> On Sat, Feb 21, 2004 at 09:39:44AM -0500, fcsoft-3Emkkp+1Olsmp8TqCH86vg at public.gmane.org wrote > I make no claims that my private source ideas are original. > > I'm simply struggling to find a business model which can revive the dying > (or dead) custom software industry in the GTA before it is too late. > > I maintain that for most custom software (which by definition has a limited > scope) this Community Licence or Private Source Licence scheme > retains most of the benefits of user control afforded by the Open Source > licences but at the same time provides a mechanism whereby the actual > developers and maintainers can get compensated. > > Private source licences don't make sense for generic utilities and or > programming tools, but they might make sense for a PHP/mySQL/C > code system to manage the local muffler shop franchise. Several "split-level" licences are offered by various outfits, e.g. MySQL and ReiserFS. If you download MySQL or ReiserFS for free, you are bound by the GPL if distribute software containing them. If you get the appropriate licence from the developers of MySQL or ReiserFS, you can include the item in proprietary software without having to disclose any source code. -- Walter Dnes Email users are divided into two classes; 1) Those who have effective spam-blocking 2) Those who wish they did -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 21 17:36:52 2004 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2004 12:36:52 -0500 Subject: Very approriate photograph Message-ID: <20040221173652.GC4310@m450> And very much on topic for a linux mailing list http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20040220131626966 -- Walter Dnes Email users are divided into two classes; 1) Those who have effective spam-blocking 2) Those who wish they did -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rufmetal-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 21 18:26:05 2004 From: rufmetal-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Chris Keelan) Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2004 13:26:05 -0500 Subject: New Google - Kinda off topic In-Reply-To: <001101c3f76e$8d5ab0a0$0b01a8c0-VMKVZpoZl3s@public.gmane.org> References: <20040219221107.427.qmail@web40208.mail.yahoo.com> <001101c3f76e$8d5ab0a0$0b01a8c0@win98p4> Message-ID: <20040221132605.6afd3162.rufmetal@eol.ca> On Fri, 20 Feb 2004 00:01:01 -0500 "Robert McDonald" wrote: > With the Buzz about the new Google Search index rolling out on > http://64.233.161.105/ > > I really wonder how searching for > > miserable failure > > Brings up the page it does in the number one spot ? It's called "Google bombing". Google ranks pages by the number of times they're mentioned on other pages, among other criteria. There's been a concerted political effort to link the words "miserable failure" to G.W.B. by mentioning those words with a hyperlink to the page you found on as many different web pages as possible. Slashdot is doing the same with the words "litigious bastards" and SCO. Internet activism is coming of age. ~ C -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 21 22:55:15 2004 From: matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (G. Matthew Rice) Date: 21 Feb 2004 17:55:15 -0500 Subject: this business model actually works In-Reply-To: <1077376624.800.13.camel-W1ecohOu015D6NYMwsFkEdAWLNoT+7d/@public.gmane.org> References: <313220-220042621143944351@M2W071.mail2web.com> <1077376624.800.13.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> Message-ID: bill traynor writes: > What do you mean by custom software? I'd interpret that as a client > hiring me to write code for a specific itch that they have. I'd also > expect that the client would have exclusive rights to all code I provide > them. This sucks of cuorse, but it's the nature of being hired to > code. Similarly, if I built a house for someone, I wouldn't expect to > have any rights to the house afterward. Not at all, I've been involved in many projects where we've retained ownership of the code and just granted them a perpetual, royalty-free, not-for-resale, ... license to the code. Usually for solutions that are not going to give the client a competitive advantage and/or they aren't going to pay the full cost of development. You just have to put this sort of stuff in the contract. > I've read the "developers dilemma" page and I think I prefer the dual > license model used by MySQL or SleepyCatSoftware, for now. In that > model, clients have a choice of going with the GPL'd version of the > software, or the (for lack of a better term) the business user license. Although most people don't realize it, this option is available to every GPLed project. If you can get all of the copyright holders to agree, you can do anything you want; including license the software under another license. There is something to be said for asking for copyright transfer on any submissions to a project that you own, as the FSF does it [nudge, nudge, wink, wink; know what I mean ;)]. You don't have to go back to the contributors for any permission when you want to do something against your own license. > NOTE: There's way more money in services than licenses or seats. This Only if your product is so inherently complicated [I don't get that one but...] or sucks so badly that people need help to deploy it. I know a few companies that can't really make a case for extensive consulting and have to make it up on licensing fees. > then allows a company like MySQL to continue to fund development on the > core package and release improvements back to the community. I'm having > difficulty finding flaws in this model given the current conservative > nature of most coporate IT decision makers, but I'm open to hear > suggestions. The battle that Starnix faces most of the time is that people [this seems to be almost universal] are more willing to spend $250k on hardware solutions that they can see than on customized solutions and software development to solve the same problem at $125k. This also explains why blinkenboxes sell. They are large empty boxes with nice blinkenlights [can't find the blinkenbox site so yo'll have to make do with: http://www.jargon.net/jargonfile/b/blinkenlights.html] that you can put the small, expensive devices in to make them look more impressive. Hey, for $250k, management wants to see some blinkenlights. TTYL, -- g. matthew rice starnix inc. phone: 905-771-0017 x242 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fcsoft-3Emkkp+1Olsmp8TqCH86vg at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 22 13:18:05 2004 From: fcsoft-3Emkkp+1Olsmp8TqCH86vg at public.gmane.org (bob findlay) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 08:18:05 -0500 Subject: FW: Re:this business model actually works In-Reply-To: <232810-22004262117588975-Xcp0aj21AvyZ8YYJsr7BYUEOCMrvLtNR@public.gmane.org> References: <232810-22004262117588975@M2W036.mail2web.com> Message-ID: <20040222131434.6652C62EC@outbox.allstream.net> > > What do you mean by custom software? I'd interpret that as a client > hiring me to write code for a specific itch that they have. I'd also > expect that the client would have exclusive rights to all code I provide > them. This sucks of cuorse, but it's the nature of being hired to > code. Similarly, if I built a house for someone, I wouldn't expect to > have any rights to the house afterward. > You are correct of course. It is my contention that custom software can come to existence under 2 different business models. The first is the one you describe. A client hires a developer to write some code which they either use internally or resell to their customers. It is typically only larger enterprises who would have the resources to afford this type of solution. The second is that a group of software users, who individually may not be able to afford to hire a custom software developer, pool their resources and contract to have some custom software written. In both cases the developer has no rights to the software. In all but the resell case the users do. > > I've read the "developers dilemma" page and I think I prefer the dual > license model used by MySQL or SleepyCatSoftware, for now. In that > model, clients have a choice of going with the GPL'd version of the > software, or the (for lack of a better term) the business user license. > Yes, all changes the client makes if they choose the business user > license does not feed back to the community. But it does allow a > company to prosper while developing open source software. Technology > based differentiation for a client/company using any piece of software > is inherent in the modifications they make to it. The core package is > usually considered commoditized, as anyone can buy it. And who better > to make the changes then the company who wrote the original GPL'd code. > NOTE: There's way more money in services than licenses or seats. This > then allows a company like MySQL to continue to fund development on the > core package and release improvements back to the community. I'm having > difficulty finding flaws in this model given the current conservative > nature of most coporate IT decision makers, but I'm open to hear > suggestions. I have no problem with the dual licences also ... but only for commodity type software like a database or a toolkit etc. The theory behind these dual licences is that the more your software is used the bigger your user base becomes. Only a small percentage of your user base will opt for the commercial licence. So the bigger your user base the better chance that this small percentage will be sufficient to sustain your developers. The GPL use is what expands your user base. The reason this theory doesn't work well for custom software is that this type of software rarely has the potential for a large enough user base for the math to work out sufficiently to pay the developer who will create the software in the first place. Almost by definition custom software rarely gets created in response to a developer's own "itch" ... it is rather a user's (who isn't a developer) "itch" that motivates its creation. Therein lies the crux of the problem. Most individual users (who aren't themselves developers) can't afford the developer costs so their "itches go unscratched". It was my contention that by pooling resources of a group of users under a Private Source or Community licence the developer can get paid and the software can get created. More importantly, the fact that the users actually own the source under a limited form of copyleft guarantees that they will be able to leverage the kind of control that open source users enjoy. > > Also, I didn't go research this model or anything, so I may have it > slightly wrong, but I think I got the gist of it. > > Thanks > Bill > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pmills-5bG9SNWDbRX3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 22 13:25:55 2004 From: pmills-5bG9SNWDbRX3fQ9qLvQP4Q at public.gmane.org (Phillip Mills) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 08:25:55 -0500 Subject: City of Toronto: spinning freely Message-ID: <200402220825.55469.pmills@axxent.ca> A day late, I've just read a Saturday Toronto Star article called, "MFP computers obsolete." (Page B3, GTA section) It looks to me as if both the techs and the politicians are trying to soften up the public so that they will swallow a 63 million dollar computer upgrade of 1999 vintage systems. There may be good business reasons for the upgrade, but the technical ones they provide are baffling to me. 1) "Toronto would like to adopt a 311 system where residents could punch in that number and get information on city services or report problems. That would require major upgrades." It might require new servers, but as an excuse for upgrading stuff that's performing some current function, the reasoning doesn't cut it. 2) "Deputy Mayor Sandra Bussin illustrated how out of date city hall's systems are by pointing out that her office computer can't send a photo via e-mail." OK, where do I start...? I'm not a PC hardware expert, but my oldest Mac is 4 years older that her PC and it has no trouble sending a photo via e-mail...guess it's a Wintel thing. Semi-seriously, though, anyone here think they could get poor Sandra's machine to send a photo via e-mail for less than $63 million? -- Phillip Mills Multi-platform software development (416) 224-0714 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 22 15:22:11 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 10:22:11 -0500 Subject: use function keys in bash In-Reply-To: <20040220011906.GA1858-oDRTo6QHVhA@public.gmane.org> References: <20040220011906.GA1858@dmz> Message-ID: <20040222152211.GI9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Feb 19, 2004 at 08:19:06PM -0500, Jeremy Wakeman wrote: > I have used tcsh for several years, but I am tired of having to relearn > commands/syntax/settings/rc files everytime I use a linux box that does > not have tcsh installed. So, I am in the process of switching to bash. > The one thing that I cannot seem to get bash to do that tcsh does is to > execute a command when I press a function key. > > In my .tcshrc, I have several entries as follows: > > bindkey -c [18~ "screen -d -r mutt || screen -S mutt mutt" > bindkey -c [19~ "screen -d -r mang || screen -S mang mang" > bindkey -c [21~ "screen -d -r mp3blaster || screen -S mp3blaster mp3blaster -a ~/.playlist_01.lst -t=500" > bindkey -c [23~ "screen -d -r topcheck || screen -S topcheck topcheck" > bindkey -c [24~ "screen -list" > > With this setup, I can just press F7 to call forward the mutt screen (or, > start one if there isn't one running), F10 for mp3blaster, etc. > > I read through the readline stuff in bash(1), but I don't see anything > about executing non-builtin commands, and none of the things I tried in > .inputrc worked. > > Is there a way to do this, or am I stuck? Well you can certainly do this in .inputrc: "\e[11~": "ls\n" And it works when you hit F1 to print that text on the command line. Of course you have to logout and back in for bash to read the file again. Maybe that will help. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rufmetal-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 22 15:16:25 2004 From: rufmetal-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Chris Keelan) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 10:16:25 -0500 Subject: City of Toronto: spinning freely In-Reply-To: <200402220825.55469.pmills-5bG9SNWDbRX3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> References: <200402220825.55469.pmills@axxent.ca> Message-ID: <20040222101625.2b1e5647.rufmetal@eol.ca> On Sun, 22 Feb 2004 08:25:55 -0500 Phillip Mills wrote: > Semi-seriously, though, anyone here > think they could get poor Sandra's machine to send a photo via e-mail > for less than $63 million? No, I think $63 million should do nicely. I'm available evenings and weekends. ~ C -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 22 15:30:56 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 10:30:56 -0500 Subject: Got my feet wet - now getting cold feet. In-Reply-To: <003a01c3f756$7cace6a0$6501a8c0-P1N1ExEQE7tmR6Xm/wNWPw@public.gmane.org> References: <003a01c3f756$7cace6a0$6501a8c0@JamesDell> Message-ID: <20040222153056.GJ9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Feb 19, 2004 at 09:08:52PM -0500, James Carruthers wrote: > This is the first time I bring a question to this group. I've only > started to get my feet wet with Linux. I installed it (RH 9 and 7.3) on > a couple of boxes at work to see how it might benefit us. It doesn't > look like management will go with it, however, I am personally quite > impressed. I've explored around a little bit in KDE and Gnome and > installed simple things like flash player. > > I am considering installing Linux on my own inspiron 1100 (upgraded to > 640MB RAM and soon to have an 80GB drive). However, I have some very > strong concerns. I'd like to hear some thoughts on this to help me make > the best decision. > > Some of the many problems I have to learn how to solve are: > > * Will the Linux OS properly recognize all my hardware? I've done > some reading on the internet and found that installing Linux on the > inspiron 1100 "is not easy" and that certain things won't work no matter > what, like the power, but I don't know if that goes for all distros or > maybe I was reading out-dated material? Should I stop before I start? Laptops are often full of proprietary hardware in order to make it small and cheaper. This tends to make life harder for Linux since the manufacturer doesn't care about Linux in general. The choice of distribution doesn't affect what hardware is supported in general, some just autodetect it better. > * How to extract the volumes of information from my outlook pst > file and import it into something like evolution? (I have noticed that > it won't import that format.) Setup an imap server, copy the mail to there with outlook, then copy it from imap to your choice of mail program. :) > * How to synch with my axim X5?, and would I need a new OS for it > too? Never heard of axim X5. What is it? > * Is there an open source pdf writer in the Linux OS? OpenOffice can export anything it does to pdf. > * I do graphic design and layout work, mainly using Coreldraw 10 - > is there open source software to replace this and will it read my cdr > files or would I need to save them all as eps or something else? Well the gimp does graphics somewhat like photoshop. For vector object layout I am not sure. xfig is probably to simple. Not sure if openoffice has any layout stuff in it for graphics. > * Will the Linux OS properly recognize my usb 2.0 wireless mouse > and my plextor PX-708UF external drive? Will I be able to "plug and > play" with the PC card slot - for instance I need to get a fire-wire > jack to connect to the semi-professional digital video camera I'll soon > be using? Assuming the pccard is a standard design with a driver in linux, then it will just work. The plextor will work. To write DVD's will either require the non free cdrecord-prodvd or the free growisofs from dvdrw+tools (or something similar to that). > * Is there open source DVD creation software available that will > make full use of my px-708uf for creating and editing digital footage? There is certainly dvdauthor and things like that. Not sure how good the utils are for making the menus and such yet but it's getting there. > * Plus, I'm moving to India in 2 weeks. My work will keep me there > indefinitely. If I make the shift and things start to go wrong how hard > is it to switch back to XP? Well you can just tell the XP installer to wipe out everything on the drive, so well backup your data properly first. > * I don't want to have 2 OS on my laptop, as I'll be creating > videos and I'll need all my hard-drive space for memory swapping and > writing the movies and software (although, I might keep my old 20GB > drive apart and separate with XP on it, just in case, but I'd rather > plug it in to one of my USB 2.0 ports as additional storage - it's not > the biggest drive, but it is of good quality and speed.) Well if there are things you must be able to do, then maybe sticking with what you are used to is better work wise, but trying both isn't bad either. Installing Linux does not take that much space, and you could easily fit a nice linux install in 5G of space, and then make maybe 10GB for winxp, and make the rest a shared fat32 drive for the video data so you can try and work with it from both. > * Which distro would be best for me? I like debian. it may not have the nicest installer, but it sure works very well once it is installed, and is very easy to upgrade and maintain. Lots of good free support on irc too. > * And, finally, what questions did I forget to ask? Probably lots. :) Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 22 15:37:57 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 10:37:57 -0500 Subject: [OT] Where can I get CD jewel cases ? In-Reply-To: <20040220094428.Y25483-TU2q2He6PgRlD5gtYiU6kEEOCMrvLtNR@public.gmane.org> References: <20040220045603.GA2241@m450> <20040220094428.Y25483@algate.perlwolf.com> Message-ID: <20040222153757.GK9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Feb 20, 2004 at 09:44:29AM -0500, John Macdonald wrote: > I once saw instructions for an Origami CD case. A sheet > of standard paper was folded into a case with no glue > required. You could try searching for that if price was > every object. Just remember paper may contain chemicals your CD won't like in the long term (I remember reading that the first auido CDs came in cardboard holders similar to vinyl records, which caused them to start deteriorating within a few years. Then they made the plastic ones that are still in use now. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 22 15:44:02 2004 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 10:44:02 -0500 Subject: City of Toronto: spinning freely In-Reply-To: <200402220825.55469.pmills-5bG9SNWDbRX3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> References: <200402220825.55469.pmills@axxent.ca> Message-ID: <4038CE42.6070908@rogers.com> Phillip Mills wrote: > A day late, I've just read a Saturday Toronto Star article called, "MFP > computers obsolete." (Page B3, GTA section) > > It looks to me as if both the techs and the politicians are trying to soften > up the public so that they will swallow a 63 million dollar computer upgrade > of 1999 vintage systems. There may be good business reasons for the upgrade, > but the technical ones they provide are baffling to me. There's a perfectly logical reason: There's some taxpayers money to be spent! > > 1) "Toronto would like to adopt a 311 system where residents could punch in > that number and get information on city services or report problems. That > would require major upgrades." > > It might require new servers, but as an excuse for upgrading stuff that's > performing some current function, the reasoning doesn't cut it. > > 2) "Deputy Mayor Sandra Bussin illustrated how out of date city hall's systems > are by pointing out that her office computer can't send a photo via e-mail." > > OK, where do I start...? I'm not a PC hardware expert, but my oldest Mac is 4 > years older that her PC and it has no trouble sending a photo via > e-mail...guess it's a Wintel thing. Semi-seriously, though, anyone here > think they could get poor Sandra's machine to send a photo via e-mail for > less than $63 million? Well, I recently spent $80 on an Epson scanner, that included software that will e-mail a scanned image. And for an even $30M, I'd be happy to teach her how to attach an existing image file to an e-mail. I'd even bring coffee & donuts! ;-) > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 22 15:35:31 2004 From: IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Ilya Palagin) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 10:35:31 -0500 Subject: City of Toronto: spinning freely In-Reply-To: <200402220825.55469.pmills-5bG9SNWDbRX3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org> References: <200402220825.55469.pmills@axxent.ca> Message-ID: <4038CC43.3050103@rogers.com> Phillip Mills wrote: > A day late, I've just read a Saturday Toronto Star article called, "MFP > computers obsolete." (Page B3, GTA section) > > It looks to me as if both the techs and the politicians are trying to soften > up the public so that they will swallow a 63 million dollar computer upgrade > of 1999 vintage systems. There may be good business reasons for the upgrade, > but the technical ones they provide are baffling to me. > > 1) "Toronto would like to adopt a 311 system where residents could punch in > that number and get information on city services or report problems. That > would require major upgrades." > > It might require new servers, but as an excuse for upgrading stuff that's > performing some current function, the reasoning doesn't cut it. This may also require installation of a client software for this "311 system", which needs PIII to show smoothly nice logos and funny icons. > > 2) "Deputy Mayor Sandra Bussin illustrated how out of date city hall's systems > are by pointing out that her office computer can't send a photo via e-mail." > > OK, where do I start...? I'm not a PC hardware expert, but my oldest Mac is 4 > years older that her PC and it has no trouble sending a photo via > e-mail...guess it's a Wintel thing. Semi-seriously, though, anyone here > think they could get poor Sandra's machine to send a photo via e-mail for > less than $63 million? > I'm sure, there is simply no need to get her a new machine. I would delete temp files, cleaned registry, or better reinstalled her buggy windows from scratch just for Today's Special Price of $1,000. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 22 20:39:17 2004 From: lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org (Lloyd Budd) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 15:39:17 -0500 Subject: social networking software , flickr Message-ID: <2F6605F6-6577-11D8-A094-0003931BD222@foolswisdom.com> Likely some of you are into the social software *sic* scene. flickr.com (macro. flash required) is a by-product of some development happening on the left coast, Game Neverending . It is basically the same flavor as the other implementations, but does include real time photo sharing. Check it out, -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 22 21:24:42 2004 From: clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (CLIFFORD ILKAY) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 16:24:42 -0500 Subject: Got my feet wet - now getting cold feet. Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.0.20040222162432.099b2788@localhost> At 21:48 20/02/2004 -0500, James Carruthers wrote: >Thank you to everyone who offered me advice on putting Linux on my >inspiron 1100. Your responses were very informative and helpful. I've >filed your advice for future reference, when I'm in a better position to >implement it and delve deeper into the Linux OS for my personal use. >Thanks again, >James Hi James, There are relatively low risk ways of using Linux on your laptop without having to make any changes to your current Windows installation. If you use virtual machine technology, you will be able to run Windows and Linux, or other x86 operating systems simultaneously. The machine that I am typing this on is running Windows 2000 Pro on a virtual machine created under VMware with Mandrake 9.1 as the host OS. I could have done it the other way around, i.e. Windows 2000 as the host with Linux being the guest OS but I wanted the more stable of the two operating systems to be the host. VMware is not the only option. I suppose one advantage of running Linux within a virtual machine is that you can be reasonably certain there will not be problems with hardware compatibility since the virtual machines tend to be "vanilla" configurations. Below are a few other options. N.B. I only have personal experience with VMware and Win4Lin. Open Source - Windows must be host Either Windows or Linux host - seems like a commercial product though I could not find out how much it is beyond the three month trial period. Microsoft bought Connectix last year. Unsurprisingly, it only runs on Windows or OS X. Does not require a host OS. Allows one to run multiple x86 operating systems simultaneously. Looks very interesting and is quite inexpensive. Commercial product. Open Source IA32 emulator that allows one to create virtual machines - similar in concept to VMware. Before embarking on this adventure, I would recommend making a disk image of your Windows installation so that you can recover quickly in the event of a problem. Actually, that is a good practice regardless because of the propensity of Windows to grow barnacles and have to be taken to dry dock periodically. Regards, Clifford Ilkay Dinamis Corporation 3266 Yonge Street, Suite 1419 Toronto, Ontario Canada M4N 3P6 Tel: 416-410-3326 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 23 00:09:45 2004 From: taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 17:09:45 -0700 Subject: Got my feet wet - now getting cold feet. In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20040222162432.099b2788-bi+AKbBUZKZeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20040222162432.099b2788@localhost> Message-ID: <20040223000945.GA42235@idiom.novusordo.net> On Sun, Feb 22, 2004 at 04:24:42PM -0500, CLIFFORD ILKAY wrote: > Open Source IA32 emulator that allows one > to create virtual machines - similar in concept to VMware. It's actually much closer to VirtualPC running on Mac. VMware is known as "virtualisation" software. The OS and programs run natively on the x86 CPU, and all access to hardware is intercepted and emulated. VMware is more like WINE than bochs in that respect. Bochs is a full CPU emulator, with all instructions emulated in software. It is therefore very slow compared to VMware, but unlike VMware it runs on anything; x86, PPC, sparc, etc. -- taa As an adolescent I aspired to lasting fame, I craved factual certainty, and I thirsted for a meaningful vision of human life - so I became a scientist. This is like becoming an archbishop so you can meet girls. -Matt Cartmill, anthropology professor and author (1943- ) /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 23 00:29:39 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 18:29:39 -0600 Subject: Got my feet wet - now getting cold feet. In-Reply-To: <20040223000945.GA42235-7r3UYZMxfuqyvPIx3LBjwNHuzzzSOjJt@public.gmane.org> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20040222162432.099b2788@localhost> <20040223000945.GA42235@idiom.novusordo.net> Message-ID: <200402221829.39036.Garth@Webostics.com> On Sun February 22 2004 6:09 pm, Taavi Burns wrote: > On Sun, Feb 22, 2004 at 04:24:42PM -0500, CLIFFORD ILKAY wrote: > > Open Source IA32 emulator that allows one > > to create virtual machines - similar in concept to VMware. > > It's actually much closer to VirtualPC running on Mac. VMware is known as > "virtualisation" software. The OS and programs run natively on the x86 > CPU, and all access to hardware is intercepted and emulated. VMware is > more like WINE than bochs in that respect. > > Bochs is a full CPU emulator, with all instructions emulated in software. > It is therefore very slow compared to VMware, but unlike VMware it runs > on anything; x86, PPC, sparc, etc. I'm glad you added that. I didn't now the nice way of saying ONE of the things you mentioned which was "Slow." IMHO, no matter what though, the end result is still Windoze and it isn't going to be any better or any more stable just because it's being babysat by *nix. : ) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From c.f.a.johnson-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 23 00:53:57 2004 From: c.f.a.johnson-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Chris F.A. Johnson) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 19:53:57 -0500 (EST) Subject: use function keys in bash In-Reply-To: <20040222152211.GI9627-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20040220011906.GA1858@dmz> <20040222152211.GI9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: On Sun, 22 Feb 2004, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Thu, Feb 19, 2004 at 08:19:06PM -0500, Jeremy Wakeman wrote: > > I have used tcsh for several years, but I am tired of having to relearn > > commands/syntax/settings/rc files everytime I use a linux box that does > > not have tcsh installed. So, I am in the process of switching to bash. > > The one thing that I cannot seem to get bash to do that tcsh does is to > > execute a command when I press a function key. > > > > In my .tcshrc, I have several entries as follows: > > > > bindkey -c [18~ "screen -d -r mutt || screen -S mutt mutt" > > bindkey -c [19~ "screen -d -r mang || screen -S mang mang" > > bindkey -c [21~ "screen -d -r mp3blaster || screen -S mp3blaster mp3blaster -a ~/.playlist_01.lst -t=500" > > bindkey -c [23~ "screen -d -r topcheck || screen -S topcheck topcheck" > > bindkey -c [24~ "screen -list" > > > > With this setup, I can just press F7 to call forward the mutt screen (or, > > start one if there isn't one running), F10 for mp3blaster, etc. > > > > I read through the readline stuff in bash(1), but I don't see anything > > about executing non-builtin commands, and none of the things I tried in > > .inputrc worked. > > > > Is there a way to do this, or am I stuck? > > Well you can certainly do this in .inputrc: > > "\e[11~": "ls\n" > > And it works when you hit F1 to print that text on the command line. > > Of course you have to logout and back in for bash to read the file > again. No need to log out. ^X^R rereads .inputrc -- Chris F.A. Johnson ================================================================= cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org http://cfaj.freeshell.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From stewsinc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 23 07:07:06 2004 From: stewsinc-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Stewart Sinclair) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 02:07:06 -0500 Subject: Preventing the next MyDoom (fwd) In-Reply-To: <4034DB1C.20504-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <5.2.1.1.0.20040219012829.02fb2080@mail.eol.ca> <5.2.1.1.0.20040219012829.02fb2080@mail.eol.ca> <4034DB1C.20504@rogers.com> Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.0.20040223020054.02fdfd00@mail.eol.ca> Good ideas all. But neither he nor any of the people he works with understand these kinds of solutions and the ones making these sorts of decisions seem to be inaccessible. Though I will mention this suggestion to him - thanks. I don't hold out much hope for it though. He will have difficulty explaining it to them and they probably aren't listing - if they can be reached at all. We're dealing with Southam after all. I know Conrad B. has moved on but that's the kind of mentality in this place. Stew ***** At 10:49 AM 19/02/04 -0500, you wrote: >Perhaps he and his employer should consider a crappy old PC, not connected >to the network, and a transport mechanism such as a flashdisk / USB memory >pen / ... >That way, he can move his mail to a system which is welcome to slash & >burn, without risking the entire corporation. > >Of course, converting the corp to Unix would provide even better >protection, since Unix viruses are practically unknown. > >Tom > >Stewart Sinclair wrote: > >>Your points are well taken and it seems so simple and obvious once it's >>explained. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cael-JTkAzvGkdyMrpQx6IzTi3laTQe2KTcn/ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 23 08:19:21 2004 From: cael-JTkAzvGkdyMrpQx6IzTi3laTQe2KTcn/ at public.gmane.org (Jeremy Wakeman) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 03:19:21 -0500 Subject: use function keys in bash In-Reply-To: <20040222152211.GI9627-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20040220011906.GA1858@dmz> <20040222152211.GI9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20040223081921.GB13052@dmz> On Sun, Feb 22, 2004 at 10:22:11AM -0500, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > Well you can certainly do this in .inputrc: > > "\e[11~": "ls\n" > > And it works when you hit F1 to print that text on the command line. > > Of course you have to logout and back in for bash to read the file > again. > > Maybe that will help. > > Lennart Sorensen That is exactly what I was looking to do. Thank you! I feel kind of silly that I didn't think to try it that way . . .. -Jeremy -- Jeremy John Wakeman cael-JTkAzvGkdyMrpQx6IzTi3laTQe2KTcn/@public.gmane.org www.polarhome.com/~cael linux registered user #125171 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 23 13:49:52 2004 From: taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 06:49:52 -0700 Subject: Got my feet wet - now getting cold feet. In-Reply-To: <200402221829.39036.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20040222162432.099b2788@localhost> <20040223000945.GA42235@idiom.novusordo.net> <200402221829.39036.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <20040223134952.GA65595@idiom.novusordo.net> On Sun, Feb 22, 2004 at 06:29:39PM -0600, Garth Meisel wrote: > On Sun February 22 2004 6:09 pm, Taavi Burns wrote: > I'm glad you added that. I didn't now the nice way of saying ONE of the > things you mentioned which was "Slow." IMHO, no matter what though, the end > result is still Windoze and it isn't going to be any better or any more > stable just because it's being babysat by *nix. : ) Actually...I have heard purely anecdotal evidence that Windoze can in fact be more stable in the virtual PC. Why? NO clue. Perhaps Windows has crappy drivers (oh my!)? But that's 3rd party anecdotal evidence. Don't listen to it. :) -- taa As an adolescent I aspired to lasting fame, I craved factual certainty, and I thirsted for a meaningful vision of human life - so I became a scientist. This is like becoming an archbishop so you can meet girls. -Matt Cartmill, anthropology professor and author (1943- ) /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-cOjNTMaGA5U at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 23 16:53:15 2004 From: linux-cOjNTMaGA5U at public.gmane.org (Ian Goldberg) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 11:53:15 -0500 Subject: Got my feet wet - now getting cold feet. In-Reply-To: <20040223134952.GA65595-7r3UYZMxfuqyvPIx3LBjwNHuzzzSOjJt@public.gmane.org> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20040222162432.099b2788@localhost> <20040223000945.GA42235@idiom.novusordo.net> <200402221829.39036.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040223134952.GA65595@idiom.novusordo.net> Message-ID: <20040223165315.GL756@paip.net> On Mon, Feb 23, 2004 at 06:49:52AM -0700, Taavi Burns wrote: > On Sun, Feb 22, 2004 at 06:29:39PM -0600, Garth Meisel wrote: > > On Sun February 22 2004 6:09 pm, Taavi Burns wrote: > > I'm glad you added that. I didn't now the nice way of saying ONE of the > > things you mentioned which was "Slow." IMHO, no matter what though, the end > > result is still Windoze and it isn't going to be any better or any more > > stable just because it's being babysat by *nix. : ) > > Actually...I have heard purely anecdotal evidence that Windoze > can in fact be more stable in the virtual PC. Why? NO clue. > Perhaps Windows has crappy drivers (oh my!)? > > But that's 3rd party anecdotal evidence. Don't listen to it. :) That's my understanding as well. It's because the "virutalized" hardware offered by the VMWare environment (or whatever other emulator you're using) is designed to be "ideal": it doesn't have any of the weird flakinesses associated with real hardware. You're essentially running Windows on an extremely slim, clean, *and standard* set of hardware. It's much more likely to be stable than running it on whatever hardware you've actually got in your box. - Ian -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 23 17:47:02 2004 From: hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (D. Hugh Redelmeier) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 12:47:02 -0500 (EST) Subject: Feb 24th. NewTLUG meeting: drive or ride? Message-ID: | From: Herb Richter | To: tlug-announce-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org, announce at newtlug.linux.ca | Subject: [TLUG-ANNOUNCE]: Feb 24th. NewTLUG meeting: Reversing an Upgrade, | LaTeX, Lyx The meeting promises to be interesting! | Location: room 1208 (SEQ building) Seneca College | SEQ building belongs to Seneca College and is a part of | the Seneca-0vOcVYEplY8 at public.gmane.org Campus, which is physically located just | south of York University, at Keele/Steeles. | | Directions: For detailed directions and info on public transit, please | see: http://cs.senecac.on.ca/~scs/seneca-directions.html | | Parking: Paid parking is available on campus. The transit directions require Flash(tm) :-( It would be good if there was a map. I happen to have a paper map of York that I picked up recently. Not great, but it does show that Pond is not "just south of Steeles". Here's one I found on York's site: 40 is SEQ 87 and 84 look to be the closest public parking. What would I expect to pay for parking? Any wise words from those who've made the trek before? Hugh Redelmeier hugh-pmF8o41NoarQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org voice: +1 416 482-8253 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 23 21:18:41 2004 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:18:41 -0500 Subject: Got my feet wet - now getting cold feet. In-Reply-To: <20040222153056.GJ9627-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <003a01c3f756$7cace6a0$6501a8c0@JamesDell> <20040222153056.GJ9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20040223161841.0f31a30d.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Sun, 22 Feb 2004 10:30:56 -0500 Lennart Sorensen disseminated the following: > For vector object layout I am not sure. Maybe this?: http://www.sodipodi.com/ -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 16:16:49 up 18 days, 4:02, 7 users, load average: 0.01, 0.04, 0.22 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Linux 2.4.22-21mdk i686 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ "Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold..." -- William Butler Yeats -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rickl-ZACYGPecefkNbK0NzMECUg at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 23 21:33:01 2004 From: rickl-ZACYGPecefkNbK0NzMECUg at public.gmane.org (Rick Tomaschuk) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:33:01 -0500 Subject: TorontoNUI.ca - Real World Linux Discount In-Reply-To: References: <1077376624.800.13.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> Message-ID: <403A2B3D.5565.C64B7B@localhost> NUI Members RECEIVE 25% OFF ALL CONFERENCE FEES INCLUDING THE EARLY BIRD DISCOUNT Novell Users International (NUI) has evolved from the need for IT professionals to have an organization that keeps them up to date on rapid technological advances. Your local chapter and the NUI virtual community offer educational, networking and social events that help its members manage their careers, reap the benefits that come with being a trained professional in this highly specialized and complex field and have a little fun too! While we support Novell products we welcome other vendors speakers and content. http://www.TorontoNUI.ca Real World Linux 2004 Conference and Expo, April 13-15, 2004 at the Metro Toronto Convention Centre is the key event in Canada exclusively dedicated to Linux and Open Source Applications, Solutions and Hardware for Management and Technology professionals in enterprise, telecommunications, manufacturing, education, financial, SMB, government agencies, life sciences - - virtually all sectors. Computer technology is an integral part of the infrastructure in every business today. IT professionals and management are critically aware of the high costs of implementation, maintenance, upgrades and annual licensing fees. Today, Linux and Open Source systems offer a low cost viable alternative. Regards, Rick Tomaschuk President - Toronto Area Novell Users Group http://www.TorontoNUI.ca info-PE4J8xSbImWvmauoTqQZlQ at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 23 21:34:10 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:34:10 -0500 (EST) Subject: Fixed!! Re:Mail routing problem... In-Reply-To: <200402191146.32507.fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <4034E162.5080804@alteeve.com> <200402191146.32507.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: <35581.209.167.86.34.1077572050.squirrel@mail.alteeve.com> > On February 19, 2004 11:16 am, Madison Kelly wrote: > >> Sendmail). When I first wrote the DNS record to 'thelinuxexperience.com' >> I set 'mail.alteeve.com' as the first destination (my bad) and >> 'mail.thelinuxexperience.com' as the secondary mail server. A few days I >> fixed that and made 'mail.thelinuxexperience.com' the only mail server >> for TLE. > > I'm not sure what you mean by saying that mail.alteeve.com was a problem, > as > long as mail.alteeve.com resolves to the correct A record the name is > irrelevant. > > Here is one problem: > > fraser-74b65gqZ7FE at public.gmane.org% host -t mx thelinuxexperience.com > thelinuxexperience.com MX 10 mail.thelinuxexperience.com > !!! thelinuxexperience.com MX host mail.thelinuxexperience.com is not > canonical > > MX records should points to hosts that are A records, not CNAMEs. > > >> ----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors ----- >> >> >> ----- Transcript of session follows ----- >> 554 5.0.0 MX list for thelinuxexperience.com. points back to alteeve.com >> 554 5.3.5 Local configuration error > > It's possible that the CNAME problem is enough to cause this but I'm not > sure. > Have you made your mailserver aware that it is the mailserver for the new > domain. IIRC, sendmail wants you to list your local domains in a file > somewhere (look for sendmail.cw or local-host-names or something). The problem ended up being a combination of the CNAME DNS records and missing the domain for TLE in the sendmail.cf (and thus sendmail.mc) files. All fixed and working great now, Thanks very much!! Madison -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 23 22:28:07 2004 From: noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Noah John Gellner) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 17:28:07 -0500 Subject: slrn + screen for Japanese Message-ID: <20040223222807.GA20022@butters.southtrak> I am using slrn as my newsreader and I would like to read Japanese newsgroups. I am using ja_JP.UTF-8 for my LC_CTYPE. However, the Japanese newsgroups are not readable. I was unable to create ja_JP.SJIS or .EUC locales using localedef. If necessary, I am happy to switch newsreaders, but I cannot use X. -- Noah John Gellner J.D. Candidate (2006) University of Toronto Faculty of Law (416) 364-7550 noah.gellner_at_utoronto.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 23 22:36:42 2004 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 17:36:42 -0500 (EST) Subject: Feb 24th. NewTLUG meeting: drive or ride? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, 23 Feb 2004, D. Hugh Redelmeier wrote: > The transit directions require Flash(tm) :-( It looks to me like the optimal method is to take the 6:30 or 7:00 run of the #107 from Downsview... although of course, whether this is truly "optimal" depends on where you are starting from. :-) Henry -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 23 23:04:54 2004 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 18:04:54 -0500 Subject: slrn + screen for Japanese In-Reply-To: <20040223222807.GA20022-y6Pr2RmEDtN2c7wgCBzOK1pr/1R2p/CL@public.gmane.org> References: <20040223222807.GA20022@butters.southtrak> Message-ID: <20040223230454.GA4375@node1.opengeometry.net> On Mon, Feb 23, 2004 at 05:28:07PM -0500, Noah John Gellner wrote: > I am using slrn as my newsreader and I would like to read > Japanese newsgroups. > > I am using ja_JP.UTF-8 for my LC_CTYPE. However, the Japanese > newsgroups are not readable. > > I was unable to create ja_JP.SJIS or .EUC locales using localedef. > > If necessary, I am happy to switch newsreaders, but I cannot use X. If X is not an option, then it's very difficult (ie. no can do). You need "Japanese xterm" that can display multibyte codes. -- William Park, Open Geometry Consulting, Linux solution for data management and processing. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 23 23:14:01 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 17:14:01 -0600 Subject: I hate cookies Message-ID: <200402231714.01542.Garth@Webostics.com> Love those goodie rings but still hate cookies. Does anyone know of a site with a list of common cookie senders that can either be downloaded or copied then and there so I can edit my cookie file so I don't have to click "REFUSE ALL" all the time. Better yet would be a site that took advice or updates on even MORE unnecessary cookies and or certificates. tia -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 23 23:12:02 2004 From: blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Byron Sonne) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 18:12:02 -0500 Subject: Feb 24th. NewTLUG meeting: drive or ride? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <403A88C2.6030404@rogers.com> > It looks to me like the optimal method is to take the 6:30 or 7:00 run of > the #107 from Downsview... although of course, whether this is truly > "optimal" depends on where you are starting from. :-) Further to your 'optimal' comment ;) int TTC_ETA; char TIME_OF_DAY[10]; switch (TIME_OF_DAY) { case 'RUSH_HOUR': TTC_ETA = rand(); break; default: TTC_ETA = rand(); break; } Regards, Byron -- For Good, return Good. For Evil, return Justice. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 23 23:13:27 2004 From: blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Byron Sonne) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 18:13:27 -0500 Subject: I hate cookies In-Reply-To: <200402231714.01542.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200402231714.01542.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <403A8917.9030708@rogers.com> Check out privoxy: http://www.privoxy.org -- For Good, return Good. For Evil, return Justice. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Mon Feb 23 23:17:31 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 17:17:31 -0600 Subject: I hate cookies In-Reply-To: <200402231714.01542.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200402231714.01542.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <200402231717.32000.Garth@Webostics.com> I should be more precise. ONE for Linux that doesn't just block certain cookies and then REPORT them to the provider of the shareware later. Just a LIST and not a program. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 24 01:13:20 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 19:13:20 -0600 Subject: I hate cookies In-Reply-To: <403A8917.9030708-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200402231714.01542.Garth@Webostics.com> <403A8917.9030708@rogers.com> Message-ID: <200402231913.20081.Garth@Webostics.com> On Mon February 23 2004 5:13 pm, Byron Sonne wrote: > Check out privoxy: http://www.privoxy.org Thank you, I've had it installed every time I've installed but just never ran it because I've had to concentrate more on OTHER people's use of the web rather than my own. Silly how the little things can escape a person sometimes. : ) What I should have noticed but didn't notice in that regard is an actual TIME saving that I could have perhaps provided BETTER than I have until I undertake this particular little endeavor now. Thanks again. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From adb-tlug-AbAJl/g/NLXk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 24 02:14:53 2004 From: adb-tlug-AbAJl/g/NLXk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org (Anthony de Boer) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 21:14:53 -0500 Subject: NewTLUG - futher topic details for Tuesday's meeting In-Reply-To: ; from hgr-FjoMob2a1F7QT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org on Fri, Feb 20, 2004 at 12:17:41PM -0500 References: Message-ID: <20040223211453.G317@leftmind.net> Herb Richter wrote: > Surviving system upgrades, and even downgrades > Henry Spencer Is the paper available online anywhere? I'm not able to make tomorrow's meeting, and would still like to learn from Henry's experience. > His system was the first Usenet site in Canada (and the first outside the > US), ... I believe there was actually a site at BNR (Ottawa) on Usenet briefly before utzoo came online. However, Henry and utzoo are famous across Usenet and beyond. Trivia question: name the science fiction novel that has an allusion to utzoo!henry. -- Anthony de Boer -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 24 03:44:45 2004 From: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (Peter Hiscocks) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 22:44:45 -0500 Subject: Ride available to meeting Message-ID: <20040223224445.B9295@ee.ryerson.ca> I'm planning to attend the meeting tomorrow evening. If anyone needs a lift from the downtown area or en-route, I'd be pleased to help. Especially for (but not limited to) someone who knows where this is, and where the parking is. Peter -- Peter D. Hiscocks Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering Ryerson University, 350 Victoria Street, Toronto, Ontario, M5B 2K3, Canada Phone: (416) 979-5000 Ext 6109 Fax: (416) 979-5280 Email: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org URL: http://www.ee.ryerson.ca/~phiscock -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-HInyCGIudOg at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 24 04:20:13 2004 From: cbbrowne-HInyCGIudOg at public.gmane.org (cbbrowne-HInyCGIudOg at public.gmane.org) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 23:20:13 -0500 Subject: NewTLUG - futher topic details for Tuesday's meeting In-Reply-To: Message from Anthony de Boer of "Mon, 23 Feb 2004 21:14:53 EST." <20040223211453.G317-AbAJl/g/NLXk1uMJSBkQmQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040223211453.G317@leftmind.net> Message-ID: <20040224042014.609C53FCA@cbbrowne.com> > Trivia question: name the science fiction novel that has an allusion to > utzoo!henry. The best money, guessing, would be _A Fire Upon The Deep_, but that a guess; I'm not sure where it would fall... -- let name="cbbrowne" and tld="ntlug.org" in name ^ "@" ^ tld;; http://www3.sympatico.ca/cbbrowne/unix.html The first cup of coffee recapitulates phylogeny. