<div dir="auto"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr">On Wed, Dec 18, 2019 at 4:51 PM D. Hugh Redelmeier via talk <<a href="mailto:talk@gtalug.org" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">talk@gtalug.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><div class="gmail_quote"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">| From: Russell Reiter via talk <<a href="mailto:talk@gtalug.org" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">talk@gtalug.org</a>><br>
<br>
| I agree that many newcomers face significant barriers through a lack of<br>
| understanding of Canada's system of administrative law and the policies<br>
| which underpin it. However, as much we would like to believe law concerns<br>
| itself with vulnerable folks, that is not quite correct<br>
<br>
Do you mean "administrative law"? That too is a technical term. It<br>
refers to "the body of law that governs the activities of<br>
administrative agencies of government."</blockquote><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Administrative_law" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Administrative_law</a>><br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%;background:transparent"><font face="tahoma, sans-serif">Technically speaking, every term used in English communications is a
technical term. In fact English is dubbed the language of the
technocrats by some others. What I was attempting to address was the
concept of victim blaming, as the issue was raised in a couple of
posts.</font></p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%;background:transparent"><font face="tahoma, sans-serif">There are two basic
branches of Law, Public and Private. Newcomers first contact with
Canada is usually through an administrative agency which vetted their
candidate application. Then they become landed and are expected to be
able to function within the norms of Canadian law, both public and
private, even as while they familiarize themselves with living under
the Canadian system of established social norms. </font></p><p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%;background:transparent"><span style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif">In this system, ignorance of the law is not a defence to an outright breach of the
law, however can be a mitigating factor in determining cause and
effect, when it is necessary for a decider to make a determination of
remedy for a breach of the law, as that law may be administrated under
a Tribunal cluster regime dealing with social and other public
justice issues. </span><br></p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%;background:transparent"><font face="tahoma, sans-serif">Ideally the Tribunal
system allows for individual regions to set the tone of remedy for
equitable breaches which are not criminal but have significant
detrimental social (not necessarily financial) effect if unchecked.
Tribunals and boards are touted as informal resolution services. This
is supposed to spare the parties and the State the burden of the very
high costs of court time in settlement. </font><span style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif">Not to say that Tribunals don't have significant cost in their own right, but they are much less than
formal court proceedings. </span></p><p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%;background:transparent"><span style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif">Private law deals with formal financial remedies
for unlawful breaches of mutually agreed upon contract terms under
privity of contract. </span></p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%;background:transparent"><font face="tahoma, sans-serif">The CRTC is one
established administrative authority of government and actually does
govern cellular communications licensing as a trust issue. </font></p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%;background:transparent"><font face="tahoma, sans-serif">I'd like to be clear
on this, although it's only my personal opinion, any monies collected
in advance and held by a business owner establishes a formal trust. Certain things have come to pass due to the practices of phone
services bundling hardware provision with service provision. </font></p><p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%;background:transparent"><span style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif">In the
land-line days, prior to WiFi mobile cellular, the courts forced phone
companies to allow consumers to actually be able to purchase their own home phones
and even to hook them up inside their homes themselves, as opposed to only renting them from the
services provider and having only the providers technicians inspect
and repair them. </span><br></p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%;background:transparent"><font face="tahoma, sans-serif">More recently
cellular companies were forced to allow carrier unlocking. This
is why the CRTC now want's consumer input on moving forward with
establishing effective future regulations. Even on this list the
right to repair is a topical issue, so administrative law is always a
factor, whether it is immediately obvious or not.</font></p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%;background:transparent"><font face="tahoma, sans-serif">From the CRTC webpage ...</font></p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%;background:transparent"><font face="tahoma, sans-serif">"What is the
CRTC?</font></p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%;background:transparent"><font face="tahoma, sans-serif">The Canadian
Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission (CRTC) was created
by the Parliament of Canada to regulate and supervise broadcasting
and telecommunications in Canada. This includes the radio,
television, cell phone, and Internet services that you and other
Canadians rely on every day. With headquarters in the National
Capital Region, the CRTC reports to Parliament through the Minister
of Canadian Heritage."</font></p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:100%;background:transparent"><a href="https://crtc.gc.ca/eng/acrtc/acrtc.htm" style="color:rgb(0,0,128)" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"><font face="tahoma, sans-serif">https://crtc.gc.ca/eng/acrtc/acrtc.htm</font></a></p>
<blockquote style="margin-left:0cm;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:0cm;border-top:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);border-right:none;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0.05cm;background:transparent">
<font face="tahoma, sans-serif"><br>
I happened to read this
today:<br>
<<a href="https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-supreme-court-ruling-could-quell-chaos-surrounding-administrative-law/" style="color:rgb(0,0,128)" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">https://www.theglobeandmail.c</a>><br>
<br>
I
think that you were talking about law in general.
Administrative<br>
law only matters when you want to challenge
government administrative<br>
decisions.</font></blockquote>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:115%;background:transparent"><font face="tahoma, sans-serif">Interesting. Here is an article on the
debate relating to standards of Judicial review of legal decisions
made by both administrative Tribunals and the Courts of Justice.</font></p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:115%;background:transparent"><font face="tahoma, sans-serif" style="color:rgb(0,0,128)"><a href="https://ablawg.ca/2018/07/23/the-great-divide-on-standard-of-review-in-canadian-administrative-law/" style="color:rgb(0,0,128)" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">https://ablawg.ca/2018/07/23/the-great-divide-on-standard-of-review-in-canadian-administrative-law/</a></font></p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:115%;background:transparent"><font face="tahoma, sans-serif">In Ontario some of the other
administrative Tribunal bodies include the Ontario Human Rights
Tribunal and the Landlord Tenant Board. Both of these administrative
agencies and many others were recently clustered under a new umbrella
name as Tribunals Ontario, </font></p><p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:115%;background:transparent"><font face="tahoma, sans-serif">A great deal of Canadians day to day
business is dealt with by administrative Tribunals, but I don't think
even the Supreme Court couldn't help you with a remedy, if you were
expected to understand it's not wise to share your personal SIN under
certain circumstances and you did so anyway. </font></p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:115%;background:transparent"><font face="tahoma, sans-serif">The problems newcomers face such as
language and financial barriers are somewhat alleviated by the
creation of Non Government Organizations as settlement agencies. But
the demand on training and information services is high, the costs of
service delivery are rising and there is a significant shortage of
funding to be able to engage enough skilled individuals to act in
counselling, training and educational roles. </font></p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:115%;background:transparent"><font face="tahoma, sans-serif">I always think back to the writers A &
H Toffler and their original work Future Shock when I sense that
language use is changing too rapidly for me to fully grasp the subtle
and contextual nuances of that changing language as it is used in
communications, legal or other.</font></p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm;line-height:115%;background:transparent"><font face="tahoma, sans-serif"><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Future_Shock" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Future_Shock</a></font></p></div><div><br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
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