[GTALUG] Debian 12

[Giles Orr]

On Tue, 20 Jun 2023 at 23:04, D. Hugh Redelmeier via talk
<talk at gtalug.org> wrote:
>
> | From: Giles Orr via talk <talk at gtalug.org>
>
> | Long release cycles are a real mixed blessing ...  <sigh>
>
> Thanks for your note on debian 12 / bookworm.
>
> I'm personally interested in debian as a replacement for CentOS.
> (GTALUG is  going to have a speaker from Rocky Linux in the next few
> months.)
>
> I'm not enculturated in the debian world, but my impression is:
>
> - debian stable is about the same as RHEL.  Very stable, very old.
>   Suitable for those who value stability.
>
> - debian testing is pretty reliable.  Perfectly fine on ones desktop.

I used to use testing on my desktops, up until ... five years ago?  I
found it had become less stable, less reliable at that point, and my
appetite for new software wasn't as great anymore.  I haven't tested
recently.

> - debian unstable is more of an adventure

If you wait a month between updates, unstable will routinely download
over a Gigabyte of updated packages.  I found it unusable on the
desktop.

> Ideologically, isn't FF ESR a match for debian stable?
>
> If you want firefox, isn't that an indication that you are a candidate
> for "testing".

Stability is great, and I mostly agree.  But this (and their ancient
version of Strapi) are the only two places where that dedication to
old software has caused me personal grief.  Of course, I'm using my
own needs as the measuring scale ... it's the one I care about.  :-)

> I don't like snaps / flatpacks much.  For reasons that we don't need
> to go over.  But your situation might be a great use: you want a
> stable OS but need very select exceptions.
>
> ==================
>
> We (GTALUG) run a debian stretch server that has fallen out of support.
> It falls on me (among others) to kick it forward.
> I was under the impression that the automated updating process is more
> recent then that.
>
> Is there a royal road to bookworm from stretch?
>
> My guess is that it gets complicated by out-of-distro things that we
> have installed.

The big question is, is this a cloud VM or real iron?  Because my
response would be to spin up another VM and re-install everything on
Bookworm to see if it worked.  This also gives you time because you
can keep the old machine running in parallel.  Time you don't have
when you're working on your own box because you want that back up now
...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debian_version_history

Stretch is apparently still supported, and will be for a while.  But I
would encourage you to upgrade ASAP.  In place if you have to (as
Znoteer says, don't skip versions), separate VM if you can.  And yes,
out-of-distro stuff is likely to break because of the changing set of
libraries and compiler builds in the OS around it.  I have to rebuild
my Python venv every time I re-install Debian - happily only for one
project, it would be nasty for multiple projects.

-- 
Giles
https://www.gilesorr.com/
gilesorr at gmail.com