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 24 05:02:40 2004 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 00:02:40 -0500 (EST) Subject: NewTLUG - futher topic details for Tuesday's meeting In-Reply-To: <20040223211453.G317-AbAJl/g/NLXk1uMJSBkQmQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040223211453.G317@leftmind.net> Message-ID: On Mon, 23 Feb 2004, Anthony de Boer wrote: > > Surviving system upgrades, and even downgrades > > Henry Spencer > > Is the paper available online anywhere? I'm not able to make tomorrow's > meeting, and would still like to learn from Henry's experience. First I would have to *write* a paper... :-) I might actually do that for the LISA conference. But not right away. > > His system was the first Usenet site in Canada (and the first outside the > > US), ... > > I believe there was actually a site at BNR (Ottawa) on Usenet briefly > before utzoo came online... Yes and no and kind of. I oversimplified. Yes, Ron Gomes's system at BNR Ottawa was getting Usenet traffic for a little while, before utzoo. However, as far as I know, nothing was ever posted from there... and at the time, the formal criterion for Usenet membership was posting a site announcement to NET.news.newsite (I think it was), so one can argue about whether that site really qualified. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rheaton-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 24 05:28:37 2004 From: rheaton-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Russ Heaton) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 00:28:37 -0500 Subject: RH 7.1 atd suddenly fails at startup...what happened? In-Reply-To: References: <20040223211453.G317@leftmind.net> Message-ID: <0nnl30hd2rnddgppt1hcl61rk4uonkulfg@4ax.com> Hi. I have a machine running Red Hat 7.1. The system had been running happily for at least a year, and then about 2 or 3 months ago, upon reboot, i get a message that atd failed... The upshot seems to be that this machine doesn't seem to have any network access any more. Any ideas of what happened and how to fix it? FYI. My level of knowledge is that I'm somewhere between 'newbie' and 'familiar' with Linux. Thanks, Russ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 24 06:10:41 2004 From: noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Noah John Gellner) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 01:10:41 -0500 Subject: RH 7.1 atd suddenly fails at startup...what happened? In-Reply-To: <0nnl30hd2rnddgppt1hcl61rk4uonkulfg-e09XROE/p8c@public.gmane.org> References: <20040223211453.G317@leftmind.net> <0nnl30hd2rnddgppt1hcl61rk4uonkulfg@4ax.com> Message-ID: <20040224061041.GA3625@butters.southtrak> atd is the at daemon, a scheduler that allows timed execution of commands. It is not clear to me how this would bork you install. Perhaps some more information would help. You might look at kernel log files or indeed run dmesg | less to read some of the start up messages. Does you machine boot now? An alternate plan is to boot using a cd-based distribution, like Knoppix. You can test your network connectivity, read logs, etc. On 00:28 Tue 24 Feb , Russ Heaton wrote: > Hi. > > I have a machine running Red Hat 7.1. The system had been > running happily for at least a year, and then about 2 or 3 months ago, > upon reboot, i get a message that atd failed... The upshot seems to be > that this machine doesn't seem to have any network access any more. > Any ideas of what happened and how to fix it? > > FYI. My level of knowledge is that I'm somewhere between 'newbie' and > 'familiar' with Linux. > > Thanks, Russ > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- Noah John Gellner J.D. Candidate (2006) University of Toronto Faculty of Law (416) 364-7550 noah.gellner_at_utoronto.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From shijialee-/E1597aS9LQAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 24 07:02:56 2004 From: shijialee-/E1597aS9LQAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (James) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 23:02:56 -0800 (PST) Subject: Feb 24th. NewTLUG meeting: drive or ride? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040224070256.4962.qmail@web40208.mail.yahoo.com> > The transit directions require Flash(tm) :-( > > It would be good if there was a map. I happen to have a paper map of > York that I picked up recently. Not great, but it does show that Pond > is not "just south of Steeles". Here's one I found on York's site: > > > 40 is SEQ > 87 and 84 look to be the closest public parking. i believe that 84 is still under construction. 87 and 86 would be your choices. > What would I expect to pay for parking? > > Any wise words from those who've made the trek before? for people who are going to take bus.. actually taking bus is quite convenience. you can take 196(which usually faster, 15 minutes) and 106 from downsview station. maximum would take you 25 minutes. then you ask the driver for a stop closer to seneca to get off. if you coming from Yong/Finch station, 60 bus is your choice (only take the 60 that goes to York or you may end up Finch West :) . once you are on campus, the map should be straightforward http://www.yorku.ca/yorkweb/maps/york2d/index.htm there are a lot buses coming in/out york, you won't take long even at 10pm. this will be my first TLUG meeting. Yikes ! Qiang __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard - Read only the mail you want. http://antispam.yahoo.com/tools -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jerome-mhXWc29+iYPyG1zEObXtfA at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 24 08:59:58 2004 From: jerome-mhXWc29+iYPyG1zEObXtfA at public.gmane.org (JM) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 16:59:58 +0800 Subject: Error on login.. Message-ID: <200402241659.58180.jerome@gmanmi.tv> After logging on to the server I dot this error.. malloc: subst.c:2563: assertion botched malloc: block on free list clobbered Stopping myself..[myacct-X6RhF4x9mZo at public.gmane.org] any idea what caused this error? im using RH9 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 24 12:28:20 2004 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:28:20 -0500 Subject: [OT-mask] Message-ID: <20040224122820.GA8604@my-wing> Greetings, I labelled this OT but it may be right on. An interesting phenomenon occurs when a Linux admin wannabe notices a winbox was compromised within a NATwork and replaces it a different flavor of winnibblets. I'm no astronaut, but this re-entry has been quite a ride. Bad guys often wear masks to hide their true identity. "I believe" the same is true with badguysonline. So my question is when if ever should there appear a 255 octet in a host address, and is it wise to do anything but DROP these? As I understand it, a packet sent to 192.168.1.255 will be seen by all hosts on the 192.168.1.0. As I understand it, 192.168.0.0/16 is non- routeable on the internet along with a few other reserved network blocks. I'd like to learn how this pertains to the wide area network. Here is just one example: 68.95.134.255 resolves to: adsl-68-95-134-255.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net thanks, farmer6re9 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 24 12:39:22 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:39:22 -0500 Subject: [OT-mask] In-Reply-To: <20040224122820.GA8604-B5vlSFeRxX4@public.gmane.org> References: <20040224122820.GA8604@my-wing> Message-ID: <403B45FA.9030900@alteeve.com> The highest IP in a network slice based on the IP given and it's subnet mask is indeed broadcast. IE, 192.168.0.255/24 is indeed broadcast but if the subnet mask was /25 then both 192.168.0.128 and 192.168.0.255 will be broadcast for their respective subnets. 192.168., 10. and 127. are reserved and are not routed to the net so you are right there. As for the rest of your question, could ask for clarity? I seem to be having trouble following the first part of your question. HTH! Madison Gregory D Hough wrote: > Greetings, > > I labelled this OT but it may be right on. An interesting phenomenon > occurs when a Linux admin wannabe notices a winbox was compromised > within a NATwork and replaces it a different flavor of winnibblets. I'm > no astronaut, but this re-entry has been quite a ride. > > Bad guys often wear masks to hide their true identity. "I believe" the > same is true with badguysonline. So my question is when if ever should > there appear a 255 octet in a host address, and is it wise to do > anything but DROP these? > > As I understand it, a packet sent to 192.168.1.255 will be seen by all > hosts on the 192.168.1.0. As I understand it, 192.168.0.0/16 is non- > routeable on the internet along with a few other reserved network > blocks. I'd like to learn how this pertains to the wide area network. > Here is just one example: > > 68.95.134.255 resolves to: > adsl-68-95-134-255.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net > > thanks, > farmer6re9 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 24 14:29:40 2004 From: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (Peter Hiscocks) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:29:40 -0500 Subject: Meeting time? Message-ID: <20040224092940.A27503@ee.ryerson.ca> Can someone confirm the meeting time this evening? I can't see it on the notices I have. Thanks - Peter -- Peter D. Hiscocks Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering Ryerson University, 350 Victoria Street, Toronto, Ontario, M5B 2K3, Canada Phone: (416) 979-5000 Ext 6109 Fax: (416) 979-5280 Email: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org URL: http://www.ee.ryerson.ca/~phiscock -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 24 14:40:09 2004 From: srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org (SRB) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:40:09 -0500 Subject: Meeting time? References: <20040224092940.A27503@ee.ryerson.ca> Message-ID: <003701c3fae4$28a86d40$3b0000c0@mastec.ca> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter Hiscocks" To: Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2004 9:29 AM Subject: [TLUG]: Meeting time? > > Can someone confirm the meeting time this evening? I can't see it on the > notices I have. > Thanks - > Peter > -- > Peter D. Hiscocks > Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering > Ryerson University, > 350 Victoria Street, > Toronto, Ontario, M5B 2K3, Canada > > Phone: (416) 979-5000 Ext 6109 > Fax: (416) 979-5280 > Email: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org > URL: http://www.ee.ryerson.ca/~phiscock > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml Here's the entire first message... says the meeting is from 7-10pm: This year we will be alternating meeting locations each month between IBM offices on Steeles Ave E., and Seneca College at the Seneca-0vOcVYEplY8 at public.gmane.org Campus. This month's NewTLUG meeting will be held Feb 24th., at Seneca College. more info below... Date: Tue, Feb 24, Time: 7 - 10pm Topics: 1) A strategy to back-out a system upgrade. by Henry Spencer Henry decided quite a while back that he was tired of maintaining the ability to upgrade. Now, instead, he maintains the ability to reinstall the system without disrupting user files or local customization, via a combination of careful filesystem layout and setup automation. To upgrade *or* downgrade, Henry simply does a fresh install of the desired system. This should be of interest not only to experienced users but to new Linux users for whom the Linux/Unix style filesystems and partitioning can be quite confusing and effective layout quite evasive. Further details to follow. 2) LaTeX and Lyx Introduction and Demo. by: Robert Searle Robert will give a detailed introduction to LaTeX and Lyx to show people that they can use great open source software other than web browsers and web servers. Outline: http://www.platinumarchitecturegroup.com/articles/linux/200.Latex/html/index.html Location: room 1208 (SEQ building) Seneca College SEQ building belongs to Seneca College and is a part of the Seneca-0vOcVYEplY8 at public.gmane.org Campus, which is physically located just south of York University, at Keele/Steeles. Directions: For detailed directions and info on public transit, please see: http://cs.senecac.on.ca/~scs/seneca-directions.html Parking: Paid parking is available on campus. --- Herb Richter Richter Equipment, Markham, Ontario http://PartsAndService.com http://PartsAndService.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-cOjNTMaGA5U at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 24 15:16:35 2004 From: linux-cOjNTMaGA5U at public.gmane.org (Ian Goldberg) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 10:16:35 -0500 Subject: [OT-mask] In-Reply-To: <20040224122820.GA8604-B5vlSFeRxX4@public.gmane.org> References: <20040224122820.GA8604@my-wing> Message-ID: <20040224151635.GP756@paip.net> On Tue, Feb 24, 2004 at 07:28:20AM -0500, Gregory D Hough wrote: > Bad guys often wear masks to hide their true identity. "I believe" the > same is true with badguysonline. So my question is when if ever should > there appear a 255 octet in a host address, and is it wise to do > anything but DROP these? A 255 is a perfectly valid address. > As I understand it, a packet sent to 192.168.1.255 will be seen by all > hosts on the 192.168.1.0. As I understand it, 192.168.0.0/16 is non- > routeable on the internet along with a few other reserved network > blocks. I'd like to learn how this pertains to the wide area network. > Here is just one example: > > 68.95.134.255 resolves to: > adsl-68-95-134-255.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net Right now, pinging this address works fine, and I don't get the multiple (DUP!) replies I would expect if it were a broadcast address [actually, I'd probably expect no reply at all, since broadcast pings are usually firewalled]. So I would bet that that network is a /20 or something like that, with: NETWORK=68.95.128.0 NETMASK=255.255.240.0 BROADCAST=68.95.143.255 [Note: 143 (10001111), not 134 (10000110)] and 68.95.134.255 is just an ordinary address on that network. - Ian -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 24 15:21:47 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:21:47 -0600 Subject: Error on login.. In-Reply-To: <200402241659.58180.jerome-mhXWc29+iYPyG1zEObXtfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200402241659.58180.jerome@gmanmi.tv> Message-ID: <200402240921.47318.Garth@Webostics.com> On Tue February 24 2004 2:59 am, JM wrote: > After logging on to the server I dot this error.. > > > malloc: subst.c:2563: assertion botched > > malloc: block on free list clobbered > > Stopping myself..[myacct-X6RhF4x9mZo at public.gmane.org] > > > any idea what caused this error? > > im using RH9 Sorry, going to have to give you a guesstimate here! Start with taking out memory and replacing it with different memory. Looks like you've got some bad RAM. Or if 2, then swap them one at a time to see blah blah blah. Then report back. : ) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 24 17:08:40 2004 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 12:08:40 -0500 (EST) Subject: NewTLUG - futher topic details for Tuesday's meeting In-Reply-To: <20040224042014.609C53FCA-xzRQuAxiFLNWk0Htik3J/w@public.gmane.org> References: <20040224042014.609C53FCA@cbbrowne.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 23 Feb 2004 cbbrowne-HInyCGIudOg at public.gmane.org wrote: > > Trivia question: name the science fiction novel that has an allusion to > > utzoo!henry. > > The best money, guessing, would be _A Fire Upon The Deep_... Yep. Actually, I'm told that *all* the future-Usenet characters in that book were based on real Usenet personalities, but the one based on me seems to be the only one people found easily recognizable. (And that's probably deliberate, since that was about the only one whose portrayal was really complimentary. Most of the others, if easily recognized, could be considered libelous...) Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From verbum-qazKcTl6WRFWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 24 19:16:24 2004 From: verbum-qazKcTl6WRFWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (verbum-qazKcTl6WRFWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 19:16:24 +0000 (UTC) Subject: uploaded 14,000-word essay: GNU/Linux, eco-activism parallels Message-ID: Here is a self-explanatory copy of mail I just sent to FSF and Mr Raymond. Tom = Tom Karmo ((COPY__FOR_TLUG)) Universal Coordinated Time (= UTC = EST+5 = EDT+4): 20040224T185428Z Dear Free Software Foundation (gnu-mXXj517/zsQ at public.gmane.org) (with cc to Eric S. Raymond = esr-4uCgticg2UFBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org, and with subsequent cc to Toronto Linux User Group listserv): I am a writer-editor and Debian GNU/Linux advocate, based in Toronto and sympathetic to the Catholic Worker tradition. I run a Web site at http://www.metascientia.com. I have written a long new essay, drawing parallels between GNU/Linux and biosphere conservation. The text incorporates hyperlinks to both http://www.gnu.org and http://www.catb.org/~esr. The essay is entitled 'No-Frills GNU/Linux: Philosophical Foundations'. You'll find it in the 'Literary' section of my http://www.metascientia.com. The exact URL is http://www.metascientia.com/PNNN____lit/SNEN____values.html. The content is open, under the GNU Free Documentation Lidense. The essay is described as follows in my site blurb: ((BLURB)) The first section, 'Taking Inventory: Frillies in the Biosphere' and the second, 'Taking Inventory: Frillies in Computing' together introduce the thesis that the problems we face in our deteriorating physical environment are paralleled by problems in the virtual space of software. - The grim thesis is taken a step further in the next section, 'Frillies, Tainter's Spiral, and Societal Collapse': so severe are our software problems that our situation is (not just uncomfortable, but, more radically) unstable, as the late Roman Empire was. - A ray of hope is first offered in a section entitled 'No-Frills GNU/Linux: A First Look', then put into the wider history-of-computing context in a section headed 'No-Frills GNU/Linux, Unix Permaculture, and Noosphere Conservation'. - The long final section, 'No-Frills GNU/ Linux in the Noosphere: Details from a Debian Implementation' explains in concrete terms, with many a screenshot, many a real-life example, how a permaculturist, deeply noosphere-green, computing philosophy may today be implemented. The essence of the long story, in essence a tour of the author's own workstation environment, is that we do well to avoid pointless software elaboration. We should, instead, harness within the X Window system the archaic power of the command-line interface. Robust contemporary incarnations of the 1980s glass teletype are lauded, notably in the context of a real-life Debian software-discovery scenario, essentially as lived in 2003 by the delighted author himself. The 14,000-word essay is respectfully dedicated to the Linux Users Group of Iraq (http:// linux-iraq.org/), a community working in difficult conditions for a worthy cause. ((/BLURB)) The FSF at http://www.gnu.org may conceivably wish to copy the essay in its entirety, to quote from it, or to link to it. It is not certain that you will wish to do such things, though, since the essay is rather more outspoken on biosphere conservation than is normal for writings in philosophy-of-GNU space, and in its technical parts is rather specific to Debian GNU/Linux. It is also mildly conceivable that Eric Raymond, at http://www.catb.org/~esr, will have some use for the essay. In the (unlikely) event that FSF has reservations regarding my philosphy, I'd be happy to hear them, so that I can do any necessary rethinking. Sincerely, (Dr) Toomas Karmo +1 416-971-6955 verbum-qazKcTl6WRFWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org http://www.metascientia.com ((/COPY__FOR_TLUG)) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lance-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 24 19:29:12 2004 From: lance-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Lance F. Squire) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 14:29:12 -0500 Subject: PgAccess Help Message-ID: <403BA608.6060702@alteeve.com> I've downloaded the latest version of PgAccess.bin and can't seem to get it to connect to my database in the localhost. The machine is running Fedora Core 1. Postgresql seems to be 7.3.4-RH. I've set tcpip_socket=true (and false) in postgresql.conf I've un-remed : local all all trust host all all 127.0.0.1. 255.255.255.255 trust and still no love connecting to template1 from pgaccess.bin psql works fine though.... What am I missing? Lance F. Squire -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From cbbrowne-HInyCGIudOg at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 24 22:19:09 2004 From: cbbrowne-HInyCGIudOg at public.gmane.org (Christopher Browne) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:19:09 -0500 Subject: SCO does something other than litigate Message-ID: <20040224221909.86948407B@cbbrowne.com> Incredible. They actually released something new. http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,4149,1531885,00.asp The Kitty choked on his spicy orange chicken when one diner said SCO had just announced delivery of its OpenServer Update Pack 2, which includes the object-relational database management system PostgreSQL. "I forgot they did anything other than litigate," Spence expectorated, following a successful Heimlich maneuver performed by his companions. There are ambiguous feelings amongst PostgreSQL developers about the merits of this announcement... -- let name="cbbrowne" and tld="cbbrowne.com" in String.concat "@" [name;tld];; http://cbbrowne.com/info/unix.html "Is your pencil Y2K certified? Do you know the possible effects if it isn't?" -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Tue Feb 24 23:09:16 2004 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 18:09:16 -0500 Subject: [OT-mask] In-Reply-To: <20040224122820.GA8604-B5vlSFeRxX4@public.gmane.org> References: <20040224122820.GA8604@my-wing> Message-ID: <403BD99C.2030009@rogers.com> Gregory D Hough wrote: > Greetings, > > I labelled this OT but it may be right on. An interesting phenomenon > occurs when a Linux admin wannabe notices a winbox was compromised > within a NATwork and replaces it a different flavor of winnibblets. I'm > no astronaut, but this re-entry has been quite a ride. > > Bad guys often wear masks to hide their true identity. "I believe" the > same is true with badguysonline. So my question is when if ever should > there appear a 255 octet in a host address, and is it wise to do > anything but DROP these? > > As I understand it, a packet sent to 192.168.1.255 will be seen by all > hosts on the 192.168.1.0. As I understand it, 192.168.0.0/16 is non- > routeable on the internet along with a few other reserved network > blocks. I'd like to learn how this pertains to the wide area network. > Here is just one example: > > 68.95.134.255 resolves to: > adsl-68-95-134-255.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net Perhaps I'm missing something here, but how does your example relate to your question? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 25 02:35:45 2004 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 21:35:45 -0500 (EST) Subject: [OT-mask] In-Reply-To: <403BD99C.2030009-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <20040224122820.GA8604@my-wing> <403BD99C.2030009@rogers.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 24 Feb 2004, James Knott wrote: > > 68.95.134.255 resolves to: > > adsl-68-95-134-255.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net > > Perhaps I'm missing something here, but how does your example relate to > your question? I think what Gregory is asking is could the address listed here be a normal host or it is definitely a broadcast address. As per Ian's answer, for any network larger than a /24 it is permissible to have host addresses with the last byte being 255 [1]. The highest address in the subnet will still be a broadcast address of course. Consider the network 192.168.10/23. This is a subnet containing 512 IPs of which 510 are usable. Now, we have: Network address: 192.168.10.0 Broadcast address: 192.168.11.255 Long netmask: 255.255.254.0 Short netmask: /23 The address 192.168.10.255 is a legitimate address for a host in this /23 network. I've just paraphrased here as this was covered in my recent talk. Those who missed the talk but have an interest here are recommended to lookup CIDR. There are plenty of CIDR tutorials online. Cheers, Rob -- Robert Brockway Senior Technical Consultant, OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Phone: 416-669-3073, Email: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org, http://www.opentrend.net OpenTrend Solutions: Reliable, secure solutions to real world problems. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From adb-tlug-AbAJl/g/NLXk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 25 13:33:21 2004 From: adb-tlug-AbAJl/g/NLXk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org (Anthony de Boer) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 08:33:21 -0500 Subject: [OT-mask] In-Reply-To: ; from rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A@public.gmane.org on Tue, Feb 24, 2004 at 09:35:45PM -0500 References: <20040224122820.GA8604@my-wing> <403BD99C.2030009@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20040225083321.O317@leftmind.net> Robert Brockway wrote: > for any network larger than a /24 it is permissible to have host addresses > with the last byte being 255 ... Note also that /32 routes (individual hosts, eg. for PPP or PPPoE connections and the like) can use every address in a block, including those ending in .0 or .255. The bottom line is that it's never ever valid to filter .255 or .0 addresses from other peoples' networks. Only the people who manage a particular network know if those addresses are in use or not. -- Anthony de Boer -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 25 14:38:52 2004 From: mr6re9-mI4xJ4qlgtBiLUuM0BA3LQ at public.gmane.org (Gregory D Hough) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 09:38:52 -0500 Subject: [OT-mask] In-Reply-To: <403B45FA.9030900-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org>; from linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org on Tue, Feb 24, 2004 at 07:39:22 -0500 References: <20040224122820.GA8604@my-wing> <403B45FA.9030900@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <20040225143852.GA15256@my-wing> Thanks Ya'll, I can see I'll need to learn more about CIDR notation. On 02/24/2004 07:39:22 AM, Madison Kelly wrote: > As > for the rest of your question, could ask for clarity? I seem to be > having trouble following the first part of your question. > > Madison > There weren't a first part, merely a cloudy, bereaved intro (see tail). Ian Goldberg wrote: > A 255 is a perfectly valid address. In this case I thought so, but wasn't absolutely sure. James Knott wrote: > Perhaps I'm missing something here, but how does your example relate > to your question? Bad guys often wear masks to hide their true identity. "I believe" the same is true with badguysonline. So my question is when if ever should there appear a 255 octet in a host address, and is it wise to do anything but DROP these? Assuming (as it were) that the example was a broadcast address (which it weren't), and I were to handle it with some form of REJECT (which I was hesitant to do myself); what could happen? --Ian explained: [quote] Right now, pinging this address works fine, and I don't get the multiple (DUP!) replies I would expect if it were a broadcast address [actually, I'd probably expect no reply at all, since broadcast pings are usually firewalled]. So I would bet that that network is a /20 or something Robert Brockway wrote: I think what Gregory is asking is could the address listed here be a normal host or it is definitely a broadcast address. As per Ian's answer, for any network larger than a /24 it is permissible to have host addresses with the last byte being 255 [1]. The highest address in the subnet will still be a broadcast address of course. Thanks for the clarification Rob, I wish I had heard your talk on this subject. OT banter follows...stop here if'n you have more important things to do. "badguysonline" -- I cannot define it any other way. I only know what I'm seeing directed at my obviously misconfigured network is not nice. It's not abnormal when one chooses to use the internet, to have one's machine(s) probed and prodded like average cattle. I accept that as a WAN fact. As a farmer though, it is my duty to protect my herd, not only from rustlers but from themselves as well. A wise rancher removes the potentially dangerous horns from his beasts that they not injure each other. It is also prudent to have a secure perimeter to keep the beasts in good pasture as they graze and chew their cud (read browse, blog and eat cookies). Maybe a little squid in the rudiment would help. What concerns me are not the random scans and probes for open ports running common services. I am worried about the coordinated "enumeration profiling"...for lack of a better term...directed at my address. I am not referring to any "afterglow" experienced for a short time after receiving a new dynamically assigned address. I am talking about specific traffic from a dozen or so creeps or perhaps one creep using a dozen or so IP's. I assume the creep(s) will not go away anytime soon, so I'm forced into doing more homework. This list has been very helpful to me in the last few years, for that I'm eternally grateful...I'm quite sure with your help and a little more effort on my part, I can hold the bandanna's at bay. The challenge for me however, is demonstrating in no uncertain terms, the Linux specific parameters being used to keep any future discussions On-Topic! Regards, farmer6re9 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lists-tZhE6lH4Esk+k03BA+Hq9g at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 25 22:28:39 2004 From: lists-tZhE6lH4Esk+k03BA+Hq9g at public.gmane.org (Oliver Meyn) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 17:28:39 -0500 Subject: PgAccess Help In-Reply-To: <403BA608.6060702-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <403BA608.6060702@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <1077748119.3777.5.camel@theconstruct.mineallmeyn.net> Hi Lance, On Tue, 2004-02-24 at 14:29, Lance F. Squire wrote: > I've downloaded the latest version of PgAccess.bin and can't seem to get > it to connect to my database in the localhost. I've had an on again off again relationship with pgaccess and I'm currently in an off again phase because after some upgrade or other it just quit, and after a bunch of aggravation I couldn't get it started again. I've been using phppgadmin in its place and it's been super, so I strongly recommend it. Cheers, Oliver -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 25 22:40:57 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 17:40:57 -0500 Subject: Sendmail won't send through MUA, help! Message-ID: <200402252241.i1PMevlb016742@srv1.alteeve.com> Hi all, Sorry for sounding like a desperate n00b but that is what I feel like right now. I had to rebuild my server today from RH7.3 to Fedora Core 1. I have spend the rest of the day since then trying to get SMTP to accept connections from user agents like Mozilla Mail. Well, actually I did have other problems but this is the one stumping me right now. Oh but wait, but she is sending us mail just now, isn't she? Well yes, I am able to send mail through the mail server... So long as I telnet into port 25 and DO IT MANUALLY!! :) Whenever the MUA tries to send mail it prompts me for a password which, though I know it is right, fails. Syslog records in '/var/log/maillog' this error: : unable to open Berkeley db /etc/sasldb2: No such file or directory : unable to open Berkeley db /etc/sasldb2: No such file or directory : no secret in database Now, I never had to worry about this before and given that I would like my users to NOT have to change their e-mail programs I would prefer to figure out a way to put things back as they were. Can anyone give me a hand here? By the way, I can -get- messages off of the server just fine. The problem is only in sending. Thanks!! Madison (ending her damn telnet session!) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 25 23:17:20 2004 From: sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org (Sidney Shapiro) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:17:20 -0500 Subject: Laptop Advice Message-ID: <1077751040.403d2d00cf7b0@webmail.ksmultimedia.com> Howdy all, I am looking for a laptop to use for school (essays and computer science) somthing good, with a built in wireless network card and a computer which will last. I am looking at spending about 1500-2000, any suggestions of where to look and who to buy from? Thanks, Sid ---------------------------------------------------------------- This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 25 23:23:52 2004 From: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (Peter Hiscocks) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:23:52 -0500 Subject: Laptop Advice In-Reply-To: <1077751040.403d2d00cf7b0-2RFepEojUI3cp3tO7ijp/+wE3QwKrvby@public.gmane.org>; from sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g@public.gmane.org on Wed, Feb 25, 2004 at 06:17:20PM -0500 References: <1077751040.403d2d00cf7b0@webmail.ksmultimedia.com> Message-ID: <20040225182352.A2213@ee.ryerson.ca> I've gotten 2 used laptops (a Toshiba and an IBM) from PCUsed at Dupont and Bathurst. I'd deal with them again. Peter On Wed, Feb 25, 2004 at 06:17:20PM -0500, Sidney Shapiro wrote: > Howdy all, I am looking for a laptop to use for school (essays and computer > science) somthing good, with a built in wireless network card and a computer > which will last. I am looking at spending about 1500-2000, any suggestions of > where to look and who to buy from? > > Thanks, > > Sid > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program. > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- Peter D. Hiscocks Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering Ryerson University, 350 Victoria Street, Toronto, Ontario, M5B 2K3, Canada Phone: (416) 979-5000 Ext 6109 Fax: (416) 979-5280 Email: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org URL: http://www.ee.ryerson.ca/~phiscock -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 25 23:31:56 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:31:56 -0500 Subject: Fixed! Re:Sendmail won't send through MUA, help! In-Reply-To: <200402252241.i1PMevlb016742-9lvgdUj7Un1L1Y7jC+g/Zg@public.gmane.org> References: <200402252241.i1PMevlb016742@srv1.alteeve.com> Message-ID: <403D306C.3020302@alteeve.com> Hi all, For the record, somewhere between RH7.3 and FC1, letting a user forward through SMTP began requiring: # saslpasswd2 -c Anywho, I'm back and in technicolor! (Or at least, my MUA is more than a darn terminal!) Madison linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org wrote: > Hi all, > > Sorry for sounding like a desperate n00b but that is what I feel like right now. > > I had to rebuild my server today from RH7.3 to Fedora Core 1. I have spend the rest of the day since then trying to get SMTP to accept connections from user agents like Mozilla Mail. Well, actually I did have other problems but this is the one stumping me right now. > > Oh but wait, but she is sending us mail just now, isn't she? > > Well yes, I am able to send mail through the mail server... So long as I telnet into port 25 and DO IT MANUALLY!! :) > > Whenever the MUA tries to send mail it prompts me for a password which, though I know it is right, fails. Syslog records in '/var/log/maillog' this error: > > > : unable to open Berkeley db /etc/sasldb2: No such file or directory > : unable to open Berkeley db /etc/sasldb2: No such file or directory > : no secret in database > > Now, I never had to worry about this before and given that I would like my users to NOT have to change their e-mail programs I would prefer to figure out a way to put things back as they were. Can anyone give me a hand here? > > By the way, I can -get- messages off of the server just fine. The problem is only in sending. > > Thanks!! > > Madison (ending her damn telnet session!) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 25 23:42:55 2004 From: taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:42:55 -0700 Subject: Laptop Advice In-Reply-To: <1077751040.403d2d00cf7b0-2RFepEojUI3cp3tO7ijp/+wE3QwKrvby@public.gmane.org> References: <1077751040.403d2d00cf7b0@webmail.ksmultimedia.com> Message-ID: <20040225234255.GA67192@idiom.novusordo.net> On Wed, Feb 25, 2004 at 06:17:20PM -0500, Sidney Shapiro wrote: > Howdy all, I am looking for a laptop to use for school (essays and computer > science) somthing good, with a built in wireless network card and a computer > which will last. I am looking at spending about 1500-2000, any suggestions of > where to look and who to buy from? You can get an iBook for under $2000. University bookstores get an educational discount, so they're probably your best bet. You can get your Word or Appleworks fix if LaTeX doesn't suit you, and all of your standard UNIX utils are handy for all your CS needs. The battery life is great on those boxen, as is the "don't need to dick around, it just works" nature is great, particularly when exams come around. You can always put Linux on it if OSX _really_ gets your goat. I tried it just to see, and it ran more smoothly than I would have expected... but still less smoothly than OSX. ;) -- taa A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. - Robert A. Heinlein /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rheaton-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 25 23:56:09 2004 From: rheaton-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Russ Heaton) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:56:09 -0500 Subject: RH 7.1 atd suddenly fails at startup...what happened? In-Reply-To: <20040224061041.GA3625-y6Pr2RmEDtN2c7wgCBzOK1pr/1R2p/CL@public.gmane.org> References: <20040223211453.G317@leftmind.net> <0nnl30hd2rnddgppt1hcl61rk4uonkulfg@4ax.com> <20040224061041.GA3625@butters.southtrak> Message-ID: Hi. I checked the logs and nothing seemed out of the ordinary, BUT while I was digging around for some info, I saw something that makes me pretty sure my system was compromised. ( see article at http://cns.utoronto.ca/~scan/expltool.txt ) Just to check i renamed the /dev/dsx and /dev/caca files and rebooted...now the system hangs after the message Remounting root filesystem in read-write mode: [OK] Perhaps I should open another thread about this problem. BTW, the network problems turned out to be unrelated to the atd problem and they're fixed, but as I said the real problem is that I can't boot anymore. Thanks, Russ On Tue, 24 Feb 2004 01:10:41 -0500, you wrote: >atd is the at daemon, a scheduler that allows timed execution of commands. It is not clear to me how this would bork you install. > >Perhaps some more information would help. You might look at kernel log files or indeed run dmesg | less to read some of the start up messages. > >Does you machine boot now? > >An alternate plan is to boot using a cd-based distribution, like Knoppix. You can test your network connectivity, read logs, etc. > > >On 00:28 Tue 24 Feb , Russ Heaton wrote: >> Hi. >> >> I have a machine running Red Hat 7.1. The system had been >> running happily for at least a year, and then about 2 or 3 months ago, >> upon reboot, i get a message that atd failed... The upshot seems to be >> that this machine doesn't seem to have any network access any more. >> Any ideas of what happened and how to fix it? >> >> FYI. My level of knowledge is that I'm somewhere between 'newbie' and >> 'familiar' with Linux. >> >> Thanks, Russ >> -- >> The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >> TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >> How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml >> > >-- >Noah John Gellner >J.D. Candidate (2006) >University of Toronto Faculty of Law >(416) 364-7550 >noah.gellner_at_utoronto.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-cOjNTMaGA5U at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 25 23:56:45 2004 From: linux-cOjNTMaGA5U at public.gmane.org (Ian Goldberg) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:56:45 -0500 Subject: Laptop Advice In-Reply-To: <20040225234255.GA67192-7r3UYZMxfuqyvPIx3LBjwNHuzzzSOjJt@public.gmane.org> References: <1077751040.403d2d00cf7b0@webmail.ksmultimedia.com> <20040225234255.GA67192@idiom.novusordo.net> Message-ID: <20040225235645.GU756@paip.net> On Wed, Feb 25, 2004 at 04:42:55PM -0700, Taavi Burns wrote: > On Wed, Feb 25, 2004 at 06:17:20PM -0500, Sidney Shapiro wrote: > > Howdy all, I am looking for a laptop to use for school (essays and computer > > science) somthing good, with a built in wireless network card and a computer > > which will last. I am looking at spending about 1500-2000, any suggestions of > > where to look and who to buy from? > > You can get an iBook for under $2000. University bookstores get an > educational discount, so they're probably your best bet. You can get > your Word or Appleworks fix if LaTeX doesn't suit you, and all of > your standard UNIX utils are handy for all your CS needs. The battery > life is great on those boxen, as is the "don't need to dick around, > it just works" nature is great, particularly when exams come around. > > You can always put Linux on it if OSX _really_ gets your goat. I tried > it just to see, and it ran more smoothly than I would have expected... > but still less smoothly than OSX. ;) Warning: having recently been in the same boat, we found that the wireless cards in the newer Mac laptops will *not* work under Linux. Since wireless is important to you, make sure you _don't_ get the models with the Airport Extreme card. (The older Airport (not Extreme) cards are reported to work fine.) Some other things, like VGA out, also don't work under Linux. - Ian -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From btraynor-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 00:15:20 2004 From: btraynor-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org (bill traynor) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:15:20 -0500 Subject: Laptop Advice In-Reply-To: <20040225234255.GA67192-7r3UYZMxfuqyvPIx3LBjwNHuzzzSOjJt@public.gmane.org> References: <1077751040.403d2d00cf7b0@webmail.ksmultimedia.com> <20040225234255.GA67192@idiom.novusordo.net> Message-ID: <1077754519.718.10.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> On Wed, 2004-02-25 at 18:42, Taavi Burns wrote: > On Wed, Feb 25, 2004 at 06:17:20PM -0500, Sidney Shapiro wrote: > > Howdy all, I am looking for a laptop to use for school (essays and computer > > science) somthing good, with a built in wireless network card and a computer > > which will last. I am looking at spending about 1500-2000, any suggestions of > > where to look and who to buy from? > > You can get an iBook for under $2000. University bookstores get an > educational discount, so they're probably your best bet. You can get > your Word or Appleworks fix if LaTeX doesn't suit you, and all of > your standard UNIX utils are handy for all your CS needs. The battery > life is great on those boxen, as is the "don't need to dick around, > it just works" nature is great, particularly when exams come around. > > You can always put Linux on it if OSX _really_ gets your goat. I tried > it just to see, and it ran more smoothly than I would have expected... > but still less smoothly than OSX. ;) I've had an iBook (G3 700Mhz) for a year and a half or so and unfortunately it sat on the shelf for 4 months. Around August 2003, the video went crazy, eventually fading to black. This happenned three months outside of the 12 month warranty and I didn't have Applecare which extends the warranty to 3 years. Through much collaboration with other sufferrers of the same problem on the Apple discussion boards as well as many nights troubleshooting hardware, it was discovered that the video chip solder points had loosened causing the chip to move. This resulted in over 3000 (I thik at last count) iBook users getting together to mount a class action lawsuit against Apple. Well, on Jan. 28th, Apple came clean and offerred a free logicboard replacement program to all iBook owners within a certain serial number range. This saga is actually still unfolding as replacement boards are now failing. For more info on this see www.blackcider.com Anyway, the moral of this story is that Apple portables are no more reliable than any other portables, regardless of what the marketin material may say. If I were to spend 1500-2000, I'd probably get the best used Thinkpad I could find. Cheers Bill -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 00:18:46 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:18:46 -0600 Subject: RH 7.1 atd suddenly fails at startup...what happened? In-Reply-To: References: <20040223211453.G317@leftmind.net> <20040224061041.GA3625@butters.southtrak> Message-ID: <200402251818.46882.Garth@Webostics.com> Are you familiar with "Rescue" and or rescue disks? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 00:16:50 2004 From: taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 17:16:50 -0700 Subject: Laptop Advice In-Reply-To: <20040225235645.GU756-cOjNTMaGA5U@public.gmane.org> References: <1077751040.403d2d00cf7b0@webmail.ksmultimedia.com> <20040225234255.GA67192@idiom.novusordo.net> <20040225235645.GU756@paip.net> Message-ID: <20040226001650.GC67192@idiom.novusordo.net> On Wed, Feb 25, 2004 at 06:56:45PM -0500, Ian Goldberg wrote: > > You can always put Linux on it if OSX _really_ gets your goat. I tried > > it just to see, and it ran more smoothly than I would have expected... > > but still less smoothly than OSX. ;) > > Warning: having recently been in the same boat, we found that the > wireless cards in the newer Mac laptops will *not* work under Linux. > Since wireless is important to you, make sure you _don't_ get the models > with the Airport Extreme card. (The older Airport (not Extreme) cards > are reported to work fine.) Good point, and one that I'd entirely forgotten as my PowerBook has an older 11MBps AirPort card. Broadcomm are a bunch of wankers it seems. My curiosity is piqued by this article, though: http://www.experts-exchange.com/Operating_Systems/Macintosh/Q_20801546.html As of kernel 2.6.3 there is MiniPCI Aironet 350 support in the mainline, though it requires older firmware revisions to work as far as I know. The card works fine with the newer driver in my Thinkpad under Linux. I'd want to be triple-sure that you can put one of these Cisco cards into the laptop, though. The IBM laptops will only accept certain wireless cards due to FCC regulations (they will NOT boot without a card the BIOS is happy with). > Some other things, like VGA out, also don't work under Linux. Never tried. Then again, I have yet to get spanning to work on my Thinkpad either. ;) (I'm pretty sure it's an obscure configuration issue, though, by the behaviour I get; it acts like it understands the nature of the hardware) -- taa A touchstone to determine the actual worth of an "intellectual"--find out how he feels about astrology. - Robert A. Heinlein /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 00:19:59 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:19:59 -0600 Subject: Laptop Advice In-Reply-To: <1077751040.403d2d00cf7b0-2RFepEojUI3cp3tO7ijp/+wE3QwKrvby@public.gmane.org> References: <1077751040.403d2d00cf7b0@webmail.ksmultimedia.com> Message-ID: <200402251819.59761.Garth@Webostics.com> And I'm glad that hardware support popped up. I have absolutely NO CLUE as to Linux and a MAC. : ) I didn't think you were going to be MAC'ing it though. : ) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 00:18:55 2004 From: taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 17:18:55 -0700 Subject: Laptop Advice In-Reply-To: <1077754519.718.10.camel-W1ecohOu015D6NYMwsFkEdAWLNoT+7d/@public.gmane.org> References: <1077751040.403d2d00cf7b0@webmail.ksmultimedia.com> <20040225234255.GA67192@idiom.novusordo.net> <1077754519.718.10.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> Message-ID: <20040226001855.GD67192@idiom.novusordo.net> On Wed, Feb 25, 2004 at 07:15:20PM -0500, bill traynor wrote: > Anyway, the moral of this story is that Apple portables are no more > reliable than any other portables, regardless of what the marketin > material may say. Everyone's fallen victim to the "we can make it cheap in vast quantity!" bug, and quality has lost. :| > If I were to spend 1500-2000, I'd probably get the best used Thinkpad I > could find. Macs and Thinkpads are both nice (I have at many horror stories about BOTH). :) -- taa A woman is not property and husbands who think otherwise are living in a dream world. - Robert A. Heinlein /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From btraynor-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 00:37:44 2004 From: btraynor-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org (bill traynor) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:37:44 -0500 Subject: Laptop Advice In-Reply-To: <200402251819.59761.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <1077751040.403d2d00cf7b0@webmail.ksmultimedia.com> <200402251819.59761.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <1077755864.718.14.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> On Wed, 2004-02-25 at 19:19, Garth Meisel wrote: > And I'm glad that hardware support popped up. I have absolutely NO CLUE as to > Linux and a MAC. : ) I didn't think you were going to be MAC'ing it though. > : ) For what it's worth, YellowDog Linux is a Mac specific distribution that works great. Similarly, I've run Debian on my iBook and it worked great as well (with a little nudge of course). And the debian-powerpc mailing list is extremely active. I believe many other distributions have a PPC version, such as Mandrake and Suse, etc. > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 01:41:18 2004 From: sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org (Sidney Shapiro) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:41:18 -0500 Subject: Laptop Advice In-Reply-To: <1077755864.718.14.camel-W1ecohOu015D6NYMwsFkEdAWLNoT+7d/@public.gmane.org> References: <1077755864.718.14.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> Message-ID: <013101c3fc09$a4c73610$6401a8c0@main> Thank you so much for the good advice guys! Has anyone had any experience with eMachines or Systemax? A friend sent me over to http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applications/Category/category_tlc.asp?CatId=1 7&SRCCODE=CANWG001>se=goog>kw=laptop and while they look great (from a price perspective) I don't know if they are going to fall apart or whatever. I have had some pretty horrific experiences with emachine desktop systems at clients, and while the cheapest things around, you certainly get what you pay for. I would like to get the most bang for the buck, and prioritize a larger hard drive and faster processor over a wxga screen and other "gamer" bells and whistles. I will also check out pcused, I have delt with macused, I think they are the same guys. Thanks again for your wonderful help guys, Sid -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 01:43:53 2004 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:43:53 -0500 Subject: I hate cookies In-Reply-To: <200402231717.32000.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200402231714.01542.Garth@Webostics.com> <200402231717.32000.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <20040226014353.GA8579@m450> On Mon, Feb 23, 2004 at 05:17:31PM -0600, Garth Meisel wrote > I should be more precise. ONE for Linux that doesn't just block > certain cookies and then REPORT them to the provider of the shareware > later. Just a LIST and not a program. With all due respect, I think you're doing it backwards, Mozilla FireFox and the big Mozilla both allow you to specify sites from which you accept cookies. Since this list is going to be much smaller than the entire web, it's easier to maintain. It is also "fail safe", i.e. if you don't specify a site, it doesn't get to add/delete/modify/read cookies. -- Walter Dnes Email users are divided into two classes; 1) Those who have effective spam-blocking 2) Those who wish they did -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 01:55:38 2004 From: sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org (Sidney Shapiro) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:55:38 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing Message-ID: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> One of my clients in Toronto got the following email today (slightly edited) Hello, *** has received a letter from Columbia Pictures. They have provided us with a log detailing illegally shared copyrighted material from an *** customer using IP *** on February 23. The complaint points to an IP assigned to your network. Please be aware that sharing copyrighted material is illegal according to the Digital Millennium Copyright Act. Also, according to *** AUP, it is not acceptable to use *** for purposes which are illegal. Please remove or stop sharing this material immediately. Any further complaints concerning illegal activities that lead back to your IP may result in termination of your account. Here is a portion of the complaint forwarded to us by Columbia Pictures, including the file name and time stamp in GMT. Title: 50 First Dates Infringement Source: BitTorrent Initial Infringement Timestamp: 23 Feb 2004 22:41:34 GMT Recent Infringment Timestamp: 23 Feb 2004 22:41:34 GMT Infringer Username: Infringing Filename: New.50.First.Dates.SVCD.TS-TCR.CD2.mpg Infringing Filesize: 820262772 Infringers IP Address: *** Infringers DNS Name: *** Infringing URL: ***/New.50.First.Dates.SVCD.TS-TCR.CD2.mpg Notice ID: *** Thank you I have been only following this on the periphery, I was told by my client that this is the first step before they start suing Canadians. Anyone know if this is scaremongering or are they actually going to start going after Canadians? Sid -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 02:20:06 2004 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:20:06 -0500 Subject: Laptop Advice In-Reply-To: <1077751040.403d2d00cf7b0-2RFepEojUI3cp3tO7ijp/+wE3QwKrvby@public.gmane.org> References: <1077751040.403d2d00cf7b0@webmail.ksmultimedia.com> Message-ID: <403D57D6.9050309@rogers.com> Sidney Shapiro wrote: > Howdy all, I am looking for a laptop to use for school (essays and computer > science) somthing good, with a built in wireless network card and a computer > which will last. I am looking at spending about 1500-2000, any suggestions of > where to look and who to buy from? IBM ThinkPads tend to work well with Linux. I haven an R31, running SuSE 9 and previously Red Hat 7.3. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 02:29:14 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:29:14 -0600 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0-UxDKcUsq0RM@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> Message-ID: <200402252029.14569.Garth@Webostics.com> 24.72.21.249 or 24.72.21.250 Let the games begin! IMHO, last time I checked, US cannot do dick with a Canadian in civil court unless the Canadian is stupid enough to visit the STATE making the claim. The same goes vice versa. I'm not a lawyer and most certainly not a lover of bandwidth pigs or children that don't understand the difference between a B and a b. Nevertheless, this is something that the ISP's MUST take care of with a quota instead of OTHER entities trying to make examples or better put "Get blood from a stone." My favorite and by far BEST quality ISP (wireless to boot) was Image Wireless out of Yorkton SK and they had a 5 Gig quota/month. My normal usage AFTER hosting and email services averaged under 50 Megs/month but I obviously DON'T run Windoze. Nor do I care about MP3's, videos, nor should I. It's the children and or Windoze users by majority without a doubt that are not using computers and bandwidth properly. Mostly because they either don't understand or don't care. That's what M$ brought upon the web world with their attempted monopoly of the web and their outragous prices for software that is not guaranteed in the least and worse yet, charged for when it comes to fixing what should have worked in the first place. All reasons which are unacceptable and can be remedied with either education of the bandwidth abusers OR monetary payment for their carelessness. I am fully behind a quota system for home users. If 5 Gigs/month isn't enough for even M$ users, then they obviously need to seek a better system. SOHO can get by fine with 5 Gigs/month too unless the SOHO is mismanaged and supports M$ desktops again with irresponsible users. WE are all paying for the web. And I'm surprised that this is the first time THIS topic has come up. At least since I've been here. We have it pretty damn good in CA. Most of the states WISH they'd even have a shot at cable modems even if it cost them $100 USD/month. Just imagine what happens when the biggest Internet country in the world begins to hand out STATIC IP's instead of crappy DHCP assigned IP's and THEY begin to catch up with us ISP wise. IPV6 is not going to help us then either now is it. What can we do to really help? No troll bait intended! -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 02:31:51 2004 From: reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (rh) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:31:51 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <200402252029.14569.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <200402252029.14569.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:29:14 -0600 Garth Meisel wrote: > 24.72.21.249 or 24.72.21.250 > > Let the games begin! > > IMHO, last time I checked, US cannot do dick with a Canadian in civil > court unless the Canadian is stupid enough to visit the STATE making > the claim. I think you will find that most major movie companies have a Canadian head office and one if it's functions is to 'hold' it's copyrights in this country...so yes, they can do dick. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 02:36:59 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:36:59 -0600 Subject: I hate cookies In-Reply-To: <20040226014353.GA8579-Mb8sf/rG248@public.gmane.org> References: <200402231714.01542.Garth@Webostics.com> <200402231717.32000.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040226014353.GA8579@m450> Message-ID: <200402252036.59939.Garth@Webostics.com> > With all due respect, I think you're doing it backwards, Mozilla > FireFox and the big Mozilla both allow you to specify sites from which > you accept cookies. Since this list is going to be much smaller than > the entire web, it's easier to maintain. It is also "fail safe", i.e. > if you don't specify a site, it doesn't get to add/delete/modify/read > cookies. Thanks, that's indeed a good point. Konqueror has that same ability as does the dreaded IE too, but obviously we do it MUCH better. I surf the web, and I'm not always sure when I need to WANT a cookie to save me typing and I'm not always sure when I KNOW exactly what the cookie entails until I rip it to it's recipe. The thing that this answer doesn't do for me is that I don't know where I'm going so how can I pre-allow a cookie from a site, if you know what I mean. Sure, we all do our computer banking, and maybe some of you even have a Hotmail address because you don't run your own email server with all the help given for Linux email servers. There's probably at least 5 wanted cookies for every one of us. But that's where my line is drawn. I may eventually find another site where I SHOP alot at or something to that effect but I was speaking more of the constantly ignorant HTML programmers that want to get as much possible information as possible without OFFERING anything in return. See, I should have been more precise in my question but you've definitely helped me refine the question. Thank you Walter. Your point is without doubt valid : ) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 02:40:09 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:40:09 -0600 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <200402252029.14569.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <200402252040.09919.Garth@Webostics.com> > I think you will find that most major movie companies have a Canadian > head office and one if it's functions is to 'hold' it's copyrights in > this country...so yes, they can do dick. Then all I can say is "That's a good point and I'm glad you mentioned it." I'm lucky I don't have to worry about it and hope others take heed to the original message because those dirty Bastions are trying to take simple normal unknowing people to the cleaners and ruining lives in the process. Let's be careful and I suppose thankful for private p2p's that we can trust! -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From legrady-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 02:40:19 2004 From: legrady-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Tom Legrady) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:40:19 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <200402252029.14569.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> Not with the DMCA they can't. Is that a federal law or a provincial law? Tom rh wrote: >On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:29:14 -0600 >Garth Meisel wrote: > > > >>24.72.21.249 or 24.72.21.250 >> >>Let the games begin! >> >>IMHO, last time I checked, US cannot do dick with a Canadian in civil >>court unless the Canadian is stupid enough to visit the STATE making >>the claim. >> >> > >I think you will find that most major movie companies have a Canadian >head office and one if it's functions is to 'hold' it's copyrights in >this country...so yes, they can do dick. >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 02:46:23 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:46:23 -0600 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <200402252040.09919.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <200402252040.09919.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <200402252046.23110.Garth@Webostics.com> And we ALL know they're blowing it way out of proportion. I went grocery shopping yesterday and got a free DVD of Monkey Trouble (1 of 4 choices like The Mask or Cinderella etc) in a damn box of Fruit Loops that cost only $3.98 so we do have alternative sources to help us if something that crazy does happen right? Kids wanted Cinderella but hey, I'm the one that had to pay for it, not them right? : ) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 02:46:50 2004 From: noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Noah John Gellner) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:46:50 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <200402252029.14569.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <20040226024650.GA27183@butters.southtrak> In fact companies do not need to hold a copyright in Canada or wait for you to unwittingly come to their state. The Ontario rules for civil procedure address the issue of jurisdiction as does the case law. Basically, so long as hearing the case in Ontario makes sense, the courts will do so. So while plaintiffs cannot forum shop to sue where it is most convenient to them, they are certainly entitled to sue a copyright infringer where the infringment is taking place. In fact the courts are more like to support hearing the case in Ontario because that is where the the evidence is and that is where the defendant is. The party most inconvenienced by the venue is the American company who wants to sue, and the court will not worry about their convenience. On 21:31 Wed 25 Feb , rh wrote: > On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:29:14 -0600 > Garth Meisel wrote: > > Let the games begin! > > > > IMHO, last time I checked, US cannot do dick with a Canadian in civil > > court unless the Canadian is stupid enough to visit the STATE making > > the claim. > > I think you will find that most major movie companies have a Canadian > head office and one if it's functions is to 'hold' it's copyrights in > this country...so yes, they can do dick. > -- -- Noah John Gellner J.D. Candidate (2006) University of Toronto Faculty of Law (416) 364-7550 noah.gellner_at_utoronto.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 03:09:54 2004 From: reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (rh) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 22:09:54 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <403D5C93.5080600-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <200402252029.14569.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:40:19 -0500 Tom Legrady wrote: > Not with the DMCA they can't. Is that a federal law or a provincial > law? > Any copyright infringement that I have had dealings with are Federal charges. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 03:12:06 2004 From: reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (rh) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 22:12:06 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <20040226024650.GA27183-y6Pr2RmEDtN2c7wgCBzOK1pr/1R2p/CL@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <200402252029.14569.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <20040226024650.GA27183@butters.southtrak> Message-ID: <20040225221206.512b8510.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:46:50 -0500 Noah John Gellner wrote: > In fact companies do not need to hold a copyright in Canada or wait > for you to unwittingly come to their state. > Not being a lawyer, I can't answer on copyright issues in general but I do know that the movie industry do have offices here and one of their 'functions' is holding copyright to their product here in Canada. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 03:24:40 2004 From: noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Noah John Gellner) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 22:24:40 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <200402252029.14569.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <20040226032440.GC27183@butters.southtrak> I assume by Federal you are referring to the US Federal government? What experiences have you had with the DMCA? It is a frightening piece of legislation in my opinion. On 22:09 Wed 25 Feb , rh wrote: > On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:40:19 -0500 > Tom Legrady wrote: > > > Not with the DMCA they can't. Is that a federal law or a provincial > > law? > > > > Any copyright infringement that I have had dealings with are Federal > charges. > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- Noah John Gellner J.D. Candidate (2006) University of Toronto Faculty of Law (416) 364-7550 noah.gellner_at_utoronto.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From legrady-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 03:30:45 2004 From: legrady-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Tom Legrady) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 22:30:45 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <200402252029.14569.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <403D6865.3070000@rogers.com> But DMCA is not a Canadian law, it is a foreign statute. In France you are not allowed to sell Nazi paraphenalia. Canada ignores French law. In the US, you are bound by the DMCA. In Canada, neither DMCA nor UnAmerican activities are against the law. rh wrote: >On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:40:19 -0500 >Tom Legrady wrote: > > > >>Not with the DMCA they can't. Is that a federal law or a provincial >>law? >> >> >> > >Any copyright infringement that I have had dealings with are Federal >charges. >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From c.f.a.johnson-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 03:47:52 2004 From: c.f.a.johnson-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Chris F.A. Johnson) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 22:47:52 -0500 (EST) Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <403D6865.3070000-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <200402252029.14569.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6865.3070000@rogers.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 25 Feb 2004, Tom Legrady wrote: > But DMCA is not a Canadian law, it is a foreign statute. > > In France you are not allowed to sell Nazi paraphenalia. Canada ignores > French law. > > In the US, you are bound by the DMCA. In Canada, neither DMCA nor > UnAmerican activities are against the law. Most countries, including Canada, have agreements to uphold foreign copyrights. I don't know whether it is upheld on the same basis as domestic copyright, or on the law in the foreign country. IOW, it is not inconceivable that Canada could enforce the DMCA. -- Chris F.A. Johnson ================================================================= cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org http://cfaj.freeshell.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 03:51:46 2004 From: reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (rh) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 22:51:46 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <403D6865.3070000-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <200402252029.14569.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6865.3070000@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20040225225146.43ac5689.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 22:30:45 -0500 Tom Legrady wrote: > But DMCA is not a Canadian law, it is a foreign statute. > I realize that. Canada is not that backard a nation that it does not have it's own copyright laws. And they are the Federal charges that I was referring to in my previous post. > In France you are not allowed to sell Nazi paraphenalia. Canada > ignores French law. > > In the US, you are bound by the DMCA. In Canada, neither DMCA nor > UnAmerican activities are against the law. > > rh wrote: > > >On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:40:19 -0500 > >Tom Legrady wrote: > > > > > > > >>Not with the DMCA they can't. Is that a federal law or a provincial > >>law? > >> > >> > >> > > > >Any copyright infringement that I have had dealings with are Federal > >charges. > >-- > >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > > > > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 03:57:07 2004 From: noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Noah John Gellner) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 22:57:07 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <403D6865.3070000-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <200402252029.14569.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6865.3070000@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20040226035707.GE27183@butters.southtrak> First it is important to distinguish between criminal and civil law. My understanding is that if, for example, a Canadian breaks a criminal law of another country while in Canada, that person would need to be extradited to face trial. In the case of the Nazi paraphenalia, imagine a Canadian company that had a mail order business to France. Further consider a Canadian who solicits a contract killing in the United States. I don't know enough about how Criminal law works in these cases to suggest what the outcomes would be but in both examples, the Canadian would be breaking the criminal law of another country and one would imagine that there is some mechanism to catch these types of offences. Otherwise there would be a free pass to many crimes. However, the lawsuits involving p2p are not criminal, they are civil and different rules apply. Civil cases are the cases that involve one party suing another. Typically the aim is to win monetary compensation for an injury or loss. In civil cases the courts in Ontario have a test that they apply to see which location is suitable for the case. I don't have the cite handy, but they have explicitly said that they would enforce the laws of outside jurisdictions whether that jursidiction be B.C. or Kentucky. When I was learning it, it struck me as weird, but this is the way it is. sorry for the excess verbiage. On 22:30 Wed 25 Feb , Tom Legrady wrote: > But DMCA is not a Canadian law, it is a foreign statute. > > In France you are not allowed to sell Nazi paraphenalia. Canada ignores > French law. > > In the US, you are bound by the DMCA. In Canada, neither DMCA nor > UnAmerican activities are against the law. > -- Noah John Gellner J.D. Candidate (2006) University of Toronto Faculty of Law (416) 364-7550 noah.gellner_at_utoronto.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From legrady-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 04:02:02 2004 From: legrady-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Tom Legrady) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 23:02:02 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <20040225225146.43ac5689.reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <200402252029.14569.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6865.3070000@rogers.com> <20040225225146.43ac5689.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <403D6FBA.1020505@rogers.com> But the letter from Columbia Pictures threatens: "Please be aware that sharing copyrighted material is illegal according to the Digital Millennium Copyright Act." rh wrote: >Tom Legrady wrote: > > >>But DMCA is not a Canadian law, it is a foreign statute. >> >> >I realize that. Canada is not that backard a nation that it does not >have it's own copyright laws. And they are the Federal charges that I >was referring to in my previous post > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 04:07:39 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 22:07:39 -0600 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <403D6FBA.1020505-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <20040225225146.43ac5689.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6FBA.1020505@rogers.com> Message-ID: <200402252207.39449.Garth@Webostics.com> No excess taken. Not sure if this fits in here guys but isn't it Finland or Iceland or Switzerland or somewhere near there that now owns and controls/runs our good old Direct Connect now known as NEOMODUS.com. Not the fake NEO-MODUS with the hyphen that tried to play the domain game. They are the ones you're talking about. And it's gaining them great massive profit just by us speaking of the them even here in this "hmmmm.......how private? forum." They are at present above and or without law. The time will come when something will change that. What, I don't know, nor do I care. But so long as those a___holes aren't trying to ruin any of our trivial lives, works for me. I suppose if either of our gov's could do something besides constant commercials of kids being picked up by the ears with huge tongs, they would. I just keep hoping it's more of an actual scare tactic than anything else. I understand it, but I don't appreciate who or how they're doing it. Goodnight. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 04:19:39 2004 From: reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (rh) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 23:19:39 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <20040226035707.GE27183-y6Pr2RmEDtN2c7wgCBzOK1pr/1R2p/CL@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <200402252029.14569.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6865.3070000@rogers.com> <20040226035707.GE27183@butters.southtrak> Message-ID: <20040225231939.060a670e.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 22:57:07 -0500 Noah John Gellner wrote: > First it is important to distinguish between criminal and civil law. > My understanding is that if, for example, a Canadian breaks a criminal > law of another country while in Canada, that person would need to be > extradited to face trial. In the case of the Nazi paraphenalia, > imagine a Canadian company that had a mail order business to France. > Further consider a Canadian who solicits a contract killing in the > United States. I don't know enough about how Criminal law works in > these cases to suggest what the outcomes would be but in both > examples, the Canadian would be breaking the criminal law of another > country and one would imagine that there is some mechanism to catch > these types of offences. Otherwise there would be a free pass to many > crimes. IMHO, I can't imagine the paraphenalia czar would be extraditable. As for the 'solicits a contract killing', that guy may be and if he isn't, I am sure his participation would be an offence here and hence, he could be prosecuted here. Plus, certain crimes committed elswhere can be prosecuted here even though they occurred in other countries. > However, the lawsuits involving p2p are not criminal, they are civil > and different rules apply. Civil cases are the cases that involve one > party suing another. Typically the aim is to win monetary compensation > for an injury or loss. > > In civil cases the courts in Ontario have a test that they apply to > see which location is suitable for the case. I don't have the cite > handy, but they have explicitly said that they would enforce the laws > of outside jurisdictions whether that jursidiction be B.C. or > Kentucky. When I was learning it, it struck me as weird, but this is > the way it is. Civil law is indeed odd and I can certainly imagine that the above is true. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 04:34:49 2004 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 23:34:49 -0500 (EST) Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <403D6FBA.1020505-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <403D6FBA.1020505@rogers.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 25 Feb 2004, Tom Legrady wrote: > But the letter from Columbia Pictures threatens: > "Please be aware that sharing copyrighted material is illegal > according to the Digital Millennium Copyright Act." That is, however, not the *only* relevant law. The DMCA makes some particularly odious rules, and is probably enforceable only in the US... but copying copyrighted material without permission, except for specific legitimate purposes like backups, is copyright violation in almost any country, including Canada. It sounds like Columbia has forgotten to revise their Threatening Letter to match Canadian law, but that doesn't mean they can't make trouble for you here. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 07:09:39 2004 From: marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Marcus Brubaker) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 02:09:39 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <403D5C93.5080600-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <200402252029.14569.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> Message-ID: <1077779378.1609.4.camel@rincewind.discworld> The DMCA is a federal law I believe. On Wed, 2004-02-25 at 21:40, Tom Legrady wrote: > Not with the DMCA they can't. Is that a federal law or a provincial law? > > Tom > > rh wrote: > > >On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:29:14 -0600 > >Garth Meisel wrote: > > > > > > > >>24.72.21.249 or 24.72.21.250 > >> > >>Let the games begin! > >> > >>IMHO, last time I checked, US cannot do dick with a Canadian in civil > >>court unless the Canadian is stupid enough to visit the STATE making > >>the claim. > >> > >> > > > >I think you will find that most major movie companies have a Canadian > >head office and one if it's functions is to 'hold' it's copyrights in > >this country...so yes, they can do dick. > >-- > >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > > > > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- Marcus Brubaker -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 07:12:10 2004 From: marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Marcus Brubaker) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 02:12:10 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <403D6865.3070000-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <200402252029.14569.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6865.3070000@rogers.com> Message-ID: <1077779530.1609.7.camel@rincewind.discworld> True, but hope you never have to get routed through the US on a foreign trip or you're screwed. See the case of the Russian guy who got arrested under the DMCA when he went to the US for a conference. He reverse engineered Adobe's e-Book format to make it accessible for blind people. On Wed, 2004-02-25 at 22:30, Tom Legrady wrote: > But DMCA is not a Canadian law, it is a foreign statute. > > In France you are not allowed to sell Nazi paraphenalia. Canada ignores > French law. > > In the US, you are bound by the DMCA. In Canada, neither DMCA nor > UnAmerican activities are against the law. > > rh wrote: > > >On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:40:19 -0500 > >Tom Legrady wrote: > > > > > > > >>Not with the DMCA they can't. Is that a federal law or a provincial > >>law? > >> > >> > >> > > > >Any copyright infringement that I have had dealings with are Federal > >charges. > >-- > >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > > > > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- Marcus Brubaker -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 07:12:41 2004 From: marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Marcus Brubaker) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 02:12:41 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <200402252029.14569.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6865.3070000@rogers.com> Message-ID: <1077779561.1609.9.camel@rincewind.discworld> On Wed, 2004-02-25 at 22:47, Chris F.A. Johnson wrote: > On Wed, 25 Feb 2004, Tom Legrady wrote: > > > But DMCA is not a Canadian law, it is a foreign statute. > > > > In France you are not allowed to sell Nazi paraphenalia. Canada ignores > > French law. > > > > In the US, you are bound by the DMCA. In Canada, neither DMCA nor > > UnAmerican activities are against the law. > > Most countries, including Canada, have agreements to uphold > foreign copyrights. I don't know whether it is upheld on the same > basis as domestic copyright, or on the law in the foreign > country. > > IOW, it is not inconceivable that Canada could enforce the DMCA. If nothing else they might be able to extradite you to the US. -- Marcus Brubaker -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 07:14:07 2004 From: marcus.brubaker-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Marcus Brubaker) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 02:14:07 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <403D6FBA.1020505-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <200402252029.14569.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6865.3070000@rogers.com> <20040225225146.43ac5689.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6FBA.1020505@rogers.com> Message-ID: <1077779646.1609.11.camel@rincewind.discworld> It's an automatically generated form email sent out to a lot of people, irregardless of country or nationality. They'll worry with those details later. On Wed, 2004-02-25 at 23:02, Tom Legrady wrote: > But the letter from Columbia Pictures threatens: > > "Please be aware that sharing copyrighted material is illegal > according to the Digital Millennium Copyright Act." > > > rh wrote: > > >Tom Legrady wrote: > > > > > >>But DMCA is not a Canadian law, it is a foreign statute. > >> > >> > >I realize that. Canada is not that backard a nation that it does not > >have it's own copyright laws. And they are the Federal charges that I > >was referring to in my previous post > > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- Marcus Brubaker -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 08:14:58 2004 From: lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org (Lloyd Budd) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 03:14:58 -0500 Subject: [OT-mask] In-Reply-To: <20040225143852.GA15256-B5vlSFeRxX4@public.gmane.org> References: <20040224122820.GA8604@my-wing> <403B45FA.9030900@alteeve.com> <20040225143852.GA15256@my-wing> Message-ID: On 25-Feb-04, at 9:38, Gregory D Hough wrote: > The challenge for me however, is demonstrating in no uncertain terms, > the Linux specific parameters being used to keep any future > discussions On-Topic! Or maybe it is writing in articulate English :-p -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rheaton-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 11:43:17 2004 From: rheaton-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Russ Heaton) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 06:43:17 -0500 Subject: RH 7.1 atd suddenly fails at startup...what happened? In-Reply-To: <200402251818.46882.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040223211453.G317@leftmind.net> <20040224061041.GA3625@butters.southtrak> <200402251818.46882.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: Yep. done. What a hassle though. I accidentally threw out disc 1 of my RH 7.1 install set that was inside a dead CD drive, so I had to locate and download an ISO image from the Internet. Anyway I used that in rescue mode and renamed those two files back to what they originally were and now the system boots. Whew, what a relief. So now, how do I get rid of that virus/trojan or whatever it is? Thanks, Russ On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:18:46 -0600, you wrote: >Are you familiar with "Rescue" and or rescue disks? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 12:55:31 2004 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 07:55:31 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <1077779561.1609.9.camel-eTg7c9BlEq95hrpxxnI5yFifK/mc/01a@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <200402252029.14569.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6865.3070000@rogers.com> <1077779561.1609.9.camel@rincewind.discworld> Message-ID: <20040226075531.32227520.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 02:12:41 -0500 Marcus Brubaker disseminated the following: > If nothing else they might be able to extradite you to the US. Good luck. Clayton Ruby, the CCLU, and the EFF would be banging on your door to represent you. Heck, this would be one easy way to get your '15 minutes'. There are courts, and then there are courts. The court of public opinion, as far as I've seen (polls, surveys, etc.), in Canada is decidedly anti-American of late. Anyway, these arrogant American bastages probably wouldn't have much more luck in Canadian courts than the Canadian recording industry has had in the past few weeks. Of course, I in no way condone the unauthorized copying and distribution of IP, but this has been blown waaaaay out of proportion. Traditionally, sharing of copyrighted material, as far as the law is concerned in Canada, is somewhere around a parking ticket in terms of its legal priority, and that's the way it should be. To the Media industry in general: 'adapt or die'. -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 07:38:22 up 20 days, 19:23, 6 users, load average: 1.34, 1.23, 1.14 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Linux 2.4.22-21mdk i686 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Proprietary Software Licenses: Duping a person into making a vow of ignorance and then selling them the fruits of knowledge is like making them believe they benefit from having their head held under water while someone sells them oxygen. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 14:47:05 2004 From: lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org (Lloyd Budd) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 09:47:05 -0500 Subject: GPL ? what does it mean ? , the name that is. Message-ID: I imagine that many of us are familiar with the documented origin of the GNU General Public License (GPL) but where does the name come from? Was "general" a common term in licenses then? It does seem that general (, generally) was part of What about "public"? Where "public licenses" common? Any insights are appreciated, Thank you, Lloyd -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 16:19:36 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 10:19:36 -0600 Subject: RH 7.1 atd suddenly fails at startup...what happened? In-Reply-To: References: <20040223211453.G317@leftmind.net> <200402251818.46882.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <200402261019.36254.Garth@Webostics.com> > So now, how do I get rid of that virus/trojan or whatever it is? I'm willing to be you don't have one. Which FS(s) are you using and is it a dual boot system. If so, which FS for the other? The partition system would be helpful too. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 16:38:41 2004 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 11:38:41 -0500 (EST) Subject: [OT-mask] In-Reply-To: <20040225143852.GA15256-B5vlSFeRxX4@public.gmane.org> References: <20040224122820.GA8604@my-wing> <403B45FA.9030900@alteeve.com> <20040225143852.GA15256@my-wing> Message-ID: On Wed, 25 Feb 2004, Gregory D Hough wrote: > OT banter follows...stop here if'n you have more important things to > do. I did but I read ahead anyway :) > WAN fact. As a farmer though, it is my duty to protect my herd, not > only from rustlers but from themselves as well. A wise rancher removes > the potentially dangerous horns from his beasts that they not injure > each other. It is also prudent to have a secure perimeter to keep the Back in my home country we make extensive use of the electric fence. Not harmful to people or animals but gives enough of a jolt for both to stay away. A quick tip: If you want to see if a fence is electrified (it should have a sign nearby) touch it with the back of your hand not the palm of your hand. Batter yet, don't touch it at all :) > beasts in good pasture as they graze and chew their cud (read browse, > blog and eat cookies). Maybe a little squid in the rudiment would help. I think a squid would looke funny in a field :) > What concerns me are not the random scans and probes for open ports > running common services. I am worried about the coordinated > "enumeration profiling"...for lack of a better term...directed at my IMHO there has been a distinct reduction in human initiated attacks in recent years. Automated attacks are very common, but not very effective, they look only for specific vulnerabilities. I'm not sure why this reduction has occured, maybe because penalties are now beeng applied to those caught breaking into systems. > address. I am not referring to any "afterglow" experienced for a short > time after receiving a new dynamically assigned address. I am talking > about specific traffic from a dozen or so creeps or perhaps one creep > using a dozen or so IP's. I assume the creep(s) will not go away > anytime soon, so I'm forced into doing more homework. A concerted attack against you is unlikely unless the baddies believe you have something they really want. My suggestions: Build & _maintain_ a good firewall. Only allow the traffic in that you need to allow in. Block the rest[1]. Keep your system security patched. Keep an eye out on security advisories, Monitor your firewall logs and consider running something like snort if appropriate. If you do these things you are far better off than 99.99% of all Internet users. [1] Be careful to allow needed ICMP types through. Cheers, Rob -- Robert Brockway Senior Technical Consultant, OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Phone: 416-669-3073, Email: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org, http://www.opentrend.net OpenTrend Solutions: Reliable, secure solutions to real world problems. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 11:50:08 2004 From: skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ at public.gmane.org (Sergey Kuznetsov) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 11:50:08 +0000 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <200402261150.08591.skuznets@blueprint.org> On February 26, 2004 03:09 am, rh wrote: > On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:40:19 -0500 > > Tom Legrady wrote: > > Not with the DMCA they can't. Is that a federal law or a provincial > > law? > > Any copyright infringement that I have had dealings with are Federal > charges. AFAIK, downloading is the gray area, because of government tax to recordable matrices. It means if you buying matrices you already paying to sound and video production companies. Therefore you can download music and movies for yourself and make copies to friends, but you can't share it for uploading. And at the same time, the part of the encoded movie file means nothing, because you cannot see it without previous parts. Here is my two cents to the piggy bank =) -- All the Best! Sergey Kuznetsov Senior Software Developer Blueprint Initiative at Samuel Lunenfeld Research Institute Mount Sinai Hospital 522 University Street Phone#: (416) 596-8505 x6343 E-Mail: skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From aitken-BwLjziHGQLusTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 17:08:02 2004 From: aitken-BwLjziHGQLusTnJN9+BGXg at public.gmane.org (Chris Aitken) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 12:08:02 -0500 Subject: multimedia linux guru for a day Message-ID: <403E27F2.8521D997@onlink.net> I need to hire a multimedia linux guru for a day (or two). I am starting my own business. I want to use non-proprietary software. Every turn I take seems to lead me back into the arms of the beast. I started with a dual-boot system so I could use W98 to run ProTools ? so I boot to W98 when I want to record music, and use linux for everything else. Then I got tired of rebooting, so I installed Vmware and a W98 vm. But it?s too tempting when I hit a snag (cups printing stops working, I don?t have time to get sound working in linux, etc.) to just reboot to W98. I love mucking around with linux, but I?m finding I don?t have the time to get everything working on the system under linux. What I?m thinking is to hire a multimedia linux guru for a day to help me get sound working in linux (for multitrack recording), get wineX installed and working (in case I can?t find a non-proprietary music notation application), set up the cd-burner to burn CDs, the scanner scanning, and an application from which I could design/print business cards and pamphlets, printing (probably cups), and a business suite in which I can cut & paste between apps ? like inserting a spreadsheet into a document. Obviously I?ll want to see all this working before I let you go. And I want to understand how we get there ? not every command entered but at least to the level of ?before we can install this app we need to run this command to see what libraries we need, download the libraries, untar them and install with rpm. ? I don?t want to be helpless when I take the system back to Timmins and hit a snag. My sytem is an Acer desktop w ASUS A7V-E socket A via KT133 m/b, 256 MB SDRAM 168pin DIMM memory/133 Major, ATI XPERT98 8MB video AGP, 3D PCI sound card 32 bit/4.1, AMD Duron 800 MHz CPU, two 20 GB IDE HDs. It?s in a full tower ? lots of free bays in case, for instance, we find that there is absolutley no support for my external cd-burner and we have to get an internal cd-burner and install it. All of this we would need to do on one (or two) of the days in March Break as that is when I?ll be in Toronto. I would want to pay enough so that we both feel a responsibility to get the job done. I?ve had mixed results hiring people on this list ? most have worked very hard for very little but a couple couldn?t complete the job. I don?t have a secret bankroller and my original cashflow forecast had nothing for software/hardware so I have to keep this cost down. I would prefer this to be done during one or two days, not an hour or two here and there at night/weekends. I would love someone like Lennart who?s knowledgable and patient. I only mention him as an example ? I wouldn?t presume that I could afford him, that he is available or that he would be interested ? or that knowledgable as he is that he would be able to do all of this. Respond privately if you like, but if your initial response is public I?ll feel a little more comfortable. Sincerely, Chris Aitken -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 17:15:12 2004 From: noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Noah John Gellner) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 12:15:12 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <200402261150.08591.skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <200402261150.08591.skuznets@blueprint.org> Message-ID: <20040226171512.GA31083@butters.southtrak> The only gray area is with respect to downloading music. A person who downloads copyrighted movies or software commits an offence under Canadian law. On 11:50 Thu 26 Feb , Sergey Kuznetsov wrote: > uploading. And at the same time, the part of the encoded movie file means > nothing, because you cannot see it without previous parts. > > Here is my two cents to the piggy bank =) > -- Noah John Gellner J.D. Candidate (2006) University of Toronto Faculty of Law (416) 364-7550 noah.gellner_at_utoronto.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 17:12:28 2004 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 12:12:28 -0500 Subject: RH 7.1 atd suddenly fails at startup...what happened? In-Reply-To: <200402261019.36254.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040223211453.G317@leftmind.net> <200402261019.36254.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <200402261212.28397.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> On Thursday 26 February 2004 11:19, Garth Meisel wrote: > > > > So now, how do I get rid of that virus/trojan or whatever it is? > > > > I'm willing to be you don't have one. Huh??? /dev/caca and /dev/dsx certainly aren't standard fare on Redhat (or any other Linux) installs. You could run chkrootkit or some other trojan finders (?) from rescue media (Knoppix would be perfect). Finding all the bugs is an interesting exercise. IMO, the ultimate (and only) solution is to reinstall from scratch. You can reasonably safely keep/backup your data (/home and /var) but you should look through that carefully as well. See http://www.cert.org/tech_tips/win-UNIX-system_compromise.html for some tips. To the OP; do not reinstall using Redhat 7.1. Install using an up-to-date distribution that is maintainable/upgradeable. I am a rabid Debian advocate but you're free to explore the lesser alternatives ;-) -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 17:29:51 2004 From: noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Noah John Gellner) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 12:29:51 -0500 Subject: RH 7.1 atd suddenly fails at startup...what happened? In-Reply-To: <200402261212.28397.fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <20040223211453.G317@leftmind.net> <200402261019.36254.Garth@Webostics.com> <200402261212.28397.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: <20040226172951.GB31083@butters.southtrak> For excellent upgradeability and maintainability both Debian and Gentoo are sweet. I use Gentoo for my server but dabble in Debian. I find Redhat hard to upgrade and to tweak. On 12:12 Thu 26 Feb , Fraser Campbell wrote: > To the OP; do not reinstall using Redhat 7.1. Install using an up-to-date > distribution that is maintainable/upgradeable. I am a rabid Debian advocate > but you're free to explore the lesser alternatives ;-) -- Noah John Gellner J.D. Candidate (2006) University of Toronto Faculty of Law (416) 364-7550 noah.gellner_at_utoronto.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 17:38:45 2004 From: blsonne-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Byron Sonne) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 12:38:45 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <20040226171512.GA31083-y6Pr2RmEDtN2c7wgCBzOK1pr/1R2p/CL@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <200402261150.08591.skuznets@blueprint.org> <20040226171512.GA31083@butters.southtrak> Message-ID: <403E2F25.5070602@rogers.com> I've noticed in your sig that you are a "J.D. Candidate". I have no idea what that means, could you explain? Kinda handy having a lawyer on the list! :) -- For Good, return Good. For Evil, return Justice. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 18:00:56 2004 From: noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Noah John Gellner) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 13:00:56 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <403E2F25.5070602-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <200402261150.08591.skuznets@blueprint.org> <20040226171512.GA31083@butters.southtrak> <403E2F25.5070602@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20040226180056.GC31083@butters.southtrak> JD what the U of T calls its law degree. Most other Canadian schools call it an LLB. It is a JD in the US. Stands for Juris Doctor. I am still a law student, but I am keenly interested in privacy and IP issues particulary with respect to Linux and Open Source. On 12:38 Thu 26 Feb , Byron Sonne wrote: > I've noticed in your sig that you are a "J.D. Candidate". I have no idea > what that means, could you explain? > > Kinda handy having a lawyer on the list! :) > -- Noah John Gellner J.D. Candidate (2006) University of Toronto Faculty of Law (416) 364-7550 noah.gellner_at_utoronto.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 18:20:50 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 12:20:50 -0600 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <1077779530.1609.7.camel-eTg7c9BlEq95hrpxxnI5yFifK/mc/01a@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <403D6865.3070000@rogers.com> <1077779530.1609.7.camel@rincewind.discworld> Message-ID: <200402261220.50178.Garth@Webostics.com> On Thu February 26 2004 1:12 am, Marcus Brubaker wrote: > True, but hope you never have to get routed through the US on a foreign > trip or you're screwed. Exactly my point earlier, and I'm glad you brought this up. Especially NOW that air travel passenger manifests are so tight. It is my expectation that there is nothing illegal about someone in the right position in the US (or elsewhere for that matter) that has a bone to pick with whomever to find that their plane is going to be grounded while in "their" air space and then it's over. Sure, the plane gets some free fuel and gets airborne again quickly but I feel sorry for the guy/girl that thought they were on a "No-stop" fare. For copying some MP3's or even M$ latest advanced server edition, I doubt it. But I think it all depends on the person with the bone to pick. A collar is a collar and setting precedent in the courts of the world is surely the best thing any law motivated "person" can do in their lifetime. Unless they set more precedence! -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From wmcgilvery-6d3DWWOeJtE at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 18:54:31 2004 From: wmcgilvery-6d3DWWOeJtE at public.gmane.org (Wil McGilvery) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 13:54:31 -0500 Subject: I can't resist Message-ID: <65B7B304AA3DE147BBD33938FE204E288A16F0@lynchmail.lynch.msft> Need a good laugh? Here is an article in which MS claims that hackers only exploit vulnerabilities after the patch is released. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/3485972.stm So why release patches at all? Then they wouldn't have to worry about their security! ;) Regards, Wil McGilvery Manager Lynch Digital Media Inc 416-744-7949 416-716-3964 (cell) 1-866-314-4678 416-744-0406? FAX www.LynchDigital.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From c.f.a.johnson-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 19:26:30 2004 From: c.f.a.johnson-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Chris F.A. Johnson) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 14:26:30 -0500 (EST) Subject: I can't resist In-Reply-To: <65B7B304AA3DE147BBD33938FE204E288A16F0-49iW0tF5bQXl9+zcyUE9hx1TMoFmMu2o@public.gmane.org> References: <65B7B304AA3DE147BBD33938FE204E288A16F0@lynchmail.lynch.msft> Message-ID: On Thu, 26 Feb 2004, Wil McGilvery wrote: > Need a good laugh? > > Here is an article in which MS claims that hackers only exploit > vulnerabilities after the patch is released. > > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/3485972.stm > > So why release patches at all? Then they wouldn't have to worry > about their security! ;) The end of the article says it all: "Almost all attacks against our software are against the legacy systems," he said. "If you want more secure software, upgrade." ("said by David Aucsmith, who is in charge of technology at Microsoft's security business and technology unit.") -- Chris F.A. Johnson ================================================================= cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org http://cfaj.freeshell.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 19:30:26 2004 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 14:30:26 -0500 Subject: I can't resist In-Reply-To: <65B7B304AA3DE147BBD33938FE204E288A16F0-49iW0tF5bQXl9+zcyUE9hx1TMoFmMu2o@public.gmane.org> References: <65B7B304AA3DE147BBD33938FE204E288A16F0@lynchmail.lynch.msft> Message-ID: <200402261430.26977.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> On Thursday 26 February 2004 13:54, Wil McGilvery wrote: > Need a good laugh? > > Here is an article in which MS claims that hackers only exploit > vulnerabilities after the patch is released. > > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/3485972.stm On the day that a worm is released to destroy systems rather than to just annoy, what will be their spin? Any bets on the placement of blame? Here are my top choices: - the open source people did it - the security community is to blame - Bin Laden did it - I did it (since after all I suggested it here!) I don't find stuff like this amusing anymore. Microsoft is the most pathetic and sad subject in the computing industry (SCO is close). -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 21:05:46 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 16:05:46 -0500 Subject: Apache/moved web page question Message-ID: <403E5FAA.5020803@alteeve.com> Hi all, I have recently migrated my website which was in a user account to a proper domain using Apache as the web server. I have the site up now under the new domain and in a new directory and I would like to remove the old website entirely. I have a redirect page on the index.html but the problem is anyone with a bookmark to a deeper page will get a 404 error if I just remove the rest. Is there anyway to tell Apache to forward to a single html file any request at all for a page in the user's website? I am on Apache2 now, as well. Thanks as always! Madison -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From wmcgilvery-6d3DWWOeJtE at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 21:14:29 2004 From: wmcgilvery-6d3DWWOeJtE at public.gmane.org (Wil McGilvery) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 16:14:29 -0500 Subject: Apache/moved web page question Message-ID: <65B7B304AA3DE147BBD33938FE204E28904DC2@lynchmail.lynch.msft> You can do this using htaccess. Here is a link. http://www.stanford.edu/leland/redirect.html Regards, Wil McGilvery Manager Lynch Digital Media Inc 416-744-7949 416-716-3964 (cell) 1-866-314-4678 416-744-0406? FAX www.LynchDigital.com -----Original Message----- From: Madison Kelly [mailto:linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org] Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2004 4:06 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: [TLUG]: Apache/moved web page question Hi all, I have recently migrated my website which was in a user account to a proper domain using Apache as the web server. I have the site up now under the new domain and in a new directory and I would like to remove the old website entirely. I have a redirect page on the index.html but the problem is anyone with a bookmark to a deeper page will get a 404 error if I just remove the rest. Is there anyway to tell Apache to forward to a single html file any request at all for a page in the user's website? I am on Apache2 now, as well. Thanks as always! Madison -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 21:29:30 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 16:29:30 -0500 Subject: multimedia linux guru for a day In-Reply-To: <403E27F2.8521D997-BwLjziHGQLusTnJN9+BGXg@public.gmane.org> References: <403E27F2.8521D997@onlink.net> Message-ID: <20040226212929.GL9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Feb 26, 2004 at 12:08:02PM -0500, Chris Aitken wrote: > I need to hire a multimedia linux guru for a day (or two). I am > starting my own business. I want to use non-proprietary software. Every > turn I take seems to lead me back into the arms of the beast. I started > with a dual-boot system so I could use W98 to run ProTools ? so I boot > to W98 when I want to record music, and use linux for everything else. > Then I got tired of rebooting, so I installed Vmware and a W98 vm. But > it?s too tempting when I hit a snag (cups printing stops working, I > don?t have time to get sound working in linux, etc.) to just reboot to > W98. I love mucking around with linux, but I?m finding I don?t have the > time to get everything working on the system under linux. > > What I?m thinking is to hire a multimedia linux guru for a day to help > me get sound working in linux (for multitrack recording), get wineX > installed and working (in case I can?t find a non-proprietary music > notation application), set up the cd-burner to burn CDs, the scanner > scanning, and an application from which I could design/print business > cards and pamphlets, printing (probably cups), and a business suite in > which I can cut & paste between apps ? like inserting a spreadsheet into > a document. Obviously I?ll want to see all this working before I let you > go. And I want to understand how we get there ? not every command > entered but at least to the level of ?before we can install this app we > need to run this command to see what libraries we need, download the > libraries, untar them and install with rpm. ? I don?t want to be > helpless when I take the system back to Timmins and hit a snag. > > My sytem is an Acer desktop w ASUS A7V-E socket A via KT133 m/b, 256 MB > SDRAM 168pin DIMM memory/133 Major, ATI XPERT98 8MB video AGP, 3D PCI > sound card 32 bit/4.1, AMD Duron 800 MHz CPU, two 20 GB IDE HDs. It?s in > a full tower ? lots of free bays in case, for instance, we find that > there is absolutley no support for my external cd-burner and we have to > get an internal cd-burner and install it. > > All of this we would need to do on one (or two) of the days in March > Break as that is when I?ll be in Toronto. I would want to pay enough so > that we both feel a responsibility to get the job done. I?ve had mixed > results hiring people on this list ? most have worked very hard for very > little but a couple couldn?t complete the job. I don?t have a secret > bankroller and my original cashflow forecast had nothing for > software/hardware so I have to keep this cost down. I would prefer this > to be done during one or two days, not an hour or two here and there at > night/weekends. I would love someone like Lennart who?s knowledgable and > patient. I only mention him as an example ? I wouldn?t presume that I > could afford him, that he is available or that he would be interested ? > or that knowledgable as he is that he would be able to do all of this. > > Respond privately if you like, but if your initial response is public > I?ll feel a little more comfortable. Well I am currently unemployed after the previous company I was at got bought, and have been trying to find Linux contracts to work on (they seem hard to find at the moment). I guess that means I am available for doing such things. Hardware looks pretty decent, except for the who knows what sound card. :) Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 21:31:38 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 16:31:38 -0500 Subject: Apache/moved web page question In-Reply-To: <403E5FAA.5020803-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <403E5FAA.5020803@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <20040226213138.GM9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Feb 26, 2004 at 04:05:46PM -0500, Madison Kelly wrote: > I have recently migrated my website which was in a user account to a > proper domain using Apache as the web server. I have the site up now > under the new domain and in a new directory and I would like to remove > the old website entirely. I have a redirect page on the index.html but > the problem is anyone with a bookmark to a deeper page will get a 404 > error if I just remove the rest. > > Is there anyway to tell Apache to forward to a single html file any > request at all for a page in the user's website? I am on Apache2 now, as > well. > > Thanks as always! A custom 404 handler script could do it. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 21:35:15 2004 From: taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 14:35:15 -0700 Subject: Apache/moved web page question In-Reply-To: <20040226213138.GM9627-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <403E5FAA.5020803@alteeve.com> <20040226213138.GM9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20040226213515.GA4367@idiom.novusordo.net> On Thu, Feb 26, 2004 at 04:31:38PM -0500, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > A custom 404 handler script could do it. But a more proper way might be to configure Apache to return a 301. http://www.w3.org/Protocols/rfc2616/rfc2616-sec10.html -- taa An Elephant; a Mouse built to government specifications. - Robert A. Heinlein /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 21:39:02 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 16:39:02 -0500 Subject: Apache/moved web page question In-Reply-To: <65B7B304AA3DE147BBD33938FE204E28904DC2-49iW0tF5bQXl9+zcyUE9hx1TMoFmMu2o@public.gmane.org> References: <65B7B304AA3DE147BBD33938FE204E28904DC2@lynchmail.lynch.msft> Message-ID: <403E6776.7030607@alteeve.com> That worked like a charm, thank you! Madison Wil McGilvery wrote: > You can do this using htaccess. > > Here is a link. > > http://www.stanford.edu/leland/redirect.html > > > Regards, > > Wil McGilvery > Manager > Lynch Digital Media Inc > > > > 416-744-7949 > 416-716-3964 (cell) > 1-866-314-4678 > 416-744-0406 FAX > www.LynchDigital.com > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Madison Kelly [mailto:linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org] > Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2004 4:06 PM > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: [TLUG]: Apache/moved web page question > > Hi all, > > I have recently migrated my website which was in a user account to a > proper domain using Apache as the web server. I have the site up now > under the new domain and in a new directory and I would like to remove > the old website entirely. I have a redirect page on the index.html but > the problem is anyone with a bookmark to a deeper page will get a 404 > error if I just remove the rest. > > Is there anyway to tell Apache to forward to a single html file any > request at all for a page in the user's website? I am on Apache2 now, as > well. > > Thanks as always! > > Madison -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 21:47:02 2004 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 16:47:02 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <20040226171512.GA31083-y6Pr2RmEDtN2c7wgCBzOK1pr/1R2p/CL@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <200402261150.08591.skuznets@blueprint.org> <20040226171512.GA31083@butters.southtrak> Message-ID: <20040226164702.18dbb792.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 12:15:12 -0500 Noah John Gellner disseminated the following: > A person who downloads copyrighted movies or software commits an offence under > Canadian law. That's a *criminal* offense? I was under the impression that copyright cases were strictly under the civil process. -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 16:46:05 up 21 days, 4:30, 7 users, load average: 0.02, 0.07, 0.03 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Linux 2.4.22-21mdk i686 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Rule #2 (John Gilmore): "The Net interprets censorship as damage and routes around it." -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 22:21:52 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:21:52 -0500 Subject: Apache/moved web page question In-Reply-To: <20040226213515.GA4367-7r3UYZMxfuqyvPIx3LBjwNHuzzzSOjJt@public.gmane.org> References: <403E5FAA.5020803@alteeve.com> <20040226213138.GM9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20040226213515.GA4367@idiom.novusordo.net> Message-ID: <20040226222152.GN9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Feb 26, 2004 at 02:35:15PM -0700, Taavi Burns wrote: > On Thu, Feb 26, 2004 at 04:31:38PM -0500, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > > A custom 404 handler script could do it. > > But a more proper way might be to configure Apache to return a 301. > > http://www.w3.org/Protocols/rfc2616/rfc2616-sec10.html Couldn't the 404 handler do that for the pages that moved? Only return 404 when it says it really should be a 404? Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 22:27:34 2004 From: taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 15:27:34 -0700 Subject: Apache/moved web page question In-Reply-To: <20040226222152.GN9627-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <403E5FAA.5020803@alteeve.com> <20040226213138.GM9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20040226213515.GA4367@idiom.novusordo.net> <20040226222152.GN9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20040226222734.GA5845@idiom.novusordo.net> On Thu, Feb 26, 2004 at 05:21:52PM -0500, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Thu, Feb 26, 2004 at 02:35:15PM -0700, Taavi Burns wrote: > > http://www.w3.org/Protocols/rfc2616/rfc2616-sec10.html > > Couldn't the 404 handler do that for the pages that moved? Only return > 404 when it says it really should be a 404? I suppose that would make even more sense. :) 404 handler returns 301 when an old page is referenced, or 404 when there never was a file by the specified name. -- taa Anyone can see a forest fire. Skill lies in sniffing the first smoke. - Robert A. Heinlein /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 22:59:35 2004 From: noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Noah John Gellner) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:59:35 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <20040226164702.18dbb792.joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <200402261150.08591.skuznets@blueprint.org> <20040226171512.GA31083@butters.southtrak> <20040226164702.18dbb792.joehill@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <20040226225935.GA32513@butters.southtrak> On 16:47 Thu 26 Feb , JoeHill wrote: > On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 12:15:12 -0500 > Noah John Gellner disseminated the following: > > > A person who downloads copyrighted movies or software commits an offence under > > Canadian law. > > That's a *criminal* offense? > > I was under the impression that copyright cases were strictly under the civil > process. Yea copyright infringement is civil and so as per an earlier post, a US company can sue you in Ontario for it. Therefore people should take the warnings coming from the US seriously. While people who are sued won't be going to jail, they are certainly open to financial risk. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From robert-yzlPDbdf3LosA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Thu Feb 26 23:42:34 2004 From: robert-yzlPDbdf3LosA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Robert McDonald) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:42:34 -0500 Subject: I can't resist References: <65B7B304AA3DE147BBD33938FE204E288A16F0@lynchmail.lynch.msft> Message-ID: <002c01c3fcc2$38e829e0$0b01a8c0@win98p4> "If you want more secure software, upgrade." Ok between checking for and installing upgrades, checking for and deleting spam and viruses targeted to windows users, rebooting when the windoze box locks up, spending the time reading about the newest security threats directed towards windows when will I have any time for Lunch, let alone work. Did I mention the systems maintenance for registry cleans, files left behind by windows or even just normal disk maintenance, Runnin windows is almost a full time occupation, the actual applications you need to do anything is like a "part time" job, if you dont wind up at a bar during lunch. Robert ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris F.A. Johnson" To: Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2004 2:26 PM Subject: Re: [TLUG]: I can't resist > On Thu, 26 Feb 2004, Wil McGilvery wrote: > > > Need a good laugh? > > > > > Here is an article in which MS claims that hackers only exploit > > vulnerabilities after the patch is released. > > > > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/3485972.stm > > > > So why release patches at all? Then they wouldn't have to worry > > about their security! ;) > > The end of the article says it all: > > "Almost all attacks against our software are against the legacy > systems," he said. > > "If you want more secure software, upgrade." > > ("said by David Aucsmith, who is in charge of technology at > Microsoft's security business and technology unit.") > > > -- > Chris F.A. Johnson > ================================================================= > cfaj-uVmiyxGBW52XDw4h08c5KA at public.gmane.org http://cfaj.freeshell.org > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 01:10:23 2004 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 20:10:23 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <20040226180056.GC31083-y6Pr2RmEDtN2c7wgCBzOK1pr/1R2p/CL@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <200402261150.08591.skuznets@blueprint.org> <20040226171512.GA31083@butters.southtrak> <403E2F25.5070602@rogers.com> <20040226180056.GC31083@butters.southtrak> Message-ID: <20040227011023.GA837@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> >> I've noticed in your sig that you are a "J.D. Candidate". I have no idea >> what that means, could you explain? >> >> Kinda handy having a lawyer on the list! :) >> >JD what the U of T calls its law degree. Most other Canadian schools call it an LLB. It is a JD in the US. Stands for Juris Doctor. > >I am still a law student, but I am keenly interested in privacy and IP issues particulary with respect to Linux and Open Source. Please note that Mr. Gellner has not referred to himself as a lawyer, quite wisely. Similarly, his comments to this list should not be construed as legal advice. He has demonstrated the ability to think, and his contributions to the list in the areas of law (and Linux) are quite useful, but are not legal advice. The service of legal advice in an official capacity in Ontario is the province of a monopoly called the Law Society of Upper Canada (yes, LSUC) and like all monopolies, they defend their province with energy. If you find yourself needing legal advice, definitely post to the list, as there are many (myself among them) who will assist you in seeking the right council and asking the right questions, but do not take as "legal advice" something that is not actually "legal advice". LSUC's rules of professional conduct are quite specific (as are those of almost any bar association) and it would be a shame to encumber Mr. Gellner's name by incorrectly characterizing his posts as legal advice. -- yours, William -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 01:14:07 2004 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 20:14:07 -0500 Subject: GPL ? what does it mean ? , the name that is. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040227011407.GB837@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Look here: http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/opensources/book/stallman.html This is the relevant chapter from Open Sources, a collection of essays about Open Source by O'Reilly. It is an interesting book, and much better presented online than in print (the print version is riddled with errors). -- yours, William -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 01:21:23 2004 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 20:21:23 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <20040227011023.GA837-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <200402261150.08591.skuznets@blueprint.org> <20040226171512.GA31083@butters.southtrak> <403E2F25.5070602@rogers.com> <20040226180056.GC31083@butters.southtrak> <20040227011023.GA837@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <20040226202123.5b6a80ea.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 20:10:23 -0500 William O'Higgins disseminated the following: > Please note that Mr. Gellner has not referred to himself as a lawyer, > quite wisely. Similarly, his comments to this list should not be > construed as legal advice. He has demonstrated the ability to think, > and his contributions to the list in the areas of law (and Linux) are > quite useful, but are not legal advice. The service of legal advice > in an official capacity in Ontario is the province of a monopoly called > the Law Society of Upper Canada (yes, LSUC) and like all monopolies, > they defend their province with energy. > > If you find yourself needing legal advice, definitely post to the list, > as there are many (myself among them) who will assist you in seeking the > right council and asking the right questions, but do not take as "legal > advice" something that is not actually "legal advice". LSUC's rules of > professional conduct are quite specific (as are those of almost any bar > association) and it would be a shame to encumber Mr. Gellner's name by > incorrectly characterizing his posts as legal advice. ...er, ya...thanks :-\ -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 20:19:01 up 21 days, 8:03, 8 users, load average: 1.08, 1.08, 1.14 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Linux 2.4.22-21mdk i686 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ "In this possibly terminal phase of human existence, democracy and freedom are more than just ideals to be valued - they may be essential to survival...."-- Noam Chomsky -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rheaton-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 01:24:32 2004 From: rheaton-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Russ Heaton) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 20:24:32 -0500 Subject: RH 7.1 atd suddenly fails at startup...what happened? In-Reply-To: <200402261212.28397.fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <20040223211453.G317@leftmind.net> <200402261019.36254.Garth@Webostics.com> <200402261212.28397.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: I was afraid it might come to that. Thank God this is not a critical machine. I've never been able to gracefully/cleanly upgrade a Linux machine. It seems that you have to have an extreme awareness of where everything is placed when you first install an app, so that when you upgrade you know what to save. If it was just a matter of saving your /etc and /home, it wouldn't be so bad, plus there are issues of what version libc you're upgrading from/to and so on and so forth, plus re-installing each app. one by one. It's not that easy when you only occasionally venture into the Linux world. In any event, I guess that's what I'm gonna have to do. I'd kind of like to try Debian, but there don't really seem to be many books on the subject, where as there seem to be lots of them for RedHat, so I'll probably go for the current version of RedHat. Thanks to all for the assistance. :-) Russ. On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 12:12:28 -0500, you wrote: >On Thursday 26 February 2004 11:19, Garth Meisel wrote: >> >> >> > So now, how do I get rid of that virus/trojan or whatever it is? >> >> >> >> I'm willing to be you don't have one. > >Huh??? /dev/caca and /dev/dsx certainly aren't standard fare on Redhat (or >any other Linux) installs. > >You could run chkrootkit or some other trojan finders (?) from rescue media >(Knoppix would be perfect). Finding all the bugs is an interesting exercise. > >IMO, the ultimate (and only) solution is to reinstall from scratch. You can >reasonably safely keep/backup your data (/home and /var) but you should look >through that carefully as well. See >http://www.cert.org/tech_tips/win-UNIX-system_compromise.html for some tips. > >To the OP; do not reinstall using Redhat 7.1. Install using an up-to-date >distribution that is maintainable/upgradeable. I am a rabid Debian advocate >but you're free to explore the lesser alternatives ;-) > >-- >Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ >Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 02:18:04 2004 From: lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org (Lloyd Budd) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 21:18:04 -0500 Subject: GPL ? what does it mean ? , the name that is. In-Reply-To: <20040227011407.GB837-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <20040227011407.GB837@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <2C7F18FC-68CB-11D8-AD41-000393CCFB66@foolswisdom.com> On 26-Feb-04, at 20:14, William O'Higgins wrote: > > This is the relevant chapter from Open Sources, a collection of essays > about Open Source by O'Reilly. It is an interesting book, and much > better presented online than in print (the print version is riddled > with > errors). Hi William, and all, Thank you for your response. I did not see the relevant passage? Can you point it out to me? I have previously read, Free as in Freedom , but I do not recall the name of the license being explained there either. Thank you, Lloyd -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 03:12:28 2004 From: reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (rh) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 22:12:28 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <20040227011023.GA837-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <200402261150.08591.skuznets@blueprint.org> <20040226171512.GA31083@butters.southtrak> <403E2F25.5070602@rogers.com> <20040226180056.GC31083@butters.southtrak> <20040227011023.GA837@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <20040226221228.44def65b.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 20:10:23 -0500 William O'Higgins wrote: > >> I've noticed in your sig that you are a "J.D. Candidate". I have no > >idea > what that means, could you explain? > >> > >> Kinda handy having a lawyer on the list! :) > >> > >JD what the U of T calls its law degree. Most other Canadian schools > >call it an LLB. It is a JD in the US. Stands for Juris Doctor. > > > >I am still a law student, but I am keenly interested in privacy and > >IP issues particulary with respect to Linux and Open Source. > > Please note that Mr. Gellner has not referred to himself as a lawyer, > quite wisely. Similarly, his comments to this list should not be > construed as legal advice. He has demonstrated the ability to think, > and his contributions to the list in the areas of law (and Linux) are > quite useful, but are not legal advice. The service of legal advice > in an official capacity in Ontario is the province of a monopoly > called the Law Society of Upper Canada (yes, LSUC) and like all > monopolies, they defend their province with energy. > > If you find yourself needing legal advice, definitely post to the > list, as there are many (myself among them) who will assist you in > seeking the right council and asking the right questions, but do not > take as "legal advice" something that is not actually "legal advice". > LSUC's rules of professional conduct are quite specific (as are those > of almost any bar association) and it would be a shame to encumber Mr. > Gellner's name by incorrectly characterizing his posts as legal > advice.-- Geez, do we have to have warning labels on everything? > > yours, > > William > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 03:26:22 2004 From: reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (rh) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 22:26:22 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <20040226225935.GA32513-y6Pr2RmEDtN2c7wgCBzOK1pr/1R2p/CL@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <200402261150.08591.skuznets@blueprint.org> <20040226171512.GA31083@butters.southtrak> <20040226164702.18dbb792.joehill@sympatico.ca> <20040226225935.GA32513@butters.southtrak> Message-ID: <20040226222622.2f6d180f.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:59:35 -0500 Noah John Gellner wrote: > On 16:47 Thu 26 Feb , JoeHill wrote: > > On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 12:15:12 -0500 > > Noah John Gellner disseminated the following: > > > > > A person who downloads copyrighted movies or software commits an > > > offence under Canadian law. > > > > That's a *criminal* offense? > > > > I was under the impression that copyright cases were strictly under > > the civil process. > > Yea copyright infringement is civil and so as per an earlier post, a > US company can sue you in Civil remedies just happens to be the option that the recording industry and the film industry are pursuing but it is not the only remedy. Sections 42 and 43 of the Copyright Act spell it out quite clearly that it, copyright violation, is a criminal offence. > Ontario for it. Therefore people should take the warnings coming > from the US seriously. While people who are sued won't be going to > jail, they are certainly open to financial risk. So yes, you are open to financial risk but also to jail time. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 03:38:35 2004 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 22:38:35 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <403D6FBA.1020505-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <200402252029.14569.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6865.3070000@rogers.com> <20040225225146.43ac5689.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6FBA.1020505@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20040227033835.GA9548@m450> On Wed, Feb 25, 2004 at 11:02:02PM -0500, Tom Legrady wrote > But the letter from Columbia Pictures threatens: > > "Please be aware that sharing copyrighted material is illegal > according to the Digital Millennium Copyright Act." To which my response would be... "Please be aware that on October 13, 1812, Major General Sir Isaac Brock made the supreme sacrifice a soldier can make, dying in the battle of Queenston Heights, in order that Canadians would not be conquered and ruled by the USA." I'd also see a Canadian lawyer for a briefing on the situation. Yeah, it'll cost a bit of money for a legal opinion, but it's worth it. -- Walter Dnes Email users are divided into two classes; 1) Those who have effective spam-blocking 2) Those who wish they did -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 06:15:27 2004 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 01:15:27 -0500 Subject: I can't resist In-Reply-To: <200402261430.26977.fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <65B7B304AA3DE147BBD33938FE204E288A16F0@lynchmail.lynch.msft> <200402261430.26977.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: <20040227061527.GC9548@m450> On Thu, Feb 26, 2004 at 02:30:26PM -0500, Fraser Campbell wrote > On the day that a worm is released to destroy systems rather than > to just annoy, what will be their spin? Any bets on the placement > of blame? Here are my top choices: > > - the open source people did it > - the security community is to blame > - Bin Laden did it > - I did it (since after all I suggested it here!) Actually, I beat you to it. I've gotten annoyed enough that I suggested in NANAE (news.admin.net-abuse.email) that governments commisssion a virus/worm that drops a DOS executable, and reboots into DOS, then loads itself into memory, low-level mis-formats the hard drive and flashes garbage into the BIOS for good measure. If people have their systems protected properly, this virus wouldn't hurt them. If it works on them, then they were vulnerable. Better to lose one computer, rather than... a) have it spam for illegal stuff on behalf of organized crime, and (see http://www.theregister.com/content/55/35722.html ) and let's not forget what they did to Osirusoft and Monkeys.com b) be used by organized crime as tools in extortion against businesses -- Walter Dnes Email users are divided into two classes; 1) Those who have effective spam-blocking 2) Those who wish they did -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 06:16:07 2004 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 01:16:07 -0500 Subject: A scripting question Message-ID: <20040227061607.GD9548@m450> AWK, bash, sed, vim macro, perl, tr, whatever. I have a remote inbox with clss.net, which allows me to control smtp-stage blocking by DNSbl, IP address, rDNS, etc. I also get a log file. I want to be able to re- format the logfile for my own statistics. Each reject causes 3 lines to be written to the logfile; 1) Originator + destination 2) A TXT output, plus a message of my choosing. 3) A zero-length line Here's an example. Note that it does *NOT* really have the leading "> "; that's just there to prevent linewrap in this message. > Thu Feb 26 08:24:15 2004 (blaezilp-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [62.195.50.109] > Certain countries (pireject-tail) If yours was a legitimate email see http://www.waltdnes.org/bypass.html to bypass block. > > Thu Feb 26 09:02:19 2004 (manko01-uAjRD0nVeow at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [65.83.117.101] > Rejected due to lack of hostname. If yours was a legitimate email see http://www.waltdnes.org/bypass.html to bypass block. > > Thu Feb 26 11:27:13 2004 (dchris8816-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [67.153.220.90] > Rejected email from dynamic IP. If yours was a legitimate email see http://www.waltdnes.org/bypass.html to bypass block. I can get rid of the blank lines with grep -v "^..." And I can get rid of the pointer to my unfiltered email address with sed "s/If yours was.*$//" This leaves me with... > Thu Feb 26 08:24:15 2004 (blaezilp-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [62.195.50.109] > Certain countries (pireject-tail) > Thu Feb 26 09:02:19 2004 (manko01-uAjRD0nVeow at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [65.83.117.101] > Rejected due to lack of hostname. > Thu Feb 26 11:27:13 2004 (dchris8816-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [67.153.220.90] > Rejected email from dynamic IP. I want to roll up the two lines for each reject into one long line like so. Again, the leading "> " isn't really there. > Thu Feb 26 08:24:15 2004 (blaezilp-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [62.195.50.109] Certain countries (pireject-tail) > Thu Feb 26 09:02:19 2004 (manko01-uAjRD0nVeow at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [65.83.117.101] Rejected due to lack of hostname. > Thu Feb 26 11:27:13 2004 (dchris8816-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [67.153.220.90] Rejected email from dynamic IP. How do I remove every second end-of-line to achieve this ? -- Walter Dnes Email users are divided into two classes; 1) Those who have effective spam-blocking 2) Those who wish they did -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jingsu-26n5VD7DAF2Tm46uYYfjYg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 06:30:59 2004 From: jingsu-26n5VD7DAF2Tm46uYYfjYg at public.gmane.org (Jing Su) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 01:30:59 -0500 Subject: A scripting question In-Reply-To: <20040227061607.GD9548-Mb8sf/rG248@public.gmane.org> References: <20040227061607.GD9548@m450> Message-ID: Well, here's a quick and easy way, working from where you left off... awk 'BEGIN{ # use str to buffer up text str=""; # two-state state machine state=0; } # for handling first line state==0 { str=$0; state=1; next; } # for handling second line state==1 { print str " " $0; str = ""; state = 0; next; }' You could also do the sed to remove the "If yours was..." stuff first, and then add an extra state to the above awk to skip over newlines... awk 'BEGIN{ # use str to buffer up text str=""; # three-state state machine state=0; } # for handling first line state==0 { str=$0; state=1; next; } # for handling second line state==1 { print str " " $0; str = ""; state = 2; next; } # for skipping newline state==2 { # probably can stick in an assert that $NF==0 state = 0; next; }' I know you can do state machines in sed, so that might be a faster/cleaner way if someone knows more about sed. -Jing On Fri, 27 Feb 2004, Walter Dnes wrote: > Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 01:16:07 -0500 > From: Walter Dnes > Reply-To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > To: Toronto Linux Users Group > Subject: [TLUG]: A scripting question > > AWK, bash, sed, vim macro, perl, tr, whatever. I have a remote inbox > with clss.net, which allows me to control smtp-stage blocking by DNSbl, > IP address, rDNS, etc. I also get a log file. I want to be able to re- > format the logfile for my own statistics. Each reject causes 3 lines to > be written to the logfile; > 1) Originator + destination > 2) A TXT output, plus a message of my choosing. > 3) A zero-length line > > Here's an example. Note that it does *NOT* really have the leading > "> "; that's just there to prevent linewrap in this message. > > > Thu Feb 26 08:24:15 2004 (blaezilp-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [62.195.50.109] > > Certain countries (pireject-tail) If yours was a legitimate email see http://www.waltdnes.org/bypass.html to bypass block. > > > > Thu Feb 26 09:02:19 2004 (manko01-uAjRD0nVeow at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [65.83.117.101] > > Rejected due to lack of hostname. If yours was a legitimate email see http://www.waltdnes.org/bypass.html to bypass block. > > > > Thu Feb 26 11:27:13 2004 (dchris8816-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [67.153.220.90] > > Rejected email from dynamic IP. If yours was a legitimate email see http://www.waltdnes.org/bypass.html to bypass block. > > I can get rid of the blank lines with > grep -v "^..." > > And I can get rid of the pointer to my unfiltered email address with > sed "s/If yours was.*$//" > > This leaves me with... > > > Thu Feb 26 08:24:15 2004 (blaezilp-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [62.195.50.109] > > Certain countries (pireject-tail) > > Thu Feb 26 09:02:19 2004 (manko01-uAjRD0nVeow at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [65.83.117.101] > > Rejected due to lack of hostname. > > Thu Feb 26 11:27:13 2004 (dchris8816-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [67.153.220.90] > > Rejected email from dynamic IP. > > I want to roll up the two lines for each reject into one long line > like so. Again, the leading "> " isn't really there. > > > Thu Feb 26 08:24:15 2004 (blaezilp-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [62.195.50.109] Certain countries (pireject-tail) > > Thu Feb 26 09:02:19 2004 (manko01-uAjRD0nVeow at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [65.83.117.101] Rejected due to lack of hostname. > > Thu Feb 26 11:27:13 2004 (dchris8816-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [67.153.220.90] Rejected email from dynamic IP. > > How do I remove every second end-of-line to achieve this ? > > -- > Walter Dnes > Email users are divided into two classes; > 1) Those who have effective spam-blocking > 2) Those who wish they did > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 07:18:29 2004 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 02:18:29 -0500 Subject: A scripting question In-Reply-To: <20040227061607.GD9548-Mb8sf/rG248@public.gmane.org> References: <20040227061607.GD9548@m450> Message-ID: <20040227071829.GB3604@node1.opengeometry.net> On Fri, Feb 27, 2004 at 01:16:07AM -0500, Walter Dnes wrote: > > Thu Feb 26 08:24:15 2004 (blaezilp-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [62.195.50.109] > > Certain countries (pireject-tail) If yours was a legitimate email see http://www.waltdnes.org/bypass.html to bypass block. > > > > Thu Feb 26 09:02:19 2004 (manko01-uAjRD0nVeow at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [65.83.117.101] > > Rejected due to lack of hostname. If yours was a legitimate email see http://www.waltdnes.org/bypass.html to bypass block. > > > > Thu Feb 26 11:27:13 2004 (dchris8816-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [67.153.220.90] > > Rejected email from dynamic IP. If yours was a legitimate email see http://www.waltdnes.org/bypass.html to bypass block. > > Thu Feb 26 08:24:15 2004 (blaezilp-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [62.195.50.109] > > Certain countries (pireject-tail) > > Thu Feb 26 09:02:19 2004 (manko01-uAjRD0nVeow at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [65.83.117.101] > > Rejected due to lack of hostname. > > Thu Feb 26 11:27:13 2004 (dchris8816-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [67.153.220.90] > > Rejected email from dynamic IP. > > Thu Feb 26 08:24:15 2004 (blaezilp-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [62.195.50.109] Certain countries (pireject-tail) > > Thu Feb 26 09:02:19 2004 (manko01-uAjRD0nVeow at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [65.83.117.101] Rejected due to lack of hostname. > > Thu Feb 26 11:27:13 2004 (dchris8816-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [67.153.220.90] Rejected email from dynamic IP. > > How do I remove every second end-of-line to achieve this ? sed 'N;s/\n//' You can do all previous steps in one-shot, if you like. -- William Park, Open Geometry Consulting, Linux solution for data management and processing. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 15:09:56 2004 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 10:09:56 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <20040227033835.GA9548-Mb8sf/rG248@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <200402252029.14569.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6865.3070000@rogers.com> <20040225225146.43ac5689.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6FBA.1020505@rogers.com> <20040227033835.GA9548@m450> Message-ID: <20040227100956.5741fca7.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 22:38:35 -0500 Walter Dnes disseminated the following: > To which my response would be... > > "Please be aware that on October 13, 1812, Major General Sir Isaac Brock > made the supreme sacrifice a soldier can make, dying in the battle of > Queenston Heights, in order that Canadians would not be conquered and > ruled by the USA." LOL! Good one. Did you ever read that public rebuke that Mel Hurting gave to Paul Cerlucci, the US Ambassador? I can send it to you offlist if you want. -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 10:07:30 up 21 days, 21:52, 9 users, load average: 0.06, 0.07, 0.12 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Microsoft Palladium: The world is a fearful place (because we allowed it to be by introducing vulnerable designs followed by clueless security initiatives) so let us fix it for you.--Cringely -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From kru_tch-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 16:30:00 2004 From: kru_tch-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (Stephen Allen) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 11:30:00 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <20040227100956.5741fca7.joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <200402252029.14569.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6865.3070000@rogers.com> <20040225225146.43ac5689.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6FBA.1020505@rogers.com> <20040227033835.GA9548@m450> <20040227100956.5741fca7.joehill@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <20040227163000.GB31117@barnyard.192.168.0.1> On Fri, Feb 27, 2004 at 10:09:56AM -0500 or thereabouts, JoeHill wrote: > On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 22:38:35 -0500 > Walter Dnes disseminated the following: > > > To which my response would be... > > > > "Please be aware that on October 13, 1812, Major General Sir Isaac Brock > > made the supreme sacrifice a soldier can make, dying in the battle of > > Queenston Heights, in order that Canadians would not be conquered and > > ruled by the USA." > > LOL! Good one. Did you ever read that public rebuke that Mel Hurting gave to > Paul Cerlucci, the US Ambassador? I can send it to you offlist if you want. No, I haven't seen it, could you put it online (it that's easier) than perhaps mailing to more than individual. Otherwise feel free to e-mail it to me to. -- _..-'( )`-.._ ./'. '||\\. (\_/) .//||` .`\. ./'.|'.'||||\\|.. )O O( ..|//||||`.`|.`\. ./'..|'.|| |||||\`````` '`"'` ''''''/||||| ||.`|..`\. ./'.||'.|||| ||||||||||||. .|||||||||||| ||||.`||.`\. /'|||'.|||||| ||||||||||||{ }|||||||||||| ||||||.`|||`\ '.|||'.||||||| ||||||||||||{ }|||||||||||| |||||||.`|||.` '.||| ||||||||| |/' ``\||`` ''||/'' `\| ||||||||| |||.` |/' \./' `\./ \!|\ /|!/ \./' `\./ `\| V V V }' `\ /' `{ V V V ` ` ` V ' ' ' -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jingsu-26n5VD7DAF2Tm46uYYfjYg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 16:35:53 2004 From: jingsu-26n5VD7DAF2Tm46uYYfjYg at public.gmane.org (Jing Su) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 11:35:53 -0500 Subject: unable to get Palm USB working in 2.6 In-Reply-To: <20040227163000.GB31117-o7t0nEE3I5NAPr+L1dq8bsJ5zM57E+Gt@public.gmane.org> References: <000001c3fc0b$a873b160$6401a8c0@main> <200402252029.14569.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6865.3070000@rogers.com> <20040225225146.43ac5689.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6FBA.1020505@rogers.com> <20040227033835.GA9548@m450> <20040227100956.5741fca7.joehill@sympatico.ca> <20040227163000.GB31117@barnyard.192.168.0.1> Message-ID: need some help... I've got my 2.6.3 kernel running ok, and have USB, visor, and usbserial modules all loaded. Yet I'm still unable to start a hot-synch with my USB Palm. I hit the hot-synch first, to get the USB connection going. But pilot-link still tells me there's nothing on the USBtty0. Any suggestions, general hints? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 16:41:31 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 11:41:31 -0500 Subject: unable to get Palm USB working in 2.6 In-Reply-To: References: <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6865.3070000@rogers.com> <20040225225146.43ac5689.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6FBA.1020505@rogers.com> <20040227033835.GA9548@m450> <20040227100956.5741fca7.joehill@sympatico.ca> <20040227163000.GB31117@barnyard.192.168.0.1> Message-ID: <20040227164127.GO9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Feb 27, 2004 at 11:35:53AM -0500, Jing Su wrote: > need some help... > I've got my 2.6.3 kernel running ok, and have USB, visor, and usbserial > modules all loaded. Yet I'm still unable to start a hot-synch with my USB > Palm. I hit the hot-synch first, to get the USB connection going. But > pilot-link still tells me there's nothing on the USBtty0. > > Any suggestions, general hints? Someone I was talking to yesterday had the same problem with a Sony Clie 4.0 and he seemed to indicate that he had forgotten to include both EHCI and UHCI drivers (USB 2 and USB 1 respectively) and that it might have been the cause of the problem for him. Some systems of course use OHCI instead of UHCI. Other than that, not sure. I don't have access to such a device to try it out myself. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 16:53:41 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 11:53:41 -0500 Subject: RH 7.1 atd suddenly fails at startup...what happened? In-Reply-To: References: <20040223211453.G317@leftmind.net> <200402261019.36254.Garth@Webostics.com> <200402261212.28397.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: <20040227165341.GP9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Thu, Feb 26, 2004 at 08:24:32PM -0500, Russ Heaton wrote: > I was afraid it might come to that. Thank God this is not a critical > machine. I've never been able to gracefully/cleanly upgrade a Linux > machine. It seems that you have to have an extreme awareness of where > everything is placed when you first install an app, so that when you > upgrade you know what to save. If it was just a matter of saving your > /etc and /home, it wouldn't be so bad, plus there are issues of what > version libc you're upgrading from/to and so on and so forth, plus > re-installing each app. one by one. It's not that easy when you only > occasionally venture into the Linux world. In any event, I guess > that's what I'm gonna have to do. I'd kind of like to try Debian, but > there don't really seem to be many books on the subject, where as > there seem to be lots of them for RedHat, so I'll probably go for the > current version of RedHat. Books tend to be obsolete very quickly (although I guess with Debian's release cycle it wouldn't be so big a deal). I have seen books on debian in the past. www.debian.org does have quite a lot of documentation. #Debian on irc.debian.org has a lot of very active and helpful people (including me sometimes) answering questions about how to do things. Every package has it's documentation (and often a debian specific README) in /usr/share/doc/packagename/ that can be very helpful in figuring out how to set things up. Basic commands needed to run a debian system efficiently: apt-get update - updates list of available packages on archvies listed in the /etc/apt/sources.list config file. apt-cache search keyword - finds packages that do what you want. apt-cache show packagename - shows description of a package apt-get install packagename - downloads and installs packagename (and dependancies) apt-get remove packagename - removes a package. apt-get --purge remove packagename - removes package files and config files. apt-get dist-upgrade - upgrades installed packages to newest avilable version (within current release) apt-get install --reinstall packagename - reinstalls a package (in case you overwrote some of its files or did something else wrong). tasksel - installs a group of packages that do a certain task. mostly useful for the initial install. dselect is really never useful anymore (it is a bad interface when the system hits 15000 available packages. It was ok for 3000). update-alternatives --config command - change which of multiple available choices provide a given command (ie vi, editor, x-window-manager, tar, gs, etc.) All versions of a command are available usually as command-specificversion or command.specific version (ie gs-esp and gs-gnu, or nvi and vim in the case of vi providers.) dpkg-reconfigure packagename - asks the questions asked during install again and updates settings for a package. xserver-xfree86 for example to change X settings. aptitude is an ncurses application that provides a menu interface to do all the above (and then some, like auto removal of dependancies when nothing else requires them (if they were automatically installed of course). All config files go in /etc, either as /etc/packageconfigfile or /etc/packagename/configfiles. Some defaults for things launched by init go in /etc/defaults/packagename. Time to stop writing before I write a Debian user guide in a single email. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jingsu-26n5VD7DAF2Tm46uYYfjYg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 16:55:25 2004 From: jingsu-26n5VD7DAF2Tm46uYYfjYg at public.gmane.org (Jing Su) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 11:55:25 -0500 Subject: unable to get Palm USB working in 2.6 In-Reply-To: <20040227164127.GO9627-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20040225213151.471c268d.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D5C93.5080600@rogers.com> <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6865.3070000@rogers.com> <20040225225146.43ac5689.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6FBA.1020505@rogers.com> <20040227033835.GA9548@m450> <20040227100956.5741fca7.joehill@sympatico.ca> <20040227163000.GB31117@barnyard.192.168.0.1> <20040227164127.GO9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: On Fri, 27 Feb 2004, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > Someone I was talking to yesterday had the same problem with a Sony Clie > 4.0 and he seemed to indicate that he had forgotten to include both EHCI > and UHCI drivers (USB 2 and USB 1 respectively) and that it might have > been the cause of the problem for him. Some systems of course use OHCI > instead of UHCI. how absent minded of me! That was exactly the problem. I updated my config to auto-load ohci-hcd. Everything works again. :) Thanks for tip! -Jing -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 17:01:00 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 11:01:00 -0600 Subject: I can't resist In-Reply-To: <20040227061527.GC9548-Mb8sf/rG248@public.gmane.org> References: <65B7B304AA3DE147BBD33938FE204E288A16F0@lynchmail.lynch.msft> <200402261430.26977.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> <20040227061527.GC9548@m450> Message-ID: <200402271101.00201.Garth@Webostics.com> > Actually, I beat you to it. I've gotten annoyed enough that I > suggested in NANAE (news.admin.net-abuse.email) that governments > commisssion a virus/worm that drops a DOS executable, and reboots into > DOS, then loads itself into memory, low-level mis-formats the hard drive > and flashes garbage into the BIOS for good measure. > > If people have their systems protected properly, this virus wouldn't > hurt them. If it works on them, then they were vulnerable. Better to > lose one computer, rather than... And $1000 (if I had it) to the first person that can make my keyboard clap for certain messages! I second the motion, 3rd it virtually, and blah blah blah! So let's break that down a little: #1- Would have to run for 3 months to be CERTAIN to catch 99% of the computers in the world. If that is even long enough. #2- Would have to be in EVERY language in the world, at least the final message. #3- #2 coincides with the D-day which should NOT be the end or beginning or near middle of the month for general courtesy reasons. #4- The worm would likely be BETTER off announcing itself with the promise to never interfere or use the system resources until 10 minutes after any activity and to immediately halt activity when it notices any activity via mouse/keyboard/joystick only. #5- The worm should also announce that it is NOT harming the system and won't interfere with normal workings and also promise to not take anything more than the IP (static) or MAC# (DHCP) or phone number. This leaves a little work for virtual private network's administrators. #6- At D-day the worm must only do "pop-up's" to notify the user they need protection and or better computing habits. ie. No HTML email & attachment checking. #7- At D-day there should be a web site flashed where they can get the required information for better habits and or other NON-commercial software to ease their embarrassment. No plugs for anything, not even OSS or M$ will surely put an end to any reasonable expectation of effect. #8- All major/minor platforms and OS keepers must be notified in order to maintain the actual truth of the experiment. M$, MAC, Linux (all of them), even Lindoze and the rest. Otherwise one of them, we can all guess who we hate most, someone will try to make their system appear better than the others by cheating. #9- Which brings us to the without a doubt toughest audience to convince: The anti-virus writers of the world. They must without a doubt be notified and government instructed (with severe penalty for any trickery) to not interfere or block/hold/quarantine, basically let it zip right through. This is where and why the header or description line in the code MUST be protected until D-day so that there are no copy-cats with other intentions. And this is the exact problem why all of you just wasted your time reading this. Sorry! #10- I despise anti-virus writers anti-virus pushers. Anyone that doesn't know who the GREATEST total of virii comes from the so called anti-virus software makers/sellers really needs to think twice. What better way to sell a product than to create a need for it. Analogy: I'm the only or the biggest windshield sales/installation company in my city or the world for that matter. But my business is starving and I'm hungry too. Is it right that I hire gangs and people willing to do the job to go out and damage windshields in the night? I'm a tire store. Can I got out slashing tires at night or drive down the road dropping nails and spike balls from a hole in my floor? Yeah, if we lived in a perfect world where everyone acted according to the laws, we wouldn't even need police. But we do not, therefore we need to act as large a group as possible and that is our best defense. The bottom line is the sooner EVERYONE boycotts anti-virus software and takes the SMART way out, the sooner the dreaded virus itself will disappear. That's just my opinion and I'm sure there's more to it because virii will always be around. Gone off-track a little there, sorry, forgive me for thinking outloud. I like the idea Walter but there obviously needs to be way more thought that goes into something like that than I can personally come up with. This is how much I came up with in the time it took to write this. I'll gladly continue this discussion privately if it gets too hot to handle here. : ) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 16:58:31 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 11:58:31 -0500 Subject: unable to get Palm USB working in 2.6 In-Reply-To: References: <20040225220954.0587fb0a.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6865.3070000@rogers.com> <20040225225146.43ac5689.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> <403D6FBA.1020505@rogers.com> <20040227033835.GA9548@m450> <20040227100956.5741fca7.joehill@sympatico.ca> <20040227163000.GB31117@barnyard.192.168.0.1> <20040227164127.GO9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20040227165831.GQ9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Feb 27, 2004 at 11:55:25AM -0500, Jing Su wrote: > On Fri, 27 Feb 2004, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > > Someone I was talking to yesterday had the same problem with a Sony Clie > > 4.0 and he seemed to indicate that he had forgotten to include both EHCI > > and UHCI drivers (USB 2 and USB 1 respectively) and that it might have > > been the cause of the problem for him. Some systems of course use OHCI > > instead of UHCI. > > > how absent minded of me! That was exactly the problem. > I updated my config to auto-load ohci-hcd. > Everything works again. :) > Thanks for tip! Oh good, so the palm thingies DO work with 2.6 if people configure 2.6 correctly. Nice to be sure. :) Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 17:20:55 2004 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 12:20:55 -0500 Subject: I can't resist In-Reply-To: <200402271101.00201.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <65B7B304AA3DE147BBD33938FE204E288A16F0@lynchmail.lynch.msft> <20040227061527.GC9548@m450> <200402271101.00201.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <200402271220.55800.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> On Friday 27 February 2004 12:01, Garth Meisel wrote: > So let's break that down a little: > #1- Would have to run for 3 months to be CERTAIN to catch 99% of the > computers in the world. ?If that is even long enough. I don't think a worm needs that much time to do massive damage. I recall reading in one of the computer rags (eweek, computing canada, or some such) about the speed with which a particular worm spread. I believe the worm was blaster and that the statistics stated were something like: - within 15 minutes 90% of available computers were infected - within 3 minutes the worm was scanning at a rate of 55 million ip addresses per second The above numbers have no basis in fact since they are only from my memory. Does anyone have a reference to statistics like this? Wish I'd saved the article :-( -- Fraser Campbell Starnix Inc. Telephone: (905) 771-0017 ext. 223 Thornhill, Ontario, Canada http://www.starnix.com/ Professional Linux Services & Products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 17:30:22 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 11:30:22 -0600 Subject: I can't resist In-Reply-To: <200402271220.55800.fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <65B7B304AA3DE147BBD33938FE204E288A16F0@lynchmail.lynch.msft> <200402271101.00201.Garth@Webostics.com> <200402271220.55800.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: <200402271130.22355.Garth@Webostics.com> > I believe the worm was blaster and that the statistics stated were > something like: > > - within 15 minutes 90% of available computers were infected > - within 3 minutes the worm was scanning at a rate of 55 million ip > addresses per second Then that's awesome and it works in favor of the project. Almost kills the copy-cat factor and brings the project back to life! Thanks. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 12:48:06 2004 From: skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ at public.gmane.org (Sergey Kuznetsov) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 12:48:06 +0000 Subject: A scripting question In-Reply-To: <20040227061607.GD9548-Mb8sf/rG248@public.gmane.org> References: <20040227061607.GD9548@m450> Message-ID: <200402271248.06667.skuznets@blueprint.org> On February 27, 2004 06:16 am, Walter Dnes wrote: > AWK, bash, sed, vim macro, perl, tr, whatever. I have a remote inbox > with clss.net, which allows me to control smtp-stage blocking by DNSbl, > IP address, rDNS, etc. I also get a log file. I want to be able to re- > format the logfile for my own statistics. Each reject causes 3 lines to > be written to the logfile; > 1) Originator + destination > 2) A TXT output, plus a message of my choosing. > 3) A zero-length line > > Here's an example. Note that it does *NOT* really have the leading > "> "; that's just there to prevent linewrap in this message. > > > Thu Feb 26 08:24:15 2004 (blaezilp-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) -> > > (waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org) [62.195.50.109] Certain countries (pireject-tail) > > If yours was a legitimate email see http://www.waltdnes.org/bypass.html > > to bypass block. > > > > Thu Feb 26 09:02:19 2004 (manko01-uAjRD0nVeow at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) > > [65.83.117.101] Rejected due to lack of hostname. If yours was a > > legitimate email see http://www.waltdnes.org/bypass.html to bypass block. > > > > Thu Feb 26 11:27:13 2004 (dchris8816-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) -> > > (waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org) [67.153.220.90] Rejected email from dynamic IP. > > If yours was a legitimate email see http://www.waltdnes.org/bypass.html > > to bypass block. > > I can get rid of the blank lines with > grep -v "^..." > > And I can get rid of the pointer to my unfiltered email address with > sed "s/If yours was.*$//" > > This leaves me with... > > > Thu Feb 26 08:24:15 2004 (blaezilp-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) -> > > (waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org) [62.195.50.109] Certain countries (pireject-tail) > > Thu Feb 26 09:02:19 2004 (manko01-uAjRD0nVeow at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) > > [65.83.117.101] Rejected due to lack of hostname. > > Thu Feb 26 11:27:13 2004 (dchris8816-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) -> > > (waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org) [67.153.220.90] Rejected email from dynamic IP. > > I want to roll up the two lines for each reject into one long line > like so. Again, the leading "> " isn't really there. > > > Thu Feb 26 08:24:15 2004 (blaezilp-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) -> > > (waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org) [62.195.50.109] Certain countries (pireject-tail) > > Thu Feb 26 09:02:19 2004 (manko01-uAjRD0nVeow at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) > > [65.83.117.101] Rejected due to lack of hostname. Thu Feb 26 11:27:13 > > 2004 (dchris8816-PkbjNfxxIARBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [67.153.220.90] > > Rejected email from dynamic IP. > > How do I remove every second end-of-line to achieve this ? #!/usr/bin/perl open IN, "wdnes.log" or die; $text = join "", ; $text =~ s/ If yours was.*$//mgi; $text =~ s/\n(?!\n)/ /mgi; print "$text"; Tested. It works. -- All the Best! Sergey Kuznetsov Senior Software Developer Blueprint Initiative at Samuel Lunenfeld Research Institute Mount Sinai Hospital 522 University Street Phone#: (416) 596-8505 x6343 E-Mail: skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From hgr-FjoMob2a1F7QT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 18:20:17 2004 From: hgr-FjoMob2a1F7QT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Herb Richter) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:20:17 -0500 (EST) Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <20040226035707.GE27183-y6Pr2RmEDtN2c7wgCBzOK1pr/1R2p/CL@public.gmane.org> References: <20040226035707.GE27183@butters.southtrak> Message-ID: On Wed, 25 Feb 2004, Noah John Gellner wrote: [cut] > In civil cases the courts in Ontario have a test that they apply to > see which location is suitable for the case. I don't have the cite > handy, but they have explicitly said that they would enforce the laws > of outside jurisdictions whether that jursidiction be B.C. or > Kentucky. When I was learning it, it struck me as weird, but this is > the way it is. Would that citation be: Braintech, Inc, v. Kostuik 1999 BCCA 0169 (1999)? http://www.courts.gov.bc.ca/jdb-txt/ca/99/01/c99-0169.txt I remember this case in the context of comity, forum shopping and the Morguard test (real and substantial connection) and especially in that the BC Court of Appeals overturned a Texas District Court award of $US300,000. Not having read the whole text of the appeal until now, I wasn't aware that the Canadian court considered a *lot* of American law (i.e. the Texas long arm statute and the 14th Amendment to the US Constitution). But it does seem to me that this was done in the context of Canadian laws. As a lay-person who takes a keen interest in legal issues that may affect my business, I find cases like this very interesting but in this case, not scary. Sure it seems that not only can someone doing business on the internet be haled into almost any court anywhere, and that we may be subject to many different versions of the laws at the same time, I guess I just have a lot of faith that the law is a lot smarter than it may sometimes appear. Nor am I particularly alarmed at the original post re the "Interesting warning regarding filesharing", from what I recall of that post (I don't have the original). I don't think it was mentioned if the recipient of that letter (the client) is an individual or a business. Esp. if a business, there is probably a business solution apart from any legal solution i.e. "What can we do to fix this?" as opposed to "What can we do to fight this?" There may even be a business opportunity. Lets say that the client is an ISP who really doesn't like the bandwidth consumed, then forwarding a copy of the letter to the file sharers may serve two purposes: bandwidth and doing something to fix this. Further more, again from what I can remember of the original post, it sounded more like a scare mongering just as in the tv ads. And if this does reduce the filesharing bandwidth then maybe "that's a good thing" :-) -- Herb Richter Toronto, Ontario http://PartsAndService.com http://PartsAndService.ca -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rheaton-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 18:27:31 2004 From: rheaton-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Russ Heaton) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:27:31 -0500 Subject: RH 7.1 atd suddenly fails at startup...what happened? In-Reply-To: <20040227165341.GP9627-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20040223211453.G317@leftmind.net> <200402261019.36254.Garth@Webostics.com> <200402261212.28397.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> <20040227165341.GP9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: Thanks. That was very helpful. I think I'll give it a go. I really don't have anything to lose. Now I know who to go to if I run into any problems with it. ;-) ;-) Thanks again, Russ On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 11:53:41 -0500, you wrote: >Books tend to be obsolete very quickly (although I guess with Debian's >release cycle it wouldn't be so big a deal). I have seen books on >debian in the past. www.debian.org does have quite a lot of >documentation. #Debian on irc.debian.org has a lot of very active and >helpful people (including me sometimes) answering questions about how to >do things. Every package has it's documentation (and often a debian >specific README) in /usr/share/doc/packagename/ that can be very helpful >in figuring out how to set things up. > >Basic commands needed to run a debian system efficiently: > >apt-get update - updates list of available packages on archvies listed > in the /etc/apt/sources.list config file. >apt-cache search keyword - finds packages that do what you want. >apt-cache show packagename - shows description of a package >apt-get install packagename - downloads and installs packagename (and > dependancies) >apt-get remove packagename - removes a package. >apt-get --purge remove packagename - removes package files and config > files. >apt-get dist-upgrade - upgrades installed packages to newest avilable > version (within current release) >apt-get install --reinstall packagename - reinstalls a package (in case > you overwrote some of its files or did something else > wrong). >tasksel - installs a group of packages that do a certain task. mostly > useful for the initial install. dselect is really never > useful anymore (it is a bad interface when the system > hits 15000 available packages. It was ok for 3000). >update-alternatives --config command - change which of multiple > available choices provide a given command (ie vi, > editor, x-window-manager, tar, gs, etc.) All versions > of a command are available usually as > command-specificversion or command.specific version (ie > gs-esp and gs-gnu, or nvi and vim in the case of vi > providers.) >dpkg-reconfigure packagename - asks the questions asked during install > again and updates settings for a package. > xserver-xfree86 for example to change X settings. > >aptitude is an ncurses application that provides a menu interface to do >all the above (and then some, like auto removal of dependancies when >nothing else requires them (if they were automatically installed of >course). > >All config files go in /etc, either as /etc/packageconfigfile or >/etc/packagename/configfiles. Some defaults for things launched by init >go in /etc/defaults/packagename. > >Time to stop writing before I write a Debian user guide in a single >email. > >Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 18:50:34 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 12:50:34 -0600 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200402271250.34330.Garth@Webostics.com> I don't remember where I heard something that lies within this last post about ISP's reporting the users to the authorities. Some ISP's were reporting the IP's, bandwidth used, and providing names of users to the authorities. Somewhere down the road someone said "Invasion of privacy" or some other legitimate right and now some ISP's have either had to rewrite their customer contracts but some have outright refused to co-operate with the authorities. I wish memory served me better but this is all I can remember. In my paranoid side I'm thinking the authorities may have asked the ISP's to actually specifically monitor and or PIPE the same usage of a certain customer to them thus why the argument. That without a doubt cannot be legal in any way shape or form no matter who the authority is SO LONG as the activity is not TERRORIST related but this also a new area without much precedent thus far. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 18:50:20 2004 From: sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org (Sidney Shapiro) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:50:20 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <20040227100956.5741fca7.joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <20040227100956.5741fca7.joehill@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <007301c3fd62$95db1090$0b9f9c18@main> > LOL! Good one. Did you ever read that public rebuke that Mel Hurting gave > to > Paul Cerlucci, the US Ambassador? I can send it to you offlist if you > want. > Could I please get a copy too? Thanks, Sid -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From zhunt-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 19:52:23 2004 From: zhunt-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Zoltan) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:52:23 -0600 Subject: problem connecting to a DLink DI-614+ router/hub Message-ID: <002501c3fd6b$3817fcd0$6400a8c0@D2XGQ811> I'm using a DLink DI-614+ router/hub that has a serves as my network hub at home. It's set up as a DHCP Server and I have two computers hooked up to it: a Win2K box and the another running YellowDog Linux (basically Red Hat 8/9 for PowerPC systems, I'm running it on an AmigaOne (A1) board). No problems with the Win2K system, lots with the YDL system. The problem I'm having is that YDL doesn't seem to be able to talk to the router. I've configured it (with the Network Conf GUI) to use dhcp to obtain IP address (same as the W2K system), however I keep getting an error when I try to activate the connection: "Determining IP information for eth0...failed" I've done as much of a physical check as I can- the cables, swapping ports around. I have been able to hook up my DSL modem directly to the A1, and this works. Just no luck with trying to connect through the router. As far as the router goes, all the right LEDs seem to be on, but checking the logs on the DLink seems that nothing is being sent from the A1. Anybody have any ideas what might be happening? Zoltan -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 25 21:23:54 2004 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter L. Peres) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 23:23:54 +0200 (IST) Subject: Proven wireless mouse for Linux ? Message-ID: What type works well ? I have too many wires on the table. It must work at least 12 hours on a set of batteries or charge. What about the third button issue ? Does a ChordMiddle event make it through the wireless protocol ? Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Wed Feb 25 21:30:54 2004 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter L. Peres) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 23:30:54 +0200 (IST) Subject: Error on login.. In-Reply-To: <200402241659.58180.jerome-mhXWc29+iYPyG1zEObXtfA@public.gmane.org> References: <200402241659.58180.jerome@gmanmi.tv> Message-ID: It does not have to be bad memory. It can be corrupted swapspace. Did the power go down and give you an unclean shutdown recently ? Anyway you can run mkswap un a swap partition that is *not* in use. I.e. swapoff -a, check with free that swap is off, and then mkswap again, then swapon -a Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 18:55:33 2004 From: sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org (Sidney Shapiro) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:55:33 -0500 Subject: The great hunt for a WYSIWYG proggie Message-ID: <007501c3fd63$4ade2d10$0b9f9c18@main> Howdy all, I have a client ripping out his hair trying to get a decent PHP/Java (or something else that will run on RH) program which will allow users to edit html pages using this program online. Sort of like M$ FrontPage but online and open source. I went through a couple dozen listings on Source Forge, and after trying about a dozen out, non of them seem to work properly (not developed enough). Has anyone installed something like this before or have a recommendation for a program like this? I have seen several perfect ones for sale, but they all range in the $3-600 category and is a lot more than the $0 my client is willing to spend. Any suggestions would be appreciated, Thanks, Sidney -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 19:01:55 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:01:55 -0600 Subject: problem connecting to a DLink DI-614+ router/hub In-Reply-To: <002501c3fd6b$3817fcd0$6400a8c0-9Ju/zT+hGic@public.gmane.org> References: <002501c3fd6b$3817fcd0$6400a8c0@D2XGQ811> Message-ID: <200402271301.55692.Garth@Webostics.com> A router or switch without a fancy supposedly good hardwired firewall should never be placed between the outside source (cable modem, phone line) because it will literally broadcast everything outside for nothing eating unnecessary bandwidth. Personally, even a fancy switch would still be placed behind at least one box at any location I'm involved with. This likely isn't your problem but I bet it would most certainly eliminate the problem too. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 19:09:50 2004 From: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (Peter Hiscocks) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 14:09:50 -0500 Subject: Ease of installation? Message-ID: <20040227140950.C22069@ee.ryerson.ca> The historic requirement has been to to defrag and then manually repartition a hard drive in order to set up a dual-boot windows-linux system. I hear rumours that some of the latest distros may be able to do this semi-automatically. Could someone aware of the state of the art in this give a summary of the current situation? I had occasion to use the Knoppix CD that comes with the latest book from Marcel Gagne, and was much impressed. The operating system recognized the USB scanner immediately. So obviously things are getting easier than my first slackware distro which came on 30 floppies. I wonder if this 'ease of installation' is extending to permanent installs. Peter -- Peter D. Hiscocks Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering Ryerson University, 350 Victoria Street, Toronto, Ontario, M5B 2K3, Canada Phone: (416) 979-5000 Ext 6109 Fax: (416) 979-5280 Email: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org URL: http://www.ee.ryerson.ca/~phiscock -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 14:16:32 2004 From: skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ at public.gmane.org (Sergey Kuznetsov) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 14:16:32 +0000 Subject: Proven wireless mouse for Linux ? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200402271416.32256.skuznets@blueprint.org> On February 25, 2004 09:23 pm, Peter L. Peres wrote: > What type works well ? I have too many wires on the table. It must work at > least 12 hours on a set of batteries or charge. What about the third > button issue ? Does a ChordMiddle event make it through the wireless > protocol ? I do use Logitech Elite wireless Kbd + wireless optical mouse. Work with no problems. Actually you can buy any woreless kbd or mouse. all of them uses standard AT/PS2 or/and USB cables at the exit. -- All the Best! Sergey Kuznetsov Senior Software Developer Blueprint Initiative at Samuel Lunenfeld Research Institute Mount Sinai Hospital 522 University Street Phone#: (416) 596-8505 x6343 E-Mail: skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From jason-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 19:21:02 2004 From: jason-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/ at public.gmane.org (Jason Shein) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 14:21:02 -0500 Subject: The great hunt for a WYSIWYG proggie Message-ID: <6f0d8aa4e9727c1daa6514d7c32d356a@pcsecurityonline.com> try htmlarea3 Works fine for me http://www.interactivetools.com/products/htmlarea/ Sidney Shapiro wrote: >Howdy all, > >I have a client ripping out his hair trying to get a decent PHP/Java (or >something else that will run on RH) program which will allow users to >edit html pages using this program online. Sort of like M$ FrontPage >but online and open source. I went through a couple dozen listings on >Source Forge, and after trying about a dozen out, non of them seem to >work properly (not developed enough). Has anyone installed something >like this before or have a recommendation for a program like this? I >have seen several perfect ones for sale, but they all range in the >$3-600 category and is a lot more than the $0 my client is willing to >spend. Any suggestions would be appreciated, > >Thanks, > >Sidney > > >-- >The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org >TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns >How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- " Eventually people tire of repairing broken Windows, And decide to replace them with something stronger" (o_ // Linux - The Choice Of A GNU Generation V_/_ Jason Shein Linux Registered User #281100 jason-gaRZxGPHtpBxZtjKW1aY+1aTQe2KTcn/@public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 19:27:51 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:27:51 -0600 Subject: Ease of installation? In-Reply-To: <20040227140950.C22069-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w@public.gmane.org> References: <20040227140950.C22069@ee.ryerson.ca> Message-ID: <200402271327.51896.Garth@Webostics.com> Most *nix's can resize partitions easily but I don't think any guarantee the defrag process for FAT32 or NTFS's. Sorry. I'm sure M$ would somehow find something to sue or complain about because it is actually modifying their file system right? Sorry that politics are in the way. It's certainly not as if Linux couldn't defrag during the process. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 19:28:42 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:28:42 -0600 Subject: Proven wireless mouse for Linux ? In-Reply-To: <200402271416.32256.skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200402271416.32256.skuznets@blueprint.org> Message-ID: <200402271328.42141.Garth@Webostics.com> > I do use Logitech Elite wireless Kbd + wireless optical mouse. > Work with no problems. > > Actually you can buy any woreless kbd or mouse. all of them uses standard > AT/PS2 or/and USB cables at the exit. Does the USB end work good on them too? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 19:26:52 2004 From: noah.gellner-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (Noah John Gellner) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 14:26:52 -0500 Subject: Ease of installation? In-Reply-To: <20040227140950.C22069-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w@public.gmane.org> References: <20040227140950.C22069@ee.ryerson.ca> Message-ID: <20040227192652.GA17631@butters.southtrak> On 14:09 Fri 27 Feb , Peter Hiscocks wrote: > I wonder if this 'ease of installation' is extending to permanent installs. > > Peter > Usually when I build a dual boot machine I partition when I first install Windows so I can't comment directly on the issue of partitioning and defraging per se. However, if you haven't installed Linux since the early days of Slackware, you are in for a pleasant surprise. I remember the old X documentation which required "black magic" to get the timings right. Mandrake and Redhat at least are extremely simple to set up. Debian takes a bit more at the beginng, but the configuration is very nice. I am a booster of Gentoo which is a mainly source install and while it takes a while to compile everthing, updates are fairly painless. I know that other *LUGs have install events, does TLUG? Noah -- Even Buddha punished evil - "Master Killer" -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 19:27:34 2004 From: linux-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Madison Kelly) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 14:27:34 -0500 Subject: Fedora Core 1 and a Palm Vx (Workpad c3) Message-ID: <403F9A26.7090701@alteeve.com> Hi all, I picked up recently a used pal pilot (The IBM Workpad c3 which is exactly a Palm Vx in a black case with the IBM logo). I tried connecting it to my computer via COM2 (ttys1, I would assume). However, as a user when I try to connect the the pilot (ask saying "No" when asked if I had ever sync'ed it before) it would just sit there seemingly forever, or at least until the palm gave up. Could someone who has got their Palm working as a user let me know what I need to do? Thanks! Madison PS - I am using [Redhat Start] -> Preferences -> More Preferences -> PalmOS Devices (Gnome Pilot). -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 19:27:53 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 14:27:53 -0500 Subject: Proven wireless mouse for Linux ? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040227192753.GR9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Wed, Feb 25, 2004 at 11:23:54PM +0200, Peter L. Peres wrote: > What type works well ? I have too many wires on the table. It must work at > least 12 hours on a set of batteries or charge. What about the third > button issue ? Does a ChordMiddle event make it through the wireless > protocol ? I think all wireless mice have at least 3 buttons (including the wheel) so you don't need chord middle. I know my dad's logitech 3 button (no wheel) from 97 runs a month or 2 on a set of AAAs. That's with 4 or 5 hours use daily. The logitech mx700 has rechargeable baterries (charges on docking station that is also base station) which is even nicer, and can use normal AAs if the rechargeables die and you don't want to buy new ones (don't place it on base station in that case though). The logitech wireless mice in general are rather nice though (better than MS's that has too much power up lag after being idle). Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 19:47:52 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:47:52 -0600 Subject: Ease of installation? In-Reply-To: <200402271327.51896.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040227140950.C22069@ee.ryerson.ca> <200402271327.51896.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <200402271347.52022.Garth@Webostics.com> On Fri February 27 2004 1:27 pm, Garth Meisel wrote: > Most *nix's can resize partitions easily but I don't think any guarantee > the defrag process for FAT32 or NTFS's. Sorry. I'm sure M$ would somehow > find something to sue or complain about because it is actually modifying > their file system right? Sorry that politics are in the way. It's > certainly not as if Linux couldn't defrag during the process. And I might need some SuSE sauce with that crow please! >From the link http://www.suse.com/us/private/products/suse_linux/i386/linwin.html But again, thankfully I don't have to deal with it so I can't guarantee it. This is the best I can come up with: Begin quote:. "No matter which version of Windows runs on your system - 95, 98, ME, NT, 2000, or XP - you can install SUSE LINUX 9.0 alongside it. During the installation, SUSE LINUX assists you in preparing the free space in the partition containing Windows 95, 98, or ME for your new Linux with a few mouse clicks. The Windows partition can easily be resized to the desired size without any loss of data. If you are not familiar with hard disk partitioning, simply let the system assistant YaST partition the hard disk automatically." -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 19:46:59 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 14:46:59 -0500 Subject: Fedora Core 1 and a Palm Vx (Workpad c3) In-Reply-To: <403F9A26.7090701-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <403F9A26.7090701@alteeve.com> Message-ID: <20040227194659.GT9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Feb 27, 2004 at 02:27:34PM -0500, Madison Kelly wrote: > Hi all, > > I picked up recently a used pal pilot (The IBM Workpad c3 which is > exactly a Palm Vx in a black case with the IBM logo). I tried connecting > it to my computer via COM2 (ttys1, I would assume). However, as a user > when I try to connect the the pilot (ask saying "No" when asked if I had > ever sync'ed it before) it would just sit there seemingly forever, or at > least until the palm gave up. > > Could someone who has got their Palm working as a user let me know > what I need to do? Thanks! > > Madison > > PS - I am using [Redhat Start] -> Preferences -> More Preferences -> > PalmOS Devices (Gnome Pilot). What permissions are on /dev/ttyS1? Does your user have access to read/write to that port? On debian the palm sync software usually asks and changes the group to a group that is just used for plan stuff so you can add your user to that group, or you can add the user to the normal dialout group that owns the serial ports (well the group) on debian. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 19:49:46 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 14:49:46 -0500 Subject: The great hunt for a WYSIWYG proggie In-Reply-To: <007501c3fd63$4ade2d10$0b9f9c18-UxDKcUsq0RM@public.gmane.org> References: <007501c3fd63$4ade2d10$0b9f9c18@main> Message-ID: <20040227194946.GU9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Feb 27, 2004 at 01:55:33PM -0500, Sidney Shapiro wrote: > I have a client ripping out his hair trying to get a decent PHP/Java (or > something else that will run on RH) program which will allow users to > edit html pages using this program online. Sort of like M$ FrontPage > but online and open source. I went through a couple dozen listings on > Source Forge, and after trying about a dozen out, non of them seem to > work properly (not developed enough). Has anyone installed something > like this before or have a recommendation for a program like this? I > have seen several perfect ones for sale, but they all range in the > $3-600 category and is a lot more than the $0 my client is willing to > spend. Any suggestions would be appreciated, I get the impression that zope does something like that, although I haven never used it myself. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 19:53:09 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 14:53:09 -0500 Subject: Ease of installation? In-Reply-To: <200402271347.52022.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040227140950.C22069@ee.ryerson.ca> <200402271327.51896.Garth@Webostics.com> <200402271347.52022.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <20040227195309.GV9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Feb 27, 2004 at 01:47:52PM -0600, Garth Meisel wrote: > And I might need some SuSE sauce with that crow please! > From the link > http://www.suse.com/us/private/products/suse_linux/i386/linwin.html > > But again, thankfully I don't have to deal with it so I can't guarantee it. > This is the best I can come up with: Begin quote:. > > "No matter which version of Windows runs on your system - 95, 98, ME, NT, > 2000, or XP - you can install SUSE LINUX 9.0 alongside it. During the > installation, SUSE LINUX assists you in preparing the free space in the > partition containing Windows 95, 98, or ME for your new Linux with a few > mouse clicks. The Windows partition can easily be resized to the desired size > without any loss of data. If you are not familiar with hard disk > partitioning, simply let the system assistant YaST partition the hard disk > automatically." So it says you can run it on a system that has any version of windows, and it says it can resize win95/98/Me drives (it does not say it can resize NTFS though). I wonder why... :) Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 19:55:21 2004 From: srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ at public.gmane.org (SRB) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 14:55:21 -0500 Subject: Ease of installation? References: <20040227140950.C22069@ee.ryerson.ca> Message-ID: <00bb01c3fd6b$ad87ec00$3b0000c0@mastec.ca> > The historic requirement has been to to defrag and then manually repartition > a hard drive in order to set up a dual-boot windows-linux system. I hear > rumours that some of the latest distros may be able to do this > semi-automatically. Could someone aware of the state of the art in this give > a summary of the current situation? Depending on your situation, you can do the following (just recently did this myself): 1. If your existing Windows system is on a SEPARATE partition (ie. you have more than one partition on your drive and Windows only occupies one of those partitions), you can easily use the Disk Management utility in XP/2000/NT to create an empty partition of the size you want for your new Linux installation (I picked 10GB for mine). Then I know from experience that if you install either Red Hat 9 or Fedora Core 1, it will detect that unused partition and allow you to select it for the install, in which case it will automatically sub-partition it to create a boot, root and swap partitions (still leaving around 9GB for your root files). 2. If you need to modify the partition that contains your Windows system, you might need something like Partition Magic (commercial Windows software), but I'm not sure how reliable it is for modifying the main system partition. I'd suggest to patiently backup everything you need (take your time not to miss anything you may require later) and reinstall windows, then install linux. Important note, is that during windows install (XP/2000/NT), you'll want to delete your existing drive partitions and create a new partition that is NOT 100% size of the disk (again something like 10GB). Then install Windows here, and the extra unpartitioned space you can set up for Linux like in point #1. I hope that helps a bit. Just an FYI, the current setup I have on my drive is 10GB partition for Windows, 10GB partition for Linux (which was subdivided by Fedora into 3 partitions: boot, root, and swap) and the remainder of my drive is set up as a FAT32 partition so that I can access files there from either OS. -Steve. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 20:00:08 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 14:00:08 -0600 Subject: Ease of installation? In-Reply-To: <200402271347.52022.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040227140950.C22069@ee.ryerson.ca> <200402271327.51896.Garth@Webostics.com> <200402271347.52022.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <200402271400.08315.Garth@Webostics.com> I really have to digress before I digest though. That could be just some misleading advertising. It usually takes about 1 week before SuSE ever gets back to me with an answer. I've asked but I can do one better than that. I'm doing a 98SE install for a friend on a box I'm building in between typing here so I'll try and copy a CD full of data to the drive and then delete some files and leave some big holes. Then I'll NOT defrag and install SuSE9. I'll let you know what happens. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 15:02:41 2004 From: skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ at public.gmane.org (Sergey Kuznetsov) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 15:02:41 +0000 Subject: Proven wireless mouse for Linux ? In-Reply-To: <200402271328.42141.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200402271416.32256.skuznets@blueprint.org> <200402271328.42141.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <200402271502.41268.skuznets@blueprint.org> On February 27, 2004 07:28 pm, Garth Meisel wrote: > > I do use Logitech Elite wireless Kbd + wireless optical mouse. > > Work with no problems. > > > > Actually you can buy any woreless kbd or mouse. all of them uses standard > > AT/PS2 or/and USB cables at the exit. > > Does the USB end work good on them too? I think so. I never tried it. I have a KVM switch who accepts only AT connectors. -- All the Best! Sergey Kuznetsov Senior Software Developer Blueprint Initiative at Samuel Lunenfeld Research Institute Mount Sinai Hospital 522 University Street Phone#: (416) 596-8505 x6343 E-Mail: skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 20:05:13 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 14:05:13 -0600 Subject: Ease of installation? In-Reply-To: <20040227195309.GV9627-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <20040227140950.C22069@ee.ryerson.ca> <200402271347.52022.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040227195309.GV9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <200402271405.13927.Garth@Webostics.com> Beat me to the punch that time. To make sure this process happens WITHOUT SuSE simply not doing the defrag, I'll be sure to to record the partition size before and after. Len, or others, is it proper that I fdisk (ms-dos) the HD with only one partition before this little test or is there a better way to make sure the results are absolute? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 20:18:47 2004 From: william.ohiggins-H217xnMUJC0sA/PxXw9srA at public.gmane.org (William O'Higgins) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 15:18:47 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <200402271250.34330.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200402271250.34330.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <20040227201847.GA1423@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> On Fri, Feb 27, 2004 at 12:50:34PM -0600, Garth Meisel wrote: >I don't remember where I heard something that lies within this last post about >ISP's reporting the users to the authorities. Some ISP's were reporting the >IP's, bandwidth used, and providing names of users to the authorities. >Somewhere down the road someone said "Invasion of privacy" or some other >legitimate right and now some ISP's have either had to rewrite their customer >contracts but some have outright refused to co-operate with the authorities. Most Terms of Service contracts with ISPs allow the ISP to reveal certain aspects of your user information simply by fiat, though that is changing a little bit as people begin to read the contracts they sign and choose between functionally equivalent providers based on how draconian their TOS are [1]. In any case, if an ISP is subpoenaed for client information, they are obliged to produce that information. >That without a doubt cannot be >legal in any way shape or form no matter who the authority is SO LONG as the >activity is not TERRORIST related but this also a new area without much >precedent thus far. This is a common misconception about precedent in the Internet age [2]. Most issues at law are well-covered by precedent by this point, such as client confidentiality and user information lists. These issues have been well tested long before the computer came along, and the precedents are valid. Most Internet activity when addressed in a courtroom is simply an different medium for the same content, and law is frequently medium-neutral. In the case of ISPs, they must produce their client's information when presented with a court order, or they must challenge the order (Shaw Communications is doing this at the moment). It is likely that as ISP the doesn't maintain records of which customers are using which IP addresses and how much bandwidth each customer is using could be found negligent in a civil suit because they create an environment which encourages criminal activity. [1] This came up a few years ago when Yahoo bought Geocities, and changed the TOS (which was legal) to read that information presented on Geocities web space was the property of Geocites/Yahoo (which is also legal). This cheesed a lot of people off, and they changed their TOS, but it was legal. I haven't read the Hotmail TOS in a while, but M$ may well own all that you write from a Hotmail account. [2] Some issues are relatively new though, such as whether cross-indexing databases, cross-site scripting and click tracking is an invasion of privacy or whether computer-generated personal information databases are salable intellectual property or whether they are derivative works. We do live in interesting times, and since "ethic change with technology" (i.e., what is acceptable depends on what is possible) things are only going to get more interesting. -- yours, William -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 20:31:27 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 14:31:27 -0600 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <20040227201847.GA1423-dS67q9zC6oM7y9Lc2D0nHSCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org> References: <200402271250.34330.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040227201847.GA1423@sillyrabbi.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <200402271431.27107.Garth@Webostics.com> Thank you, I love learning. And it's still absolutely astounding how many people think they're intelligent and or educated that simply click the "Accept" or "OK" buttons without reading what they've just become party to. And what's worse is how many software and other companies simply try to get away with as much as they possibly can because they know that exact same thing. The other day I tried to inform some of my family members what their EULA entailed but I honestly had to give up on the 31st different link to yet another page of blah blah blah. : ) Interesting times without a doubt. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 21:26:07 2004 From: taavi-LbuTpDkqzNzXI80/IeQp7B2eb7JE58TQ at public.gmane.org (Taavi Burns) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 14:26:07 -0700 Subject: Ease of installation? In-Reply-To: <200402271400.08315.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040227140950.C22069@ee.ryerson.ca> <200402271327.51896.Garth@Webostics.com> <200402271347.52022.Garth@Webostics.com> <200402271400.08315.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <20040227212607.GA44338@idiom.novusordo.net> On Fri, Feb 27, 2004 at 02:00:08PM -0600, Garth Meisel wrote: > I'm doing a 98SE install for a friend on a box I'm building in between typing > here so I'll try and copy a CD full of data to the drive and then delete some > files and leave some big holes. Then I'll NOT defrag and install SuSE9. > I'll let you know what happens. I suspect that we are far beyond the days of FIPS when one did have to defrag first (as it would 'fake' the partition into being smaller by tweaking some numbers and that's it). FAT is not a compilcated filesystem and its format is well understood. I suspect that the SuSE installer is capable of moving any data from the end of the disk into empty space to make space for itself. But that's my suspicion only. PartitionMagic definitely does this (with NTFS too, to boot). I've not heard any horror stories about PartitionMagic, and it's a lot faster than a reinstall of Windows, even if it is sometimes very slow (it's being 'safe'). Definitely backup important documents first. In fact, go and back up your important documents now, and regularly. :) -- taa Belief gets in the way of learning. - Robert A. Heinlein /*eof*/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 21:33:10 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 15:33:10 -0600 Subject: Ease of installation? In-Reply-To: <20040227212607.GA44338-7r3UYZMxfuqyvPIx3LBjwNHuzzzSOjJt@public.gmane.org> References: <20040227140950.C22069@ee.ryerson.ca> <200402271400.08315.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040227212607.GA44338@idiom.novusordo.net> Message-ID: <200402271533.10075.Garth@Webostics.com> That's what I'm hoping but I think I service too many M$ friends. Not the way it sounds! I promise the results before 5:00pm my time (CST). I really don't like CROW that much. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 22:36:41 2004 From: matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (G. Matthew Rice) Date: 27 Feb 2004 17:36:41 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Herb Richter writes: > Not having read the whole text of the appeal until now, I wasn't aware > that the Canadian court considered a *lot* of American law (i.e. the Texas > long arm statute and the 14th Amendment to the US Constitution). But it > does seem to me that this was done in the context of Canadian laws. As a fellow lay-person, my understanding is that the courts will look at precedents from the UK [preferably] and then the USA and, maybe, other places. If there isn't anything in Canada already. -- g. matthew rice starnix inc. phone: 905-771-0017 x242 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 22:50:19 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 16:50:19 -0600 Subject: Ease of installation? In-Reply-To: <200402271533.10075.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040227140950.C22069@ee.ryerson.ca> <20040227212607.GA44338@idiom.novusordo.net> <200402271533.10075.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <200402271650.19745.Garth@Webostics.com> Yeah well didn't expect a ploppy floppy to be out of tolerable condition so I need to add a little more time to this. Haven't even got the dose yet but some might say that's a good thing : ) Sorry. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 22:58:33 2004 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 17:58:33 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <007301c3fd62$95db1090$0b9f9c18-UxDKcUsq0RM@public.gmane.org> References: <007301c3fd62$95db1090$0b9f9c18@main> Message-ID: <403FCB99.7010108@rogers.com> Sidney Shapiro wrote: >>LOL! Good one. Did you ever read that public rebuke that Mel Hurting > > gave > >>to >>Paul Cerlucci, the US Ambassador? I can send it to you offlist if you >>want. >> > > > Could I please get a copy too? > > Thanks, > > Sid Might as well send it to me too. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 23:09:17 2004 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 18:09:17 -0500 Subject: Interesting warning regarding filesharing In-Reply-To: <403FCB99.7010108-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org> References: <007301c3fd62$95db1090$0b9f9c18@main> <403FCB99.7010108@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20040227180917.7e2ce0fa.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 17:58:33 -0500 James Knott disseminated the following: > Might as well send it to me too. Okay, I'll just post it here, it's plain text anyhow. Send it to all your American friends ;-) Mel Hurtig to Paul Cellucci Date: April 4, 2003 Location: University of Victoria Speech on Canada - U.S. Relations -- Mel Hurtig (780) 488-3832 mhurtig-sK6dKysfGH7D0D/r9Z6QQA at public.gmane.org At The University of Victoria April 4, 2003 "I want to say a few words about the ill-mannered, obnoxious, arrogant U.S. Ambassador to Canada, Paul Cellucci. Mr. Cellucci, you ask why Canada doesn't support the United States. Why have we let you down? Is not an equally justified question, Mr. Cellucci, why have you not supported Canada? Why have you turned your back on us? Why have you and your country proceeded in a reckless, arrogant manner which is 100% guaranteed to substantially increase terrorism and volatility around the world, is guaranteed to destabilize Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Iran, Pakistan (with its nuclear weapons), Turkey, Indonesia, the Philippines, Sudan, Yemen and many other countries? Why have you launched into this foolhardy aggression that will cause hundreds of millions of Muslims to hate and despise Westerners for generations into the future, with potentially cataclysmic results, for ourselves, for our children and for our grandchildren? Mr. Cellucci, you ask why Canada doesn't support the United States in your aggressive, pre-emptive militarism. Let me give you just a few of the reasons: First, we are opposed to war when we believe there are viable alternatives to war. Scores of countries, Canada included, made it clear that they believed that more weapons inspectors and more time would determine whether or not Iraq had weapons of mass destruction. We also believed that unless they were invaded, there was no probability of Iraq launching attacks beyond its border. We also believed that there was no evidence of cooperation between two natural opponents, Saddam Hussein and Osama Bin Laden. We also believed that your war would kill and injure thousands of innocents. We also believed that we should not break with clear, long-established international lawS. international law which is the fundamental basis of the United Nations. Unlike your country, Mr. Cellucci, Canada has always been a strong supporter of the United Nations. Perhaps, Mr. Cellucci, you should look in a mirror and ask why it is that BOTH your NAFTA partners fought off heavy pressure from the White House and your State Department to join your ill-advised war. After all, didn't Mr. Bush once say that the U.S. has no greater friend than Mexico? Where is it mandated that if your neighbour chooses to go off into a potentially catastrophic war, you must go too, even if we strongly disagree with your reasons and your logic, and if we regard your evidence for the necessity of war with the greatest skepticism? Mr. Cellucci, the war your country has launched is the very type of war that was so harshly condemned by the Nuremberg War Crime Trials. How is your attack on Baghdad different from the terrible day of infamy that Franklin Delano Roosevelt spoke of after Japans attack on Pearl Harbour, December 7th, 1941? Today, just as we were in the case of the Vietnam War, Canada is on the right side of history in relation to the war on Iraq. Were also on the side of morality, justice and well-established, principled international law. And were also on the side of innocent Iraqi men, women and children, not to mention the young British and American men and women who have been and will be killed both during the war, and for many years AFTER the war is over in the Balkans - like quagmire of ethnic war lords, bigotry and hatred and in the inevitable civil war that will result from the debris of Americas so-called and almost humorous, if it wasn't so deadly - coalition of the willing. You know, bullied and bribed countries like Cameroon, the Marshall Island, Angola, Guinea, Ethiopia, El Salvador and Eritrea. Several times in your inappropriate, offensive, threatening speech, Mr. Cellucci, you referred to Canadians as part of our family. Mr. Cellucci, this might come as a surprise for you, but we are NOT part of your family and we have no desire to be part of your family. In a public opinion poll for Macleans magazine, Canadians were asked how they would describe our relations with the U.S. Only one in three said like family or best friends. 65% said cordial but distant or openly hostile. In another Macleans poll, 72% of Canadians said that they did not want to move closer to the U.S. And, more recently, only 8% said they thought Canada should become more like the U.SS Five times as many opted for less like the U.S. Mr. Cellucci, some of these poll results were from polls taken soon after September 11th, when world-wide sympathy and support for your country was impressive and enthusiastic. Shouldnt you be asking yourself how you and Mr. Bush and Donald Rumsfeld and Dick Cheney have managed to squander so much popular support from around the world in so short a time? Mr. Cellucci, you say that the United States would be there for Canada and that Americans are disappointed and upset that Canada is not supporting the U.S. now. Please tell me, exactly, where was the United Sates when from 1914 to 1917 tens of thousands of young Canadian men were left dead in the muddy trenches of Europe fighting off the Germans? And, where was the United Sates from 1939 to late 1941, when Germany was overrunning Europe and the Luftwaffe and the rockets were bombing England and killing tens of thousands of men, women and children during the blitz and the Germans were beginning their roundup of millions of Jews who would be slaughtered in the Nazi concentration camps? How is it that even though you knew exactly what was happening, your country sat back in the face of so much evil and agony, and waited until the Japanese attacked you before you finally, reluctantly, got involved in the war against the brutal Nazis? Mr. Cellucci, Id like to hear your answer to that question. And, by the way, thank you for being there for us when your country invaded us three times, the only country to ever invade Canada. And, please dont ever lecture us again about going to war. We left 45,000 Canadians in European graves during our defence of liberty and democracy in the Second World War, while for much of the war your isolationists refused to get involved. Mr. Cellucci, lets be clear. Canadians do not approve of your bad manners, your grossly undiplomatic behaviour, your lecturing us about defence spending, your warnings about the possible linkage of our opposition to war with your trade policies. Best be careful. If you want to advocate linkage, Canadians may want to consider imposing a 27% tariff on our exports of oil, natural gas and electricity to the United States as a reasonable quid pro quo for your egregious softwood lumber duties. After all, you do believe in reciprocity, dont you? And, dont for a moment consider it a meaningful warning for you to suggest that Mr. Bush might not want to come to Canada for his official state visit next month. Canadians well remember the disastrous results for Canadian sovereignty when Ronald Reagan visited the obsequious Brian Mulroney in Quebec City in 1985. Moreover, we all know why Mr. Bush was or is planning to come to Ottawa. There was only one reason. Not to patch up relations between the two countries, but rather to get your hands on even more of Canadas oil, natural gas and electricity. Best mind your manners, Mr. Cellucci, or the Canadian government might just possibly finally wake up to the fact that Mexico, your other NAFTA partner, firmly refused to sign the ridiculous NAFTA energy and resource-sharing agreement that some of our inept trade negotiators somehow managed to agree to. Perhaps the Canadian government will realize that we haven't replaced our declining natural gas reserves since 1982. That our major Western sedimentary basin pools are depleting at the rate of 20% a year, that new replacement reserves are proving to be much more expensive to locate, are smaller in size and deplete more rapidly. Mind your manners Mr. Cellucci, or perhaps Canada will have to walk away from the foolish NAFTA clauses that mean we must continue selling you 62% of our oil and natural gas, even if we Canadians begin to run short ourselves. Mr. Cellucci, you were greatly upset that Cabinet Minister Herb Dhaliwal made totally inappropriate remarks by suggesting that George W. Bush was a failed statesman. My, my, my. How terribly offensive can one be? How does failed statesman compare with Richard Nixon calling Prime Minister Pierre Trudeau an asshole, or John F. Kennedy calling Prime Minister John Diefenbaker a son of a bitch and a prick, or Lyndon Johnson grabbing Lester Pearson by the collar and shouting you pissed on my rug when Pearson suggested a pause in the U.S. bombing of North Vietnam and the slaughter of hundreds of thousands of civilians in the bombing. It seems to me that being called a failed statesman is not only a mild criticism by comparison, but it is an accurate criticism. George W. Bush is no moron. Few Canadians regard Americans as bastards. Most Canadians like most Americans. But, not since the days of Richard Nixon and the Vietnam War has there been so much anti-Americanism in the world. The U.S. has antagonized not only the Muslim world, but long-time allies as well. It has walked away from, worked against or failed to support a long list of international agreements supported by Canada and the overwhelming majority of countries - the Land Mines Treaty, the Nuclear Test Ban Treaty, the agreement to provide lower cost drugs to developing countries battling AIDS and other diseases, the International Criminal Court, the U.N. protocol on Developing, Producing or Stockpiling Biological or Toxic Weapons, the Small Arms Treaty, the United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child (supported by 191 countries, but not the U.S. or Somalia!). While it is true that in recent months anti-Americanism in Canada has been increasing, and has increased since the invasion of Iraq and your ill-considered remarks, most of the antipathy is directed not at average Americans, but at George W. Bush and the arrogant, aggressive men and women who surround him as key advisors, the repugnant Donald Rumsfeld, the selfishly-motivated Dick Cheney, Karl Rowe and Paul Wolfowitz and other American hyper hawks who apparently place little value on human lives and have little appreciation for the value of patient international diplomacy. Mr. Cellucci, Canadians are not impressed by your campaign of intimidation, by threats re the border, by proposed American boycotts of Canadian products. Perhaps you would much better serve your country if you reminded your fellow citizens that millions of American jobs depend on your exports to Canada, that as every year goes by you will become increasingly dependent on imports of Canadian resources, that for 46 years in a row Canada has been the leading export market in the world for U.S. goods and services, that your exports to Canada every year are greater than your exports to all fifteen European Union countries combined, greater than your exports to Japan, the United Kingdom and Germany put together and more than to all of Latin America and the Caribbean countries combined. Perhaps, instead of threatening us with economic retaliation for not taking part in your military aggression, you would be wise to remind Americans that by punishing Canadians you would be harming your best customer (not a very bright thing to do), you would be harming the profitable American companies that dominate so much of the Canadian economy, and you would be encouraging more anti-Americanism in Canada. Mr. Cellucci, both you and your predecessor Gordon Giffin and Senator Hillary Clinton have expressed concerns about the Canada-U.S. border and, in Giffins words, skepticism about Canadas reliability on security. Forget for a moment that Canada has already committed close to an extra $10 billion to security and defence spending since September 11th. Forget too, that Canada has had in place overseas document-screening for air travelers well before the United States even thought of such precautions. Forget that the September 11th terrorists were mostly from your Saudi Arabian friends, and were in the U.S. on visas. Forget that at the time of September 11th there were some six million illegals living in your country, but do consider the following. There is not one single airport in Canada, not one single flight school that would have been dumb enough to agree to train people from the Middle East how to fly large passenger jet aircraft - people who had no interest in learning how to take off or how to land the aircraft - without quickly reporting the highly suspicious students to the RCMP and/or to CSIS. Once again, Mr. Cellucci, look in the mirror instead of warning Canadians re security. Increasingly, your CIA, your FBI, your National Security Agency, all with huge multi-billion dollar budgets, make the term American intelligence seem like a laughable oxymoron. And, by the way, have you thought about apologizing to Canadians for all the Canadians killed on September 11th and for your own irresponsible action in appointing your personal driver as head of security at Logan Airport in Boston, where two of the ill-fated aircraft and their hijackers took off from? Dont you think that you owe Canadians an apology? Shouldnt it be Canadians who need to be concerned about the border, given your poor security record and all the violent nutcases your gun-ridden society breeds, your murderous snipers, your anthrax disseminators, your Timothy McVeighs, your Columbines, your paranoid militia, your aggressive history and behaviour? Please dont threaten us about the border, because if you do, we might just decide to look more closely at your own records. And, dont for a single moment believe that Tom dAquino, Allan Gotlieb and Brian Mulroney represent majority opinion in Canada. They never have, and they certainly dont now. The best thing you and your fellow Americans can do in the best interests of future Canadian - American relations, is to listen carefully to every word Mr. dAquino, Mr. Gotlieb and Mr. Mulroney say, and then remember that Brian Mulroney left office as the least-popular prime minister in Canadian history, and that most Canadians do not subscribe to the craven policies of Gotlieb and dAquino. Canada, you and Mr. Bush may find it hard to believe, is not yet an American colony, and we have no intention of becoming one. You would best serve your country by making that clear in Washington." -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 18:05:03 up 22 days, 5:49, 6 users, load average: 1.22, 1.14, 1.13 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ "If the Nuremberg laws were applied, then every post-war American president would have been hanged."-- Noam Chomsky -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From street_smart-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 23:20:24 2004 From: street_smart-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (StreetSmart) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 18:20:24 -0500 Subject: Question Message-ID: If I have a question I would like to ask. How do i e-mail the question to all? Thanks allot StreetSmart -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From btraynor-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 23:20:51 2004 From: btraynor-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org (bill traynor) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 18:20:51 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1077924051.702.4.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> On Fri, 2004-02-27 at 18:20, StreetSmart wrote: > If I have a question I would like to ask. How do i e-mail the question to > all? Thanks allot You just did. tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org reaches everyone. > > StreetSmart > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 23:33:04 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 17:33:04 -0600 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <1077924051.702.4.camel-W1ecohOu015D6NYMwsFkEdAWLNoT+7d/@public.gmane.org> References: <1077924051.702.4.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> Message-ID: <200402271733.04718.Garth@Webostics.com> I don't particularly enjoy smart C SUCKERS thinking they can prove a point by pulling a simple OLD ploy. I don't know what the rest of you think but I think this person needs to learn a lesson in security! -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 23:34:54 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 17:34:54 -0600 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <200402271733.04718.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <1077924051.702.4.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> <200402271733.04718.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <200402271734.54018.Garth@Webostics.com> And especially when a header doesn't say Hotmail but says M$! There is no hiding and now it will be proven. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 23:37:16 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 17:37:16 -0600 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <200402271734.54018.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200402271733.04718.Garth@Webostics.com> <200402271734.54018.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <200402271737.16269.Garth@Webostics.com> and the IP in question was 24.42.141.235 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From street_smart-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 23:36:10 2004 From: street_smart-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (StreetSmart) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 18:36:10 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <1077924051.702.4.camel-W1ecohOu015D6NYMwsFkEdAWLNoT+7d/@public.gmane.org> References: <1077924051.702.4.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> Message-ID: Thanks. I?m interested in learning to use Linux. Iv read a number of articles on different distros, and it seems to me like everyone thinks Freebsd is the best to start with. Any suggestions on what one to start with, and were to get it would be helpful. I know www.linuxiso.com has allot of distros, but my burner isn?t working so I guess ill resort to buying a copy, the money goes to Linux anyways, mine as well help them out. Thanks again. StreetSmart -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org]On Behalf Of bill traynor Sent: Friday, February 27, 2004 6:21 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Question On Fri, 2004-02-27 at 18:20, StreetSmart wrote: > If I have a question I would like to ask. How do i e-mail the question to > all? Thanks allot You just did. tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org reaches everyone. > > StreetSmart > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 23:38:02 2004 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 18:38:02 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <200402271733.04718.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <1077924051.702.4.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> <200402271733.04718.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <20040227183802.11c6fd72.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 17:33:04 -0600 Garth Meisel disseminated the following: > I don't particularly enjoy smart C SUCKERS thinking they can prove a point by > pulling a simple OLD ploy. I don't know what the rest of you think but I > think this person needs to learn a lesson in security! WTF? -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 18:37:50 up 22 days, 6:22, 6 users, load average: 1.45, 1.33, 1.25 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ "The free communication of ideas and opinions is one of the most precious of the rights of man."-- Declaration of the Rights of Man -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 23:41:51 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 17:41:51 -0600 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <20040227183802.11c6fd72.joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <200402271733.04718.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040227183802.11c6fd72.joehill@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <200402271741.51228.Garth@Webostics.com> You're used to 2 messages on the same LUG? -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 23:42:51 2004 From: Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ at public.gmane.org (Garth Meisel) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 17:42:51 -0600 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <200402271741.51228.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040227183802.11c6fd72.joehill@sympatico.ca> <200402271741.51228.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <200402271742.51038.Garth@Webostics.com> On Fri February 27 2004 5:41 pm, Garth Meisel wrote: > You're used to 2 messages on the same LUG? And it's already tooooooooooooooooooooooooooo late anyway. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 23:51:22 2004 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 18:51:22 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <200402271734.54018.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <1077924051.702.4.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> <200402271733.04718.Garth@Webostics.com> <200402271734.54018.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <20040227185122.19d66aeb.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 17:34:54 -0600 Garth Meisel disseminated the following: > And especially when a header doesn't say Hotmail but says M$! There is no > hiding and now it will be proven. K, you're going to have to enlighten me, I must be thick but I have no idea what you're referring to. For me, the headers show a Rogers account and using Outlook :-\ -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 18:50:04 up 22 days, 6:34, 6 users, load average: 1.49, 1.30, 1.27 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ "The philosophers have only interpreted the world in various ways. The point, however, is to change it."-- Karl Marx -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 23:54:09 2004 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 18:54:09 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <20040227185122.19d66aeb.joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <1077924051.702.4.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> <200402271733.04718.Garth@Webostics.com> <200402271734.54018.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040227185122.19d66aeb.joehill@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <403FD8A1.7030305@rogers.com> JoeHill wrote: > On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 17:34:54 -0600 > Garth Meisel disseminated the following: > > >>And especially when a header doesn't say Hotmail but says M$! There is no >>hiding and now it will be proven. > > > K, you're going to have to enlighten me, I must be thick but I have no idea what > you're referring to. For me, the headers show a Rogers account and using > Outlook :-\ > That's about all I noticed too, plus the fact he's on my subnet. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 00:35:00 2004 From: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (Peter Hiscocks) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 19:35:00 -0500 Subject: Ease of installation? In-Reply-To: <20040227195309.GV9627-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org>; from lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org on Fri, Feb 27, 2004 at 02:53:09PM -0500 References: <20040227140950.C22069@ee.ryerson.ca> <200402271327.51896.Garth@Webostics.com> <200402271347.52022.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040227195309.GV9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <20040227193500.A3330@ee.ryerson.ca> Interesting. I'll check that out. Thanks, guys. I have an older version of Partition Magic, but it no longer works on something like W98, and I'm loath to spring for the cost of an upgrade. Peter On Fri, Feb 27, 2004 at 02:53:09PM -0500, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > On Fri, Feb 27, 2004 at 01:47:52PM -0600, Garth Meisel wrote: > > And I might need some SuSE sauce with that crow please! > > From the link > > http://www.suse.com/us/private/products/suse_linux/i386/linwin.html > > > > But again, thankfully I don't have to deal with it so I can't guarantee it. > > This is the best I can come up with: Begin quote:. > > > > "No matter which version of Windows runs on your system - 95, 98, ME, NT, > > 2000, or XP - you can install SUSE LINUX 9.0 alongside it. During the > > installation, SUSE LINUX assists you in preparing the free space in the > > partition containing Windows 95, 98, or ME for your new Linux with a few > > mouse clicks. The Windows partition can easily be resized to the desired size > > without any loss of data. If you are not familiar with hard disk > > partitioning, simply let the system assistant YaST partition the hard disk > > automatically." > > So it says you can run it on a system that has any version of windows, > and it says it can resize win95/98/Me drives (it does not say it can > resize NTFS though). I wonder why... :) > > Lennart Sorensen > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- Peter D. Hiscocks Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering Ryerson University, 350 Victoria Street, Toronto, Ontario, M5B 2K3, Canada Phone: (416) 979-5000 Ext 6109 Fax: (416) 979-5280 Email: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org URL: http://www.ee.ryerson.ca/~phiscock -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 00:41:51 2004 From: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (Peter Hiscocks) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 19:41:51 -0500 Subject: Ease of installation? In-Reply-To: <00bb01c3fd6b$ad87ec00$3b0000c0-v1hdsqwqw2f3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org>; from srb-s8PdfxpoPdHk1uMJSBkQmQ@public.gmane.org on Fri, Feb 27, 2004 at 02:55:21PM -0500 References: <20040227140950.C22069@ee.ryerson.ca> <00bb01c3fd6b$ad87ec00$3b0000c0@mastec.ca> Message-ID: <20040227194151.B3330@ee.ryerson.ca> The problem usually is that the system was installed with one partition, since that's the default for installing windows. (It would be nice if Microsoft would provide a spare partition, but that seems unlikely. ;). Partition Magic is expensive, so I'd like to avoid that if possible. And backing up the system is a nice idea, but unless you have a working writeable CDROM on the system, it's really not practical. (I guess the alternative would be to put in another hard drive.) Defragging is not too much to ask - that's easy to do in advance of an install. But moving the partitions around is the sticking point. Anyway, I'll take a look at the Suse offering. Thanks for the suggestions. Peter On Fri, Feb 27, 2004 at 02:55:21PM -0500, SRB wrote: > > The historic requirement has been to to defrag and then manually > repartition > > a hard drive in order to set up a dual-boot windows-linux system. I hear > > rumours that some of the latest distros may be able to do this > > semi-automatically. Could someone aware of the state of the art in this > give > > a summary of the current situation? > > Depending on your situation, you can do the following (just recently did > this myself): > > 1. If your existing Windows system is on a SEPARATE partition (ie. you have > more than one partition on your drive and Windows only occupies one of those > partitions), you can easily use the Disk Management utility in XP/2000/NT to > create an empty partition of the size you want for your new Linux > installation (I picked 10GB for mine). Then I know from experience that if > you install either Red Hat 9 or Fedora Core 1, it will detect that unused > partition and allow you to select it for the install, in which case it will > automatically sub-partition it to create a boot, root and swap partitions > (still leaving around 9GB for your root files). > > 2. If you need to modify the partition that contains your Windows system, > you might need something like Partition Magic (commercial Windows software), > but I'm not sure how reliable it is for modifying the main system partition. > I'd suggest to patiently backup everything you need (take your time not to > miss anything you may require later) and reinstall windows, then install > linux. Important note, is that during windows install (XP/2000/NT), you'll > want to delete your existing drive partitions and create a new partition > that is NOT 100% size of the disk (again something like 10GB). Then install > Windows here, and the extra unpartitioned space you can set up for Linux > like in point #1. > > I hope that helps a bit. > > Just an FYI, the current setup I have on my drive is 10GB partition for > Windows, 10GB partition for Linux (which was subdivided by Fedora into 3 > partitions: boot, root, and swap) and the remainder of my drive is set up as > a FAT32 partition so that I can access files there from either OS. > > -Steve. > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- Peter D. Hiscocks Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering Ryerson University, 350 Victoria Street, Toronto, Ontario, M5B 2K3, Canada Phone: (416) 979-5000 Ext 6109 Fax: (416) 979-5280 Email: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org URL: http://www.ee.ryerson.ca/~phiscock -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From btraynor-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 01:20:32 2004 From: btraynor-zC6tqtfhjqE at public.gmane.org (bill traynor) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 20:20:32 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <200402271733.04718.Garth-xsdjDKdUMl2akBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org> References: <1077924051.702.4.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> <200402271733.04718.Garth@Webostics.com> Message-ID: <1077931231.702.6.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> On Fri, 2004-02-27 at 18:33, Garth Meisel wrote: > I don't particularly enjoy smart C SUCKERS thinking they can prove a point by > pulling a simple OLD ploy. I don't know what the rest of you think but I > think this person needs to learn a lesson in security! Did I miss something? > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 01:40:22 2004 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 20:40:22 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <1077931231.702.6.camel-W1ecohOu015D6NYMwsFkEdAWLNoT+7d/@public.gmane.org> References: <1077924051.702.4.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> <200402271733.04718.Garth@Webostics.com> <1077931231.702.6.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> Message-ID: <20040227204022.32632595.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 20:20:32 -0500 bill traynor disseminated the following: > Did I miss something? I dunno, I think someone's tinfoil hat is on too tight ;-) -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 20:39:48 up 22 days, 8:24, 6 users, load average: 1.17, 1.31, 1.38 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Mandrake Linux release 9.2 (FiveStar) for i586 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ "When you give food to the poor, they call you a saint. When you ask why the poor have no food, they call you a communist."-- Archbishop Helder Camara -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rufmetal-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 02:19:30 2004 From: rufmetal-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Chris Keelan) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 21:19:30 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <20040227185122.19d66aeb.joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <1077924051.702.4.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> <200402271733.04718.Garth@Webostics.com> <200402271734.54018.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040227185122.19d66aeb.joehill@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <20040227211930.64a0a997.rufmetal@eol.ca> On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 18:51:22 -0500 JoeHill wrote: > K, you're going to have to enlighten me, I must be thick but I have no > idea what you're referring to. For me, the headers show a Rogers > account and using Outlook :-\ YHBT. HAND. ~ C -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From kru_tch-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 02:58:42 2004 From: kru_tch-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (Stephen Allen) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 21:58:42 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <20040227211930.64a0a997.rufmetal-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <1077924051.702.4.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> <200402271733.04718.Garth@Webostics.com> <200402271734.54018.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040227185122.19d66aeb.joehill@sympatico.ca> <20040227211930.64a0a997.rufmetal@eol.ca> Message-ID: <20040228025841.GF31117@barnyard.192.168.0.1> On Fri, Feb 27, 2004 at 09:19:30PM -0500 or thereabouts, Chris Keelan wrote: > On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 18:51:22 -0500 > JoeHill wrote: > > > K, you're going to have to enlighten me, I must be thick but I have no > > idea what you're referring to. For me, the headers show a Rogers > > account and using Outlook :-\ > > YHBT. Who has been? What a confusing thread... -- Stephen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 03:33:44 2004 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 22:33:44 -0500 Subject: Ease of installation? In-Reply-To: <20040227193500.A3330-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w@public.gmane.org> References: <20040227140950.C22069@ee.ryerson.ca> <200402271327.51896.Garth@Webostics.com> <200402271347.52022.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040227195309.GV9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20040227193500.A3330@ee.ryerson.ca> Message-ID: <40400C18.7080801@rogers.com> Peter Hiscocks wrote: > Interesting. I'll check that out. Thanks, guys. > > I have an older version of Partition Magic, but it no longer works on > something like W98, and I'm loath to spring for the cost of an upgrade. Can't you build PM DOS bootable disks? That's the way I've usually used it. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 04:27:44 2004 From: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org (Peter Hiscocks) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 23:27:44 -0500 Subject: Ease of installation? In-Reply-To: <40400C18.7080801-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>; from james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org on Fri, Feb 27, 2004 at 10:33:44PM -0500 References: <20040227140950.C22069@ee.ryerson.ca> <200402271327.51896.Garth@Webostics.com> <200402271347.52022.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040227195309.GV9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <20040227193500.A3330@ee.ryerson.ca> <40400C18.7080801@rogers.com> Message-ID: <20040227232744.B9589@ee.ryerson.ca> I suspect that the earlier versions of PM cannot cope with the gigabyte sized disks, and that's why it didn't work on the most recent versions of Windows. (So it's not the operating system, I'm sorry, I didn't make that clear.) I don't know if that would be different at the DOS level, I didn't try it, but I rather doubt it if it's an issue relating to the size of the disk. Peter On Fri, Feb 27, 2004 at 10:33:44PM -0500, James Knott wrote: > Peter Hiscocks wrote: > > Interesting. I'll check that out. Thanks, guys. > > > > I have an older version of Partition Magic, but it no longer works on > > something like W98, and I'm loath to spring for the cost of an upgrade. > > Can't you build PM DOS bootable disks? That's the way I've usually used it. > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- Peter D. Hiscocks Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering Ryerson University, 350 Victoria Street, Toronto, Ontario, M5B 2K3, Canada Phone: (416) 979-5000 Ext 6109 Fax: (416) 979-5280 Email: phiscock-g851W1bGYuGnS0EtXVNi6w at public.gmane.org URL: http://www.ee.ryerson.ca/~phiscock -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rufmetal-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 06:19:21 2004 From: rufmetal-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Chris Keelan) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 01:19:21 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: References: <1077924051.702.4.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> Message-ID: <20040228011921.7425fcba.rufmetal@eol.ca> On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 18:36:10 -0500 "StreetSmart" wrote: > Thanks. I_m interested in learning to use Linux. Iv read a number of > articles on different distros, and it seems to me like everyone thinks > Freebsd is the best to start with. Any suggestions on what one to > start with, and were to get it would be helpful. I know > www.linuxiso.com has allot of distros, but my burner isn_t working so > I guess ill resort to buying a copy, the money goes to Linux anyways, > mine as well help them out. Thanks again. Please provide a link to the article(s) which state(s) that FreeBSD is the best Linux distro for a beginner. I'd love to read it/them. I know, I know: IHBT. Thanks, I'll HAND. ~ C -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Fri Feb 27 21:24:24 2004 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter L. Peres) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 23:24:24 +0200 (IST) Subject: Proven wireless mouse for Linux ? In-Reply-To: <200402271416.32256.skuznets-WRMZ5ucGVl4BXFe83j6qeQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200402271416.32256.skuznets@blueprint.org> Message-ID: On Fri, 27 Feb 2004, Sergey Kuznetsov wrote: > On February 25, 2004 09:23 pm, Peter L. Peres wrote: > > What type works well ? I have too many wires on the table. It must work at > > least 12 hours on a set of batteries or charge. What about the third > > button issue ? Does a ChordMiddle event make it through the wireless > > protocol ? > > I do use Logitech Elite wireless Kbd + wireless optical mouse. > Work with no problems. > > Actually you can buy any woreless kbd or mouse. all of them uses standard > AT/PS2 or/and USB cables at the exit. Thanks. I appreciate your answer. Are there any issues with regard to chording mouse buttons, wheel issues etc ? I understand that some wireless protocols may not like several mouse buttons held down at the same time etc. What about extra keys on the keyboard ? Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 12:54:23 2004 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 07:54:23 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <20040228025841.GF31117-o7t0nEE3I5NAPr+L1dq8bsJ5zM57E+Gt@public.gmane.org> References: <1077924051.702.4.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> <200402271733.04718.Garth@Webostics.com> <200402271734.54018.Garth@Webostics.com> <20040227185122.19d66aeb.joehill@sympatico.ca> <20040227211930.64a0a997.rufmetal@eol.ca> <20040228025841.GF31117@barnyard.192.168.0.1> Message-ID: <20040228075423.659f2819.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 21:58:42 -0500 Stephen Allen disseminated the following: > Who has been? What a confusing thread... HAND? YHBT? I have no freakin' idea what the hell is goin' on here. Maybe more acid will help, gimme a minute ;-) -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 07:52:23 up 22 days, 19:36, 6 users, load average: 1.21, 1.36, 1.27 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Mandrake Linux release 9.2 (FiveStar) for i586 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ "The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness."-- John Kenneth Galbraith -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 13:49:33 2004 From: pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Paul King) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 08:49:33 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: References: <1077924051.702.4.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> Message-ID: <4040561D.1725.C8B7560@localhost> Well, for one thing, FreeBSD is a kind of BSD, not Linux. THe only similarity they share is that they both come from the UNIX lineage. I must admit, that I have downloaded BSD before, and have never been able to successfully install it on any hardware yet. That being said, I have used Linux since Slackware and the 1.0.6 kernel. Comparing it to what I now run Linux on, I recall that I was able to run it successfully on truly degenerate hardware (to begin with, a 486 SX-33 (no math co-pro) with 4 megs of RAM). These days on current hardware, you should have no trouble installing a recent linux. A distribution I have worked with recently that I would recommend to a beginner: Mandrake 9.2, which I had to install on a school server. Best use of framebuffers I have seen, although I don't use framebuffers myself. Paul King From: "StreetSmart" To: Subject: RE: [TLUG]: Question Date sent: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 18:36:10 -0500 Send reply to: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Thanks. I??m interested in learning to use Linux. Iv read a number of > articles on different distros, and it seems to me like everyone thinks > Freebsd is the best to start with. Any suggestions on what one to start > with, and were to get it would be helpful. I know www.linuxiso.com has allot of > distros, but my burner isn??t working so I guess ill resort to buying a copy, the > money goes to Linux anyways, mine as well help them out. Thanks again. > > StreetSmart > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org]On Behalf Of bill > traynor > Sent: Friday, February 27, 2004 6:21 PM > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Question > > > On Fri, 2004-02-27 at 18:20, StreetSmart wrote: > > If I have a question I would like to ask. How do i e-mail the question to all? > > Thanks allot > > You just did. tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org reaches everyone. > > > > > StreetSmart > > > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml ========================================================= Paul King http://www3.sympatico.ca/pking123/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 13:50:19 2004 From: pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Paul King) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 08:50:19 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <20040228075423.659f2819.joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <20040228025841.GF31117@barnyard.192.168.0.1> Message-ID: <4040564B.15.C8C2AF7@localhost> A look on Google suggests that IHBT stands for "Institute of Himalayan Bioresource Technology", but I suspect that the writer intended it to say "I have been there". "HAND" appears to stand for "Have a nice day". Could we please make English the official language of this list? These idiotic acronyms are used by other people to assure themselves of how hip and cool they are. So that if I don't know what HAND stands for (a pun!), I must be out of the loop. It's dumb. Techies, who are already hip and cool, ought to have no need for obscure acronyms outside of the usual ones to assure themselves of their sophistication. Paul King Date sent: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 07:54:23 -0500 From: JoeHill To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Question Organization: Send reply to: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 21:58:42 -0500 > Stephen Allen disseminated the following: > > > Who has been? What a confusing thread... > > HAND? YHBT? I have no freakin' idea what the hell is goin' on here. > > Maybe more acid will help, gimme a minute ;-) > > -- > JoeHill > Registered Linux user #282046 > Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > 07:52:23 up 22 days, 19:36, 6 users, load average: 1.21, 1.36, 1.27 > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > Mandrake Linux release 9.2 (FiveStar) for i586 > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > "The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral > philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for > selfishness."-- John Kenneth Galbraith -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. > Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text > below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml ========================================================= Paul King http://www3.sympatico.ca/pking123/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 14:11:19 2004 From: matt-s/rLXaiAEBtBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (G. Matthew Rice) Date: 28 Feb 2004 09:11:19 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <4040564B.15.C8C2AF7-bi+AKbBUZKZeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org> References: <20040228025841.GF31117@barnyard.192.168.0.1> <4040564B.15.C8C2AF7@localhost> Message-ID: "Paul King" writes: > A look on Google suggests that IHBT stands for "Institute of Himalayan > Bioresource Technology", but I suspect that the writer intended it to say "I > have been there". "HAND" appears to stand for "Have a nice day". > > Could we please make English the official language of this list? These acronyms happen. Try these links and this site: http://www.acronymfinder.com/af-query.asp?Acronym=yhbt http://www.acronymfinder.com/af-query.asp?Acronym=hand http://www.acronymfinder.com/af-query.asp?Acronym=ihbt YMMV. TTFN, -- g. matthew rice starnix inc. phone: 905-771-0017 x242 thornhill, ontario, canada http://www.starnix.com professional linux services & products -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rufmetal-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 14:00:59 2004 From: rufmetal-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Chris Keelan) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 09:00:59 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <4040564B.15.C8C2AF7-bi+AKbBUZKZeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org> References: <20040228025841.GF31117@barnyard.192.168.0.1> <4040564B.15.C8C2AF7@localhost> Message-ID: <20040228090059.24ee1a3a.rufmetal@eol.ca> On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 08:50:19 -0500 "Paul King" wrote: > Could we please make English the official language of this list? These > idiotic acronyms are used by other people to assure themselves of how > hip and cool they are. Actually, like any subculture, jargon will permeate computer geek conversation. It's normal. Get over it. I'll remind you of the content of the original message: > > If I have a question I would like to ask. How do i e-mail the > > question to all? Thanks allot > > StreetSmart http://www.catb.org/~esr/jargon/html/F/flame-bait.html http://www.catb.org/~esr/jargon/html/T/troll.html http://www.catb.org/~esr/jargon/html/Y/YHBT.html > So that if I don't know what HAND stands for (a > pun!), I must be out of the loop. It's dumb. Techies, who are already > hip and cool, ought to have no need for obscure acronyms outside of > the usual ones to assure themselves of their sophistication. You can't really be that new at this. ~ C -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 14:29:32 2004 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 09:29:32 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <20040228090059.24ee1a3a.rufmetal-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040228025841.GF31117@barnyard.192.168.0.1> <4040564B.15.C8C2AF7@localhost> <20040228090059.24ee1a3a.rufmetal@eol.ca> Message-ID: <20040228092932.16d1476a.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 09:00:59 -0500 Chris Keelan disseminated the following: > I'll remind you of the content of the original message: > > > > If I have a question I would like to ask. How do i e-mail the > > > question to all? Thanks allot > > > > StreetSmart > > http://www.catb.org/~esr/jargon/html/F/flame-bait.html > > http://www.catb.org/~esr/jargon/html/T/troll.html > > http://www.catb.org/~esr/jargon/html/Y/YHBT.html > > > So that if I don't know what HAND stands for (a > > pun!), I must be out of the loop. It's dumb. Techies, who are already > > hip and cool, ought to have no need for obscure acronyms outside of > > the usual ones to assure themselves of their sophistication. > > You can't really be that new at this. I just don't see how the OP is flame-bait, a troll, or otherwise. In fact, I think certain *responses* were decidedly unfriendly. Anyway, enough of this, the questions been answered, and hopefully StreetSmart hasn't been scared away by us nutjobs ;-) -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 09:23:34 up 22 days, 21:08, 5 users, load average: 1.49, 1.33, 1.23 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Mandrake Linux release 9.2 (FiveStar) for i586 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ "Not only do I think marijuana should be legalized, I think it should be mandatory"-- Bill Hicks -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From street_smart-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 14:50:52 2004 From: street_smart-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (StreetSmart) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 09:50:52 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <20040228092932.16d1476a.joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <20040228092932.16d1476a.joehill@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: I'm kind of confused on the whole topic. But yes my question has been answered. Just to clarify do you guys think mandrake is a good distro for beginners? StreetSmart -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org]On Behalf Of JoeHill Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 9:30 AM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Question On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 09:00:59 -0500 Chris Keelan disseminated the following: > I'll remind you of the content of the original message: > > > > If I have a question I would like to ask. How do i e-mail the > > > question to all? Thanks allot > > > > StreetSmart > > http://www.catb.org/~esr/jargon/html/F/flame-bait.html > > http://www.catb.org/~esr/jargon/html/T/troll.html > > http://www.catb.org/~esr/jargon/html/Y/YHBT.html > > > So that if I don't know what HAND stands for (a > > pun!), I must be out of the loop. It's dumb. Techies, who are already > > hip and cool, ought to have no need for obscure acronyms outside of > > the usual ones to assure themselves of their sophistication. > > You can't really be that new at this. I just don't see how the OP is flame-bait, a troll, or otherwise. In fact, I think certain *responses* were decidedly unfriendly. Anyway, enough of this, the questions been answered, and hopefully StreetSmart hasn't been scared away by us nutjobs ;-) -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 09:23:34 up 22 days, 21:08, 5 users, load average: 1.49, 1.33, 1.23 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Mandrake Linux release 9.2 (FiveStar) for i586 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ "Not only do I think marijuana should be legalized, I think it should be mandatory"-- Bill Hicks -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 15:08:35 2004 From: pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Paul King) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 10:08:35 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <20040228090059.24ee1a3a.rufmetal-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <4040564B.15.C8C2AF7@localhost> Message-ID: <404068A3.14587.CD3D038@localhost> > You can't really be that new at this. That's not really the point. Several years ago, I used to give talks on 'net use in courses, and sure, I explained 'net acronyms. I strongly disagree with your implication that 'net acronyms were ever any part of a "subculture". Acronyms, especially those germaine to a particular area or technology, are and have been useful to ease the reading of messages on Internet newsgroups or on mailing lists. That is, it rose out of conveniance. Newcomers were often encouraged to read a FAQ to become familiar with the norms of the group and with the acronyms. I maintain a FAQ for the newsgroup sci.bio.food-science where I devote an entire section to scientific and Internet acronyms. Acronyms are meant to clarify. That is, they are meant to ease the reading of messages in the group for those who have dealt much with the topic at hand. If, for example I want to talk about polyacrylamide gel electrophoresis, it would save a lot of typing (and a lot of eyestrain on the part of the reader) to simply abbreviate it as PAGE. PAGE might be used several times in the same sentence. Anyone interested in PAGE or what it is used for will immediately recognise the acronym. If they don't, they can read the FAQ and at least see what it stands for. There are many acceptable uses for Internet acronyms, as well as smilies and so on. I use them all the time. Over-use of acronyms obscure messages. Unless someone wish to post a FAQ to interpret their own jargon, they are essentialy writing messages to themselves. Paul King > > ~ C > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml ========================================================= Paul King http://www3.sympatico.ca/pking123/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 15:08:15 2004 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 10:08:15 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: References: <20040228092932.16d1476a.joehill@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <20040228100815.45e88ed0.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 09:50:52 -0500 StreetSmart disseminated the following: > I'm kind of confused on the whole topic. But yes my question has been > answered. Just to clarify do you guys think mandrake is a good distro for > beginners? Definitely, at least as far as totally free (as in beer) distros go. If you want to pony up some dough for something that requires a *little* less fiddling (proprietary drivers, Flash plugins and all that), then you can go with Libranet or Xandros, or you can even buy the Mandrake Discovery Edition which comes with everything you'll need for a full desktop experience (aforementioned drivers like Nvidia, Flash and Java plugins, etc.). Mandrake detects and supports almost all newer hardware, I even have it working with my digital camera and Visor (Palm OS). There is a very good-sized Mandrake community, the mailing lists are populated by very knowledgeable and helpful people. -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 10:00:20 up 22 days, 21:44, 5 users, load average: 1.71, 1.62, 1.47 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Mandrake Linux release 9.2 (FiveStar) for i586 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ "If those in charge of our society - politicians, corporate executives, and owners of press and television - can dominate our ideas, they will be secure in their power. They will not need soldiers patrolling the streets. We will control ourselves."-- Howard Zinn -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From street_smart-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 15:27:33 2004 From: street_smart-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (StreetSmart) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 10:27:33 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <20040228100815.45e88ed0.joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <20040228100815.45e88ed0.joehill@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: I know www.linuxiso.com has many distros, but my burner isn't working properly, were else can I get a copy of mandrake? Other forums suggest first timers buying the distro, because it comes with user manuals and instructions. But I still don't see allot of stores selling the distro. StreetSmart -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org]On Behalf Of JoeHill Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 10:08 AM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Question On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 09:50:52 -0500 StreetSmart disseminated the following: > I'm kind of confused on the whole topic. But yes my question has been > answered. Just to clarify do you guys think mandrake is a good distro for > beginners? Definitely, at least as far as totally free (as in beer) distros go. If you want to pony up some dough for something that requires a *little* less fiddling (proprietary drivers, Flash plugins and all that), then you can go with Libranet or Xandros, or you can even buy the Mandrake Discovery Edition which comes with everything you'll need for a full desktop experience (aforementioned drivers like Nvidia, Flash and Java plugins, etc.). Mandrake detects and supports almost all newer hardware, I even have it working with my digital camera and Visor (Palm OS). There is a very good-sized Mandrake community, the mailing lists are populated by very knowledgeable and helpful people. -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 10:00:20 up 22 days, 21:44, 5 users, load average: 1.71, 1.62, 1.47 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Mandrake Linux release 9.2 (FiveStar) for i586 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ "If those in charge of our society - politicians, corporate executives, and owners of press and television - can dominate our ideas, they will be secure in their power. They will not need soldiers patrolling the streets. We will control ourselves."-- Howard Zinn -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mcg2-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 15:44:05 2004 From: mcg2-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Matthew Godycki) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 10:44:05 -0500 Subject: Question References: Message-ID: <000501c3fe11$b2561170$6401a8c0@yoshiko> Not a brick and mortar store but.... www.cheapbytes.com HTH, -Matt ----- Original Message ----- From: "StreetSmart" To: Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 10:27 AM Subject: RE: [TLUG]: Question > I know www.linuxiso.com has many distros, but my burner isn't working > properly, were else can I get a copy of mandrake? Other forums suggest first > timers buying the distro, because it comes with user manuals and > instructions. But I still don't see allot of stores selling the distro. > > StreetSmart > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org]On Behalf Of JoeHill > Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 10:08 AM > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Question > > > On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 09:50:52 -0500 > StreetSmart disseminated the following: > > > I'm kind of confused on the whole topic. But yes my question has been > > answered. Just to clarify do you guys think mandrake is a good distro for > > beginners? > > Definitely, at least as far as totally free (as in beer) distros go. If you > want > to pony up some dough for something that requires a *little* less fiddling > (proprietary drivers, Flash plugins and all that), then you can go with > Libranet > or Xandros, or you can even buy the Mandrake Discovery Edition which comes > with > everything you'll need for a full desktop experience (aforementioned drivers > like Nvidia, Flash and Java plugins, etc.). Mandrake detects and supports > almost > all newer hardware, I even have it working with my digital camera and Visor > (Palm OS). > > There is a very good-sized Mandrake community, the mailing lists are > populated > by very knowledgeable and helpful people. > > -- > JoeHill > Registered Linux user #282046 > Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > 10:00:20 up 22 days, 21:44, 5 users, load average: 1.71, 1.62, 1.47 > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > Mandrake Linux release 9.2 (FiveStar) for i586 > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > "If those in charge of our society - politicians, corporate executives, and > owners of press and television - can dominate our ideas, they will be secure > in > their power. They will not need soldiers patrolling the streets. We will > control > ourselves."-- Howard Zinn > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From street_smart-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 15:53:31 2004 From: street_smart-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (StreetSmart) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 10:53:31 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <000501c3fe11$b2561170$6401a8c0-uPx0nR2PG5o@public.gmane.org> References: <000501c3fe11$b2561170$6401a8c0@yoshiko> Message-ID: There are many mandrake distros, what one is best suited for me? They range from 7.1 to 9.2 The page is: http://cart.cheapbytes.com/cgi-bin/cart/scan/MM=0f8cd00d03e98c6e6768081a443b 66a8:50:99:50?mv_session_id=7dwNWwTw&mv_pc=6&mv_more_ip=1&mv_nextpage=result s Iv read the notes on them, they mainly tell you what its compatible with. StreetSmart -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org]On Behalf Of Matthew Godycki Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 10:44 AM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Question Not a brick and mortar store but.... www.cheapbytes.com HTH, -Matt ----- Original Message ----- From: "StreetSmart" To: Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 10:27 AM Subject: RE: [TLUG]: Question > I know www.linuxiso.com has many distros, but my burner isn't working > properly, were else can I get a copy of mandrake? Other forums suggest first > timers buying the distro, because it comes with user manuals and > instructions. But I still don't see allot of stores selling the distro. > > StreetSmart > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org]On Behalf Of JoeHill > Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 10:08 AM > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Question > > > On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 09:50:52 -0500 > StreetSmart disseminated the following: > > > I'm kind of confused on the whole topic. But yes my question has been > > answered. Just to clarify do you guys think mandrake is a good distro for > > beginners? > > Definitely, at least as far as totally free (as in beer) distros go. If you > want > to pony up some dough for something that requires a *little* less fiddling > (proprietary drivers, Flash plugins and all that), then you can go with > Libranet > or Xandros, or you can even buy the Mandrake Discovery Edition which comes > with > everything you'll need for a full desktop experience (aforementioned drivers > like Nvidia, Flash and Java plugins, etc.). Mandrake detects and supports > almost > all newer hardware, I even have it working with my digital camera and Visor > (Palm OS). > > There is a very good-sized Mandrake community, the mailing lists are > populated > by very knowledgeable and helpful people. > > -- > JoeHill > Registered Linux user #282046 > Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > 10:00:20 up 22 days, 21:44, 5 users, load average: 1.71, 1.62, 1.47 > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > Mandrake Linux release 9.2 (FiveStar) for i586 > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > "If those in charge of our society - politicians, corporate executives, and > owners of press and television - can dominate our ideas, they will be secure > in > their power. They will not need soldiers patrolling the streets. We will > control > ourselves."-- Howard Zinn > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From teddymills-VFlxZYho3OA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 15:54:11 2004 From: teddymills-VFlxZYho3OA at public.gmane.org (Teddy Mills) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 10:54:11 -0500 Subject: PHPBB for TLUG Message-ID: <000b01c3fe13$1bec98b0$0301a8c0@amazon> PHPBB for TLUG. Should this be done? Does it make more sense than email lists? --------------------------------------------------------------- teddy mills http://www.vger.ca VGER directives...To collect...all that is collectable. To sell...all that is saleable.To merchandise...all that is merchandisable. Family Guys Quagmire "allllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll right" Capt Tenneal "LETS GO!" -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From teddymills-VFlxZYho3OA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 15:56:12 2004 From: teddymills-VFlxZYho3OA at public.gmane.org (Teddy Mills) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 10:56:12 -0500 Subject: PHPBB for TLUG References: <000b01c3fe13$1bec98b0$0301a8c0@amazon> Message-ID: <001301c3fe13$641b99b0$0301a8c0@amazon> Organizations of topics and categories would certainly be nice, as opposed to a quasi flat-file system. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Teddy Mills" To: Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 10:54 AM Subject: [TLUG]: PHPBB for TLUG > PHPBB for TLUG. Should this be done? > Does it make more sense than email lists? > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------- > teddy mills http://www.vger.ca > VGER directives...To collect...all that is collectable. To sell...all that > is saleable.To merchandise...all that is merchandisable. > > Family Guys Quagmire "allllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll right" > Capt Tenneal "LETS GO!" > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 15:59:12 2004 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 10:59:12 -0500 (EST) Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <20040228090059.24ee1a3a.rufmetal-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040228090059.24ee1a3a.rufmetal@eol.ca> Message-ID: On Sat, 28 Feb 2004, Chris Keelan wrote: > You can't really be that new at this. Is the purpose to communicate, or to show off how cool you are? Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 16:03:50 2004 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 11:03:50 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: References: <000501c3fe11$b2561170$6401a8c0@yoshiko> Message-ID: <20040228110350.600acfde.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 10:53:31 -0500 StreetSmart disseminated the following: > There are many mandrake distros, what one is best suited for me? They range > from 7.1 to 9.2 The page is: > > http://cart.cheapbytes.com/cgi-bin/cart/scan/MM=0f8cd00d03e98c6e6768081a443b > 66a8:50:99:50?mv_session_id=7dwNWwTw&mv_pc=6&mv_more_ip=1&mv_nextpage=result > s > > > Iv read the notes on them, they mainly tell you what its compatible with. Well, you definitely want to go with the latest, since anything before 9.1 is not going to see many updated packages built for it. IIRC, 9.0 has already been "EOL'd", ie. it's no longer supported by Mandrakesoft. 9.2 has been very solid for me once I twiddled with it (I have crappy old hardware). 9.1 should be solid right off the bat, and once you get that up and running, it's fairly easy to upgrade to the latest and greatest using 'urpmi', kinda the equivalent (no flames please) of Debian's 'apt'. -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 10:57:22 up 22 days, 22:41, 5 users, load average: 1.24, 1.16, 1.15 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Mandrake Linux release 9.2 (FiveStar) for i586 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ There are literally several levels of SCO being wrong. And even if we were to live in that alternate universe where SCO would be right, they'd still be wrong.-- Linus Torvalds -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From street_smart-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 16:13:38 2004 From: street_smart-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (StreetSmart) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 11:13:38 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <20040228110350.600acfde.joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <20040228110350.600acfde.joehill@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: Do you suggest the CheapBytes Mandrake Linux 9.2.1 (3 CD-R Set) It has some updates installed over 9.2. It looks good, I fill the requirements with no problem. Or should I get the CheapBytes Mandrake Linux 9.1 (3 CD-R Set) If I do get this one, I can just download the updates that would have been installed on the 9.2.1 Correct? Thanks. StreetSmart -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org]On Behalf Of JoeHill Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 11:04 AM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Question On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 10:53:31 -0500 StreetSmart disseminated the following: > There are many mandrake distros, what one is best suited for me? They range > from 7.1 to 9.2 The page is: > > http://cart.cheapbytes.com/cgi-bin/cart/scan/MM=0f8cd00d03e98c6e6768081a443b > 66a8:50:99:50?mv_session_id=7dwNWwTw&mv_pc=6&mv_more_ip=1&mv_nextpage=result > s > > > Iv read the notes on them, they mainly tell you what its compatible with. Well, you definitely want to go with the latest, since anything before 9.1 is not going to see many updated packages built for it. IIRC, 9.0 has already been "EOL'd", ie. it's no longer supported by Mandrakesoft. 9.2 has been very solid for me once I twiddled with it (I have crappy old hardware). 9.1 should be solid right off the bat, and once you get that up and running, it's fairly easy to upgrade to the latest and greatest using 'urpmi', kinda the equivalent (no flames please) of Debian's 'apt'. -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 10:57:22 up 22 days, 22:41, 5 users, load average: 1.24, 1.16, 1.15 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Mandrake Linux release 9.2 (FiveStar) for i586 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ There are literally several levels of SCO being wrong. And even if we were to live in that alternate universe where SCO would be right, they'd still be wrong.-- Linus Torvalds -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From teddymills-VFlxZYho3OA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 16:17:15 2004 From: teddymills-VFlxZYho3OA at public.gmane.org (Teddy Mills) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 11:17:15 -0500 Subject: Question References: Message-ID: <004401c3fe16$54f12010$0301a8c0@amazon> If your just beginning, what bl**dy h*ll difference does it make what version your getting? Just download it, buy it whatever...and start learning... sheesh! ----- Original Message ----- From: "StreetSmart" To: Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 11:13 AM Subject: RE: [TLUG]: Question > Do you suggest the CheapBytes Mandrake Linux 9.2.1 (3 CD-R Set) It has some > updates installed over 9.2. It looks good, I fill the requirements with no > problem. Or should I get the CheapBytes Mandrake Linux 9.1 (3 CD-R Set) If I > do get this one, I can just download the updates that would have been > installed on the 9.2.1 Correct? Thanks. > > StreetSmart > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org]On Behalf Of JoeHill > Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 11:04 AM > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Question > > > On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 10:53:31 -0500 > StreetSmart disseminated the following: > > > There are many mandrake distros, what one is best suited for me? They > range > > from 7.1 to 9.2 The page is: > > > > > http://cart.cheapbytes.com/cgi-bin/cart/scan/MM=0f8cd00d03e98c6e6768081a443b > > > 66a8:50:99:50?mv_session_id=7dwNWwTw&mv_pc=6&mv_more_ip=1&mv_nextpage=result > > s > > > > > > Iv read the notes on them, they mainly tell you what its compatible with. > > Well, you definitely want to go with the latest, since anything before 9.1 > is > not going to see many updated packages built for it. IIRC, 9.0 has already > been > "EOL'd", ie. it's no longer supported by Mandrakesoft. 9.2 has been very > solid > for me once I twiddled with it (I have crappy old hardware). 9.1 should be > solid > right off the bat, and once you get that up and running, it's fairly easy to > upgrade to the latest and greatest using 'urpmi', kinda the equivalent (no > flames please) of Debian's 'apt'. > > -- > JoeHill > Registered Linux user #282046 > Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > 10:57:22 up 22 days, 22:41, 5 users, load average: 1.24, 1.16, 1.15 > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > Mandrake Linux release 9.2 (FiveStar) for i586 > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > There are literally several levels of SCO being wrong. And even if we were > to > live in that alternate universe where SCO would be right, they'd still be > wrong.-- Linus Torvalds > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mcg2-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 16:21:15 2004 From: mcg2-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Matthew Godycki) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 11:21:15 -0500 Subject: Question References: <000501c3fe11$b2561170$6401a8c0@yoshiko> Message-ID: <001f01c3fe16$e34f0c50$6401a8c0@yoshiko> Doh, obviously I missed the earlier portion of the thread that discussed cheapbytes, my apologies. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Matthew Godycki" To: Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 10:44 AM Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Question > Not a brick and mortar store but.... www.cheapbytes.com > > HTH, > -Matt > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "StreetSmart" > To: > Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 10:27 AM > Subject: RE: [TLUG]: Question > > > > I know www.linuxiso.com has many distros, but my burner isn't working > > properly, were else can I get a copy of mandrake? Other forums suggest > first > > timers buying the distro, because it comes with user manuals and > > instructions. But I still don't see allot of stores selling the distro. > > > > StreetSmart > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org]On Behalf Of JoeHill > > Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 10:08 AM > > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Question > > > > > > On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 09:50:52 -0500 > > StreetSmart disseminated the following: > > > > > I'm kind of confused on the whole topic. But yes my question has been > > > answered. Just to clarify do you guys think mandrake is a good distro > for > > > beginners? > > > > Definitely, at least as far as totally free (as in beer) distros go. If > you > > want > > to pony up some dough for something that requires a *little* less fiddling > > (proprietary drivers, Flash plugins and all that), then you can go with > > Libranet > > or Xandros, or you can even buy the Mandrake Discovery Edition which comes > > with > > everything you'll need for a full desktop experience (aforementioned > drivers > > like Nvidia, Flash and Java plugins, etc.). Mandrake detects and supports > > almost > > all newer hardware, I even have it working with my digital camera and > Visor > > (Palm OS). > > > > There is a very good-sized Mandrake community, the mailing lists are > > populated > > by very knowledgeable and helpful people. > > > > -- > > JoeHill > > Registered Linux user #282046 > > Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org > > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > 10:00:20 up 22 days, 21:44, 5 users, load average: 1.71, 1.62, 1.47 > > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > Mandrake Linux release 9.2 (FiveStar) for i586 > > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > "If those in charge of our society - politicians, corporate executives, > and > > owners of press and television - can dominate our ideas, they will be > secure > > in > > their power. They will not need soldiers patrolling the streets. We will > > control > > ourselves."-- Howard Zinn > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 16:48:48 2004 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter L. Peres) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 18:48:48 +0200 (IST) Subject: Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Sat, 28 Feb 2004, StreetSmart wrote: > I'm kind of confused on the whole topic. But yes my question has been > answered. Just to clarify do you guys think mandrake is a good distro for > beginners? Imho, get a knoppix iso and burn it (I know you do not have broadband - shop around a little). This will let you play with Linux before installing it (it runs directly from the cd). Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From street_smart-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 16:55:13 2004 From: street_smart-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (StreetSmart) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 11:55:13 -0500 Subject: Programming in Linux Message-ID: Are there free programs available in Linux to write VB, c++, or java programs? StreetSmart -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 16:58:28 2004 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 11:58:28 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: References: <20040228110350.600acfde.joehill@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <20040228115828.55edfa6b.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 11:13:38 -0500 StreetSmart disseminated the following: > Do you suggest the CheapBytes Mandrake Linux 9.2.1 (3 CD-R Set) It has some > updates installed over 9.2. That sounds great, actually. I didn't know they had something like that. Go for it! We're here for ya! -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 11:57:15 up 22 days, 23:41, 5 users, load average: 1.08, 1.22, 1.24 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Mandrake Linux release 9.2 (FiveStar) for i586 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Rule #2 (John Gilmore): "The Net interprets censorship as damage and routes around it." -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 17:28:26 2004 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter L. Peres) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 19:28:26 +0200 (IST) Subject: Programming in Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Sat, 28 Feb 2004, StreetSmart wrote: > Are there free programs available in Linux to write VB, c++, or java > programs? No VB, but c++, java, lisp, scheme, c#, fortran, pascal, tcl/tk, prolog, perl and a couple more I forget now. tcl/tk is the closest equivalent to VB (although very different). There are several gui designers available. vtcl is one (produces java and tcl output). Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lance-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 17:37:48 2004 From: lance-5ZoueyuiTZhBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Lance F. Squire) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 12:37:48 -0500 Subject: Programming in Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4040D1EC.1020209@alteeve.com> StreetSmart wrote: > Are there free programs available in Linux to write VB, c++, or java > programs? > > StreetSmart > VB being a Microsoft proprietery pruduct, is not available on anything but Windows. Perl, Php and other free programming languages can easily take there place though. C, C++ and i think some Java can be compiled using gcc You can also get Java development systems free from Sun and IBM for Linux. Did I miss any? Lance -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 18:02:43 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 13:02:43 -0500 Subject: Proven wireless mouse for Linux ? In-Reply-To: References: <200402271416.32256.skuznets@blueprint.org> Message-ID: <20040228180240.GY9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Fri, Feb 27, 2004 at 11:24:24PM +0200, Peter L. Peres wrote: > Thanks. I appreciate your answer. > > Are there any issues with regard to chording mouse buttons, wheel issues > etc ? I understand that some wireless protocols may not like several mouse > buttons held down at the same time etc. What about extra keys on the > keyboard ? I know the logitechs I have dealth with allow all 3 mouse buttons to be held at the same time and work great. I have also found logitech wired keyboards are among the keyboards that allow the most keys at a time. remember the keyboard just send key down, key up events (And probably something for key repeat but that might be elsewhere in the keyboard hardware). Being wireless doesn't seem to affect the behaviour at all at least on the logitech hardware. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 18:10:06 2004 From: rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org (Rob Sutherland) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 13:10:06 -0500 Subject: Programming in Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040228131006.521b9793.rob@cheapersafer.com> On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 11:55:13 -0500 "StreetSmart" wrote: > Are there free programs available in Linux to write VB, c++, or java > programs? There isn't a Linux version of VB, but there are several Basics with IDE's avalable for Linux, here's a page with some links to them. http://www.memeshadow.net/multi/html/index.php?op=modload&name=phpWiki&file=index&pagename=Migrating%20Applications There's a link on that Wiki page to a table of Windows/Linux equivalents. Rob -- Rob Sutherland - rob-HoWcdTCbwWKHoZZAE0nKLw at public.gmane.org Computer Support at http://www.cheapersafer.com -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 18:18:13 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 13:18:13 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: References: <20040228092932.16d1476a.joehill@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <20040228181813.GZ9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Sat, Feb 28, 2004 at 09:50:52AM -0500, StreetSmart wrote: > I'm kind of confused on the whole topic. But yes my question has been > answered. Just to clarify do you guys think mandrake is a good distro for > beginners? Well that's one way to get a lot of useless answers. Here is mine: I think mandrake is a pain in the ##$#@ whenever I have had to deal with it. I think Debian is the right system for all linux users and is certainly the one following the open/free software spirit the most. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 18:20:15 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 13:20:15 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <404068A3.14587.CD3D038-bi+AKbBUZKZeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org> References: <4040564B.15.C8C2AF7@localhost> <404068A3.14587.CD3D038@localhost> Message-ID: <20040228182015.GA9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Sat, Feb 28, 2004 at 10:08:35AM -0500, Paul King wrote: > That's not really the point. Several years ago, I used to give talks on 'net > use in courses, and sure, I explained 'net acronyms. > > I strongly disagree with your implication that 'net acronyms were ever any part > of a "subculture". > > Acronyms, especially those germaine to a particular area or technology, are and > have been useful to ease the reading of messages on Internet newsgroups or on > mailing lists. That is, it rose out of conveniance. Newcomers were often > encouraged to read a FAQ to become familiar with the norms of the group and > with the acronyms. I maintain a FAQ for the newsgroup sci.bio.food-science > where I devote an entire section to scientific and Internet acronyms. > > Acronyms are meant to clarify. That is, they are meant to ease the reading of > messages in the group for those who have dealt much with the topic at hand. If, > for example I want to talk about polyacrylamide gel electrophoresis, it would > save a lot of typing (and a lot of eyestrain on the part of the reader) to > simply abbreviate it as PAGE. PAGE might be used several times in the same > sentence. Anyone interested in PAGE or what it is used for will immediately > recognise the acronym. If they don't, they can read the FAQ and at least see > what it stands for. There are many acceptable uses for Internet acronyms, as > well as smilies and so on. I use them all the time. > > Over-use of acronyms obscure messages. Unless someone wish to post a FAQ to > interpret their own jargon, they are essentialy writing messages to themselves. Hmm, and here I thought they were used to shorten messages so the usenet servers running 9600 bps modems wouldn't have so much data to transfer. :) Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 18:24:59 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 13:24:59 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <4040561D.1725.C8B7560-bi+AKbBUZKZeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org> References: <1077924051.702.4.camel@ponter.spinlocks.co> <4040561D.1725.C8B7560@localhost> Message-ID: <20040228182459.GB9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Sat, Feb 28, 2004 at 08:49:33AM -0500, Paul King wrote: > Well, for one thing, FreeBSD is a kind of BSD, not Linux. THe only similarity > they share is that they both come from the UNIX lineage. Well BSD started from UNIX source. Linux never had unix source, it was from scratch. Same design philosophy for the base system though. > I must admit, that I have downloaded BSD before, and have never been able to > successfully install it on any hardware yet. That being said, I have used Linux > since Slackware and the 1.0.6 kernel. Comparing it to what I now run Linux on, > I recall that I was able to run it successfully on truly degenerate hardware > (to begin with, a 486 SX-33 (no math co-pro) with 4 megs of RAM). These days on > current hardware, you should have no trouble installing a recent linux. Well I have installed Linux and BSD on both MIPS 3000 machines and x86 and even sparc. Hasn't been a problem so far (NetBSD being my choice for BSD that runs on anything, although I much prefer running Debian on everything). > A distribution I have worked with recently that I would recommend to a > beginner: Mandrake 9.2, which I had to install on a school server. Best use of > framebuffers I have seen, although I don't use framebuffers myself. Is that the one that messed with the kernel to put the boot messages inside a small pretty box ala win2k boot? What a waste of development time. :) Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 18:28:08 2004 From: lsorense-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys at public.gmane.org (Lennart Sorensen) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 13:28:08 -0500 Subject: Programming in Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040228182807.GC9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> On Sat, Feb 28, 2004 at 11:55:13AM -0500, StreetSmart wrote: > Are there free programs available in Linux to write VB, c++, or java > programs? VB is a microsoft only language. C++ can be done with g++, QT is a nice gui widget set in C++, and ther are development IDE's in kde for doing stuff, as well as others. Heck dev-c++ is free for windows and uses g++ as well and is pretty nice actually should you ever have to write programs for windows. kdevelop and such seem OK, although I prefer vim + Makefile + gcc/g++. Lennart Sorensen -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 18:32:22 2004 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter L. Peres) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 20:32:22 +0200 (IST) Subject: Proven wireless mouse for Linux ? In-Reply-To: <20040228180240.GY9627-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <200402271416.32256.skuznets@blueprint.org> <20040228180240.GY9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: On Sat, 28 Feb 2004, Lennart Sorensen wrote: > I know the logitechs I have dealth with allow all 3 mouse buttons to be > held at the same time and work great. I have also found logitech wired > keyboards are among the keyboards that allow the most keys at a time. > remember the keyboard just send key down, key up events (And probably > something for key repeat but that might be elsewhere in the keyboard > hardware). Being wireless doesn't seem to affect the behaviour at all > at least on the logitech hardware. Ok. The chording etc issue is due to the possibility of key (or mouse) break events to get lost when the wireless link is noised (f.ex. by a narby vacuum cleaner or a/c). This can end you up with the equivalent of a DEL key held down for while and other similar horrors. The wireless protocols have error checking in them to avoid this. One of the cheap ways is to throw out key chords that seem illegal (to Windows users at least). Thus my question. Now I want to go all the way, wireless keyboard and wireless optical mouse ;-) I think I saw it somewhere in a shop. Wireless optical mice probably eat batteries for lunch (that bright light eats power!) but I'll try anyway. thanks, Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rufmetal-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 18:28:32 2004 From: rufmetal-MwcKTmeKVNQ at public.gmane.org (Chris Keelan) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 13:28:32 -0500 Subject: OT: Acronyms [was RE: Question] In-Reply-To: References: <20040228090059.24ee1a3a.rufmetal@eol.ca> Message-ID: <20040228132832.76b56867.rufmetal@eol.ca> On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 10:59:12 -0500 (EST) Henry Spencer wrote: > On Sat, 28 Feb 2004, Chris Keelan wrote: > > You can't really be that new at this. > > Is the purpose to communicate, or to show off how cool you are? How does typing acronyms in common useage in dozens of internet forums, across a significant period of time, equate to me trying to show how cool I am? If this were a hockey discussion list, would I be trying to show off when I discussed "neutral zone trap" or a "box plus one" defence? I didn't use YHBT/HAND because I wanted to confuse Mr. King or Mr. Hill, rather I couldn't imagine that either participant of this sometime technical discussion list /wouldn't/ know those acronyms. It turns out that Street Smart wasn't trolling and for that I owe him an apology. I made that assessment based on his two messages, the first of which was a question to the list asking how he could ask the list questions (?!?), the second offered the observation that FreeBSD might be the best Linux distro for a beginner. Are you telling me that your antennae didn't twitch at that? I resent the implication that I'm a d00d (do I need to spell *that* out for the list?) because I used internet jargon while participating in a technical discussion group. ~ C -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 18:43:03 2004 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 13:43:03 -0500 Subject: Proven wireless mouse for Linux ? In-Reply-To: References: <20040228180240.GY9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: <200402281343.03593.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> On Saturday 28 February 2004 13:32, Peter L. Peres wrote: > Now I want to go all the way, wireless keyboard and wireless optical mouse > ;-) I think I saw it somewhere in a shop. Wireless optical mice probably > eat batteries for lunch (that bright light eats power!) but I'll try > anyway. I've had a cordless logitech for almost 2 years. Batteries seem to last about 4-5 months. I've never had problems with interference from outside sources (that I've noticed). My mouse is not optical, I don't recall ever having a problem with this mouse or needing to clean the wheel so I don't see a win for optical (perhaps I'm missing something). -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 18:44:23 2004 From: pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Paul King) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 13:44:23 -0500 Subject: Programming in Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <40409B37.28544.D99633D@localhost> In general, you will stand a chance of getting most of this (except vb) if you install Linux as a "developer" workstation in most distros such as Mandrake. You will get a ton of other languages besides. VB - Forget it (although I thought there was some kind of attempt to do this by someone). C++ - gpp (You don't have to go to any trouble to install this. It's usually there.) java - The compile and doc tools are usually there if you choose to install "developer tools" or something to that effect in whatever distro. Otherwise you only get the runtime libraries to run other people's stuff (not too helpful) Paul King From: "StreetSmart" To: "Tlug" Subject: [TLUG]: Programming in Linux Date sent: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 11:55:13 -0500 Send reply to: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Are there free programs available in Linux to write VB, c++, or java > programs? > > StreetSmart > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml ========================================================= Paul King http://www3.sympatico.ca/pking123/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 18:50:40 2004 From: henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org (Henry Spencer) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 13:50:40 -0500 (EST) Subject: OT: Acronyms [was RE: Question] In-Reply-To: <20040228132832.76b56867.rufmetal-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040228132832.76b56867.rufmetal@eol.ca> Message-ID: On Sat, 28 Feb 2004, Chris Keelan wrote: > > Is the purpose to communicate, or to show off how cool you are? > > How does typing acronyms in common useage in dozens of internet > forums, across a significant period of time, equate to me trying to show > how cool I am? Are they in common use *here*? No, they're not. So lay off them. You keep saying "but people are supposed to understand these things". This misses the point. If your goal is to communicate, you should try to be as clear as possible, not merely meet some minimum standard that you think "ought" to be enough. > I didn't use YHBT/HAND because I wanted to confuse Mr. King > or Mr. Hill, rather I couldn't imagine that either participant of this > sometime technical discussion list /wouldn't/ know those acronyms. Sorry, they're not familiar to me either. Probably I don't hang around the chat rooms enough; I have better things to do. > It turns out that Street Smart wasn't trolling and for that I owe him an > apology. I made that assessment based on his two messages, the first of > which was a question to the list asking how he could ask the list > questions (?!?), the second offered the observation that FreeBSD might > be the best Linux distro for a beginner. > Are you telling me that your antennae didn't twitch at that? Odd, but more suggestive of very naive beginner than deliberate troll. Henry Spencer henry-lqW1N6Cllo0sV2N9l4h3zg at public.gmane.org -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 19:03:26 2004 From: reg.hughson-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (rh) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 14:03:26 -0500 Subject: OT: Acronyms [was RE: Question] In-Reply-To: <20040228132832.76b56867.rufmetal-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040228090059.24ee1a3a.rufmetal@eol.ca> <20040228132832.76b56867.rufmetal@eol.ca> Message-ID: <20040228140326.264fb102.reg.hughson@sympatico.ca> On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 13:28:32 -0500 Chris Keelan wrote: [snip] > It turns out that Street Smart wasn't trolling and for that I owe him > an apology. I made that assessment based on his two messages, the > first of which was a question to the list asking how he could ask the > list questions (?!?), the second offered the observation that FreeBSD > might be the best Linux distro for a beginner. > > Are you telling me that your antennae didn't twitch at that? > Your antennae may have twitched but in the end, your assumption was wrong. Unfortunately, far too often, people are so quick to want to fire that 'RTFM' answer out there with their aura of superiority. I am sure that turns alot of people off of lists and and of ventures such as learning linux. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 19:07:34 2004 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 14:07:34 -0500 Subject: OT: Acronyms [was RE: Question] In-Reply-To: <20040228132832.76b56867.rufmetal-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040228090059.24ee1a3a.rufmetal@eol.ca> <20040228132832.76b56867.rufmetal@eol.ca> Message-ID: <200402281407.34094.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> On Saturday 28 February 2004 13:28, Chris Keelan wrote: > How does typing acronyms in common useage in dozens of internet > forums, across a significant period of time, equate to me trying to show > how cool I am? [snip] > I didn't use YHBT/HAND because I wanted to confuse Mr. King > or Mr. Hill, rather I couldn't imagine that either participant of this > sometime technical discussion list /wouldn't/ know those acronyms. I am on many technical lists, in 10 years of Internet use I don't ever recall seeing those acronyms. I'm not about to waste my time looking them up right now either. > It turns out that Street Smart wasn't trolling and for that I owe him an > apology. I made that assessment based on his two messages, the first of It was obvious that he was a newbie. I suppose you're one of the guys that flame people (on list) for sending unsubscribe messages as well? > Are you telling me that your antennae didn't twitch at that? Your useless replies were the only ones generating twitches, perhaps you haven't noticed. > I resent the implication that I'm a d00d (do I need to spell *that* out > for the list?) because I used internet jargon while participating in a > technical discussion group. Can't say I get it, you must be hanging out in msn chat or something? -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 19:13:44 2004 From: pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Paul King) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 14:13:44 -0500 Subject: OT: Acronyms [was RE: Question] In-Reply-To: <20040228132832.76b56867.rufmetal-MwcKTmeKVNQ@public.gmane.org> References: Message-ID: <4040A218.2331.DB442EF@localhost> Well, 1) trolling happens seldom on this list (although yes it has happened); and 2) I don't know you or your intentions, but to be sure I found your message obscure, and I see myself as quite clean on the topic of "Internet messages". I agree it is a technical discussion list, (and so you don't need to spell out "OS", "OOP" or "CPU") but my experience tells me that it has been posted to by people at all experience levels. Many have more experience than I do, while others have less. So if I was confused, you probably confused a lot of other people, but probably not everybody. And finally, point 3) people like StreetSmart who post innocent questions that even show little knowledge of computers of operating systems in general are usually patiently dealt with by many on this list. Their questions are taken seriously (at least I take them seriously) because I feel thankful that ordinary users have considered Linux at all. Paul King > I didn't use YHBT/HAND because I wanted to confuse Mr. King > or Mr. Hill, rather I couldn't imagine that either participant of this > sometime technical discussion list /wouldn't/ know those acronyms. > ========================================================= Paul King http://www3.sympatico.ca/pking123/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From legrady-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 19:39:57 2004 From: legrady-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Tom Legrady) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 14:39:57 -0500 Subject: OT: Acronyms [was RE: Question] In-Reply-To: <200402281407.34094.fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <20040228090059.24ee1a3a.rufmetal@eol.ca> <20040228132832.76b56867.rufmetal@eol.ca> <200402281407.34094.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: <4040EE8D.7010406@rogers.com> I've been using the internet since 1989, and working professionally in the software industry since 1993. I might recognize the phrases represented by YHBT and HAND if they were typed out, but I certainly don't know what the abbreviations mean. Mind you, even after asking about the abbreviation, I still can't remember what the first letter in IIRC stands for, so that may simply reflect a defect in my understanding. OTH, YMMV. Tom >>I didn't use YHBT/HAND because I wanted to confuse Mr. King >>or Mr. Hill, rather I couldn't imagine that either participant of this >>sometime technical discussion list /wouldn't/ know those acronyms. >> >> -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 19:41:01 2004 From: pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Paul King) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 14:41:01 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <20040228182459.GB9627-1wCw9BSqJbv44Nm34jS7GywD8/FfD2ys@public.gmane.org> References: <4040561D.1725.C8B7560@localhost> Message-ID: <4040A87D.9491.DCD3A96@localhost> > On Sat, Feb 28, 2004 at 08:49:33AM -0500, Paul King wrote: > > Well, for one thing, FreeBSD is a kind of BSD, not Linux. THe only similarity > > they share is that they both come from the UNIX lineage. > > Well BSD started from UNIX source. Linux never had unix source, it was > from scratch. Same design philosophy for the base system though. > As far as I am concerned, if it takes a knowledge of the source code lineage to tell them apart, then I think that it is fair enough to say that they are similar to any ordinary user. I said nothing about source code. What I meant is that StreetSmart can pick up a generic "UNIX" textbook and apply it to Linux (which I have done in the past), and feel fairly confident that they will still get something out of it. Paul King ========================================================= Paul King http://www3.sympatico.ca/pking123/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 20:12:22 2004 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 15:12:22 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: References: <20040228025841.GF31117@barnyard.192.168.0.1> <4040564B.15.C8C2AF7@localhost> Message-ID: <4040F626.20205@rogers.com> G. Matthew Rice wrote: > "Paul King" writes: > >>A look on Google suggests that IHBT stands for "Institute of Himalayan >>Bioresource Technology", but I suspect that the writer intended it to say "I >>have been there". "HAND" appears to stand for "Have a nice day". >> >>Could we please make English the official language of this list? These > > > acronyms happen. Try these links and this site: > > http://www.acronymfinder.com/af-query.asp?Acronym=yhbt > http://www.acronymfinder.com/af-query.asp?Acronym=hand > http://www.acronymfinder.com/af-query.asp?Acronym=ihbt > > YMMV. TTFN, But there are too many TLAs. TLA = Three Letter Acronym. ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From street_smart-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 20:18:15 2004 From: street_smart-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (StreetSmart) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 15:18:15 -0500 Subject: Programming in Linux In-Reply-To: <40409B37.28544.D99633D-bi+AKbBUZKZeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org> References: <40409B37.28544.D99633D@localhost> Message-ID: I'm reading allot of stuff on a program called "Wine" which supposedly allows you to run windows on top of Linux, sort of like an emulator would emulate a game. What can this sort of program be used for and what is the best available for Linux. StreetSmart -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org]On Behalf Of Paul King Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 1:44 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Programming in Linux In general, you will stand a chance of getting most of this (except vb) if you install Linux as a "developer" workstation in most distros such as Mandrake. You will get a ton of other languages besides. VB - Forget it (although I thought there was some kind of attempt to do this by someone). C++ - gpp (You don't have to go to any trouble to install this. It's usually there.) java - The compile and doc tools are usually there if you choose to install "developer tools" or something to that effect in whatever distro. Otherwise you only get the runtime libraries to run other people's stuff (not too helpful) Paul King From: "StreetSmart" To: "Tlug" Subject: [TLUG]: Programming in Linux Date sent: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 11:55:13 -0500 Send reply to: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Are there free programs available in Linux to write VB, c++, or java > programs? > > StreetSmart > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml ========================================================= Paul King http://www3.sympatico.ca/pking123/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mwilson-4YeSL8/OYKRWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 20:10:04 2004 From: mwilson-4YeSL8/OYKRWk0Htik3J/w at public.gmane.org (Mel Wilson) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 15:10:04 -0500 Subject: Question References: Message-ID: In article , "StreetSmart" wrote: >I know www.linuxiso.com has many distros, but my burner isn't working >properly, were else can I get a copy of mandrake? Other forums suggest first >timers buying the distro, because it comes with user manuals and >instructions. But I still don't see allot of stores selling the distro. U of T Bookstore usually (often? sometimes?) has one or two distros. It's my usual source for Slackware, if you wanted Slackware.. you might not.. Regards. Mel. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 20:57:31 2004 From: pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Paul King) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 15:57:31 -0500 Subject: Programming in Linux In-Reply-To: References: <40409B37.28544.D99633D@localhost> Message-ID: <4040BA6B.11305.E1347D5@localhost> Wine is just a set of libraries used to emulate the Microsoft Windows environment. So, not being an actual program, "WINE is not an emulator" (that's what WINE stands for). Wine is not the most stable set of libraries to use. It is always better to use the native Linux libraries, preferably its own static libraries, so that your program won't choke on a system upgrade. I recall that this was done successfully with WordPerfect 6 and 8, which seems to install on any Linux without trouble. I have two programs that require WINE: WordPerfect Office 2000 for Linux, and Borland Kylix 3.0 (parallel to Delphi 7 on Windows). Thus, its widest acceptance are among software makers who perhaps don't have the manpower or budget to do a full port of their software to Linux. But unfortunately, there is a price to pay in loss of stability. Paul King From: "StreetSmart" To: Subject: RE: [TLUG]: Programming in Linux Date sent: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 15:18:15 -0500 Send reply to: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > I'm reading allot of stuff on a program called "Wine" which supposedly > allows you to run windows on top of Linux, sort of like an emulator would > emulate a game. What can this sort of program be used for and what is the > best available for Linux. > > StreetSmart > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org]On Behalf Of Paul King > Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 1:44 PM > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Programming in Linux > > > In general, you will stand a chance of getting most of this (except vb) if > you > install Linux as a "developer" workstation in most distros such as Mandrake. You > will get a ton of other languages besides. > > VB - Forget it (although I thought there was some kind of attempt to > do this by someone). > > C++ - gpp (You don't have to go to any trouble to install this. It's > usually there.) > > java - The compile and doc tools are usually there if you choose to > install "developer tools" or something to that effect in whatever > distro. Otherwise you only get the runtime libraries to run other > people's stuff (not too helpful) > > Paul King > > From: "StreetSmart" > To: "Tlug" > Subject: [TLUG]: Programming in Linux > Date sent: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 11:55:13 -0500 > Send reply to: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > > > Are there free programs available in Linux to write VB, c++, or java > > programs? > > > > StreetSmart > > > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > ========================================================= > Paul King http://www3.sympatico.ca/pking123/ > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml ========================================================= Paul King http://www3.sympatico.ca/pking123/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 21:11:00 2004 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter L. Peres) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 23:11:00 +0200 (IST) Subject: Proven wireless mouse for Linux ? In-Reply-To: <200402281343.03593.fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <20040228180240.GY9627@csclub.uwaterloo.ca> <200402281343.03593.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: On Sat, 28 Feb 2004, Fraser Campbell wrote: > I've had a cordless logitech for almost 2 years. Batteries seem to last > about 4-5 months. I've never had problems with interference from > outside sources (that I've noticed). My mouse is not optical, I don't > recall ever having a problem with this mouse or needing to clean the > wheel so I don't see a win for optical (perhaps I'm missing something). You are missing the fact that my desk is used for hw development and its surface is mouse ball un-friendly (or too friendly, it picks up all the dust and bits). thanks, Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 21:22:54 2004 From: fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f at public.gmane.org (Fraser Campbell) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 16:22:54 -0500 Subject: Programming in Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200402281622.54902.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> On Saturday 28 February 2004 15:18, StreetSmart wrote: > I'm reading allot of stuff on a program called "Wine" which supposedly > allows you to run windows on top of Linux If you want to run MS Windows on top of Linux there are two solutions that I know of: - win4lin (http://www.netraverse.com/) - vmware Win4lin lets you run an actual copy of Windows 98 (or 95) on Linux. You launch a real live copy of Windows and the vast majority of Windows software will run glitch free (as long as it is software that isn't manipulating hardware directly). Win4lin doesn't yet run Windows 2000 or XP but I believe that it will eventually be supported. vmware lets you run most (all?) operating systems for Intel compatible hardware. Again, you need a full install of Windows and it is the real Windows that is running. I've seen vmware running but I haven't used it. I do use win4lin fairly regularly and Windows 98 runs very acceptably (not noticably slower than it would be on the native hardware). I'm pretty sure that vmware is heavier on resources but it's also a little more flexible. Wine tries to emulate the Windows API under unix/X to let Windows apps run natively in Linux (no emulator). Wine's advantages are: - native execution of Windows binary, should be faster - no licenses required (no win4lin, no vmware and no MS Windows license) Wine's disadvantage is that while it can run some applications well it's just as likely that you're favorite Windows app won't cooperate. I haven't spent much time looking at Wine lately, please correct me if I am wrong. I expect http://www.winehq.com/ has an FAQ about some of the issues. There are commercial efforts at making Wine work better. Crossover and (I think) WineX, they might be better than plain wine but again you need to buy a license. Why do you want to run Windows on top of Linux? Just curious about what applications it is that you think you need, it might be that there's a Linux equivalent that's good enough or better than what you're used to. If it's the latest generation games that you're wanting to run unfortunately I think you really are stuck with Windows for that. -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From street_smart-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 21:33:27 2004 From: street_smart-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (StreetSmart) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 16:33:27 -0500 Subject: Programming in Linux In-Reply-To: <200402281622.54902.fraser-eicrhRFjby5dCsDujFhwbypxlwaOVQ5f@public.gmane.org> References: <200402281622.54902.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: I'm just interested in learning about the program it self. I herd about it, and it seems cool. I haven't even gotten a copy of Linux yet but I should be ready to try the os soon. Thanks for the help. StreetSmart -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org]On Behalf Of Fraser Campbell Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 4:23 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Programming in Linux On Saturday 28 February 2004 15:18, StreetSmart wrote: > I'm reading allot of stuff on a program called "Wine" which supposedly > allows you to run windows on top of Linux If you want to run MS Windows on top of Linux there are two solutions that I know of: - win4lin (http://www.netraverse.com/) - vmware Win4lin lets you run an actual copy of Windows 98 (or 95) on Linux. You launch a real live copy of Windows and the vast majority of Windows software will run glitch free (as long as it is software that isn't manipulating hardware directly). Win4lin doesn't yet run Windows 2000 or XP but I believe that it will eventually be supported. vmware lets you run most (all?) operating systems for Intel compatible hardware. Again, you need a full install of Windows and it is the real Windows that is running. I've seen vmware running but I haven't used it. I do use win4lin fairly regularly and Windows 98 runs very acceptably (not noticably slower than it would be on the native hardware). I'm pretty sure that vmware is heavier on resources but it's also a little more flexible. Wine tries to emulate the Windows API under unix/X to let Windows apps run natively in Linux (no emulator). Wine's advantages are: - native execution of Windows binary, should be faster - no licenses required (no win4lin, no vmware and no MS Windows license) Wine's disadvantage is that while it can run some applications well it's just as likely that you're favorite Windows app won't cooperate. I haven't spent much time looking at Wine lately, please correct me if I am wrong. I expect http://www.winehq.com/ has an FAQ about some of the issues. There are commercial efforts at making Wine work better. Crossover and (I think) WineX, they might be better than plain wine but again you need to buy a license. Why do you want to run Windows on top of Linux? Just curious about what applications it is that you think you need, it might be that there's a Linux equivalent that's good enough or better than what you're used to. If it's the latest generation games that you're wanting to run unfortunately I think you really are stuck with Windows for that. -- Fraser Campbell http://www.wehave.net/ Georgetown, Ontario, Canada Debian GNU/Linux -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 21:54:28 2004 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 16:54:28 -0500 Subject: Programming in Linux In-Reply-To: References: <200402281622.54902.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> Message-ID: <20040228215428.GA8700@node1.opengeometry.net> On Sat, Feb 28, 2004 at 04:33:27PM -0500, StreetSmart wrote: > I'm just interested in learning about the program it self. I herd > about it, and it seems cool. Then, you heard wrong. Linux is not cool. It is in fact excruciatingly painful. It requires years of problem sets, lectures, midterms, and exams, just to learn how to use editor and shell properly. -- William Park, Open Geometry Consulting, Linux solution for data management and processing. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From street_smart-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 22:10:38 2004 From: street_smart-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (StreetSmart) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 17:10:38 -0500 Subject: Programming in Linux In-Reply-To: <20040228215428.GA8700-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040228215428.GA8700@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: How can you be so sure I haven't gone threw the years of problem sets, lectures, midterms, and exams. You cant. I didn't ask you if you thought Linux was cool, so you don't have to give your opinion. Thanks. StreetSmart -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org]On Behalf Of William Park Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 4:54 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Programming in Linux On Sat, Feb 28, 2004 at 04:33:27PM -0500, StreetSmart wrote: > I'm just interested in learning about the program it self. I herd > about it, and it seems cool. Then, you heard wrong. Linux is not cool. It is in fact excruciatingly painful. It requires years of problem sets, lectures, midterms, and exams, just to learn how to use editor and shell properly. -- William Park, Open Geometry Consulting, Linux solution for data management and processing. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 22:17:43 2004 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 17:17:43 -0500 Subject: Programming in Linux In-Reply-To: <20040228215428.GA8700-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <200402281622.54902.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> <20040228215428.GA8700@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <20040228171743.52afe845.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 16:54:28 -0500 William Park disseminated the following: > > I'm just interested in learning about the program it self. I herd > > about it, and it seems cool. > > Then, you heard wrong. Linux is not cool. It is in fact excruciatingly > painful. It requires years of problem sets, lectures, midterms, and > exams, just to learn how to use editor and shell properly. I think he meant Wine, Willie, but very funny anyway :-) -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 17:15:48 up 23 days, 5:00, 5 users, load average: 1.61, 1.50, 1.38 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Mandrake Linux release 9.2 (FiveStar) for i586 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ "Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone."-- John Maynard Keynes -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From street_smart-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 22:21:08 2004 From: street_smart-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (StreetSmart) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 17:21:08 -0500 Subject: Programming in Linux In-Reply-To: <20040228171743.52afe845.joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <20040228171743.52afe845.joehill@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: Honestly, does it really matter to you if I'm wrong in saying Linux is cool. Maybe I enjoy writing essays, and taking exams on Linux. Just leave it at that please. StreetSmart -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org]On Behalf Of JoeHill Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 5:18 PM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Programming in Linux On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 16:54:28 -0500 William Park disseminated the following: > > I'm just interested in learning about the program it self. I herd > > about it, and it seems cool. > > Then, you heard wrong. Linux is not cool. It is in fact excruciatingly > painful. It requires years of problem sets, lectures, midterms, and > exams, just to learn how to use editor and shell properly. I think he meant Wine, Willie, but very funny anyway :-) -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 17:15:48 up 23 days, 5:00, 5 users, load average: 1.61, 1.50, 1.38 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Mandrake Linux release 9.2 (FiveStar) for i586 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ "Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone."-- John Maynard Keynes -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 22:21:22 2004 From: joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (JoeHill) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 17:21:22 -0500 Subject: Programming in Linux In-Reply-To: References: <20040228215428.GA8700@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <20040228172122.6dbdef39.joehill@sympatico.ca> On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 17:10:38 -0500 StreetSmart disseminated the following: > How can you be so sure I haven't gone threw the years of problem sets, > lectures, midterms, and exams. You cant. I didn't ask you if you thought > Linux was cool, so you don't have to give your opinion. Thanks. He's yankin' yer chain, man. Chill ;-) -- JoeHill Registered Linux user #282046 Homepage: www.orderinchaos.org +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 17:20:21 up 23 days, 5:04, 6 users, load average: 1.28, 1.33, 1.33 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Mandrake Linux release 9.2 (FiveStar) for i586 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ "If I said yes, that would then suggest that that might be the only place where it might be done which would not be accurate ... necessarily accurate ... it might also not be inaccurate, but I mean ... I'm disinclined to mislead anyone."-- Donald Rumsfeld -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 22:29:38 2004 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 17:29:38 -0500 Subject: Programming in Linux In-Reply-To: <20040228171743.52afe845.joehill-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg@public.gmane.org> References: <200402281622.54902.fraser@georgetown.wehave.net> <20040228215428.GA8700@node1.opengeometry.net> <20040228171743.52afe845.joehill@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <20040228222938.GA9173@node1.opengeometry.net> On Sat, Feb 28, 2004 at 05:17:43PM -0500, JoeHill wrote: > On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 16:54:28 -0500 > William Park disseminated the following: > > > > I'm just interested in learning about the program it self. I herd > > > about it, and it seems cool. > > > > Then, you heard wrong. Linux is not cool. It is in fact excruciatingly > > painful. It requires years of problem sets, lectures, midterms, and > > exams, just to learn how to use editor and shell properly. > > I think he meant Wine, Willie, but very funny anyway :-) Oh, Wine... okey, French seems to have the reputation. But, I think, that can be attributed to particular foot fungus that French people have. Or, it could be because they don't take shower as often. I lean towards Sake (anything rice, really), but German/Dutch beer is good also. -- William Park, Open Geometry Consulting, Linux solution for data management and processing. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 22:38:29 2004 From: pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Paul King) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 17:38:29 -0500 Subject: Programming in Linux In-Reply-To: <20040228215428.GA8700-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: Message-ID: <4040D215.31451.E6FB4CF@localhost> Date sent: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 16:54:28 -0500 From: William Park To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Programming in Linux Send reply to: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > On Sat, Feb 28, 2004 at 04:33:27PM -0500, StreetSmart wrote: > > I'm just interested in learning about the program it self. I herd > > about it, and it seems cool. > > Then, you heard wrong. Linux is not cool. It is in fact excruciatingly > painful. It requires years of problem sets, lectures, midterms, and > exams, just to learn how to use editor and shell properly. > Well, I wonder how I learned it. I was completely self-taught before my first programming course (in C/C++) at U of T. Before that, my only computer background was in Fortran, BASIC and PASCAL. All done through some kind of user-safe "sandbox" they set up. For you geeks out there, it was worse than tcsh. Far worse. Basic was on RSTS/E. Anyone remember that? The only commands it supported was "dir" and "basic". I taught myself UNIX in around 1988 by going up to a sysop guy on campus and saying "uhhh ... can I have a UNIX account?" (that was before security became an issue). And to my luck they even gave me privelages to use the SUN graphics terminals instead of those boring VT100s and XL87s. I played with it and taught myself how to configure my X environment and to program with pointers. In PASCAL. Paul King ========================================================= Paul King http://www3.sympatico.ca/pking123/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From legrady-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 23:59:06 2004 From: legrady-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Tom Legrady) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 18:59:06 -0500 Subject: Programming in Linux In-Reply-To: <4040D215.31451.E6FB4CF-bi+AKbBUZKZeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org> References: <4040D215.31451.E6FB4CF@localhost> Message-ID: <40412B4A.9080603@rogers.com> My first Unix experience at UofT in the mid 80s involved some restricted shell that was hardly able to do anything .... the editor was ex. It baffled me the first time I came across references to 'remote shell', since I thought 'rsh' was my old nightmare. Tom > > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mike-DlQxw/23Tq2aMJb+Lgu22Q at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 00:38:38 2004 From: mike-DlQxw/23Tq2aMJb+Lgu22Q at public.gmane.org (Mike Waychison) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 19:38:38 -0500 Subject: Programming in Linux In-Reply-To: <40409B37.28544.D99633D-bi+AKbBUZKZeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org> References: <40409B37.28544.D99633D@localhost> Message-ID: <4041348E.1090903@waychison.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Paul King wrote: | | C++ - gpp (You don't have to go to any trouble to install this. It's | usually there.) | Uhhh.. I think you confused cpp (the C preprocessor) and gcc, the C compiler. The GNU C++ compiler is g++. Mike Waychison -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFAQTSOdQs4kOxk3/MRAmwXAKCGCnI3X5FGBDkVxFbmT+rmb9MXfgCfQXGC S/uhG+URo/yawdHsoMsCreg= =B/vD -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 00:45:59 2004 From: lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org (Lloyd Budd) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 19:45:59 -0500 Subject: has everyone been eating their happy pills? Message-ID: I know about "How To Ask Questions The Smart Way?" but where is the "How to Answer Questions..." I may want to read through the results of the following search: http://www.google.com/search?q=netiquette -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 01:02:53 2004 From: waltdnes-SLHPyeZ9y/tg9hUCZPvPmw at public.gmane.org (Walter Dnes) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 20:02:53 -0500 Subject: A scripting question (harder than I thought) In-Reply-To: <20040227071829.GB3604-qFXCSEZiv8lIJHMOrJ9DSGq87BGP6SvQ@public.gmane.org> References: <20040227061607.GD9548@m450> <20040227071829.GB3604@node1.opengeometry.net> Message-ID: <20040229010253.GA732@m450> On Fri, Feb 27, 2004 at 02:18:29AM -0500, William Park wrote > On Fri, Feb 27, 2004 at 01:16:07AM -0500, Walter Dnes wrote: > > > > How do I remove every second end-of-line to achieve this ? > > sed 'N;s/\n//' It works, and almost no moving parts. As a consultant, you're probably used to customers giving you a spec, and when you come up with a solution to their spec, they say "That's not what I really meant". It turns out that I can't "delete every second line". Some DNSbls, like sorbs and spamhaus) throw a monkey-wrench into things by returning more than 1 line in the %TXT% message. Example... > Wed Feb 11 16:58:49 2004 (gongguail21-DVq+YeWbj7f7Za/I2yyZNw at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [221.150.38.95] > Rejected due to lack of hostname. If yours was a legitimate email see http://www.waltdnes.org/bypass.html to bypass block. > > Wed Feb 11 19:01:42 2004 (b446ahi-O5WfVfzUwx8 at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [24.47.205.208] > HTTP Proxy See: http://www.dnsbl.sorbs.net/cgi-bin/lookup?IP=24.47.205.208 > SOCKS Proxy See: http://www.dnsbl.sorbs.net/cgi-bin/lookup?IP=24.47.205.208 > Spam Received See: http://www.dnsbl.sorbs.net/cgi-bin/lookup?IP=24.47.205.208 > Dynamic IP Address See: http://www.dnsbl.sorbs.net/cgi-bin/lookup?IP=24.47.205.208 Email rejected on advice of dnsbl.sorbs.net. If yours was a legitimate email see http://www.waltdnes.org/bypass.html to bypass block. > > Wed Feb 11 19:28:06 2004 (News-8EyPGC1My3pUtMC7kmziAtBPR1lH4CV8 at public.gmane.org) -> (waltdnes at waltdnes.org) [80.64.107.202] > Rejected due to lack of hostname. If yours was a legitimate email see http://www.waltdnes.org/bypass.html to bypass block. I use the aggregate sorbs zone to cut down on DNS traffic. Sorbs has that IP address listed under 4 categories, and returns 4 lines. Do I need to use Python or something similar ? The rules for the logfile are 1) The "anchor line" begins with regex "^(Mon|Tue|Wed|Thu|Fri|Sat|Sun) (Jan|Feb|Mar|Apr|May|Jun|Jul|Aug|Sep|Oct|Nov|Dec) " and ends with "]" 2) Followed N lines (N > 0) of text, which do not match rule 1. 3) Followed by one zero-length line I think that a script-based approach would work like so - find a line that does *NOT* match rule 1 - join it to the previous line -- Walter Dnes Email users are divided into two classes; 1) Those who have effective spam-blocking 2) Those who wish they did -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 01:59:12 2004 From: clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (CLIFFORD ILKAY) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 20:59:12 -0500 Subject: Programming in Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.0.20040228205846.0390b948@localhost> At 11:55 28/02/2004 -0500, StreetSmart wrote: >Are there free programs available in Linux to write VB, c++, or java >programs? Yes, it's called Python :) Regards, Clifford Ilkay Dinamis Corporation 3266 Yonge Street, Suite 1419 Toronto, Ontario Canada M4N 3P6 Tel: 416-410-3326 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 02:03:00 2004 From: clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (CLIFFORD ILKAY) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 21:03:00 -0500 Subject: PHPBB for TLUG In-Reply-To: <000b01c3fe13$1bec98b0$0301a8c0-vAnPq90cUBg@public.gmane.org> References: <000b01c3fe13$1bec98b0$0301a8c0@amazon> Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.0.20040228210243.0390b948@localhost> At 10:54 28/02/2004 -0500, Teddy Mills wrote: >PHPBB for TLUG. Should this be done? >Does it make more sense than email lists? No on both counts, thanks. Regards, Clifford Ilkay Dinamis Corporation 3266 Yonge Street, Suite 1419 Toronto, Ontario Canada M4N 3P6 Tel: 416-410-3326 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 02:04:34 2004 From: clifford_ilkay-biY6FKoJMRdBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (CLIFFORD ILKAY) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 21:04:34 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <404068A3.14587.CD3D038-bi+AKbBUZKZeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org> References: <20040228090059.24ee1a3a.rufmetal@eol.ca> <4040564B.15.C8C2AF7@localhost> <404068A3.14587.CD3D038@localhost> Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.0.20040228210317.0390b948@localhost> At 10:08 28/02/2004 -0500, Paul King wrote: > > You can't really be that new at this. > >That's not really the point. Several years ago, I used to give talks on 'net >use in courses, and sure, I explained 'net acronyms. > >I strongly disagree with your implication that 'net acronyms were ever any >part >of a "subculture". > >Acronyms, especially those germaine to a particular area or technology, >are and >have been useful to ease the reading of messages on Internet newsgroups or on >mailing lists. That is, it rose out of conveniance. Newcomers were often >encouraged to read a FAQ to become familiar with the norms of the group and >with the acronyms. [snip] That presumes newbies know what the acronym FAQ stands for:) Seriously, I have encountered people who did not know. Regards, Clifford Ilkay Dinamis Corporation 3266 Yonge Street, Suite 1419 Toronto, Ontario Canada M4N 3P6 Tel: 416-410-3326 -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 03:09:13 2004 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 22:09:13 -0500 Subject: A scripting question (harder than I thought) In-Reply-To: <20040229010253.GA732-Mb8sf/rG248@public.gmane.org> References: <20040227061607.GD9548@m450> <20040227071829.GB3604@node1.opengeometry.net> <20040229010253.GA732@m450> Message-ID: <20040229030913.GA10732@node1.opengeometry.net> On Sat, Feb 28, 2004 at 08:02:53PM -0500, Walter Dnes wrote: > 1) The "anchor line" begins with regex "^(Mon|Tue|Wed|Thu|Fri|Sat|Sun) > (Jan|Feb|Mar|Apr|May|Jun|Jul|Aug|Sep|Oct|Nov|Dec) " > and ends with "]" > > 2) Followed N lines (N > 0) of text, which do not match rule 1. > > 3) Followed by one zero-length line > > I think that a script-based approach would work like so > > - find a line that does *NOT* match rule 1 > - join it to the previous line (3) is better pattern than (1) or (2); that is, every log is separated by an empty line. Now, if I read you right, you want to join multi-lines into a single-line for each log. In that case, 1. awk -v RS='' '{gsub("\n", ""); print}' 2. csplit logfile '/^$/' '{*}' for i in xx*; do tr -d '\n' < $i done 3. while read line; do case $line in '') echo ;; *) echo -n "$line" ;; esac done If you need to match "Mon Jan ...", then solutions are slightly different, because you have explicit beginning and ending. From top of my head, 4. print=no while read line; do case $line in Mon*|Tue*|Wed*|Thu*|Fri*|Sat*|Sun*) print=yes ;; '') print=no ;; esac case $print in yes) echo -n "$line" ;; no) echo "$line" ;; esac done 5. awk ' /^(Mon|Tue|Wed|Thu|Fri|Sat|Sun)/ {ORS=""} /^$/ {ORS="\n"} {print} ' 6. echo -e 'g/^(Mon|Tue|Wed|Thu|Fri|Sat|Sun)/.,/^$/j\nwq' | ed -- William Park, Open Geometry Consulting, Linux solution for data management and processing. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Sat Feb 28 16:53:27 2004 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 11:53:27 -0500 (EST) Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <404068A3.14587.CD3D038-bi+AKbBUZKZeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org> References: <4040564B.15.C8C2AF7@localhost> <404068A3.14587.CD3D038@localhost> Message-ID: On Sat, 28 Feb 2004, Paul King wrote: > I strongly disagree with your implication that 'net acronyms were ever > any part of a "subculture". Hi Paul. They are definitely part of a subculture: http://www.catb.org/~esr/jargon/ The culture is alive and well and has leaked many terms to the mainstream in recent decades, much like other successful subcultures. This subculture has even been the subject of formal cultural studies. > Over-use of acronyms obscure messages. Unless someone wish to post a FAQ > to interpret their own jargon, they are essentialy writing messages to > themselves. Not if the audience understands. As a rule I avoid accronyms that I think it is unlikely my audience will understand (or I'll post a reference) but this is not equivalent to saying the jargon is not useful or does not have relevance to a particular groups of users (the subculture). In any case the Jargon File is a good read. Cheers, Rob > > Paul King > > > > > ~ C > > -- > > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > > ========================================================= > Paul King http://www3.sympatico.ca/pking123/ > > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- Robert Brockway Senior Technical Consultant, OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Phone: 416-669-3073, Email: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org, http://www.opentrend.net OpenTrend Solutions: Reliable, secure solutions to real world problems. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From anton-F0u+EriZ6ihBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 03:23:41 2004 From: anton-F0u+EriZ6ihBDgjK7y7TUQ at public.gmane.org (Anton Markov) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 22:23:41 -0500 Subject: Recovery disk using LVM2 Message-ID: <40415B3D.7060808@truxtar.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hello everyone, When I switched over from Redhat to Debian two months ago, I also converted my system to use Logical Volume Manager Version 2 (LVM2) which comes with the 2.6 series of kernels. Now, my system works fine, and I have no complaints about Debian or the 2.6 kernels, but I am concerned that I don't have a working recovery disk that would recognize the LVM2 partitions or be able to recover them should something go wrong. Right now I am running the kernel-2.6.3-1-686 unstable Debian kernel, with the lvm-common and lvm2 packages installed. My hard drive is divided into a 12GB free partition at the start (for any emergency installations or [ouch] Windoze), and the remaining 70GB as an LVM physical volume. The new LVM2 uses the device-mapper code in the 2.6 kernels. Here are the possible solutions I see and the problems they present: - - KNOPPIX: Knoppix is famous for their LVM recovery capability, however Knoppix uses the 2.4 kernels, which does not have the device-mapper kernel. Is this still true? Is there a version of Knoppix that supports LVM2. If there is, that would be my perfect recovery disk. - - Mindi/Mondo: Mindi is a mini-linux distribution that can be created on-the-fly to use your current kernel (and thus support all your hardware as if you are running your full system). Unfortunately, Mindi seems to have problems with stock Debian kernels (it even says so on their site). The Debian Mindi package has broken dependencies (the mindi-kernel package does not exist on any official or un-official mirror Debian). I tried installing the source version and creating a boot CD with my current kernel, but when I reboot, I get a kernel panic "Unable to mount root partition on device (0.0)" or something like that. (Mindi passes the "root=/dev/mem" option to the kernel) Again, I think it's a problem with Debian and/or kernel 2.6 compatibility with Mindi. These are about the only solutions I see now (or variants there of, such as building a custom Knoppix CD with the 2.6 kernel). I really need to stick with the 2.6 kernels, because of my new hardware that doesn't work well in older kernels (and 'cause Linus said so :) ). If anyone sees how I can get my ideas working, or has any other suggestions, I would greatly appreciate them. Thanks. - -- Anton Markov <("anton" + "@" + "truxtar" + "." + "com")> GnuPG Key fingerprint = 5546 A6E2 1FFB 9BB8 15C3 CE34 46B7 8D93 3AD1 44B4 *** LINUX - MAY THE SOURCE BE WITH YOU! *** -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFAQVtFRreNkzrRRLQRAlxYAJ9byMFn7jEKwubr2+BryzYypwkkUQCgm/W3 ooV7pnom2fvU4hDKU3etj7M= =z0l0 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 03:39:39 2004 From: pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Paul King) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 22:39:39 -0500 Subject: Programming in Linux In-Reply-To: <4041348E.1090903-DlQxw/23Tq2aMJb+Lgu22Q@public.gmane.org> References: <40409B37.28544.D99633D@localhost> Message-ID: <404118AB.4723.F836F4F@localhost> There are some systems that gpp is another symbolic link. > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > Paul King wrote: > > | > | C++ - gpp (You don't have to go to any trouble to install this. It's > | usually there.) > | > > Uhhh.. I think you confused cpp (the C preprocessor) and gcc, the C > compiler. The GNU C++ compiler is g++. > > Mike Waychison > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux) > > iD8DBQFAQTSOdQs4kOxk3/MRAmwXAKCGCnI3X5FGBDkVxFbmT+rmb9MXfgCfQXGC > S/uhG+URo/yawdHsoMsCreg= > =B/vD > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml ========================================================= Paul King http://www3.sympatico.ca/pking123/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 03:47:02 2004 From: sidney-3Kd7Tu4o6f/sBN0MCq728g at public.gmane.org (Sidney Shapiro) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 22:47:02 -0500 Subject: PHPBB for TLUG In-Reply-To: <000b01c3fe13$1bec98b0$0301a8c0-vAnPq90cUBg@public.gmane.org> References: <000b01c3fe13$1bec98b0$0301a8c0@amazon> Message-ID: <012701c3fe76$b92ee480$6701a8c0@main> I think BB has its place, and I don't think its here. If you had some way of loading the posts from the list into BB, that would be nifty. Sid > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org] On Behalf Of Teddy > Mills > Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 10:54 AM > To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org > Subject: [TLUG]: PHPBB for TLUG > > PHPBB for TLUG. Should this be done? > Does it make more sense than email lists? > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------- > teddy mills http://www.vger.ca > VGER directives...To collect...all that is collectable. To sell...all that > is saleable.To merchandise...all that is merchandisable. > > Family Guys Quagmire "allllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll right" > Capt Tenneal "LETS GO!" > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 03:54:09 2004 From: opengeometry-FFYn/CNdgSA at public.gmane.org (William Park) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 22:54:09 -0500 Subject: A scripting question (harder than I thought) In-Reply-To: <20040229010253.GA732-Mb8sf/rG248@public.gmane.org> References: <20040227061607.GD9548@m450> <20040227071829.GB3604@node1.opengeometry.net> <20040229010253.GA732@m450> Message-ID: <20040229035409.GA12395@node1.opengeometry.net> On Sat, Feb 28, 2004 at 08:02:53PM -0500, Walter Dnes wrote: > I use the aggregate sorbs zone to cut down on DNS traffic. Sorbs > has that IP address listed under 4 categories, and returns 4 lines. > Do I need to use Python or something similar ? While I'm at it... If you follow line-by-line approach, then Python script will not be that different from shell/sed/awk. A different approach would be to read the whole file and split out the blocks as string. 1. In Python, all = open('logfile', 'r').read() a = all.split('\n\n') for i in a: print i.replace('\n\n', '') 2. Using my Bash patch, http://home.eol.ca/~parkw/index.html#bash you would do something similar, all=`cat logfile` a=() array -j $'\n\n' a "$all" printf '%s\n' "${a[@]//$'\n'/}" -- William Park, Open Geometry Consulting, Linux solution for data management and processing. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 04:48:07 2004 From: pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Paul King) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 23:48:07 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: References: <404068A3.14587.CD3D038@localhost> Message-ID: <404128B7.208.FC220A3@localhost> > On Sat, 28 Feb 2004, Paul King wrote: > > > I strongly disagree with your implication that 'net acronyms were ever > > any part of a "subculture". > > Hi Paul. They are definitely part of a subculture: > > http://www.catb.org/~esr/jargon/ > > The culture is alive and well and has leaked many terms to the > mainstream in recent decades, much like other successful subcultures. Robert, I wasn't denying that a subculture exists; I was disagreeing that acronyms are from anything resembling a subculture. Also, let's not get "jargon" mixed up with acronyms. I am sure that terminology has leaked out, but I have yet to hear anyone use an acronym like "IIRC" used in a normal conversation. Rather, they would begin the sentence with "If I recall correctly ...". Nor has anyone told me to HAND. Rather, "Have a nice day" has been more the norm. For example, I have been using newsgroups (called the USENET) almost since the beginning in the 80s. Acronyms, as far as I can tell, arose due to the fact that the primary basis of the USENET was text, and it saved both typing and reading. It arose out of necessity. Back then, there were only a few newsgroups distributed worldwide, and everybody had a FAQ (Frequently-asked questions) file, and a FAQ maintainer who was also some kind of an authority on the topic of the newsgroup. For those newsgroups without a maintainer, the USENET had (and still has) an internal, universally-distributed newsgroup called news.announce.newusers, which has general introductory material regarding newsgroup ettiqutte which can apply to the USENET as a whole. Us food scientists (like all scientists) also have arcane acronyms and our own jargon. But I don't see that as being "cultural" anymore than USENET acronyms are cultural. Maybe it's true that food scientists form a subculture like chemists and physicists, but like these it is quite limited. But I agree that USENET and mailing lists are cultures in nearly every other sense. It even has unique rules of ettiquette, clearly laid-out. I have read USENET articles where people are baring their soul anonymously to the world, while others just like to verbally abuse others. Some people, like Robert McElwaine (google *that*) are legendary in their infamy. So is Serdar Argic. It has legends, rumors, fears, hopes, loves, emotions (through emoticons) and everything you could ask for in a true culture except for face-to-face human contact. > > This subculture has even been the subject of formal cultural studies. > > > Over-use of acronyms obscure messages. Unless someone wish to post a FAQ > > to interpret their own jargon, they are essentialy writing messages to > > themselves. > > Not if the audience understands. You always need a FAQ. There will always be people in the audience who don't "get it", and re-hashing the rules each time for a newbie is tiresome. Newbies, and people who have better things to do in life than to run to an acronym website every time he sees an acronym he doesn't know about. An argument can be made for this mailing list needing one. However, I have noticed that people have been mostly pretty good about not letting the acronyms get out of hand, so maybe it isn't necessary. > As a rule I avoid accronyms that I think > it is unlikely my audience will understand (or I'll post a reference) but [snip] I hadn't said jargon were not useful. In fact I often advocate it, ans use it myself. But like you, I consider my audience and avoid acronyms unless I think people will "get it". Like you, I aim for clarity, and use acronyms if they are helpful in aiding that. Otherwise, what's the point? Paul King -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From mcg2-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 06:03:48 2004 From: mcg2-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Matthew Godycki) Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 01:03:48 -0500 Subject: Programming in Linux References: Message-ID: <002501c3fe89$cc65bca0$6401a8c0@yoshiko> With regard to Java, there are plenty of options, many of them coincidentally written in Java. A couple of "bigger" IDEs are (both OSS as I recall): - Netbeans - Eclipse Of course, you can also use your favourite editor (vi, emacs, pico, whathaveyou) along with the javac compiler. Cheers, -Matt ----- Original Message ----- From: "StreetSmart" To: "Tlug" Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 11:55 AM Subject: [TLUG]: Programming in Linux > Are there free programs available in Linux to write VB, c++, or java > programs? > > StreetSmart > > -- > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns > How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml > -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 06:12:26 2004 From: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org (Robert Brockway) Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 01:12:26 -0500 (EST) Subject: Question In-Reply-To: <404128B7.208.FC220A3-bi+AKbBUZKZeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org> References: <404068A3.14587.CD3D038@localhost> <404128B7.208.FC220A3@localhost> Message-ID: On Sat, 28 Feb 2004, Paul King wrote: > Robert, I wasn't denying that a subculture exists; I was disagreeing Ah ok. Everything commented below is IMHO since I wouldn't be able to have anyone else's opinion. > get "jargon" mixed up with acronyms. I am sure that terminology has Actually I think the Jargon file is badly named but I raise it as a cultural identifier anyway. > leaked out, but I have yet to hear anyone use an acronym like "IIRC" > used in a normal conversation. Rather, they would begin the sentence Oh I have :) I've also heard them say IMHO, RTFM, UTSL, HTH and heard people comment that they greped for things around the house[1]. Admittedly this was largely done in the company of people who would have a clue what the person was saying :) In any case, just because the culture in question does not express itself widely in the "real world" does not stop it from being a culture (IMHO as noted :) The people who built the Internet or were there before it became popular have often considered themselves a group apart from the rest of the world. > For example, I have been using newsgroups (called the USENET) almost Yes I know it well :) > Us food scientists (like all scientists) also have arcane acronyms and > our own jargon. But I don't see that as being "cultural" anymore than > USENET acronyms are cultural. Maybe it's true that food scientists form > a subculture like chemists and physicists, but like these it is quite > limited. I believe that various groups of scientists could form limited subcultures and that in some cases they have. I just think computing tends to be more all-encompassing for those involved in it. Better yet, the people involved allow themselves to be all-encompassed :) > But I agree that USENET and mailing lists are cultures in nearly every > other sense. It even has unique rules of ettiquette, clearly laid-out. I I guess we only differ on whether a culture need constitute itself in the real world to a wide degree. I believe this is not a requirement for a subculture to exist. If I did believe this point I would likely be 100% in agreement with you. > have read USENET articles where people are baring their soul anonymously Yeah, I've always tried to avoid that :) I think it is the same phenomena that causes people to bare their soul on Ricky Lake or worse Jerry Springer :) > to the world, while others just like to verbally abuse others. Some > people, like Robert McElwaine (google *that*) are legendary in their > infamy. So is Serdar Argic. It has legends, rumors, fears, hopes, loves, Now there's a name I haven't heard in some years. I used to frequent several mideast newsgroups. Thanks for the walk down memory lane :) > emotions (through emoticons) and everything you could ask for in a true > culture except for face-to-face human contact. That's the core difference in our positions I guess. [1] The first time I heard this I burst our laughing. My friend had commented that he had grapped the house for the keys and not found them (he might have even said the grep returned 1). Anyway, I had a mental image of him moving around the house picking up everything that was not nailed down and comparing it to a known set of keys. I still find this funny. I guess you had to be there :) Cheers, Rob -- Robert Brockway Senior Technical Consultant, OpenTrend Solutions Ltd. Phone: 416-669-3073, Email: rbrockway-wgAaPJgzrDxH4x6Dk/4f9A at public.gmane.org, http://www.opentrend.net OpenTrend Solutions: Reliable, secure solutions to real world problems. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 06:21:59 2004 From: IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Ilya Palagin) Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 01:21:59 -0500 Subject: Recovery disk using LVM2 In-Reply-To: <40415B3D.7060808-F0u+EriZ6ihBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org> References: <40415B3D.7060808@truxtar.com> Message-ID: <40418507.60304@rogers.com> Anton Markov wrote: ... > > When I switched over from Redhat to Debian two months ago, I also > converted my system to use Logical Volume Manager Version 2 (LVM2) which > comes with the 2.6 series of kernels. Now, my system works fine, and I > have no complaints about Debian or the 2.6 kernels, but I am concerned > that I don't have a working recovery disk that would recognize the LVM2 > partitions or be able to recover them should something go wrong. > ... What's the purpose of recovery disks? They hardly help if one accidentally deletes a file, or if a file system crashes because of the faulty hard drive. The only useful usage of recovery disks is rewriting of lilos's or grub's boot record after (re)installation of a poorly designed alternative OS, which doesn't recognize anything but its own stuff. All other problems are usually handled by journaling file systems. Debian has `mkboot` utility for making boot floppies. There is a requirement - image kernel must fit 1.44 floppy, no initrd is allowed, otherwise they both exceed 1.44MB. Thus, compile your own minimal monolithic kernel and make a boot floppy with mkboot, pointing it to the "boot" kernel you've prepared. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 12:28:52 2004 From: pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Paul King) Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 07:28:52 -0500 Subject: Question In-Reply-To: References: <404128B7.208.FC220A3@localhost> Message-ID: <404194B4.7356.1167F3A2@localhost> > [1] The first time I heard this I burst our laughing. My friend had > commented that he had grapped the house for the keys and not found them > (he might have even said the grep returned 1). Anyway, I had a mental > image of him moving around the house picking up everything that was not > nailed down and comparing it to a known set of keys. I still find this > funny. I guess you had to be there :) > > Cheers, > Rob > That reminds me of a news thread in rec.humor whose subject line says "You know you have been on the computer too long when ..." One of these said: "... you try to grep a book." Perhaps we now ought to add " ... and grep returned 1" (that would be spooky). Others included "... your wife wants you to take out the trash, and you are looking for the trashcan icon." "You tried to double- click your office window to open it." and on and on. Paul ========================================================= Paul King http://www3.sympatico.ca/pking123/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 12:47:34 2004 From: pking123-rieW9WUcm8FFJ04o6PK0Fg at public.gmane.org (Paul King) Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 07:47:34 -0500 Subject: On the Computer too long (Was: Question) Message-ID: <40419916.6190.117913A1@localhost> Continuing from another thread ... Selections from "You know you have been hacking too long when ..." When you want to grep a book. When you want to grep a videocassette. When you look for your toothbrush by trying to do a 'grep toothbrush /dev/gym_bag' command. When you look for your car keys using: "grep keys /dev/pockets" When you look for your homework using: "grep homework /dev/backpack" You try to sleep, and think ... "telnet sleep.dcs.toronto.edu". You try to balance a checkbook ... in HEX. You press the wrong floor button on your elevator by mistake, and try to find the "UNDO" button. ========================================================= Paul King http://www3.sympatico.ca/pking123/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From rfk-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 19:47:49 2004 From: rfk-Zd07PnzKK1IAvxtiuMwx3w at public.gmane.org (Robert F. Kennedy) Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:47:49 -0500 Subject: Apache as WAP server In-Reply-To: <404194B4.7356.1167F3A2-bi+AKbBUZKZeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org> References: <404194B4.7356.1167F3A2@localhost> Message-ID: <01a801c3fefc$e9338fb0$1902a8c0@coilnetworks.com> Hello, I looked through Apache.org documentation and couldn't find any reference to setting it up as a WAP server. Can this be done? Thanks, Robert Robert F. Kennedy Toronto -----Original Message----- From: owner-tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org [mailto:owner-tlug at ss.org] On Behalf Of Paul King Sent: Sunday, February 29, 2004 7:29 AM To: tlug-lxSQFCZeNF4 at public.gmane.org Subject: Re: [TLUG]: Question > [1] The first time I heard this I burst our laughing. My friend had > commented that he had grapped the house for the keys and not found > them (he might have even said the grep returned 1). Anyway, I had a > mental image of him moving around the house picking up everything that > was not nailed down and comparing it to a known set of keys. I still > find this funny. I guess you had to be there :) > > Cheers, > Rob > That reminds me of a news thread in rec.humor whose subject line says "You know you have been on the computer too long when ..." One of these said: "... you try to grep a book." Perhaps we now ought to add " ... and grep returned 1" (that would be spooky). Others included "... your wife wants you to take out the trash, and you are looking for the trashcan icon." "You tried to double- click your office window to open it." and on and on. Paul ========================================================= Paul King http://www3.sympatico.ca/pking123/ -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 19:51:12 2004 From: james.knott-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (James Knott) Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:51:12 -0500 Subject: On the Computer too long (Was: Question) In-Reply-To: <40419916.6190.117913A1-bi+AKbBUZKZeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org> References: <40419916.6190.117913A1@localhost> Message-ID: <404242B0.5010905@rogers.com> Paul King wrote: > Continuing from another thread ... > > Selections from "You know you have been hacking too long when ..." > > When you want to grep a book. There are 10 kinds of people in this world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't. ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From drew-vnkfHpbZfesgsBAKwltoeQ at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 19:47:42 2004 From: drew-vnkfHpbZfesgsBAKwltoeQ at public.gmane.org (Andrew G. Hammond) Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:47:42 -0500 Subject: has everyone been eating their happy pills? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <404241DE.4010007@xyzzy.dhs.org> Lloyd Budd wrote: > > I know about "How To Ask Questions The Smart Way?" > Anyone else think that ESR comes across as arrogant in that FAQ? Especially the older versions. > but where is the "How to Answer Questions..." No kidding. Always makes me want to smack the smug jerks who just say RTFM without providing a pointer to relevant documentation. If you can't say something useful don't waste other people's time. You know, the ones who googled into the thread archive in search of an answer to the same question? The ones who are trying to RTFM? Especially makes me want to smack them when I just spent a good chunk of my time helping them solve their problem, and they can't be bothered to help out some newbie. I think that's the thing that really bothers me about ESR's FAQ. It propounds this very polarized view of the world: godly hackers and lowly suplicant lusers. I don't hardly know squat about Java stuff, so when I've got a tough Java problem, I call one of my buddies who does. He isn't much for networking, so when he needs a firewall script written, he calls me. > The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org > TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns Neolithic. Almost as dumb as munging reply-to. -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 22:17:25 2004 From: IlyaPalagin-bJEeYj9oJeDQT0dZR+AlfA at public.gmane.org (Ilya Palagin) Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 17:17:25 -0500 Subject: Apache as WAP server In-Reply-To: <01a801c3fefc$e9338fb0$1902a8c0-B7WYQ2cLakwWhyVFc8JwjA@public.gmane.org> References: <01a801c3fefc$e9338fb0$1902a8c0@coilnetworks.com> Message-ID: <404264F5.40201@rogers.com> Robert F. Kennedy wrote: > Hello, > > I looked through Apache.org documentation and couldn't find any > reference to setting it up as a WAP server. Can this be done? Yes, just add the following mime types: application/vnd.wap.sic application/vnd.wap.slc application/vnd.wap.wbxml wbxml application/vnd.wap.wmlc wmlc application/vnd.wap.wmlscriptc wmlsc > > Thanks, > Robert -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 22:44:52 2004 From: lloyd-fEEwcc3XMu8jODpR/OX0VQ at public.gmane.org (Lloyd Budd) Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 17:44:52 -0500 Subject: has everyone been eating their happy pills? In-Reply-To: <404241DE.4010007-vnkfHpbZfesgsBAKwltoeQ@public.gmane.org> References: <404241DE.4010007@xyzzy.dhs.org> Message-ID: On 29-Feb-04, at 14:47, Andrew G. Hammond wrote: > Lloyd Budd wrote: > >> I know about "How To Ask Questions The Smart Way?" >> > > Anyone else think that ESR comes across as arrogant > in that FAQ? Especially the older versions. I agree, but still be helpful. >> but where is the "How to Answer Questions..." > > No kidding. Always makes me want to smack the smug > jerks who just say RTFM without providing a pointer to > relevant documentation. If you can't say something > useful don't waste other people's time. The great news is that each of us can "ignore" people -- there is even "common" technology that makes this easier ;-) . I always struggle with not feeding the flame. > I think that's the thing that really bothers me about > ESR's FAQ. It propounds this very polarized view of > the world: godly hackers and lowly suplicant lusers. Well, in the context of your own msg, please elaborate? ;-) Have you considered submitting suggestions to ESR? ;-) I think things being *slightly* polarized makes sense though -- people are looking for hand-outs, so demonstrating your knowledge and research is appropriate. If your time is too valuable, then use something else or pay someone (or barter) ;-) -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 22:42:48 2004 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter L. Peres) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 00:42:48 +0200 (IST) Subject: tk again (question) Message-ID: I know there are a number of very knowledgeable people here, so I'll ask: In wish, I have a canvas c with some objects on it. I would like to retrieve the object types t, their location l and their config options o and store them in a form that can later be passed to a statement like $c create $t $l $o to regenerate them on another canvas. The question is, the command $c itemconfigure $n returns a really strange set of options that need to be parsed and altered a lot to be re-parsable in a statement like $c create $l $o. Note that the problem appears with $o only, the other elements ($t, $l) are easy. The real question is: where is this subject treated (book, message etc), if at all ? (Obviously there are no answers in my docs or on google - none I could find, that is). Simple script to show problem follows: set c .c canvas $c pack $c $c create rectangle 10 10 20 20 -fill blue -tags {one two} set o [$c itemconfigure 1] o is: % {-activedash {} {} {} {}} {-activefill {} {} {} {}} {-activeoutline {} {} {} {}} {-activeoutlinestipple {} {} {} {}} {-activestipple {} {} {} {}} {-activewidth {} {} 0.0 0.0} {-dash {} {} {} {}} {-dashoffset {} {} 0 0} {-disableddash {} {} {} {}} {-disabledfill {} {} {} {}} {-disabledoutline {} {} {} {}} {-disabledoutlinestipple {} {} {} {}} {-disabledstipple {} {} {} {}} {-disabledwidth {} {} 0.0 0} {-fill {} {} {} blue} {-offset {} {} 0,0 0,0} {-outline {} {} black black} {-outlineoffset {} {} 0,0 0,0} {-outlinestipple {} {} {} {}} {-state {} {} {} {}} {-stipple {} {} {} {}} {-tags {} {} {} {one two}} {-width {} {} 1.0 1.0} (really) $o is not in a form that can be passed to $c create ... how do I make it to be so ? I tried to reformat it using: foreach l $o { foreach i $l { if { $i != "" } { if {[llength $i]==1} { puts -nonewline "$i " } else { puts -nonewline "{$i} " } } } puts " \\" } but several ingredients are missing. My tk_version is 8.4something (I know I should upgrade but is this problem fixed ?). My current idea is to take the option and print it iff it has an arg that is not null, or zero (or 1.0 ? or ?!!) and to print the first and last arg or list only in that case. How does that sound ? tia, Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 22:50:14 2004 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter L. Peres) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 00:50:14 +0200 (IST) Subject: has everyone been eating their happy pills? In-Reply-To: <404241DE.4010007-vnkfHpbZfesgsBAKwltoeQ@public.gmane.org> References: <404241DE.4010007@xyzzy.dhs.org> Message-ID: > Neolithic. Almost as dumb as munging reply-to. You have to see the good side. The list could have been distributed using smoke-signs and signal fires. Otherwise I aggree. I refuse to count the times I help people and the times when I do *not* get helped myself ... Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml From plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org Sun Feb 29 22:47:36 2004 From: plp-ysDPMY98cNQDDBjDh4tngg at public.gmane.org (Peter L. Peres) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 00:47:36 +0200 (IST) Subject: Apache as WAP server In-Reply-To: <01a801c3fefc$e9338fb0$1902a8c0-B7WYQ2cLakwWhyVFc8JwjA@public.gmane.org> References: <01a801c3fefc$e9338fb0$1902a8c0@coilnetworks.com> Message-ID: Just put wap pages in the server filespace and point a proxy at it/them. Most phones and providers have builtin proxys. Peter -- The Toronto Linux Users Group. Meetings: http://tlug.ss.org TLUG requests: Linux topics, No HTML, wrap text below 80 columns How to UNSUBSCRIBE: http://tlug.ss.org/subscribe.shtml